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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.

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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you get in touch with technology? With

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Speaker 1: tech Stuff from how stuff works dot com. Hello again, everyone,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to tech stuff. My name is Chris Polette and

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Speaker 1: I'm an editor here at how stuff works dot com.

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Speaker 1: And I just made the person sitting across from me

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Speaker 1: crack up his name entitled our senior writer, Jonathan Strickland.

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Speaker 1: But reverse that. Yes, I love the band, we all do,

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Speaker 1: but there's other things in life, you know that's more important.

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Speaker 1: M hm uh yeah. Actually we're not gonna be talking

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Speaker 1: a lot about bands per se, no, but we are

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Speaker 1: talking about music, definitely the history of music and video games.

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Speaker 1: And I have an interest in this because, of course,

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm I'm a gamer. I enjoyed playing video games,

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Speaker 1: but I really had early on a very deep fascination

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Speaker 1: and admiration for some of the greats in video game music.

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Speaker 1: And you have to remember, Chris and I both come

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Speaker 1: from an era in which home video games either had

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Speaker 1: no music at all when they first came out, or

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Speaker 1: or no sounds at all when they first came out,

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Speaker 1: or the sounds were let's call them primitive. Well, I, well,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I think that's uh, that may be

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Speaker 1: an oversimplification because we had well, you know, the early

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Speaker 1: palm games Boop. You're right, that's incredibly sophisticated. I retract

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Speaker 1: my statement. Beat Boop is an amazing, amazing soundtrack. Okay, okay,

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Speaker 1: let's just point that out now. We We've talked about

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Speaker 1: the history of video games in different contexts in many

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Speaker 1: in many podcasts, um. And not to get back into that,

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Speaker 1: but you know, video games are are several decades old, now, Okay.

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Speaker 1: The first one that I found, according to my research,

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Speaker 1: was Pong Nolan Bushnell's amazing video game Pong with Magnificent Octopus,

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Speaker 1: his Magnificent Octopus. I actually, actually I I still enjoy

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Speaker 1: Pong to something degree. It's very simple, but sometimes the

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Speaker 1: simple games are are fun. I was just played exclusively.

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Speaker 1: If there's no paint for me to watch dry, I

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Speaker 1: love a Pong alright, well, alright, but yes, I actually

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Speaker 1: do like playing Pong too. I'm just I'm grouchy because

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Speaker 1: my medication is wearing of note to self, don't record

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Speaker 1: more podcasts with with Jonathan when he's sick. Um. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: Pong Okay, we're not talking a lot of soundtrack here,

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Speaker 1: but it did have at least have noise. It had

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Speaker 1: sound sound effects that went along with the ball hitting

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Speaker 1: the paddle and then of course the ball missing the paddle,

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Speaker 1: also hitting the walls and hitting the walls yes, boop whoop.

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Speaker 1: And to elaborate on that, before Palm came out, there

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Speaker 1: were a few home game systems, but none of them

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Speaker 1: incorporate sound. They were absolutely silent. Yep, yep. Now, UM

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Speaker 1: one of the games that I had sort of forgotten about,

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Speaker 1: and basically I went to UH in search of video

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Speaker 1: game music history and I found it a really awesome

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Speaker 1: timeline by Glenn McDonald out there. If you can find

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Speaker 1: it should be pretty easy to find. UM. But he

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Speaker 1: brought up one that I had completely forgotten and didn't

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Speaker 1: think of as a video game, but and it's really

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Speaker 1: I guess technically not but as an electronic game, Simon,

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Speaker 1: And I didn't realize it was that old. UM. But yeah, Simon.

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Speaker 1: It revolves around sound because you're trying to match the

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Speaker 1: colors and and lights and sounds UM in a pattern.

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Speaker 1: And it's a very very simple game. You just try

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Speaker 1: to repeat it goes you know, from the first note

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Speaker 1: to the second note of the third and you're supposed

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Speaker 1: to repeat back the atter in it plays for you

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Speaker 1: and until you finally miss one and it buzzes. It

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Speaker 1: gets too complex for you to be able to follow.

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Speaker 1: But but yeah, it's it's funny because I had I

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Speaker 1: had completely not thought about that as an electronic uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, a step in the history of electronic gaming

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Speaker 1: and the sound UM. But the next one he mentioned

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Speaker 1: was another favorite of mine back from my days hanging

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Speaker 1: out at the skating rink, UM Tito's Gunfight UM, which

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Speaker 1: was the first to use rather than using hardwired circuits,

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Speaker 1: it used the actual microprocessor to make the sounds. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we should point out that these early game systems, everything

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Speaker 1: was hardwired into the console. Like the Pong game. You

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Speaker 1: couldn't play other games on that system. That's all it did.

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Speaker 1: Let's play the variations of Pong, and so all the

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Speaker 1: sounds that the console could make were hardwired into the circuitry. Um.

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Speaker 1: There was nothing beyond that. And a lot of these

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Speaker 1: early games like Simon, same thing. If you had assignment,

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Speaker 1: It's not like you could suddenly play music. I mean,

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Speaker 1: apart from music that would have four notes to it

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Speaker 1: and a little noise if you got anything wrong wrong.

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Speaker 1: You couldn't play a song on it, no, because it

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Speaker 1: only had those four tones that was capable of making. Yes,

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Speaker 1: now that's you know, in in contrast to two other machines. UM. Actually,

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Speaker 1: it reminds me a little bit of Loops, which just

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Speaker 1: came out in the last year. I have one of those.

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Speaker 1: You do have loops, so do I. That's funny. I

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Speaker 1: didn't know that, but yeah, you can. You can actually

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Speaker 1: play music on that to some degree. But the sounds,

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Speaker 1: they're far more advanced sounds on that. UM. Another system actually,

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Speaker 1: one that I owned, the Attar, also had hardwired sounds

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Speaker 1: on it. UM you were you were limited the people

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Speaker 1: who would program games that would come on the cartridges,

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Speaker 1: which are using ROMs you snap into place in the

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Speaker 1: cartridge slot read only memory. Yes. Uh, the people who

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Speaker 1: programmed games had to take advantage of the sounds that

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Speaker 1: are hardwired into the console itself. It's a very limited

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Speaker 1: sound library and so you know what what you had

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Speaker 1: to deal with was, you know, your standard and lots

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Speaker 1: of little I still remember the McDonald brought it up,

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Speaker 1: but I still remember the tank sound from combat that right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there were there were various beeps and bloops that were

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Speaker 1: at different pitches, so you could make some very very

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Speaker 1: primitive music. Essentially would program it, hard program it onto

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Speaker 1: the cartridge and that would tell the console, okay, make

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Speaker 1: these noises. So this is still like besides the Gunfight game.

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Speaker 1: These are more like Simon, and as far as music goes,

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Speaker 1: they're more like Simon than they are a computer with

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Speaker 1: a dedicated sound card or system for handling sound files. Yes,

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Speaker 1: just just to to clarify, Gunfight was an our standalone

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Speaker 1: arcade game, and so was the initial version of Pong.

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Speaker 1: But there were Pong in its many many clones made

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Speaker 1: it into the home and along with the UM But

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Speaker 1: do you know what the the first UH system was

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Speaker 1: that took advantage that didn't have to be hardwired on

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Speaker 1: a home system. UH. If I had to guess, I'd

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Speaker 1: say it was the NES UH. No, Actually it was

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Speaker 1: another system that you probably did not have. I don't

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Speaker 1: think you've ever mentioned having that. The Odyssey to UH

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Speaker 1: had programmable stop laughing, had programmable cartridges and the programmers

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Speaker 1: could encode sound a sound library on the cartridge itself.

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Speaker 1: Um so, and it also had speech synthesis, which explained

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Speaker 1: why it sold so well. Oh wait a minute, the

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Speaker 1: Intellivision also had speech synthesis usually was pretty primitive. There

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Speaker 1: were normally just a few words that each game would

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Speaker 1: be able to do. I had B seventeen balm or

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Speaker 1: that's exactly how it's on it too. I'm not if

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Speaker 1: any of you guys had that game out there, you

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Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about. Well, actually, uh, McDonald said

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Speaker 1: that Major League Baseball was the first talking game. Did

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Speaker 1: you have that one with Strike? Yeah? Yeah, I had

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Speaker 1: that game as well. I'm not proud of this, it's okay. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know what. At the time though, it was, it

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Speaker 1: was a big deal and it's funny. Uh Uh. One

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Speaker 1: of the things that he that McDonald pointed out in

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Speaker 1: his timeline was, um, even though these systems were primitive

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Speaker 1: in terms of sound design and soundscaping, uh, compared to now,

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Speaker 1: I mean what we have now we've got actual songs

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Speaker 1: from regular recording arts that are actually encoded into the game. Um. Well,

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Speaker 1: even without that level of sophistication, they still provided um

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Speaker 1: a lot of context and character and richness for the

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Speaker 1: game player. Uh. He specifically mentioned Space Invaders because you

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Speaker 1: hear the marching and and as they get closer and

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Speaker 1: closer to the planet, it speeds up, and you hear

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Speaker 1: the sound of it speed up, and then that you know, constant,

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Speaker 1: you know, triggers your panic response. It does. And you

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Speaker 1: wouldn't think, you know, yeah, that's that's kids stuff, that's

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Speaker 1: no big deal. It really does have an effect, and

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Speaker 1: it has effect on how you feel when you're playing

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Speaker 1: the game and increases your uh, your desire to kill

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Speaker 1: off those little buggers so you can face another wave

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Speaker 1: of those little buggers. And some of the early ar

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Speaker 1: kid games like well, you know, things like pac Man

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Speaker 1: and Donkey Kong had their little, little tiny elements of

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Speaker 1: music to them. It was almost like a jingle for

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Speaker 1: a commercial in the sense that it was not terribly sophisticated,

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Speaker 1: not terribly lone, but very very catching. Right do do

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Speaker 1: do do do do do? Yeah, you can do that

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Speaker 1: if you if you try that to someone and they

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Speaker 1: do that what Chris just did. That means that they

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Speaker 1: were around in the early eighties and they played a

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Speaker 1: lot of Donkey Kong yes um Unfo Sinately, as I

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Speaker 1: was doing research for this podcast, I got sidelined by

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Speaker 1: VG Music dot com is the video game Music Archive,

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Speaker 1: and it has all those different files that you could

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Speaker 1: listen to the music from those video games. There's a

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Speaker 1: good hour of my life that just disappeared, and I

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Speaker 1: don't know where it went. Well, let's do you mind

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Speaker 1: if I if I skip ahead a bit. I mean

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Speaker 1: we're talking about a lot of the Arcade games and

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Speaker 1: a lot of the the like Atari bas games. But

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Speaker 1: really the Atari system was pretty primitive. I was just

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Speaker 1: gonna ask you a triviuta, a quick trivia question. Hit me,

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Speaker 1: do you know? Really I'm grouchy. He never says that

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Speaker 1: I will take it out on tyler Um. He had

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Speaker 1: one thing to do today. Okay, So do you know

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Speaker 1: who wrote the music for Donkey Kong? I do not.

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Speaker 1: It was, in fact Miyamoto San himself, Miamoto, Yes, Shigeru

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Speaker 1: Miyamoto who wrote the music for for Donkey Kong on

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Speaker 1: a small electronic keyboard, according to UH. According to Glenn McDonald,

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Speaker 1: so Miyamoto is a giant the game industry. But I

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Speaker 1: had no idea. And it's it's funny to show you that.

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Speaker 1: That again shows you what how ground level he was.

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Speaker 1: And this whole thing, well, the reason why I was

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Speaker 1: going to skip ahead, was that if if we want

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Speaker 1: to talk about home consoles, which really, yeah, we eventually

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Speaker 1: are going to be focusing mostly on the console system

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Speaker 1: because you know, the arcades eventually faded from popularity, not

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Speaker 1: that they don't exist anymore, but in the United States

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Speaker 1: they're few and far between, and the development for games

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Speaker 1: tends to be more focused on the home market than

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Speaker 1: on the arcade market in the United States. There's still

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Speaker 1: places like Japan arcades are huge, but um not in

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Speaker 1: the United States so much. Well, I wanted to talk

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Speaker 1: about the original Nintendo system and how it was kind

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Speaker 1: of a huge jump ahead of everything else. Now, one

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Speaker 1: of the reasons why when I say huge jump ahead,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's primitive compared to today's consoles, but at

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Speaker 1: the time was a big deal. It had four whole

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Speaker 1: channels for music. Well, when you think about it, was

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Speaker 1: came out in the mid eighties and four channel stereo

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Speaker 1: was kind of a big deal. Yeah, And you've got

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Speaker 1: to remember that most of these game systems had one channel, like,

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Speaker 1: so if there was a sound effect, it had to

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Speaker 1: interrupt the music or so if there's so like when

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Speaker 1: Mario would jump in Dulu, do the they'tle thing it

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Speaker 1: would it would interrupt the music in the middle of it. Um. So,

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Speaker 1: so having a system that would allow you to play

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Speaker 1: four channels of sound was a big deal. Now, one

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Speaker 1: of those channels was usually used for sound effects, and

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Speaker 1: the other three would be used in various forms for music. UM.

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Speaker 1: I read about game composers who would try and try

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Speaker 1: figure out ways to make a a four note chord,

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Speaker 1: which is hard to do if you've only got three channels.

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Speaker 1: So what they would do is they would do a

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Speaker 1: instead of doing a true chord, they would do essentially

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Speaker 1: a broken chord. They would play the notes back to

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Speaker 1: back so quickly that to us it sounds almost like

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Speaker 1: they were played simultaneously. So so you would get the

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Speaker 1: effect of the chord without actually truly playing a chord.

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Speaker 1: And then there were other game developers who would allow

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Speaker 1: for music to take over and then when a sound

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Speaker 1: effect comes in, it would drop one channel out of

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Speaker 1: the four out so the sound effect could take place. Um. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because typically, uh, you know, I'm sure a lot of

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Speaker 1: our musician listeners are going to say, well, would you know,

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Speaker 1: chord really only requires three notes, but you would want, um,

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Speaker 1: the richness and depth of additional octaves in there too, right,

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Speaker 1: And and I want to mention one guy in particular

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Speaker 1: as really being instrumental, if you will, for you in

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Speaker 1: the development of video game music as far as as

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Speaker 1: its effect in the game industry. I'm interested to see

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Speaker 1: who this is. Cochi Condo, the composer for both Super

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Speaker 1: Mario Brothers and Legend of Zelda. And that's the reason

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Speaker 1: why I'm singling out Cochi Condo. And please people don't

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Speaker 1: write into me and tell me that I should talk

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Speaker 1: about some other composer, because we're gonna talk about a

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Speaker 1: few others before the end of this. But the reason

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Speaker 1: why I wanted to single him out and mentioned him

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Speaker 1: is because, uh, he sort of created this this idea

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Speaker 1: in the video games of different environments having different soundtracks, right,

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Speaker 1: so when you moved from one environment into another, you

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Speaker 1: would get a new uh tune playing in the background,

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Speaker 1: and this would enhance your your video gaming experience. That

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Speaker 1: was Super Mario Brothers. It was pretty simple. There was

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Speaker 1: one tune for when you were above ground, and there

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Speaker 1: was one tune when you were in the dungeon levels,

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Speaker 1: and then I think there was a different one when

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Speaker 1: you were underwater. So the interesting part there is that

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Speaker 1: this this really gave composers for video games that really

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Speaker 1: gave them a shot in the arms, saying, oh, you know,

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Speaker 1: this can be more than just adding a little extra

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Speaker 1: element into a video game. It's more than just the

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Speaker 1: icing on the cake. There's there's an element here that

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Speaker 1: can be intrinsic to the video game playing experience. Now,

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Speaker 1: at the time, most of the composers for video games

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Speaker 1: were working exclusively with one developer, and in a way,

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Speaker 1: actually some of the earliest video games, the composers were

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Speaker 1: people who were just on staff who happened to also

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Speaker 1: be musicians. So, you know, in the video game industry

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Speaker 1: when it first started out, they didn't have the resources

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Speaker 1: or the cloud really or the prestige to attract quote

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Speaker 1: unquote real composers. Now, I say quote unquote because I

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Speaker 1: consider the guys who came up with these video game

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Speaker 1: tunes to be real composers, because I mean a lot

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Speaker 1: of these tunes I'm still a big fan of. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're you're speaking of people who are dedicated to composing.

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Speaker 1: That what they do, that's that's their main And then

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Speaker 1: eventually you got to a point where video game developers

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Speaker 1: would be able to hire someone who specifically specialized in music,

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Speaker 1: but even then they were another person in the company payroll.

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Speaker 1: It's not like you commissioned someone to compose music for

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Speaker 1: your video game. The thing that makes the video game

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Speaker 1: music really interesting that I think uh kachy Condo uh

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Speaker 1: kind of launched was this idea of the interactive experience,

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Speaker 1: and that things that the player does changes the environment

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Speaker 1: in some way, and in this case, it would change

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Speaker 1: the music that's playing in the background depending on where

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Speaker 1: the player was. And that's fundamentally a different experience than

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Speaker 1: composing music for either a film or just composing music period,

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Speaker 1: like creating a symphony, right because in those it's the

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Speaker 1: audience is passive. There's nothing the audience can do that's

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Speaker 1: going to alter the progressional music sort of causing a

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Speaker 1: scene at a life symphony. Don't do that, by the way,

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Speaker 1: I've done hundreds of years ago. I don't want to

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Speaker 1: do that anymore. I'm tired of being thrown out of

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Speaker 1: all the symphony halls in the United States though I

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Speaker 1: couldn't you know what to him, but throughout the Opera

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Speaker 1: House in Sydney. So anyway, the there's a goal the

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Speaker 1: it's it's it seems like it would almost be closer

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Speaker 1: to movie music and in a lot of ways than

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Speaker 1: it would be to traditional symphonic music, because it's programmatic,

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Speaker 1: it has a it has a theme to it, and

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Speaker 1: it actually is helping tell the story. Right, It's meant

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Speaker 1: to help elevate the experience. But even with movie music,

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Speaker 1: you still have a set, uh set series of events. Right,

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Speaker 1: that's exactly exactly. But but to just to elaborate on

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Speaker 1: your point, the reason why it's even different from that

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Speaker 1: is the second time you watch that movie, that movie,

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Speaker 1: unless you're watching some really weird choose your own adventure

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Speaker 1: thing is going to progress the exact same way, so

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Speaker 1: that the first time clue any and the hundredth time, okay,

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Speaker 1: sure clue the end of Clue for those of you

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Speaker 1: who don't know, Clue came out in four starring Tim

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Speaker 1: Curry and it was phenomenal and had three different dings. Um.

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Speaker 1: But but apart from that, in most situations, the the

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Speaker 1: eight hundredth time you watch the movie is going to

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Speaker 1: be the same as the first as far as the

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Speaker 1: progression of scenes go, barring director's cuts and all that mess.

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Speaker 1: So in other words, the composer does not have to

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Speaker 1: create musical segues or musical themes that will be incorporated

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Speaker 1: or perhaps mixed in with other themes based upon what

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Speaker 1: the characters going through. So this is also the era

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Speaker 1: in which I think, possibly because a lot of us

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Speaker 1: grew up with this type of music, but I think

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Speaker 1: this era is also what inspired, um, what would later become. Uh.

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Speaker 1: You know people who play these kinds of video game

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Speaker 1: scores for others as you know, a symphonic piece and things,

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Speaker 1: because some of this music is just so memorable for us. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And I wanted to mention, um the work of no

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Speaker 1: Boo Boo Yomatsu, is that the guy who did Final Fantasy,

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Speaker 1: because that for so many people, is that's like a

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Speaker 1: big deal, the definitive video game music for a large

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Speaker 1: portion of the players out there. Not me because I

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Speaker 1: like playing games, that makes sense. But you know, people

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Speaker 1: who enjoy Final Fantasy. I don't know what's wrong with you,

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Speaker 1: but they're all I'm on medication. Yeah, blame it on

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Speaker 1: that direct your hate mail too, Um, but no, they

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Speaker 1: but yeah they Final Fantasy has soundtracks available. Um, and

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Speaker 1: you know, I don't know that when all of this

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Speaker 1: started when the video game craze started, people would have

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Speaker 1: assumed that this's you buy a soundtrack for a video game.

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Speaker 1: Maybe not, but it happens, and it's not unusual anymore. No.

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Speaker 1: In fact, and and there are live performances video everything

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Speaker 1: from I've seen some great a cappella renditions of classic

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Speaker 1: video game music where they run through several like including

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Speaker 1: Super Mario Brothers and the Legend of Zelda, and and

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Speaker 1: and you know the classic games of the NES era

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Speaker 1: all the way up. Yeah. See, that's that's all from

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Speaker 1: this period. So I think that's this That period is

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Speaker 1: really when it's taken off to the point where it's

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Speaker 1: something that's noticeable, right and then so so the NES

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Speaker 1: really helps set some standards. The next big leap was

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Speaker 1: probably from in n with the introduction of the Sony PlayStation.

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Speaker 1: So I mean this is a big leap, okay, there

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Speaker 1: there there were, Yeah, there were incremental improvements with the

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Speaker 1: systems between the NES and when the PlayStation came out.

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Speaker 1: Don't get me wrong, Um there were and there were

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Speaker 1: some great video games songs that came out during that time.

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Speaker 1: But when the Sony PlayStation came out, that allowed up

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Speaker 1: to twenty four sampled voices. Yes to play um now

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Speaker 1: again in the in the previous generation, and yes, you

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Speaker 1: could only play discreet sounds capable that that that the

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Speaker 1: machine was capable of sending to the TV. The PlayStation

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Speaker 1: allows you to actually sample music yep, and even and

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Speaker 1: even to let you use effects like looping in reverb

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Speaker 1: what you you couldn't do before. And it and it

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Speaker 1: also you know, had CD equality c D quality audio

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Speaker 1: since rather than using cartridges as so many of these

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Speaker 1: other games did in the past, we were actually dealing

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Speaker 1: with an optical disc and it allowed for three different

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Speaker 1: types of music within video games. The first one bad

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Speaker 1: and carible. You could argue that the first one was

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Speaker 1: musical instrument digital interface middi midi uh now miny is

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Speaker 1: it's essentially like a language really uh and depending upon

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Speaker 1: the synthesizer that's in your UM what I was just

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Speaker 1: going to mention, you know, some of them are very

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Speaker 1: tiny and give you the force, good lord, So not

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Speaker 1: the many Glorians, um, I do hate them. Passion that

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Speaker 1: birds brighter than the exploding suns, so so many, so many.

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Speaker 1: You know. It's it's a like any any device in

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Speaker 1: a computer that has a synthesizer in it can play

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Speaker 1: back the information stored in a MIDI file and um,

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Speaker 1: depending upon the synthesizer, it all sound different in each machine, right,

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Speaker 1: So it's so many is not like a standardized sound

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Speaker 1: as a standardized way of recording, like of presenting music.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of like a piano role an old player piano.

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Speaker 1: So you have two different player pianos, and one of

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Speaker 1: them is in the style of grand piano, and one

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Speaker 1: of them is in the style of a honky tonk piano,

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Speaker 1: and you put the same role of piano player paper

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Speaker 1: in them. One of them is gonna sound very different

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Speaker 1: from the other, even though they're both playing the same notes. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so the Sunny PlayStation was capable of playing mini music.

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Speaker 1: It was also capable of playing mods or digital modules. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I remember that now. It's worth noting that some computers

388
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Speaker 1: had been using these different types of formats for years,

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Speaker 1: but they weren't really common in home video game consoles,

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Speaker 1: probably because the hardware I'm guessing hardware needed uh to

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Speaker 1: do that was probably going to be pretty expensive comparatively

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Speaker 1: in computer games. This this ability had been there for

393
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Speaker 1: years because this is the era when we've already got

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Speaker 1: sound cards for computers like sound Blaster and Roland and

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Speaker 1: all those devices that would come out, and you would

396
00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:43,560
Speaker 1: you would actually install the sound card into your computer,

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Speaker 1: which would give your computer the capability of playing back

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Speaker 1: these kinds of sounds plug speakers and to them, and

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Speaker 1: the need to have that music. This was before computers

400
00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:55,280
Speaker 1: would come standard with sound cards. Now, most times if

401
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:57,160
Speaker 1: you go out and buy a computer, there's at least

402
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Speaker 1: some sort of sound card pre installed where it will

403
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:04,080
Speaker 1: play back these these file formats. But back in the day,

404
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:06,960
Speaker 1: you had to do it yourself. Now, like I said,

405
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:08,440
Speaker 1: it took like Chris was saying, it took a while

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Speaker 1: for the consoles to catch up, and Sony PlayStation was

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Speaker 1: the first one. So so these digital modules. What was

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00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:17,000
Speaker 1: interesting to me about these is that it would allow

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Speaker 1: you to record the sound of an individual note of

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Speaker 1: of a particular instrument. So you would record every sound

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Speaker 1: that a tenor saxophone can play individually, each note. You

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Speaker 1: then record every single note that a that a a

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Speaker 1: piccolo can play. You would record every single note that

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Speaker 1: a violin can play, and so you would have a

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00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,160
Speaker 1: sample of each of those notes, and then you could

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Speaker 1: build music based on that library of sounds and the

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00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 1: various notes they are able to play, and you could

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00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 1: um sort of synthesize the sound of actual music and

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00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:58,879
Speaker 1: it it was okay, I mean it wasn't you know.

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00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,440
Speaker 1: It was obviously synthesized stuff. But if you were really

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Speaker 1: good at programming with mods, you could make some some

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Speaker 1: decent music. Now, the problem is that mods are tend

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Speaker 1: to be larger file sizes. MIDI is actually a very

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Speaker 1: small file size, yes, and so that's one of the

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Speaker 1: reasons why it was so popular in early games, because

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Speaker 1: it didn't take up a lot of space and you

427
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:28,600
Speaker 1: could dedicate that space for things like gameplay. It's also

428
00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:33,960
Speaker 1: why it was so popular and the mides on people's

429
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:36,919
Speaker 1: home pages, yes, because you could host a MIDI file

430
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:38,960
Speaker 1: on your homepage and you didn't have to worry about

431
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 1: going over your tiny little cap for your web page.

432
00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:44,119
Speaker 1: So that's why if you visited a web page in

433
00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:46,639
Speaker 1: the early nineties, early to mid nineties, you had that

434
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:51,119
Speaker 1: looping midi that played some irritating tune and it was terrible.

435
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 1: And I had those for me. It was Rule Britannia

436
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:56,760
Speaker 1: was one of them, and Yoho a Pirate's Life for

437
00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:59,000
Speaker 1: me another because I had a page on the British

438
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,440
Speaker 1: Navy and on a page on piracy, and you'll never

439
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:05,240
Speaker 1: find them people, so don't worry about it. I think

440
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:06,960
Speaker 1: even if you win the way Back Machine you would

441
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:09,199
Speaker 1: have trouble finding it. I can't even tell you what

442
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:12,040
Speaker 1: the address is now. It's too long. That's just funny.

443
00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:17,960
Speaker 1: So we're releasing the Jonathan Strickland find his homepage from

444
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 1: Don't Don't. I really don't want to see that again.

445
00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:25,040
Speaker 1: But okay, So so it could play the MIDI files,

446
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:26,360
Speaker 1: you can play the mod files, I said, I could

447
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 1: play three different times of music. The third was referred

448
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,960
Speaker 1: to at the time as red Book red Book, which

449
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 1: is now red Book. Of course, you could make CD

450
00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 1: equality music, so you could create a song or or

451
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 1: a score with a full orchestra if you wanted to

452
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:47,679
Speaker 1: record it to this format, and it would play it

453
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,240
Speaker 1: back like that. But the problem is that it takes

454
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: a lot of processor power to do it. And the

455
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,400
Speaker 1: article I read, which let me let me pull out

456
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:59,800
Speaker 1: the title here, it was specific. The article is called

457
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:04,440
Speaker 1: do game music Not just kids Stuff? By Matthew blinky Um.

458
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 1: He said that engineers at the time called it stealing

459
00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:11,320
Speaker 1: time from the laser because the lasers meant to let

460
00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:13,480
Speaker 1: you play the game. I was reading the data off

461
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: of the CD, and if you were dedicating some of

462
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:20,040
Speaker 1: that to audio, it was stealing that time to play

463
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:24,400
Speaker 1: audio rather than to play the game. So um, that

464
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:27,840
Speaker 1: was But the PlayStation era really kind of push things

465
00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:31,080
Speaker 1: to a new level. And uh and since then, we've

466
00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:35,440
Speaker 1: got much more sophisticated consoles that are essentially just specialized

467
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:38,360
Speaker 1: computers that could do it essentially the same thing computers

468
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:40,119
Speaker 1: can do. So they can read all the different foul

469
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 1: formats that computers can read. So depending upon what the person,

470
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 1: what the video game developers preferences, that's what you're gonna get.

471
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,240
Speaker 1: And UM, did you want to add anything. I've got

472
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,320
Speaker 1: a list of some of some composers I wanted to

473
00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:55,920
Speaker 1: go through, but um, and we've mentioned a couple of

474
00:27:55,920 --> 00:28:02,440
Speaker 1: them already. I wanted to, uh to mention another note. Um,

475
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:04,679
Speaker 1: and this is actually something that sort of came up

476
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:11,120
Speaker 1: in our Sega Saga podcast. Um. Do you remember Resident Evil. Yes,

477
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 1: it was one of the very first games to start

478
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:19,240
Speaker 1: using realistic sound effects, which when you're playing a survival

479
00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:23,160
Speaker 1: horror game that's important can be it's very important. Again,

480
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,919
Speaker 1: it adds a lot of depth and feeling to the

481
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:29,199
Speaker 1: game that you wouldn't have gotten with just music. But

482
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,360
Speaker 1: it's also uh taking us a little that that other

483
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:35,719
Speaker 1: step closer to being in sort of an interactive movie

484
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,640
Speaker 1: environment where things are you you do have some control

485
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 1: over it, but it's much more realistic and cinematic than

486
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:47,880
Speaker 1: it would have been playing you know, berserk. Yeah, you know,

487
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 1: also not zombies, but you know still yes, don't touch

488
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 1: the walls. Um. Yeah. And you know we mentioned earlier

489
00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 1: about live performances of these. One of the performance, as

490
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:05,160
Speaker 1: I should mention, is it's a touring show called Video

491
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 1: Games Live. Ah, yes, I remember that. It's an orchestral

492
00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 1: performance of video game music. And they even do things

493
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:14,720
Speaker 1: like they'll they'll do. There's usually a section that walks

494
00:29:14,760 --> 00:29:17,440
Speaker 1: you through the early early days of video gaming, where

495
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:19,360
Speaker 1: like I was saying, you know, the songs tend to

496
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 1: be of jingle length. You know, it might be at

497
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 1: most thirty seconds of music that would loop and so,

498
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 1: but they'll they'll play that, and and it even begins

499
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: usually humorously with pong, where the entire orchestra is going

500
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: bing bong, bing bong. But works its way up to

501
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 1: some of my favorites like Elevator Action and Gauntlet Tolude

502
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: do anyway, So the those that's a fun way of

503
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,719
Speaker 1: going to to experience this video game music, and they

504
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: do work their way up to more modern songs. And

505
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,560
Speaker 1: in fact, there have been some composers for television and

506
00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 1: movies who have composed music for video deo games. So, um,

507
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 1: I have a quick list of some of the folks

508
00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 1: that I think would be interesting. Just to mention Clint

509
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: Bahakian I hope I'm seeing his name correctly. B A

510
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: J A K I A n. Is the fellow who

511
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:18,080
Speaker 1: wrote the music for Star Wars Knights of the Old

512
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:21,440
Speaker 1: Republic as well some other Star Wars. So here's here's

513
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 1: a challenge is taking a franchise which already has a

514
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 1: very established sound to it, right, so you have to

515
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 1: essentially take the foundation that John Williams, the composer for

516
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 1: the original movies, that the foundation he created, and then

517
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:40,080
Speaker 1: to build on that in a way that is respectful

518
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:42,680
Speaker 1: and yet is not just a carbon copy of what's

519
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:48,600
Speaker 1: already come before. Um here's uh Mark Barrel, who wrote

520
00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 1: the music for the Crash Bandicoot series, do a barrel roll,

521
00:30:52,480 --> 00:31:01,000
Speaker 1: barrel roll. Uh. David burgoed Ratchet and Clank. Uh. Greg

522
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:05,200
Speaker 1: Edmondson who did the music for Uncharted in Firefly. There

523
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:09,560
Speaker 1: you go. See, there's that that crossover. Uh. There's Dan

524
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 1: ford in he did Mortal Kombat. Get over here. Um.

525
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,400
Speaker 1: Jason Hayes did the music for World of Warcraft. Uh.

526
00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 1: Let's see Michael Michael Hinnig who wrote the music for

527
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 1: Balder's Gate, one of the games I really enjoyed playing. Um.

528
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 1: Let's see. Oh, Michael Hunter, who did the music for

529
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,200
Speaker 1: Grand Theft Auto San Andreas and Grand Theft Auto four.

530
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 1: The theme to Grand Theft Auto four is one of

531
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 1: my favorite video game themes to come out over the

532
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:41,600
Speaker 1: last few years. It's um, it's the Soviet one and

533
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:45,840
Speaker 1: it has this sort of mix between uh, kind of

534
00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 1: a techno sound in the old Soviet sort of music

535
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 1: that that kind of military style music from the Soviet era.

536
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 1: And is I really enjoyed that one quite a bit. Uh.

537
00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 1: Let's see, there's a well we mentioned cog On though,

538
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 1: of course. Um. There is Michael Land who wrote one

539
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:10,240
Speaker 1: of my favorite, probably my favorite video game score of

540
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:13,000
Speaker 1: all time. Do you know what that is? It's the

541
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 1: Monkey Island Games, The Monkey. I actually have the theme

542
00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: to the to the Monkey Island Games on my MP

543
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:23,640
Speaker 1: three player because that's how much. That's the only video

544
00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 1: game song. No wait, I'm sorry. I also grant the

545
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:27,719
Speaker 1: thought of four on there, but those are the only

546
00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 1: two video game songs I have on my MP three player. Uh.

547
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 1: There's Robin Miller, who wrote the music for Missed and Riven.

548
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:38,200
Speaker 1: Now you could argue that the music in those games

549
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:41,320
Speaker 1: was very much important to the role of the game,

550
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: to to really get that feeling across. And then I

551
00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 1: have Martin O'Donnell, who wrote the music to the Halo series,

552
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 1: which is very distinctive with the the Men's chorus, and

553
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:57,480
Speaker 1: then later on there's a full chorus. Uh. It's actually

554
00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:00,480
Speaker 1: really some cool stuff. And what's funny is that, as

555
00:33:00,520 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 1: I recall the original recording of the Men's Chorus were

556
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 1: that was actually guys who are working for Bungee who

557
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 1: got together in a recording studio and oh, they just

558
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:16,960
Speaker 1: they all just sang into the microphones. And I apologize people,

559
00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:19,520
Speaker 1: I'm sick. I don't know what I'm doing. But yeah,

560
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:22,360
Speaker 1: that's that's my my list. Now. I know there's a

561
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 1: Bowels and other video game composers out there. But that's

562
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 1: that's just a quick list that I grab together, you know.

563
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,920
Speaker 1: You know one, I'm surprised you didn't mention who's that

564
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,520
Speaker 1: Michael Giaquino. Oh, yes, Yes, Michael Giaquino, who who went

565
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 1: on to write the music for television like Lost, Yes,

566
00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 1: and The Incredibles, which is I'm actually more of a

567
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:44,520
Speaker 1: fan of his, his his movie music. He wrote for

568
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:48,360
Speaker 1: music for Medal of Honor. Right, Yes he did, see

569
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 1: it's all up there somewhere there, you go. I didn't

570
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 1: even have that written down. And that's the funny thing too,

571
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:55,240
Speaker 1: when you now that now that we have this kind

572
00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:58,320
Speaker 1: of level of crossover that we we really didn't have

573
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:01,760
Speaker 1: before between move movies, TV and video games. I mean,

574
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 1: they're all franchising one another. Once you come up with

575
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:08,120
Speaker 1: a good title, you try to hit as many variations

576
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: of media as he possibly can, so their crossovers too.

577
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:12,279
Speaker 1: He also, you know, he also did the music for

578
00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 1: Alias Um. But did the video games too, I mean,

579
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:21,359
Speaker 1: the the the incredible game up Rattui. I'm just looking

580
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:22,839
Speaker 1: at some of the video game titles. You can see

581
00:34:22,880 --> 00:34:24,640
Speaker 1: him on his sight. But yes, he did the whole

582
00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 1: the U the Medal of Honor series, and also did

583
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:30,840
Speaker 1: a Call of Duty Finest Hour UM and some of

584
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: the other Call of Duty games. So um, it's just

585
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:37,919
Speaker 1: it's just amazing too that it has come this far.

586
00:34:38,040 --> 00:34:40,640
Speaker 1: But wouldn't have been able to do that without the

587
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 1: hardware necessary to to make that happen, and you know,

588
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:46,440
Speaker 1: the programming ability to add that in. And there's some

589
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:48,920
Speaker 1: games out there that do this, do this ability of

590
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:52,320
Speaker 1: this interactive experience of really meshing all the music together

591
00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 1: in ways that are truly phenomenal. For example, the Red

592
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:00,440
Speaker 1: Dead Redemption game. As you know, it's a Western. It's

593
00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:02,359
Speaker 1: setting it's set in the West, just as the Old

594
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: West is dying. It's the turn of the century, so

595
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:09,120
Speaker 1: it's the early and it has a music that changes

596
00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:11,640
Speaker 1: based upon the environment you're in. So when you are

597
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,520
Speaker 1: in the the Old West, it's kind of that Old

598
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 1: West sort of music. When you move into Mexico, it's

599
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:20,439
Speaker 1: a lot of like horns and mariachi style music. But

600
00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 1: it also uses music to songs to a really really

601
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:28,640
Speaker 1: good effect. There's a spoiler alert. Spoiler alert for people

602
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,360
Speaker 1: who have not played Red Dead Redemption yet. When you

603
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 1: first managed to make your way to Mexico. UM as

604
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:39,920
Speaker 1: soon as you land, once you get past the big

605
00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 1: mission that lets you get there, there's a song that

606
00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:46,319
Speaker 1: plays and it it is shocking when you first hear it,

607
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,440
Speaker 1: not for the content of the song, but because you

608
00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: had only been listening to environmental music and uh instrumentation

609
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 1: up to that point. But then you get into Mexico

610
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:58,640
Speaker 1: and an actual song with lyrics and vocals, you know,

611
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: it starts up and that's it's it's so powerful a

612
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,839
Speaker 1: moment that it surprises you. And by the way, don't

613
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 1: get off your horse if you want to listen to

614
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 1: the song, because I found out the hard way when

615
00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:13,480
Speaker 1: I saw something like, oh, there's a plant I need

616
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 1: to pick up, and I got off the horse and

617
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,400
Speaker 1: started picking up. The song faded away, and then I

618
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:19,439
Speaker 1: got on the horse, thinking well, and maybe it'll come back.

619
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:23,359
Speaker 1: New had to reload. But it was really I mean

620
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:27,160
Speaker 1: that that those kind of moments are You can see

621
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:29,759
Speaker 1: that that's built on that foundation from any es days,

622
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:32,879
Speaker 1: you know, and now we're just capable of making much

623
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:36,520
Speaker 1: more sophisticated music than we were back then. So I

624
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 1: expect that the musical aspect of video games will continue

625
00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:41,960
Speaker 1: to grow in importance, and of course we'll we'll continue

626
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:45,360
Speaker 1: to cherish those older tunes that just sort of evoke

627
00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:47,680
Speaker 1: that feeling that we got back when we were you know,

628
00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:52,160
Speaker 1: in our our our our teens, early teens playing various

629
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:56,319
Speaker 1: video games that was awesome, and we didn't even get

630
00:36:56,360 --> 00:37:00,719
Speaker 1: into things like the music games. Yeah, like typically like

631
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:07,359
Speaker 1: Guitar Hero and rock Band and Rapper, the Rapper, the Rapper. Yeah,

632
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:12,279
Speaker 1: all the harmonics games, mean all the harmonics games. Yeah,

633
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,920
Speaker 1: there's there's tons of That's the whole podcast to itself,

634
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,800
Speaker 1: just where music is the gameplay. It's not just to

635
00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:21,480
Speaker 1: to enrich it, but it is the gameplay. A lot

636
00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 1: to do another episode on that at some point. So

637
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,080
Speaker 1: let's wrap this one up. If you guys have any

638
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:28,399
Speaker 1: what's you know? Tell us what your favorite video game

639
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