Speaker 1: I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset.
Speaker 2: When I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset.
Speaker 1: And when I find my.
Speaker 3: Ball in a brid egg Friday egg, the dreaded Friday
Speaker 3: Friday Frida egg brid Egg Frida egg bride egg Lie.
Speaker 2: I'm about ready to run off of the hup course.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to another edition of the Friday Golf Podcast.
Speaker 2: I am your host, Andy Johnson, and we are going
Speaker 2: to talk about the twenty twenty five Players Championship which
Speaker 2: was won by Rory McElroy on Monday morning. I am
Speaker 2: joined on this podcast by Gabby Herzigg of The Athletic.
Speaker 2: She was on site. I was on site until Saturday.
Speaker 2: It was delightful there, it was really great. And then
Speaker 2: on the back half I am joined by Kyle Porter
Speaker 2: of Normal Sport. So two great guests to kind of
Speaker 2: talking about the big stories to come out of the Players.
Speaker 2: Each of them. I asked to pick out three things
Speaker 2: to talk about, So before we get to Gabby and Kyle,
Speaker 2: let's talk about our partner club champion. It was really
Speaker 2: windy on Saturday and Sunday at the Players. It was awesome,
Speaker 2: awesome viewing and to me when the win picks up.
Speaker 2: That's where it's most important to have your equipment dialed.
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Speaker 2: try any type of club with any type of shaft
Speaker 2: and you and see you know what works best for you.
Speaker 2: I am a huge, huge proponent of this. I think
Speaker 2: like when you see the heavy wind and balls that
Speaker 2: managed to pierce through it, these are generally players that
Speaker 2: have you don't know how to hit shots, but also
Speaker 2: have that club really optimized so that their ball can
Speaker 2: be kind of heavy through the wind. And we saw,
Speaker 2: you know, two supreme players with irons battling it out
Speaker 2: with Rory McElroy and JJ Spahd who's turned into an
Speaker 2: elite iron player. They both hit heavy balls. If you
Speaker 2: want to hit a heavy ball, if you want to
Speaker 2: get optimized, you want to get your clubs dialed in,
Speaker 2: go to Club Champion dot com slash Frida egg and
Speaker 2: use the promo code Frida Egg. You'll get a free
Speaker 2: driver or iron fitting with a club purchase using the
Speaker 2: code Frida Egg. That's Club Champion dot Com slash Frida Egg.
Speaker 2: All right, let's get to Gabby Herzig from The Athletic.
Speaker 2: All right, we welcome on Gabby Herzig, staff writer from
Speaker 2: The Athletic, a New York Times company. You know, very fancy.
Speaker 2: You know, if I were you, I'd just say I'm
Speaker 2: a staff writer for the New York Times. But you're
Speaker 2: the Athletic. Anyways, we are. We saw you on the
Speaker 2: ground last week at TPC Sawgrass. You stayed through the playoff.
Speaker 2: I am excited to talk about your experience down there
Speaker 2: and kind of your takeaways from the week. So I
Speaker 2: asked you to come up with three things about the players.
Speaker 2: What's your first thing?
Speaker 3: I guess we could start with the champion himself, Rory McElroy.
Speaker 3: My takeaway about Rory this week is, I know there
Speaker 3: has been so much chatter about the mental side of
Speaker 3: things for him, and he really kind of laid it
Speaker 3: all on the line in his post round interview yesterday
Speaker 3: talking about, you know, walking from the sixteenth to seventeenth
Speaker 3: teen and thinking about his ball going into the water.
Speaker 3: It was very vulnerable Rory. The fact that he would
Speaker 3: admit those things is you know, you don't hear that
Speaker 3: often from a professional athlete of his stature. And but
Speaker 3: I want to talk about Rory's actual golf, his shot
Speaker 3: making specifically. You know, one thing that he mentioned there
Speaker 3: yesterday is this three quarter three quarter nine iron that
Speaker 3: he hit on the seventeenth hole, and it means three
Speaker 3: quarterback swing with three quarter speed and I'm about to
Speaker 3: go hit nine hundred of those on the driving range.
Speaker 3: Try to figure out how to do it, because clearly
Speaker 3: something is working for him. And I just think he
Speaker 3: demonstrated this ability to have a full toolkit of shots
Speaker 3: this week on like you know, maybe we've ever seen,
Speaker 3: especially when he's just not driving the ball well. And
Speaker 3: that's probably why we got to see it more because
Speaker 3: he had to make more shots. You know, I think
Speaker 3: of the six the six hole yesterday or on I
Speaker 3: don't even know what day it is right now, but
Speaker 3: on Sunday he hit in the pine straw and had
Speaker 3: to hit this like forty yard slice around the tree
Speaker 3: and he ended up right of the pin, you know,
Speaker 3: perfect position. It was just one of the coolest shots
Speaker 3: I've ever seen. So that's my first takeaway as we
Speaker 3: you know, we talked about Rory so much, but do
Speaker 3: we talk about his shot making abilities enough. I don't know.
Speaker 2: It's an interesting point because I feel like, I feel
Speaker 2: like if you look at like the Phil Ernie Els
Speaker 2: Jim Furick era really pre the kind of the era
Speaker 2: right before Tiger, it became like it was like normal
Speaker 2: for somebody at age thirty five to be hitting their
Speaker 2: like peak as a golfer, and that that was like
Speaker 2: for a myriad of reasons. It was you know, obviously
Speaker 2: in compared to other sports. Physically you might be past
Speaker 2: your prime a little bit at thirty five. But when
Speaker 2: the game without TrackMan and the technology and the tools
Speaker 2: that are today, I think the game was a little
Speaker 2: bit more nuanced, especially when you considered the spinnier golf ball.
Speaker 2: And you know, like I'm reading this book about about
Speaker 2: Tiger Woods and it's just Steve Williams, Steve Williams really
Speaker 2: retelling it. And Steve Williams talks about when Tiger got
Speaker 2: the solid core golf ball and it was really about control.
Speaker 2: You know, there was added distance, but the control was
Speaker 2: the big piece that it just held in the wind stronger.
Speaker 2: And I think that's the biggest thing from my perspective
Speaker 2: of when I was a kid with a wound ball
Speaker 2: versus now with a solid core ball, was the number
Speaker 2: of shots that you had to have when you're playing
Speaker 2: in the wind. And it makes sense why the maturation
Speaker 2: and the excellence of golf was later when you consider
Speaker 2: all the types of shots. And I think what we've
Speaker 2: seen with Rory over the course of his career is
Speaker 2: he's gone from like this guy that beat up soft
Speaker 2: golf courses where he could overpower them and the margins
Speaker 2: got a little bigger, to now a player that's got
Speaker 2: arguably more shots as many, if not more shots than
Speaker 2: everybody else, and he plays the hard courses the best,
Speaker 2: like us Like. He's been unbelievable in the US Open
Speaker 2: the last really five years. He's probably been the best
Speaker 2: US Open player. Maybe Xander is the best. You know,
Speaker 2: you can make an argument, but it's it's really an
Speaker 2: interesting kind of career arc because it does he obviously
Speaker 2: had their early success, but he is seemingly reaching a
Speaker 2: new level at age thirty five, when most of his
Speaker 2: counterparts at thirty five are kind of slowing down.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he basically said it all. He said, you know,
Speaker 3: I feel like I'm a more complete golfer than I
Speaker 3: ever have been in my career, and to hit that,
Speaker 3: you know, around this time is pretty remarkable. As you said,
Speaker 3: he he just it's funny because he hit what I
Speaker 3: think twenty eight eight fairways, which is like less than
Speaker 3: half of the fairways this week, and yet down the
Speaker 3: stretch the things that it's not it's not those creative
Speaker 3: shots or those escape routes that bring him trouble. It's
Speaker 3: the simple things. And you know, you saw the first
Speaker 3: thing that comes to mind for me is either the
Speaker 3: seven foot birdie put on fifteen or the chip on sixteen,
Speaker 3: which he left in a perfect spot on that green
Speaker 3: and just comes up I think thirteen or fourteen feet short.
Speaker 3: So it's it's interesting to see like the areas that
Speaker 3: he finds like to be his strengths and the ones
Speaker 3: to be his weaknesses. And I think that tells you
Speaker 3: a lot about who he is as a player and
Speaker 3: where his areas of growth need to be. You know,
Speaker 3: clearly he's got a lot of it under control with
Speaker 3: this new you know, the new swing changes he made
Speaker 3: in the off season have seemed to help him tremendously,
Speaker 3: and now it's just like, can he get that, can
Speaker 3: he get over that hump of just you know, him
Speaker 3: against his own brain? Basically?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's what makes God so compelling is
Speaker 2: that you can feel better than you've ever felt about something,
Speaker 2: and then the moment of getting into a golf tournament
Speaker 2: and you can psych yourself out or deep in a
Speaker 2: golf tournament, you can you can put yourself mentally in
Speaker 2: a pretzel. And I think that's one of my big
Speaker 2: takeaways from Rory was just I think this was a
Speaker 2: super important win in terms of his major arc because
Speaker 2: I think it eliminates a lot of that doubt. Well,
Speaker 2: the players is not a major. It also isn't a
Speaker 2: signature event. You know, it is not an event that
Speaker 2: he's It's it's just a it's a conundrum, right, what
Speaker 2: is it?
Speaker 3: Is it not technically a signature event.
Speaker 2: I just don't think it's more than that, right yeah, right, right, right,
Speaker 2: Like this feels more significant than the win at Pebble Beach,
Speaker 2: and so it's like one of those things where like
Speaker 2: it wasn't easy. I don't think it. I think it
Speaker 2: was one that held probably looks back and you make
Speaker 2: it couple of decisions different ways, and you could talk
Speaker 2: yourself into him winning by three or four, but at
Speaker 2: the same time getting it done and winning one in
Speaker 2: those high leverage moments, especially after what happened at Pinehurst
Speaker 2: last year and the the consecutive year after year, the
Speaker 2: LACC and the Saint Andrews, like three years in a row,
Speaker 2: these high leverage moments, just being on the wrong side
Speaker 2: of you know, the breaks and maybe maybe some misplays
Speaker 2: here or there. And I think that that's like a
Speaker 2: big thing for his mental psyche going into the Masters.
Speaker 3: Yeah, on the you know, on the eighteenth green on Sunday,
Speaker 3: you know, him being able to lip in that par putt,
Speaker 3: I just thought to myself, like the margins are just
Speaker 3: so slim here, Like if that ball goes one more
Speaker 3: rotation to the right, like this is a totally different
Speaker 3: story and we might be talking about him in a
Speaker 3: completely different way right now on this podcast. And that's
Speaker 3: what makes this game so baffling, because like inches can
Speaker 3: determine narratives and it's honestly unfair. Like he's been playing
Speaker 3: some incredible golf this season, and I was like asked
Speaker 3: in interviews before the Monday finish happened, like, how would this,
Speaker 3: you know, determine like his year, how we think about
Speaker 3: him for the rest of the major season. And I
Speaker 3: was like, it doesn't if you really think about it,
Speaker 3: it doesn't matter as much as we put emphasis on
Speaker 3: because of those slim margins and those little like bits
Speaker 3: of luck that you can just get or not get.
Speaker 3: So I thought I did think that watching you know,
Speaker 3: the three whole playoff on Monday morning, especially his first
Speaker 3: t shot on sixteen, just literally stepping it up and
Speaker 3: bombing it on down the left side of the fairway.
Speaker 3: He looked so much more confident than he obviously was.
Speaker 3: He told us that later, but he kind of he
Speaker 3: had that energy of like I'm coming out here to
Speaker 3: win a golf tournament, kind of like it goes in
Speaker 3: and out, and then you know, you see how he
Speaker 3: three putts on the seventeenth green, You're like, it's a
Speaker 3: little bit fleeting for him, that feeling and that energy,
Speaker 3: and I think he pulled it off this time, obviously,
Speaker 3: but you exactly how you said, it's so mental, it's all,
Speaker 3: you know, those six inches between the years.
Speaker 2: I think, having watched a lot of the high leverage moments.
Speaker 2: I think the most nerve wracking place maybe outside of
Speaker 2: like short puts coming down the stretch to win is
Speaker 2: the first tee mm hmm. And if you think back
Speaker 2: to like Pinehurst to Lacc to the Open, for the
Speaker 2: most part, he he has just absolutely bludgeoned t shots
Speaker 2: off the first hole like it seemed like the first
Speaker 2: hole energy. I think that's like that's where you get
Speaker 2: the most nerves. You get into the round and you're
Speaker 2: kind of set and you're and then like where your
Speaker 2: nerves are going to come back is when you're trying
Speaker 2: to win something. That's where your hands just like feel weird,
Speaker 2: like when you're standing over a putt.
Speaker 3: Like like spaghetti, like the whole thing. It's just it's
Speaker 3: the worst feeling ever.
Speaker 2: But the the first te he's been so good. It's
Speaker 2: it's it's interesting. I I did think like one of
Speaker 2: the underrated things. You were probably there on the ground
Speaker 2: you might not have seen this. I thought he kind
Speaker 2: of alphad JJ spawn right out of the gate. Did
Speaker 2: you see him like kind of like after they after
Speaker 2: Gary Young did the intro, he kind of walked up
Speaker 2: to him and gave him this like, hey, like he
Speaker 2: was very polite, but it was polite, I felt in
Speaker 2: a very game smith ship way, like it was something
Speaker 2: that was like.
Speaker 3: I'm about to destroy your life, but it's so great
Speaker 3: you're here. Thanks for doing this, man.
Speaker 2: It was. It was totally like a thing that I
Speaker 2: feel like if you were at a at a club
Speaker 2: and the best player in the club was playing someone
Speaker 2: they knew they were better than, and they were in
Speaker 2: a playoff or something, that's exactly what the best player
Speaker 2: in the club would do. It would walk up to
Speaker 2: him and like congratulate them on being there before they
Speaker 2: just go. It was like an interesting because then he
Speaker 2: hits this three hundred and forty yard drive down the middle,
Speaker 2: and I thought that that next t shot was so
Speaker 2: compelling as to like, kim Spawn, who probably has slept
Speaker 2: like complete shit two days in a row, can he
Speaker 2: muster something off that tee And the answer.
Speaker 3: Was no, no, no, of course not he And he
Speaker 3: said he knew that he had the honor on the tee,
Speaker 3: which was super important. So like Rory was sleeping knowing
Speaker 3: that he was hitting that first tee shot, and you know,
Speaker 3: as soon as he takes like his little dog headcover
Speaker 3: off the driver, like everyone's like ooh, just steps up
Speaker 3: there and does that. And I think that he was
Speaker 3: able to lean on that shot a lot throughout the
Speaker 3: rest of those three holes. Like even the moment that
Speaker 3: really stood out to me was after JJ flies it
Speaker 3: in the water on seventeen and he's like asking, like,
Speaker 3: where did that just go? And Rory's like, dude, it's
Speaker 3: in the water and walks straight behind him with his
Speaker 3: butter in hand. And before JJ's even able to discern
Speaker 3: like where the ball.
Speaker 2: Went, Shade's blockie, you know, asking Rory of where the
Speaker 2: ball went.
Speaker 3: It had some notes of that. I would say, JJ
Speaker 3: was can we just talk about like the club selection
Speaker 3: on seventeen for a second, because you.
Speaker 2: Can talk about anything you want to talk about. This
Speaker 2: is a podcast. You're the gust.
Speaker 3: Thanks Andy, I appreciate you clarifying that he I watched
Speaker 3: back the audio, which I hadn't heard obviously because I
Speaker 3: was there. I was standing there out of earshot, and
Speaker 3: it sounded like his caddie, you know, hands it in
Speaker 3: the eight iron and said, you know, I don't remember
Speaker 3: the word he used, but like a little chippy eight
Speaker 3: or something like that. And then he's like encouraging JJ
Speaker 3: one more time, and he goes just a full stock,
Speaker 3: smooth swing. I'm like, and then JJ goes stock. I
Speaker 3: thought you I thought you said had to take some
Speaker 3: off of it. Like he literally said that, So there
Speaker 3: was and he didn't back away or anything. He just
Speaker 3: went into the shot after that. So like that's the
Speaker 3: type of experience, a level difference that like really can
Speaker 3: make or break a situation like this, Like if if
Speaker 3: that's Rory's not gonna you know, first of all, I
Speaker 3: don't know if he's having conversations with Harry like that.
Speaker 3: But a player like JJ, you have to back off
Speaker 3: you're unsure about that and start start fresh. You don't
Speaker 3: just walk into the shot not knowing what your guy's
Speaker 3: telling you to do.
Speaker 2: It's interesting because that was the thing that stuck out
Speaker 2: to me about the shot he chose to hit, was
Speaker 2: like that was like a full bore or there was
Speaker 2: a full like Apex eight iron versus Rory hit that
Speaker 2: really soft three quarter speed knuckler. And I think like
Speaker 2: the knucklers. The advantage of the knucklers, like you just
Speaker 2: like kind of know the general area it's going to
Speaker 2: land in, whether it gets really hit by wind or
Speaker 2: minimally hit by wind, like the margin. You know, if
Speaker 2: you think about the green there, it's whatever thirty paces
Speaker 2: long or deep roughly, like if you hit the chipper
Speaker 2: into the middle of the green, it would take like
Speaker 2: a really weird wind event to have to miss the green. Right.
Speaker 2: I think like it's generally like a pretty good strategy
Speaker 2: there is to not hit something full because then if
Speaker 2: it's down when the wind can't like the one thing
Speaker 2: that's hard there is downwind can get knocked down if
Speaker 2: you don't get enough backspin on it. But that chipper
Speaker 2: into the wind was like totally the shot because like spawns,
Speaker 2: just it didn't get hit by it didn't get touched
Speaker 2: by the wind. Yeah, and that's a weird thing with
Speaker 2: those grand stands.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: I think Rory's flew like probably five yards further than
Speaker 2: he expected. I couldn't believe when it landed out deep
Speaker 2: into the green it got.
Speaker 3: I know, I know, that's that's exactly what he said
Speaker 3: he was practicing, like on the range when he turned
Speaker 3: around backwards to hit shots towards the third green. I
Speaker 3: thought that was brilliant. You know, he'd been doing that
Speaker 3: all week going to the opposite side of the rain.
Speaker 3: He just has like this like sixth sense or more
Speaker 3: awareness of how to hit the ball in the wind.
Speaker 3: And I feel like JJ was kind of just unprepared
Speaker 3: for that moment.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's I think that's what it was, is like
Speaker 2: golf golf asks all these questions. That's I think why
Speaker 2: we probably love golf tournaments the most is like over
Speaker 2: the course of seventy two holes, like you are going
Speaker 2: to get every aspect of your game is going to
Speaker 2: get showcased. And I think that was one thing that
Speaker 2: JJ didn't hadn't faced yet, was that was all week.
Speaker 2: It was down on seventeen, and it's it's amazing that like, okay,
Speaker 2: just the matter of circumstance, the weather delay that like okay,
Speaker 2: we're going to ask you one more question, and it's
Speaker 2: the end of the wind and he just he that's
Speaker 2: where Rory had the shot and JJ didn't.
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's like it's like you're you're finishing a test
Speaker 3: and like you realize there's like one more page left
Speaker 3: and it's a question that you have no idea how
Speaker 3: to answer.
Speaker 2: I think I've finally out own the dreams. Oh I
Speaker 2: haven't where you have anxiety about tests. I think, like,
Speaker 2: it hasn't happened to me in a while, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: I think it's finally done.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can tell this is a source of stress
Speaker 3: for me.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, it's the worst when you wake up and
Speaker 2: you're like, oh my.
Speaker 3: God, horrible, horrible. I have it all the time. Actually,
Speaker 3: recently it's been like missing Google Google calendar invites. That's
Speaker 3: been horrible for me.
Speaker 2: See, I don't have to dream about that because I
Speaker 2: missed my fair share without dreaming, you know. So it's
Speaker 2: kind of kind of an issue. What's your next thing?
Speaker 3: Okay, my next thing is, Oh, I spent a long time,
Speaker 3: uh thinking, talking about and watching a tree this week,
Speaker 3: and I had a forty five minute conversation with you.
Speaker 3: I wrote an article about the tree. Love writing about
Speaker 3: inanimate objects.
Speaker 2: I liked it. I liked the lead to it. It
Speaker 2: really drew me in.
Speaker 3: Thank you.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: Actually I have to give a shout out to Sean
Speaker 3: Zach for that one, because when I was coming back
Speaker 3: in to you know, sit down and write the story,
Speaker 3: I think he came out to me and just asks like, oh,
Speaker 3: what are you doing today? And I was like the tree,
Speaker 3: and he goes, oh, like what did it tell you? Like,
Speaker 3: did you get did you get any good insight? I
Speaker 3: was like, I know, I'm at least going to be now.
Speaker 3: So that was it was a really fun story. I
Speaker 3: will say, like I love doing the kind of like
Speaker 3: you know, the thing that everyone's talking about story and
Speaker 3: trying to add a new element, a new light to it.
Speaker 3: And speaking to Davis about it was so cool because
Speaker 3: he's just ridiculously passionate about this, and you know, he
Speaker 3: was sending me videos and pictures from the reconstruction process,
Speaker 3: and the fact that they lifted that five hundred thousand
Speaker 3: pound tree one hundred yards is like still baffling to me.
Speaker 3: They I forget what the system is called. That they
Speaker 3: put it on these like logs or like you know,
Speaker 3: these like inflatable tubes and they roll it slowly and
Speaker 3: they take the tube from the end and put it
Speaker 3: in the front and like it keeps going very like
Speaker 3: slowly and surely. And I'm pretty sure like that mode
Speaker 3: of transportation was like invented in the Roman Empire to
Speaker 3: like move things to build like you know whatever monuments
Speaker 3: that are still standing today. And I was just like
Speaker 3: having these images of my brain of like golf course
Speaker 3: construction and like the little nuances that go into it.
Speaker 3: And it was a very cool process.
Speaker 2: I will say that tree mattered very it was. It
Speaker 2: was stunt. I I was watching Scotty and Rory. You
Speaker 2: might have been out there too, and I think I
Speaker 2: saw Scotty hit like the worst shot I've ever seen
Speaker 2: him hit.
Speaker 3: Oh really, I didn't see this.
Speaker 2: He hit like almost like a pull hook with a
Speaker 2: three wood. I mean it was like just so bad
Speaker 2: and like he just generally had a bad attitude this week,
Speaker 2: and it was just like an epitome of it. But
Speaker 2: like you just saw guys like they were very uncomfortable
Speaker 2: and like extreme. Like you know, I'm not like a
Speaker 2: huge proponent of move of like trees in general and
Speaker 2: as as features that deter players, but I do think
Speaker 2: like every once in a while a unique twists are
Speaker 2: turn and I think that's the thing that it provides
Speaker 2: is like it just doesn't the they're afraid to hit
Speaker 2: their normal stock shot. I think like the stock shot
Speaker 2: can just kind of work there, but it's like if
Speaker 2: if you hit a little high on the face, maybe
Speaker 2: it maybe it hits it. So now it's got these
Speaker 2: guys hitting these weird shots and they just they just struggled.
Speaker 2: I mean, like Rory that that fairway was like a
Speaker 2: big problem forer rorri.
Speaker 3: That week, Yeah, a hundred percent. I thought it was
Speaker 3: really funny that Toasty pulls out three Wood. I'm like,
Speaker 3: just had read or watched this video that you guys
Speaker 3: did with him where he's like, I'll hit driver anywhere
Speaker 3: even if the fairway is ten golf balls wide, and
Speaker 3: I'm like, so the tree's working. This is awesome, But yeah,
Speaker 3: it was. It was so cool. There were a few
Speaker 3: like oohs and ahs when like guys kind of caught
Speaker 3: what a little spitty and high on the face, and
Speaker 3: like Keith Mitchell looked like very upset with one of
Speaker 3: those shots, and Ludwig was like switching between driver and
Speaker 3: three wood, and I I asked jos Goverren, like what
Speaker 3: the deal is there, and he said, like, it very
Speaker 3: much depends on the wind direction, if it's into or
Speaker 3: against and or helping, And like there's just a lot
Speaker 3: of decision making because of a feature that, like you said,
Speaker 3: isn't really isn't actually in play, It just really looks
Speaker 3: like it is. So that's the Pete die effect, and
Speaker 3: I didn't know this before talking to to Davis. Was
Speaker 3: was just he wanted to deceive you and have this
Speaker 3: like trickery or distraction in some of these design elements.
Speaker 3: Like Davis was talking about like a section of bunkers
Speaker 3: at Whistling Straits that he would he asked He asked
Speaker 3: Pete about one day and he was like, why did
Speaker 3: you put those bunkers there? Like no one's gonna no
Speaker 3: one's gonna go over there. And He's like, Oh, They're
Speaker 3: just meant to distract you. And I thought that was
Speaker 3: so cool.
Speaker 2: It is it's it has a huge impact. This is
Speaker 2: a Justin Ray tweet that I saw at the end
Speaker 2: of the week the final your Cole League Yes, final
Speaker 2: tally on the sixth hole this week, Field hit fifty
Speaker 2: eight point two percent of fairways, the fewest there since
Speaker 2: twenty eleven, and sixty six birdies for the week were
Speaker 2: twenty six viewer than last year. So I these guys
Speaker 2: are creatures of habit and anything you do that just
Speaker 2: like kind of changes. I think it like fits really well.
Speaker 2: Like one of the things I take away with from
Speaker 2: Sawgrass always is variety. And you saw it like I
Speaker 2: think one of the things that didn't get talked about
Speaker 2: a ton was the added length on the par five holes.
Speaker 2: How that might have played a little bit into Rory's hands, true,
Speaker 2: because he's a player that second t for example, got
Speaker 2: moved back and a little left, and that that he's
Speaker 2: one of the few players that can really turn over
Speaker 2: right driver driver right to left. So adding distance on
Speaker 2: those par fives, the thicker rough probably helped Rory McElroy
Speaker 2: a little bit too. Like there are little things that
Speaker 2: play into in the hands, but overall, the the thing
Speaker 2: I always take away with with Sawgrass is like, how
Speaker 2: like if you think about like T shot after T shot,
Speaker 2: rarely do they show you like the same look. And
Speaker 2: I think these guys, these guys get so good if
Speaker 2: you show them like a hole with like a similar
Speaker 2: width fair way and a similar bunk row alignment over
Speaker 2: and over again, like they get comfortable. And the thing
Speaker 2: with saw Grass is that it's like it goes, you know,
Speaker 2: one goes left to right, Two goes right to left,
Speaker 2: four goes kind of kind of left to right. You
Speaker 2: kind of want to hit a fade there, you know,
Speaker 2: Five you go left to right, and then six now
Speaker 2: has this like you gotta go low. Like it's like
Speaker 2: a whole new thing, like everything moves different directions. And
Speaker 2: then you get to six and it's like go low.
Speaker 2: And then it keeps jogging around with the different different
Speaker 2: shapes and and and ask and like they're within those
Speaker 2: different shapes there are super wide fairways and then they're
Speaker 2: super narrow fairways, which like I always get up to
Speaker 2: four t and I'm like, god, after like one and two,
Speaker 2: this looks so narrow because like one and two are
Speaker 2: pretty generous, and then four it's like, oh, it's just
Speaker 2: this thin little ribbon and there's all this trouble on
Speaker 2: the right, and I'm gonna bail left, but bailing left
Speaker 2: might be worse than hitting it right. You know. It
Speaker 2: just it's a it. It's Brendan used this term in
Speaker 2: a video recently, like visually and apologetic ear muffs for
Speaker 2: the kids, visually visual fuckery. Yeah, and there's just a
Speaker 2: lot of that out there. And six with the tree
Speaker 2: back is similar. I know, like some people are like
Speaker 2: very against it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't get that personally, Like I I think
Speaker 3: it's fun. Well, guys are playing for twenty five million dollars.
Speaker 3: Throw a tree in there, okay, just like make them
Speaker 3: get around it. It's I think it's adds like a
Speaker 3: really cool element of like again like testing guys and
Speaker 3: having them use every tool in their toolbox, just like
Speaker 3: you said. And I honestly, this is my first time
Speaker 3: at TPC Sawgrass, first time covering the players, and I
Speaker 3: don't think it translates as well on TV. Like I
Speaker 3: didn't realize that about TPC zaw Grass before really walking
Speaker 3: the property and like seeing that some of these site
Speaker 3: lines and like some of the visuals that you get
Speaker 3: off the tee approaching greens, you know, even like the
Speaker 3: quirky little elements of like a palm tree and a bunker,
Speaker 3: or like the little moguls on the fourteenth that they
Speaker 3: put back in. Like I think we don't really we
Speaker 3: don't really see this stuff that often on the PGA
Speaker 3: tour and it's definitely refreshing to me. And I just
Speaker 3: don't think I fully appreciated that about the property before
Speaker 3: I actually got to see it with my own eyes.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The other thing I head b back in so long,
Speaker 2: I just forgot how great of a spectator of course
Speaker 2: it is.
Speaker 3: I was that was gonna be my like bonus takeaway.
Speaker 2: I it's like I I last time I was there
Speaker 2: almost ten years ago now, my brother in law was stationed.
Speaker 2: He was in the Navy in Jacksonville, and we went
Speaker 2: just as spectators on Saturday. I was there covering the
Speaker 2: term in all week. On Saturday, I went as a
Speaker 2: fan nice and like we just like sat on seventeen
Speaker 2: basically all day. He's not a big golf fan. He's
Speaker 2: not like a golf fan. It's just you know, and
Speaker 2: and we just sat there and I was like, this
Speaker 2: is like delightful, like for a our, like a someone
Speaker 2: who's deeply engrossed in the game, I can enjoy this
Speaker 2: and for somebody that's not, it's like a phenomenal entry
Speaker 2: point because you could see the shots. You can but
Speaker 2: like all around almost every hole is perfect places to run.
Speaker 3: It's amazing. I actually so my dad was there this week.
Speaker 3: He was on a buddy's trip with like his six
Speaker 3: college friends, and he was, oh, it's amazing. They went,
Speaker 3: they went fishing, they played a round golf. It's aspiration
Speaker 3: will it is really truly. I like put this photo
Speaker 3: of them on my Instagram story at one point and
Speaker 3: like wrote, like sawgrass dads with like a trademark symbol,
Speaker 3: and they were obsessed with it. They like made me
Speaker 3: send it to them, and they're like putting it in
Speaker 3: a photo album or something. But I was I was
Speaker 3: able to like walk around with him and his friends
Speaker 3: for you know, thirty minutes on Thursday and another thirty
Speaker 3: minutes on Saturday or Sunday and Saturday, and they were
Speaker 3: just like so giddy about how great of a spectating
Speaker 3: course it was that they couldn't even like figure out
Speaker 3: a place to stand and stay for a while because
Speaker 3: they were like this place looks better, like was this
Speaker 3: last one even better than that?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 3: On on Saturday, I sat with them in the second
Speaker 3: green and there's this nice little hillside and you watch
Speaker 3: all the players go for it or lay up, and
Speaker 3: we saw Rory hit like an incredible flop shot from
Speaker 3: the right rough and then you just stand up and
Speaker 3: you could see them tee off on the third hole
Speaker 3: and they're all excited about going out to the twelfth
Speaker 3: hole because they're apparently great tacos over there.
Speaker 2: It was like a whole journey.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, exactly, tacos on twelve.
Speaker 2: So the dads were overrated. Tacos Taco.
Speaker 3: I just I agree, honestly, I went there.
Speaker 2: People love him down there, but I feel like if
Speaker 2: you put them in any any city, it's just be
Speaker 2: like run into the mill.
Speaker 3: Place A thousand percent agree. We went on Tuesday night.
Speaker 3: I think saw Michael Griller picking up as co order,
Speaker 3: and I will say, like the place itself has a
Speaker 3: great vibe, like it is the place to be, but like, yeah,
Speaker 3: tacos can be better.
Speaker 2: Yeah they're okay, They're nothing to write home about. You know,
Speaker 2: people do of these crazy things like and we I
Speaker 2: feel like this is a common discussion point with like
Speaker 2: other majors all the time. It's like, oh awful the
Speaker 2: spectating experiences, yeah, funny, like and I listen, I I
Speaker 2: I would say that I'm not a PGA tour apologist,
Speaker 2: but I would say this is like literally the best
Speaker 2: tournament you can go to as a spectator. It's a
Speaker 2: great time of year, the weather's usually like really good,
Speaker 2: and it's like the tickets aren't crazy and it's the
Speaker 2: best place to see like it it is to me
Speaker 2: the best spectator experience in golf.
Speaker 3: PC agree.
Speaker 2: Let's have a master's maybe yeah, yes, pretty Yeah.
Speaker 3: That's next level. But my dad was saying, like I've
Speaker 3: been to other terms. My dad, like I've been to
Speaker 3: the Open with him and at St. Andrew's where you
Speaker 3: literally can't see any can't see anything and you have
Speaker 3: to walk like three miles to get to one hole
Speaker 3: and then like it takes some of your an hour
Speaker 3: to get back to the clubhouse. But he was he
Speaker 3: was having a ball. Like we were just talking about
Speaker 3: how how much we'd recommend it to other spectators that
Speaker 3: they're trying to choose, Like what, PJ Torment, can you
Speaker 3: like get the closest and have the best views, like walk,
Speaker 3: I went over to the merch shop and like there's
Speaker 3: a freaking driving range like right there for people to
Speaker 3: try to hit, like the seventeenth T shot.
Speaker 2: There is yes over there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was crazy.
Speaker 2: PJ didn't let me know. I forgot. You can't you
Speaker 2: can't talk on this podcast. He jammed us, what's your
Speaker 2: final thing?
Speaker 3: Okay, my final thing is that Scotty Shuffler is in
Speaker 3: a mood and I'm scared. I was out there for
Speaker 3: a few holes here and there with Scotty and like
Speaker 3: had a pretty small sample size and he was pissed,
Speaker 3: like he is definitely in a spot where he's like
Speaker 3: so frustrated with himself. And it's funny because what he's still.
Speaker 2: Finished twentieth or something, yeah.
Speaker 3: T fifteen twentieth like somewhere around there. And it's coming
Speaker 3: out in like several different ways. First, it's just you know,
Speaker 3: he's he has this like outburst or once every once
Speaker 3: and every while after a bad shot, and it's like,
Speaker 3: you know, for a while, we just thought Scotty was
Speaker 3: like this nice, like wholesome world number one, And he's
Speaker 3: got some yron and I will tell you that. And
Speaker 3: then it's also coming out in the media in like
Speaker 3: some of these interactions that he's had with reporters recently
Speaker 3: have been sassy. I would call them snarky. Yeah, he
Speaker 3: has a sense of humor. He's a sarcastic guy. But
Speaker 3: like these have been I think one step further than that.
Speaker 3: I just remember on Friday afternoon, the super group of Rory,
Speaker 3: Xander and Scotti comes in one after another to the
Speaker 3: flash area. I don't know if you were there, Andy,
Speaker 3: but so we were all there was probably a thirty
Speaker 3: people standing around the little like fenced off flash area,
Speaker 3: and like Sander came in and then Scotty was like
Speaker 3: kind of leaning against the fence and like waiting for
Speaker 3: him to be done. So he was already having to wait,
Speaker 3: which is like, oh no, like players five minutes to
Speaker 3: do media. But and he walks up to the microphone
Speaker 3: and he's kind of just like adjusting his belt or whatever,
Speaker 3: and like looks up and there's about ten to fifteen
Speaker 3: seconds of silence, like no one wants to ask a question, like,
Speaker 3: and Scotty just goes so I'll make a statement, and
Speaker 3: like eventually someone chimed in and asked the first question.
Speaker 3: But I just thought that was so indicative of like
Speaker 3: the headspace and like mindset that he's in right now.
Speaker 3: It's literally like translating to people being fearful of asking
Speaker 3: him a question. So it's an interesting like vibe and
Speaker 3: dynamic that I'm getting from Scotty right now because he's
Speaker 3: like obviously this close to going on another tear like
Speaker 3: he did last year, and it right now it's coming
Speaker 3: down to putts falling, and that's it's been a spot
Speaker 3: of you know, a sore spot for him in the
Speaker 3: past with the putting struggles, and it just it seems
Speaker 3: to be getting to him, but I think it's getting
Speaker 3: to him in a way where we're gonna see him
Speaker 3: like really break out again soon and it's gonna be like, oh,
Speaker 3: I remember, you know.
Speaker 2: He had a different ramp up this year, which is interesting.
Speaker 2: But I will say that the new putters are band
Speaker 2: aids mm hmm. You get a new putter, you like it,
Speaker 2: you have some success with it, if you're not, if
Speaker 2: you're not technique wise really sound.
Speaker 3: Are you saying that about the about the mallet switch.
Speaker 2: From last year? Yeah, Like it's you know, like he's
Speaker 2: always I think he's gonna be a streak putter for them,
Speaker 2: you know, like, and I think he's really struggles when
Speaker 2: there's added elements to the putting, whether it's wind or
Speaker 2: the greens are slow, like we saw him like, I
Speaker 2: don't know if I've ever seen him putt as bad
Speaker 2: as he put it at last year's Open with the
Speaker 2: slower greens. It seems like, you know, but then you know,
Speaker 2: the wind. I think the wind was bothering him this week,
Speaker 2: particularly on Saturday, when I feel like, really, I don't
Speaker 2: know if you saw this, but he said something to
Speaker 2: the lines of like I get the worst bounces of
Speaker 2: anyone in golf, No way.
Speaker 3: Yeah it was that caught on like a hot mic
Speaker 3: or something.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm the telecasts Scotty. And it's like, I
Speaker 2: think I can think of like a lot of really
Speaker 2: good bounces that you've gotten and fled to, like winning
Speaker 2: major championships or like the one that you know, you
Speaker 2: hit a terrible duck hook into the into the trees
Speaker 2: on eighteen and yeah, just like drop down into into
Speaker 2: the rough and you could make a par from there,
Speaker 2: like you know, like you think about like his career
Speaker 2: I did.
Speaker 5: I think.
Speaker 2: I think he's a creature of habit. He had his
Speaker 2: habit disturbed. The other thing that I I think having
Speaker 2: a young kid is hard, and I think the early
Speaker 2: days of having a young kid are a lot easier
Speaker 2: than like once. It's not like oh this is new.
Speaker 2: This is like your life changes your amount of time.
Speaker 2: Like I just think, like I personally deal with this
Speaker 2: still is like there's a push and pull of like
Speaker 2: where I want to be with my career and what
Speaker 2: I want to do with my career, but also what
Speaker 2: I want to do with my family, and that is
Speaker 2: going to be like a push and pull, And I wonder,
Speaker 2: like is that like these are all this is just
Speaker 2: all speculative from my part, but like you just wonder about,
Speaker 2: like what could have changed in the in the in
Speaker 2: the timeframe from he wins his ninth win last year.
Speaker 2: You know, he wins the hero it was dominant. He
Speaker 2: has the hand injury, and he's just come back like
Speaker 2: in a different headspace.
Speaker 3: I can see that for sure.
Speaker 2: Or is it simply like he hasn't won a golf
Speaker 2: tournament in four months, which is the longest he's gone
Speaker 2: without winning a golf tournament in a really long time.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's I feel like it could be
Speaker 3: easily a combination of both. Like some it's just like
Speaker 3: something's bubbling with Scottie, Like it feels like it's slowly
Speaker 3: slowly getting like just has this energy to it with
Speaker 3: him and like I don't know you at least also
Speaker 3: with the with I get the worst bounces of any golfer,
Speaker 3: Like at least he's kind of like funny with these things,
Speaker 3: Like I heard one. I heard one where he's coming
Speaker 3: off I think the second green, and he had missed
Speaker 3: the hole by like two feet, like it was it
Speaker 3: was a bad putt. He's walking to the next scene,
Speaker 3: he goes, I love a lipout, just a lipout, and
Speaker 3: it's like at least you're able to have a little
Speaker 3: bit of humor with these things, Like I like that
Speaker 3: from Scotty. I think we're gonna see him like really
Speaker 3: come out hot again soon, like you said, like it
Speaker 3: might just be coming down too. He doesn't necessarily have
Speaker 3: that like super super ultra strong foundation with the putter
Speaker 3: like some other players do where they can just rely
Speaker 3: on it, you know, in times where they need it
Speaker 3: like a like a spee for example, and it's gonna
Speaker 3: come back. But like I just wanted to throw it
Speaker 3: out there, like how interesting like the Scotti Scheffler energy
Speaker 3: is right now, because usually he's kind of just like
Speaker 3: the guy shoots sixty eight and comes in, he's like
Speaker 3: all happy, could go lucky about like just you know,
Speaker 3: I commit to my shots and what I like delivering
Speaker 3: all the lines that number one in the player in
Speaker 3: the world has to deliver, and like that was not
Speaker 3: what he was doing last week.
Speaker 2: I feel like this is like he's evolved though, because
Speaker 2: like early on, like three years ago, it was like God,
Speaker 2: this guy's boring. Yes, yes, and it was like he
Speaker 2: doesn't give give you anything, and then it evault like
Speaker 2: it seemed like he got more comfortable and he would
Speaker 2: crack jokes.
Speaker 3: Yes, it was like the wholesome kind of like quirky dude.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but like was funny. Yes, and and like now
Speaker 2: it's like gone to like where he's like he's he's
Speaker 2: still pretty funny, but he also kind of like doesn't
Speaker 2: have the patience for for questions that he doesn't like.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's like, I mean, I just like don't want
Speaker 3: to get in his way, Like it's a little scary.
Speaker 2: Well that's the thing when you I don't know. It
Speaker 2: was a really weird week for the media just in general. Yeah,
Speaker 2: between Marikawa and and Scottie, it was. It was just
Speaker 2: a strange, strange week there, even.
Speaker 3: Rory like getting asked about the phone stealing episode. It
Speaker 3: was it was a little awkward here and there with
Speaker 3: with some of these guys just like seeming like they
Speaker 3: were questioning motives and like thinking that like the people
Speaker 3: were out to get them sort of vibe. And I
Speaker 3: just like I know where that's coming from, but like
Speaker 3: I feel I feel like they should these players should
Speaker 3: understand like if they you know, if they give the time,
Speaker 3: if they give those like more nuanced answers, like it
Speaker 3: can only bode well for them, and like that's the
Speaker 3: thing that I think, like the agents side of the
Speaker 3: discussion like has to realize that it's only going to
Speaker 3: get worse if they and I don't know if you
Speaker 3: read shame Gian's peace and Brody's Yeah, yeah, Brody's really
Speaker 3: touched on that, Like this is this is uh, you know,
Speaker 3: this is like the beat the giving time to media.
Speaker 3: It's not you're not owing us anything. You're owing like
Speaker 3: the people that are following you and are fans of
Speaker 3: you on the PGA tour, you know, an insight and
Speaker 3: a different look into what might be going on or
Speaker 3: what you're thinking. That always that doesn't always come out
Speaker 3: when you like post an Instagram reel about your practice
Speaker 3: round or like a highlight reel on TV. You know,
Speaker 3: you have to take the time to actually express that,
Speaker 3: and that's how you win people over, Like that's how
Speaker 3: you get fans to follow you and buy in. So
Speaker 3: I just feel like there's a lot in it for
Speaker 3: them too, like they owe it to themselves in a way.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I I completely agree, it's like the I just
Speaker 2: I think sometimes like it's hard, you know. I think,
Speaker 2: like I podcast for a living, so like it's very
Speaker 2: much in my interest to just like tell people what
Speaker 2: I'm thinking, right, But like at the same time, like
Speaker 2: if I feel like these players, like if they just
Speaker 2: got up there and were earnest and honest, like and
Speaker 2: to you exactly what they think about subjects for the
Speaker 2: most part and in topics and how they feel, it
Speaker 2: would just it would let people in. I think that's
Speaker 2: like the biggest issue that so many people, like I
Speaker 2: do you see that Isaiah Selinda quotes.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was there. I was there talking to him with.
Speaker 2: Sean about like all these guys are like cookie cutter,
Speaker 2: you know, white bread like boring vanilla tour pros and
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be different, right. But like, the the reason
Speaker 2: that people feel that way is that like whether it's
Speaker 2: been coached out of them or whatever. Like I think
Speaker 2: like the general belief on tour is that if you
Speaker 2: just keep your mouth shut and you play decent golf,
Speaker 2: the sponsors are gonna just you know, back up the
Speaker 2: brinks trucks and they're just gonna pour money on you.
Speaker 2: It's like the Ricky Fowler Gary Woodland kind of like
Speaker 2: playbook Matt Kocher playbook until he didn't tip a guy,
Speaker 2: Like just smile and you're gonna get paid a lot
Speaker 2: of money. But like the reality is like in today's society,
Speaker 2: people just want a little bit more. They want like
Speaker 2: this is like I think what influencers do is they
Speaker 2: let people in. And that's what makes these YouTubers so attractive,
Speaker 2: is like people feel like they forge personal bonds with
Speaker 2: them because they openly talk about when they suck. Like,
Speaker 2: you know, I saw the Bob does Sports guy did
Speaker 2: this spoof on Rory's comments about YouTube golf. It was
Speaker 2: so good, you know, I I saw it because Rory
Speaker 2: showed me it and he was laughing about about what
Speaker 2: how he spoofed him. Like, you know, you have no
Speaker 2: idea what it's like to hit the first putt knowing
Speaker 2: it's not going to go in and an eight man scramble.
Speaker 2: You know, you have no idea.
Speaker 3: What a animal.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's no idea what it's like to see your
Speaker 2: friend eight beers deep path to can or eight donuts
Speaker 2: deep can't get to the top of his swing.
Speaker 3: What's his name, Joey cold Cuts?
Speaker 2: No the fat for us? Yeah, it's like I mean,
Speaker 2: like but like they they humanize, they like they get
Speaker 2: on the same level as their audience, talking about like struggles,
Speaker 2: and it's like tour players like will not for the
Speaker 2: most part show you that vulnerability.
Speaker 3: Whether it's healthy or not. We as a society have
Speaker 3: become accustomed to having parasocial relationships with these figures online,
Speaker 3: whether it be athletes or influencers or your favorite artist
Speaker 3: or whatever it might be. And I actually do you
Speaker 3: kind of alluded to this. I do think in a
Speaker 3: way like modern day coaching has taught a lot of
Speaker 3: these players to like keep the blinders on, like keep
Speaker 3: your head down, like don't let any outside factors distract you.
Speaker 3: Like we've heard Scottie Scheffler talk about before that he
Speaker 3: doesn't have any sports like apps on his phone because
Speaker 3: he doesn't want to ever see any sort of notification
Speaker 3: around him or his game. I think some players do
Speaker 3: a better job it than others, and we applaud them
Speaker 3: for being so focused and committed and whatever, but at
Speaker 3: the same time it hinders in a way, like that
Speaker 3: fan experience, Like we we want them to be vulnerable,
Speaker 3: but we also want them to perform their best, and
Speaker 3: like is there a sacrifice there one way or the other.
Speaker 3: I feel like Rory took an interesting approach this week
Speaker 3: and just like putting it all out there, you know,
Speaker 3: like admitting that you know, he has work to do
Speaker 3: in some of these areas, and he's made certain mistakes
Speaker 3: in the past in his career. Like I think he
Speaker 3: mentioned like being able to you know, have like a
Speaker 3: negative memory arise to the surface and being able to
Speaker 3: replace it with a more positive one, and that that's
Speaker 3: still a work in progress for him. And that's the
Speaker 3: kind of stuff that like makes people want to learn
Speaker 3: a little bit more, watch a little bit more, see
Speaker 3: if it changes. I had a really fascinating and honestly
Speaker 3: like difficult conversation or you know, to hear with Max
Speaker 3: Homa after Friday's round. You know, stood there after he
Speaker 3: finished and missed the cut by six or seven shots,
Speaker 3: and he was like nearly in tears and very graciously
Speaker 3: took like five six minutes to talk to us about
Speaker 3: you know, he just doesn't know like where he's going
Speaker 3: right now, and he basically feels like he's going in
Speaker 3: circles and it's like he's had all this change, but
Speaker 3: do you like keep changing things if you're so stuck
Speaker 3: in this position or do you just keep going and
Speaker 3: feels like he's on the right path, but the results
Speaker 3: are nowhere to be found. Like he called it a
Speaker 3: toxic relationship with the game, which it was like all
Speaker 3: this stuff is striking and is exactly the type of
Speaker 3: thing that, like you look at as a sports fan,
Speaker 3: You're like, Wow, I really respect that guy for actually
Speaker 3: coming out and saying that.
Speaker 2: I think everybody has somewhat of a toxic relationship with
Speaker 2: the game of golf.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, he said that he's the toxic one.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's that's the thing, is like, what these
Speaker 2: guys And this is why I tell I tell people
Speaker 2: all the time, is like like I'll play golf with
Speaker 2: someone and they'll be like, I suck. I'm a fifteen handicap,
Speaker 2: and I'll be like, good news. I walk around a
Speaker 2: golf course telling myself I suck all day. And you
Speaker 2: know the funny thing is, I know, like you know,
Speaker 2: most of the players in the top ten in the
Speaker 2: world say the exact same thing to themselves all day
Speaker 2: around a golf course, like it is a toxic gamem hm.
Speaker 2: And the more of these guys like talk about their
Speaker 2: struggles with it. It is so relatable. Like who hasn't
Speaker 2: been in the situation of Max Homa, where like you
Speaker 2: aren't putting so much work into the game and the
Speaker 2: game is just beating you down over and over again
Speaker 2: because you're like almost getting worse the more you work
Speaker 2: at it. Like that is so relatable, so relatable.
Speaker 3: I had someone text me after that article about like
Speaker 3: how they feel that way in their own job. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and it's like it's it's such a relatable concept. And
Speaker 3: golf is one of those one of the few sports
Speaker 3: that we can actually go out and play ourselves and
Speaker 3: it's not it's not like we're watching like, you know,
Speaker 3: linebackers zacking each other and like it's not quite as
Speaker 3: revealing hearing them like talking about their struggle. So we're
Speaker 3: never going to be in that situation. But you know,
Speaker 3: we have our own games and everyone has their own
Speaker 3: ceiling and like goals and work that they put in,
Speaker 3: and when you're not seeing those results, it's something that
Speaker 3: like you have to realize the best players in the
Speaker 3: world might be having the exact same frustrations that you are,
Speaker 3: just on a different level.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's uh, it'll be interesting to see how it goes.
Speaker 2: It doesn't seem like it's getting better, you know, with
Speaker 2: between the media. I think it's like kind of an
Speaker 2: overarching issue in all of sports. You see it with
Speaker 2: like Lebron and Steven A. Smith bubbling up, you see.
Speaker 2: I think it's it has a lot to do with
Speaker 2: like the state of online discourse in the in the
Speaker 2: country right now. I don't think it's the healthiest it's
Speaker 2: ever been, and I think it bleeds across like everybody
Speaker 2: feels like they're trying to be trying to villain a
Speaker 2: villain by each other, right Like they're trying to make
Speaker 2: everybody seem like the bad, bad person when it's you know,
Speaker 2: a lot of cases it's just you know, asking questions
Speaker 2: to get more context hundred percent.
Speaker 3: And I mean the media landscape right now too, Like
Speaker 3: it doesn't help that a lot of these platforms like
Speaker 3: have to turn out an insane amount of work and
Speaker 3: headlines to stay aflow, and everything's an ad based revenue system.
Speaker 3: We're very lucky over at the Athletic to be able
Speaker 3: to kind of take our time with things and only
Speaker 3: put out stuff that we actually think is one hundred
Speaker 3: percent you know, worthy of a story and a byline,
Speaker 3: but it's it's like a it's a very strange time
Speaker 3: and media right now, Like there, you know, shops are
Speaker 3: closing left and right, and you know, some of the
Speaker 3: some of the best voices like may might not have
Speaker 3: a ton of options for where to put their work.
Speaker 3: Like it's it's definitely like a it's a shrinking beast
Speaker 3: in a way, and it's tough to see, like some
Speaker 3: the dominating you know, narratives are kind of shaped around
Speaker 3: like the platforms that aren't like representative of the core
Speaker 3: of journalism. I would say, so as as someone who's
Speaker 3: like in it in the space, like it is tough
Speaker 3: to see, like when people jump to those conclusions and
Speaker 3: assumptions and it's not representative of like the entirety or
Speaker 3: the best. So we'll see. I mean, I hope it
Speaker 3: doesn't get much worse. I'd like to see like maybe
Speaker 3: a few players like step up and maybe give the
Speaker 3: opposite perspective to what Colin did and say, you know
Speaker 3: how much maybe they appreciate the light that some of
Speaker 3: us shed on the game and are able to translate
Speaker 3: from them to the fans. We'll see. I mean, it's
Speaker 3: it's a very interesting predicament that we're in right now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's I I think that it's a you know,
Speaker 2: they'll all be on their best behavior at Augusta National.
Speaker 3: Yes, that's the only thing we know.
Speaker 2: It'll be an interesting story to follow. All right. Everybody
Speaker 2: can read your work at the Athletic. They can also
Speaker 2: follow you on x and Instagram.
Speaker 3: Yes, indeed, thank you, Andy, appreciate you.
Speaker 2: For coming on. We'll talk to you.
Speaker 6: We'll see you in a couple of weeks at Augusta.
Speaker 6: All right, big thanks to Gabby for joining us. Now
Speaker 6: let's kick it over to Kyle Porter from Normal Sport
Speaker 6: for his three things from the Players Championship.
Speaker 2: All right, this is very exciting. I have Kyle Porter
Speaker 2: of Normal Sport, a great newsletter place to read about
Speaker 2: golf if you don't already subscribe at normalsport dot com.
Speaker 2: That's right, correct, normalsport dot com.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it used to be a Normal Sport. We paid
Speaker 4: I think eight hundred bucks to get rid of one vow,
Speaker 4: which is just insane. But yeah, normal sport dot com.
Speaker 2: Those domain squatters, man, they I always win.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I wish I could go back to
Speaker 4: college and tell myself just buy you know, which domain
Speaker 4: you could be a billionaire.
Speaker 2: It's uh, you know, we got the Frida Egg we
Speaker 2: were forever fridagg dot c. Yeah, we got the Frida
Speaker 2: egg dot com. My astute attorney slash married and cousin
Speaker 2: had remember like put a reminder on when the domain expired,
Speaker 2: got it an auction for nine dollars. It was wow,
Speaker 2: incredible score.
Speaker 4: I I can't tell you how many times I've gone
Speaker 4: to Frida egg dot com.
Speaker 2: It's the analytics company.
Speaker 1: It's this.
Speaker 4: It looks like it was built in like nineteen ninety
Speaker 4: two or something.
Speaker 2: I've been waiting, waiting for for years for that thing
Speaker 2: to fold. I cannot believe that they're still paying for
Speaker 2: the website.
Speaker 4: He doesn't look like they can afford it.
Speaker 2: No, I don't think it's a company anymore. It's I
Speaker 2: would like that website, but I have yet to been
Speaker 2: able to get it. So you know that's the that's
Speaker 2: your website minute starting a business. Yeah, websites are hard
Speaker 2: to come by. The website addresses what are players? This
Speaker 2: is a sensational Monday Finish Monday playoff between Rory McElroy
Speaker 2: and the guy everybody thought would be on the other
Speaker 2: side of the playoff JJ spawn Kyle, I asked you
Speaker 2: to prepare three things to talk about. What's what's one
Speaker 2: thing you want to talk about about this year's players?
Speaker 4: Well, do you want to go reverse order or like
Speaker 4: order of importance the way that I seem.
Speaker 2: Let's go, let's go one to three, let's cook on
Speaker 2: Three'll hook people here with the most important thing.
Speaker 4: This is business minute number two. The uh, I think
Speaker 4: my number one is is And we could probably do
Speaker 4: a whole podcast just on this, but it's I think
Speaker 4: I think Rory winning it made me real, especially the
Speaker 4: way that he won. I know it's been talked about
Speaker 4: a ton of like he didn't he hit forty eight
Speaker 4: percent of fairways, didn't drive it that well?
Speaker 1: Uh, I think he's raised. I think his floor is.
Speaker 4: Higher than it's ever been. I think I think most
Speaker 4: people who follow this closely would say, yeah, that's that's
Speaker 4: probably true. Like his floor is the highest it's ever
Speaker 4: been because his game's more complete than it's ever been.
Speaker 4: And I think the question that I walk away from
Speaker 4: from this Player Championship with is can you raise your
Speaker 4: floor without lowering your ceiling? Because I think that is
Speaker 4: the that's the holy grail. In golf is to raise
Speaker 4: your floor and also sort of in parallel, raise your ceiling.
Speaker 4: And it's really really hard to do because by definition
Speaker 4: and raising your floor, you're making better decisions, better choices,
Speaker 4: not hitting iver everywhere, like like I mean, he did
Speaker 4: all those things, and how do you raise your ceilings
Speaker 4: simultaneously so that maybe you have a chance to win
Speaker 4: some major championships.
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, this is this is what golf's all about.
Speaker 2: I think we heard Tiger Woods when he was going
Speaker 2: through his heyday, he harped on consistency. He was always
Speaker 2: seeking everything he was doing was to be more consistent,
Speaker 2: and that's kind of what you're talking about. How do
Speaker 2: you raise your floor, how do you become more consistent?
Speaker 2: How do you evolve as a golfer? I think that's
Speaker 2: the the other things that we're seeing this, you know,
Speaker 2: maturation of of Rory McElroy. And I think like one
Speaker 2: of the things with golf is there's so few players
Speaker 2: that play at a high level long enough where you
Speaker 2: can really see them evolve, and we are seeing Rory
Speaker 2: McElroy really evolve. I think over the last five years
Speaker 2: it's been been the big, big kind of transformation where
Speaker 2: he's to become extraordinarily more consistent and just more of
Speaker 2: a well rounded player.
Speaker 4: And not just that, but I think it's one thing
Speaker 4: to have those shot. I mean, we saw him hit
Speaker 4: some really cool shots in the playoff. The shot into seventeen.
Speaker 4: I thought the shot, honestly into eighteen was really cool.
Speaker 4: It was like this kind of flighty draw into eight.
Speaker 4: It didn't matter at that point that the event was over,
Speaker 4: but it was a cool shot that he said he's
Speaker 4: been working on that he hasn't always been able to
Speaker 4: hit with seven eight. I think he hit it with
Speaker 4: an eight iron. Somebody pointed this out to me on Twitter, Andy,
Speaker 4: and I thought it or X or whatever it's called,
Speaker 4: and I thought it was interesting. I said, he's almost
Speaker 4: having this sort of Steph Lebron sort of second prime
Speaker 4: of his career, which I thought was a really cool
Speaker 4: because you know, I don't know that I think you
Speaker 4: watched twenty four year old Rory and it's like, I
Speaker 4: don't know if anybody's ever driven the ball like that,
Speaker 4: including him at age thirty five. But man, you see
Speaker 4: these NBA guys kind of accumulate these little tricks and
Speaker 4: these little nuances to their these little wrinkles to their
Speaker 4: game where it's like, I don't know if Steph is
Speaker 4: like physically as gifted at age thirty seven as he
Speaker 4: was at twenty six, but man, he's just so much
Speaker 4: smarter and just better all around than he used to be.
Speaker 4: And I think I think that's a great comp for
Speaker 4: what Rory is doing right now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think if you if you looked at it,
Speaker 2: I saw that tweet, and I really I like that.
Speaker 2: I think you could say something similar about like Brady too,
Speaker 2: where Brady had like these kind of distinct runs. I
Speaker 2: think with with Rory, uh, you know, this is a
Speaker 2: longevity that we haven't seen since really Phil and Ernie
Speaker 2: in terms of Infurick maybe uh, in terms of like
Speaker 2: really great play for a really long time, like Tiger's.
Speaker 2: Tiger's career was kind of like, you know, twelve years
Speaker 2: and then it was like hit or miss for a
Speaker 2: year here, a year there for the next you know, ten.
Speaker 2: With Rory, I think you have that middle lull. I
Speaker 2: would say kind of like twenty sixteen to really twenty
Speaker 2: twenty one was where he was in this like in
Speaker 2: between phase. You know, it's kind of like a in
Speaker 2: that phase that's where there was a lot of frustration,
Speaker 2: a lot of stuff happened. But you know, he's come
Speaker 2: out the other end from like twenty twenty two on.
Speaker 2: He's been you know, I know he hasn't won a major,
Speaker 2: but he's been so consistent in majors. It's Yeah.
Speaker 4: Well, he actually mentioned I don't know if he saw
Speaker 4: his presser, but he mentioned twenty I think he said
Speaker 4: twenty fifteen to twenty twenty where he like he was
Speaker 4: actually talking. Actually, I don't think it was in his
Speaker 4: press conference. I think it was on live from where
Speaker 4: he said it with Brande All and those guys afterward,
Speaker 4: and he was just saying like I didn't really he
Speaker 4: was talking more about like from an emotional standpoint. He's like,
Speaker 4: I didn't I didn't really put myself out there, and
Speaker 4: I didn't commit myself to.
Speaker 1: Like the game emotionally.
Speaker 4: I think that's the right way to say what he
Speaker 4: was saying in the way that I have over the
Speaker 4: last five years. And he's like, it's hard to put
Speaker 4: yourself out there all the time because you have to
Speaker 4: take a lot of crap from people when you don't win,
Speaker 4: or if you don't win, which is going to be
Speaker 4: often and I thought that was really interesting. I think
Speaker 4: it's funny because people have given him a lot of
Speaker 4: flack about the last three or four years of not
Speaker 4: winning majors, which I think is actually the wrong way
Speaker 4: to view it. I think if you want to give
Speaker 4: him flack for his career, it's like he didn't give
Speaker 4: himself a chance at winning a major between what the
Speaker 4: fourteen PGA and really like, yeah.
Speaker 1: Twenty one ers.
Speaker 4: I'm trying to think twenty eighteen at CARNOUSTI was kind
Speaker 4: of in it, but there were very very few chances
Speaker 4: at winning a major championship in that six year period.
Speaker 4: And that's like, I mean, for somebody like Rory who's
Speaker 4: out there really early on in his career, that's prime
Speaker 4: major winning years, and he kind of kicked him away
Speaker 4: a little bit. That's probably an unfair way to say it,
Speaker 4: but I think that's the part to be critical about,
Speaker 4: not the last three or four years of like near
Speaker 4: missus that that's worthy of praise, but the part before
Speaker 4: that is like, man, you kind of whiffed on twenty
Speaker 4: four twenty eight major opportunities there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I you know, it's interesting because like I wonder
Speaker 2: why it happened. There. I didn't expect to be having
Speaker 2: this conversation, but you know, like what in that period
Speaker 2: it probably was you know, the least good Roy McElroy
Speaker 2: in terms of like high level golf. I think it
Speaker 2: could be that there was like a wave of new players.
Speaker 2: It kind of like he wasn't you know, the game
Speaker 2: was changing, there were new young talents. That's kind of
Speaker 2: when the emergence of Speeth and Justin Thomas, Jason Day
Speaker 2: reaching the top of the game like other players. I
Speaker 2: think there is like this thing with with golf, and
Speaker 2: I think it's going it's happening right now where Rory
Speaker 2: pushed a number of great players to new level, Jason
Speaker 2: Day being one of them. Like Jason Day went up
Speaker 2: in his play to match Rory in like say twenty fifteen,
Speaker 2: twenty sixteen, and now Scotti Scheffler has done something similar
Speaker 2: to Rory where he's raised the bar where Rory was
Speaker 2: at the peak of the game for you know, really
Speaker 2: since twenty ten till now, he's considered, if not the best,
Speaker 2: one of the best, and last year was the first
Speaker 2: time that it was clear he was not the best,
Speaker 2: you know, Yeah, And with that bar raising, he has
Speaker 2: clearly taken his game to the next level.
Speaker 4: In my opinion, yeah, I think I definitely think some
Speaker 4: of it is is players. I mean, you know, twenty
Speaker 4: that was kind of the era where it was like
Speaker 4: these guys that grew up watching Time. I mean, I
Speaker 4: know Rory grew up watching Tiger, but it was really
Speaker 4: like the.
Speaker 1: Sort of JT.
Speaker 4: Speed Like that era was like prime, like, oh, Tiger's
Speaker 4: in golf, I'm going to go play golf because it's
Speaker 4: cool and there's a ton of money in it, by
Speaker 4: the way, and all those guys started to hit at
Speaker 4: the time where Rory was getting into. I think the
Speaker 4: other part of it with Rory is like you went
Speaker 4: four majors at twenty five, and then you start looking
Speaker 4: around and like, you know.
Speaker 1: Is this just it?
Speaker 4: Like is this It gets a little existential of like, oh,
Speaker 4: is this all that life is going to be? And
Speaker 4: so I think he went through that five six year
Speaker 4: period and then you get old. I mean you and
Speaker 4: I experienced this in our careers in our lives, Like
Speaker 4: you get old enough to where you have a little
Speaker 4: bit of like, oh, I've only got like the X
Speaker 4: number of years left to do this. I need to
Speaker 4: really commit myself to it and appreciate it. And I
Speaker 4: think there's some of that in there well, just from
Speaker 4: a from a psychological and an emotional perspective.
Speaker 1: Of his as well. To bring it back to the players, though,
Speaker 1: I think, I don't know how you feel.
Speaker 4: I thought he I thought he did a great job
Speaker 4: of decision making at TPC Sawgrass. I just there's times
Speaker 4: over the years, I know we all have group text
Speaker 4: about it like.
Speaker 1: What are you like, why are you hitting that shot?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 1: What are you doing? Man?
Speaker 2: You know, it's one moment with nine on Saturday when
Speaker 2: he hit in the water on nine with the driver. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was like, wait did you hit that?
Speaker 4: But that was that was kind of old old Rory.
Speaker 4: I go back to I think it was on.
Speaker 2: Do you think he was trying to hit it over
Speaker 2: the water?
Speaker 1: I mean it went straight in.
Speaker 4: He wasn't that far away from getting it over.
Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying. I don't think he hit it well.
Speaker 1: It didn't even touch land.
Speaker 2: I know. That's why. He just did not hit it well.
Speaker 2: And you couldn't possibly be trying to hit it up
Speaker 2: the left side.
Speaker 4: He Uh, there was a moment on Friday, him and
Speaker 4: Shuffler and Xander were playing together and JT had just
Speaker 4: on Thursday hit that mini driver into the water on
Speaker 4: eighteen and JT is always trying to like like rope
Speaker 4: like roll one over on eighteen and get it going
Speaker 4: up the left side. And I watched, I watched. I
Speaker 4: think Rory hit first. He just hits three woods like
Speaker 4: kind of kind of cutting through wood like up the middle,
Speaker 4: working to the right side, and I was like, man,
Speaker 4: that's such like a just an adult decision from him,
Speaker 4: you know, and and some one that I'm sure he's
Speaker 4: tempted to not make because he can hit that huge
Speaker 4: drawing driver up there if he if he catches it,
Speaker 4: but it's just it's such a smart, like Friday adult decision.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, he. I think also like his targets. He
Speaker 2: talked about this in his post round about how conservative
Speaker 2: he was this week with his targets, and I think
Speaker 2: it like was he was out of position at a time,
Speaker 2: and it's because like he had this great week putting
Speaker 2: and scrambling, but he was doing it from like positions
Speaker 2: where it was feasible to recover. He wasn't putting himself.
Speaker 2: It wasn't like when you think back to like even
Speaker 2: okill a couple of years ago when he was chasing
Speaker 2: on Sunday. Yeah, and it's like, oh, this might be
Speaker 2: set up for Rory come back. And he gets going
Speaker 2: and he misses, like the second green, I think it
Speaker 2: was he missed it. Yeah, he missed his short sighted
Speaker 2: right makes a bogie and he's immediately out of it
Speaker 2: because it's like he needed It's like and he pushed
Speaker 2: the gas too much, and it's like that's the one
Speaker 2: place you couldn't miss it, because like what you can't
Speaker 2: do is go backwards. Like this week in particular, it
Speaker 2: just seemed like every miss was left in a place
Speaker 2: where he had enough space to work with and and
Speaker 2: get get himself into a position to make a par
Speaker 2: if he did miss Yeah.
Speaker 4: And I can't think that that is anything other than
Speaker 4: watching Scotty over the last two years, right, I think
Speaker 4: I think Scotty's course management is the best in the
Speaker 4: world and Rory's I think, I mean, I haven't seen everything.
Speaker 4: I've seen a lot of Rory pressers. I think he
Speaker 4: kind of talks about Scotty a lot, like pretty openly, like,
Speaker 4: and some of it's joking, like, oh, we'll never catch Scott.
Speaker 4: You know whatever, But I have to think he is
Speaker 4: like looking at Scotty and saying, man, I hit it
Speaker 4: as good as him, I hit it better than him.
Speaker 4: What is he doing that's different than me?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 4: Course, management decision, Like I just I can't think that's
Speaker 4: I mean, I have to think that some of that
Speaker 4: has rubbed off on the way that he is going
Speaker 4: about playing some of these golf courses, because it is
Speaker 4: materially different than I think a lot of the way
Speaker 4: he's gone about it in the past.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's like a I think one of the things
Speaker 2: that Scotty has is like a lack of ego in
Speaker 2: his game where he's not afraid to take speed off
Speaker 2: to hit fairways, Like he isn't afraid to not take
Speaker 2: on flags because he knows he could, just like he's
Speaker 2: going to hit. And it's like always like you know,
Speaker 2: I don't know if this is a statistic, but it's
Speaker 2: been kind of like every time I've seen Rory for
Speaker 2: the most part, with Scotty, outside of maybe last year's
Speaker 2: Players where Scotty like really played great and Rory didn't
Speaker 2: play that great, But didn't they paired together last year
Speaker 2: at the Players too.
Speaker 4: I think so I think Rory was didn't he miss
Speaker 4: he missed the cut?
Speaker 2: He did not play well at the But like to me,
Speaker 2: when we've seen them together and we saw him at
Speaker 2: uh was Pinehurst? Did they play together? Lacc? They were
Speaker 2: together on Sunday, Yeah, and then this week.
Speaker 1: I don't remember Pinehurst this week.
Speaker 2: Something that's always jarring to me is like how much
Speaker 2: Scotty starts behind Rory, Because like, if you think about
Speaker 2: it as like a race, like Rory's often like forty
Speaker 2: yards ahead of him. Yeah, he hits his so much
Speaker 2: further than Scotty does that he's already like, you know,
Speaker 2: let's just say a tenth or a tenth or two,
Speaker 2: a tenth or so better than Scotty on every single hole.
Speaker 2: That's not a part three And it's just like Scotty's
Speaker 2: been so good from there in. But like from a
Speaker 2: skill standpoint, I think Rory overall is a better putter.
Speaker 2: I think Scotty is probably a better iron player, a
Speaker 2: better short game, but the short game's not that different.
Speaker 2: Rory's a great short game player. It has a great
Speaker 2: short game and a lot of the iron play where
Speaker 2: Rory gets himself in trouble over you know, over the
Speaker 2: last five or six years, it's just been around like
Speaker 2: a few bad misses.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I think I mean, you sort of answered
Speaker 4: it right there. You can be it's like a tortoise
Speaker 4: in the hair thing. You can be a tenth better,
Speaker 4: a tenth better for nine straight holes and then you
Speaker 4: hit one into a spot that like on nine that
Speaker 4: you cost yourself a stroke and you just erased all
Speaker 4: those tints that you that you stacked up right. And
Speaker 4: that's where Scotty is. And it takes so much mental
Speaker 4: energy to make to maintain that decision making over the
Speaker 4: course of seventy two holes, because these guys, I mean,
Speaker 4: this is a j I talk about this with JT
Speaker 4: all the time. It's like, well I could hit that shot.
Speaker 4: It's like, yeah, I know you, I know you could,
Speaker 4: but that's very different than you should, you know. And
Speaker 4: that's that's the part where I'm so impressed by Scotty's
Speaker 4: humility and his lack of ego, and his willingness to
Speaker 4: be super conservative in spots where you would think one
Speaker 4: of the best ball strikers in the game and of
Speaker 4: the last twenty years would not be conservative, but he is.
Speaker 4: And I think that I think I do think that
Speaker 4: part has rubbed off on Rory a little bit.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think, like he said it early this year,
Speaker 2: like he's going to play more like Scotti this year
Speaker 2: and his patience, and I thought this was like this
Speaker 2: tournament was like the showcase of that. He clearly did
Speaker 2: not have his A game this week. And yeah, he's
Speaker 2: still won, and I think a lot of people were
Speaker 2: saying he kicked away winning it in regulation. I mean,
Speaker 2: this is one of the best fields in golf. I
Speaker 2: think the other part of his game that he's transformed,
Speaker 2: besides the kind of more conservative targets and smarter play,
Speaker 2: is like he has added so many shots his repertoire
Speaker 2: where now like there was this advanced analytic from I
Speaker 2: think it's ron close that he's the best player an
Speaker 2: eighteen plus miles an hour wind on the PGA Tour.
Speaker 2: You know, this is a guy that people said when
Speaker 2: the conditions get tough years, you know, in that twenty
Speaker 2: sixteen range, he couldn't play when it was firm or windy,
Speaker 2: he couldn't play. In the last couple of years, we've
Speaker 2: seen when it's been the toughest conditions at the US Opens,
Speaker 2: he's become the best US Open playersh Yeah, at the
Speaker 2: Scottish Open, like he rises to the occasion when these win.
Speaker 2: And a lot of it is the development of his
Speaker 2: off speed stuff. Like he's known for his power, but
Speaker 2: his ability now to take speed off on the irons
Speaker 2: in particular and hit those flight and knocked down shots.
Speaker 2: You saw it on seventeen. It was the difference in
Speaker 2: the playoff was Rory's ability to take speed off hit
Speaker 2: something that was very unpredictable in the wind with that
Speaker 2: flighted shot versus JJ spawn just simply not having the
Speaker 2: same shot in the bag, hitting a more like full
Speaker 2: shot that got up in the air and the wind
Speaker 2: not hitting it right like that was the difference in
Speaker 2: the wind.
Speaker 4: Well, I think it's I think what's interesting about that
Speaker 4: is he's really evolved from like you used to think,
Speaker 4: oh it's got a rain or be soft or wet
Speaker 4: for Rory to to really like, you know, go out
Speaker 4: and have a chance to beat this field. And now
Speaker 4: it's almost the opposite. You almost want like for for
Speaker 4: his sake, he almost wanted to be fast, firm, windy.
Speaker 4: But again, like I think the thing that really stood
Speaker 4: out about this week in particular is he balanced having
Speaker 4: those shots with knowing when to use them. It's one
Speaker 4: thing to have them, it's another thing to know when
Speaker 4: to apply the gas and when to pull off and
Speaker 4: hit the brake. And we don't always see top level
Speaker 4: players make the right decision. I mean I always go
Speaker 4: back to JT and it's like always got every shot,
Speaker 4: and it's like, well, that's fine if for if I'm
Speaker 4: just watching you on the range, but can you apply
Speaker 4: them in the right situation? And if you can't, then
Speaker 4: it doesn't matter. You're going to shoot yourself out of it.
Speaker 4: And I thought that he did a great job of
Speaker 4: applying those shots. Yeah, it like your practice and your
Speaker 4: work you've put in builds up those shots, but applying
Speaker 4: them in the right situation like we saw in seventeen,
Speaker 4: like we saw on.
Speaker 1: Six.
Speaker 4: You know that kind of forty yard cut out of
Speaker 4: the pinestraw there, Like that's a six shot, but you
Speaker 4: have to know when to use it and when not to.
Speaker 2: All right, what's your next thing?
Speaker 4: My next thing is a little bit related to those shots,
Speaker 4: which is that I have really come to love and
Speaker 4: appreciate TPC Sawgrass and I think early in my career
Speaker 4: covering golf twenty thirteen. I didn't have a huge golf background,
Speaker 4: and so I was kind of ambivalent toward TPC Sawgrass.
Speaker 4: I didn't appreciate it. I didn't hate it, but I
Speaker 4: grew to dislike it a little bit because everybody, everybody
Speaker 4: just talks about seventeen too much, and it just everything
Speaker 4: felt a little bit overrated. But man, I just think
Speaker 4: it is a really cool test of professional golf in
Speaker 4: a way that those guys don't often get tested outside
Speaker 4: of major championships. And I put something about that on
Speaker 4: Twitter and Michael Kim responded and said that he thinks
Speaker 4: it's because it was specifically built for professional golf, whereas
Speaker 4: a lot of these places a lot of it, Like
Speaker 4: you know, you think about a place like TPC Craig Ranch,
Speaker 4: that's probably a bad example, but a lot of other
Speaker 4: courses they get that they go to, it wasn't necessarily
Speaker 4: built for professional golf. And I'm I'm I'm not a
Speaker 4: architecture Like, I don't know architecture, but I do know
Speaker 4: like variants, like you can just look at the numbers.
Speaker 4: And I was talking to Rick Gaiman and I said, man,
Speaker 4: that the variance in scoring has to be wider here
Speaker 4: than anywhere else, and he he told me that this
Speaker 4: TPC Sagrass and Mirfield Village are the two widest standard
Speaker 4: deviations in terms of scoring every year on consistently on
Speaker 4: the PGA Tour, So outside of the majors, those are
Speaker 4: the two highest, which to me makes sense after watching.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you nail it. Like the it being
Speaker 2: designed and Michael Kibb being designed for professional golf is
Speaker 2: such a big aspect of it because like you're not
Speaker 2: concerned with playability, and I think like it shows generally
Speaker 2: a TPC sawgrass, like the more offline you hit it,
Speaker 2: the wor your your situation is like because there's a
Speaker 2: lot of water because it's built out of swamp, Like
Speaker 2: if you you blasted offline, you're generally going in water.
Speaker 2: Water is obviously I think something that like tests and
Speaker 2: scares pro golfers because of the you know, penalty associated
Speaker 2: with it. The way you just described rorate for nine holes,
Speaker 2: making up point one point one point one off every
Speaker 2: tea and then losing it all on one shot, Like
Speaker 2: that's a big part of it. I think, like the
Speaker 2: other thing about it is like when you're designing, like
Speaker 2: you're not thinking about playability concerns, and I think that's
Speaker 2: one of the big things that that Sagress has going
Speaker 2: for it is that they don't have to address like hey,
Speaker 2: we need to get fifteen handicaps around here or twenty
Speaker 2: handicaps around here. Obviously it is a very popular public
Speaker 2: golf course, but you know you're going to play this
Speaker 2: championship golf course and a good example of this, like
Speaker 2: and I think it's gotten softer over the years, Like
Speaker 2: this has been like a delicate balance for the tour
Speaker 2: to run because they have this cap cow. I mean, yeah,
Speaker 2: you start to do the math on the back of
Speaker 2: a napkin of like what an eight hundred you know,
Speaker 2: two hundred or two hundred and fifty players at eight
Speaker 2: hundred bucks ahead? Does you know on a daily basis
Speaker 2: you start to look at the numbers, it's like this
Speaker 2: thing makes a shitload of money, right, Like, so they
Speaker 2: have to balance, They have to balance the idea of
Speaker 2: like this is a popular place for people to play
Speaker 2: with like we host this championship, but the idea that
Speaker 2: it was built one of the things I love about
Speaker 2: what's going on there, and with the recent work that
Speaker 2: Scott Sherman and Davis love have done like to me,
Speaker 2: like the new work on fourteen with those super severe
Speaker 2: moguls is like quintessential Sawgrass because that t shot you need,
Speaker 2: You're supposed to hit it up the left side, like
Speaker 2: that's where you want to hit it, but you got
Speaker 2: water in a bunker over there, and it's scary and
Speaker 2: you have like it's on a diagonal, so you have
Speaker 2: to pick how far you want to cover. And as
Speaker 2: you saw, like I thought with Rory's restart like that,
Speaker 2: that's the worst first driver to have to hit after
Speaker 2: a four hour break, and of course he bails way right.
Speaker 2: It gets him in trouble. He has to chip out
Speaker 2: will Zl Taurus is cooking. Oh gosh, he was flying.
Speaker 2: I thought he was gonna win the tournament after the
Speaker 2: thirteenth hole and he hits it right over there, and
Speaker 2: it's just you know, it's the what you cannot bail.
Speaker 2: And that's what I love about Like that work was
Speaker 2: like it's added back in that severity over there, has
Speaker 2: added in the penalty for bailing. And I think that's
Speaker 2: what Sawgrass does so well, is it shows you know
Speaker 2: where you want to go, but you just can't get there.
Speaker 2: Like it's hard to get yourself to go there. And
Speaker 2: if you do not swing freely, and if you try
Speaker 2: and guide it around there, you are in for a
Speaker 2: world of like it's kind of just like body blows
Speaker 2: all day, and I think it's got Like what what's
Speaker 2: unique about sawgrass is it has I think there are
Speaker 2: golf courses that kind of paper cut you to death.
Speaker 2: Sawgrass can apply body blows. And then there are a
Speaker 2: few places on the golf course as we saw we
Speaker 2: see every year with seventeen is one of them. What
Speaker 2: happened is zeal toursund fourteen, Like, there are a few
Speaker 2: places on that golf course that can complete deliver knockout
Speaker 2: blows and that's where you get that high variance.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think even eighteen isn't I don't know what
Speaker 4: architecture people think about eighteen Again, not my world, but
Speaker 4: it's just asking a question of you that is very unique.
Speaker 4: You know, you've got the whole planet to the right,
Speaker 4: and you can go too far right though you can
Speaker 4: bail out, but it's going to be a nightmare. But
Speaker 4: then if you it's just I mean, it requires and
Speaker 4: I know you guys, and I think Joseph's written about
Speaker 4: this quite a bit. But it just requires consequential decision
Speaker 4: making in shots that you don't get it a lot of.
Speaker 4: I mean you watch most tour stops and it's like,
Speaker 4: I don't think double is really in play, and certainly
Speaker 4: not triple. And here it's like you could finish eight six, five,
Speaker 4: five y five, like like Zalataurus did, and that is
Speaker 4: I mean Saturday, and there's thirty sixty six is and
Speaker 4: I realized they're a little bit earlier in the day.
Speaker 4: Emilionogrioz struggling to break ninety.
Speaker 2: Yes, and that is and that was a guy who
Speaker 2: had like, legitimately play a good Saturday. You're in contention.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was late. I mean he was later.
Speaker 4: He wasn't super late, and he's playing well on the
Speaker 4: week and she goes out in.
Speaker 1: Forty five and you're like, oh my god.
Speaker 4: And I get it was windier and the wind kicked
Speaker 4: up and all that, but that's just a I think
Speaker 4: that's a facet that we're only accustomed to scene at
Speaker 4: tough major championships. I think about a windy Augusta. I
Speaker 4: think about an Open when he gets a little there's
Speaker 4: a little bit of weather. A US Open obviously, but man,
Speaker 4: the variants in scoring, I just have I just think
Speaker 4: it's awesome. I think it makes for a great championship
Speaker 4: and it I think it's part I mean, if you
Speaker 4: look at the leaderboard and you just erase Rory's name,
Speaker 4: it's not it's not ideal, you know, like it's not
Speaker 4: great for the tour, but it's guys that are playing
Speaker 4: great golf.
Speaker 2: Right and it allows variety totally. You know, I think
Speaker 2: like if anything this this week, I think especially with
Speaker 2: the weather you saw, you saw flushers. You know, like
Speaker 2: nobody on that board is not a very good iron player, right,
Speaker 2: Like JJ spawn. The skill that has really risen to
Speaker 2: the top with him over as he's become a better
Speaker 2: and better player. The skill that was really evident when
Speaker 2: he was on corn Ferry Tour and Canadian Tour was
Speaker 2: the iron play. Tom Hogy certain he's played well there
Speaker 2: historically great iron player. You know, it's a comedy. It's
Speaker 2: like precise players are really rewarded there where you know,
Speaker 2: I think, like you know, there's so many golf courses
Speaker 2: where precision doesn't matter that much because you hit it
Speaker 2: over a certain threshold. Once your power gets to a
Speaker 2: certain level. On a lot of golf courses that the
Speaker 2: tour plays, the precision's just overwhelmed because it's like, at
Speaker 2: the end of the day, I'm hitting a wedge into
Speaker 2: fairly large targets. And I think this is where what
Speaker 2: you said about like and what Michael said about it
Speaker 2: being designed for pros makes a big difference, because like,
Speaker 2: you can't just overwhelm Sawgrass. Like, sure, you could get
Speaker 2: hot and overwhelment probably for a round or two. It
Speaker 2: is really hard to just strictly your your strategy cannot
Speaker 2: be too overwhelm it for seventy two holes because at
Speaker 2: some point it will get you with a big number
Speaker 2: when you spray one, you know, or hit a really
Speaker 2: bad wedge.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And how many times have you and I been
Speaker 4: at a major where you know, we're talking on Saturday
Speaker 4: or Sunday and you say something like, I don't even
Speaker 4: know if this place is identifying the guy that's playing best, right,
Speaker 4: And I don't really ever feel like that that's the
Speaker 4: case at TPC Sawgrass.
Speaker 1: I think that.
Speaker 4: You want to identify the guy who's hitting the ball best,
Speaker 4: and not just who's hitting at the farthest or who's
Speaker 4: the got the fastest swing speed or whatever. And I
Speaker 4: have no doubt this week that Lucas Glover and JJ
Speaker 4: Spahn and Rory hit the ball better than anybody else
Speaker 4: in the field, you know, like those are the guys that,
Speaker 4: oh yeah, and and I just think that is it
Speaker 4: it to me, it's it's it's just very different than
Speaker 4: when we normally get at a PGA Tour event, and
Speaker 4: I I think it's great. I think it's very appealing.
Speaker 4: I think it's compelling. I I was looking forward to
Speaker 4: this week maybe more than I ever have before. And
Speaker 4: I think that it got tiring if I like, get
Speaker 4: dragged on forever into Monday and all that. But it
Speaker 4: just is a golf course that I think is I
Speaker 4: think that the Tour does a great job with it.
Speaker 4: And I think that it identifies god that are hitting
Speaker 4: the ball very very well, which is which is awesome.
Speaker 2: All right, what's your last one?
Speaker 1: Well, my last one?
Speaker 4: This is maybe a personal one, but I got a
Speaker 4: little bit and I'm interested to hear your take. I
Speaker 4: have purposely not listened as to not I don't know
Speaker 4: if you do this, but I get scared that I'm
Speaker 4: going to steal other people's takes and apply them to mine,
Speaker 4: and so I just try to stay siloed during major weeks.
Speaker 2: That's one of the things that I like I try
Speaker 2: and do too, is I don't like listening to other
Speaker 2: golf podcasts because you don't want to get other people's
Speaker 2: thoughts in your head.
Speaker 4: Yes, totally, but one of my takeaways from this week
Speaker 4: was I just I found Scotty Shuffler's sort of reactions
Speaker 4: and disposition to be pretty tiresome. And I like Scotty
Speaker 4: as a player. I think he's way underrated and just incredible.
Speaker 4: I like him as a person. I have good interactions
Speaker 4: with him. We have a good rapport, but he just
Speaker 4: I think when you're not winning and you start to,
Speaker 4: you know, mutter and groan at every single bounce that
Speaker 4: you get or every single thing that happens, It's like,
Speaker 4: I don't know, man, I think the wind is blowing
Speaker 4: for everybody else as well. I think these are the
Speaker 4: same greens that everybody else is hitting to, and I'm
Speaker 4: just curious. I think that's one thing it's gonna be.
Speaker 4: That's sort of he did it a lot last year,
Speaker 4: and it kind of gets swept under the rug because
Speaker 4: he's winning nine times I'm interested to see how how
Speaker 4: that goes this year.
Speaker 1: If he's not winning at.
Speaker 2: All, you don't think he's getting worse bounces than everybody
Speaker 2: else on tour this way, he suggests on Saturday.
Speaker 5: No, absolutely, remember the bounce he got when he won
Speaker 5: the Masters, when the when he hit it into like
Speaker 5: the bomb roll forrest left of eighteen and it kicked
Speaker 5: out just like right the grass.
Speaker 4: Remember, yeah, and listen, like, I think part of it
Speaker 4: is like that was a good violence. Yeah, And it's like, dude,
Speaker 4: I don't know. Part of it is every shot in
Speaker 4: reaction is shown, which is unfair to him. I totally
Speaker 4: get that. And again Michael Kim responded to me and said,
Speaker 4: there's I got a list of guys that are way
Speaker 4: worse than Scottie Scheffer, which I don't I think is
Speaker 4: like for sure true, but I can only see what
Speaker 4: is shown.
Speaker 1: To me, and I just I don't know.
Speaker 4: I'm I don't know how that's going to go for
Speaker 4: him if that continues this year.
Speaker 2: I mean, this is the story of every pro golfer ever. Uh,
Speaker 2: this is a story of like almost every golfer ever.
Speaker 2: Is that everybody Like it's just such a psychologically difficult
Speaker 2: sport that it's very hard to blame yourself. Yeah, right,
Speaker 2: And I think like the vast majority of golfers are
Speaker 2: completely delusional. Like the best golfer are almost the most
Speaker 2: illusional ones. They never sure it's like maybe you just
Speaker 2: didn't hit a good shot. Scotti is not, that's not
Speaker 2: something that's in his head, like maybe I misjudge the win.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think it would be like if you fully miked
Speaker 2: up players all the time and you could just listen
Speaker 2: to any of them, it would be astonishing as to
Speaker 2: what some of the players are thinking about. Like, do
Speaker 2: I think Scotty's reactions are different than everybody else? No,
Speaker 2: I also think like this is like like I think
Speaker 2: that it shows some in some ways, Like I think
Speaker 2: Rory's like very self aware. I don't think like Rory
Speaker 2: really moans and goes on and on about bad bounces
Speaker 2: here or there like occasionally might. But I do think
Speaker 2: that there are, like there's just different spectrums of golfers. And
Speaker 2: I think Scotty's on the one that like doesn't believe
Speaker 2: he's he's ever done anything wrong on a golf course
Speaker 2: or hit a bad shot. I mean, golfers are weird.
Speaker 2: And I think like the other thing that Scotty's dealing
Speaker 2: with right now that I talked about this with Jeff
Speaker 2: Ogilvie a little bit, and Ogilvie was like, the hardest
Speaker 2: thing to do is to play after the week you've won.
Speaker 2: But my where I kind of Jeff, you know, I
Speaker 2: was like, is there an issue with is it make
Speaker 2: it the next year really hard when you win nine times?
Speaker 2: And he was like, oh, absolutely, yeah, because your expectations,
Speaker 2: his expectations are so I mean, they're so over the moon.
Speaker 2: I guarantee it. He won so much last year, Yeah,
Speaker 2: that it's going to make this year extremely hard.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: And I think that's a little bit. My point is
Speaker 4: like it can it can almost get going in the
Speaker 4: wrong direction to where you just are mentally and and
Speaker 4: look like Scotty is emotional and this is this is
Speaker 4: not like that different than he was last year or
Speaker 4: the year before that, of the year before that. I
Speaker 4: just think the public perception of him in the same
Speaker 4: way that it's it's I think turned a little bit
Speaker 4: on guys like Spieth and JT who are always gesticulating
Speaker 4: and hollering. I wonder what happens with Scotty this year
Speaker 4: in turn, like you don't see that with Mark Awa
Speaker 4: and Xander and Rory, And there's a lot of top
Speaker 4: guys that I think are on TV a lot that
Speaker 4: don't do that.
Speaker 1: So I don't know.
Speaker 4: I just and again like that's a personal thing that
Speaker 4: I noticed, but I think it could start to to
Speaker 4: affect him a little bit, just in terms of like
Speaker 4: whether it's the way that the media speaks to him
Speaker 4: and perceives him, or the way that fans perceive him
Speaker 4: or whatever. I'm just int something I've got my eye
Speaker 4: on going into into major season.
Speaker 2: Something's been off since he came back. You know, he's
Speaker 2: been really chippy with the media. He's been a little
Speaker 2: agitated on the golf course.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but is that a isn't that a expectation thing?
Speaker 2: I think so, you know, like, but it's it's also
Speaker 2: I think this is what we want.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: The thing that I worry about is like, to me,
Speaker 2: i'd I'd take ten Scottie shufflers, powdy Scottie shufflers giving
Speaker 2: us something to talk about over Xander, who looks the
Speaker 2: same if he's you know key Yeah, well, I mean
Speaker 2: JJ spawn was like, you know, gave us like nothing.
Speaker 2: I thought he was really good in the press conference, uh,
Speaker 2: talking about like his journey and like belief in his
Speaker 2: in himself. But like in terms of like I mean
Speaker 2: he made when he made the shot I made the
Speaker 2: putt from off sixteen Green on Saturday, I was like
Speaker 2: Holy God, Like I was like that was insane. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and he and it's just like no reaction, you know,
Speaker 2: Like I think I'd rather have people that like articulate
Speaker 2: how they're feeling in the more than someone that doesn't
Speaker 2: give us anything, like you know, like Xander to me
Speaker 2: is like the ultimate like you get. And I think
Speaker 2: it's like such a weapon the way he plays. You know.
Speaker 2: I say this as a member of media who wants
Speaker 2: stuff to talk about, but Xander is just so steady
Speaker 2: inside the ropes right like where you can tell if
Speaker 2: he had made four birdies in a row or four
Speaker 2: bogies in a row for the most part.
Speaker 4: Yeah, do you think that Scotty is a great character
Speaker 4: because I mean we talk about the idea of individual
Speaker 4: sports having characters, and you look at all the like
Speaker 4: the tennis guys, they were all great characters, obviously great players,
Speaker 4: but they also had their own sort of Ethos.
Speaker 1: And you know they were good.
Speaker 4: Phil's an amazing character, speeth is a character, Rory's a
Speaker 4: good character. Do you think Scotty is a good character.
Speaker 2: I don't necessarily think he's like a great character. I
Speaker 2: don't think he's a bad character. I think he's gotten
Speaker 2: infinitely more interesting over the last year. Like I think
Speaker 2: you've seen him come out of his shell. He's been
Speaker 2: funny at times, and I think like he's gotten a
Speaker 2: lot better. I think, like in terms of like being
Speaker 2: in front of the media and answering questions all the time,
Speaker 2: he's gotten better. I think like him being chippy honestly
Speaker 2: makes him a better character.
Speaker 4: What do you think, Yeah, I'm I think I'm with you.
Speaker 4: I remember I was talking to one media member at
Speaker 4: the twenty twenty what was the first Masters he won,
Speaker 4: twenty twenty two.
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, yeah, twenty two, because twenty three was wrong.
Speaker 4: And this media member said, gosh, I'm not looking forward
Speaker 4: to his presser because he's just always so boring, and
Speaker 4: I kind of I didn't know how to take that
Speaker 4: statement at the time. I definitely disagree with it. Now
Speaker 4: I think he is If you listen to Scotty talk
Speaker 4: about golf or life or anything. He's got some really
Speaker 4: interesting I think, stuff you can apply to your own
Speaker 4: golf game or wife or whatever. I think he also
Speaker 4: kind of low key has some some takes. Like I
Speaker 4: think he has some takes. He sometimes not always, but
Speaker 4: sometimes floats out there and you're like, oh, give me
Speaker 4: more on that. What else you got in there? Uh so, yeah,
Speaker 4: I think he's I'm with you. I think he's an
Speaker 4: above average character. He's not He's not a phill fills
Speaker 4: like a ten of ten character, you know, but I
Speaker 4: think he's certainly a better character than I thought he
Speaker 4: was going to be three years ago.
Speaker 1: I just worry about how he is.
Speaker 4: I worry about how he's perceived a little bit and
Speaker 4: how that affects him because we've seen that negative spiral.
Speaker 4: He's not as abrasive as somebody like a Bryson, but
Speaker 4: we still, I mean, think about how much we saw
Speaker 4: Bryson spiral when kind of the media got against him,
Speaker 4: and you know, like, and I don't know that Scotty's
Speaker 4: in danger of that happening, but it was just something
Speaker 4: that it sort of clicked for me that for the
Speaker 4: first time during this Players Championship.
Speaker 2: Are you more worried about Colin Markalla in the media
Speaker 2: or or Scottie Scheffler in the media.
Speaker 7: I don't know if you're joking or not, but uh,
Speaker 7: I don't know. I cannot believe Marc that was that.
Speaker 4: That that and I mean this in all sincerity. That
Speaker 4: reeked of somebody that just had never been told no
Speaker 4: or never been criticized before, right Like, uh that that
Speaker 4: was just like, Oh, you've never faced adversity in in
Speaker 4: your life or that's what That's what it seemed like.
Speaker 4: I'm not saying that he hasn't, but that that that
Speaker 4: was just the perception after he I mean he he
Speaker 4: almost started crying, but he was so emotional about it,
Speaker 4: and you're like, gosh, I think and all these guys
Speaker 4: I wrote about this for the newsletter, all these guys
Speaker 4: want to be loved like that that just as all
Speaker 4: of us.
Speaker 1: Do as humans. And I think it like.
Speaker 4: He just had it seems like he and of course
Speaker 4: you win two majors and people are just worshiping you,
Speaker 4: and then it's like, oh, not everybody loves me, and
Speaker 4: that can be that can be pretty jarring, and clearly it.
Speaker 1: Was for him.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I I sometimes just wonder about like somebody's got
Speaker 2: to give him advice not to do that. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: it's are you worried about Scottie at all? Like do
Speaker 2: you do you game? Yeah? From a game standpoint, No,
Speaker 2: not not really.
Speaker 4: I do think I was looking at his numbers from
Speaker 4: TC Sagrass and he was bad around the greens, and
Speaker 4: and the thing that I was thinking about that Andy is,
Speaker 4: you know, the injury that he had in December was
Speaker 4: to his hand, and I think he's go at some
Speaker 4: of the best or most underrated hands in the world
Speaker 4: in terms of him and ram their hands short game
Speaker 4: are just unbelievable. And so you're like, hmm, is there
Speaker 4: something in there that there's a little bit of lost
Speaker 4: touch or there's a little bit of I don't know.
Speaker 4: That's just that's one thing that I've I think noticed
Speaker 4: a little bit early on in his year. But I
Speaker 4: don't I don't want to get too worked up after
Speaker 4: what was he played like four events, five events and
Speaker 4: he's finished top twenty five and all of them.
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, I you know, I think it's just
Speaker 2: a I think he's such a creature habit. It's hard
Speaker 2: because he's come into this year with like a different schedule. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and he's he's working his way into it. That being said, like,
Speaker 2: don't love that he hasn't. I mean, I don't think
Speaker 2: he's had a chance, real chance to win on Sunday
Speaker 2: this year, you know. And I think that's that's a
Speaker 2: little bit concerning. You know, in terms of stats, he
Speaker 2: is forty fourth around the green okay, for you know,
Speaker 2: it's early. It's he's only got twenty measured rounds, but
Speaker 2: forty fourth kind of I mean, I think that's that's
Speaker 2: the big difference, you know, in where he's at.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: And I think what's interesting about him from a from
Speaker 4: a narrative perspective is like, I mean, I heard somebody
Speaker 4: talking about this the other day. It might have been
Speaker 4: it might have been you, I don't I don't remember
Speaker 4: who it was, but just the idea that you get
Speaker 4: this sort of two year window of your peak golf,
Speaker 4: like the best golf of your life, maybe a year
Speaker 4: and a half, eighteen months. I think Patrick care Harrington
Speaker 4: used to talk about this window that you get, and
Speaker 4: some guys it's lasted longer than that. Maybe Rory like
Speaker 4: we're to bring it fully back around. Maybe he's had
Speaker 4: a couple of randows, yeah, or earth maybe maybe three.
Speaker 4: I don't know, but I think the question everybody was asking,
Speaker 4: or at least I was asking, and I think other
Speaker 4: people in golf media were asking with Scotti is like, man,
Speaker 4: was that last two years like your window?
Speaker 1: Not that you're not gonna.
Speaker 4: Win or play great golf again or whatever, but was
Speaker 4: that like, like, how long can you realistically keep that level?
Speaker 4: I mean, he's playing right now, if you just look
Speaker 4: at twenty twenty five.
Speaker 1: He's playing at a pretty high level. He's playing really
Speaker 1: good Golf's.
Speaker 2: Fourth in strokes gad total. Yeah, he's been really really good.
Speaker 4: But it's it's coming off that two year window of like,
Speaker 4: you know, is this just the dip back down to yeah, okay,
Speaker 4: maybe you win once a year or twice every three
Speaker 4: years like a normal star, not like a Tiger level star.
Speaker 4: I think that part is really intriguing for the next
Speaker 4: I mean, Phil doesn't think he's gonna win at all,
Speaker 4: so who knows.
Speaker 1: I mean, well, what.
Speaker 2: A take to win five dude?
Speaker 1: Somebody? And I still think this.
Speaker 4: I think Phil could have had and maybe still could
Speaker 4: have the Barklay career where our kids only know him
Speaker 4: as a great commentator and not a great player.
Speaker 2: I think for that to happen, they're the next broadcast
Speaker 2: deal has to go away from from Golf Channel. I
Speaker 2: think that it would be impossible for Golf Channel to bring
Speaker 2: him in. Why brandle him? I just don't don't see it.
Speaker 2: I think there's just too much bad blood there from
Speaker 2: from the divorce. Now, like what would be interesting. I
Speaker 2: just saw like NBC and and USGA. I saw Josh
Speaker 2: Carpenter had that story over the weekend, didn't reach their deal.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: Like now say like a a streamer comes in, like
Speaker 2: Apple or Amazon or yeah, you know whatever it may
Speaker 2: be Netflix, Like, could you see it a very small
Speaker 2: like role there? Yeah? Absolutely, I think like it would
Speaker 2: require something else, you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a good point. I just want to see
Speaker 4: him cooking up takes. I mean, you think Johnny Miller
Speaker 4: had takes, Phil's got nuclear take, I mean just the
Speaker 4: hottest takes.
Speaker 1: It would be incredible.
Speaker 4: Uh. And I know there's been rumors of him in
Speaker 4: different kind of lead seats over the years at different
Speaker 4: at different places, and that, you know, I think once
Speaker 4: the live thing happened, everybody thought out that that can
Speaker 4: never happen. But I think, you know, like you give
Speaker 4: it enough time and anything could take place, could happen.
Speaker 4: So I'm interested to see if that ever does go down.
Speaker 4: I think, I legitimately think if he was not saying
Speaker 4: like truly crazy things, that he'd be really really good
Speaker 4: in that in that chair.
Speaker 2: I think we saw little bits and pieces of it.
Speaker 2: He would have been the best. I think, you know,
Speaker 2: I think obviously I think Trevor's been really good.
Speaker 1: Agree uh.
Speaker 2: And I think NBC has a few things to straighten out.
Speaker 2: I think they're they I think the double the double booth.
Speaker 1: Is not there's so many people.
Speaker 2: It's just not there's nobody. Nobody can have the ball
Speaker 2: long enough to make a play, you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like it's like uh lines and hockey or something.
Speaker 2: It's just it's crazy because it's like, especially it was
Speaker 2: especially illuminated with the playoffs, where it looks like that
Speaker 2: just fasting it back and forth.
Speaker 1: It feels this doesn't this isn't actually happening.
Speaker 4: It feels like they're running them out of the booth
Speaker 4: and down the stairs and running somebody else in like
Speaker 4: to the microphones.
Speaker 1: That's what it feels like. It's happening.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but uh, Kyle, thanks for coming on. Uh what
Speaker 2: do you what do you have coming up on normal sport?
Speaker 6: Oh?
Speaker 4: We will be breaking down the players all week. I
Speaker 4: think one of my favorite parts of being independent is
Speaker 4: I can kind of write whatever I feel like is
Speaker 4: important in the moment. And I feel like, you know,
Speaker 4: you have six weeks a year that are really really important,
Speaker 4: and you know what does that leave forty six that
Speaker 4: are not as important?
Speaker 2: So what about the travelers?
Speaker 1: But I know you're partial to the love.
Speaker 2: The I love the signature events. The weeks after majors.
Speaker 1: Oh gosh, it's so brutal.
Speaker 4: But yeah, we'll be doing players all week and then
Speaker 4: obviously ramp up for for Agusta. We'll be I'll be
Speaker 4: going to a Gusta Masters as got credential for normal sports.
Speaker 4: That'll be fun and I'm sure we'll hang out a
Speaker 4: bunch there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll see you there. Thanks Kyle. All Right, that
Speaker 2: does it for another edition of the Friday Golf Podcast.
Speaker 2: Big thanks to PJ Clark. He is working overtime. He's spent.
Speaker 2: We have warn him out. PJ was on the ground
Speaker 2: all week. It was fun to see him interact with
Speaker 2: with all this fans on the ground, PJ has become
Speaker 2: I think the most beloved, loved member of the Friday
Speaker 2: Golf team. And he put this, produced this, and it's
Speaker 2: just going NonStop. So he needs a day off here
Speaker 2: pretty soon, and I think he's going to get one
Speaker 2: this weekend with his Saint John's in the NCAA tournament.
Speaker 2: But anyways, big thanks to Gabby and Kyle for joining
Speaker 2: and we will be back next week. We'll probably get
Speaker 2: some golf architecture talk into next week's episode, so thanks
Speaker 2: for joining in and we'll be back next week.