Speaker 1: One of the most admired, respected, and busiest global leaders
Speaker 1: in the world is Mark Carney. He served for a
Speaker 1: number of years as the Governor of the Bank of
Speaker 1: Canada for a number of additional years as the Governor
Speaker 1: of the Bank of England. He currently serves as a
Speaker 1: Special UN Envoy for Climate Action Finance, and he also
Speaker 1: chairs Brookfield Asset Management. I had a chance to sit
Speaker 1: down with Mark recently to talk about how he does
Speaker 1: all these things so well, Mark has been the Bank
Speaker 1: of Canada governor, been the governor of the Bank of England.
Speaker 1: Has anybody ever been the governor of two different central
Speaker 1: banks in two different countries.
Speaker 2: No, I don't think so.
Speaker 1: And so in addition to that, in addition to that,
Speaker 1: you are also the chairman of Brookfield Asset Management, and
Speaker 1: you are the new chairman of Bloomberg. So you obviously
Speaker 1: like b Bank of Canada, Bank of England, Bloomberg and Brookfield.
Speaker 1: But there's a story in the latest edition of a
Speaker 1: Canadian newspaper like two days ago that's saying that you
Speaker 1: might also be the next Prime Minister of Canada.
Speaker 2: So any interest in that in the story, not in
Speaker 2: the story per se. The you know, It's interesting you
Speaker 2: you say the same thing over and over, but it
Speaker 2: gets heard differently in different contexts. And I think that
Speaker 2: story is probably more indication of the current environment in Canada.
Speaker 3: In other words, you wouldn't be uninterested in that.
Speaker 2: I'm interested that we have an effective prime minister in Kenada. Okay,
Speaker 2: so Prime Minister Trudeau, and you know him. I know
Speaker 2: him well, yes, and he's done very so.
Speaker 1: But we'll take that as maybe all right, so I
Speaker 1: won't pursue that anymore. All right, let me ask you,
Speaker 1: as the Bank of England governor and as the Bank
Speaker 1: of Canada governor, do you think the other the central
Speaker 1: banks recently figured out that inflation was more serious than
Speaker 1: it was too late? Or do you think they recognized
Speaker 1: early when it was going to be serious they just
Speaker 1: didn't do enough about it.
Speaker 3: No.
Speaker 2: I think in hindsight they realized it too late. They
Speaker 2: were operating under the old paradigm, if you will. It
Speaker 2: was an issue of not enough demand, and that is
Speaker 2: something that works well generally until you have a bunch
Speaker 2: of supply shocks. And we had a COVID supply shock,
Speaker 2: we had an energy supply shock. We had supply shoks
Speaker 2: with supply chains, geopolitics, all of which meant that there
Speaker 2: was more than transitory inflation, and it took a while
Speaker 2: for some of the central banks to fully recognize that
Speaker 2: and start to respond.
Speaker 1: Now that they have did recognize it, do you think
Speaker 1: they've done enough? And do you see any more rate
Speaker 1: increases likely to come about? There are many people in
Speaker 1: the market who think that maybe another rate increase in
Speaker 1: the United States is likely.
Speaker 3: What do you think about that?
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, first first part of the question, and I
Speaker 2: think that once they started to move, and particularly when
Speaker 2: the FED started to move, it did respond in a
Speaker 2: very effective manner. It's consistently surprised people with it how
Speaker 2: resolute it was and what it was prepared to do.
Speaker 2: It recognized that the bigger risk was that inflation stayed
Speaker 2: high or worsened, and it has put us in a position,
Speaker 2: put the US in a position where inflation is increasingly
Speaker 2: under control, not totally under control. And that gets to
Speaker 2: the second part of your question, which is, I know,
Speaker 2: if I have to choose a camp, I be in
Speaker 2: the camp of I expect that there will be a
Speaker 2: bit more tightening by the Fed, so probably an additional
Speaker 2: rate increase this year, But.
Speaker 3: What's as important.
Speaker 2: In fact, what's more important is the path of policy
Speaker 2: over the course of the next twelve to eighteen months.
Speaker 2: And I think it's finally beginning to be recognized. It's
Speaker 2: been a painful few weeks for some of the market
Speaker 2: in getting recognition that it's not just about where the
Speaker 2: rate is today, it's not just about the peak, but
Speaker 2: it's the path, and the path of rates is very
Speaker 2: much and I've been in this view for a while,
Speaker 2: higher for longer, in order to ensure that policy is
Speaker 2: adequately tight to bring inflation fully back to that two percent.
Speaker 1: When I was in the White House as a young man,
Speaker 1: we were running for reelection under Jimmy Carter, and the
Speaker 1: head of the inflation Effort fighting inflation effort was a
Speaker 1: man named Fred Kahn, former Cornell professor, and he went
Speaker 1: out into the White House briefing room one day and said,
Speaker 1: I think we're going to have a recession. Well, Carter
Speaker 1: hauled him into the oval. Officer said Fred, I'm running
Speaker 1: for reelection. Do not use the R word. It scares people.
Speaker 1: And fred Kahn said, well, what am I supposed to do?
Speaker 1: I have to be honest, be honest, but don't use
Speaker 1: the R word. So the next time Fred Kahn went
Speaker 1: out and he said, I think we're heading into a banana.
Speaker 3: He used the word banana.
Speaker 1: As a substitute of recession for figuring reporters wouldn't put
Speaker 1: that in the headline. So are we heading into a banana?
Speaker 1: Do you think or you think we're not going into
Speaker 1: a banana?
Speaker 3: Well, I think the.
Speaker 2: Likelihood of banana has gone down. Actually, to be clear,
Speaker 2: the FED has done quite a masterful job. Other things
Speaker 2: have helped. But if you look at and you asked
Speaker 2: me a moment ago rightly about unemployment and getting back
Speaker 2: to the two percent, what's happened in the US, almost
Speaker 2: uniquely in the US is there hasn't been a sharp
Speaker 2: rise in unemployment. There's been a fall in vacancies, something
Speaker 2: that hasn't happened in the past. But of course this
Speaker 2: cycle is quite different than any previous cycles. So the
Speaker 2: Fed's been able to thus far ease some of the
Speaker 2: pressure in the labor market by reducing vacancies as opposed
Speaker 2: to increasing unemployment. That, plus the other aspects of the
Speaker 2: resilience that we've seen in the US economy makes recession
Speaker 2: less likely because the reality is, you know, if you
Speaker 2: get half a percent or certainly a full percent. Historically,
Speaker 2: anytime the unemployment rate in the US had risen by
Speaker 2: at least half of percent, there's been a recession. It's
Speaker 2: just you get the compounding effect that hasn't happened, So
Speaker 2: the probability's gone down, but there's still lots.
Speaker 1: When you're the head of the central back in Canada,
Speaker 1: do you kind of refer a lot to what the
Speaker 1: US was doing because your economy so tied to the US.
Speaker 1: Or do you say, look, we're we're going to do
Speaker 1: what we want to do. We don't care what the
Speaker 1: US is going to do. You consult a lot.
Speaker 2: We obsess about the US as the short answer, because
Speaker 2: it's the most impactful external factor for the Canadian economy.
Speaker 2: And there's also some you know, some of the things
Speaker 2: that drive growth in the United States, they're common factors
Speaker 2: that drive growth and or inflation in Canada. Let's talk
Speaker 2: about your background. So where did you grow up in Canada?
Speaker 3: Where were you born?
Speaker 2: I was born in Fort Smith in the Northwest Territories.
Speaker 1: And you're the Arctic and you're in the Northwest Territories. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's very far up.
Speaker 2: It is very far up Yeah, So what we're your
Speaker 2: emphasis on the north and what were your parents doing there?
Speaker 3: My parents were teachers.
Speaker 1: And did you ever tay to them that's pretty far
Speaker 1: up north to be living. And did they ever move closer?
Speaker 1: They moved, we moved. Well, it's interesting.
Speaker 2: I mean it's whatever two hour flights south to Edmonton, which.
Speaker 3: Is probably then you grow up in Edmonton.
Speaker 2: I grew up in Edmonton. I went to Yes, And
Speaker 2: so you were a hockey player too. I was a
Speaker 2: hockey player.
Speaker 3: Yes. So you played Harvard hockey at Harvard's right, I did? Yes?
Speaker 2: Ish I opened the gate. I was a goalie, so
Speaker 2: I opened the gate for a lot of very good players.
Speaker 3: Really.
Speaker 2: So were you a star at Harvard in the hockey
Speaker 2: world or.
Speaker 3: I was very good at opening the gate? Yes? But
Speaker 3: you never consider going to the NHL?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: I considered it. They didn't. The NHL did not consider it.
Speaker 3: Maybe in some sort of administrative role.
Speaker 1: But okay, So after you graduated, you went to do
Speaker 1: something like investment banking and you went to Goldman Sacks.
Speaker 3: I went to Golden Sacks in London, yes, nineteen eighty eight.
Speaker 3: And what did you do there?
Speaker 2: I worked, Actually I worked in the credit department. So yeah,
Speaker 2: credit analysis, which was probably the best thing I could
Speaker 2: have done, because you know, you build up a fundamental skill.
Speaker 1: How many people go to Goldman after college a young
Speaker 1: get an MBA and you decided not to get an
Speaker 1: MBA but to get a PhD in economics. Why did
Speaker 1: you want a PhD economics?
Speaker 2: I wanted to well, I thought that at some point
Speaker 2: i'd work in public policy, and I thought it would
Speaker 2: be more useful. And I toyed a bit with being
Speaker 2: an academic as well. My father was ended up being
Speaker 2: a professor ultimately.
Speaker 1: So you did this in Oxford. Why didn't you do
Speaker 1: a university in the United States or Canada?
Speaker 3: Why did you get the way to England? Yeah?
Speaker 2: It was To be honest, you could do a PhD
Speaker 2: in Oxford in three years, as opposed to if you're
Speaker 2: in the US system as a doctor student, you spend
Speaker 2: a huge amount of time teaching, which is great if
Speaker 2: you're going to be an academic. If you want the
Speaker 2: academic training, though, it means that the average time is most.
Speaker 3: So when you were in Oxford, did you also played hockey? Rint? Right?
Speaker 3: I did? And where you was a star or you're
Speaker 3: a star.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, So you stayed at Goldman for how many years?
Speaker 3: I was back?
Speaker 2: In total, I was thirteen years at Goldman, but eight
Speaker 2: almost ten years, I guess.
Speaker 3: So what the highest level you reached.
Speaker 2: That Goldman was to be a managing director managing director,
Speaker 2: So managing director, a managing director?
Speaker 1: Okay, So why did you leave Goldman? Some people think
Speaker 1: it's the greatest thing in the world to be a
Speaker 1: Goldman managing director. Why did you decide to leave and
Speaker 1: go back to Canada?
Speaker 2: But I had an opportunity to become Deputy governor at
Speaker 2: the Bank of Canada. I've always had an interest in
Speaker 2: public policy. It was unique, unique opportunity and I fully
Speaker 2: huge respect for the guy who was governor at the time,
Speaker 2: David Dodge.
Speaker 3: And so how.
Speaker 1: Would they have heard of you? You're an investment banker
Speaker 1: in Goldman. People in Canada are They.
Speaker 3: Had an end. They put an ad in the paper
Speaker 3: and I applied.
Speaker 1: They put an ad in the paper and you responded, wow, okay,
Speaker 1: that's how.
Speaker 3: You got a job. Okay.
Speaker 1: Well now it's like, okay, so it's not how you
Speaker 1: got to be the governor as well? You responded to that.
Speaker 2: Well, they knew they knew okay, well no, but you
Speaker 2: know for the governor as well. I mean that's become
Speaker 2: the norm now central banks do put ads. I don't
Speaker 2: think the face. So you're the deputy governor. You then
Speaker 2: went to the Finance. I went to the Finance Department
Speaker 2: and I worked with Yeah, I was one of the
Speaker 2: Then you become the governor and I became the governor
Speaker 2: Stephen Harper, and that was an easy time because there
Speaker 2: was no recession, there was no problems, the economy was
Speaker 2: going well well. I yeah, basically I remember saying to Diana,
Speaker 2: my wife's that.
Speaker 3: Look.
Speaker 2: I mean we had young kids, like you know, this job,
Speaker 2: you know you make eight decisions a year. You know
Speaker 2: exactly when you make those decisions, you know, work life balance.
Speaker 3: It was going to work.
Speaker 2: Great and U and two weeks after I started, bear
Speaker 2: Stearn's failed. Ultimately you finished after about how many years
Speaker 2: were you that?
Speaker 3: Just under six six?
Speaker 1: All right, you step down and say now I'm going
Speaker 1: to go back and make money at Goldman Sachs.
Speaker 3: So what did you want to do? Didn't I didn't
Speaker 3: step down. I was asked to.
Speaker 2: I was approached by the UK government to become governor
Speaker 2: of the Bank of England.
Speaker 3: And is like an illegal poaching.
Speaker 1: I mean they're going to another country to take the
Speaker 1: central banker from another country.
Speaker 3: Did you think that was unusual?
Speaker 2: Well, it was, it was, It was unusual. It was
Speaker 2: I mean the unusual times. Technically the head of state,
Speaker 2: Queen Elizabeth is the same, so it's inter company transfer.
Speaker 3: Okay. So yeah, all right.
Speaker 1: So when you're the head of the Central Bank of Canada,
Speaker 1: by the way, you get your signature on the currency. Yes, wow,
Speaker 1: so that it's pretty nice when your hand somebody a
Speaker 1: dollar bill, you say to people with my signature, you
Speaker 1: ever tell them that, well, you don't break that rag?
Speaker 3: Okay? All right.
Speaker 1: So you get offered to go to be the head
Speaker 1: of the Central Bank of England and you said yes
Speaker 1: right away?
Speaker 3: And I didn't. Actually I.
Speaker 2: Turned it down a few times. It was a rolling
Speaker 2: conversation over the course of twenty two eight.
Speaker 1: So you ultimately took the job. I then took the job. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I eventually took the job for about eight years.
Speaker 3: Yeah, just under. And when you're the head of.
Speaker 1: The Central Bank of England, does the Queen call you
Speaker 1: for advice or she ask you anything? To meet the
Speaker 1: Queen very much.
Speaker 3: Or I did have a few audiences, right.
Speaker 1: And just and the prime minister, he doesn't appoint you
Speaker 1: the prime minister or he or she doesn't appoint you.
Speaker 3: Uh, you're appointed by the sovereign.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and the sovereign report to the Board of Governors.
Speaker 2: I show, uh, well you I mean you report to
Speaker 2: the British people. Really through parliament is the way that's
Speaker 2: really the accountability you're I mean, you can only be
Speaker 2: removed for incapacity and that is a very Did you
Speaker 2: enjoy that job, job, job security, the job?
Speaker 3: I enjoy that I it was, Yes, I did.
Speaker 2: I mean it was you know sometimes in the in
Speaker 2: the thick of it, it's it doesn't feel enjoyable. But
Speaker 2: it was incredibly challenged. He was you know, there was
Speaker 2: a lot going on, which is the reason why an
Speaker 2: outsider came in.
Speaker 3: So yes, I did enjoy it.
Speaker 1: Was it more fun to be the head of the
Speaker 1: Central Bank of Canada or Central Bank of England?
Speaker 2: I would say was with The challenges were much greater
Speaker 2: in the UK. You had an institution that had been
Speaker 2: totally transformed. You had a financial system that I mean
Speaker 2: was at the epicenter of the problems and had to
Speaker 2: be fixed. You had the elements of Brexit what ultimately
Speaker 2: was Brexit, the Scottish referendum. You had a big management challenge,
Speaker 2: you know, so it was you enjoyed it.
Speaker 3: I enjoyed it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you would recommend that job anybody that gets
Speaker 1: offered it, right.
Speaker 3: I did recommend it too. I recommended it to a
Speaker 3: number of people.
Speaker 1: Yet, not too long from now, the next meeting of
Speaker 1: a COP will occur. I guess it's in Abodhabir Dubai,
Speaker 1: and I assume you'll be there as a special envoy.
Speaker 1: So the last COP meeting didn't seem to make a
Speaker 1: lot of progress. What kind of progress you think is
Speaker 1: going to be made this time where we actually get
Speaker 1: closer to getting to the target goals?
Speaker 3: And you have?
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I think the first thing. Let's just back
Speaker 2: up for one second. So if we go to the
Speaker 2: Paris COP seven years ago, the world was headed towards
Speaker 2: three and a half degrees warming by the end of
Speaker 2: this century. IA came out last week says on current policies,
Speaker 2: what actually is happening, We're headed to two point four degrees.
Speaker 2: So there has been quite a bit of progress, it's
Speaker 2: not enough. The goal is to be less than two.
Speaker 2: But just to be clear in terms of the scale
Speaker 2: of investment in the policies that we're making progress this
Speaker 2: COP and full credit to the Presidency of the COP
Speaker 2: the United Emirates and Sultan al Jaber is very focused
Speaker 2: on commercial solutions for climate change. And so first and
Speaker 2: foremost and objective to get the major oil countries, producing
Speaker 2: countries and companies to commit to zero methane near zero
Speaker 2: methane by twenty thirty, doubling the efficiency of producing and
Speaker 2: transporting oil and gas.
Speaker 1: So you step down for the Central Bank of England
Speaker 1: and then you often become the special envoy off you
Speaker 1: and now you're the chairman of Field Asset Management, and
Speaker 1: now to be the chairman of Bloomberg. Right, what is
Speaker 1: Brookfield Asset Management?
Speaker 2: So Brookfield Asset Management and Brookfield as a whole is
Speaker 2: one of the world's largest alternative asset managers. The asset
Speaker 2: management business is the capital light bit. So this is
Speaker 2: where the twelve hundred plus investment professionals of Brookfield reside.
Speaker 2: We oversee the investments that have two hundred thousand operating
Speaker 2: professionals and it's a business that invests effectively in the
Speaker 2: backbone of the global economy.
Speaker 3: So that means renewable power.
Speaker 2: One of the largest owners operators at renewable power, over
Speaker 2: one hundred and sixty gigawatts of renewable power owned, operate
Speaker 2: and develop. One of the largest real estate investors in
Speaker 2: the world. One of the pioneers, if not the pioneers,
Speaker 2: of infrastructure is an asset class. So one hundred and
Speaker 2: sixty billion under management in infrastructure, and that's everything from
Speaker 2: energy infrastructure to data infrastructure, big private equity business and
Speaker 2: a very large private credit business as well.
Speaker 1: Now you have many jobs. Currently you're not the head
Speaker 1: of the central bank in Inlet anymore or Canada, but
Speaker 1: among other things, you're the special I guess advisor to
Speaker 1: the UN Envoy Special Envoy UN on climate change.
Speaker 3: So right, that's correct, on climate action and finance. Right,
Speaker 3: So what does that really mean? What are you doing?
Speaker 1: You're telling the people in each country they should go
Speaker 1: more electric or don't burn as much oil, or what
Speaker 1: it's really about.
Speaker 2: So a lot of if there's a common theme to
Speaker 2: my career, it's working at the intersection of public policy
Speaker 2: and private markets. So a lot of that in central banking,
Speaker 2: that's what you're doing. And that's what I'm doing, is
Speaker 2: this special envoy, And really it's to organize the private
Speaker 2: financial system to be ready for climate change, not just
Speaker 2: the physical impacts of climate change, but to be part
Speaker 2: of the solution, to be able to provide capital, get
Speaker 2: capital where it's needed to.
Speaker 3: Get a mission.
Speaker 1: So in this disposition, which I assume is probably an
Speaker 1: unpaid position very much, so you know, people are looking
Speaker 1: at you all the time, say you're the special envoy
Speaker 1: for climate action.
Speaker 2: Can you can't fly in a private plane so easily?
Speaker 2: I guess, right?
Speaker 1: Then do you take public transportation or you can you
Speaker 1: drive your own carve it's an oil and gas car
Speaker 1: or not?
Speaker 3: Well I have I.
Speaker 2: Might not surprise if we have an electric car, as
Speaker 2: you would expect, and most of the time that is
Speaker 2: charged in Quebec.
Speaker 3: I live just on the border with Quebec.
Speaker 2: And that's therefore, are you countable power?
Speaker 3: Are you conscious?
Speaker 1: People always looking at you as a special envoye saying
Speaker 1: you know he's using too much, he's got too big
Speaker 1: a carbon footprint, or you don't worry about that?
Speaker 2: Well no, people, look, people will make that, particularly if
Speaker 2: they don't want to confront the tough issues around climate change,
Speaker 2: the big blocks of what's actually going to make a difference.
Speaker 2: They'll go to, you know, the anything you're wearing. You know,
Speaker 2: there's plastic on my watch strap, and therefore there's an
Speaker 2: element of high carbons in that.
Speaker 1: If you have an oil and gas investment that comes
Speaker 1: to an investment committee and you're the special envoy, you
Speaker 1: have to recuse yourself or how do you know.
Speaker 2: Well, we have a very we have very clear approach
Speaker 2: at Brookfield. As I say, we're one of the largest
Speaker 2: renewable energy providers and we are systematically going through our
Speaker 2: assets to ensure that as much as possible they have
Speaker 2: business plans that are consistent with the transition towards net zero.
Speaker 2: And we do that first and foremost. From a fiduciary perspective,
Speaker 2: we see being low carbon or lowering your carbon footprint
Speaker 2: to put it that way, as one of the fundamental
Speaker 2: drivers of value in the market. And I have to say,
Speaker 2: you know, we're being proven right. We know in real
Speaker 2: time that the mapping of the temperature increase to the
Speaker 2: extreme weather events is worse than we thought ten years ago.
Speaker 2: So actually the goal, even though the goal is getting
Speaker 2: tougher to get it's becoming more.
Speaker 3: To get there. And the third thing we know is
Speaker 3: the mapping.
Speaker 2: You can map specific actions to specific emission reductions and
Speaker 2: it can become very clear whether you're making a difference
Speaker 2: on that and what we've seen. I'll make two points
Speaker 2: if I may, on that. One is we go back
Speaker 2: five years ago. Clean energy investment, so that's wind, solar,
Speaker 2: battery storage, and let's say ev charging those types of things.
Speaker 2: About five hundred billion worldwide dollars spent this year last year,
Speaker 2: one point two trillion this year one point eight trillion. Okay,
Speaker 2: that is one and a half one point six times
Speaker 2: what we're spending on conventional energy investment, and that's starting
Speaker 2: to move, you know, so you can see in real
Speaker 2: time what's happening in terms of emission reduction, solution emission reduction,
Speaker 2: and as well, you know, from a financial we're at Bloomberg,
Speaker 2: you know, and talking a bit about Brookfield as well.
Speaker 3: From a financial perspective.
Speaker 2: First off, the numbers are huge in terms of the
Speaker 2: you know, the action is in the clean not in
Speaker 2: the conventional. Secondly, the information set around whether or not
Speaker 2: a company doesn't matter what the industry is could be
Speaker 2: tech could be motor, whatever services. The information about what
Speaker 2: your carbon footprint is today and where it's going is exploding,
Speaker 2: so you can tell.
Speaker 3: Who's part of the solution, who's part of the problem,
Speaker 3: and that is driving value.
Speaker 1: Some of the emerging market countries say, well, wait a second,
Speaker 1: you guys in the United States and Western Europe, you
Speaker 1: had a century or so to pollute as much as
Speaker 1: you want it. Now you're asking us, as we're emerging,
Speaker 1: to give away the right to use some of these
Speaker 1: same kinds of fuels that you use as it's not fair,
Speaker 1: They would say, what do you respond to that.
Speaker 3: Well, it's not fair.
Speaker 2: Unfortunately, the disproportionate impacts of climate change will also fall
Speaker 2: in those same countries and the people in those countries.
Speaker 2: You know, Africa, seventeen percent of the world's people three
Speaker 2: percent of the world's emissions run right, but you know,
Speaker 2: you know, hundreds of millions of people will be in
Speaker 2: uninhabitable climate if we don't get.
Speaker 3: This on top.
Speaker 2: So we've got to all get together and deal with it.
Speaker 2: First point, and then the second is that now, given
Speaker 2: the progress that has been made in the economics of
Speaker 2: wind solar stores particularly, they are becoming the low cost
Speaker 2: solutions for those countries as well.
Speaker 1: You have an electric car. You said you drive electric car, right,
Speaker 1: So some people say electric cars are not perfect in
Speaker 1: the sense that they get the minerals you need for
Speaker 1: some of their batteries. For example, you have to do
Speaker 1: a lot of mining of things, and that is not
Speaker 1: great for the environment either. But on the whole you
Speaker 1: would say electric vehicles are infinitely better than carbon.
Speaker 3: Well, here we are in combustion.
Speaker 2: At Bloomberg and I can reference BNF research on this,
Speaker 2: which they actually show depending on where you are where
Speaker 2: the crossover point is that your electric car net impact
Speaker 2: on the environment is you know where it's better than
Speaker 2: the internal combustion engine car.
Speaker 3: If you're in.
Speaker 2: Place like Canada, where you've got a lot of clean
Speaker 2: power eighty five percent of our power zero mission in Canada,
Speaker 2: a little plug for Canadian manufacturing there by the way,
Speaker 2: and the crossovers about eighteen months. If you're even if
Speaker 2: you're in China where you have instilled in the installed
Speaker 2: based a lot of coal, it's well, I'll have to
Speaker 2: check on I'll do BNF and check the number, but
Speaker 2: it's around five years, okay, So and that includes the
Speaker 2: embedded carbon from all those processes.
Speaker 1: For somebody whos watching it says, I'd like to be
Speaker 1: like Mark Carney successful, but almost everything is touched to say,
Speaker 1: maybe not hockey perfectly, but pretty good.
Speaker 3: What was it your hard work?
Speaker 1: It's just being good jeans, you know, just smarter than
Speaker 1: everybody else. So what is it luck? What do you
Speaker 1: think it is that enable you to do all these things?
Speaker 1: And you're still a very young man by my standard,
Speaker 1: you're fifty eight years old. That's a teenager to me.
Speaker 1: How so what do you think made this possible?
Speaker 2: Well, look, luck is a huge element of it, without question.
Speaker 2: You make your own luck to some extent if you're
Speaker 2: doing things that you like and you care about, so
Speaker 2: you're around opportunities. You know, I wouldn't have been Governor
Speaker 2: of the Bank of England if I hadn't wanted to
Speaker 2: be in public policy and was the governor of Bank
Speaker 2: of Canada, for example.
Speaker 3: But I, at least in.
Speaker 2: My experience, maybe with my genes or whatever, I think
Speaker 2: you can't get away.
Speaker 3: From hard work.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to hear more of my interviews. You
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