1
00:00:03,560 --> 00:00:06,439
Speaker 1: Hi, get everybody on dan Hord and thanks for downloading

2
00:00:06,480 --> 00:00:13,480
Speaker 1: The Bengals Booth Podcast. The the Nage addition, as ESPN's

3
00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:15,920
Speaker 1: Ben Solec joins me for an entertaining look at the

4
00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:19,680
Speaker 1: Bengals off season and their chances of contending in twenty

5
00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:24,919
Speaker 1: twenty five, followed by five observations about the Bengals offensive line.

6
00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:27,960
Speaker 1: The Bengals Booth Podcast is brought to you by pay Corps,

7
00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:31,960
Speaker 1: proud to be the Bengals official HR software provider, by

8
00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:36,400
Speaker 1: Alta Fiber, future proof fiber Internet designed to elevate your home, business,

9
00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:39,680
Speaker 1: and community to a new level, and by Kettering Health

10
00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:42,559
Speaker 1: the best care for the best fans. Kettering Health is

11
00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:46,320
Speaker 1: the official healthcare provider of the Bengals. Now here's a

12
00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:49,040
Speaker 1: quick reminder that you can have the latest edition of

13
00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:52,640
Speaker 1: this podcast delivered right to your phone, tablet, or computer

14
00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:56,960
Speaker 1: by subscribing wherever you get your podcasts. It's the greatest

15
00:00:56,960 --> 00:01:02,880
Speaker 1: thing since using uniform numbers for memorization. There's a golf

16
00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:06,039
Speaker 1: course in the Cincinnati area where a four digit code

17
00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,560
Speaker 1: is needed to enter a bathroom on the course. When

18
00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:11,960
Speaker 1: I asked somebody for the code, they said it was

19
00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:17,280
Speaker 1: easy to remember. Jackie Robinson, Barry Larkin say no more

20
00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,600
Speaker 1: four to two one one. My memory isn't as sharp

21
00:01:21,640 --> 00:01:25,000
Speaker 1: as it once was, but the uniform number technique works

22
00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,959
Speaker 1: for me every time, and you can use it for

23
00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:33,560
Speaker 1: important numbers and dates. For example, my wedding anniversary is

24
00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:37,559
Speaker 1: Bill Russell jim Ar Chase. Now if I could only

25
00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:42,800
Speaker 1: remember where I left my keys. Now let's get to football.

26
00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:46,920
Speaker 1: As I record this podcast, training camp is roughly three

27
00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:50,880
Speaker 1: weeks away. Last week I got the local perspective on

28
00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:54,360
Speaker 1: the team from seven Bengals Beat reporters, and this week

29
00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:58,600
Speaker 1: it's the national perspective as I caught up with ESPN's

30
00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:02,840
Speaker 1: Ben Solack. Dan, you have written and said a lot

31
00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:06,040
Speaker 1: of interesting things about the Bengals this offseason, and I

32
00:02:06,080 --> 00:02:08,239
Speaker 1: want to start with something that you wrote after the

33
00:02:08,280 --> 00:02:12,200
Speaker 1: Bengals reached their contract extensions with Jamar Chase and t Higgins.

34
00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:20,559
Speaker 1: Quote the trio of Burrow Higgins Chase cements auto contender status.

35
00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:24,320
Speaker 1: That is a strong statement. Explained why you feel that way.

36
00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:28,720
Speaker 2: Because of the Broncos Bengals game last year, where the

37
00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:32,360
Speaker 2: entire premise of the Broncos defense, which was like inarguably

38
00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:34,680
Speaker 2: a top five most certainly a top three, perhaps the

39
00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:38,320
Speaker 2: best defensive football Last season, the entire premise was, well,

40
00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:41,240
Speaker 2: we have Patrick Sartan, and you're not used to playing

41
00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,079
Speaker 2: games in which we can just take your wide receiver

42
00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:45,519
Speaker 2: one away and we're to force your offense to play

43
00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:48,119
Speaker 2: left handed, and that's such a challenging thing to deal

44
00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:51,200
Speaker 2: with from an offensive perspective. And the Bengals just kind

45
00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:53,639
Speaker 2: of said loll and then threw it to t Higgins

46
00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:57,800
Speaker 2: a bunch opposite Riley Moss. Right Like, I'm fairly confident

47
00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:00,000
Speaker 2: that te Higgins is a top fifteen receiver in the NIF.

48
00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:02,280
Speaker 2: I think he's right there with DeVante Smith in the

49
00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:04,160
Speaker 2: argument for the best wide receiver two in football.

50
00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:04,960
Speaker 3: I think t would be.

51
00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:06,440
Speaker 2: A wide receiver one and over half the teams in

52
00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:07,880
Speaker 2: the league. I think he would have made over thirty

53
00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:09,680
Speaker 2: million dollars via the free agent market this year. He's

54
00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:11,880
Speaker 2: that caliber of a guy. There's obviously injury concerns, but

55
00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:14,359
Speaker 2: he's on the field. He's on the field, and Joe

56
00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:16,120
Speaker 2: took such a nice step forward last season. We all

57
00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:18,840
Speaker 2: know what Jamar is and so if you have that

58
00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:21,560
Speaker 2: caliber of a passing attack, you're gonna be in every

59
00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:24,040
Speaker 2: single game you play, because there's no second half deficit

60
00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:25,640
Speaker 2: that you feel like you can't dig your way out of.

61
00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:28,480
Speaker 2: You're gonna be able to dictate terms to opposing defenses,

62
00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:31,280
Speaker 2: even those who have elite corner ones who can win

63
00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:33,880
Speaker 2: against Jamar and mancot Bridge, And you're gonna be able

64
00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:35,600
Speaker 2: to make playoff bushes because you can just get lucky

65
00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:38,040
Speaker 2: and get hot with that passing game. And so yeah,

66
00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:41,480
Speaker 2: there's so much to talk about with the Bengals outside

67
00:03:41,480 --> 00:03:44,080
Speaker 2: of the nucleus, right outside of the solar system of

68
00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:46,040
Speaker 2: Joe Burrow, Jabar, Chase and t Higgins. They got a

69
00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,119
Speaker 2: lot changing and to deal with them to improve upon.

70
00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:50,640
Speaker 2: But that trio right there, it's as good as it

71
00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:52,680
Speaker 2: gets in football. It keeps them in the AFC conversation

72
00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:53,400
Speaker 2: every single year.

73
00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:57,000
Speaker 1: At this time last year, going into last season, I

74
00:03:57,040 --> 00:04:00,480
Speaker 1: didn't think realistically there was any way they were going

75
00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:02,760
Speaker 1: to keep both. Did you feel the same.

76
00:04:02,560 --> 00:04:03,720
Speaker 3: Way one hundred percent?

77
00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:06,920
Speaker 2: I was when I was at camp last year was

78
00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:10,280
Speaker 2: when Jamar started not showing up to camp because he

79
00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:13,360
Speaker 2: wanted an extension, while also they were still dealing with

80
00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:15,600
Speaker 2: Tea not wanting to participate in camp because he wanted

81
00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:17,520
Speaker 2: his extension. I was like, all right, this is chalked

82
00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:20,480
Speaker 2: like you, there's just too many balls in the air

83
00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:23,440
Speaker 2: to juggle contract wise. And the Bengals obviously have more

84
00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:25,799
Speaker 2: limiting factors on their ability to make these mega deals

85
00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:27,960
Speaker 2: than other teams because they are a family owned team

86
00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:30,200
Speaker 2: that weren't recently purchased with huge amounts of money and

87
00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:32,640
Speaker 2: minority owners, like they just have less cash moving around

88
00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:34,120
Speaker 2: than some of these other squads to And so I

89
00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:35,880
Speaker 2: thought they were going to get priced out. And again

90
00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:38,960
Speaker 2: I think t could have made considerably more money on

91
00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:40,599
Speaker 2: the open market if he wanted to get out of

92
00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:42,840
Speaker 2: Cincinnati now, the same you could have said about Chris

93
00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:44,840
Speaker 2: Stalwin and Tampa Bay. He took a discount to stay there.

94
00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:47,000
Speaker 2: I don't think he made a bad business decision at all.

95
00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:49,799
Speaker 2: But they were able to work the Joe Burrow angle

96
00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:52,120
Speaker 2: of it work. We made the Super Bowl angle of

97
00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:54,200
Speaker 2: it work, the what you can be here as Jamar

98
00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:56,679
Speaker 2: Chase's running mate and have this very unique, very strong,

99
00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,039
Speaker 2: one A one B situation such that they were able

100
00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:01,040
Speaker 2: to keep both of those guys. It is I think

101
00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,760
Speaker 2: from the day that they realize Jamar and Joe were

102
00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:05,320
Speaker 2: going to be what they are so the twenty twenty

103
00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:07,800
Speaker 2: one Super Bowl run. They have been making efforts, the

104
00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:11,560
Speaker 2: ownership group in the Blackburn's efforts to be ready for

105
00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:13,279
Speaker 2: these contracts and the fact that they got that ball

106
00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:15,479
Speaker 2: over the line is extremely impressive, So kudos to them.

107
00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:16,080
Speaker 3: It's a big deal.

108
00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:20,560
Speaker 1: ESPN's Ben Solak is our guest. We often associate quarterbacks

109
00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:24,320
Speaker 1: with Super Bowl windows, and Joe Burrow has famously said

110
00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:26,560
Speaker 1: the window is my career.

111
00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:32,560
Speaker 2: Do you agree, Yeah, in the sense that an elite quarterback,

112
00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:34,560
Speaker 2: And I think Burrow I hate using the word elite

113
00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:37,440
Speaker 2: because to me, elite means top ten percent, top five percent.

114
00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:39,960
Speaker 2: To mean that's like Patrick Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen,

115
00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:43,200
Speaker 2: the MVP guys right, so near elite, top five whatever

116
00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:45,200
Speaker 2: action if you want to use when you have that guy,

117
00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:46,760
Speaker 2: and then yeah, you have the receivers.

118
00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:48,039
Speaker 3: Like I say, you're always contending.

119
00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:51,359
Speaker 2: However, Burrow is taking the term there and kind of

120
00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:54,279
Speaker 2: making it his own. We talk about super Bowl windows

121
00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:57,080
Speaker 2: and winning windows. What we're really talking about in the

122
00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:01,160
Speaker 2: media are rookie contract windows and your most competitive team

123
00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:03,479
Speaker 2: builds are those team bills in which your quarterback is

124
00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:06,120
Speaker 2: an extremely low cap hit because it allows you to

125
00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,680
Speaker 2: get forty million dollars in surplus, fifty million dollars in surplus.

126
00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:12,080
Speaker 2: You can go around and pay everybody, get free agents

127
00:06:12,120 --> 00:06:15,320
Speaker 2: in on the defensive tackle, linebacker, corner, offensive guard, tight end,

128
00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:17,960
Speaker 2: and you can build those ancillary pieces. It's how the

129
00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,880
Speaker 2: Eagles built around Jalen Hurts before they made their Super

130
00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:22,960
Speaker 2: Bowl runs, how the forty nine ers built around brock

131
00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:24,680
Speaker 2: perty and now that he has to get paid. You

132
00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:26,719
Speaker 2: saw their talent departure this past year.

133
00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:30,000
Speaker 3: So Joe can say that, and he's not wrong.

134
00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:33,560
Speaker 2: However, I can start naming for you some Bengals who

135
00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:36,520
Speaker 2: have gotten out of the building because price tag wise,

136
00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:38,400
Speaker 2: the Bengals had to make some some contract decisions.

137
00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:39,560
Speaker 3: And so he's correct.

138
00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:41,919
Speaker 2: But we're also right when we talk about the differences

139
00:06:41,960 --> 00:06:44,800
Speaker 2: between that first window, that rookie contract window, and then

140
00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:47,040
Speaker 2: the later windows, in which the margins are a lot smaller.

141
00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:50,520
Speaker 1: Let's move from Joe and his targets to the guys

142
00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:52,200
Speaker 1: in front of him. The Bengals are going to have

143
00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:54,480
Speaker 1: a couple of new starters on the offensive line. It

144
00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:58,040
Speaker 1: all looked an all likelihood. Rookie Dyllon Fairchild at left

145
00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:01,200
Speaker 1: guard and then either Lucas Patrick, Cody Ford or maybe

146
00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:05,119
Speaker 1: Cordell Vohlson at right guard. What's your concern level?

147
00:07:07,400 --> 00:07:09,120
Speaker 3: Like moderate to severe?

148
00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:11,240
Speaker 2: But that's what it's been in the last couple of

149
00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:14,000
Speaker 2: years with the interior, right, I think even when you

150
00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:16,800
Speaker 2: know they had just made the Alex Capa signing, and

151
00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:18,880
Speaker 2: you know Ted Carriss was a couple of years younger,

152
00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:21,440
Speaker 2: and it felt much better than it had when Hakima

153
00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:23,480
Speaker 2: Dnergy was starting feeing the Super Bowl. Right, it felt

154
00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:25,720
Speaker 2: much better, but it still wasn't the sort of interior

155
00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:28,120
Speaker 2: offensive line where I looked at like a playoff run

156
00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:29,640
Speaker 2: which you got to go through Chris Jones, and which

157
00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:30,840
Speaker 2: you got to go through at Oliver and which you

158
00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:33,280
Speaker 2: got to go through Dom du Madebuque and Baltimore, and

159
00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:33,760
Speaker 2: I say, like.

160
00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:35,560
Speaker 3: Wow, the Bengals are fine on the interior.

161
00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:39,240
Speaker 2: I've always been moderately to severely concerned about the Bengals interior.

162
00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:41,160
Speaker 2: They're rolling the dice on a couple of different guys.

163
00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:43,360
Speaker 2: You brought up Fairchild, who was a player I liked

164
00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:44,640
Speaker 2: a lot coming out of the draft. I thought he

165
00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:46,800
Speaker 2: was going to be a round four, round five project guy,

166
00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:50,480
Speaker 2: round three, year one starter that might be shaky. Lucas Patrick,

167
00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:53,520
Speaker 2: I think is your average NFL right guard. You would

168
00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:56,000
Speaker 2: love if Cody Ford or Cordell Olson can beat him out.

169
00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:59,120
Speaker 2: I'm not sure you're couting those chickens until they hatched, though,

170
00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:02,200
Speaker 2: so it's probably not a great interior. Again, I think

171
00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:04,880
Speaker 2: guard center guard, it's a below average group in the NFL.

172
00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:06,360
Speaker 3: But also that's I.

173
00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:08,640
Speaker 2: Think that's pretty close to how it's been the last

174
00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:10,560
Speaker 2: couple of years, and they know how to color in

175
00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:12,840
Speaker 2: the lines around it, and so the concern level is there.

176
00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:14,600
Speaker 2: But I've also seen them be an a lead offense

177
00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:16,040
Speaker 2: despite poor guard play.

178
00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:16,640
Speaker 3: So there you go.

179
00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:19,120
Speaker 1: What'd you think of a Marius Mims when the Bengals

180
00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:21,200
Speaker 1: selected him, and what do you think of him now

181
00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:22,960
Speaker 1: that he's got a rookie year under his bill.

182
00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:25,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, Amarius has a chance to be very, very, very good,

183
00:08:25,600 --> 00:08:28,360
Speaker 2: and I believe that strongly coming out of Georgia. I mean,

184
00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:31,440
Speaker 2: you took Amarus mims twenty twenty five best plays as

185
00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:33,160
Speaker 2: a prospect, put them against anybody else that was like

186
00:08:33,200 --> 00:08:35,040
Speaker 2: a top five pick, and it was the youth and

187
00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:37,040
Speaker 2: the lack of experience of some of the injury concerns

188
00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:39,200
Speaker 2: that knocked him down the board a bit. Now here

189
00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:41,839
Speaker 2: you are one year later he's been He.

190
00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,160
Speaker 3: Was eighteen overall. Mims was the year he came out,

191
00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:44,600
Speaker 3: Is that right?

192
00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:47,040
Speaker 2: I can't remember what exact pick they took him, but

193
00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:49,000
Speaker 2: you got some good film. He also got a little

194
00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:50,440
Speaker 2: bit banged up over the course of the season, and

195
00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:53,079
Speaker 2: you're in the summer as well, and you're worried about

196
00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:55,440
Speaker 2: the availability, worried about how many snaps he can put together.

197
00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:57,760
Speaker 2: I thought he quitted himself quite nicely when he was

198
00:08:57,800 --> 00:08:59,360
Speaker 2: at full health last season, once he had a sea

199
00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:00,920
Speaker 2: legs under him, I got a little bit of experience.

200
00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:03,880
Speaker 2: I thought you saw the clear vision for an impressive,

201
00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:05,240
Speaker 2: a Pro Bowl caliber right tackle.

202
00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:07,200
Speaker 3: So I'm very bullish on Mims.

203
00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:09,640
Speaker 2: I just I always hold my breath right, making sure

204
00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:12,280
Speaker 2: that you know it's tough on ligaments, lower by the

205
00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:14,400
Speaker 2: ligaments to carry three hundred and fifty pounds around like that.

206
00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:15,280
Speaker 3: So you're just hoping that.

207
00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:17,440
Speaker 2: He stays healthy long enough, gets through the rookie growing

208
00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:19,320
Speaker 2: pains well enough, and delivers on the investment.

209
00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:20,600
Speaker 3: Because he looks like it looks like he could be

210
00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:20,880
Speaker 3: a star.

211
00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,520
Speaker 1: Every Bengals coach, player and fan would like to see

212
00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,120
Speaker 1: Joe Burrow take fewer hits. Zach Taylor says playing with

213
00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:31,680
Speaker 1: the lead and being in fewer shootouts would help, maybe

214
00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:36,560
Speaker 1: more than anything else. But what else schematically do you

215
00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:39,520
Speaker 1: think they could be doing or should be doing. Should

216
00:09:39,640 --> 00:09:42,400
Speaker 1: Joe throw it away more, should they try to emphasize

217
00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:44,880
Speaker 1: the run more. What do you think of that in

218
00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:46,679
Speaker 1: terms of trying to cut down on the hits that

219
00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:47,320
Speaker 1: Joe takes.

220
00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:50,560
Speaker 2: I think Joe could decide to talk and run more,

221
00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:53,600
Speaker 2: and both talking run in terms of crossing the line

222
00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:55,800
Speaker 2: of scrimmage and talking run in terms of just escaping

223
00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:59,360
Speaker 2: the pocket. When we talk about pocket management, we're using

224
00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:03,040
Speaker 2: an umbrella term to often describe very different things. There

225
00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:05,400
Speaker 2: are really good pocket managers who are great at buying

226
00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:07,840
Speaker 2: an extra half second to get the throw off from

227
00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:10,080
Speaker 2: a bit of an adjusted platform, and instead of taking

228
00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:12,160
Speaker 2: a huge blow, they take a glancing blow. This is

229
00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:15,880
Speaker 2: your Tom Brady category of pocket managers. There are unbelievable

230
00:10:15,920 --> 00:10:19,480
Speaker 2: pocket managers who just have a sense of escapability and

231
00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:21,920
Speaker 2: strength and maneuverability in the pocket that they could be

232
00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:24,400
Speaker 2: under durest from multiple players and still get out of it.

233
00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:27,040
Speaker 2: Ask Sam Hubbard about trying to tackle Lamar Jackson on

234
00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:29,679
Speaker 2: that one huge scramble up against the goal line last year.

235
00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,679
Speaker 2: That's your Lamar Jackson pocket manager. And there's a wide

236
00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:37,400
Speaker 2: spectrum in between calibrating to exactly when to hold onto

237
00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:38,959
Speaker 2: the ball for how long to hold onto the ball,

238
00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:40,480
Speaker 2: When to try to buy a half second, why did

239
00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:42,400
Speaker 2: they try to escape, to buy two seconds? When to

240
00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,360
Speaker 2: just tuck and drop your eyes and go right now.

241
00:10:44,679 --> 00:10:47,400
Speaker 2: That is a learning curve for every quarterback over the

242
00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:49,360
Speaker 2: course of years. Patrick Mahomes is still changing the way

243
00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:50,960
Speaker 2: he does that. Josh Allen is still changing the way

244
00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:53,840
Speaker 2: he does that. So on and so forth. Burrow, who

245
00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:56,560
Speaker 2: is extremely good. We can't take a single thing away

246
00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:59,920
Speaker 2: from him. Who's extremely good at getting to his checkdown,

247
00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,880
Speaker 2: getting to the backside, finding aggressive throws downfield late in

248
00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:05,160
Speaker 2: the down. He is a wonderful processor who knows where

249
00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:08,160
Speaker 2: his outs are. Still probably has a little bit too

250
00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:11,120
Speaker 2: much confidence in his ability, a little bit too much

251
00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:13,760
Speaker 2: willingness to take a big shot so he can give

252
00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:18,839
Speaker 2: Andre Josevas one handed catch opportunity eighteen yards down the

253
00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:20,840
Speaker 2: field when it's like, hey, Joe, for a second earlier,

254
00:11:20,840 --> 00:11:22,920
Speaker 2: you just talked to the ball randomly picked out four yards,

255
00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:24,880
Speaker 2: we'll get you back on second and sex you know,

256
00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:27,959
Speaker 2: we'll go for this. And so I think Taylor's is

257
00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:30,400
Speaker 2: absolutely correct in terms of the trailing aspect. You would

258
00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:31,960
Speaker 2: love to be able to leave more games a little

259
00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:34,240
Speaker 2: bit better defense, run the ball with Chase Brown. But

260
00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:37,959
Speaker 2: I remember that when Burrow decided to stop taking sacks.

261
00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:39,560
Speaker 2: It was, I want to say the twenty two season,

262
00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:42,680
Speaker 2: like he had those bad early games against against the Cowboys,

263
00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:44,600
Speaker 2: and the offense was nasty and he was taking a

264
00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:47,040
Speaker 2: ton of sacks, and then he just made a choice

265
00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:48,839
Speaker 2: like I'm not going to live this way anymore. That's

266
00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:50,400
Speaker 2: a hard thing to do, to change your stripes like

267
00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:52,640
Speaker 2: that as a quarterback. So he's proven he can make

268
00:11:52,679 --> 00:11:56,840
Speaker 2: play style changes to lessen the amount of contact he's taking.

269
00:11:56,880 --> 00:11:58,400
Speaker 3: It's probably the case that he has to choose to

270
00:11:58,440 --> 00:11:58,640
Speaker 3: do so.

271
00:11:58,679 --> 00:12:02,600
Speaker 1: Again, has he evolved over the course of five NFL

272
00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:04,079
Speaker 1: seasons in your opinion.

273
00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:05,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the biggest way for sure.

274
00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:09,440
Speaker 2: I One of my firm beliefs in terms of understanding

275
00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:12,440
Speaker 2: players is guys can get better or worse within their

276
00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:14,880
Speaker 2: play style, but they rarely change their stripes at the

277
00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:17,840
Speaker 2: quarterback positions. The Jameis Winston's or the Jameis Winston Sometimes

278
00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:20,520
Speaker 2: it's five touchdowns, no picks. Sometimes there's no touchdowns, three packs.

279
00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:22,600
Speaker 2: But we're shooting, baby, we're aggressive. We're throwing the ball

280
00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:24,840
Speaker 2: down the field, right, Derek Carr is gonna check it down.

281
00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:26,959
Speaker 2: Doesn't matter if it's third and nine with the game

282
00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:29,440
Speaker 2: on the line, Ball's going underneath. You know, you are

283
00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:31,880
Speaker 2: as you are. You don't change your stripes. And through

284
00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:34,240
Speaker 2: the first couple of years of Burrow's career, I would

285
00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:36,679
Speaker 2: have described him as, oh, you know, excellent process or oh,

286
00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:38,720
Speaker 2: very accurate, but I would have said that he takes

287
00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:40,040
Speaker 2: too many sacks, and he's willing to hold onto the

288
00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:42,640
Speaker 2: football too long, and high sack quarterbacks tend to stay

289
00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:45,000
Speaker 2: high sack quarterbacks. And then you just flicked a switch.

290
00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:47,680
Speaker 2: And I know there was a lot of coaching about that.

291
00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:49,600
Speaker 2: I talked with Dan Pitcher about that in camp last year,

292
00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:51,200
Speaker 2: and he kind of laughed at the memory of some

293
00:12:51,240 --> 00:12:53,760
Speaker 2: of those conversations with Burrow and what that growing process

294
00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:57,040
Speaker 2: was like. But Burrow really dialed down in his sack

295
00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,320
Speaker 2: rate in a way that not a lot of quarterbacks

296
00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:02,199
Speaker 2: are capable of doing. The pressure rate still stays high

297
00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:03,160
Speaker 2: because he likes to hold.

298
00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:03,640
Speaker 3: On the football.

299
00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:06,520
Speaker 2: But in general, the number one way the Burrow has

300
00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:10,079
Speaker 2: grown is his ability to erase sacks, right, That erase

301
00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:13,160
Speaker 2: that very big negative play. I do think also last

302
00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:16,599
Speaker 2: season we talk a lot about Burrow the processor and

303
00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:20,080
Speaker 2: you know, pre snap post snap recognition. A lot of

304
00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:21,600
Speaker 2: that was when they were in their RPO game and

305
00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:24,880
Speaker 2: they were in their spread offense. And he deserves his

306
00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:27,960
Speaker 2: flowers for it. But that's also it's a clearer picture.

307
00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:30,080
Speaker 2: Last year they were in a lot more twelve personnel

308
00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:31,840
Speaker 2: and they did a little bit more play action, and

309
00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:34,200
Speaker 2: they changed a lot of the looks and Burrow was

310
00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:36,480
Speaker 2: still just like not only nails in terms of his

311
00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:40,199
Speaker 2: decision making, but he remains one of the most impressive.

312
00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:41,240
Speaker 3: Aggressive throwers of the football.

313
00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:44,200
Speaker 2: Guys like Patrick Mahomes Josh Allen are struggling a little

314
00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:45,960
Speaker 2: bit to find the downfield throws that they used to.

315
00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:49,280
Speaker 2: Burrow's got no problem, right, His ability to identify that

316
00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:51,240
Speaker 2: one moment of weakness and then shoot at it with

317
00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:54,400
Speaker 2: no hesitation, that's one of one, right, Like the big

318
00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:57,000
Speaker 2: differentiator between him and Justin Herbert, that debate that's gone

319
00:13:57,000 --> 00:13:58,679
Speaker 2: on for years. You know these two quarterbacks and their

320
00:13:58,679 --> 00:13:59,960
Speaker 2: differences and who's better than whatever.

321
00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:02,720
Speaker 3: The big thing about Burrows he just knows when to shoot.

322
00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:04,160
Speaker 2: He knows how to rip off that big play in

323
00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:05,760
Speaker 2: a way that really nobody else in the league does

324
00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:07,600
Speaker 2: through the air. So that's those are the two areas

325
00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:09,040
Speaker 2: with Burrows and through the most over his time.

326
00:14:10,440 --> 00:14:12,920
Speaker 1: ESPN's Ben Solac is our guest. You can follow him

327
00:14:12,920 --> 00:14:17,080
Speaker 1: on x at Benjamin Solac. The Bengals passing game is

328
00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:19,800
Speaker 1: so good that I think the Chase Brown is flying

329
00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:21,760
Speaker 1: under the radar a little bit. He had more than

330
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,080
Speaker 1: thirteen hundred combined rushing and receiving yards last year. He

331
00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:28,720
Speaker 1: scored eleven touchdowns. Are you bullish on Chase Brown?

332
00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:31,280
Speaker 3: Absolutely love what I saw from Chase Brown last year.

333
00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:35,160
Speaker 2: I I what Chase Brown did last year from just

334
00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:39,080
Speaker 2: like his individual play and how it impacted the offense

335
00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:43,600
Speaker 2: to me, was more interesting, more dangerous, more scary than

336
00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:45,160
Speaker 2: like anything Joe Mixon ever did.

337
00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:46,920
Speaker 3: And Joe Mixon was a great player. He's a three

338
00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:47,280
Speaker 3: down player.

339
00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:49,680
Speaker 2: Joe Mixon remains a solid player, do not get me wrong,

340
00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:52,880
Speaker 2: But what Brown did, especially as a receiver right after

341
00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:55,400
Speaker 2: Zach Moss went down, Brown was averaging like four and

342
00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:57,320
Speaker 2: a half catches a game for thirty five yards, right,

343
00:14:57,640 --> 00:14:59,360
Speaker 2: some of the explosive catches out of the backfield. And

344
00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:02,000
Speaker 2: then the ability to be a viable quick option again

345
00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,640
Speaker 2: talking about like screen game and RPO game and cheasing

346
00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:06,400
Speaker 2: a little bit more yardage, getting a ball out of

347
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:08,520
Speaker 2: Burrow's hand faster so he doesn't have to take those hits.

348
00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:10,120
Speaker 3: Brown was just so valuable.

349
00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:12,040
Speaker 2: And then the second to third level stuff is just

350
00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:15,040
Speaker 2: like the speed in the second level is sick and

351
00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:18,240
Speaker 2: it's really really nice to have a second player like that.

352
00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,360
Speaker 2: When you think about how good Jamar Chase is after

353
00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:23,720
Speaker 2: the catch, it's not really Key's game. It's not really

354
00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:26,360
Speaker 2: a Sicki's game. It was never Boyd's game. It's not

355
00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:28,720
Speaker 2: jose of US's game. Having Brown actually be able to

356
00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:31,600
Speaker 2: eliminate some angles, it just gives you so many more layups. Right,

357
00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:33,880
Speaker 2: You're throwing these swings, you're throwing these screens that can

358
00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:35,480
Speaker 2: all of a sudden it become twenty yard gains, thirty

359
00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:38,200
Speaker 2: yard games. The way that Jamar Chase has manufactured offense

360
00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,640
Speaker 2: for you. So I am enamored with Chase Brown. There's

361
00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:43,760
Speaker 2: probably a limit on how many touches you want to

362
00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:45,480
Speaker 2: give a guy of his size between the tackles.

363
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,080
Speaker 3: That's the reality of it. They probably over.

364
00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:49,400
Speaker 2: The course of the next couple of years are going

365
00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:51,600
Speaker 2: to want to find a timeshare way to make sure

366
00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:54,760
Speaker 2: they don't overload him with carries. But what he did

367
00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:56,320
Speaker 2: once Moss went down with the course of the season,

368
00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:58,320
Speaker 2: between the tackles and then all the ancillary stuff.

369
00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:00,560
Speaker 3: To me, I'm unsurprised.

370
00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:01,520
Speaker 2: That they're willing to kind of make him the running

371
00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:03,040
Speaker 2: back one to see what he looks like on a

372
00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:05,560
Speaker 2: full volume of touches. I think again, it's not that

373
00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:08,360
Speaker 2: he's better than Mixing, because Mixing is very consistent, but

374
00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:10,920
Speaker 2: he's so dangerous and it's another thing you got to

375
00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:13,280
Speaker 2: deal with on the chalkboard when you plan for this offense.

376
00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:14,320
Speaker 3: I love Chase Brown.

377
00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:17,760
Speaker 1: As we record this podcast, the Bengals have not been

378
00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:20,440
Speaker 1: able to reach a contract extension with Trey Hendrickson. He

379
00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:23,960
Speaker 1: is under contract through this season. So if you are

380
00:16:24,040 --> 00:16:28,120
Speaker 1: running the show, here are your options. A. Extend him

381
00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:31,920
Speaker 1: for a total of three seasons at roughly thirty million

382
00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:35,040
Speaker 1: dollars a year or more. B Give him a raise

383
00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,840
Speaker 1: this year and then part ways. See trade him for

384
00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:43,760
Speaker 1: draft picks. What draft picks might again, Well, I saw

385
00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:46,880
Speaker 1: that you proposed at some point in the last month

386
00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:49,160
Speaker 1: or two like a second and a fifth or something

387
00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:51,440
Speaker 1: like that, so I'll give you four.

388
00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:52,320
Speaker 3: That could be kind of okay.

389
00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:55,720
Speaker 1: So let's say for the sake of that, that you

390
00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:59,520
Speaker 1: get that offer from somebody a second and a four.

391
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:01,480
Speaker 3: I think I would do it.

392
00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:04,119
Speaker 2: I would want conditions that if he continues to be

393
00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:07,320
Speaker 2: as productive, that the picks become stronger, because didn't feel

394
00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:08,960
Speaker 2: like super strong picks for a guy who was just

395
00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:12,000
Speaker 2: as productive as Hendrickson was. Now I will say I

396
00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:14,160
Speaker 2: went back and I watched a lot of Hendrickson last month.

397
00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:17,119
Speaker 2: Because of the whole contract negotiation. Let's call spade a

398
00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:19,679
Speaker 2: spade here. The guy wanted to accumulate sacks as he

399
00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:21,639
Speaker 2: wanted a contract on plays in which sacks were not

400
00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:25,359
Speaker 2: really viable. His interest in contributing to the efforts of

401
00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:29,000
Speaker 2: the eleven on defense were at times questionable. I don't

402
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,320
Speaker 2: fault him for that at all. If I were thirty

403
00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:33,240
Speaker 2: going on thirty one and I were nearly leading the

404
00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:36,040
Speaker 2: league in sacks and I was having a contract dispute, buddy,

405
00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:37,600
Speaker 2: I'd be prioritizing the exact same thing.

406
00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:39,480
Speaker 3: So I don't I don't fault Trey for it.

407
00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:43,080
Speaker 2: At all, But if there are bridges burned there in

408
00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:47,560
Speaker 2: terms of the culture for him in Cincinnati and his

409
00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:50,000
Speaker 2: contract negotiations, then I want to get out.

410
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:52,119
Speaker 3: While the getting out it's good, and it's not like

411
00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:52,679
Speaker 3: I'm doing.

412
00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:55,000
Speaker 2: It with a twenty four year old who I planned

413
00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:56,720
Speaker 2: my whole franchise around, and now he's me.

414
00:17:56,760 --> 00:17:57,880
Speaker 3: He's thirty one years old.

415
00:17:57,920 --> 00:18:01,159
Speaker 2: You know you were already going to start thinking about

416
00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:06,080
Speaker 2: post Trey Hendrickson lives and schemes and depth charts and

417
00:18:06,119 --> 00:18:08,240
Speaker 2: outcomes a couple of years ago, right when you were

418
00:18:08,280 --> 00:18:10,520
Speaker 2: drafting Joseph Side, when you were drafting Miles Murphy, you

419
00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:11,840
Speaker 2: were thinking about the fact that we don't know how

420
00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:13,359
Speaker 2: much longer those guy's prime we are gonna last. We

421
00:18:13,359 --> 00:18:15,480
Speaker 2: don't know if he's gonna continue to be this fourteen

422
00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:17,399
Speaker 2: sack guy that he's been in low body's a seventeen

423
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:21,560
Speaker 2: sack guys, Holy smokes, you've been preparing for life after Henderson,

424
00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:24,240
Speaker 2: And so to me, if I can get a near

425
00:18:24,359 --> 00:18:26,800
Speaker 2: contender to give me a Day two pick now and

426
00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:28,960
Speaker 2: then an accelerated pick Okay, if he has ten plus

427
00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:30,480
Speaker 2: sacks another day, tub pick later. If I can get

428
00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:32,520
Speaker 2: the lines of the commanders to do that, I'm gonna

429
00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:35,280
Speaker 2: get out. While the getting out's good. I'm gonna say,

430
00:18:35,280 --> 00:18:36,639
Speaker 2: all right, I did a great job with Tea, I

431
00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:39,360
Speaker 2: did a great job with a Jamar contract, and I'm

432
00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:42,560
Speaker 2: ready to move forward with a younger approach on defense.

433
00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:45,679
Speaker 2: We know from last season that even if you get

434
00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:49,720
Speaker 2: an unbelievable twenty twenty five Trey Henderson, you get a

435
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:52,760
Speaker 2: seventeen sax season from Trey Henderson this year, and A

436
00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:54,439
Speaker 2: goes necessarily solve the defense.

437
00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:55,520
Speaker 3: Other stuff's got to happen.

438
00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:58,280
Speaker 2: Hopefully it does, but we know that that alone does

439
00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:00,639
Speaker 2: not a good defense create for the put And it

440
00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:04,000
Speaker 2: was last year, and so you can't trick yourself into saying,

441
00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:05,320
Speaker 2: go give him a raise. Now he's going to give

442
00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:07,359
Speaker 2: us seventeen sacks again, and we'll fix all the other

443
00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:08,640
Speaker 2: stuff and our defense will begin up.

444
00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:11,000
Speaker 3: For the super Bowl. That's way too many ifs, so

445
00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:12,120
Speaker 3: I would want to begin out now.

446
00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:16,040
Speaker 1: They also selected Shamar Stewart with that in mind. He

447
00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:18,119
Speaker 1: was the seventeenth pick in the draft this year. What

448
00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:20,720
Speaker 1: did you think of the Bengals selecting Schamar, and what'd

449
00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:22,000
Speaker 1: you think of their draft as a whole.

450
00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:25,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, So the Schamar pick I liked for Cincinnati. Again,

451
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,280
Speaker 2: it's actually more similar to the Amarius Mims pick than

452
00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:30,320
Speaker 2: I think people realize. You take the best twenty twenty

453
00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:31,400
Speaker 2: five plays of this guy.

454
00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:33,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, he could be in the top five pick.

455
00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:35,560
Speaker 2: There's a great reason why he's not a top five

456
00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:37,720
Speaker 2: pick though he was highly inconsistent. He doesn't have the

457
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,280
Speaker 2: sack production. So the Bengals take the swing further down

458
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:42,360
Speaker 2: in the draft. And this is how Duke Tobin has

459
00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:43,120
Speaker 2: been drafting.

460
00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:43,400
Speaker 3: Right.

461
00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:47,200
Speaker 2: It's very easy to take pictures of Duke Tobin's last

462
00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:49,639
Speaker 2: few years as a drafter and be like, dude, what

463
00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:51,240
Speaker 2: is this right? In terms like some of the defensive

464
00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:53,280
Speaker 2: players they've swung and missed on. But I've always been

465
00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:57,360
Speaker 2: a Duke Tobin believer and defender because he knows that

466
00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:00,879
Speaker 2: for Cincinnati specifically, with again like some the limits on

467
00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:02,520
Speaker 2: the money that the ownership group has, some of the

468
00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:05,160
Speaker 2: big contracts they had coming down the Mountain, he had

469
00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:07,919
Speaker 2: to approach the draft from a very aggressive position just

470
00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:09,840
Speaker 2: to we gotta take the big swings, we gotta take

471
00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:11,840
Speaker 2: the big risks if we connect on these and might

472
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:13,080
Speaker 2: be able to get us over the hill. So I

473
00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:15,800
Speaker 2: appreciate the way that he's drafted. I like the Stewart

474
00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:17,720
Speaker 2: draft pick for them. Got to get him in the building.

475
00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:20,760
Speaker 2: Gotta figure this out. Guy absolutely needs reps. He needs

476
00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:22,920
Speaker 2: to eat the playbook, like we got to get the

477
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:26,200
Speaker 2: dude in the building. So I like the Stewart pick Night.

478
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:27,840
Speaker 2: I liked it was a round earlier than I thought

479
00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:29,520
Speaker 2: Night would go Fairchild. Like I said, I liked it

480
00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:31,720
Speaker 2: was around earlier than I thought Fairchild would go. But

481
00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:33,720
Speaker 2: that's kind of how the draft process works. You know,

482
00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:35,480
Speaker 2: you have these players, Okay, I understand the fit. I

483
00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:37,440
Speaker 2: understand the like I think it's gonna go pick sixty five,

484
00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:38,680
Speaker 2: and then he goes pick forty five. What are you

485
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:41,640
Speaker 2: gonna do? Night as a Pratt one to one replacement

486
00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:43,000
Speaker 2: makes so much sense to me. I think that's gonna

487
00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,679
Speaker 2: be a very good fit. Fairchild. I'm not sure your

488
00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:46,959
Speaker 2: one's going to be pretty The hope is that you're

489
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:48,080
Speaker 2: two and year three a little better.

490
00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:51,520
Speaker 1: We are visiting with ESPN's Ben Solak. In a recent

491
00:20:51,640 --> 00:20:55,040
Speaker 1: story where you listed names to know for the upcoming season,

492
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:59,200
Speaker 1: you included the Bengals new defensive coordinator El Golden. El

493
00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:04,159
Speaker 1: Golden at the right time to elevate the Bengals defense.

494
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:04,960
Speaker 3: No idea.

495
00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:09,360
Speaker 2: You know, the college to NFL jump is extremely hard

496
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:12,080
Speaker 2: to predict from a schematic perspective, right. I think that

497
00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:14,080
Speaker 2: when when John Harbaugh makes the leap, and he was

498
00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:17,040
Speaker 2: obviously in the NFL previously, we can all go okay,

499
00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:18,760
Speaker 2: like this is probably gonna work. There's gonna be some

500
00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:20,959
Speaker 2: good stuff here, what have you. Golden obviously has been

501
00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:23,280
Speaker 2: in Cincinnati before, has been in the NFL before. But

502
00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,359
Speaker 2: when you're talking defensive scheme, much more so than offensive scheme,

503
00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,760
Speaker 2: you're talking about a coach's ability to adjust relative to

504
00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,040
Speaker 2: his personnel and to adjust relative to the week by

505
00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:34,480
Speaker 2: week demands of the offense that he's facing. Defensive personnel,

506
00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:37,840
Speaker 2: excuse me. Defensive scheme is much more about I have

507
00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:40,040
Speaker 2: a big roll ofex of things I can do, and

508
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:41,680
Speaker 2: I know how to hand select that two or three

509
00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:43,960
Speaker 2: things we're going to do this week. First offensive scheme

510
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:45,480
Speaker 2: where it's like this is my stuff, we run it,

511
00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:49,800
Speaker 2: let's go. And so it's very hard to prognosticate when

512
00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:52,199
Speaker 2: if a defensive coach is going to be good. From

513
00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:54,320
Speaker 2: an ex's and most perspective, ELEVATEI guys are not a

514
00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:57,200
Speaker 2: lotvich depends on the individual and his understanding of the players.

515
00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:58,160
Speaker 3: So it's something to watch for.

516
00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:02,040
Speaker 2: The thing that gives me some excitement and some faith

517
00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:05,600
Speaker 2: is the fact that Golden's coming from the college ranks,

518
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:08,840
Speaker 2: coming from a younger demographic, a younger cohort of players,

519
00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:11,920
Speaker 2: and the big difficulty with lou Ana Roumo's defense over

520
00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:13,960
Speaker 2: his time in Cincinnatis. I thought it was a great defense.

521
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:16,040
Speaker 2: It had its awesome heyday in the early twenty twenties.

522
00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:18,000
Speaker 2: But the big difficulty was it was a lot for

523
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:19,720
Speaker 2: the young players to eat. It was a lot for

524
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:21,440
Speaker 2: the young players to chew up and understand. That was

525
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:24,320
Speaker 2: a very complex defense required a ton of communication. If

526
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:27,600
Speaker 2: you weren't at a level of football intelligence, you just

527
00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 2: couldn't get on the field right. We couldn't even like

528
00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:31,800
Speaker 2: hide you in a certain spot. You were just going

529
00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:33,040
Speaker 2: to get backed on. You were going to be wrong

530
00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,080
Speaker 2: in your assignments. And so the hope is that Golden,

531
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,399
Speaker 2: who's used to working with a younger cohort, like I said,

532
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 2: can still get a complex defense out there getting NFL

533
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,280
Speaker 2: caliber defense out there, but simplify things for the younger guys,

534
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:44,920
Speaker 2: allowed them to play a little bit faster. Because you've

535
00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:46,800
Speaker 2: seen good things right from your DJ Turners and your

536
00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 2: Dax Hills and so what have you. So I got

537
00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:51,800
Speaker 2: no idea for you. It's very hard to figure it out,

538
00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:52,840
Speaker 2: but I'm watching with interest.

539
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,440
Speaker 1: In the same story, you listed Dax Hill among sixteen

540
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:01,320
Speaker 1: key players returning from injury this year. Dax was drafted

541
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 1: to play safety, but played well after the shift to

542
00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:07,560
Speaker 1: outside corner last year. Did you see enough to think

543
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:10,680
Speaker 1: that Dax Hill can be a high level outside cornerback

544
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 1: in the NFL?

545
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:14,400
Speaker 2: Not yet, No, And I think that his best spot

546
00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 2: is the nickel. I prefer him in the nickel to outside.

547
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,360
Speaker 2: And what with Mike Hilton is still a free agent

548
00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:22,600
Speaker 2: at this point, right Hilton unsigned? Anywhay, Yeah, I would

549
00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:24,840
Speaker 2: expect him to be the nickel player. I also like

550
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:27,439
Speaker 2: that because it keeps DJ Turner on the outside.

551
00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 3: Between the two.

552
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:31,200
Speaker 2: When I've seen them play healthy, I've been more impressed

553
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:34,040
Speaker 2: with Turner than Hill on the outside. I thought that

554
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:35,520
Speaker 2: was like kind of a gimmey. And then sometimes I

555
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:37,320
Speaker 2: say that in Bengals fans are like very surprised by that.

556
00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:39,399
Speaker 2: I don't know, that's just been my impression camping. Then

557
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:41,679
Speaker 2: the limited action for both of them, and so I

558
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:43,720
Speaker 2: like a DJ Turner on the outside and a Dax

559
00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:46,320
Speaker 2: Hill DJ Turner fighting for that outside spot. I should

560
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 2: be clear, and then Dax Hill being the first off

561
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:51,159
Speaker 2: the board for that nickel spot. If you end up

562
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,400
Speaker 2: you know, when you're in your base defense, you don't

563
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:55,479
Speaker 2: need a nickel. You want to experiment with Dax being

564
00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:57,560
Speaker 2: an outside player there, fine, but again I think you're

565
00:23:57,600 --> 00:24:00,240
Speaker 2: running into a too much on his plate problem, which

566
00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:02,320
Speaker 2: is a lot of the issues in the lou anaumo era.

567
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:03,760
Speaker 3: So to me, just leave him at the nickel. I

568
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:05,119
Speaker 3: think that's where he's best in the NFL.

569
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,480
Speaker 1: What about Cam Taylor Britt. A couple of years ago,

570
00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:10,719
Speaker 1: people were speculating that he could be on a Pro

571
00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:13,200
Speaker 1: Bowl track, and then this past season he got benched

572
00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:16,080
Speaker 1: multiple times and had a really disappointing season.

573
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:20,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, I lessen twenty three Camp Taylor Britt. I was there.

574
00:24:20,280 --> 00:24:22,840
Speaker 3: I was drinking the kool aid right, And it's worth

575
00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:24,320
Speaker 3: noting when it.

576
00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 2: Comes to these big, long, physical corners who aren't necessarily

577
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 2: the speediest guys but are very good at producing on

578
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:34,640
Speaker 2: the ball. You gotta live a little bit with both

579
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:37,520
Speaker 2: edges of the sword, right. I remember Rusulla Douglas in

580
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:40,280
Speaker 2: Philadelphia before he went to Green Bay and figured it

581
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:42,840
Speaker 2: out right, like these guys are feast or famine. It's

582
00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:44,359
Speaker 2: just a little bit the nature of the position. And

583
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:47,119
Speaker 2: it's also those particular guys in their play style. With

584
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 2: that said, you could tell camp Taylor Britt was taking

585
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:51,560
Speaker 2: a lot of unnecessary risks last year.

586
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 3: You could see that there were mental errs last year

587
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:53,840
Speaker 3: that led to big plays.

588
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,080
Speaker 2: And I think it's easy to wipe a lot of

589
00:24:56,119 --> 00:25:00,000
Speaker 2: that away and say, new defensive coordinator, maybe he's gonna

590
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:01,680
Speaker 2: agree with him a little bit more. Scheme's going to

591
00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:03,040
Speaker 2: protect him a little bit more. He's going to go

592
00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:06,280
Speaker 2: back to being an impactful player. That's fair to a point.

593
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,120
Speaker 2: It also happened the twenty twenty four season. Happened, right,

594
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:13,560
Speaker 2: and corners have legendarily, you know, impervious confidence. But it

595
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 2: happened like he had a very bad season and it

596
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:17,600
Speaker 2: clearly affected him. And so the idea that he's just

597
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:19,639
Speaker 2: going to bounce back right to the sea mark that

598
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:22,719
Speaker 2: he was on is probably a little bit optimistic, but

599
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:25,600
Speaker 2: development is never linear, especially at the cornerback position, where

600
00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:27,919
Speaker 2: again it can be very feast of fame and very volatile,

601
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:29,800
Speaker 2: very high risk, high reward. And so I saw have

602
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,240
Speaker 2: a lot of faith in cam Taylor britt because narratively,

603
00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:33,840
Speaker 2: I can wipe away a lot of what happened in

604
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:35,840
Speaker 2: the twenty four season. But that doesn't mean I just

605
00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:37,480
Speaker 2: want to kind of like, you know, put my hand

606
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:38,879
Speaker 2: on my eyes and pretend it never happened. You have

607
00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,120
Speaker 2: to acknowledge the fact that this is a mercurial player

608
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:41,560
Speaker 2: right now.

609
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 1: All right, let me pick your brain about the other

610
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 1: teams in the AFC North. What is your biggest question

611
00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 1: where Baltimore, Pittsburgh, and Cleveland are concerned.

612
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 2: Baltimore, I think we'll start with there because I think

613
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 2: that you got to reach to go find a question

614
00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:57,919
Speaker 2: about Baltimore. I think Baltimore is going to be an

615
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:00,879
Speaker 2: extremely good team. Once again, the biggest question for them

616
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,639
Speaker 2: is the linebacker position. Last year, rope One Smith was

617
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 2: really rough to start the year, which it didn't look

618
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:09,000
Speaker 2: like he was like fully in shape. He leveled out

619
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,479
Speaker 2: as the season went on. They were playing Trenton Simpson

620
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 2: young man next to him, Simpson was struggling to figure

621
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:16,399
Speaker 2: things out, get his sea legs under him, so eventually

622
00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:19,160
Speaker 2: they replaced him with Chris Board and with Malie Harrison,

623
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:21,120
Speaker 2: both of them left in free agencies. Right now, it's

624
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 2: Roquan Smith and it's Trenton Simpson with pretty much nobody

625
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:26,479
Speaker 2: behind him, a fourth round pick, a free agent from

626
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,760
Speaker 2: the Rams. That position has been a strength of the

627
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,119
Speaker 2: Ravens last couple of years. It can be potentially a

628
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:33,240
Speaker 2: weakness this year. And they had to put all their

629
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:34,960
Speaker 2: resources into the secondary ex That's why they had a

630
00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,320
Speaker 2: lot of turnovers. So linebacker's the spot for them where

631
00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:39,440
Speaker 2: I'm worried about the depth. I'm worried about the performance

632
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:41,639
Speaker 2: for Baltimore Cleveland.

633
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 3: What are we thought?

634
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 2: Everything I'm worried about in Cleveland not to worried about

635
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:47,560
Speaker 2: in Cleveland. I don't think whoever the Browns play at

636
00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:49,720
Speaker 2: quarterback is going to be good enough to register on

637
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,159
Speaker 2: the seismic scale of the AFC North, let alone in

638
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:52,639
Speaker 2: the AFC.

639
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 3: And so I mean, I'm.

640
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 2: Just worried about further hijinks and shenanigans out of Cleveland

641
00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:02,639
Speaker 2: and then Pittsburgh. A lot of names man Jalen Ramsey,

642
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:05,760
Speaker 2: John new Smith, Darius Slay, DK Metcalf, Aaron Rodgers, a

643
00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:08,360
Speaker 2: huge amount of turnover from a team that's been perennially

644
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:09,920
Speaker 2: a nine and eight, right perenally right.

645
00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:10,639
Speaker 3: Above five hundred.

646
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 2: I look at this team, I feel like a five

647
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:17,359
Speaker 2: hundred team, you know, big carousel spin, and I'm worried

648
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 2: that there's not that big of a result there at

649
00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:22,679
Speaker 2: the end. They need another really good year from a

650
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:24,840
Speaker 2: defensive front that's once again gotten a year older.

651
00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:25,160
Speaker 3: TJ.

652
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:27,880
Speaker 2: Watt, Cam Hayward, Al Smith, a high Smith dealing with injuries.

653
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 2: They need guys like Ramsey and Darius Lay to contribute

654
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,239
Speaker 2: to that secondary right away. Those over thirty year old

655
00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 2: dbs go. Look at the history of DB's once they

656
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:36,120
Speaker 2: hit the big three.

657
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 3: Oh, it is not a good history. So it's a

658
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:38,760
Speaker 3: finn bet bear.

659
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 2: They need Aaron Rodgers to be an elevator, right They

660
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 2: need him to be a guy who lifts up the team,

661
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:45,720
Speaker 2: who improves the team, something he hasn't been since he

662
00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 2: left Green Bay. He's forty two years old. It's a

663
00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:50,119
Speaker 2: thin needle to thread. So I see the vision. I

664
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 2: understand they're they're acting with urgency, which I appreciate they

665
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:55,000
Speaker 2: needed to do that, and they've added some names.

666
00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:56,680
Speaker 3: It was, it was the appropriate course of action.

667
00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 2: Got to hit some tough three balls here, got hit

668
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:02,520
Speaker 2: some shots order for all this to Colas and so

669
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 2: you know it's Mike Tomlin. You trust him until the

670
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:07,840
Speaker 2: scoreboard actually has triple zeros and they lost the game.

671
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:09,520
Speaker 3: You know he's good to wriggling his way out of

672
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:11,280
Speaker 3: tight corners. But this is a tight corner.

673
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:16,200
Speaker 1: Final thing. The Bengals will contend in the AFC North

674
00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:20,639
Speaker 1: and be a team that can make a postseason run if.

675
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 2: The defense is twenty year better, right, I mean, like

676
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:27,680
Speaker 2: the model of elite offense and good enough defense gets

677
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,480
Speaker 2: us into a playoff run is a very well trodden

678
00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:31,320
Speaker 2: model at this point.

679
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:33,480
Speaker 3: That is a very common way for NFL teams to get.

680
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,639
Speaker 2: To the postseason. And then it's three games to the

681
00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 2: super Bowl. Let's just get hot, right, Let's just win

682
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 2: a couple. So I don't need this defense to elevate.

683
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 2: I need it to be average right by the way

684
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 2: attend the end of the season, rolls around. Need to

685
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:47,000
Speaker 2: be fine enough that they can hold their weight for

686
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:50,080
Speaker 2: two punts, right, stop up two drives and then put

687
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 2: the onus on burrowing on this offense to consistently score

688
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 2: thirty plus. It's not the best way to do it.

689
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:55,640
Speaker 2: The best way to do is the eaglesways have the

690
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:56,720
Speaker 2: best offense, the best defense.

691
00:28:56,760 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 3: Who cares. But you don't get to do that every

692
00:28:58,200 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 3: single year.

693
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 2: And so elite offense and average defense is a very

694
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 2: viable model for playoff success, has been for the last

695
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,160
Speaker 2: five seven years. And the Bengals are well equipped for that.

696
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 2: So defense takes just a moderate step into functionality. And yeah,

697
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 2: we're cooking with hot grease.

698
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 1: Ben, This has been tremendous and a lot of fun.

699
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 1: I really appreciate your time. Keep up the great work.

700
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:19,120
Speaker 3: And thanks, thank you to I appreciate you.

701
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 1: Ben obviously knows his stuff. You can find his content

702
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 1: on ESPN dot com, ESPN Plus and various ESPN podcasts.

703
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 1: The Bengals Booth Podcast is brought to you by pay Core,

704
00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:35,760
Speaker 1: Proud to be the Bengals official HR software provider, by

705
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:40,280
Speaker 1: Alta Fiber future proof fiber Internet designed to elevate your home, business,

706
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 1: and community to a new level, and by Kettering Health

707
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 1: the best care for the best fans. Kettering Health is

708
00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:51,200
Speaker 1: the official healthcare provider of the Bengals. Former Pro Bowl

709
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 1: offensive lineman Kyle Long recently graded all thirty two offensive

710
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:58,280
Speaker 1: lines for CBS Sports and put the Bengals in the

711
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 1: average category. For what it's worth, Baltimore was the only

712
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 1: team in the AFC North that grated higher, and the

713
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:09,560
Speaker 1: Ravens were in the above average category, not in the

714
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 1: top two tiers. Here are five observations for why the

715
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 1: Bengals offensive line could turn out to be better than

716
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:21,640
Speaker 1: Kyle Long and many others expect. Observation number one is

717
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:24,200
Speaker 1: that the Bengals are in great shape and tackle with

718
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,280
Speaker 1: one of the league's biggest duos in Orlando Brown Junior

719
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:32,040
Speaker 1: and Amrius Mims. Orlando was a four time Pro Bowler

720
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 1: before coming to Cincinnati and was playing at that level

721
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 1: last year before suffering a broken fibula that limited him

722
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:43,600
Speaker 1: to eleven games. Here are Joe Burrow, Dan Pitcher, and

723
00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:47,040
Speaker 1: Zach Taylor on Orlando's play before the injury.

724
00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:50,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was playing great, best for his career, one

725
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 2: of the top tackles in the league.

726
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 4: He's a first time captain. I know that means a

727
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,080
Speaker 4: lot to him. It means a lot to us because

728
00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 4: you know, we believe in him, his consistent and you

729
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:03,320
Speaker 4: tell you just you can tell how much it means

730
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 4: to him. You know, we need key pieces like that

731
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 4: that you can just depend on to do their job

732
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 4: and not need a lot of attention. And he's done

733
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 4: a great job there.

734
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:13,240
Speaker 1: Orlando State and Cincinnati in the offseason and worked out

735
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 1: regularly at Pey Corps Stadium. He should be as good

736
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:19,800
Speaker 1: as ever in twenty twenty five. And if the opposite

737
00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 1: tackle spot you have twenty two year old Amrius Mims,

738
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 1: my pick to be the Bengals breakout player this year.

739
00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:31,040
Speaker 1: Here's Orlando on his six', eight three hundred and fifty pound.

740
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 1: Teammate the DIFFERENCE i see from his time of year

741
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: compared to last.

742
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 4: Year he's definitely gotten better AND i can't wait to

743
00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 4: see what he does On.

744
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,280
Speaker 5: Sundays. Man he's really really been putting it together all.

745
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: OFFSEASON i fully expect That amrius will be mentioned as

746
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,640
Speaker 1: one of the NFL's best young tackles by the end

747
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:51,160
Speaker 1: of the. Year Here's Dave lapham on The cincinnati.

748
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 5: Skyline i've got tremendous confidence in what those tackles can.

749
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:59,320
Speaker 5: Do they are genetic, freaks they are physical. MARVELS i,

750
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:03,080
Speaker 5: mean you, know six' eight plus three hundred and thirty

751
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 5: five to fifty pounds and, long arms, big hands, tremendous feet,

752
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:11,960
Speaker 5: you know in terms of being able to move their

753
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:17,680
Speaker 5: feet and laterally and. Change direction and it's incredible the

754
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 5: size of, these behemoths with their ability to bend, the

755
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,120
Speaker 5: knees bend at their hips and lower their pad level

756
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 5: and move and. BE athletic i think they're as good

757
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:29,560
Speaker 5: at cannamisers In The National.

758
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 1: Football league observation number two Involves Center. Ted carris i'm

759
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 1: not sure if it's, widely known but Last Year Pro

760
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:41,920
Speaker 1: football Focus graded ted as the fourth best pass blocking

761
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 1: center IN. The nfl at the age of, Thirty one

762
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:47,959
Speaker 1: ted had the highest pass blocking great of his career

763
00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 1: since becoming a full. Time starter, once again.

764
00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:54,720
Speaker 5: Here's Lap ted carriss is a tremendous leader. Of men

765
00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 5: he knows the game of football as well as the,

766
00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:03,600
Speaker 5: coaches do, extremely. Intense eigent he can come up and

767
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 5: recognize defenses and help. A quarterback he can recognize things before,

768
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,920
Speaker 5: the quarterback and a lot of times the quarterback are

769
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:14,680
Speaker 5: depending on him to call out fronts and alignments and

770
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 5: all that sort. Of thing in the defensive line when

771
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 5: he's making calls to his.

772
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: Offensive linemen So the bengals are in good shape at tackle.

773
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:26,520
Speaker 1: And center observation number three Concerns Rookie, dylan fairchild the

774
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:30,000
Speaker 1: leading candidate to start at. LEFT guard i don't know

775
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 1: if you saw it on, social Media but fairchild has

776
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 1: been using his so called time off between the final

777
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 1: mini camp and the start of training camp to work

778
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 1: OUT with Mma Star. Sean strickland there's a video clip

779
00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:46,560
Speaker 1: of the two wrestling that Chowse off, fairchild's, strength quickness.

780
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:50,320
Speaker 1: And flexibility here's what offensive Line Coach scott peters told

781
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:53,479
Speaker 1: me After the Bengals drafted fairchild in the.

782
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:56,320
Speaker 6: Third, round obviously you did a lot of work in

783
00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 6: the draft looking at every guard that was conceivably available for,

784
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 6: the draft and one thing that really stood Out with

785
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:06,040
Speaker 6: dylan is uh is his just, his size, athletic ability

786
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:09,280
Speaker 6: in his, Play strength he's he's one of the Strongest

787
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 6: people i've ever tied. Up with. Very strong he's a.

788
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 6: Great kid, he's humble, you know he works. Very hard he's,

789
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:18,680
Speaker 6: extremely TOUGH and i think you know all that stuff with,

790
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:22,280
Speaker 6: his dimensions his, physical nature the way he plays. Extremely

791
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:24,640
Speaker 6: hard those are the things that we, you know really

792
00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:26,080
Speaker 6: stood out. To me, YOU know i think he can

793
00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 6: set a firm anchor. In there he's got the tools to,

794
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:31,960
Speaker 6: play long which is something we emphasize as. In protection

795
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,120
Speaker 6: he's got good feet, to MOVE and, i think, you

796
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:36,600
Speaker 6: know he's got all the tools you're looking for in,

797
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 6: a player especially, a guard. You KNOW so i think for,

798
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 6: for us it was a no brainer at that point, In,

799
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:44,880
Speaker 6: time uh just To take DYLAN because, i think, you

800
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:46,440
Speaker 6: KNOW like, i said he has all the traits so

801
00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 6: that you're looking for in an.

802
00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 1: Elite guard dylan doesn't have to, be elite but he

803
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:53,640
Speaker 1: does have to be reliable if. He Isn't the bengals

804
00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:56,160
Speaker 1: do have a three year starter waiting in the Wings

805
00:34:56,440 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 1: In Cordel volson observation number four concerned the starter at

806
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 1: the other. Guard spot it looks like that's going to

807
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 1: come down to a training camp Battle Between lucas Patrick And.

808
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 1: Cody ford patrick played mostly left guard For the saints

809
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:14,280
Speaker 1: last year and center the year before For. The bears

810
00:35:14,760 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: the last time he was a full time starter at

811
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:20,399
Speaker 1: right guard was in twenty Twenty In, green Bay when

812
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:24,840
Speaker 1: lucas posted THE highest pff grades of. His career ford

813
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 1: played both tackle spots and left guard For the bengals

814
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: last year and earned the respective teammates and coaches for

815
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:35,120
Speaker 1: his ability to hold his own. Wherever needed here's Offensive

816
00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:39,960
Speaker 1: Coordinator dan Pitcher on Patrick versus ford at. TRAINING camp i.

817
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,399
Speaker 4: Think it would be a, good battle and those guys

818
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 4: are two competitive guys that KNOW what nfl football. Looks

819
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 4: Like and i've looked forward to seeing how that.

820
00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:48,919
Speaker 1: Plays out and we shouldn't Rule Out cordell vohlsen as

821
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,759
Speaker 1: a right. Guard candidate he played on the right side

822
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:54,840
Speaker 1: of the line in college and says those banked reps

823
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 1: would help him move from the left side to. The

824
00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:00,960
Speaker 1: right the fifth and final observation and INVOLVES new o

825
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 1: Line Coach. Scott peters I'm A frank, pollock FAN and

826
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 1: i don't think he ever got enough credit for Helping

827
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: the bengals come within minutes of Winning A super bowl

828
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:13,480
Speaker 1: with a patchwork offensive line that included four players who

829
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 1: combined to start one Game After super bowl. Fifty Six

830
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: but i'm excited to see what impact, His Replacement, scott peters.

831
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 1: Will have scott is eleven years younger and brings an

832
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:30,319
Speaker 1: unusual background with his martial. Arts Expertise Here's. Ted garris, you.

833
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:32,440
Speaker 7: Know that's that's one of THE joys i take as a.

834
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:33,319
Speaker 3: Football player i've had.

835
00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 7: A LOT of o line coaches in, my time and,

836
00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:37,719
Speaker 7: you know to learn Something that i've never even heard

837
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:40,359
Speaker 7: of has, you know it's taken, you know this eight

838
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 7: weeks to kind of get comfortable with it and now

839
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:43,799
Speaker 7: we can take it in the summer and.

840
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 3: Train IT but i think he's done a.

841
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 7: Great job, you know we're gonna have some some nuances

842
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:49,720
Speaker 7: that are a little, bit DIFFERENT and i think it's gonna,

843
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:51,839
Speaker 7: you know what we talked about when he first, GOT

844
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:55,359
Speaker 7: hired i, was like how can we increase our one

845
00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:57,680
Speaker 7: on one? Win percentage that's like all, you know that's

846
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:00,160
Speaker 7: like the. Main goals how can we put tools in

847
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:02,640
Speaker 7: our players' hands that increase.

848
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:03,600
Speaker 3: The chances of a one on?

849
00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 7: One victory because WE and i, think that, you know

850
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,399
Speaker 7: we've kind of it's great to have a guy come

851
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 7: in that hasn't been here kind of look at it

852
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 7: from ten thousand feet and really be honest about you

853
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,399
Speaker 7: know what, we are who, we are you know who

854
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 7: we are as, an offense and how we can, you

855
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:20,920
Speaker 7: know be the best unit for.

856
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:23,080
Speaker 1: This offense that's going to. Do it for this episode

857
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:25,120
Speaker 1: Of The Bengals booth podcast brought to you By, Pay

858
00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,720
Speaker 1: core proud to Be The BENGALS official hr, software Provider

859
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,600
Speaker 1: By alta fiber future Proof fiber internet designed to elevate,

860
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:35,879
Speaker 1: your home business and community to a, new level And

861
00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:39,120
Speaker 1: By kettering health the best care for the. Best Fans

862
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:43,040
Speaker 1: kettering health is the official healthcare provider Of. The bengals

863
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: if you haven't done, so already please subscribe to this

864
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 1: podcast and if you have, a minute give it a

865
00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:51,800
Speaker 1: rating or share a comment that Helps more bengals fans.

866
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,680
Speaker 1: Find Us I'm dan hord and thanks for Listening To

867
00:37:55,840 --> 00:38:07,400
Speaker 1: The Bengals. Booth podcast