1 00:00:02,080 --> 00:00:16,280 Speaker 1: Radio Radio Radio Commies, a Myth and Bullshit, a radio 2 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:23,480 Speaker 1: phonic novella. Look Radio hosted by Malamla Locomotive is welcome 3 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:27,040 Speaker 1: back to look At Radio. Welcome to season four of 4 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:33,279 Speaker 1: Local Radio Wanted for Crimes against the Patriarchy. We interrupt 5 00:00:33,280 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 1: our regularly scheduled programming to bring you Quarantine Confidential, a 6 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:42,239 Speaker 1: special pandemic broadcast about our experiences with quarantine and COVID nineteen. 7 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 1: I'm Theos and I'm Mala. Our intention behind this mini 8 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:51,320 Speaker 1: series is to archive our experiences during this global coronavirus pandemic. 9 00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 1: Thank you for joining us on this journey. Thank you 10 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: so much for being here. As you know, this is 11 00:00:55,600 --> 00:01:00,160 Speaker 1: our special edition of Local Quarantine Confidential. Last time I'm 12 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:04,000 Speaker 1: on Quarantine Confidential, we interviewed Brianna Ross, regional campaigns director 13 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 1: at Planned Parenthood. You can tune into that episode on 14 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:11,040 Speaker 1: Apple Podcast, Spotify, SoundCloud, and audio boom. Go make sure 15 00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 1: and give that episode some love, all right, And we 16 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:15,640 Speaker 1: just want to remind all of you that if you 17 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: haven't subscribed to our newsletter, please do so. 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Yeah, 43 00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: and today we have a very special episode where we 44 00:02:51,160 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: are actually going to cover something that's happening in the 45 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:57,760 Speaker 1: news cycle and somebody's something that's happening in our community, 46 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:00,560 Speaker 1: in our Latino X community that's happened a lot conversation 47 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:02,640 Speaker 1: happening online, and so we're just going to get right 48 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 1: into it. Oh my god, there's so much going on. 49 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:09,800 Speaker 1: There is so much going on. I mean, first of all, um, 50 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:16,720 Speaker 1: we can talk about AOC Alexandro Castio Corthez, who uh 51 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 1: this week gave a really amazing, extensive, impassioned, informative, like 52 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:29,080 Speaker 1: strong um speech about this awful man I want to 53 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:32,360 Speaker 1: call him you who, but his last name is actually Yoho, 54 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 1: and he like verbally assaulted essentially AOC on the job 55 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 1: called her a fucking bitch, you know, called her disgusting 56 00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:46,360 Speaker 1: all kinds of things because of you know, the efforts 57 00:03:46,400 --> 00:03:48,760 Speaker 1: and the things that she's lobbying behind as far as 58 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:52,760 Speaker 1: COVID nineteen relief for the poor, for the working class. 59 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 1: So she had to go on the record and call 60 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 1: him out and talk about what he said. Quote him, 61 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 1: because he attempted to give this like half ass apology, 62 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 1: invoking his daughters and his wife as some sort of shield, 63 00:04:10,040 --> 00:04:14,560 Speaker 1: you know, to like explain away or minimize or distract 64 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 1: from his misogyny. And there's been a lot of conversation 65 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 1: about not only the verbal assault on AOC, but the 66 00:04:21,320 --> 00:04:24,479 Speaker 1: way that she stood up for herself and articulated that 67 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:29,720 Speaker 1: self defense on what is essentially a global stage. Absolutely. Absolutely, 68 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,360 Speaker 1: And I think it's also important to note that this 69 00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 1: type of harassment doesn't happen in a vacuum. We can 70 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 1: see it at every single level of our lives as women, 71 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:42,920 Speaker 1: whether that be within our homes, whether that be at 72 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: the workplace, on the street, in relationships. However, she was 73 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:50,200 Speaker 1: specifically talking about workplace harassment, and so I want us 74 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:52,800 Speaker 1: to keep that in mind when she when we hear 75 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 1: her speech, right, And also, I wanted to ask you, Mala, 76 00:04:56,240 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 1: and I would want to share maybe a couple examples myself, 77 00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:04,200 Speaker 1: but I'm sure you've experienced harassment at work, right, verbal harassment, 78 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 1: even sexual harassment, and so would you be comfortable sharing 79 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: maybe a particular experience just to contextualize that this happens 80 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 1: to all of us. It really does happen. We know 81 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 1: that street harassment is a problem, We know that workplace 82 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 1: sexual harassment is a problem. And I actually had an 83 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:29,039 Speaker 1: experience with workplace sexual harassment that was so bizarre. So, 84 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 1: as you all know, I used to work at a 85 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:35,679 Speaker 1: rape crisis center, right, a trauma recovery center. Um. Everyone 86 00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:39,479 Speaker 1: in the building super trained and educated and knowledgeable and 87 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 1: experienced in this issue of sexualization of violence against women 88 00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:49,000 Speaker 1: and gender minorities and children, like the last place probably 89 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:52,440 Speaker 1: that you would expect for workplace sexual harassment to take place. 90 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:55,720 Speaker 1: While I did have an experience UM with a co 91 00:05:55,839 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 1: worker who was sis straight man, and he was like 92 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:08,840 Speaker 1: always super friendly with me and joky and like that's fine, 93 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:13,279 Speaker 1: that's cool, friendly and and joking around is great. But 94 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: then it began to venture into commentary, like about my appearance, 95 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 1: about my clothes, about my nail polish, about my makeup, 96 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:26,200 Speaker 1: about my jewelry, Like increasingly there was commentary coming from 97 00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 1: this man who was a therapist, by the way, at 98 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:31,039 Speaker 1: the rape crisis center where I worked, there was this 99 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 1: constant commentary from this man about my appearance and so 100 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:39,240 Speaker 1: kind of being in a situation where I'm teaching self defense, 101 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:44,120 Speaker 1: um to people, I'm teaching assertiveness to people, to youth, 102 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 1: to women, um. You know, I'm working in this field 103 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:51,200 Speaker 1: responding to sexual violence. And then here in the rape 104 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:55,360 Speaker 1: crisis center, this dynamic is taking place. So the turning 105 00:06:55,400 --> 00:06:59,239 Speaker 1: point was one day they actually had like an hr 106 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:02,719 Speaker 1: workplace actual harassment type training where they showed us this 107 00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 1: old video like from the late eighties early nineties describing 108 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 1: all the different things that are considered sexual harassment in 109 00:07:13,080 --> 00:07:17,320 Speaker 1: the workplace, and those things that they listed included commentary 110 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 1: on women's clothes, commentary on appearance, you know, commentary on 111 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 1: bodies and body parts and things like that. And almost 112 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:29,920 Speaker 1: immediately after that video and that training, this man came 113 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 1: right up to me and said, I really want to 114 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:35,800 Speaker 1: apologize to you because I realized that I have overstabbed 115 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: and that I have cross the boundaries and that I 116 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:40,200 Speaker 1: have been inappropriate with you, and I just want to 117 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: acknowledge that and say that I'm sorry. He was scared 118 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:46,280 Speaker 1: as he should have been. But yeah, that's my store. 119 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: That's one of my stories. That is so experiences. Oh 120 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:55,080 Speaker 1: my god, girl, I wish I didn't have so many, um, 121 00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 1: but one in particular, Yeah, you know. One in particular 122 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:01,040 Speaker 1: when prepping for this episode, was actually when I was 123 00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:05,120 Speaker 1: a community organizer and I was being trained by another 124 00:08:05,160 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: community organizer. He had been there for a couple of years, 125 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:10,680 Speaker 1: and so he was just training me um on how 126 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:13,480 Speaker 1: to like facilitate these meetings because we were following a 127 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: specific type of model of like organizing and facilitating meetings 128 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:20,640 Speaker 1: and all that stuff. And so I had known him 129 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 1: for a couple of months. I was like a community organizer, 130 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,720 Speaker 1: like I was no longer in training mode. When he 131 00:08:26,720 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 1: he and I are talking and he tells me, Um, oh, yeah, 132 00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 1: you know when I went out to go train you 133 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:34,760 Speaker 1: and meet you at this particular meeting, I was expecting 134 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 1: to see like an older Senora or like an older Latina. 135 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:41,160 Speaker 1: But then you walked in and I was like, oh, 136 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: she's really hot. And I was like taken aback because 137 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:50,199 Speaker 1: I'm like, this is both an insult and a compliment, 138 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 1: like you're trying like why why are you why are 139 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 1: you saying this to me and why are you doing this? 140 00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 1: And then on top of that, he um his wife 141 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:01,720 Speaker 1: was also a community organizer, and so we were like 142 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 1: all coworkers and colleagues and it was so uncomfortable, and 143 00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:08,560 Speaker 1: I think in that moment I kind of just laughed 144 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: it off and was like, oh ha ha, you know, 145 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 1: like I was completely caught off guard. And also context, 146 00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 1: I was twenty one at the time, and not that 147 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: I was really young, but I think I was still 148 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:24,640 Speaker 1: learning how to respond myself to workplace harassment and just 149 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:28,520 Speaker 1: harassment in general. And so now, you know, fast forward 150 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:32,920 Speaker 1: to me being um, now, when I experienced workplace harassment, 151 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: I will call it out. You know. I had a 152 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 1: coworker kind of try to get really close to me 153 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:41,880 Speaker 1: so that I could literally smell his cologne, and I 154 00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:44,840 Speaker 1: literally put my arms up as a barrier and I said, 155 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 1: please don't get that close to me. I need you 156 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 1: to back up. And it really embarrassed him, and he 157 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 1: like turned red and was like, oh, I'm sorry, and 158 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,160 Speaker 1: you know, like I wouldn't have done that as a 159 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,600 Speaker 1: twenty one year old, But after everything that I've learned 160 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:01,280 Speaker 1: and just my own process, as you know, I was 161 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,360 Speaker 1: able to finally call it out in a different way. 162 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 1: And so I've experienced it in like very small ways, 163 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:08,840 Speaker 1: like the subtle ways where kind of just makes you 164 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:12,239 Speaker 1: like question, like did that happen? Like was that harassment? 165 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,719 Speaker 1: And then it really overt ways, you know, And so 166 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 1: those have been a couple of my experiences thus far. Yeah, 167 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 1: And I mean it's it's so wild because I feel 168 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 1: like the USA you have sent me so many like 169 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:32,200 Speaker 1: text messages and like screenshots and stuff of not only 170 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: co workers, but like men like around your office space, 171 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 1: like leaving notes on your car and just yeah, they're 172 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:43,680 Speaker 1: like out for you. Be careful. It's weird. It's like 173 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 1: so weird too, and scary to come come out of 174 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:51,200 Speaker 1: my office, you know and have notes left on my 175 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 1: car with like phone numbers and like notes saying like 176 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,520 Speaker 1: oh I saw you walking by and I thought you 177 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:58,560 Speaker 1: were really beautiful, like I'd love to get to know you. 178 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:02,920 Speaker 1: And I'm like, do these men really think that it's flattering? 179 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's actually really frightening and scary 180 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:09,840 Speaker 1: because you clearly can see my car, which means you 181 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:12,400 Speaker 1: can see my license plate, which and which also means 182 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:15,840 Speaker 1: you probably watched me walk into my office. Um, I 183 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: was having this is like a whole other this can 184 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:21,960 Speaker 1: just really spiral into a whole conversation of my experience. 185 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:25,079 Speaker 1: But there was another moment where I was like, by 186 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:27,720 Speaker 1: I was having lunch at the park near my office 187 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 1: and this man. I was in my car already, and 188 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:33,439 Speaker 1: this man rolls up to me and was like, Oh, 189 00:11:33,520 --> 00:11:36,360 Speaker 1: I saw you from the post office at the park 190 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: and I had to come and say hi to you 191 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 1: because I think you're so beautiful. And I'm like, this 192 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 1: is frightening, this is really scary, right, and but these 193 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 1: are just this is just the reality of our day 194 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,640 Speaker 1: to day lives as women out in the world. And 195 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 1: so even in the workplace, we experience verbal harassment, sexual 196 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:58,200 Speaker 1: harassment even when we're not in the office. But just 197 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:04,520 Speaker 1: like proximity to the workplace absolutely. I feel like I've 198 00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:08,040 Speaker 1: probably shared this too on a previous episode, But like 199 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:12,600 Speaker 1: you know, the the outside of the workplace is the street, 200 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:16,320 Speaker 1: so their street harassment. Then the inside of the workplace 201 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:20,280 Speaker 1: you're have coworkers, so then it's workplace sexual harassment. So 202 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:23,960 Speaker 1: it's like, where is the space that the harassment is 203 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:26,880 Speaker 1: not gonna happen, right, And like I had an experience 204 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:29,440 Speaker 1: to um while working at Peace Over Violence, Like I 205 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:31,800 Speaker 1: left the office to go walk down the street and 206 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: get a ballet on my lunch break because it was 207 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: hot a f It was the summer, and I'm leaving 208 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:39,400 Speaker 1: and I'm walking and some random man in a part 209 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:42,560 Speaker 1: sees me and starts yelling at me, and he's like, hey, 210 00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:45,000 Speaker 1: you come here, come here, and he starts following me, 211 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 1: and he's like yelling at me and cussing at me. 212 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:52,000 Speaker 1: And then when I just would not stop or turn 213 00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:54,600 Speaker 1: around or look at him, he likes started calling me 214 00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:57,360 Speaker 1: a horse face bitch and like follow me for like 215 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 1: a good block. And and then after I like got 216 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: out of that situation, I got my palida and then 217 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:04,400 Speaker 1: I had to go back to work at the rape 218 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 1: Crisis center. You know, Like it was just like such 219 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:11,679 Speaker 1: like a mind fuck, and I hated it. And so, 220 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:14,319 Speaker 1: like you said, there's these like overt instances that are 221 00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:18,959 Speaker 1: unmistakably violent, there are also these other instances that like 222 00:13:20,040 --> 00:13:24,319 Speaker 1: read us compliments, but they're actually super predatory and creepy 223 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:28,440 Speaker 1: and inappropriate. And what happened to AOC was one of 224 00:13:28,480 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 1: those like outright over acts of harassment right from Representative 225 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:39,040 Speaker 1: Ted yoho Um who is a Republican from Florida, and Um, 226 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:42,280 Speaker 1: it's just been really interesting to see the dialogue unfold 227 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:46,080 Speaker 1: after she stood up for herself after she called him 228 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:49,560 Speaker 1: out on record and after she held Power accountable for 229 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,240 Speaker 1: harm done. So, like, I don't know, have you seen 230 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:55,800 Speaker 1: some of that dialogue, some of that conversation online or 231 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:59,160 Speaker 1: amongst the people that you know the s Yeah. I 232 00:13:59,200 --> 00:14:02,880 Speaker 1: think for the first maybe day or two or just 233 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:05,360 Speaker 1: even just immediately after, I saw a lot of praise 234 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:10,600 Speaker 1: for the speech, all the examples, the way she broke 235 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 1: down the systems and not just this is just an 236 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:16,920 Speaker 1: interaction between me and another person, me and another colleague, 237 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 1: but the systems that enable this type of behavior. And 238 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 1: I also like, I'm sure that there are so many 239 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:25,240 Speaker 1: examples that don't even come to light, and that she 240 00:14:25,320 --> 00:14:27,960 Speaker 1: doesn't share of all the harassment that she must face 241 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 1: in her workplace right as a congresswoman. Um. But she 242 00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 1: did name a couple other examples, and I thought that 243 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 1: that was really powerful, um because you know, I don't 244 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: think that she was sensationalizing her experience. But unfortunately, it 245 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: takes the public uh specific examples of women experiencing any 246 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,120 Speaker 1: type of violence or harassment to be taken seriously. And 247 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:55,200 Speaker 1: so I think that the way she set up her 248 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:59,760 Speaker 1: speech was really powerful in just naming the different men 249 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:04,760 Speaker 1: Um that have you know a verbally abused her or 250 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: made comments to her. And I also thought it was 251 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 1: really powerful how she um named the other and he's 252 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 1: just his name is escaping me, but named the other 253 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:18,160 Speaker 1: Republican representative that was standing next to yoho Um because 254 00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:22,680 Speaker 1: she also whole held him accountable for just implicitly enabling 255 00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:26,880 Speaker 1: that behavior and not calling it out or speaking up 256 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:28,800 Speaker 1: or saying hey, dude, that's not cool, you know, And 257 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:30,800 Speaker 1: we talked about that all the time. How other men 258 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:35,320 Speaker 1: enable this type of behavior from their peers, from from 259 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:38,000 Speaker 1: men as well, And so going back, just going back 260 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:40,200 Speaker 1: to answering your question, mala Um, I think the first 261 00:15:40,240 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 1: couple of days and the first hours after the speech, 262 00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 1: I saw a lot of praise, and then I think 263 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 1: the next couple of days, maybe a couple of days 264 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 1: after we saw, I saw on social media on Twitter 265 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:57,560 Speaker 1: specifically people breaking down her speech and saying that she 266 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 1: was using victim blaming language, which I know is what 267 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 1: led you to create a thread which I wanted us 268 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: to talk about because I would say, from what I've seen, 269 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 1: you can tell me if I'm if I'm right or wrong, 270 00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 1: But from what I've seen, I've seen, um, folks um 271 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,960 Speaker 1: engage with your tweet very positively, like yes, like this 272 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: is an important threat and how and how Mala broke 273 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 1: it down. But I also saw a couple of comments 274 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: and a couple of pushback. So what has can you 275 00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 1: talk about your threat? And then what the reception has 276 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 1: been on social media? Yeah? So you know, I want 277 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 1: to say this first is that AOC is a congresswoman. 278 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 1: She is in public office. She's a public servant, so 279 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 1: you know, hold her accountable, critique her, do all of 280 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 1: those things. Number one, let's just put that out there 281 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:52,200 Speaker 1: for any anybody in public office. Um, anyone in public 282 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:55,760 Speaker 1: office has stepped into a role willingly and eagerly to 283 00:16:55,920 --> 00:17:00,080 Speaker 1: serve like their constituents. So if as a constituent, you 284 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:02,480 Speaker 1: have a critique, you have a grape, like, I want 285 00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 1: you to voice that. Absolutely. It's not about like shutting 286 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:07,919 Speaker 1: down dialogue or saying people are wrong. But something that 287 00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 1: I did see was some tweets specifically saying that like 288 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:19,840 Speaker 1: her aoc s specific statement where she says, my parents 289 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:23,880 Speaker 1: did not raise me to accept abuse from men, right, 290 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:29,879 Speaker 1: and sort of a juxtaposition between her own upbringing. It 291 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 1: is also my personal opinion that her statement about her 292 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 1: parents not raising her to accept abuse from men, it's 293 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:38,399 Speaker 1: my personal opinion that she was not victim blaming, that 294 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 1: that was not a statement of victim blame. I think 295 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 1: where a lot of the discomfort lies with that statement 296 00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:47,879 Speaker 1: isn't something that is a lot deeper and more insidious 297 00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:50,000 Speaker 1: and and really sad for a lot of us to 298 00:17:50,119 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: kind of come to terms with. Because while she's talking 299 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:57,120 Speaker 1: about the standard that her parents have set for her 300 00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: as far as defending herself and standing up for herself 301 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,679 Speaker 1: off and speaking truth to power and standing up to 302 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:06,720 Speaker 1: men who do harm to her, we also know that 303 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:09,920 Speaker 1: not all parents do that for their kids. Not all 304 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 1: teachers do that for their students. Not all religious leaders 305 00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:17,320 Speaker 1: do that for their congregations, you know. Um, not all 306 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:20,119 Speaker 1: communities do that for the girls in the community or 307 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:23,240 Speaker 1: the boys the children. A lot of our families are 308 00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 1: families that um socialize and raise daughters into abuse, into 309 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:35,000 Speaker 1: accepting abuse in some ways, into expecting abuse, into normalizing abuse. 310 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:38,639 Speaker 1: It starts in early childhood. And it's not just the girls, 311 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:40,919 Speaker 1: it's the boys too. They're getting the same messages, but 312 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 1: they kind of are at different ends of the sword. 313 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:46,879 Speaker 1: Like the girls are hearing this is just how men are, 314 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:51,000 Speaker 1: boys will be boys, you know, especially if you I 315 00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:56,120 Speaker 1: spoken my thread very specifically about like Latin X families, UM, 316 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,440 Speaker 1: you know, families from religious backgrounds where I know these 317 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:02,800 Speaker 1: things to be pervasive because that's the family I come from, 318 00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 1: and there is a lot of like you know, minimizing 319 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 1: of violence against women, UM, victim blaming, especially with regards 320 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:14,680 Speaker 1: to sexual assault. And so the way that I heard 321 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:17,880 Speaker 1: it was, you know, this is an example of of 322 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:21,919 Speaker 1: parenting that wants to see and want to have. You know, 323 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,600 Speaker 1: we should all want to be able to say my 324 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:27,679 Speaker 1: parents didn't raise me to accept abuse from men, because 325 00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:31,360 Speaker 1: there are so many instances across cultures and communities where 326 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:34,399 Speaker 1: the opposite is true, where actually families do you know, 327 00:19:34,480 --> 00:19:39,159 Speaker 1: acculturate with girls into being on the receiving end of abuse, 328 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:43,560 Speaker 1: not into victimhood, but into like examining the world through 329 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:47,359 Speaker 1: a lens that that puts us as inferior and deserving 330 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:52,400 Speaker 1: of mistreatment, and that makes boys and men in our lives, 331 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:56,520 Speaker 1: you know, guilt free and never culpable for the harm 332 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:58,399 Speaker 1: that they do to the women and girls in their lives. 333 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:00,520 Speaker 1: I do not think that she was vic and blaming. 334 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:03,919 Speaker 1: I think she was talking about her own specific, particular 335 00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:09,760 Speaker 1: experience in the context of what was actually right, like, uh, 336 00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:15,639 Speaker 1: workplace harassment from basically as her colleague, her coworker, you know, 337 00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:18,960 Speaker 1: another congress person. So that's the thread that I wrote, 338 00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:23,200 Speaker 1: and it's been retweeted. Um, people are engaging with it. 339 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: It's always interesting to see like that kind of overlap 340 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,240 Speaker 1: between the people who only read the first tweet in 341 00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 1: the thread and people who only read you know, the 342 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:34,440 Speaker 1: headline and not the whole article, and how people form 343 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:38,640 Speaker 1: like really big opinions with very little information. I also 344 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:41,879 Speaker 1: think some of that is happening with AOC's speech. I 345 00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:44,800 Speaker 1: don't know if everybody has listened to the entire thing, 346 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:47,439 Speaker 1: or if this is like you know, sound bites are 347 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:51,879 Speaker 1: happening and people are reacting at all. That being said, like, um, 348 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: you know, one survivor, I don't think speaks for all. 349 00:20:56,760 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 1: I don't think any survivor is perfect, and I think 350 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 1: it's really a misogynistic and unfair to expect like one 351 00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:10,000 Speaker 1: woman's self defense to cover all bases for everybody. Um. 352 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:11,919 Speaker 1: That being said, I think it's a good conversation and 353 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 1: I'm happy that it's the dialogue is taking place. You know, yeah, absolutely, Malah, 354 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 1: I like definitely feel and I hear everything that you're saying. 355 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:22,600 Speaker 1: I mean, I was somebody as a child, you know, 356 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:26,560 Speaker 1: that was conditioned to or raised to be more quiet 357 00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,200 Speaker 1: and more timid. You know, my parents never they saw 358 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 1: that I was maybe a more shy kid, and they 359 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 1: never did anything really to help me break out of 360 00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:37,080 Speaker 1: that or foster like, where does that shyness come from? Right? 361 00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:41,520 Speaker 1: And it took me a long time to be empowered 362 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:43,840 Speaker 1: to use my voice and to be okay with conflict. 363 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,080 Speaker 1: And this all had to has to do with the 364 00:21:46,119 --> 00:21:49,920 Speaker 1: way I saw my parents relationship play out in real 365 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:52,000 Speaker 1: time as a kid, growing up to and now as 366 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 1: and now as an adult. And so I definitely was 367 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:58,720 Speaker 1: someone that was raised and conditioned to tolerate things that 368 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:01,920 Speaker 1: I did not want, both in inter any type of 369 00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 1: interpersonal relationship. And so like I feel that I'm on 370 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:07,199 Speaker 1: the other end of it, you know, I I was 371 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:10,240 Speaker 1: taught to tolerate what I didn't want. Um, But I, 372 00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:14,400 Speaker 1: as a survivor as well, did not did not hear 373 00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:19,160 Speaker 1: aoc Ocascio's speech and think, oh, you know, she's talking 374 00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: about me, and this is shaming of me, and like 375 00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:24,640 Speaker 1: what I went through in my experience, I didn't personalize 376 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: what she said. I understood it and heard it as 377 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:30,960 Speaker 1: her talking about her experience. And I think it was 378 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:34,840 Speaker 1: really powerful that she called upon her parents because Yoho 379 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,480 Speaker 1: called upon his daughters as a scapego and I think 380 00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 1: that we can't forget that, like that's the context of 381 00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 1: her also calling upon her parents, because he tries to 382 00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:48,320 Speaker 1: use his relationships, his relations to other women as an 383 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:51,840 Speaker 1: example of Oh, I can't be misogynistic, I can't be 384 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:54,399 Speaker 1: hateful towards women. And we hear that time and time 385 00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 1: again from any type of abuser, like, oh, we hear 386 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,080 Speaker 1: this all the time, especially on sucking Mother's Day. Oh, 387 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:02,439 Speaker 1: my mother raised me to be a loving man. My 388 00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: mother raised me to respect women. Yet they condone and 389 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:09,359 Speaker 1: our friends with rapists or our abusers themselves, you know. 390 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:12,600 Speaker 1: And so we can't forget that and just hone in 391 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:17,000 Speaker 1: on one line that and take it out of context. 392 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 1: But I do agree with you that it is important 393 00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:24,200 Speaker 1: to um hold someone like AOC or at any level 394 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:27,760 Speaker 1: that is speaking on a national platform um and think 395 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 1: about the way they are using their language. And I 396 00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:33,240 Speaker 1: think that it's it's it is still good to engage 397 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:35,520 Speaker 1: in these conversations and we can't just shut them down. 398 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:38,879 Speaker 1: But I also think contextualizing and understanding where is that 399 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: AOC was coming from. And you know, I think it 400 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:48,320 Speaker 1: is important to point out that, you know, Representative Yoho 401 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:52,720 Speaker 1: gave his half ass apology first invoked his wife and 402 00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:57,520 Speaker 1: daughters as a shield, and her speech came after his 403 00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:01,639 Speaker 1: half ass apology. Right, it makes sense to me that 404 00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:07,359 Speaker 1: she would invoke her own family when the worst that's 405 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: being put out there. I don't think that she was like, 406 00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,080 Speaker 1: here's the thing, right, Like the words have meanings, words 407 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:19,560 Speaker 1: have definitions. Victim blaming is something that is super specific 408 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:25,439 Speaker 1: and comes out of a well documented history of families, 409 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:34,760 Speaker 1: police detectives, judges, attorneys specifically blaming rape and domestic violence. 410 00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:39,600 Speaker 1: Victims who have come forward and disclose what happened to them, 411 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 1: are trying to report, are trying to seek justice. It 412 00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:46,440 Speaker 1: is in those processes where we we have kind of 413 00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:49,920 Speaker 1: come up with this, this term of victim blaming. It's 414 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:53,760 Speaker 1: literally when people in a position of power or in 415 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:57,680 Speaker 1: a position to help, a position to intervene, who who 416 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:03,919 Speaker 1: um claim to be helpers, who claim to be you know, uh, 417 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:08,040 Speaker 1: folks that uphold law, justice and order. When those folks 418 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:11,359 Speaker 1: turn around and literally tell a victim who is seeking help, 419 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:14,960 Speaker 1: who is seeking justice, who is seeking acknowledgment, you did 420 00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:18,040 Speaker 1: this to yourself. This is your fault. Why did you 421 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:19,840 Speaker 1: wear that, Why did you talk like that, Why did 422 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 1: you say that, Why did you go there? Victim blaming 423 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:25,320 Speaker 1: comes from a very specific place, and it happens all 424 00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,840 Speaker 1: the time, and it is it's it's life threatening. It's 425 00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:32,639 Speaker 1: a threat to community safety, um and and to the 426 00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:38,679 Speaker 1: safety of the children survivors. Yahmala, I definitely hear what 427 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 1: you're saying, and thank you so much for you know, 428 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: bringing in your professional, professional expertise and also your personal 429 00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:48,520 Speaker 1: experience into this conversation. Um. You know, before we continue, 430 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:51,360 Speaker 1: we did want to talk about another another topic that's 431 00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:53,920 Speaker 1: in the media this week. 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So, coming back to the episode, 475 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:11,800 Speaker 1: into our conversation, we were in the midst of talking 476 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:18,760 Speaker 1: about you know, Representative ted Yo Ho hurling misogynist slurs 477 00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:25,480 Speaker 1: at Representative Alexandria Corth. This and how AOC held him 478 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:29,000 Speaker 1: accountable publicly right in her speech and her call out, 479 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 1: and how she invoked her family. She talked about systems 480 00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 1: of violence against women, of repression of women, and of 481 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:41,120 Speaker 1: women's speech um and the importance of holding power accountable right. 482 00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 1: So we wanted to come back and kind of tie 483 00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 1: in some other elements and pieces of history and like 484 00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 1: pieces of journalism to help us really understand and contextualize 485 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:55,720 Speaker 1: what is going on right with with around, under and 486 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 1: behind like the AOC situation. So I came across this 487 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:05,480 Speaker 1: article on Miss magazine online, written by Michelle Goodwin. And 488 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:11,720 Speaker 1: this article draws the connections between Representative Ted Yoho calling 489 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:16,040 Speaker 1: AOC a fucking bitch and a case involving a woman 490 00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:21,560 Speaker 1: named Miss Mary Hamilton's. So, in to quote the article, 491 00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 1: the Supreme Court ruled in Hamilton's versus Alabama that black 492 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,280 Speaker 1: women were entitled to be referred to by their names. 493 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:33,120 Speaker 1: More specifically, the Supreme Court ruled courts must use respectful 494 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:37,120 Speaker 1: forms of address, long required and reserved for white women. 495 00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:40,640 Speaker 1: The article goes on to say, prior to the Hamilton's case, 496 00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:43,680 Speaker 1: in Southern States, it was not uncommon for black Americans 497 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 1: to suffer the indignities of being called the N word 498 00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:52,160 Speaker 1: by law enforcement, jurors, attorneys, or even judges in court 499 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 1: during court proceedings or jury deliberations. Hamilton's case resonates in 500 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:01,160 Speaker 1: the wake of Representative Ted Yoho accosting and hurling a 501 00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 1: misogynistic slur at Rep. AOC this week. He called her 502 00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,720 Speaker 1: disgusting and a fucking bitch and at first denied it, 503 00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:11,840 Speaker 1: but then refused to apologize, and he was overheard by 504 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:15,640 Speaker 1: a reporter. So for me, like, I had no idea 505 00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 1: about this history, right, And thank you to Michelle Goodwin 506 00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 1: for talking about Miss Mary Hamilton's and and this case 507 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: that literally had to be brought to light to force 508 00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:30,640 Speaker 1: public officials, judges, law enforcement to call Black Americans by 509 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:34,239 Speaker 1: their names and by respectful titles and pointing out that 510 00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:36,760 Speaker 1: this was something that was really reserved for white women, 511 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:41,160 Speaker 1: like respectful treatment, being called miss mrs instead of being 512 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:47,880 Speaker 1: called slurs. And fast forward to today AOC is experiencing 513 00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,760 Speaker 1: what she's experiencing. It really is quite profound, you know, 514 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,440 Speaker 1: So I thought it was important for us to kind 515 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,560 Speaker 1: of engage this history to show even how anti blackness 516 00:31:56,600 --> 00:32:00,800 Speaker 1: is tied into this and there is a big, big, big, 517 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:04,680 Speaker 1: big big issue. Um that is bigger even than Representative 518 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:09,240 Speaker 1: Ted Yoho himself, right and his actions. Yeah, absolutely, I 519 00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,000 Speaker 1: mean this is what we mean. And not just Mola 520 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:13,960 Speaker 1: and I, but just in general folks that are having 521 00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 1: this conversation activist writers, journalists, when we're talking about systemic racism. 522 00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 1: It's not just individual people, but how were laws put 523 00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 1: in place that upholds white supremacy? And so thank you 524 00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,240 Speaker 1: Molla for bringing that example, because it really journing to 525 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:34,440 Speaker 1: us something that happened in history and then something that 526 00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:36,640 Speaker 1: we're still seeing to this day. Right, And it was 527 00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:39,480 Speaker 1: not that long ago either. This law had to be 528 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 1: passed to call black people by their names, and so 529 00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:46,240 Speaker 1: thank you for bringing that up. That's wild. And you 530 00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 1: know what you think about like how older our dads, 531 00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:52,240 Speaker 1: like our dads were alive when that law was being passed. Yes, 532 00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:56,600 Speaker 1: you know, it's so true. It's so true. I mean, 533 00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 1: I mean, it is so wild. And this is you know, 534 00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: this past weekend was I saw folks online commemorating what 535 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:09,760 Speaker 1: would have been Emmett Tills I believe seventy or eightieth birthday. 536 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:12,240 Speaker 1: And my father just turned to eighty this past year 537 00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:14,320 Speaker 1: and it still would have been could have been my 538 00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,840 Speaker 1: father's age, and that would like seeing that, I was like, wow, 539 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,040 Speaker 1: like this is really this is really not that long ago. 540 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,960 Speaker 1: And we know that obviously, but just the same white 541 00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:27,480 Speaker 1: supremacist violence, the same violence at the hands of the police. 542 00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 1: I mean, it's just it's a lot. It's a lot, 543 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:34,400 Speaker 1: and it's a good reminder. It's a good reminder of 544 00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,240 Speaker 1: all the work that's don't needs to be done. Okay, 545 00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 1: So another example that we wanted to bring today is 546 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:43,800 Speaker 1: something that we saw in the news cycle last week. 547 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:51,640 Speaker 1: Um Judge Esther Salace's child was murdered and her husband 548 00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:54,920 Speaker 1: was shot. And so Judge Esther Salas is a federal 549 00:33:55,000 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 1: judge in New Jersey and her child, her twenty old son, 550 00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:03,400 Speaker 1: was shot and her husband was shot. And this was 551 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 1: I would call this a hate crime, right. But this murderer, 552 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:11,600 Speaker 1: the person that killed her family is was a self 553 00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:16,279 Speaker 1: described anti feminist and attorney. And the plot twist is 554 00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:19,640 Speaker 1: that he actually left a trail of writing on line 555 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:23,640 Speaker 1: and he had a two thousand page collection of writings 556 00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:28,239 Speaker 1: that he posted online back in with just you know, 557 00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:34,799 Speaker 1: pure hate speech, violence against women, misogyny, racism, basically a manifesto, right. 558 00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:37,920 Speaker 1: I think that we thought it was really important to 559 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 1: bring this specific case and specific example when talking about 560 00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:46,680 Speaker 1: Gaso Cortez and what's happening in like the broader the 561 00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:51,560 Speaker 1: broader um scale, you know, the broader conversation when we're 562 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:55,960 Speaker 1: talking about who's impositions of power, who's elected into Congress, 563 00:34:56,400 --> 00:35:01,680 Speaker 1: who's appointed to be judges, you know, and so it's 564 00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:05,080 Speaker 1: just all connected. And so we wanted to bring this 565 00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 1: to lay out the foundation for this conversation. And what's 566 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:14,959 Speaker 1: even like, this case has not I don't think it's 567 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 1: been really fully truly investigated yet. I don't think we 568 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,080 Speaker 1: know everything, or at least not everything has been brought 569 00:35:21,120 --> 00:35:22,840 Speaker 1: to life. But what we do know is that Judge 570 00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:26,560 Speaker 1: Salas is from Monterey Park, which is, uh, you know, 571 00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:30,399 Speaker 1: us like a small city in the west Sangebro Valley 572 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:34,040 Speaker 1: of Los Angeles County. And um, I spent a ton 573 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:36,480 Speaker 1: of time in Monterey Park because I you know, I 574 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:39,960 Speaker 1: grew up in the Sange Roll Valley, and so she's 575 00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,720 Speaker 1: like a local girl, you know what I mean. So 576 00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:46,839 Speaker 1: she also, as a judge, was presiding over a case 577 00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:50,600 Speaker 1: involving Jeffrey Epstein. Um I think that there are like 578 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:55,239 Speaker 1: multiple there were like in addition to the criminal there 579 00:35:55,239 --> 00:36:00,239 Speaker 1: were also other like civil legal matters in courts involving him, right, 580 00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:04,800 Speaker 1: and she was working on something and so that also 581 00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:08,719 Speaker 1: can't be ignored. There's that connection there. And I think 582 00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:11,520 Speaker 1: that this case, I don't want it to go quiet, 583 00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:14,080 Speaker 1: right like, and like the Vanessa gi End case cannot 584 00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:16,600 Speaker 1: go quiet, and this case cannot go quiet because this 585 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:20,640 Speaker 1: is major stuff AOC like, and these are all three 586 00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:23,719 Speaker 1: of these women are Latinas in in in positions of 587 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:30,000 Speaker 1: public service right, military, judge, um, congresswoman, and to be 588 00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,080 Speaker 1: killed and to be targeted like it's just dangerous for 589 00:36:33,120 --> 00:36:34,560 Speaker 1: them out there. And you know, there's a lot of 590 00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,680 Speaker 1: people who do not like AOC and who do not 591 00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:39,839 Speaker 1: want to see her thrive. Like their vocal they make 592 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:42,839 Speaker 1: themselves known. This man that was very public of him 593 00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:45,440 Speaker 1: to attack her that way, that was very bold. But 594 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,640 Speaker 1: they do it. They've done it to other um, you know, 595 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:52,360 Speaker 1: black women, congressman, congresswomen and senators, um, other women you 596 00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:55,759 Speaker 1: know in public life, but we don't always hear about it, 597 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:01,719 Speaker 1: right And I think it's also like when we're talking 598 00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:04,640 Speaker 1: about the layers, to think about how so much of 599 00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:08,719 Speaker 1: this can thrive online. Like we always talk about the 600 00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:11,200 Speaker 1: positives of social media and how we can connect and 601 00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:15,000 Speaker 1: build community, but we know that the powers that be 602 00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:19,520 Speaker 1: like Facebook, at Twitter, at Instagram don't actually take hate 603 00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:24,520 Speaker 1: speech down. And we see these like Nazi white supremacist 604 00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:28,040 Speaker 1: groups thrive on social media, and then we also see, 605 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:31,080 Speaker 1: you know, police officers are in these groups as well, 606 00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:33,640 Speaker 1: and then we wonder why we have a problem. And 607 00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:36,880 Speaker 1: so I, you know, if there was a different type 608 00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:41,479 Speaker 1: of um I don't know, different type of measures that 609 00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:45,879 Speaker 1: social media platforms can take or would take about when 610 00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:49,319 Speaker 1: it comes to hate speech, I think that a lot 611 00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:52,440 Speaker 1: of the a lot of this violence specifically perpetrated against 612 00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:55,880 Speaker 1: women could be would be caught or would be stopped, 613 00:37:56,280 --> 00:38:00,280 Speaker 1: you know. I Like, for me, a personal example is, uh, 614 00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:03,560 Speaker 1: I was a student at UC Santa Barbara when Elliott 615 00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:07,360 Speaker 1: Rodgers killed students at UC Santa Barbara in like a 616 00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:11,240 Speaker 1: campus involved shooting. And he had a trail of writing 617 00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:14,000 Speaker 1: as well, you know, in his and a lot of 618 00:38:14,719 --> 00:38:16,600 Speaker 1: you know, he was in an in cell group, he 619 00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:19,040 Speaker 1: was in a like one of those four Chan chains 620 00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:21,799 Speaker 1: as well, and he made YouTube videos. And so if 621 00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:24,760 Speaker 1: there were different steps that were take to actually protect 622 00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:27,359 Speaker 1: women in society, you know, we would see less of this, 623 00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:29,880 Speaker 1: and so yeah, I wanted to bring up that layer 624 00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:34,880 Speaker 1: as well, that that what the internet, what the what 625 00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,160 Speaker 1: role the internet can play as well when it comes 626 00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,600 Speaker 1: to violence against women. Absolutely, I mean it's like the 627 00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:44,040 Speaker 1: new town Square, right, and it has been. It's the 628 00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:45,960 Speaker 1: digital town Square, and it has been for a very 629 00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:50,319 Speaker 1: long time. And yeah, the Elliott Rodgers situation is so 630 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:53,520 Speaker 1: disturbing too. He had like YouTube videos and I remember 631 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 1: watching seeing like in the wake of what happened on 632 00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:58,880 Speaker 1: the news, then playing clips right of like his videos 633 00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:03,520 Speaker 1: and his speeches and things, and you know, women, fems, 634 00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:08,360 Speaker 1: transfolks like black folks online for years have been talking 635 00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:10,640 Speaker 1: about this, that this is a very very big problem 636 00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:16,080 Speaker 1: um hate speech and radicalization of young white people and 637 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:19,719 Speaker 1: young white men in particular, white men of all ages 638 00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:25,600 Speaker 1: really on the Internet. And just like you said, you know, 639 00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:28,799 Speaker 1: what do you do when the police are on the 640 00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:32,439 Speaker 1: message chains and they're populating them and they're starting them, 641 00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:37,279 Speaker 1: and they're their members and they believe it and they're involved, 642 00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:40,000 Speaker 1: you know, and there's and and the same can be 643 00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:42,719 Speaker 1: true of anybody in tech or silicon Valley or or 644 00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:46,399 Speaker 1: in Facebook. You know, behind the scenes, this is really 645 00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:49,200 Speaker 1: how they feel. So you know, they're going to put 646 00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:54,760 Speaker 1: a lot of their their work, they're programming their efforts 647 00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:58,840 Speaker 1: behind their actual and true beliefs, and so it's like 648 00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:04,080 Speaker 1: are really wild sort of battle where the open forum 649 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:07,960 Speaker 1: can be good for certain types of you know, organizing, 650 00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,480 Speaker 1: for knowledge sharing, for connecting with people, for building movements, 651 00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:14,279 Speaker 1: but it also means that we're sharing space with all 652 00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:17,320 Speaker 1: of this violence that's kind of just allowed to percolate. 653 00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:22,000 Speaker 1: So yeah, it's it's I mean, it's the Internet, you know, 654 00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:27,360 Speaker 1: and it's just this constant monster. But we need it. 655 00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:31,160 Speaker 1: But also it's bad for us, but also it's bad 656 00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:36,279 Speaker 1: for us, right, No, it's true. Yeah, No, I mean 657 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:39,479 Speaker 1: so often we talk about the beauty of social media 658 00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:41,840 Speaker 1: and like clearly, like Mal and I met on social media. 659 00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:47,680 Speaker 1: We've grown our platform through social media. Um, but yeah, 660 00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:51,200 Speaker 1: there's also a lot of negatives to it. With anything, 661 00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:58,560 Speaker 1: of course, Um, it's true, it's true. So anyways, so 662 00:40:59,680 --> 00:41:05,600 Speaker 1: and way right right. So also, just to reference the 663 00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:08,600 Speaker 1: article that we were referring to when we talked about 664 00:41:08,600 --> 00:41:11,600 Speaker 1: we talked about Judge Esther Salas. There was an article 665 00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:13,840 Speaker 1: written in the Atlantic, and so if you want to 666 00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:18,720 Speaker 1: check that out, there's a thorough, uh thorough report on 667 00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:23,120 Speaker 1: this man in particular, and so check it out. It's 668 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:25,720 Speaker 1: called the New Jersey shooting suspect left a pro Trump 669 00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:30,440 Speaker 1: paper trail, you know, check it out. And also Mala 670 00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:33,799 Speaker 1: referenced to miss magazine article and so we'll link them 671 00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:35,480 Speaker 1: in the in the show notes, so y'all can check 672 00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:39,640 Speaker 1: them out. We like, we like to cide our sources. 673 00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:42,799 Speaker 1: We love to cide our sources. Don't ever say that 674 00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:47,360 Speaker 1: Local doesn't cite their sources, because we do. Thank you 675 00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:50,560 Speaker 1: all for being here with us and for participating in 676 00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:52,759 Speaker 1: this conversation. We want to know what you think and 677 00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:55,279 Speaker 1: how you feel, because, like we said, we don't want 678 00:41:55,320 --> 00:42:00,239 Speaker 1: these cases um to go silent. They're like, you know, 679 00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:06,040 Speaker 1: killing us and it's really bad and trying to um, 680 00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:11,400 Speaker 1: you know, stifle descent and they're also like being super 681 00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:16,760 Speaker 1: disrespectful and coming for AOC in uncool ways. And yeah, 682 00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:18,840 Speaker 1: so thanks for being here. We want to know, but 683 00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:20,080 Speaker 1: we want to know what you think. We want to 684 00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:24,400 Speaker 1: know how you feel, So definitely like comment on the episode, 685 00:42:24,600 --> 00:42:28,879 Speaker 1: you know, like subscribe, share all that good stuff if 686 00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:33,120 Speaker 1: you appreciate the work of indie Latin X podcasters Hit 687 00:42:33,160 --> 00:42:36,480 Speaker 1: the Venomo at look at dash Radio. We always appreciate that, 688 00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:40,439 Speaker 1: Yes we do. We always appreciate that. And also if 689 00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,080 Speaker 1: you want more long if you want to contribute in 690 00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:46,200 Speaker 1: long term ways, you can become a patron on patreon 691 00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:50,000 Speaker 1: dot com, slash look at Underscore Radio. Reminder that we 692 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,440 Speaker 1: have a weekly i G Live and also just quick 693 00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:57,280 Speaker 1: shout out to all my Peruvian listeners tomorrow's vint Julio, 694 00:42:57,680 --> 00:43:02,239 Speaker 1: which is proving an independence day. Yes, and if you 695 00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:06,560 Speaker 1: are not a huge fan of ads while you're listening 696 00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:09,680 Speaker 1: to podcasts, it's another good reason to become a patron 697 00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:14,400 Speaker 1: because we do offer ad free listening over there. Um 698 00:43:14,520 --> 00:43:18,360 Speaker 1: what else, Visit our website, say hi to us on Instagram, 699 00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:22,000 Speaker 1: and until then, it's see you next time, see you 700 00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:24,120 Speaker 1: next time. The seat us