1 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:08,400 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:13,720 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 2: I apologize for people that's going to be offended by it. 3 00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:19,279 Speaker 2: When I'm in front of the camera, I just don't 4 00:00:19,320 --> 00:00:21,759 Speaker 2: know how to put it. I believe I'm the best 5 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 2: on the planet. I am not worried about anything or anybody. 6 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 2: You put the camera in front of me, you put 7 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 2: the lights on, I believe I will be a dominant 8 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 2: presence in front of anyone's camera. 9 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 3: That's just how I feel. 10 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 1: Steven A. 11 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:46,160 Speaker 4: Smith, holy smokes man, like, that's one where I feel 12 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:48,040 Speaker 4: like the bar is very high. We watch one TV 13 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:53,600 Speaker 4: literally every day, listen to his podcast, and my only 14 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 4: trepidation about it is like, well, what does he have 15 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 4: left to say? Turns out a lot. What did you 16 00:00:59,000 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 4: take away from it? 17 00:01:00,240 --> 00:01:04,200 Speaker 5: I just resonated with him talking about his mother, his father, 18 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,520 Speaker 5: when he talked about opening the fridge and not having 19 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 5: any food there. There's so much there. But he's so authentic, 20 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:14,120 Speaker 5: and he's so confident, and he's fifty six, Jason, and 21 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:16,560 Speaker 5: I really do think that he's entering his prime. 22 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 4: This is a guy who basically says I didn't understand business. 23 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:25,640 Speaker 4: I got fired and I realized I did not understand 24 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:29,119 Speaker 4: what was going on behind the scenes, and then he 25 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 4: resets and sets about learning that. And now, to your point, 26 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 4: he's unstoppable in part because now he yets it. 27 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 5: Well, that part resonates big time with me because him 28 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 5: getting fired in my suspension and then the resetting and 29 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:48,520 Speaker 5: the lessons learned. But the way I see it, if 30 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 5: you fast forward now fifteen years, for him is probably 31 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 5: the number one most influential voice in sports and almost 32 00:01:55,120 --> 00:02:00,760 Speaker 5: pop culture, is a trifecta of lessons learned, great relationships, 33 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:04,280 Speaker 5: amazing work ethic, yeah, and supreme confidence. 34 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 4: Your point about like what he's building is so fascinating 35 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:12,280 Speaker 4: because we talked about this notion of where the media 36 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:15,520 Speaker 4: is going and how he reacts to it. And I 37 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:17,400 Speaker 4: loved his answer when I asked that, which is basically 38 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:20,119 Speaker 4: like I've already I've already figured it out. 39 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 5: And everywhere he goes he's a pop culture hero. I 40 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:24,480 Speaker 5: know that he came to one of the Timberwolves games. 41 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 5: He sat next to me, and I thought I was 42 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 5: sitting with like Muhammad Ali. Right, people in Minnesota loves 43 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 5: Stephen A. Smith, and I didn't think that was going 44 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 5: to happen. Right, He is very powerful and again he's 45 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:35,519 Speaker 5: just getting started. 46 00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:38,520 Speaker 4: And he's leveraging that. He's, you know, making a million 47 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:41,200 Speaker 4: bucks a year a little bit more, gets fired from ESPN, 48 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 4: basically has to go away, come back only on the radio, 49 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:47,639 Speaker 4: not on TV. Making four hundred thousand dollars a year. 50 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:53,360 Speaker 4: Fast forward to now twenty plus million dollars annually is 51 00:02:53,440 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 4: most likely what he's going to get. 52 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:58,520 Speaker 5: He's earning every part of whatever that twenty million dollars 53 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:01,119 Speaker 5: plus ends up. He's earned every dollar and he now 54 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 5: knows it. 55 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:11,679 Speaker 3: On this episode of the Deal, Stephen A. 56 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 4: Smith, all right, so we like to start the show 57 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 4: having people introduce themselves. 58 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:27,800 Speaker 3: Tell us who you are stephen A. Smith, ESPN, Stephen A. 59 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:28,520 Speaker 3: Smith's Show. 60 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,160 Speaker 2: I guess that says it all now, New York Times 61 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 2: bestselling author. 62 00:03:32,880 --> 00:03:34,480 Speaker 3: I like that one. Yeah, that's a good one. That 63 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:35,480 Speaker 3: works for me too. 64 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:40,440 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, yes, I love the way they've started off 65 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 2: this far, Soto. 66 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:43,440 Speaker 3: I'm very very pleased. I'm very pleased. 67 00:03:43,760 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 4: All right, So well, let's actually start there, because you 68 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 4: two obviously know each other. Now I believe your friends, 69 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 4: Yes we are, But I dare say that before you 70 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:56,000 Speaker 4: knew each other, you knew of each other. What did 71 00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 4: you know of him, what'd you think of him? Well, obviously, 72 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 4: his baseball career spoke for it elf. Obviously he's had 73 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 4: his trials and tribulations. 74 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 2: But I always considered him a good dude, somebody that 75 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:07,600 Speaker 2: would get in front of the camera talk to people, 76 00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 2: was personable, very relatable, tried to be fair minded and whatever, 77 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 2: and was just an outstanding great player. And so that 78 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:18,000 Speaker 2: was the guy that I knew on the baseball field, 79 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 2: and I didn't know him in any other capacity at 80 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:23,479 Speaker 2: that particular moment in time. And if I don't know 81 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 2: you at all, I'm going to be incredibly, incredibly objective. 82 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:30,799 Speaker 2: When I get to know you, I'm going to still 83 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,480 Speaker 2: be objective in terms of pursuing truth and. 84 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 3: What have you. 85 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:36,680 Speaker 2: But if you're my guy, you're my guy, and I'm 86 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:38,480 Speaker 2: going to go out publicly and I'm going to be 87 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:41,600 Speaker 2: unapologetic about the fact that this is my guy. And 88 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:44,840 Speaker 2: it's not just about being friendly. It's about looking at 89 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 2: a person and looking at them for who they are 90 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:49,080 Speaker 2: and saying, that's a person I want to be friends 91 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 2: with because they're a really good person. 92 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 3: And that's how I feel about Alex Rodriguez. What did 93 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 3: you know about him? 94 00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:57,720 Speaker 5: Well, obviously I knew he was someone that was very 95 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 5: respected in my circles and especially in New York being 96 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:02,920 Speaker 5: a Yankee. One of the things that was endaring was 97 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 5: that he was a Yankee fan, So immediately that was 98 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 5: a great connection. And one thing about steven A and 99 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 5: this is kind of when we got to know each other. 100 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:12,600 Speaker 5: I went to my tough time in twenty fourteen when 101 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:14,839 Speaker 5: I served my suspension, and he was critical about me. 102 00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 5: So once I talked to him, I asked for his advice. 103 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 5: And one thing about steven A, if you don't want 104 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:20,920 Speaker 5: to hear the truth, don't ask. 105 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 3: For his advice. 106 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 5: And he gave me some tough love, you know, And 107 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:26,920 Speaker 5: that kind of started what I call a very very 108 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 5: good relationship, is very respectful. And then watching him over 109 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 5: the last ten years, I mean, he had his downtime 110 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 5: when ESPN let you go and you came back. I 111 00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 5: had my downturn on my suspension. In the last decade 112 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 5: for both of us has been a lot better. But 113 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:43,080 Speaker 5: I think the common theme is we come from the bottom, 114 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:45,919 Speaker 5: we don't forget what we came from. But more importantly, 115 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:47,840 Speaker 5: I think we've learned from some of them, At. 116 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 3: Least I have. 117 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:50,480 Speaker 5: I know you have as well, Stephen, and it's been 118 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:53,839 Speaker 5: great to watch him develop to this mega media superstar. 119 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 4: If you think back to your early days, how did 120 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:03,600 Speaker 4: those early experiences family decisions, you made, decisions that were 121 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:05,920 Speaker 4: made for you. How did it affect you as a businessman? 122 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I was incredibly ignorant to business. 123 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:13,040 Speaker 2: But I think for me, if I had to crystallize 124 00:06:13,279 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 2: where business came to the forefront of my mind was 125 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 2: when I got fired in two thousand and nine. You see, 126 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:26,360 Speaker 2: there's a difference between making money and learning business. When 127 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:28,600 Speaker 2: you're trying to make money, what you're doing is you're 128 00:06:28,600 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 2: going out there, you're performing. You're praying that some sort 129 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:35,040 Speaker 2: of a meritocracy will be in existence, you'll be recognized 130 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:39,599 Speaker 2: for your attributes and your production, and ultimately you'll be 131 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:45,520 Speaker 2: fairly compensated for it. When you think about business now, 132 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:49,320 Speaker 2: you're looking at the entire landscape and you're monitoring what's 133 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:53,520 Speaker 2: transpiring not just before your very eyes, but around you. 134 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 2: And you're looking at the stratosphere that you're venturing into 135 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:00,240 Speaker 2: or that you're in the midst of, and you're paying 136 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 2: attention to the tea leaves. You're paying attention to what's 137 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 2: going on, et cetera, et cetera. Because when I got 138 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:09,520 Speaker 2: let go by ESPN due to a contract dispute, it was. 139 00:07:09,640 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 3: An incredibly humbling experience. 140 00:07:12,120 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 2: I went from having four jobs to zero in one meeting, 141 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 2: just like that. I didn't think it was fair. I 142 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:22,560 Speaker 2: didn't think it was right. I thought I got hold. 143 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 2: I thought I got screwed over big time. And I 144 00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 2: was very, very upset. But I was overwhelmed, not just 145 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 2: with sorrow but with fear. Because as I was driving 146 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 2: home from Connecticut back to Hollis Queens, New York, to 147 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 2: my mom's house, I pulled over on the side of 148 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,400 Speaker 2: the road and I just put my head in my 149 00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:45,680 Speaker 2: hands because I was like, I've lost everything, and I 150 00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 2: had no game plan. I had no plan B. I 151 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:52,560 Speaker 2: had walked around thinking that folks yelling my name, screaming 152 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:56,960 Speaker 2: my name, CMN commercials, I'm on TV, I'm popular, boom, 153 00:07:57,280 --> 00:07:59,040 Speaker 2: this is who I am, this is what I'm worth. 154 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:02,000 Speaker 2: I had no knowledge, no clue whatsoever, of what my 155 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:05,400 Speaker 2: true worth was because I wasn't attached to anything that 156 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 2: was perceived as being a revenue generator. And if I 157 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 2: didn't have knowledge about my business. Then they got to 158 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:14,640 Speaker 2: define my worth, not me. And so as a result, 159 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:16,720 Speaker 2: when I wanted X amount of dollars and they said 160 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 2: I wasn't worth it, I couldn't prove to them that 161 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 2: they were wrong because I had no platform or no evidence, 162 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 2: no dabta whatsoever that validated that. And I didn't know 163 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 2: that until they let me go. And when they let 164 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:30,800 Speaker 2: me go, and I went about the business of licking 165 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:33,520 Speaker 2: my wounds and then ultimately trying to resurrect my career. 166 00:08:33,800 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 2: What I zeroed in on was mastering the business that 167 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:41,560 Speaker 2: I was in and ultimately positioning myself where I would 168 00:08:41,600 --> 00:08:44,280 Speaker 2: be able to define my worth and lo and behold. 169 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:48,320 Speaker 2: I've had three contracts since, and I think it's fair 170 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:50,599 Speaker 2: to say that I've kind of figured stuff. 171 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 5: Out, and another one coming, by. 172 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:54,400 Speaker 2: The way, another one coming. My contract ends in June 173 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:57,560 Speaker 2: of twenty twenty five. I'm sure we'll be talking before then, 174 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 2: and hopefully things will work out. If it doesn't, it doesn't, 175 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:05,400 Speaker 2: and that's business, and that's something that I believe I'm 176 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,240 Speaker 2: going to be prepared to handle. Let's just say this, 177 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 2: this ain't two thousand and. 178 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 3: Nine, Steven. 179 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:12,520 Speaker 5: I do want to go back because we do share 180 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:18,360 Speaker 5: a lot in common, more than the pinstripes. Yes, the 181 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 5: fact that we both fell and my suspension. You're firing, 182 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 5: But what lessons did you learn? 183 00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:27,280 Speaker 3: And I don't think i'd be where I am today. 184 00:09:27,720 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 2: I was arrogant, and I was the worst kind of 185 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 2: arrogant because I was stupid while I was arrogant. When 186 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 2: I say I was arrogant, I never mistreated people. I'm 187 00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:39,560 Speaker 2: never humane and humane when I'm talking about is just 188 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 2: an overwhelming level of confidence and who I am in 189 00:09:43,240 --> 00:09:47,000 Speaker 2: what I do in this business, and I just I'm 190 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:49,439 Speaker 2: one of those guys and I am to this, you know, for. 191 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 3: Better or worse. 192 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 2: I apologize for people that's going to be offended by it. 193 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 2: When I'm in front of the camera, I just don't 194 00:09:55,880 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 2: know how to put it. I believe I'm the best 195 00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:03,440 Speaker 2: on the planet. I am not worried about anything or anybody. 196 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:06,120 Speaker 2: You put the camera in front of me, you put 197 00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:09,000 Speaker 2: the lights on, I believe I will be a dominant 198 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 2: presence in front of anyone's camera. That's just how I 199 00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:16,440 Speaker 2: feel because I'm that comfortable with it. And so for 200 00:10:16,559 --> 00:10:20,200 Speaker 2: me having that attitude, I thought that was all I 201 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:24,120 Speaker 2: needed because people knew me and they screamed my name 202 00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:26,439 Speaker 2: in the streets. But you got to be educated about 203 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 2: your business, about the business in hand. Do you generate revenue? 204 00:10:31,520 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 2: That's what business is about. And I realized that I 205 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 2: was a victim of being a newspaper person because so 206 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:42,439 Speaker 2: many newspaper people pay no attention to business. They pay 207 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 2: attention to the affinity they have with the audience and 208 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:48,720 Speaker 2: what's reciprocated, and they will let that speak for them 209 00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 2: because for years that's what it did. 210 00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:53,760 Speaker 3: But the advent and the introduction. 211 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:56,240 Speaker 2: Of sports talk radio and then ultimately television, of course 212 00:10:56,240 --> 00:10:58,640 Speaker 2: it was always there, but especially in this day and age, 213 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 2: the bait format ultimately need a podcast stratgy. 214 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 3: There's so many different avenues. 215 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:05,680 Speaker 2: Not to mention social media and how that could potentially 216 00:11:05,679 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 2: be monetized, because I don't care how good your product is. 217 00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 2: If people ain't buying it, money ain't being generated. If 218 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 2: money ain't being generated, bodies are gonna fall because they 219 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,080 Speaker 2: don't have the revenue to pay the folks that are producing. 220 00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:20,720 Speaker 2: And when you deduce things from that simplistic perspective, it 221 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:24,199 Speaker 2: goes a long way towards humbling you. And then this 222 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 2: is the black element. As a black man. It's very 223 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:30,320 Speaker 2: very important that I say this. The more knowledgeable I became, 224 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:35,839 Speaker 2: the more I learned to depersonalize things. When I was 225 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:38,760 Speaker 2: let go in two thousand and nine, I'm a black man, 226 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 2: I'm doing this, I'm doing that. They gonna let me go. 227 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 2: They want to do this to the white guy. That 228 00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 2: was the mentality. And tell my mother, as I wrote 229 00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:48,840 Speaker 2: in my book, Straight Shooter, looked at me and gave 230 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:51,199 Speaker 2: me a tray with some bagels and eggs and some tea, 231 00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:53,280 Speaker 2: and put a handheld mirror in front of me, and 232 00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 2: she said, I'm just wondering when you're gonna look at yourself. 233 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:57,960 Speaker 3: She said, this ain't about all of that is about you. 234 00:11:57,960 --> 00:11:59,880 Speaker 2: You would have one complaining. You would have won talking 235 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:02,719 Speaker 2: about your bosses. That way, you would have won lamenting 236 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:04,640 Speaker 2: the state of affairs at work and all the stuff. 237 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:06,319 Speaker 2: She said, I'm not saying you should have been fired, 238 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:10,160 Speaker 2: but would you have wanted you working for you at 239 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:12,240 Speaker 2: that time the way that you were? She said, I'm 240 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:14,439 Speaker 2: saying it's time to look at yourself. If she hadn't 241 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 2: told me that, I would have kept licking my wanes 242 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 2: and thinking that it was them instead of me, and 243 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:23,679 Speaker 2: I think that once I became more knowledgeable. 244 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,679 Speaker 3: About the business, the biggest lesson I learned. 245 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 2: Is that all of a sudden, you depersonalized stuff because 246 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:33,439 Speaker 2: you can see why certain decisions are mean, and all 247 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:36,320 Speaker 2: of a sudden it makes sense. So if you ESPN 248 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,880 Speaker 2: and you expected to generate about fifty million in revenue, 249 00:12:39,920 --> 00:12:41,959 Speaker 2: but you only generated. 250 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:45,240 Speaker 3: Thirty, well that would explain why I got less. But 251 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:49,959 Speaker 3: if you got more, it would also explain why I'm 252 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 3: asking for more. 253 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 2: And so you know what's it going to be. And 254 00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:57,440 Speaker 2: that's the mentality, and that's what I've learned. The biggest 255 00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:00,160 Speaker 2: lesson I learned was the importance of mastering my business. 256 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:02,640 Speaker 2: It's not just from a negotiating standpoint, not just to 257 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 2: empower myself as a as a talent, but as a man, 258 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 2: learning to separate emotion from business. 259 00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:14,400 Speaker 4: And so the key thing that happens in your sort 260 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 4: of resurrection journey, as it were, is Dave Roberts comes 261 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:19,880 Speaker 4: to you. What gave him such confidence in you? 262 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:23,560 Speaker 2: Dave Roberts, everybody knows he and I are very very close. 263 00:13:23,600 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 2: Of course, I love him deally. He is an absolute 264 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:33,160 Speaker 2: nightmare to work for. If you are not one thousand 265 00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:38,680 Speaker 2: percent committed to winning. This man lives, eats, and breathes winning. 266 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:42,040 Speaker 2: He is not a pleasant person to be around. If 267 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:46,200 Speaker 2: you are losing. He is dogged about it. And there's 268 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 2: one talent he believes that it's like him, and you're 269 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:53,079 Speaker 2: looking at him. You know, I'm not you know, if 270 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:56,199 Speaker 2: I lose, I lose what, I'm not gonna sleep. Well, 271 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,240 Speaker 2: I'm not going to rest. I'm not gonna drop in 272 00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:03,280 Speaker 2: the ratings and stand still and accept that. I'm not gonna, 273 00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 2: you know, be near the top of the heat and 274 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:09,000 Speaker 2: not shoot for the top. I'm not going to be 275 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:12,200 Speaker 2: at the top and settle. I'm not built like that. 276 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:15,880 Speaker 2: And he knows, and he always said, you're a machine. 277 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 2: And you know he got that from a story Mark 278 00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 2: Shapiro tells Mark Shapiro again as the president you know 279 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 2: over there William Morris, dvor and Mark Shapiro. When he 280 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:31,800 Speaker 2: he brought me in the ESPN in two thousand and three, 281 00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 2: he was told at the time he rod he was like, 282 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 2: who's this guy, Stephen A. 283 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:38,080 Speaker 3: I'm at Fox. I'm at Fox Sports. 284 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:41,360 Speaker 2: At the time, Kevin Frasier, who's the host of Entertainment Tonight, 285 00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:44,440 Speaker 2: who was once at ESPN. That's one of my buddies. 286 00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 2: He and I've been friends for thirty years. And he 287 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:49,520 Speaker 2: was working on NBA shoot Around is what it was 288 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 2: called at the time, and he went to Mark. 289 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 3: He said, this is what we need. Mark's like, who's 290 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:57,240 Speaker 3: this guy? Kevin said, the best. 291 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:01,600 Speaker 2: You have to get him, and according to Shapiro, he 292 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 2: had twenty. 293 00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 3: Five direct reports. 294 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:08,560 Speaker 2: And he went into a meeting and asked what everybody 295 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 2: thought about me, and every single individual in that room said, hell, no, 296 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 2: don't bring him here. 297 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 3: He's not a cup of tea. 298 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:18,280 Speaker 2: We don't want them. He's not for us, he's for them. 299 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 2: Do not bring him here. Everyone except Norby Williamson, he 300 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 2: was indecisive. What do you want to do. I guess 301 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:26,720 Speaker 2: he's worth a chance. I don't know what you want. 302 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 2: But everybody else was an emphatic no. And Shapiro said, 303 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 2: I've never seen anybody have such universal dissension against them 304 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:42,640 Speaker 2: in a meeting like this. Get him here for an audition. 305 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:44,960 Speaker 2: I want to see him. I go up there for 306 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 2: an addition, and eighteen different people interviewed me. 307 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 3: Wow. 308 00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:51,560 Speaker 2: And the last was a guy by the name of 309 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:56,120 Speaker 2: Mike McQuaid, who was an exceptional senior coordinator producer at 310 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 2: ESPN for years. And he looked at me and all 311 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 2: he said to me, he was, you know, you're at 312 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 2: Fox and it's cool, but you know, essentially compared to 313 00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:08,760 Speaker 2: us in the world the sports, right, you know, they're 314 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:10,360 Speaker 2: the little fish. 315 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:11,520 Speaker 3: We big fish. 316 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 2: He said, you the big fish in the little pond. 317 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,560 Speaker 2: How you gonna feel about being the little fish? You know, 318 00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 2: the little fish in a big pond. And I looked 319 00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:22,880 Speaker 2: around and I said, I mean no disrespect to anybody, 320 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:24,360 Speaker 2: but I ain't gonna be in a little fish in 321 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 2: anybody's pond. Turn the lights on, put on the camera, 322 00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 2: and watch me do what I do. And he said, 323 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 2: all right, let's go, and he put me in the studio. 324 00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 2: It was at two fifteen pm. At two forty five pm, 325 00:16:37,760 --> 00:16:41,800 Speaker 2: we finished at three o'clock. I was on the road 326 00:16:42,320 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 2: heading back to New York. At three point thirty, my 327 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 2: agent at the time called me and said, we just 328 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:50,520 Speaker 2: agreed to a three year deal for ESPN. 329 00:16:51,120 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 3: Watch. 330 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 2: A peer on them was watching and he called it 331 00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 2: the greatest audition he had ever seen. And that's how 332 00:16:57,040 --> 00:16:57,640 Speaker 2: it started. 333 00:16:57,920 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 4: And so I do want to go back to that 334 00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:02,680 Speaker 4: moment where you come back because you start this rebuild. 335 00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:06,800 Speaker 4: It's clear then, and you've described it in talking about Dave, 336 00:17:07,359 --> 00:17:09,879 Speaker 4: it's clear that you had a much I don't know 337 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 4: if you had a better grasp, you had more focus 338 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:14,920 Speaker 4: on the numbers and what you had to deliver. 339 00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:17,680 Speaker 3: Is that fair? Yes? So where does it go from there? 340 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:21,200 Speaker 4: How do you build that sort of business and sort 341 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:25,119 Speaker 4: of almost analytic foundation to take the next step. 342 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 3: Well, first of all, you have to assign yourself. 343 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 2: And I talked to a a Rod about this, you know, 344 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 2: I was like, listen, man, you're going to do baseball. 345 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:36,600 Speaker 2: This is a beautiful thing because obviously this man is 346 00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 2: a savant when it comes to the diamond and I'm 347 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 2: looking at him and I'm like, the games, live events, 348 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 2: that's always a winner. You're a part of that. You're winning, right. 349 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:50,920 Speaker 2: If you're not a part of that, what do you do? 350 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 2: You can make all the sports and appearances in the world, 351 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:56,280 Speaker 2: to use ESPN as an example, but if you ain't 352 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 2: hosting this show, nobody knows when you're coming on. One 353 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 2: day is an analyst, another day is another analyst, another 354 00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:03,160 Speaker 2: day is somebody else. 355 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:04,680 Speaker 3: So it's not appointment viewing. 356 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,959 Speaker 2: That means what happens is ultimately they could deduce what 357 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 2: the number is and they don't necessarily have to attribute 358 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:13,800 Speaker 2: it to you because you're not a consistent presence on 359 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:17,080 Speaker 2: the show. As a result, they get to dilute your impact, 360 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:20,399 Speaker 2: therefore dilute your worth and as a result, say do 361 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:22,200 Speaker 2: you hold your horses in terms of what you think 362 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:25,600 Speaker 2: you're worth? This may not necessarily be soow So when 363 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 2: Skip Bayless came to me, and Skip Bayless was like, hey, man, 364 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:31,399 Speaker 2: I need you on the show. I'm getting my ratings 365 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:33,200 Speaker 2: and what have you. But to do something with somebody 366 00:18:33,240 --> 00:18:35,000 Speaker 2: every day, it needs to be somebody I know I can. 367 00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 3: Trust, et cetera, et cetera. 368 00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:38,600 Speaker 2: One of the things that I had to pay attention 369 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:43,240 Speaker 2: to and ultimately had to heed was that that's five 370 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 2: days a week, every day ten am. That means the 371 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:51,199 Speaker 2: audience knows exactly where to find me, which means that 372 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:54,480 Speaker 2: if these ratings jump up, there's no way they can 373 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 2: deny the impact that I had because I'm right there. 374 00:18:59,240 --> 00:19:02,560 Speaker 2: And so because of that, I went to the show. 375 00:19:02,840 --> 00:19:06,720 Speaker 2: We skyrocketed to number one on ESPN two. Okay, we 376 00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:09,480 Speaker 2: were doing the unthinkable. We were beating some of the 377 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:12,359 Speaker 2: sports centers in ratings, which is something that you know, 378 00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:15,639 Speaker 2: the elder statesman in the business was swearing we would 379 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,919 Speaker 2: never be able to do. And then from that point forward, 380 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:22,560 Speaker 2: it was just calculative measures that took place along the way. 381 00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:26,440 Speaker 2: Skip Baylor's was ultimately going to leave because he was 382 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:27,200 Speaker 2: going to get. 383 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 3: Offered a boatload of money from Fox. 384 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:33,320 Speaker 2: I had dreams of making sure that we transitioned from 385 00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:36,840 Speaker 2: ESPN to to ESPN one because ESPN one always has 386 00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:40,360 Speaker 2: more viewers. So if we're right there, that's definitely going 387 00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 2: to facilitate us grasping a larger audience as those larger 388 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:47,120 Speaker 2: numbers come in. All of a sudden, here we are, 389 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:50,720 Speaker 2: and who's the constant. You've got Skip Bayles's he's in, 390 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:52,800 Speaker 2: he's out. You got Max Kellum and he's in, he's out. 391 00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 2: You've got Kerry Champion, You've got Molly Carum, You've got 392 00:19:56,000 --> 00:20:00,119 Speaker 2: all of these contributors. Who's the one constant, Steve a 393 00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:01,720 Speaker 2: beat at one constant. 394 00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:03,639 Speaker 4: I don't want to get too far away though, from 395 00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:07,120 Speaker 4: that initial decision though, to pair with Skip, because I 396 00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 4: think the three of us can agree that fundamentally changes 397 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:16,280 Speaker 4: sports media. You and Skip had a relationship you had 398 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:20,720 Speaker 4: seemingly dissimilar backgrounds, but actually, when you peel it back, 399 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:26,280 Speaker 4: you're both incredibly hard working journalists at the core. Because 400 00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:29,280 Speaker 4: if we think about deals, that's probably one of the 401 00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:31,720 Speaker 4: best deals you do is getting into a partnership with 402 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:32,320 Speaker 4: Skip Bayless. 403 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 3: Scared Bayless is insane and I'm not. Yeah, let's get 404 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:36,920 Speaker 3: that out of the way. 405 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 2: And I say that affectionately, and he knows what story 406 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:42,200 Speaker 2: I'm going to tell. 407 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:43,880 Speaker 3: It's two thousand and five. 408 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:48,000 Speaker 2: Bob Lee is hosting sports centers on Sunday morning, the 409 00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:52,320 Speaker 2: Great Bobbley. And in hosting those sports centers, there was 410 00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,639 Speaker 2: a segment okay, old school news school. 411 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:55,439 Speaker 3: They had talked about it. 412 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 2: Bobly ultimately took a hold of it and had Skip 413 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:02,440 Speaker 2: and Eye On in separate rooms in a studio right 414 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:07,359 Speaker 2: here in midtown Manhattan, and Skip would say our landish 415 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,360 Speaker 2: things sometimes of what people thought were outlandish, and some 416 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,919 Speaker 2: athlete got in trouble, and Skip Baylor's goes a national 417 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 2: television on a Sunday morning at eleven AM, to be exact, 418 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:23,520 Speaker 2: and this man says, no athlete should be allowed outside 419 00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:28,040 Speaker 2: after eleven pm. He said, nothing good happens at nighttime. 420 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:32,679 Speaker 2: Nothing good happens at night. Every athlete in that contract 421 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:36,919 Speaker 2: should have an eleven pm curfew. And I'm literally laughing, 422 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 2: and I'm like, how old do you skip? How old 423 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:41,600 Speaker 2: you have lost your mind? 424 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:41,879 Speaker 3: You know? 425 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:44,760 Speaker 2: And so we finished the segment and we come out 426 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 2: of our separate rooms and I was like, man, that 427 00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:47,919 Speaker 2: was hilarious. 428 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:49,919 Speaker 3: Man, that was funny. Way to go. Man. 429 00:21:50,359 --> 00:21:55,760 Speaker 2: He looked around, He's leaning to me. He said, I'm serious. 430 00:21:56,720 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 2: He said, no athletes should be allowed out after the clock. 431 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:04,000 Speaker 2: Is nothing good that comes from being out after eleven 432 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:08,040 Speaker 2: o'clock at night. And that's when I knew if we 433 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:14,840 Speaker 2: ever paid, it's gonna be big time. Because I naturally 434 00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 2: thought nothing like him. 435 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:20,200 Speaker 3: Naturally he thought nothing like me. We were polar opposites. 436 00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:22,280 Speaker 3: It wasn't something that had to be manufactured. 437 00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:25,280 Speaker 5: So Stephen, that was then, Yes, it is now. Yes, 438 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 5: you've had multiple co hosts. Yeah, I love what you 439 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:30,080 Speaker 5: guys doing Mondays and Tuesdays, earn Foot on all of that. 440 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:34,439 Speaker 5: The question is the rating wars, right, who's winning? 441 00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:34,680 Speaker 4: Now? 442 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 2: It was me close, not even close. And I don't 443 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:43,479 Speaker 2: say that with joy, believe it or not, because I 444 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 2: want to win. I want to be number one but 445 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 2: I think a couple of weeks ago we won by 446 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:48,840 Speaker 2: a ten to one margin. 447 00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:52,280 Speaker 3: It's been very, very lopsided. 448 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:56,840 Speaker 2: And I take no joy in saying that, because I 449 00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:59,080 Speaker 2: want SKIP to be successful. I'm going to always be 450 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:02,119 Speaker 2: grateful for what he did to me. Keishawn Johnson's a 451 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:04,560 Speaker 2: friend of mine. Michael Irvin is a friend of mine. 452 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 2: You know, Richard Sherman is a friend of mine. I'm 453 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 2: not rooting against these guys. I just want to be 454 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 2: number one. But you know, first take is definitely it. 455 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 2: This is at a time when linear television, you know, 456 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 2: is doing the ling shows a get canceled. 457 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 3: We're going up in the ratings. 458 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:23,640 Speaker 2: I literally had a conversation with the bosses, like, look, 459 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:26,840 Speaker 2: if I'm going to continue to do this show, it 460 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:30,640 Speaker 2: can't be about that, because now I'm competing against myself. 461 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,600 Speaker 2: I'm proud to say that I wake up every day 462 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 2: with two thoughts in my mind, how do I make 463 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:38,359 Speaker 2: my bosses more money and how do I get some 464 00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:41,400 Speaker 2: of it. I can say stuff like that about being 465 00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:43,879 Speaker 2: at ESPN because I know I don't show up to 466 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,840 Speaker 2: work thinking about just myself. I show up to work 467 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:50,959 Speaker 2: thinking about facilitating success for the company. And so I 468 00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:53,680 Speaker 2: want all of these guys to succeed. In these ladies, 469 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:55,720 Speaker 2: I see you know them all. You see them all 470 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 2: every day. Anything they need from me, I'm happy to 471 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:00,879 Speaker 2: do it. The bosses need something for me, I'm happy 472 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,760 Speaker 2: to do it. I'm here to win for all of us. So, 473 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:05,880 Speaker 2: but I'm not going to apologize for wanting to win 474 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 2: for me too, right. 475 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:11,760 Speaker 4: And so that leads to I think a fascinating conversation 476 00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:16,320 Speaker 4: about this moment that we're in that you're addressing directly, Stephen, 477 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:20,159 Speaker 4: which is the media landscape is radically changing. Even the 478 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,359 Speaker 4: business model sure they're at ESPN is changing. You think 479 00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 4: about you know, Logan Paul, You think about Pat McAfee, 480 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 4: you think about Dude Perfect licensing content to ESPN. This 481 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,720 Speaker 4: world is going to change. How do you ensure that 482 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:36,359 Speaker 4: you change your business with it? 483 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:39,159 Speaker 3: I've already done it. The Stephen A. Smith's show is 484 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:42,600 Speaker 3: owned and operated by me, has nothing to do with ESPN. 485 00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:47,320 Speaker 2: You have people and respect to everybody who does it 486 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 2: because it's a money making business. The podcast Stratospy that 487 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 2: we live in props to you guys for doing what 488 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:56,159 Speaker 2: you're doing. I'm proud of everything that I see and 489 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:59,200 Speaker 2: I want everybody to succeed. But when you look at 490 00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:03,520 Speaker 2: those guys, they have podcasts. I have a show. What 491 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:05,919 Speaker 2: do I mean by that? I came out of my 492 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:09,040 Speaker 2: own pocket and I built my own television set in 493 00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:14,679 Speaker 2: my own television studio. I'm trying to produce content for 494 00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 2: linear television and the streaming stratosphere. I can sit up 495 00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,680 Speaker 2: there one minute and I'm doing a thirty minute sports show. 496 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,920 Speaker 3: Another minute, it's an hour show on politics. 497 00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:26,640 Speaker 2: That can go up against real time with Bill Maher, 498 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:28,800 Speaker 2: The Daily Show or something like that. You look at 499 00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:30,720 Speaker 2: the set, you might peak at it and say, man, 500 00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 2: this looks like a late night show Stephen Cober, Jimmy Fallon, 501 00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 2: Jimmy Kimmel. Yes, it's true. Hell, I could do something 502 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:38,520 Speaker 2: for Bloomberg News if I knew as much as y'all 503 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:39,400 Speaker 2: did about business. 504 00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 3: Okay, I'm just saying that. For me, that's what I'm after. 505 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:46,360 Speaker 3: I wasn't out to do a podcast. 506 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 2: Everybody else was doing a podcast number one and number two. 507 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 2: I didn't need to necessarily do that because even though 508 00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 2: the landscape is changing, I'm still winning in linear television, 509 00:25:57,000 --> 00:25:59,639 Speaker 2: and by the way, it's winning and streaming because you 510 00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:02,640 Speaker 2: have to remember there is such a thing called ESPN YouTube. 511 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 2: People can talk all the stuff that they want about 512 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,320 Speaker 2: the you know, ESPN's and Less households, and it was 513 00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:10,720 Speaker 2: one hundred million, and then it dipped to eighty nine, 514 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 2: and then eighty two. 515 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:13,440 Speaker 3: And then down to seventy one. 516 00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:19,440 Speaker 2: What they're leaving out is that the audience hasn't left ESPN. 517 00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:25,399 Speaker 2: They're just watching it differently iPads, smartphones, laptops, et cetera. 518 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:27,920 Speaker 2: And oh, by the way, in my first year doing 519 00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:28,439 Speaker 2: the Stephen A. 520 00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:31,360 Speaker 3: Smith Show on YouTube, which is separate and apart from 521 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:33,879 Speaker 3: all of that, I already have six hundred and fourteen 522 00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:37,359 Speaker 3: thousand subscribers averaging over eight million views pro. 523 00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:42,320 Speaker 2: So I'm just getting started. My attitude is I've already adjusted. 524 00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 2: It's just a matter of what I'm going to be 525 00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:49,639 Speaker 2: incentivized to do. I'm not going to be apologetic about this. 526 00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 2: I want to and I intend to get paid. But 527 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:56,119 Speaker 2: in the same breath, I also want to be somebody 528 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,639 Speaker 2: that whether it's ESPN and Disney or someone else, looks 529 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 2: at and has faith in to help build find different talents, 530 00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,679 Speaker 2: scout and the value and create different shows and different 531 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:10,679 Speaker 2: platforms for content I want to be one of those 532 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:11,720 Speaker 2: guys as well. 533 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:12,119 Speaker 3: Steven A. 534 00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:14,439 Speaker 5: That's one other things that we also have in common 535 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,760 Speaker 5: is a great friend and mutual mentor in Mark Shapiro. 536 00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:19,640 Speaker 3: What did you learn from Mark Shapiro? 537 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:23,960 Speaker 2: Mark and I have a special relationship. You know, it's rare, 538 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:27,480 Speaker 2: and I'm just gonna say it. Plain to be a 539 00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:30,560 Speaker 2: black man from the streets in New York City, it 540 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,159 Speaker 2: is rare that you find yourself in a position to 541 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:37,040 Speaker 2: have the kind of relationships that I've been blessed and fortunate. 542 00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:40,639 Speaker 3: Enough to have. And Mark Shapiro is certainly up there 543 00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:42,400 Speaker 3: with some of the great. 544 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 2: Relationships that I've had. He's a businessman, make no mistake 545 00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 2: about it. He does not always deliver me good news. 546 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 2: We do not always agree, and we will butt heads. 547 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:53,879 Speaker 2: And if you don't know us, you'd be like, what 548 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:55,400 Speaker 2: the hell is wrong with them? Why do they talk 549 00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:56,280 Speaker 2: to each other like that? 550 00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:57,480 Speaker 3: What you don't. 551 00:27:57,320 --> 00:27:59,040 Speaker 2: Understand is that we could talk to each other like 552 00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:00,359 Speaker 2: that and be like, all right, man, I meet you 553 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:01,040 Speaker 2: for dinner in an hour. 554 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:02,679 Speaker 3: All right, man, I see you next Tuesday. Were going 555 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:03,640 Speaker 3: to the next game together? 556 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:07,479 Speaker 2: A right, when you have somebody like Mark Shapiro, in 557 00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:08,080 Speaker 2: your life. 558 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 3: I just can't say enough of you. 559 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:14,159 Speaker 2: He's alive, he's energized, He's constantly swinging for the defenses, 560 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:18,080 Speaker 2: and he goes for it. And it's pretty impossible to 561 00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:22,560 Speaker 2: be in his presence and be somebody who's complacent, who 562 00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 2: doesn't want to work hard, and who doesn't care about results. 563 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:30,200 Speaker 2: If you're trying to win, you don't mind being around him. 564 00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:33,160 Speaker 3: And he is the only I love Irian Manuel as well. 565 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,560 Speaker 2: We've had a great relationship for years, but I don't 566 00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 2: apologetically tell anybody I'm at William Morrison Deavor because Mark 567 00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 2: Shapiro is there. It's a personal relationship that I've had 568 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 2: with him for over twenty years. He is the man 569 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,600 Speaker 2: that hired me when he was going to six Flags, 570 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,480 Speaker 2: when he was going running Dick Clark Productions, when he 571 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:52,320 Speaker 2: was all of these years that he was away from me, 572 00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 2: he would still call and provide input and do what 573 00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:01,720 Speaker 2: he could to protect me, what to elevate me. He's 574 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,800 Speaker 2: always always had my back and I've always appreciated that. 575 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:09,680 Speaker 4: We talked a bit about Mark Shapiro, and if you 576 00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:12,320 Speaker 4: haven't listened to our episode with him yet, go back 577 00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:16,040 Speaker 4: and check it out. Coming up we discuss how Stephen 578 00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 4: a went from a local journalist to the face of ESPN, 579 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:28,400 Speaker 4: plus how mentorship and accountability played critical roles in his success. 580 00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:41,200 Speaker 4: And so as we talk about sort of mentorship and guidance, 581 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,920 Speaker 4: you know, one very clear through line in your book 582 00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:47,240 Speaker 4: are these series of and they are mostly men in 583 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,120 Speaker 4: your life, and often they are men of color, Black 584 00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:52,760 Speaker 4: men who you know, whether it's Big House Gains, your 585 00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:55,920 Speaker 4: coach at Winston Salem, you know, whether it's Dave Roberts, 586 00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:58,880 Speaker 4: but even thinking about John Thompson, thinking about John Cheney, 587 00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 4: what role did they play and how does that act 588 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:07,520 Speaker 4: differently from a mentorship perspective. I am notably asking this 589 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,920 Speaker 4: as the white guy he's setting here for you well, 590 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:13,720 Speaker 4: because there's an activism thread there too that I think 591 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,040 Speaker 4: comes into or worldview. 592 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,800 Speaker 2: You could say activism and you wouldn't be far off, 593 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,320 Speaker 2: but it's really not about that. Instead of activism, I'll 594 00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 2: use another word with the letter A, accountability. These are 595 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:31,080 Speaker 2: pioneers from the black community that toiled through the terrain 596 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:36,160 Speaker 2: in a very very significant way, created and provoked change, 597 00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:44,000 Speaker 2: made differences, and ultimately had to confront hardships that weren't 598 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:48,200 Speaker 2: given to the typical person out in this world. You 599 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:49,760 Speaker 2: John Thompson, you have to go through a lot to 600 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:51,120 Speaker 2: get to where you are. You John Cheney, you have 601 00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 2: to go through a lot to get to where you are. 602 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:54,960 Speaker 2: And for me to be in a position that, I mean, 603 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,840 Speaker 2: let's not forget Sunny Hill in Philadelphia. Can't forget him, 604 00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:02,400 Speaker 2: Can't forget Rob King, former editor at the Philadelphia Enquirer, 605 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 2: the Great Bryant Gumble and the path that he paid. 606 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 2: I grew up admiring Ed Bradley, although I didn't have 607 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:10,400 Speaker 2: the pleasure of meeting him. God Rest the soul. Former 608 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:15,800 Speaker 2: sixty Minutes reporter. You see iconic figures that come from 609 00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:20,400 Speaker 2: your community. There's a standard they established and when they 610 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,720 Speaker 2: come to you and they approach you and they're talking 611 00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:25,880 Speaker 2: to you about things, here's what you have to remember. 612 00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 2: They're talking to you for a reason because they believe. 613 00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 3: You have the potential to do and accomplish the things 614 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 3: similar to what they did. 615 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 2: And they're letting you know. There's a responsibility that comes 616 00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 2: with it. There's an expectation. You know, Reverend Jackson came 617 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:44,959 Speaker 2: up to me with that one time. Al Shopton came 618 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:46,480 Speaker 2: up to me with that one time. I got a 619 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:48,840 Speaker 2: call from Barack Obama one time that came. You know, 620 00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 2: throughout the years, you see people coming up to you, 621 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 2: and it's something in my mind that I appreciate greatly 622 00:31:56,920 --> 00:32:00,520 Speaker 2: because it reminds me that it's not just about me. 623 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:04,680 Speaker 3: Excuse me, You're here, be mission minded. You ain't here 624 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:06,520 Speaker 3: for just to check. You ain't here just to do 625 00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 3: a good job and go home. You don't get to 626 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:11,720 Speaker 3: do that because you have the power to influence lives. 627 00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:15,240 Speaker 2: Therefore, you have a responsibility to strive to do so 628 00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:16,400 Speaker 2: in a very positive way. 629 00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 3: And if it's with a hard, hard truth, so be it. 630 00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:23,720 Speaker 3: But you're doing it for the right reasons. And so 631 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:25,240 Speaker 3: to me, that's the difference. 632 00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:28,280 Speaker 2: And I've often said this because there are white individuals 633 00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:30,520 Speaker 2: that I've looked up to, that I've admired for many, 634 00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:33,000 Speaker 2: many years, and that I've talked to on a constant 635 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:36,120 Speaker 2: basis that's given me advice, counsel tools. One of those 636 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 2: people that I talk to religiously that I love very 637 00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:42,960 Speaker 2: dearly is Bob Iger. You know, I don't, I have never, 638 00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:49,240 Speaker 2: nor will I ever ask Bob Iger for anything but advice. 639 00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 3: You do not leverage relationships like that. 640 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,400 Speaker 2: This man and what he did to take me under 641 00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:01,280 Speaker 2: his wing, to care about me enough just to give 642 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,360 Speaker 2: me guidance. Okay, it was a big thing. He didn't 643 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:06,960 Speaker 2: have to do that. I'm not gonna I could leave 644 00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:10,640 Speaker 2: ESPN this year. I got nothing negative to say about 645 00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:10,960 Speaker 2: that man. 646 00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:11,600 Speaker 3: That's my guy. 647 00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:14,120 Speaker 5: Kind of advice that Bob give you, he gave me. 648 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,080 Speaker 3: A boatload of advice. He also told you. 649 00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,880 Speaker 2: You reminded me about the importance of business, not to 650 00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:21,719 Speaker 2: take things personal, to educate yourself about what you need 651 00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,320 Speaker 2: to educate yourself about, so you don't take things personally, 652 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:27,800 Speaker 2: so you don't personalize it in a fashion that compromises 653 00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:31,560 Speaker 2: your ability to perform. And then also understanding you don't 654 00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:34,240 Speaker 2: always have to give into this need to fight every 655 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:38,520 Speaker 2: battle and to come out swinging. You don't take relationships 656 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:41,680 Speaker 2: like that and leverage that for something more. You do 657 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:45,720 Speaker 2: what you do because other opportunities will always be available 658 00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:47,520 Speaker 2: to you when you're learning. 659 00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:48,320 Speaker 3: From wise individuals. 660 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,320 Speaker 5: StepN and I know you've interviewed everyone from like Michael 661 00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:55,640 Speaker 5: to Magic as a young black man coming up, watching 662 00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:58,360 Speaker 5: these guys from Afar, writing about them in Philly and 663 00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 5: the Ally News. What are some of the people that 664 00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:04,800 Speaker 5: you've admired, that have given you advice, and that you 665 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:06,880 Speaker 5: sound like Michael Jordan and Kobe when you're talking about 666 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:07,760 Speaker 5: I want to be number one? 667 00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:09,479 Speaker 3: But how did they influence you? 668 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:12,120 Speaker 5: Both from Afar and now it's friends or mentors. 669 00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 2: Well, when you're great, when you speak, folks have no 670 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:19,239 Speaker 2: choice but to listen if they want to win. And 671 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:23,239 Speaker 2: you know you're sitting here doing this podcast. Here's the 672 00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:26,360 Speaker 2: reality of the situation. No matter what you've been through, 673 00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 2: there's no doubt that greatness was in your career. So 674 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:32,880 Speaker 2: when you suit it down, I'm sitting in Minnesota with you. 675 00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:35,000 Speaker 3: You got your black suit on you. I'm like this 676 00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:37,640 Speaker 3: brother's an owner for the NBA team, you know, saying 677 00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:39,719 Speaker 3: is going to own an NBA team. 678 00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:43,200 Speaker 2: I'm loving this right now. Earned not given, you know, 679 00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:46,400 Speaker 2: because you made smart decisions along the way. Every decision 680 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:48,360 Speaker 2: was wrong. You made a lot of wise decisions, a 681 00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,920 Speaker 2: lot of smart decisions. The Kobe's of the world, the 682 00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:54,240 Speaker 2: Mjs of the world, I mean. 683 00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:57,560 Speaker 3: People like that. You just watch guys and you watch 684 00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:03,240 Speaker 3: them work, and most of the I'm watching rather than asking, 685 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,120 Speaker 3: because I'm a pretty keen observer. 686 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 2: And so when I think about a guy like Kobe 687 00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:15,520 Speaker 2: two thousand and two thousand and five, two thousand and six, 688 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:19,480 Speaker 2: Kobe Bryant trial and stuff is over. He settles the case, 689 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:23,680 Speaker 2: he's back, he's playing ball, never stopped, and he's doing interviews. 690 00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:25,759 Speaker 2: You know, he's still talking to people after games and 691 00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:28,120 Speaker 2: stuff like that. But he never sat down and gave 692 00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:30,719 Speaker 2: it one on one to anybody. And then he gave 693 00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:33,560 Speaker 2: it to me. And he comes into the quite frankly 694 00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:35,759 Speaker 2: studios that's the name of the show back into on 695 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:37,920 Speaker 2: ESPN two from two thousand and five to two thousand 696 00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,759 Speaker 2: and seven, and I was sitting there like, like, yo, man, 697 00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:45,279 Speaker 2: people like my interviews, they like to said, they telling me, 698 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:50,160 Speaker 2: you know, I'd be like Oprah. And his exact words was, 699 00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:57,880 Speaker 2: f Oprah harpo. I don't want to hear Oprah again. 700 00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:01,760 Speaker 2: You insult her when when you say. 701 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:08,480 Speaker 3: Oprah harpo, she owns the Oprah Winfrey Show, she. 702 00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:12,319 Speaker 2: Owns her own brand. That's what I want for you 703 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:15,440 Speaker 2: one day. And that's what he said to me, which 704 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,920 Speaker 2: is why, even though I loved him so much and 705 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 2: we were pretty tight for a media member to a player, 706 00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:23,880 Speaker 2: it broke my heart when he passed away in that 707 00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:27,280 Speaker 2: helicopter accident because I was with him three weeks earlier 708 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:30,480 Speaker 2: on New Year's Eve, hugged one another, talked with one another. 709 00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:33,640 Speaker 2: We were partying together at New Year's Eve and we 710 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:38,880 Speaker 2: were talking about doing something together for ESPN because he 711 00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:41,360 Speaker 2: knew that I was about to start my production company 712 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:44,279 Speaker 2: and I was aiming to make things happen. So he 713 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:46,760 Speaker 2: was a guy that I just considered to be a savant, 714 00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:50,360 Speaker 2: just a brilliant, brilliant mind. And then when it comes 715 00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:53,600 Speaker 2: to just elements of winning. What touched me about the 716 00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:57,959 Speaker 2: last dance with Michael Jordan was that Michael Jordan said 717 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,000 Speaker 2: things in the last dance that Michael Jordan had been 718 00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:01,040 Speaker 2: telling me for years. 719 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:04,880 Speaker 3: And so I'm watching him and he was like, you 720 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:06,399 Speaker 3: might have and the. 721 00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,000 Speaker 2: Part where he got really, really emotional and he called 722 00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:11,480 Speaker 2: for a break and he was like, you might have 723 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:14,440 Speaker 2: a problem with me. That's because you never want anything, 724 00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,200 Speaker 2: you know, he was talking to whoever he was talking to. 725 00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,879 Speaker 2: The sacrifices that come with it. You didn't do this, 726 00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:23,200 Speaker 2: you know, you didn't know what it takes. You didn't 727 00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:24,840 Speaker 2: know what it took to get to this point. The 728 00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:29,160 Speaker 2: sacrifices that were made and I take all of that 729 00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:31,320 Speaker 2: and I look at my life. 730 00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:33,320 Speaker 3: I've got two daughters, I got full older sisters. 731 00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:36,400 Speaker 2: Both my parents passed away in twenty seventeen and eighteen, respectively, 732 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:40,080 Speaker 2: and I've got fifteen nieces and nephews. And there's a 733 00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:44,280 Speaker 2: lot of moments that I've missed. I don't have regrets 734 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:48,760 Speaker 2: about that. It had to be done. We want welfare, 735 00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:53,040 Speaker 2: government cheese and bread, then spend long in it, but 736 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:54,960 Speaker 2: we starved. I know what rats and roaches in the 737 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,239 Speaker 2: house look like. I know what it's like to open 738 00:37:57,280 --> 00:38:01,080 Speaker 2: the refrigerator and they'd be absolutely positively nothing in there. 739 00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:05,200 Speaker 3: I know what it's like to walk around starving. 740 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:11,000 Speaker 2: I know I've been there, and I'm like, I'm never 741 00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:16,319 Speaker 2: going back. And my daughters will never experience that, and 742 00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:19,480 Speaker 2: my sisters will are done experience that, and my nieces 743 00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:23,520 Speaker 2: and nephews ain't experience that. Whatever I gotta do to 744 00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:29,080 Speaker 2: be great enough to ensure that we don't have those concerns, 745 00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:32,879 Speaker 2: I will do. And if that means that they get 746 00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:35,600 Speaker 2: to spend Christmas and Thanksgiving together. But I gotta be 747 00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:38,279 Speaker 2: on the road at work. I gotta be traveling, I 748 00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:42,080 Speaker 2: gotta be at a game. I gotta sacrifice time, that 749 00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:45,600 Speaker 2: family time. Yes, it hurts, No, I don't like it, 750 00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:49,760 Speaker 2: but I know what the alternative is in my world, 751 00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,880 Speaker 2: and the alternative has always been something unacceptable for me, 752 00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:57,200 Speaker 2: and I'm just not going there. So it's a decision 753 00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,399 Speaker 2: I made a long time ago and I don't look 754 00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 2: back from them. 755 00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:03,640 Speaker 4: And to that end, you know, as Alex has alluded to, 756 00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:07,920 Speaker 4: you're in the verge of being almost certainly the highest 757 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:11,960 Speaker 4: paid sports commentator in the business. In your book, you 758 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:15,759 Speaker 4: talk about your late brother. He visualized that for you. 759 00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:17,279 Speaker 4: He manifested it. 760 00:39:17,560 --> 00:39:19,319 Speaker 3: He visualized it two months before he died. 761 00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:23,040 Speaker 4: You manifested it. So as you think about that, I 762 00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 4: know you think about him a lot. And what's happened 763 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:29,120 Speaker 4: in those intervening years. Were you always confident this is 764 00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:30,000 Speaker 4: where it would end up? 765 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:30,600 Speaker 3: Oh? 766 00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:33,200 Speaker 2: No, I wasn't confident that it would end up where 767 00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:37,279 Speaker 2: I am today. I thought that I would be successful. 768 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:40,320 Speaker 2: I thought that I would be pretty good, if not great. 769 00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:44,120 Speaker 2: I thought that you would respect me, you would see me, 770 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:47,720 Speaker 2: you would know me. But I never thought I would 771 00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:50,520 Speaker 2: be in the position that I'm in right now. I'm 772 00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:54,160 Speaker 2: in a position right now where I literally, I mean, 773 00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:55,600 Speaker 2: I tell him. 774 00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:56,160 Speaker 3: I just I did. 775 00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,239 Speaker 2: My pastor has a podcast, and he had Beyond the 776 00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:03,120 Speaker 2: other day. It's always nervous being around him because I'm 777 00:40:03,160 --> 00:40:03,799 Speaker 2: trying to get there. 778 00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:07,640 Speaker 3: You know, I'm trying to get there. I'm not quite 779 00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:11,320 Speaker 3: there yet, but I'm like past I'm trying. I'm really trying, 780 00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:11,600 Speaker 3: you know. 781 00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:15,760 Speaker 2: And he's known me for thirty years and knows everything 782 00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:18,759 Speaker 2: about my life inside and out because he's my spiritual father, 783 00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:20,600 Speaker 2: and I confide in him about a lot of things. 784 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:24,200 Speaker 3: Thinking about your question, he asked me the same thing, 785 00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:24,520 Speaker 3: and I. 786 00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:27,080 Speaker 2: Said, I knew I'd be successful, but I didn't know 787 00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 2: this would happen. Yeah, we talk about I could be 788 00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:35,680 Speaker 2: the highest paid. Well, let's talk about that for a second. 789 00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:39,520 Speaker 2: ESPN has done nothing wrong to me in that regard. 790 00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:42,920 Speaker 2: When I signed my contract years ago, I was the 791 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:43,560 Speaker 2: highest paid. 792 00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:48,200 Speaker 3: Then, Yep, they treated me right. Things just happened, you know. 793 00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:52,120 Speaker 3: Other folks came down the pike. Pat McAfee, Kick and Tail. 794 00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:56,960 Speaker 2: In the YouTube stratospy over two million hours, built the 795 00:40:57,000 --> 00:40:58,720 Speaker 2: show over seven years. 796 00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:02,560 Speaker 3: He deserved, That's what he got. Troy Aikman and Joe 797 00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:06,160 Speaker 3: Buck are institutions. They deserve. 798 00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:08,880 Speaker 2: What I mean, I can't even express to you what 799 00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,560 Speaker 2: it is to have them. Troy Aikman, I respect the 800 00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:13,200 Speaker 2: hell out of Joe Buck, but I don't really know him. 801 00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:15,720 Speaker 2: I love me some Troy Achman. That's my that's my brother. 802 00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:18,440 Speaker 2: I love Troy Aikman, you know. And he's phenomenal. 803 00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 3: You know. 804 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:21,000 Speaker 2: You think Kirk Kurbs, she's been there for years. You 805 00:41:21,040 --> 00:41:22,799 Speaker 2: think all of these other guys, they've been there for years. 806 00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:26,359 Speaker 2: It was their turn. The only reason I ever asked, 807 00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:29,439 Speaker 2: I answered any questions about me being the highest paid. 808 00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:34,200 Speaker 2: It was me saying, hello, it's my turn. You know, 809 00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:37,600 Speaker 2: my contract's coming up. I've been number one. I was 810 00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:39,480 Speaker 2: number one then, I'm still number one now. 811 00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:40,399 Speaker 3: It ain't too many dudes. 812 00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:42,440 Speaker 2: It's fifty six years of age, twenty years in the 813 00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:43,480 Speaker 2: television business. 814 00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:45,879 Speaker 3: That's number one for the last twelve years. 815 00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:47,759 Speaker 2: And when I say number one, I'm talking about every 816 00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:50,320 Speaker 2: week and every month and every year for twelve years. 817 00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:53,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's how I feel. 818 00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:59,120 Speaker 2: But that doesn't mean that ESPN is wrong or Disney 819 00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:01,360 Speaker 2: is wrong for feeling otherwise. 820 00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:04,520 Speaker 3: If you feel otherwise, you feel otherwise, then I'll have 821 00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:06,520 Speaker 3: to find somebody who does feel like I feel. 822 00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:09,680 Speaker 2: And you know, we'll go from there. But the biggest 823 00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:12,120 Speaker 2: thing for me is that people try to act and 824 00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:13,719 Speaker 2: they're trying to pit it like it's going to be. 825 00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:18,759 Speaker 3: Some negotiating war. No, it's not. This is what I 826 00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:19,720 Speaker 3: bring to the table. 827 00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:24,319 Speaker 2: Do you value and appreciate me enough to give me 828 00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:29,839 Speaker 2: what I think I deserve or not? If you don't, 829 00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:32,920 Speaker 2: I respect that. I hope you respect the fact that 830 00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:36,840 Speaker 2: somebody else might. And we go from there. But so 831 00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:39,879 Speaker 2: many times people think that I'm talking about ESPN. I'm 832 00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:43,279 Speaker 2: not talking about ESPN. I'm talking about the business. I'm 833 00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:47,759 Speaker 2: talking about everybody. Hello, we live in America. I thought 834 00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:51,120 Speaker 2: this was capitalism. I thought we tried to inch as 835 00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:53,760 Speaker 2: close to my meritocracy as we possibly could. 836 00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:55,920 Speaker 3: I thought we were about winners. 837 00:42:56,520 --> 00:43:00,520 Speaker 2: If you're going to pay folks, isn't it it's supposed 838 00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:02,879 Speaker 2: to be people who would win for you. They didn't 839 00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:05,799 Speaker 2: pay him to lose. They didn't pay Derek g to 840 00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:07,880 Speaker 2: the lose. They didn't pay Michael Jordan to lose. I 841 00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:14,719 Speaker 2: don't recall that you get paid to win. I've won, now, 842 00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:17,000 Speaker 2: that doesn't mean I can't. I don't have to keep winning. 843 00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:21,520 Speaker 2: I understand the responsibility that comes along with it. But 844 00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:23,560 Speaker 2: what I'm saying to the industry, when I got let 845 00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:25,760 Speaker 2: go in two thousand and nine, y'all left me for dead. 846 00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:28,799 Speaker 2: He thought I was done. I'm not talking about again 847 00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:31,319 Speaker 2: Disney's man. I'm talking about contemporaries in the business. The 848 00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:34,120 Speaker 2: articles they were writing, the smack they were talking, they 849 00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:38,040 Speaker 2: were writing my appetash, talking major, major nonsense. 850 00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:40,600 Speaker 3: And it's okay because you were doing your. 851 00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:42,279 Speaker 2: Job and you have a right to your opinion, and 852 00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:44,359 Speaker 2: based on the facts at that particular moment in time, 853 00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:47,360 Speaker 2: I gotta give you credit for deducing that that was 854 00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:49,960 Speaker 2: the situation and that was your opinion. Well, what you're 855 00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:55,680 Speaker 2: gonna say now, because I'm here, and by the way, 856 00:43:56,040 --> 00:44:01,000 Speaker 2: I'm fifty six and I'm coming I'm not done. Lost 857 00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:04,040 Speaker 2: forty pounds, Calester royal level drop by one hundred points, 858 00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:07,040 Speaker 2: insolent resistant levels from twenty seven to or two, body 859 00:44:07,080 --> 00:44:09,879 Speaker 2: fat from twenty nine point four to ten point four. 860 00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:13,560 Speaker 3: I'm not messing around. I'm on a mission. 861 00:44:13,840 --> 00:44:15,799 Speaker 5: You look like you're forty six and not fifty six. 862 00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:17,439 Speaker 2: I appreciate that. I think I look a little younger 863 00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:19,840 Speaker 2: than that. But say, I'm saying, stevehn At. 864 00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:22,200 Speaker 5: What thing that you know, like Nick, my nephew is 865 00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:26,480 Speaker 5: an enormous fan of you, like other millions young people. Right, 866 00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:29,239 Speaker 5: But they forget Steven A, the writer in Philly that 867 00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,480 Speaker 5: wasn't making millions and millions of dollars. My question to 868 00:44:32,560 --> 00:44:35,840 Speaker 5: you is how much to being a writer help you? 869 00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:40,000 Speaker 5: Being so good on television everything? Because it provided substance. 870 00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:43,720 Speaker 5: It got me addicted to having something to say. 871 00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:46,640 Speaker 2: When you're a columnist, you have to wake up every 872 00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:49,480 Speaker 2: morning and you have to be about the business of 873 00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:53,720 Speaker 2: what is the most attractive story to write about today? 874 00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:57,400 Speaker 3: What will compel and ingratiate you with the reader? Okay? 875 00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:01,520 Speaker 2: And do you have interesting content to provide? In some 876 00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:04,239 Speaker 2: cases three, four or five times a week? Can you 877 00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:08,440 Speaker 2: do that? When they called me screaming a I listened carefully. 878 00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:12,160 Speaker 2: I don't mind you saying I'm loud. I don't mind 879 00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:16,400 Speaker 2: you pointed to me being bombastic and demonstrative on occasion. 880 00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:20,640 Speaker 2: What I mind is if I sense you utilizing that 881 00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:28,799 Speaker 2: stigma to evade or omit my career, Dad, I will 882 00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:32,799 Speaker 2: not tolerate. I was in those press boxes, I was 883 00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:36,520 Speaker 2: in those clubhouses, I was in those locker rooms. I 884 00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:39,399 Speaker 2: traveled on the road over two hundred and twenty five 885 00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:43,160 Speaker 2: days a year covering the Philadelphia seventy six ers. I 886 00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:46,960 Speaker 2: did that and the NBA Playoffs and the NBA Finals, 887 00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:50,239 Speaker 2: And prior to that, I was covering college sports, and 888 00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:52,640 Speaker 2: prior to that, I was covering high school sports. 889 00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:54,200 Speaker 3: I was the one that started out. 890 00:45:54,120 --> 00:45:57,319 Speaker 2: As an intern for the Winston Salem Journal, and then 891 00:45:57,360 --> 00:46:00,239 Speaker 2: I went over to the Atlanta Journal Constitution. Then I 892 00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:03,359 Speaker 2: went to the Greensboro News and Records, where I'm literally 893 00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:08,799 Speaker 2: working from eight thirty to six pm every day doing 894 00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:12,160 Speaker 2: calendar items, school lunch menus and all of this other stuff. 895 00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:15,520 Speaker 2: And then from seven pm to midnight I worked for 896 00:46:15,600 --> 00:46:20,920 Speaker 2: free covering prep sports in the Piedmont Triad area in 897 00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:24,600 Speaker 2: North Carolina. They wouldn't pay me because they had no money, 898 00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,640 Speaker 2: so I used it because I wanted the experience to 899 00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:30,600 Speaker 2: generate filines so I could build my. 900 00:46:30,640 --> 00:46:33,760 Speaker 3: Portfolio and ultimately get a job in this business. 901 00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:35,719 Speaker 2: I'm the one that started out at the New York 902 00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:39,520 Speaker 2: Daily News as a reporter. From April of nineteen ninety 903 00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:42,120 Speaker 2: three to August of nineteen ninety three, I had to 904 00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:46,080 Speaker 2: cover homicide. This is the stuff I've done, so when 905 00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:48,520 Speaker 2: I'm sitting there and I'm looking at people and they're 906 00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:51,280 Speaker 2: talking like, you know, he's loud and he's one basketing, 907 00:46:51,360 --> 00:46:52,279 Speaker 2: he's demonstrative. 908 00:46:52,719 --> 00:46:54,880 Speaker 3: I'm looking at them like, you can kiss my ass. 909 00:46:55,360 --> 00:46:58,600 Speaker 2: Excuse my language, you can do that, because what you're 910 00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:02,200 Speaker 2: trying to do is you're trying to ignore any. 911 00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:04,879 Speaker 3: Race that I did what you did to get here? 912 00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:06,400 Speaker 3: All right, stephen A. 913 00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:09,839 Speaker 5: Smith from New York, there's so many young people out 914 00:47:09,840 --> 00:47:13,880 Speaker 5: there admire you look at for you, watch your journey. 915 00:47:13,920 --> 00:47:15,800 Speaker 5: If they want to be the next stephen A Smith, 916 00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:17,440 Speaker 5: what advice would you give them? 917 00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:20,719 Speaker 2: Be committed to the work and the journey, not the results. 918 00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:26,040 Speaker 2: Forget the sizzle because all that glitters ain't gold. You 919 00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:29,279 Speaker 2: got to be about to work because ultimately that's going 920 00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:32,320 Speaker 2: to be your saving grace, the work that you're willing 921 00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:34,680 Speaker 2: to put in, the sacrifices that you're willing to make, 922 00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:37,880 Speaker 2: the fact that you're not addicted to the glitz and glamour. 923 00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:39,640 Speaker 3: It ain't all it's cracked up to be. 924 00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:43,239 Speaker 2: Keep in mind, when I got let go in two 925 00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:47,960 Speaker 2: thousand and nine, everybody knew, so being known and being 926 00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:51,399 Speaker 2: a celebrity and you know, being this everybody knew when 927 00:47:51,440 --> 00:47:54,080 Speaker 2: I fell flat on my face when I failed. When 928 00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,680 Speaker 2: my epitaph was being written and I was considered done 929 00:47:56,760 --> 00:48:00,839 Speaker 2: in this industry. Everybody knew my name is paraded all 930 00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:05,520 Speaker 2: over the place. That wasn't fun. So don't be too high, 931 00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:09,400 Speaker 2: don't get too low. Be as even keel as you 932 00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:13,960 Speaker 2: possibly can. Exercise humility, have that in a confidence, because 933 00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:15,360 Speaker 2: they're gonna come to you and they're gonna try to 934 00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:18,680 Speaker 2: break you down. Because, especially in this day and age, 935 00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:22,040 Speaker 2: with the advent of social media and everybody feeling like 936 00:48:22,120 --> 00:48:26,280 Speaker 2: they have a voice, criticism is more prevalent than ever before. 937 00:48:27,560 --> 00:48:30,919 Speaker 2: We have to understand it in today's society on far 938 00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:36,799 Speaker 2: too many occasions, folks, definition of success is bringing you 939 00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:40,040 Speaker 2: down to dare level because they can't elevate. 940 00:48:39,640 --> 00:48:40,640 Speaker 3: Themselves to yours. 941 00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:44,600 Speaker 2: And when you understand that, and then you be about 942 00:48:44,600 --> 00:48:47,800 Speaker 2: the business of doing your job, mastering your craft, and 943 00:48:47,880 --> 00:48:50,439 Speaker 2: committing yourself to being the best at what you do 944 00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:55,080 Speaker 2: on an everyday basis. Every day is a new day. 945 00:48:55,160 --> 00:48:57,719 Speaker 2: You got to get up and do it again. When 946 00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:01,000 Speaker 2: you commit yourself to that, you're on your way. If 947 00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:03,600 Speaker 2: you're looking for shortcuts, just get out the way now 948 00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:05,640 Speaker 2: because you ain't going So you ain't gonna win. If 949 00:49:05,680 --> 00:49:07,120 Speaker 2: you look at for shortcuts, you ain't gonna win. 950 00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:11,239 Speaker 3: You will fall love that. Thank you very much, Thank 951 00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:12,759 Speaker 3: you so much. I appreciate it. 952 00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:24,759 Speaker 1: The Deal is a production from Bloomberg Podcasts and Bloomberg Originals. 953 00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:28,360 Speaker 1: The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly. 954 00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:33,000 Speaker 1: Our producers are Victory Veyaz and Lizzie Phillip. Our story 955 00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:36,880 Speaker 1: editor is Sir Dartha Mahonta. Our system producers are Stacy 956 00:49:36,920 --> 00:49:40,760 Speaker 1: Wong and Cale Brooks. Blake Maples is our sound engineer. 957 00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:45,719 Speaker 1: Rubob Shakir is our creative director. Our direction is from 958 00:49:45,800 --> 00:49:51,800 Speaker 1: Jacqueline Kessler. Original music by Blake Maples, casting by Dave Warren. 959 00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:57,440 Speaker 1: Our managing editor is David Ravella. Our executive producers are 960 00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:02,920 Speaker 1: Sage Bauman, Jason Kelly, Adam Miski, Brendon Newnam, Kelly Laferrier, 961 00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:09,600 Speaker 1: Ashley Hoenig, Trey Shallowhorn, Kyle Kramer, and Andrew Barden. Additional 962 00:50:09,600 --> 00:50:14,279 Speaker 1: support from Rachel Scarmzino, Elena Los Angeles, Anna Masarakis and 963 00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:19,280 Speaker 1: Randall Williams. Joshua Devo is our director of photography. Camera 964 00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:24,200 Speaker 1: operation by Jesse Riddner Billy Boyerman and Natasha Abelard. Our 965 00:50:24,239 --> 00:50:27,200 Speaker 1: gaffer is Rob Hilcox, and our grip is Pronoy Jacob. 966 00:50:27,680 --> 00:50:31,560 Speaker 1: Our production assistant is Diana Colung. Alex Eicanis is our 967 00:50:31,640 --> 00:50:35,400 Speaker 1: video editor. You can also watch the Deal on Bloomberger 968 00:50:35,480 --> 00:50:39,840 Speaker 1: Visuals YouTube and Bloomberg Television. Subscribe to the Deal wherever 969 00:50:39,880 --> 00:50:42,800 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening.