Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media.
Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to Cool People who did cool stuff,
Speaker 2: which is sometimes about cool people who did cool stuff,
Speaker 2: but is currently about complicated people who did interesting stuff.
Speaker 2: I'm your host, Murder Kiljoy, and my guest is Miriam. Hi, Miriam,
Speaker 2: Hi are you today? That's totally a different day than
Speaker 2: the previous day, because obviously we recorded on different days.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm having a really different day than it was
Speaker 3: the last time that we talked.
Speaker 2: Sophie is our producer. Hi, Sophie, Hi.
Speaker 1: I'm still drinking my questionably colored electrolyte drink.
Speaker 2: It's lasted you days days. Yeah. For anyone who can't see,
Speaker 2: which is everyone except the three of us, because mercifully
Speaker 2: this is not a video podcast. Sophie is currently drinking
Speaker 2: a I was trying to come something more clever than
Speaker 2: it is. It just looks like pee, that's what's happening.
Speaker 3: Yeah, aesthetically this drink.
Speaker 2: But it seems like it probably tastes good. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: don't know.
Speaker 3: It's taken her three days to drink it.
Speaker 2: That's true, but that parts, well, that's not true. That's
Speaker 2: the part that's the lie, that's the bit we're doing.
Speaker 2: But part of the not bit, but instead my weird
Speaker 2: thing where I have to do everything the same way
Speaker 2: every time that I'm not going to diagnose. We also
Speaker 2: have to introduce our audio engineer, Rory hi Rori or
Speaker 2: hi Rory inter The music is my own Woman.
Speaker 3: I think it's a really good way of making sure
Speaker 3: you don't forget anything. That's what I think it is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly exactly. We are on part two of a
Speaker 2: two parter about gioseppes On Gara, who is a would
Speaker 2: be Well, I guess if you don't kill the person
Speaker 2: you're trying to kill, you're not an assassin.
Speaker 3: So he's a murder he did, he did assassinate someone.
Speaker 2: Well, but but he didn't try to kill that guy.
Speaker 3: Mmmm. True.
Speaker 2: True, So I think he's would be assassin and just
Speaker 2: a regular murderer, yes, and.
Speaker 3: An interesting person who did interesting stuff, we definitely agree.
Speaker 2: Who is wildly sympathetic, just the most sympathetic of the
Speaker 2: person who it's so complicated. I love this story.
Speaker 3: So many bad things have happened to him.
Speaker 2: I know, I know. And now he's in Miami and
Speaker 2: he has a gun. He got ten bullets and then
Speaker 2: because nothing makes sense and anywhere that only has one
Speaker 2: version of history means that it's probably lying to you.
Speaker 2: He either practiced somewhere with the first five rounds or
Speaker 2: they were on him when he was arrested. Both have
Speaker 2: been presented by credible sources.
Speaker 3: That seems like so easy to fact check, I know,
Speaker 3: but for that, not for you if people are saying
Speaker 3: different things, but like he either had five bullets in
Speaker 3: his pocket or he did not, Like this is there's
Speaker 3: no subtlety to this.
Speaker 2: A lot of like records and stuff all went missing.
Speaker 3: You did say there were conspiracy theories, true crime elements
Speaker 3: to this.
Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, all of the records about him disappeared in
Speaker 4: nineteen forty five. WHOA, and then like his criminal record
Speaker 4: in Italy was like destroyed in the war the coming one,
Speaker 4: the World War two one.
Speaker 2: And like there's just like stuff, you know.
Speaker 3: Anyway, I don't think we've even talked about why he
Speaker 3: has a criminal record in Italy. I don't think you
Speaker 3: mentioned any Italian crimes.
Speaker 2: He was arrested having an illegal knife on him when
Speaker 2: he was like twenty oh care and he served thirteen
Speaker 2: days in jail for it, which is kind of wild.
Speaker 2: It might have been during the while he was like
Speaker 2: walking around Rome trying to kill the king part of
Speaker 2: his life. But I'm not sure.
Speaker 3: I mean, I would hope he had a like for
Speaker 3: his sake in terms of his planning, that he had
Speaker 3: a gun when he was walking around Rome hoping to
Speaker 3: kill the king.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but yeah, so he had illegally feoun him. Pie
Speaker 2: served searching days in jail, and who knows, it seemed
Speaker 2: like not a big deal. It only came up because
Speaker 2: they actually spent a while after he got arrested right there,
Speaker 2: would like write, hello, our friend Mussolini, can you let
Speaker 2: us know about this man we have in custody, you know, right,
Speaker 2: And for a while they were like, oh, I don't
Speaker 2: have anything on that guy, and slowly came up. And
Speaker 2: then there's like a bunch of others Joe's Angaras in
Speaker 2: the US and whatever. Anyway, So the closer we get
Speaker 2: to the event itself, the blurrier the details get, because
Speaker 2: everyone wanted to take credit for saving the day or
Speaker 2: knowing something about what happened, or tying him into their
Speaker 2: favorite pet conspiracy about the anarchist international network that they
Speaker 2: think is bad instead of like me, where I think
Speaker 2: it's cool, you know.
Speaker 3: Not to make the whole conversation back to the Sondhim musical.
Speaker 3: But the song about Zangara in the show is called
Speaker 3: How I Saved Roosevelt, And it's a crowd song where
Speaker 3: every single person is telling like how the story is
Speaker 3: really about them.
Speaker 2: That is very accurate.
Speaker 3: Yes, he's a good writer, Stephen Sondheim. But like everybody
Speaker 3: is talking about like, oh, he tried to push in
Speaker 3: front of me and I made him to go stand
Speaker 3: at the back. And then somebody else is like I
Speaker 3: saw him getting up on the chair and I pushed him,
Speaker 3: you know, like everybody has their own little thing. And
Speaker 3: then is like basically talk about this story is really
Speaker 3: about me, while he just like screams in anguish and
Speaker 3: is ignored.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's actually just pretty directly like those two exact
Speaker 2: things are going to happen well, or people will claim
Speaker 2: they happened.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: There's one version of The Fateful Day where Giuseppe went
Speaker 2: and got a hotel room and smoked half a hundred
Speaker 2: cigarettes on the bed while chambering the gun and worrying.
Speaker 2: This comes from the woman who runs the hotel.
Speaker 3: Can I ask you something, You're a professional writer? Half
Speaker 3: a hundred?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Why half hundred. I didn't that that was the
Speaker 2: way the woman described it. Half a hundred cigarettes.
Speaker 3: Fifty there's a perfectly good number.
Speaker 2: Half a hundred carries a different connotation, it.
Speaker 3: Does, doesn't it. It sounds like he had one hundred
Speaker 3: there and he only smoked half of them, and like
Speaker 3: he was trying to smoke all of them, but he
Speaker 3: only did half.
Speaker 2: Smoking fifty cigarettes, it means you were there for a
Speaker 2: while smoking half a hunt undred cigarettes, and means like
Speaker 2: you're like.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is you know, it sounds wild to smoke
Speaker 3: half a hundred cigarettes. Smoking fifty cigarettes is just a
Speaker 3: lot of cigarettes. I just wanted to really do a
Speaker 3: close reading of this moment. Thank you for indulging me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, totally Yeah, two and a half packs.
Speaker 2: They could have just said two and a half packs, right,
Speaker 2: because then anyway.
Speaker 3: Whatever that sounds reasonable, I know, he smoked two and
Speaker 3: a half packs of cigarettes. Just sounds like, yeah, that
Speaker 3: doesn't even sound like anything.
Speaker 2: I've met people who do that. But he didn't smoke.
Speaker 3: Oh great, so he actually smoked half a zero cigarettes.
Speaker 2: Probably he also had a room in town. He probably
Speaker 2: never went to a hotel. Great, this woman has probably
Speaker 2: just interjected herself into the story. But it's also kind
Speaker 2: of a compelling narrative, like you could see they're like, well,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna die today. I'm gonna go smoke half a
Speaker 2: hundred cigarettes. You know, I don't know either way. Nine pm,
Speaker 2: February fifteenth, nineteen thirty three, Franklin and Doug Nope, where
Speaker 2: did that one? Franklin diminutive Deborah Franklin Deborah Roosevelt docked
Speaker 2: and got into a car, one of the three cars
Speaker 2: with his entourage, and they went off to Bayfront Park.
Speaker 2: And if you're thinking to yourself and only Margaret, is
Speaker 2: that place sounds familiar? And there's a band stand there?
Speaker 2: Did you, Margaret get trapped there? Once kettled alongside thousands
Speaker 2: of other people in November two thousand and three, the
Speaker 2: day after you saw Dead pres play at the bandstand
Speaker 2: at the Miami FTAA protests. Well, I looked at photos
Speaker 2: and the answer is yes, I saw Dead pres play
Speaker 2: where this guy shot the president.
Speaker 3: That actually rules. Do you think they knew?
Speaker 2: I don't know. I have no idea.
Speaker 3: I mean, I would hope somebody told them.
Speaker 2: I know, I know they're like, oh, you should have
Speaker 2: been dead Mayor just for the night.
Speaker 3: You know, if they really fucked up the show, if
Speaker 3: they really fucked up the show, then they were dead Mayor.
Speaker 3: It's like, oh, yeah, I missed on that one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so anyway, Franklin, Demetrius Roosevelt, Miriam gave me that
Speaker 2: one in between. Then the break showed up at the
Speaker 2: park and there was a huge crowd. Giuseppe tried to
Speaker 2: push his way through the front of the crowd. Some
Speaker 2: witnesses claim that he had someone with him, most claimed
Speaker 2: that he didn't. He probably didn't.
Speaker 3: It seems like he usually doesn't have anybody with him,
Speaker 3: and when he does, it's often a teenager.
Speaker 2: Well those are the ones we hear about. But yes, okay,
Speaker 2: he wanted to get to the front row because he
Speaker 2: is short, and he wants to shoot the speaker, which
Speaker 2: is obviously a thing that comes up anyway, and potentially
Speaker 2: a guy stopped him from pushing his way forward. This one,
Speaker 2: I kind of tend to believe there was, Like some
Speaker 2: witnesses Zuku Testa this one the particular, like, hey, what
Speaker 2: are you doing? You can't push your way up, And
Speaker 2: he's like, I'm sure it let me through, And the
Speaker 2: guy's like no, you're a man. You can't go anywhere,
Speaker 2: you know. But obviously this guy has a vested interest
Speaker 2: in claiming he saved the president, so right, you know,
Speaker 2: he remembers the story very well. He's also one of
Speaker 2: the people who claimed that the guy, oh I don't remember,
Speaker 2: everyone had. It's like a chart of people who claimed
Speaker 2: to have saved the president and claimed that he did
Speaker 2: or didn't have an accomplice with him whatever. So he
Speaker 2: ends up in the third row. Waiting on the steps
Speaker 2: to the stage. Are all these dignitaries. Since the country
Speaker 2: that their dignitaries in is the United States of America,
Speaker 2: this means it's all the rich people in town, like
Speaker 2: all the business leaders of Miami or whatever, sitting there.
Speaker 3: And since it's like the early twentieth century, they're all
Speaker 3: probably wearing like top hats and like a ribbon across
Speaker 3: their chest.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that says like I am an industrialist. Ha ha
Speaker 2: ha sucks to be you. I think that's what they
Speaker 2: all wore.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Also waiting there is the mayor of Chicago, Anton cermac
Speaker 2: I was.
Speaker 3: Really waiting for you to explain what he was doing there,
Speaker 3: because it never occurred to me to wonder what he
Speaker 3: was doing in Miami ran so the soon to be president.
Speaker 2: The first time I read it, I was like, oh, huh,
Speaker 2: I need killed like an important guy. And I'm like, wait,
Speaker 2: Miami is famously not in Chicago. Yeah, so what the
Speaker 2: fuck was the mayor of Chicago doing in Miami. I
Speaker 2: hear mayor of Chicago in the nineteen thirties, and I
Speaker 2: assume he's a corrupt mafia puppet, right, And Miami is
Speaker 2: almost a sister crime city to Chicago at this point
Speaker 2: with organized crime or whatever. Is what I've infurring. I mean,
Speaker 2: that's a subtext to some stuff I've read. I'm not
Speaker 2: a historian of the organized crime in Miami. So is
Speaker 2: he there because of organized crime? No? Ant In cermac
Speaker 2: is the politician who broke the racist Irish stranglehold on
Speaker 2: Chicago politics. Huh, including by getting the Irish vote. He
Speaker 2: wasn't a like haha, we pulled one over on the Irish.
Speaker 2: He himself was an immigrant. He was from Slovakia. He
Speaker 2: grew up speaking Czech, was a coal miner, and Anton
Speaker 2: grew up working class before he kind of bootstrapped him.
Speaker 2: He American dreamed himself into being a businessman. You know
Speaker 2: and then started exploiting people for money or whatever. Right,
Speaker 2: but he fought against prohibitionists on a campaign of personal liberty.
Speaker 2: He ousted the incumbent mayor by leveraging his own working
Speaker 2: class cred and rousing the vote of the ethnic minorities
Speaker 2: whod been shut out of politics, especially getting out the
Speaker 2: black vote in a way that hadn't been done well.
Speaker 3: And if he was an anti prohibition guy, that means
Speaker 3: that the Chicago mob was probably very anti him, because
Speaker 3: the mob wanted prohibition to stay so they could continue
Speaker 3: selling illegal bootze.
Speaker 2: He did this thing where he kind of ran on
Speaker 2: a mafia neutral platform, but he was anti mafia, according
Speaker 2: to what I've read the people of This is where
Speaker 2: there's even more arguments, right, But yeah, he was. He
Speaker 2: was anti mafia. The mafia was anti him. This is
Speaker 2: part of why people thought that maybe this is why
Speaker 2: he was killed. It is almost certainly not what happened.
Speaker 2: He won by the largest landslide victory in the city's history.
Speaker 2: And his whole thing is anti corruption. And then what
Speaker 2: people claim is that actually he was just as dirty,
Speaker 2: but he was the opposite side. Al Capone is in
Speaker 2: jail at this point and so he wants not actually,
Speaker 2: but people say that he wants or there's no evidence
Speaker 2: rather of the idea that he wants a different mafia
Speaker 2: guy in charge. Right right seems to be a minority
Speaker 2: opinion among historians. I believe that the general opinion is
Speaker 2: that he was anti corruption and anti mafia. He's sixty
Speaker 2: nine years old at this point. It took him a
Speaker 2: while to get to mayor, right, and he's in Miami
Speaker 2: because Chicago is having trouble raising enough money through taxes
Speaker 2: thanks to the Depression, to pay for all the public
Speaker 2: services it needs. Specifically, he is there because public school
Speaker 2: teachers aren't getting paid enough in Chicago. Oh no, I'm
Speaker 2: telling you this is a tragedy. The active duty mayor
Speaker 2: traveled to Miami to hang around a bandstand to desperately
Speaker 2: try to catch the ear of the president elect for
Speaker 2: a second to plead for federal funds to pay public
Speaker 2: school teachers.
Speaker 3: Oh no, that's such a good thing to do.
Speaker 2: It is. And it wasn't a like I'm just gonna
Speaker 2: go chum it up with so and so. He was
Speaker 2: there as a like, if I can get half a
Speaker 2: second of the president, maybe I can help these teachers
Speaker 2: Oh my god. He didn't know exactly when the things
Speaker 2: was gonna be.
Speaker 3: He just like and this wasn't him being like like
Speaker 3: trying to like yeah, forge a political alliance or like
Speaker 3: call in a favor for himself.
Speaker 2: This was like, oh no, yeah, because he was he
Speaker 2: was just kind of do it okay for himself. You know,
Speaker 2: he's like the business guy and like, yeah, as far
Speaker 2: as I can tell, there was an ulterior motive here.
Speaker 2: He was there for literally the thing that just Seppi's
Speaker 2: there for, yeah, that poor kids should get to go
Speaker 2: to school.
Speaker 3: That poor kids should get to go to school.
Speaker 2: Oh no, I know that. This was the moment where
Speaker 2: I was like, oh god, like this is like I
Speaker 2: read this.
Speaker 3: I was really counting on this podcast recording session to
Speaker 3: lift my spirits.
Speaker 2: You know that. I'm so sorry.
Speaker 3: It's always a gamble talking to you.
Speaker 2: I know.
Speaker 3: No, that's not true. I love talking to you.
Speaker 2: It's still like it's a tragedy, but it's like you
Speaker 2: know when we go see Shakespeare for the comedies and
Speaker 2: the tragedies, right, yeah.
Speaker 3: No, it's a poetic tragedy. Yeah, it's a oh.
Speaker 2: And both sides of it are I straight up thing
Speaker 2: Joeppe's on the wrong side of this, but honestly, so
Speaker 2: is this businessman mayor right, like in other ways, you know,
Speaker 2: for anyone who's listening wonders by talking about I mean
Speaker 2: because of capitalism, not because of the anyway whatever. So
Speaker 2: there's the mayor, there's some business leaders, there's twenty five
Speaker 2: thousand Miamians, and then there's Giuseppe's Angara with a revolver
Speaker 2: in his pocket. Franklin Dylan Dorothy Dorothy Dylan Roosevelt shows
Speaker 2: up and he's he's paralyzed. Right, there's a thing that
Speaker 2: wasn't a People did know this at the time. It
Speaker 2: wasn't totally hidden, but it wasn't like it was downplayed
Speaker 2: as much as possible.
Speaker 3: It was sort of yeah, he like like I know,
Speaker 3: he sort of really tried to avoid being photographed in
Speaker 3: a wheelchair and stuff like that, but.
Speaker 2: Like, you know, and he walked with heavy leg braces
Speaker 2: underneath his trousers and I'm not trying to At some
Speaker 2: point I wanted I want to read more about ableism
Speaker 2: and FDR because I think it's very interesting that possibly
Speaker 2: the most powerful American president in history was a was disabled.
Speaker 2: You know, Yeah, especially during a period of even more
Speaker 2: intense and ableism than currently, which is still instead of
Speaker 2: going up on stage, he's in an open car, right,
Speaker 2: so they just pick him up and put him onto
Speaker 2: the backseat of the car so we can talk to
Speaker 2: the crowd. This is part of the like, well, they're
Speaker 2: not really hiding it, they're just not playing it up.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: That was also like that was a very popular way
Speaker 3: for politicians to appear in public, you know, up to
Speaker 3: another assassination that ye fair took place.
Speaker 2: Yeah, before people realize that convertibles is a good way
Speaker 2: to get shot. Yeah. He gives a very very short speech,
Speaker 2: just a couple of sentences, and he talks about he's
Speaker 2: trying to go to the beach. Yeah, he talks about
Speaker 2: his favorite topic. He talks about how he caught had
Speaker 2: a great time fishing, but he figures he gained about
Speaker 2: ten pounds on vacation, and so his first order of
Speaker 2: business once he gets into the White House is an
Speaker 2: executive order of himself to lose those ten pounds. Oh gross, Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's like all he talks about. It's ridiculous.
Speaker 3: Franklin diet culture, Roosevelt.
Speaker 1: I did not enjoy that. I did not enjoy that.
Speaker 2: No, no, he's going to say another annoying fatbook thing
Speaker 2: a little bit too.
Speaker 1: We all had the same face of like, yeah.
Speaker 3: Nobody wants to hear about your diet.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you're ob tessive worry abou anyway, whatever, m
Speaker 2: M no, thank you. Yeah. Actually that's a kind of
Speaker 2: Trumpian way to talk. They'll like getting up and giving
Speaker 2: a speech is like I had a great time fishing,
Speaker 2: you know, and now I'm going to say something body
Speaker 2: shamy like, yeah.
Speaker 3: I think they like, I'm just like you. I enjoy
Speaker 3: phishing and a self deprecating joke is like pretty standard
Speaker 3: politician like way of trying to endear yourself to a crowd.
Speaker 2: But no, you're you're right. And it was over before
Speaker 2: anyone knew it, and Giuseppe was like, oh, I missed
Speaker 2: my chance. And he didn't shoot during it because he
Speaker 2: didn't have a clear line of sight and you know whatever,
Speaker 2: and FDR's aids helped him back down to sitting in
Speaker 2: the back seat. A few dignitaries rushed over to talk
Speaker 2: to him, including Anton Sermac, who was like, Hey, I've
Speaker 2: got some business to talk to you about. Gara was
Speaker 2: about twenty five feet away, and so he stood up
Speaker 2: on his chair and he said, I love products and services. Wow,
Speaker 2: oh you really?
Speaker 3: You jump scared me with that one. I didn't say coming.
Speaker 2: I know that no one suspects that I can't do
Speaker 2: a Spanish inquisition because if I just say the Spanish products,
Speaker 2: that doesn't work. Well, here's ads and we're back. He
Speaker 2: did stand up on his chair. He didn't shout anything.
Speaker 2: He's quiet the entire time. Another woman about his size
Speaker 2: named Lillian Cross, who was almost certainly in the song
Speaker 2: that you're talking about, Yeah, was standing on the chair
Speaker 2: right in front of him, and so he held the
Speaker 2: gun over her right shoulder and fired one shot, then
Speaker 2: two more shots, than two more shots, and then the
Speaker 2: gun was empty. Lilian's face was burned by the powder
Speaker 2: as he fired. And then everyone claims to be the
Speaker 2: hero who saved the day. Yeah, Lillian Cross gets the
Speaker 2: most credit, Like she's the one you're gonna find on
Speaker 2: the Wikipedia page for example. She's actually the Well, neither
Speaker 2: of these are very credible witnesses. No one stopped his aim.
Speaker 2: The spoiler alert, no one stopped him.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no. She definitely claims to have given him
Speaker 3: a mighty shove or something when he Yeah, when he
Speaker 3: was aiming.
Speaker 2: She claims she hit his arm with her bag or
Speaker 2: wrestled his arm up. And then a carpenter named Thomas
Speaker 2: Armor in the British style with a U somehow that's
Speaker 2: important to me, disputes this and says Lilian didn't do anything.
Speaker 2: It was I who rushed forward and grabs Angara's arm
Speaker 2: and forced it up. Zagara's claim is that no one
Speaker 2: stopped him. Well, I mean, afterwards they crap beats the
Speaker 2: shit out and almost kills him. But most likely they
Speaker 2: are both liars or misremembering. Most likely, Zanngara fired unimpeded
Speaker 2: except for the wobbling of his chair that was caused
Speaker 2: by the crowd, and that's how he remembers it. And furthermore,
Speaker 2: of his arm had been held up, he wouldn't have
Speaker 2: shot so many people.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he would have missed more.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And almost every almost every witness who isn't claiming
Speaker 2: that they personally saved the day is like, no, he
Speaker 2: just shot on him. No one stopped him until he
Speaker 2: was done. The rich, little old lady became the national hero.
Speaker 2: The carpenter was the local hero. And so there's like
Speaker 2: a huge fight, and this was a big drama. For
Speaker 2: years the rest of his life, he was petitioning Congress
Speaker 2: for a medal of honor since Lilian had gotten one,
Speaker 2: and he would like whenever she would be on like
Speaker 2: talk shows or whatever, he would show up.
Speaker 3: And be like, Oh, that's so embarrassing.
Speaker 2: I know as soon as he started shooting, the crowd
Speaker 2: dropped to the ground. Reasonable and part of this whole thing.
Speaker 2: I think people were like, oh, someone spoiled his aim.
Speaker 2: How could he have missed? He was only twenty five
Speaker 2: feet away. I think that people who say this have
Speaker 2: not fired a lot of handguns. I feel confident that
Speaker 2: the average news shooter could hit center mass of a
Speaker 2: target in a calm situation with a handgun from twenty
Speaker 2: five feet away after a little bit of practice. I
Speaker 2: do not feel confident that the average shooter could hit
Speaker 2: a target in a crowd from twenty five feet away
Speaker 2: while standing on a wobbly chair full of adrenaline. Handguns
Speaker 2: are incredibly inaccurate, and twenty five feet is not close
Speaker 2: for a handgun.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you said he had he had been
Speaker 3: in the army, though, so would he have had like
Speaker 3: weapons training.
Speaker 2: So he probably had some training. They probably, and I
Speaker 2: can't say this for certain, they probably did not teach
Speaker 2: him how to use handguns much.
Speaker 3: Mmmm yeah, fair.
Speaker 2: Overall soldiers don't use handguns. Officers use handguns. That's a
Speaker 2: good point. And even then they don't really use them,
Speaker 2: they just carry them.
Speaker 3: Well, and he had been thinking he was going to
Speaker 3: be aiming at the guy on stage, not the guy
Speaker 3: in the car, like his plan is changing, like everything.
Speaker 2: And he was going to be row and yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: not standing on a wobbly chair. He also came close.
Speaker 2: The bullets like whizzed by within the foot of the
Speaker 2: guy's head, you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, unprecedented and unfamiliar to hear a story about a
Speaker 3: soon to be president having bullets come so very close
Speaker 3: to shooting him at a rally.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I hate it when history rhymes.
Speaker 2: I mean, are you predicting here and now that Trump
Speaker 2: is going to enact a new deal and save the
Speaker 2: world from Nazis?
Speaker 3: Oh, well no I am. Actually I'm not going to
Speaker 3: put my money on that one.
Speaker 2: I really kind of entrapped you there. So Zangara injured
Speaker 2: five people with his five bullets, and he came within
Speaker 2: inches of FDR's head. He actually for a while thought
Speaker 2: he had injured six people, and he bragged about it
Speaker 2: while he was in Joe. He's like waiting for death
Speaker 2: row and he's like, I shot six people with five bullets.
Speaker 3: That's not a good look, man.
Speaker 2: No, No, Sirmac took a round to the chest, but
Speaker 2: he did not die right away. Mabel gil the wife
Speaker 2: of the president of the power company, was hit in
Speaker 2: the abdomen and nearly died. That was actually people were
Speaker 2: more worried about Mabel than they were about Sirmac. Margaret Cruse,
Speaker 2: who should not have been shot because she should have
Speaker 2: a name that prevents you from being shot unless you
Speaker 2: are ahead of State of the UK.
Speaker 3: Yeah, nothing bad should ever happen to Margaret's except that
Speaker 3: one who you.
Speaker 2: Mentioned, Yeah, exactly. She was a twenty three year old
Speaker 2: who was just in the crowd and she was shot
Speaker 2: through the hand and then another bullet went through her
Speaker 2: hat and grazed her.
Speaker 3: Are you bragging about shooting a random twenty five year old?
Speaker 2: I think he's like because he actually later he's like
Speaker 2: pretty like he talks about how he would not have
Speaker 2: targeted these people, but he also clearly is like, isn't sorry,
Speaker 2: but This is why you don't shoot into crowds everyone,
Speaker 2: you know, Yeah, don't do it. Yeah, A cop, a
Speaker 2: Secret Service agent, and a chauffeur were all woundedly well.
Speaker 2: The Secret Service agent was probably lying. Yes, witnesses at
Speaker 2: the hospital said, the blood on his hand with someone else's.
Speaker 3: Oh hell yeah.
Speaker 2: But he is to this day, or at least as
Speaker 2: of when this book was written, and I don't remember
Speaker 2: when on the official list of Secret Service members who
Speaker 2: were wounded in the line of duty?
Speaker 3: Was he Was he collecting those checks? Was he like
Speaker 3: taken off, taken off of active duty and just sitting
Speaker 3: at home like I got shot for the president?
Speaker 2: You know what though, Like if you're in a shooting,
Speaker 2: if you're a bodyguard and there is a shooting, I
Speaker 2: feel like you could be done. You're like, you know what,
Speaker 2: on my watch, that man survived and I'm done. You
Speaker 2: pay me for the rest of my life.
Speaker 3: Now, if you're at work and someone shoots at you,
Speaker 3: your employers should pay for you to just chill for
Speaker 3: the rest of your life. How about that.
Speaker 2: That's the sorry, that's the rules.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: When the shots rang out, FDR's bodyguard jumped on him.
Speaker 2: The car started to gun off and I think this
Speaker 2: is true. This is very propaganda for FDR, but I
Speaker 2: believe this is true. No witnesses dispute this at all. Someone,
Speaker 2: probably FDR, stopped them from driving away. They stayed and
Speaker 2: helped the wounded instead. Sirmak was put into the car
Speaker 2: next to FDR, who tried hard to keep the man
Speaker 2: from going into shock. As they drove off towards the hospital,
Speaker 2: the crowd attackted Zangara. Someone shouted, lynch him, kill him,
Speaker 2: cut his throat because crowds be like that. Sometimes. A
Speaker 2: bunch of cops tackled him. The crowd was beating him.
Speaker 2: He was silent by most reports. One witness claimed he shouted.
Speaker 2: He did not, Just to be clear, he did not
Speaker 2: shout this. One witness claimed he shouted, I want to
Speaker 2: kill the president. I kill the president. Too many people
Speaker 2: are starving to death. I'm glad I got Sirmac.
Speaker 3: I love how somebody is like yes, And then he
Speaker 3: shouted several complete coherent sentences.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that include knowing the name of the mayor of Chicago. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Why the fuck would he know the name of the
Speaker 3: mayor of Chicago and recognize him by sight?
Speaker 2: Right? He had a picture of FDR in his pocket
Speaker 2: to make sure he knew what the guy looked like.
Speaker 3: You know, people weren't on TV then, Yeah, but also
Speaker 3: people are on TV now. And if you showed a
Speaker 3: resident of Miami a lineup of people and said which
Speaker 3: of these is the mayor of Chicago, there is a
Speaker 3: zero percent chance anyone can pick them out? Yeah, pick
Speaker 3: them out. I don't actually know who the mayor of
Speaker 3: Chicago currently is.
Speaker 2: No, I don't either. Yeah. Cops took him from the
Speaker 2: crowd and they tied him to the trunk rack on
Speaker 2: the back of a car. Huh, strangling him, and then
Speaker 2: cops were like hanging on to the running boards as
Speaker 2: they drove away.
Speaker 3: Wait, sorry, is he like he's like being towed behind
Speaker 3: the car?
Speaker 2: Okay, so like an old timey car is going to
Speaker 2: have that spot on the back where the trunk is
Speaker 2: literally a place you put a trunk.
Speaker 3: Oh, okay, got it, I'm picturing it now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's on top of that. So they get to
Speaker 2: the hospital and then this is my favorite weird anecdote
Speaker 2: of the whole thing. The guy working at the emergency
Speaker 2: room was sitting back on it, sitting back in the chair.
Speaker 2: His feet were up in the middle of the night.
Speaker 2: You know, it's not midnight, but it's like nine PM's
Speaker 2: in the emergency room.
Speaker 3: Oh, nothing happening in this Miami emergency room. I hope
Speaker 3: no important people charging covered in blood.
Speaker 2: Certainly not while you're reading a Nudi mag Yes. I
Speaker 2: love that.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's what it would be in a movie,
Speaker 3: like that's.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it totally, it absolutely would be, you know.
Speaker 2: And then they're at the door and they're like, open
Speaker 2: the door for the President of the United States, and
Speaker 2: he thinks they're joking. He shouts back, tell him to
Speaker 2: piss on the floor and swim under it. Oh my god.
Speaker 3: People don't say shit like that anymore.
Speaker 2: People knew how to be clever in the thirties, damn.
Speaker 2: And then like later in his life people were like,
Speaker 2: did you really say that? And he's like, I'm not
Speaker 2: saying one way or the other.
Speaker 3: Oh my god. See this is the guy, like everybody
Speaker 3: back at the crowd who's trying to make the whole
Speaker 3: story about them. Sorry, but the story is actually about
Speaker 3: this guy who was reading porn and told the president
Speaker 3: to piss on the floor and swim under the door.
Speaker 2: I know. That's that's the one whose story from that
Speaker 2: day should ring on into history.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is the that guy's story.
Speaker 2: What's that?
Speaker 3: Do we know that guy's name or will he ever
Speaker 3: forever be known to history as that guy?
Speaker 2: I think it's not. I didn't write it down. If
Speaker 2: it was written down in my source.
Speaker 3: Well, he's the hero of this story, absolutely, a guy
Speaker 3: who is bad at his job.
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. And so they all pile into the hospital.
Speaker 2: Sir Mac held on for a good while longer, like
Speaker 2: like weeks or something, and the doctors thought he was
Speaker 2: going to be fine. He was in serious but not
Speaker 2: critical condition. X rays, which I believe were pretty new
Speaker 2: at the time, determined that the bullet was in a
Speaker 2: safish place to leave it for while he recovered, and
Speaker 2: they were like, you know, taking the bullet out might
Speaker 2: kill him. They were incorrect. I don't want to be like.
Speaker 2: They were working with the best available knowledge they had,
Speaker 2: but they were wrong. You know. Eventually it killed him.
Speaker 2: And then our friend Franklin Doomsday, Franklin Doomsday, Roosevelt, thank you,
Speaker 2: came in to visit the next day while Sirmac was
Speaker 2: still alive, and Sirmac these are his last words to Roosevelt.
Speaker 2: He said, basically, this is not a quote, It was
Speaker 2: just a summation. He was like, the teachers. The teachers
Speaker 2: are what matter. Anton pay the teachers.
Speaker 1: Shit.
Speaker 2: This is why I believe that he was actually there
Speaker 2: for that. You know, well, because he is no, he's dying.
Speaker 2: Well he doesn't know if he's dying, but he probably
Speaker 2: feels like he's dying, and he was. You know, he
Speaker 2: also might have said I'm glad it was me and
Speaker 2: not you, and those words are inscribed on his tomb.
Speaker 2: There's no evidence he said it, but it would have
Speaker 2: been in character.
Speaker 3: Way less noble than hey, make sure you pay the
Speaker 3: Chicago public school teachers.
Speaker 2: I know, I know. So Franklin Damien Roosevelt comes out
Speaker 2: of this looking like a fucking rock star. He not
Speaker 2: only kept his cool underfire, he stopped his own retreat
Speaker 2: to make sure that the wounded were cared for. And
Speaker 2: then there's like even another moment because there's like cops
Speaker 2: on the running boards and they're like driving away and
Speaker 2: one of the cops falls off, which I think is funny,
Speaker 2: but then they stop and make sure the cop gets
Speaker 2: back on, and so he's like he stopped his retreat
Speaker 2: twice to make sure everyone's taken care of.
Speaker 3: And did he take care of the teachers?
Speaker 2: I don't know. I mean, I don't know. In my mind,
Speaker 2: I'm like, well, he did a lot of like under
Speaker 2: his watch, a lot more federal money went into things
Speaker 2: like that.
Speaker 3: For sure, into education.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I don't know whether or not he kept
Speaker 2: up his promise to Stirmac or I don't know if
Speaker 2: you even promised it, you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but the guy took a bullet. You pay the teachers.
Speaker 2: Pay theseus anyway, and then restructure society in a more
Speaker 2: horizontal way. Yeah. But he proved to a lot of
Speaker 2: the world that he had what it took by how
Speaker 2: he handled being literally under fire, keeping his cool, which
Speaker 2: is good because World War Two happened under his watch. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean he had to kind of get well, not
Speaker 2: he America had to get drag kicking and screaming into that.
Speaker 2: You know. But in all of this, do you think
Speaker 2: that he can this isn't an ad transition. Do you
Speaker 2: think that he can squeeze in some time to be
Speaker 2: a little bit more fat phobic?
Speaker 3: Oh my god, I forgot that you said. The fat
Speaker 3: phobia came back.
Speaker 2: Jesus so that cop who got shot. The bullet ricocheted
Speaker 2: from somewhere else and hit him in the forehead and
Speaker 2: got lodged between his skin and his skull.
Speaker 3: Yikes.
Speaker 2: And so Franklin Dumbledore, because I'm saying negative things about him,
Speaker 2: Roosevelt said, I think this is a direct quote. Of course,
Speaker 2: no bullet could get through his thick skull, but the
Speaker 2: hospital should starve him so he loses twenty pounds. Jesus
Speaker 2: christ Man just got shot in the forehead for you.
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm I'm hardly one to criticize somebody for
Speaker 3: taking the opportunity to dunk on a cop, but like, but.
Speaker 2: When you're the cops, boss, it's actually shitty.
Speaker 3: It seems in poor taste. Yeah, it seems.
Speaker 1: Rude, I know, I know, unnecessary.
Speaker 2: And then after the incident, at his next stop, I
Speaker 2: think Baltimore, he gets met by literally a thousand cops
Speaker 2: at secret Service agents. They're like, all right, no more.
Speaker 2: He only had six secret Service agents with him in Miami.
Speaker 2: They're like, Noah, that's done. You are uh, you have
Speaker 2: a Philanx with you from now on. And if you
Speaker 2: want your own personal Failanx, you should buy one from
Speaker 2: our sponsor, hire an entire phalanx dot made up website. Yeah,
Speaker 2: our new sponsor. We can get money because I want
Speaker 2: my own, and so I want them to give me
Speaker 2: one as a if I figure, if I promote them enough,
Speaker 2: a failanx of what I don't really care could be geese.
Speaker 3: That would be terrifying. A failanx of geese, I would run.
Speaker 2: But I feel like that'd be like the infinite thing
Speaker 2: that Rintrok could just chase forever. You know, yeah, probably
Speaker 2: happy hunting grounds. Well, now I don't want it because
Speaker 2: now I'm comparing it to afterlife and rent trust to
Speaker 2: live for a lot longer. So you know what, cancel
Speaker 2: that sponsor and instead let's just go with whatever random
Speaker 2: ads here they are and we're back. But if you
Speaker 2: could have a phalanx of anything, what would you have
Speaker 2: each of you? I think hedgehogs would be nice because
Speaker 2: they have spears.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just think they're cute and like I like
Speaker 3: the I like the sort of spiky but cuddly vibe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what about like foxes? Does that work in the scenario?
Speaker 2: Oh, that'd be good.
Speaker 3: Falanx of foxes has a nice alliterative.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, totally I used to know what a group
Speaker 2: of foxes was called.
Speaker 1: I don't.
Speaker 2: I think it's called an earth. There's a band called
Speaker 2: an Earth of Foxes.
Speaker 1: A group of foxes is called it's called a skulk,
Speaker 1: leash or earth.
Speaker 3: Hell yeah, I like a skulk.
Speaker 1: I like a skulk. Foxes make some of the cutest
Speaker 1: noises I've ever heard in my entire life.
Speaker 3: They also make some of the most terrifying noises I've
Speaker 3: ever heard in my entire life.
Speaker 1: That's also true, but we're gonna go with the happy
Speaker 1: part of that first.
Speaker 2: Oh my lord, a thousand foxes screaming like tortured people,
Speaker 2: be so metal.
Speaker 3: I would run. I would run from them even faster
Speaker 3: than I did from the.
Speaker 2: But you know who didn't run Zangara because he wasn't afraid.
Speaker 3: That's true. He was a little tied up.
Speaker 2: Also, it's true although literally even in things, all the
Speaker 2: people who kind of hated him and like literally did
Speaker 2: the killing of him spoiler alert, were like, this is
Speaker 2: like the bravest man we've ever seen in her life.
Speaker 2: They took him to the county jail, they stripped him naked.
Speaker 2: I told you that was going to come back. And
Speaker 2: then at some point they brought a woman in to
Speaker 2: take his statement, so they gave him clothes for a moment,
Speaker 2: and then as soon as she left, they stripped him
Speaker 2: naked again, even though the ostensible purpose of stripping him
Speaker 2: naked was to like search him, you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and they've made it very clear that the clothes
Speaker 3: are for the benefit of the person doing the interrogation,
Speaker 3: not for his benefit.
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. And he's wearing just a towel and a
Speaker 2: bunch of the photos taken in his time there's actually
Speaker 2: fairly striking photos because he's, you know, a foot and
Speaker 2: a half shorter than the guard next to him and stuff,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 3: Did Franklin Devin Rose, they'll like stop by to make
Speaker 3: any comments about his body once his shirt was off,
Speaker 3: Like that just seems to be the theme.
Speaker 2: Oh he's really thin. I think I think FDR would
Speaker 2: have liked, would have approved.
Speaker 1: Okay, What's what's so funny is I was like, why
Speaker 1: can't we think is there nobody of note whose name
Speaker 1: starts with D? And then I remembered who the president is.
Speaker 1: I was like, I love that that didn't come to
Speaker 1: any of our minds this entire time. I was like,
Speaker 1: I was like, whose name starts with? Theme was like
Speaker 1: goes like Damian Lillard, okay, Magpie got Dumbledore. I was
Speaker 1: like pretty good, pretty good.
Speaker 2: I was like, who who could it possibly be? Yeah? Yeah,
Speaker 2: no no other D names. That's it. We're out of them.
Speaker 1: No other D names of note.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Donatello, oh, Ninja Turtle.
Speaker 2: Yeah mm hmmm. So at a moment where I was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: of course, and I was like, oh, right, he's named
Speaker 2: after someone, the media hit job against Sangara started. Look,
Speaker 2: he's no hero, but this is still a media hit job.
Speaker 2: It started within twenty minutes because well, I'll explain why.
Speaker 2: Within twenty minutes, the Miami Herald published an extra edition
Speaker 2: of their paper because a reporter ran four blocks to
Speaker 2: a hotel payphone to file a report. And yes, it
Speaker 2: was only this week that I realized when newsyes shout
Speaker 2: extra extra, read all about it, they mean an extra
Speaker 2: edition of the paper, like we've already published one today.
Speaker 2: Here's an extra.
Speaker 3: One, yeah, because something so important just happened that we
Speaker 3: had an.
Speaker 2: Extra which also means that people in Miami learned about
Speaker 2: this within twenty minutes, which is like faster than they
Speaker 2: might learn about it. Now. I mean, they might learn
Speaker 2: about it now faster than that, but.
Speaker 3: They would have learned even more misinformation about it now
Speaker 3: in the first twenty minutes, right.
Speaker 2: And this report called Zangara a swarthy Italian typical of
Speaker 2: his breed. Ew Yeah, it's gonna get worse for how
Speaker 2: they feel about Italians not being white. Not that it
Speaker 2: would be okay if they weren't whatever, It's just people
Speaker 2: are shitty to people, That's what I'm trying to get at.
Speaker 2: Reporters bribed their way into the jail to get access
Speaker 2: to the documents, like just like bribed their way to
Speaker 2: be like, hey, let's see the things that we're not
Speaker 2: supposed to see, and then interview him. Another reporter said, quote,
Speaker 2: his bulging eyes dilate in the dim light as he speaks.
Speaker 2: His hair dark and curly, is awry. His face is dark,
Speaker 2: the heavy growth of beard common to his race showing prominently.
Speaker 3: He stared italianly.
Speaker 2: I know, well, they all wrote his accent out.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's always an early nineteenth and early twentieth century journalists.
Speaker 3: If they didn't like you, they would transcribe your dialect
Speaker 3: and it sucked.
Speaker 2: Uh huh. And it's interesting because I mean it. I
Speaker 2: mean it continues to happen in literature to this day,
Speaker 2: but it started falling out of fashion and people realizing
Speaker 2: that it's usually just racism. But it certainly happened to
Speaker 2: people of color a lot longer, and it happened to
Speaker 2: Italians and like ethnic whites. But like they would always
Speaker 2: constantly write about how he wants to keel the president
Speaker 2: k E e L hmmm. A really obnoxious sheriff did
Speaker 2: the interview with him. But weirdly, the stenographer who came
Speaker 2: and did the stenography for it was this woman who
Speaker 2: actually tried to reverse all of that and actually like
Speaker 2: edited his English to be clearer.
Speaker 3: She was like, fuck off, I know how to spell.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I'm also just like fixing like grammar and
Speaker 2: stuff like that because he, oh interesting, he didn't speak
Speaker 2: with clean English grammar. He could read and listen and
Speaker 2: understand clean English grammar perfectly fine, but.
Speaker 3: He did not grow up in an English speaking country
Speaker 3: and he went to school for two months. Get off
Speaker 3: his back.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he speaks more languages than you. When they arrested
Speaker 2: him and they went to his room, they found that
Speaker 2: cheap suitcase with nice clothes, and they found a bunch
Speaker 2: of books and they were like English grammar books and
Speaker 2: a Spanish like instruction book and like just stuff like
Speaker 2: that because he was teaching himself things.
Speaker 3: Interview him an Italian if y'all are so smart.
Speaker 2: Well, the sheriff claimed to have. I don't believe him, No,
Speaker 2: no one does. Because he did it in English interspersed
Speaker 2: with Spanish words. He would be like that ombre over there.
Speaker 3: Oh my god. More people who should be embarrassed, be.
Speaker 2: Like Mucco, Not even mucho Grazzi's, but like Mucco. Thanks.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: It's like it when you know, when I was in
Speaker 3: high school and like the kid who was never actually
Speaker 3: in class would show up to Spanish class for once
Speaker 3: and like be like, oh I uh nido to go
Speaker 3: to el bathroom?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, totally. Only that's pretending to speak Spanish. He's
Speaker 2: just speaking Spanish and claiming it's Italian. To be fair,
Speaker 2: the way that I got by in Italy was by
Speaker 2: speaking Spanish, but I didn't pretend it was a Italian. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Oh I've had I've had some conversations with Portuguese speakers.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, we're like, look, if you speak a
Speaker 2: Romance language, we'll figure it out. I have a better
Speaker 2: chance with Spanish than I do it English.
Speaker 3: You know, we will figure this out. Yeah, but I
Speaker 3: will not claim to be speaking your language. And I
Speaker 3: will be a little embarrassed about this situation, and I
Speaker 3: will not rag about it.
Speaker 2: Also, Seppi speaks English perfectly fine, and so he kept saying,
Speaker 2: I understand you fine, please just speak English, God Jesus Christ.
Speaker 2: And then like the guy kept being like, do you
Speaker 2: know how to read? And he's like, yes, you arrested
Speaker 2: me with books, you know, like I had a newspaper
Speaker 2: in my pocket, like you know, like he just had
Speaker 2: a heavy accent. Giuseppe spoke really candidly about what he'd
Speaker 2: done and why he'd done it. He said he wanted
Speaker 2: to keel all the rich people who quote tread the
Speaker 2: poorer people under their feet. He said, quote rich men
Speaker 2: send their children to school, and when I was a
Speaker 2: young man, rich men's son went to school while I
Speaker 2: worked in a brick factory in Italy and burned myself.
Speaker 2: He would like show the scar on his side, you know,
Speaker 2: because he's like naked in front of him or whatever.
Speaker 2: They asked what he thought about the president, and he said,
Speaker 2: as a man, I like mister Roosevelt, but as a president,
Speaker 2: I want to kill him. He said, quote, yes, I
Speaker 2: kill president. I tried. I want to kill him because
Speaker 2: I hate government. If he didn't die, I am sorry.
Speaker 2: Sorry I didn't kill him, So if I kill him,
Speaker 2: I am glad. He said he didn't care what happened
Speaker 2: to him, because quote, I'm half dead now because the
Speaker 2: capitalists they make me this way. And the sheriff asked, really,
Speaker 2: I think this first funny. The sheriff asked, do you
Speaker 2: like anarchism as the direct quote, and he said, no, foolish.
Speaker 2: What about socialism? No more foolish?
Speaker 3: Ah.
Speaker 2: Nice. He didn't like COMMUNI, he didn't like fascism, he
Speaker 2: didn't like Mussolini. He was very clear he had no
Speaker 2: organizational ties besides being member of the union, which he
Speaker 2: did not like very much, but he joined because it
Speaker 2: was the only way to get work. They asked him
Speaker 2: whether he wanted to kill the sheriff like someone else
Speaker 2: in the room. The guard was like, well, do you
Speaker 2: want to kill the sheriff? And he said he would
Speaker 2: not kill working men like himself. And so that's why
Speaker 2: I feel like on some level he's probably not like hey,
Speaker 2: I got everyone in the crowd. He just didn't care,
Speaker 2: which isn't you should care? You shouldn't kill people.
Speaker 3: Yeah, just don't fire into crowds. Yeah, if you don't
Speaker 3: want to kill random people in the crowd, don't fire
Speaker 3: into a crowd.
Speaker 2: Right. He said he had not discussed the plan with anyone.
Speaker 2: He had no accomplices. He also said he had no friends.
Speaker 2: He said he didn't believe in God. He believed in
Speaker 2: things he could see, like the earth, the sky, and
Speaker 2: the moon. They asked where he thought he'd go when
Speaker 2: he died, and they meant like, are you going to
Speaker 2: heaven or hell? You killed some people, and he said, quote,
Speaker 2: I go in the ground. Nice fucking goes hard.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: He never showed the slightest bit of remorse. His stomach
Speaker 2: hurt from being overworked and abused. He blamed the capitalist government.
Speaker 2: It was right to kill the leaders of the capitalist government.
Speaker 2: And he didn't mind that he was going to die.
Speaker 2: He said, over and over again, I am right, and
Speaker 2: my life is ended. The Secret Service initially guessed that
Speaker 2: he was an anarchist with connection to groups in Patterson,
Speaker 2: New Jersey, but then they determined that he wasn't. They
Speaker 2: did this huge report. They traveled all over the country,
Speaker 2: they interviewed everyone that he'd ever met, and then that
Speaker 2: report disappeared in nineteen forty five, and we don't know
Speaker 2: what's in it.
Speaker 3: Ah damn.
Speaker 2: I see how people end up conspiracy minded or true
Speaker 2: crime brained, because almost certainly there was nothing of particular
Speaker 2: note in that report, and it matches what every other
Speaker 2: newspaper and witness agreed on, and everything is exactly what
Speaker 2: we think it is.
Speaker 3: What made it disappear like what happens?
Speaker 2: It was like transferred to the White House, and then
Speaker 2: it just kind of people lost track of it.
Speaker 1: That's how storties get misinterpreted. Did people get called heroes, villains?
Speaker 2: Yeah, you name it. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean I think we can say he did not
Speaker 3: have links to any anarchists in Patterson, New Jersey, because
Speaker 3: if they had even found a hint of it, there
Speaker 3: would have been a fucking witch hunt.
Speaker 2: They did arrest a bunch of people he knew, eventually
Speaker 2: let everyone out. That is the main reason that I agree.
Speaker 2: I think that they there were like different cops and
Speaker 2: agencies coming forward to being like, oh, we've been after
Speaker 2: him for years, been foiling his bomb making ring. Of anarchists,
Speaker 2: but it looked like they'd probably just made all that up.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that sounds not true.
Speaker 2: Also, people claim that he'd been working to kill Mussolini
Speaker 2: or Hoover, which is really funny because he had been
Speaker 2: working to try and kill the king, although actually some
Speaker 2: historians have been like, we have no evidence that he
Speaker 2: actually did that. It's just his own word, but I
Speaker 2: see no reason why would have lied about it. Or
Speaker 2: they claimed that he was in touch with the now
Speaker 2: underground Italian anarchist group the New Era. Other people assume
Speaker 2: he meant to kill cermac all along, that he'd been
Speaker 2: working for al Capone or maybe an Italian crime family
Speaker 2: as part of some big international thing. This is whatever,
Speaker 2: but he became a folk hero to some people. While
Speaker 2: he was in jail, people did old fashioned fed posting.
Speaker 2: Five unemployed brickmakers from Patterson were arrested because one of
Speaker 2: them wrote a friend a joke letter, and this is
Speaker 2: the like when I say joke letter, I'm like, or
Speaker 2: there's something here right. The letter was quote with my
Speaker 2: most sincere regrets, I'm forced to tell you of my
Speaker 2: brother bricklayer's unsuccessful attempt on the life of our president's
Speaker 2: elect if I were the one who had the honor
Speaker 2: of shooting at our present president, I assure you that
Speaker 2: I would take a week to practice and make a
Speaker 2: good job of it. It seems a shame to have
Speaker 2: in our midst a man of such poor aim. I
Speaker 2: do believe we should have a place where we could
Speaker 2: all go and practice up on our shooting as it
Speaker 2: looks like an open seat on presidents and politicians. That's
Speaker 2: like a joke, but not a joke.
Speaker 3: It's like not a it's not that funny, no, But
Speaker 3: it also isn't what somebody would say if they were
Speaker 3: part of an organization that was trying to shoot people.
Speaker 2: And like in a clear text letter that they yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like that isn't that just doesn't ring. It does
Speaker 3: not have the ring of truth to it. No, neither
Speaker 3: is it funny. But it's like Luigi posting. It's a
Speaker 3: thing like people aren't.
Speaker 2: Being like, oh I I helped him, but instead they're
Speaker 2: like fuck those rich people.
Speaker 3: I did enjoy all those posts that people made where
Speaker 3: they were like, oh yeah, Luigi, he was with me
Speaker 3: all week and yeah, specifically between the hours of five
Speaker 3: and eight am.
Speaker 2: With bad photoshop jobs.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was that was funny. I surely had a
Speaker 3: good time with that.
Speaker 2: Someone wrote Zangara a letter in code into the jail
Speaker 2: that was easily deciphered by the guards that congratulated him
Speaker 2: on his good work and mentioned some other places where
Speaker 2: politicians that he could go kill. The guy who wrote
Speaker 2: this again just fed posting. It's just nothing changes. Nothing
Speaker 2: changes is the moral here.
Speaker 3: Photoshop had not been invented yet, so he could not
Speaker 3: do a bad photoshop for a joke, right.
Speaker 2: The guy put his own return address on the letter,
Speaker 2: with a self addressed postcard inside so that he could
Speaker 2: hear back from his hero. He was taken to an
Speaker 2: insane asylum where he lived the rest of his life.
Speaker 3: Jesus.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then people started sending letter bombs and shit
Speaker 2: and like threats to different politicians and stuff that would
Speaker 2: say things like I am a friend of Zangara and
Speaker 2: I want to take up the work he failed to do.
Speaker 2: I kill all presidents, governors and millionaires. They were like
Speaker 2: even copying his style of speaking. You know, yeah, I
Speaker 2: hate policemen and kill all your officers who I see
Speaker 2: on street at midnight.
Speaker 3: Yeah there, I mean, it's this is very like, this
Speaker 3: is a.
Speaker 2: Meme yeah, m hmm, totally. J Egar Hoover, the head
Speaker 2: of the FBI. I wrote basically, there's no sign of
Speaker 2: a conspiracy. He'd never been in Chicago and he was
Speaker 2: there to kill FDR once again.
Speaker 3: J Edgar Hoover saw conspiracies everywhere, Like I feel like
Speaker 3: if there had been one, he would have noticed.
Speaker 2: Sure, Jesus Edgar Hoover, he would have done it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: unless he's in on it. Sorry.
Speaker 3: I a while back, a movie about Jay Edgar Hoover
Speaker 3: came out. I did not see it, but I saw
Speaker 3: a trailer for it, and then they introduced the character.
Speaker 3: The guy's like, this is John, He's our new up
Speaker 3: and comer from the Bureau. And the guy like looks
Speaker 3: straight into the camera and goes, Actually, I prefer Jay Edgar,
Speaker 3: And I think about it every time I think about
Speaker 3: j Edgar Hoover.
Speaker 1: So funny, he's so bad.
Speaker 3: So funny, that's all irrelevant.
Speaker 2: And so all throughout his trial he showed no remorse,
Speaker 2: he showed no fear. He was just very clear. He's
Speaker 2: very consistent. And this was commented on heavily in the press.
Speaker 2: Basically he's on trial and then Sir Macte and so
Speaker 2: I was on death row, and he writes that memoir
Speaker 2: while he's on death row. Since the government file is lost.
Speaker 2: This is the single biggest source we have on his life.
Speaker 2: It is written in chapters, some of which are only
Speaker 2: a few sentences or paragraphs long. Each one ends with,
Speaker 2: thus ends the twelfth chapter of my life or whatever.
Speaker 2: Nice when I read from it earlier to be like
Speaker 2: when I was three, I fell in down the stairs,
Speaker 2: it goes, and thus ended the second chapter of my
Speaker 2: life when I was four, you know, And I want
Speaker 2: to read you some of this because some of the
Speaker 2: ones near the end of it. It's it's funny because
Speaker 2: again historians are like, we don't know what he believed.
Speaker 2: It's a mystery. But let me just read to you
Speaker 2: some of this stuff that he wrote that everyone had
Speaker 2: access to the whole time. Thirty third chapter. I will
Speaker 2: now tell you what I think about religion. My belief
Speaker 2: is that all religion was invented by capitalists. They invented
Speaker 2: them so people would respect their property. The Roman Catholic
Speaker 2: religion is the first one to talk about hell all caps.
Speaker 2: The priests do not do anything, and what they preach
Speaker 2: they know is false. They are like sharks working for
Speaker 2: the capitalists and spreading their propaganda and living off of
Speaker 2: the people who go to church and believe them. They
Speaker 2: talk of paradise in the next world, but there is
Speaker 2: no such thing. I believe that a person is in
Speaker 2: paradise when he has good health and plenty of money,
Speaker 2: and purgatory is when a person has good health and
Speaker 2: is working for a living. I believe that hell is
Speaker 2: when a person is sick and in misery, and that
Speaker 2: death ends it all. If I had my way, I
Speaker 2: would put all priests in hell so no one could
Speaker 2: save them. I believe that if all money is burned,
Speaker 2: it would do away with the priest's paradise. This finishes
Speaker 2: the thirty third chapter, and I'm going to read another
Speaker 2: one a second. But like, that goes pretty hard, I know,
Speaker 2: and it's kind of interesting because it didn't go anti semitic.
Speaker 3: I appreciate that. Of course, the shark metaphor really did
Speaker 3: not work because he's like, they are like sharks who
Speaker 3: work for capitalism spread propaganda. I'm like, sharks don't.
Speaker 2: Do that at all. Yeah, no, no, again, Like you know,
Speaker 2: very direct writer, but not necessarily the most polished. Thirty
Speaker 2: fourth chapter my idea, idea gets a capital eye, which
Speaker 2: is actually made me think that there might be an
Speaker 2: anarchist inspiration to that part of it, because the anarchists
Speaker 2: used to be called the idea of the capital eye
Speaker 2: when we were more openly sounded like a cult. My
Speaker 2: idea is just. I was always against the capitalist. This
Speaker 2: is the reason why I wanted to kill the head
Speaker 2: of this government, because the people that run the government
Speaker 2: do not work, and the poor working people have to
Speaker 2: support them. They suck the blood out of the poor people,
Speaker 2: and it is my belief that they ought to be killed.
Speaker 2: The poor support them on their shoulders. They are no good.
Speaker 2: They have all the money tied up. The poor are
Speaker 2: willing to work, but cannot because it takes money to
Speaker 2: make work. So what is the use of having money
Speaker 2: if the poor cannot have any to buy their food.
Speaker 2: What we ought to do is kill all of the capitalists,
Speaker 2: burn all of the money, and form a civil society
Speaker 2: of communism. I have nothing more to say. Tomorrow I
Speaker 2: go to the electric chair to die, but I am
Speaker 2: not afraid. I go contented because I go from my idea.
Speaker 2: I salute all of the poor of the world. A
Speaker 2: Riva Derci Zangara Juseppi, damn. Yeah, he definitely said what
Speaker 2: he believed, like, yeah.
Speaker 1: There's there's not really a lot that you uh miss there. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like not mysterious, not mysterious, Miriam is exactly right, not mysterious,
Speaker 1: Thank you, Miriam.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it just didn't make sense to them, So they
Speaker 2: were like, you're just saying crazy things. You can't just
Speaker 2: get rid of money and have communism that doesn't map
Speaker 2: to anything that I understand in nineteen thirty three, Like
Speaker 2: what fuck you?
Speaker 3: I really do wonder how much of it was coming
Speaker 3: from the fact that it just did not map for
Speaker 3: people that he was talking about killing capitalists and the
Speaker 3: person he had targeted was FDR and that like, by
Speaker 3: the American standard totally that didn't compute.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's a huge part of it. And
Speaker 2: so go afraid to the electric chair is exactly what
Speaker 2: he did. He marched into the death chamber with his
Speaker 2: head held high. Final mystery. He handed a few notebooks
Speaker 2: to the warden, who said they contained only personal requests
Speaker 2: and they have never been published. They probably contained personal
Speaker 2: requests and which never published, but like, sure.
Speaker 3: I hope at least one of them was like somebody
Speaker 3: punched my.
Speaker 2: Dad, I know right. Guards tried to lead him to
Speaker 2: the chair, but he said, no, don't touch me. I
Speaker 2: go myself. I know, fraid of electric chair. I show you.
Speaker 2: I go sit down all by myself. And he went
Speaker 2: to the chair and he hesitated, and then he hopped
Speaker 2: down on the chair. One person was like, as though
Speaker 2: someone sitting down at a barber.
Speaker 4: Hmm.
Speaker 2: He thought the chair was already electrified. Hmmm. He looked surprised.
Speaker 2: When he sat down on the chair. He was like
Speaker 2: still alive. So he looked up around and was like, see,
Speaker 2: I know afraid of electric chair. His feet didn't touch
Speaker 2: the floor. Is the smallest person that they had ever
Speaker 2: murdered in the electric chair. They struggled to fit the
Speaker 2: cap to his head since his head was so small,
Speaker 2: and then they put a black hood over his head,
Speaker 2: and he spoke his last words, Viva Italia, goodbye to
Speaker 2: all poor people everywhere. Then he said, and this is
Speaker 2: the only part I'm gonna do where I'm gonna do
Speaker 2: his Italian because that's the way it's written. But I
Speaker 2: actually think at some point it's almost just evocative. He said,
Speaker 2: push it to button, Go ahead, push it to button
Speaker 2: and that's uh, that's the end of justep. He's on Garam.
Speaker 3: That is a sad story, fucking tragedy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he is a sick, empathetic character. Who you know,
Speaker 2: He's like, I I have nothing more to say, goodbye
Speaker 2: to the poor people.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think about how we were talking during break about
Speaker 2: how this compares to Leon Shogosh. And for anyone who's listening,
Speaker 2: Leon Schogosh was a He was an anarchist. He was
Speaker 2: actually US born. Everyone thought he wasn't, but he was.
Speaker 3: They couldn't spell his last name, so they figured he
Speaker 3: must be foreign, right.
Speaker 2: Also because he was an anarchist, they literally were like,
Speaker 2: there are no American born anarchists, is what they claim.
Speaker 2: At the time, he killed President McKinley, and he had
Speaker 2: been ostracized from the anarchist scene. He actually was an anarchist,
Speaker 2: he was very clear about it, but he'd been ostracized
Speaker 2: from the scene. People didn't trust him. People thought he
Speaker 2: was a FED. Basically fed didn't even exist yet.
Speaker 3: There had been Emma Goldman had written a letter about him,
Speaker 3: an open letter in an anarchist publication that was basically saying,
Speaker 3: like everyone has been going around saying that this guy
Speaker 3: who keeps trying to join anarchist groups is a spy.
Speaker 3: He's just awkward. Stop saying that he's a spy. Be
Speaker 3: nice to him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think and I've seen this happen in
Speaker 2: smaller ways where people when they when they discover a cause,
Speaker 2: they want to get involved, and if they're socially ostracized,
Speaker 2: they will find ways to act on their own. And
Speaker 2: most of the ways that people want to act on
Speaker 2: their own around certain radical ideas are poor strategic decisions.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think he both believed that killing McKinley would
Speaker 3: be an effect of political act, but I think that
Speaker 3: like one of the main reasons might have been that
Speaker 3: he wanted to prove to other anarchists that he was
Speaker 3: legit right.
Speaker 2: And I think that obviously GISEPPI wasn't in anarchists or
Speaker 2: communist circles as far as anyone can tell.
Speaker 3: And I think also as people on reality TV say
Speaker 3: was not there to make friends, that's true, you know,
Speaker 3: and I think chol Gosh was there to make friends
Speaker 3: and wasn't good at it.
Speaker 2: But I think that they, like I think this is
Speaker 2: a reason to talk about why we need to be
Speaker 2: inclusive mm hmmm, because there's people who who want to
Speaker 2: make the world better for very good reasons, and I
Speaker 2: think that a social direction is a much more useful one,
Speaker 2: one that is socially constructed, one that like we get
Speaker 2: together and say, like, what is a good way to
Speaker 2: make the world a better place. You know, I'm not
Speaker 2: trying to be like individual acts of no purpose or whatever,
Speaker 2: like I'm not trying to make sweeping generalizations here, But
Speaker 2: I just see this and I'm like, I see why
Speaker 2: he was isolated from everyone. He didn't really like people,
Speaker 2: and then he just suffered all the time and he
Speaker 2: felt really alienated by that. But I'm like, I wish
Speaker 2: he had gotten to feel supported and like, yeah, I
Speaker 2: don't know.
Speaker 3: And with chol Gosh, he did this thing. He assassinated
Speaker 3: the president for the you know what he saw as
Speaker 3: like the anarchist cause, and I think to prove himself
Speaker 3: to anarchists. Most anarchists immediately decry, you know, like his
Speaker 3: actions and like said like, oh, this is like not
Speaker 3: at all okay. And then there was a huge crackdown
Speaker 3: on anarchists in the United States.
Speaker 2: And it more or less ended anarchism as ah it
Speaker 2: didn't help the anarchist movement in the US.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. It really harmed the anarchist movement in the US,
Speaker 3: and it, you know, was not strategic. Yeah, and you know,
Speaker 3: and of course he was executed too. And like, had
Speaker 3: he found a community when he showed up looking for
Speaker 3: an anarchist community, I think that that would have gone
Speaker 3: really differently totally, because he very obviously did not sit
Speaker 3: down with anybody else and say like, so I'm thinking
Speaker 3: of killing McKinley. Yeah, And I think if he had,
Speaker 3: and he had had people like who had his and
Speaker 3: the movement's best interests at heart, they would have been like, hey,
Speaker 3: I no, that's not a great idea. Why don't you
Speaker 3: help organize industrial workers?
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally, because it's like most of the time the
Speaker 2: things that actually changed things are less glamorous and more
Speaker 2: work and like involve working with people.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I don't know, but there's always work for
Speaker 3: the client guy who's not good at working with people too.
Speaker 3: You know, everybody else is out there organizing factory workers
Speaker 3: and somebody needs to take notes, you.
Speaker 2: Know, No, totally, and it's like there's still ways to
Speaker 2: be And I say, this is like I live alone
Speaker 2: on a mountain, you know, by choice. Yeah, my favorite
Speaker 2: person is my dog, and like you all are great too,
Speaker 2: but I can't.
Speaker 3: I can't compare to rentro We know your dog is phenomenal, we.
Speaker 2: Know, yeah, And so there is a place for the introvert.
Speaker 2: There is a place for the people who like And
Speaker 2: most of my work is self directed, but I see
Speaker 2: it within this larger framework, and it is a terrible
Speaker 2: I'm not trying to make one to one comparisons here,
Speaker 2: and especially right now, I'd be terrified too, but you know,
Speaker 2: and and Zangara also he isn't show gosh right, he's
Speaker 2: but he's more of just like a person who organically
Speaker 2: on kind of his own, but probably through conversation too.
Speaker 2: Like it's probably something that was in the air hit upon.
Speaker 2: Capitalism is the problem rich kids getting to go to
Speaker 2: school while I'm digging dirt by the side of the
Speaker 2: road when I'm five years old is a problem. And
Speaker 2: he had no particular interest in continuing to live because
Speaker 2: of the misery that he felt he had been put
Speaker 2: into by capitalism, and he just wanted a way to
Speaker 2: try to help by lashing out. And I don't think
Speaker 2: it was I don't think it was good. And the
Speaker 2: Shakespearean level of tragedy of killing the guy who was
Speaker 2: working on exactly his issue is written by a cruel god.
Speaker 3: You know, the fact that the only person who actually
Speaker 3: died from his attack was like the guy who was
Speaker 3: explicitly there to ensure that poor children got to go
Speaker 3: to school.
Speaker 2: He would have gone to go to school. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: And that's why you don't kill random people.
Speaker 5: The episodes, Yeah, this has been a PSA about not
Speaker 5: firing a gun into a crowd, a thing we can't
Speaker 5: believe we have to tell people not to do.
Speaker 2: Anyway, I'm sure, actually, I know specifically next week I'll
Speaker 2: be back with things that are more bull throatedly positive
Speaker 2: things in the world. But for now, is there anything
Speaker 2: you want to plug?
Speaker 3: Well, first of all, that was a fucking fascinating story,
Speaker 3: and I'm really glad you told it to me, so
Speaker 3: thank you. I'm sorry I gave you grief for it
Speaker 3: not being as happy as I was expecting. But that's
Speaker 3: like the pattern around here.
Speaker 2: Also, yeah, I like to mix it up, so people
Speaker 2: are always a little bit anxious, you know, where it's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: three quarters of the time you're gonna end up really
Speaker 2: happy and then you know, yeah.
Speaker 3: And nothing else that's been happening this week has made
Speaker 3: me anxious, So I really appreciate it. As far as
Speaker 3: things to plug, I would like to plug the podcasting
Speaker 3: collective and publishing collective that you and I are in
Speaker 3: Strangers in a Tangled Wilderness. We publish books, we publish zines,
Speaker 3: we publish podcasts, we publish RPGs, We do it all.
Speaker 3: It's so cool. People should check out Strangers in a
Speaker 3: Tangled Wilderness. They should even like, maybe check out our Patreon,
Speaker 3: and they should help support the kickstarter for this new
Speaker 3: book by this exciting author named Margaret Kiljoy. And that
Speaker 3: book is called The Immortal Choir Holds Every Voice.
Speaker 2: No, it's the Eternal.
Speaker 3: I'm hanging up right now.
Speaker 2: It is The Immortal Choir. Yeah. I wrote another book
Speaker 2: in the Daniel Kaine series. It's going to come out
Speaker 2: this summer, but it's going to kickstart in March. And
Speaker 2: if you go back and want to hear the first book,
Speaker 2: it's called The Lamble Slaughter of the Lion. I told
Speaker 2: you no one will be able to remember the titles
Speaker 2: of my books, but it's the very first episodes of
Speaker 2: Cool Zone Media book Club, and then I kind of
Speaker 2: want to plug Dinah Wars. But if you listen to
Speaker 2: this podcast, you probably know about Dinah Wars. Dino Wars
Speaker 2: are happening every Uncle's n Media book Club because it's
Speaker 2: been really fun to write podcasts from the future, and
Speaker 2: Sophie's in one of them.
Speaker 3: And the second Daniel Kane book is called The Barrel
Speaker 3: Will Send What It May? I do remember the names
Speaker 3: of your books.
Speaker 2: Well done.
Speaker 3: All three books are great. People should read them, Yeah,
Speaker 3: and like adapt them to a TV series. I think
Speaker 3: they would make an amazing TV series.
Speaker 2: But I agree, Yeah, I think soby.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we finally did the Oprah episodes on Behind the Bastard,
Speaker 1: So if you're like, oh, you've been waiting for those,
Speaker 1: it's a sixth parter. Most of them are out, should
Speaker 1: be all out by the time this or almost out
Speaker 1: by the time these drops.
Speaker 2: Yeah, then that last one will be tomorrow.
Speaker 1: Probably probably allegedly so many parts.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but Oprah has been such a recurring character all
Speaker 2: throughout Behind the Bastards that makes sense. Yeah, It's like
Speaker 2: could be when I finally do Mala Testa.
Speaker 1: You know, also, she's been so relevant for so many
Speaker 1: decks gids.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the excellent podcast Maintenance Face, which would have a
Speaker 3: lot to say about Franklin Dionysus Roosevelt's the best one,
Speaker 3: all right, Sorry about his fat shaming. They they have
Speaker 3: basically done it behind the Bastards on specifically the diet
Speaker 3: culture aspect of Oprah's work, as.
Speaker 1: Has my dear friend Sarah Marshall. And you're wrong about Oh.
Speaker 3: Oh, I love that one.
Speaker 2: There's so many good shows, but you shouldn't listen to
Speaker 2: any of them except this one, except this.
Speaker 3: One and the Strangers in a Tangled Wilderness ones.
Speaker 2: Yeah, those are fine if Sophie or Miriam or me
Speaker 2: is on it, or is produced by any of those people,
Speaker 2: or you just like it, or has Sarah Marshall?
Speaker 1: Sure if I've described somebody as my dear friend permitted?
Speaker 2: Yeah, no Sarah Marshall's grandfather yet, or I guess people
Speaker 2: just listen whatever they want.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, listen whatever you want.
Speaker 2: All right.
Speaker 1: That's podcast, Bye everyone, Bye bye. Cool People Who Did
Speaker 1: Cool Stuff is a production of cool Zone Media. For
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