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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and welcome back to Coast to Coast, George nor

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Speaker 1: with you, Mark Carloto, back with us. An aerospace engineer

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Speaker 1: more than thirty years of experience and satellite imaging. We're

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Speaker 1: both sensing, image processing and pattern recognition. You received a

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Speaker 1: PhD in electrical engineering from the Carnegie Mellon University back

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Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty one and has published numerous technical articles

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Speaker 1: and books. Of course, doctor Carlato contributed extensively to the

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Speaker 1: investigation of the face and other structures in the Sidonia

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Speaker 1: region of Mars, wrote a book back in twenty sixteen

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Speaker 1: called the Sidonia Controversy, analyzed anomalous objects in the STS

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Speaker 1: forty eight and STS eighty Space Shuttle videos, and participated

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Speaker 1: in a recent study of unusual surface features on the

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Speaker 1: far side of the Moon. Mark, welcome back. Good to

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Speaker 1: have you, hi, George has to be here, and happy

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Speaker 1: holidays to you. I hope you have a wonderful Christmas

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Speaker 1: and a great star did the New year? You two

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Speaker 1: so so far, so good? Excellent. Mark, Can let me

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Speaker 1: take just a few minutes before we get into your

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Speaker 1: new work beyond Atlantis, which is amazing, by the way.

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Speaker 1: How did you get involved in the Sidonius story. It

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Speaker 1: was just it was reading the newspaper. There was an

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Speaker 1: article about the face on Mars and back in nineteen

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Speaker 1: eighty five, and you know, it talked about this formation

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Speaker 1: and how you know, planetary scientists had decided it was

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Speaker 1: just a rock formation, an optical illusion, and but you know,

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Speaker 1: looking at it, I don't know. My instinct my intuition said, no,

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Speaker 1: that that that can't be the answer. It's got to

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Speaker 1: be more to that. And so I started digging. And

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Speaker 1: I mean at that point, I was, you know, I

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Speaker 1: was out of school PhD and working for a fairly

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Speaker 1: conservative aerospace company, and you know, doing that kind of

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Speaker 1: thing was like, I really want to get involved in this,

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Speaker 1: and this whole other world opened up, and uh, it's

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Speaker 1: been a wild ride. Tell us what your theory was

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Speaker 1: then and what it is today now. Back then, it

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Speaker 1: was trying to determine whether it was an artificial structure

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Speaker 1: or not. That seemed to me to be the key question. Um,

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Speaker 1: And so that's what I did. I wasn't terribly interested

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Speaker 1: in alignments and context and things like that that others

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Speaker 1: like like Richard Hogeland were UM, but we you know,

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Speaker 1: we worked together and we had a good relationship for

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Speaker 1: those years. UM. And you know, my I don't know.

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Speaker 1: My take on it at that point was I was

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Speaker 1: pretty open minded. It could it could be you know, ET,

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Speaker 1: it could be indigitous Martians, it could be a previous

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Speaker 1: civilization from Earth. And at this point, after spending the

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Speaker 1: last for five years now looking at Earth mysteries and

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Speaker 1: ancient civilizations and sort of where we came from, UM,

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Speaker 1: and started putting the ET hypothesis on whole, just sort

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Speaker 1: of for sake of argument, let's look at some other possibilities.

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Speaker 1: I think it's possible that it was an earlier civilization

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Speaker 1: from Earth, maybe a founding civilization back some dating that

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Speaker 1: I did as an article I posted on before Atlantis

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Speaker 1: UM that actually redes the analysis that Dick Hosan did

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Speaker 1: a number of years ago using star charts and basically

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Speaker 1: looking at patterns matching stars, matching the constellation, the pleads

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Speaker 1: and sort of approaching it in a different way. And

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Speaker 1: I get a date of about two hundred and eighty

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Speaker 1: thousand years, which is like kind of the in the

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Speaker 1: early days of the you know, the early Sumerian kings

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Speaker 1: and this you know, if you're familiar with the Sumerian

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Speaker 1: kings list, it goes back the three hundred four by

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Speaker 1: some accounts, five hundred thousand years ago. So you know this,

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Speaker 1: this is the possible connection between Earth and Mars. So

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Speaker 1: it may not be the remote past. It might have

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Speaker 1: been early in our prehistory. That's so that's my current

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Speaker 1: take today. So you're still convinced though, that it could

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Speaker 1: be artificial. Yeah, and you know it's it's it's it's

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Speaker 1: really strange. I really expected to find more really compelling stuff.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's a few formations that are interesting, but

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Speaker 1: nothing that has really struck me as being any more

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Speaker 1: compelling than the face and the surrounding structures in Sidonia,

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Speaker 1: especially the face. The face is a remarkable object, and people,

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Speaker 1: even geologists have said to me, you know, it's remarkable

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Speaker 1: how symmetrical it is. Well, let's jump ahead to today,

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Speaker 1: where you have been looking at some of our lost civilizations.

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Speaker 1: Your latest book is called Beyond Atlantis, Vestiges of the

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Speaker 1: World's Lost Civilizations. Tell me your thoughts on what you

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Speaker 1: think Atlantis might have been. First of all, well, I'm

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Speaker 1: less inclined to think of Atlantis as a place. I

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Speaker 1: think think of it more as a time, okay, because

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Speaker 1: there are there are stories of ancient civilizations and floodness

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Speaker 1: throughout the world, and tales of civilizations in all parts

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Speaker 1: of the world, including the desert regions. Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: T E. Lawrence, Lawrence of Arabia talked about Atlantis of

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Speaker 1: the sands. We believed that there were vestiges of a

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Speaker 1: prehistoric civilization in the desert, buried under the Rube Alkali

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Speaker 1: in um in Arabian Peninsula. And so you know, I

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Speaker 1: think I think Atlantis, I'm not just ending up there

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Speaker 1: was you know, Plaza's account wasn't wasn't actually correct to

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Speaker 1: some degree, um. But I think there was also other

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Speaker 1: civilizations and other other parts of the world in earlier times.

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Speaker 1: So you know what I do, and before Atlantis is

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Speaker 1: kind of roll rolled back to the history even before

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Speaker 1: you know, ten thousand BC, which is when roughly when

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Speaker 1: Plato said that Atlantis existed, and others like Hancock and

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Speaker 1: Bevall and other researchers have have found evidence to support that.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to go back even further, um. And so

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Speaker 1: that's what I that's what I started in the Before

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Speaker 1: Atlantis and theond Atlantis is really the culmination of that

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Speaker 1: work where I present a lot a lot of evidence

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Speaker 1: to support it. So it's sort of I've been trying

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Speaker 1: to follow the data to see where the data leads,

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Speaker 1: and I'm convinced that there there there's hundreds of sites

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Speaker 1: throughout the world, at point to four locations on Earth

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Speaker 1: that are highly likely to have been previous polls, and

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Speaker 1: you can get into that later. It's there's there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of reasons for thinking that, but again I'm with

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Speaker 1: this analysis, I'm more into the context, whereas you know,

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Speaker 1: in Mars, I was like really sort of focusing on well,

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Speaker 1: is it artificial or not? These things on Earth are

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Speaker 1: truly artificial. They're made by some hands, human or otherwise.

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Speaker 1: So what I'm trying to do now is make sense

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Speaker 1: and figure out what the chronology might have been, how

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Speaker 1: old could the earliest structures have been, and basically reasoning

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Speaker 1: through geometry and climate change using a lot of different

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Speaker 1: kinds of information, sort of a convergence of evidence approach

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Speaker 1: to coming up with some answers that are a little

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Speaker 1: different from what others have been looking at. I'm looking

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Speaker 1: at up that's a lot older. You know, I'm not

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Speaker 1: interested so much in ten thousand, um uh years ago. Uh,

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Speaker 1: that's that's pretty that's pretty far back for most people.

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Speaker 1: But you know, people are talking about you know, uh

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Speaker 1: like Graham Hancock talks about the end of of a

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Speaker 1: of an ice age civilization during the younger Dryest. Sure, well,

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Speaker 1: so where did that civilization come from? So my theory

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Speaker 1: kind of addresses the time before that and the time

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Speaker 1: and perhaps multiple ages before that. Um. Anyway, and of

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Speaker 1: course Plato believes that Atlantis per se sunk. Do you

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Speaker 1: still think there was some Earth tragedies a long time ago? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, there's it. There's so much textual and another

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Speaker 1: evidence suggesting that there was a sunken continent. But y'all

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Speaker 1: just say that's impossible. Um. But you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's it's clear that we know so little about our planet. Um.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there are new theories now about the nature

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Speaker 1: of play techtonics that perhaps it's being driven by the

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Speaker 1: moon and not so much by mental conduction. So, you know, geology,

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Speaker 1: the big breakthrough in the nineteen sixties was proving wegnus

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Speaker 1: theory of continental drift, you know, which became known as playtechtonics,

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Speaker 1: and that's that's a proven theory. But that's not to

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Speaker 1: say that they know everything. So the possibility of sunching continents,

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Speaker 1: I think that's that's that's an open question. I'm sort

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Speaker 1: of pursuing a different hypothesis, but I'm not ruling it out.

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Speaker 1: You know, I don't want to say, you know, it

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Speaker 1: can't be anything else. I'm just trying to open the

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Speaker 1: door to consider other possibilities. Um, so we you know,

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Speaker 1: kind of cover the bases. Graham Hancock's going to be

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Speaker 1: on the program next week, Mark anything you want me

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Speaker 1: to pass on to him. Um, we're all grateful he

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Speaker 1: you know, he started he started this back thirty plus

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Speaker 1: years ago, and you know, it's it's changing paradigms is

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Speaker 1: really hard and it's going to take a long time,

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Speaker 1: and a lot of us are grateful that he's been

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Speaker 1: in the fight and has been pushing us for so long. UM. So, um,

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Speaker 1: congrats to him on his on his work in his series, uh,

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Speaker 1: his Netflix series. Uh. I know it's generated a lot

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Speaker 1: of controversy, but it's also opened up a lot of

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Speaker 1: people's eyes to the possibility. So congratulations to him. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: are you familiar with the work of Michael kremal Mark, Yes, yeah,

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Speaker 1: a little bit. Yeah. He believes civilizations are millions of

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Speaker 1: years older than this what modern day science is saying,

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Speaker 1: and that may echo some of the things that you believe. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, he's a lot of his work keys off

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Speaker 1: the idea of these out of place artifacts he's oop

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Speaker 1: arts uh and um and some of them do go

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Speaker 1: back that far um And you know, I again, I'm

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Speaker 1: not going to rule that out, um, I think. And

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Speaker 1: what I have in the beginning the first chapter of

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Speaker 1: Beyond Atlantis is is a page and a discussion of

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Speaker 1: examples of of autoplas artifacts that are you know, perhaps

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Speaker 1: tens of thousands of years old, and they're throughout you know,

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Speaker 1: exists throughout the world. And this is part of the

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Speaker 1: argument I used to uh uh to sort of establish

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Speaker 1: the possibility that there wasn't a single uh civilization that

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Speaker 1: it was really it was really a worldwide civilization that

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Speaker 1: that's existed for a very long time on Earth just

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Speaker 1: by virtue of the diversity of artifacts, you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: the syropeum in Egypt and the the statues and other

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Speaker 1: um uh pieces of art and looks or you know

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Speaker 1: the Egypt that you know attributed to the Egyptians, and

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Speaker 1: you know the enormous stones at ball Beck and in

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Speaker 1: the Sacred Valli and Peru, and you know the anti

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Speaker 1: Cathera mechanism in Greece. I mean it just the list

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Speaker 1: goes on and on and so um. You know, I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, Michael Cremo was the first to really or

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Speaker 1: one of the first to um you know, suggest that

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Speaker 1: we should sort of take these these art of places,

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Speaker 1: these out of place artifacts seriously, not as not as

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Speaker 1: like mistakes or you know, just mislabeled um samples, but

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Speaker 1: as as true as as as you know, pieces of

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Speaker 1: data that can't be explained by current theories. And so

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Speaker 1: it forces us to you know, re examine those theories

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Speaker 1: and consider other possibilities. So again, you know, these are Hancock,

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Speaker 1: Cremo and others are really the pioneers that have gotten

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Speaker 1: the ball rolling, uh, so that we can hope, we

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Speaker 1: can continue to push the paradigm and you know, look

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Speaker 1: into some new into some new directions. How many past

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Speaker 1: civilizations that have simply vanished and disappeared do you think

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Speaker 1: there might have been? I do it? The Beyond Atlantis

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Speaker 1: has has a lot of a lot of photographs, a

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Speaker 1: lot of figures. UM. It's not super heavy with text.

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Speaker 1: You know, I don't repeat a lot of a lot

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Speaker 1: of stuff that's that other people have written about. There.

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Speaker 1: It's footing out and all that. UH. And it's pretty

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Speaker 1: you go through it pretty quickly until you hit the

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Speaker 1: last chapter and then and then it's like, UM, it's

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Speaker 1: it's pretty dense with with some technical ideas. And one

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Speaker 1: of the ideas there is I look at um at

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Speaker 1: at data. Again, the study that I do is very

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Speaker 1: data intensive, and I look at data and based on

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Speaker 1: the data, I I estinate there's been tens of civilizations.

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Speaker 1: Civilization of the you know of the um scope the

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Speaker 1: magnitude of the Egyptians or the Samarians UM and they

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Speaker 1: you know, they've come and gone cataclysms um UM. You know,

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Speaker 1: a major disruption was the Toba eruptions, this giant volcano

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Speaker 1: UM about seventy five thousand years ago. UM. And this

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Speaker 1: is this is well known UH, and I believe it

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Speaker 1: had a devastating effect on some of the early civilizations.

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Speaker 1: But you know they refounded UM just like after younger

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Speaker 1: Dryas and UM and you know, and likely after the

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Speaker 1: next one. Will you know, it won't destroy everything. It'll

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Speaker 1: be um, it'll be a somewhat of a reset, but

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Speaker 1: not a complete reboot. Um and uh. And some you know,

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Speaker 1: parts of the world will be will be affected more

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Speaker 1: than others, um and um. You know, those places that

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Speaker 1: are more devastated may may you know, the civilization band,

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Speaker 1: but others in other parts of the world may continue on.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I think it's been this cross fertilization.

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Speaker 1: It hasn't been a single mother. You know, a lot

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Speaker 1: of the researchers talk about sort of the the mother

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Speaker 1: or the parent civilization to today's civilizations. I think that's

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Speaker 1: just the last chapter. I think it's it's occurred many times.

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Speaker 1: And you know, the evidence for this is mythological and religious,

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Speaker 1: if you will. I mean, I think we've got to

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Speaker 1: look at all the sources. It's not just you know,

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Speaker 1: science doesn't have the answers. I think the answers are

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Speaker 1: going to be found by a synthesis of science and

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Speaker 1: myth and and you know, all different sources. Listen to

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Speaker 1: more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at one am

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Speaker 1: Eastern and go to Coast to Coast am dot com

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Speaker 1: for more