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Speaker 1: Welcome to have the money. I'm Joel and I am Matt,

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Speaker 1: and today we're discussing achieving balance in a world of

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Speaker 1: work domination. I am so glad that a lot of

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Speaker 1: folks are tuning in to hear US talk about some

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Speaker 1: work life balance. Man, it's something that you it's a

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Speaker 1: topic that you and I discuss, I feel like, personally,

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Speaker 1: like when we're not recording ourselves talking to mark microphone,

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Speaker 1: we talk a lot, even when we're not talking to

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Speaker 1: Mike's it's true, but that's what we're talking about today.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about achieving we're talking about finding that balance

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Speaker 1: and we we have talked about work life balance some

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Speaker 1: on the podcast in the past, but I feel like too, Matt,

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Speaker 1: as we've grown, we've got a lot more thoughts on

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Speaker 1: this topic, as you and I have have discussed together

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Speaker 1: and just kind of grown as individuals. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: feel like there's there's just a lot more nuanced that

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Speaker 1: you and I that we've kind of seen in our

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Speaker 1: own lives, and hopefully we can kind of discuss how

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Speaker 1: we view this really important topic because especially now, where

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Speaker 1: work is like the lines are more blurred than ever

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Speaker 1: before for people when it comes to their work, how

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Speaker 1: they work, when they work. It's Um, it's a problem,

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Speaker 1: I think, for a lot of folks, feeling like they're

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Speaker 1: working all the time, they're on all the time, and so, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's something we need to talk about and we

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Speaker 1: can't like pretend that people can just like stop working

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Speaker 1: or that they can just like that. It's easy, right,

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Speaker 1: but there it's just the chief financial independence. And then

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Speaker 1: you don't have to work worry about it, and can

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Speaker 1: you just do that in the next eighteen months and

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Speaker 1: then you can make whatever decisions you want. Like yeah,

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Speaker 1: that that's, you know, not in the cards for most people.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, we'll give our thoughts on on achieving work

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Speaker 1: life balance in a world where we're gonna work. Really

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Speaker 1: does nominate. But first, Matt, let's talk about I just

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Speaker 1: want to mention that I went to a concert recently.

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Speaker 1: That's that's now that, uh, can I say that Covid

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Speaker 1: is over? Is covid is mostly it's totally over. Okay,

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Speaker 1: everybody's saying that it's over at this point. All right,

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Speaker 1: so I went to a concert. Well, actually, interestingly enough,

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Speaker 1: you had to wear masks at this concert, so that

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Speaker 1: was kind of uh, I hadn't. I had been to

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Speaker 1: multiple shows and that had not been the case, but

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Speaker 1: it kind of felt like a throwback. Yeah, it did.

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Speaker 1: But why is that why you sounds sick right now?

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Speaker 1: Because do I sound sick? You have a little congestion.

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Speaker 1: I feel great. Okay. Well, so I went to went

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Speaker 1: to concert one of my favorite artists and I went

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Speaker 1: with a couple of friends and I was gonna buy

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Speaker 1: some I hate mining tickets online because the fees are

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Speaker 1: so annoying. Like I literally went down to the Fox,

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Speaker 1: one of our big theaters in Atlanta, recently and bought

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Speaker 1: tickets in person just to avoid the stupid fees they

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Speaker 1: come with buying them online. Yeah, I was there actually that.

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Speaker 1: It was on the way back from kids, because you,

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Speaker 1: you were dragging me along. You're like, I gotta make

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Speaker 1: a pit stop. Listen, it was right on the way, man,

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Speaker 1: it was right on the way. So staying in their

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Speaker 1: wedding on you to buy your stupid tickets. That's just

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Speaker 1: the right friend thing to do. Okay. So, but for

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Speaker 1: these tickets, uh, there, that wasn't possible, and so I

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Speaker 1: bought them online, but I found out because it was

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Speaker 1: really close to the show date, I had procrastinated to

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Speaker 1: buy these tickets. I wasn't sure if I was gonna

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Speaker 1: be able to make it and dive into a facebook marketplace. No,

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Speaker 1: you can't actually list tickets for sale on facebook marketplace.

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Speaker 1: I've tried before and they take it down and so,

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Speaker 1: but they have resell people resell their tickets on these

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Speaker 1: platforms where you can buy the tickets. And so I

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Speaker 1: ended up buying resale tickets instead because there were still

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Speaker 1: regular tickets left, but the resale tickets were cheaper because

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Speaker 1: people are just trying to offload them before so they

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Speaker 1: didn't get nothing. So I was like, Oh man, I

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Speaker 1: saved an extra fourteen bucks per ticket by buying the

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Speaker 1: resale tickets. especially. It's just a good tip if you're

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Speaker 1: getting closer to a show you want to see, uh,

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Speaker 1: it's it's not. They're not gonna like make it obvious

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Speaker 1: that you're gonna save money going in that direction, but

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Speaker 1: you can definitely click the resale part of it and

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Speaker 1: at least kind of check and see if there are

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Speaker 1: tickets available to love it for less money. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: love it. It makes sense in this way to hold

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Speaker 1: loosely to some of the things that we want in

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Speaker 1: life like going to a show, because I'm sure if

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Speaker 1: those tickets were Wayne more expensives, like Nah, maybe, maybe not,

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Speaker 1: and if it's sold out, I would have just been like,

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Speaker 1: I guess I'm not going to this one. Yes, exactly.

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Speaker 1: Obviously there's some concerts, there are some shows that are

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Speaker 1: worth putting the money down, but if it's not like

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Speaker 1: a bucket list concert, if it's not a bucket list

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Speaker 1: vacation or destination, I'm starting to think ahead because Kate

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Speaker 1: and I are like we're going to try to plan

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Speaker 1: a little get away and I love the feeling that

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Speaker 1: we're not tied to a specific destination. Basically, we can

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Speaker 1: watch the airfares, look for something that's going to go

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Speaker 1: on sale and pounce because there's an incredible deal that

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Speaker 1: we're going to be able to take advantage of. That's

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Speaker 1: what you kind of did that when number one rule

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Speaker 1: of cheap travel is is to book a deal and

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Speaker 1: then figure out why you want to go to that

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Speaker 1: place right. So I'm glad you guys are doing that.

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Speaker 1: Glad you're able to take advantage of some of those

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Speaker 1: resale tickets as well from that concert with Cherous to

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Speaker 1: see where you're gonna end up. I am too. We

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Speaker 1: may not actually end up flying somewhere, maybe we'll just

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Speaker 1: end up driving somewhere, but I would like to fly somewhere.

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Speaker 1: I realized when you and I I mean even though

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Speaker 1: Orlandos is definitely driving distance from Atlanta, but even just

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Speaker 1: the idea of going to the airport, getting on a

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Speaker 1: plane and makes it makes it feel a little more special.

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Speaker 1: And it's been a minute since Kate's flowing somewhere. A

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Speaker 1: lot of our vacations recently we've been driving, and so

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Speaker 1: I feel like it would feel a little more special

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Speaker 1: to hop on a flight as well. So something to

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Speaker 1: keep in mind. But let's introduce real quickly the beer

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Speaker 1: that we're gonna enjoy during this episode. It is s'mores

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Speaker 1: by wicked weed brewing. This is the last of the

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Speaker 1: guilty pleasures beers. I'm looking forward to enjoying this one

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Speaker 1: and sharing our thoughts at the end of the episode.

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Speaker 1: By the way, this beer reminds me of that scene

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Speaker 1: in the sand lot. Were there for the insmores in

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Speaker 1: the clubhouse. Uh, I haven't seen that movie in twenty

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Speaker 1: five years, probably. Yeah, it's so good. But let's move on,

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Speaker 1: Matt let's talk about work life balance and and how

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Speaker 1: we can achieve more of that balance in a world that,

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Speaker 1: like I feel like it's conspiring to get us to

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Speaker 1: work more and work all the time, even and up

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Speaker 1: until I'm sure you remember this, Matt, from history class,

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Speaker 1: when Copernicus came along in the fift hundreds. Before that,

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Speaker 1: everybody thought that the Earth was the center of the universe.

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Speaker 1: But Old Nick Copernicus, he said that's not actually really true.

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Speaker 1: We live in a Helio centric universe and that means

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Speaker 1: the planets, including Earth, are all revolving around the sun.

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Speaker 1: Now that's just like common knowledge. We learned it in

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Speaker 1: grade school and but but nick, he wasn't really believed in.

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Speaker 1: In fact, it took more than a century for his

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Speaker 1: theory to become widely accepted. And I think, Matt, you

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Speaker 1: and I, we would say that that career and work

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Speaker 1: seems to be kind of at the center of our

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Speaker 1: American universe. And you and I were willing to be

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Speaker 1: heretical here in this in this episode and saying that's

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Speaker 1: a bad idea, and it's not that work can't be fulfilling.

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Speaker 1: You and I, we've always been pro work. That's actually

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Speaker 1: been one of our our our biggest disappointments with the

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Speaker 1: fire movement. Oftentimes there is kind of an anti work

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Speaker 1: sentiment in the fire movement. But yeah, we think it

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Speaker 1: provides meaning and structure for lots of folks, not to

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Speaker 1: mention a necessary source of income to put a roof

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Speaker 1: over your head and keep groceries in the fridge. But

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Speaker 1: when our lives revolve around work, when it's at the

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Speaker 1: center of everything we do, we think that kind of

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Speaker 1: throws things out of lack and that's kind of really

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Speaker 1: what we want to talk about today exactly. It makes

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Speaker 1: me think about when you're driving a car and a

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Speaker 1: tire gets out of balance and you start feeling it

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Speaker 1: a little bit. Or actually with this happened to your

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Speaker 1: bike recently. It got out of true and it wasn't

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Speaker 1: perfectly right bodily and it started out kind of lights.

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Speaker 1: He started hearing it. Uh, we noticed that. We're Buking

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Speaker 1: to get some barbecue one day and it's like, what's

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Speaker 1: that sound? It's kind of like that, that, that, that,

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Speaker 1: that whatever, but slightly rubbing on the brake. But the

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Speaker 1: more you wrote on it, the worse it would get and,

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Speaker 1: in particular, the faster you would drive to right a ride.

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Speaker 1: But same thing is true when we're driving somewhere. If,

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Speaker 1: if you have a tire that's out of balance, if

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Speaker 1: you don't address the underlying issue, it can get worse

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Speaker 1: and worse. Ultimately it could lead to even more damage

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Speaker 1: happening to that car. And I think the same thing

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Speaker 1: is true when it comes to our work. If we

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Speaker 1: just push on and continue to work harder and harder

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Speaker 1: for longer periods of time as we get into our

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Speaker 1: late twenties, thirties forties, I think it could cause irreparable

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Speaker 1: harm not only to ourselves but to those around us

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Speaker 1: and maybe some of the other things that we claim

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Speaker 1: that are important to us. And all that being said,

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Speaker 1: like we truly do believe that that finding that balance,

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Speaker 1: that that it is a possibility. Um, however, it may

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Speaker 1: not look the same for everybody. oftentimes it does come

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Speaker 1: down to your own personal preference and yeah, so we'll

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Speaker 1: talk about how to figure that out in your own life.

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Speaker 1: But the chrushing reality, though, is that Americans are working

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Speaker 1: more than ever these days. We work on average, four

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Speaker 1: and thirty five more hours more than German workers. We

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Speaker 1: work four hundred hours more than the folks in the

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Speaker 1: UK and three hundred and sixty five hours, typically more

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Speaker 1: than the French in a given year. I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: that comes from like our our puritan heritage or not,

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Speaker 1: where it's like all right, no, you're gonna work six

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Speaker 1: days a week, idle hands are yeah, simful. Um. Basically, though,

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Speaker 1: were the outliers here here in America, and it's important

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Speaker 1: to remember to that massive numbers of paid time off

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Speaker 1: days are left unused and you know, even when we

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Speaker 1: do take some of that personal time off, it's often

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Speaker 1: times that we that we just find it hard to

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Speaker 1: not just check in for a little bit and be

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Speaker 1: connected to the office. Basically, for a lot of folks,

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Speaker 1: even the millions who now have a more fly, a

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Speaker 1: little work environment, work it's still the center of the

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Speaker 1: universe and we believe that that's not a good thing.

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Speaker 1: And the crazy thing is, Matt, that it's true like

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Speaker 1: we have become, it seems like, even more focused on

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Speaker 1: work as a culture and as individuals inside of that culture.

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Speaker 1: But it's kind of crazy because it's almost not as

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Speaker 1: necessary actually as we might think, because American workers are

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Speaker 1: are more productive than ever. Thanks to specialization and technological innovation.

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Speaker 1: We're able to get more done than we're smarter than

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Speaker 1: we used to do. I don't know if that's even true,

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Speaker 1: but we just have to added told you just right.

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Speaker 1: We're totally dumber than we're dumber, but we have better

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Speaker 1: tools at our disposal right to be more productive and

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Speaker 1: we can accomplish more than people could decades ago, largely

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Speaker 1: because of the advent of those tools. But despite something

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Speaker 1: like a four hundred and fifty percent rise in productivity,

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Speaker 1: we're still like working our tails off. We're working more

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Speaker 1: than we should, we're more focused on work than a

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Speaker 1: lot of people have predicted we would be at this

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Speaker 1: point in time and and specifically when we're talking about

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Speaker 1: those predictions in in nineteen thirty. Yeah, that's almost a

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Speaker 1: hundred years ago. Economists, John Maynard Keane's predicted that there

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Speaker 1: was going to be this meteoric rise in productivity. He

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Speaker 1: was he was spot on, but he also predicted that

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Speaker 1: US being that much more productive would lead to something

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Speaker 1: like fifteen hour work weeks, that we would just have

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Speaker 1: loads of leisure time and it was going to be

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Speaker 1: like some sort of paradise, you know we all lived in.

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Speaker 1: But he was way off on his prediction. And the

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Speaker 1: question is why? Why did he get half of the

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Speaker 1: equation right but miss the other half? I think it's

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Speaker 1: for a couple of reasons. I think one the reality

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Speaker 1: is work provides other benefits besides just income. Like why

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Speaker 1: does Elon Musk continue to work and create new companies?

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Speaker 1: He doesn't have to write. He doesn't have to create

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Speaker 1: the boring company in addition to Tesla, after starting paypal

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Speaker 1: and and making, you know, tons of money off that,

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Speaker 1: his most successful venture, the boring company. He could stop tomorrow. Right,

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Speaker 1: but that company is still around. I actually totally forgot it.

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Speaker 1: I think he still just like, yeah, we're gonna drill

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Speaker 1: tunnels underground in order to foster high speed transportation. No,

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Speaker 1: I think he still at it and I'm curious to

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Speaker 1: see what becomes of it. But his same same true

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Speaker 1: with somebody like Lebron James, like, does he have to

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Speaker 1: dribble the basketball or dunk ever again in his life

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Speaker 1: if he doesn't want to know, he could completely just

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Speaker 1: chill out sit on the sidelines. He doesn't. He totally

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Speaker 1: has enough money. He doesn't need another fifty million dollars,

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Speaker 1: that's for sure. But why quit when you love it? Right?

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Speaker 1: And and I think that is the reality for a

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Speaker 1: lot of people, is that work provides something beyond just dollars.

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Speaker 1: Right and and another less positive reason is because we

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Speaker 1: consume too much as people, as Americans in particular. Many

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Speaker 1: of US could choose to work less if we could

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Speaker 1: just inhibit our desires a little bit more, if we

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Speaker 1: could rein in our spending, we would have more fiscal

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Speaker 1: ability to kind of like turn the dial down on

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Speaker 1: on how much we're committing and how much time we're

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Speaker 1: spending doing work related stuff. And it's not that consumption

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Speaker 1: in and of itself is inherently bad. Right and so, like,

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Speaker 1: for instance, if you thought back two hundred years ago,

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Speaker 1: the advances in technology, like I think that's something else

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Speaker 1: that he didn't count on. The canes was it counting on?

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Speaker 1: Is that as like not only is innovation and technology

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Speaker 1: gonna allow us to be more efficient, it's also going

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Speaker 1: to create other technologies that we're going to want to

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Speaker 1: have in our life? Right and so he wasn't counting

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Speaker 1: on something as basic as air conditioning or like refrigeration, right,

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Speaker 1: like these are things that nobody would say are, oh

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Speaker 1: my gosh, that's lavish living right there. Right, like nobody

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Speaker 1: who lives in the south is going to say, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you don't really need air conditioning. No, like that's an

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Speaker 1: amazing invention that's allowed large populations to live in the

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Speaker 1: south in a way that doesn't but their health at risk.

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Speaker 1: But it's more of like what you're talking about, obviously,

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Speaker 1: is like the like more the conspicuous consumption, the consuming

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Speaker 1: of things just because we can consume them, not necessarily because, uh,

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Speaker 1: it's something that has brought value to our lives. And

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Speaker 1: you and me, by the way, in midsummer and like,

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Speaker 1: we would be migrating north for a few months if,

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Speaker 1: if it wasn't for the A C. So that's yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's made embrace it. Maybe embrace that's on a life.

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Speaker 1: But we, we've said it before, we'll say it again.

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Speaker 1: We do think that work is a good thing. Like

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Speaker 1: your so angel, like there's this innate need that we

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Speaker 1: have to accomplish some productive work, and it's for reasons

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Speaker 1: that go just beyond earning money. Most of US derive

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Speaker 1: satisfaction from the work that we're able to do, even

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Speaker 1: from the jobs that we we might not love right,

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Speaker 1: like I'm thinking of even somebody who's just sweeping the floor.

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Speaker 1: You can sweep the floor, you can be a janitor

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Speaker 1: and find deep intrinsic value within that work that you're doing,

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Speaker 1: with the value that you're providing not only the people

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Speaker 1: who are walking across the floor, but also the employers

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Speaker 1: who pay your salary. It just takes a reframe for

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Speaker 1: a lot of times to view your job in a

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Speaker 1: different light. And and that's not saying that everyone should

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Speaker 1: stay with the job that they're in. Always, uh, there

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Speaker 1: the room to move and improve, but it does come

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Speaker 1: down a mindset, though. There's a lot of that, because

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Speaker 1: if we can realize that our work is often in

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Speaker 1: service to others, you know, that we're contributing to society,

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Speaker 1: that can completely shift how it is that we view

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Speaker 1: our work. And for those folks who do want to

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Speaker 1: retire early, like, it's all good. You know, work doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean that you have to collect a paycheck. It can

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Speaker 1: look like volunteering, you know, with local organizations in your community. Uh,

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Speaker 1: that is meaningful as well, and if you're at the

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Speaker 1: point that you don't need the money, it can still

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Speaker 1: be an incredibly fulfilling source of quote unquote, work, even

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Speaker 1: though you're not necessarily getting paid. Well, yeah, and speaking

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Speaker 1: of cleaning makes me think when I did pressure washing,

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Speaker 1: like my first job in radio. I was the only

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Speaker 1: part time I got paid fifteen bucks an hour and

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Speaker 1: I had to have something else to do on the side,

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Speaker 1: and so I became I pressure washed houses and it

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Speaker 1: wasn't my long term goal to stay in that business

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Speaker 1: for very long and in reality I stayed there for

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Speaker 1: just like a year and a half, I think. But

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Speaker 1: it was actually kind of, kind of cool. There was

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Speaker 1: something really rewarding about like getting there, the house is

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Speaker 1: all dirty, algae covered on the sides of it, stuff,

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Speaker 1: and you clean that puppy up and then like yeah,

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Speaker 1: the homeowners pumped and they're super happy and come home

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Speaker 1: and they're like, I didn't realize my house was that

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Speaker 1: color exactly. I thought that was I love it. Surprisingly

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Speaker 1: a cool job for that reason. And the reality is

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Speaker 1: that really, when when it comes to work, you can

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Speaker 1: take anything too far. Beer right. We talked about that

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Speaker 1: on the show. Like we we love craft beer, but

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Speaker 1: moderation is the key to enjoying it correctly. If Matt

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Speaker 1: and I were pounding four beers every show one we

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Speaker 1: would the show be bad and too we would be overweight,

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Speaker 1: like we would it wouldn't be good. But splitting this

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Speaker 1: twel for our hearts, all the different poor health outcomes

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Speaker 1: that would that we would be contributing to. Right. It's

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Speaker 1: right exactly, and plus it would cost us way more money.

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Speaker 1: And the same true when it comes to how we work,

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Speaker 1: because if we over emphasize the role that work plays

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Speaker 1: in our lives, it's going to stop giving us that

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Speaker 1: sense of satisfaction and we're more likely to get burned out.

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Speaker 1: And I like the way I actually meant that that writer,

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Speaker 1: Derrick Thompson. He he writes a lot about work and

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Speaker 1: business in for the Atlantic and he rans some numbers.

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Speaker 1: Recently found that your your career, is only one six

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Speaker 1: of your waking existence over the course of your life,

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Speaker 1: and I think that's helpful to put it in perspective,

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Speaker 1: because sometimes it feels like it's at least half of

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Speaker 1: our existence. And when you put it like that, I

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Speaker 1: don't know, it makes me think that we should be

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Speaker 1: finding ways to put work in its proper and likely

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Speaker 1: less important than we're making it place, because work is good,

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Speaker 1: but overwork is very bad. Totally. Yeah, and I like

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Speaker 1: Derrick Thompson a lot, and I mean the more I

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Speaker 1: read by him. I'm like, man like how that guy

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Speaker 1: thinks about the world. But, having said it's difficult to

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Speaker 1: look at an entire lifetime and say okay, because you're

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Speaker 1: not really thinking about work so much when you're a

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Speaker 1: fifth five year old or a ten year old. Uh,

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Speaker 1: and same thing when you're older and retired. Right. And so,

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Speaker 1: if you like eliminate fifteen years on the tail end,

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Speaker 1: fifteen years on the front end, it's like a quarter. Truly. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like a third of your of of your twenty four

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Speaker 1: hour day is typically devoted to work, and that's I

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Speaker 1: think that's also where most of our listeners are right,

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Speaker 1: like we are in the stage of life typically where

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Speaker 1: we are working. And so I say that not to

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Speaker 1: just not to like roast derrek Thompson or anything like that,

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Speaker 1: but just to point out that it is important. And

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Speaker 1: this is the reason why we're talking and focusing on work.

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Speaker 1: It's not because it's it's this small thing that we

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Speaker 1: want to relegate off to the sides. It's because, well,

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Speaker 1: it does take up a decent amount of our time.

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Speaker 1: Is that we just need to make sure that we're

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Speaker 1: putting it within its right place, because if we are

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Speaker 1: working too much then we're looking at overwork, we're looking

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Speaker 1: at addiction, and that is also a real thing. It's

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Speaker 1: it's something to be wary of because if you are

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Speaker 1: prone to overwork, it's important, I think, to do some

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Speaker 1: self reflection to figure out, like why that is. GABB

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Speaker 1: or mate, he's a Canadian doctor and he writes about addiction.

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Speaker 1: He talks about how easy it is for people to

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Speaker 1: make work and what they do their identity and, unlike

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Speaker 1: drug use, it's it's basically an addiction. That's it's it's

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Speaker 1: more socially acceptable, but it's still an addiction that can

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Speaker 1: make us it can make our families miserable. Um, and

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Speaker 1: if you feel like maybe you fall into that camp,

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Speaker 1: it's it's going to take some real internal work to

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Speaker 1: adopt a different, less intense attachment to your work, and

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Speaker 1: I think it's like one of the first steps to

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Speaker 1: figuring out whether or not you're addicted or not is

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Speaker 1: if you're bristling even at the suggestion that maybe you're

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Speaker 1: working too much. You know, like that can be a

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Speaker 1: serious indicator if your partner tells you that, or maybe

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Speaker 1: you're even listening to US talk about and you're like,

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Speaker 1: I don't work I don't work too much. Let me alone.

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Speaker 1: But it's one of those things that can be easier

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Speaker 1: seeing in other people, but within yourself oftentimes I think

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Speaker 1: there's so much self denial and there's they're just refusal

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Speaker 1: of the truth when we are working too much and

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Speaker 1: we are finding too much of our identity from the

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Speaker 1: approval of our superiors, of our bosses, even from our clients. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I think one of the ways which we see

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Speaker 1: that our our culture as a whole is pretty work addicted.

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Speaker 1: What's like? The second question you typically ask somebody, after

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Speaker 1: giving their name, it is what do you do for

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Speaker 1: a living? What you do? Yeah, and that's where the

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Speaker 1: conversation starts. There's so many more interesting things about people

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Speaker 1: than just the job they perform, and so I don't know,

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Speaker 1: like that's my favorite conversations are one where it's a

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Speaker 1: very important thing. I don't yeah, it's it's a fine

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Speaker 1: land of I want to know that about somebody for sure,

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Speaker 1: but I also I'm like it's not everything. It makes

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Speaker 1: me want to start. The second question is like what's

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Speaker 1: your favorite what are your favorite hobbies to do for fun?

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Speaker 1: Like go somewhere else with the conversation, because that's just

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Speaker 1: always the first line of questioning and there are other

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Speaker 1: cool things that people have to offer and maybe we

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Speaker 1: start there and get to the work stuff later on

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Speaker 1: in the Combo. Yeah, and unfortunately, uh, people don't have

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Speaker 1: as many hobbies as they wish they had, and so

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Speaker 1: you might ask them that and they might say, uh,

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Speaker 1: what do you mean? Okay, yeah, actually, we're gonna talk

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Speaker 1: more about the lack of hobbies in our lives, plus

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Speaker 1: a bunch of other reasons why it is it's so

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Speaker 1: difficult for us to strike that work life balance. We'll

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Speaker 1: get to all that right after this. Allright, we're still

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Speaker 1: talking about work life balance, Matt you and I were

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Speaker 1: going to offer kind of our prescription from the how

428
00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:32,679
Speaker 1: to money standpoint, because for over work, we're gonna talk

429
00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:34,680
Speaker 1: about that in just a little bit. But let's continue

430
00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:36,760
Speaker 1: maybe down the diagnostic path for a little bit, because

431
00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:39,040
Speaker 1: there's a lot more that we need to kind of

432
00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:42,240
Speaker 1: consider as we're thinking about our own individual situation, because

433
00:19:42,359 --> 00:19:45,520
Speaker 1: work is obviously a necessity. Work can be and is

434
00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:48,399
Speaker 1: a good thing if it's in its proper place. But

435
00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:52,879
Speaker 1: and ideally there's this alignment between your work and your interests.

436
00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:54,560
Speaker 1: But you don't. You don't get there overnight and I

437
00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:57,880
Speaker 1: think sometimes maybe part of the problem is that we

438
00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,080
Speaker 1: assume that we're supposed to have this job that we

439
00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:02,280
Speaker 1: absolutely love and then maybe if you love it, it's

440
00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:05,760
Speaker 1: okay if you work twelve hour days, but there's often

441
00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:08,520
Speaker 1: a financial trade off if you opt to pursue work

442
00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:11,320
Speaker 1: that you find enjoyable. For a lot of folks, and

443
00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:13,240
Speaker 1: that was the case for me at least, when I

444
00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:15,240
Speaker 1: went to work in radio. That first job, like I said,

445
00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:17,560
Speaker 1: was didn't make very much and I had to start

446
00:20:17,600 --> 00:20:20,919
Speaker 1: off part time, even working in a major market. But

447
00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,719
Speaker 1: that was okay for me because I cared less about

448
00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:25,560
Speaker 1: making a lot of money and I cared more about

449
00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:28,040
Speaker 1: doing something that I enjoyed. But there was that trade

450
00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:29,199
Speaker 1: off and I think if you want to go down

451
00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:31,240
Speaker 1: that path, you just have to realize that's going to

452
00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:33,440
Speaker 1: be the case, that you might you might have to

453
00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:37,080
Speaker 1: be okay making a smaller salary in order to enjoy

454
00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:39,200
Speaker 1: the work that you're doing. I feel like I feel

455
00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,159
Speaker 1: like that's one of those trade offs that folks aren't

456
00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:43,600
Speaker 1: considering as much because, as they think, well, I have

457
00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:46,840
Speaker 1: the opportunity to earn this much money, but well, just

458
00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:48,960
Speaker 1: because you have the opportunity does not mean that you

459
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:51,360
Speaker 1: have to go down that path. Yes, that's I think

460
00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:53,280
Speaker 1: that's the kind of thinking that I want more folks

461
00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:56,520
Speaker 1: to consider, rather than Oh, you must always I mean,

462
00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:58,720
Speaker 1: we're money nerds here, right, like we are always looking

463
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:02,399
Speaker 1: for different ways to optimize all sorts of things money

464
00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,000
Speaker 1: related with our lives, whether it's the amount that we're earning,

465
00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 1: the amount that we're spending. But I don't think that's

466
00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:09,760
Speaker 1: necessarily a healthy default, right. We do need to think

467
00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:13,720
Speaker 1: about how it is that we're actually spending these life hours,

468
00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:15,800
Speaker 1: these and who knows, right, like, who knows how many,

469
00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:18,520
Speaker 1: how long we're actually going to live? It's one of

470
00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:21,560
Speaker 1: those finite resources that none of us actually knows what

471
00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:25,200
Speaker 1: anybody is gonna how long. I'm gonna give me a

472
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,360
Speaker 1: heads up. I think that's an email. You probably don't

473
00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,840
Speaker 1: want to but if somebody emails you super seriously and

474
00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:33,640
Speaker 1: they're like, Joel, you're gonna die on x date, you're

475
00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:36,919
Speaker 1: you're probably gonna Block that Guy Right. Probably. What if

476
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:41,280
Speaker 1: they were right, though? Oh Man, nobody email Joel Uh.

477
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:43,000
Speaker 1: And so let's let's let's talk about some of the

478
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,639
Speaker 1: different reasons why today. I think we think it's just

479
00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:49,240
Speaker 1: harder than ever to fine and discover that work life balance.

480
00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:51,720
Speaker 1: Work generally speaking, like, there used to be kind of

481
00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:54,360
Speaker 1: the standard nine to five job, right. There were more

482
00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:58,240
Speaker 1: clear divisions. That's no longer the case, and technology is

483
00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,400
Speaker 1: the is the major culprit here. Uh. The same thing

484
00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,800
Speaker 1: that enables you to work from anywhere, it also allows

485
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:07,359
Speaker 1: you to work at any time, often creating like that

486
00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:10,359
Speaker 1: nagging sense, that guilt that you should be working when

487
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,159
Speaker 1: it's completely unnecessary. You know, like how often do you

488
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:17,560
Speaker 1: find yourself checking an email compulsively, uh, and responding at

489
00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:20,359
Speaker 1: all crazy hours of the evening? Those are things that

490
00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:22,840
Speaker 1: could most likely wait until the next morning once you're

491
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:26,000
Speaker 1: at your actual desk. Uh. And so instead of letting

492
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 1: these just great technological inventions work for us, we've become

493
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,359
Speaker 1: enslaved to them. Technology and innovation are are one of

494
00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:37,119
Speaker 1: those double edged swords, right, and in some ways, and

495
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:39,080
Speaker 1: in a lot of ways, it's helped us. It's allowed

496
00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:42,480
Speaker 1: us to do so much more than John Mayner Kaine's

497
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:46,440
Speaker 1: would have ever thought possible, but simultaneously it allows us, uh,

498
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 1: to be tempted to overwork more than we ever thought possible.

499
00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,280
Speaker 1: It makes me think about just the intro to the

500
00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:56,720
Speaker 1: Flintstones Matt and how the Big Bird Chirps Fred. He says, yeah,

501
00:22:56,800 --> 00:22:58,840
Speaker 1: but I'm a Doity, like hops down the back of

502
00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:00,760
Speaker 1: the dinosaur, hops into a car. He's like ready to

503
00:23:00,800 --> 00:23:03,320
Speaker 1: go home, and that's by the store, gets a big

504
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:07,960
Speaker 1: old slab of Toronto Rims. Why you like that in right.

505
00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,200
Speaker 1: Then they pulled up to the movie man. This classic,

506
00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:13,920
Speaker 1: classic things that we should be doing. Yeah, well, there

507
00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:16,200
Speaker 1: is something really healthy about kind of got some meat

508
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 1: and going to a drive in. That schedule, right. And

509
00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:20,159
Speaker 1: and so he's he's got that going on spades. And

510
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,440
Speaker 1: we actually we have this neon dollar light in our

511
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 1: you know, in our studio, and it cuts off at

512
00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:30,199
Speaker 1: four thirty and it is this like Pavlovian symbol to

513
00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:32,480
Speaker 1: say like hey, guys, works done for the day. That's

514
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:34,639
Speaker 1: the factory whistle. Right. That's right for us. That's our

515
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:36,800
Speaker 1: version of it, and I think if people can implement

516
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:39,040
Speaker 1: that like that, that can be that can be a

517
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 1: helpful way to shut down. You need something to kind

518
00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:43,639
Speaker 1: of help you create a delineation. And then we have

519
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,040
Speaker 1: a bike ride home and that kind of helps the

520
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 1: delineation even more so I think that can be helpful

521
00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 1: for folks. I think, by the way, we don't manually

522
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:52,440
Speaker 1: turn that off. It's set. It's plugged into this Little

523
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,440
Speaker 1: Smart Bluetooth socket or whatever, and I've got the things set.

524
00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:57,560
Speaker 1: It kicks on at eight in the morning cuts off

525
00:23:57,600 --> 00:24:00,439
Speaker 1: at four thirties every single day. And the reality is

526
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:01,960
Speaker 1: that tech it can be used for good or bad.

527
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:04,399
Speaker 1: Right Social Media, for instance, it it can allow you

528
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 1: to access, let's say, a personal finance hive. Mind in

529
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,200
Speaker 1: how the money facebook group acts and you can get

530
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,360
Speaker 1: killer advice and encouragement instantly when you need it. There's

531
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:16,280
Speaker 1: awesome folks in there, almost ten awesome folks in there.

532
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:17,680
Speaker 1: You can you can link up with all your old

533
00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 1: high school friends if you have the desire to do

534
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:22,800
Speaker 1: that for some reason. That's right. But but we all know,

535
00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:25,320
Speaker 1: everybody knows at this point, social media can also drain

536
00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:28,480
Speaker 1: hours of your time. You can be doom strolling for

537
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,640
Speaker 1: hours on end every day through your preferred social media APP,

538
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,639
Speaker 1: whatever it is, and in order to maintain work life balance,

539
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:37,520
Speaker 1: it's crucial to figure out which tools you need and

540
00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:40,040
Speaker 1: which ones you should ditch and then set up rules

541
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: around the technology that you're keeping around so that you're

542
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 1: in charge of it, not the other way around, and

543
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,000
Speaker 1: it just makes me think Matt Cal Cal Newport's book

544
00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:50,800
Speaker 1: digital minimalism. I feel like that helped me see the

545
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 1: need for that. Uh. We're not attempting to Romanticize the

546
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:58,959
Speaker 1: fifties or factory jobs, but the reality is technology has

547
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:00,960
Speaker 1: allowed us to become more and that's a good thing,

548
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:02,920
Speaker 1: but the thing that could be freeing us has also

549
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:05,680
Speaker 1: at times become our abuser. I think that's why it's

550
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:09,120
Speaker 1: so important to set boundaries and set rules with within,

551
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:11,959
Speaker 1: within your life, right, and so, like work can so

552
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:15,360
Speaker 1: easily seep into all aspects of life, in particular once

553
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:17,480
Speaker 1: you get home. And so like something that we've implemented,

554
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: that Kate and I have implemented at our house, we've

555
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 1: got a special counter when we put our phones uh.

556
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 1: It's got a little plug over there where you can

557
00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 1: kind of charge it in as well, and so there's

558
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:26,880
Speaker 1: a natural draw to want to put it over there, right.

559
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:28,919
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, that's that's where the power is, but

560
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:32,439
Speaker 1: it's also removed from our kitchen table. It's removed from

561
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:34,719
Speaker 1: the kitchen a little bit and it's separate, which allows

562
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:37,320
Speaker 1: us to, you know, hopefully at least focus on the

563
00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:40,280
Speaker 1: kids a little bit more, like, in particular, Monday through Friday,

564
00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:41,719
Speaker 1: right like they've been at school all day. They've got

565
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 1: a lot they want to talk about and if I'm

566
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 1: tempted to you know, like hop on a text threat or, uh,

567
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:49,240
Speaker 1: get back to an email or something like that, it's

568
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:52,120
Speaker 1: gonna make those conversations feel a little more second rate

569
00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:55,639
Speaker 1: as compared to just fully engaging with them, uh, and

570
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:57,879
Speaker 1: investing within those relations. Reality might be you need to

571
00:25:57,880 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 1: hop on email for and we can talk about we'll

572
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:01,640
Speaker 1: get this in a little bit, but for let's say

573
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:03,560
Speaker 1: twenty minutes a night. But you can do that after

574
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 1: the kids are asleep. But if your phone is buzzing

575
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,160
Speaker 1: in your pocket, you're probably gonna hop on and think

576
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,400
Speaker 1: that the need, you've got to be on there right now.

577
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,439
Speaker 1: And you you what, could wait and be confined to

578
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:16,280
Speaker 1: a specific small period of time. You've you kind of

579
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:18,000
Speaker 1: let overtake the rest of Your Life, and that one

580
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,440
Speaker 1: little change can make a big difference as to whether

581
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:22,000
Speaker 1: or not you feel like you have to respond right

582
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,120
Speaker 1: now or not. Exactly, or, the very least, turning off

583
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,000
Speaker 1: those push notifications so that you are not notified if

584
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:28,840
Speaker 1: you still happen to have your phone in your pocket.

585
00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:32,120
Speaker 1: But Um, another thing that's keeping us, I think that

586
00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:34,040
Speaker 1: that that's causing us to seem like we don't have

587
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 1: as much balance, is flexibility. Because, like today, most folks

588
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 1: have more flexibility than ever. They've got more options than

589
00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:43,720
Speaker 1: ever when it comes to their work. Not everyone, of course,

590
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,160
Speaker 1: but COVID has created a work economy that gives more

591
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:50,320
Speaker 1: optionality to just a slew of workers out there who

592
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: previously didn't have so much. A recent survey from Gallup

593
00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 1: finds out nearly half of all workers in the US,

594
00:26:57,480 --> 00:26:59,720
Speaker 1: and that's what that comes out to, is around sixty

595
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 1: million and folks have the flexibility now to work when

596
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 1: and where they want, at least part of the time.

597
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 1: And interestingly enough, we actually think that, like full time

598
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 1: working from from home has some serious downsides, uh, for

599
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 1: us in a number of ways, but for a socially

600
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,639
Speaker 1: for sure. Plus they can impact our ability to to

601
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,159
Speaker 1: move up the ladder, increasing our our skills and our

602
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,439
Speaker 1: income and the impact that we're gonna have at our jobs.

603
00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:24,760
Speaker 1: And so because of that hybrid work, it sounds better

604
00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,159
Speaker 1: to us. It seems to be the policy that that

605
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:30,440
Speaker 1: more employers are implementing, because, you know, you can't completely

606
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:33,479
Speaker 1: put the cat back in the bag when it comes to, uh,

607
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,879
Speaker 1: the ability to work from home. But this, you know,

608
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,760
Speaker 1: the reality is that this new found flexibility can have

609
00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:42,600
Speaker 1: both pros and cons to it. Yeah, and, like we said,

610
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 1: like technology, that double edged sorting. It can make it

611
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:47,959
Speaker 1: so that we're able to get more work done in

612
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:50,840
Speaker 1: fewer hours, but that's just not how it shakes out

613
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,200
Speaker 1: for the most Parton and there was this new study

614
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 1: method that actually shows that, while folks are working more hours,

615
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,080
Speaker 1: as work from home increases, so so people are actually

616
00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: dedicating more hour their job, even though they're not in

617
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:05,160
Speaker 1: the office, largely because maybe hey, I'm not commuting, while

618
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:08,080
Speaker 1: I spend that time working. Well, each hour is actually

619
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:10,320
Speaker 1: less productive than it used to be, which to me

620
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:13,560
Speaker 1: says that we're switching tasks more, we feel compelled to

621
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 1: work more, but we're not getting as much done when

622
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:18,720
Speaker 1: we're quote unquote, working like we're spending more time in

623
00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:20,840
Speaker 1: front of our computers, but we're just not getting as

624
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:24,080
Speaker 1: much done, and I think a part of that is accountability.

625
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:26,679
Speaker 1: Right when you're sitting at home it feels like you're

626
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 1: at home. And what do you like to do at home?

627
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:30,919
Speaker 1: You like to do the laundry. You wanna check the

628
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 1: package that was that was just dropped off on the

629
00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:37,040
Speaker 1: front porch because the Amazon guy showed up. Like there's

630
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 1: all these other temptations and you're not. It's less of

631
00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:43,040
Speaker 1: a work environment versus coming in and it's like it's

632
00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:45,239
Speaker 1: it's time to work, to get the business done, and

633
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 1: people still feel like they're always working though. They always

634
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:50,480
Speaker 1: feel attached to it, which is just a draining sensation.

635
00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 1: And so the reality is so many months of malaise. Yeah,

636
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 1: like we feel like we're floating in the middle. We're

637
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 1: attempting to multitask. It's just making us it harder for

638
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:01,520
Speaker 1: us to perform any of our tasks, work or personal,

639
00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:03,800
Speaker 1: really really all that well, that's right. Yeah, let's talk

640
00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 1: about status as well. In the pursuit of status, the

641
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,959
Speaker 1: pursuit of job titles, I think that can lead us

642
00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:12,560
Speaker 1: to to work a whole lot more than maybe we

643
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 1: wish we did, because I mean, first of all, like

644
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:17,200
Speaker 1: you certainly don't have to be crazy ambitious right, like,

645
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 1: depending on on how it is that you grew up

646
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 1: in the circles you run in. Uh, you might be

647
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,479
Speaker 1: more than happy to simply punch the clock Monday through

648
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: Friday without feeling the need to to rock it up

649
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:29,160
Speaker 1: the corporate ladder, or you might find that ambition like that.

650
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:31,200
Speaker 1: It just comes naturally to you. Right like that. You

651
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 1: are always pushing yourself forward. This is a different strokes

652
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:38,720
Speaker 1: for different folks kind of kind of thing. Ambition. It

653
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 1: can be good or bad. You know, so much of

654
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:43,120
Speaker 1: it depends on how you funnel that ambition. And so

655
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 1: if you are pursuing a job or a career for

656
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 1: like exterior, external signaling reasons, I think it's likely going

657
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,640
Speaker 1: to lead to significant amounts of unhappiness. You just want

658
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: to tell all your friends, if you want everyone to

659
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,000
Speaker 1: know you're a podcaster, you know, and that's the only

660
00:29:58,040 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 1: reason you're doing because you think it's the coolest job ever.

661
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 1: or a doctor or CFO, see, whatever, like whatever it is. Oftentimes, yeah,

662
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,080
Speaker 1: folks are a tempted into taking jobs that they otherwise

663
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 1: would totally turn down because they like the ring. Like,

664
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:12,120
Speaker 1: not like literally literally, like they like the ring of it.

665
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 1: When they were to say it, they they like the idea.

666
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 1: They love that. Second question in the Combo. What is

667
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:19,080
Speaker 1: it that you do for a living? You're like, Oh, boom,

668
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 1: I was waiting for you to ask. I actually wish

669
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 1: you would ask that before you ask my name, because

670
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 1: I'm so proud of it. I'm literally a rocket sciences

671
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 1: Um and so I mentioned because I just think it's

672
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,120
Speaker 1: important to keep in mind, even within personal finance. You know,

673
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 1: I see folks in our space doing more, they're working

674
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 1: harder and they're progressing more quickly and because that is

675
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 1: easy to get jealous, but man like, I've got to

676
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 1: remind myself of the reality that my joy that is

677
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: coming from things that cannot be measured by acquaintances or

678
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 1: other folks within the personal finance space or or things

679
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 1: that folks post on social media. I think it's good

680
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 1: to be ambitious, but you need to have bumper rails

681
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 1: in place. For me personally, that's why I like to

682
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: have hard boundaries around when it is that I do

683
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:00,440
Speaker 1: allow myself to work. I like the that I do.

684
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,240
Speaker 1: I like the ability that the impact, Joel, that you

685
00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 1: and I are having on the countless people who listen

686
00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:07,880
Speaker 1: to our show who are able to put themselves in

687
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 1: a better financial position based on what it is that

688
00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:12,120
Speaker 1: we talk about. That's amazing. Plus, we have fun doing it.

689
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,480
Speaker 1: It's so much fun. Also, I like making money, like like.

690
00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:17,760
Speaker 1: These are all things that lead to someone wanting to

691
00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:20,040
Speaker 1: be a little more ambitious. I think those can all

692
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 1: be good things. And so how do you contain that?

693
00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:24,719
Speaker 1: And so for me personally, just having some just hard barriers.

694
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 1: So when it is that I give myself, that I

695
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,560
Speaker 1: throw myself at that work allows me to not think

696
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:31,719
Speaker 1: about it when I'm not working. Yeah, I mean I

697
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,160
Speaker 1: like that. You said ambition, but with bumper rails and

698
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 1: it's like in a bowling alley, right, we call them

699
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 1: gutter guards when I was a kid, and you stick

700
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 1: those things in the bumpers, maybe you might not get

701
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:42,840
Speaker 1: a strike, but at least you're gonna hit up in.

702
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 1: It's almost impossible to not hit up in right with

703
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 1: those up. And so, uh, if you have those those

704
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: gutter guards up, if you have some sort of and

705
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 1: we're talking to talk about how to do this in

706
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 1: just a minute, but if you have those limitations on

707
00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:59,280
Speaker 1: your salitation, safeguards, boundaries like whatever, it is like. It

708
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 1: makes me think of Um like a camp fire fire.

709
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:04,440
Speaker 1: It's a it's a great thing to have when you're

710
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 1: out camping, especially when it's cooler. Like you used to cook.

711
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: It's an entertainment. You just sit there, you stare at

712
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 1: it for whatever the bear wants you to do, it

713
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 1: within within a reasonable and we'll put it in the

714
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:15,239
Speaker 1: fire pit. Though, like like, there are precautions you need

715
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:16,840
Speaker 1: to need to take, because if it gets out of

716
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:19,960
Speaker 1: that firing it's going to cause a lot of harm.

717
00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: In the same way, work is the same thing as fire,

718
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 1: and one of the things people are giving up because

719
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,960
Speaker 1: they are so focused on work is leisure activities and hobbies. Matt,

720
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:31,800
Speaker 1: that is there was a recent survey and it just

721
00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:35,720
Speaker 1: brought a tear to my eyes. So sad that, especially millennials,

722
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:39,120
Speaker 1: there's just such a lack of hobbies that they have

723
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:41,160
Speaker 1: been able to cultivate in their lives. And and there

724
00:32:41,240 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 1: was a recent American time use survey and it was

725
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,240
Speaker 1: literally at the bottom of the list leisure time or

726
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 1: hobby activities. Like people just ain't got time for that,

727
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:52,800
Speaker 1: and that made me that may be bummed out. I'm like, man,

728
00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: I just want more time for those things in my life,

729
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 1: and if that means cutting back on work, even though

730
00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:59,720
Speaker 1: I like my work. I'm gonna do it because that's

731
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 1: that's off matters. Yeah, and not only that, I thought

732
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 1: you're gonna reference the study about how watching TV was

733
00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:08,480
Speaker 1: most people's number one leisure activity, which is, I mean,

734
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 1: we've talked about that before. Just like, no wonder, four

735
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 1: hours on average a day. It's so much. It's a

736
00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 1: problem and no wonder it's not rewarding, because it's it's

737
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 1: I mean it's quite possibly the most passive, disengaged thing

738
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:22,479
Speaker 1: that you could do with your leisure and it's actually

739
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 1: it's actually draining. Like studies have shown that scrolling on

740
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,720
Speaker 1: your phone or watching TV, those are draining activities. They

741
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: you think that they're going to be. And I'm not

742
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:33,360
Speaker 1: saying that watching TV is is all bad. Sometimes Emily

743
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:35,040
Speaker 1: and I will watch like watching the show, an episode

744
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 1: of community and nine or something like that, but it

745
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 1: is a real problem if it's something like four hours

746
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 1: a day, because something that can be good in small

747
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 1: amounts then becomes a drug that like numbs us, and

748
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:47,440
Speaker 1: I think that is is how a lot of people

749
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: use television and it's preventing them from from exploring the

750
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 1: world around them, from enjoying hobbies that matter. It's it's

751
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:57,160
Speaker 1: a television side tangent, right. Yeah, what's sort of like

752
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:59,640
Speaker 1: folks who are trying to quit smoking. Right, eventually it's

753
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,040
Speaker 1: helpful to have a cessation device or something you can

754
00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 1: maybe substitute in rather than just trying to culd Turkey

755
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 1: eliminate smoking altogether overnight. And I know people who have

756
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:09,399
Speaker 1: done it and I'm impressed by it, but it makes

757
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:11,759
Speaker 1: it more difficult. It's not it's easy to accomplish and

758
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:14,000
Speaker 1: in front of the show Laura Vandercamp, she just wrote

759
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:16,279
Speaker 1: a great article in the in the New York Times,

760
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:20,359
Speaker 1: about incorporating fulfilling and enjoyable activities into your everyday life.

761
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,080
Speaker 1: It's it's not necessarily that we need to remove more

762
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 1: things from our lives, but maybe, I don't know, we

763
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:29,239
Speaker 1: should look to add more fulfilling, meaningful hobbies and activities

764
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:31,800
Speaker 1: to our calendar. That might mean detaching from work a

765
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 1: little more, but maybe the more we start to experience

766
00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:38,319
Speaker 1: and enjoy things that like we haven't made the time for,

767
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:41,000
Speaker 1: it will naturally start to kind of realign our priorities. Yeah,

768
00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:43,800
Speaker 1: it's no surprise that watching TV is like the least

769
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:48,160
Speaker 1: meaningful fulfilling leisure activity because like, yeah, you're you're not

770
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:50,799
Speaker 1: engaged in it at all, and I think sometimes it's

771
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:52,560
Speaker 1: still the one we participate in the most. It is

772
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,759
Speaker 1: and I think folks maybe they count on that because

773
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:56,319
Speaker 1: they're thinking, okay, well, I don't want to have to

774
00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 1: think about my leisure and the recreation that I participated in.

775
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,759
Speaker 1: What Laura was arguing is that by engaging with it

776
00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:05,160
Speaker 1: and being a little more proactive with it that we

777
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:06,799
Speaker 1: can find that not only do we have the time

778
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:10,120
Speaker 1: to participate within that activity that we previously thought we didn't,

779
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,920
Speaker 1: but now that our lives just and like generally speaking,

780
00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:16,240
Speaker 1: feel more fulfilling because we now have this activity outside

781
00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:17,879
Speaker 1: of our work. But I like what you said about

782
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:21,440
Speaker 1: smoking and cessation devices, because when you have an absence

783
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:23,360
Speaker 1: of something pulling you out of work, it can be

784
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:25,719
Speaker 1: difficult to say, well, I'm going to work less. Right,

785
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:27,719
Speaker 1: if you're saying, well, I work too much, I'm going

786
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: to just start cutting back, well, if they don't have

787
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:33,040
Speaker 1: anything to go to their thinking why? Why would I

788
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:34,320
Speaker 1: want to cut back on working? Why don't I just

789
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:36,719
Speaker 1: keep working make more money, because at least they're there's

790
00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 1: there's some sort of like scorecard, right, and that's what

791
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 1: they're measuring. And so you have to develop these core pursuits,

792
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:45,800
Speaker 1: these hobbies, these interests to pursue so that it pulls

793
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,040
Speaker 1: you away from work and not only will you find

794
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 1: that you actually are working less, but you're gonna find

795
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:52,280
Speaker 1: much more fulfillment, plus a whole lot of other benefits

796
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 1: that come with pursuing some of these interests. And so

797
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,200
Speaker 1: maybe you want to get on the pickleball bandwagon, because

798
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 1: that's that's hot right now, or just I don't one

799
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: of my things even just I like to take bike

800
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:04,360
Speaker 1: rides before dinner with my little dude. I know you

801
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 1: like to do the same that with your with your kiddos.

802
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:08,640
Speaker 1: We ran into each other on the mountain, like not literally,

803
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 1: but yeah, you were going up the mountain, we were

804
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:12,919
Speaker 1: coming down. I'm like, how dody, it's like the best,

805
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:14,880
Speaker 1: the best thing of you before dinner, a little physical exercise,

806
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:17,879
Speaker 1: getting outdoors, like seeing wild animals. It's awesome. We literally

807
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 1: did that lesson. We ran in. was like, oh, fancy again,

808
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:24,080
Speaker 1: but there's just so many options right. It doesn't even

809
00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:26,080
Speaker 1: have to be outdoors and physical. You could like join

810
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 1: a choir. I mean there's just there, but learn to

811
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 1: play the piano. There's there's a million different things you

812
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:34,799
Speaker 1: can participate in and it just reminds me of our

813
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: conversation with West Moss back in the day. Mat which

814
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:38,399
Speaker 1: will link to that one in the show, notes such

815
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:41,240
Speaker 1: a he had such good and important data and thoughts

816
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:43,600
Speaker 1: on what it looks like to be a happy retiree

817
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 1: living a well rounded life. The happiest retirees have more

818
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 1: what he calls core pursuits, and so what it's like

819
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:52,239
Speaker 1: three and a half person that we didn't start using

820
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:54,200
Speaker 1: that term until we we talked. We talked with him,

821
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:55,880
Speaker 1: but like that's just a part of my vernacular now,

822
00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:58,000
Speaker 1: like it's just something that you need to develop a

823
00:36:58,040 --> 00:37:01,239
Speaker 1: core pursuit. So, whether you're into what corps singing like,

824
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:04,040
Speaker 1: whatever it is that you love, having and developing more

825
00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 1: core pursuits is going to make you more well rounded

826
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,480
Speaker 1: and it's gonna make you happier. The happiest retirees, we're

827
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:12,839
Speaker 1: not the ones with the most millions in their four

828
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,600
Speaker 1: one k they were the most well rounded people who

829
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 1: lived closer to friends and families, spent more time with

830
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 1: them and had more personal endeavors. That just kind of

831
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,160
Speaker 1: light them up. Yeah, and if you're thinking, well, I

832
00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:26,080
Speaker 1: don't have time for hobbies, thank you very much. All

833
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:27,839
Speaker 1: my time is occupied by work and all the other

834
00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 1: responsibilities I have in life. You'll be surprised that, when

835
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,319
Speaker 1: you allow yourself to participate in some of these life

836
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:36,160
Speaker 1: giving activities, you'll be surprised at how you're able to

837
00:37:36,200 --> 00:37:38,560
Speaker 1: make time for these things, not only from the enjoyment

838
00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:40,279
Speaker 1: that they're able to bring to your life, but in

839
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 1: how they cause you to feel about the other areas

840
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 1: of your life as well. But, Joel, we're gonna keep

841
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: talking here. Right after the break, we're going to discuss

842
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:49,279
Speaker 1: how it is that you're going to be able to

843
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:52,920
Speaker 1: find balance within your own life. We'll talk about what

844
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:55,160
Speaker 1: it means to find meaningful work. We'll get to all

845
00:37:55,200 --> 00:38:06,399
Speaker 1: of that right after this. All right, let's keep going.

846
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 1: Let's talk about work life balance. This one's kind of

847
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:10,520
Speaker 1: getting to be a long one. Is it kind of

848
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:14,440
Speaker 1: ironic that the work life balance episode as it feels

849
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:16,040
Speaker 1: like it's going to run along? Hey, I don't know,

850
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:18,560
Speaker 1: there's a lot to say right there's there's just Um,

851
00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:20,880
Speaker 1: there's a lot of nuance involved in this conversation that

852
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: I feel like we have to bring to the Ford,

853
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:25,400
Speaker 1: especially when we're talking about something as complicated as our

854
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:27,839
Speaker 1: relationship to work. And I think one of the things

855
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:29,719
Speaker 1: that we have to talk when we're talking about how

856
00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 1: to help people find their own balance, how you and

857
00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 1: I try to do this. Well, one of the things

858
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:35,239
Speaker 1: you have to do is be careful with the time

859
00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 1: frame you're using to judge whether or not you are

860
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:41,520
Speaker 1: living that balanced life, because the reality is one day

861
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:46,000
Speaker 1: or one week of overwork doesn't necessarily mean you're overworking right.

862
00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 1: You want to start by taking an honest assessment of

863
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:52,000
Speaker 1: how much time you're actually dedicating towards work, and do

864
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:55,279
Speaker 1: it over multiple months so that you can at least

865
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:58,600
Speaker 1: kind of have a better understanding of because you might

866
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:00,560
Speaker 1: be in in some sort of a job where, Hey,

867
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:03,560
Speaker 1: I travel a lot in the month of October and

868
00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 1: so because of that, like it might feel like I'm

869
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:07,560
Speaker 1: spending too much time working, but you know what, I

870
00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:09,400
Speaker 1: get plenty of time off these other times and I

871
00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:11,960
Speaker 1: feel balanced, even though it feels like I'm loaded up

872
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:14,000
Speaker 1: in the fall. It's like the difference between weather and

873
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:16,880
Speaker 1: climate change. It's like they are there. You know they

874
00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:19,759
Speaker 1: might be related, but they're very different things as well,

875
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:22,280
Speaker 1: and it can't be like, oh, it's degrees in September,

876
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:25,759
Speaker 1: this is this one day. Yeah, right, well, and and

877
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:27,920
Speaker 1: it's also important, by the way, when you're thinking about

878
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:31,000
Speaker 1: your how how much time you're spending towards work, to

879
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 1: include everything in this calculation, that that includes a commute,

880
00:39:34,480 --> 00:39:37,040
Speaker 1: if you have one. You might be shocked by how

881
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:40,359
Speaker 1: many hours your job actually requires of you. And then

882
00:39:40,600 --> 00:39:43,239
Speaker 1: the question is, once you've kind of understood like this

883
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 1: is roughly how many hours, over a longer period of

884
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:49,440
Speaker 1: time I am working, can I work less? Or maybe

885
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:51,640
Speaker 1: you need to find something else entirely to do entirely

886
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 1: because the job that you currently have is not going

887
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 1: to allow you that's sort of flexibility and, like we

888
00:39:57,080 --> 00:39:59,640
Speaker 1: said at the beginning of this episode, like your definition

889
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,239
Speaker 1: of Balt is going to be largely determined by your

890
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:06,120
Speaker 1: specific circumstances. But taking that holistic view of your job

891
00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:09,760
Speaker 1: and how much time you're actually spending on it, taking

892
00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:12,239
Speaker 1: that realistic snapshot, I think it's gonna is going to

893
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 1: be the right starting point. That's right. Yeah, you need

894
00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:16,799
Speaker 1: to take you need to perform an honest audit of

895
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:19,400
Speaker 1: your time. I did that for an entire year, and

896
00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:21,680
Speaker 1: actually I'll link to the the APP I used clock up,

897
00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:23,359
Speaker 1: I think it was. Was It clockify? I think that's right.

898
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:25,560
Speaker 1: But if you think that might be helpful for you,

899
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:27,359
Speaker 1: we can link to that in our show notes. But

900
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:29,880
Speaker 1: it's important to point out too, that not all balance

901
00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 1: is equal or that your balance is better or worse

902
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 1: than somebody else's balance. Right, because we are all in

903
00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:40,279
Speaker 1: different stages of our lives and you might be front

904
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:43,520
Speaker 1: loading the sacrifice. That's what our our friend DOC G says.

905
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 1: If you're in your your early twenties, you might be

906
00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:48,839
Speaker 1: working really hard, trying to make a lot of money.

907
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:50,719
Speaker 1: You're cutting back in other areas. We think this is

908
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:53,680
Speaker 1: this can be a great idea. Essentially, you're you're basically

909
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:56,560
Speaker 1: earning more balance for future you by putting in more,

910
00:40:56,560 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 1: more work now, you're gonna have more options when your

911
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 1: life incurs other demands, like like having kids, like having

912
00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:04,520
Speaker 1: a family. It's the same thing we do with our money, right,

913
00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 1: the more we're able to funnel towards the investments now,

914
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:09,120
Speaker 1: we're providing future flexibility for ourselves. Well, we can do

915
00:41:09,160 --> 00:41:10,879
Speaker 1: the same thing kind of with our time. If in

916
00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:14,600
Speaker 1: those early mid twenties, we're able to put more effort

917
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:16,560
Speaker 1: into our career in a little bit more time. It

918
00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:19,799
Speaker 1: does allow us more future flexibility when the demands are

919
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:23,960
Speaker 1: actually more severe. Totally. Yeah, or uh, the other side

920
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 1: of the coin. Right you might be on the flip side,

921
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:28,640
Speaker 1: wanting to work less right now in order in order

922
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:31,520
Speaker 1: to spend some more time with your grandkids because you've

923
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:33,279
Speaker 1: got more money than you need. You know, there's there's

924
00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:35,880
Speaker 1: just no need to work at all anymore, and so

925
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 1: I think most of our listeners are probably, you know,

926
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:41,880
Speaker 1: somewhere in the middle of that pendulum. But we're pointing

927
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:43,920
Speaker 1: this out because finding balance it's not a black or

928
00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 1: white proposition, and you are unlikely to want to mimic

929
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:51,760
Speaker 1: like our sensibilities directly. Uh, it comes down to taste,

930
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:53,759
Speaker 1: and that's something else that that Derrick Thompson mentioned in

931
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:56,440
Speaker 1: that article too, how he likes a certain kind of wine,

932
00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:59,840
Speaker 1: and just because you don't like that wine doesn't mean that, well,

933
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,239
Speaker 1: you're an idiot. Yeah, that you're done. I mean, for

934
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 1: us it's it's craft beer. Not Everybody out there who

935
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:07,640
Speaker 1: listens to the show likes craft Beer Tho, but what

936
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 1: we always say is you've got to find your craft

937
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:12,960
Speaker 1: beer equivalent. What is it that you're willing to splurge on?

938
00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:14,839
Speaker 1: And in the same way when it comes to work,

939
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:17,040
Speaker 1: what is your craft beer equivalent as far as work goes?

940
00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:19,240
Speaker 1: What is the balance that you're trying to strike that

941
00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:21,759
Speaker 1: that is going to work for you? It doesn't necessarily

942
00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 1: mean that that it's better or worse than what it

943
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:25,840
Speaker 1: is that Joel and I are talking about here on

944
00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:28,760
Speaker 1: the show, but it is important for you to figure

945
00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:31,000
Speaker 1: out what that is for you, and part of the

946
00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:32,920
Speaker 1: equation is going to be asking yourself the question, do

947
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,600
Speaker 1: I like my job? Because your answer to that, sir,

948
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 1: it's probably going to indicate how you need to move forward.

949
00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:41,000
Speaker 1: That's going to factor into the equation. The the ideal

950
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 1: is to do work that doesn't necessarily feel like work. Right.

951
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:46,600
Speaker 1: That is kind of glorified in today's culture and I

952
00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 1: think the reality is more people can do work that

953
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:54,440
Speaker 1: they find meaningful than ever before. But it's it's easier

954
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:57,279
Speaker 1: said than done, because we we do feel like that.

955
00:42:57,320 --> 00:42:59,680
Speaker 1: It's possible for for a lot of folks, how the

956
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:03,120
Speaker 1: money serves. In particular, if you like your job, you

957
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 1: probably won't feel as much of a burning necessity to

958
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 1: cut back on those hours. But while you're pursuing meaningful work,

959
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:11,640
Speaker 1: it's still important to spend time thinking about those other

960
00:43:11,840 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 1: important elements of your life too. Just because your work

961
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 1: is fun or meaningful doesn't mean you aren't too attached

962
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:20,040
Speaker 1: to it, right, doesn't mean you're not overdoing it, and

963
00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:22,399
Speaker 1: then you couldn't enjoy your life more. Worried to dial

964
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:24,200
Speaker 1: it back a little bit and try to incorporate more

965
00:43:24,239 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 1: of those corporate suits like we're talking about. Yeah, finding

966
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 1: work that you love, meaningful work like that's another one

967
00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:31,880
Speaker 1: of those double edged swords, right, because, yeah, if you

968
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 1: are doing work that you love, you're gonna find it

969
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,640
Speaker 1: harder than ever to work less because it's something that

970
00:43:36,719 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 1: brings you a ton of value. Like Elon Musk, he's like,

971
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:40,880
Speaker 1: I'm literally trying to save humanity and take the mull

972
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:43,279
Speaker 1: to Mars. And so when you think of that, that's

973
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 1: how you're thinking about it, then, I mean, yeah, this

974
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:47,359
Speaker 1: is a way of life for him. Going Mountain biking

975
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:50,759
Speaker 1: just doesn't register on the scale exactly. Um, you know.

976
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:54,040
Speaker 1: And as we're talking about different jobs to like, like

977
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:56,520
Speaker 1: certain careers are just not going to be compatible with

978
00:43:56,560 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 1: having much balance, you know, like or they're going to

979
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:01,880
Speaker 1: at least throw in a bunch of extra hurdles, like

980
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:04,560
Speaker 1: it's going to be more difficult to have balance, uh,

981
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 1: like as a pharmacist, or maybe not, like as an

982
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:13,360
Speaker 1: e Er doctor. Right, pharmacists work a lot to somebody WHO's,

983
00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:15,640
Speaker 1: you know, like like an author or a web developer,

984
00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:18,040
Speaker 1: where they can easily set their own hours. But other

985
00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:20,919
Speaker 1: jobs are going to allow for all types of flexibility,

986
00:44:21,239 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 1: and so what you do and the company you work

987
00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 1: for are going to have major impacts on how much

988
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:28,919
Speaker 1: balance that you're going to be able to achieve. Uh.

989
00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:32,719
Speaker 1: And if you are experiencing the negative reality of a

990
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:35,359
Speaker 1: job that that feels too demanding to you, you might

991
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: have to start asking some of these hard questions, right

992
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:40,360
Speaker 1: about what your future career should look like and what

993
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:43,279
Speaker 1: changes that you'll that you'll likely need to make. It

994
00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 1: comes down to forecasting, thinking in your mind, looking ahead,

995
00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:49,720
Speaker 1: and if you are experiencing, you know, the negative reality

996
00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:52,040
Speaker 1: of a job that's too demanding, you might have to

997
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 1: start asking yourself some hard questions about what your future

998
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:59,160
Speaker 1: career should look like, what changes that you'll need to make. Yeah,

999
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:02,919
Speaker 1: I think the the best long term vision for work

1000
00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 1: in your life should be to do work that's voluntary,

1001
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:09,160
Speaker 1: and I don't just literally mean volunteering. there. There's just

1002
00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:13,120
Speaker 1: something more fulfilling about work that you're able to do

1003
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 1: when you don't need that paycheck in order to pay

1004
00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,920
Speaker 1: rent or the mortgage, making progress with your savings, achieving

1005
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:21,920
Speaker 1: a nice little piece out money fund, just creating more

1006
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:24,759
Speaker 1: financial margin and space will give you. I would say

1007
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:26,919
Speaker 1: it's going to give you a different connection to your work.

1008
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:29,919
Speaker 1: You don't have to be completely financially independent in order

1009
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,080
Speaker 1: to appreciate and change your connection to your work. If

1010
00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:36,360
Speaker 1: you need that paycheck this Friday to pay rent for

1011
00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:39,160
Speaker 1: for October, like, you're gonna have a different connection to

1012
00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:41,560
Speaker 1: your work. You're gonna feel differently about the email that

1013
00:45:41,560 --> 00:45:43,400
Speaker 1: showed up in your inbox because you're living paycheck to

1014
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 1: but if you have six, eight, nine months worth of

1015
00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:48,920
Speaker 1: savings in the bank and you're like boom, like I

1016
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:50,960
Speaker 1: just I like my job, but I don't have to

1017
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:53,760
Speaker 1: treat it the way other people do who are reliant

1018
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: on the next paycheck to make sure their budget doesn't

1019
00:45:56,640 --> 00:45:58,560
Speaker 1: get messed up, well, that's kind of a cool thing

1020
00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:01,560
Speaker 1: to realize that. Once you're personal finances are in better shape,

1021
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:04,279
Speaker 1: you can have a different relationship to your boss, to

1022
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:07,480
Speaker 1: your employer, to your job, and it just allows you

1023
00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:09,879
Speaker 1: more breathing room to decipher whether or not the job

1024
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:12,040
Speaker 1: you're currently in is when you want to keep in

1025
00:46:12,080 --> 00:46:14,360
Speaker 1: your life moving forward. Exactly basically, what you're saying is

1026
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:16,200
Speaker 1: that when you have financial margin in your life, like

1027
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:19,040
Speaker 1: you can look at your job, your career with like

1028
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,160
Speaker 1: through a completely different Lens, and that's man, that's invaluable

1029
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:25,440
Speaker 1: and man, you know, I stumbled across another Lower Vandercam

1030
00:46:25,520 --> 00:46:28,319
Speaker 1: gym recently about whether or not it's okay to to

1031
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:30,560
Speaker 1: work from the beach. I think this is in the times,

1032
00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:33,279
Speaker 1: but basically her argument is that if working a little

1033
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:35,800
Speaker 1: bit on vacation, if it allows you to get away

1034
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 1: more often, that it's likely a good thing, and if

1035
00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:42,160
Speaker 1: you make room for some small, like vacation style getaways

1036
00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:45,440
Speaker 1: during like your typically non vacation work days, that it

1037
00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:48,520
Speaker 1: can provide some helpful balance. So, for instance, like if

1038
00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:50,840
Speaker 1: you can get out for an afternoon hike or or

1039
00:46:50,880 --> 00:46:53,000
Speaker 1: a bike ride or like a surf session, but if

1040
00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:55,439
Speaker 1: that forces you to work after the kids go to bed,

1041
00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:57,799
Speaker 1: if you have to shift your hours a little a

1042
00:46:57,800 --> 00:47:00,239
Speaker 1: little bit. If you have to move your time well,

1043
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,200
Speaker 1: that could be well worth it to you. In a

1044
00:47:02,239 --> 00:47:03,959
Speaker 1: time study she did for for one of her books

1045
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:07,080
Speaker 1: you mentioned. Yeah, there's a couple and her and her

1046
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:09,040
Speaker 1: husband they go on hikes during the middle of the

1047
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 1: day because it allows them to like basically help each

1048
00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:13,439
Speaker 1: other out, like they're able to. It's not the goal

1049
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 1: of a hike, like goal of the hike is to

1050
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:17,480
Speaker 1: get out because it's beautiful, get some exercise, get some

1051
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:19,759
Speaker 1: fresh air, they get to reconnect talk about stuff, but

1052
00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:23,239
Speaker 1: they happen sometimes to solve problems for each other, for

1053
00:47:23,480 --> 00:47:26,759
Speaker 1: each of their individual jobs. And guess what, they're able

1054
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:29,000
Speaker 1: to sit down and work on the spreadsheets at night

1055
00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 1: at nine pm, because who wants to go hiking in

1056
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:33,840
Speaker 1: the dark? Nobody wants to do that. And so the

1057
00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 1: ability to to move time around a little bit is

1058
00:47:37,160 --> 00:47:39,680
Speaker 1: an incredible benefit if you have the luxury, if you

1059
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:42,239
Speaker 1: have the flexibility to do that within your job. Yeah,

1060
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:44,040
Speaker 1: and I think that's again when we talked about the

1061
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:46,799
Speaker 1: double edged short of technology. The reality is that you

1062
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:49,200
Speaker 1: probably can get in a quick twenty or thirty minute

1063
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:51,960
Speaker 1: work session on a vacation and I'm not saying that's ideal,

1064
00:47:52,040 --> 00:47:54,480
Speaker 1: but I'm saying if it allows you to take more vacations,

1065
00:47:54,719 --> 00:47:56,920
Speaker 1: then maybe that is a good thing. And I like

1066
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:59,319
Speaker 1: the way Laura thinks about it, because because some people

1067
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:01,759
Speaker 1: are more rigid about their hours and when they let

1068
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:04,560
Speaker 1: work interrupt it, but because of the way work has

1069
00:48:04,600 --> 00:48:07,960
Speaker 1: evolved in our modern culture, we have a lot more

1070
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:10,839
Speaker 1: say over when and how we work, and that can

1071
00:48:10,840 --> 00:48:12,759
Speaker 1: be bad or that can be good. That can allow

1072
00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:15,760
Speaker 1: us to work a little bit at night, just adding

1073
00:48:15,800 --> 00:48:18,360
Speaker 1: to our the amount of work we're doing overall, or

1074
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:20,160
Speaker 1: it allows to take that break during the day so

1075
00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:22,200
Speaker 1: that we can kind of time shift when we work.

1076
00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:24,640
Speaker 1: And I think you have to make sure you're setting

1077
00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:27,600
Speaker 1: up those bumper guards, those those guardrails, just like you

1078
00:48:27,600 --> 00:48:29,680
Speaker 1: would with the Bowling Alley, to make sure that you're

1079
00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:32,640
Speaker 1: not overdoing it and allowing that technology to to run

1080
00:48:32,640 --> 00:48:34,120
Speaker 1: your life. But you have to use it in a

1081
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:36,480
Speaker 1: way that's going to allow you to take the time

1082
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:38,840
Speaker 1: you need and want for the things that matter to

1083
00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:41,840
Speaker 1: you that go beyond work exactly. Yeah, time is like

1084
00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:43,840
Speaker 1: one of the most fungible things right the ability for

1085
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:45,560
Speaker 1: us to just to kind of decide that like, okay, well,

1086
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:46,960
Speaker 1: I wasn gonna use this time for this thing, but

1087
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:48,880
Speaker 1: now I'm gonna kind of push it over here. It

1088
00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:51,440
Speaker 1: just depends on what it is that we're trying to achieve,

1089
00:48:51,560 --> 00:48:55,239
Speaker 1: but it's simultaneously, though, it's important to be careful when

1090
00:48:55,239 --> 00:48:58,279
Speaker 1: you start blurring the lines between work and life or

1091
00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:01,560
Speaker 1: work and play, because it can be difficult to perceive

1092
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:03,520
Speaker 1: what's going on below the surface. Like one of the

1093
00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 1: things I've learned from reading about Warren Buffett is that, man,

1094
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 1: he was a terrible father, he was a terrible husband

1095
00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:12,279
Speaker 1: and even though he was present at home, his mind

1096
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:15,359
Speaker 1: was elsewhere. He was analyzing balance sheets in his mind,

1097
00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:18,160
Speaker 1: thinking about these businesses, these deals that he was considering,

1098
00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:21,960
Speaker 1: and that meant that he wasn't very involved and he

1099
00:49:22,040 --> 00:49:24,600
Speaker 1: was not very engaged when it came to raising and

1100
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:27,240
Speaker 1: growing his family. And so it's I don't I mentioned

1101
00:49:27,239 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: that because when we are on our own, sometimes we

1102
00:49:30,560 --> 00:49:32,480
Speaker 1: might be tempted to work a little bit harder and

1103
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:35,359
Speaker 1: we alone are the ones who bear the brunt of

1104
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:37,839
Speaker 1: the sacrifices we make. Right Um. But when you start

1105
00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:41,040
Speaker 1: involving other people, right, like you've got a significant other,

1106
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:44,160
Speaker 1: then it gets a little bit trickier because assuming like,

1107
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,600
Speaker 1: unless you find somebody who shares the exact same goals

1108
00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:50,480
Speaker 1: and timelines and schedules that you do, you're gonna have

1109
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:52,839
Speaker 1: to figure out how to make life work. But with kids, man,

1110
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:55,399
Speaker 1: it can be it's even more difficult, like they don't

1111
00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:58,239
Speaker 1: understand that we have to work, you know. I mean

1112
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,839
Speaker 1: they learned quickly that three old is always like, Daddy,

1113
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:03,320
Speaker 1: Youre going to school too. I'm like Kinda, yeah, Buddy,

1114
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:07,799
Speaker 1: I am actually. But, like I mentioned that, because we

1115
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:10,520
Speaker 1: we have to keep in mind the impact that the

1116
00:50:10,560 --> 00:50:13,439
Speaker 1: sacrifices we choose to make, the impacts that it has

1117
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:15,879
Speaker 1: on other people and the other things that that we

1118
00:50:15,960 --> 00:50:19,080
Speaker 1: claim and that we have identified are important within our

1119
00:50:19,080 --> 00:50:21,319
Speaker 1: own lives. Yeah, or so, Matt as I was kind

1120
00:50:21,320 --> 00:50:23,960
Speaker 1: of like we're getting ready for this this episode, I

1121
00:50:24,360 --> 00:50:27,000
Speaker 1: stumbled upon this old, old, Old New York Times article

1122
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:30,279
Speaker 1: literally from the Year Nineteen Ten and President Howard Taft He,

1123
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:32,520
Speaker 1: actually he was quoted and he said that people should

1124
00:50:32,520 --> 00:50:35,239
Speaker 1: take three months of vacation a year. I was kind

1125
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:38,000
Speaker 1: of shocked by that. I was like where's, where's that

1126
00:50:38,040 --> 00:50:40,399
Speaker 1: sort of mindset these days? Like it, it's it doesn't

1127
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 1: very new and progress. That feels very Norwegian or whatever. Yeah,

1128
00:50:45,280 --> 00:50:47,279
Speaker 1: he kind of does well and I was like, well,

1129
00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:49,440
Speaker 1: that's that's probably not realistic for a lot of folks.

1130
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:51,759
Speaker 1: But when you go back to the John Maynar kines thing,

1131
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,960
Speaker 1: if we, if we were using our productive hours more

1132
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:57,560
Speaker 1: efficiently and we were cutting back on our spending, using

1133
00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:00,640
Speaker 1: our money more efficiently too, like we probably could enjoy

1134
00:51:00,719 --> 00:51:03,640
Speaker 1: more leisure time. And we think the reality is that

1135
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:05,959
Speaker 1: you can have it all, maybe not all at once,

1136
00:51:06,280 --> 00:51:07,960
Speaker 1: but you can have a career that you enjoy, you

1137
00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:10,719
Speaker 1: can have chunks of meaningful family time that matter, you

1138
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:14,000
Speaker 1: can have personal hobbies that you regularly partake in, but

1139
00:51:14,120 --> 00:51:18,319
Speaker 1: it will likely mean proactively d prioritizing your career. And

1140
00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:21,239
Speaker 1: one of the five regrets of the dying is having

1141
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:24,000
Speaker 1: worked too much. So maybe we should learn from the

1142
00:51:24,040 --> 00:51:28,400
Speaker 1: reality of what hospice doctors and nurses tell us about

1143
00:51:28,760 --> 00:51:31,520
Speaker 1: the regrets of people who are on their deathbed and

1144
00:51:31,560 --> 00:51:34,960
Speaker 1: we should make changes now. My guess is, though, that

1145
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:37,400
Speaker 1: most folks that are friend doc G, who we had

1146
00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:39,640
Speaker 1: on recently, Matt, who is a hospice doctor, c well,

1147
00:51:39,680 --> 00:51:42,040
Speaker 1: they probably don't wish that they had never worked. They

1148
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:45,520
Speaker 1: probably found satisfaction, they would have injustitute and would not

1149
00:51:45,600 --> 00:51:48,359
Speaker 1: have lived a fulfilling life. In that way around, you've

1150
00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:50,319
Speaker 1: got to have some money, and the reality is, like

1151
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,840
Speaker 1: work life balance, it's not necessarily a set number of

1152
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:54,759
Speaker 1: hours you can't work beyond it's it's more of a

1153
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:58,120
Speaker 1: lifestyle framework. And if you don't design your life for yourself,

1154
00:51:58,160 --> 00:52:00,239
Speaker 1: somebody else is going to do it and typically most

1155
00:52:00,239 --> 00:52:02,760
Speaker 1: people that is their boss who is kind of determining

1156
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:06,719
Speaker 1: the trajectory of of their lives instead of themselves and

1157
00:52:06,760 --> 00:52:08,680
Speaker 1: what they want to do. It's your life and you're

1158
00:52:08,680 --> 00:52:11,000
Speaker 1: in the driver's seat. And and the reality too, is, Matt,

1159
00:52:11,360 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 1: that the job market is full of opportunities right now

1160
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:17,160
Speaker 1: for folks who are realizing maybe my current career track,

1161
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:19,800
Speaker 1: it's it's not the best one, it's it's not a

1162
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:21,319
Speaker 1: great one for me to be on. It's not my

1163
00:52:21,400 --> 00:52:23,840
Speaker 1: best long term interest. That is the perfect time to

1164
00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:26,880
Speaker 1: try to find something different, something that allows you to

1165
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:28,879
Speaker 1: have more balance, something that even allows you to make

1166
00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:31,520
Speaker 1: more money. I don't know that there's a better time

1167
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:35,040
Speaker 1: to be thinking through these things and making adjustments, because

1168
00:52:35,440 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 1: a whole lot of workers have a whole lot more

1169
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:40,399
Speaker 1: say over what they do, how they do it, when

1170
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:43,560
Speaker 1: they do it than ever before. Exactly. Yeah, yeah, switching

1171
00:52:43,640 --> 00:52:45,440
Speaker 1: jobs is the best way to make more money. But

1172
00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:47,400
Speaker 1: even if you like the current job that you're with,

1173
00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:49,959
Speaker 1: just think through like, like Joel said, like design your life,

1174
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:51,840
Speaker 1: think through what it is you want your day to

1175
00:52:51,880 --> 00:52:54,000
Speaker 1: day to to look like, and then just start living

1176
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:56,799
Speaker 1: it out. It truly isn't anymore complicated than that. And,

1177
00:52:56,880 --> 00:52:59,840
Speaker 1: granted your you might have to set different boundaries in place.

1178
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,560
Speaker 1: You might have to institute certain rules at home, whether

1179
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:05,040
Speaker 1: that's when it is that you're going to be on

1180
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:06,640
Speaker 1: email or when it is that you even have your

1181
00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:09,200
Speaker 1: phone within reach, but the goal here is to get

1182
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 1: you to think about what that looks like for you

1183
00:53:11,239 --> 00:53:13,680
Speaker 1: and take some of those practical steps to start actually

1184
00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:17,279
Speaker 1: achieving it. Uh, you got anything else? Okay, don't like

1185
00:53:17,320 --> 00:53:19,400
Speaker 1: work dominate your life, man, don't. Yeah, I don't do it,

1186
00:53:19,600 --> 00:53:22,480
Speaker 1: enjoy it. It's great cutting back a little bit as

1187
00:53:22,480 --> 00:53:25,480
Speaker 1: a just as an American population. Granted, there are some

1188
00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:28,040
Speaker 1: people who aren't working enough, but generally speaking, we tend

1189
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:30,879
Speaker 1: to work too much. In particular, I'm guessing a lot

1190
00:53:30,920 --> 00:53:33,759
Speaker 1: of the listeners who listened to our show Julia's UH,

1191
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:36,319
Speaker 1: some quick notes on our beer for this episode. This

1192
00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:39,360
Speaker 1: was s'mores by wicked weed brewing. This is an imperial

1193
00:53:39,360 --> 00:53:42,879
Speaker 1: stout brewed with chocolate, Vanilla and cinnamon. Did you taste

1194
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:45,560
Speaker 1: those flavors? Uh, you know, it was kind of muddled

1195
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:47,279
Speaker 1: to me. Honestly, I thought it was. I thought it

1196
00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:49,120
Speaker 1: was okay. I was like, man, this beer would be

1197
00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:51,439
Speaker 1: better if I was sitting around campfire eating an actual

1198
00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:54,319
Speaker 1: smore but I don't know, like the flames again. I'm

1199
00:53:54,360 --> 00:53:56,960
Speaker 1: just not super super impressed with this stout series from

1200
00:53:56,960 --> 00:53:58,680
Speaker 1: w could weed. I like with the weed as a brewery.

1201
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,920
Speaker 1: I prefer their Sour Beers. Yeah, this one was okay. Honestly,

1202
00:54:01,960 --> 00:54:04,080
Speaker 1: if every single one of the beers, of the ones

1203
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:05,799
Speaker 1: we had four of them, if every single one of

1204
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:08,240
Speaker 1: those had been barrel aged in a different type of barrel,

1205
00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:11,520
Speaker 1: that would have given it that additional depth and I

1206
00:54:11,560 --> 00:54:13,960
Speaker 1: think each one of those would have been singing a

1207
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 1: little bit more, like like some more bourbon barrel action

1208
00:54:16,239 --> 00:54:18,279
Speaker 1: would have been yeah, just a little more depth. Um,

1209
00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:20,640
Speaker 1: it's almost as if these these beers were a little

1210
00:54:20,640 --> 00:54:23,440
Speaker 1: two dimensional, right, and maybe some of that aging, some

1211
00:54:23,480 --> 00:54:26,440
Speaker 1: of those additional flavors would have allowed us to really

1212
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:28,759
Speaker 1: dive into it a little bit more and and and

1213
00:54:28,840 --> 00:54:31,279
Speaker 1: be huge fans. They're still good, totally, still good. You

1214
00:54:31,320 --> 00:54:33,200
Speaker 1: pick these up with these really expensive no, it was

1215
00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:34,520
Speaker 1: a four pack. That's one part of the Reson I

1216
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:35,880
Speaker 1: picked it up. was like four different beers in a

1217
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:37,799
Speaker 1: four pack. It's great, like you don't normally. You don't

1218
00:54:37,800 --> 00:54:40,719
Speaker 1: normally get that, so got it. But yeah, it was

1219
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:42,520
Speaker 1: I don't know, it was like eleven bucks. Or Okay,

1220
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:44,960
Speaker 1: so eleven twelve bucks for for these guys that like

1221
00:54:45,080 --> 00:54:47,439
Speaker 1: that feels appropriate. If this was like an eighteen dollar

1222
00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:50,040
Speaker 1: four pack'd be I would I would not be happy.

1223
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:51,440
Speaker 1: So much of it does come down to the value,

1224
00:54:51,480 --> 00:54:53,560
Speaker 1: comes down to the cost of the beer, and there

1225
00:54:53,560 --> 00:54:55,560
Speaker 1: are some beers we have that, no matter what, you're

1226
00:54:55,600 --> 00:54:57,759
Speaker 1: just like that is phenomen I don't care what you

1227
00:54:57,760 --> 00:54:59,880
Speaker 1: paid for it, but that's just an excellent beer. If

1228
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:03,160
Speaker 1: paid two dollars for that beer, even more amazing. We

1229
00:55:03,160 --> 00:55:05,080
Speaker 1: need to go get more of that. But this was

1230
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:07,400
Speaker 1: one that, yeah, you start thinking, okay, how much, how

1231
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:10,680
Speaker 1: much were those? Okay, not too expensive. Definitely worth checking

1232
00:55:10,719 --> 00:55:13,800
Speaker 1: out if you like a variety of some different stoubts

1233
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:16,759
Speaker 1: in your fridge, especially if we're getting closer to fall

1234
00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:18,680
Speaker 1: time right. You know what, man a. that's gonna do

1235
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:21,319
Speaker 1: it for this episode, Rabbit. For folks who want the

1236
00:55:21,320 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 1: show notes links to anything that we mentioned, will have

1237
00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:26,160
Speaker 1: those available on our website at how to money dot com.

1238
00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:28,480
Speaker 1: That's right, buddy. So until next time, best friends out,

1239
00:55:28,560 --> 00:55:29,799
Speaker 1: best friends out,