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Speaker 1: Good morning and welcome to the Counterpoints and we how
Speaker 1: you doing.
Speaker 4: I'm good. We've got a lot of news to get
Speaker 4: through today. Even though we're so close to the holidays,
Speaker 4: the news cycle just won't slow down.
Speaker 1: It won't, it won't.
Speaker 5: I did want to start out with one quick personal thing,
Speaker 5: which is apologies for this show getting out as late
Speaker 5: as it is. About two weeks ago, my wife was
Speaker 5: diagnosed with breast cancer. That might also explain I'm kind
Speaker 5: of losing my voice. At the same time, this will
Speaker 5: be our last show plus We're doing counterpoints Friday, Christmas
Speaker 5: in New Ye's breaks, so we'll see you guys again
Speaker 5: in January.
Speaker 1: It's a you know, they've.
Speaker 5: They've made extraordinary advances when it comes to the treatment
Speaker 5: of breast cancer, which and she's already getting the treatment,
Speaker 5: and we're very confident that this will be something that's
Speaker 5: just that we deal with in the past.
Speaker 1: But I have to bear with us a little bit
Speaker 1: as we go through that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, we're all pulling for you, guys. Ryan, You've
Speaker 4: got all your kids, a lot to worry about, and.
Speaker 5: You know we've got speaking of Health and Human Services maransition. Ever,
Speaker 5: luckily there's going to be a very steady hand on
Speaker 5: the till. RFK Junior was on Capitol Hill yesterday meeting
Speaker 5: with senators. Looks like he actually might make it and
Speaker 5: become Secretary of Health Human Service.
Speaker 1: We're going to talk about that.
Speaker 5: A bunch of folks are in Doha trying to cinch
Speaker 5: up a ceasefire deal in Gaza. Saudi Arabia has gotten
Speaker 5: involved as well. We're going to talk about that over
Speaker 5: at drops O News. We kind of busted The New
Speaker 5: York Times relying on a hamas adjacent source to verify documents.
Speaker 1: We talked to the source about those documents. He said, bro.
Speaker 5: I told The New York Times, I have real doubts
Speaker 5: about whether those are authentic documents or not. And they
Speaker 5: just ran with it.
Speaker 1: Anyway.
Speaker 4: I hope he did say bro.
Speaker 5: I don't think he said bro, but close enough. So
Speaker 5: we'll get we'll get into that AOC got crushed in
Speaker 5: her effort to become a chair or ranking member of oversight.
Speaker 1: Luigi's getting charged as a terrorist. What else we got, Yeah.
Speaker 4: He was indicted last night, So we have updates on that.
Speaker 4: Some interesting polling. That'll be uh, it'll be an interesting
Speaker 4: conversation topic. Maybe for everyone's holiday dinner. You can talk
Speaker 4: about this point.
Speaker 1: I was.
Speaker 5: I was coming out of GW Hospital on Monday.
Speaker 4: I can't wait to see this.
Speaker 5: I don't think we're ever going to see it. But
Speaker 5: I got stopped on the street by two reporters. So
Speaker 5: do you have a second to talk about the health
Speaker 5: insurance industry? They're doing man on the Street interviews with
Speaker 5: people in Washington, d C. They happened to running a
Speaker 5: round with British accentors. They said they're from Sky News.
Speaker 5: I'm like, sure, I'll do this, Yeah, but.
Speaker 4: We won't spoil it in case they do, Eric, because
Speaker 4: what you.
Speaker 1: Said was at the end they asked my name, I
Speaker 1: told him.
Speaker 4: Amazing. Well, stay tuned see if that goes to air.
Speaker 4: We're going to do updates from well, actually there's a
Speaker 4: lot going on in Capitol Hill, so we will be
Speaker 4: talking a little bit about what happened with Alexandro Acasio
Speaker 4: Cortez and Connolly for the Oversight Committee. It sounds like
Speaker 4: I feel like we're usually talking about Republicans when we're
Speaker 4: talking about random parliamentary stuff, but this time it's den
Speaker 4: fun one.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's all kinds of parliamentary stuff randomly going on
Speaker 4: with Republicans right now as they look to keep the
Speaker 4: government funded. So we'll probably touch on that a bit
Speaker 4: as well. Ryan updates from Ukraine and updates from both
Speaker 4: Germany and Canada, where the leadership is in dire straits.
Speaker 1: Center left is collapsing all over the world.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a good way to put it. Macron as well,
Speaker 4: maybe we can talk about that too. He's facing some
Speaker 4: stiff troubles right ahead. But to return to Robert F.
Speaker 4: Kennedy Junior, let's start with his trip around Capitol Hill,
Speaker 4: which seems to be going very very well. I want
Speaker 4: to start with this mashup of clips so you can
Speaker 4: just get a little flavor of what's been happening over
Speaker 4: the last couple of days. As RFK Junior meets to
Speaker 4: discuss his confirmation with senators.
Speaker 6: Here you go.
Speaker 1: Can I follow up on Robert Kennedy. He's on the
Speaker 1: hill today, he's meeting with senators.
Speaker 5: What do you say to people who are worried that
Speaker 5: his views on vaccines will translate into policies that will
Speaker 5: make their kids less safe.
Speaker 6: No, I think he's going to be much less radical
Speaker 6: than you would think. I think he's got a very
Speaker 6: open mind, or I wouldn't have put him there. He's
Speaker 6: going to be very much less radical. But there are problems.
Speaker 6: I mean, we don't do as well as a lot
Speaker 6: of other nations, and those nations use nothing.
Speaker 3: We trying to gain your peace support to lead the
Speaker 3: Deparminent of Health and Human Services is expected to be
Speaker 3: pressed on his views on vaccine.
Speaker 4: Senator, you met with RFK Junior yesterday?
Speaker 1: What was your takeaway?
Speaker 7: Very impressive. I mean, here's a guy that wants to
Speaker 7: focus on health. It's called Health and Human Services. Health
Speaker 7: not sickness. So he wants to make us healthy is
Speaker 7: exactly what we are doing. I ran the biggest hospital company.
Speaker 7: I know, we've got to figure out how to get
Speaker 7: people healthy, and he's going to do I think he's
Speaker 7: going to do a great job with regard to vaccines.
Speaker 7: If you listen to what he says, he is pro vaccine.
Speaker 7: What he wants is give you information so you can
Speaker 7: decide what you put into your body or your child's body.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 7: That makes all the sense of the world to me. Yeah,
Speaker 7: I'm moreliation.
Speaker 4: It's great to see you.
Speaker 8: It was so appreciated to get away from guessing and
Speaker 8: do facts, do science, get behind the science and stay
Speaker 8: with it. Don't be guessing. And that's what a lot
Speaker 8: of these vaccines have done. They haven't been one hundred
Speaker 8: percent proven. If you look at the number of vaccines
Speaker 8: these young babies get over a short period of time,
Speaker 8: it's dozens and dozens of them, and he's totally against that.
Speaker 8: He wants to make sure that parents understand the good
Speaker 8: and the bad.
Speaker 1: And the ugly.
Speaker 4: So I also grabbed about fifteen minutes with Senator Tarberville
Speaker 4: after his meeting with RFK Junior. He said something similar
Speaker 4: but in a little bit more detail. He said he
Speaker 4: talked to RFK Junior about how he has a grandchild
Speaker 4: coming and he was saying, you know, there are all
Speaker 4: these the vaccine schedule, there are all of these vaccines
Speaker 4: and rfs, and you said to him, we only got
Speaker 4: three when we were kids. And that was a little
Speaker 4: bit from their conversation was like, it's basically you've just
Speaker 4: had all of these. It was like polio, smallpox and
Speaker 4: something else that you've just been added up and added up.
Speaker 4: And so Taperville is using this line that he thinks
Speaker 4: r f K Junior is going to quote follow the science,
Speaker 4: and so a little bit of that from Rick Scott
Speaker 4: as well. Part of this is a sincere ideological conversion
Speaker 4: from people like Tuberville, who has been now questioning people
Speaker 4: about red dye forty. I mean, you just never saw
Speaker 4: this from Republicans, right, you know this better than I do.
Speaker 4: I mean that it was there was this ideological and
Speaker 4: political difference to the business community to the business community,
Speaker 4: and it's there have been sincere ideological conversions. A lot
Speaker 4: of it is obviously political. Now let's actually skip ahead
Speaker 4: to a three because this is what Taperville told me.
Speaker 4: His first question was to rfk Junior. It was about abortion,
Speaker 4: he said, And this was going to be the big
Speaker 4: sticking point with Robert F. Kennedy Junior being confirmed by
Speaker 4: Republican Senate. Josh Holly posted a thread last night saying
Speaker 4: that he got all of these concessions, which I think
Speaker 4: are very significant concessions. Whether you're like pro choice or
Speaker 4: pro life, these are significant concessions from someone who says
Speaker 4: that he's pro choice. Reinstating the Mexico City policy, That's
Speaker 4: what Josh Holly said. What is that you committed for foreign.
Speaker 5: Funding, non initiated into the lingo of the abortion wars.
Speaker 4: Taxpayer funding for abortion internationally and domestically is what he
Speaker 4: committed to Holly, Mexico City. Mexico City is foreign, right. Yeah.
Speaker 4: But he also said in the same post that he
Speaker 4: would end taxpayer funding for abortions domestically. Does that mean
Speaker 4: probably Planned Parenthood taxpayer.
Speaker 5: Funding because currently Planned Parenthood doesn't use the money that
Speaker 5: gets from the Federgarment for abortion services.
Speaker 1: But what he's saying is don't give them a penny period.
Speaker 4: Perhaps, Yeah, I mean they don't specifically say that, but
Speaker 4: that's how I would That's how Republicans would interpret it,
Speaker 4: and I think other people already have interpreted that way.
Speaker 4: Reinstating the bar on titled ten funds going to organizations
Speaker 4: that promote abortions. So that's probably also a number one
Speaker 4: on Planned parent I'm not entirely sure about that. But
Speaker 4: he also said, and I think this is the most significant,
Speaker 4: that all of his deputies, according to Holly at HHS,
Speaker 4: would be pro life. So that's basically Robert F. Kennedy Junior,
Speaker 4: man who says he is per choice, saying I will
Speaker 4: have a pro life Health and Human Services department.
Speaker 5: Right, And then the problem there is that Planned Parenthood,
Speaker 5: as you know, does an enormous amount of healthcare services
Speaker 5: for low income women use who use them as because
Speaker 5: they can't get any services anywhere else. So he's saying
Speaker 5: he's all about health, but obviously those types of services
Speaker 5: are crucial to health, but he's just going to kind
Speaker 5: of capitulate on it in order to get in there.
Speaker 5: I guess nobody should have expected him to die on
Speaker 5: like the altar of women's rights. That's not what RFK
Speaker 5: Junior was ever going to do.
Speaker 4: His like Big Life's Mission is vaccines, you know, and
Speaker 4: pharma and food and yeah, I would imagine. I mean,
Speaker 4: he's always actually talked about this in the language of
Speaker 4: bodily autonomy, which is where it gets really tricky for
Speaker 4: him to now come out and talk about how he'll
Speaker 4: be running essentially a pro life HHS. The reason that
Speaker 4: it's worth going through this Hally thread is that this
Speaker 4: is enough that I think this will be enough to
Speaker 4: put him on a blidepath to confirmation with Senate Republicans.
Speaker 4: This should satisfy them for the most part on the
Speaker 4: pro life issue, on the issue of abortion, like you're not.
Speaker 4: This is going to settle the pro life groups down.
Speaker 4: They're going to stop lobbying against him or chirping against him.
Speaker 4: And now his tough thing is going to be it
Speaker 4: we heard Trump address, It is going to be talking
Speaker 4: to like Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins about vaccines and
Speaker 4: people who are even less moderate than them. Tuberville Scott
Speaker 4: said they've been satisfied in their conversations, but that's still
Speaker 4: a sticking point.
Speaker 5: Yeah, my guess would be, and tell me if you
Speaker 5: think I'm right getting into the Republican mind that as
Speaker 5: long as he's good for them on abortion, they actually
Speaker 5: don't care about ahhs.
Speaker 1: It's like it's like not a.
Speaker 5: Top tier concern of theirs, Are they really Oh no,
Speaker 5: He's gonna run AHHS.
Speaker 1: Into the ground.
Speaker 5: So boy, that would be that would be so sad
Speaker 5: for Republicans if something like that happened.
Speaker 4: What's funny is that I think they used to care
Speaker 4: about HHS to like protect business interests, right, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean? Like it was it was interesting.
Speaker 5: That, Yeah, they're like, okay, they're they're they're adopting some
Speaker 5: of the crunchy, h like hippie vibes around.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like what you would call like a raw milk.
Speaker 4: Politics, Yeah exactly.
Speaker 5: But Trump seems to like be nowhere near that. And
Speaker 5: so that's why you saw at the top of the
Speaker 5: segment there hit him saying like, no, he's not really
Speaker 5: into all that. So I think basically what they're trying
Speaker 5: to say is, Okay, he's going to be really good
Speaker 5: an abortion for us, and he's not actually going to
Speaker 5: do these things. He's not going to ban the vaccines.
Speaker 5: He's not gonna stop you from getting the vaccines. You
Speaker 5: might have out there ideas about it, but he's he's
Speaker 5: not actually going to implement them. Yeah, which is kind
Speaker 5: of a funny, you know, way to kind of get
Speaker 5: yourself through.
Speaker 4: But yeah, it's I mean, I think it'll probably work
Speaker 4: at this point, although Talverfilt told me he thinks that
Speaker 4: Democrats are essentially saving their biggest attacks on Robert F.
Speaker 4: Kennedy Junior until after the Holidays, when the confirmation process
Speaker 4: is really heating up and actually like people have to
Speaker 4: make the decision to vote yes or no.
Speaker 1: So do you think he gets through as of right now?
Speaker 4: I would say yes. I think there's just like the
Speaker 4: voters really really like Robert F. Kennedy Junior, republic The
Speaker 4: Republican base really likes Robert F. Kennedy Junior for whatever reason.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: So I also think, just from a Democratic small D perspective,
Speaker 5: like if you win the White House and you run
Speaker 5: saying you're going to like bring a certain person into
Speaker 5: the White House, right all right, guy one, Yeah, he
Speaker 5: said he was going to put this guy in a
Speaker 5: job that's very similar to this, Like this is not
Speaker 5: a surprise.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and people voted for him, so.
Speaker 4: Go ahead, well and really quickly. This is a great
Speaker 4: transition to a two if we can go back to
Speaker 4: a great Christian PARENTI piece and compact about how RFK
Speaker 4: Junior could quote take on the CIA. Now, you can't
Speaker 4: do that from HHS. But the position you can do
Speaker 4: that from is a trusted Trump advisor, a literal member
Speaker 4: of his cabinet, which r F K Junior now is.
Speaker 4: That's another thing I've been trying to sort of sniff
Speaker 4: out a little bit, is like, are you guys he
Speaker 4: just treating him as the crazy hippie uncle at the
Speaker 4: Thanksgiving table who you just start to like, you'll wink
Speaker 4: and at each other across the table while he's talking
Speaker 4: about whatever. No, he's actually very much in the inner circle.
Speaker 4: He has trusted and valued and so to that extent
Speaker 4: he could do a little bit of what PARENTI talks
Speaker 4: about here.
Speaker 5: And the CIA links to the HHS are to AHHS
Speaker 5: are kind of interesting. So he and he writes at
Speaker 5: one point this is I thought it a really interesting
Speaker 5: passage parent he writes. Between twenty thirteen and twenty twenty, USAID,
Speaker 5: which is basically a CIA front, along with Anthony Fauci's NIAID,
Speaker 5: and the Defense Threat Reduction Agency of the US Department
Speaker 5: of Defense all gave millions of dollars to a New
Speaker 5: York based nonprofit called EcoHealth Alliance. We've reported about that
Speaker 5: over and over run by doctor Peter Dajak. EcoHealth Alliance
Speaker 5: in turn funded gain a function research at the Wuhan
Speaker 5: Institute of Virology. In twenty fifteen, EcoHealth Alliance also pitched
Speaker 5: in q Tel, which is basically the CIA's private equity firm,
Speaker 5: for funding with a proposal called quote Identifying Predictable Patterns
Speaker 5: in Disease Emergence. We don't know the results of these
Speaker 5: proposals because in q Tel provides limited public information on
Speaker 5: its investments and then parente rights. Though thoroughly documented, this
Speaker 5: set of facts is so insane that they make any
Speaker 5: person reiterating them sound insane by association. It's one of
Speaker 5: the kind of advantages that the CIA and the USAID
Speaker 5: and the Defense Department have had in the entire bioweapons
Speaker 5: space is that it just sounds completely nuts. And RFK
Speaker 5: Junior has written an entire book about this. Yes, the
Speaker 5: Truth about Wuhan, I think it's called or something about
Speaker 5: Fauci something. Anyway, In any event, this is not a
Speaker 5: kind of hobby horse for him, like this is this
Speaker 5: this could.
Speaker 1: Get interesting yeah, you have to.
Speaker 5: Meanwhile, in the ndaastite, they shoveled a whole bunch more
Speaker 5: money towards gain a function research that's he headed towards
Speaker 5: passage this week.
Speaker 4: Yes, and towards the Global Engagement Center that was funneling
Speaker 4: money towards basically websites that were recommending suppression of for example,
Speaker 4: the Federalists and the Daily Wire. So it's it's the
Speaker 4: DA is getting interesting. But Robert F. Kennedy Junior, and
Speaker 4: to your point about Parente's links from HHS, USA I
Speaker 4: D to Eco Health, then all of these like you,
Speaker 4: in order to actually change this have to basically know
Speaker 4: the ins ou It's like you need to do chapter
Speaker 4: in verse in them while you're sleeping. And he can
Speaker 4: do that, which should be terrifying to the people who
Speaker 4: benefit from those fives.
Speaker 5: And I don't think RFJ k Jr. Remotely has all
Speaker 5: the answers here. But I also know that we are
Speaker 5: a deeply unhealthy country. You can just travel around the
Speaker 5: country or look around, and you can tell you can
Speaker 5: just see it like we need help.
Speaker 1: Like we're not in a good place.
Speaker 5: And the corporate capture of our our food, our medicines
Speaker 5: is like obviously a huge problem. So if RFK Junior
Speaker 5: comes in as a wrecking ball just because he doesn't
Speaker 5: know how to rebuild, it doesn't mean that a little
Speaker 5: bit of creative destruction wouldn't be useful. Because whatever path
Speaker 5: we're on is not a.
Speaker 4: Good one, right, Yeah, creative destruction.
Speaker 5: The pollutants, the chemicals, the plastics, all all of it
Speaker 5: together is like we're we're on a suicide path.
Speaker 4: Yeah, creative destructions, I think the best case scenario here.
Speaker 1: So that's what people voted for.
Speaker 4: So it's exactly what people Although Tuberville also told me
Speaker 4: he was satisfied by r f K juniors answers on climate,
Speaker 4: so that might not be so good for the country.
Speaker 1: Left what did what did Tulverville hear?
Speaker 4: I don't know. I wasn't there, Ryan, I just asked questions.
Speaker 5: Rf K Junior is willing to give up on climate too,
Speaker 5: So actually I bet what. So here's how I bet
Speaker 5: RFK Junior finesses the climate issue with deniers like Tuberville.
Speaker 5: What I bet he said is that we over emphasize
Speaker 5: carbon yeah yeah, and that we don't emphasize enough the
Speaker 5: problems of plastics which come from carbon by the way,
Speaker 5: don't tell Tuberville that and all the other poisons in
Speaker 5: our that go into our bloodstream and our actual streams.
Speaker 5: And so he's not so rf Kju is not saying
Speaker 5: climate is not a problem. He's saying that the a
Speaker 5: mono maniacal fixation just on climate misses the holistic problem
Speaker 5: facing the Earth. And I think Tuberville would hear that
Speaker 5: and be like, oh, he's he's with me. He doesn't care.
Speaker 4: About he said, he agrees with me on climate.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so you can watch, I guarantee you that's how
Speaker 5: that conversation went.
Speaker 4: And tub it was like, yeah, well, don't tell anybody
Speaker 4: where the plastic comes from because it gets really sticky. Yeah,
Speaker 4: all right, Ryan, we're going to be talking about Haretz here.
Speaker 4: What have you got for us?
Speaker 5: So, yeah, there's a bunch of reporting coming out of
Speaker 5: the Mid East that they're getting increasingly close to an
Speaker 5: actual ceasefire deal. I tend to think that they're exaggerating
Speaker 5: how close we are.
Speaker 1: It's just my gut, and you know, following.
Speaker 5: This probably closely that I suspect net Yahoo will continue
Speaker 5: to drag this out right until January nineteenth and reach
Speaker 5: a deal on like January twentieth. What Hamas has said
Speaker 5: publicly is that they are ready to make a deal
Speaker 5: today as long as Israel stops adding new conditions constantly.
Speaker 1: So what so what is happening? As they narrow each.
Speaker 5: Gap, then Israel will put in like kind of one
Speaker 5: more one more new thing, say oh, you do this
Speaker 5: like and then then it takes another couple of days.
Speaker 5: People gotta meet again, you gotta pass the paper back
Speaker 5: and forth.
Speaker 4: Well we saw this by the way around. It was
Speaker 4: like late August around the DNC. We were in another cycle.
Speaker 4: I mean, this seems to be closer. Was saying.
Speaker 5: I'm also was saying the exact same thing. The deal,
Speaker 5: we'll take the deal on the table. Biden put forward
Speaker 5: the public deal that that Israel's cabin had approved, what
Speaker 5: their war cabin had approved. Biden made it public. Hamas said,
Speaker 5: we'll take it, We're done, We're good.
Speaker 1: This is it. We'll take it. And Israel kept saying
Speaker 1: no and just kind of moving the line.
Speaker 5: So the current deal it's on the table includes huge
Speaker 5: concessions from Amas. The main concession that that includes is
Speaker 5: that Israeli troops would not have to withdraw immediately from Gaza.
Speaker 1: Like that was that was a huge sticking point.
Speaker 5: Originally AMAS was saying there's no ceasefire until you withdraw
Speaker 5: from Gods.
Speaker 1: Now they're saying, fine, Israeli troops.
Speaker 5: Can stay as long as there is some path for
Speaker 5: them leaving in the future, and during the pause and fighting,
Speaker 5: all the vulnerable and civilian hostages would be exchanged for
Speaker 5: several hundred Palestinian hostages and then then next you would
Speaker 5: move to a uh you know, talks towards a permanent ceasefire.
Speaker 5: Saudi Arabia has gotten involved, saying that they would kind
Speaker 5: of find they would help to finance the reconstruction of
Speaker 5: Gaza while normalizing relations with Israel UH, and Saudi Arabia
Speaker 5: has dropped its demand that Israel recognized a Palestinian state
Speaker 5: and replaced that with a quote path toward a Palestinian state.
Speaker 4: So, and this is all from we know these like
Speaker 4: broad contours from the Hartz report.
Speaker 5: All right, Another and another reporting, some Maxios reporting. There's
Speaker 5: some reporting from Arabic outlets as well.
Speaker 1: This is these from yesterday it broke. Yeah, these are
Speaker 1: the broad contours of the deal, and.
Speaker 5: Think about that when you follow the news over the
Speaker 5: next several days with without a deal, Like I'd.
Speaker 1: Love to be proven wrong.
Speaker 5: I'd love that just as we walk out of the
Speaker 5: studio they announced that actually everybody has agreed to the ceasefire.
Speaker 4: UH.
Speaker 5: That yesterday in Gaza, there were celebrations in the streets
Speaker 5: at the news that a ceasefire deal was close, Like
Speaker 5: everybody wants this, But I think Yahu sees another six
Speaker 5: weeks or five weeks or so that he can kind
Speaker 5: of rain hell down upon Gaza.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 5: There are still hospitals left standing. Kamal Odd one hospital
Speaker 5: in northern Gaza UH, which has been subject to now
Speaker 5: more than a month of relentless assaults from Israel, leading
Speaker 5: to the killing of multiple doctors, nurses, their families. Yesterday,
Speaker 5: yesterday doctors were attacked in while they were operating, like
Speaker 5: through the windows. But the hospital is still operating. And
Speaker 5: I believe that Israel's attempting to completely ethnically cleanse northern
Speaker 5: Gaza and needs to shut down all the hospitals. So
Speaker 5: I don't think that they'll reach a deal until they've
Speaker 5: completely shut down all of the hospitals.
Speaker 4: So the Sun's very cynical, not quite. I mean this,
Speaker 4: I would be surprised to be honest, if Netnahu brokeer
Speaker 4: this deal and like agreed to the deal under Biden
Speaker 4: as opposed to under Trump, I think he obviously really well.
Speaker 5: The reason that might happen under Biden is that that's
Speaker 5: kind of what Trump has been demanding. Like Trump has
Speaker 5: been saying that he wants this done by the time
Speaker 5: that he's in office, and he will then take credit
Speaker 5: for it, which fine, I don't like.
Speaker 1: I don't care who takes credit for stuff.
Speaker 4: He could do it on day one though, right, like
Speaker 4: he could well, which.
Speaker 1: Is why he might.
Speaker 5: That's why that's why I said it might be on
Speaker 5: January twentieth. Yeah, yeah, And speaking of credit, I don't
Speaker 5: defend Biden ever, but like he was getting dragged yesterday
Speaker 5: for saying that he had helped, you know, broker a
Speaker 5: deal at free to Hunt. You know, he got a
Speaker 5: hundred more than a hun and in fact, in November
Speaker 5: when there was a week long ceasefire, one hundred and
Speaker 5: five hostages were released by AMAS. And you know, if
Speaker 5: you're going to say that Biden is facilitating the genocide,
Speaker 5: which I do say, and I do believe he also
Speaker 5: broke her that deal. So it's like I don't understand
Speaker 5: why people were getting upset on him. It actually, to me,
Speaker 5: makes it worse for him because it shows that was possible.
Speaker 5: Like the only thing that has freed hostages at scale
Speaker 5: was a ceasefire like that, and the deal that we
Speaker 5: will eventually reach, probably on January twentieth, after after another
Speaker 5: several thousand people are killed violently and tens of thousands
Speaker 5: maybe more die of starvation or what disease and maount
Speaker 5: nutrition because like, you know, imagine going a year plus
Speaker 5: without access to reliable clean water medicine, Like even the
Speaker 5: healthiest people are gonna, you know, collapse under those circumstances.
Speaker 5: The deal we'll eventually get was on the table a
Speaker 5: year ago. They didn't want it a year ago. They
Speaker 5: wanted to do what they did for the last year.
Speaker 1: Go ahead.
Speaker 4: Well, I was gonna say, I mean, we should even
Speaker 4: take a look at Sirias. We have some video of
Speaker 4: Nisnahu and oh that's right.
Speaker 5: So there's there's this there's this like kind of debate,
Speaker 5: Like there was some reporting that uh that man Yahu
Speaker 5: was on his way to Doha to like finalize this deal,
Speaker 5: and then they said no, he's not in.
Speaker 1: They said no, he's not in Doha.
Speaker 5: He was supposed to be in court, actually he got
Speaker 5: for his corruption trial, but he got he was allowed
Speaker 5: to like not show up for his corruption trial. And
Speaker 5: then they released video of where he actually is over
Speaker 5: the goal on heights.
Speaker 1: He's addressing people in UH in Hebrew.
Speaker 4: Here stunning visual. I mean, yeah, he's got his flat jacket.
Speaker 5: On, his flat jacket, but what's he what's he wearing
Speaker 5: a flat jacket? Right, there's no like he's not remotely
Speaker 5: at any risk there. But he's standing basically a top
Speaker 5: Mount Herman, which Israel wants because it is basically the
Speaker 5: only way for Israelis to go skiing without having to
Speaker 5: fly somewhere, so within their own borders they could, so
Speaker 5: they can now have a ski resort.
Speaker 4: The argument is it's a buffer und.
Speaker 5: They're the buffer zone and the buffer zone and the
Speaker 5: buffer zone and the buffer zone and the buffer zone.
Speaker 1: It's a ski resort.
Speaker 5: And then they're gonna and there's and they say they're
Speaker 5: going to they say they're going to settle it and
Speaker 5: populate it as well.
Speaker 1: They're going to double like double, and then some of
Speaker 1: the population in the area.
Speaker 5: UH, the State Department will say it's a buffer zone
Speaker 5: and this is temporary, while Israel saying, actually, we're going
Speaker 5: to settle it and populate it.
Speaker 4: So two different, two different lines coming from which is
Speaker 4: not unfamiliar at all because this is an administration on
Speaker 4: one hint says we support a two state solution, but
Speaker 4: we're supporting a war from a man who says there's
Speaker 4: no such thing as a two state solutions. Right along
Speaker 4: those lines, right.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you have Israel being a little bit more open
Speaker 5: and honest about what they're doing, and the State Department
Speaker 5: just lying directly to our faces about that what we
Speaker 5: see and what they're saying is actually not what they're
Speaker 5: doing and saying it's like what's going on here? So no,
Speaker 5: so he was not in Doha reaching a ceasefire deal.
Speaker 5: He was working on the invasion and occupation of Syria,
Speaker 5: taking the opportunity of the Syrian people overthrowing a dictator
Speaker 5: to get a ski resort, call it a buffer zone.
Speaker 4: Meanwhile, you guys at dropsite have a really interesting report
Speaker 4: about Hamas documents provided by Israel to the New York Times,
Speaker 4: and all of this goes to Iran as well, which
Speaker 4: is the mean, that's the central like fear of Americans.
Speaker 4: Here is the World War Three component. And now you
Speaker 4: have the New York Times. This is a great story.
Speaker 1: You should just like, yeah, really fascinating and embarrassing.
Speaker 5: For the New York Times story in Drop Sight by
Speaker 5: Jeremy Skahele and Shreef of Delcadus, we can put this
Speaker 5: up on the screen, we can put a link in there.
Speaker 5: But so basically to give you the gist of what's
Speaker 5: going on here. So twice now in the last couple months,
Speaker 5: the New York Times has run major bombshell stories citing
Speaker 5: Hamas documents that were found by Israel and then given
Speaker 5: to the New York Times. So that's the chain of custody,
Speaker 5: alleged chain of custody of these documents. So when you're
Speaker 5: doing this reporting, what you need to do is figure
Speaker 5: out whether or not the documents that you're being given
Speaker 5: are authentic. One of the ways you can do that
Speaker 5: is by verifying that the source of the documents, it
Speaker 5: would have access to those documents leg and has it
Speaker 5: and doesn't have a.
Speaker 1: Motivation to lie about them.
Speaker 5: So, in other words, if a if a Hamas whistleblower,
Speaker 5: for instance, or an IDF whistleblower reaches out and you
Speaker 5: can confirm that that is who they are, and they
Speaker 5: hand over some documents to you. You start out with
Speaker 5: a threshold of Okay, these are probably authentic, but I'm
Speaker 5: going to need to cross reference some things. We're going
Speaker 5: to need to figure some other things out. Now, if
Speaker 5: Hamas came to you and said that they had discovered
Speaker 5: some IDF documents and then gave you those documents.
Speaker 1: You start from a place of skepticism, yes, because they.
Speaker 5: Are motivated to lie about them, and they don't they
Speaker 5: wouldn't really have access to them.
Speaker 1: They say, well, it was during October seventh.
Speaker 5: We were in the you know, we were in one
Speaker 5: of the military bases, and we made off with some
Speaker 5: hard drives, and here.
Speaker 1: The documents that we got.
Speaker 5: What you would then do is you would take those
Speaker 5: documents and you would give them to sources connected to
Speaker 5: the IDF, presumably former, because if you give them current,
Speaker 5: you know they're not gonna be able to do that
Speaker 5: unless they're quite trustworthy, and that those sources will then
Speaker 5: try to figure out, okay, here are some problems with
Speaker 5: these documents, or say, you know, these actually kind of
Speaker 5: look authentic.
Speaker 1: There's other things you can do to try to authenticate them.
Speaker 5: So New York Times gets these documents from Hamas, I
Speaker 5: mean allegedly from Hamas through Israel, and so they take
Speaker 5: it to a former Hamas guy. They take it to
Speaker 5: a Salah al Awada, that's who they name in their
Speaker 5: article as saying that they bear that they you know,
Speaker 5: bears almost to Hamas documents and that these are good
Speaker 5: enough you should go ahead and publish these documents.
Speaker 1: That's that's who the Times cites.
Speaker 5: So Jeremy Scahill calls the guy up and says, you know,
Speaker 5: can you what else can you tell me about these documents?
Speaker 5: This this sounds very interesting and you can you can
Speaker 5: read read the full story. He tells me, I didn't
Speaker 5: tell the New York Times these were authentic documents, and I'll.
Speaker 1: Just read one portion of it.
Speaker 5: Told Dropsite that The Times only shared one page out
Speaker 5: of thirty with him. After looking it over, he said.
Speaker 5: He told the Times reporter that there was a particular
Speaker 5: phrase in the document that he suspected was a translation
Speaker 5: and that the person who wrote it did not sound
Speaker 5: native in Arabic. I told him this looks translated. It
Speaker 5: doesn't look real. This phrase is out of context, it
Speaker 5: is not used, and its meaning is not clear. The
Speaker 5: phrase in question roughly translates in English as quote air
Speaker 5: cover quote. I told him it might be translated from
Speaker 5: another language, that whomever wrote it translated it literally, but
Speaker 5: it is not used in the modern Arabic context unquote.
Speaker 5: And he also shared a voice note with Dropsite that
Speaker 5: he had sent to the reporter where he had raised
Speaker 5: these doubts. And he also shared the exchanges that they'd had.
Speaker 5: So we know that this conversation happened because the time
Speaker 5: says it happened, like the time says, they talked to
Speaker 5: this guy and he shared with what he told them,
Speaker 5: And so.
Speaker 1: Think about that.
Speaker 5: So now imagine that you are a reporter. Hamas has
Speaker 5: handed you document is that they say are Hebrew documents
Speaker 5: from the IDF. You show it to a Hebrew speaker,
Speaker 5: and the Hebrew speaker tells you.
Speaker 1: Who an Hebrew speaker used to be with the IDF.
Speaker 5: Hebrew speaker says, this word actually looks like it was
Speaker 5: originally written in Arabic and translated into Hebrew.
Speaker 1: This doesn't look right.
Speaker 5: You could not then source that person as authenticating your
Speaker 5: documents what that person told you, is that you have
Speaker 5: fake documents. And how pathetic is it that Israel, which
Speaker 5: is in the Middle East doesn't have Arabic speakers to
Speaker 5: fabricate their documents.
Speaker 4: It's like not even a good fabri Like they're.
Speaker 5: Using Google Translate, like they're starting in Hebrew or English
Speaker 5: and then just having it translated into Arabic. And what
Speaker 5: happens when you do that is that your language doesn't
Speaker 5: sound authentic. And so that particular story was a claim.
Speaker 5: You remember, this bombshell was a claim that Iran was
Speaker 5: read in on October seventh and that Hamas wanted Irani
Speaker 5: and helped for October seventh.
Speaker 4: Which is a hugely significant and which.
Speaker 5: Was used as a pretext for the expansion of their
Speaker 5: assault on Iran. So it turns out, let's come just
Speaker 5: completely fake. So now fast forward to just a couple
Speaker 5: of days ago, they put out a new investigation that
Speaker 5: they said was from Hamas documents that Israel had obtained
Speaker 5: and given to the New York Times. This one, the
Speaker 5: document said basically it was Hamas saying, we love to
Speaker 5: hide our militants inside unra's schools and is our secret weapon.
Speaker 1: To go after Israel. Like that's basically what they're saying.
Speaker 5: This document says in that article, they say that they
Speaker 5: were not able to authenticate the documents, but they believed
Speaker 5: they were authentic because they bore similarities to previous documents
Speaker 5: that they had been able to authenticate. So they're clearly
Speaker 5: referring back to these Iran documents, which we now know
Speaker 5: were fabricated themselves.
Speaker 1: So Israel is just concocting. And then what do they do?
Speaker 1: Bombed in two Unra.
Speaker 5: Schools and killed more than sixty people, So like this
Speaker 5: is all premeditated. Like so they cook up these faked documents,
Speaker 5: they give them to the New York Times, they say
Speaker 5: these are Hamas documents, and then they use that article
Speaker 5: as pretexts. Then for some slaughter that they carry out.
Speaker 5: They did get busted by Build, not by Build Build,
Speaker 5: and I believe it was Jewish Currents ran a piece
Speaker 5: based on quote unquote Hamas documents that said that Yayahsinwar
Speaker 5: was planning to escape to Egypt with a bunch of
Speaker 5: hostages that turned out to be demonstrably proven to be
Speaker 5: a hoax and a bunch of egg on Build's face,
Speaker 5: and like that's not in question, Like you don't need
Speaker 5: to take it from me that that was fake, but
Speaker 5: that happened before The New York Times is getting hoaxed here.
Speaker 4: So the reason, I mean, there are many reasons, but
Speaker 4: one of the pieces of this puzzle that's so significant
Speaker 4: is obviously the Iran link. Because the New York Times,
Speaker 4: what in two thousand and two, two thousand and three,
Speaker 4: was relying on bad sourcing and that reporting was used
Speaker 4: over and over again to substantiate war.
Speaker 8: Right.
Speaker 4: It's a lesson that is very has very recently been learned,
Speaker 4: specifically specifically by the New York Times. And some of
Speaker 4: this you and I probably disagree on some of this,
Speaker 4: but some of it doesn't even need to be faked
Speaker 4: and exaggerated because we've talked before about how there's a
Speaker 4: genuine challenge for UNRA in Gaza to like disentangle itself
Speaker 4: from the government, which is de facto Hamas.
Speaker 1: Right, like this, they have tens of thousands of employees.
Speaker 4: Right right, yeah, And it just so all that is
Speaker 4: to say for The New York Times, I mean, Israel's
Speaker 4: another question.
Speaker 5: And to the point, like most of those tens of
Speaker 5: thousands of employees are like teachers and those types of
Speaker 5: folks so just do some of them work, you know,
Speaker 5: on the side from us.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like a handful with no doubt.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a problem.
Speaker 5: But what Israel had claimed that they had found much
Speaker 5: more sinister collaboration and then use that to slaughter a
Speaker 5: bunch of civilians and who are sheltering in these in
Speaker 5: these schools.
Speaker 4: It's very very sloppy, I mean on the part of
Speaker 4: the New York Times and such a high stakes. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I don't even know why.
Speaker 5: I don't even know why Israel and New York Times bother.
Speaker 5: At this point, Israel has shown that it can slaughter
Speaker 5: endless amounts of Palestinians without any cover. They don't even
Speaker 5: need the New York Times to lie for them. Like,
Speaker 5: so if you're at the New York Times, you can
Speaker 5: stand down, like the world has given up. The world
Speaker 5: is just allowing this genocide to unfold. You want to
Speaker 5: go ahead and and your credibility in order to facilitate
Speaker 5: more of the genocide. You go ahead and do it,
Speaker 5: but you don't actually have to anymore, Like nobody's going
Speaker 5: to stop them.
Speaker 4: It's a I mean, this Jeremy just calling the calling
Speaker 4: the guy like.
Speaker 1: He's like, can you prove that Yeah, here's voice memo,
Speaker 1: here's texts.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's such a set amazing.
Speaker 1: So embarrassing.
Speaker 5: Oh so we went to the New York Times for comment,
Speaker 5: and they responded by saying that they didn't answer any
Speaker 5: of the questions directly. They responded by saying that it
Speaker 5: was a rich story based on lots of different sources. Sure,
Speaker 5: so they talked to analysts and other people for other
Speaker 5: parts of the story. The headline, the lead, and the
Speaker 5: whole story are about these documents that you obtained, and
Speaker 5: you're not even going to stand up for those documents.
Speaker 4: Right exactly. That's a cop outaresthetic.
Speaker 1: They should be ashamed of themselves.
Speaker 5: They they they feel like they have total impunity because
Speaker 5: the Washington Post, Lost Angelis, Times, Wall Street Journal, all
Speaker 5: these other outlets that used to be major competitors of
Speaker 5: theirs have all withered, and so the New York Times
Speaker 5: now just stands alone, and so they're just completely unchecked
Speaker 5: except by people within their newsroom and by independent media
Speaker 5: at this point.
Speaker 1: But the editors there will they even hold a meeting
Speaker 1: about this.
Speaker 5: Oh hey, by the way, guys, we turns out we
Speaker 5: got hoaxed and ran two major stories based on documents
Speaker 5: that were fabricated, and dozens of people were killed, many
Speaker 5: of them were burned to death as a result of
Speaker 5: and on the predicate of these articles that we published
Speaker 5: and got. Should we meet about this and try to
Speaker 5: not have this happen again, because it's because even if
Speaker 5: you don't care about all the death, it's embarrassing. But
Speaker 5: because they have so much impunity because they have no
Speaker 5: competitors at this point, that's interesting point because not even
Speaker 5: have a meeting about this.
Speaker 4: In prior eras the Washington Post would have loved to
Speaker 4: run your drops and would light them up and they
Speaker 4: would have been calling the source. Yeah, if they had
Speaker 4: more like if if they had more resources, and absolutely
Speaker 4: yea and more like I mean right now, they're really
Speaker 4: just not even competing with the time, so it's not
Speaker 4: necessarily even the thought like, oh, let's spend some of
Speaker 4: our reporters time calling up one of their sources.
Speaker 5: But yeah, and there's also it's a kind of colonialism
Speaker 5: where it's like you can actually just say whatever you
Speaker 5: want about Hamas and Hamas documents, just say it, and
Speaker 5: nobody's nobody's gonna like raise an issue with it.
Speaker 4: Let's move on to the indictment of Luigi Mangione. He
Speaker 4: was indicted last night. We put C one up on
Speaker 4: the screen. He was indicted for first degree murder, obviously
Speaker 4: in the death of United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson. That
Speaker 4: is according to the Manhattan District Attorney's office. So that's
Speaker 4: a step towards actually getting He's facing two counts we
Speaker 4: should add a second degree murder. One of it is
Speaker 4: killing as a crime of terrorism, two for second degree
Speaker 4: criminal possession of a weapon, three counts of third degree
Speaker 4: criminal possession of a weapon, one count for fourth degree
Speaker 4: possession of a weapon, and one count of second degree
Speaker 4: possession of a forged instrument. So he's facing all kinds
Speaker 4: of charges. This one obviously is the headline charge, but
Speaker 4: it also comes amidst discussion about an Emerson poll. This
Speaker 4: is C two we should put up on the screen here, Ryan,
Speaker 4: did you see this Emerson poll where a majority of
Speaker 4: voters think the actions of the killer of the United
Speaker 4: Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson are unacceptable. Seventeen percent find the
Speaker 4: actions acceptable, while sixteen percent are unsure. Now, interestingly, the
Speaker 4: pollster says while sixty eight percent of voters overall reject
Speaker 4: the killer's actions. Younger voters and Democrats are more split.
Speaker 4: Forty one percent of voters aged eighteen through twenty nine
Speaker 4: find the killer's actions acceptable. But to clear the breakdown
Speaker 4: of that is, twenty four percent of those eighteen to
Speaker 4: twenty nine year old said it was somewhat acceptable. Seventeen
Speaker 4: percent said it was completely acceptable. And when you combine
Speaker 4: both of them, that's where you get the forty one
Speaker 4: percent thinking that it was acceptable, even though some of
Speaker 4: them just said somewhat. And media I covered this as
Speaker 4: you just saw on the screen as a quote stunning poll,
Speaker 4: I don't know that it's that stunning, Ryan, what do
Speaker 4: you think?
Speaker 1: Well?
Speaker 5: Also, one detailed I think we should let the viewers
Speaker 5: know is that this murder happened on December fourth, which
Speaker 5: is the day that we were recording Counterpoints here in
Speaker 5: the studio. And if you remember, there was a kid
Speaker 5: named Luigi Mangione who came by and was in the
Speaker 5: control room from about six am until about I think
Speaker 5: we did a Counterpoints Friday recording afterwards, so that went
Speaker 5: till eleven or eleven thirty. It might be a different
Speaker 5: Luigi Manjean, but from seeing him seemed like the same
Speaker 5: guy seeing Baltimore.
Speaker 1: We talked.
Speaker 5: I remember we talked about Gilman and his prep school kid.
Speaker 5: He talked about how he'd never been to New York,
Speaker 5: didn't have any plans on going to New York.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he can't even ride a bike.
Speaker 1: Actually, from what I he couldn't ride a bike. You
Speaker 1: would never ride a city bike because you do.
Speaker 4: People don't know.
Speaker 1: This sates McDonald's.
Speaker 4: You love to talk about bikes.
Speaker 1: I do, like, yeah, we had a long conversation about bikes.
Speaker 1: Curly hair.
Speaker 5: Anyway, So the terror, by the way, I'm curious for
Speaker 5: your taking the terror charges. Yeah, I've seen I've seen
Speaker 5: people make a but I think it is a fair point. Like, hey,
Speaker 5: wait a minute, January sixth, guys, they were they were
Speaker 5: trying to terrorize all sorts of people. They don't get
Speaker 5: charged with that. Lots of people don't get charged with terror.
Speaker 5: On the other hand, you know, if that wasn't Luigi
Speaker 5: who was here in the control room, I think it was,
Speaker 5: but it wasn't. Whoever was guilty of this has said that,
Speaker 5: like the goal was to sow terror, like.
Speaker 4: It's in the paragraph manifesto.
Speaker 5: When when when Lennon and Rose Pierre used the word terror.
Speaker 5: They don't use it pejoratively.
Speaker 1: Yeah, their goal.
Speaker 4: Is to terror Please please don't charge me with terrorism.
Speaker 5: Yeah, not not saying that he did it, but if
Speaker 5: he did, the goal was to terrorize. So yeah, so
Speaker 5: that like the pearl clutching around the terrorism charges to
Speaker 5: me is like, well, look man, if you're going to
Speaker 5: do this stuff like this, that's what you're doing, right.
Speaker 4: And Migngioni is pleading not guilty. Right, he says this
Speaker 4: is not what happened, and which which is very interesting.
Speaker 1: He was here in the control room.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but it continues to be very interesting because this
Speaker 4: is the there's a manifesto that is being pinned to him,
Speaker 4: and maybe it is him. It seems likelier that doesn't fit.
Speaker 4: It seems likely not that it is, but but we've
Speaker 4: seen set up, so it's not impossible that there are
Speaker 4: I mean really though, like he's pleading not guilty. The
Speaker 4: whole situation is extremely bizarre. He's able to get he
Speaker 4: shoots a guy in cold blood in Manhattan during the
Speaker 4: day and just gets away for days, just blends into
Speaker 4: the crowd in town and is able to actually get
Speaker 4: out of state to Pennsylvania and isn't caught for days
Speaker 4: Like that, I think of itself is pretty strange. That
Speaker 4: continues to me to be the weirdest part of all
Speaker 4: of this.
Speaker 5: I would like to know the real story on how
Speaker 5: they caught him, because you know, when whatever like this
Speaker 5: feels like one of those stitched together, you know, cover
Speaker 5: stories for how they caught him, because where in fact,
Speaker 5: they were using surveillance technologies that are, to put it generously,
Speaker 5: maybe on the constitutional edge of being allowed. And so
Speaker 5: what will often happen if you use those types of
Speaker 5: authorities to solve a crime or to catch somebody, You
Speaker 5: then figure out a way that you could have done
Speaker 5: it legitimately, and you pull that together, or maybe they
Speaker 5: really are completely incompetent and just you know, somebody you
Speaker 5: know saw him at the McDonald's and made a phone call.
Speaker 4: Speculation is that he's going to plead not guilty by insanity,
Speaker 4: which is obviously a different you know, that's very different
Speaker 4: than saying I flat out didn't do it.
Speaker 5: Not guilty by insanity. Like right, there's two. Basically, you're
Speaker 5: trying to get the jury to get You're trying to
Speaker 5: give the jury a reason to acquit you even though
Speaker 5: they know you did it, And the one would be
Speaker 5: I wasn't there, it wasn't me.
Speaker 1: This is all planted, and it's like, like you said,
Speaker 1: it's getting hard.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's pretty hard. There's a lot of footage.
Speaker 5: Yeah, because they could subpoena our cameras here and find
Speaker 5: that actually Luigi wasn't here. But then the second one
Speaker 5: would be to say he was insane, and then the
Speaker 5: jury can be like, yeah, he was temporarily insane, right,
Speaker 5: and that doesn't mean we condone it. We mean it
Speaker 5: was an active insanity, but it means we're going to
Speaker 5: let him go now.
Speaker 1: And then they give him a gun charge or something.
Speaker 4: Right, well, he has charges, so they.
Speaker 5: Feel like they've still said there have to be some
Speaker 5: consequences here, but not necessarily life in prison.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 5: I think that's my guess of where the strategy goes. Yeah,
Speaker 5: so are you surprised at the forty one to forty
Speaker 5: youth that's twenty nine and under say that by forty
Speaker 5: one to forty now it's Emerson.
Speaker 1: They're like it's a.
Speaker 4: Thousand percon pole, right, But anyway, well, I'm saying that's
Speaker 4: not I mean, yes, I'm sure polsters would look at
Speaker 4: me and be like a thousand people that's statistically stated,
Speaker 4: bobble bar.
Speaker 1: It is. But if you're a bad polster, you can
Speaker 1: get whatever you want out of that.
Speaker 4: Well, when you're down in the seventeen percent, you can
Speaker 4: find seventeen percent of Americans who say just about everything
Speaker 4: like it's it's usually around twenty percent.
Speaker 1: You can say in a poll it's somewhat acceptable.
Speaker 4: It's forty one combined with the seventeen so somewhat.
Speaker 1: That's somewhat and definitely acceptable.
Speaker 4: Completely acceptable, right, Yeah, So all that is to say, I.
Speaker 5: Think it's a tough one because people have complicated views
Speaker 5: about this. I think they're like, it's wrong to commit murder.
Speaker 5: I wouldn't commit murder. I wouldn't urge anybody to commit murder.
Speaker 1: What do I think about this? Kind of rather than
Speaker 1: not say so, where do you.
Speaker 5: Where do you come down? Like how do you pull
Speaker 5: that right? Sentiment, which I think is pretty widely held.
Speaker 4: And by the way, we should be clear that we
Speaker 4: don't exactly know how man Joni is exactly going to
Speaker 4: plead Again, the speculation is not guilty by reason of insanity.
Speaker 4: It does look like all the indications are not guilty.
Speaker 4: That he that's his case is going to be, is
Speaker 4: not guilty, but how exactly he makes that plea is
Speaker 4: a different question. Now back to this, there's two different
Speaker 4: things here. I mean, if you're asking the question of
Speaker 4: somewhat acceptable versus completely acceptable, to your point, the complicated
Speaker 4: feelings about acceptability are going to come in. And that's
Speaker 4: where it seems like, I.
Speaker 1: Guess that falls under somewhat acceptable.
Speaker 4: But that's the thing, right, Like there's somewhat unacceptable. There's
Speaker 4: a totally different question as to whether it's acceptable to
Speaker 4: talk about Thompson's corruption in the aftermath of his death.
Speaker 4: And I feel like it's very easy to conflate those
Speaker 4: two things, especially if you're just like responding quickly to
Speaker 4: a pole. And so I think some of it from that.
Speaker 4: And there's all of this like hysteria over people getting zoomers,
Speaker 4: getting like mangioni tattoos. They're doing it because everyone's going
Speaker 4: to their fainting couch and acting as though healthcare executives
Speaker 4: are beyond criticism. And it just strikes me as such
Speaker 4: a like when somebody take an example of a combine,
Speaker 4: what do we do after something like that we talk
Speaker 4: about bullying, we talk about why it's not okay to
Speaker 4: bully people because it makes people snap. It doesn't mean
Speaker 4: it's okay. Nobody's saying it's okay for people to snap.
Speaker 4: Like we are adults and can hold multiple views at
Speaker 4: the same time that are not inconsistent. Like two things
Speaker 4: can be true that the more you create a climate
Speaker 4: that pushes people to extremism and makes them miserable, makes
Speaker 4: them angry, the more likely you are to get situations
Speaker 4: like this. It doesn't justify it, it doesn't make it right.
Speaker 4: And so I think the way the question is worded
Speaker 4: is in that direction. And I think the reason that
Speaker 4: so many people are acting out and like ironically sometimes
Speaker 4: not ironically, like embracing MANGIONI. It's not the way that
Speaker 4: I'm reacting to any of this, But the reason is
Speaker 4: because there's now so much hysteria that's like weirdly defending
Speaker 4: the healthcare industry and acting like he was just a
Speaker 4: guy who was trying to do.
Speaker 5: His best diving deeper into the pull. The other interesting
Speaker 5: number is this somewhat unacceptable because yes, it's somebody who
Speaker 5: you know, shot a guy in the back in on
Speaker 5: sixth Avenue, and to get people off of totally unacceptable,
Speaker 5: which is where everybody starts with that act, and move
Speaker 5: them even to somewhat unacceptable. Is you know that's something
Speaker 5: that that's some gray area for young people. That was
Speaker 5: an extra seven percent, So that takes it to forty
Speaker 5: forty eight percent, which leaves only one in three people
Speaker 5: under twenty nine saying that it was completely unacceptable. So
Speaker 5: two thirds of young people confronted with, hey, this somebody
Speaker 5: walked up and shot somebody in the back in broad daylight?
Speaker 1: Is that completely unacceptable?
Speaker 5: Two out of three were not willing to say that
Speaker 5: was completely unacceptable. So even though only forty one so
Speaker 5: it's actually kind of a higher number.
Speaker 4: Yes, And I do get why people are I get why,
Speaker 4: you know, they're people who the types of people who
Speaker 4: introduce themselves to that happy hours is like classical liberals
Speaker 4: are disturbed by these numbers, And I get why, like
Speaker 4: normal people are disturbed by these numbers. They are like, yes,
Speaker 4: that's it speaks to the problem of the healthcare system,
Speaker 4: and it speaks to the problem of like the deep,
Speaker 4: deep anger and sense of unjust like unjustness and just
Speaker 4: misery that people are experiencing, and this is like cathartic.
Speaker 4: So yes, it's disturbing because the system in order to operate,
Speaker 4: in order to in order to let's say, exact justice
Speaker 4: peacefully and through the classically liberal process, you have to
Speaker 4: have buy in. And what you're losing is public buy in.
Speaker 4: And you can't just blame the public for that. You
Speaker 4: have to also blame the top for that. Right. Just
Speaker 4: to lash out at the public is the exact wrong
Speaker 4: way to go about it. And it's only going to
Speaker 4: make things worse if you're just lashing out of the public.
Speaker 1: And I feel bad for TikTok.
Speaker 5: Just as they thought they were maybe going to get
Speaker 5: some salvation from the from the coming band, all of
Speaker 5: a sudden, all these young people are in now celebrating Luigi.
Speaker 5: So TikTok is like they're starting to take it out
Speaker 5: of app stores. Right, It's like like the ban is coming,
Speaker 5: like it's like a month away or something like that.
Speaker 5: And so there's but there's still time to stave it off.
Speaker 5: Donald Trump, at his press conference this week hinted that
Speaker 5: there might be some daylight there.
Speaker 1: Let's let's roll Trump here.
Speaker 4: C Three, How do you plan to stop the ban on.
Speaker 6: TikTok next month, we'll take a look at TikTok. You know,
Speaker 6: I have a warm spot in my heart for TikTok
Speaker 6: because I won youth by thirty four points. There are
Speaker 6: those that say that TikTok has something to do with it. Now,
Speaker 6: Joe Rogan did and some of the other people that
Speaker 6: were recommended by my son Barony, who have any new names?
Speaker 1: I said, who is that?
Speaker 6: Tell me who's that dead?
Speaker 1: You gotta be kidding. I can't believe you don't know.
Speaker 6: And I did those interviews and it was actually sort
Speaker 6: of cute. Do you want to know the truth? So
Speaker 6: I have a little bit of a warm spot in
Speaker 6: my heart. I'll be honest.
Speaker 5: I love how transparent Trump is, the transactional nature.
Speaker 1: Of his support for someone else.
Speaker 5: We've always known that that the only litmus test for Trump,
Speaker 5: whether he likes you is if you like him. Yes,
Speaker 5: Kim Jong un does like TikTok, young people Muslims in America.
Speaker 1: Doesn't matter if you like him, he likes you, by
Speaker 1: the way, not to be the actually guy.
Speaker 5: He did not win the youth vote by thirty four
Speaker 5: points for in his circle, which does that leave him alone?
Speaker 1: Fifty two forty six to ask.
Speaker 5: But hey, if he wants to think, if he wants
Speaker 5: to think that young people supported him by thirty four
Speaker 5: points and he wants to then govern based on what
Speaker 5: young people want for this country, then Donald Trump, you
Speaker 5: won young people by thirty four points. I actually actually
Speaker 5: don't believe anybody who tells you otherwise.
Speaker 4: One of the funny things is when we were talking
Speaker 4: with our friend Luigi in the control room on December fourth,
Speaker 4: he said that Trump won ninety percent of the youth vote,
Speaker 4: but we didn't. We never checked it out. Yeah, but
Speaker 4: it could be true.
Speaker 5: And Luigi said that he really separates Trump from the
Speaker 5: rest of the oligarchs.
Speaker 4: Right now, by starting this bit, you have probably gotten.
Speaker 1: Us in so much trouble. I didn't start the bit.
Speaker 1: People would probably know that.
Speaker 5: I'm just referencing memes on like Facebook and elsewhere, all
Speaker 5: these people saying like, I just wanted to talk about
Speaker 5: this cool December fourth morning I had with my friend
Speaker 5: Luigi down in San Antonio. We got coffee, we did
Speaker 5: the little little walk on the river there.
Speaker 4: You brought the bit here. Yeah, you'll have to accept
Speaker 4: that plan.
Speaker 1: That's fair enough.
Speaker 5: In any event, the I think TikTok has a chance
Speaker 5: of surviving. For this reason. The deep State had wanted
Speaker 5: to ban TikTok for a very long time because they
Speaker 5: don't control it. China's got influence over there, and they
Speaker 5: don't like having like they're in the US news media.
Speaker 5: They want US news media to be the sovereign domain
Speaker 5: of our corporate overlords, not our Chinese overlords. But they
Speaker 5: could never get any any traction with that belief until
Speaker 5: after October seventh. After October seventh, people were able to
Speaker 5: see people in Gaza who they connected with in a
Speaker 5: parasocial way being slaughtered on a daily basis, and it
Speaker 5: turned the public who was getting their news from TikTok uh.
Speaker 1: Off of the off of the genocide.
Speaker 5: Like it convinced them that what they were being told
Speaker 5: in the in the sanitized version of the news did
Speaker 5: not comport with what was actually happening on the ground.
Speaker 5: That's when they were able to get bipartisan buy in
Speaker 5: to pass the legislation to force a sale, which they're
Speaker 5: saying they won't sell it, so therefore they will shut
Speaker 5: it down. I think now that they basically are successful
Speaker 5: in their genocide, and nobody's going to stop them, that
Speaker 5: the main thrust behind the ban is kind of gone,
Speaker 5: so maybe they'll give it a reprieve.
Speaker 1: What do you what do you think?
Speaker 4: I don't know. I mean, the just wait until we
Speaker 4: start talking more about China and the drones, right, Republican,
Speaker 4: Republican and Democrats.
Speaker 1: Like that is there is right And Michael McCall is saying.
Speaker 4: Michael m news that was news last night. He said
Speaker 4: it was like Chinese technology or likely Chinese drones, which
Speaker 4: I don't know why he's saying that without you know,
Speaker 4: the it's just we've.
Speaker 1: Heard already told the Iranian drone.
Speaker 4: We were told there were Iranians from Jeff.
Speaker 5: Andrew, Transportation Secretary, a Transportation Committee member, which yeah, like
Speaker 5: get out.
Speaker 1: Of here with your Yeah. I don't know who told credential.
Speaker 4: He said someone told him that.
Speaker 1: He said, I'm on.
Speaker 5: He said, I'm on the committee, and I talked to people,
Speaker 5: talk to people in the business.
Speaker 1: You know, he's talking to some drone company owner.
Speaker 4: So when Paul came out and said that last night,
Speaker 4: my spidery senses went up.
Speaker 5: I mean, maybe now this has come from the intelligence A
Speaker 5: side exactly.
Speaker 4: Yeah, maybe, but I just I think your point about
Speaker 4: control is really important, and.
Speaker 1: I actually I commented, I said, he doesn't know.
Speaker 4: I like my I have a very unpopular take on this.
Speaker 4: I've said that TikTok should be banned for a long time,
Speaker 4: but not for any of these reasons. And the TikTok
Speaker 4: bill is such a disaster, like it was just a
Speaker 4: I didn't support any of that because it was complete
Speaker 4: deep state overreach.
Speaker 5: I think I think all social media should be banned
Speaker 5: for people under like sixteen or something close.
Speaker 1: So because it's a collective action problem.
Speaker 5: As a parent, I'm completely failing when it comes to
Speaker 5: my kids in social media.
Speaker 1: Kids can't parents can't do it alone.
Speaker 5: So I think that the deal, the grand bargain that
Speaker 5: we should strike with China and trum Trump is already
Speaker 5: talking about US and China together can do great things
Speaker 5: for the world.
Speaker 1: So here should be the deal.
Speaker 5: We will allow TikTok to continue, but Chairman, she gets
Speaker 5: to regulate our children's social media consumption.
Speaker 1: In China.
Speaker 5: It's like you get one hour on Friday, one hour
Speaker 5: on Saturday, and they just that includes video games.
Speaker 4: But you know, they just pump government propaganda into the
Speaker 4: because it's a totally.
Speaker 1: Different it's only hours. If it's fine.
Speaker 4: You want your kids getting us government propaganda.
Speaker 1: If it's only for an hour on Friday and Saturday.
Speaker 4: It's like top gun two clips.
Speaker 1: Yeah, whatever, fine.
Speaker 5: So I would I look at China's regulation of social
Speaker 5: media for their kids and I'm so jealous.
Speaker 1: Mm hmmmmm, Like they've they've they've got that under control.
Speaker 5: So so so if we can outsource that to she,
Speaker 5: then we'll let TikTok keep going.
Speaker 4: Ryan, I've been excited over the last couple of days
Speaker 4: to get your take on what went down in the
Speaker 4: back rooms of the Democratic House Caucus when Jerry Connolly
Speaker 4: just snatched defeat from the draws of victory victory for himself,
Speaker 4: defeat argument for the Democratic Party when he took chairmanship
Speaker 4: of the House Oversight or ranking member of the House
Speaker 4: Oversight Committee, from Alexandra Okazio Cortez, who wanted the job.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: So the backstory here is Jamie Raskin was had this
Speaker 5: position as top Democrat on Oversight Committee.
Speaker 1: He moved over to take the top.
Speaker 5: Spot on the Judiciary Committee, which is kind of higher
Speaker 5: ranking spot he had.
Speaker 1: He and he and AOC are very close.
Speaker 5: He had made AOC the vice chair, which is a
Speaker 5: kind of position that he made up, but came with
Speaker 5: a real authority on the committee, an ability to learn
Speaker 5: operation of it and how to get things how to
Speaker 5: get things done, and how to do you know, oversight
Speaker 5: both towards you know, the law enforcement directions, the PENA direction,
Speaker 5: but also using the committee as a platform for you know,
Speaker 5: creating political controversis controversy and narratives and videos and you
Speaker 5: know what you know, which is like ninety nine percent
Speaker 5: of Congress's job at this point.
Speaker 4: Well, and Jim Jordan used it very effectively as well.
Speaker 4: When you're in the minority, you still have a lot
Speaker 4: of power if you're on oversight because you're just driving
Speaker 4: different investigative narratives.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and so if the if the vote were just
Speaker 5: up to the Oversight Committee, Democrats there, they're mostly all
Speaker 5: AOC allies. When that overwhelmingly goes to the Steering Committee,
Speaker 5: which is a kind of secretive leadership situation, It was
Speaker 5: where you know that like she never had a shot there,
Speaker 5: but then you can challenge it and take it to
Speaker 5: the entire caucus and we can put up the results
Speaker 5: of that caucus vote, which just happened. She lost one
Speaker 5: thirty one to eighty four, so later later today, but
Speaker 5: it'll air on Friday Thursday.
Speaker 1: If you're a premium I will be interviewing.
Speaker 5: Greg Gasar Cottrissman from Texas, who is the new chair
Speaker 5: of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. The Progressive Caucus has, blask him,
Speaker 5: ninety five members one hundred something like that. It has
Speaker 5: more than eighty four, so in other words, so these
Speaker 5: are secret ballots, by the way, so nobody knows how
Speaker 5: people voted.
Speaker 1: AOC didn't even win the.
Speaker 5: Entire Progressive Caucus. That shows but and she's close with
Speaker 5: a decent number of people who are not in the
Speaker 5: Progressive Caucus. So actually, so Connolly, did you know fairly
Speaker 5: well creeping into the CPC?
Speaker 4: So how that's I think is probably very well.
Speaker 1: And we'll talk to Kazar about this.
Speaker 5: The Progressive Caucus for many Democrats is a branding exercise.
Speaker 1: Two. Just tell people back at home that they're progressive.
Speaker 4: Which is the opposite of the Freedom Caucus, which actually
Speaker 4: like pretty rigorously enforces.
Speaker 1: Right, and they kicked out Mario Taylor Green even yeah, right, Yeah.
Speaker 5: There have been some efforts by a Parilla Giapaul to
Speaker 5: tighten to tighten kind of conditions for getting in, you
Speaker 5: have to support two thirds of the things that you
Speaker 5: know that they you know, complicated litmus tests, but a
Speaker 5: lot of room for letting people walk. And on the
Speaker 5: one hand, like there are there are circumstances like Matt
Speaker 5: cart Wright, who lost rip was Scranton progressive who kept
Speaker 5: winning this Trump district.
Speaker 1: And progressive would say, okay, look, there are going to.
Speaker 5: Be some things he's not with us on because he
Speaker 5: represents this kind of rural Pennsylvania district.
Speaker 1: But he's for Medicare for all, he's for the Green
Speaker 1: New Days, like he's for.
Speaker 5: All this stuff, and he's a populist Democrat that he's
Speaker 5: the kind we want. That's a good argument, but a
Speaker 5: lot of other Democrats use that argument to smuggle in
Speaker 5: a lot of corporate behavior. What really happened here, though,
Speaker 5: was predictable from the very beginning, and that is that
Speaker 5: AOC ousted Joe Crowley came in a way that is
Speaker 5: unacceptable to her colleagues, came unforgivable and unforgivable, came in
Speaker 5: with other people who had unforgivable views when it came
Speaker 5: to Israel and Palestine, where she did to leave me
Speaker 5: all on Omar and then proceeded to continue to endorse
Speaker 5: some primary challenges to sitting Democrats, not as many as
Speaker 5: the left would like, not as early as the organizations
Speaker 5: would like, but far more than was acceptable two incumbent democrats.
Speaker 5: The acceptable number of primary challenges for incumbent Democrats is zero,
Speaker 5: with the asterisk being it's okay, if you want a
Speaker 5: primary Corey Bush, Jamal Bowman and Omar reshoot it to
Speaker 5: leave those those kinds of incumbent Democrats, you can you
Speaker 5: can challenge those, and that's not actually a threat to
Speaker 5: the Democratic Party.
Speaker 1: You're still you can still be a team player.
Speaker 5: Although even there, it's like you didn't have a whole
Speaker 5: lot of Democrats openly going against Jamal Bowman and Corey
Speaker 5: Bush for for that reason that there's there's this, uh come,
Speaker 5: there's this like Omerta within this within the within the house,
Speaker 5: which is again.
Speaker 4: It is so so different and we'll talk about this
Speaker 4: a little bit, but it is so different from the Republicans,
Speaker 4: which basically are I say this not pejoratively like a circus,
Speaker 4: like they air their stuff out.
Speaker 1: Which they should good, good for them. And so in
Speaker 1: my book, the squad.
Speaker 5: I interviewed a lot of AOC's staff members who who
Speaker 5: said that very early twenty nineteen, this was a fundamental
Speaker 5: question facing her as she came into office. Would she
Speaker 5: try to get along with her colleagues well and move
Speaker 5: up the ranks of the Democratic Party, build power that way,
Speaker 5: and then use that power for good. Or is she
Speaker 5: a constant insurgent who uses her platform in the House
Speaker 5: to build a national movement and just understands that the
Speaker 5: House is not the place where she's going to exercise
Speaker 5: her power, but that the House is actually a defanged
Speaker 5: institution anyway, and that there's more power culturally and politically
Speaker 5: at being a national figure.
Speaker 1: And her staff.
Speaker 5: Who were on the other side of this argument, disagreed
Speaker 5: with the idea of kind of playing by the rules
Speaker 5: and moving up to the ranks, said, it's actually not
Speaker 5: even a choice for you. There is nothing that you
Speaker 5: can do to shrink yourself down small enough that they
Speaker 5: will ever forgive you for what you did.
Speaker 1: And I was last night, I was pulled.
Speaker 5: I wanted to pull up one quote because I think
Speaker 5: it's quite prescient from Corbyn. Trent, if you remember, that
Speaker 5: was her Tennessee communications director who had a fun Southern drawl.
Speaker 5: It was always kind of discordant and fun to hear him,
Speaker 5: like representing the Bronx congresswoman. But so he like so
Speaker 5: at one point and so this is from the book,
Speaker 5: he said Trump Trent Corbin. Trent said he would often
Speaker 5: warn Ocasio Cortez that, because of the way she had
Speaker 5: burst onto the scene and because of the threat she
Speaker 5: represented to others, her hope of being accepted as a
Speaker 5: member in good standing would always be frustrated. Quote disarming
Speaker 5: will not make them happy, he said. Even if she
Speaker 5: left politics and became merely an influencer or an MSNBC
Speaker 5: talking head, he argued, they'd still hunt her until the
Speaker 5: end of time, he said. Quote The funny thing is
Speaker 5: it still wouldn't prove to her that.
Speaker 1: It won't work.
Speaker 5: I just have to get a little smaller so nobody
Speaker 5: thinks I'm a threat. Okay, sorry again, guys, Sorry again
Speaker 5: for all this trouble. And so she tried that that
Speaker 5: root of sorry for all his trouble. But like, look out,
Speaker 5: look how prepared I am at the Oversight committee hearings.
Speaker 5: Look how look how much good I do for the party. Yep,
Speaker 5: I've gone to Nevada, which we won. Ye, I helped
Speaker 5: Jackie Rosen win in Nevada. You sent you sent me
Speaker 5: to Pennsylvania with Puerto Rican population.
Speaker 4: I'm popular on TikTok, Like these oversight hearings are going
Speaker 4: viral on TikTok.
Speaker 1: Young people. Yeah, absolutely love me.
Speaker 5: It's it is their hook into the Democratic Party. And
Speaker 5: she kept believing that the Democratic Party cared about any
Speaker 5: of that, that the Democratic Party cared about winning or
Speaker 5: doing good things.
Speaker 1: That was that's her fundamental like disconnect.
Speaker 5: If you see these members of Congress as just individual
Speaker 5: power seeking politicians rather than people who are engaged in
Speaker 5: a collective fight to make the world a better place,
Speaker 5: then you're going to analyze the situation.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 5: So it's by having too much faith in her colleagues
Speaker 5: that she and you found a good post from her
Speaker 5: Republican friend.
Speaker 4: Yeah, let's put the next element up, and as we do,
Speaker 4: I just want to say, like, I think it's true,
Speaker 4: they care about themselves winning, right like Nancy Pelosi cares
Speaker 4: about they care about power among their friends like Joe Crowley.
Speaker 4: That's why you want Joe Crowley to win.
Speaker 5: Not necessarily ironically, she was even fine to see Joe
Speaker 5: Crowley lose because he was going to challenge you, speaker,
Speaker 5: but she just didn't like the idea that broadly speaking,
Speaker 5: you're going to challenge Democrats, the block.
Speaker 4: Of establishment right who are loyal to her. So Tim Burchett,
Speaker 4: who I believe is Freedom Caucus, but they're like fight club,
Speaker 4: You're not You're not allowed to know. Some of them
Speaker 4: will say freedom Caucus, like we know some of them are.
Speaker 4: But I'm happy for us because the Democrats don't realize
Speaker 4: that in their youth circle, she is a Rocks. That's
Speaker 4: what Tim Burchett, a Republican, said of Connolly defeating Alexandra
Speaker 4: Ocazio Cortez. And there's also David Sirota posted after this
Speaker 4: happened Today's reminder that no change agent will be able
Speaker 4: to quote nice their way to power inside the Democratic Party.
Speaker 4: Power will have to be ripped away from the establishment.
Speaker 4: They're not going to give it away in exchange for
Speaker 4: good manners or being a team player. When I read that,
Speaker 4: I just think that is so accurate because it reminds
Speaker 4: me of the exact dynamics that happened with John Baynor
Speaker 4: and who was going up against John Baynor, Mark Meadows
Speaker 4: and Jim Jordan and ultimately Mark Medows and Jim Jordan.
Speaker 4: They were not interested in playing nice at all, that
Speaker 4: was clear. They thought they the establishment had sort of
Speaker 4: thought that they snuffed out the tea Party. Donald Trump
Speaker 4: came along and Democrats Nancy Pelosi, you're going to get
Speaker 4: a Donald Trump if you are elevating Connolly over Alexandra
Speaker 4: Ocazio Cortez and Amos's. He was just trying to tell
Speaker 4: them that She's trying to say, you have to listen
Speaker 4: to the populists, but at some point you just have
Speaker 4: to go completely. You have to go completely, like outside
Speaker 4: the structures of power because they don't care.
Speaker 5: Right because even from a cynical perspective, Democrats, even for
Speaker 5: their own individual advancement, should actually have sided with it.
Speaker 5: Aoc here because there was reporting that she was telling
Speaker 5: Democrats that she was going to stop endorsing challenges to
Speaker 5: incumbents if you give her the ranking, if you give
Speaker 5: her the ranking seat, you have brought her fully within
Speaker 5: the tent, and she's going to then stop. You know,
Speaker 5: you have them completely pulled her in, so she's no
Speaker 5: longer a threat to you. But they hate her and
Speaker 5: what she represents so much that even if she completely
Speaker 5: surrenders it.
Speaker 1: It's not enough for them. So the only question will be.
Speaker 5: Does she respond to this by saying, well, Pelosi was
Speaker 5: my prob and once she's gone, I'll be okay because
Speaker 5: Pelosi organized behind the scenes.
Speaker 1: And if I just keep showing.
Speaker 5: My colleagues that I care about the party and I
Speaker 5: care about making the world a better place, that that
Speaker 5: I am a that I'm a good person to have
Speaker 5: on the team, that they will eventually welcome me in.
Speaker 5: So that's and maybe she can just outlive them all,
Speaker 5: Like she's young enough and they're old definitely will like
Speaker 5: So that's one option, Like they all just actually die.
Speaker 5: And then she's in her fifties and there's all these
Speaker 5: people in their thirties and forties who kind of came
Speaker 5: up in politics admiring her. That that's one. That's one path,
Speaker 5: m H. The other is to say, they're never going to.
Speaker 4: Accept me, they're never going to accept her, and.
Speaker 5: I'm going to build my power base as the leader
Speaker 5: of a movement, which was the kind of Bernie Sanders
Speaker 5: wing of the party, was Elizabeth Warren wing before that.
Speaker 1: Now I'm going to.
Speaker 5: Make it the AOC wing and then that's going to
Speaker 5: be my power base. Yes, like that's that's not option.
Speaker 5: That's in front of her, and we'll get to see
Speaker 5: where it goes.
Speaker 4: She knows that voter sentiments are way closer to her
Speaker 4: than they are to Nancy Pelosi, the base of the party,
Speaker 4: and so what she should realize is that maybe she
Speaker 4: I mean, I don't know. It sounds like she doesn't
Speaker 4: realize this. But the House Freedom Caucus operated as a block.
Speaker 4: It said, we are taking the Tea Party sentiments because
Speaker 4: we recognize there what is popular with our voters, and
Speaker 4: we are going to we are going to vote in lockstep.
Speaker 4: They're losing their ability to do that. We should report
Speaker 4: right here. The House and Senate released a fifteen hundred
Speaker 4: page NDAA, or basically, it's a it would fund the government.
Speaker 4: The government will shut down on Friday at midnight if
Speaker 4: a bill is not passed to continue funding the government.
Speaker 4: And Mike Johnson has put out a bill in order
Speaker 4: to hit the seventy two hour review rule. It's kind
Speaker 4: of funny how he's being hampered by the concessions that
Speaker 4: Kevin McCarthy made to people like Mike Johnson, and then
Speaker 4: more broadly to the Freedom Caucus specifically to become Speaker,
Speaker 4: which was putting Conservatives on the Rules Committee. So that's
Speaker 4: trip Roy Thomas Massey who are now thwarting the parliamentary
Speaker 4: procedure of how Johnson ends up getting this build to
Speaker 4: fund the government through. So that's just an amusing little
Speaker 4: takeaway that only happened because the Freedom CAC is operated
Speaker 4: as a block. That is, if the if the Squad,
Speaker 4: if there was something between the Squad and the Congressional
Speaker 4: Progressive Caucus that's like a middle size between Squad, which
Speaker 4: is too small to operate as a block, and the CPC,
Speaker 4: which is like too sprawling to be in lockstep on
Speaker 4: progressive priorities, they would be so powerful.
Speaker 5: Well, it was headed in that direction, and in twenty
Speaker 5: twenty two a ton of them got nuked by APAC
Speaker 5: and DMFI.
Speaker 1: So it was a real The Squad was growing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I mean like it's you can't, you can't.
Speaker 1: Which is they don't want you final chapters in that book.
Speaker 4: Even if it's smart for them to put you in
Speaker 4: the club, they don't want you in the club. They
Speaker 4: don't want you in there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so good luck, and they're never gonna.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and by the way, changing and reforming the entire system,
Speaker 4: this entire Mike Johnson, who was Freedom Caucus adjacent, he
Speaker 4: wasn't in the Freedom Caucus, but he talked like a
Speaker 4: lot of them. He's now putting an omnibus out that
Speaker 4: is full of pork that Republicans said they would not do,
Speaker 4: and he's forcing them to vote on it. He's probably
Speaker 4: going to have to work with Democrats. So is it?
Speaker 4: You know, have anti establishment Republicans changed the system through
Speaker 4: the Freedom Caucus and through saying screw John Bayner were
Speaker 4: working outside of the halls of power. No, but they're
Speaker 4: getting closer and at the very least they've set the
Speaker 4: standard that this is not acceptable and Democrats don't have
Speaker 4: anything like that.
Speaker 5: Right now, moving over to Ukraine, stunning footage emerging out
Speaker 5: of Moscow and published simultaneously in a bunch of Ukrainian
Speaker 5: television networks. So we don't have to wonder about, you know,
Speaker 5: how the footage had taken or what happened here, we
Speaker 5: can roll this vo here.
Speaker 1: So this is this is the moment.
Speaker 5: That General igor Kirolov, who's basically in charge of Russia's
Speaker 5: nuclear Protection Force, is walking out of his There you
Speaker 5: see it, walking out of his walking out of a
Speaker 5: building in Boom.
Speaker 4: And if you're listening to it, yeah, you just see
Speaker 4: snow covering snow and debris covering the camera all of
Speaker 4: a sudden.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: And so this is happening as as Zelenski is huddling
Speaker 5: with with European leaders doing everything he can to try
Speaker 5: to get as much support in place for his war
Speaker 5: effort as possible before Trump takes office. But meanwhile things
Speaker 5: are collapsing politically around him. Not you know, not only
Speaker 5: is Trump coming into office in Washington, you have Trudeau
Speaker 5: on his way out. We're gonna talk about that in
Speaker 5: a moment. Trudeau on his way out in Canada. Canada
Speaker 5: has been one of the really top you know, Western
Speaker 5: supporters of the Ukrainian war effort, and I think has
Speaker 5: the third largest population of Ukrainians in the world, including
Speaker 5: including Ukraine. And you have the German Chancellor Schulz on
Speaker 5: his way out, uh which is and he's probably going
Speaker 5: to be replaced by the you know, the was the
Speaker 5: Christian Democratic Union whatever they call that center right party
Speaker 5: over it in Germany, which is which has actively been
Speaker 5: saying that they want to reduce support for the Ukraine
Speaker 5: war effort. You've got Macrone in trouble in France, and
Speaker 5: so the writing is clearly on the wall when it
Speaker 5: comes to.
Speaker 1: Western support for this war effort.
Speaker 5: Meanwhile, you know, Ukraine is running out of Ukrainians to
Speaker 5: throw into the trenches here, while the Russian economy, in
Speaker 5: the Ukrainian economy is in complete collapse as as any
Speaker 5: economy would be facing this these circumstances and just completely
Speaker 5: propped up by NATO financing. Whereas Russia's economy is, you know,
Speaker 5: it's not completely booming off the walls, but they're doing well.
Speaker 5: Putin is facing no political backlash to speak of it.
Speaker 5: It's not as if his position is threatened. His his goals,
Speaker 5: you know, continue to remain achievable. So, uh look looking
Speaker 5: like a complete mess. And you know, Trump just the
Speaker 5: other day calling for an immediate ceasefire in Ukraine. The
Speaker 5: a sign of what I think is some desperation comes
Speaker 5: from a.
Speaker 1: Recent tweeted video. We can put this is put this
Speaker 1: up as just a vo.
Speaker 5: This is related to this charge by Western allies that
Speaker 5: North Korea is has surged a bunch of like special
Speaker 5: forces operatives into you know to support the Russian cause.
Speaker 5: A couple of weeks ago, I repeated that on this
Speaker 5: show because I thought it was just a fact, Like
Speaker 5: I thought it was like a publicly known fact and
Speaker 5: that North Korea was like that North Korea wasn't denying it,
Speaker 5: nobody was denying it.
Speaker 1: I was like, this is this is what we're doing.
Speaker 5: Uh it turns out no, Like uh, it turns out
Speaker 5: that this is an argument that Ukraine and Ukraine supporters
Speaker 5: in the US have been making.
Speaker 1: In order to try to gin up support for the
Speaker 1: war effort.
Speaker 5: Like I and it seems it was like, wait a minute,
Speaker 5: that that's what this is.
Speaker 4: Are you saying that the claims are exaggerated or that.
Speaker 5: It may not even be true, Like, so, there's there's
Speaker 5: no evidence that North Koreans are actually fighting in Russia
Speaker 5: other than these claims that are being made. And so
Speaker 5: what we showed you there was z Lensky tweeting that
Speaker 5: the reason that there's no that they have been able
Speaker 5: to provide zero evidence that there are North Koreans participating
Speaker 5: in this this assault is that Russia has been deleting
Speaker 5: all the videos and that they've been burning the faces
Speaker 5: of the Korean troops who've been killed so that Ukraine
Speaker 5: can't then get the bodies and prove to the world
Speaker 5: that this claim they made about North Korean's being there.
Speaker 5: And I don't know if if you believe that, I
Speaker 5: don't know what to tell you, like that, if that's
Speaker 5: that's where you are at this point, you're saying that
Speaker 5: they're burning their faces and they and so they put up.
Speaker 1: A little bit of video that purports to show.
Speaker 5: Something along those lines, and it's like, I don't know, man,
Speaker 5: it's just so. And the reason I repeated on the
Speaker 5: show is like I just I just thought it was true.
Speaker 5: I just thought, like, oh, North Korea is sending some
Speaker 5: troops because Russia asked them to do that.
Speaker 1: Okay, fine, like we should end this war.
Speaker 5: But the source of this has been kind of NATO
Speaker 5: sources saying that North Korea is doing this, therefore we
Speaker 5: need to, you know, ramp up more funding for this war,
Speaker 5: which is like, that's how far removed I am from
Speaker 5: the the propaganda here, because it's like I don't even
Speaker 5: see how that's a persuasive argument, Like I don't even
Speaker 5: get the right idea that that's a persuasive argument, Like
Speaker 5: you're to me, your position on whether or not this
Speaker 5: war should continue shouldn't be changed, whether or not there's
Speaker 5: some North Korean special forces involved.
Speaker 4: Well, it's actually I think the opposite. I think that's
Speaker 4: what's interesting about this line, which is they think they're
Speaker 4: convinced that what this means is we need to give
Speaker 4: people will people will respond to this and say, oh
Speaker 4: my gosh, yes, please send all of the money to Ukraine,
Speaker 4: and let's continue this war. Let's defeat Putin. He is
Speaker 4: now engaging. This is like access of evil. I think
Speaker 4: that's what they assume. People interpreted as yes, yeah, whereas
Speaker 4: a lot of people look at there like you're kidding me.
Speaker 4: There's another nuclear power involved, Like stop, is so out
Speaker 4: of touch. The New York Times reported yesterday on a
Speaker 4: general US general who's Air Force Major General pat Ryder.
Speaker 4: The Pentagon's booksmen told Rapperts on Monday that the North
Speaker 4: Koreans had entered combat last week in Kursk, and they
Speaker 4: assessed that North Korean soldiers have engaged in combat and
Speaker 4: have indications they have separate casualties, both killed and wounded. Reportedly,
Speaker 4: I think they think it's around thirty casualties, something like
Speaker 4: that The New York Times, to something we talked about
Speaker 4: earlier in the show, said those claims could not be
Speaker 4: independently verify.
Speaker 5: Because they're burning their faces, Like, are you kidding me?
Speaker 5: And then look, if North Korea is sending troops to Russia, like,
Speaker 5: it's not as if I believe that North Korea has
Speaker 5: some like morality that would prevent it from allowing its
Speaker 5: special forces to become mercenaries for Russia. Sure, they'd be
Speaker 5: fine to do that, but we need a little evidence,
Speaker 5: and this like claims could not be corroborated. That's one
Speaker 5: thing when you go and say your claims could not
Speaker 5: be corroborated because Russia is destroying video evidence and burning
Speaker 5: the faces of the Korean soldiers, That's what I'm like,
Speaker 5: Hold on a second, that makes no sense.
Speaker 4: I mean, in North Korea's mom isn't entirely surprising, but.
Speaker 5: It wouldn't be I mean, sure, like, but if they're
Speaker 5: not involved, we shouldn't say.
Speaker 4: That they are definitely not definitely mean.
Speaker 1: And look, maybe maybe I'm totally wrong.
Speaker 5: There's some and the and the US military is uh,
Speaker 5: you know, telling the truth for once, but we need
Speaker 5: we need some evidence and and the excuse for their
Speaker 5: not being evidence really cannot be that the Russians are
Speaker 5: burning the faces of the people.
Speaker 1: Killed, which is in those words, how do you do what?
Speaker 5: Come on, how do you do that? They're all walking
Speaker 5: around with gas cans. I just find that and you
Speaker 5: still would have the rest of the person even if
Speaker 5: we burn their face.
Speaker 1: Oh, faces burned. You can't tell who this.
Speaker 4: Is right or right, like uniforms and or other things.
Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe we're stupid as they think they are.
Speaker 1: You think they are, they think they are.
Speaker 4: Speaking of stupid people. This is a good transition to
Speaker 4: Justin Trudeau's smart. Dude, nailed it.
Speaker 1: He's smart. You can say what you want about Is
Speaker 1: you think he's smart? Oh yeah? When yeah, things kind
Speaker 1: of a bimbo or something.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you think he is like a sort of snowy
Speaker 4: Gavin Newsom.
Speaker 1: Yeah he's read books. He's read. I bet he's read books.
Speaker 4: He's read like gone girl.
Speaker 5: Oh, by the way, I do have to like I
Speaker 5: totally face planted during that interview that we did with
Speaker 5: Guy Stewart, the Syrian.
Speaker 1: Who went to fight in Syria.
Speaker 5: I was making fun of our audience for not reading
Speaker 5: and told everybody that they should go read. Ah, I
Speaker 5: thought I was saying for Whom the Bell Oh yeah,
Speaker 5: that was so I'm blaming guy since he's not here.
Speaker 5: So Guy was saying that there's this character in the
Speaker 5: book that keeps talking about manyana, which is there's a
Speaker 5: similar phrase in Kurdish. That's from for Whom the Bell Tolls. Right,
Speaker 5: Obviously people say manyana in uh in George Orwell's book
Speaker 5: Homage to Catalonia, But it's much more of a thing
Speaker 5: in for Whom the Bell tollsa Manyana.
Speaker 1: Which is by Ernest Hemingway. It is a great book.
Speaker 5: Ah, but I've conflated al much to Catalonia and Ernest
Speaker 5: and and from the Bell Tolls while making fun of
Speaker 5: young people for not reading it is utterly embarrassing.
Speaker 1: So it's quite all right.
Speaker 4: I mean, none of us caught it. There's three of
Speaker 4: us here, and none of us caught it. The audience
Speaker 4: caught it right.
Speaker 5: Away, though of course they did well write audience, but
Speaker 5: actually they didn't catch that.
Speaker 1: They're like, no, dude, that's by George Orwell.
Speaker 5: The actual own would have been, no dude, that's for
Speaker 5: whom the Bell tolls.
Speaker 4: That's the act.
Speaker 5: Because I said it was an American right who went
Speaker 5: to fighting Spain. George Orwell is not an American.
Speaker 4: No, so you had that part right, Yeah, just a
Speaker 4: lot of jumbled you know. It's if people are easy
Speaker 4: to confuse, it's fair.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you guys tried to four hours of shows straight.
Speaker 4: Well, exactly, this is we're about to talk here about
Speaker 4: the German chancellor, Justin Trudeau.
Speaker 1: Exactly did you catch that one? Good one?
Speaker 4: So, not a good one at all, but Justin Trudeau
Speaker 4: has Justin Trudeau is facing very serious calls for his resignation,
Speaker 4: very serious calls for his resignation. We could put first
Speaker 4: element up on the screens from the BBC. His finance
Speaker 4: minister quit, resigned And this is as the BBC puts
Speaker 4: it in the headline, all coming amidst a quote spat
Speaker 4: over Trump threat, the Trump threat obviously being the tariffs,
Speaker 4: and his finance minister resigned, she said, because he's prioritizing
Speaker 4: political gimmicks, meaning he flew down to mar A Lago
Speaker 4: and sort of made nice with Donald Trump and then
Speaker 4: the two have exchanged barbs ever since. Because Trudeau realized
Speaker 4: that his own party was furious about that. And so
Speaker 4: this is a significant threat to his party, significant threat
Speaker 4: to his leadership. Ryan, how do you think this is
Speaker 4: going to shake out for Trudeau?
Speaker 5: I will say, to give Trump credit, it is funny
Speaker 5: when he calls him Governor Trudeau, oh, and calls the
Speaker 5: great State of Canada like that's good stuff. So he
Speaker 5: asked Christian Friedland to step down as Minister of Finance
Speaker 5: and take a different cabinet position. She said no, and
Speaker 5: then she timed her her vicious resignation letter for maximum
Speaker 5: political damage to him. Basically, what her argument is is
Speaker 5: that you know the game is on, like Trump is
Speaker 5: coming for us. This is an existential threat. It's twenty
Speaker 5: five percent tariff. Canada needs to be put aside all
Speaker 5: of our different differences and completely unite against Trump right now,
Speaker 5: the same way that they did say when they were
Speaker 5: renegotiating NAFTA that you know, we need to collectively fight
Speaker 5: for this because this is going to set our path.
Speaker 1: For you know, a generation or more.
Speaker 5: And she's saying we need to harbor as many of
Speaker 5: our resources and financial resources as we can in order
Speaker 5: to be ready for the trade war. That they believe
Speaker 5: that they should have to try to back Trump down
Speaker 5: from these tariffs, because like Trump's predicate here is kind
Speaker 5: of ridiculous. He's saying that he's going to slap these
Speaker 5: twenty five percent tariffs on Canada because it's it's borders insecure.
Speaker 1: Come on, it's not would.
Speaker 5: Seriously, you're you're like the Trump base really wants a
Speaker 5: wall all the way across the northern Canada, like northern
Speaker 5: US and southern Canada.
Speaker 1: Really that's what that's what we're gonna do.
Speaker 5: Come on, Also, if it's a state, if it's just
Speaker 5: another state and he's the governor, we don't have walls
Speaker 5: between our states, so that makes any sense.
Speaker 1: And so not yet.
Speaker 5: Freelan's argument was, look, we can win this if we
Speaker 5: stand up to him, because he's not really serious about US.
Speaker 1: He's he's he'd rather take on China and Europe and Mexico.
Speaker 4: He's willing to negotiate too.
Speaker 5: I mean, also, they need like we the USMC we
Speaker 5: need their wood. They're oil like like we need. There
Speaker 5: are imports from Canada maple syrup because it's not getting
Speaker 5: cold enough of Vermont. Uh, there are imports that we
Speaker 5: need from Canada. That putting a giant tariff on it's
Speaker 5: not gonna do anything for domestic manufacturing up New York.
Speaker 5: New England is making as much maple syrup as it can. Like,
Speaker 5: putting a tariff on Canadian maple syrup is just gonna
Speaker 5: let them charge us more.
Speaker 4: I'm gonna be honest. I like the cheap maple syrup
Speaker 4: that ourf K Junior is probably about to ban. I
Speaker 4: don't even know.
Speaker 1: One of my daughters like that. I'm like, we stop it, right, stuff,
Speaker 1: Come on?
Speaker 4: So the opposition reader's.
Speaker 5: Same with the timber and the like oil and natural resource.
Speaker 5: It's like, what's the point of a tariff on that?
Speaker 4: Well? But here's I actually think to your point about
Speaker 4: whether Trudeau is smart or stupid, I sort of think
Speaker 4: he's handling this in a smarter way than raging against
Speaker 4: Trump's quote economic nationalism, which is what really did in
Speaker 4: her resignation of that too.
Speaker 1: Here, yeah, this is her. This is about her resigning, right.
Speaker 4: And I mean, there's Trump is the one thing. The
Speaker 4: one way that you don't get a deal with Donald
Speaker 4: Trump is by going full like elite, knocking him and
Speaker 4: treating him like he's dirt. All of that. It's like
Speaker 4: a really bad way to get something in your country's
Speaker 4: interest from the incoming president. They can't prevent Donald Trump
Speaker 4: becoming the president of the United States. They have to
Speaker 4: work with Donald Trump. And we saw him negotiate a
Speaker 4: lot with AMLO, with USMCA, like they can get a
Speaker 4: good deal out of Donald Trump. And I think that's
Speaker 4: why Trudeau, to your point about maybe him being smart,
Speaker 4: maybe he is the winter Gavin Newsom flew down to
Speaker 4: mar A Lago and tried to actually work something out. Now,
Speaker 4: was it a little embarrassingly that's the right word. Sycophantic?
Speaker 4: Maybe it might have been. I'm sure that's what caused
Speaker 4: a lot of ripples in Canadian politics. Probably wasn't a
Speaker 4: different way that he could have done it, although I
Speaker 4: don't know if Trump would have allowed it to be
Speaker 4: done a different way with that that photo op at
Speaker 4: the dinner table. But Donald Trump is the president. Like
Speaker 4: it's as simple as that. You have to work with
Speaker 4: the incoming president. And Trudeau's popularity according to BBC in
Speaker 4: June of this year, it was at twenty eight percent.
Speaker 4: Twenty eight percent.
Speaker 1: Canada is overstate, is welcome. I mean he's been there forever.
Speaker 4: The vibes have shifted. There was a great piece recently
Speaker 4: about how Trudeau and Obama like the center left. As
Speaker 4: we were talking about Loui, we'll be talking about Schulzen McCrone.
Speaker 4: In this block. The center left had its moment where
Speaker 4: it was riding high and felt really good and it
Speaker 4: looked like Trudeau was the future and Trudeau would be
Speaker 4: like the uh. He was the setting the tone for
Speaker 4: the future of Canada and it was I think this
Speaker 4: was in a peace spot on Angela Merkel and her
Speaker 4: new book, and that has collapsed. That vision of the
Speaker 4: future is completely collapsed, and it's one that the sort
Speaker 4: of Davo set was really optimistic about because it meant
Speaker 4: they had control. And that moment has totally faded from
Speaker 4: West from politics, to say the very least. So his opposition,
Speaker 4: the opposition leader in this case, who's the last name.
Speaker 4: I can't say Pierre, I never can say it. But
Speaker 4: he is a very formidable opponent. He has a robust
Speaker 4: presence online, support from American Conservatives now goes viral a lot.
Speaker 5: But he hid like a barn Burner speech and whatever
Speaker 5: their Congress.
Speaker 4: Is, yeah whatever, it's well, there are states, so.
Speaker 1: They don't know their state legislature.
Speaker 4: He if you haven't seen the video of him like
Speaker 4: munching on an apple while just destroying a reporter. I
Speaker 4: highly recommend looking that one up. But he is his
Speaker 4: support from American conservatives, but more importantly, all of that
Speaker 4: stems from him just being very articulates. He makes his
Speaker 4: case really well. He's a good ambassador for his ideas.
Speaker 4: Canada's next federal election, according to BBC, must be held
Speaker 4: in October, at the very latest he's calling for. Opposition
Speaker 4: party is calling for earlier elections. Trudeau is facing calls
Speaker 4: from his own party to resign. It is just a
Speaker 4: complete mess. And maybe, as that political headline suggested, the
Speaker 4: chaos is good for Canada because they need something other
Speaker 4: than Trudeau.
Speaker 5: And so if we can put up F three here,
Speaker 5: this is an interesting wrinkle here amid all this collapse,
Speaker 5: their their dollar is crashing. That has interesting implications for
Speaker 5: Trump's attempt to do a trade war. So when you're
Speaker 5: when your dollar crashes, when or when your currency crashes,
Speaker 5: then your exports are cheaper.
Speaker 1: So that what this.
Speaker 5: Means is Canadian products that get exported into let's say
Speaker 5: into the United States, we can buy them cheaper.
Speaker 1: Trump then.
Speaker 5: Has his tariffs kind of defect m So the goal
Speaker 5: of a tariff is to basically raise the price of
Speaker 5: something for domestic consumers, which then encourages domestic production of
Speaker 5: that thing. Like we said, when it comes to Canada,
Speaker 5: some of that's ridiculous because maple syrup would et cetera.
Speaker 1: But whatever.
Speaker 5: But setting that aside, it just means that if your
Speaker 5: currency collapses by twenty five percent and then then you
Speaker 5: come in with a twenty five percent tariff, we actually
Speaker 5: have to come in with now closer to like a
Speaker 5: thirty five percent tariff because because of math.
Speaker 1: In order just to get it back to where you
Speaker 1: were originally.
Speaker 5: So all the jaw bwoning between Trump and Trudeau, which
Speaker 5: is driving down their dollar actually makes it then harder
Speaker 5: for Trump to do what he's trying to do with
Speaker 5: his with his tariffs, because currently it's doing the reverse.
Speaker 4: It's it's like a reverse tariff now over in Germany.
Speaker 5: So we're subsidizing their exports right now and over it
Speaker 5: through Trump's mouth.
Speaker 4: In Germany, Chancellor Olaf Schultz has lost a bout of
Speaker 4: confidence in the fallout from that is continuing as well
Speaker 4: in the Parliament. So this really ryan to your point
Speaker 4: about the center left. My Crone right now is struggling
Speaker 4: with the center left coalition that he he cobbled together,
Speaker 4: the weirdest coalition that we sort of covered a lot
Speaker 4: when it was happening, but in this case with Schultz,
Speaker 4: kind of interesting. That's happening during Angola Merkel's book tour.
Speaker 4: By the way, I think that's not great timing, or
Speaker 4: maybe it is great timing, but maybe it's gonna help
Speaker 4: her sell books. But as MPR report, Schultz's practice three
Speaker 4: party coalition government collapsed in really November when the Chancellor
Speaker 4: fired his finance minister. Sound familiar and in dispute over
Speaker 4: how to revitalize Germany's stagnant economy. Where does this go?
Speaker 5: So yeah, and so this is heavily Ukraine related in
Speaker 5: the sense that you know, he wanted to bust through.
Speaker 1: You know, Germany loves its death as.
Speaker 4: The Controls loves its Russian oil.
Speaker 1: The love well, they love the Russian oil.
Speaker 5: But yes, they they It's just the German culture just
Speaker 5: hates to spend beyond what it believes or its means.
Speaker 5: But he wanted to do so for the ongoing Ukraine War,
Speaker 5: and his his coalition collapsed basically as as a result
Speaker 5: of that.
Speaker 4: His coalition is with the Green Party too, though it.
Speaker 5: Is interesting in the Greens have been very militaristic too.
Speaker 5: The reason that he has this bizarre coalition is that
Speaker 5: the far right, the far far right party is picking
Speaker 5: up now like fifteen twelve to fifteen percent of the
Speaker 5: parliament and nobody will form a coalition with the.
Speaker 1: Far far right. Good for them.
Speaker 5: Germany has a troubled history when it comes to the
Speaker 5: far right, the far right, and so that leaves then
Speaker 5: less of the parliament to form a coalition. It makes
Speaker 5: it very hard for anybody to have a majority government
Speaker 5: that can actually do anything.
Speaker 1: And it's going to get especially interesting next time.
Speaker 5: Because the AfD, the far right party, is expected to
Speaker 5: grow to maybe twenty percent well.
Speaker 4: And it's a vicious cycle because the less or the
Speaker 4: more that you have right stagnant center left merely mounts.
Speaker 1: They can't deliver any thing right.
Speaker 4: The more exactly, the more powerful AfD gets, and the
Speaker 4: more fuel you're adding to the fire. So it's I mean,
Speaker 4: they're in like the exact definition of a pickle right.
Speaker 5: And it looks like the far left might be able
Speaker 5: to barrel its way into the parliament too through people
Speaker 5: have probably been following her. Sarah wagonnecked, this like kind
Speaker 5: of firebrand leftist who wagen wagen necked whenever, this firebrand
Speaker 5: leftist who like East Germans, joined the Communist Party and
Speaker 5: back in back when there was still an East East Germany.
Speaker 1: She's like you, yeah, there you go, Bernie, except she.
Speaker 5: Has gone hardcore anti immigrants.
Speaker 4: Not uncommon in Europe, but she is.
Speaker 5: But she's kept all the other left wing stuff but
Speaker 5: become like super German nativist. And it's a it's an
Speaker 5: interesting test for that kind of politics, which are being
Speaker 5: upended now by Syria, by Syria, because so many Syrians
Speaker 5: are just like they're like, yeah, we literally you thought
Speaker 5: we were lying, like we literally are refugees.
Speaker 1: We would rather be in Syria.
Speaker 5: Now that we can go back to Syria, We're going
Speaker 5: to go back to Syria.
Speaker 1: But a lot of them have been there ten years.
Speaker 5: Have built businesses and have built roots, and so the summer,
Speaker 5: you know, significant number are going to stay. So it'll
Speaker 5: you know, if she barrels in with you know, ten
Speaker 5: to fifteen percent. AfD's got twenty percent, it's pretty you'd
Speaker 5: have to have basically every other every other party would
Speaker 5: have to team up together to form a government. But
Speaker 5: those parties don't agree with each other, so functionally, what
Speaker 5: do you do? Right, Well, I guess we'll find out.
Speaker 4: Donald Trump enters office once again at a very precarious
Speaker 4: time in geopolitical history.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you're upscrewed. As Socger likes to say,
Speaker 1: Europe is just completely screwed.
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, well, And that's why I think breaking points
Speaker 4: works is because it's a good example of how the
Speaker 4: US may be a better position to not follow in
Speaker 4: the failed path of Europe, and that's failures.
Speaker 5: On the left right, we really kind of the grass
Speaker 5: is always greener on the other side, and like over here,
Speaker 5: left end right. I think both kind of love the
Speaker 5: parliamentary system because it allows you to vote your conscience
Speaker 5: and support Let's say, if you're on the right, you know,
Speaker 5: whichever flavor of right you like, you vote for them,
Speaker 5: and then they get a little piece of the parliament.
Speaker 5: So it means you don't have to you know, if
Speaker 5: you're on the left and you don't but you don't
Speaker 5: like Joe Biden, you vote for the Bernie Party right,
Speaker 5: or you vote where there's some technocratic like left Warrant
Speaker 5: Party and there's and then there's the whatever Biden is.
Speaker 4: In AOC said in Europe she would never.
Speaker 1: Been the same papiness, and that's correct, she would not be.
Speaker 5: We saw that play out this week, so we we
Speaker 5: kind of fine for that. On the other hand, it
Speaker 5: has its problems, a huge stagnant which we're seeing.
Speaker 4: I mean, we feel like we're stagnant. We can't pass
Speaker 4: anything through in Congress. But what gets worse is when
Speaker 4: you have the seesaw effect, you're changing a lot and
Speaker 4: nothing's really changing, Like policies just swing back and forth.
Speaker 5: We pass all our stuff in December of after elections.
Speaker 4: Yeah right, yeah, that's that's the way we do things,
Speaker 4: so vot.
Speaker 1: Voters don't get to say anymore. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Well, Ryan, we're all we're all pulling for you
Speaker 4: to close the loop on the beginning of the show,
Speaker 4: and I'm just amazed at and your family how are
Speaker 4: able to keep going and bring us to the news.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Well, we'll look back on this. It will be a
Speaker 5: thing that happened. Absolutely, that's the that's the hope.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, we will be back with one more show before
Speaker 4: the new year. Because Ryan booked a great guest, a
Speaker 4: huge guest.
Speaker 5: Chairman of the Congressional Progressive Caucus, Greg Gasar, incoming chairman
Speaker 5: from Austin.
Speaker 4: Texas, and we will that's a Friday show, So we're
Speaker 4: gonna sit down with him for a good long conversation
Speaker 4: about a lot of what we discussed without having a
Speaker 4: member of the Congressional Progressive Caucus here to kind of
Speaker 4: talk about the future and UH tactics and strategy and
Speaker 4: recent news as well. So that'll be fascinating, Ryan, especially
Speaker 4: on the custom the government government shutdown by the way,
Speaker 4: so lots of talk about with Greg Asar. Tune in
Speaker 4: on Friday for that Breaking Points dot Com. If you
Speaker 4: want to get a premium membership, you get to access
Speaker 4: to Counterpoints Friday shows early. You get to watch them
Speaker 4: on Thursday night, which when we have a lawmaker is
Speaker 4: cool because you actually get access to breaking news. There
Speaker 4: you go, all right, Breakingpoints dot Com. We will be
Speaker 4: back here Friday with more and we'll see you after
Speaker 4: the holiday break with more Counterpoints see then. Yeah,