Speaker 1: M. Welcome back to Behind the Bastards, the podcast where
Speaker 1: every week we read about a terrible person, and this
Speaker 1: one is part two of the story of Savitri Debby
Speaker 1: and most importantly, today is the episode recorded on the
Speaker 1: tail end of my recorder's batteries. So we are fucking
Speaker 1: dare devils right now. Wow? Okay, I like Robert, you're edging. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is the podcast edging. Yes, this is edging. This
Speaker 1: is what it means. This has never been totally clied
Speaker 1: what edging is, but I think that this I am
Speaker 1: the first person to edge more than a hundred thousand
Speaker 1: people at the same time. Wow. Okay, that was a
Speaker 1: flex on many levels, and I'm just going to through it. Okay.
Speaker 1: So that's what edging is, just plowing through it. Wow.
Speaker 1: Edging is when you're like, I'm not going when you
Speaker 1: bring someone to Yeah, you go to the edge of orgasm,
Speaker 1: but you keep you keep you keep stopping, and then
Speaker 1: that's the joke. Okay, Okay, Well I've brought up the
Speaker 1: joke originally, and now I'm explaining why I was corrected,
Speaker 1: which is what all great comedians do. So in October
Speaker 1: of nineteen, Hitler's death still fresh on her mind. Savitri
Speaker 1: Devi took part in the Festival of Kali at the
Speaker 1: Kalighat Temple in Calcutta. Now. Kali is the Hindu deity
Speaker 1: of destruction, a blueskinned goddess, and in traditional depictions, she
Speaker 1: wears a necklace of severed heads, a skirt made from
Speaker 1: severed arms, and wields just about every conceivable manner of
Speaker 1: ancient weapon in her many arms. You see a lot
Speaker 1: of times. Yeah, it's really cool. Like some of the
Speaker 1: statues of her like fucking twenty feet tall. It's metal
Speaker 1: as hell. Um. Yeah. So, as the goddess of destruction,
Speaker 1: Kali tends to inspire some pretty powerful feelings. As Tri
Speaker 1: stared up at the image of her goddess covered in
Speaker 1: gore and armed with massive swords the size of small ours,
Speaker 1: she blgged Cali for her blessing, a blessing of violence
Speaker 1: and destruction against the Allied powers who had destroyed her
Speaker 1: beloved Nazi Germany. She left the ceremony convinced that it
Speaker 1: was now her duty to do what she'd failed to
Speaker 1: do back in nineteen thirty nine. She had to finally
Speaker 1: travel to Germany and take part in the resistance to
Speaker 1: the Allies by any means necessary. She left her twenty
Speaker 1: cats in the care of a friend and left her
Speaker 1: Oh my god, and the cats. Yeah, it's pretty wild
Speaker 1: cats behind. This is a person who leaves her twenty
Speaker 1: cats behind and the care of a friend to go
Speaker 1: be a Nazi, like a month or two after Hitler died,
Speaker 1: Like months after Hitler do you get that texts just
Speaker 1: like hey, um so, like I have to go do
Speaker 1: a thing. Could you look after my cats? Indefinitely? Right? No? No?
Speaker 1: Could you look after my cats? And definitely will I
Speaker 1: go to try to resurrect Nazism in nineteen forties Germany
Speaker 1: parentheses there's twenty of the cats, by the way, just because,
Speaker 1: oh my god, it's good stuff. All the cruel and
Speaker 1: horrible things that this woman has done. I don't even
Speaker 1: know all of them. Yet this has to be like
Speaker 1: top ten. This is bad. It's pretty bad. She's a
Speaker 1: bad Yeah, she's not a great friend or person, but
Speaker 1: she does finally reach the birthplace of Hitlerism, the center
Speaker 1: of the ideology she'd adopted for herself in nineteen She
Speaker 1: later wrote in her book Golden the Furnace that the
Speaker 1: gods had ordained that I should have a glimpse of ruins,
Speaker 1: bitter irony of fate. Germany at that point was still
Speaker 1: largely destroyed and chopped up into four pieces by its
Speaker 1: victorious enemies. So Very Tree's writing about this time shows
Speaker 1: a wild ignorance about the extent of actual Nazi crimes,
Speaker 1: because she's so horrified and how bad things are in Germany.
Speaker 1: She writes, quote one remembers, I say that episode of
Speaker 1: the Second War is one beholds the ruins of all
Speaker 1: the German cities, the plight of men and women in
Speaker 1: the overcredit areas still fit to live in, and all
Speaker 1: the misery, all the bitterness consequent of that devilish bombing.
Speaker 1: Streams of fire, tons of phosphorus relentlessly poured over his
Speaker 1: people for five years. These were England's thanks to Adolf
Speaker 1: Hitler for having shown mercy to her soldiers in his
Speaker 1: hour of victory. These were the thanks of the United
Speaker 1: States of America for his older's orders not to shoot.
Speaker 1: The parachute is captured on German soil, which is like
Speaker 1: so she's she's framing the the British evacuations uh from
Speaker 1: the coast of France as like German mercy rather than
Speaker 1: incompetence on Hitler's behalf, which they actually were just rank
Speaker 1: and competence on Hitler's behalf. He's also talking about the
Speaker 1: mercy of Germany and not killing captured Allied UH paratroopers,
Speaker 1: which was illegal. And in doing this she's ignoring, for
Speaker 1: one example, the Malmedy massacre, in which a WAFF and
Speaker 1: s S troop massacred eight four American POWs with machine guns.
Speaker 1: She's also ignoring the estimated three point three million Russian
Speaker 1: POWs who died in German custody. But if I wind
Speaker 1: up actually arguing actual history with a dead Nazi will
Speaker 1: be here all day. So we're just going to move
Speaker 1: forward from that. But fair she whitewashes things a bit,
Speaker 1: is the point? Just a bit, just a scooch Just
Speaker 1: obviously it's gonna be horrible seeing Germany after World War Two,
Speaker 1: because like the bombing campaign over Germany was one of
Speaker 1: the greatest crimes in history. That said, they kind of
Speaker 1: had it coming tonight. I mean, fun man, if anyone
Speaker 1: has ever deserved that, it's fucking Nazi Germany. They do
Speaker 1: present themselves as a pretty clear target. Good, yeah, you
Speaker 1: can you can say the Allies. Maybe the Allies went
Speaker 1: overboard in some areas, will also being like, but what
Speaker 1: were they supposed to do? I think a bit of
Speaker 1: an overreaction may have been Historically you're like, okay, okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: you gotta do something. Yeah, you know, I it's it's
Speaker 1: something to not be happy about. But of the list
Speaker 1: of historical crimes I'm going to be outraged at, it's
Speaker 1: lower than, for example, the ones committed by Nazi Germany. Yeah, sure, sure, yeah. Um. Now,
Speaker 1: before visiting Germany, Savitri had hung out in Sweden, where
Speaker 1: a number of Nazis had fled after the war. There
Speaker 1: she met spinn Head and a Nazi supporting explorer and author,
Speaker 1: and a number of former members of the Nazi Party
Speaker 1: who were hiding out there because you know, it was
Speaker 1: a crime to be a Nazi. Now, she told them
Speaker 1: her mission was to deliver a message of hope to
Speaker 1: the German people. Now, since Nazism was a bit unpopular
Speaker 1: after the Second World War, she wasn't able to find
Speaker 1: any printers in Sweden to actually print out this message
Speaker 1: of hope, so instead, Savitri Devi had to write out
Speaker 1: five hundred leaflets by hand. Each featured a swastika, and
Speaker 1: these words quote men and women of Germany, in the
Speaker 1: midst of unspeakable riggers and suffering, hold fast to our
Speaker 1: glorious national socialist faith and resist, Defy the people, Defy
Speaker 1: the powers which work to denazify the German nation and
Speaker 1: the whole world. Nothing can destroy what is built on truth.
Speaker 1: We are pure gold which can be tested in the furnace.
Speaker 1: The furnace may glow and crackle, nothing can destroy us.
Speaker 1: One day we will rebel and triumph again. Hope and wait,
Speaker 1: Heil Hitler. So she writes five of these by hand
Speaker 1: and wearing a sorry and swastika earrings. Savitri Devi takes
Speaker 1: a train across Germany and tosses out hundred of leaflets
Speaker 1: um over the course about fifteen hours. Attached to each
Speaker 1: was a gift, a small amount of coffee, sugar, butter,
Speaker 1: sardines or cigarettes. She considered this journey to be an
Speaker 1: act of religious devotion, describing the leaflets as written and
Speaker 1: throne by the gauze through me. As her train crossed
Speaker 1: from Germany into Belgium, She's sang a Hindu him to Shiva.
Speaker 1: So a lot of commitment, a lot of commitment is
Speaker 1: going into this yes, yes, and that is all you
Speaker 1: can say. Yeah, that is yeah. Now. So she gets
Speaker 1: inspired by the success of her first visit and she
Speaker 1: plans two more trips through Germany. She spent a little
Speaker 1: bit of time resting in London and meeting up with
Speaker 1: fascists in London. Uh and because of all the fascists
Speaker 1: that are in London, she's able to actually find a
Speaker 1: printer to print up six thousand additional leaflets to take
Speaker 1: to Germany. Using a connection to an old friend in France,
Speaker 1: she secured a military permit to visit Germany for a
Speaker 1: longer period of time, claiming not falsely that she intended
Speaker 1: to write a book about the nation's post war trials.
Speaker 1: Her second tripped into Germany lasted three months and she
Speaker 1: successfully handed out all six thousand leaflets. She also met
Speaker 1: with a number of old Nazis, none of the none
Speaker 1: of them were very high ranking. These were like third
Speaker 1: rate Nazis, former po w's, and some of these POWs
Speaker 1: did have legitimate stories of Allied brutality that they faced
Speaker 1: in captivity, because like you know, it was a war. Um.
Speaker 1: She interviewed numerous German citizens, introducing herself at the start
Speaker 1: as a committed Nazi. To gain their trust, Savitri would
Speaker 1: then talk about her belief that Adolph Hitler was still
Speaker 1: alive somewhere in the world, and a shure these defeated
Speaker 1: Nazis that surely there were only two or three years
Speaker 1: away from a revival of Nazism in Germany. Imagine that
Speaker 1: Hitler was your tupac, Like that is such a wild
Speaker 1: That's like Hitler's like, No, he's on an island somewhere.
Speaker 1: You don't understand He's going to drop amazing album. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's got an album. Really, Yeah, you don't be the
Speaker 1: holograms a decoy? Yeah that sleek. I mean, I think
Speaker 1: we can. I mean that said, we both agreed that
Speaker 1: the hologram is a deco. Oh no, the hologram is
Speaker 1: absolutely decoy. Okay. Now, one of of these conversations um
Speaker 1: that Savitri had with a former Wehrmacht soldier is worth
Speaker 1: me reading out here. And I'm gonna quote again from
Speaker 1: the book Hitler's priestess quote, continuing his narrative to post
Speaker 1: war conditions and occupied Germany. The old fighter's face darkened.
Speaker 1: Nice people to talk about freedom and justice. These damned democrats,
Speaker 1: they have tied us hand and foot, so we cannot move.
Speaker 1: They have muzzled us, so we can offer no resistance
Speaker 1: while they plunder our country left and right, dismantle and
Speaker 1: carry off our factories piece by piece, cut down our forests,
Speaker 1: take our oil, our iron or steel, all that we have,
Speaker 1: and into the bargain, make people believe that we were
Speaker 1: to blame for the war, These confounded liars. He lusted
Speaker 1: for revenge. He longed for the day when the last
Speaker 1: Allies ran for their lives to escape Germany, when Paris
Speaker 1: would lay in ruins at its next German occupation, next
Speaker 1: time he would show neither mercy nor good humor. Savitri
Speaker 1: Devi felt a sense of mounting excitement as his mood
Speaker 1: became ever uglier, and he began to describe in a
Speaker 1: raised voice, how he would kill his enemies. This was
Speaker 1: the spirit she sought, the rolling eyes of a wounded animal,
Speaker 1: a war god of the Stone age, thirst for blood,
Speaker 1: barbaric magnificence. It was a perfect meeting of minds, the violent,
Speaker 1: resentful German and the Aryan prophetess of revenge. The day
Speaker 1: of reckoning seemed already nearer. Oh okay uh, she's a
Speaker 1: fun trip to Germany. I mean, you know, she had
Speaker 1: me at the beginning with the you know, feeling plundered
Speaker 1: and betrayed by the Democratic Party. Sure, yes, that's a
Speaker 1: strong start talking about the Democratic Party. Though I know,
Speaker 1: I know, I just there, Rob Robber, I was away
Speaker 1: from the mic at that point. What else can I do?
Speaker 1: I can confirm you were not away from the mic,
Speaker 1: as I think everyone you're right upon. This is revisionist,
Speaker 1: This is absurd, This is Savitri DEVII levels of revisionists.
Speaker 1: You are the Savitri Devi of this party. That's so mean.
Speaker 1: At least make me the Elizabeth Holmes of this podcast. Jeez,
Speaker 1: you have not earned that yet, James, Make me a
Speaker 1: fun one, Make me a fun bastard. Come on, make
Speaker 1: me a fun tragic one with a pony tail at least. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's nothing tragic about Savitri um So. She returned to
Speaker 1: France at December of ninety eight and immediately began to
Speaker 1: write a book, Gold in the Furnace, about her experiences
Speaker 1: and her growing conception of Hitlerism is something beyond what
Speaker 1: the old National Socialists had really believed. In February of
Speaker 1: nineteen nine, three chapters into her book, Savitri Devi was
Speaker 1: arrested by French authorities. She spent a total of six months. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because you know it's illegal to be a Nazi for
Speaker 1: good reason. I'm like, wait, hold on, unpacked that, yes,
Speaker 1: I understand. Yeah. She spent a total of six months
Speaker 1: in pre trial attention and then prison after her conviction
Speaker 1: for spreading Nazi propaganda. The time behind bars was good
Speaker 1: for Savitri, as it historically often is for Nazis who
Speaker 1: fancy themselves writers like her Idol Adolf Hitler. She used
Speaker 1: her prison time as an excuse to finish her first book.
Speaker 1: Just uses it as like a sabbatical, as one would
Speaker 1: is sabbatical. Yeah, it's an old Nazi story. She also
Speaker 1: took the opportunity to meet even more old Nazis. A
Speaker 1: lot of National Socialists were still imprisoned by the British
Speaker 1: occupation forces, and these old fighters were all too happy
Speaker 1: to talk with Savitri Devi. Her dearest friend in the
Speaker 1: prison was a former war dress from the bergen Belson
Speaker 1: concentration camp, a quote beautiful looking woman, a blonde of
Speaker 1: about my age. In Devie's words, she claimed that this
Speaker 1: war criminal had the classical beauty of a chieftain's wife
Speaker 1: in ancient Germany. And again this was a woman who
Speaker 1: worked at a concentration camp voluntarily the languages. So yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: and writes about like how cruel this woman's imprisonment was
Speaker 1: and how nice the concentration camps was. Like she's trash,
Speaker 1: She's she's trashed, She's she's absolute trash. I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: like spend a lot of time debunking her ship, like
Speaker 1: she's garbage. Yeah, and it's crazy. I mean it's like
Speaker 1: she is the one that that is like providing all
Speaker 1: of this information to She is the source. Yeah, she
Speaker 1: is the source. And again I can't say it enough.
Speaker 1: She never had the kutzpah to actually go to Nazi
Speaker 1: Germany while it existed. I think because number one, she
Speaker 1: would have been disappointed because like none of this this
Speaker 1: weird religious ship she attached to it was an actual
Speaker 1: part of Nazism in Nazi Germany. Um, Like she would
Speaker 1: have like she would have been like a just like
Speaker 1: she might have gotten knocked up by some Nazi, like
Speaker 1: at the orders of Heinrich Heimbler, but she wouldn't have Um,
Speaker 1: she wouldn't have been anything special in Nazi Germany. The
Speaker 1: odds are good. Like maybe they would have tried to
Speaker 1: use her to like propagandize because she knew a bunch
Speaker 1: of languages. I don't know. They might have liked had
Speaker 1: to try to reach out to India. But probably she
Speaker 1: would have just been another person. I don't know. I
Speaker 1: think that's an interesting aspect of it that isn't emphasized enough.
Speaker 1: She just wasn't willing to actually go to Nazi Germany
Speaker 1: in this place, she claimed, ruled Yeah, cool, so well.
Speaker 1: In late nineteen nine, Savitri Devi was again a free woman,
Speaker 1: and she published her first book to widespread acclaim from
Speaker 1: the international Nazi community. From this point on, Devy became
Speaker 1: a prolific author, writing up every significant event in her
Speaker 1: life through a mixture of supposedly nonfiction works as well
Speaker 1: as fanciful tales. For example, she retold the story of
Speaker 1: her first trip back to Europe and the children's fable
Speaker 1: Long Whiskers and the Two Legged Goddess, whose heroine is
Speaker 1: a cat loving Nazi named Helio Dora. No, that can't
Speaker 1: be real. Yeah, that sounds like random words selected from Uh, well,
Speaker 1: it all makes sense, like the Heliodora's really a self
Speaker 1: insert charactered cats Helio Savitri Devii's obsessed with sun, gods
Speaker 1: and goddesses a good how embarrassing for her. What's embarrassing
Speaker 1: is that Savitri writes that her self insert fantasy character
Speaker 1: has quote no human feelings in the ordinary sense of
Speaker 1: the word. She had been from her very childhood much
Speaker 1: too profoundly shocked at the behavior of man towards animals
Speaker 1: to have any sympathy for people suffering an account of
Speaker 1: their being Jews. Okay, the Holocaust is it bad? Have
Speaker 1: you seen what happened to cats when I was a kid.
Speaker 1: But here's the take that is a wild take to
Speaker 1: be like, you know how we resolve, uh, like violence
Speaker 1: towards cats also cause violence towards people. Yeah, surely the
Speaker 1: Holocaust is cool because cats have been mistreated? Is Vitri?
Speaker 1: She just goes to a whole other place. She's like,
Speaker 1: did you know, like when you're having like when you're
Speaker 1: having an argument with someone who doesn't want to have
Speaker 1: a good faith argument with you, and you're just like,
Speaker 1: well what about this? And they're like, well what about
Speaker 1: cats in France? What about that? Huh? And You're like,
Speaker 1: I don't I've been stunned like a pokemon. I don't know.
Speaker 1: And over the next few years, Savitri wrote and conversed
Speaker 1: with increasingly aged Nazis and gradually refined her theories about
Speaker 1: the world, until in nineteen fifty eight she published what
Speaker 1: would prove to be her magnum opus, The Lightning in
Speaker 1: the Sun. In this work, the ideas Savitri had been
Speaker 1: rattling around in her head all finally came together. Hitler,
Speaker 1: she concluded, was a man against time, fighting to uphold
Speaker 1: Aryan virtues and blood against the corruption of modernity. She
Speaker 1: placed him at the center of her own trinity, one
Speaker 1: that replaced the decadent Christian one she'd grown up despising,
Speaker 1: and her trinity. I dare you to make less sense
Speaker 1: than the trinity? She picks, Yeah, you think, who do
Speaker 1: you think? Who do you think's first? Hitler? Well, Hitler
Speaker 1: is the most important, but he's not the first, oh,
Speaker 1: the first. No, it goes in order of it goes
Speaker 1: in order of, like time period. So these are all
Speaker 1: historical figures. First one is definitely uh someone ancient Greek, no,
Speaker 1: ancient Egyptian at the first atheist. He's generally called he
Speaker 1: was like this, this pharaoh who declared himself the sun God,
Speaker 1: and like tried to institute monotheism and then he died
Speaker 1: and everything he did was burned by the people who
Speaker 1: came after him because they thought he was an asshole. Um.
Speaker 1: And it's weird because she like hates monotheism so much,
Speaker 1: but he's like one of the people she loves. I
Speaker 1: think just because he's the sun god and she's got
Speaker 1: a weird she'll make an exception. She'll give any sun
Speaker 1: god a pass. Basically, it's it's fucking weird. Um. Second
Speaker 1: in her holy trinity is gang Scott, does she And
Speaker 1: here's why? Why? Um? It would it wouldn't make sense.
Speaker 1: I mean, basically history's greatest conqueror. He's a great conqueror
Speaker 1: and he's not Christian or Jewish or anything. You know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So act In is the Sun and the con is
Speaker 1: the lightning and Hitler, she believes, combines the best attributes
Speaker 1: of both the Pharaoh's wisdom with the strategic mind of Genguscott.
Speaker 1: Genghis Khan succeeded in invading Russia during the winter. So
Speaker 1: I don't know where you're coming from. This woman is okay,
Speaker 1: one of these two knew how to invade Russia, and
Speaker 1: it was not Hitler and then Hitler or is there, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the third is hit because he combines the best parts
Speaker 1: of Acinat just like a terrible cartoon. She would not
Speaker 1: watch this cartoon wild. Yeah, it's so dumb. Um. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So there's probably a couple of reasons for her obsession
Speaker 1: with Acant And for one thing, Akinat was deeply revered
Speaker 1: by the Theosophical Society, which you will remember from our
Speaker 1: our episodes on anthroposophy. Um, and the Theosophical Society held
Speaker 1: a lot of ties also to the Tulist Society and
Speaker 1: all the other weird little occult groups who supported the Nazis.
Speaker 1: Early on had been a utopian thinker who tried and
Speaker 1: failed to a stay a perfect city. Good Rich Clark,
Speaker 1: Sametri's biographer, writes that she saw his son worshipping cult
Speaker 1: as quote rejection of all politics that promotes man's interest
Speaker 1: at a cost to the beauty and abundance of nature,
Speaker 1: which is just invented by her. Like, yeah, I feel
Speaker 1: like maybe she's she's like me and Jack Skellington. She's
Speaker 1: just kind of there for the aesthetic and maybe doesn't
Speaker 1: fully understand she is okay, Jack Skellington. Yeah, that is okay, Okay,
Speaker 1: Now I'm now, I'm like, I understand this mindset. If
Speaker 1: this holy Trinity doesn't work for you, consider embracing the
Speaker 1: holy Trinity of the products and services that support this show. Products, services,
Speaker 1: and god, what's the third one? Each is one and
Speaker 1: a half of the trinity. That's how good both products
Speaker 1: and services are. Wow. Yeah they add up to three products.
Speaker 1: M h, we're back. So um God, there's so much
Speaker 1: to get through with this. This woman's fucking stupid, stupid,
Speaker 1: fucking beliefs, but they're very important. They're they're stupid, and
Speaker 1: they're also kind of they're so dumb and complicated. They're
Speaker 1: so and comicated a lot of phases. They all make sense.
Speaker 1: I'll say that they don't make sense of the fact
Speaker 1: that they're true, but like, based on her history and
Speaker 1: like the things that she imbibes, they all makes I
Speaker 1: can see why why she came to these conclusions. But
Speaker 1: they're super dumb. So the core of her Nazism is
Speaker 1: a love of nature, which was a big part of
Speaker 1: actual original Nazism too. They were very into like like
Speaker 1: natural life and ship and like taking care of the
Speaker 1: land and animal welfare UM, and some of her early
Speaker 1: books that she wrote when the Nazis were in power,
Speaker 1: but before she was explicitly a Nazi, like The Impeachment
Speaker 1: of Man UM, don't explicitly reference in Nazism. And these
Speaker 1: books like The Impeachment of Man is still kind of
Speaker 1: popular among chunks of the New Age and environmentalist movements today.
Speaker 1: Savitri Devi's passionate writing on animal rights is actually one
Speaker 1: of the many little roads that exist between the green
Speaker 1: movement and the neo Nazi movement. UM, and it's really
Speaker 1: fucked up. UM. Devi herself famously railed against the Allied
Speaker 1: forces purging Germany of its fascist organizations, saying that quote,
Speaker 1: you cannot denazifying nature. Um. She believed that nature was
Speaker 1: fundamentally nationalist, national socialist. UM. And yeah, that's a that's
Speaker 1: a take. I'm gonna read a quote from the Man now,
Speaker 1: and I want to remind you there are people who
Speaker 1: are like environmentalists, who are not Nazis, who read this
Speaker 1: book today and don't really realize what's going on a
Speaker 1: civilization that makes such a ridiculous fuss about alleged war crimes,
Speaker 1: acts of violence against the actual or potential enemies of
Speaker 1: one's cause, and tolerate slaughter houses and vivisection laboratories and
Speaker 1: circuses in the fur industry, infliction and pain upon creatures
Speaker 1: that can never before or against any cause, does not
Speaker 1: deserve to live out with it, bless the day it
Speaker 1: will destroy itself. So that a healthy, hard, frank, and brave,
Speaker 1: nature loving and truth loving elite of superman with a
Speaker 1: life centered faith, a natural human aristocracy is beautiful on
Speaker 1: its own higher level, as the four legged kings of
Speaker 1: the jungle might again rise and rule upon its remains forever.
Speaker 1: So again you see how because of the kind of
Speaker 1: stuff she's written, she's there's this, there's these bridges. She's
Speaker 1: a big part of why there's bridges between the eco
Speaker 1: movement and the Nazi movement. And there very much are
Speaker 1: on like the hard edge of the of the of
Speaker 1: the eco movement, of the anticlimate change movement, there are
Speaker 1: Nazis and left wing activists who kind of increasingly seem
Speaker 1: like Nazis in a lot of cases. Is not to
Speaker 1: say that, like even supporting radical environmental action makes you
Speaker 1: a Nazi. It's to say that, like part of the
Speaker 1: what schre achieved is building in roads between these groups
Speaker 1: and the Nazi movement. So now more there's a lot
Speaker 1: of people that get into Nazism through environmentalism, and Savitri
Speaker 1: Devi is a part of that um And that's kind
Speaker 1: of the story we're telling today. Snazism really knows how
Speaker 1: to ruin a good thing. It wasn't as good at
Speaker 1: it before Savitri Devi. It's always been a ruiner, but
Speaker 1: she really took it to new levels, elevated how bad
Speaker 1: it was. Yea. So the lightning in the sun her
Speaker 1: opus pose. It's a cyclical view of history. She believe
Speaker 1: that time began with a Golden Age in which it
Speaker 1: was dominated by the perfect a sun god age like
Speaker 1: a sun god. And this degraded slowly into a Silver
Speaker 1: age and then a Bronze age. And both of these
Speaker 1: worst ages featured increased racial mixing that weakened the arians.
Speaker 1: They also featured pernicious Jewish influence. The next age is
Speaker 1: the kali Yuga, or Dark Age, which Savitri believed the
Speaker 1: world had all really entered into. She also called this
Speaker 1: dark age the reign of the Jew. No. Yeah, the
Speaker 1: only way out of this dark age was for the
Speaker 1: man against time. Hitler to gather up the terrible weapons
Speaker 1: of the Dark Age and use them to bring about
Speaker 1: the return of the Golden Age, presumably through genocidal purging
Speaker 1: of non arians in the establishment of a strict racial hierarchy.
Speaker 1: Her book was dedicated quote to the godlike individual of
Speaker 1: our times, the man against Time, the greatest European of
Speaker 1: all times, both sun and lightning, as a tribute of
Speaker 1: unfailing loyalty and love forever and ever God. You know,
Speaker 1: there's been a lot said about fan culture. I don't
Speaker 1: agree with all of it, but you know, this is
Speaker 1: a real argument against fan culture. This is the worst
Speaker 1: fan culture has ever gone. I feel comfortable saying this
Speaker 1: is this is this is the worst it can go.
Speaker 1: This is bad stand culture. It's bad, bad, bad there
Speaker 1: and and even the way that she rights and structures
Speaker 1: these things, it kind of you can hear that like
Speaker 1: interest in like ancient history in there, because it just
Speaker 1: sounds like she's kind of connecting these lines that don't
Speaker 1: actually exist to make it sound like to I mean,
Speaker 1: kind of like the way she like arguably maybe lifted
Speaker 1: some of her own like self mythologizing from mind comps,
Speaker 1: Like she's just like putting something she wants to say
Speaker 1: into a familiar framework. Yeah, it's called syncretics. Well, this
Speaker 1: is part of syncretism, is like taking these other things
Speaker 1: that you like and sticking it onto this thing. Um.
Speaker 1: And this is like the main thing she goes down
Speaker 1: in history for for doing to Nazism. Now I have
Speaker 1: I have a lot of debates with myself putting this
Speaker 1: together about how much detailed to get into about Savitri's theories.
Speaker 1: There's a really dark, very vile world of esoteric Hitlerist
Speaker 1: fantasy based in large part off of her writing. And
Speaker 1: this ship is dangerous. Um. It spreads a kind of
Speaker 1: ideological infection that grabs impressionable chldren primarily in a vice
Speaker 1: like grip, and turns them into something very dangerous. And
Speaker 1: a lot of people have died from this, and I
Speaker 1: am not going to If you're very knowledgeable about this,
Speaker 1: you will notice there is a lot of things I'm
Speaker 1: leaving out just because like this is enough to understand it,
Speaker 1: and I don't want to just like be spreading weird
Speaker 1: Nazi propaganda to an audience. Um of as you said,
Speaker 1: a hundred thou people, the Robert that is the most
Speaker 1: merciful thing you've ever done on this entire podcast. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just too dangerous in my opinion. That's good, that's yeah,
Speaker 1: I agree. And I don't even know what it was.
Speaker 1: It's fucking weird, stupid ship. But yeah. The last thing
Speaker 1: that's really important to understand about Davitri Devi's beliefs is
Speaker 1: that she decided Hitler was what she called well, she
Speaker 1: was not the only person. Other people had the same idea,
Speaker 1: but she's one of the more prominent ones. The kali Yuga,
Speaker 1: the tenth incarnation of vishnu um and she used several
Speaker 1: segments from August Kuba's x I advised book The Young Hitler.
Speaker 1: I knew Kubazek was Hitler's friend when they were like teenagers.
Speaker 1: He wrote a terrible book. It's valuable because it's the
Speaker 1: only insight we haven't hit Hitler at that period. But
Speaker 1: he clearly wrote it to make money. Is it like
Speaker 1: my friend Dahmer? Is it like that? It's like the
Speaker 1: same vibe of like this horrible person. Yeah, I knew,
Speaker 1: you're like cool. Yeah, but you also get the feeling
Speaker 1: that kuba Zeck didn't really think he was horrible until
Speaker 1: he like he was writing it. Initially to be a
Speaker 1: biography that was published under the Nazi regime as like
Speaker 1: a pro Hitler piece of propaganda, and then they lost
Speaker 1: the war, and then he just kind of rewrote it
Speaker 1: so that it could be like, well, now I'm just
Speaker 1: I guess I'm just going to explain my evil friend
Speaker 1: to the ally so Fu sinister. Oh my god. I mean,
Speaker 1: there are people care's a lot of debates to have
Speaker 1: about kubaz Eck, but most historians will agree, well, you
Speaker 1: have to read Kubazek. You have to take him with
Speaker 1: like a lot of salt. Yeah, he's trying to takes
Speaker 1: him with no salt at all. And she pulled several
Speaker 1: passages from his book as like evidence that Hitler was
Speaker 1: the Kali Yuga and was like channeling fucking Vishnu. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's this woman does not understand Shades of Gray even remote.
Speaker 1: She's just okay, she would have written Shades of Gray,
Speaker 1: though if she had been around, I wish she had
Speaker 1: like agains the better world, Oswit, literally every single person
Speaker 1: you've ever told me about on this cursed show, Robert,
Speaker 1: everything would have been better off if people had just
Speaker 1: channeled their horny energy into fan fiction instead. Of brutal
Speaker 1: Hayden murder every single time. Masturbating the fan fiction is
Speaker 1: the only things that will save us from the next Hitler.
Speaker 1: It will absolutely and and and that's where the Kylo
Speaker 1: ren stands come in. If you know an angry person
Speaker 1: who spends too much time writing fan fiction for under
Speaker 1: no circumstances, stop them, encourage that behavior. Yea, the lives
Speaker 1: that I can't even begin to tell you. Yeah, it's good, Okay,
Speaker 1: so this is okay horrible. Back to what you were saying,
Speaker 1: that was horrible. So she like reads Kubazek and she
Speaker 1: becomes convinced that a couple of chunks of that book
Speaker 1: are evidence that Hitler is channeling Vishnu is the avatar
Speaker 1: of Vishnu Um. Yeah. Yeah, there's like there these moments
Speaker 1: in the book where like Hitler will like that that
Speaker 1: Kubazek writes very like Purple Prosy, where Hitler will like suddenly,
Speaker 1: like in the middle of a conversation like make some
Speaker 1: sort of like grand statement about the future, and it's
Speaker 1: like maybe it's true because he was Hitler, Like it
Speaker 1: wouldn't be the weirdest thing of Hitler had always been
Speaker 1: that guy, right, Sure, But Also, kubaz Eck wrote this, well,
Speaker 1: after Hitler, you know, was done with and it's entirely possible.
Speaker 1: He was like, people are going to expect him to
Speaker 1: make grand speeches that are like dark and crazy about
Speaker 1: the future because he was Hitler, and he threw them
Speaker 1: in there because that's what like, we don't know. Um. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So decades later, uh Savitri Devi would claim that her
Speaker 1: initial inspiration for the idea that Hitler was the Kla
Speaker 1: Yuga had come from a conversation she'd had in nineteen
Speaker 1: thirty six with Satyananda Swami, the founder and the head
Speaker 1: of the Hindu mission where she'd worked. She claims that
Speaker 1: sat Yananda used to say, and I'm cluding directly from
Speaker 1: her writing here, Adolf Hitler is the reincarnation of the
Speaker 1: god Vishnu. Vishnu is the aspect of the Hindu trinity,
Speaker 1: who goes to keep things from rushing to destruction, to
Speaker 1: keep them back to going against time. Time is destruction.
Speaker 1: You have to destroy in order to create again. But
Speaker 1: there are forces that try to postpone destruction. And he
Speaker 1: said Hitler was the reincarnation of that force. And he was.
Speaker 1: He was. But it's a nice thing to hear a
Speaker 1: very refreshing thing to hear from a Hindu stage. I
Speaker 1: told him, I came here because I'm really a pagan,
Speaker 1: a worshiper of the Sun, and I believe in the
Speaker 1: pagan reaction of Emperor Julian. And I came to India
Speaker 1: to get, if possible, a sort of tropical equivalent of
Speaker 1: what we have had in Europe before Christianity. And I
Speaker 1: am not a disciple of any Indian. I'm a disciple
Speaker 1: of Adolph hit There he said, good, good, Adolf Hitler.
Speaker 1: He's as much a Hindu as any of our Hindus.
Speaker 1: He's an incarnation of the god Vishnu, probably never happened,
Speaker 1: but might have particulate. Yeah, it is, but one of
Speaker 1: the things that Hindu scholars, who again are generally very
Speaker 1: critical of a lot of all of these claims of seats,
Speaker 1: will point out some like one of the kind of
Speaker 1: downsides of sort of this very open aspect of Hindu
Speaker 1: mythology where it kind of upset accepts new things and
Speaker 1: new gods and other religions, and like it's a very
Speaker 1: open canonically in a lot of ways. And so there
Speaker 1: were a lot of Indians who would have who very
Speaker 1: well might have been like, Okay, you worship Hitler. Sure,
Speaker 1: he's probably like this, like because like they're just looking
Speaker 1: at a way to understand through their religion, just thing
Speaker 1: that matters to you. Like yeah, again, who knows, Um,
Speaker 1: you'll get different opinions on this than a on who
Speaker 1: you go to. UM. So yeah, we don't know what's true.
Speaker 1: What is important is that after Savitri Devi starts writing
Speaker 1: about all this ship, a lot of Nazis come to
Speaker 1: believe it. In fact, the reeling and wounded remaining Nazis
Speaker 1: of the West um felt like Savitri's occult musings were
Speaker 1: basically a breath of fresh air, and she spent her
Speaker 1: middle and later years traveling around and meeting fascists all
Speaker 1: over the world. In nineteen sixty one, she made her
Speaker 1: first direct connection with the English neo Nazis of the
Speaker 1: British National Party or b n P. As the war
Speaker 1: years receded further and further away, an international agglomeration of
Speaker 1: fascist inclined folks began to link up and plan together
Speaker 1: for a resurgence of Nazism. Savitri Devi was at the
Speaker 1: center of it. As this paragraph from Hitler's priestess Illustrates quote.
Speaker 1: She lost no time in contacting Andrew Fontaine, the president
Speaker 1: of the BNP. A spring camp attended by twenty delegates
Speaker 1: from European nationalist groups was held on Fontaine's estate at
Speaker 1: Narford at Narford, Norfolk, in May of nineteen sixty one.
Speaker 1: Those present included Robert Lyon, a young leader in the
Speaker 1: American National States Rights Party, which violently opposed a segregation
Speaker 1: in the South, representatives from German neo Nazi groups, and
Speaker 1: Savitri Devi. Another key figure was x S S Lieutenant
Speaker 1: Friedrich Borth born in nineteen This blue eyed, blonde Austrian
Speaker 1: Nazi had served in the Luftwaffa and the OFFA s S.
Speaker 1: As a teenage officer, he had commanded an assault group
Speaker 1: and won the Iron Cross. After serving a three year
Speaker 1: jail sentence in post war Vienna, he published an SS
Speaker 1: veteran magazine, Dust Camarade, which was swiftly suppressed by the
Speaker 1: Soviet authorities. Thereafter, he was connected with numerous extreme right
Speaker 1: wing groups and attended the most international fascist gatherings. He
Speaker 1: led the boom Himer toured Yugant until it's banning in
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty nine. And then bring the Legion Europa, the
Speaker 1: Austrian section of UH theer Arts June You Europe, another
Speaker 1: international grouping inspired by the French O a s and
Speaker 1: Algeria and Belgian Rancorps over the loss of the Congo.
Speaker 1: After a busy schedule of lectures at Narford, the participants
Speaker 1: celebrated their Nordic racial identity with Folkish songs and tankards
Speaker 1: of traditional ale around the campfire. So you see what's
Speaker 1: happening here. Savitri Devi gets pulled into not just neo
Speaker 1: Nazi groups and not just old Nazis. She's meeting with
Speaker 1: the American States Rights Party, She's meeting with like these
Speaker 1: Belgians who are angry that they've lost control of the Congo,
Speaker 1: and she's meeting with all these old neo Nazis in
Speaker 1: the British National Party and stuff. Um would you say
Speaker 1: at this point she is out of her depth in
Speaker 1: terms of I can't believe you did that. No, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: I think no, no, She's not out of her depth
Speaker 1: at all. Um, she is. What she is doing is
Speaker 1: helping to draw She's not the only force doing this,
Speaker 1: but she's helping to draw these groups together by providing
Speaker 1: the early Like these are all separate groups, like the
Speaker 1: Cause of desegregation, like a lot of racists who don't
Speaker 1: want America disegregated, fought against the Nazis. She is a
Speaker 1: part of all these different, like very far right groups,
Speaker 1: including Nazis, coming together and in a lot of cases
Speaker 1: starting to embrace these weird, this weird Nazi religion. She's
Speaker 1: um she's invented as something to unify all of them.
Speaker 1: That's what starts to happen in this period. And that's
Speaker 1: what's really unique about this period is like these are
Speaker 1: all groups like the Belgian, like pro Congolese control of
Speaker 1: like the Belgium, Like the Belgians weren't pro Nazi, but
Speaker 1: like these Belgians start to get pro Nazi now because
Speaker 1: like they realize there's like this white identity thing, but
Speaker 1: also this this weird religion that is more attractive to
Speaker 1: them than actual national socialism would have been. It's interesting.
Speaker 1: I mean, it seems like part of her effectiveness lies
Speaker 1: in like having so many little bits of things for
Speaker 1: people to latch onto, so that even if you don't
Speaker 1: agree with the larger ideology, there's a worm on a
Speaker 1: hook that will get you in. That's called syncretism. That's
Speaker 1: what syncretism really is, is like all these different things
Speaker 1: kind of it's like a catamari of ideology with like
Speaker 1: Nazism at the core, but all these things sticking to it,
Speaker 1: and these things get other people stuck to them. Um.
Speaker 1: So like yeah, that's what we start to see happening
Speaker 1: in the early nineteen sixties. Um. In nineteen sixty two,
Speaker 1: Savitri was in England again for a gathering of worldwide
Speaker 1: Nazis that included Bastard pod main character George Lincoln Rockwell.
Speaker 1: Oh I know a thing about to get not great Oka.
Speaker 1: Savitri Devi was one of the signatories for the World
Speaker 1: Union of National Socialists and proposed organization to form a
Speaker 1: quote combat efficient International Apparatus to facilitate a return to
Speaker 1: Nazi values and the extermination of non whites from Western nations.
Speaker 1: Now ones wound up being a bust for several reasons,
Speaker 1: including the fact that Rockwell was almost immediately kicked out
Speaker 1: of the United Kingdom, but he and Savitri developed a
Speaker 1: friendly relationship. The leader of the American Nazi Party had
Speaker 1: been on the lookout for a new American fascist religion,
Speaker 1: something esoteric and enchanting that he could use to draw
Speaker 1: in new members in a way that national socialist political
Speaker 1: theory and unvarnished racism just did not. And he must
Speaker 1: have thought The Lightning in the Sun had some potential
Speaker 1: for he published an abridged version of the book in
Speaker 1: the National Socialist World magazine, The Lightning in the Sun
Speaker 1: the US. The Lightning in the Sun, it should be said,
Speaker 1: could be a y a book that like is out
Speaker 1: right now, it might be to be entirely honest, and
Speaker 1: that why a book might actually be Nazi propaganda hidden
Speaker 1: his young adult which, oh, you can't put it past yeah, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: much like for example, the band Ace of Basse Wait
Speaker 1: what yeah, the ASA base where Nazis. Did you not
Speaker 1: hear that? Oh? Adam Todd Brown read a great article
Speaker 1: about this for correct, The base of ass was a
Speaker 1: Nazi submarine base. If you watch the music video for
Speaker 1: all that she wants is another baby. The woman who
Speaker 1: just wants another baby to get on welfare is like
Speaker 1: holding a star of David the entire time, and there's
Speaker 1: all these long, lingering shots of it. There's a bunch
Speaker 1: of other stuff. The sign that they saw is clearly
Speaker 1: a swastika. If you listen to the lyrics, it's fucked up.
Speaker 1: Um wow. But we have to blaze past that right now.
Speaker 1: I found I found a book called Lightning on the
Speaker 1: Sun that's pretty closely Nazi ship. It's about a guy
Speaker 1: named Glenn the Store. Yeah, Glenn Schmidler, who might be
Speaker 1: a moon god. Yep, that's some Nazi ship there, or
Speaker 1: anti Nazi, since Nazi Savitri was all about the sun God,
Speaker 1: it could be either. Really, so, Savitri Devi would go
Speaker 1: on to spend the bulk of her remaining years in India,
Speaker 1: traveling irregularly when the demands of her national socialist beliefs
Speaker 1: took her around the world. She remained convinced all her
Speaker 1: life that Hitler would return, either in a new incarnation
Speaker 1: or after revealing that he had somehow survived the war
Speaker 1: and lead a resurgent Nazism to global victory. She retired
Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy, living for a time at the home
Speaker 1: of her friend Francois Dior in England. That's the de
Speaker 1: or you're thinking of, really, yeah, it's well, it's it's
Speaker 1: like the daughter, I think of the woman who created
Speaker 1: the line. Yeah daughter, Oh good. She was a big
Speaker 1: Nazi backer before the war. Yeah, wow, okay, learning more?
Speaker 1: I love fashion knowledge. Savitri Devi was kicked out of
Speaker 1: Door's house eventually for her twin habits of refusing to
Speaker 1: bathe ever and chewing on garlic constantly. Disgusting. Come on,
Speaker 1: that's what gets the reaction, Sophie, She's terrible, Harley. I
Speaker 1: was chewing on garlic a lot over the summer. It
Speaker 1: helps preserve your voice. I don't think that's why she
Speaker 1: was doing it. Does she do you have to bathe?
Speaker 1: Who chewing on garlic? Do we know what happened to
Speaker 1: her cats? Oh? Solid question, Jamie. Well, she had numerous
Speaker 1: pet cats. What happened to those she left to Nazi
Speaker 1: Germany with? She I was just about to say she
Speaker 1: spent most of her remaining year is living alone in
Speaker 1: India with dozens sometimes of pet cats and at least
Speaker 1: one cobra um. She always had a funkload of cats. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this woman. I couldn't get away from her cats. One
Speaker 1: thing about her that you would think that cats live
Speaker 1: long enough that the original twenty cats she left behind
Speaker 1: would still be alive. But that because I think a
Speaker 1: lot of them were. I think a lot of them
Speaker 1: were she she was taking them with. I don't know precisely,
Speaker 1: but my assumption, based on everything I know Savitri Devi,
Speaker 1: is that she would have absolutely tried to get back
Speaker 1: her original cats if it was possible. She was very
Speaker 1: endo cats. She would not have abandoned the cats. I
Speaker 1: don't think she was. She was real consistent about that part. Yeah.
Speaker 1: As she grew older, Devy became more and more convinced
Speaker 1: that the United States represented the most fertile ground for
Speaker 1: the growth of the esoteric Nazi religions he had spent
Speaker 1: her life helping to construct. In nineteen two, she decided
Speaker 1: to travel to the United States to do what she
Speaker 1: could do to help American Nazism break out as a
Speaker 1: national force. She died it on the way while staying
Speaker 1: at a friend's house in Great Britain. Her ashes, however,
Speaker 1: finally made it across the pond to the United States
Speaker 1: of America, and American Nazis laid her to rest by
Speaker 1: sprinkling her on their heroes grave George Lincoln Rockwell. So
Speaker 1: Rockwell and Savitri Devi's share a grave. Yeah wow, Okay,
Speaker 1: So she's like, okay, yeah, you know who doesn't share
Speaker 1: a grave with George Lincoln Rockwell and Savitri Devi. The
Speaker 1: products and services were about to hawk. Yes for now,
Speaker 1: you never know. Now we're back. We're back. So Savitri
Speaker 1: Devi's dead, But this is not the end for her. Um,
Speaker 1: not really, because starting in the late nineteen seventies, a
Speaker 1: famous Holocaust denier in publisher Ernst Zundel, had found her
Speaker 1: old work and started pushing it back into circulation. Now,
Speaker 1: but it only developed a limited audience in those early
Speaker 1: post war days. But now, nearly twenty years later, uh,
Speaker 1: people were ready for esoteric hitlersm the book Hitler's Priests notes,
Speaker 1: by the late nineteen seventies, the historical experience of the
Speaker 1: Third Reich was quickly receding into the past, as popular
Speaker 1: literature and films ably demonstrated Nazism was becoming something mythical,
Speaker 1: even fantastic, and also plastic that could be molded and
Speaker 1: combined with novel associations. By publishing the work of Savitri Devi,
Speaker 1: Zundel aimed to create a new cultic interest in Hitler,
Speaker 1: linking him to ancient mysteries, the world of nature, and
Speaker 1: powerful religious symbols drawn from the Oriens. She was just
Speaker 1: saying that by saying it's plastic, he's pointing out, we
Speaker 1: have all these weird movies now about like Nazis on
Speaker 1: the Moon. You know, You've got these fanciful stories like Wolfenstein,
Speaker 1: these games about like Nazi like all of this, this
Speaker 1: this fictional sort of world that's been built up, like
Speaker 1: mythology built up around the Nazis, usually not by people
Speaker 1: who are actual Nazis in a lot of cases, just
Speaker 1: by people who are like, well, they're the worst people ever,
Speaker 1: so I can make them the bad guys. That's an
Speaker 1: easy go for a bad guy. Um. But Zundel is like,
Speaker 1: this is a fucking opportunity because kids are growing up
Speaker 1: reading about these cool, evil, bad guy Nazis. And for
Speaker 1: the same reason that kids love dressing up as Imperial
Speaker 1: Stormtroopers from Star Wars, kids get interested in the Nazis
Speaker 1: from this. And he sees Savitri Devi's work is like,
Speaker 1: I can fucking get a shipload of kids interested in
Speaker 1: Nazism by pushing this stuff back out there. And he's
Speaker 1: fucking right now, yeah, yeah, another important architect of this
Speaker 1: whole thing and who we're not going to get into enough,
Speaker 1: but I will do an episode on in the future
Speaker 1: is a Chilean Nazi named Miguel Serrano UM, and it's
Speaker 1: from Miguel that we actually get the term esoteric Hitlerism.
Speaker 1: Serrano and Devi seemed to have reached essentially the same
Speaker 1: conclusion about Hitler as an avatar of Vishnu through slightly
Speaker 1: different intellectual roots. UM. Miguel was a student of Young
Speaker 1: and a Mithrist, which we just don't have enough time
Speaker 1: to get into once again, the Theosophical Society UM. He
Speaker 1: was also an early Avid Western practitioner of yoga. Miguel
Speaker 1: corresponded with Devi during her lifetime. Before he died in
Speaker 1: two thousand nine, he gave interviews to Nazi magazines with
Speaker 1: names like black Son, where he said this about Savitri
Speaker 1: Devi quote, Savitri Devi is the greatest warrior after Adolf Hitler,
Speaker 1: Rudolf Hess and Joseph Gebel's. Moreover, she was the first
Speaker 1: to discover the ancient and spiritual power behind Hitlerrism. She
Speaker 1: envisioned a new religion and inaugurated a sanctuary for Hitler
Speaker 1: in India. She was as I myself am anti Christian.
Speaker 1: She initiated completely on her own all that I have
Speaker 1: developed up until now. It is not mere coincidence that
Speaker 1: the Spanish Catholics published an attack against Savitri Devi Atto
Speaker 1: Iron and me. It was very late in her life
Speaker 1: when we started to write each other. We just missed
Speaker 1: each other in Europe by one week. I arrived a
Speaker 1: few days after her death. I think that Savitri Devi
Speaker 1: will be the greatest sister of all the pre Sevesotera
Speaker 1: hitlersm the beasts of Wotan. And he's like wearing a
Speaker 1: male feminist T shirt while he does this. He's like,
Speaker 1: I don't hate women. I like this. I like the
Speaker 1: worst woman I've ever heard of love. He would not
Speaker 1: have warned me I will say that much. But you're
Speaker 1: getting the spirit of the guy, right. He's a real
Speaker 1: gigantic piece of ship, and we're not getting into it up.
Speaker 1: But he gives her credit as like the real motive
Speaker 1: force behind the religion that Hitlerrism becomes, even though he's
Speaker 1: also like kind of independently coming to a lot of
Speaker 1: the same conclusions and even earlier in some cases. Like
Speaker 1: she's the popularizer in a lot of ways. She has
Speaker 1: a big role in that um. And yeah, he's we'll
Speaker 1: talk about him more later today, Savitri Devi's fingerprints can
Speaker 1: be found all over the radical and murderous chunks of
Speaker 1: the fascist right. The Fair Creek Division, an accelerationist neo
Speaker 1: Nazi organization that's very similar to Adam Wafan Division, similar
Speaker 1: enough to talk about for the purposes of this podcast.
Speaker 1: Both of them seek to bring about the destruction of
Speaker 1: the current world order through destabilizing attacks. The Fair Creek
Speaker 1: Division directly cites Devy as an inspiration. The group's gab
Speaker 1: of bio includes this Devy quote. Creation and destruction are
Speaker 1: one to the eyes of one who can see beauty.
Speaker 1: Savitri's beliefs went on to have a big influence on
Speaker 1: Adam Waffen two and the members of the Base who
Speaker 1: weren't FBI agents, anti fascists or journalists, which is basically,
Speaker 1: these seven guys you got arrested. That's a familiar yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: in these groups like the Base that we can see
Speaker 1: some hint of what makes a Vitri Devi so dangerous.
Speaker 1: The leader of the Michigan Cell of Adam Waffen Division,
Speaker 1: who was DOCST a few days before I wrote this episode,
Speaker 1: reached his position in charge of the Michigan Cell when
Speaker 1: he was fifteen years old. The three members of the
Speaker 1: base who were arrested in Georgia in the process of
Speaker 1: trying to spark a race war were ages nineteen, twenty
Speaker 1: one and twenty five, respectively. These acceleration as esoteric hitler
Speaker 1: Ists tend to be young, and there is disagreement on
Speaker 1: the average age at which people enter cults, but the
Speaker 1: work of Dr John G. Clark, a psych professor at Harvard,
Speaker 1: who surveyed five current and former cult members, suggests an
Speaker 1: average age of nineteen and a half for new cult members.
Speaker 1: He also points out that most new cult members are male.
Speaker 1: This is because young men are particularly vulnerable to being
Speaker 1: enraptured by ideologies that offered them a sense of purpose
Speaker 1: and belonging. It's one of the reasons the same age
Speaker 1: group as the ideal recruitment population for soldiers. But Esotera
Speaker 1: Hitlerism doesn't just suck these kids in because they're young.
Speaker 1: And to explain this new part, I'm gonna have to
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about Kechism, and I am very sorry.
Speaker 1: Do we do we have? Do we absolutely? Is it? Absolutely? Yeah?
Speaker 1: We really do. Kechism started out as a joking parody
Speaker 1: of religion invented by the ship posters four chan and
Speaker 1: eight chan during gamer Gate. It's very dumb and talking
Speaker 1: about it makes me feel very silly. But the short
Speaker 1: of it is Kechism started out, and for probably most
Speaker 1: people still is a dumb gag and a way for
Speaker 1: them to make fun of members of minority groups by
Speaker 1: pretending to be members of a victimized religion because they
Speaker 1: think that's funny. The whole thing focuses around ship posting
Speaker 1: and spreading memes. But as the Trump campaign ramped up
Speaker 1: and this weird internet movement started to have an impact
Speaker 1: on the real world, some, particularly unhinged annon, started to
Speaker 1: take Kechism more seriously. Well, others just thought the joke
Speaker 1: kept getting funnier and spread it around for that reason.
Speaker 1: Lawrence Murray, a writer for the fascist podcast The Right Stuff,
Speaker 1: was probably the first person to purposefully meld Kechism with
Speaker 1: Savitri Devi's philosophy into something he called esoteric Keckism. He
Speaker 1: started shooting out memes that replaced Hitler with Pepe as
Speaker 1: an avatar of Vishnu, stuff like that. It's very dumb.
Speaker 1: When interviewed, Murray claims he was only half joking. With
Speaker 1: the whole idea, but like any joke of the sort
Speaker 1: on the Internet, it spread like wildfire, and a certain
Speaker 1: chunk of the people who saw it took it seri reously,
Speaker 1: which led them to the work of more serious fascist thinkers,
Speaker 1: people likes of Etrea Devi, and led some of them
Speaker 1: into accelerationist groups like Adam Woffen and the Base. It
Speaker 1: is not a coincidence that Honders Brevic, the Utoya, Norway
Speaker 1: shooter who massacred dozens of children at a left wing
Speaker 1: summer camp, directly praised Hindu nationalism in his manifesto. It
Speaker 1: is also not a total coincidence that both Honders Brevick
Speaker 1: and Brenton Tarrant, the christ shoot shooter, claimed to be
Speaker 1: Knights Templar, members of a Christian order fighting against Muslims basically.
Speaker 1: And it is not a coincidence that the Urban Dictionary
Speaker 1: page for Kechism, written by a gamer gator, describes it
Speaker 1: as a red pilled ideology originating from the true Knights Templar.
Speaker 1: And again, all of this is joking. All of this
Speaker 1: is not joking. It's both at once. It's the contradiction
Speaker 1: of modern fucking Yeah. Well, that's yeah, the great the
Speaker 1: greatest trick the devil ever played was irony poisoning, because
Speaker 1: you just can't. Yeah, you can't argue with that. Um.
Speaker 1: And some people will say, and it's possible there is
Speaker 1: are some central figures behind this spread of syncretism, like
Speaker 1: sinister individuals who have like kind of put all this
Speaker 1: together purposefully, or at least put pieces of it together purposefully.
Speaker 1: But I tend to be of the belief that most,
Speaker 1: if not all, of it is a morphous and acephalis.
Speaker 1: It happened without a head, without much intention on its own.
Speaker 1: There may have been bits of intention here and there,
Speaker 1: like esoteric Keeckism, but a lot of it just happened
Speaker 1: because of the sort of structures Savitri Devi built Um.
Speaker 1: It's it's just kind of the natural result of the
Speaker 1: amorphous and sticky nature of the faith that she created.
Speaker 1: If Hindu mythology and ancient Egyptian history can be folded
Speaker 1: in with Adolf Hitler and the Aryan myth, why can't
Speaker 1: Keechisum wind up in there too? Can't the Knights Temple
Speaker 1: are fit in there too? All these weird little subcultures
Speaker 1: you've got Norse mythology, chan culture, gamer culture, new age, spiritualism, environmentalism,
Speaker 1: even veganism. All these things appeal heavily to a lot
Speaker 1: of young people. And the more little bridges that you
Speaker 1: can build between these different communities and actual extermination is
Speaker 1: Nazi beliefs, the more young men will kind of accidentally
Speaker 1: fall in and get caught in this net. It's like
Speaker 1: a tunnel spider's web. And at the end the great
Speaker 1: innovations have e treat every brought like that's that's the
Speaker 1: innovation she brought to Nazism. She took what was a
Speaker 1: dead political system that couldn't spread outside of Germany, not really,
Speaker 1: and turned it into a living, syncretic religion, something with vitality,
Speaker 1: something capable of mutating and absorbing and staying relevant, and
Speaker 1: something capable of inspiring young men to commit murder in
Speaker 1: the memory of Adolf Hitler nearly a century after his death,
Speaker 1: could you give me that word one more time, of
Speaker 1: of the the syncretism syncretism, Yeah, I mean it's and
Speaker 1: and if you are able to, you know, find a
Speaker 1: way to get a group of people who are looking
Speaker 1: for something to believe in, who are maybe a little
Speaker 1: bit okay, you know what, You're right. I was, um,
Speaker 1: but yeah, just like finding a group of vulnerable, vulnerable
Speaker 1: people ideologically that needs something to believe in and put
Speaker 1: a delicious chocolate coating on the outside of it. Uh,
Speaker 1: it seems to work. It works. So how do you
Speaker 1: feel about Savitri fan? You gotta check out her books.
Speaker 1: Can't say I'm a fan she. I don't think that
Speaker 1: I would. I don't think we would have been friends
Speaker 1: in junior high and I don't think we would have
Speaker 1: been friends now. I yeah, no, I mean I truly.
Speaker 1: And it is interesting that we don't talk about her.
Speaker 1: I had no idea this person existed. I why do
Speaker 1: you think that is? There's a there's a degree to
Speaker 1: which I think a lot of people who knew about
Speaker 1: her and are like researchers didn't really want to because
Speaker 1: there's this worry about making a bigger deal of it
Speaker 1: than it is. It's kind of like I didn't really
Speaker 1: write about h N much until the christ Street shooting,
Speaker 1: when it was like, okay, well now we gotta the base.
Speaker 1: Now it's gotten to this point like all right, we
Speaker 1: gotta fucking talk about Savitri dev Devi and esoteric Hitlerism,
Speaker 1: Like we gotta get some of this out there. Um,
Speaker 1: I do think it's also just like not super well known.
Speaker 1: I think she was seeing like really, to be entirely honest,
Speaker 1: I think most of her efforts would have looked like
Speaker 1: a failure to most of observers. Observers up until maybe
Speaker 1: at the earliest a decade ago. You know, people who
Speaker 1: were really aware of what was going on would have
Speaker 1: known earlier, but most people, even pretty well informed people,
Speaker 1: would have been like, well, this is kind of a
Speaker 1: dead end and just something to like make fun of
Speaker 1: up until we start to the internet. Really is what
Speaker 1: what provides this with the last ingredient it needs to
Speaker 1: take all? Yeah, she like pioneered the red pill mentality,
Speaker 1: like it's yeah, she's a big part of that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and we're not like Julius Evola is a big part
Speaker 1: of this. Who's Steve Bannon fucking loves take away any
Speaker 1: credit from any of the red pil pioneers. Everyone deserves
Speaker 1: to take up space. We'll get them all. We'll get
Speaker 1: them all on this show. We will, we will. They
Speaker 1: deserve it weller as usual. This was absolutely horrifying and
Speaker 1: you've ruined my day. Thank you. Good. Yeah, that's the goal. Okay, good, well,
Speaker 1: and I've got I've got some plugables, like you can
Speaker 1: listen to my podcast My Year in Mensa. It's online now.
Speaker 1: There's only four episodes. It's real quick. I'm on Twitter
Speaker 1: at Jamie Loftus help Instagram at Jamie car Superstar on
Speaker 1: tour for the next month or so. Jamie Loftus is
Speaker 1: innocent dot com. And that's what I have to say.
Speaker 1: I love when we talk about the worship in the
Speaker 1: entire world and at the end you're like, so, what's
Speaker 1: your Twitter handle? This is if you really want to
Speaker 1: learn more about esoteric hitlersm follow Sophie's Twitter Why underscore,
Speaker 1: Sophie Underscore? Why rather subolutely violent? No, gosh, you know,
Speaker 1: you know what. It has been on Twitter for less
Speaker 1: than forty eight hours, already getting accused of crimes. Robert
Speaker 1: gonna be canceled by the time this came up because
Speaker 1: he blew his nose on the mic no less than
Speaker 1: four times several hours. I am, I am ill, You're ill,
Speaker 1: I know, but you know, but I mean now you're
Speaker 1: just now you're just bragging about it. Follow our podcast
Speaker 1: at Bassard's Pot on Instagram. Don't tell anyone to do so, sorry, listeners,
Speaker 1: what to do for I'm get it together? I know
Speaker 1: I didn't sleep last night, and the episodes nobody, Well,
Speaker 1: I know we've had the sleep last night. That does
Speaker 1: that excuse the nose blowing? My friend having trouble sleeping?
Speaker 1: Does it excuse the nose blower? No? No, no, Robert, Sophie, Robert,
Speaker 1: that's going to be okay? It is not. We're always
Speaker 1: getting mad. And the episode, my friend and go take
Speaker 1: a nappy. The episode is over. Go hug a cat, cat.
Speaker 1: Can you stop nazis cat and encourage the angriest person
Speaker 1: you know to write fan fiction? That's truly the greatest
Speaker 1: service you can do. Both of those things are critical. Alright,
Speaker 1: episodes over. Bye by