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Speaker 1: M. Welcome back to Behind the Bastards, the podcast where

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Speaker 1: every week we read about a terrible person, and this

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Speaker 1: one is part two of the story of Savitri Debby

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Speaker 1: and most importantly, today is the episode recorded on the

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Speaker 1: tail end of my recorder's batteries. So we are fucking

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Speaker 1: dare devils right now. Wow? Okay, I like Robert, you're edging. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is the podcast edging. Yes, this is edging. This

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Speaker 1: is what it means. This has never been totally clied

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Speaker 1: what edging is, but I think that this I am

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Speaker 1: the first person to edge more than a hundred thousand

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Speaker 1: people at the same time. Wow. Okay, that was a

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Speaker 1: flex on many levels, and I'm just going to through it. Okay.

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Speaker 1: So that's what edging is, just plowing through it. Wow.

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Speaker 1: Edging is when you're like, I'm not going when you

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Speaker 1: bring someone to Yeah, you go to the edge of orgasm,

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Speaker 1: but you keep you keep you keep stopping, and then

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Speaker 1: that's the joke. Okay, Okay, Well I've brought up the

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Speaker 1: joke originally, and now I'm explaining why I was corrected,

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Speaker 1: which is what all great comedians do. So in October

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Speaker 1: of nineteen, Hitler's death still fresh on her mind. Savitri

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Speaker 1: Devi took part in the Festival of Kali at the

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Speaker 1: Kalighat Temple in Calcutta. Now. Kali is the Hindu deity

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Speaker 1: of destruction, a blueskinned goddess, and in traditional depictions, she

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Speaker 1: wears a necklace of severed heads, a skirt made from

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Speaker 1: severed arms, and wields just about every conceivable manner of

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Speaker 1: ancient weapon in her many arms. You see a lot

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Speaker 1: of times. Yeah, it's really cool. Like some of the

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Speaker 1: statues of her like fucking twenty feet tall. It's metal

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Speaker 1: as hell. Um. Yeah. So, as the goddess of destruction,

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Speaker 1: Kali tends to inspire some pretty powerful feelings. As Tri

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Speaker 1: stared up at the image of her goddess covered in

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Speaker 1: gore and armed with massive swords the size of small ours,

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Speaker 1: she blgged Cali for her blessing, a blessing of violence

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Speaker 1: and destruction against the Allied powers who had destroyed her

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Speaker 1: beloved Nazi Germany. She left the ceremony convinced that it

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Speaker 1: was now her duty to do what she'd failed to

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Speaker 1: do back in nineteen thirty nine. She had to finally

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Speaker 1: travel to Germany and take part in the resistance to

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Speaker 1: the Allies by any means necessary. She left her twenty

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Speaker 1: cats in the care of a friend and left her

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, and the cats. Yeah, it's pretty wild

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Speaker 1: cats behind. This is a person who leaves her twenty

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Speaker 1: cats behind and the care of a friend to go

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Speaker 1: be a Nazi, like a month or two after Hitler died,

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Speaker 1: Like months after Hitler do you get that texts just

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Speaker 1: like hey, um so, like I have to go do

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Speaker 1: a thing. Could you look after my cats? Indefinitely? Right? No? No?

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Speaker 1: Could you look after my cats? And definitely will I

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Speaker 1: go to try to resurrect Nazism in nineteen forties Germany

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Speaker 1: parentheses there's twenty of the cats, by the way, just because,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, it's good stuff. All the cruel and

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Speaker 1: horrible things that this woman has done. I don't even

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Speaker 1: know all of them. Yet this has to be like

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Speaker 1: top ten. This is bad. It's pretty bad. She's a

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Speaker 1: bad Yeah, she's not a great friend or person, but

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Speaker 1: she does finally reach the birthplace of Hitlerism, the center

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Speaker 1: of the ideology she'd adopted for herself in nineteen She

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Speaker 1: later wrote in her book Golden the Furnace that the

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Speaker 1: gods had ordained that I should have a glimpse of ruins,

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Speaker 1: bitter irony of fate. Germany at that point was still

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Speaker 1: largely destroyed and chopped up into four pieces by its

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Speaker 1: victorious enemies. So Very Tree's writing about this time shows

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Speaker 1: a wild ignorance about the extent of actual Nazi crimes,

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Speaker 1: because she's so horrified and how bad things are in Germany.

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Speaker 1: She writes, quote one remembers, I say that episode of

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Speaker 1: the Second War is one beholds the ruins of all

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Speaker 1: the German cities, the plight of men and women in

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Speaker 1: the overcredit areas still fit to live in, and all

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Speaker 1: the misery, all the bitterness consequent of that devilish bombing.

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Speaker 1: Streams of fire, tons of phosphorus relentlessly poured over his

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Speaker 1: people for five years. These were England's thanks to Adolf

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Speaker 1: Hitler for having shown mercy to her soldiers in his

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Speaker 1: hour of victory. These were the thanks of the United

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Speaker 1: States of America for his older's orders not to shoot.

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Speaker 1: The parachute is captured on German soil, which is like

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Speaker 1: so she's she's framing the the British evacuations uh from

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Speaker 1: the coast of France as like German mercy rather than

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Speaker 1: incompetence on Hitler's behalf, which they actually were just rank

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Speaker 1: and competence on Hitler's behalf. He's also talking about the

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Speaker 1: mercy of Germany and not killing captured Allied UH paratroopers,

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Speaker 1: which was illegal. And in doing this she's ignoring, for

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Speaker 1: one example, the Malmedy massacre, in which a WAFF and

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Speaker 1: s S troop massacred eight four American POWs with machine guns.

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Speaker 1: She's also ignoring the estimated three point three million Russian

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Speaker 1: POWs who died in German custody. But if I wind

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Speaker 1: up actually arguing actual history with a dead Nazi will

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Speaker 1: be here all day. So we're just going to move

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Speaker 1: forward from that. But fair she whitewashes things a bit,

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Speaker 1: is the point? Just a bit, just a scooch Just

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Speaker 1: obviously it's gonna be horrible seeing Germany after World War Two,

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Speaker 1: because like the bombing campaign over Germany was one of

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Speaker 1: the greatest crimes in history. That said, they kind of

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Speaker 1: had it coming tonight. I mean, fun man, if anyone

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Speaker 1: has ever deserved that, it's fucking Nazi Germany. They do

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Speaker 1: present themselves as a pretty clear target. Good, yeah, you

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Speaker 1: can you can say the Allies. Maybe the Allies went

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Speaker 1: overboard in some areas, will also being like, but what

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Speaker 1: were they supposed to do? I think a bit of

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Speaker 1: an overreaction may have been Historically you're like, okay, okay, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you gotta do something. Yeah, you know, I it's it's

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Speaker 1: something to not be happy about. But of the list

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Speaker 1: of historical crimes I'm going to be outraged at, it's

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Speaker 1: lower than, for example, the ones committed by Nazi Germany. Yeah, sure, sure, yeah. Um. Now,

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Speaker 1: before visiting Germany, Savitri had hung out in Sweden, where

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Speaker 1: a number of Nazis had fled after the war. There

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Speaker 1: she met spinn Head and a Nazi supporting explorer and author,

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Speaker 1: and a number of former members of the Nazi Party

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Speaker 1: who were hiding out there because you know, it was

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Speaker 1: a crime to be a Nazi. Now, she told them

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Speaker 1: her mission was to deliver a message of hope to

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Speaker 1: the German people. Now, since Nazism was a bit unpopular

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Speaker 1: after the Second World War, she wasn't able to find

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Speaker 1: any printers in Sweden to actually print out this message

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Speaker 1: of hope, so instead, Savitri Devi had to write out

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Speaker 1: five hundred leaflets by hand. Each featured a swastika, and

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Speaker 1: these words quote men and women of Germany, in the

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Speaker 1: midst of unspeakable riggers and suffering, hold fast to our

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Speaker 1: glorious national socialist faith and resist, Defy the people, Defy

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Speaker 1: the powers which work to denazify the German nation and

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Speaker 1: the whole world. Nothing can destroy what is built on truth.

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Speaker 1: We are pure gold which can be tested in the furnace.

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Speaker 1: The furnace may glow and crackle, nothing can destroy us.

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Speaker 1: One day we will rebel and triumph again. Hope and wait,

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Speaker 1: Heil Hitler. So she writes five of these by hand

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Speaker 1: and wearing a sorry and swastika earrings. Savitri Devi takes

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Speaker 1: a train across Germany and tosses out hundred of leaflets

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Speaker 1: um over the course about fifteen hours. Attached to each

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Speaker 1: was a gift, a small amount of coffee, sugar, butter,

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Speaker 1: sardines or cigarettes. She considered this journey to be an

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Speaker 1: act of religious devotion, describing the leaflets as written and

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Speaker 1: throne by the gauze through me. As her train crossed

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Speaker 1: from Germany into Belgium, She's sang a Hindu him to Shiva.

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Speaker 1: So a lot of commitment, a lot of commitment is

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Speaker 1: going into this yes, yes, and that is all you

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Speaker 1: can say. Yeah, that is yeah. Now. So she gets

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Speaker 1: inspired by the success of her first visit and she

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Speaker 1: plans two more trips through Germany. She spent a little

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Speaker 1: bit of time resting in London and meeting up with

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Speaker 1: fascists in London. Uh and because of all the fascists

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Speaker 1: that are in London, she's able to actually find a

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Speaker 1: printer to print up six thousand additional leaflets to take

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Speaker 1: to Germany. Using a connection to an old friend in France,

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Speaker 1: she secured a military permit to visit Germany for a

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Speaker 1: longer period of time, claiming not falsely that she intended

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Speaker 1: to write a book about the nation's post war trials.

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Speaker 1: Her second tripped into Germany lasted three months and she

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Speaker 1: successfully handed out all six thousand leaflets. She also met

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Speaker 1: with a number of old Nazis, none of the none

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Speaker 1: of them were very high ranking. These were like third

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Speaker 1: rate Nazis, former po w's, and some of these POWs

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Speaker 1: did have legitimate stories of Allied brutality that they faced

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Speaker 1: in captivity, because like you know, it was a war. Um.

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Speaker 1: She interviewed numerous German citizens, introducing herself at the start

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Speaker 1: as a committed Nazi. To gain their trust, Savitri would

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Speaker 1: then talk about her belief that Adolph Hitler was still

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Speaker 1: alive somewhere in the world, and a shure these defeated

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Speaker 1: Nazis that surely there were only two or three years

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Speaker 1: away from a revival of Nazism in Germany. Imagine that

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Speaker 1: Hitler was your tupac, Like that is such a wild

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Speaker 1: That's like Hitler's like, No, he's on an island somewhere.

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Speaker 1: You don't understand He's going to drop amazing album. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's got an album. Really, Yeah, you don't be the

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Speaker 1: holograms a decoy? Yeah that sleek. I mean, I think

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Speaker 1: we can. I mean that said, we both agreed that

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Speaker 1: the hologram is a deco. Oh no, the hologram is

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Speaker 1: absolutely decoy. Okay. Now, one of of these conversations um

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Speaker 1: that Savitri had with a former Wehrmacht soldier is worth

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Speaker 1: me reading out here. And I'm gonna quote again from

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Speaker 1: the book Hitler's priestess quote, continuing his narrative to post

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Speaker 1: war conditions and occupied Germany. The old fighter's face darkened.

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Speaker 1: Nice people to talk about freedom and justice. These damned democrats,

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Speaker 1: they have tied us hand and foot, so we cannot move.

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Speaker 1: They have muzzled us, so we can offer no resistance

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Speaker 1: while they plunder our country left and right, dismantle and

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Speaker 1: carry off our factories piece by piece, cut down our forests,

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Speaker 1: take our oil, our iron or steel, all that we have,

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Speaker 1: and into the bargain, make people believe that we were

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Speaker 1: to blame for the war, These confounded liars. He lusted

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Speaker 1: for revenge. He longed for the day when the last

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Speaker 1: Allies ran for their lives to escape Germany, when Paris

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Speaker 1: would lay in ruins at its next German occupation, next

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Speaker 1: time he would show neither mercy nor good humor. Savitri

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Speaker 1: Devi felt a sense of mounting excitement as his mood

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Speaker 1: became ever uglier, and he began to describe in a

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Speaker 1: raised voice, how he would kill his enemies. This was

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Speaker 1: the spirit she sought, the rolling eyes of a wounded animal,

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Speaker 1: a war god of the Stone age, thirst for blood,

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Speaker 1: barbaric magnificence. It was a perfect meeting of minds, the violent,

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Speaker 1: resentful German and the Aryan prophetess of revenge. The day

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Speaker 1: of reckoning seemed already nearer. Oh okay uh, she's a

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Speaker 1: fun trip to Germany. I mean, you know, she had

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Speaker 1: me at the beginning with the you know, feeling plundered

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Speaker 1: and betrayed by the Democratic Party. Sure, yes, that's a

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Speaker 1: strong start talking about the Democratic Party. Though I know,

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Speaker 1: I know, I just there, Rob Robber, I was away

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Speaker 1: from the mic at that point. What else can I do?

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Speaker 1: I can confirm you were not away from the mic,

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Speaker 1: as I think everyone you're right upon. This is revisionist,

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Speaker 1: This is absurd, This is Savitri DEVII levels of revisionists.

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Speaker 1: You are the Savitri Devi of this party. That's so mean.

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Speaker 1: At least make me the Elizabeth Holmes of this podcast. Jeez,

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Speaker 1: you have not earned that yet, James, Make me a

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Speaker 1: fun one, Make me a fun bastard. Come on, make

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Speaker 1: me a fun tragic one with a pony tail at least. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's nothing tragic about Savitri um So. She returned to

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Speaker 1: France at December of ninety eight and immediately began to

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Speaker 1: write a book, Gold in the Furnace, about her experiences

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Speaker 1: and her growing conception of Hitlerism is something beyond what

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Speaker 1: the old National Socialists had really believed. In February of

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Speaker 1: nineteen nine, three chapters into her book, Savitri Devi was

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Speaker 1: arrested by French authorities. She spent a total of six months. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because you know it's illegal to be a Nazi for

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Speaker 1: good reason. I'm like, wait, hold on, unpacked that, yes,

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Speaker 1: I understand. Yeah. She spent a total of six months

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Speaker 1: in pre trial attention and then prison after her conviction

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Speaker 1: for spreading Nazi propaganda. The time behind bars was good

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Speaker 1: for Savitri, as it historically often is for Nazis who

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Speaker 1: fancy themselves writers like her Idol Adolf Hitler. She used

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Speaker 1: her prison time as an excuse to finish her first book.

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Speaker 1: Just uses it as like a sabbatical, as one would

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Speaker 1: is sabbatical. Yeah, it's an old Nazi story. She also

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Speaker 1: took the opportunity to meet even more old Nazis. A

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Speaker 1: lot of National Socialists were still imprisoned by the British

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Speaker 1: occupation forces, and these old fighters were all too happy

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Speaker 1: to talk with Savitri Devi. Her dearest friend in the

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Speaker 1: prison was a former war dress from the bergen Belson

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Speaker 1: concentration camp, a quote beautiful looking woman, a blonde of

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Speaker 1: about my age. In Devie's words, she claimed that this

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Speaker 1: war criminal had the classical beauty of a chieftain's wife

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Speaker 1: in ancient Germany. And again this was a woman who

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Speaker 1: worked at a concentration camp voluntarily the languages. So yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: and writes about like how cruel this woman's imprisonment was

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Speaker 1: and how nice the concentration camps was. Like she's trash,

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Speaker 1: She's she's trashed, She's she's absolute trash. I'm not gonna

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Speaker 1: like spend a lot of time debunking her ship, like

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Speaker 1: she's garbage. Yeah, and it's crazy. I mean it's like

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Speaker 1: she is the one that that is like providing all

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Speaker 1: of this information to She is the source. Yeah, she

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Speaker 1: is the source. And again I can't say it enough.

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Speaker 1: She never had the kutzpah to actually go to Nazi

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Speaker 1: Germany while it existed. I think because number one, she

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Speaker 1: would have been disappointed because like none of this this

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Speaker 1: weird religious ship she attached to it was an actual

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Speaker 1: part of Nazism in Nazi Germany. Um, Like she would

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Speaker 1: have like she would have been like a just like

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Speaker 1: she might have gotten knocked up by some Nazi, like

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Speaker 1: at the orders of Heinrich Heimbler, but she wouldn't have Um,

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Speaker 1: she wouldn't have been anything special in Nazi Germany. The

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Speaker 1: odds are good. Like maybe they would have tried to

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Speaker 1: use her to like propagandize because she knew a bunch

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Speaker 1: of languages. I don't know. They might have liked had

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Speaker 1: to try to reach out to India. But probably she

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Speaker 1: would have just been another person. I don't know. I

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Speaker 1: think that's an interesting aspect of it that isn't emphasized enough.

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Speaker 1: She just wasn't willing to actually go to Nazi Germany

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Speaker 1: in this place, she claimed, ruled Yeah, cool, so well.

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Speaker 1: In late nineteen nine, Savitri Devi was again a free woman,

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Speaker 1: and she published her first book to widespread acclaim from

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Speaker 1: the international Nazi community. From this point on, Devy became

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Speaker 1: a prolific author, writing up every significant event in her

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Speaker 1: life through a mixture of supposedly nonfiction works as well

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Speaker 1: as fanciful tales. For example, she retold the story of

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Speaker 1: her first trip back to Europe and the children's fable

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Speaker 1: Long Whiskers and the Two Legged Goddess, whose heroine is

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Speaker 1: a cat loving Nazi named Helio Dora. No, that can't

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Speaker 1: be real. Yeah, that sounds like random words selected from Uh, well,

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Speaker 1: it all makes sense, like the Heliodora's really a self

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Speaker 1: insert charactered cats Helio Savitri Devii's obsessed with sun, gods

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Speaker 1: and goddesses a good how embarrassing for her. What's embarrassing

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Speaker 1: is that Savitri writes that her self insert fantasy character

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Speaker 1: has quote no human feelings in the ordinary sense of

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Speaker 1: the word. She had been from her very childhood much

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Speaker 1: too profoundly shocked at the behavior of man towards animals

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Speaker 1: to have any sympathy for people suffering an account of

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Speaker 1: their being Jews. Okay, the Holocaust is it bad? Have

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Speaker 1: you seen what happened to cats when I was a kid.

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Speaker 1: But here's the take that is a wild take to

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Speaker 1: be like, you know how we resolve, uh, like violence

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Speaker 1: towards cats also cause violence towards people. Yeah, surely the

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Speaker 1: Holocaust is cool because cats have been mistreated? Is Vitri?

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Speaker 1: She just goes to a whole other place. She's like,

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Speaker 1: did you know, like when you're having like when you're

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Speaker 1: having an argument with someone who doesn't want to have

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Speaker 1: a good faith argument with you, and you're just like,

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Speaker 1: well what about this? And they're like, well what about

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Speaker 1: cats in France? What about that? Huh? And You're like,

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Speaker 1: I don't I've been stunned like a pokemon. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: And over the next few years, Savitri wrote and conversed

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Speaker 1: with increasingly aged Nazis and gradually refined her theories about

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Speaker 1: the world, until in nineteen fifty eight she published what

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Speaker 1: would prove to be her magnum opus, The Lightning in

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Speaker 1: the Sun. In this work, the ideas Savitri had been

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Speaker 1: rattling around in her head all finally came together. Hitler,

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Speaker 1: she concluded, was a man against time, fighting to uphold

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Speaker 1: Aryan virtues and blood against the corruption of modernity. She

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Speaker 1: placed him at the center of her own trinity, one

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Speaker 1: that replaced the decadent Christian one she'd grown up despising,

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Speaker 1: and her trinity. I dare you to make less sense

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Speaker 1: than the trinity? She picks, Yeah, you think, who do

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Speaker 1: you think? Who do you think's first? Hitler? Well, Hitler

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Speaker 1: is the most important, but he's not the first, oh,

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Speaker 1: the first. No, it goes in order of it goes

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Speaker 1: in order of, like time period. So these are all

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Speaker 1: historical figures. First one is definitely uh someone ancient Greek, no,

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Speaker 1: ancient Egyptian at the first atheist. He's generally called he

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Speaker 1: was like this, this pharaoh who declared himself the sun God,

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Speaker 1: and like tried to institute monotheism and then he died

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Speaker 1: and everything he did was burned by the people who

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Speaker 1: came after him because they thought he was an asshole. Um.

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Speaker 1: And it's weird because she like hates monotheism so much,

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Speaker 1: but he's like one of the people she loves. I

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Speaker 1: think just because he's the sun god and she's got

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Speaker 1: a weird she'll make an exception. She'll give any sun

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Speaker 1: god a pass. Basically, it's it's fucking weird. Um. Second

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Speaker 1: in her holy trinity is gang Scott, does she And

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Speaker 1: here's why? Why? Um? It would it wouldn't make sense.

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Speaker 1: I mean, basically history's greatest conqueror. He's a great conqueror

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Speaker 1: and he's not Christian or Jewish or anything. You know. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So act In is the Sun and the con is

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Speaker 1: the lightning and Hitler, she believes, combines the best attributes

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Speaker 1: of both the Pharaoh's wisdom with the strategic mind of Genguscott.

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Speaker 1: Genghis Khan succeeded in invading Russia during the winter. So

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Speaker 1: I don't know where you're coming from. This woman is okay,

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Speaker 1: one of these two knew how to invade Russia, and

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Speaker 1: it was not Hitler and then Hitler or is there, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the third is hit because he combines the best parts

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Speaker 1: of Acinat just like a terrible cartoon. She would not

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Speaker 1: watch this cartoon wild. Yeah, it's so dumb. Um. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So there's probably a couple of reasons for her obsession

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Speaker 1: with Acant And for one thing, Akinat was deeply revered

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Speaker 1: by the Theosophical Society, which you will remember from our

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Speaker 1: our episodes on anthroposophy. Um, and the Theosophical Society held

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Speaker 1: a lot of ties also to the Tulist Society and

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Speaker 1: all the other weird little occult groups who supported the Nazis.

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Speaker 1: Early on had been a utopian thinker who tried and

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Speaker 1: failed to a stay a perfect city. Good Rich Clark,

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Speaker 1: Sametri's biographer, writes that she saw his son worshipping cult

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Speaker 1: as quote rejection of all politics that promotes man's interest

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Speaker 1: at a cost to the beauty and abundance of nature,

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Speaker 1: which is just invented by her. Like, yeah, I feel

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Speaker 1: like maybe she's she's like me and Jack Skellington. She's

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Speaker 1: just kind of there for the aesthetic and maybe doesn't

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Speaker 1: fully understand she is okay, Jack Skellington. Yeah, that is okay, Okay,

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Speaker 1: Now I'm now, I'm like, I understand this mindset. If

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Speaker 1: this holy Trinity doesn't work for you, consider embracing the

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Speaker 1: holy Trinity of the products and services that support this show. Products, services,

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Speaker 1: and god, what's the third one? Each is one and

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Speaker 1: a half of the trinity. That's how good both products

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Speaker 1: and services are. Wow. Yeah they add up to three products.

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Speaker 1: M h, we're back. So um God, there's so much

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Speaker 1: to get through with this. This woman's fucking stupid, stupid,

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Speaker 1: fucking beliefs, but they're very important. They're they're stupid, and

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Speaker 1: they're also kind of they're so dumb and complicated. They're

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Speaker 1: so and comicated a lot of phases. They all make sense.

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Speaker 1: I'll say that they don't make sense of the fact

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Speaker 1: that they're true, but like, based on her history and

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Speaker 1: like the things that she imbibes, they all makes I

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Speaker 1: can see why why she came to these conclusions. But

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Speaker 1: they're super dumb. So the core of her Nazism is

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Speaker 1: a love of nature, which was a big part of

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Speaker 1: actual original Nazism too. They were very into like like

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Speaker 1: natural life and ship and like taking care of the

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Speaker 1: land and animal welfare UM, and some of her early

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Speaker 1: books that she wrote when the Nazis were in power,

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Speaker 1: but before she was explicitly a Nazi, like The Impeachment

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Speaker 1: of Man UM, don't explicitly reference in Nazism. And these

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Speaker 1: books like The Impeachment of Man is still kind of

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Speaker 1: popular among chunks of the New Age and environmentalist movements today.

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Speaker 1: Savitri Devi's passionate writing on animal rights is actually one

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Speaker 1: of the many little roads that exist between the green

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Speaker 1: movement and the neo Nazi movement. UM, and it's really

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Speaker 1: fucked up. UM. Devi herself famously railed against the Allied

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Speaker 1: forces purging Germany of its fascist organizations, saying that quote,

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Speaker 1: you cannot denazifying nature. Um. She believed that nature was

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Speaker 1: fundamentally nationalist, national socialist. UM. And yeah, that's a that's

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Speaker 1: a take. I'm gonna read a quote from the Man now,

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Speaker 1: and I want to remind you there are people who

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Speaker 1: are like environmentalists, who are not Nazis, who read this

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Speaker 1: book today and don't really realize what's going on a

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Speaker 1: civilization that makes such a ridiculous fuss about alleged war crimes,

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Speaker 1: acts of violence against the actual or potential enemies of

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Speaker 1: one's cause, and tolerate slaughter houses and vivisection laboratories and

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Speaker 1: circuses in the fur industry, infliction and pain upon creatures

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Speaker 1: that can never before or against any cause, does not

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Speaker 1: deserve to live out with it, bless the day it

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Speaker 1: will destroy itself. So that a healthy, hard, frank, and brave,

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Speaker 1: nature loving and truth loving elite of superman with a

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Speaker 1: life centered faith, a natural human aristocracy is beautiful on

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Speaker 1: its own higher level, as the four legged kings of

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Speaker 1: the jungle might again rise and rule upon its remains forever.

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Speaker 1: So again you see how because of the kind of

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Speaker 1: stuff she's written, she's there's this, there's these bridges. She's

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Speaker 1: a big part of why there's bridges between the eco

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Speaker 1: movement and the Nazi movement. And there very much are

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Speaker 1: on like the hard edge of the of the of

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Speaker 1: the eco movement, of the anticlimate change movement, there are

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Speaker 1: Nazis and left wing activists who kind of increasingly seem

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Speaker 1: like Nazis in a lot of cases. Is not to

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Speaker 1: say that, like even supporting radical environmental action makes you

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Speaker 1: a Nazi. It's to say that, like part of the

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Speaker 1: what schre achieved is building in roads between these groups

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Speaker 1: and the Nazi movement. So now more there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of people that get into Nazism through environmentalism, and Savitri

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Speaker 1: Devi is a part of that um And that's kind

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Speaker 1: of the story we're telling today. Snazism really knows how

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Speaker 1: to ruin a good thing. It wasn't as good at

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Speaker 1: it before Savitri Devi. It's always been a ruiner, but

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Speaker 1: she really took it to new levels, elevated how bad

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Speaker 1: it was. Yea. So the lightning in the sun her

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Speaker 1: opus pose. It's a cyclical view of history. She believe

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Speaker 1: that time began with a Golden Age in which it

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Speaker 1: was dominated by the perfect a sun god age like

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Speaker 1: a sun god. And this degraded slowly into a Silver

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Speaker 1: age and then a Bronze age. And both of these

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Speaker 1: worst ages featured increased racial mixing that weakened the arians.

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Speaker 1: They also featured pernicious Jewish influence. The next age is

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Speaker 1: the kali Yuga, or Dark Age, which Savitri believed the

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Speaker 1: world had all really entered into. She also called this

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Speaker 1: dark age the reign of the Jew. No. Yeah, the

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Speaker 1: only way out of this dark age was for the

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Speaker 1: man against time. Hitler to gather up the terrible weapons

422
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:14,760
Speaker 1: of the Dark Age and use them to bring about

423
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:18,080
Speaker 1: the return of the Golden Age, presumably through genocidal purging

424
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 1: of non arians in the establishment of a strict racial hierarchy.

425
00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 1: Her book was dedicated quote to the godlike individual of

426
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:29,560
Speaker 1: our times, the man against Time, the greatest European of

427
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 1: all times, both sun and lightning, as a tribute of

428
00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 1: unfailing loyalty and love forever and ever God. You know,

429
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:42,680
Speaker 1: there's been a lot said about fan culture. I don't

430
00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 1: agree with all of it, but you know, this is

431
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:48,639
Speaker 1: a real argument against fan culture. This is the worst

432
00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:51,399
Speaker 1: fan culture has ever gone. I feel comfortable saying this

433
00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:54,359
Speaker 1: is this is this is the worst it can go.

434
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,840
Speaker 1: This is bad stand culture. It's bad, bad, bad there

435
00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 1: and and even the way that she rights and structures

436
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 1: these things, it kind of you can hear that like

437
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:07,760
Speaker 1: interest in like ancient history in there, because it just

438
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,359
Speaker 1: sounds like she's kind of connecting these lines that don't

439
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:12,840
Speaker 1: actually exist to make it sound like to I mean,

440
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:16,080
Speaker 1: kind of like the way she like arguably maybe lifted

441
00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: some of her own like self mythologizing from mind comps,

442
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:22,400
Speaker 1: Like she's just like putting something she wants to say

443
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:27,159
Speaker 1: into a familiar framework. Yeah, it's called syncretics. Well, this

444
00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:30,440
Speaker 1: is part of syncretism, is like taking these other things

445
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,919
Speaker 1: that you like and sticking it onto this thing. Um.

446
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 1: And this is like the main thing she goes down

447
00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 1: in history for for doing to Nazism. Now I have

448
00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:44,119
Speaker 1: I have a lot of debates with myself putting this

449
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,479
Speaker 1: together about how much detailed to get into about Savitri's theories.

450
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 1: There's a really dark, very vile world of esoteric Hitlerist

451
00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 1: fantasy based in large part off of her writing. And

452
00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 1: this ship is dangerous. Um. It spreads a kind of

453
00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,720
Speaker 1: ideological infection that grabs impressionable chldren primarily in a vice

454
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:04,119
Speaker 1: like grip, and turns them into something very dangerous. And

455
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:05,879
Speaker 1: a lot of people have died from this, and I

456
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 1: am not going to If you're very knowledgeable about this,

457
00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 1: you will notice there is a lot of things I'm

458
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 1: leaving out just because like this is enough to understand it,

459
00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,440
Speaker 1: and I don't want to just like be spreading weird

460
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:20,600
Speaker 1: Nazi propaganda to an audience. Um of as you said,

461
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:24,640
Speaker 1: a hundred thou people, the Robert that is the most

462
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:27,800
Speaker 1: merciful thing you've ever done on this entire podcast. Yeah,

463
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:31,720
Speaker 1: it's just too dangerous in my opinion. That's good, that's yeah,

464
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 1: I agree. And I don't even know what it was.

465
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:39,119
Speaker 1: It's fucking weird, stupid ship. But yeah. The last thing

466
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:42,080
Speaker 1: that's really important to understand about Davitri Devi's beliefs is

467
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:44,800
Speaker 1: that she decided Hitler was what she called well, she

468
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,919
Speaker 1: was not the only person. Other people had the same idea,

469
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:50,879
Speaker 1: but she's one of the more prominent ones. The kali Yuga,

470
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 1: the tenth incarnation of vishnu um and she used several

471
00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,720
Speaker 1: segments from August Kuba's x I advised book The Young Hitler.

472
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: I knew Kubazek was Hitler's friend when they were like teenagers.

473
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,440
Speaker 1: He wrote a terrible book. It's valuable because it's the

474
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:08,600
Speaker 1: only insight we haven't hit Hitler at that period. But

475
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:11,240
Speaker 1: he clearly wrote it to make money. Is it like

476
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 1: my friend Dahmer? Is it like that? It's like the

477
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:18,880
Speaker 1: same vibe of like this horrible person. Yeah, I knew,

478
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,200
Speaker 1: you're like cool. Yeah, but you also get the feeling

479
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 1: that kuba Zeck didn't really think he was horrible until

480
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: he like he was writing it. Initially to be a

481
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 1: biography that was published under the Nazi regime as like

482
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 1: a pro Hitler piece of propaganda, and then they lost

483
00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:36,440
Speaker 1: the war, and then he just kind of rewrote it

484
00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:37,920
Speaker 1: so that it could be like, well, now I'm just

485
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:40,240
Speaker 1: I guess I'm just going to explain my evil friend

486
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 1: to the ally so Fu sinister. Oh my god. I mean,

487
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 1: there are people care's a lot of debates to have

488
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:51,880
Speaker 1: about kubaz Eck, but most historians will agree, well, you

489
00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 1: have to read Kubazek. You have to take him with

490
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: like a lot of salt. Yeah, he's trying to takes

491
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:01,280
Speaker 1: him with no salt at all. And she pulled several

492
00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 1: passages from his book as like evidence that Hitler was

493
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:12,240
Speaker 1: the Kali Yuga and was like channeling fucking Vishnu. Yeah,

494
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:16,480
Speaker 1: it's this woman does not understand Shades of Gray even remote.

495
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 1: She's just okay, she would have written Shades of Gray,

496
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 1: though if she had been around, I wish she had

497
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:29,280
Speaker 1: like agains the better world, Oswit, literally every single person

498
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 1: you've ever told me about on this cursed show, Robert,

499
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 1: everything would have been better off if people had just

500
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:39,240
Speaker 1: channeled their horny energy into fan fiction instead. Of brutal

501
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:46,000
Speaker 1: Hayden murder every single time. Masturbating the fan fiction is

502
00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:48,400
Speaker 1: the only things that will save us from the next Hitler.

503
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,280
Speaker 1: It will absolutely and and and that's where the Kylo

504
00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,640
Speaker 1: ren stands come in. If you know an angry person

505
00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 1: who spends too much time writing fan fiction for under

506
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 1: no circumstances, stop them, encourage that behavior. Yea, the lives

507
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 1: that I can't even begin to tell you. Yeah, it's good, Okay,

508
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:13,480
Speaker 1: so this is okay horrible. Back to what you were saying,

509
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: that was horrible. So she like reads Kubazek and she

510
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:18,520
Speaker 1: becomes convinced that a couple of chunks of that book

511
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: are evidence that Hitler is channeling Vishnu is the avatar

512
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:27,480
Speaker 1: of Vishnu Um. Yeah. Yeah, there's like there these moments

513
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:29,280
Speaker 1: in the book where like Hitler will like that that

514
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 1: Kubazek writes very like Purple Prosy, where Hitler will like suddenly,

515
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 1: like in the middle of a conversation like make some

516
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,680
Speaker 1: sort of like grand statement about the future, and it's

517
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:40,880
Speaker 1: like maybe it's true because he was Hitler, Like it

518
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:43,040
Speaker 1: wouldn't be the weirdest thing of Hitler had always been

519
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:47,360
Speaker 1: that guy, right, Sure, But Also, kubaz Eck wrote this, well,

520
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 1: after Hitler, you know, was done with and it's entirely possible.

521
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:53,280
Speaker 1: He was like, people are going to expect him to

522
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:56,200
Speaker 1: make grand speeches that are like dark and crazy about

523
00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:58,959
Speaker 1: the future because he was Hitler, and he threw them

524
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:03,120
Speaker 1: in there because that's what like, we don't know. Um. Yeah.

525
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: So decades later, uh Savitri Devi would claim that her

526
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 1: initial inspiration for the idea that Hitler was the Kla

527
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 1: Yuga had come from a conversation she'd had in nineteen

528
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:17,000
Speaker 1: thirty six with Satyananda Swami, the founder and the head

529
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:19,480
Speaker 1: of the Hindu mission where she'd worked. She claims that

530
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 1: sat Yananda used to say, and I'm cluding directly from

531
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 1: her writing here, Adolf Hitler is the reincarnation of the

532
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:28,720
Speaker 1: god Vishnu. Vishnu is the aspect of the Hindu trinity,

533
00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:30,840
Speaker 1: who goes to keep things from rushing to destruction, to

534
00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 1: keep them back to going against time. Time is destruction.

535
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:35,640
Speaker 1: You have to destroy in order to create again. But

536
00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: there are forces that try to postpone destruction. And he

537
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 1: said Hitler was the reincarnation of that force. And he was.

538
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 1: He was. But it's a nice thing to hear a

539
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: very refreshing thing to hear from a Hindu stage. I

540
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:47,480
Speaker 1: told him, I came here because I'm really a pagan,

541
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:49,240
Speaker 1: a worshiper of the Sun, and I believe in the

542
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 1: pagan reaction of Emperor Julian. And I came to India

543
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:54,760
Speaker 1: to get, if possible, a sort of tropical equivalent of

544
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 1: what we have had in Europe before Christianity. And I

545
00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,320
Speaker 1: am not a disciple of any Indian. I'm a disciple

546
00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:02,160
Speaker 1: of Adolph hit There he said, good, good, Adolf Hitler.

547
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 1: He's as much a Hindu as any of our Hindus.

548
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:07,640
Speaker 1: He's an incarnation of the god Vishnu, probably never happened,

549
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 1: but might have particulate. Yeah, it is, but one of

550
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 1: the things that Hindu scholars, who again are generally very

551
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 1: critical of a lot of all of these claims of seats,

552
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 1: will point out some like one of the kind of

553
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 1: downsides of sort of this very open aspect of Hindu

554
00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 1: mythology where it kind of upset accepts new things and

555
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 1: new gods and other religions, and like it's a very

556
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:34,040
Speaker 1: open canonically in a lot of ways. And so there

557
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 1: were a lot of Indians who would have who very

558
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 1: well might have been like, Okay, you worship Hitler. Sure,

559
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 1: he's probably like this, like because like they're just looking

560
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 1: at a way to understand through their religion, just thing

561
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:48,959
Speaker 1: that matters to you. Like yeah, again, who knows, Um,

562
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:52,040
Speaker 1: you'll get different opinions on this than a on who

563
00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:56,640
Speaker 1: you go to. UM. So yeah, we don't know what's true.

564
00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 1: What is important is that after Savitri Devi starts writing

565
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:01,800
Speaker 1: about all this ship, a lot of Nazis come to

566
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 1: believe it. In fact, the reeling and wounded remaining Nazis

567
00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:08,480
Speaker 1: of the West um felt like Savitri's occult musings were

568
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 1: basically a breath of fresh air, and she spent her

569
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 1: middle and later years traveling around and meeting fascists all

570
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: over the world. In nineteen sixty one, she made her

571
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 1: first direct connection with the English neo Nazis of the

572
00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 1: British National Party or b n P. As the war

573
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:26,120
Speaker 1: years receded further and further away, an international agglomeration of

574
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:28,920
Speaker 1: fascist inclined folks began to link up and plan together

575
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:32,000
Speaker 1: for a resurgence of Nazism. Savitri Devi was at the

576
00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 1: center of it. As this paragraph from Hitler's priestess Illustrates quote.

577
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:39,400
Speaker 1: She lost no time in contacting Andrew Fontaine, the president

578
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 1: of the BNP. A spring camp attended by twenty delegates

579
00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 1: from European nationalist groups was held on Fontaine's estate at

580
00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:48,840
Speaker 1: Narford at Narford, Norfolk, in May of nineteen sixty one.

581
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:52,120
Speaker 1: Those present included Robert Lyon, a young leader in the

582
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:55,760
Speaker 1: American National States Rights Party, which violently opposed a segregation

583
00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,720
Speaker 1: in the South, representatives from German neo Nazi groups, and

584
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 1: Savitri Devi. Another key figure was x S S Lieutenant

585
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:05,880
Speaker 1: Friedrich Borth born in nineteen This blue eyed, blonde Austrian

586
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,520
Speaker 1: Nazi had served in the Luftwaffa and the OFFA s S.

587
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 1: As a teenage officer, he had commanded an assault group

588
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:13,600
Speaker 1: and won the Iron Cross. After serving a three year

589
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:16,399
Speaker 1: jail sentence in post war Vienna, he published an SS

590
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 1: veteran magazine, Dust Camarade, which was swiftly suppressed by the

591
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 1: Soviet authorities. Thereafter, he was connected with numerous extreme right

592
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:26,080
Speaker 1: wing groups and attended the most international fascist gatherings. He

593
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,640
Speaker 1: led the boom Himer toured Yugant until it's banning in

594
00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:31,400
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty nine. And then bring the Legion Europa, the

595
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:35,480
Speaker 1: Austrian section of UH theer Arts June You Europe, another

596
00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:37,840
Speaker 1: international grouping inspired by the French O a s and

597
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:40,840
Speaker 1: Algeria and Belgian Rancorps over the loss of the Congo.

598
00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 1: After a busy schedule of lectures at Narford, the participants

599
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 1: celebrated their Nordic racial identity with Folkish songs and tankards

600
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:50,120
Speaker 1: of traditional ale around the campfire. So you see what's

601
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,960
Speaker 1: happening here. Savitri Devi gets pulled into not just neo

602
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:56,920
Speaker 1: Nazi groups and not just old Nazis. She's meeting with

603
00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:59,920
Speaker 1: the American States Rights Party, She's meeting with like these

604
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,080
Speaker 1: Belgians who are angry that they've lost control of the Congo,

605
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,120
Speaker 1: and she's meeting with all these old neo Nazis in

606
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 1: the British National Party and stuff. Um would you say

607
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: at this point she is out of her depth in

608
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 1: terms of I can't believe you did that. No, no, no, no, no,

609
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:21,279
Speaker 1: I think no, no, She's not out of her depth

610
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,759
Speaker 1: at all. Um, she is. What she is doing is

611
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:27,200
Speaker 1: helping to draw She's not the only force doing this,

612
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 1: but she's helping to draw these groups together by providing

613
00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:33,680
Speaker 1: the early Like these are all separate groups, like the

614
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 1: Cause of desegregation, like a lot of racists who don't

615
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,719
Speaker 1: want America disegregated, fought against the Nazis. She is a

616
00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:43,160
Speaker 1: part of all these different, like very far right groups,

617
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:47,160
Speaker 1: including Nazis, coming together and in a lot of cases

618
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 1: starting to embrace these weird, this weird Nazi religion. She's

619
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:54,319
Speaker 1: um she's invented as something to unify all of them.

620
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 1: That's what starts to happen in this period. And that's

621
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 1: what's really unique about this period is like these are

622
00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 1: all groups like the Belgian, like pro Congolese control of

623
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 1: like the Belgium, Like the Belgians weren't pro Nazi, but

624
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 1: like these Belgians start to get pro Nazi now because

625
00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 1: like they realize there's like this white identity thing, but

626
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 1: also this this weird religion that is more attractive to

627
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,800
Speaker 1: them than actual national socialism would have been. It's interesting.

628
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:23,520
Speaker 1: I mean, it seems like part of her effectiveness lies

629
00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 1: in like having so many little bits of things for

630
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:29,439
Speaker 1: people to latch onto, so that even if you don't

631
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:32,360
Speaker 1: agree with the larger ideology, there's a worm on a

632
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:36,439
Speaker 1: hook that will get you in. That's called syncretism. That's

633
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 1: what syncretism really is, is like all these different things

634
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:41,800
Speaker 1: kind of it's like a catamari of ideology with like

635
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:44,520
Speaker 1: Nazism at the core, but all these things sticking to it,

636
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 1: and these things get other people stuck to them. Um.

637
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,920
Speaker 1: So like yeah, that's what we start to see happening

638
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:54,640
Speaker 1: in the early nineteen sixties. Um. In nineteen sixty two,

639
00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:57,320
Speaker 1: Savitri was in England again for a gathering of worldwide

640
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:03,680
Speaker 1: Nazis that included Bastard pod main character George Lincoln Rockwell.

641
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:16,840
Speaker 1: Oh I know a thing about to get not great Oka.

642
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 1: Savitri Devi was one of the signatories for the World

643
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:24,120
Speaker 1: Union of National Socialists and proposed organization to form a

644
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:28,840
Speaker 1: quote combat efficient International Apparatus to facilitate a return to

645
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:32,680
Speaker 1: Nazi values and the extermination of non whites from Western nations.

646
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: Now ones wound up being a bust for several reasons,

647
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:39,719
Speaker 1: including the fact that Rockwell was almost immediately kicked out

648
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 1: of the United Kingdom, but he and Savitri developed a

649
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 1: friendly relationship. The leader of the American Nazi Party had

650
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:48,480
Speaker 1: been on the lookout for a new American fascist religion,

651
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 1: something esoteric and enchanting that he could use to draw

652
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:54,640
Speaker 1: in new members in a way that national socialist political

653
00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: theory and unvarnished racism just did not. And he must

654
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:00,800
Speaker 1: have thought The Lightning in the Sun had some potential

655
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 1: for he published an abridged version of the book in

656
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:07,239
Speaker 1: the National Socialist World magazine, The Lightning in the Sun

657
00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:09,879
Speaker 1: the US. The Lightning in the Sun, it should be said,

658
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:12,960
Speaker 1: could be a y a book that like is out

659
00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:16,840
Speaker 1: right now, it might be to be entirely honest, and

660
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 1: that why a book might actually be Nazi propaganda hidden

661
00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:26,000
Speaker 1: his young adult which, oh, you can't put it past yeah, no, no, no,

662
00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:32,719
Speaker 1: much like for example, the band Ace of Basse Wait

663
00:38:32,840 --> 00:38:36,040
Speaker 1: what yeah, the ASA base where Nazis. Did you not

664
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:39,239
Speaker 1: hear that? Oh? Adam Todd Brown read a great article

665
00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 1: about this for correct, The base of ass was a

666
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,320
Speaker 1: Nazi submarine base. If you watch the music video for

667
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:46,719
Speaker 1: all that she wants is another baby. The woman who

668
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 1: just wants another baby to get on welfare is like

669
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:51,520
Speaker 1: holding a star of David the entire time, and there's

670
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: all these long, lingering shots of it. There's a bunch

671
00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:56,680
Speaker 1: of other stuff. The sign that they saw is clearly

672
00:38:56,719 --> 00:38:59,560
Speaker 1: a swastika. If you listen to the lyrics, it's fucked up.

673
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,960
Speaker 1: Um wow. But we have to blaze past that right now.

674
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:05,719
Speaker 1: I found I found a book called Lightning on the

675
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: Sun that's pretty closely Nazi ship. It's about a guy

676
00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 1: named Glenn the Store. Yeah, Glenn Schmidler, who might be

677
00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 1: a moon god. Yep, that's some Nazi ship there, or

678
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 1: anti Nazi, since Nazi Savitri was all about the sun God,

679
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:29,160
Speaker 1: it could be either. Really, so, Savitri Devi would go

680
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 1: on to spend the bulk of her remaining years in India,

681
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:35,120
Speaker 1: traveling irregularly when the demands of her national socialist beliefs

682
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:38,200
Speaker 1: took her around the world. She remained convinced all her

683
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 1: life that Hitler would return, either in a new incarnation

684
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,520
Speaker 1: or after revealing that he had somehow survived the war

685
00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:47,600
Speaker 1: and lead a resurgent Nazism to global victory. She retired

686
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:50,239
Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy, living for a time at the home

687
00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:54,160
Speaker 1: of her friend Francois Dior in England. That's the de

688
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:58,399
Speaker 1: or you're thinking of, really, yeah, it's well, it's it's

689
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:00,800
Speaker 1: like the daughter, I think of the woman who created

690
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 1: the line. Yeah daughter, Oh good. She was a big

691
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:08,520
Speaker 1: Nazi backer before the war. Yeah, wow, okay, learning more?

692
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 1: I love fashion knowledge. Savitri Devi was kicked out of

693
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:16,759
Speaker 1: Door's house eventually for her twin habits of refusing to

694
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:22,759
Speaker 1: bathe ever and chewing on garlic constantly. Disgusting. Come on,

695
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:35,080
Speaker 1: that's what gets the reaction, Sophie, She's terrible, Harley. I

696
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:37,239
Speaker 1: was chewing on garlic a lot over the summer. It

697
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,600
Speaker 1: helps preserve your voice. I don't think that's why she

698
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:43,360
Speaker 1: was doing it. Does she do you have to bathe?

699
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:47,239
Speaker 1: Who chewing on garlic? Do we know what happened to

700
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:52,440
Speaker 1: her cats? Oh? Solid question, Jamie. Well, she had numerous

701
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:56,240
Speaker 1: pet cats. What happened to those she left to Nazi

702
00:40:56,360 --> 00:40:58,520
Speaker 1: Germany with? She I was just about to say she

703
00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:00,719
Speaker 1: spent most of her remaining year is living alone in

704
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 1: India with dozens sometimes of pet cats and at least

705
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:07,359
Speaker 1: one cobra um. She always had a funkload of cats. Yeah,

706
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:11,359
Speaker 1: this woman. I couldn't get away from her cats. One

707
00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:13,400
Speaker 1: thing about her that you would think that cats live

708
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 1: long enough that the original twenty cats she left behind

709
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:17,320
Speaker 1: would still be alive. But that because I think a

710
00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:18,799
Speaker 1: lot of them were. I think a lot of them

711
00:41:18,840 --> 00:41:22,480
Speaker 1: were she she was taking them with. I don't know precisely,

712
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:24,920
Speaker 1: but my assumption, based on everything I know Savitri Devi,

713
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: is that she would have absolutely tried to get back

714
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:30,279
Speaker 1: her original cats if it was possible. She was very

715
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:34,640
Speaker 1: endo cats. She would not have abandoned the cats. I

716
00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:40,319
Speaker 1: don't think she was. She was real consistent about that part. Yeah.

717
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:43,880
Speaker 1: As she grew older, Devy became more and more convinced

718
00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:46,880
Speaker 1: that the United States represented the most fertile ground for

719
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:49,799
Speaker 1: the growth of the esoteric Nazi religions he had spent

720
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:53,400
Speaker 1: her life helping to construct. In nineteen two, she decided

721
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:55,200
Speaker 1: to travel to the United States to do what she

722
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 1: could do to help American Nazism break out as a

723
00:41:58,160 --> 00:42:01,320
Speaker 1: national force. She died it on the way while staying

724
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:04,360
Speaker 1: at a friend's house in Great Britain. Her ashes, however,

725
00:42:04,520 --> 00:42:06,839
Speaker 1: finally made it across the pond to the United States

726
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 1: of America, and American Nazis laid her to rest by

727
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 1: sprinkling her on their heroes grave George Lincoln Rockwell. So

728
00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:18,640
Speaker 1: Rockwell and Savitri Devi's share a grave. Yeah wow, Okay,

729
00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:22,200
Speaker 1: So she's like, okay, yeah, you know who doesn't share

730
00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:24,800
Speaker 1: a grave with George Lincoln Rockwell and Savitri Devi. The

731
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:29,480
Speaker 1: products and services were about to hawk. Yes for now,

732
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:41,920
Speaker 1: you never know. Now we're back. We're back. So Savitri

733
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:47,879
Speaker 1: Devi's dead, But this is not the end for her. Um,

734
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:50,480
Speaker 1: not really, because starting in the late nineteen seventies, a

735
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:54,400
Speaker 1: famous Holocaust denier in publisher Ernst Zundel, had found her

736
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:57,520
Speaker 1: old work and started pushing it back into circulation. Now,

737
00:42:57,560 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 1: but it only developed a limited audience in those early

738
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 1: post war days. But now, nearly twenty years later, uh,

739
00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:07,919
Speaker 1: people were ready for esoteric hitlersm the book Hitler's Priests notes,

740
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:11,080
Speaker 1: by the late nineteen seventies, the historical experience of the

741
00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: Third Reich was quickly receding into the past, as popular

742
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:18,520
Speaker 1: literature and films ably demonstrated Nazism was becoming something mythical,

743
00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:22,320
Speaker 1: even fantastic, and also plastic that could be molded and

744
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 1: combined with novel associations. By publishing the work of Savitri Devi,

745
00:43:28,760 --> 00:43:31,920
Speaker 1: Zundel aimed to create a new cultic interest in Hitler,

746
00:43:32,239 --> 00:43:35,040
Speaker 1: linking him to ancient mysteries, the world of nature, and

747
00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 1: powerful religious symbols drawn from the Oriens. She was just

748
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:40,279
Speaker 1: saying that by saying it's plastic, he's pointing out, we

749
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 1: have all these weird movies now about like Nazis on

750
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:45,640
Speaker 1: the Moon. You know, You've got these fanciful stories like Wolfenstein,

751
00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:48,840
Speaker 1: these games about like Nazi like all of this, this

752
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:52,600
Speaker 1: this fictional sort of world that's been built up, like

753
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:56,399
Speaker 1: mythology built up around the Nazis, usually not by people

754
00:43:56,440 --> 00:43:58,360
Speaker 1: who are actual Nazis in a lot of cases, just

755
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 1: by people who are like, well, they're the worst people ever,

756
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:02,400
Speaker 1: so I can make them the bad guys. That's an

757
00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:07,400
Speaker 1: easy go for a bad guy. Um. But Zundel is like,

758
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:10,279
Speaker 1: this is a fucking opportunity because kids are growing up

759
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:14,239
Speaker 1: reading about these cool, evil, bad guy Nazis. And for

760
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 1: the same reason that kids love dressing up as Imperial

761
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 1: Stormtroopers from Star Wars, kids get interested in the Nazis

762
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 1: from this. And he sees Savitri Devi's work is like,

763
00:44:22,719 --> 00:44:24,880
Speaker 1: I can fucking get a shipload of kids interested in

764
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:28,800
Speaker 1: Nazism by pushing this stuff back out there. And he's

765
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 1: fucking right now, yeah, yeah, another important architect of this

766
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:38,279
Speaker 1: whole thing and who we're not going to get into enough,

767
00:44:38,320 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 1: but I will do an episode on in the future

768
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:44,040
Speaker 1: is a Chilean Nazi named Miguel Serrano UM, and it's

769
00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:47,040
Speaker 1: from Miguel that we actually get the term esoteric Hitlerism.

770
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:50,239
Speaker 1: Serrano and Devi seemed to have reached essentially the same

771
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:53,320
Speaker 1: conclusion about Hitler as an avatar of Vishnu through slightly

772
00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 1: different intellectual roots. UM. Miguel was a student of Young

773
00:44:57,320 --> 00:44:59,920
Speaker 1: and a Mithrist, which we just don't have enough time

774
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:06,279
Speaker 1: to get into once again, the Theosophical Society UM. He

775
00:45:06,440 --> 00:45:11,040
Speaker 1: was also an early Avid Western practitioner of yoga. Miguel

776
00:45:11,160 --> 00:45:14,239
Speaker 1: corresponded with Devi during her lifetime. Before he died in

777
00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 1: two thousand nine, he gave interviews to Nazi magazines with

778
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 1: names like black Son, where he said this about Savitri

779
00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:25,120
Speaker 1: Devi quote, Savitri Devi is the greatest warrior after Adolf Hitler,

780
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:28,279
Speaker 1: Rudolf Hess and Joseph Gebel's. Moreover, she was the first

781
00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 1: to discover the ancient and spiritual power behind Hitlerrism. She

782
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 1: envisioned a new religion and inaugurated a sanctuary for Hitler

783
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:38,160
Speaker 1: in India. She was as I myself am anti Christian.

784
00:45:38,440 --> 00:45:40,960
Speaker 1: She initiated completely on her own all that I have

785
00:45:41,080 --> 00:45:44,040
Speaker 1: developed up until now. It is not mere coincidence that

786
00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:47,520
Speaker 1: the Spanish Catholics published an attack against Savitri Devi Atto

787
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:49,680
Speaker 1: Iron and me. It was very late in her life

788
00:45:49,719 --> 00:45:51,759
Speaker 1: when we started to write each other. We just missed

789
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:53,920
Speaker 1: each other in Europe by one week. I arrived a

790
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:56,359
Speaker 1: few days after her death. I think that Savitri Devi

791
00:45:56,440 --> 00:45:58,879
Speaker 1: will be the greatest sister of all the pre Sevesotera

792
00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:02,440
Speaker 1: hitlersm the beasts of Wotan. And he's like wearing a

793
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 1: male feminist T shirt while he does this. He's like,

794
00:46:04,840 --> 00:46:07,600
Speaker 1: I don't hate women. I like this. I like the

795
00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:11,520
Speaker 1: worst woman I've ever heard of love. He would not

796
00:46:11,680 --> 00:46:14,960
Speaker 1: have warned me I will say that much. But you're

797
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:17,560
Speaker 1: getting the spirit of the guy, right. He's a real

798
00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 1: gigantic piece of ship, and we're not getting into it up.

799
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:23,320
Speaker 1: But he gives her credit as like the real motive

800
00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:27,919
Speaker 1: force behind the religion that Hitlerrism becomes, even though he's

801
00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:29,800
Speaker 1: also like kind of independently coming to a lot of

802
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:32,719
Speaker 1: the same conclusions and even earlier in some cases. Like

803
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:35,239
Speaker 1: she's the popularizer in a lot of ways. She has

804
00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:39,960
Speaker 1: a big role in that um. And yeah, he's we'll

805
00:46:39,960 --> 00:46:43,799
Speaker 1: talk about him more later today, Savitri Devi's fingerprints can

806
00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:46,440
Speaker 1: be found all over the radical and murderous chunks of

807
00:46:46,520 --> 00:46:50,480
Speaker 1: the fascist right. The Fair Creek Division, an accelerationist neo

808
00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:55,240
Speaker 1: Nazi organization that's very similar to Adam Wafan Division, similar

809
00:46:55,360 --> 00:46:57,800
Speaker 1: enough to talk about for the purposes of this podcast.

810
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:00,719
Speaker 1: Both of them seek to bring about the destruction of

811
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:04,080
Speaker 1: the current world order through destabilizing attacks. The Fair Creek

812
00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:07,840
Speaker 1: Division directly cites Devy as an inspiration. The group's gab

813
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:11,839
Speaker 1: of bio includes this Devy quote. Creation and destruction are

814
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:14,200
Speaker 1: one to the eyes of one who can see beauty.

815
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:17,759
Speaker 1: Savitri's beliefs went on to have a big influence on

816
00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:20,160
Speaker 1: Adam Waffen two and the members of the Base who

817
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:23,760
Speaker 1: weren't FBI agents, anti fascists or journalists, which is basically,

818
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:28,399
Speaker 1: these seven guys you got arrested. That's a familiar yeah, yeah,

819
00:47:29,800 --> 00:47:32,919
Speaker 1: in these groups like the Base that we can see

820
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:35,960
Speaker 1: some hint of what makes a Vitri Devi so dangerous.

821
00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:39,880
Speaker 1: The leader of the Michigan Cell of Adam Waffen Division,

822
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:42,920
Speaker 1: who was DOCST a few days before I wrote this episode,

823
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:46,080
Speaker 1: reached his position in charge of the Michigan Cell when

824
00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 1: he was fifteen years old. The three members of the

825
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:51,759
Speaker 1: base who were arrested in Georgia in the process of

826
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:55,560
Speaker 1: trying to spark a race war were ages nineteen, twenty

827
00:47:55,680 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 1: one and twenty five, respectively. These acceleration as esoteric hitler

828
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:04,719
Speaker 1: Ists tend to be young, and there is disagreement on

829
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,360
Speaker 1: the average age at which people enter cults, but the

830
00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:10,280
Speaker 1: work of Dr John G. Clark, a psych professor at Harvard,

831
00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:13,600
Speaker 1: who surveyed five current and former cult members, suggests an

832
00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:16,720
Speaker 1: average age of nineteen and a half for new cult members.

833
00:48:17,040 --> 00:48:19,959
Speaker 1: He also points out that most new cult members are male.

834
00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:23,200
Speaker 1: This is because young men are particularly vulnerable to being

835
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:25,960
Speaker 1: enraptured by ideologies that offered them a sense of purpose

836
00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:28,600
Speaker 1: and belonging. It's one of the reasons the same age

837
00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:32,320
Speaker 1: group as the ideal recruitment population for soldiers. But Esotera

838
00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 1: Hitlerism doesn't just suck these kids in because they're young.

839
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 1: And to explain this new part, I'm gonna have to

840
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:42,160
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about Kechism, and I am very sorry.

841
00:48:43,480 --> 00:48:47,960
Speaker 1: Do we do we have? Do we absolutely? Is it? Absolutely? Yeah?

842
00:48:48,080 --> 00:48:52,520
Speaker 1: We really do. Kechism started out as a joking parody

843
00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:55,560
Speaker 1: of religion invented by the ship posters four chan and

844
00:48:55,640 --> 00:48:58,800
Speaker 1: eight chan during gamer Gate. It's very dumb and talking

845
00:48:58,840 --> 00:49:01,399
Speaker 1: about it makes me feel very silly. But the short

846
00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:03,919
Speaker 1: of it is Kechism started out, and for probably most

847
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:06,360
Speaker 1: people still is a dumb gag and a way for

848
00:49:06,440 --> 00:49:08,880
Speaker 1: them to make fun of members of minority groups by

849
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:11,880
Speaker 1: pretending to be members of a victimized religion because they

850
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:15,120
Speaker 1: think that's funny. The whole thing focuses around ship posting

851
00:49:15,200 --> 00:49:17,840
Speaker 1: and spreading memes. But as the Trump campaign ramped up

852
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,160
Speaker 1: and this weird internet movement started to have an impact

853
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:23,960
Speaker 1: on the real world, some, particularly unhinged annon, started to

854
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:27,279
Speaker 1: take Kechism more seriously. Well, others just thought the joke

855
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:29,960
Speaker 1: kept getting funnier and spread it around for that reason.

856
00:49:30,719 --> 00:49:34,520
Speaker 1: Lawrence Murray, a writer for the fascist podcast The Right Stuff,

857
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:38,200
Speaker 1: was probably the first person to purposefully meld Kechism with

858
00:49:38,320 --> 00:49:43,680
Speaker 1: Savitri Devi's philosophy into something he called esoteric Keckism. He

859
00:49:43,800 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 1: started shooting out memes that replaced Hitler with Pepe as

860
00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 1: an avatar of Vishnu, stuff like that. It's very dumb.

861
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:52,800
Speaker 1: When interviewed, Murray claims he was only half joking. With

862
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:55,399
Speaker 1: the whole idea, but like any joke of the sort

863
00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:58,080
Speaker 1: on the Internet, it spread like wildfire, and a certain

864
00:49:58,160 --> 00:50:00,360
Speaker 1: chunk of the people who saw it took it seri reously,

865
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:03,880
Speaker 1: which led them to the work of more serious fascist thinkers,

866
00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:07,160
Speaker 1: people likes of Etrea Devi, and led some of them

867
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:11,239
Speaker 1: into accelerationist groups like Adam Woffen and the Base. It

868
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:14,600
Speaker 1: is not a coincidence that Honders Brevic, the Utoya, Norway

869
00:50:14,680 --> 00:50:17,120
Speaker 1: shooter who massacred dozens of children at a left wing

870
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:21,640
Speaker 1: summer camp, directly praised Hindu nationalism in his manifesto. It

871
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:24,560
Speaker 1: is also not a total coincidence that both Honders Brevick

872
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 1: and Brenton Tarrant, the christ shoot shooter, claimed to be

873
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:32,160
Speaker 1: Knights Templar, members of a Christian order fighting against Muslims basically.

874
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:36,279
Speaker 1: And it is not a coincidence that the Urban Dictionary

875
00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:40,160
Speaker 1: page for Kechism, written by a gamer gator, describes it

876
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:44,200
Speaker 1: as a red pilled ideology originating from the true Knights Templar.

877
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:47,560
Speaker 1: And again, all of this is joking. All of this

878
00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:50,839
Speaker 1: is not joking. It's both at once. It's the contradiction

879
00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:55,080
Speaker 1: of modern fucking Yeah. Well, that's yeah, the great the

880
00:50:55,200 --> 00:50:58,359
Speaker 1: greatest trick the devil ever played was irony poisoning, because

881
00:50:58,440 --> 00:51:02,040
Speaker 1: you just can't. Yeah, you can't argue with that. Um.

882
00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:06,840
Speaker 1: And some people will say, and it's possible there is

883
00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:10,840
Speaker 1: are some central figures behind this spread of syncretism, like

884
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 1: sinister individuals who have like kind of put all this

885
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:16,719
Speaker 1: together purposefully, or at least put pieces of it together purposefully.

886
00:51:17,320 --> 00:51:20,759
Speaker 1: But I tend to be of the belief that most,

887
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:23,319
Speaker 1: if not all, of it is a morphous and acephalis.

888
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:26,640
Speaker 1: It happened without a head, without much intention on its own.

889
00:51:26,680 --> 00:51:28,359
Speaker 1: There may have been bits of intention here and there,

890
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:31,480
Speaker 1: like esoteric Keeckism, but a lot of it just happened

891
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:36,120
Speaker 1: because of the sort of structures Savitri Devi built Um.

892
00:51:36,560 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 1: It's it's just kind of the natural result of the

893
00:51:38,600 --> 00:51:41,600
Speaker 1: amorphous and sticky nature of the faith that she created.

894
00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:45,200
Speaker 1: If Hindu mythology and ancient Egyptian history can be folded

895
00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:48,080
Speaker 1: in with Adolf Hitler and the Aryan myth, why can't

896
00:51:48,120 --> 00:51:51,040
Speaker 1: Keechisum wind up in there too? Can't the Knights Temple

897
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 1: are fit in there too? All these weird little subcultures

898
00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:59,160
Speaker 1: you've got Norse mythology, chan culture, gamer culture, new age, spiritualism, environmentalism,

899
00:51:59,200 --> 00:52:03,120
Speaker 1: even veganism. All these things appeal heavily to a lot

900
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:05,840
Speaker 1: of young people. And the more little bridges that you

901
00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:09,719
Speaker 1: can build between these different communities and actual extermination is

902
00:52:09,840 --> 00:52:13,440
Speaker 1: Nazi beliefs, the more young men will kind of accidentally

903
00:52:13,600 --> 00:52:16,120
Speaker 1: fall in and get caught in this net. It's like

904
00:52:16,200 --> 00:52:19,719
Speaker 1: a tunnel spider's web. And at the end the great

905
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:22,680
Speaker 1: innovations have e treat every brought like that's that's the

906
00:52:22,760 --> 00:52:25,640
Speaker 1: innovation she brought to Nazism. She took what was a

907
00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:29,360
Speaker 1: dead political system that couldn't spread outside of Germany, not really,

908
00:52:29,680 --> 00:52:33,880
Speaker 1: and turned it into a living, syncretic religion, something with vitality,

909
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:38,040
Speaker 1: something capable of mutating and absorbing and staying relevant, and

910
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 1: something capable of inspiring young men to commit murder in

911
00:52:41,080 --> 00:52:44,160
Speaker 1: the memory of Adolf Hitler nearly a century after his death,

912
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:46,200
Speaker 1: could you give me that word one more time, of

913
00:52:46,600 --> 00:52:50,800
Speaker 1: of the the syncretism syncretism, Yeah, I mean it's and

914
00:52:50,920 --> 00:52:53,600
Speaker 1: and if you are able to, you know, find a

915
00:52:53,719 --> 00:52:57,479
Speaker 1: way to get a group of people who are looking

916
00:52:57,520 --> 00:52:59,799
Speaker 1: for something to believe in, who are maybe a little

917
00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:04,359
Speaker 1: bit okay, you know what, You're right. I was, um,

918
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:08,600
Speaker 1: but yeah, just like finding a group of vulnerable, vulnerable

919
00:53:08,760 --> 00:53:12,160
Speaker 1: people ideologically that needs something to believe in and put

920
00:53:12,239 --> 00:53:15,799
Speaker 1: a delicious chocolate coating on the outside of it. Uh,

921
00:53:16,360 --> 00:53:22,719
Speaker 1: it seems to work. It works. So how do you

922
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 1: feel about Savitri fan? You gotta check out her books.

923
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:30,600
Speaker 1: Can't say I'm a fan she. I don't think that

924
00:53:30,680 --> 00:53:32,839
Speaker 1: I would. I don't think we would have been friends

925
00:53:32,880 --> 00:53:34,880
Speaker 1: in junior high and I don't think we would have

926
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:39,120
Speaker 1: been friends now. I yeah, no, I mean I truly.

927
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:42,279
Speaker 1: And it is interesting that we don't talk about her.

928
00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:47,000
Speaker 1: I had no idea this person existed. I why do

929
00:53:47,040 --> 00:53:49,400
Speaker 1: you think that is? There's a there's a degree to

930
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:51,760
Speaker 1: which I think a lot of people who knew about

931
00:53:51,840 --> 00:53:55,120
Speaker 1: her and are like researchers didn't really want to because

932
00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:57,480
Speaker 1: there's this worry about making a bigger deal of it

933
00:53:57,560 --> 00:53:59,920
Speaker 1: than it is. It's kind of like I didn't really

934
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:02,640
Speaker 1: write about h N much until the christ Street shooting,

935
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:06,000
Speaker 1: when it was like, okay, well now we gotta the base.

936
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:07,880
Speaker 1: Now it's gotten to this point like all right, we

937
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:11,880
Speaker 1: gotta fucking talk about Savitri dev Devi and esoteric Hitlerism,

938
00:54:11,960 --> 00:54:15,000
Speaker 1: Like we gotta get some of this out there. Um,

939
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:18,960
Speaker 1: I do think it's also just like not super well known.

940
00:54:19,080 --> 00:54:22,200
Speaker 1: I think she was seeing like really, to be entirely honest,

941
00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:24,560
Speaker 1: I think most of her efforts would have looked like

942
00:54:24,640 --> 00:54:29,560
Speaker 1: a failure to most of observers. Observers up until maybe

943
00:54:29,640 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 1: at the earliest a decade ago. You know, people who

944
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:35,480
Speaker 1: were really aware of what was going on would have

945
00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 1: known earlier, but most people, even pretty well informed people,

946
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:40,440
Speaker 1: would have been like, well, this is kind of a

947
00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:42,880
Speaker 1: dead end and just something to like make fun of

948
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:46,800
Speaker 1: up until we start to the internet. Really is what

949
00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:49,640
Speaker 1: what provides this with the last ingredient it needs to

950
00:54:49,680 --> 00:54:53,239
Speaker 1: take all? Yeah, she like pioneered the red pill mentality,

951
00:54:53,440 --> 00:54:56,839
Speaker 1: like it's yeah, she's a big part of that. Yeah,

952
00:54:57,160 --> 00:54:59,359
Speaker 1: and we're not like Julius Evola is a big part

953
00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:03,799
Speaker 1: of this. Who's Steve Bannon fucking loves take away any

954
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:06,920
Speaker 1: credit from any of the red pil pioneers. Everyone deserves

955
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:10,680
Speaker 1: to take up space. We'll get them all. We'll get

956
00:55:10,719 --> 00:55:12,920
Speaker 1: them all on this show. We will, we will. They

957
00:55:12,960 --> 00:55:19,360
Speaker 1: deserve it weller as usual. This was absolutely horrifying and

958
00:55:19,800 --> 00:55:25,279
Speaker 1: you've ruined my day. Thank you. Good. Yeah, that's the goal. Okay, good, well,

959
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:30,359
Speaker 1: and I've got I've got some plugables, like you can

960
00:55:30,400 --> 00:55:34,080
Speaker 1: listen to my podcast My Year in Mensa. It's online now.

961
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:37,800
Speaker 1: There's only four episodes. It's real quick. I'm on Twitter

962
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 1: at Jamie Loftus help Instagram at Jamie car Superstar on

963
00:55:42,200 --> 00:55:45,320
Speaker 1: tour for the next month or so. Jamie Loftus is

964
00:55:45,360 --> 00:55:48,680
Speaker 1: innocent dot com. And that's what I have to say.

965
00:55:48,880 --> 00:55:50,600
Speaker 1: I love when we talk about the worship in the

966
00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:52,799
Speaker 1: entire world and at the end you're like, so, what's

967
00:55:52,800 --> 00:55:59,040
Speaker 1: your Twitter handle? This is if you really want to

968
00:55:59,120 --> 00:56:05,560
Speaker 1: learn more about esoteric hitlersm follow Sophie's Twitter Why underscore,

969
00:56:05,640 --> 00:56:15,840
Speaker 1: Sophie Underscore? Why rather subolutely violent? No, gosh, you know,

970
00:56:17,120 --> 00:56:19,640
Speaker 1: you know what. It has been on Twitter for less

971
00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:25,720
Speaker 1: than forty eight hours, already getting accused of crimes. Robert

972
00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:27,479
Speaker 1: gonna be canceled by the time this came up because

973
00:56:27,480 --> 00:56:29,160
Speaker 1: he blew his nose on the mic no less than

974
00:56:29,239 --> 00:56:34,279
Speaker 1: four times several hours. I am, I am ill, You're ill,

975
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:36,239
Speaker 1: I know, but you know, but I mean now you're

976
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:41,680
Speaker 1: just now you're just bragging about it. Follow our podcast

977
00:56:41,840 --> 00:56:47,440
Speaker 1: at Bassard's Pot on Instagram. Don't tell anyone to do so, sorry, listeners,

978
00:56:47,480 --> 00:56:52,080
Speaker 1: what to do for I'm get it together? I know

979
00:56:52,920 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 1: I didn't sleep last night, and the episodes nobody, Well,

980
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:04,279
Speaker 1: I know we've had the sleep last night. That does

981
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:07,320
Speaker 1: that excuse the nose blowing? My friend having trouble sleeping?

982
00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:13,640
Speaker 1: Does it excuse the nose blower? No? No, no, Robert, Sophie, Robert,

983
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:17,480
Speaker 1: that's going to be okay? It is not. We're always

984
00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:19,560
Speaker 1: getting mad. And the episode, my friend and go take

985
00:57:19,560 --> 00:57:26,640
Speaker 1: a nappy. The episode is over. Go hug a cat, cat.

986
00:57:27,080 --> 00:57:31,840
Speaker 1: Can you stop nazis cat and encourage the angriest person

987
00:57:31,960 --> 00:57:35,000
Speaker 1: you know to write fan fiction? That's truly the greatest

988
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:38,720
Speaker 1: service you can do. Both of those things are critical. Alright,

989
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:40,480
Speaker 1: episodes over. Bye by