1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,560 Speaker 1: On August eleventh, twenty twenty, the Big Ten, led by 2 00:00:03,640 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 1: its new commissioner Kevin Warren, released a statement that shook 3 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:12,000 Speaker 1: the college football world. The Big Ten was canceling its 4 00:00:12,039 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: fall football schedule due to the ongoing pandemic. 5 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 2: I think right now, like a lot of college football 6 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,280 Speaker 2: fans just kind of devastated by the news that it's 7 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 2: a reality. Now there won't be any college football as 8 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:24,600 Speaker 2: far as the Big Ten, And it sounds like eventually 9 00:00:24,680 --> 00:00:25,320 Speaker 2: the PAC twelve. 10 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,680 Speaker 1: For now, the PAC twelve did follow suit, while the 11 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 1: other major conferences remained in a holding pattern. With so 12 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:35,320 Speaker 1: many unknowns about the virus and more and more cases 13 00:00:35,360 --> 00:00:38,879 Speaker 1: by the day, the entire season was hanging on by 14 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:39,320 Speaker 1: a thread. 15 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 3: It's incumbent on the Big Ten to share this medical 16 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 3: information with the population at large, not just in sports. 17 00:00:47,760 --> 00:00:52,960 Speaker 1: And then just five weeks later, the Big Ten changed 18 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:53,480 Speaker 1: its mind. 19 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 3: Great news for college football, great news for college game day, 20 00:00:58,680 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 3: great news for everybody. 21 00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:01,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, are we waiting for? 22 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:02,040 Speaker 2: Now? 23 00:01:02,080 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 5: Is the PAC twelve to make the same decision, and 24 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 5: then we can get the whole band back together again. 25 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:11,440 Speaker 1: This is great. The season was saved, at least some 26 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:16,560 Speaker 1: version of it. How exactly does the season get canceled 27 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:20,280 Speaker 1: and uncanceled within the span of a few short weeks 28 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 1: from the solid verbal This is a special production. So 29 00:01:28,400 --> 00:01:32,520 Speaker 1: now what My name is, Ty hilden Brandt. I'm joined 30 00:01:32,560 --> 00:01:36,479 Speaker 1: as always by Dan Rubinstein. Dan, let's start here. Do 31 00:01:36,560 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 1: you remember where you were March the eleventh, twenty twenty. 32 00:01:41,480 --> 00:01:45,320 Speaker 4: Yes, March eleventh. I was in Brooklyn and not knowing 33 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:47,640 Speaker 4: what the hell was happening in the world. And I 34 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:49,559 Speaker 4: think it was my brother's birthday too, So that's great, 35 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:51,680 Speaker 4: crazy day, right, That was the day of the world 36 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 4: sort of stood still. Tom Hanks Rita Wilson both test 37 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 4: positive for COVID. That was kind of like the first 38 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 4: straw weird world. We had an NBA game that was 39 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 4: halted right before tip off. There was a jam packed arena, 40 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 4: remember they booed upon hearing the announcement, and then shortly thereafter, 41 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 4: at ninety six Eastern time, the NBA just flat out 42 00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 4: suspended its season until further notice. 43 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:21,919 Speaker 1: I remember this, yep, I remember vividly. Mark Cuban came 44 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 1: out with a quote shortly thereafter saying, look, this is 45 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:27,800 Speaker 1: this is much bigger than just the NBA. I don't know, 46 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:29,800 Speaker 1: if I'm going to send my kids to school tomorrow, 47 00:02:29,880 --> 00:02:32,800 Speaker 1: is it that big? Just a crazy state of affairs, 48 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 1: to say the least. We're not going to get into 49 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:37,960 Speaker 1: the full history of the coronavirus here, no, but we 50 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: are going to talk about college football. After that night 51 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:43,679 Speaker 1: in March, you and I at that point we were 52 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,799 Speaker 1: doing streams like nearly every day on Twitter. 53 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:51,919 Speaker 4: Yeah, just having conversations, maybe like bringing something silly and 54 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 4: light to the world in the afternoons, at. 55 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:58,440 Speaker 1: Some points doing trivia, right because that was correct a 56 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:00,880 Speaker 1: thing that we did, but also trying to make heads 57 00:03:00,919 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 1: or tails of what exactly was going on with this virus, 58 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 1: with this pandemic, what was it going to mean for 59 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:10,920 Speaker 1: college football. We sort of knew it was going to 60 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 1: be the tip of the spear, and I remember at 61 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:14,959 Speaker 1: one point we said, there's like a zero percent chance 62 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,520 Speaker 1: that this doesn't affect the college football season. We just 63 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:21,040 Speaker 1: didn't know what was going to happen next. We knew 64 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 1: somewhere down the line we'd have to deal with that 65 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 1: as a college football podcast, but we just didn't know 66 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,400 Speaker 1: where it was all headed. I feel like at some 67 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:31,639 Speaker 1: point in there, before we got to July, you flat 68 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:33,840 Speaker 1: out move from Brooklyn to California. 69 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, we did pick up for at least an 70 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 4: extended period of time, moved to California, eventually ending up 71 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 4: in the Chicago suburbs. But I just remember, right we 72 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:49,520 Speaker 4: were streaming and I was in the closet of my 73 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:52,680 Speaker 4: bedroom in Brooklyn, and then all of a sudden, we 74 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 4: were doing streams and I was doing it from one 75 00:03:55,440 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 4: of my brother's childhood bedrooms, and we were corearantining in 76 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 4: another house when we flew to Chicago, and I was 77 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 4: using a bunch of pillows to do broadcast quiet affairs. 78 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 4: I don't know. It was a wild time. And all 79 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 4: the while, by the way, just to bring it back 80 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 4: to college football, you have each outspoken coach, positively or negatively, 81 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:24,479 Speaker 4: weighing in with no big college football governing body. It's 82 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 4: just a bunch of coaches weighing in on what they 83 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:30,320 Speaker 4: think will happen months down the line. 84 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:34,600 Speaker 1: And despite the fact that we had crazy uncertainty that 85 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:38,160 Speaker 1: deeper we got into the summer and near mutiny in 86 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:42,400 Speaker 1: some cases, it didn't always start that way. 87 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 5: You probably got to go back to most of the 88 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:48,039 Speaker 5: spring and early summer, where everyone was saying that everyone 89 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:48,839 Speaker 5: was in sync. 90 00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:51,039 Speaker 3: These commissioners were all talking. 91 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 5: To each other, athletic directors like they were having all 92 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 5: these daily calls. And what changed was I believe it 93 00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:00,160 Speaker 5: was July ninth, if I'm remembering the day correctly, when 94 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 5: the Big Ten decided to go conference only schedule. 95 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:05,200 Speaker 1: So that's the call hour back of the athletic of 96 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:08,480 Speaker 1: the Big ten network of serious XM. She's right, it 97 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 1: didn't start out in a state of pure chaos. We 98 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:14,240 Speaker 1: just didn't know where things were headed. But once we 99 00:05:14,279 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 1: got to that July ninth date, that is when things 100 00:05:19,279 --> 00:05:21,520 Speaker 1: eventually started to change. 101 00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 4: To be clear, Nicole is one of a handful of 102 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:27,040 Speaker 4: people who on the conference level was well sourced with 103 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:31,159 Speaker 4: regard to the thinking of the higher ups at various 104 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,800 Speaker 4: conferences within various conferences. So yeah, everybody was trying to 105 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:38,719 Speaker 4: wait as long as possible. But then July means in 106 00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:41,480 Speaker 4: a normal year, what does it mean. It means preview 107 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:44,159 Speaker 4: magazines are coming out, it means video games are coming out. 108 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:47,800 Speaker 4: It means there are conference media days where coaches are 109 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 4: giving press conferences in advance of fall camps. So July 110 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 4: in earnest is when momentum before the season really gets going. 111 00:05:56,680 --> 00:06:01,919 Speaker 5: That's when the Big Ten certainly went out on its own, 112 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:05,360 Speaker 5: and you saw that the PAC twelve made a decision 113 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 5: very soon after to also go conference only. So then 114 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 5: those two leagues started to move a little bit more 115 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:13,560 Speaker 5: in lockstep than everybody else. And so that was the 116 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:17,040 Speaker 5: backdrop headed towards that first week in August, where everyone 117 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 5: had said, this is like our hard deadline. We need 118 00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:20,919 Speaker 5: to make our decisions about if we're just going to 119 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 5: delay the start of the season and if we're not 120 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:25,239 Speaker 5: going to do it at all. And I think that's 121 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:30,240 Speaker 5: really where, you know, the mess escalated. 122 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 1: The mess escalated. So here's what happened. Yes on July 123 00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 1: the ninth, the Big Ten comes out and announces it's 124 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:40,640 Speaker 1: going to play a conference only slate. The PAC twelve 125 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:44,599 Speaker 1: followed suit a day later with the same announcement. The 126 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:47,919 Speaker 1: interesting tidbit here is that, at least from the standpoint 127 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 1: of the other major conferences dan it seemed to come 128 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: out of left field, and this image I think that 129 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 1: we had been fed for the first couple months of 130 00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:01,280 Speaker 1: uncertainty starting in March, that everyone was talking that they 131 00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:05,080 Speaker 1: were in lockstep. It started to take on a little 132 00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:08,200 Speaker 1: bit of a different landscape. This was in earnest the 133 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:11,160 Speaker 1: beginning of the mass confusion that we saw throughout the 134 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: course of the summer. Collectively. What it meant, and we 135 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 1: didn't know it at the time, was a showdown was 136 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 1: coming in early August, and that's when conferences had decided 137 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 1: that they needed to make a decision on whether or 138 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 1: not to play. We'll talk about that timeline a little 139 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:31,280 Speaker 1: bit later and what drove that, But the story that 140 00:07:31,360 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 1: really emerged here in talking with Nicole and others Kevin Warren, 141 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 1: the brand new commissioner of the Big Ten. He was 142 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 1: not able to circle the wagons like his predecessor Jim 143 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:46,080 Speaker 1: Delaney and get everyone on the same page, both privately 144 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:50,480 Speaker 1: and publicly. That's what ultimately led to just this state 145 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 1: of mass confusion. Dan. 146 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:54,120 Speaker 4: The fact is you have commissioners across the board that 147 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:57,480 Speaker 4: are either brand new, relatively new, not super well regarded 148 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 4: within their own conference, and and there were rumblings about, Okay, 149 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 4: this conference is going to follow this conference, and this 150 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:07,840 Speaker 4: conference is paying attention to this element of everything. So 151 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 4: everybody essentially is on a different page as for how 152 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:15,760 Speaker 4: to react and how to plan for a possible season. 153 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:19,400 Speaker 5: As you have a brand new commissioner facing a scenario 154 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 5: that no college commissioners had faced in one hundred years. 155 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:25,240 Speaker 5: Plus the decision to go out on your own in 156 00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:28,680 Speaker 5: July and try to lead on something without being aligned 157 00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 5: with all the other commissioners, and then not having your 158 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 5: duck center row, not having everyone on board, not even 159 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 5: explaining everything correctly. So all of that was happening in 160 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:44,400 Speaker 5: early August, and then you know, the next five weeks 161 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:50,120 Speaker 5: of anger, uproar, lawsuit from the Nebraska players, eventually getting 162 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:52,960 Speaker 5: back to the point of okay, actually we can restart, 163 00:08:53,000 --> 00:08:54,199 Speaker 5: and we can restart in the fall. 164 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 1: I talked to our friend David Jones. Dan remember David, 165 00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:00,440 Speaker 1: of course, longtime frint of the podcast, sports columnist from 166 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:03,400 Speaker 1: Penn Live dot com. I asked him, did you know 167 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:06,199 Speaker 1: what was going on? What was happening in this moment 168 00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 1: in time? He was a little bit more direct. 169 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 3: Oh, no, no one knew what the hell was going on. Well, 170 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 3: look at it this way. I mean, the coaches didn't 171 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:17,199 Speaker 3: know what Kevin Warren was going to do? Did they 172 00:09:17,520 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 3: Was there any evidence that they did? 173 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:23,040 Speaker 1: There was no evidence, Dan, for those of you play go, No, 174 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:25,400 Speaker 1: they were all in the dark. The Big ten decided 175 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 1: on August the eleventh that it was going to pull 176 00:09:27,559 --> 00:09:30,200 Speaker 1: the plug in its fall season again. The PAC twelve 177 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:35,480 Speaker 1: followed suit shortly thereafter. At the time, I remember it 178 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 1: felt inevitable that the whole house of cards are going 179 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:41,360 Speaker 1: to come down, and I remember we would read speculation 180 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:44,720 Speaker 1: from guys like Dennis Dodd other national college football reporters 181 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:47,839 Speaker 1: that this was the thing that was going to happen. 182 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:52,840 Speaker 1: That it was assumed at some point August eleventh, maybe 183 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:55,120 Speaker 1: shortly thereafter, that it wasn't just going to be the 184 00:09:55,160 --> 00:09:57,080 Speaker 1: Big Ten, and it wasn't just going to be the 185 00:09:57,080 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 1: Pac twelve, that it was going to be all of that. 186 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: If that had happened, maybe we're talking about a spring 187 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:03,720 Speaker 1: season now as we record this. Maybe we're not talking 188 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 1: about any twenty twenty or twenty twenty one season at all. Yeah. 189 00:10:06,800 --> 00:10:10,079 Speaker 4: I mean, optics obviously played a huge element in all 190 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:13,600 Speaker 4: of this, because nobody wanted to be seen as being 191 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 4: careless or reckless or not caring about their students or 192 00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 4: coaches or staff members or student populace on campus. So 193 00:10:21,480 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 4: everybody is weighing what they want to do, which is 194 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:28,440 Speaker 4: play football and keep everybody healthy, and how it will 195 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,360 Speaker 4: look if they do something one way and another conference 196 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 4: or another group of teams approaches things completely differently. So 197 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:37,439 Speaker 4: there's that element to things as well. 198 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:42,240 Speaker 1: The spirit of the decision to suspend the season, I 199 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 1: think was noble, the way that they framed it. It 200 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:49,560 Speaker 1: was in the interest of player health and safety. It's 201 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 1: the way that the decision was made and in particular 202 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 1: the way it was communicated that led to a ton 203 00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:03,720 Speaker 1: of infighting. David, import particular referenced a particular episode with 204 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 1: Jim Delaney, Kevin Warren's predecessor, who back in the early 205 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: nineties tried to slip Penn State into the Big Ten Conference. 206 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,400 Speaker 1: Penn State eventually ended up getting into the conference, but 207 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,560 Speaker 1: David pointed to that and said, this was a situation 208 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 1: that Jim Delaney had learned from and had used effectively 209 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:23,840 Speaker 1: to manage the conference moving forward. 210 00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:25,959 Speaker 3: And what Delaney learned about that and what do you 211 00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:31,319 Speaker 3: what he used beyond in his thirty years as as 212 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 3: commissioner was a sense for when there's descent, when there's 213 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:40,560 Speaker 3: there's palpable descent, you get everyone together. You don't air 214 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:43,720 Speaker 3: your dirty laundry, You get everyone together, you see whether 215 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 3: you can do it or not. And then if you 216 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:49,440 Speaker 3: decided you were going to do it, then you then 217 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 3: you do. You tell everyone, look, we're not going to 218 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:55,680 Speaker 3: have descent openly on the on the outside. If we 219 00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:58,400 Speaker 3: don't want to do this, let's let's say so now. 220 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:02,120 Speaker 3: But we need uniformity when we go out there in 221 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 3: the world. So clearly none of that happened, and it 222 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:09,440 Speaker 3: was a mess because of it. 223 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: It was a mess because of it. And ironically, when 224 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:13,320 Speaker 1: you asked Nicole about this. 225 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:17,240 Speaker 5: The Big Ten was the model for that under Jim Delaney. 226 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 5: Like when people disagreed, they fell inline, they said all 227 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 5: the right things. 228 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:24,320 Speaker 1: The Big Ten used to be the model for how 229 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:26,680 Speaker 1: to communicate effectively, how to circle the wagons, how to 230 00:12:26,679 --> 00:12:29,920 Speaker 1: close ranks. In this case, that did not happen with 231 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 1: a new commissioner, Dan. 232 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,240 Speaker 4: No, it didn't. And it showed obviously because you have 233 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 4: you know, Scott Frost Nebraska and Ryan Day and Ohio 234 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:40,280 Speaker 4: State and Jim Harbaugh and Michigan all saying they want 235 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:42,160 Speaker 4: to play and how upset they are and how there's 236 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:47,520 Speaker 4: no communication, and you have very public infighting among huge 237 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:49,439 Speaker 4: member programs. 238 00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,920 Speaker 1: I remember at the time we did a show and 239 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: of course at this point, we were continuing to do 240 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: live streams every day trying to figure out what's happening here, 241 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 1: and what was really unclear at the time was which 242 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:07,640 Speaker 1: direction it was going to go from there. Of course, 243 00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 1: the Big Ten and Pac twelve were on record saying 244 00:13:10,640 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 1: that they were going to do away with their season. 245 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:15,000 Speaker 1: They were going to aim to play in the spring. 246 00:13:15,640 --> 00:13:18,400 Speaker 1: It was unclear how serious a suggestion that was. I 247 00:13:18,440 --> 00:13:20,440 Speaker 1: was fascinated by it. I always wanted there to be 248 00:13:21,280 --> 00:13:23,560 Speaker 1: a possibility of a spring season, if only because it 249 00:13:23,600 --> 00:13:25,240 Speaker 1: was something new. It was a quirk we had never 250 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,959 Speaker 1: seen it before, and at the time it kind of 251 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,320 Speaker 1: felt like the best idea on the table, at least 252 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:34,360 Speaker 1: to me. Meanwhile, we had the ACC, we had the SEC, 253 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 1: and we had the Big twelve, all of whom were 254 00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:41,280 Speaker 1: standing pat and this turned into a storyline. Will unpack 255 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 1: this a little bit more later, but they were not 256 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:48,719 Speaker 1: ready to commit to extreme measures at this juncture. They 257 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 1: were standing pat. I think at this point, as we 258 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 1: got a little bit past this decision from the Big 259 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:58,440 Speaker 1: Ten and Pac twelve, we eventually came around to the 260 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,200 Speaker 1: idea that like now they're they're actually just not going 261 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:03,640 Speaker 1: to change their mind here they're going to find a 262 00:14:03,640 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 1: way to play through it, come hell or high water. 263 00:14:06,679 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. 264 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:09,319 Speaker 4: And the backdrop, by the way, is the NBA announced 265 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 4: that they were going to move the rest of the 266 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 4: balance of the season schedule and the playoffs all to Florida, 267 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:20,800 Speaker 4: all to Disney World. And so you have this backdrop 268 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:26,720 Speaker 4: of a major sport postponing and taking extreme precaution by 269 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 4: putting all of its players and coaches and staff members 270 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 4: into a bubble in Florida, which I believe that began 271 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 4: in July, right, that began in July. So that has 272 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:39,200 Speaker 4: to be weighing heavily on decision makers within the sport 273 00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:43,120 Speaker 4: about postponing until possibly spring and saying, well, look, the 274 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 4: calendar is already sort of screwy in the sports world, 275 00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:49,120 Speaker 4: what can we do? And I remember Urban Meyer was 276 00:14:49,160 --> 00:14:51,840 Speaker 4: one of the big opponents of moving to spring, saying 277 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:53,640 Speaker 4: it'll never happen, it'll never work, it'll be bad for 278 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 4: the sport. I remember that there were just there were 279 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 4: big opinions, big capital o opinions about the potential of 280 00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:01,920 Speaker 4: moving the sport down a few months. 281 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:05,800 Speaker 1: I was fascinated by the spring thing. I was fascinated 282 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:09,120 Speaker 1: from the moment I heard about it, and I didn't 283 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:10,640 Speaker 1: hear about it from the Big Ten. I heard about 284 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:15,640 Speaker 1: it from Chris Fowler. Chris Fowler was doing regular Instagram 285 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 1: TV things with all of this going down, and I 286 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:21,240 Speaker 1: remember he was the one who first pointed out that 287 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:24,960 Speaker 1: he had talked to some decision makers, coaches, administrators, what 288 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 1: have you, and that this was an outside possibility. I 289 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 1: asked David, just from his standpoint, how realistic of a 290 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 1: possibility was this? Is it something that he thought could 291 00:15:36,720 --> 00:15:37,600 Speaker 1: have actually happened. 292 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 3: It could have worked, and it would have gotten under 293 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 3: the wire before the fiscal year ends, which is June 294 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:47,960 Speaker 3: thirtieth for all these major universities. So I was saying, 295 00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 3: you know, Jeff Brahm came up with a really good plan. 296 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,480 Speaker 3: You remember that everyone forgets that now, but he thought 297 00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 3: it all out and it made sense. We could have 298 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:01,360 Speaker 3: had a lot more satisfying and I think if we'd 299 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:04,760 Speaker 3: had in the spring, everyone in the SEC is glad 300 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 3: they had it. When they did, they just kind of 301 00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 3: forged ahead and thank god, nothing really bad happened. But 302 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 3: they didn't know that. They didn't know that then they 303 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:16,040 Speaker 3: just went ahead and did it. 304 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: So I get the sets from him that there was 305 00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 1: at least some discussion around the spring season being a 306 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:25,160 Speaker 1: little bit of a possibility. Nicole brings up a really 307 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 1: valid point though, that David didn't. 308 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:30,840 Speaker 5: I think if everybody had done it, it would have 309 00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:34,000 Speaker 5: been different. But if you only had two leagues and 310 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:36,840 Speaker 5: three were going to play like the split part, that 311 00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:38,960 Speaker 5: was always going to be uncomfortable if it happened, and 312 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:44,120 Speaker 5: especially as we now see what it's actually like. I mean, 313 00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 5: we saw guys opt out programs, opped out of bowl games, 314 00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:48,600 Speaker 5: like it's not hard to imagine that would have happened 315 00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 5: at the Power five level as well. Again, but then 316 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:53,200 Speaker 5: you have, Okay, what are the TV deals, like, what 317 00:16:53,240 --> 00:16:56,600 Speaker 5: are all those other pieces around that look like who knows? 318 00:16:57,160 --> 00:17:00,720 Speaker 5: But I do think that it sounded like a better 319 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:03,960 Speaker 5: idea at the time, at least something to play towards 320 00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:06,080 Speaker 5: and not say like we're just totally wiping out this year, 321 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:09,920 Speaker 5: whereas ultimately, like wiping out the whole year is probably 322 00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 5: the easier situation for all of these teams, And I'm 323 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:17,320 Speaker 5: sure some of these FCS programs would tell you that too, 324 00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:19,320 Speaker 5: even though they're trying to do the spring season. 325 00:17:20,080 --> 00:17:22,600 Speaker 1: I remember in the heat of the moment Dan arguing 326 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:27,280 Speaker 1: vociferously with you that the spring season was a good idea, right, 327 00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:30,879 Speaker 1: and you throwing cold water on that idea, being like, 328 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:32,439 Speaker 1: why are we doing this at all? 329 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:35,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, it was just it just seemed kicking the can 330 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 4: is never really a solution. I understand certain conferences and 331 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:44,439 Speaker 4: perhaps at lower levels FCS Division two, whatever, that they'll say, well, 332 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 4: we don't have the funds to test people with the 333 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:52,400 Speaker 4: rigor and the consistency that major conferences do because it's expensive. 334 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:54,439 Speaker 4: You remember, this is all you know. Testing is in 335 00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:57,159 Speaker 4: its infancy, rapid test. We don't know how accurate or 336 00:17:57,359 --> 00:18:01,120 Speaker 4: inaccurate everything is, and so they're that cloud of uncertainty 337 00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 4: that did push certain conferences and levels to the spring. 338 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:07,520 Speaker 4: But ultimately, I think Nicole is absolutely right where even 339 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:11,399 Speaker 4: though the sport is inherently splintered, the fact that you 340 00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:13,440 Speaker 4: could have two or three conferences playing in the fall 341 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 4: than another couple in the spring, it really deflates the 342 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:21,400 Speaker 4: sport and interest in the sport to I think everybody 343 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:24,760 Speaker 4: paying attention. Yeah, and as we record again, there is 344 00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:27,280 Speaker 4: a bit of a spring season going on. We've got 345 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:30,960 Speaker 4: FCS playoffs that have been underway for a few weeks now, 346 00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:35,040 Speaker 4: and I guess the obvious question is if we had 347 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:38,199 Speaker 4: more FBS action going on, would there be more attention 348 00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 4: on it? 349 00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:40,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, there would be. It definitely would not feel like 350 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:43,480 Speaker 1: a normal season. What we got in twenty twenty wasn't 351 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:45,960 Speaker 1: a normal season either. We did get through it. 352 00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:48,440 Speaker 4: Right, though, I wondered Ty, and to you, I think 353 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:50,159 Speaker 4: everything you're saying is correct, though I wonder you know 354 00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:54,439 Speaker 4: NBA ratings cratered because sports fans are used to a 355 00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 4: certain TV calendar to watching the sports that they love. 356 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:00,719 Speaker 4: And so when the NBA Finals is in what October 357 00:19:01,080 --> 00:19:04,040 Speaker 4: instead of June? What does it mean when you are 358 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:08,120 Speaker 4: deciding between the Kentucky Derby and Auburn Kentucky. What does 359 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 4: it mean when you're deciding between the Masters and cal Stanford. 360 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 4: What does it mean when you're deciding between Yankees Orioles 361 00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 4: and Texas Oklahoma that kind of thing. What does that 362 00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:22,879 Speaker 4: do in terms of the revenue for the sport and 363 00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:26,040 Speaker 4: the sports popularities and the ability to maintain fan interest? 364 00:19:26,119 --> 00:19:28,359 Speaker 4: I think, I mean, there's no way of knowing, but 365 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:31,639 Speaker 4: I think the move of the NBA makes that at 366 00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:32,919 Speaker 4: least an interesting question. 367 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:37,879 Speaker 1: Well, so here we are it's at this point, the 368 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:41,840 Speaker 1: later part of August, and we've got a decision that 369 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:46,080 Speaker 1: the Big Ten made. The other three Power five conferences 370 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:50,920 Speaker 1: are standing pat And what we see happen is this 371 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:55,439 Speaker 1: outcry both from within the Big Ten conference, as we 372 00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:58,840 Speaker 1: alluded to earlier, as well as from the general public 373 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 1: and politicians. There was a lot going on out in 374 00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: the public sphere around college football. To some extent, the 375 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:10,760 Speaker 1: Big Ten had been politicized, for better or worse, and 376 00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:14,520 Speaker 1: the speculation started to mount that the ground was shifting 377 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:19,880 Speaker 1: and that maybe, maybe, just maybe there would be some 378 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:20,919 Speaker 1: sort of fall season. 379 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,680 Speaker 5: After all, everyone I was talking to everyone we talked 380 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:26,320 Speaker 5: to all summer, like, they kept moving the goalposts. So 381 00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 5: at one point they were saying, we'll never bring the 382 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 5: athletes back if campuses aren't open, right, that went out 383 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:35,160 Speaker 5: the window when they were like, oh no, it's actually 384 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:38,560 Speaker 5: safer to bring just the athletes back and have no 385 00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:40,639 Speaker 5: one else there. And we're like, well, but they're supposed 386 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 5: to be like regular students, Like isn't this the whole 387 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,439 Speaker 5: thing that like there's a Supreme Court case about and 388 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 5: all these lawsuits, so some of those things. Just the 389 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:52,280 Speaker 5: goalposts kept getting moved and another one of them was 390 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:55,199 Speaker 5: this idea of you know what happens if there's an 391 00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 5: outbreak in the student population, Like, I think that to me, 392 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 5: one of the big turning points was when Notre Dame 393 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,560 Speaker 5: decided not to shut down and just to quarantine all 394 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:08,600 Speaker 5: of its students for two weeks because at that point 395 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:10,200 Speaker 5: and they were like, essentially like, we're going to play 396 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:14,360 Speaker 5: through this. That's when other places were like, Okay, well 397 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:17,800 Speaker 5: we'll just let the case numbers go up, survive it 398 00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:20,359 Speaker 5: for a couple of weeks, and move on. And I 399 00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:22,600 Speaker 5: don't think that if you had said to any athletic 400 00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:25,879 Speaker 5: directors or commissioners in the previous months, oh, you're going 401 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:29,520 Speaker 5: to like have three hundred cases, right or a thousand 402 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 5: cases and there's still gonna be a season, like they 403 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:33,280 Speaker 5: would have said no, that would. 404 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:35,560 Speaker 4: Have shut it down. Yeah, I mean, she's absolutely right. 405 00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:39,240 Speaker 4: And at this point we are also talking about which 406 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:42,159 Speaker 4: schools want to play and which schools don't want to 407 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:45,159 Speaker 4: play rumoredly and that there may be votes, and that 408 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:48,920 Speaker 4: there are anonymous Twitter accounts saying the season's coming back 409 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:52,480 Speaker 4: on this date, but maybe this state, and here's where 410 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:55,560 Speaker 4: everything lies right now. It was all over the place, 411 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:57,680 Speaker 4: and especially with the Big ten, but within a number 412 00:21:57,720 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 4: of different conferences, and that you know, the Big twelve 413 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:02,440 Speaker 4: is at the SEC and like they're going to fall 414 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:06,120 Speaker 4: in line. So there was so much swirling that it 415 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:11,160 Speaker 4: became sort of impossible to separate the real from the hopeful. 416 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:13,879 Speaker 1: And I think the one thing that I remember looking 417 00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:17,600 Speaker 1: back is how much at the time we talked about 418 00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:20,879 Speaker 1: the money aspect of it. This was sort of the 419 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:25,200 Speaker 1: elephant in the room. It will forever remain unclear how 420 00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:30,800 Speaker 1: much the public outcry actually shifted the opinions of decision makers, 421 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 1: but we knew that the revenue thing was out there, 422 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:37,160 Speaker 1: and the challenge, I have to believe from the standpoint 423 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:41,680 Speaker 1: of the powerbrokers was how do we balance the loss 424 00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:47,440 Speaker 1: of revenue with a potential moral and frankly legal firestorm 425 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:52,520 Speaker 1: if the virus leads to dire circumstances on campus. Nicole 426 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 1: mentioned this, David mentioned it as well. 427 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 3: The main thing we're afraid of is some sort of 428 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,600 Speaker 3: class action suit from a bunch of playersers who got 429 00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:05,159 Speaker 3: really sick. That didn't happen. But everyone's going to forget 430 00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 3: that because they were really worried about it at the time. 431 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 3: And that's that's that was their motivation for all this, 432 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:14,760 Speaker 3: And I don't blame them, but the whole thing is 433 00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:18,240 Speaker 3: so screwy because this is this is treated as an 434 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:19,440 Speaker 3: amateur endeavor. 435 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:23,719 Speaker 1: Yeah, the amateurism thing we could come back to at 436 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,560 Speaker 1: another point in time. But what was going on is 437 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 1: there were medical advisors to the NCAA saying that if 438 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:32,720 Speaker 1: numbers continued on their trajectory, there was no way anyone 439 00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:35,920 Speaker 1: should be playing. And obviously, if health and well being 440 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:40,159 Speaker 1: were the primary concerns here, this would have gone in 441 00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 1: a different direction. The question is fair or not did 442 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 1: this revenue angle to some degree, went out over what 443 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,280 Speaker 1: you could argue were common sense arguments to not play 444 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:54,360 Speaker 1: because of health of well being. 445 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:58,680 Speaker 4: Dan, Yeah, and it's also important to remember doctors aren't 446 00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:04,640 Speaker 4: lockstep with each other. Right, everybody's looking and considering different facts. Right, 447 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:08,320 Speaker 4: It's there's okay, there's the myocarditis thing. There is the 448 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 4: you know, how could it spread from this person to 449 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:12,840 Speaker 4: this person? And is it outside? Is it in the 450 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:15,160 Speaker 4: locker room or should we be cleaning equipment in this way? 451 00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:15,399 Speaker 2: Like? 452 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 4: What are the potential long term? 453 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:16,919 Speaker 3: Like? 454 00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:20,840 Speaker 4: There are so many different things that different doctors consider 455 00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:25,160 Speaker 4: and making their recommendations that it's it's impossible to even 456 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:30,520 Speaker 4: say this. This group of doctors is a monolithic opinion group. 457 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:34,879 Speaker 4: So you know what you had what parents of players 458 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:37,840 Speaker 4: that are doctors saying this and the commissioner turning to 459 00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:42,119 Speaker 4: this doctor who's saying that. Like it all became very confusing. 460 00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:45,439 Speaker 1: Understandably, one of the points that Nicole brought up in 461 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,240 Speaker 1: our conversations with her was the lack of oversight from 462 00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:51,000 Speaker 1: the NC Double A, or i should say the lack 463 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:54,920 Speaker 1: of true leadership from the NC Double A to help 464 00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 1: drive this process. We'll cover that in part two when 465 00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: we talk about what we learned in the mean time, though, 466 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: the Big Ten five weeks later decides it's going to 467 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:06,040 Speaker 1: plug the season back in. It's going to do this 468 00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:11,760 Speaker 1: thing again. They move forward with a modified eight game schedule. 469 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 1: You may recall Ohio State only played five games because 470 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:19,439 Speaker 1: of COVID reasons. Eventually, they do end up making it 471 00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:24,000 Speaker 1: through to the College Football Playoff and the National Championship 472 00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:28,119 Speaker 1: before losing to Alabama. For all intents and purposes, I 473 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 1: guess a successful COVID season for the Big Ten, despite 474 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:35,600 Speaker 1: the fact that it started out on very very rocky footing. 475 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:38,040 Speaker 1: Of course, we'd be putting our head in the sand 476 00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,720 Speaker 1: if we didn't acknowledge the TV partners and the role 477 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:42,800 Speaker 1: that they had in turning the season back on. 478 00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 5: I think it's definitely a safe guest to say that 479 00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,800 Speaker 5: this was driven by the money and the finances. And 480 00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:51,040 Speaker 5: I think it's also fair for those people who made 481 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:54,760 Speaker 5: those decisions to say, well, it's not just greed, it's 482 00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 5: not just the money we bring in, because it's that 483 00:25:57,040 --> 00:26:00,560 Speaker 5: that props up everything else. You had certain conferences kind 484 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:03,560 Speaker 5: of select exactly how many conference games they were going 485 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:07,680 Speaker 5: to play, or try to reschedule things like up until 486 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 5: you know that very last weekend when there were conference 487 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:12,160 Speaker 5: tournament games being played, like in the. 488 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,160 Speaker 3: SEC and ACC. 489 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:16,960 Speaker 5: Some of these makeup games, And that is solely about 490 00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:20,680 Speaker 5: the inventory that you promised your TV partners, Like those 491 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 5: teams don't need to play, they don't want to play, 492 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:25,199 Speaker 5: but you want to say we got x amount of 493 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:26,240 Speaker 5: games out of. 494 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,000 Speaker 1: Why and so it happened, Dan, we had a season 495 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 1: after all that. Did you like the product in twenty twenty, No. 496 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:37,080 Speaker 4: Not especially I didn't like the product for a number 497 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,200 Speaker 4: of reasons. I mean, not having a fall camp and 498 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,520 Speaker 4: you know, having new coaches and you know, freshmen or transfers, 499 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:45,600 Speaker 4: and not having live tackling with a regular fall camp, 500 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:49,280 Speaker 4: and not having an environment within a stadium that were 501 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 4: used to across the sport by you know, for large part, 502 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 4: it was a college football devoid of the culture that 503 00:26:56,720 --> 00:27:00,680 Speaker 4: makes the sport incredible. I am glad they played. I'm 504 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:05,199 Speaker 4: glad it went relatively well in terms of player health 505 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:08,399 Speaker 4: and safety. But I don't look back on the twenty 506 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:10,879 Speaker 4: twenty season with any degree of fondness, with all the 507 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,640 Speaker 4: starting and stopping and arguments about you know, people having 508 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:18,040 Speaker 4: conspiracy theories about oh, Michigan just wanted to duck Ohio 509 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 4: State or Florida State just wanted to duck Clemson. Like 510 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:24,280 Speaker 4: it was just there was so much nonsense just thrown 511 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:28,280 Speaker 4: into the crockpot of twenty twenty that I just I'm 512 00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 4: so ready for a season not involving any of that silliness. 513 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:38,960 Speaker 4: I had a sense of guilt doing our show, certainly, 514 00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:41,359 Speaker 4: I really did, and I know we heard from fans 515 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:44,280 Speaker 4: out there who were also ambivalent. There was a lot 516 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:47,720 Speaker 4: going on in the world, and to some extent, it 517 00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,359 Speaker 4: felt very awkward to be cheering on college football in 518 00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:53,680 Speaker 4: the way that we would typically do as a national 519 00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:57,600 Speaker 4: college football podcast. With so much bad news going on 520 00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,119 Speaker 4: around us, I didn't know where to place that, and 521 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,320 Speaker 4: I know you struggled with that as well. Ultimately, as 522 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:04,960 Speaker 4: you said, I think we were glad that we had 523 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:08,679 Speaker 4: a season that we made it through relatively unscathed, but 524 00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:11,520 Speaker 4: for a good chunk of it, I just didn't know 525 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,680 Speaker 4: how to feel. I didn't know how to feel, especially 526 00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:18,160 Speaker 4: because of many of the things we just discussed, all 527 00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:22,240 Speaker 4: of this turmoil going on around the sport, trying to 528 00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:26,240 Speaker 4: figure out, Okay, what is happening here? There are conferences 529 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:30,000 Speaker 4: that are ripping themselves apart at the seams. I hope 530 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:34,920 Speaker 4: that on the backside of this will be better for it. 531 00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:39,160 Speaker 4: We'll discuss that in Part two. I think what we 532 00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:44,640 Speaker 4: know definitively after going through the genesis of this decision, 533 00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 4: decision making and the season at large, first and foremost, 534 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:52,480 Speaker 4: the Big Ten and Kevin Warren found itself in a 535 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 4: near impossible situation, and frankly, they botched the way that 536 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:00,880 Speaker 4: it was communicated. They screwed up the packaging of that 537 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:05,120 Speaker 4: very important decision. Nicole's point was that they made the 538 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,720 Speaker 4: call based on pure intentions to try and keep people safe. 539 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 4: I don't think anybody can fault them for that, but 540 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 4: they did so, I guess without the support of many 541 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:18,680 Speaker 4: within their own conference, certainly before they had everyone on 542 00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:22,680 Speaker 4: board to echo out the right talking points. And really 543 00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:24,520 Speaker 4: in lieu of that decision, they could have just kicked 544 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:26,760 Speaker 4: the can down the road. They could have decided that 545 00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,320 Speaker 4: instead of pulling the plug and creating a circus, they 546 00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 4: would wait a few weeks, much the way the ACC, 547 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:36,000 Speaker 4: the SEC, the Big Twelve decided to do. Because by 548 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 4: that point all these schools had adequate protocols in place, 549 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 4: they had more access to testing, they knew a little 550 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 4: bit more about the virus and what exactly they were 551 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,680 Speaker 4: looking for. If they had decided to postpone this decision 552 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 4: instead of being the first to make it, perhaps they 553 00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:52,680 Speaker 4: would have put themselves in a better situation and not 554 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 4: have this firestorm circulating around them. By the way, it 555 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:59,120 Speaker 4: should be noted when you and I say things like 556 00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:04,240 Speaker 4: it went really relatively well, we say that hoping it 557 00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:08,000 Speaker 4: went relatively well. We are not in locker rooms. We 558 00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:10,120 Speaker 4: are not on campus, we are not in dorm rooms, 559 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 4: we are not in college town apartments. We have no 560 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:17,000 Speaker 4: idea what players went through, and by the looks of 561 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:20,040 Speaker 4: how a number of schools or players at a number 562 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 4: of schools and coaches at a number of schools decided 563 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:24,959 Speaker 4: not to play in bowl games and to just stop 564 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,160 Speaker 4: the season as soon as possible, it doesn't seem like 565 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:31,920 Speaker 4: the player experience, with what no in person classes and 566 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:34,960 Speaker 4: no social life and parties and Friday night dinners with teammates, 567 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 4: that they were ready to be absolutely done with the 568 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,400 Speaker 4: twenty twenty season, much more so than any group of people. 569 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:47,320 Speaker 4: So we hope if things went relatively well, but we 570 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:50,280 Speaker 4: don't know. We have no idea what it was like 571 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,240 Speaker 4: on a day to day basis, if you're a player, 572 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:54,360 Speaker 4: if you're a coach, if you're a family member. There 573 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:57,800 Speaker 4: are coaches who lived apart from family members that were 574 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 4: especially immunal compromised. We have no concept. So when we 575 00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:05,400 Speaker 4: say we hope or it appears that it went pretty well, 576 00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:09,960 Speaker 4: that's just because we don't know about outward personal disasters. 577 00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:13,840 Speaker 4: So our fingers are crossed that things were at least 578 00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:16,800 Speaker 4: okay in the fall of twenty twenty for those involved. 579 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:21,200 Speaker 4: The second takeaway Dan despite all the bad stuff in 580 00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 4: the world and our ambivalence towards watching and rooting for 581 00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 4: college football. I thought our friend David Jones hit it best. 582 00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,920 Speaker 3: It was a real release to finally have the games again, 583 00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:38,000 Speaker 3: and it was good. It was a good thing because 584 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:42,840 Speaker 3: we got to be with our tribes. You know, even reporters, 585 00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:44,720 Speaker 3: they have their own tribes. When we go to a 586 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,640 Speaker 3: press box, the other reporters are our tribe. You get 587 00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:53,000 Speaker 3: to socialize, you get to see each other. What's all gone? 588 00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 3: This was so much different to me because no one 589 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 3: got to really get together, no one, no one got 590 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:06,960 Speaker 3: to socialize that tribe. You've got, man, you wear your 591 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:09,120 Speaker 3: colors like no other sport. 592 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:14,120 Speaker 1: We couldn't get together like we could in the past. 593 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:17,400 Speaker 1: The games were out there, as David said, they were 594 00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:19,960 Speaker 1: still pretty good, and it still gave us a way 595 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:21,560 Speaker 1: to be part of the tribe, even if we couldn't 596 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:22,240 Speaker 1: be there physically. 597 00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, we got the calories we needed, We absolutely got 598 00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:26,720 Speaker 4: the calories. 599 00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,320 Speaker 1: We needed, but the meal was not anywhere near the center. 600 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:39,440 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to part one, Don't Forget. You can 601 00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:42,800 Speaker 1: listen to full interviews with Nicole and David on our 602 00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: Patreon aproballers dot Com, Join us on Thursday for Part two, 603 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:50,800 Speaker 1: When we wonder where does it all go from here?