1 00:00:04,519 --> 00:00:06,120 Speaker 1: This is quite a wall here. 2 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 2: Oh, these are some great photos. 3 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:12,959 Speaker 3: That's Jimmy Carter enough me. 4 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:18,800 Speaker 4: Uh huh, yes, me and Lorena Lynn. How did this 5 00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 4: come about? 6 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 3: She was given a concert in Burninghalla. Uh huh, carry 7 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:24,640 Speaker 3: me backstage, leader. 8 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:26,640 Speaker 1: Look at this suit that you have on. 9 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 2: Maybe you've never heard of Bill Baxley, but here in 10 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:32,160 Speaker 2: Alabama he's a big deal. 11 00:00:32,440 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 4: That Johnny Cash. Oh wow. 12 00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:39,880 Speaker 2: Baxley is eighty two, slightly balding, with silver hair and eyebrows. 13 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 2: In the pictures he's showing me on the wall of 14 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:47,280 Speaker 2: his office, I see him looking younger, his hair is dark, 15 00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:51,199 Speaker 2: and he's standing with famous musicians and politicians. 16 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 3: That's my daddy swearing me in for my first term. 17 00:00:55,160 --> 00:00:55,600 Speaker 5: Wow. 18 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:59,560 Speaker 2: Baxley was elected as Alabama's attorney General when he was 19 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 2: just twenty eight years old. He later served as lieutenant governor, 20 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:08,680 Speaker 2: and he's still practicing law today. During his career, Baxley 21 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:13,400 Speaker 2: prosecuted hundreds of cases and sent three people to Alabama's 22 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:13,920 Speaker 2: death row. 23 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:19,200 Speaker 3: There are some crimes that are so wrong and so 24 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 3: horrible that they only deserve one punishment. 25 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:28,759 Speaker 2: He's a lifelong defender of the death penalty, a true believer, 26 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 2: Like when the US Supreme Court outlawed the death penalty 27 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:37,039 Speaker 2: in the nineteen seventies, Baxley worked hard to bring executions 28 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:42,480 Speaker 2: back to Alabama. He's that kind of true believer, so 29 00:01:42,560 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 2: it's not surprising that Baxley was skeptical when his son, 30 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,480 Speaker 2: who's also an attorney, asked his dad to look over 31 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 2: a case because he believed an innocent man was on 32 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 2: death row. 33 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 3: Over the course of my long career, I've had dozens 34 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 3: and dozens of instances where these I'll call them do gooders, 35 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 3: but they're good people. They take up there's causes of 36 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:12,800 Speaker 3: people that have been sentenced to death, and they get 37 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:15,079 Speaker 3: interested in trying to help them, and they all think 38 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 3: they're always innocent. 39 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:20,720 Speaker 2: Baxley didn't even glance at the case file until weeks later. 40 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:24,840 Speaker 2: On an icy winter morning, it was too slippery to 41 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:27,960 Speaker 2: walk down the driveway and grab the newspaper, so he 42 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 2: picked up the file that his son sent him and 43 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 2: began reading about a black man named to Forrest Johnson, 44 00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:38,400 Speaker 2: who was sentenced to death for killing a Shaff's deputy. 45 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 3: I mean, mid morning, I couldn't believe what I was reading. 46 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 3: I wouldn't have believed that something like this could have happened. 47 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:47,359 Speaker 2: What was so unbelievable about it? 48 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 3: Everything? Everything. I don't know how the guy got indicted, 49 00:02:51,760 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 3: how they got I didn't see how the jury convicted him. 50 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:57,919 Speaker 3: I would have never believed that that could have happened 51 00:02:57,919 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 3: in Alabama. Quest question in my mind. This guy was 52 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 3: not guilty of this crime, and I couldn't comprehend how 53 00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 3: this could happen. 54 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:14,480 Speaker 2: There's only one other case where Basley thought the defendants 55 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 2: were innocent, and that case is almost one hundred years old. 56 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 2: So what is it about this case to Forrest's case 57 00:03:24,000 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 2: that convinced Backsley that Alabama is trying to execute an 58 00:03:28,040 --> 00:03:28,880 Speaker 2: innocent man. 59 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 3: It's a unique absurdity that I've never seen before. It's 60 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:40,640 Speaker 3: too late to give him back all those years he's 61 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:43,960 Speaker 3: been on death road, but it's not too late to 62 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 3: correct it today and get him out for the future. 63 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 3: It's wrong, it's gone this long, but it's still not 64 00:03:52,840 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 3: too late to correct. 65 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 2: My name is Beth Shelburne. Like Bill Baxley, I was 66 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 2: born in raised in Alabama. I grew up about a 67 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 2: mile away from where the crime at the center of 68 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 2: this story took place. I'm a journalist and writer and 69 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 2: for the last three years, I've been investigating the case 70 00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:17,200 Speaker 2: that rocked Bill Baxley's world. The story begins on a 71 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:21,359 Speaker 2: hot July night in nineteen ninety five. It unfolds in 72 00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:26,000 Speaker 2: two places at once, the Crown Sterling Sweet's Hotel and 73 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 2: a nightclub that's almost four miles away called Tea's Place. 74 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:34,159 Speaker 2: By the end of the night, one man will be 75 00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:38,479 Speaker 2: shot dead and two others will encounter someone who will 76 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 2: put them at the center of the murder investigation to 77 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:47,800 Speaker 2: Forrest Johnson is still on death row and he's running 78 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:48,640 Speaker 2: out of time. 79 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 6: M hm, do you hear my maness? 80 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:20,240 Speaker 7: Laughter? 81 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:41,479 Speaker 6: Had my feet? Sorrows dep re list in this bad tears. 82 00:05:42,880 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 6: I want to see revelation. I want to know you. 83 00:05:57,800 --> 00:06:05,400 Speaker 6: I'm reason Oh, it's precious. 84 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:24,160 Speaker 1: To I'm Beth Shelburne. 85 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:38,799 Speaker 2: This is ear witness, Chapter one Behind the Crown. 86 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:42,919 Speaker 8: Yes, ma'am, this is very calling from Crowns Drilling Sweet 87 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:46,800 Speaker 8: Hotel in Birmingham, Alabama. I'm calling because I've had several 88 00:06:46,839 --> 00:06:49,360 Speaker 8: guests report what appears on the windows. There have been 89 00:06:49,440 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 8: two gunshots and people running in the parking lot. 90 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:57,560 Speaker 2: It's twelve fifty five am on July nineteenth, nineteen ninety five. 91 00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 8: It's twenty three plain, that is correct. I have security 92 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 8: on the premisist, which is typically County Police, but I'm 93 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 8: calling you because I want to make sure that the 94 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 8: Birmingham Police arrive. Please, all right, look at the one out. 95 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 8: Thank you very much, all right. 96 00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 2: The Crown Sterling Suites Hotel was a nine story building 97 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:27,040 Speaker 2: in Birmingham. Today the hotel is an embassy suites. Inside 98 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 2: the main entrance of the hotel, there's a pale tiled 99 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:33,360 Speaker 2: walkway that leads through the lobby. 100 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:34,800 Speaker 1: The front desk. 101 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 2: Is to the left, but keep walking past it and 102 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:42,320 Speaker 2: you enter a huge atrium, an open space surrounded by 103 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 2: windows with an indoor garden of leafy green plants and trees. 104 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:51,360 Speaker 2: The tiled walkway leads to a coy pond with a 105 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 2: fountain at the center. It's lush and humid inside, but 106 00:07:56,680 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 2: despite all the windows, the field is dim and moody. 107 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 2: Keep walking past the cooy pond and there's a short 108 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:11,040 Speaker 2: hallway that leads to the hotel's back parking lot. It 109 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:14,640 Speaker 2: was here outside the double doors of the Crown Sterling 110 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:20,320 Speaker 2: Suite's Hotel where a deputy sheriff was killed. No one 111 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:23,680 Speaker 2: saw the murder, but a few people heard gunshots. 112 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:28,360 Speaker 9: I remember hearing popping noises from the distance. 113 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:32,680 Speaker 2: Barry Rushikov was working at the front desk when he 114 00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 2: made that nine to one to one call. 115 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 9: When I heard it, I believe that's when I tried 116 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:41,360 Speaker 9: to call Officer Hardy on the radio with no response. 117 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:45,880 Speaker 2: Officer William Hardy, who went by Bill, had been a 118 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 2: deputy with the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office for twenty three years. 119 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:53,080 Speaker 2: He was also a security guard at the hotel, where 120 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:57,200 Speaker 2: he worked the night shift to make extra money. Hardy 121 00:08:57,280 --> 00:09:00,520 Speaker 2: was five foot ten, had a thin mustache, and wore 122 00:09:00,559 --> 00:09:03,360 Speaker 2: his hair in a Jerry curl. He was known to 123 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 2: be easy going and friendly. When Deputy Hardy wasn't making 124 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 2: hotel security rounds, Barry usually saw him wearing his brown 125 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:16,400 Speaker 2: and tan deputy uniform, sitting at one of the tables 126 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 2: in the hotel's atrium, smoking more brand menthol cigarettes and 127 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:22,559 Speaker 2: drinking coffee. 128 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:23,839 Speaker 4: You know, when I. 129 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 9: Worked there, and when I was working nights, it was me, 130 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:30,679 Speaker 9: you know, Officer Hardy or whatever officer on duty, and 131 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 9: or we would sometime have a houseman who is cleaning 132 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 9: floors or something. 133 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 4: But very minimal group, and I never felt unsafe. 134 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:42,880 Speaker 2: Barry wasn't the only person to hear the popping noises. 135 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:47,679 Speaker 2: A few guests at the hotel also heard gunshots, including 136 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:51,559 Speaker 2: Marshal Kelly Cummings, a guest in a fourth floor room 137 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:54,200 Speaker 2: directly above the hotel's back exit. 138 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:57,120 Speaker 10: I can remember like it was yesterday, ma as far 139 00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:58,280 Speaker 10: as the details. 140 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 2: As I worked on this project, I started referring to 141 00:10:01,640 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 2: Cummings as the Keebler cookie guy, because in nineteen ninety 142 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 2: five he worked for Keebler as a truck driver. 143 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:12,199 Speaker 10: When I was with Keebler driving one of the step 144 00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:15,679 Speaker 10: vans delivering cookies and crackers and stuff, and. 145 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 2: We had a Cummings was staying at the Crown Sterling 146 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 2: for a company training. After the workday was over, he 147 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:25,439 Speaker 2: drank a few beers at the hotel bar with some coworkers, 148 00:10:25,960 --> 00:10:28,719 Speaker 2: and then he and the other Keepler employee he was 149 00:10:28,800 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 2: rooming with turned in between ten and eleven PM. But 150 00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:35,640 Speaker 2: Cummings was not asleep for long. 151 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:38,079 Speaker 10: But he just I woke up and it was I 152 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:40,920 Speaker 10: kept hearing somebody talk kind of talk. 153 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:44,080 Speaker 2: So you heard some voices and it sounded like they 154 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:45,280 Speaker 2: were arguing or. 155 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:47,520 Speaker 10: Not really bad. But they were. 156 00:10:47,480 --> 00:10:48,440 Speaker 11: Having a conversation. 157 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:51,280 Speaker 1: Yeah it was male voices. 158 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:55,520 Speaker 10: Yeah, well they quit arguing and then I didn't hear anything. 159 00:10:55,520 --> 00:11:00,359 Speaker 10: So I laid back down and it probably wasn't seconds, 160 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:01,679 Speaker 10: thirty seconds, forty five. 161 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:02,079 Speaker 4: I'm out. 162 00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:06,079 Speaker 10: I didn't count boom, small caliber gun. He won a 163 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 10: big caliber and all of a sudden, the few sects 164 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:11,600 Speaker 10: are a boom. About the second time I say it, Ben, 165 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 10: that was. 166 00:11:13,160 --> 00:11:22,000 Speaker 2: A gun, he remembers, turning to the coworker he was 167 00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:22,920 Speaker 2: sharing a room with. 168 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:27,280 Speaker 10: I said, you hear that? He says, yeah. So I 169 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 10: stood up and opened the blind to get my eyes 170 00:11:30,080 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 10: fixed because it was dark. Then it had the lights 171 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 10: in the. 172 00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:36,720 Speaker 2: Last one directly beneath his window, Cummings sees a four 173 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 2: door car. It's dark copper or light brown with the 174 00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:45,680 Speaker 2: vinyl top, parked facing the hotel's back double doors. He 175 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 2: sees a tall person get into the driver's side of 176 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:52,960 Speaker 2: the car, close the door, and slowly pull away with 177 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 2: the headlights off. 178 00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 10: And so I called down to the front desk. I said, hey, 179 00:11:57,040 --> 00:11:58,000 Speaker 10: there's been shots fired. 180 00:11:58,000 --> 00:11:58,200 Speaker 8: I heard. 181 00:11:58,280 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 10: Did you hear that? 182 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:01,800 Speaker 9: I believe I got a phone call from someone in 183 00:12:01,840 --> 00:12:03,079 Speaker 9: the room saying they heard. 184 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:07,640 Speaker 2: Gunshots, So Barry makes that initial nine to one one call, 185 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 2: hangs up and decides to investigate it. 186 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 9: Jumped over the counter to walk back, and I was 187 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:14,600 Speaker 9: walked back. 188 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:16,400 Speaker 4: I saw Offsta Hardy's radio. 189 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:20,960 Speaker 2: Barry sees Deputy Hardy's radio on a table in the 190 00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 2: hotel's atrium, and right next to it his cigarette still 191 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:34,880 Speaker 2: burning in an ash tray. Meanwhile, back on the fourth floor, 192 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:38,160 Speaker 2: Marshall Kelly Cummings hangs up the phone with Barry and 193 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:39,439 Speaker 2: goes back to the window. 194 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 10: And I kept looking, and I kept looking. Finally my 195 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 10: eyes got where I could see, and I looked down. 196 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 10: I could see him laying on the ground. I went, oh, no, 197 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 10: this ain't good. 198 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:54,600 Speaker 2: Cummings spots a body on the ground and realizes someone 199 00:12:54,679 --> 00:12:58,439 Speaker 2: has been badly hurt. It's right around this time Barry 200 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:01,040 Speaker 2: makes the same tearable discovery. 201 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:03,840 Speaker 9: There's a hallway that went to the door that went 202 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 9: back out to the back parking lot. As I turned 203 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:09,439 Speaker 9: the corner to go down that hallway and I looked 204 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 9: out the door in the distance, I saw Offsta Hardy. 205 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 4: On the ground. That's when I ran back to the front. 206 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:25,720 Speaker 9: Desk made an emergency phone call to the police. 207 00:13:25,640 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 12: Just man the Supirital crowds to phys. 208 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 8: Colia and I have a pit. What appears to be a. 209 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:33,840 Speaker 12: Jumped the county police officer shot. 210 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:34,559 Speaker 8: In the back of our building. 211 00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 12: She ends not moving. People in a car drove away 212 00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:44,160 Speaker 12: and he's lying on the on the pavement. I'm a 213 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 12: little fraid to go up. Yes, he is a Birmingham 214 00:13:47,520 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 12: Police out Jefferson County. 215 00:13:49,240 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 8: He is a hired night time security for us. 216 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 12: Hi, do you know if you can sign anything? 217 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 8: Like if it's breeze? I K and how much blood? 218 00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:00,760 Speaker 12: I'm trying, man, my, my, my promise. 219 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:02,320 Speaker 8: I don't know if the people are still out there. 220 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 12: Okay, we we should be that Charlotte you I'm gonna 221 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:06,719 Speaker 12: go back. 222 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:07,520 Speaker 8: Okay, thank you. 223 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:15,240 Speaker 12: Got Jess Ketty deputy has been shot on the back 224 00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:19,040 Speaker 12: entrance of the hotel Crown Show the suite and is. 225 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 5: One of us and we are they have got one 226 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:22,640 Speaker 5: down who has been shot. 227 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:27,400 Speaker 12: And they said it looks gad, it looks too bad. 228 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:32,200 Speaker 12: Three three two Do we have any information? Do we 229 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 12: have anything on a suspect to know anything? 230 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 2: After he makes the second nine to one one call, 231 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:56,520 Speaker 2: Barry walks down the hallway to the back parking lot. 232 00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:00,240 Speaker 9: And then I went back out the office. Already he 233 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:03,080 Speaker 9: was not a good condition. He did have a wound 234 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 9: to his face. He was making a gurgling, gasping noise. 235 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 9: You know, he was not conscious. I believe I took 236 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:16,080 Speaker 9: my jacket off, my uniform jacket off, to try to 237 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 9: cover him, or put under his head, or try to 238 00:15:18,080 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 9: comfort him. But fortunately officers arrived so quickly, and I 239 00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 9: was removed from that area immediately. 240 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:32,760 Speaker 2: More than a dozen officers from four different agencies arrive 241 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 2: at the hotel. One of them is Detective Tony Richardson, 242 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 2: who says he'd known Deputy Hardy since he first started 243 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:44,640 Speaker 2: working for the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office in nineteen seventy eight. 244 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 5: Being black and bo being black, naturally I noticed him. 245 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 5: I was told more than once to get a haircut. 246 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 5: That you know, to be a deputy shaff you got 247 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:01,360 Speaker 5: to have your haircut. So the reason I mentioned that 248 00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 5: is because from the first day that I ever saw him, 249 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:06,760 Speaker 5: his hair was out. 250 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:09,840 Speaker 1: To hear big afro, big afro. 251 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 11: And he would put on his hat. 252 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:17,520 Speaker 5: He wore that hat religiously. Everybody else as the Sheriff's 253 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:19,960 Speaker 5: office hated those hats. They didn't want to wear him, 254 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 5: you know, But he always wore his hat. 255 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:28,040 Speaker 2: Deputy Hardy often wore his traditional broad brimmed tan smoky 256 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:32,000 Speaker 2: the bear style sheriff's hat. It was later entered as 257 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 2: evidence from the crime scene with a bullet hole through 258 00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 2: the brim. 259 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:38,960 Speaker 5: And he would have it on his head and all 260 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,280 Speaker 5: that hair would be on the side would be out here, 261 00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:44,320 Speaker 5: and I'm like, who is this guy? How can he 262 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:47,480 Speaker 5: get away with that? And not only that, he is 263 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:51,160 Speaker 5: in the sheriff's office. How can he get away with that? 264 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 5: So I was in treat by him, fascinated by him, 265 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:58,760 Speaker 5: but I was scared of him. I was scared to 266 00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:02,080 Speaker 5: meet him because I thought, of my mind, this guy's 267 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:04,879 Speaker 5: got to be crazy, you know who to do that 268 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:05,800 Speaker 5: and get away with it. 269 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:06,600 Speaker 13: He's got to be greaty. 270 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:07,680 Speaker 11: I would scatter of him. 271 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 5: But anyway, when I first met him, I met him 272 00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 5: and talked to him. He started to feel better about well. 273 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 5: I started to feel better about him. 274 00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:19,040 Speaker 4: We were never. 275 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:21,840 Speaker 5: Just busom buddies real close, but we were close and 276 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:23,040 Speaker 5: we knew each other. 277 00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:27,680 Speaker 2: Tony Richardson and Bill Hardy had been colleagues at the 278 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 2: Jefferson County Sheriff's office for seventeen years. Richardson remembers the 279 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:36,160 Speaker 2: last time he saw Hardy alive. 280 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:41,680 Speaker 5: The last day I saw Bill, my brother and I. 281 00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:44,960 Speaker 5: My brother would put a sheriff's office offso and we 282 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 5: were standing there smoking and Bill drove out the alley 283 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:52,600 Speaker 5: and he was pulling up twenty second and he stopped 284 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:55,640 Speaker 5: in the road and he started to talk to us, 285 00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 5: and he said, hey, guys, hang out doing loan with 286 00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:00,840 Speaker 5: some money. It's just you know, stuff like that. And 287 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:02,639 Speaker 5: we laughed and talked for a minute. And that was 288 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 5: the last time I saw him. And the next time 289 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:06,439 Speaker 5: I heard Bill's name was about two o'clock in the 290 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 5: morning when I got the call saying that he had 291 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:15,159 Speaker 5: been shot. At that time, I was what was considered 292 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:21,880 Speaker 5: a Crimes against Persons detective, which meant that I worked homicides. 293 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 5: The lieutenant felt like because it involved a deputy sheriff, 294 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:30,639 Speaker 5: and you know that we needed all the help that 295 00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 5: we could get. So I got called out. 296 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:35,240 Speaker 2: Did you go to the actual scene? 297 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 4: Yeah? 298 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: What did you encounter when you got there? 299 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:46,120 Speaker 5: Well, by the time I got there, Bill's body was gone. 300 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,879 Speaker 2: Paramedics had already lifted Bill Hardy into an ambulance and 301 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:54,800 Speaker 2: rushed him to the emergency room of Birmingham's largest hospital. 302 00:18:55,680 --> 00:18:59,360 Speaker 2: He is gravely injured with two gunshot wounds to. 303 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:01,080 Speaker 1: His head and jaw. 304 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 2: A medical examiner notes a bullet wound to Hardy's finger 305 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 2: likely means he raised his hand in a defensive posture 306 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:13,800 Speaker 2: when he was shot. Police go to his house to 307 00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:17,359 Speaker 2: tell his wife, Patricia Diane Hardy, and bring her to 308 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:21,640 Speaker 2: the hospital. Jim Woodward, the chief deputy in Jefferson County, 309 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 2: also rushes over when he hears that Hardy was shot. 310 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:28,120 Speaker 1: What do you remember about the incident? 311 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:32,119 Speaker 14: I got the call that Hardy had been shot, and 312 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 14: they told me said looked very serious. So I got 313 00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:40,639 Speaker 14: in my car and went down to the hospital. I 314 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:43,120 Speaker 14: stood there while they were operating on him, and then 315 00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:47,199 Speaker 14: I just heard one say that's it. It's over. We 316 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 14: can't do anymore. 317 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:48,919 Speaker 4: It's over. 318 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 14: We can't save him. He's gone. 319 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:55,159 Speaker 2: What does that feel like when you are a career 320 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:56,640 Speaker 2: law enforcement officer in. 321 00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 14: Well, it's kind of devastating to you. You know, you 322 00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:04,320 Speaker 14: get to know these guys and I knew Hardy. Well, 323 00:20:05,080 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 14: that's a very devastating thing that happen to you. 324 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:13,679 Speaker 2: Deputy Bill Hardy is pronounced dead seven hours after he 325 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 2: was shot. The cause of death is two gunshot wounds 326 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:24,640 Speaker 2: fired at close range. I wanted to know more about 327 00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 2: Deputy Hardy, so I wrote to several family members inviting 328 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:33,240 Speaker 2: them to talk. They never responded, and I can only 329 00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 2: imagine his murder must be one of the hardest things 330 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,919 Speaker 2: they've ever experienced. But I have learned a few things 331 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:45,199 Speaker 2: about Deputy Hardy. He was married to Patricia Diane Hardy. 332 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 2: He had two children and four adult step children. Hardy 333 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:54,439 Speaker 2: started working as a deputy in nineteen seventy two. His 334 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 2: duties included delivering subpoenas and directing traffic outside the courthouse. 335 00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:03,160 Speaker 5: You know. 336 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:12,160 Speaker 3: It was rough. It was rough. It's rough right now. 337 00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 5: It's a rough right This many well working homicide I 338 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:25,359 Speaker 5: worked at bunch, but none of them affected me like 339 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 5: the killing of a deputy Shaff. You know, you have 340 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:33,640 Speaker 5: a bond with the guys you work with in the uniform. 341 00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 5: Whether you know 'em or not, you have a bond. 342 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:44,320 Speaker 5: So when I was a deputy Share working another deputy 343 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:46,600 Speaker 5: Share it's murdered, do you think that was emotional? Yes? 344 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:52,680 Speaker 13: It was mm very and had it been my decision 345 00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:56,760 Speaker 13: the day we caught the people that did it. Let's 346 00:21:56,840 --> 00:21:58,160 Speaker 13: let's put 'em on death throat. 347 00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:08,239 Speaker 2: Lead Detective Tony Richardson and his team of investigators have 348 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:12,160 Speaker 2: no eyewitnesses to the shooting, and there's no known motive. 349 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:16,320 Speaker 2: A fellow officer has just been shot, and they have 350 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:30,399 Speaker 2: almost no evidence to go on. At the exact time 351 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:34,199 Speaker 2: that Deputy Bill Hardy was shot to Forrest Johnson and 352 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:37,639 Speaker 2: his friend Ardregis Ford were four miles away from the 353 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:41,639 Speaker 2: crime scene at a downtown Birmingham nightclub called Tea's Place, 354 00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 2: but they would soon become the focus of Tony Richardson's investigation. 355 00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:07,879 Speaker 2: Just a few hours before Deputy Hardy is shot ar 356 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:11,680 Speaker 2: dragas Ford gets into the passenger side of his nineteen 357 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:16,280 Speaker 2: seventy one black Monte Carlo. It's an old car and 358 00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:19,960 Speaker 2: the driver's side door doesn't open, so he slides over 359 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 2: into the driver's seat, starts the ignition, and heads out 360 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:26,520 Speaker 2: to pick up his friend to Forrest Johnson to go 361 00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:31,560 Speaker 2: to a club called Teas Place. I wasn't able to 362 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:36,200 Speaker 2: interview to Forest or Ardregas for this podcast. The Alabama 363 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:39,520 Speaker 2: Department of Corrections doesn't allow people on death road to 364 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 2: do interviews with reporters like me. So I was unable 365 00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:47,639 Speaker 2: to talk to Forrest directly. And ar Dragas died in 366 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, I didn't get a chance to interview 367 00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:55,639 Speaker 2: him before then. I was able to speak to Ardregas's mother, 368 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 2: Joyce Ford. 369 00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:02,199 Speaker 15: That particular night said they was going to teas and 370 00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:05,440 Speaker 15: see he would go to Tease every Tuesday and he 371 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:09,480 Speaker 15: have his particular same parking space and everything because he 372 00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:11,280 Speaker 15: would give them good tips. 373 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,920 Speaker 2: Ardregas was willing to pay for a good parking space 374 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:19,679 Speaker 2: because he was in a wheelchair. When Ardregas was a teenager, 375 00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:23,520 Speaker 2: a group of men began shooting outside an apartment building 376 00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:27,399 Speaker 2: he was visiting. He was shot trying to shield his 377 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:29,800 Speaker 2: cousin and her baby from gunfire. 378 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,840 Speaker 15: My son when he got shot when he was fifteen, 379 00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:36,840 Speaker 15: I had just gotten off from work. I was tied 380 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 15: in the phone, rang Rang Rang. I didn't answer the phone, 381 00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 15: you know, and I finally answered it and they stated 382 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:48,679 Speaker 15: that he had gotten shot. I need to rush to 383 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:53,280 Speaker 15: the murgency room. That was like a dream, you know. 384 00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:56,960 Speaker 15: You hear about things happening to other people, but when 385 00:24:57,040 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 15: it hit home, you know, and then he got spinal 386 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 15: cord injury. He got shot in the back. Yeah, and 387 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:10,800 Speaker 15: he was paralyzed realize from chest down T four they 388 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:14,400 Speaker 15: called it. So that was like a nightmare. 389 00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:20,400 Speaker 2: In his early twenties, ar Dragus outfitted his Monte Carlo 390 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,800 Speaker 2: with the makeshift system so he could throw his wheelchair 391 00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:26,639 Speaker 2: in the back and drive the car using just his 392 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:27,920 Speaker 2: upper body. 393 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 15: He would cut a broom you know, the broomsticks. He 394 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,919 Speaker 15: would put have one to the brakes, one to the salator, 395 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:40,240 Speaker 15: and he would tape it to the car. He would 396 00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:40,879 Speaker 15: tape it to it. 397 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 6: So he like retro fitted his Yeah. 398 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:44,640 Speaker 5: He did. Did. 399 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:49,480 Speaker 15: He didn't buy the regular equipment that he should have used. 400 00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:53,399 Speaker 2: Ar Dragas and to Forest actually came up with this 401 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:57,560 Speaker 2: idea together. Here's to Forrest's cousin, Antonio. 402 00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:00,400 Speaker 16: Green Draga's was. I guess that was a prime thing. 403 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,159 Speaker 16: He didn't want that handicap accessible pedals and stuff in 404 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,520 Speaker 16: his car. But as far as coming up with this great, 405 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 16: this genius idea where they're gonna well some metal rods 406 00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 16: to the break and accelerator pedal so he could use 407 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 16: his hands and dry, well, he get to thinking about 408 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,920 Speaker 16: this thing and metal rods well, did from the brake 409 00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:24,080 Speaker 16: pedal or the accelerator. That's not too good of an 410 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,560 Speaker 16: idea in case you get in the accident. He hate 411 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,560 Speaker 16: to see Draga's impaled through the seat right here. So 412 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 16: he goes and buys two brooms out of the little 413 00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:39,720 Speaker 16: dollar store wherever, And no measurements, no, just nothing precise 414 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:42,359 Speaker 16: about it. He just gets the broom and breaks them 415 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:47,000 Speaker 16: and duct tape the sticks, one to the accelerated pedal 416 00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,600 Speaker 16: and one to the brake pedal so Dragus could drive 417 00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:51,080 Speaker 16: his car. 418 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,359 Speaker 6: Could he get around? Well, I mean did he drive real? 419 00:26:55,480 --> 00:27:02,560 Speaker 15: Well? 420 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:05,200 Speaker 2: It's been a while since to Forest and Ardregas have 421 00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:09,240 Speaker 2: hung out because to Forest had recently gotten out of prison. 422 00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:13,439 Speaker 2: He was arrested for driving with a suspended license, and 423 00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 2: as officers padded him down at the city jail, he 424 00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:21,800 Speaker 2: tossed something into a nearby trash can. Officers reached into 425 00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:25,960 Speaker 2: the can and found a plastic bag of cocaine. To 426 00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:30,720 Speaker 2: Forest ended up pleading guilty to drug possession. To Forest 427 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 2: served about a year in prison, and by the night 428 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,720 Speaker 2: of Hardy's murder, he'd been out about three months. To 429 00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:41,159 Speaker 2: Forest puts on jean shorts and a Tommy Hill figure 430 00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:44,640 Speaker 2: blue and white shirt, then gets into the passenger side 431 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 2: of Ardregas's car and they head downtown. They pull up 432 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:53,159 Speaker 2: and park outside Tea's Place, but it's too early to 433 00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:55,760 Speaker 2: go inside, so they hang out in the parking lot 434 00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:58,879 Speaker 2: flirting with some girls who work at the car dealership 435 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,200 Speaker 2: across the street. To Forrest buys a hot dog from 436 00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 2: a cart on the sidewalk. Regulars start trickling into the club, drinking, 437 00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:14,360 Speaker 2: dancing and catching up inside. There's something music low lighting. 438 00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:19,120 Speaker 2: It's Tasty Tuesday at Teas Place, which means women get 439 00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:19,600 Speaker 2: in free. 440 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:26,959 Speaker 7: I used to go to Teas Tuesday, Thursday, Friday, and Saturday. 441 00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:30,000 Speaker 2: Barbetta Hunt was one of the regulars who was there 442 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 2: that night. 443 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:34,280 Speaker 1: What was your nickname back then? 444 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:35,560 Speaker 11: Mama Cat. 445 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 2: That's like in the world of nicknames, that's the best n. 446 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:44,280 Speaker 7: My mother, it's the purpose and my father, Fred Perkins. 447 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:46,200 Speaker 7: They gave me that name when I was born. But 448 00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:48,120 Speaker 7: that's Monday. My name is Mama Cat. 449 00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 2: When she was in her early twenties, Mama Cat spent 450 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 2: a lot of nights hanging out at Teas Place. 451 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,440 Speaker 7: When you walk into the door, that's my spot right there. 452 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 7: It's on the right hand side. Every time I got 453 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,360 Speaker 7: that was my spot. I don't move from this spot. 454 00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:06,760 Speaker 7: I don't walk to the bag. I don't walk there. 455 00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:10,200 Speaker 7: I say right there. Me and my friend Velinici Aqui Sanders, 456 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:10,880 Speaker 7: we were together. 457 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 17: We got there before eleven because the club was always 458 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:18,160 Speaker 17: free on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday before eleven for women. 459 00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:22,200 Speaker 2: This is Belanique Sanders nicknamed Queisi. 460 00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,480 Speaker 17: Anything after eleven it was five dollars and me and 461 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 17: Barbetta was very cheap, so we tried to make sure 462 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 17: we got there in free because the little money we 463 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 17: had said we wanted to buy something to eat, and 464 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:36,240 Speaker 17: I love to get a chicken plate from there, a 465 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:37,920 Speaker 17: chicken breast with some French fries. 466 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 1: Oh my god, did you know Trafforst Johnson? 467 00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:42,960 Speaker 11: Yes? 468 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:43,440 Speaker 15: I did. 469 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,240 Speaker 17: I knew him from hanging out in the neighborhood in 470 00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:49,640 Speaker 17: Nsley and I, oh my god, I had a crush 471 00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 17: on him. 472 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,920 Speaker 11: He was the finest. Yeah. 473 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 2: What do you remember about what he looked like? 474 00:29:56,520 --> 00:30:02,480 Speaker 17: He was short, hmm, a nice body, Oh my god. Anyway, 475 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:07,920 Speaker 17: he was a ladies man. I will say that, sweet, 476 00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:12,280 Speaker 17: always kind. He was just a nice gentleman like his 477 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 17: mama had raised him really well. 478 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:16,760 Speaker 2: Did you guys ever go out or did he know 479 00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,240 Speaker 2: that you had a crush on him? 480 00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:20,960 Speaker 17: He knew I had a crush on him, but we 481 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:24,720 Speaker 17: never went out. No, we would just see each other. 482 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 17: I smiled, be like, Oh that he is, I'm gonna 483 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:27,200 Speaker 17: get him. 484 00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:30,040 Speaker 11: Yeah, that's it. 485 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 2: To Forest mostly grew up in Birmingham's Pratt City neighborhood, 486 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:37,960 Speaker 2: or Pratt for short. 487 00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 16: We grew up together, I mean closer than just cousins. 488 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:44,720 Speaker 16: We were like brothers because we were all pretty much 489 00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:47,480 Speaker 16: raised right in the same little local community. 490 00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,600 Speaker 2: While to Forest was growing up, most of his extended 491 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:55,720 Speaker 2: family also lived in or near Pratt, including his cousin 492 00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:56,800 Speaker 2: Antonio Green. 493 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 16: And Uh, since we were todd I mean babies, we 494 00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,320 Speaker 16: were kind of together, took out in this thing, and 495 00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:06,720 Speaker 16: he was a couple of years younger than I am, 496 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,360 Speaker 16: so he always kind of held on to my shirt 497 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 16: tail and you know, so I've been closely connected with 498 00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:15,240 Speaker 16: him for our entire life. 499 00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:15,840 Speaker 4: Pretty much. 500 00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:20,440 Speaker 2: To Forest's mom, Donna, was seventeen when she had him, 501 00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 2: and when to Forest was young, she was more like 502 00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 2: a sister to him than a mother. Donna leaned on 503 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 2: her parents and siblings to help take care of to Forest, 504 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:33,640 Speaker 2: and as to Forrest got older, she leaned on him 505 00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:35,520 Speaker 2: to help take care of his little brother. 506 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:40,160 Speaker 16: He started at a very young age, much too young 507 00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 16: to really be faced with the type of responsibility that 508 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,560 Speaker 16: he took on. He was at an age where he 509 00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 16: was still a kid. I'm talking about eleven twelve, you know, 510 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,640 Speaker 16: just in their teen years, and had to take on 511 00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:56,520 Speaker 16: the responsibility of taking care of his little brother. You know, 512 00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,000 Speaker 16: he had a little brother that he got ready for 513 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:03,480 Speaker 16: school and his clothes he did. You know, He's always 514 00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 16: been that caring little dude, you know, and he did that. 515 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:10,120 Speaker 16: So he had to take on some things during that time. 516 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:12,360 Speaker 16: You know, his mom and dad was dead, but his 517 00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,720 Speaker 16: dad was a very very heavy drinker. 518 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:20,200 Speaker 2: To Forest's father, Ronald, was an alcoholic and would get 519 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 2: violent when he drank, which was every day. This made 520 00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:28,560 Speaker 2: home life extremely volatile for to Forrest, his younger brother, 521 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:34,080 Speaker 2: little ron and especially his mother, Donna. She eventually left 522 00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,200 Speaker 2: Ronald when to Forest was a teenager and moved in 523 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:40,160 Speaker 2: with another man who had an apartment in the Tuxedo 524 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:45,440 Speaker 2: Projects in Birmingham's Insley community, also known as the Brickyard. 525 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 4: Oh. 526 00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,040 Speaker 11: It was called the Brickyard. 527 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:53,400 Speaker 2: Velinique aka Queasi, the one who had a crush on 528 00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:55,560 Speaker 2: to Forest, also grew up there. 529 00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:59,480 Speaker 11: It was rough. I did you know My mom had 530 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:00,160 Speaker 11: three girls. 531 00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:02,720 Speaker 17: My had three and we lived in a five bedroom 532 00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:07,240 Speaker 17: project with our grandparents, So it was just a bunch 533 00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:09,200 Speaker 17: of girls in the house. But I mean, you know, 534 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 17: I had just seen people get killed right in front 535 00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:15,960 Speaker 17: of me. My cousin got shot in the stummy. You know, 536 00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:17,320 Speaker 17: a lot of. 537 00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 11: It was rough. 538 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:22,920 Speaker 17: You had family's daddy couldn't afford to eat. You know, 539 00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:27,320 Speaker 17: kids come to school, you know, wearing the same clothes 540 00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:28,000 Speaker 17: over and over. 541 00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,320 Speaker 11: It was rough. It was rough growing up in the projects. 542 00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:35,120 Speaker 2: To Forest and his little brother moved there when to 543 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:39,280 Speaker 2: Forest was sixteen. When he was seventeen, to Forrest was 544 00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:42,200 Speaker 2: shot and a drive by shooting and spent three months 545 00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,080 Speaker 2: in the hospital. To Forest's mom told me the bullet 546 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:52,560 Speaker 2: is still lodged in his chest. During this period, seven 547 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:57,000 Speaker 2: of to Forest's friends would be shot and killed. No 548 00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:01,000 Speaker 2: one was ever prosecuted for any of these crimes, and 549 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:02,520 Speaker 2: it was around this time that. 550 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:04,160 Speaker 1: To Forest dropped out of school. 551 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,480 Speaker 2: Several family members tell me that at twenty two, to 552 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:17,000 Speaker 2: Forest was somewhat adrift. He spent his time working on 553 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:20,799 Speaker 2: old cars and playing video games. He was having a 554 00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:26,000 Speaker 2: good time dating different women. He had five children who 555 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 2: he loved, but he was also unsettled. He hadn't yet 556 00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:35,080 Speaker 2: figured out his purpose, and he didn't know he was 557 00:34:35,200 --> 00:35:05,879 Speaker 2: running out of time. As to Forrest and Ardregas wait 558 00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:09,880 Speaker 2: outside of Teas, Ardregas's beeper goes off a few times. 559 00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:12,960 Speaker 2: The beeps are from a girl he met a few 560 00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:16,720 Speaker 2: nights before, but he ignores her, hoping to meet someone 561 00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:21,560 Speaker 2: else inside. Tees to Forrest walks toward the club's entrance 562 00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:26,240 Speaker 2: behind Ardregas and his wheelchair. They're focused on meeting girls 563 00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:30,160 Speaker 2: and having a good time. They don't know that this 564 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:33,439 Speaker 2: night will change their lives, and the people they run 565 00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:37,040 Speaker 2: into don't know they're about to become alibi witnesses. 566 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,280 Speaker 18: There was a love before eleven, and we were standing 567 00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 18: outside and they came up as far as its pushing 568 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:46,960 Speaker 18: to Draga's. 569 00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:51,360 Speaker 2: One of the first people they run into is Kenyara Pickett, 570 00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:53,120 Speaker 2: who was standing near the entrance. 571 00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,120 Speaker 18: I remember exactly where I was standing, right in front 572 00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,560 Speaker 18: of the club when he walked up, because I thought 573 00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:02,760 Speaker 18: I was shouting night out, you know, back in the days. 574 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:05,319 Speaker 11: It was TSC wearing big clothes back then, and. 575 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:08,800 Speaker 18: I had on some black, some black big jeans but shorts, 576 00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,560 Speaker 18: and I had on some black and white rebox and 577 00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:13,440 Speaker 18: then I think I had on the button down shut 578 00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:16,160 Speaker 18: my sister she had just got out of the hospital. 579 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:18,359 Speaker 18: She had a blood clot and I when she got 580 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:20,120 Speaker 18: out to the hospital, we just went down and you know, 581 00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:20,920 Speaker 18: to celebrate that. 582 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:25,000 Speaker 2: She came home to Forrest and Ardregas make their way 583 00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:29,160 Speaker 2: past Kenara and go into Tea's. Mama Cat and Belanik 584 00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 2: are already inside, perched at their table right by the 585 00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:33,120 Speaker 2: front door. 586 00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 7: Tavarras Johnson, I remember he was pushing a Dreka's four 587 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:38,320 Speaker 7: in the wheelchair. 588 00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:39,120 Speaker 11: They came together. 589 00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 17: I had saw Toofar was pushing a Draca's in the 590 00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,960 Speaker 17: club because we always standing at the front by the 591 00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:49,560 Speaker 17: door so we can be nosy and see everything. 592 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:52,359 Speaker 2: You wanted to see who was coming in and who 593 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:53,479 Speaker 2: was leaving with who? 594 00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:57,560 Speaker 11: Yes, yes, ma'am a boy. 595 00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:01,360 Speaker 19: Eleven o'clock I saw Tafarest come and pushing Anddraga's in 596 00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:03,279 Speaker 19: and I was excited to see him because I hadn't 597 00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:04,960 Speaker 19: seen him in a year, because I had just got 598 00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:06,480 Speaker 19: out the military. 599 00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:09,799 Speaker 2: Stanley Chandler is also at Tease that night to catch 600 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 2: up with friends. He and to Forrest knew each other 601 00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:14,080 Speaker 2: as kids and Pratt. 602 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:17,560 Speaker 19: So we stood there and we start we talked, you 603 00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:21,040 Speaker 19: know about old times, you know, and I mean we joked, 604 00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:21,680 Speaker 19: laying and. 605 00:37:21,719 --> 00:37:26,000 Speaker 2: Laugh to Forrest and Ardregas settle in at a table 606 00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:30,240 Speaker 2: chatting with people who stopped by watching the dance floor. 607 00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:35,560 Speaker 20: I was sitting on the balcony because when you go around, 608 00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:38,600 Speaker 20: it's like a little balcony part that you could sit at. 609 00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:41,640 Speaker 20: And so I seen Draca's in too far ast when 610 00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:43,319 Speaker 20: they came in the door, because he was pushing them 611 00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:44,000 Speaker 20: in a wheelchair. 612 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:48,359 Speaker 2: This is Dedra Carter, who was celebrating getting released from 613 00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:53,160 Speaker 2: the hospital with her sister Kenyara. Dedra was also at 614 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:54,200 Speaker 2: Tease that night. 615 00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:58,759 Speaker 20: And him and my cousin Mona and my sister, all 616 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,520 Speaker 20: of us was just there talking. And you know, I 617 00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:04,920 Speaker 20: think Toofars liked at Mona, so you know, he was 618 00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:06,560 Speaker 20: trying to hook up with him, but she wouldn't. 619 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:08,879 Speaker 11: No, she wouldn't never hook up with him. 620 00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 20: We used to laugh, talk joking, like even we at 621 00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:14,759 Speaker 20: the club music playing, We're still cracking up, you know, 622 00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:16,760 Speaker 20: you know, just talking and stuff. 623 00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:21,239 Speaker 2: To Forrest SIPs along island iced tea and orders our 624 00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:24,720 Speaker 2: Dragas a brandy and coke. At one point, to Forrest 625 00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:27,720 Speaker 2: goes back to the bar because Dragas says his drink 626 00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,800 Speaker 2: is too weak, and the bartender makes him a new one. 627 00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:34,359 Speaker 2: They linger at the club into the early hours of 628 00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:35,240 Speaker 2: Wednesday morning. 629 00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:38,439 Speaker 20: When I said we would probably ship the club now 630 00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:42,359 Speaker 20: we was there, I know, to probably like they used 631 00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:46,839 Speaker 20: to close about maybe one two o'clock, so we would 632 00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:48,840 Speaker 20: leave right right before that, so I know it was 633 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:50,040 Speaker 20: like maybe one. 634 00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:53,040 Speaker 19: I ain't up leaving a club roughly about I'm gonna 635 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:55,680 Speaker 19: say around about right at one. And like I said, 636 00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:58,279 Speaker 19: he was standing across the club, you know, you could 637 00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:02,120 Speaker 19: see him because it wasn't a big, big club, you know, 638 00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:05,399 Speaker 19: And I just started to do signs up and I. 639 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:07,480 Speaker 15: Left and he was still there. 640 00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:09,000 Speaker 19: Yeah, you stayed there when I left. 641 00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:17,239 Speaker 2: There are at least ten people who say they saw 642 00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:21,400 Speaker 2: to Forrest and Ardregas at Tea's place between eleven PM 643 00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:25,960 Speaker 2: and one thirty am. Deputy Bill Hardy was shot right 644 00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:30,279 Speaker 2: in the middle of that time frame, around twelve fifty am, 645 00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:35,720 Speaker 2: four miles away at the Crown Sterling Suites Hotel. People 646 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:43,279 Speaker 2: like Kenyara, Dedra Stanley, Queisi, Mama Cat all remember that night. 647 00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:50,240 Speaker 2: Their corroborated statements weave together a shield. That shield should 648 00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:54,319 Speaker 2: protect to Forest and Ardregas from the accusations about to 649 00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:59,200 Speaker 2: head their way. But it doesn't. The state would arrest 650 00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:03,600 Speaker 2: to Forest and Ardregis, try them and seek the death 651 00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:13,239 Speaker 2: penalty against both of them for Deputy Hardy's murder. For 652 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:16,600 Speaker 2: the last three years, I've been trying to figure out. 653 00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:17,440 Speaker 1: How this happened. 654 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:22,839 Speaker 2: I've read through thousands of pages of court transcripts and 655 00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:27,080 Speaker 2: investigative documents. I've done a full audit of all the 656 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:31,960 Speaker 2: media coverage and interviewed more than eighty people, including several 657 00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:37,000 Speaker 2: who were directly involved in this investigation and prosecution, and 658 00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:42,279 Speaker 2: many who have never spoken publicly about the case. I'm 659 00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:46,080 Speaker 2: not trying to find the real killer of Deputy Hardy. 660 00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:52,200 Speaker 2: I'm investigating why that person was never found. One of 661 00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:55,799 Speaker 2: the first things I tried to unwind, how did to 662 00:40:55,960 --> 00:40:59,760 Speaker 2: Forrest Johnson and ardregus Ford end up at the center 663 00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:03,479 Speaker 2: of the investigation when they were somewhere else at the time. 664 00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:09,560 Speaker 2: Deputy Hardy was killed. Here's one thing everyone agrees on. 665 00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:15,040 Speaker 2: After they leave Tea's place to Forrest and Ardregas pick 666 00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:17,520 Speaker 2: up two girls and the Monte Carlo. 667 00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:19,160 Speaker 1: One sits in the. 668 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:23,759 Speaker 2: Back by Ardregas's wheelchair, the other one sits between Ardregas 669 00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:27,440 Speaker 2: and to Forest in the front. And that girl the 670 00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:31,600 Speaker 2: one in the front seat. What she tells police will 671 00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:35,319 Speaker 2: land to Forest and Ardregas right at the center of 672 00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:36,200 Speaker 2: the investigation. 673 00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:46,719 Speaker 5: I'm at the Shriff's office headquarters along with Yolanda Michelle Chambers. 674 00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:50,400 Speaker 5: Yolanda is a black female. 675 00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:52,120 Speaker 18: She's fifteen years of age. 676 00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:54,160 Speaker 1: That's next time. 677 00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:04,000 Speaker 2: Ear Witness is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts 678 00:42:04,239 --> 00:42:09,239 Speaker 2: in association with Signal Company Number One. Executive producers are 679 00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:14,200 Speaker 2: Jason Flom, Jeff Kempler, Kevin Wardis, and me Beth Shelburn. 680 00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:17,880 Speaker 2: The investigative reporting for this series was done by Me 681 00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:23,799 Speaker 2: and Mara McNamara. Producers are MARAA. McNamara, Hannah Beal, and 682 00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:29,799 Speaker 2: Jackie Pauley. Kara Kornhaber is our senior producer. Britt Spangler 683 00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:34,520 Speaker 2: is our sound designer. Additional story editing from Marie Sutton, 684 00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:39,840 Speaker 2: fact check help from Katherine Newhan, and special thanks to 685 00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:44,360 Speaker 2: to Forrest Johnson's legal defense team. You can follow the 686 00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:50,000 Speaker 2: show on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, and Twitter at Lava for Good. 687 00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:53,480 Speaker 2: To see behind the scenes content from our investigation, visit 688 00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:56,960 Speaker 2: Lava for Good dot com. Slash earwitness 689 00:43:04,040 --> 00:43:04,680 Speaker 4: To the