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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. R Kelly. Okay, I guess

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Speaker 1: he's jealous. Shawn comes Diddy is getting all the attention

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Speaker 1: in the last days. Another wrinkle, let me say a

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Speaker 1: bizarre wrinkle in the R. Kelly sex trafficking prosecution. R Kelly,

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Speaker 1: a renowned R and B singer, multi millionaire, just can't

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Speaker 1: keep his yap shut. Kenny. I'm Nancy Grace. This is

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Speaker 1: Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 1: The I Believe I Can fly hit Maker is behind bars. Yes,

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Speaker 1: he's in the can serving a thirty one year sentence

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Speaker 1: for child sex abuse crimes. You heard me right, child

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Speaker 1: sex abuse crimes. He hears about Seawan Combe's aka Diddy

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Speaker 1: getting all the attention, and now he has demanded that

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Speaker 1: he be set free and wants quote house arrest, citing

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Speaker 1: fears for his safety and claims there is a murder

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Speaker 1: plot orchestrated against him by fellow inmates. Oh, I hate

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Speaker 1: when that happens. When you get convicted on multiple counts

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Speaker 1: of child sex abuse and sex trafficking and you get

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Speaker 1: thrown behind bars and the other inmates don't like you. Wow,

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Speaker 1: I wonder why, hmmm, what do we know? With me

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Speaker 1: right now is a very special guest, Lisa Van Allen.

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Speaker 1: I met in just her poise and her emotion. Her

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Speaker 1: recounting her time with R. Kelly, the music superstar, nearly

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Speaker 1: broke my heart. Lisa, a father and mother of a girl,

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Speaker 1: say their daughter was ninety pounds and looked like a

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Speaker 1: prisoner after she returned from the singer's tour bus and

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Speaker 1: screamed quote like a mad woman at the mention of R.

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Speaker 1: Kelly's name. Now, these quote rumors have been swirling for years,

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Speaker 1: and I recall when R Kelly was prosecuted. I mean

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Speaker 1: it took a darn videotape being sent to the prosecutor's office.

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Speaker 1: I guess the word of the victims wasn't enough, so

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Speaker 1: they go forward with a video of R. Kelly not

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Speaker 1: only having sex with a minor that's called tuttory rape

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Speaker 1: according to the prosecution, but urinating on her and in

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Speaker 1: her mouth. Okay, the jury acquitted him, claiming that they

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Speaker 1: didn't know if the girl was underage. Okay, Lisa Allan,

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Speaker 1: could you please, as best as you can tell us

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Speaker 1: how you met R. Kelly and what happened after that.

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Speaker 2: I met him in nineteen ninety eight at the Home

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Speaker 2: Alone video shoot. I actually went with a friend of

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Speaker 2: mine's girlfriend. She was an extra and I went with

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Speaker 2: her and I was an extra as well, and he

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Speaker 2: actually had his cousin come up to me and told

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Speaker 2: me that he wanted to meet me. I wasn't sure

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Speaker 2: who he was when he told me. He said, Rob

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Speaker 2: wants to meet you. And I was asking who Rob was,

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Speaker 2: and he said R Kelly. So I went over to him.

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Speaker 2: I was, you know, surprised because I was only seventeen

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Speaker 2: years old, so I didn't expect to meet him. There

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Speaker 2: were tons of grown women there, strippers and other you

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Speaker 2: know things like that that he could have been interested

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Speaker 2: in meeting. But he picked out the youngest girl in

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Speaker 2: the crowd and I went to met him and he

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Speaker 2: asked me how old I was, and I thought I

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Speaker 2: was seventeen. His first question, well, his second question was

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Speaker 2: will your mother let you come to Chicago?

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Speaker 1: Lisa hold on. For those of you just joining me,

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Speaker 1: an alleged victim of the superstar R Kelly, the creator

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Speaker 1: of I Believe I Can Fly. Hold on just a moment,

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Speaker 1: Doctor Bethany Marshall, let me ask Lisa one more question. Lisa,

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Speaker 1: was this before or after he was tried on that

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Speaker 1: video with the fourteen year old girl before? So, Doctor

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Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall, the first thing he did, and Lisa Van

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Speaker 1: Allen has been consistent every time she's told her story.

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Speaker 1: First thing he did. He seeks her out. There's all

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Speaker 1: these strippers, grown women everywhere. He comes over to a

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Speaker 1: teen girl and says, how old are you? What does

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Speaker 1: that tell you, Doctor Bethany?

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Speaker 3: It tells me that this is his offending pattern. He

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Speaker 3: wants underage girls, minors, and he wants girls who are

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Speaker 3: pliable over whom he can have control. And you know

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Speaker 3: R Kelly is setting up a sex cult, so what

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Speaker 3: is he going to do. He's going to go towards

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Speaker 3: the youngest, the most vulnerable members of any group, and

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Speaker 3: he's going to recruit them. He's on a recruiting mission.

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Speaker 3: That's what it tells me.

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Speaker 1: Back to Lisa Van Allen, she claims that R. Kelly

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Speaker 1: took advantage of her sexually as a young girl, and

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Speaker 1: I believe her. I believe her standing on her own

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Speaker 1: because I've met her. We're not just some disembodied voices

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Speaker 1: over the airwaves. I have met Lisa Van Allen I

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Speaker 1: have looked her in the eye. I have spoken to

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Speaker 1: her on and off camera. I have evaluated her credibility,

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Speaker 1: her demeanor, her the degree of detail. I've compared her

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Speaker 1: current statements to many many previous statements for inconsistencies anderation.

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Speaker 1: And I can tell you, as a veteran felony prosecutor,

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Speaker 1: if I were a better I would put money that

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Speaker 1: Lisa Van Allen is telling the truth, and I believe

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Speaker 1: a jury would agree with me.

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Speaker 4: Listen, when we first started having sense, Rob was behind

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Speaker 4: the camera and I started popping the tapes in to

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Speaker 4: see what was on them. But I came across the

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Speaker 4: one with me him and the fourteen year.

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Speaker 5: Old bootleg copies of the tape start showing up around

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Speaker 5: the country.

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Speaker 4: This is the one that makes it almost impossible for

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Speaker 4: people to pretend that they did not know that this

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Speaker 4: person had a thing for little girls.

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Speaker 1: So Lisa Van Allen, R. Kelly comes up to you,

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Speaker 1: amongst all the strippers and the women ground women, he

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Speaker 1: picks out a skinny little girl, and then what happens

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Speaker 1: says how old are you? Then what happens and when

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Speaker 1: your mama lets you come to my town?

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Speaker 2: Right? And then I mean, of course if he knows

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Speaker 2: I'm not going to ask my mother at the video

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Speaker 2: shoot and there's no you wouldn't have cell phones, you know,

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Speaker 2: back then like now. So I'm assuming he asked that

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Speaker 2: question just to see if I would agree to come

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Speaker 2: pretty much, you know what I mean? So yeah, so after.

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Speaker 1: That, then, so what did what did you say?

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I said yes, my mother would allow me

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Speaker 2: to come, but of course I didn't ask her, you

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Speaker 2: get what I mean?

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Speaker 1: And that started it. Listen.

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Speaker 5: R Kelly is arrested on the Chicago charges. The charges

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Speaker 5: they filed against him were not statutory rape charges. They

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Speaker 5: filed child pornography charges. It's the same penalties, but is

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Speaker 5: easier to prove if you cannot in it down to

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Speaker 5: a specific date. There was no date on the tape.

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Speaker 1: What about the child or charge?

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Speaker 2: How right?

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Speaker 5: He ultimately has to face the charges in a Chicago courtroom.

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Speaker 5: He pleads not guilty in post his bail, and he's released.

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Speaker 6: After R Kelly please not guilty, he goes straight to

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Speaker 6: a Southside church. He goes straight to an event where

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Speaker 6: he is admired by young children. Here, he is being

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Speaker 6: prosecuted for allegedly having sex with an underage girl and

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Speaker 6: ministers civil rights leaders in the city Chicago wanted to

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Speaker 6: play up the side of him that did the I

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Speaker 6: believe I can fuck, and not the side of him

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Speaker 6: with the ranting lyrics that kind of went along with

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Speaker 6: possibly having sex for.

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Speaker 1: The underage girl you are hearing from Surviving R Kelly

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Speaker 1: on Lifetime. As we all know, the musical superstar R

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Speaker 1: Kelly was arrested on child porn charges for making that

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Speaker 1: grainy video with a fourteen year old girl in a

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Speaker 1: sex act. And in the video you can clearly see

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Speaker 1: a mole on the back of R. Kelly's back, which

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Speaker 1: is the mole on his back, But the girl would

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Speaker 1: refuse to admit that it was her, so the state

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Speaker 1: ran up against rock and a hard spot because they

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Speaker 1: couldn't definitely prove it was her. But Lisa Van Allen

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Speaker 1: is with me who lived with R Kelly, who I

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Speaker 1: believe is one of his victims. Lisa Van Allen, do

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Speaker 1: you believe the girl was fourteen years old in that

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Speaker 1: porn tape?

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Speaker 2: I know she was fourteen because we actually had a,

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Speaker 2: you know, a threesome with her and at the time

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Speaker 2: he told me she was sixteen years old. I later

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Speaker 2: found out that she was two years younger than that.

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Speaker 2: So because we were headed to one of his video shoots.

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Speaker 2: On the way there, she told me that she was

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Speaker 2: going to be getting a PP Cruiser for her sixteenth birthday.

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Speaker 2: By me doing the math, you know how long ago

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Speaker 2: the first encounter was. It was two years prior to that.

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Speaker 2: So if you're just about to turn sixteen in a

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Speaker 2: few weeks, and that would have made you fourteen when

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Speaker 2: we had the sexual encounter and the tape that was

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Speaker 2: on trial, she would exactly the same, had the same hairstyle,

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Speaker 2: the same, the same just everything, everything was exactly the same,

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Speaker 2: the same, It was even in the same room.

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean, Lisa, you had a threesome weather right,

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Speaker 1: But I think you've gotten to know her fairly well,

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Speaker 1: and you saw her, You saw her more of her

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Speaker 1: than any of us have seen. And I'm not judging.

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Speaker 1: I don't care who does what with who unless it

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Speaker 1: is non consensual or there's a minor involved, exactly, And

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Speaker 1: I think everyone is so in awe, not me, but

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Speaker 1: other people of r. Kelly that he has literally gotten

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Speaker 1: away with felonies for decades. I mean Lisa, his marriage

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Speaker 1: to Aleiah back in this all the time of my head.

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Speaker 1: In nineteen ninety six, she was fifteen, and he coerced

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Speaker 1: her to lie on the marriage certificate, to marry her exactly,

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Speaker 1: and then when it came out that the certificate was

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Speaker 1: a fraud, her parents had a fit, I'm sure, and

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Speaker 1: they got the thing annulled and she would never speak

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Speaker 1: if R Kelly is my understanding, Lisa, well.

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Speaker 2: I know he told me that they had to think

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Speaker 2: called pins and eyeballs, So no matter if it was

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Speaker 2: pins and her eyeballs or he, they wouldn't speak about it.

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Speaker 1: So I want to go back to you, Lisa van

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Speaker 1: Allen with me who was lured into Ourchlly's web. So

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Speaker 1: he comes up to you on this video shoot. He

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Speaker 1: picks you out of all these grown women. You're just

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Speaker 1: a skinny little teen girl, ask if you can come

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Speaker 1: to his town, which I assume with Chicago. Did you go?

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Speaker 7: Yes?

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Speaker 8: I did.

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Speaker 2: I didn't go immediately. I waited about a month to

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Speaker 2: call him. The main reason was because I didn't know

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Speaker 2: what to talk to him about. I mean that might

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Speaker 2: sound a little praying to a grown people, but as

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Speaker 2: a young girl I didn't know what to talk to

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Speaker 2: a grown man yet alone R Kelly on the phone

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Speaker 2: about I didn't think he was going to rush me

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Speaker 2: to Chicago. I thought we were going to have a

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Speaker 2: phone conversation. So I waited a while to call him,

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Speaker 2: and then once I did call him, it was no

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Speaker 2: conversation other than him asking when can you get to Chicago?

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Speaker 1: And then what happened?

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Speaker 2: So I told him whenever, you know, he could get

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Speaker 2: me there, and he put me on the phone with

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Speaker 2: June Brown, which is his assistant, and June talked to

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Speaker 2: me through everything of how to get there. He didn't

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Speaker 2: book it for me, of course, because I was seventeen

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Speaker 2: at the time, so they sent me the money and

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Speaker 2: they actually told me to get my own ticket and

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Speaker 2: where to go and what hotel to go to once

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Speaker 2: I got there and everything, and then they brought me

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Speaker 2: to him once I got to Chicago.

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Speaker 1: So they are killing his people told you how to

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Speaker 1: book your own ticket at seventeen, I would not have

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Speaker 1: known how to book my own ticket, and you did

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Speaker 1: and use the money.

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Speaker 2: I didn't. No, I didn't even have an ID, so

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Speaker 2: I had to go and tuck me in to get

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Speaker 2: an ID, you know, telling me what's all I needed

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Speaker 2: to do to fly.

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Speaker 1: To Nicole de Board joining me. Former prosecutor now criminal

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Speaker 1: defense lawyer, Nicole Aboard, You've prosecuted a lot of felony cases,

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Speaker 1: and I think this is diabolical. And I'll tell you why,

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Speaker 1: because they knew how to erase all the evidence of

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Speaker 1: their involvement. It's not him putting it on his credit

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Speaker 1: card or his recording studio. She did it so in

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Speaker 1: years to come they could go, oh, she just showed up.

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Speaker 1: We didn't even know she was coming.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: You know, it is heartbreaking to hear this account of

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Speaker 7: what happened. And I have to agree that what adds

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Speaker 7: to the credibility of this story here are the details,

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Speaker 7: the many many details about when and how and what

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Speaker 7: was said and what the instructions were. So I tend

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Speaker 7: to agree that this is the case that really ought

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Speaker 7: to hold up if the charges would just be accepted.

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Speaker 1: You know, Alexis esschut writer online dot Com investigative reporter.

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Speaker 1: What a mind? Let me just think of the right

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Speaker 1: word for how to mess with your mind? Because one

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Speaker 1: moment he's having sex with these girls, and the next

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Speaker 1: moment people are cheering for him and he's singing gospel

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Speaker 1: music Nancy.

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Speaker 9: The thing is so many people have come forward for

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Speaker 9: so many years with stories about R. Kelly, and the

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Speaker 9: authorities never believed them. Reporters. I have spoken with people

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Speaker 9: who said that they knew victims that we're living with R.

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Speaker 9: Kelly for years. We've written stories. The authorities have done

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Speaker 9: nothing because he is so famous and so rich and

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Speaker 9: so powerful, and just no one believed these girls.

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Speaker 1: This is one of the.

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Speaker 9: Hardest stories to cover a reporter. When you write things,

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Speaker 9: and you write them and no one believes it and

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Speaker 9: nothing happens. The police do nothing. It's so frustrating.

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Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace, the Grammy winning singer and

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Speaker 1: pop icon, got thirty plus years behind bars for sex

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Speaker 1: abusing women and underage girls and boys, and doing it

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Speaker 1: over the span of decades. I remember when he was

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Speaker 1: sentenced by US District Judge and Donnelley. This is after

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Speaker 1: Donnelly heard multiple statements from seven victims during hours and

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Speaker 1: hours in court of victim statements in Brooklyn Federal Court.

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Speaker 1: And there was another witness, Javonte Cunningham. I will never

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Speaker 1: forget what was said. Quote. With every free edition of

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Speaker 1: a new victim, you grew in wickedness and the witness

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Speaker 1: steered directly at him. She said, and I quote, you

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Speaker 1: used your fame and power to groom and coach underage

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Speaker 1: boys and girls for your own sex gratification. Another victim stated,

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Speaker 1: in open court, quote you made me do things that

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Speaker 1: broke my spirit. I literally wished I would die because

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Speaker 1: of how low you made me feel. She then turned

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Speaker 1: to R. Kelly in court and said do you remember that?

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Speaker 1: And R Kelly wouldn't even look up at her. R Kelly,

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Speaker 1: Robert Sylvester Kelly convicted on nine charges racketeering, violating the

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Speaker 1: Man Act that bar interstate transportation of women and girls

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Speaker 1: for quote immoral purposes. Yeah, the judge threw the book

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Speaker 1: at him. But now he says, people behind bars don't

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Speaker 1: like me. I need house arrest. That chance, bro that chance.

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Speaker 1: Let's just revisit.

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Speaker 10: The Cook County State's Attorney's office, as we understand it

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Speaker 10: now from two sources, has indicted R.

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Speaker 11: Kelly.

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Speaker 10: As you know, R Kelly back in two thousand and

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Speaker 10: eight went to trial. He went to trial on fourteen

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Speaker 10: counts of child pornography. He was acquitted in that trial.

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Speaker 10: And in that trial there was also physical evidence, including

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Speaker 10: a tape, a videotape that prosecutors at the time says

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Speaker 10: was a girl that was thirteen years or fourteen years

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Speaker 10: old and r Kelly involved in sexual acts that had been.

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Speaker 1: Recorded by r Kelly.

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Speaker 10: But he was acquitted on those charges because the jury

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Speaker 10: said they simply could not positively, beyond a reasonable doubt,

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Speaker 10: end up being able to identify r Kelly or the girl,

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Speaker 10: even though they brought a lot of witnesses to say otherwise.

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Speaker 10: There were witnesses in that particular case that said opposite things,

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Speaker 10: and so the jury just was not able to go forward.

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Speaker 1: With a conviction.

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Speaker 10: R Kelly has always maintained that he is innocent of

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Speaker 10: all the charges and accusations that have been coming at him.

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Speaker 1: You hear from our friend, sirrs Seidner. R Kelly behind bars,

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Speaker 1: indeded and booked on ten counts of aggravated criminal sex abuse.

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Speaker 1: Straight out to Crime online dot Com investigative reporter Robin

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Speaker 1: Olenski Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, author of Beautiful Life,

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Speaker 1: the CSI behind the Casey Anthony trial on Amazon, Robin,

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Speaker 1: what happened?

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Speaker 12: Well, here's the story. Nancy r Kelly has been charged

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Speaker 12: with the ten counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse. These

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Speaker 12: are allegations that stem from many years from nineteen ninety

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Speaker 12: eight to twenty ten, involving four females, three who were

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Speaker 12: at the time teenage.

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Speaker 1: Teenage girls. When you say eighteen girls, Robin Olinsky, are

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Speaker 1: you talking thirteen or nineteen?

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Speaker 12: Oh, we're talking thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, young, very young who

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Speaker 12: idolized this man.

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Speaker 1: Guys we're talking about are Kelly Robert Sylvester Kelly, aged

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Speaker 1: fifty two, said to spend another night in jail. Robin

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Speaker 1: Olinsky Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, tell me about

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Speaker 1: the arrest and the booking.

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Speaker 12: Well, here's the situation. He actually R. Kelly turned himself

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Speaker 12: in in Chicago to the police department, and there were

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Speaker 12: many many reporters, both in mainstream news and entertainment reporters

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Speaker 12: all there shouting questions at him, did you do it?

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Speaker 12: Are you guilty? And he said nothing. He turned himself

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Speaker 12: into the police and he was booked. And then the

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Speaker 12: next day the judge he had a bond hearing, and

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Speaker 12: he was being held on a million dollar bond, has

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Speaker 12: to put up one hundred thousand cash to get out,

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Speaker 12: and so far, Nancy, he has come up with the money.

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Speaker 12: Here's this guy who allegedly has all this money and

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Speaker 12: his worst millions and billions of dollars, and he can't

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Speaker 12: come up with one hundred thousand dollars to get out.

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Speaker 1: Prosecutors allege one of the women was an underage girl

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Speaker 1: who Kelly solicited when he was on trial for child

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Speaker 1: porn back in two thousand and eight. Let me introduce

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Speaker 1: my all star panel, Robin Wolinsky, Crime online dot Com

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Speaker 1: investigative reporter Brad Micklan, New Jersey lawyer, doctor Bethany Marshall,

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Speaker 1: renowned California psychoanalyst Vincent Hill, cop turned PI author of

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Speaker 1: playbook to a murder on Amazon. Brad Micklin, you're the

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Speaker 1: high profile defense lawyer. According to sources, one of the

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Speaker 1: women was an underage girl Kelly solicited file he's on

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Speaker 1: trial for child porn back in two thousand and eight.

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Speaker 1: Remember that, Brad Micklin, what if your client jumped up

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Speaker 1: and he's on video with a fourteen year old girl

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Speaker 1: having sex and then urinates iner mouth. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: didn't want to say that, but that's the truth. That's

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Speaker 1: what happened, Brad mclin. And during that during that trial,

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Speaker 1: he sailicit's another underage girl.

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Speaker 8: Well, if it's true, Nancy, it's obviously repulsive. But with

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Speaker 8: regard to the current charges facing him, there are many

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Speaker 8: issues that they need to get passed first. There are

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Speaker 8: going to be statue limitation issues because these a lot

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Speaker 8: of these actions were back in the late nineties. You

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Speaker 8: got this documentary out that's going to came to Jewelry Pool,

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Speaker 8: and yet Avignatti with his hands into the evidence before

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Speaker 8: the prosecutors even got to it. So I think long

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Speaker 8: before we start to judge him on whether or not

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Speaker 8: he did this, we have to see whether there's a

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Speaker 8: basis for them to move forward on it.

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Speaker 1: Okay, first of all, the only thing that I heard

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Speaker 1: that makes carries any water with me is the Avinati issue.

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Speaker 1: You know what, Avianati has seemed to land in the

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Speaker 1: middle of every every controversy he's involved with, the Stormy

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Speaker 1: Daniels issue, then he somehow injected himself in the me

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Speaker 1: too campaign, and now this. I have a problem with

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Speaker 1: him having states evidence first as well. But that aside,

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Speaker 1: this is a very interesting fact. Brad mclin and I

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Speaker 1: did not know this until I started very carefully researching

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Speaker 1: the law, the law has changed in multiple jurisdictions where

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Speaker 1: the statute of limitations no longer applies in cases like this,

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Speaker 1: and it's retroactive, which I was very surprised about, which

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Speaker 1: means that if you commit a crime, say you committed

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Speaker 1: the crime in two thousand, the two thousand law doesn't

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Speaker 1: apply anymore. You get the twenty nineteen law. That's very rare,

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Speaker 1: very rare under our constitution, but it's happened. So statute

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Speaker 1: of limitations is not going to help him. To doctor

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Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall, renown California psychoanalyst Dodger Bethany, I mean the

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Speaker 1: nerve while he's on trial for child porn, got a jury,

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Speaker 1: the works. According to these prosecutors, he slit it's another

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Speaker 1: little girl, Nancy.

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Speaker 3: He's compulsive. I mean, he is a sex predator, predators

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Speaker 3: pre date. The attorney who was giving the press her

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Speaker 3: kept talking about the fact that there was more than

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Speaker 3: five years age difference between him and his victims. She

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Speaker 3: said it again and again and again. And what that

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Speaker 3: tells me is she's trying to say he's not your

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Speaker 3: average run of the mill sex predator. He is a pedophile.

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Speaker 3: The criteria for pedophilia is that there is more than

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Speaker 3: five years age difference between the offender and the victim,

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Speaker 3: and that the victim is precubescent. Now, the youngest one

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Speaker 3: was thirteen years old, so she was on the cusp.

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Speaker 3: But as you just mentioned that, there was that other

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Speaker 3: case when he was brought up charges of child pornography.

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Speaker 3: So this guy just can't stop himself. His whole life

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Speaker 3: is organized around the compulsion. And I think fancy that

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Speaker 3: this is why he doesn't have any money. How can

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Speaker 3: you make money when all you want to do is

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Speaker 3: have sex with little kids? It ruins your entire life.

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Speaker 3: This is all he can do. He's a talented musician,

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Speaker 3: but I bet most of his waking hours are thinking

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Speaker 3: about obtaining access to children and having sex with him.

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Speaker 1: Well. Also, if reports are true, he is keeping up

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Speaker 1: at least six different properties in the Atlanta area alone,

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Speaker 1: plus whatever he's got going on in Chicago, housing all

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Speaker 1: of these women that are in his harem. And that

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Speaker 1: is a euphemistic way to put it, you know, let

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Speaker 1: me just put it like this. I've told many a

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Speaker 1: jury and Brad Macklin is going to shudder during this.

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Speaker 1: The story at the end of a closing argument about

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Speaker 1: mister Scorpion and mister Turtle. Mister Scorpion meets mister Turtle

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Speaker 1: at the side of the river and says, please just

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Speaker 1: carry me across, and Turtle says, oh no, mister Scorpion,

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Speaker 1: because you will surely bite me and we will both

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Speaker 1: go to the bottom of the river and I will die.

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Speaker 1: But Scorpion says, I promise, Why would I kill myself?

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Speaker 1: Subby grudgingly, Turtle takes him across the river. Halfway across,

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Speaker 1: Turtle feels a pain in his neck and he says,

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Speaker 1: mister Scorpion, you bit me now we will both die,

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Speaker 1: and Scorpion says, I can't help it. It's just my nature.

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Speaker 13: Earlier today, Robert Kelly was indicted before a Cook County

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Speaker 13: grand jury on ten counts of aggravated criminals sexual abuse

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Speaker 13: involving four victims. The first victim initials HW, was involved

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Speaker 13: in incidents which occurred between May twenty six to nineteen

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Speaker 13: ninety eight and May twenty fifth, nineteen ninety nine. A

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Speaker 13: grand jury returned an indictment on four counts of aggravated

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Speaker 13: criminals sexual abuse based on the victim being under the

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Speaker 13: age of seventeen and Robert Kelly being more more than

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Speaker 13: five years older than the victim. The second victim, initials

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Speaker 13: r L, was involved in an incident which occurred between

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Speaker 13: September twenty sixth nineteen ninety eight and September twenty fifth,

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Speaker 13: two thousand and one. A grand jury returned an indictment

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Speaker 13: on two counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse based on

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Speaker 13: the victims being under the age of seventeen and Robert

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Speaker 13: Kelly being more than five years older than that victim.

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Speaker 13: The third victim, INITIALS LC, was involved in an incident

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Speaker 13: which occurred February eighteenth, two thousand and three. A grand

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Speaker 13: jury returned an indictment on one count of aggravated criminal

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Speaker 13: sexual abuse based on the transmission of seamen by Robert

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Speaker 13: Kelly upon any part of the body of the victim

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Speaker 13: for the purpose of sexual gratification during the course of

435
00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 13: an underlying felony of attempt criminal sexual assault. The fourth victim,

436
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 13: initials JP, was involved in incidents which occurred between May one,

437
00:26:56,840 --> 00:27:00,920
Speaker 13: two thousand and nine and January thirty first, two thy ten.

438
00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 13: A grand jury returned an indictment on the three counts

439
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:07,840
Speaker 13: three counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse based on the

440
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:11,080
Speaker 13: victim being under the age of seventeen and Robert Kelly

441
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:14,760
Speaker 13: being more than five years older than the victim. Aggravated

442
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 13: criminal sexual abuse is a Class two felony with the

443
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:22,159
Speaker 13: sentencing range of three to seven years for count. It

444
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:26,880
Speaker 13: is also probationable. We anticipate that mister Kelly will appear

445
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 13: in bond court tomorrow afternoon.

446
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 1: Thank you. You are hearing the prosecutor outline all of

447
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 1: the charges against R and B star are Kelly, Robert

448
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 1: Sylvester Kelly. And right now he's sitting in the can.

449
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:43,840
Speaker 1: There's just no nice way to put it. He's behind

450
00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 1: bars trying to drum up the money to make bond.

451
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:50,879
Speaker 1: Joining me Robbie Olinsky, Vincent Hill, doctor Bethany Marshall, and

452
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:54,880
Speaker 1: Brad Micklin to Vincent Hill turned PI, author of playbook

453
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: to a Murder on Amazon. You know, they go all

454
00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:01,880
Speaker 1: the way back to nineteen ninety eight for these claims,

455
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,200
Speaker 1: which show me the statute of limitation is not an

456
00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 1: effect based on new legislation. A lot of defense attorneys,

457
00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:14,480
Speaker 1: probably including Brad McK limb, but certainly R. Kelly's lawyer

458
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: is going to argue to a jury that these claims

459
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 1: are so old, why are they just coming forward? Now?

460
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:20,640
Speaker 9: You know what jr.

461
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 1: Ar might fall for that, But there are other counts

462
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,480
Speaker 1: as well. Vincent, what did they have to do to

463
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:27,760
Speaker 1: get this information, to get the evidence to show the case.

464
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:30,159
Speaker 11: Well, Manti, I'm glad they did update the statute of

465
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:33,399
Speaker 11: limitations for these gruesome crimes. I mean, this reminds me

466
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:36,520
Speaker 11: of a Monica Lewinsky. You heard you got semen on dresses,

467
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 11: you got semen on shirt, You've got semen on blouses.

468
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 11: So the physical evidence is there. Thankfully, if we can

469
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 11: get past these statue of limitations, we can actually get

470
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 11: a conviction. And it's no wonder he's still sitting in

471
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,480
Speaker 11: jail and he can't come up with one hundred grand.

472
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 11: He's been paying off women for years before closed on

473
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 11: his house in twenty twelve because he had to go

474
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 11: and pay all these women in civil cases. So it's

475
00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,480
Speaker 11: no wonder he's sitting in jail and that's where he belongs.

476
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: Quite frank two, Doctor Bethany Marshall, renownced California psychoanalyst. Doctor Bethany,

477
00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 1: you would think after the first jury trial where he's

478
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 1: actually brought up on felony charges of creating pornography with

479
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:18,239
Speaker 1: a girl fourteen years old. You would think that that

480
00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:20,600
Speaker 1: would stop him, but it didn't.

481
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:26,520
Speaker 14: According to prosecutors, offenders offend again and again and again,

482
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:32,800
Speaker 14: and they organize their entire lives around the compulsion to offend,

483
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 14: like see a lesser compulsion.

484
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 3: Let's take for example, alcoholism. An alcoholic might get a

485
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 3: job as a bartender. A pedophile might get a job

486
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:47,520
Speaker 3: as a priest, or as a school teacher. A sex

487
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:51,320
Speaker 3: offender pedophile might become a musician so he can lure

488
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 3: little girls, and he will remain undeterred even when he

489
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 3: has to pay out settlements. This is what we saw

490
00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 3: with Michael Jackson. Remember settlement after settlement with little boys.

491
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 3: But the crimes went on and on. And that's because

492
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:10,000
Speaker 3: there's also something called institutional sociopathy, where one socip path

493
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 3: bands with another and then bands with another.

494
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:13,640
Speaker 9: These people like r.

495
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:17,880
Speaker 3: Kelly, and we saw this with Harvey Weinstein, they surround

496
00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:22,200
Speaker 3: themselves with people who accommodate to their crimes, so they

497
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,400
Speaker 3: are aided and embedded all over the place. And that's

498
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 3: why the offending pattern never stopped.

499
00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 1: To New Jersey lawyer High profile. Defense attorney Brad mclin

500
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 1: joining us, Brad macklin, what do you make of the

501
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 1: fact that some of the charges date back to nineteen

502
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 1: ninety eight and how would you attack that a trial?

503
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 8: Well, and that's going to be a problem. I mean,

504
00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,600
Speaker 8: he's not at this time. Several victims in several incidents,

505
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 8: So you first attacked the statute limitations because in Illinois

506
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 8: the limitations depend on whether or not there's corroboration, the

507
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,240
Speaker 8: age of defender and the relationship that R. Kelly may

508
00:30:57,280 --> 00:30:59,600
Speaker 8: have had with that meaning was he in a position

509
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:01,440
Speaker 8: of the thought or where they personally claimed.

510
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:02,640
Speaker 3: So as a defense.

511
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 8: Attorney, you're going to attack each specific event, each specific

512
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:08,440
Speaker 8: victim and date to try to knock out some of

513
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 8: the claims. It's not going to be a slam dunk

514
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:13,239
Speaker 8: on a statute limitations issue, but at least you can

515
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,000
Speaker 8: get rid of some of the offenses and some of

516
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 8: the victims and reduce what you're facing a trial.

517
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 1: Guys, when Brad and I are talking about statute of limitations,

518
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:27,760
Speaker 1: what that means is under our jurisprudence, under our constitution,

519
00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:32,720
Speaker 1: after a certain period of time years, cases can no

520
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 1: longer be prosecuted. They're deemed too old. The evidence is

521
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:41,160
Speaker 1: no longer as valid as it was before. That's the rationale.

522
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,560
Speaker 1: So you have a limit on how many years pass

523
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: until you can no longer try the case. This is

524
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: what we know. Singer R Kelly's prosecutors alleging he's solicited

525
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 1: underage girls for sex even while he was on trial

526
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: for child porn. While he was on trial back in

527
00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:02,120
Speaker 1: two thousand and eight, according to prosecutors, Kelly still found

528
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:07,160
Speaker 1: time to talk to fans, to sign autographs, to take photos,

529
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 1: and meet an underage girl he invited to his home, and,

530
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:15,640
Speaker 1: according to them, solicited for sex. Other accusers include a

531
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 1: little girl who met Kelly at her sixteenth birthday party,

532
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: and a hairdresser who expected to braid the singers here,

533
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,360
Speaker 1: only to find out he wanted a sex act instead.

534
00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 1: He goes on and on and on, but now he's

535
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:31,760
Speaker 1: really looking at a heap of trouble. Now, this is

536
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 1: the person you don't want to have a fender bender with.

537
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 1: And see Gloria allready get out of the car in

538
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:40,200
Speaker 1: front of you. Oh no, you do not listen to this.

539
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 15: We have an appointment today with the New York City

540
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 15: Police Department, who have as asked to meet with Faith

541
00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:49,920
Speaker 15: in furtherance of their investigation into potential victims of R.

542
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 1: Kelly.

543
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:54,720
Speaker 15: We will offer our full and complete cooperation in their investigation.

544
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:59,560
Speaker 15: Prosecutors in Chicago and Atlanta are also seeking information from

545
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 15: potent victims, and we plan to offer them our cooperation

546
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 15: as well. Mister Kelly, you may soon join the ranks

547
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:09,959
Speaker 15: of Bill Cosby and Harvey Weinstein.

548
00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:11,320
Speaker 1: Just as they have.

549
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:16,960
Speaker 15: Been and are being held accountable for their actions, you

550
00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 15: also must be accountable.

551
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:22,960
Speaker 1: To Robin Olensky, author of Beautiful Life and Crime Online

552
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:25,480
Speaker 1: dot com investigative reporter, where you can find this and

553
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 1: every other breaking news item in justice and criminal law.

554
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: Robin Lensky, how did Gloria already get involved?

555
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:40,440
Speaker 12: Well, Gloria Allread is now representing one of the underage

556
00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:43,880
Speaker 12: girls who has claims against R.

557
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:44,840
Speaker 7: Kelly.

558
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,880
Speaker 12: You know what, Nancy, When I've been researching this case

559
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 12: and covering it over time, what comes to my mind

560
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,240
Speaker 12: though about this? Remember what your grandmother used to say

561
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:56,320
Speaker 12: to you, Where there's smoke, there's fire. Now, all of

562
00:33:56,360 --> 00:34:00,560
Speaker 12: these are allegations, but you start building your ca and

563
00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 12: it goes back to nineteen ninety eight, and then you

564
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 12: know there's stuff prior to that, and then it goes

565
00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 12: on and on and on.

566
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:10,400
Speaker 15: In response to the allegations of his many alleged victims

567
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 15: as contained in the recent Lifetime documentary, Kelly's attorney has

568
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:18,200
Speaker 15: appeared to threaten a lawsuit against Lifetime, and, according to

569
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:23,600
Speaker 15: news reports, someone associated with Kelly's team launched a Facebook

570
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 15: page called quote Surviving Lies to allegedly discredit his accusers.

571
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:33,480
Speaker 15: Reports indicated that the page was quote swiftly taken down

572
00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:38,719
Speaker 15: for violating Facebook's policy on bullying or sharing others private

573
00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 15: contact information. News reports also claim that mister Kelly is

574
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 15: threatening to sue everyone involved in the documentary. Mister Kelly's attorney,

575
00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:52,759
Speaker 15: Stephen Greenberg, said the singer will quote hopefully sue Lifetime

576
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,720
Speaker 15: in his first interview with ABC News since the release

577
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 15: of Lifetime Surviving R. Kelly, I say to mister Kelly

578
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,160
Speaker 15: and his attorney, be careful what you hope for. All

579
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:04,880
Speaker 15: of these attempts to intimidate and threaten our clients and

580
00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:10,040
Speaker 15: others will not work. Mister Kelly, Your disgusting tactics will

581
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:13,680
Speaker 15: not prevent women who alleged they were victimized from telling

582
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:14,320
Speaker 15: their truth.

583
00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 1: That is at turning Gloria Allred and I've got to

584
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:18,239
Speaker 1: tell you something. I got a soft spot for her,

585
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,640
Speaker 1: and this is why I not always heard of her.

586
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:24,200
Speaker 1: And I worked with her daughterly sublime at Court TV

587
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 1: for many many years. Fine fine woman, and long story short.

588
00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:31,480
Speaker 1: When I was out covering the Scott Peterson trial and

589
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:35,360
Speaker 1: I was there in Medwood City for months and months

590
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,960
Speaker 1: and months, I would get to the courthouse, okay, I'd

591
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 1: get there around six o'clock in the morning to start

592
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 1: doing morning TV, stay for the whole day do Court TV,

593
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:50,000
Speaker 1: and stay to do Larry King, which ended at that

594
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:53,160
Speaker 1: time at ten o'clock at night. When I would finally

595
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 1: leave the courthouse, I would notice that Gloria Allred was

596
00:35:56,760 --> 00:35:59,400
Speaker 1: there when I got there at six. When I left

597
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:01,840
Speaker 1: at night, I remember her standing there in her fancy

598
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 1: Saint John's suit, working two cell phones, standing at a

599
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:10,319
Speaker 1: stop sign, working We're king. I'm telling you, she's got

600
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:13,960
Speaker 1: a work ethic like nobody else, Gloria Allred. And when

601
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 1: she gets ahold of your case, it's like a pit

602
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:18,880
Speaker 1: bull's got a hold of you. You got to get pliers,

603
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 1: you got to get a utensil to get her jaw

604
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: off your case. Joining me Brad Micklin, doctor Bethany Marshall,

605
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:30,319
Speaker 1: Vincent Hill, and Robin Wolenski. So let me understand this.

606
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:35,000
Speaker 1: Robin Wilensky, this guy, he's a music sensation, he's an icon.

607
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:38,720
Speaker 1: Can't put together the bail money.

608
00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:43,240
Speaker 12: Yes, quite incredible, isn't it. Here's a guy who wins

609
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:46,839
Speaker 12: three Grammys for his songs. He's writing songs for other

610
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:51,480
Speaker 12: famous artists. He's got all these videos, he's got all

611
00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 12: these homes, he's got all this same he has all

612
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 12: this fortune. And oh, by the way, I can't come

613
00:36:57,600 --> 00:36:59,200
Speaker 12: up with one hundred thousand dollars.

614
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,799
Speaker 1: It's actually two hundred and fifty thousand dollars bond for

615
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 1: each of the four women. That's a million dollar bond.

616
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 1: So he's got to come up with one hundred thousand

617
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:12,000
Speaker 1: dollars in cash. Kelly's lawyers ask for a lower bond amount,

618
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:15,839
Speaker 1: arguing that his finances are a mess because he has

619
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:20,000
Speaker 1: just been dropped by a second by another record label.

620
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:23,239
Speaker 1: But so far that hasn't happened. The bond remains at

621
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:26,920
Speaker 1: one million dollars. I want to outline exactly what the

622
00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 1: charges are to doctor Bethany Marshall, psychoanalysts out of Beverly Hills.

623
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 1: He is accused of basically operating compounds, homes, townhomes, condos,

624
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:46,360
Speaker 1: at least six of them, where he houses young girls.

625
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 1: They start around age sixteen or so or younger, and

626
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:54,120
Speaker 1: they live there for years. Everything they do, their food,

627
00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: what they wear is controlled. They are given cell phones

628
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:02,120
Speaker 1: that they can only die R. Kelly or his Hinch people.

629
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 1: They cannot come out of their rooms or go into

630
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:08,160
Speaker 1: the hall. They have to ask to go to the restroom.

631
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:12,239
Speaker 1: And apparently there is a den mother of sorts that

632
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:16,960
Speaker 1: explains to these young girls how they are to accommodate R.

633
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:21,960
Speaker 1: Kelly's demands, what he wants them to do, and if

634
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 1: that video was any indication of what he wants them

635
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 1: to do urinating in their mouth. I'm just very surprised

636
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:33,879
Speaker 1: it's taken so long, doctor Bethany, How did it get

637
00:38:33,920 --> 00:38:36,480
Speaker 1: this far and what do you perceive of the acts

638
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:37,800
Speaker 1: that he is committing.

639
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:41,440
Speaker 3: Well, okay, Nancy, you note that sex offenders on average

640
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,920
Speaker 3: offend for seventeen years before they come to the attention

641
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:49,560
Speaker 3: of law enforcement or before they're incarcerated prosecuted. So I'm

642
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:53,520
Speaker 3: not completely surprised by this. Look how long everything went

643
00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 3: on with Harvey Weinstein before he was prosecuted. But Nancy,

644
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:00,759
Speaker 3: we have to frame our thinking appropriately about what R.

645
00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,440
Speaker 3: Kelly is doing. This is not a school teacher in

646
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:07,280
Speaker 3: a classroom that has targeted a miner and is obsessed

647
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:10,480
Speaker 3: with that minor. This is a leader of a sex cult.

648
00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 3: That's what he fancies himself as being. This is a

649
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 3: Warren Jeffs. This is a David Koresh, This is a

650
00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:22,280
Speaker 3: John of God. This is somebody who has amassed wealth

651
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:27,040
Speaker 3: properties compounds so he can bring as many women in

652
00:39:27,120 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 3: as possible as a part of his harem. And then,

653
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 3: as with leaders of any cults, he systematically cuts them

654
00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:38,879
Speaker 3: off from financial and social support. He prevents them from

655
00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:44,080
Speaker 3: calling their families. He begins to deprive them of food, clothing,

656
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:48,719
Speaker 3: and autonomy, and slowly he brainwashes them over time. So

657
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:52,239
Speaker 3: we're so fascinated by the sexual aspect of the sex

658
00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:55,560
Speaker 3: cult that we forget that he is a run of

659
00:39:55,600 --> 00:40:00,160
Speaker 3: the mill cult leader, as any other cult leader would be.

660
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:05,040
Speaker 3: Again cutting off his victims from outside support. He wants

661
00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:08,440
Speaker 3: to be the sole supplier of everything in their lives,

662
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:11,239
Speaker 3: and I think he believed that this would go on

663
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 3: and on and on, this idea of not being able

664
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:16,799
Speaker 3: to post bail. I'm sure she has a lot of

665
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:19,640
Speaker 3: money and properties, but you have to pour a lot

666
00:40:19,719 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 3: of money into an obsession like this, Nancy. He's supporting

667
00:40:23,680 --> 00:40:26,160
Speaker 3: scores of women and paying off other women at the

668
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 3: same time in their families.

669
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: Brad mclin, he's got another problem with me. A veteran

670
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:34,960
Speaker 1: trial lawyer out of New Jersey jurisdiction, Brad Macklin. Brad

671
00:40:35,040 --> 00:40:38,640
Speaker 1: he owes nearly two hundred thousand dollars of child support,

672
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:43,000
Speaker 1: so his money problems don't stop with just his bail issue. Now,

673
00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:46,600
Speaker 1: according to court documents, he owes almost two hundred grand

674
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:50,800
Speaker 1: in unpaid child support and catch this. The court ordered r.

675
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:53,640
Speaker 1: Kelly to make monthly payments of about twenty grand back

676
00:40:53,640 --> 00:40:56,439
Speaker 1: in two thousand and nine. He didn't even show up

677
00:40:56,680 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 1: at the hearing, according to the court documents. Now, to

678
00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:04,760
Speaker 1: avoid being held in contempt a judge order, he paid

679
00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 1: the entire amount one hundred and sixty one thousand by

680
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 1: March six. Of course, he didn't do it, and Greenberg,

681
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:16,759
Speaker 1: his defense lawyer, says he doesn't have to pay the

682
00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:20,520
Speaker 1: child support before getting out of jail on this, I

683
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:23,120
Speaker 1: bet the court will disagree with that. Brad Micklin, I

684
00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:25,040
Speaker 1: think the court's going to hold him till he pays

685
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:27,760
Speaker 1: the child support plus the bond.

686
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 8: I agree actually with you, Nancy. I think even if

687
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:33,600
Speaker 8: they haven't ruled that way now, I think the Family

688
00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:36,840
Speaker 8: Court should be making some decisions about not only what

689
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:39,520
Speaker 8: happens when he gets released, but what happens when he

690
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,000
Speaker 8: does post the bell and comes to court. What happens

691
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 8: to one hundred thousand dollars? Does it get returned to him?

692
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:46,359
Speaker 8: Or do attach it and take it and paid over

693
00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:48,840
Speaker 8: to the Child's department, which I think is what ultimately

694
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:49,879
Speaker 8: will happen in this case.

695
00:41:56,600 --> 00:42:05,280
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Gray in the last days Predator

696
00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:10,680
Speaker 1: are Kelly demanding he be released from his thirty plus

697
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:14,880
Speaker 1: year sentence on child abuse and sex trafficking because the

698
00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:19,239
Speaker 1: other inmates don't like him and he's afraid. We we

699
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 1: how do you think those boys and girls felt while

700
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:25,960
Speaker 1: you were molesting them? You think they were afraid? You know,

701
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:28,799
Speaker 1: I don't even want to hear it. Let's just revisit

702
00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:33,600
Speaker 1: what we know. You're never going to believe this. The

703
00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 1: defense attorneys and all of R. Kelly's supporters, including his

704
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 1: two girlfriends, were in court want him released. Listen to

705
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:48,520
Speaker 1: our friend at WGNTV. This is Nancy Luke.

706
00:42:48,600 --> 00:42:51,160
Speaker 16: Kelly's attorneys are asking the judge to release the R

707
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 16: and B singer while he waits for trial, arguing that

708
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:56,440
Speaker 16: he's not a danger to the community because many of

709
00:42:56,480 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 16: the allegations are decades old. They also don't think Kelly

710
00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:04,799
Speaker 16: should have prisoners as roommates. Kelly's attorneys are arguing that

711
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 16: he should get to live with his not one, but

712
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:11,520
Speaker 16: two girlfriends in a secure facility such as a townhouse.

713
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 8: A place it's appropriate, that'll be safe for him and

714
00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:16,319
Speaker 8: that can house.

715
00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 12: The women that are part of his relationship.

716
00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:19,920
Speaker 1: So we can't tell you where he would be living.

717
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:23,120
Speaker 1: R Kelly has just been moved out of solitary confinement

718
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:28,240
Speaker 1: and into GP general population, but prosecutors are fighting back

719
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:32,000
Speaker 1: against claims by his defense team he was held in

720
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:36,360
Speaker 1: solitary against his will, and they point very clearly to

721
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:40,760
Speaker 1: recorded jail house calls PS. All the calls of jail

722
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:44,839
Speaker 1: are recorded, okay, and there's a warning that you hear

723
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:46,839
Speaker 1: when you accept a call from the jail that it's

724
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:52,839
Speaker 1: from a jail, okay. On those calls, he explained why

725
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,560
Speaker 1: he refused to go into general population when it had

726
00:43:55,600 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 1: been offered, and he claims he was worried about his

727
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:06,480
Speaker 1: fame making him too popular. Am unquote regular inmates? Who

728
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:09,520
Speaker 1: does he think he is special? Quote if I go

729
00:44:09,600 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 1: to population, I'm just up on everybody, and everybody's up

730
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 1: on me, and I'm trying to figure out how to

731
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:18,760
Speaker 1: trust that or whatever. He goes on to talk about

732
00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 1: why he doesn't want quote too many people up on you.

733
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:26,399
Speaker 1: I've seen too many movies and it's just that I'm

734
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:27,279
Speaker 1: so popular.

735
00:44:27,480 --> 00:44:27,760
Speaker 17: Here.

736
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:33,760
Speaker 1: Lisa Van Allen, then a teen girl, when she meets R. Kelly, Lisa,

737
00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:35,960
Speaker 1: what happened when you got to Chicago?

738
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:40,839
Speaker 2: Initially, when I got there, you know, being so young,

739
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:44,800
Speaker 2: it was a bit exciting to travel to another city

740
00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:47,799
Speaker 2: and to meet you know, him, and to hang out

741
00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:50,799
Speaker 2: here his music and things like that. But soon after that,

742
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:54,880
Speaker 2: you know, that kind of died down because he asked

743
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:58,120
Speaker 2: me to do a threesome with him, and the way

744
00:44:58,120 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 2: he got me to do it was he told me

745
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 2: it never had one before, and with me thinking that

746
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:07,600
Speaker 2: his girlfriend, I felt, you know, kind of obligated to

747
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:09,839
Speaker 2: do that for him if he had never had one before,

748
00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:11,399
Speaker 2: and he was a superstar, and you know what I mean,

749
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:14,160
Speaker 2: I'm like, girls are always throwing themselves at him, and

750
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:16,400
Speaker 2: he's never had one before, so I'll just I'll go

751
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:19,160
Speaker 2: ahead and do it, you know, for him. We had

752
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:23,680
Speaker 2: the threesome, and after we had it, it just became

753
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:27,960
Speaker 2: and just something that he always wanted to do threesomes

754
00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:28,880
Speaker 2: with different girls.

755
00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:31,760
Speaker 3: So what happened then I would get very upset.

756
00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:35,799
Speaker 2: I'd cry more often than not, I cry about it,

757
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:37,800
Speaker 2: and he would always try to give me like Pep

758
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:41,880
Speaker 2: talks about how you know, it was just sex and

759
00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:44,440
Speaker 2: it didn't hold any emotion to him, and how a

760
00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:46,719
Speaker 2: lot of times he didn't know the girl's names, and

761
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:48,719
Speaker 2: you know, if I could just do it and get

762
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:50,960
Speaker 2: it over with, you know, So it would be a

763
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:53,920
Speaker 2: lot of a trauma involved for me because you know,

764
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:55,719
Speaker 2: it was something that I didn't want to do, and

765
00:45:55,760 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 2: I felt, you know, that I had to do it

766
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 2: for him, especially since I had already done it, you

767
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:03,240
Speaker 2: know what I mean. But you know, once I've realized

768
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:05,400
Speaker 2: once we did it, more than once, I believed it

769
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:08,040
Speaker 2: was a lie. But I was already caught up into it,

770
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:10,719
Speaker 2: and I ended up living there with him. You know,

771
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:12,440
Speaker 2: he was taking care of me. You know, I didn't

772
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:15,200
Speaker 2: have my job anymore at the mall, you know, so

773
00:46:15,719 --> 00:46:18,279
Speaker 2: it kind of was like I really didn't have a choice.

774
00:46:18,520 --> 00:46:21,680
Speaker 1: When he would try to give you as you refer

775
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:25,080
Speaker 1: to it as pep talks, you told me that he

776
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:27,560
Speaker 1: would say things like, if you love me, you wouldn't

777
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:28,440
Speaker 1: try to change me.

778
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:30,360
Speaker 3: Yes, he would, Yes.

779
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:32,600
Speaker 2: He would say that, And he'd say things that he

780
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,040
Speaker 2: would say that that's what his mother told him, if

781
00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:37,160
Speaker 2: if a woman loves a man, she won't try to

782
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:40,400
Speaker 2: change him. So I'm thinking to myself, well, him and

783
00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:42,960
Speaker 2: his mother would know better than me. If i'm you know,

784
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:44,719
Speaker 2: I'm you know, I'm a child. What do I know

785
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:48,560
Speaker 2: about what a grown woman should do or what you

786
00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:49,839
Speaker 2: know to to please a man?

787
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:50,279
Speaker 3: You know?

788
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:54,239
Speaker 2: So I go off with what he told me, like, Okay, well,

789
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:54,960
Speaker 2: I guess he's right.

790
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:57,759
Speaker 1: At this time, you were seventeen, and how old was

791
00:46:57,800 --> 00:47:00,759
Speaker 1: he thirty one? Okay, I guess that's all right. There

792
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:06,400
Speaker 1: another bizarre twist and the prosecution of R Kelly, the

793
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:11,920
Speaker 1: R and B star multi millionaire in the last days

794
00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: Kelly insists he should be released, that inmates want to

795
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:23,839
Speaker 1: kill him. Hmm, how about solitary That's a good alternative,

796
00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:27,279
Speaker 1: but not house arrest. Need see.

797
00:47:27,280 --> 00:47:30,520
Speaker 17: There were several reasons that R. Kelly's attorneys cited for

798
00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:35,440
Speaker 17: requesting house arrest. Kelly's legal team submitted a motion claiming

799
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:39,400
Speaker 17: Bureau of Prison officials conspired to arrange for him to

800
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:43,120
Speaker 17: be killed by a fellow inmate. This alleged plot included

801
00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:46,800
Speaker 17: a terminally ill inmate who claimed he was promised early

802
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:49,919
Speaker 17: release in exchange for carrying out the murder. They also

803
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:53,239
Speaker 17: claim he was given an overdose quantity of medication by

804
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:57,920
Speaker 17: prison staff, resulting in hospitalization. They also claim he was

805
00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:03,320
Speaker 17: being denied essential medication and surgery for blood clients. Kelly's

806
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:07,800
Speaker 17: legal team also argued that continued incarceration under these circumstances,

807
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:12,160
Speaker 17: with threats to his life and potential denial of medical care,

808
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:17,000
Speaker 17: constitutes cruel and unusual punishment, a violation of his Eighth

809
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:22,040
Speaker 17: Amendment rights. Federal prosecutors have called these allegations repugnant and

810
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,360
Speaker 17: have stated that Kelly is using these claims to promote

811
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:29,040
Speaker 17: himself and avoid responsibility for his crimes.

812
00:48:29,480 --> 00:48:35,560
Speaker 1: Are Kelly previously acquitted in a child pornography case, then

813
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:41,040
Speaker 1: arrested by FEDS and prosecuted. He catches a thirty plus

814
00:48:41,120 --> 00:48:45,960
Speaker 1: year sentence for child sex abuse and sex trafficking. According

815
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 1: to R. Kelly's lawyer quote, his situation is emblematic of

816
00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:57,320
Speaker 1: the weaponization of the DOJ to go after public features.

817
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:02,680
Speaker 1: Ok So he is now what R Kelly is the

818
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:06,280
Speaker 1: target of a government conspiracy? Okay?

819
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:11,000
Speaker 17: A federal judge denied Kelly's request for house arrest, citing

820
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:14,200
Speaker 17: a lack of jurisdiction in the matter. It's just another

821
00:49:14,280 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 17: and a long list of legal maneuverings made by Kelly's

822
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:21,440
Speaker 17: legal team. The Supreme Court has denied multiple appeals from R.

823
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:25,279
Speaker 17: Kelly related to his convictions for sex crimes and racketeering.

824
00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 17: In October of twenty twenty four, the Supreme Court declined

825
00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:32,880
Speaker 17: to hear an appeal regarding his convictions. Kelly's lawyers argued

826
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:36,799
Speaker 17: a shorter statue of limitation should have applied, and just

827
00:49:36,920 --> 00:49:40,520
Speaker 17: last month, June twenty third, the Supreme Court denied an

828
00:49:40,520 --> 00:49:44,760
Speaker 17: appeal related to his RICO conviction. Kelly's legal team argued

829
00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:47,680
Speaker 17: the prosecution's use of the Rico Act to define the

830
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:52,719
Speaker 17: terms enterprise was a misinterpretation. All these decisions mean that

831
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:56,640
Speaker 17: R Kelly's convictions and his decade's long prison sentence will stand.

832
00:49:56,760 --> 00:50:01,600
Speaker 1: Hitmaker r Kelly demanding he get out of jail early

833
00:50:02,840 --> 00:50:07,480
Speaker 1: and have just house arrest. What is he jealous of

834
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:10,120
Speaker 1: all the attention D B D D D is getting.

835
00:50:10,920 --> 00:50:12,720
Speaker 1: Goodbye friend,