WEBVTT - Curate This: Influencer Crimes

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<v Speaker 1>Ridiculous crime. It's a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 2>Zaren Elizabeth n Hi.

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<v Speaker 3>How are you to do?

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<v Speaker 2>Pretty well? Do you do? Oh? To you? I'm good, well,

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<v Speaker 2>happy for you, thank.

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<v Speaker 3>You, and I'm happy for you and all your joyful

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<v Speaker 3>bounties and also with you. Yes, let us give thanks,

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<v Speaker 3>let us give thanks and praise Saren.

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<v Speaker 2>It is right to you, you know.

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<v Speaker 3>Do you know what's ridiculous?

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<v Speaker 2>I do the nineteen ninety four movie Clifford.

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<v Speaker 3>Okay, do you know this film? Is that what a

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<v Speaker 3>lot of people don't?

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<v Speaker 2>Short? Wow? Look at you? Do you agree? Now?

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<v Speaker 3>And then my brain works totally.

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<v Speaker 2>Do you know the other star in that movie, Clifford Martin?

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<v Speaker 2>And just think of a kind of a curmudgeingly humorous actor.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh gosh, my last name rhymes with Hoden.

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<v Speaker 3>Charles Groden. Yes, that was like I was. I could

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<v Speaker 3>see him and I was trying to remember his name.

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<v Speaker 2>So Martin shirt is like this annoying character in the movie,

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<v Speaker 2>and Charles Groden is a long suffering person. Right, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>Well you know who loves the film?

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<v Speaker 3>Ummm, Saddam hussaying, no.

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<v Speaker 2>Good, guess I'll tell you it this way. Martin Short

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<v Speaker 2>was on a flight from LA to New York. And

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<v Speaker 2>he had never met this person who loved the film,

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<v Speaker 2>and this person wanted to talk to him all about it.

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<v Speaker 2>And this is like, this is a movie was a bomb?

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<v Speaker 4>Right?

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<v Speaker 2>Nobody ever goes hey.

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<v Speaker 3>Look was it Henry Kissinger?

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<v Speaker 2>Good? Guess no, So I'll just I'll read you. This

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<v Speaker 2>is how Martin Short tells the story. Okay, quote. Half

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<v Speaker 2>an hour into the flight, I noticed a figure hovering

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<v Speaker 2>in the periphery of my vision. Nicholas Cage crouched in

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<v Speaker 2>the aisle beside me, his eyes locked on mine. Can

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<v Speaker 2>I just say something to you? He said, a very

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<v Speaker 2>Nick Cagy intensity in his voice. The dining room scene

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<v Speaker 2>in Clifford with You and Charles Groden, where he's confronting

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<v Speaker 2>you and you keep lying to him, a sustained battle

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<v Speaker 2>of wits, much of it improvised, in which Clifford drives

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<v Speaker 2>Groad's character the edge. Well, I broke my VCR watching it.

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<v Speaker 2>I watched that scene twenty five times in a row,

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<v Speaker 2>and I rewound it so much that the machine jammed

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<v Speaker 2>and the tape broke. What Nick Cage man? I love

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<v Speaker 2>Nick Cage. I want to meet him if you could

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<v Speaker 2>ask me there if you have. If I met like

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<v Speaker 2>a genie and they're like, you get three wishes, two

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<v Speaker 2>of them would be Nick Cage.

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<v Speaker 3>Related, Meet Nick Cage and what's the other one?

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<v Speaker 2>Got to meet him again? He likes me, so we

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<v Speaker 2>hang out and become friends. We like we race cars

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<v Speaker 2>and we compare, like our various comic book collections, and

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<v Speaker 2>our kung fu fighting and like weather Jack, I like

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<v Speaker 2>your your karate g Have you seen my kung fu outfit?

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<v Speaker 2>We show up surprise each other with sunglass gifts. Let's

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<v Speaker 2>make that happen. I know, Nicholas Cage. If you're listening,

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<v Speaker 2>we could be best. So there you go. It's ridiculous,

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<v Speaker 2>right it is?

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<v Speaker 3>And do you want to know what else is ridiculou?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my god, I'm here.

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<v Speaker 3>For social media influencers. This is Ridiculous Crime, a podcast

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<v Speaker 3>about absurd and outrageous capers, heists, and cons. It's always

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<v Speaker 3>ninety nine percent murder free and one hundred percent ridiculous.

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<v Speaker 2>Damn right.

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<v Speaker 3>Influencers in them. Yeah, I'm talking about the folks who

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<v Speaker 3>leverage their online presence, yes, particularly on social media, to

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<v Speaker 3>affect the opinions, the behaviors, the purchasing decisions.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, of consumers. I'm assuming their audience.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it's like that's an academic way to put it. Yes,

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<v Speaker 3>it's very nice and how minded they build a following,

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<v Speaker 3>like they create this engaging content, yes, and they interact

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<v Speaker 3>with their audience and they establish themselves as like a

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<v Speaker 3>credible source.

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<v Speaker 2>Of information at an entertaining one.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and like and usually like in a specific niche.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, all right, so they lurk.

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<v Speaker 3>They darken the doorways of social media platforms like Instagram totally.

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<v Speaker 2>They're almost like street level famous YouTube.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, YouTube, YouTube TikTok.

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<v Speaker 3>And yeah, so they have or they want you to.

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<v Speaker 4>Say, by the way, that is now called ekis in Spanish,

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<v Speaker 4>Oh it's sekis Okay, so YouTube TikTok and ekis.

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<v Speaker 3>And then Insta. So they want you to think that

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<v Speaker 3>they have this like specialized knowledge experience or like authority

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<v Speaker 3>so that their opinions are valuable.

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<v Speaker 2>Totally, or a great life that you're envs like you.

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<v Speaker 3>And they build this trust through interaction. What they want

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<v Speaker 3>you to think is transparency totally and like a consistent

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<v Speaker 3>brand voice.

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<v Speaker 4>Ah.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. So the endorsements, the recommendations, they carry weight. They

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<v Speaker 3>impact people's decisions on things including purchasing stuff totally products

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<v Speaker 3>and services and and so, like you know, they focus on,

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<v Speaker 3>like I said, a specific niche beauty, fashion, fitness, technology.

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<v Speaker 2>Travel, gambling, advice.

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<v Speaker 3>How do yeah, how do they do it?

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<v Speaker 2>Zara? How do they do Elizabeth? Great questions Aaron.

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<v Speaker 3>They create and share various types of content a.

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<v Speaker 2>Photos, videos, steady stream of stuff, live streams.

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<v Speaker 3>It's all just like tailored for this audience. Sometimes they

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<v Speaker 3>do collabse that's true, very true, to promote these products

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<v Speaker 3>or services. It's like sponsored content, reviews, ambassadorships.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, brought to you by Yetti cooler, so you're.

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<v Speaker 3>Like the toblerone ambassador. They get commissions for like hawking

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<v Speaker 3>this stuff, and I understand, yeah, And then they have

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<v Speaker 3>all like these affiliate links and stuff, and they can

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<v Speaker 3>track the sales through their recommendations. Some of them sell

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<v Speaker 3>their own stuff merch digital courses, and they do public events,

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<v Speaker 3>they do conferences, met and greets.

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<v Speaker 2>They've really changed the name of fame.

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<v Speaker 3>They really really have. And here's something that I find interesting.

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<v Speaker 2>What is that, Elizabeth.

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<v Speaker 3>We like to classify and label everything, including influencers. So

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<v Speaker 3>there's a categorization for influencers based on their following. Oh

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<v Speaker 3>really yeah, so mega influencers are celebrities and public figures

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<v Speaker 3>with millions of followers. Millions, okay, so mega influencers, macro

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<v Speaker 3>influencers have five hundred thousand to one million followers.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, I didn't know this was about brokenewer.

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<v Speaker 3>Mid tier influencers they're fifty thousand to five hundred thousand.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 3>Micro influencers they have ten thousand to fifty thousand followers.

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<v Speaker 3>And then there's nano influencers and that's one thousand to

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<v Speaker 3>ten thousand followers. Okay, So, and then there's me, the

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<v Speaker 3>anti influencer.

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<v Speaker 2>Wait, so wait a minute on Ekis on Twitter. Then

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<v Speaker 2>I would have been a nano nano because I had

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<v Speaker 2>like some like six thousand. Yeah, I didn't even know

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<v Speaker 2>what I was.

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<v Speaker 3>That it was right there in front of you. You

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<v Speaker 3>could have monetized.

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<v Speaker 2>I can't wait to tell my family I am.

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<v Speaker 3>The anti influencer. Yeah, I have a private account. I

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<v Speaker 3>have less than a thousand followers, and I'm an anti

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<v Speaker 3>influencer in that if I were to profile a product

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<v Speaker 3>or a lifestyle as cool, it would instantly make it

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<v Speaker 3>uncool and.

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<v Speaker 2>Lose money that's not true.

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<v Speaker 3>I deflate brand, but I can.

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<v Speaker 2>See people being less likely to buy that ruin fads.

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<v Speaker 3>I am an anti influencer, but influencers, right, they're this

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<v Speaker 3>great trope.

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<v Speaker 2>By the way, just interrupt for a second. Would you

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<v Speaker 2>want to be to have and wield that power? It

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<v Speaker 2>feels like something you would hate.

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<v Speaker 3>No, I couldn't. I could. I wouldn't want to. I

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<v Speaker 3>would find it exhausting. Yeah, Like I dabble on social media,

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<v Speaker 3>so I'll post something every now and then, but like,

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<v Speaker 3>I don't have how the interns do it with our

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<v Speaker 3>Instagram account.

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<v Speaker 2>I can't.

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<v Speaker 3>I couldn't keep up with that.

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<v Speaker 2>I stay from social media now. It's all gotten lame anywhere.

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<v Speaker 3>It's exhausting and I don't really care. And so you know, we.

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<v Speaker 2>Also, I mean there's just when I go into Instagram now,

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<v Speaker 2>it's like I don't see people who I follow anymore. No,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm like, wait, what happened? I didn't add any of

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<v Speaker 2>this stuff.

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<v Speaker 3>There's all this stuffy social media I have, But yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>I don't go in there because it's ads and it's

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<v Speaker 3>stuff I don't know why I'm being.

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<v Speaker 2>Shown and they've really changed the game.

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<v Speaker 3>And then if you look someone up who's a friend

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<v Speaker 3>of yours and you see all this stuff that you missed.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, do you have to pay to be an influencer?

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<v Speaker 3>Now?

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, what's up?

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know, but we need to get back to

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<v Speaker 3>like group emails.

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<v Speaker 2>There you go. There.

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<v Speaker 3>It is so we got the trope of the influencer,

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<v Speaker 3>like an airhead who can create the image of success

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<v Speaker 3>and coolness and people just follow blindly.

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<v Speaker 2>Sure.

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<v Speaker 3>I like to see people in public trying to get

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<v Speaker 3>into the game and create quote unquote content.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, like in restaurants and stuff, and they're like reviewing

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<v Speaker 2>the food they're eating and they're alone, the cameras on

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<v Speaker 2>like a little tripod on the table.

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<v Speaker 3>You and I We're at Heifeiburger in Oakland and saw

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<v Speaker 3>a guy doing that.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, That's what I was thinking of.

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<v Speaker 3>It was. It was a really weird thing to watch,

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<v Speaker 3>Like he had multiple cameras set up.

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<v Speaker 2>Totally on a table by himself. He turned his personality on.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and then was like talking. It was really strange.

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<v Speaker 3>But yeah, that's content. I don't like that word.

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<v Speaker 2>Just like marry not content.

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<v Speaker 3>You make stupid videos. It's not content, you make stupid videos.

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<v Speaker 3>I have really set myself up to be like the

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<v Speaker 3>grumpy old gal today anti influencer. It's nine days out

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<v Speaker 3>of ten these days anyway, influencers in public. So it's

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<v Speaker 3>wild and like you see them making their videos and

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<v Speaker 3>like crowded airports.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yes, I've seen that gyms parks their like yoga stuff.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and they've got like some friend filming them. Okay,

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<v Speaker 3>take it from the top. Yeah, the light's really good.

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<v Speaker 3>It looks foolish.

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<v Speaker 2>It also just doesn't look like real or present or

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<v Speaker 2>any of the things you would really want from somebody

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<v Speaker 2>who is trying to influence you. But it's so performing.

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<v Speaker 3>When you see it, it makes me think of like

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<v Speaker 3>if I hear a jingle and a commercial, I automatically

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<v Speaker 3>think about what it looked like when they were recording

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<v Speaker 3>in the studio, Like, well, someone like shredding on a

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<v Speaker 3>guitar and the guy from the ad agency is like,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm sorry, but that's just not giving toyotas on right now,

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<v Speaker 3>like I need to take it from the top. Or

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<v Speaker 3>like a vocalist at the mic like singing her heart

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<v Speaker 3>out and the producer clicks on the speaker and says,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, that was great, but I need you to

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<v Speaker 3>put a little more of a growl in the words

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<v Speaker 3>Maxi pad and she's like, okay, got it, got it,

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<v Speaker 3>Like okay's just again.

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<v Speaker 2>Come on, grab the keys, let me go, let's go.

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<v Speaker 3>So all that said, I have for you today some influencers,

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<v Speaker 3>criminal ones, ones that ran afoul of the law while

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<v Speaker 3>in the act of personal myth making. So that's what

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<v Speaker 3>being an influencer is, right, it's personal myth making, creating

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<v Speaker 3>a persona and a lifestyle that's simply not true, not attainable,

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<v Speaker 3>it's mythic.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>So I'm going to start outside of these here, United States,

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<v Speaker 3>home of innumerable grifters and cons who sail the social

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<v Speaker 3>media sees that we're going over to Bele Italia.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh heck, yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>I want to tell you about Kiara Feranyi. Yeah. So

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<v Speaker 3>she is one of the most prominent figures in Italy

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<v Speaker 3>and fashion media digital entrepreneurship saren. She was born in

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<v Speaker 3>nineteen eighty seven in Cremona, Italy. Her dad was a dentist.

0:11:22.760 --> 0:11:27.960
<v Speaker 3>Her mom, Marina Degardo, is a Sicilian writer who worked

0:11:28.040 --> 0:11:31.960
<v Speaker 3>as deputy director for the fashion brand Blue Marine. So

0:11:32.000 --> 0:11:32.720
<v Speaker 3>she's in that.

0:11:32.960 --> 0:11:34.920
<v Speaker 2>So she's kind of a nepo baby.

0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:37.040
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and she's got these sisters. And when she was

0:11:37.080 --> 0:11:40.400
<v Speaker 3>sixteen years old, she got scouted by a modeling agency

0:11:40.440 --> 0:11:44.520
<v Speaker 3>in Milan. Sixteen Oh okay, when she was six. They

0:11:44.559 --> 0:11:47.000
<v Speaker 3>were like, yeah, look look at those gams.

0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:49.240
<v Speaker 2>You're going You have a future, You have a future.

0:11:50.160 --> 0:11:51.920
<v Speaker 3>So she modeled for a couple of years. She gave

0:11:51.960 --> 0:11:54.439
<v Speaker 3>it up. In two thousand and nine, she and her

0:11:54.440 --> 0:12:00.120
<v Speaker 3>ex boyfriend Ricardo Pizzoli, they started her fashion blog call

0:12:00.400 --> 0:12:01.640
<v Speaker 3>The Blonde Salad.

0:12:02.160 --> 0:12:04.160
<v Speaker 2>Wow. Yeah, just a word salad.

0:12:04.280 --> 0:12:06.360
<v Speaker 3>Maybe it means something, and it sounds better an.

0:12:06.320 --> 0:12:08.120
<v Speaker 2>Italian sounds better than the original Italian?

0:12:08.240 --> 0:12:08.720
<v Speaker 3>Exactly?

0:12:09.480 --> 0:12:12.640
<v Speaker 2>Isn't a soup? Yeah?

0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:13.080
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

0:12:14.320 --> 0:12:17.280
<v Speaker 2>His name is Rick Soup exactly.

0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:22.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. So twenty eleven teen Vogue named her Blogger of

0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:27.160
<v Speaker 3>the Moment. So that's who I lost out to that year, apparently. Yeah,

0:12:27.160 --> 0:12:27.640
<v Speaker 3>it's crazy.

0:12:27.640 --> 0:12:29.320
<v Speaker 2>I thought you had a good shot that year. I know,

0:12:29.840 --> 0:12:30.679
<v Speaker 2>I've been blogging it.

0:12:30.640 --> 0:12:34.000
<v Speaker 3>Up her blog. Though her blog didn't just stay a blog,

0:12:34.160 --> 0:12:37.280
<v Speaker 3>oh no, it evolved into a full scale talent agency

0:12:37.320 --> 0:12:41.360
<v Speaker 3>and fashion brand. She had like a footwear collection. She

0:12:41.440 --> 0:12:46.880
<v Speaker 3>was making millions of euros. Twenty fifteen, she became the

0:12:46.920 --> 0:12:50.040
<v Speaker 3>first fashion blogger to appear on any Vogue cover for

0:12:50.160 --> 0:12:51.480
<v Speaker 3>Vogue Espanya.

0:12:51.160 --> 0:12:51.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh look at her.

0:12:52.000 --> 0:12:54.120
<v Speaker 3>She got featured Forbes thirty under thirty.

0:12:54.480 --> 0:12:55.480
<v Speaker 2>Don't you buy her way on into that?

0:12:55.520 --> 0:12:57.920
<v Speaker 3>I think probably? And she was the subject of a

0:12:57.960 --> 0:13:01.600
<v Speaker 3>Harvard Business School case study. Really a different kind of criminal.

0:13:01.720 --> 0:13:02.600
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

0:13:03.040 --> 0:13:08.719
<v Speaker 3>So by twenty seventeen, Kiara had ten million followers on Instagram.

0:13:09.160 --> 0:13:10.000
<v Speaker 3>Ten million.

0:13:10.520 --> 0:13:12.559
<v Speaker 2>That's a lot. Yeah, it's a lot of people.

0:13:12.760 --> 0:13:16.680
<v Speaker 3>She launched these collections. She had a capsule collection, like

0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:19.720
<v Speaker 3>literally with n Espresso in twenty twenty one.

0:13:20.360 --> 0:13:22.560
<v Speaker 2>The coffee maker. So it wasn't closed, it was like

0:13:22.760 --> 0:13:23.760
<v Speaker 2>which coffee.

0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:28.160
<v Speaker 3>It was like special coffees. She had fragrance quote initiatives,

0:13:28.280 --> 0:13:32.400
<v Speaker 3>as some sources called them. I have a fragrance initiative

0:13:32.559 --> 0:13:34.839
<v Speaker 3>and I, you know, put on the old squirts and

0:13:34.880 --> 0:13:35.640
<v Speaker 3>then walk out of.

0:13:37.280 --> 0:13:39.000
<v Speaker 2>I have a fragrance initiative. Like when I've been in

0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:40.920
<v Speaker 2>like a closed room for a while, someone comes up

0:13:40.960 --> 0:13:42.520
<v Speaker 2>and I'm like, I know it's crazy in here.

0:13:44.360 --> 0:13:46.280
<v Speaker 3>That's right, that's an initiative.

0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:47.760
<v Speaker 2>We have to take an initiative.

0:13:49.000 --> 0:13:53.679
<v Speaker 3>So she appeared in documentaries like Kiar for any unposted,

0:13:54.800 --> 0:13:59.640
<v Speaker 3>and then she had this reality series The Ferragnz What

0:14:00.120 --> 0:14:02.439
<v Speaker 3>and that ran from twenty twenty to twenty twenty three.

0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:08.120
<v Speaker 3>Because he she married an Italian rapper called Fedes fed Easy.

0:14:08.320 --> 0:14:09.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh so this was their portmanteau.

0:14:10.080 --> 0:14:12.480
<v Speaker 3>And his real name is Fredriko Luccia.

0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:13.920
<v Speaker 2>He didn't stay with that.

0:14:13.920 --> 0:14:16.640
<v Speaker 3>That's a good nose, right, I mean, that's like that's

0:14:17.160 --> 0:14:20.080
<v Speaker 3>you could be smooth, don't know, he's like one of

0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:23.160
<v Speaker 3>those illustrated man types. He looks like the desk in

0:14:23.200 --> 0:14:25.960
<v Speaker 3>a poorly performing high school's detention room. Like he's all

0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:30.200
<v Speaker 3>scribble city. So the couple there they became known as

0:14:30.440 --> 0:14:33.320
<v Speaker 3>Faragnez and I know I'm not saying that, like, you.

0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:37.040
<v Speaker 2>Know, sure the benefit of their yeah Italy exactly.

0:14:37.120 --> 0:14:40.280
<v Speaker 3>So they had two kids before separating in early twenty

0:14:40.320 --> 0:14:43.800
<v Speaker 3>twenty four. But they'll always have that reality show. I'm

0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:45.720
<v Speaker 3>shocked it didn't last, to be honest. Oh so a

0:14:45.840 --> 0:14:49.240
<v Speaker 3>lot so she served as a judge or like guest

0:14:49.320 --> 0:14:52.680
<v Speaker 3>judge on shows like Project Runway, Making the Cut and

0:14:52.920 --> 0:14:56.720
<v Speaker 3>the San Remo Music Festival. She's just everywhere sounds and

0:14:56.720 --> 0:14:59.640
<v Speaker 3>she also she's got all these brand partnerships mashups. If

0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:03.640
<v Speaker 3>he will late in twenty twenty two, she partnered with Balco,

0:15:04.400 --> 0:15:08.800
<v Speaker 3>a well known confectionery company, to launch a limited edition

0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:12.880
<v Speaker 3>pink Christmas Pandora, branded with her logo.

0:15:13.240 --> 0:15:16.440
<v Speaker 2>That's a bread, right, what is Pandora? What is Pandora? Elizabeth? Clearly,

0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:16.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't know.

0:15:17.080 --> 0:15:18.160
<v Speaker 3>I'm so good at asking.

0:15:18.320 --> 0:15:19.880
<v Speaker 2>Yes, great question, Elizabeth.

0:15:20.800 --> 0:15:24.640
<v Speaker 3>Pandora is a traditional Italian sweet bread. Okay, you have

0:15:24.680 --> 0:15:25.600
<v Speaker 3>it during Christmas?

0:15:25.680 --> 0:15:27.120
<v Speaker 2>Her pan, I just assume bread.

0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:29.880
<v Speaker 3>It's a golden bread, a Dior.

0:15:30.480 --> 0:15:30.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:34.760
<v Speaker 3>So it came from Verona Fair, Verona.

0:15:34.560 --> 0:15:35.520
<v Speaker 2>The gentleman, come from there.

0:15:35.600 --> 0:15:38.960
<v Speaker 3>Yes, it's known for its golden color. It has like

0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:42.240
<v Speaker 3>a fluffy Brioche like text. Oh that sounds good, signature

0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:47.000
<v Speaker 3>eight point star shape. You bake it into a special.

0:15:46.640 --> 0:15:47.640
<v Speaker 2>Mold Okay, there we go.

0:15:47.720 --> 0:15:50.080
<v Speaker 3>It gets dusted with powdered sugar. It looks like snow

0:15:50.120 --> 0:15:51.680
<v Speaker 3>covered mountains. It's delishes.

0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:52.320
<v Speaker 2>Sound good?

0:15:52.360 --> 0:15:54.360
<v Speaker 3>You've actually had it at my place?

0:15:54.520 --> 0:15:54.840
<v Speaker 2>Have I?

0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:59.360
<v Speaker 3>Because Sarah Tasioni, the Colabrian cutie. Yes, she always brings

0:15:59.400 --> 0:15:59.840
<v Speaker 3>one over.

0:15:59.760 --> 0:16:02.040
<v Speaker 2>The it is Okay, I would like to try it

0:16:02.040 --> 0:16:04.880
<v Speaker 2>again because it sounds amazing. Apparently the first time you.

0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:07.080
<v Speaker 3>Did, you did, but she just don't remember these things.

0:16:07.840 --> 0:16:10.400
<v Speaker 3>You know, you got drunk on Pandora and then we

0:16:10.480 --> 0:16:13.040
<v Speaker 3>had to wheel you out the door. So these things

0:16:13.080 --> 0:16:16.080
<v Speaker 3>are everywhere in the shops at holiday times, all right,

0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:18.480
<v Speaker 3>and they come in like those cool boxes. It's like

0:16:18.560 --> 0:16:23.080
<v Speaker 3>a curved top cardboard box, like a dome almost, and

0:16:23.120 --> 0:16:25.720
<v Speaker 3>the boxes are a lot of times really beautifully decorated.

0:16:26.320 --> 0:16:29.720
<v Speaker 3>Hers was special. It was a stylish pink box with

0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:32.800
<v Speaker 3>a red ribbon on top, and there was matching pink

0:16:33.080 --> 0:16:34.200
<v Speaker 3>icing on the Pandora.

0:16:34.480 --> 0:16:36.800
<v Speaker 2>Okay, the millennial, yes.

0:16:37.200 --> 0:16:39.120
<v Speaker 3>And there are all sorts of pictures of her pretending

0:16:39.160 --> 0:16:40.720
<v Speaker 3>to take a bite of a slice of it where

0:16:40.760 --> 0:16:44.120
<v Speaker 3>she's like yeah, and then you know she's like spits

0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:44.400
<v Speaker 3>it out.

0:16:44.600 --> 0:16:46.160
<v Speaker 2>I like it if she did that, and then like smile,

0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:48.000
<v Speaker 2>there's just crumbs all on her teeth and like I

0:16:48.080 --> 0:16:49.160
<v Speaker 2>love these Whereas.

0:16:48.920 --> 0:16:51.320
<v Speaker 3>They caught her like mid where it's just like half

0:16:51.360 --> 0:16:55.480
<v Speaker 3>the pieces left, she's like and like a hand mark

0:16:55.520 --> 0:17:00.720
<v Speaker 3>of so it. But it wasn't just that the packaging

0:17:00.840 --> 0:17:04.439
<v Speaker 3>was cute and the was cute and she's cute. The

0:17:04.520 --> 0:17:07.800
<v Speaker 3>campaign was promoting a charity initiative.

0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:08.800
<v Speaker 2>What's the charity initiative?

0:17:09.400 --> 0:17:12.160
<v Speaker 3>I'm so glad? I asked that buyers they were led

0:17:12.200 --> 0:17:14.639
<v Speaker 3>to believe that a portion of each cakes I believe

0:17:15.280 --> 0:17:19.040
<v Speaker 3>would be donated to the Regina Margherita Children's Hospital in

0:17:19.040 --> 0:17:25.600
<v Speaker 3>Turin to support Turino, to support sarcoma and youing sarcoma.

0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:28.120
<v Speaker 2>Research, dear god, children's cancer, and that of.

0:17:28.080 --> 0:17:30.960
<v Speaker 3>Course didn't happen, which is really you know why we're

0:17:30.960 --> 0:17:34.359
<v Speaker 3>talking about her. So in reality, the company Baloco, they

0:17:34.400 --> 0:17:37.520
<v Speaker 3>made a single donation of fifty thousand euros before the

0:17:37.560 --> 0:17:39.720
<v Speaker 3>promotional campaign began, okay, and.

0:17:39.600 --> 0:17:40.160
<v Speaker 2>That was it.

0:17:40.760 --> 0:17:44.160
<v Speaker 3>No further donations tied to sales volume, which is how

0:17:44.200 --> 0:17:44.960
<v Speaker 3>those things normally.

0:17:45.320 --> 0:17:46.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's the idea.

0:17:46.280 --> 0:17:49.560
<v Speaker 3>And these these cakes were priced at around nine euros each,

0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:53.240
<v Speaker 3>and that's compared to the normal like you know, three, three,

0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:57.720
<v Speaker 3>seventy or four euros.

0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:58.520
<v Speaker 2>So there's very specific like that.

0:17:58.800 --> 0:18:02.680
<v Speaker 3>So there's like a steep mark. Her companies made nearly

0:18:02.760 --> 0:18:08.119
<v Speaker 3>a million dollars in licensing promotional revenue, and remember peeled

0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:10.840
<v Speaker 3>off only fifty k for kids cancer. Wow.

0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:11.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:18:11.200 --> 0:18:17.119
<v Speaker 3>So there was this journalist, Silvaggia Lucerelli, and she, like herself,

0:18:17.240 --> 0:18:19.960
<v Speaker 3>is pretty problematic and has been sued fifteen ways to

0:18:20.000 --> 0:18:25.000
<v Speaker 3>Sunday for privacy violations defamations right now, Well, she uncovered

0:18:25.000 --> 0:18:27.160
<v Speaker 3>the discrepancy, so I'll say, okay, good job.

0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:27.680
<v Speaker 2>Get on her. Yeah.

0:18:28.359 --> 0:18:33.320
<v Speaker 3>By early twenty twenty four, Italy's antitrust authority had opened

0:18:33.359 --> 0:18:39.160
<v Speaker 3>an investigation into both Farani and the Pandora company Ploco.

0:18:39.680 --> 0:18:42.520
<v Speaker 3>So they figured that the consumers had been misled into

0:18:42.560 --> 0:18:46.280
<v Speaker 3>thinking that the purchases triggered donations, when in fact the

0:18:46.359 --> 0:18:47.680
<v Speaker 3>donations was independent.

0:18:47.800 --> 0:18:48.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:18:48.400 --> 0:18:51.760
<v Speaker 3>So she and her companies were fined over a million euros,

0:18:51.920 --> 0:18:54.880
<v Speaker 3>and then the cake company got fined around six hundred

0:18:54.880 --> 0:18:58.720
<v Speaker 3>and seventy five thousand. She publicly apologized. She said she

0:18:58.800 --> 0:19:02.480
<v Speaker 3>believed that no trial necessary to prove her innocence, and

0:19:02.520 --> 0:19:03.880
<v Speaker 3>she's like, you know what, I'm going to go ahead

0:19:03.920 --> 0:19:06.640
<v Speaker 3>and donate a million euros to the hospital, and I'm

0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:09.920
<v Speaker 3>never going to mix charity and commerce in future promotions.

0:19:10.320 --> 0:19:12.960
<v Speaker 3>And then people started digging around some more and they

0:19:13.000 --> 0:19:19.199
<v Speaker 3>found other like hanky charity stuff. She did Easter Eggs

0:19:19.240 --> 0:19:22.240
<v Speaker 3>in twenty twenty one and twenty twenty two, and then

0:19:22.320 --> 0:19:25.000
<v Speaker 3>all these other branded collaborations that were supposed to have

0:19:25.240 --> 0:19:30.240
<v Speaker 3>a charity aspect to it. A similar structures payments to

0:19:30.280 --> 0:19:34.720
<v Speaker 3>her brands while no conditional donations were made. This consumer

0:19:34.800 --> 0:19:40.320
<v Speaker 3>group CODACONS filed complaints across all these Italian jurisdictions. Multiple

0:19:40.320 --> 0:19:45.919
<v Speaker 3>investigations were initiated into all this like aggravated fraud. So

0:19:46.080 --> 0:19:49.800
<v Speaker 3>October of twenty twenty four, Milan prosecutors concluded that she

0:19:49.880 --> 0:19:54.159
<v Speaker 3>had realized an unjust profit of two point two five

0:19:54.320 --> 0:19:57.879
<v Speaker 3>million euros via all these schemes, and they wanted to

0:19:57.920 --> 0:20:01.040
<v Speaker 3>do indicteror for aggravated fraud. By it's December of twenty

0:20:01.080 --> 0:20:05.199
<v Speaker 3>twenty four, she reached a settlement with CODACNS, agreeing to

0:20:05.240 --> 0:20:08.359
<v Speaker 3>compensate all the affected consumers with one hundred and fifty

0:20:08.359 --> 0:20:13.240
<v Speaker 3>euros each, reimbursed legal expenses, and donate two hundred thousand

0:20:13.240 --> 0:20:15.680
<v Speaker 3>euros to an anti violence charity for women.

0:20:15.920 --> 0:20:20.280
<v Speaker 2>She essentially stole some two and whatever million euros from

0:20:20.320 --> 0:20:22.560
<v Speaker 2>all these charities, and she gets off with a slap

0:20:22.560 --> 0:20:24.199
<v Speaker 2>on the rest essentially.

0:20:23.680 --> 0:20:28.360
<v Speaker 3>And then they withdrew their complaints. So despite the settlement,

0:20:28.480 --> 0:20:32.800
<v Speaker 3>January twenty twenty five, the Milan prosecutor formally indicted her

0:20:33.320 --> 0:20:38.520
<v Speaker 3>on aggravated fraud charges, along with Bloco's leadership and her

0:20:38.680 --> 0:20:43.280
<v Speaker 3>former manager Fabio Dmato. So a trial is set to

0:20:43.280 --> 0:20:44.400
<v Speaker 3>begin in September.

0:20:44.680 --> 0:20:46.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh so she actually still catch some with justice.

0:20:47.040 --> 0:20:49.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, she faces up to five years in prison.

0:20:50.160 --> 0:20:50.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:20:50.960 --> 0:20:55.080
<v Speaker 3>Simultaneously, the scandal triggered legislative change, a sort of Jackie

0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:59.160
<v Speaker 3>Cougan situation. In early twenty twenty four, Italy enacted the

0:20:59.200 --> 0:21:04.480
<v Speaker 3>Ferrani Law, requiring influencers with over one million followers to

0:21:04.680 --> 0:21:09.200
<v Speaker 3>clearly disclose and legally structure charitable promotions to combat false

0:21:09.240 --> 0:21:10.240
<v Speaker 3>advertising and fraud.

0:21:10.320 --> 0:21:11.800
<v Speaker 2>That's amazing they put her name on the law.

0:21:11.920 --> 0:21:14.040
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, if you got over a million. So let's let's

0:21:14.040 --> 0:21:16.600
<v Speaker 3>stop there for a bit. I need to hear some ads.

0:21:16.720 --> 0:21:21.240
<v Speaker 3>I'm hoping for one for some influencer stuff. That would

0:21:21.240 --> 0:21:24.320
<v Speaker 3>be amazing. When we come back, more social media scamming

0:21:44.600 --> 0:21:47.880
<v Speaker 3>Zareneth Saren All right, are you ready to influence?

0:21:48.160 --> 0:21:48.880
<v Speaker 2>You don't have to get ready.

0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:54.159
<v Speaker 3>If you stay ready, let me tell you something. Belle Gibson, like,

0:21:54.240 --> 0:21:56.600
<v Speaker 3>I'm talking about the star of such his as lethal

0:21:56.640 --> 0:22:01.679
<v Speaker 3>weapon three, what women want? Daddy's home too, tim and

0:22:01.760 --> 0:22:05.240
<v Speaker 3>boss level but with a stuffed up nose Bell Gibson,

0:22:06.280 --> 0:22:08.159
<v Speaker 3>which I have quite a bit anyway, because I'm a

0:22:08.200 --> 0:22:11.000
<v Speaker 3>delicate orchid. In the slightest thing sets my systems up.

0:22:11.000 --> 0:22:11.520
<v Speaker 2>This is true.

0:22:11.640 --> 0:22:17.560
<v Speaker 3>No, I said Belle Gibson, not Mel Gibson. Belle is

0:22:17.600 --> 0:22:20.480
<v Speaker 3>another Aussie and one who's also full of it. Oh

0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:23.400
<v Speaker 3>really yeah, So she was born Annabelle Natalie Gibson.

0:22:23.600 --> 0:22:25.479
<v Speaker 2>Does she Do you think she intentionally tried to make

0:22:25.520 --> 0:22:27.280
<v Speaker 2>it Bell Gibson. So it's kind of had like.

0:22:27.240 --> 0:22:33.960
<v Speaker 3>That, probably Bell Gibson. Belle Gibson with boord and like

0:22:34.080 --> 0:22:39.480
<v Speaker 3>to do well in Tasmania Devil. She dropped out of

0:22:39.520 --> 0:22:42.840
<v Speaker 3>high school. She moved to Perth, Australia. She got work

0:22:42.880 --> 0:22:46.600
<v Speaker 3>at like a catering supply company, and she got super

0:22:46.640 --> 0:22:49.879
<v Speaker 3>into skateboarding culture there. Good for her, right, and she

0:22:50.040 --> 0:22:52.880
<v Speaker 3>was a big online presence in that community because that's

0:22:52.880 --> 0:22:56.720
<v Speaker 3>where all the action takes place with skateboarding is online totally.

0:22:56.840 --> 0:23:00.400
<v Speaker 3>That's really the spot really where everything happens. In July

0:23:00.440 --> 0:23:04.880
<v Speaker 3>of two thousand and nine, she moved to Melbourne, Melbourne, Melbourne, Melbourne,

0:23:05.160 --> 0:23:08.560
<v Speaker 3>Melbourne and the next year, when she was eighteen, she

0:23:08.600 --> 0:23:11.920
<v Speaker 3>had a kid. Congratulations. A couple of years go by

0:23:12.000 --> 0:23:14.600
<v Speaker 3>then she made it to the big time. She opened

0:23:14.640 --> 0:23:20.240
<v Speaker 3>an Instagram account. H No, she w buddy, I wish,

0:23:20.359 --> 0:23:22.959
<v Speaker 3>I wish. So she has this Instagram account. It has

0:23:23.000 --> 0:23:28.040
<v Speaker 3>now been deleted. I think healing underscore bell and she

0:23:28.160 --> 0:23:32.479
<v Speaker 3>claimed that she had multiple cancers, including a terminal brain tumor.

0:23:33.440 --> 0:23:36.720
<v Speaker 3>Tragic news and then she's like, oh, ps, I also

0:23:36.840 --> 0:23:40.440
<v Speaker 3>I healed myself through natural diets and holistic health approaches,

0:23:41.800 --> 0:23:43.959
<v Speaker 3>so you know that's the way it works with terminal

0:23:44.000 --> 0:23:50.679
<v Speaker 3>brain cancer and other cancers. I have had it up

0:23:50.680 --> 0:23:56.760
<v Speaker 3>to hear with pseudoscience, like science denial. Food is medicine, yes,

0:23:57.920 --> 0:23:59.960
<v Speaker 3>but it's not the only medicine. Yes, eat your color

0:24:00.040 --> 0:24:02.760
<v Speaker 3>is very important, but it's not the only medicine. If

0:24:02.800 --> 0:24:05.760
<v Speaker 3>you buy into this, please don't message me or email

0:24:05.840 --> 0:24:09.240
<v Speaker 3>us or leave some like wounded comment. I'm glad you

0:24:09.280 --> 0:24:12.240
<v Speaker 3>feel like you've accomplished something, but we are seeing people

0:24:12.359 --> 0:24:15.639
<v Speaker 3>dying as a result of the ignorance that blossoms in

0:24:15.720 --> 0:24:17.119
<v Speaker 3>this BS wellness culture.

0:24:17.119 --> 0:24:19.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I know, legit, people that likely have been dying.

0:24:20.160 --> 0:24:23.400
<v Speaker 2>Amanda from MTV she died press cancer, which she could

0:24:23.440 --> 0:24:24.000
<v Speaker 2>have been treating it.

0:24:24.280 --> 0:24:28.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, exactly, And TikTok not a source of health information.

0:24:28.800 --> 0:24:31.240
<v Speaker 2>Now, all the short form videos just generally.

0:24:30.960 --> 0:24:33.040
<v Speaker 3>Pasteurization important and safe.

0:24:33.200 --> 0:24:33.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah that's true.

0:24:34.000 --> 0:24:39.480
<v Speaker 3>Vaccines save lives. Yeah, yeah, Gibson was going around telling

0:24:39.480 --> 0:24:41.960
<v Speaker 3>the media that she had this brain cancer. She also

0:24:42.000 --> 0:24:46.080
<v Speaker 3>had blood, spleen, uterine, liver, and kidney cancer.

0:24:46.240 --> 0:24:47.040
<v Speaker 2>What the hell?

0:24:47.600 --> 0:24:51.800
<v Speaker 3>What bad luck? Right? Bad luck? No, not bad luck.

0:24:51.880 --> 0:24:54.120
<v Speaker 3>She said she got all of those as a reaction

0:24:54.280 --> 0:24:56.840
<v Speaker 3>to the Gardasle cervical cancer vaccine.

0:24:56.960 --> 0:25:00.400
<v Speaker 2>Oh wow, So she threw shade on real legit vaccine. Yeah,

0:25:00.480 --> 0:25:01.760
<v Speaker 2>and she's like, I got all the cancer.

0:25:01.880 --> 0:25:03.600
<v Speaker 3>But she's like, you know, the thing is, what's great,

0:25:03.680 --> 0:25:05.760
<v Speaker 3>I cured my cancer with Whole Foods.

0:25:06.280 --> 0:25:06.800
<v Speaker 2>So a.

0:25:08.359 --> 0:25:12.800
<v Speaker 3>Year after starting her Instagram account, she debuted The Whole Pantry,

0:25:13.080 --> 0:25:17.879
<v Speaker 3>which was a mobile app that blended healthy recipes, positive affirmations,

0:25:18.160 --> 0:25:19.520
<v Speaker 3>and wellness philosophy.

0:25:19.680 --> 0:25:21.679
<v Speaker 2>Now you know, I grew up eating health food. I

0:25:21.720 --> 0:25:24.760
<v Speaker 2>was a vegetarian as a kid, so I understand and

0:25:24.800 --> 0:25:27.159
<v Speaker 2>will argue for the benefit of food being key. But

0:25:27.200 --> 0:25:29.720
<v Speaker 2>I'm with you. I cannot stand this stuff that people

0:25:29.720 --> 0:25:31.199
<v Speaker 2>have been doing because now it's hard for people to

0:25:31.240 --> 0:25:32.800
<v Speaker 2>find the real science because of.

0:25:32.760 --> 0:25:37.760
<v Speaker 3>These exactly exactly, so, this app, The Whole Pantry, was

0:25:37.800 --> 0:25:41.800
<v Speaker 3>downloaded two hundred thousand times in its first month, and

0:25:41.840 --> 0:25:44.280
<v Speaker 3>then it was later selected as one of Apple's best

0:25:44.320 --> 0:25:47.880
<v Speaker 3>food and drink apps in twenty thirteen. That is who

0:25:47.880 --> 0:25:51.320
<v Speaker 3>we lost out to that year's Zarin right. Okay, so

0:25:51.359 --> 0:25:54.600
<v Speaker 3>it was also slated to be pre installed on the

0:25:54.680 --> 0:25:56.920
<v Speaker 3>new Apple Watch in twenty fifteen.

0:25:56.640 --> 0:25:57.480
<v Speaker 2>Like a youtwo song.

0:25:58.040 --> 0:26:00.280
<v Speaker 3>Well you know how great Apple is when it comes

0:26:00.280 --> 0:26:01.840
<v Speaker 3>to judgment and pre installations.

0:26:01.920 --> 0:26:04.520
<v Speaker 2>No products, it never failed, no, no always good ones. Yeah,

0:26:04.520 --> 0:26:06.399
<v Speaker 2>so around, I still can't get that YouTube bottom of

0:26:06.480 --> 0:26:08.720
<v Speaker 2>my computer, my phone, my iPad.

0:26:08.960 --> 0:26:12.520
<v Speaker 3>It never around the same time, she secured a cookbook deal,

0:26:13.000 --> 0:26:15.400
<v Speaker 3>and when the book was launched in November of twenty fourteen,

0:26:15.520 --> 0:26:17.600
<v Speaker 3>she wrote in the preface that she had been quote

0:26:17.840 --> 0:26:20.800
<v Speaker 3>stable for two years now with no growth of the cancer.

0:26:21.640 --> 0:26:23.439
<v Speaker 3>But that didn't match up what she'd said in the

0:26:23.480 --> 0:26:25.760
<v Speaker 3>press and in her social media, Like she was telling

0:26:25.800 --> 0:26:29.040
<v Speaker 3>magazines that the cancer had reached her liver and her kidneys.

0:26:29.600 --> 0:26:32.600
<v Speaker 3>She posted on The Whole Pantry's Facebook page that her

0:26:32.640 --> 0:26:35.840
<v Speaker 3>cancer had spread to her brain, blood, spleen, and uterus.

0:26:36.320 --> 0:26:38.280
<v Speaker 3>And then she doubled down. She's like, you know what,

0:26:38.440 --> 0:26:40.960
<v Speaker 3>it's I don't just have cancer, I have heart failure too.

0:26:41.160 --> 0:26:42.280
<v Speaker 2>I also have hair cancer.

0:26:43.280 --> 0:26:47.200
<v Speaker 3>She said, that's that. Get damned hair cancer. She said

0:26:47.200 --> 0:26:49.639
<v Speaker 3>she had to have heart surgery quote several times.

0:26:49.880 --> 0:26:50.639
<v Speaker 2>Several times.

0:26:50.840 --> 0:26:52.840
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and then she even died on the table once

0:26:52.880 --> 0:26:54.600
<v Speaker 3>and they were all clear and they brought her back.

0:26:54.720 --> 0:26:56.919
<v Speaker 2>She didn't start doing near death experienced stuff and I

0:26:56.960 --> 0:26:57.960
<v Speaker 2>went to heaven and came back.

0:26:58.040 --> 0:27:02.040
<v Speaker 3>But like, was that enough? No? No, what story people

0:27:02.040 --> 0:27:04.919
<v Speaker 3>would say, can we interview your doctors and look at

0:27:04.920 --> 0:27:09.960
<v Speaker 3>your charts? Like we've never seen anything like this for

0:27:10.040 --> 0:27:14.399
<v Speaker 3>someone who'd undergone multiple heart surgeries. She was shockingly scarfree.

0:27:14.680 --> 0:27:18.280
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, zipper or no, it was the chest.

0:27:18.200 --> 0:27:21.240
<v Speaker 3>No, nothing, no, raised, it was you know.

0:27:22.240 --> 0:27:23.120
<v Speaker 2>Exactly.

0:27:24.840 --> 0:27:28.199
<v Speaker 3>Through the nose. So, like I said earlier, and we've agreed,

0:27:28.200 --> 0:27:31.760
<v Speaker 3>food is medicine. That's undisputed. And the whole pantry was

0:27:31.800 --> 0:27:34.639
<v Speaker 3>actually like a good thing in terms of promoting movement

0:27:34.640 --> 0:27:37.440
<v Speaker 3>and exercise and positivity and healthy eating.

0:27:37.520 --> 0:27:39.919
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, they'll name some good stuff and what they're catching

0:27:39.960 --> 0:27:41.879
<v Speaker 2>app wasn't. That's why it gets confusing.

0:27:42.040 --> 0:27:44.679
<v Speaker 3>The app wasn't the problem. The problem was Old Girl's

0:27:44.800 --> 0:27:48.440
<v Speaker 3>Instagram account. So that's where she was like touting snake

0:27:48.480 --> 0:27:53.160
<v Speaker 3>oil stuff like coffee enemas, juice cleanses, detox liver cleansing,

0:27:53.200 --> 0:27:55.359
<v Speaker 3>which ps, that's what your liver does. For a living

0:27:56.160 --> 0:27:59.160
<v Speaker 3>and then like really dangerous stuff like anti facts and

0:27:59.440 --> 0:28:04.800
<v Speaker 3>drinking the pasteurized raw milk brainworm City basically. So either way,

0:28:05.200 --> 0:28:08.439
<v Speaker 3>she's making moves, she's doing deals, and she was living

0:28:08.520 --> 0:28:10.920
<v Speaker 3>large too, Like she had this really posh townhouse, she

0:28:11.000 --> 0:28:14.240
<v Speaker 3>drove a luxury car, elegant office space. She was getting

0:28:14.240 --> 0:28:19.600
<v Speaker 3>like cosmetic dental procedures. Yeah, she wore designer clothes. She

0:28:19.680 --> 0:28:23.919
<v Speaker 3>took all these really extravagant international vacations, sales of the

0:28:23.960 --> 0:28:27.160
<v Speaker 3>app and the book combined to bring in more than

0:28:27.720 --> 0:28:31.160
<v Speaker 3>one hundred million Australian dollars for our miracle gal. What

0:28:32.080 --> 0:28:34.040
<v Speaker 3>she was on the brink of expanding out into a

0:28:34.080 --> 0:28:36.920
<v Speaker 3>brand called The Whole Life, not just the whole Pantry,

0:28:36.960 --> 0:28:39.200
<v Speaker 3>the Whole Life, which seems like a lot, The Whole

0:28:39.240 --> 0:28:40.719
<v Speaker 3>Life all that's everything.

0:28:40.800 --> 0:28:43.800
<v Speaker 2>I'm still stuck on one hundred million, the Australian dollars.

0:28:43.760 --> 0:28:47.400
<v Speaker 3>Right, No, one million million? Did I say it? It's

0:28:47.440 --> 0:28:52.440
<v Speaker 3>one million anyway, So she of course claimed charitable intentions.

0:28:52.960 --> 0:28:55.840
<v Speaker 3>So I feel like the Kardashians are the only ones

0:28:56.200 --> 0:28:58.280
<v Speaker 3>on this ship of fools who just take the money

0:28:58.280 --> 0:29:01.800
<v Speaker 3>and don't try to do some bogus I don't know,

0:29:01.840 --> 0:29:05.400
<v Speaker 3>maybe they do. I don't know willingly follow what they do.

0:29:05.680 --> 0:29:08.880
<v Speaker 3>Everything I know is through osmosis. I watch a lot

0:29:08.920 --> 0:29:11.840
<v Speaker 3>of stuff on TV, like a lot, but I draw

0:29:11.880 --> 0:29:14.480
<v Speaker 3>the line at around on that, Oh my gosh, I'm

0:29:14.520 --> 0:29:19.200
<v Speaker 3>so living my truth and honest and transparent. Anyway, So,

0:29:19.280 --> 0:29:23.760
<v Speaker 3>Gibbson said that she donated substantial proceeds up to three

0:29:23.840 --> 0:29:27.960
<v Speaker 3>hundred thousand dollars to various causes, including like children with cancer,

0:29:28.160 --> 0:29:32.960
<v Speaker 3>maternal health care, but investigative reports revealed that only a

0:29:33.000 --> 0:29:36.440
<v Speaker 3>few thousand dollars were actually donated, like two percent of

0:29:36.480 --> 0:29:39.960
<v Speaker 3>what she claimed. Yeah, And since rumors about her possible

0:29:40.000 --> 0:29:42.880
<v Speaker 3>fraud started to spread, people looked into all her business

0:29:42.880 --> 0:29:46.760
<v Speaker 3>dealings and it came out that her charitable contributions from

0:29:46.760 --> 0:29:49.880
<v Speaker 3>both twenty thirteen and twenty fourteen never made it to

0:29:49.920 --> 0:29:53.880
<v Speaker 3>the stated destinations. And Gimbson is like, that's a lie.

0:29:54.200 --> 0:29:56.160
<v Speaker 3>And the press were like, no, you're the lie. You

0:29:56.200 --> 0:29:57.200
<v Speaker 3>are one big lie.

0:29:57.440 --> 0:29:58.800
<v Speaker 2>You're the lie. Yeah.

0:30:00.560 --> 0:30:04.440
<v Speaker 3>So Fairfax Media they found that she had quote failed

0:30:04.440 --> 0:30:06.880
<v Speaker 3>to hand over the proceeds solicited in the name of

0:30:06.960 --> 0:30:11.160
<v Speaker 3>five charities and had quote grossly overstated the company's total

0:30:11.200 --> 0:30:14.440
<v Speaker 3>donations to different causes When asked about this, two of

0:30:14.480 --> 0:30:17.040
<v Speaker 3>the charities backed it up. They were like, she used

0:30:17.040 --> 0:30:19.560
<v Speaker 3>our name in fundraising drives, but that was like as

0:30:19.600 --> 0:30:22.960
<v Speaker 3>far as we got involved, some of them got shady

0:30:23.040 --> 0:30:24.680
<v Speaker 3>little bits of money or no money at all.

0:30:24.800 --> 0:30:25.080
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

0:30:25.560 --> 0:30:27.640
<v Speaker 3>One of the big claims was that the whole pantry

0:30:27.720 --> 0:30:31.560
<v Speaker 3>donated three hundred thousand to charity, not just the cancer stuff,

0:30:31.600 --> 0:30:34.920
<v Speaker 3>but like you know, healthcare and impoverished countries and like

0:30:34.960 --> 0:30:36.680
<v Speaker 3>schools and sub Saharan Africa.

0:30:36.800 --> 0:30:38.360
<v Speaker 2>Oh that that old.

0:30:38.560 --> 0:30:39.360
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:30:39.400 --> 0:30:41.400
<v Speaker 2>People always picked the same ones because it's like, oh,

0:30:41.440 --> 0:30:43.640
<v Speaker 2>you're doing such good work with those ports children and

0:30:43.840 --> 0:30:46.160
<v Speaker 2>some South in Africa who don't even have deaths at schools,

0:30:46.520 --> 0:30:47.880
<v Speaker 2>and those kids with cancer.

0:30:48.160 --> 0:30:50.040
<v Speaker 3>Tell me the name of the country or the city

0:30:50.160 --> 0:30:54.480
<v Speaker 3>or the village, like no, just deepest, darkest stuff. So

0:30:54.760 --> 0:30:57.160
<v Speaker 3>at one point she said she was working with twenty

0:30:57.280 --> 0:30:59.880
<v Speaker 3>different charities. Twenty Yeah, that was a major exact.

0:31:00.560 --> 0:31:02.360
<v Speaker 2>It's also a nice round number. She should have gone

0:31:02.360 --> 0:31:03.120
<v Speaker 2>with eighteen, I know.

0:31:03.440 --> 0:31:06.600
<v Speaker 3>So they presented with all this damning evidence of her fraud.

0:31:06.680 --> 0:31:09.400
<v Speaker 3>She admitted like, okay, yeah, that is a major exaggeration.

0:31:09.880 --> 0:31:12.480
<v Speaker 3>So the press they really start digging in. They calculate

0:31:12.600 --> 0:31:16.120
<v Speaker 3>that she had donated a total of about seven grand

0:31:16.600 --> 0:31:20.280
<v Speaker 3>spread among three charities, and that's a long way from

0:31:20.360 --> 0:31:21.680
<v Speaker 3>three hundred thousand dollars.

0:31:22.200 --> 0:31:24.000
<v Speaker 2>The best kind of Reporters also found she doesn't even

0:31:24.040 --> 0:31:24.840
<v Speaker 2>tip at restaurants.

0:31:24.880 --> 0:31:27.720
<v Speaker 3>Well, and then a thousand of that seven thousand was

0:31:27.760 --> 0:31:31.640
<v Speaker 3>only donated after the media investigations came to light. She's

0:31:31.680 --> 0:31:36.040
<v Speaker 3>got to throw another thousand in it. And some of

0:31:36.080 --> 0:31:39.240
<v Speaker 3>the seven thousand wasn't even donated in her name or

0:31:39.280 --> 0:31:41.920
<v Speaker 3>the company's name. It was just under someone else's name.

0:31:42.360 --> 0:31:45.600
<v Speaker 3>Because you know, I make a lot of really big donations,

0:31:45.600 --> 0:31:48.040
<v Speaker 3>but I do it under my other name, Mackenzie Scott,

0:31:49.200 --> 0:31:52.240
<v Speaker 3>like the same name as ex wife of Jeff Bezos,

0:31:52.640 --> 0:31:55.400
<v Speaker 3>happens to donate billions or sometimes I donate under the

0:31:55.480 --> 0:31:58.440
<v Speaker 3>name Bill Gates. Oh yeah, the pet name that my

0:31:58.520 --> 0:31:59.480
<v Speaker 3>friends have for me.

0:31:59.800 --> 0:32:01.840
<v Speaker 2>Your longer name Bill and Melinda Gates.

0:32:01.680 --> 0:32:05.040
<v Speaker 3>Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. Yeah yeah, that's it's like,

0:32:05.280 --> 0:32:06.640
<v Speaker 3>you know, a family thing.

0:32:06.680 --> 0:32:07.520
<v Speaker 2>Thank you for all the money, you.

0:32:09.440 --> 0:32:13.120
<v Speaker 3>Know, me and Darlene shyly So. One of the charities

0:32:13.200 --> 0:32:15.720
<v Speaker 3>that Gibson said that she was fundraising for was to

0:32:15.720 --> 0:32:18.920
<v Speaker 3>support treatment for a kid with brain cancer. The only

0:32:18.960 --> 0:32:21.680
<v Speaker 3>thing is her parents never saw a dime. They didn't

0:32:21.720 --> 0:32:24.040
<v Speaker 3>know that their kid was being used as a fundraising too,

0:32:24.760 --> 0:32:26.840
<v Speaker 3>And then they were like starting to wonder if she

0:32:27.160 --> 0:32:29.800
<v Speaker 3>only befriended them and their kid in order to do

0:32:29.880 --> 0:32:32.080
<v Speaker 3>research on what it's like to have brain cancer?

0:32:32.360 --> 0:32:33.240
<v Speaker 2>Are you kidding? Yeah?

0:32:33.240 --> 0:32:35.400
<v Speaker 3>Apparently she was like asking a lot of questions which

0:32:35.480 --> 0:32:37.440
<v Speaker 3>you don't really need to ask if you yourself have

0:32:37.520 --> 0:32:38.560
<v Speaker 3>brain cancer, She's like.

0:32:38.560 --> 0:32:40.800
<v Speaker 2>Does it hurt on side of your head or like

0:32:40.880 --> 0:32:41.440
<v Speaker 2>in the center?

0:32:42.920 --> 0:32:46.520
<v Speaker 3>Totally. So in February of twenty fifteen, things started to

0:32:46.560 --> 0:32:50.560
<v Speaker 3>come crashing down. A close friend of Gibson's confronted her, like,

0:32:50.680 --> 0:32:53.200
<v Speaker 3>have you been cheating the charities? And do you have

0:32:53.280 --> 0:32:56.080
<v Speaker 3>cancer in the first place? You have to tell the truth.

0:32:56.120 --> 0:32:59.000
<v Speaker 3>Her friend told her, No, said Gibson, I do not.

0:32:59.120 --> 0:32:59.760
<v Speaker 2>Have to tell the truth.

0:33:00.240 --> 0:33:03.200
<v Speaker 3>So her friends saw that Gibson was not just getting

0:33:03.200 --> 0:33:06.560
<v Speaker 3>one over on people. She was hurting people people with cancer.

0:33:07.000 --> 0:33:08.520
<v Speaker 3>So she's like, I know what I gotta do. I'm

0:33:08.560 --> 0:33:12.040
<v Speaker 3>going public. She got in touch with the cops, a lawyer,

0:33:12.560 --> 0:33:15.440
<v Speaker 3>and an investigative journalist. Oh no, that's the start of

0:33:15.480 --> 0:33:16.200
<v Speaker 3>a joke right there.

0:33:16.480 --> 0:33:18.360
<v Speaker 2>Seriously, I'll walk into a bar but here's the.

0:33:18.320 --> 0:33:20.120
<v Speaker 3>Thing, none of them really interested in what she had

0:33:20.160 --> 0:33:20.480
<v Speaker 3>to say.

0:33:20.640 --> 0:33:20.960
<v Speaker 2>Why not?

0:33:21.320 --> 0:33:21.760
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

0:33:21.840 --> 0:33:23.680
<v Speaker 2>But then was she not good at telling the stories?

0:33:23.720 --> 0:33:26.560
<v Speaker 3>You walk in, my friend, you'll find that a lot

0:33:26.600 --> 0:33:29.400
<v Speaker 3>of people don't want to step to these influencers. They

0:33:29.680 --> 0:33:32.560
<v Speaker 3>just like that thing, you know. Yeah, you'll see. So

0:33:32.720 --> 0:33:36.720
<v Speaker 3>the Melbourne newspaper The Age, stepped up. They broke the

0:33:36.760 --> 0:33:40.680
<v Speaker 3>story and in March twenty fifteen, after reports identified her

0:33:40.760 --> 0:33:43.520
<v Speaker 3>charity frauds, it was revealed that she made up her

0:33:43.560 --> 0:33:46.480
<v Speaker 3>cancers and then also lied about her age, her personal

0:33:46.480 --> 0:33:50.040
<v Speaker 3>life or history so she couldn't escape it now. In

0:33:50.040 --> 0:33:53.440
<v Speaker 3>April of twenty fifteen, she admitted to Australian Women's Weekly

0:33:53.520 --> 0:33:56.400
<v Speaker 3>that her claims about all of her cancers were just fiction.

0:33:57.040 --> 0:34:00.720
<v Speaker 3>As she said, quote, none of it's true. And she

0:34:00.800 --> 0:34:03.120
<v Speaker 3>said it wasn't her fault though, I mean, it never is.

0:34:03.520 --> 0:34:05.680
<v Speaker 3>She claimed that it was the way that she was

0:34:05.720 --> 0:34:09.000
<v Speaker 3>brought up. Her mom neglected her. She said she had

0:34:09.040 --> 0:34:11.839
<v Speaker 3>to take care of her. Yeah, she said, you had

0:34:11.840 --> 0:34:14.320
<v Speaker 3>to take care of herself. And her autistic little brother

0:34:14.400 --> 0:34:15.440
<v Speaker 3>from a very young age.

0:34:15.520 --> 0:34:16.440
<v Speaker 2>Was he really autistic?

0:34:16.960 --> 0:34:20.440
<v Speaker 3>She never got to be a kid. It was everyone

0:34:20.440 --> 0:34:25.120
<v Speaker 3>else's fault. Throughout the whole interview, she never apologized. It

0:34:25.120 --> 0:34:27.240
<v Speaker 3>should be noted that her mom then gave an interview

0:34:27.280 --> 0:34:30.000
<v Speaker 3>stating that that was all her claims were false and

0:34:30.000 --> 0:34:33.160
<v Speaker 3>that her little brother is not as I knew. I know,

0:34:33.000 --> 0:34:38.719
<v Speaker 3>I know, I don't know how. So here you have

0:34:38.760 --> 0:34:41.600
<v Speaker 3>this woman who has all these deals, books, apps, with Apple,

0:34:41.800 --> 0:34:44.839
<v Speaker 3>lifestyle brands, you name it, and it's all built upon

0:34:44.920 --> 0:34:47.359
<v Speaker 3>her having a bunch of different cancers and treating it

0:34:47.360 --> 0:34:49.200
<v Speaker 3>with stuff like apple cider, vinegar.

0:34:49.080 --> 0:34:50.880
<v Speaker 2>And nobody was suspicious.

0:34:50.960 --> 0:34:53.960
<v Speaker 3>No, and then now she admits made it all up,

0:34:54.160 --> 0:34:55.080
<v Speaker 3>never had cancer.

0:34:55.200 --> 0:34:55.880
<v Speaker 2>I'm a fraud.

0:34:56.320 --> 0:34:58.600
<v Speaker 3>And so this made people wonder, like, what's up with

0:34:58.680 --> 0:35:02.520
<v Speaker 3>these big corporations or shoveling cash? He like, didn't they

0:35:02.560 --> 0:35:07.040
<v Speaker 3>investigate before signing on to like basically endorse her brand

0:35:07.080 --> 0:35:11.719
<v Speaker 3>And where's the due diligence? Yeah, so we're talking about

0:35:11.760 --> 0:35:15.880
<v Speaker 3>like her cookbook publisher was Penguin Books. So and then

0:35:15.920 --> 0:35:20.880
<v Speaker 3>you got Apple and the watch launch, all that breathless,

0:35:21.040 --> 0:35:24.759
<v Speaker 3>fawning coverage in the Australian press. Everyone seemed to look

0:35:24.800 --> 0:35:26.720
<v Speaker 3>the other way because the story was just too good

0:35:26.960 --> 0:35:30.080
<v Speaker 3>and she was making them too much money. So let's

0:35:30.080 --> 0:35:33.080
<v Speaker 3>look at Penguin. I like to go after publishers. So

0:35:33.280 --> 0:35:36.040
<v Speaker 3>Lantern Books was the imprint, the Penguin imprint that put

0:35:36.040 --> 0:35:40.120
<v Speaker 3>out the cookbook. They were like, hey man, it's a cookbook.

0:35:40.160 --> 0:35:46.640
<v Speaker 3>We only vet the recipes. It actually looked into her

0:35:46.960 --> 0:35:49.239
<v Speaker 3>sort of Before the book was published. They made her

0:35:49.280 --> 0:35:52.880
<v Speaker 3>answer questions on video about the information in her preface

0:35:52.920 --> 0:35:56.120
<v Speaker 3>that told her sob story, and I guess they thought

0:35:56.120 --> 0:35:58.640
<v Speaker 3>it was good enough, like you know, things got hot though,

0:35:58.680 --> 0:36:01.800
<v Speaker 3>So Penguin pulled the from the shelves. Claimed it was

0:36:01.840 --> 0:36:04.920
<v Speaker 3>because it was asking Gibson for confirmation of her stories

0:36:04.960 --> 0:36:07.640
<v Speaker 3>and she wasn't providing it, And they wound up having

0:36:07.680 --> 0:36:11.560
<v Speaker 3>to pay thirty thousand dollars to the Victorian Consumer Law

0:36:11.680 --> 0:36:15.400
<v Speaker 3>Fund as a penalty for not validating her you know,

0:36:15.440 --> 0:36:16.440
<v Speaker 3>the veracity of.

0:36:16.480 --> 0:36:19.680
<v Speaker 2>Claimed and doing their due diligence essentially, Saren, what about Apple?

0:36:19.880 --> 0:36:22.280
<v Speaker 2>What about Apple? Isabeth Pocket?

0:36:22.480 --> 0:36:22.760
<v Speaker 4>Apple?

0:36:23.000 --> 0:36:23.280
<v Speaker 2>Long?

0:36:23.360 --> 0:36:27.239
<v Speaker 3>Last you ask a question? At first, Apple refused to

0:36:27.239 --> 0:36:29.160
<v Speaker 3>pull the whole pantry app from the app store?

0:36:29.239 --> 0:36:29.760
<v Speaker 2>Are you kidding?

0:36:30.000 --> 0:36:32.239
<v Speaker 3>They said that the only thing they cared about was

0:36:32.239 --> 0:36:35.040
<v Speaker 3>that the app worked like it said it would, And

0:36:35.080 --> 0:36:38.200
<v Speaker 3>they're like, it's functional, or get off our backs Wow.

0:36:38.320 --> 0:36:41.280
<v Speaker 3>But then they quietly removed it from the Apple Watch,

0:36:42.360 --> 0:36:44.360
<v Speaker 3>like she didn't get the U two treatment. They just

0:36:44.440 --> 0:36:47.360
<v Speaker 3>like pulled it. And then they quietly took the app

0:36:47.440 --> 0:36:50.480
<v Speaker 3>off the app store and erased all the promotional material

0:36:50.560 --> 0:36:54.040
<v Speaker 3>that included whole pantry And like, did they explain themselves?

0:36:54.160 --> 0:36:55.160
<v Speaker 2>Probably not, of course not.

0:36:55.160 --> 0:36:57.480
<v Speaker 3>They're Apple, They're the big dogs. They owe no one

0:36:57.560 --> 0:36:58.200
<v Speaker 3>anything like.

0:36:58.200 --> 0:37:00.520
<v Speaker 2>Back off saren why asking somebody? Yeah.

0:37:00.760 --> 0:37:04.120
<v Speaker 3>Elle Australia magazine they wrote a glowing piece on her

0:37:04.280 --> 0:37:07.440
<v Speaker 3>in their December twenty fourteen issue. It came out, they

0:37:07.440 --> 0:37:09.520
<v Speaker 3>got a couple tips that like, you know, she's not

0:37:09.600 --> 0:37:13.239
<v Speaker 3>really telling the truth, everything's actually made up. Magazine ignores it.

0:37:13.520 --> 0:37:16.960
<v Speaker 3>Then another magazine, Cosmopolitan, which has like the same publisher

0:37:16.960 --> 0:37:20.919
<v Speaker 3>as El Australia, they gave Gibson its twenty fourteen Fun

0:37:21.000 --> 0:37:25.920
<v Speaker 3>Fearless Female Social Media Award, and then they also got

0:37:25.960 --> 0:37:28.080
<v Speaker 3>tips via email like hey, look, she's not what she

0:37:28.120 --> 0:37:29.440
<v Speaker 3>says she is. They ignored them.

0:37:29.640 --> 0:37:31.560
<v Speaker 2>We already gave her the three f awards, so we're

0:37:31.600 --> 0:37:32.160
<v Speaker 2>going with it. There.

0:37:32.160 --> 0:37:36.280
<v Speaker 3>It is then Gibson admits to the lies. Everyone figured

0:37:36.320 --> 0:37:38.480
<v Speaker 3>they'd do something like, you know, Stripper of the Award

0:37:39.520 --> 0:37:41.600
<v Speaker 3>the award that you and I should have won totally.

0:37:41.680 --> 0:37:45.799
<v Speaker 2>I mean, if anybody's a fun, fearless female, if you're me. No.

0:37:45.920 --> 0:37:48.440
<v Speaker 3>They claim that she had been quote reader nominated and

0:37:48.520 --> 0:37:52.879
<v Speaker 3>reader voted, like, so blame the reader. Yeah, nice, don't

0:37:52.880 --> 0:37:55.880
<v Speaker 3>worry that. When the award came out, the magazine's associate

0:37:55.960 --> 0:37:59.359
<v Speaker 3>editor said, they quote put forward the nomination myself. So

0:37:59.800 --> 0:38:02.279
<v Speaker 3>it was the readers or was it the staff? Does

0:38:02.280 --> 0:38:03.480
<v Speaker 3>anyone tell the truth around here?

0:38:03.560 --> 0:38:05.359
<v Speaker 2>Is there any accountability anymore? Zero?

0:38:06.040 --> 0:38:12.000
<v Speaker 3>May twenty sixteen, consumer Affairs Victoria cav initiated civil proceedings

0:38:12.000 --> 0:38:15.320
<v Speaker 3>against Gibson and her company. They cited misleading and deceptive

0:38:15.320 --> 0:38:19.840
<v Speaker 3>conduct under Australian consumer law. March twenty seventeen, the Federal

0:38:19.840 --> 0:38:23.400
<v Speaker 3>Court of Australia upheld most allegations. They figured that like

0:38:23.480 --> 0:38:26.840
<v Speaker 3>Gibson had no reasonable basis to believe she had cancer,

0:38:27.640 --> 0:38:31.080
<v Speaker 3>and that she had engaged in deceptive conduct.

0:38:31.680 --> 0:38:33.640
<v Speaker 2>She should have stuck with skateboarding.

0:38:33.600 --> 0:38:36.439
<v Speaker 3>Honestly, like it'd be a different world for her right now.

0:38:37.200 --> 0:38:40.000
<v Speaker 3>They tried to enforce the judgment that like search warrants

0:38:40.040 --> 0:38:40.800
<v Speaker 3>on her property.

0:38:40.800 --> 0:38:43.400
<v Speaker 2>In twenty twenty twenty twenty one, Raids and Stuff.

0:38:43.160 --> 0:38:45.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, they tried to recover the unpaid debts, which like

0:38:46.000 --> 0:38:49.320
<v Speaker 3>at this point is north of five hundred thousand dollars.

0:38:50.040 --> 0:38:53.160
<v Speaker 3>February twenty twenty one, a court registrar classified the case

0:38:53.160 --> 0:38:58.680
<v Speaker 3>as abandoned, though, but enforcement actions continued. In early twenty

0:38:58.719 --> 0:39:03.320
<v Speaker 3>twenty five, Netflix least a dramatized series called Apple Cider Vinegar,

0:39:03.800 --> 0:39:07.960
<v Speaker 3>dramatizing her story and against wellness scams, and that was

0:39:08.000 --> 0:39:10.279
<v Speaker 3>based on the investigative book The Woman Who Fooled the

0:39:10.280 --> 0:39:14.000
<v Speaker 3>World by bo' donnelly and Nick Toscano. I have neither

0:39:14.080 --> 0:39:18.279
<v Speaker 3>read nor watched either influencer. Hell, that's where we are,

0:39:18.719 --> 0:39:21.560
<v Speaker 3>So let's take a break, little breather, listen to some ads,

0:39:21.600 --> 0:39:24.040
<v Speaker 3>maybe they will influence you. And when we come back,

0:39:24.120 --> 0:39:48.440
<v Speaker 3>I have one more for you, Zaren. Hey, Hey, I

0:39:48.480 --> 0:39:51.960
<v Speaker 3>got one more influencer for you today, Elizabeth Dunnon.

0:39:53.480 --> 0:39:56.680
<v Speaker 2>During the break, I was practicing influencing the interns. They

0:39:56.719 --> 0:39:58.279
<v Speaker 2>just looked at me and kind of hung their like

0:39:58.320 --> 0:40:00.000
<v Speaker 2>shaggy heads and they're like, what are you doing here?

0:40:00.040 --> 0:40:02.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, but look they're all wearing your exact same outfit.

0:40:02.560 --> 0:40:05.040
<v Speaker 2>Who I didn't even notice you influenced them. Yeah, that's

0:40:05.080 --> 0:40:08.200
<v Speaker 2>good job. Thank you. I've learned so much today.

0:40:08.880 --> 0:40:11.319
<v Speaker 3>How many followers do you have? I have two and

0:40:11.360 --> 0:40:11.960
<v Speaker 3>their dogs.

0:40:12.040 --> 0:40:14.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I've got the same too and their dogs.

0:40:14.680 --> 0:40:21.040
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Carolyn Callaway, Yeah, she was the ultimate New York

0:40:21.080 --> 0:40:26.080
<v Speaker 3>lifestyle right. Was born in nineteen ninety one in Falls Church, Virginia.

0:40:26.200 --> 0:40:29.560
<v Speaker 3>She went to the Tony Boarding school Phillips Exeter Academy.

0:40:30.400 --> 0:40:33.400
<v Speaker 3>Her great grandpa was a real estate mogul who developed

0:40:33.480 --> 0:40:35.080
<v Speaker 3>most of Sarasota, Florida.

0:40:35.360 --> 0:40:37.040
<v Speaker 2>Oh fun fact, there you go.

0:40:37.200 --> 0:40:39.720
<v Speaker 3>So she started out as an undergrad and art history

0:40:39.800 --> 0:40:43.719
<v Speaker 3>at NYU, New York University, and then she got fixated

0:40:43.760 --> 0:40:47.600
<v Speaker 3>on going to Cambridge like just like determined. It took

0:40:47.640 --> 0:40:50.960
<v Speaker 3>her three applications, but in twenty thirteen she went to

0:40:51.000 --> 0:40:54.640
<v Speaker 3>Saint Edmund's College, Cambridge. She had to fake her transcripts

0:40:54.680 --> 0:40:56.799
<v Speaker 3>to get in, but whatever, what do you mean she

0:40:56.880 --> 0:40:58.320
<v Speaker 3>cheated her way into Cambridge?

0:40:58.360 --> 0:40:58.760
<v Speaker 4>Wow?

0:40:58.840 --> 0:41:01.520
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. So she made a name for herself there, but

0:41:01.600 --> 0:41:06.560
<v Speaker 3>not academically. No. She joined Instagram and it was on

0:41:06.600 --> 0:41:10.719
<v Speaker 3>that platform that she created a highly stylized feed like

0:41:10.800 --> 0:41:15.120
<v Speaker 3>and her signature were these long diaristic captions.

0:41:15.280 --> 0:41:17.880
<v Speaker 2>Oh yes, I remember people talking about this.

0:41:18.120 --> 0:41:23.080
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. So her Instagram journey that began with glamorized depictions

0:41:23.120 --> 0:41:26.480
<v Speaker 3>of her student life at Cambridge, and she bought followers

0:41:26.520 --> 0:41:30.759
<v Speaker 3>and used targeted ads to build her following. Her feed

0:41:30.880 --> 0:41:34.440
<v Speaker 3>was aspirational, it was dreamy. She got the nickname Gatsby

0:41:34.520 --> 0:41:35.319
<v Speaker 3>of Cambridge.

0:41:35.400 --> 0:41:35.920
<v Speaker 2>Are you kidding?

0:41:36.120 --> 0:41:37.600
<v Speaker 3>I'm not Kiddingaty of Cambridge?

0:41:37.680 --> 0:41:41.200
<v Speaker 2>I mean you do know who? Did you read the book?

0:41:41.239 --> 0:41:44.640
<v Speaker 3>I haven't read the book, but we all know that

0:41:44.680 --> 0:41:47.759
<v Speaker 3>what we see on Insta isn't the honest truth at all.

0:41:47.880 --> 0:41:49.400
<v Speaker 3>It is a created identity.

0:41:49.640 --> 0:41:51.480
<v Speaker 2>A couple of friends of mine who just post pictures

0:41:51.480 --> 0:41:53.640
<v Speaker 2>of food that they've horrifically cooked.

0:41:53.800 --> 0:41:57.279
<v Speaker 3>My god, when people post pictures of dinners and you're like,

0:41:57.440 --> 0:41:58.800
<v Speaker 3>don't tell anyone you maybe.

0:41:58.880 --> 0:41:59.840
<v Speaker 2>Did your car run over that?

0:42:00.040 --> 0:42:02.759
<v Speaker 3>And it's like the flash was on and it's just

0:42:03.280 --> 0:42:05.919
<v Speaker 3>and it's two colors on an entire play.

0:42:06.000 --> 0:42:07.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it looks like something like you know, in two

0:42:07.680 --> 0:42:09.080
<v Speaker 2>year olds make your food out of mud.

0:42:11.320 --> 0:42:14.080
<v Speaker 3>It's so brutal. Or the worst is like, look at

0:42:14.080 --> 0:42:16.600
<v Speaker 3>this beautiful party spread and you're like, oh.

0:42:16.480 --> 0:42:19.160
<v Speaker 2>Money, don't take don't you are those paper napkins? Yea?

0:42:19.719 --> 0:42:22.440
<v Speaker 3>Is it a plastic table cloth? I am the biggest

0:42:22.480 --> 0:42:24.520
<v Speaker 3>stob in the world. So if you think that I'm

0:42:24.520 --> 0:42:26.600
<v Speaker 3>going to look at an Instagram feed and not judge,

0:42:26.680 --> 0:42:31.160
<v Speaker 3>no I am. I am judge, jury executioner, Lady Justice.

0:42:31.200 --> 0:42:35.480
<v Speaker 3>I am a pcently lady host justice exactly all right. So,

0:42:35.880 --> 0:42:38.920
<v Speaker 3>but we had, like, you know, this beautiful thing on Instagram.

0:42:38.960 --> 0:42:41.960
<v Speaker 3>The basics of life, though, like getting rejected from colleges,

0:42:42.480 --> 0:42:44.759
<v Speaker 3>not being able to pay your rent, looking frumpy. Those

0:42:44.760 --> 0:42:47.800
<v Speaker 3>things aren't interesting unless you're an anti influence.

0:42:48.560 --> 0:42:48.799
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:42:48.800 --> 0:42:51.640
<v Speaker 3>So around twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, she's at the height

0:42:51.719 --> 0:42:55.040
<v Speaker 3>of her Instagram, okay, and because of that, she secured

0:42:55.080 --> 0:42:59.240
<v Speaker 3>a six figure US book deal with Flat Iron Books

0:42:59.239 --> 0:43:01.960
<v Speaker 3>for a memoir that was supposed to be titled and

0:43:01.960 --> 0:43:10.000
<v Speaker 3>we were like and we were like multiple outlets. New

0:43:10.080 --> 0:43:14.239
<v Speaker 3>Yorker The Cut reported different amounts. The Cut said it

0:43:14.280 --> 0:43:16.960
<v Speaker 3>was three hundred and seventy five thousand dollars with a one

0:43:16.960 --> 0:43:19.279
<v Speaker 3>hundred thousand dollars advance, so that brought it up to

0:43:19.320 --> 0:43:23.239
<v Speaker 3>four seventy five. Carolyn herself sometimes refers to it as

0:43:23.280 --> 0:43:26.440
<v Speaker 3>a five hundred thousand dollars book deal. All I can

0:43:26.520 --> 0:43:30.400
<v Speaker 3>say is that is insane. That's an insane Amountred thousand

0:43:30.440 --> 0:43:34.040
<v Speaker 3>dollars is an insane advance like this, Just we don't

0:43:34.080 --> 0:43:35.440
<v Speaker 3>see numbers like that, not.

0:43:35.400 --> 0:43:38.640
<v Speaker 2>In publishing, not anymore, not even like authors who actually

0:43:38.640 --> 0:43:40.560
<v Speaker 2>do write their books. I do have like a history

0:43:40.560 --> 0:43:41.440
<v Speaker 2>of writing books.

0:43:41.480 --> 0:43:45.239
<v Speaker 3>No, no, So the book was pitched as an expansion

0:43:45.400 --> 0:43:49.400
<v Speaker 3>of her Instagram captions. It was like coming of age

0:43:49.480 --> 0:43:55.640
<v Speaker 3>story right Instagram the Empire. It was set against her,

0:43:55.680 --> 0:43:59.560
<v Speaker 3>like romanticized Cambridge years. But the reason you haven't heard

0:43:59.600 --> 0:44:03.640
<v Speaker 3>about it it was never published. The deal fell apart

0:44:03.719 --> 0:44:06.880
<v Speaker 3>before the manuscript was delivered, so she had to return

0:44:06.960 --> 0:44:09.799
<v Speaker 3>what was left of the advance to Flatirn. And she

0:44:09.960 --> 0:44:12.520
<v Speaker 3>claimed that she walked away from it because the publishers

0:44:12.560 --> 0:44:16.160
<v Speaker 3>wanted to quote a cookie cutter memoir that didn't reflect

0:44:16.160 --> 0:44:20.040
<v Speaker 3>her true voice. But there's another account, one that painted

0:44:20.040 --> 0:44:24.560
<v Speaker 3>a different picture, that the project collapsed due to Carolyn's procrastination,

0:44:24.760 --> 0:44:29.160
<v Speaker 3>her chaotic process, her reluctance to edit or refine drafts.

0:44:29.520 --> 0:44:30.880
<v Speaker 3>Who told that side of the story.

0:44:31.120 --> 0:44:33.120
<v Speaker 2>Elizabeth told that side of the story, Thank.

0:44:32.960 --> 0:44:37.960
<v Speaker 3>You, Natalie Beach. She met Carolyn at Nyuka or Caroline

0:44:38.000 --> 0:44:41.640
<v Speaker 3>at Nyu. Beach has said that she ghost wrote many

0:44:41.680 --> 0:44:46.200
<v Speaker 3>of Caroline's long Instagram captions, the ones that like established

0:44:46.200 --> 0:44:52.200
<v Speaker 3>her dreamy, diaristic style. I can't get over ghostwriting Instagram captions.

0:44:52.560 --> 0:44:55.000
<v Speaker 2>I'm still thinking about ghostwriting the Whip, so i can't.

0:44:55.920 --> 0:44:58.279
<v Speaker 3>But like there's like the Lana del Rey of it

0:44:58.360 --> 0:44:59.440
<v Speaker 3>all is a little.

0:44:59.480 --> 0:45:00.920
<v Speaker 2>Jills bear verjacent.

0:45:01.120 --> 0:45:05.360
<v Speaker 3>It's very yeah, and but like ghost writing Instagram captions

0:45:05.440 --> 0:45:06.319
<v Speaker 3>come on as a.

0:45:06.320 --> 0:45:07.279
<v Speaker 2>Job as a job.

0:45:07.560 --> 0:45:10.120
<v Speaker 3>And then Beach said she also co authored the book

0:45:10.160 --> 0:45:15.480
<v Speaker 3>proposal that landed the deal, and that you know, Caroline

0:45:15.600 --> 0:45:18.520
<v Speaker 3>just handled the photos, the ideas, the editing, the vibe

0:45:18.960 --> 0:45:21.600
<v Speaker 3>she vibed out on it. To September of twenty nineteen,

0:45:21.680 --> 0:45:25.879
<v Speaker 3>Beach published I was Caroline Callaway in The Cut, and

0:45:25.960 --> 0:45:29.800
<v Speaker 3>the piece revealed their friendship, collaborative work, and then the eventual.

0:45:29.400 --> 0:45:31.920
<v Speaker 2>Fallouts like printing text messages and yeah, it.

0:45:31.880 --> 0:45:36.200
<v Speaker 3>Talked about like Caroline's manipulation, erratic behavior. She had all

0:45:36.239 --> 0:45:40.360
<v Speaker 3>these emotional episodes, like you know, she would allegedly threaten

0:45:40.400 --> 0:45:44.440
<v Speaker 3>to self harm if Beach pushed back on anything. There

0:45:44.480 --> 0:45:47.640
<v Speaker 3>was the strain Beach had of being uncredited while her

0:45:47.760 --> 0:45:51.760
<v Speaker 3>writing is like building this brand, and the essay became

0:45:51.800 --> 0:45:54.920
<v Speaker 3>The Cut's most read story of the year. Reignited interest

0:45:55.000 --> 0:45:57.920
<v Speaker 3>in the collapsed book deal. I remember reading it when

0:45:57.960 --> 0:45:58.640
<v Speaker 3>it came out.

0:45:58.600 --> 0:46:01.000
<v Speaker 2>Sound like this is so much and you said her name.

0:46:01.000 --> 0:46:02.720
<v Speaker 2>I was like, oh I remember this. Yeah.

0:46:03.160 --> 0:46:05.400
<v Speaker 3>So with no book deal, what's a gal to do?

0:46:05.680 --> 0:46:06.680
<v Speaker 2>I do not know Elizabeth.

0:46:06.800 --> 0:46:09.520
<v Speaker 3>I don't know either. So how can she make the

0:46:09.600 --> 0:46:12.800
<v Speaker 3>money to support her dreamy install lifestyle. I wouldn't know

0:46:12.840 --> 0:46:13.200
<v Speaker 3>what to do?

0:46:13.320 --> 0:46:15.360
<v Speaker 2>She knew what to show, how savvy girl.

0:46:15.440 --> 0:46:18.520
<v Speaker 3>She started holding things called creativity workshops.

0:46:18.640 --> 0:46:19.000
<v Speaker 2>Oh no.

0:46:19.440 --> 0:46:24.400
<v Speaker 3>She announced a creativity workshop tour in December of twenty eighteen,

0:46:24.680 --> 0:46:26.560
<v Speaker 3>and it was going to be this like multi city

0:46:26.680 --> 0:46:28.680
<v Speaker 3>road show. Is going to cost one hundred and sixty

0:46:28.719 --> 0:46:32.920
<v Speaker 3>five dollars a person, and attendees were promised creative guidance,

0:46:33.400 --> 0:46:37.960
<v Speaker 3>lunch care packages, personal letters, and fresh orchid crowns.

0:46:38.040 --> 0:46:39.960
<v Speaker 2>She's going to monetize her fan base.

0:46:40.200 --> 0:46:45.160
<v Speaker 3>Yes, the tour would hit cities like Boston, San Francisco, Chicago, DC. Yeah.

0:46:45.880 --> 0:46:49.160
<v Speaker 3>It really quickly began to fall apart. The first problem

0:46:49.280 --> 0:46:50.960
<v Speaker 3>is that she never booked the venues.

0:46:51.400 --> 0:46:53.600
<v Speaker 2>Are you kidding me that right there?

0:46:53.760 --> 0:46:56.880
<v Speaker 3>That's a problem. Yeah, and then she ordered twelve hundred

0:46:56.960 --> 0:46:59.640
<v Speaker 3>Mason jars for the care packages. But she had no

0:46:59.680 --> 0:47:00.799
<v Speaker 3>place to store.

0:47:00.560 --> 0:47:03.239
<v Speaker 2>Them, so she did a total four seasons landscape.

0:47:03.600 --> 0:47:04.880
<v Speaker 3>Yes for the events.

0:47:05.200 --> 0:47:07.640
<v Speaker 2>Yes, and then she shows up with like, here's some

0:47:07.640 --> 0:47:09.040
<v Speaker 2>stuff I got at the Dollar Star.

0:47:10.120 --> 0:47:13.920
<v Speaker 3>She's not a logistics lady. So the press and critics

0:47:13.920 --> 0:47:16.880
<v Speaker 3>they drew parallels to the disaster of the fire festival,

0:47:17.000 --> 0:47:22.080
<v Speaker 3>Oh y, we need to do it. And under mounting

0:47:22.160 --> 0:47:26.480
<v Speaker 3>scrutiny from Twitter users like Kayleie Donaldson, who called it

0:47:26.480 --> 0:47:31.560
<v Speaker 3>a quote scam, Caroline announced cancelations and refunds, but despite

0:47:31.600 --> 0:47:35.520
<v Speaker 3>the chaos, she did hold two in person workshops, one

0:47:35.520 --> 0:47:38.239
<v Speaker 3>of which took place in Brooklyn. A reporter from New

0:47:38.320 --> 0:47:45.400
<v Speaker 3>York Magazine attended the event and shared a vivid account. Yes, Zarines,

0:47:47.320 --> 0:47:57.239
<v Speaker 3>I want you to picture it. You are an aspiring

0:47:57.360 --> 0:48:01.680
<v Speaker 3>Instagram influencer. Your feed is all hydro flasks and Chanel

0:48:01.760 --> 0:48:04.719
<v Speaker 3>shopping bags and sun dresses and of course you and

0:48:04.800 --> 0:48:07.920
<v Speaker 3>all of it. Standing in front of a field of sunflowers,

0:48:07.960 --> 0:48:11.040
<v Speaker 3>your hands shielding your eyes from the sun, facing out

0:48:11.040 --> 0:48:13.800
<v Speaker 3>to the ocean, wearing a suggestion of a swimsuit, holding

0:48:13.840 --> 0:48:16.439
<v Speaker 3>up a peace sign at the color correct at sea.

0:48:17.000 --> 0:48:18.960
<v Speaker 3>You are a waif of a girl. You've got the

0:48:19.080 --> 0:48:22.160
<v Speaker 3>thy gap and the long brown hair meant for social

0:48:22.200 --> 0:48:25.960
<v Speaker 3>media stardom. You only have four seven hundred and forty

0:48:26.000 --> 0:48:29.080
<v Speaker 3>five followers. Though your feed is a little scattered, you

0:48:29.120 --> 0:48:32.439
<v Speaker 3>haven't seemed to lock into a real esthetic. You want

0:48:32.480 --> 0:48:34.840
<v Speaker 3>more than just the image. You want to create things.

0:48:34.880 --> 0:48:37.560
<v Speaker 3>You aren't sure what you want to be an entrepreneur.

0:48:37.840 --> 0:48:40.200
<v Speaker 3>You aren't one hundred percent sure what that means, but

0:48:40.280 --> 0:48:43.279
<v Speaker 3>it's what you want to that end. You've purchased a

0:48:43.280 --> 0:48:48.960
<v Speaker 3>ticket for Caroline Calloway's creativity workshop. You love her. She's everything.

0:48:49.680 --> 0:48:53.080
<v Speaker 3>She's so beautiful and stylish and witty and messy. You

0:48:53.160 --> 0:48:55.600
<v Speaker 3>wish you were her, and this would be the best

0:48:55.600 --> 0:48:57.600
<v Speaker 3>way to try and get as close to that happening

0:48:57.640 --> 0:49:00.239
<v Speaker 3>as possible. You took a couple trains to get to

0:49:00.280 --> 0:49:03.320
<v Speaker 3>Brooklyn early this morning. You walk up to a loft building,

0:49:03.360 --> 0:49:05.600
<v Speaker 3>triple checking the address on your phone with the one

0:49:05.640 --> 0:49:08.680
<v Speaker 3>on the building. This should be the place cars sit by.

0:49:08.840 --> 0:49:11.400
<v Speaker 3>People chat outside a coffee shop on their way to work.

0:49:11.800 --> 0:49:14.520
<v Speaker 3>You sit on a nearby stoop and wait. Pretty soon

0:49:14.560 --> 0:49:17.640
<v Speaker 3>people start showing up all manner of young white women

0:49:17.880 --> 0:49:21.520
<v Speaker 3>stream in from ride shares and public transportation and even

0:49:21.560 --> 0:49:25.000
<v Speaker 3>a bike. They are all impossibly cool in your estimation,

0:49:25.560 --> 0:49:28.040
<v Speaker 3>and you realize you are one of them, so you

0:49:28.120 --> 0:49:30.480
<v Speaker 3>must be cool too. You look up at the sky

0:49:30.640 --> 0:49:33.640
<v Speaker 3>to remember this moment when everything came together and your

0:49:33.760 --> 0:49:38.320
<v Speaker 3>journey truly started right here on the sidewalk in Brooklyn,

0:49:38.680 --> 0:49:42.160
<v Speaker 3>right here in the coolest place on earth. Your heart

0:49:42.239 --> 0:49:46.840
<v Speaker 3>is full, brimming with potential and serious bravitas of the moment.

0:49:47.520 --> 0:49:50.279
<v Speaker 3>Then a pigeon alights next to your shoe, hoops on

0:49:50.320 --> 0:49:54.279
<v Speaker 3>the sidewalk, coops and flies away. Wasn't supposed to go

0:49:54.440 --> 0:49:57.239
<v Speaker 3>like that? Those are yeazis. That was a close call.

0:49:57.360 --> 0:50:01.080
<v Speaker 3>Oh you saw Suddenly the door the loft swings Olga.

0:50:01.960 --> 0:50:04.279
<v Speaker 3>You get to a large open space and mingle with

0:50:04.320 --> 0:50:07.000
<v Speaker 3>the other attendees. You scan the crowd, but you can

0:50:07.120 --> 0:50:10.120
<v Speaker 3>see Caroline. You pour yourself a coffee with oat milk,

0:50:10.360 --> 0:50:13.600
<v Speaker 3>stroll through the root and listening in on conversations. One

0:50:13.640 --> 0:50:16.600
<v Speaker 3>woman tells another she came up from Florida. Another chimes

0:50:16.600 --> 0:50:19.040
<v Speaker 3>in that she's in town from Seattle. You pass a

0:50:19.080 --> 0:50:22.359
<v Speaker 3>woman talking about going to an Ivy League college with another.

0:50:22.040 --> 0:50:23.480
<v Speaker 2>Who's in nursing school.

0:50:23.600 --> 0:50:27.759
<v Speaker 3>They discuss the difficulty of juggling posting with studying. One

0:50:27.760 --> 0:50:30.280
<v Speaker 3>woman clears her throat and sings a high note. Apparently

0:50:30.320 --> 0:50:33.000
<v Speaker 3>she's trained to be an oppersit. That's a good angle.

0:50:33.040 --> 0:50:36.040
<v Speaker 3>You think to be cute and sing opera and wear

0:50:36.160 --> 0:50:40.080
<v Speaker 3>European designer clothes and travel to European cities and speak

0:50:40.160 --> 0:50:43.319
<v Speaker 3>various European languages, just like the europe of it all.

0:50:43.480 --> 0:50:46.840
<v Speaker 3>It's a good gimmick. As dreamy pop music plays, a

0:50:46.920 --> 0:50:49.719
<v Speaker 3>staffer hands you a personalized journal with your name on it.

0:50:50.120 --> 0:50:53.399
<v Speaker 3>You are prepared to cherish it forever. You also get

0:50:53.400 --> 0:50:56.839
<v Speaker 3>a tot, a candle, a crystal, and a mason jar

0:50:57.000 --> 0:51:00.640
<v Speaker 3>seated for a DIY garden. The event tickets said you'd

0:51:00.680 --> 0:51:04.600
<v Speaker 3>also get an orchid crown, the pinnacle of Instagram cool.

0:51:04.880 --> 0:51:08.200
<v Speaker 3>Not just a flower crown, an orchid crown. You ask

0:51:08.239 --> 0:51:10.440
<v Speaker 3>about it and you're told there won't be crowns, but

0:51:10.520 --> 0:51:12.640
<v Speaker 3>you will get one orchid to wear in your hair

0:51:12.960 --> 0:51:14.799
<v Speaker 3>or pin to your top. You just have to make

0:51:14.800 --> 0:51:17.960
<v Speaker 3>sure you return it before you leave. Suddenly, the room

0:51:18.000 --> 0:51:21.600
<v Speaker 3>goes silent. Caroline has arrived. She's wearing a T shirt

0:51:21.600 --> 0:51:24.919
<v Speaker 3>that says scammer under a cart again. Across one side

0:51:24.920 --> 0:51:27.520
<v Speaker 3>of the room is a banner reading fire Festival in

0:51:27.600 --> 0:51:32.560
<v Speaker 3>handcut aqua paper letters. Caroline playfully identifies and waves at

0:51:32.600 --> 0:51:35.600
<v Speaker 3>the journalists present. She then declares that she won't allow

0:51:35.680 --> 0:51:38.919
<v Speaker 3>them to take photos with the orchids. For the next

0:51:38.920 --> 0:51:41.359
<v Speaker 3>few hours, you break into groups of five or show

0:51:41.440 --> 0:51:45.560
<v Speaker 3>and share your creations, poems, artwork that one woman sings

0:51:45.600 --> 0:51:49.280
<v Speaker 3>an aara. You wrote a stream of consciousness paragraph about

0:51:49.280 --> 0:51:51.840
<v Speaker 3>the beach. Caroline walks by as you read it and

0:51:51.880 --> 0:51:54.640
<v Speaker 3>gives a nod, moving on to the next group. Soon

0:51:54.680 --> 0:51:56.640
<v Speaker 3>the whole thing is over and you all spill out

0:51:56.640 --> 0:51:59.200
<v Speaker 3>onto the street. You have to admit it was kind

0:51:59.200 --> 0:52:02.560
<v Speaker 3>of a mess. That's Caroline. Knowing it's a mess and

0:52:02.600 --> 0:52:05.040
<v Speaker 3>still feeling it was worth it makes you in on it.

0:52:05.360 --> 0:52:10.640
<v Speaker 3>Caroline's in her presence, her authenticity content be damned. And then,

0:52:11.280 --> 0:52:13.520
<v Speaker 3>like the end of Animal House, a text comes on

0:52:13.560 --> 0:52:15.680
<v Speaker 3>the screen and it turns out you gave up on

0:52:15.760 --> 0:52:18.640
<v Speaker 3>being an Instagram influencer. You moved to Florida and you

0:52:18.680 --> 0:52:22.200
<v Speaker 3>got your real estate license. Good for you. There you go.

0:52:23.120 --> 0:52:29.239
<v Speaker 3>The workshops were a bust that didn't stop Caroline. She

0:52:29.360 --> 0:52:32.760
<v Speaker 3>held two workshops under a cheekier title, the aptly named

0:52:32.880 --> 0:52:36.560
<v Speaker 3>the Scam. No press was invited for those, but one

0:52:36.600 --> 0:52:40.920
<v Speaker 3>reporter did go undercover. Attendees were refunded if they were journalists,

0:52:41.000 --> 0:52:43.759
<v Speaker 3>and some semblance of delivery took place, but still it

0:52:43.800 --> 0:52:48.400
<v Speaker 3>was underwhelming. In April of twenty twenty, she responded to

0:52:48.640 --> 0:52:53.480
<v Speaker 3>Beach's essay with I am Carolyn Calloway, and she self

0:52:53.480 --> 0:52:55.880
<v Speaker 3>published it behind a paywall to raise money for COVID

0:52:55.960 --> 0:52:59.880
<v Speaker 3>nineteen relief efforts. Raised nearly fifty grand that's how we

0:53:00.120 --> 0:53:03.160
<v Speaker 3>people paid to read it. Then in twenty twenty three,

0:53:03.320 --> 0:53:07.000
<v Speaker 3>she released her memoir called Scammer, and it's a collection

0:53:07.200 --> 0:53:11.759
<v Speaker 3>of sixty seven vignettes, some new summ repurposed public and

0:53:11.800 --> 0:53:16.840
<v Speaker 3>critical response was mixed, but you know, amused, intrigued. A

0:53:16.920 --> 0:53:19.400
<v Speaker 3>guy from The New Yorker called it funny, engaging and

0:53:19.440 --> 0:53:23.759
<v Speaker 3>full of genuine insight. Really yeah, she continued building a

0:53:24.200 --> 0:53:29.919
<v Speaker 3>bizarre patchwork career. She joined OnlyFans in twenty twenty. Oh

0:53:29.960 --> 0:53:35.240
<v Speaker 3>and she sells literary themed softcore content and it apparently makes.

0:53:35.080 --> 0:53:38.320
<v Speaker 2>A literary theme softcore on her body.

0:53:38.640 --> 0:53:41.680
<v Speaker 3>No, so she does like cosplay of characters from stuff

0:53:41.719 --> 0:53:45.280
<v Speaker 3>like Harry Potter, Matilda and Beauty and the Beast, basically

0:53:45.320 --> 0:53:48.960
<v Speaker 3>like kid stuff. Oh and then there are partially undressed

0:53:49.000 --> 0:53:53.520
<v Speaker 3>photographs of herself captioned with details of her father's autopsy.

0:53:54.560 --> 0:53:58.479
<v Speaker 3>What yeah, yeah, yeah, there it is. Apparently she makes

0:53:58.480 --> 0:53:59.400
<v Speaker 3>a lot of money doing this.

0:53:59.520 --> 0:54:02.799
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, everyone only apparently does. So.

0:54:02.960 --> 0:54:05.360
<v Speaker 3>She went around saying in the interviews that she started

0:54:05.360 --> 0:54:09.280
<v Speaker 3>her naked lady journey thanks to your alma mater, Playboy.

0:54:09.520 --> 0:54:12.080
<v Speaker 2>Oh there you go, and according to her stuff.

0:54:11.880 --> 0:54:14.799
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, she said. The magazine commissioned a photoshoot of her

0:54:14.800 --> 0:54:17.960
<v Speaker 3>addressed as a student in a library, but then Playboy

0:54:18.040 --> 0:54:21.520
<v Speaker 3>released the statement saying quote, Playboy does not have and

0:54:21.719 --> 0:54:26.400
<v Speaker 3>did not have any photoshoot planned with Caroline Calloway. Yeah. Oof.

0:54:26.920 --> 0:54:27.080
<v Speaker 2>So.

0:54:27.200 --> 0:54:31.440
<v Speaker 3>Twenty twenty one, she launched a DIY skincare product that

0:54:31.560 --> 0:54:34.320
<v Speaker 3>called snake Oil, and it was like grape seed and

0:54:34.480 --> 0:54:38.440
<v Speaker 3>essential oils. Dermatologists were skeptical.

0:54:38.000 --> 0:54:40.920
<v Speaker 2>If she leans into it, The hill Scammer shared sneak bar.

0:54:41.120 --> 0:54:43.160
<v Speaker 2>She was like, you know what, you're.

0:54:43.000 --> 0:54:45.680
<v Speaker 3>In on it, but you're still spending the money. But

0:54:45.800 --> 0:54:47.719
<v Speaker 3>you know it doesn't matter, Like you could buy it

0:54:47.760 --> 0:54:52.560
<v Speaker 3>and be in on the joke. That's what I get it.

0:54:53.280 --> 0:54:57.040
<v Speaker 3>Twenty twenty three, she relocated to Sarasota, Florida with her

0:54:57.120 --> 0:54:58.360
<v Speaker 3>cat Matisse, where.

0:54:58.200 --> 0:54:59.960
<v Speaker 2>Her grandfather had founded the town.

0:55:00.800 --> 0:55:04.279
<v Speaker 3>October of twenty twenty four, she made headlines again, not

0:55:04.400 --> 0:55:08.080
<v Speaker 3>for a scandal, but for refusing to evacuate during Hurricane

0:55:08.120 --> 0:55:13.799
<v Speaker 3>Milton despite mandatory orders. So why didn't she evacuate? Well,

0:55:13.840 --> 0:55:17.560
<v Speaker 3>she said she had trauma from her previous evacuation during

0:55:17.640 --> 0:55:21.600
<v Speaker 3>Hurricane Ian. She also doesn't know how to drive, and

0:55:21.640 --> 0:55:24.960
<v Speaker 3>the airports were closed. And then she posted updates from

0:55:24.960 --> 0:55:28.799
<v Speaker 3>her house promising that her forthcoming book would come out

0:55:28.880 --> 0:55:33.120
<v Speaker 3>quote if I survive yeah, and social media like she

0:55:33.239 --> 0:55:37.319
<v Speaker 3>got the world's worst influencer. Yet here's the thing about

0:55:37.360 --> 0:55:43.160
<v Speaker 3>Caroline Callaway. She embodies influencer culture's excess. I mean she

0:55:43.200 --> 0:55:45.440
<v Speaker 3>had all this mess with like she was getting evicted,

0:55:45.560 --> 0:55:48.360
<v Speaker 3>not paying a rent and it was just lawsuits against

0:55:48.360 --> 0:55:53.960
<v Speaker 3>her for that persona though was outpacing substance. She had

0:55:53.960 --> 0:55:57.920
<v Speaker 3>this painfully chaotic result. I am an agent of chaos,

0:55:57.960 --> 0:56:00.600
<v Speaker 3>as you like to say, but I like that chaos

0:56:00.600 --> 0:56:04.080
<v Speaker 3>to be organic. I just do one little thing to

0:56:04.120 --> 0:56:06.560
<v Speaker 3>set it in motion. But I don't orchestra you see

0:56:06.600 --> 0:56:10.560
<v Speaker 3>the earth with Yes, I want authentic chaos. So these influencers, like,

0:56:10.600 --> 0:56:14.680
<v Speaker 3>are they con artists? Performance artists? Deeply troubled, you know,

0:56:14.800 --> 0:56:19.160
<v Speaker 3>charismatic trying to navigate this brutal digital era. I'd like

0:56:19.200 --> 0:56:21.440
<v Speaker 3>your thoughts on that, because that question is my takeaway.

0:56:21.440 --> 0:56:21.960
<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

0:56:22.000 --> 0:56:25.600
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, wow, that's quick. You know, like if you

0:56:25.640 --> 0:56:28.120
<v Speaker 2>don't like trim a tree and then a tree limp

0:56:28.239 --> 0:56:30.719
<v Speaker 2>falls on her person and hurts them, that seems to

0:56:30.760 --> 0:56:33.200
<v Speaker 2>be her mess. Yes, it's not like you with the

0:56:33.239 --> 0:56:35.560
<v Speaker 2>I seated the earth and this grew of the earth

0:56:35.800 --> 0:56:38.000
<v Speaker 2>with the conditions of sunlight and water. It's like, oh,

0:56:38.280 --> 0:56:40.959
<v Speaker 2>let's see what pops up. This is more like where

0:56:40.960 --> 0:56:43.520
<v Speaker 2>did that come from? Why didn't someone do their due

0:56:43.560 --> 0:56:46.080
<v Speaker 2>diligence and trim this tree? And she's like, I'm just

0:56:46.120 --> 0:56:46.640
<v Speaker 2>so messy.

0:56:46.920 --> 0:56:50.120
<v Speaker 3>Well, and you know, messy people are entertaining to a certain.

0:56:50.480 --> 0:56:52.759
<v Speaker 2>Yere right up. Util the mess is on you and.

0:56:52.800 --> 0:56:53.799
<v Speaker 3>It gets exhausted.

0:56:53.880 --> 0:56:56.239
<v Speaker 2>I sent you to the hospital or bankruptcy or.

0:56:56.320 --> 0:57:00.160
<v Speaker 3>Yes, you know what I need. I need to talk back.

0:57:00.440 --> 0:57:04.239
<v Speaker 3>That's my kind of social media.

0:57:04.440 --> 0:57:11.239
<v Speaker 2>Oh oh my god, could you just see that? I

0:57:11.320 --> 0:57:12.040
<v Speaker 2>led get.

0:57:15.280 --> 0:57:18.120
<v Speaker 3>Hi, Zaron and Elizabeth, you want to hear something ridiculous.

0:57:18.440 --> 0:57:20.840
<v Speaker 1>When I was in the Navy back in the early seventies,

0:57:21.120 --> 0:57:21.640
<v Speaker 1>we used.

0:57:21.520 --> 0:57:25.800
<v Speaker 2>To fly from Chicago to California, buy cors beer at

0:57:25.880 --> 0:57:29.560
<v Speaker 2>five dollars a case, take it back to Chicago, and

0:57:29.680 --> 0:57:34.520
<v Speaker 2>sell it for twenty dollars a case. Now that's ridiculous.

0:57:35.080 --> 0:57:37.640
<v Speaker 2>You were doing smoking in the bandit in the air force.

0:57:38.000 --> 0:57:40.240
<v Speaker 2>I love that, even though I don't like cors beer.

0:57:40.360 --> 0:57:43.200
<v Speaker 3>How in the world was cores cheaper in California?

0:57:43.400 --> 0:57:46.040
<v Speaker 2>Well, because you know, back then you couldn't get cores

0:57:46.080 --> 0:57:48.680
<v Speaker 2>east of the Mississippi. The whole thing in the smoking

0:57:48.720 --> 0:57:50.840
<v Speaker 2>the band it was legit. Like my father, I remember

0:57:50.880 --> 0:57:54.160
<v Speaker 2>when we went to Colorado. We were driving to California

0:57:54.200 --> 0:57:55.880
<v Speaker 2>and he was all excited to be able to get

0:57:55.960 --> 0:57:56.600
<v Speaker 2>COR's beer.

0:57:57.040 --> 0:57:59.680
<v Speaker 3>He's like, we're going to go in Colorado and California.

0:57:59.720 --> 0:58:00.520
<v Speaker 3>I guess this is just fun.

0:58:00.560 --> 0:58:01.800
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, because all you have to do is you

0:58:01.840 --> 0:58:04.440
<v Speaker 2>go somewhere west and then you can fly somewhere back

0:58:04.480 --> 0:58:06.560
<v Speaker 2>east and all of a sudden, now it's super valuable.

0:58:07.000 --> 0:58:08.560
<v Speaker 2>We don't have that kind of regional fund anymore.

0:58:08.600 --> 0:58:09.800
<v Speaker 3>Beer list, No, we really don't.

0:58:10.240 --> 0:58:11.120
<v Speaker 2>I love that. Thank you.

0:58:11.160 --> 0:58:14.160
<v Speaker 3>That's awesome, And that's it for today. You can find

0:58:14.240 --> 0:58:18.280
<v Speaker 3>us online at Ridiculous Crime dot com. We just one

0:58:18.680 --> 0:58:22.880
<v Speaker 3>lady Blogger of the seventeenth Century, awarded by Doanes Backpills

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<v Speaker 3>It's pretty Big Deals, Aaron, don't laugh. We're also at

0:58:26.520 --> 0:58:30.960
<v Speaker 3>Ridiculous Crime on Blue Sky and Instagram all the sash halls.

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<v Speaker 3>talk back on the iHeart app, Please reach out. Ridiculous

0:58:46.720 --> 0:58:49.600
<v Speaker 3>Crime is hosted by Elizabeth Dutton and Zaren Burnett, produced

0:58:49.640 --> 0:58:53.360
<v Speaker 3>and edited by Chief Ridiculous Crime brand Ambassador Dave Cousten,

0:58:53.680 --> 0:58:58.480
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0:58:58.520 --> 0:59:01.760
<v Speaker 3>with two point eight million followers, Marisa Brown. The theme

0:59:01.840 --> 0:59:05.280
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<v Speaker 3>Tuned flip Flop TikToker Travis Dunton. Post wardrobe is provided

0:59:09.720 --> 0:59:13.120
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<v Speaker 3>and mister Andre. Executive producers are feed curator Ben Boleen

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<v Speaker 3>and professional Instagram real consultant Noel grind dis Crime Say

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<v Speaker 3>It One More Time Geous Crime.

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