WEBVTT - The Moons of Uranus, Part 1

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<v Speaker 1>What's the color of ice? I think about the wedge

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<v Speaker 1>of ice broken from the lid of the lake in winter.

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<v Speaker 1>It goes from dusky white to clear as it leaks

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<v Speaker 1>itself into your hands. But when the glacier shears off

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<v Speaker 1>and unveils its inner face, forged over one hundred thousand years,

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<v Speaker 1>now you see a questioning blue. Now the glacier melts

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<v Speaker 1>into the sea and it's gone, becomes green with algae,

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<v Speaker 1>gray with mud, and a color that was once called

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<v Speaker 1>wine dark. But what is the color of ice? That's

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<v Speaker 1>not the ice we know that lies hidden behind a

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<v Speaker 1>haze and swims in a darkness, crushed by diamond rain.

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<v Speaker 1>We approach our destination along the orbital plain, great wide

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<v Speaker 1>table of the sun.

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<v Speaker 2>But as the.

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<v Speaker 1>Planet comes into view, we're looking at the north pole.

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<v Speaker 1>This is summer. The frozen eye reclines on its flank.

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<v Speaker 1>There's the pole now bathing in the season of light.

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<v Speaker 1>The hidden face the opposite pole now holds cord in

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<v Speaker 1>the bitter cold of the stars. There's something about that blue,

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<v Speaker 1>almost as cold as a thing can be, but joyful

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<v Speaker 1>in the way it devours the sunshine. It reminds us

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<v Speaker 1>of something something on Earth. That brings life, or invites

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<v Speaker 1>the living, or is alive itself.

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<v Speaker 3>Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey you, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My

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<v Speaker 2>name is Robert Lamb.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm Joe McCormick, and today we're going to be

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<v Speaker 1>fulfilling a very common request. Years ago, we did a

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<v Speaker 1>series of episodes where we looked at the moons of

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<v Speaker 1>various planets in the Solar System, the moons of Jupiter,

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<v Speaker 1>the moons of Saturn, the moons of Mars, and I

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<v Speaker 1>think we even did one even though Venus doesn't have

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<v Speaker 1>a moon.

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<v Speaker 2>We did an.

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<v Speaker 1>Episode sort of about the alternative universe where there would

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<v Speaker 1>be a moon of Venus something like that. But today

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<v Speaker 1>we're going to be talking about the moons of the

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<v Speaker 1>seventh planet in our Solar System. In this first episode

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<v Speaker 1>in the series, I think we're going to be focusing

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<v Speaker 1>mainly on the planet itself, and then we will get

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<v Speaker 1>more into the moons in the subsequent part or parts.

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<v Speaker 1>And since this is an audio medium, the question of

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<v Speaker 1>how to pronounce that planet's name is unavoidable. I thought

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<v Speaker 1>we should tackle it right here at the beginning, because

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<v Speaker 1>I know we have said it moultiple ways on the

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<v Speaker 1>podcast before. I think I have said it multiple ways before,

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<v Speaker 1>and the only thing to do is give ourselves preemptive,

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<v Speaker 1>full absolution to pronounce it any which way we want.

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<v Speaker 1>But basically, so I was trying to figure out, like

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<v Speaker 1>what is actually the right way, and I think it

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<v Speaker 1>goes like this. If you listen to astronomers and planetary

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<v Speaker 1>scientists talk about this planet, most often you will hear

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<v Speaker 1>them pronounce it urinus, basically the word urine and then

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<v Speaker 1>the word us. On the other hand, there's sort of

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<v Speaker 1>a dos Boot situation going on with this planet name,

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<v Speaker 1>like for the most part, like the scientists might say urinus,

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<v Speaker 1>but for the most part, just people say uranus, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>at least they do in America. I don't know if

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<v Speaker 1>it's different in other English speaking cultures or other languages

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<v Speaker 1>where the name would be you know, a direct homophone.

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<v Speaker 1>But anyway, Uranus is. It's sort of part of the culture,

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<v Speaker 1>it's part of the world we grew up in, and

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<v Speaker 1>there's really no fixing that. So I think that will

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<v Speaker 1>probably come out of our mouths as well.

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<v Speaker 2>Well. The tragedy of it is that I feel like

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<v Speaker 2>most of the time. When you hear uranus as the

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<v Speaker 2>pronunciation for the planet Uranus, it is coming out of

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<v Speaker 2>the mouth of, say a of a talk show host

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<v Speaker 2>or you know, late night news situation, a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>of t he. Yeah, I mean not just a little

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<v Speaker 2>bit of t he, but like a front loaded, like

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<v Speaker 2>dump truck quality of t he to the to the

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<v Speaker 2>to the detriment of whatever the actual news is. Like,

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<v Speaker 2>it could be announced tomorrow that life was discovered on Uranus,

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<v Speaker 2>but the the the late night talk show hosts would

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<v Speaker 2>say you're anus, everyone would laugh and completely forget that

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<v Speaker 2>the most breathtaking news in the history of our species

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<v Speaker 2>was just revealed. Because Uranus if pronounced slightly incorrectly, I'm sorry.

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<v Speaker 2>From my point of view, it sounds like you're saying

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<v Speaker 2>somebody's anus.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, a benevolent jellyfish inhabit the clouds. It's it's very interesting,

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<v Speaker 1>But the main thing is we did successfully probe uranus.

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<v Speaker 2>Haha. Yeah, yeah, So it's it's I mean, especially for

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<v Speaker 2>a professional space science communicators, people working for NASA and

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<v Speaker 2>so forth. I don't know, I guess it probably comes

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<v Speaker 2>to the point where you've got to just embrace it, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>and enroll with it, but it also there has to

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<v Speaker 2>still be some at least low level of just fixed

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<v Speaker 2>frustration over the situation.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it's one of those things that becomes annoying

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<v Speaker 1>and then it comes full circle and becomes funny again. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>but for another wrinkle, we have the apparently correct uranus

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<v Speaker 1>and then we have the common uranus. But according to

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<v Speaker 1>an interview I saw with the American physicist Kevin Grazier,

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<v Speaker 1>who writes a lot about space and about science fiction

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<v Speaker 1>from a science perspective, he was the editor and a

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<v Speaker 1>contributing author on the science of Doune, which we have

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<v Speaker 1>talked about on the show before. He says in one

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<v Speaker 1>interview that it technically it is uranus. So you know,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe he's right, But apparently nobody says it that way.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, it starts with everyone who wants to start

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<v Speaker 2>pronouncing it differently. You know, say uranus sounds good to.

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<v Speaker 1>Me, so you say uranus. I say uranus. Most experts

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<v Speaker 1>say urinus. But in any case, it's gonna be fine.

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<v Speaker 1>We all know which planet we're talking about. It's number seven.

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<v Speaker 1>It's big, it's blue, it's cold, it's beautiful, and it

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<v Speaker 1>has a heck of a lot of moons.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and and the fair amount of mystery surrounding it.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, in this episode we're venturing farther out into

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<v Speaker 2>the void here, so we're gonna encounter some more space

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<v Speaker 2>to wonder. We'll also, I think eventually be getting to

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<v Speaker 2>a fourth pronunciation for your old boy, So so strap in,

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<v Speaker 2>but Urinus. Here are some of the basics for anyone

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<v Speaker 2>who needs a refresher, and I think we can all

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<v Speaker 2>deal with a refresher. Uranus is the seventh planet from

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<v Speaker 2>the Sun, and in size it has the third largest

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<v Speaker 2>diameter in the Solar System. It's about four times larger

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<v Speaker 2>than Earth in diama. Yes, While Uranus and its neighbor

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<v Speaker 2>Neptune were previously classified as gas giants like Jupiter and Saturn,

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<v Speaker 2>it became clear in the nineteen nineties so they are

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<v Speaker 2>actually a subset of gas giants ice giants. So most

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<v Speaker 2>of the planet's mass is believed to be a hot

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<v Speaker 2>and dense fluid of icy materials around a small rocky core.

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<v Speaker 2>Its atmosphere is mostly molecular hydrogen and atomic helium, and

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<v Speaker 2>there also seems to be a small amount of methane.

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<v Speaker 2>It experiences the equivalent of a seventeen hour day like

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<v Speaker 2>a seventeen hour seventeen hours of Earth day, and an

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<v Speaker 2>eighty four year solar orbit.

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<v Speaker 1>Now, you mentioned that most of the planet's mass is

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<v Speaker 1>this relatively hot and dense fluid of icy materials. But

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<v Speaker 1>that should not give you the wrong impression about the

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<v Speaker 1>planet overall, because an interesting fact about Uranus is that

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<v Speaker 1>it is the coldest planet in the Solar System, even

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<v Speaker 1>though it is not the farthest from the Sun. Neptune

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<v Speaker 1>is much farther away from the Sun. I think something

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<v Speaker 1>like ten times the distance from the Earth to the

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<v Speaker 1>Sun farther away than Urinus is, and yet it is

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<v Speaker 1>actually a little bit warmer. On average, the temperature in

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<v Speaker 1>the upper atmosphere of Urinus reaches negative two hundred and

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<v Speaker 1>twenty four degrees celsius, colder than equivalent measures on Neptune,

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<v Speaker 1>which are about ten degrees celsius higher. I want to

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<v Speaker 1>come back in a little bit to why that might be.

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<v Speaker 1>But yeah, not the farthest away, but the coldest.

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<v Speaker 2>It's cold out there. It's lonely out there.

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<v Speaker 1>Now, you mentioned that it takes eighty four years for

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<v Speaker 1>Uranus to orbit the Sun once. That means since its

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<v Speaker 1>discovery in seventeen eighty one, which we will narrate in

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<v Speaker 1>a few minutes. Here, less than three full years have

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<v Speaker 1>elapsed on Uranus. It's seventeen eighty one plus eighty four

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<v Speaker 1>Earth years is eighteen sixty five plus another eighty four

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<v Speaker 1>is nineteen forty nine, and then it will be another

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<v Speaker 1>full year on that planet. When it's twenty thirty three

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<v Speaker 1>on Earth. Calendar pages tear away quite a bit slower there.

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<v Speaker 1>This longer year also gives you an idea of how

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<v Speaker 1>far away from the Sun this planet is. You know.

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<v Speaker 1>This comes up on the show a good bit. When

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<v Speaker 1>we make visual representations of the Solar System. One thing

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<v Speaker 1>that's pretty much always impossible to capture is the real

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<v Speaker 1>relative size and distance between objects. There really, I think

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<v Speaker 1>is no convincing way to represent the real distance between

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<v Speaker 1>planets in the Solar System within the same image and

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<v Speaker 1>have it make intuitive sense. So let's talk about the

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<v Speaker 1>scaling up of distances as one moves further out from

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<v Speaker 1>the Sun. The average distance from Earth to the Sun

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<v Speaker 1>is a commonly used measurement. It's called an astronomical unit,

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<v Speaker 1>or AU for short, and it's equivalent to about one

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<v Speaker 1>hundred and forty nine point six million kilometers, pulling up

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<v Speaker 1>numbers cited by NASA JPL for these other planets. Both

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<v Speaker 1>Mercury and Venus, of course, are within one AU, so

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<v Speaker 1>Mercury is about zero point four and Venus is about

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<v Speaker 1>zero point seven AU from the Sun. They're both closer

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<v Speaker 1>than Us. Mars is about one point five AU, so

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<v Speaker 1>about one point one and a half times the distance

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<v Speaker 1>from Us to the Sun. Suddenly Jupiter is more than

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<v Speaker 1>five times the distance. Saturn is nine point five AU,

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<v Speaker 1>and then Urinus is suddenly nineteen point two AU, So

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<v Speaker 1>the distances multiply greatly the further you go out, and

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<v Speaker 1>then Neptune is about thirty so another another ten basically

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<v Speaker 1>sort of ten AU between Saturn and Uranus, and then

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<v Speaker 1>another ten between Uranus and Neptune.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So venturing into into the outer Solar system, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>it's like it's like leaving an urban center and traveling

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<v Speaker 2>out into the boonies. The gas stations that you you

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<v Speaker 2>would venture into or are are farther and farther apart,

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<v Speaker 2>and you begin to wonder where your next tank is

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<v Speaker 2>going to come from.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so it's always impossible to reckon the real scale

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<v Speaker 1>of space. And the funny thing is, this is just

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<v Speaker 1>our Solar system. You know, this is like the things

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<v Speaker 1>that are actually relatively very close together from a space perspective.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, absolutely, all right, So let's see some more facts

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<v Speaker 2>about Urinus itself. It has thirteen rings, and like Venus,

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<v Speaker 2>it rotates east to west. It also rotates at a

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<v Speaker 2>near ninety degree angle from the plane of its orbit,

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<v Speaker 2>so this gives it the appearance of spinning on its side.

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<v Speaker 1>That is a very interesting and unique fact about Uranus.

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<v Speaker 1>So if you can picture it, all of the other

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<v Speaker 1>planets in the Solar system, you know, they all have

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<v Speaker 1>some degree of axial tilt, but they more or less

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<v Speaker 1>spin like a top, with the north and south poles

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<v Speaker 1>facing more or less perpendicular to the solar plane. So

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<v Speaker 1>you can imagine the Sun in the middle of the

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<v Speaker 1>Solar system, and then there is a disc of flat

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<v Speaker 1>discs spreading out from the Sun that all of the

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<v Speaker 1>planets orbit on. Those planets have some tilt, but they

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<v Speaker 1>more or less rotate so that their equator is in

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<v Speaker 1>line with that plane, and their north and south poles

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<v Speaker 1>are at right angles to it. Urinus is the exception.

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<v Speaker 1>It lies on its side Its axial tilt is something

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<v Speaker 1>like ninety seven or ninety eight degrees, so almost perfectly

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<v Speaker 1>sideways from the perspective of the solar plane. Its equator

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<v Speaker 1>rotates up and down, and its poles point to the sides,

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<v Speaker 1>which has the strange effect that its seasons as it

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<v Speaker 1>orbits the Sun throughout its year, mean that the poles

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<v Speaker 1>get like many Earth years of light and darkness as

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<v Speaker 1>the year progresses. So for forty two years, its north

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<v Speaker 1>pole will be in relative sunshine and its south pole

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<v Speaker 1>will be in relative darkness, and then it flips around

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<v Speaker 1>for the other season. It's a weird planet, very strange.

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<v Speaker 1>This actually comes back to the question of why Uranus

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<v Speaker 1>is the coldest planet, even though it's not the farthest

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<v Speaker 1>from the Sun. How could a planet closer to the

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<v Speaker 1>Sun be colder than one farther away. The answer is

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<v Speaker 1>that planets give off their own heat, and compared to most,

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<v Speaker 1>Urinus gives off very little. So one major idea proposed

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<v Speaker 1>to explain why Urinus gives off so little intrinsic heat,

0:13:27.720 --> 0:13:31.360
<v Speaker 1>is the same as the reason it, unlike other planets

0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:35.520
<v Speaker 1>in the Solar System, rotates on its side. Scientists think

0:13:35.559 --> 0:13:38.560
<v Speaker 1>that billions of years ago during the formation of the

0:13:38.600 --> 0:13:44.040
<v Speaker 1>Solar System, Urinus very likely suffered a colossal impact from

0:13:44.120 --> 0:13:48.600
<v Speaker 1>a roughly Earth sized or Mars sized object, which was

0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:52.040
<v Speaker 1>able to both knock it out of its original orientation

0:13:52.320 --> 0:13:56.720
<v Speaker 1>and give it its its backwards rotation pattern opposite the

0:13:56.720 --> 0:13:59.640
<v Speaker 1>rest of the Solar System and its a sideways orientation

0:14:00.000 --> 0:14:04.360
<v Speaker 1>sways axial tilt, but also to blast away much of

0:14:04.400 --> 0:14:08.080
<v Speaker 1>its mass and energy, leaving it with less intrinsic heat

0:14:08.520 --> 0:14:12.200
<v Speaker 1>than even other ice giants like Neptune, and so if

0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:15.200
<v Speaker 1>this impact hypothesis is correct, it would explain much of

0:14:15.240 --> 0:14:18.960
<v Speaker 1>what we know about Uranus, why it's so cold, why

0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:22.040
<v Speaker 1>it's tilted, and why its rotation is the way it is.

0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:26.440
<v Speaker 1>One of the most striking things about Uranus is its appearance,

0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:30.440
<v Speaker 1>which can vary based on seasonal conditions. But in the

0:14:30.480 --> 0:14:34.880
<v Speaker 1>famous true color images assembled from what was captured by

0:14:34.880 --> 0:14:38.720
<v Speaker 1>the narrow angle camera of Voyager two in nineteen eighty six,

0:14:39.520 --> 0:14:44.400
<v Speaker 1>the planet looks like an almost perfectly uniform field of

0:14:44.520 --> 0:14:50.000
<v Speaker 1>pale blue green color, like a featureless Cyan ocean of fog.

0:14:50.840 --> 0:14:53.240
<v Speaker 1>And this is especially strange when you think about it

0:14:53.280 --> 0:14:56.480
<v Speaker 1>in contrast to the sort of banded surface of Jupiter,

0:14:56.800 --> 0:15:00.680
<v Speaker 1>it's just ripping with visible storms, or or like the

0:15:00.720 --> 0:15:04.000
<v Speaker 1>sandy stripes you see on Saturn with that big, nasty

0:15:04.040 --> 0:15:07.200
<v Speaker 1>polar hexagon. The truth is Urinus is not always as

0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:11.000
<v Speaker 1>calm looking as it is in these famous photos. For

0:15:11.040 --> 0:15:15.320
<v Speaker 1>one example, I found a February seventh, twenty nineteen NASA

0:15:15.360 --> 0:15:20.720
<v Speaker 1>news article by Ray Villard and Claire Seravia noting photos

0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:23.240
<v Speaker 1>that had been taken by the Hubble Space Telescope of

0:15:23.320 --> 0:15:28.120
<v Speaker 1>visible storms on both Uranus and Neptune. And in these pictures,

0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:32.200
<v Speaker 1>the storm on Urinus appears as a gigantic white dome

0:15:32.280 --> 0:15:36.120
<v Speaker 1>of clouds swarming over the planet's north pole, and the

0:15:36.160 --> 0:15:39.120
<v Speaker 1>authors note that this gigantic weather pattern might have been

0:15:39.200 --> 0:15:44.280
<v Speaker 1>formed by seasonal changes of flow in the atmosphere, because remember,

0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:46.640
<v Speaker 1>the planet is tilted on its side, so as the

0:15:46.720 --> 0:15:50.880
<v Speaker 1>seasons change, the part of the planet facing the direction

0:15:51.000 --> 0:15:54.200
<v Speaker 1>of the sun goes from a polar region that basically

0:15:54.400 --> 0:15:57.560
<v Speaker 1>remains in direct sunlight for many, many Earth years at

0:15:57.560 --> 0:16:02.080
<v Speaker 1>a time to an equatorial reaon that rotates through standard

0:16:02.200 --> 0:16:05.400
<v Speaker 1>day night cycles like Earth does, except it's rotating on

0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:09.320
<v Speaker 1>its side, and these drastic changes in seasons may give

0:16:09.440 --> 0:16:13.120
<v Speaker 1>rise to major changes in the flow of the atmosphere,

0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:17.600
<v Speaker 1>resulting in weather like this. I was reading an article

0:16:17.800 --> 0:16:22.320
<v Speaker 1>by the astrophysics blogger Ethan Seagull which made the point

0:16:22.320 --> 0:16:27.680
<v Speaker 1>that the Voyager two images are probably especially featureless because

0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:32.040
<v Speaker 1>they were taken during the solstice on Uranus, when the

0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:35.760
<v Speaker 1>continuous rays of sunlight had been falling on one of

0:16:35.840 --> 0:16:39.520
<v Speaker 1>the planet's polar regions for many earth years, and so

0:16:39.640 --> 0:16:45.040
<v Speaker 1>this regime of NonStop polar daytime created a haze of

0:16:45.200 --> 0:16:47.440
<v Speaker 1>methane in the upper atmosphere. So up at the top

0:16:47.480 --> 0:16:50.360
<v Speaker 1>of the atmosphere, there's all this methane up there, which

0:16:50.600 --> 0:16:54.800
<v Speaker 1>both masks the clouds and the visible weather patterns below,

0:16:54.880 --> 0:16:57.560
<v Speaker 1>so you can't really see what's going on beneath all

0:16:57.560 --> 0:17:01.080
<v Speaker 1>that methane, and it absorbs red light, leading to the

0:17:01.120 --> 0:17:05.120
<v Speaker 1>pale blue green color that we can't stop staring at.

0:17:05.680 --> 0:17:08.359
<v Speaker 1>By contrast, when you see photos of Uranus taken by

0:17:08.400 --> 0:17:12.920
<v Speaker 1>telescopes during its equinox, you will see more defined atmospheric

0:17:13.000 --> 0:17:16.200
<v Speaker 1>bands and storms and clouds, not as dramatic at all

0:17:16.560 --> 0:17:19.280
<v Speaker 1>as what you'd see on Jupiter, but the stuff is there,

0:17:19.880 --> 0:17:23.720
<v Speaker 1>so Uranus is not actually always featureless. This seems to

0:17:23.760 --> 0:17:27.400
<v Speaker 1>be a function of when and how it was photographed

0:17:27.480 --> 0:17:32.159
<v Speaker 1>by Voyager two. But in those voyager images it is

0:17:32.560 --> 0:17:38.840
<v Speaker 1>deeply striking, almost haunting, how frozen and unperturbed and uniform

0:17:39.000 --> 0:17:40.720
<v Speaker 1>the planet appears.

0:17:40.840 --> 0:17:44.040
<v Speaker 2>Very interesting. Yeah, yeah, it's a it's there's a there's

0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:45.800
<v Speaker 2>a calmness. So it's a call like you look at

0:17:45.840 --> 0:17:48.919
<v Speaker 2>images of of of Urinus and it's it's calming compared

0:17:48.960 --> 0:17:52.040
<v Speaker 2>to like the the the the the evident kind of

0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:54.200
<v Speaker 2>complexity and chaos of Jupiter.

0:17:54.600 --> 0:18:01.720
<v Speaker 1>Absolutely colder, stiller, more uniform, it'll even lying on its side,

0:18:01.760 --> 0:18:04.639
<v Speaker 1>and not to get to anthropomorphic, but as if dead.

0:18:05.040 --> 0:18:07.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and there's also a sense of the sky to it,

0:18:07.200 --> 0:18:09.639
<v Speaker 2>which is fitting. We'll come back to that in a second.

0:18:09.680 --> 0:18:15.280
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, mostly though this episode, we're getting into the

0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:19.280
<v Speaker 2>moons of Uranus and it has a healthy number of

0:18:19.359 --> 0:18:22.760
<v Speaker 2>moons twenty seven known moons. This is a good n

0:18:22.960 --> 0:18:25.920
<v Speaker 2>this is a number that we can handle, we can

0:18:25.960 --> 0:18:29.280
<v Speaker 2>actually name, I think, all the moons of Urinus, where as,

0:18:29.320 --> 0:18:32.600
<v Speaker 2>of course there are some really robust moon counts for

0:18:32.760 --> 0:18:35.880
<v Speaker 2>Jupiter and Saturn. So things are leveling out a little

0:18:35.880 --> 0:18:39.240
<v Speaker 2>bit for us as we continue our journey out through

0:18:39.280 --> 0:18:40.160
<v Speaker 2>the Solar system.

0:18:40.520 --> 0:18:42.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think this is more of a fair fight.

0:18:42.320 --> 0:18:44.280
<v Speaker 1>I don't think we said the names of all the

0:18:44.320 --> 0:18:45.560
<v Speaker 1>moons of Jupiter or Saturn.

0:18:45.880 --> 0:18:46.200
<v Speaker 2>Right.

0:18:46.320 --> 0:18:48.800
<v Speaker 1>Well, we can't promise in this series that we're going

0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:52.399
<v Speaker 1>to like discuss all of Urinus's moons deeply, because some

0:18:52.480 --> 0:18:54.240
<v Speaker 1>of them are just kind of rocks that I don't

0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:57.000
<v Speaker 1>know how much there is to say about them. I

0:18:57.000 --> 0:18:59.280
<v Speaker 1>don't mean to be offensive if you're a devotee of

0:18:59.280 --> 0:19:02.719
<v Speaker 1>any particular Bianca or something, but yeah, we will have

0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:04.199
<v Speaker 1>more to say about some than others.

0:19:04.680 --> 0:19:06.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and there's just not a lot to say about

0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:10.800
<v Speaker 2>some of them, just because we just haven't explored Uranus

0:19:11.040 --> 0:19:13.800
<v Speaker 2>or its moons as much. We've only had the one

0:19:13.920 --> 0:19:17.800
<v Speaker 2>voyager two fly by, really, and that's it, basically.

0:19:17.840 --> 0:19:17.959
<v Speaker 3>Know.

0:19:18.080 --> 0:19:20.840
<v Speaker 2>In addition to things like Hubble analysis and so.

0:19:20.760 --> 0:19:33.000
<v Speaker 1>Forth, Before we explore more about the planet and its moons,

0:19:33.000 --> 0:19:34.880
<v Speaker 1>I think we should take a little bit of time

0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:40.320
<v Speaker 1>to discuss the origins of this name, the mythological moniker

0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:43.880
<v Speaker 1>that has caused so much pleasure and pain among astronomers worldwide.

0:19:44.200 --> 0:19:46.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's right, and you know, it could have been

0:19:47.160 --> 0:19:50.399
<v Speaker 2>it could have been weirder in some respects because it

0:19:50.440 --> 0:19:53.520
<v Speaker 2>took about seventy years for this to be firmly decided

0:19:53.600 --> 0:19:59.359
<v Speaker 2>upon that, yes, this planet is Uranus. William Herschel wanted

0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:01.840
<v Speaker 2>to name it after King George the Third, so he

0:20:01.880 --> 0:20:06.520
<v Speaker 2>wanted to call it essentially the George Star Georgian Sidas,

0:20:07.320 --> 0:20:10.920
<v Speaker 2>but luckily we didn't. Can you imagine if if that

0:20:11.119 --> 0:20:14.040
<v Speaker 2>was the we had all these you know, these Roman

0:20:14.080 --> 0:20:18.240
<v Speaker 2>deity names, and then George Starr amazing presumably not.

0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:20.359
<v Speaker 1>I've got a story to tell about William Herschel in

0:20:20.840 --> 0:20:22.960
<v Speaker 1>a little bit here, but yeah, wanting to name it

0:20:23.000 --> 0:20:26.120
<v Speaker 1>after King George the third, He's just forever in the

0:20:26.160 --> 0:20:29.840
<v Speaker 1>heavens that that would be hilarious. Yeah, I don't know

0:20:29.880 --> 0:20:32.800
<v Speaker 1>what the modern equivalent like this is the this is

0:20:32.880 --> 0:20:34.480
<v Speaker 1>the gerald Ford planet.

0:20:36.040 --> 0:20:38.160
<v Speaker 2>I mean it is. There's always gonna be something weird

0:20:38.160 --> 0:20:43.120
<v Speaker 2>about naming these astral bodies after things and a given culture,

0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:46.000
<v Speaker 2>and we'll run into some of that again when we

0:20:46.040 --> 0:20:48.920
<v Speaker 2>get into some of the literary names that are invoked

0:20:48.920 --> 0:20:51.760
<v Speaker 2>in the moons. But but yeah, I just can't imagine

0:20:51.800 --> 0:20:55.520
<v Speaker 2>this being the George Star. So the namesake here is

0:20:55.880 --> 0:20:59.800
<v Speaker 2>the Greek primordial deity of the sky urin Us or

0:20:59.800 --> 0:21:03.200
<v Speaker 2>I think I think more correctly, or it would be Urunas. Right.

0:21:03.240 --> 0:21:04.840
<v Speaker 2>We've talked about this before on the show.

0:21:05.160 --> 0:21:06.920
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if i'd stand by that. I've heard

0:21:06.960 --> 0:21:09.840
<v Speaker 1>it said that way too, So we've got Urinus is

0:21:09.840 --> 0:21:14.959
<v Speaker 1>what most astronomers and planetary scientists say. The lay public,

0:21:15.000 --> 0:21:18.120
<v Speaker 1>at least in the US, says Uranus. We got one

0:21:18.160 --> 0:21:21.680
<v Speaker 1>interview with the guy who says, technically it's Uranus, and yes,

0:21:21.960 --> 0:21:23.760
<v Speaker 1>I've also heard uranus.

0:21:24.000 --> 0:21:28.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, though, I love Uruanas. But I'm gonna feel like

0:21:28.240 --> 0:21:31.280
<v Speaker 2>a weirdo if i start calling it that just among

0:21:31.320 --> 0:21:35.560
<v Speaker 2>friends and family or even on the podcast. So I'm

0:21:35.600 --> 0:21:37.439
<v Speaker 2>just gonna have to stick with you. Okay, let's do

0:21:37.480 --> 0:21:41.440
<v Speaker 2>it all right, So who is we can say Urunas?

0:21:41.480 --> 0:21:43.440
<v Speaker 2>Though when we're referring to the god, I think maybe

0:21:43.440 --> 0:21:48.560
<v Speaker 2>that's a good way of differentiating it. Here Greek primordial

0:21:48.600 --> 0:21:51.159
<v Speaker 2>deity of the sky and both a child and a

0:21:51.200 --> 0:21:54.639
<v Speaker 2>consort of Gaya, the parent and a parent of Titans

0:21:55.200 --> 0:21:58.639
<v Speaker 2>of the Cyclopses, as well as the Hecataneries, the one

0:21:58.720 --> 0:22:02.520
<v Speaker 2>hundred handed warriors who don't get enough I think attention

0:22:03.119 --> 0:22:05.800
<v Speaker 2>in the various wars of the gods, perhaps just because

0:22:05.840 --> 0:22:09.240
<v Speaker 2>they're hard to illustrate. It's hard to maybe imagine what

0:22:09.280 --> 0:22:11.879
<v Speaker 2>one hundred handed monster looks like.

0:22:12.400 --> 0:22:14.359
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, you can imagine two hands is just

0:22:14.440 --> 0:22:15.560
<v Speaker 1>kind of multiply from there.

0:22:15.960 --> 0:22:19.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, just like an absurdity of goro coming at you. There.

0:22:19.960 --> 0:22:24.560
<v Speaker 1>What's the Latin prefix for fifty? Like the quinta deca goro?

0:22:26.520 --> 0:22:29.640
<v Speaker 2>I don't know that sounds good. Okay, that's a lot

0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:33.160
<v Speaker 2>of button inputs though, for the punches. Anyway, Uranas is

0:22:33.240 --> 0:22:35.840
<v Speaker 2>the one who stands on high. He is the rain maker.

0:22:36.440 --> 0:22:39.840
<v Speaker 2>Among his many children was the titan Cronus, who, at

0:22:39.880 --> 0:22:45.600
<v Speaker 2>Gaya's urging, rebelled against his father, And of course Cronus

0:22:45.600 --> 0:22:48.320
<v Speaker 2>famously castrated his father in the myths and cast the

0:22:48.320 --> 0:22:51.640
<v Speaker 2>bloody pieces over his shoulder and ushered in a new

0:22:51.760 --> 0:22:55.800
<v Speaker 2>age of gods. Cronus would of course, eventually be overthrown

0:22:55.840 --> 0:22:57.600
<v Speaker 2>by his own son Zeus.

0:22:58.080 --> 0:23:00.480
<v Speaker 1>Okay, well, here I thought, this is a good opportune, ever,

0:23:00.560 --> 0:23:05.760
<v Speaker 1>reading from Hesiod's Theogony to explain what happened to old Urinus. Here, Oh,

0:23:05.840 --> 0:23:09.119
<v Speaker 1>let's happy, Okay. This is the version hosted on Harvard

0:23:09.200 --> 0:23:12.040
<v Speaker 1>Center for Hellenic Studies website. This is a translation by

0:23:12.080 --> 0:23:15.320
<v Speaker 1>Naggie and banks. Oh, and it's gonna mention Earth and Sky.

0:23:15.400 --> 0:23:17.960
<v Speaker 1>I think Earth would be the goddess Gaia, and Sky

0:23:18.080 --> 0:23:22.199
<v Speaker 1>would be Urinus. Here yeah, Hesiod writes, Now monstrous strength

0:23:22.280 --> 0:23:26.080
<v Speaker 1>is powerful joined with vast size. Four of as many

0:23:26.119 --> 0:23:28.840
<v Speaker 1>sons as were born of Earth and Sky. They were

0:23:28.880 --> 0:23:32.000
<v Speaker 1>the fiercest and were hated by their father from the

0:23:32.119 --> 0:23:35.119
<v Speaker 1>very first. As soon as any of these was born,

0:23:35.400 --> 0:23:37.719
<v Speaker 1>he would hide them all and not send them up

0:23:37.720 --> 0:23:40.640
<v Speaker 1>to the light. In a cave of the Earth and

0:23:40.800 --> 0:23:45.240
<v Speaker 1>Sky exulted over the work of mischief, while huge Earth

0:23:45.400 --> 0:23:49.520
<v Speaker 1>groaned from within. Straightened as she was, and she devised

0:23:49.560 --> 0:23:53.199
<v Speaker 1>a subtle and evil scheme. For quickly, having produced a

0:23:53.240 --> 0:23:56.680
<v Speaker 1>stock of white iron, she forged a large sickle blade,

0:23:56.960 --> 0:23:59.960
<v Speaker 1>and gave the word to her children, and said, encouragingly,

0:24:00.400 --> 0:24:03.240
<v Speaker 1>though troubled in her heart, children, of me and of

0:24:03.240 --> 0:24:06.280
<v Speaker 1>a father madly violent, if you would obey me, we

0:24:06.359 --> 0:24:09.560
<v Speaker 1>shall avenge the baneful injury of your father, for he

0:24:09.680 --> 0:24:13.359
<v Speaker 1>was the first that devised acts of indignity, so spoke she,

0:24:13.640 --> 0:24:16.280
<v Speaker 1>But soon seized on them all, nor did any of

0:24:16.320 --> 0:24:20.840
<v Speaker 1>them speak till, having gathered courage, great and wily Cronos

0:24:20.840 --> 0:24:24.680
<v Speaker 1>addressed his dear mother. Thus in reply, Mother, this deed

0:24:24.680 --> 0:24:27.199
<v Speaker 1>at any rate I will undertake and accomplished. Since our

0:24:27.280 --> 0:24:31.040
<v Speaker 1>father of detested name, I care not, for he was

0:24:31.080 --> 0:24:35.360
<v Speaker 1>the first that devised acts of indignity. They're really hitting

0:24:35.400 --> 0:24:39.600
<v Speaker 1>the talking points here. Thus spoke he and huge Earth

0:24:39.720 --> 0:24:43.800
<v Speaker 1>rejoiced much at heart, and hid and planted him in ambush.

0:24:44.119 --> 0:24:47.679
<v Speaker 1>In his hand she placed a sickle with jagged teeth,

0:24:48.000 --> 0:24:53.080
<v Speaker 1>and suggested to him all the stratagem. Then came vast Sky,

0:24:53.080 --> 0:24:57.159
<v Speaker 1>bringing night with him, and eager for love, brooded around Earth,

0:24:57.200 --> 0:25:01.000
<v Speaker 1>and lay stretched on all sides but his from out

0:25:01.000 --> 0:25:04.240
<v Speaker 1>his ambush grasped at him with his left hand, while

0:25:04.280 --> 0:25:07.040
<v Speaker 1>in his right he took the huge sickle, long and

0:25:07.119 --> 0:25:11.520
<v Speaker 1>jagged toothed, and hastily mowed off the genitals of his father,

0:25:11.880 --> 0:25:14.880
<v Speaker 1>and threw them backwards to be carried away behind him.

0:25:15.400 --> 0:25:18.679
<v Speaker 2>Pretty rough stuff. I don't know why the sickle had

0:25:18.680 --> 0:25:19.679
<v Speaker 2>to have jagged teeth.

0:25:19.720 --> 0:25:20.360
<v Speaker 1>I don't know either.

0:25:20.560 --> 0:25:22.560
<v Speaker 2>Thed was just laying it in there a little bit.

0:25:22.840 --> 0:25:25.560
<v Speaker 1>It's a serrated sickle. I've never even heard of such

0:25:25.600 --> 0:25:27.600
<v Speaker 1>a thing. It's like a steak knife.

0:25:27.920 --> 0:25:28.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:25:29.000 --> 0:25:31.840
<v Speaker 1>But as I mentioned Urinus there, his name is synonymous

0:25:31.840 --> 0:25:34.600
<v Speaker 1>with Sky, so in this translation they just call him Sky.

0:25:35.000 --> 0:25:37.400
<v Speaker 1>So I think it's very interesting that we end up

0:25:37.440 --> 0:25:40.040
<v Speaker 1>with a planet that, in a way, based on the

0:25:40.080 --> 0:25:43.760
<v Speaker 1>original mythological context, could just be called sky. It is

0:25:43.840 --> 0:25:45.240
<v Speaker 1>the sky planet.

0:25:45.800 --> 0:25:48.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, And of course it's interesting that we're switching

0:25:48.600 --> 0:25:52.119
<v Speaker 2>from Roman to Greek in coming out here to Uranus.

0:25:52.640 --> 0:25:55.320
<v Speaker 2>And of course this may raise the question of why

0:25:55.880 --> 0:25:58.320
<v Speaker 2>why are we talking about modern discussions of what this

0:25:58.400 --> 0:26:00.840
<v Speaker 2>planet will be named? And of course you know that

0:26:00.880 --> 0:26:04.679
<v Speaker 2>has to do with with how late it was discovered,

0:26:06.119 --> 0:26:10.000
<v Speaker 2>properly discovered, because when discussing basically this comes down to

0:26:10.200 --> 0:26:13.320
<v Speaker 2>a discussion of the classical planets versus the the more

0:26:14.040 --> 0:26:17.119
<v Speaker 2>outer and I guess you could say modern planets. The

0:26:17.119 --> 0:26:20.600
<v Speaker 2>classical planets are those visible to the naked eye and

0:26:21.000 --> 0:26:25.400
<v Speaker 2>bright enough to be considered important in ancient astronomy and astrology.

0:26:26.520 --> 0:26:28.760
<v Speaker 2>And we'll discuss a little bit more about what that

0:26:28.800 --> 0:26:31.560
<v Speaker 2>means in just a second there. There there are many

0:26:31.640 --> 0:26:34.760
<v Speaker 2>names for the classical planets because they pop up in

0:26:34.920 --> 0:26:37.639
<v Speaker 2>various astronomical systems.

0:26:37.600 --> 0:26:40.280
<v Speaker 1>Right, they were known to many different ancient cultures, so

0:26:40.320 --> 0:26:43.159
<v Speaker 1>they have many different names exactly.

0:26:43.280 --> 0:26:46.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So you know, for instance, mercury through Saturn have

0:26:46.280 --> 0:26:51.600
<v Speaker 2>names that indicate elemental alignment in Chinese tradition, So Mars

0:26:51.680 --> 0:26:56.760
<v Speaker 2>is the fire star, Jupiter is the wood star, that

0:26:56.920 --> 0:27:00.000
<v Speaker 2>sort of thing. But the Chinese for the outer planets,

0:27:00.080 --> 0:27:03.840
<v Speaker 2>interestingly enough, is not based in an actual like Chinese

0:27:03.960 --> 0:27:08.399
<v Speaker 2>at astrological history, but in translation of at least the

0:27:08.400 --> 0:27:14.480
<v Speaker 2>spirit of the Western names. So Uranus in Mandarin is

0:27:14.960 --> 0:27:19.480
<v Speaker 2>Tan wang Shing or sky king star. So I think

0:27:19.520 --> 0:27:22.800
<v Speaker 2>that's that's center, just basically alluding to this is a

0:27:22.840 --> 0:27:25.320
<v Speaker 2>sky god. That's the name that we've used in naming

0:27:25.320 --> 0:27:28.800
<v Speaker 2>the planet. So it's sky sky king star. Neptune is

0:27:28.920 --> 0:27:33.679
<v Speaker 2>ocean king star, Pluto is nether World king star. In translation.

0:27:34.280 --> 0:27:37.800
<v Speaker 1>I love that, Yes, translating the sense of the names.

0:27:38.200 --> 0:27:40.840
<v Speaker 1>So the name in Mandarin is like a summary of

0:27:40.880 --> 0:27:43.560
<v Speaker 1>where the name comes from, like the Latin or Greek name.

0:27:44.080 --> 0:27:47.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So again talking about the classical planets here, these

0:27:47.040 --> 0:27:53.199
<v Speaker 2>were the planets that were known to antiquity Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter,

0:27:53.280 --> 0:27:56.679
<v Speaker 2>and Saturn. Uranus was the first planet discovered via the

0:27:56.720 --> 0:28:00.199
<v Speaker 2>aid of a telescope, and it happened in seventeen eighty

0:28:00.280 --> 0:28:04.680
<v Speaker 2>one by astronomer William Herschel In addition, he also discovered

0:28:04.720 --> 0:28:10.400
<v Speaker 2>infrared radiation. He's also credited with the discovery of Titania

0:28:10.520 --> 0:28:12.800
<v Speaker 2>and Oberon, which are some moons we'll get into in

0:28:12.800 --> 0:28:16.440
<v Speaker 2>a bit, as well as two of the moons of Saturn,

0:28:16.920 --> 0:28:20.640
<v Speaker 2>Enceladus and Mimas. His son John Herschel got to carry

0:28:20.640 --> 0:28:23.520
<v Speaker 2>on their tradition and named seven moons of Saturn and

0:28:23.600 --> 0:28:25.080
<v Speaker 2>four moons of Uranus.

0:28:25.680 --> 0:28:28.480
<v Speaker 1>Now, a really interesting thing about the discovery of Uranus

0:28:28.520 --> 0:28:32.399
<v Speaker 1>by William Herschel is that at first he did not

0:28:32.680 --> 0:28:36.440
<v Speaker 1>realize he had discovered a new planet in the Solar System.

0:28:36.720 --> 0:28:38.520
<v Speaker 1>And the reason for this will sort of tie into

0:28:38.520 --> 0:28:41.240
<v Speaker 1>things we've been talking about. I was reading about this

0:28:41.400 --> 0:28:45.520
<v Speaker 1>in a paper called Uranus in the Establishment of Herschel's

0:28:45.560 --> 0:28:49.360
<v Speaker 1>Astronomy by Simon Schaeffer, published in the Journal of the

0:28:49.400 --> 0:28:53.040
<v Speaker 1>History of Astronomy in nineteen eighty one, and so the

0:28:53.080 --> 0:28:56.200
<v Speaker 1>story of the discovery of Urinus goes like this. William

0:28:56.240 --> 0:29:00.560
<v Speaker 1>Herschel had undertaken a project, beginning in seventeen seventy nine,

0:29:00.600 --> 0:29:03.720
<v Speaker 1>to survey all of the stars in the sky to

0:29:03.800 --> 0:29:07.000
<v Speaker 1>the limit of the eighth magnitude using a seven foot

0:29:07.080 --> 0:29:12.200
<v Speaker 1>reflecting telescope, mainly for the purpose of identifying double stars

0:29:12.680 --> 0:29:17.360
<v Speaker 1>so that Herschel could try to make measurements of stellar parallax.

0:29:17.960 --> 0:29:22.000
<v Speaker 1>In March seventeen eighty one, Herschel had his telescope moved

0:29:22.000 --> 0:29:26.360
<v Speaker 1>to his house on New King Street in Bath in Somerset, England,

0:29:26.840 --> 0:29:30.400
<v Speaker 1>and he was picking up with his observations from this location.

0:29:30.480 --> 0:29:33.200
<v Speaker 1>And on the week of the discovery of Uranus, he

0:29:33.280 --> 0:29:37.680
<v Speaker 1>had been occupied cataloging the visible stars within the constellation Gemini,

0:29:38.280 --> 0:29:41.760
<v Speaker 1>and also with some observations of the planet's Mars and Saturn.

0:29:42.480 --> 0:29:46.520
<v Speaker 1>And on Tuesday, March thirteenth, at ten thirty pm, Herschel

0:29:46.560 --> 0:29:49.240
<v Speaker 1>made a note of an object in the area of

0:29:49.280 --> 0:29:53.720
<v Speaker 1>the star Pollux, also known as Beta Geminorum. The object

0:29:53.920 --> 0:29:58.560
<v Speaker 1>was quote a curious either nebulous star or perhaps a comet,

0:29:59.120 --> 0:30:03.320
<v Speaker 1>and later translated this discovery to his volume in progress,

0:30:03.360 --> 0:30:06.400
<v Speaker 1>which was called Observations on the Fixed Stars.

0:30:06.960 --> 0:30:07.320
<v Speaker 2>Quote.

0:30:07.480 --> 0:30:10.680
<v Speaker 1>Looking at a star in the quartile between oreguess right

0:30:10.680 --> 0:30:14.160
<v Speaker 1>foot and the left foot of Castor, I discovered a comet.

0:30:14.640 --> 0:30:16.960
<v Speaker 1>It was at the distance of almost two thirds of

0:30:16.960 --> 0:30:20.240
<v Speaker 1>my field of view from a small telescopic star which

0:30:20.280 --> 0:30:23.680
<v Speaker 1>followed it, and seemed to have the same declination. Now

0:30:23.720 --> 0:30:27.840
<v Speaker 1>Herschel didn't seem to be immediately overwhelmed with ideas of

0:30:27.840 --> 0:30:30.280
<v Speaker 1>the importance of this finding. He after this just went

0:30:30.320 --> 0:30:33.040
<v Speaker 1>back to looking for double stars, and it wasn't until

0:30:33.200 --> 0:30:36.680
<v Speaker 1>Saturday March seventeenth, which was four days later, that he

0:30:36.720 --> 0:30:40.280
<v Speaker 1>went back and looked for the curious nebulous star or

0:30:40.320 --> 0:30:43.880
<v Speaker 1>perhaps comet again, and this time he concluded that it

0:30:43.960 --> 0:30:46.240
<v Speaker 1>must be a comet rather than a star, because it

0:30:46.280 --> 0:30:49.960
<v Speaker 1>had changed its place. So he invited some friends over,

0:30:50.040 --> 0:30:53.440
<v Speaker 1>including a guy named doctor William Watson, to come take

0:30:53.480 --> 0:30:55.800
<v Speaker 1>a look at the comet he had found, and he

0:30:55.960 --> 0:30:59.000
<v Speaker 1>noted in his journal that unfortunately the measurements he took

0:30:59.040 --> 0:31:02.600
<v Speaker 1>that night were written down wrong because Watson and another

0:31:02.680 --> 0:31:05.200
<v Speaker 1>gentleman wouldn't stop talking at him while he was trying

0:31:05.240 --> 0:31:09.120
<v Speaker 1>to write them. But he eventually sent off his findings

0:31:09.120 --> 0:31:11.520
<v Speaker 1>in a letter to the Royal Society in London, and

0:31:11.640 --> 0:31:15.600
<v Speaker 1>Herschel reported that the object was a newly discovered comet,

0:31:16.000 --> 0:31:19.080
<v Speaker 1>but there were some strange things about it. Based on

0:31:19.160 --> 0:31:22.400
<v Speaker 1>initial observations, it would seem that the comet was quote

0:31:22.720 --> 0:31:26.680
<v Speaker 1>much larger in diameter but less luminous than any comet

0:31:27.040 --> 0:31:30.280
<v Speaker 1>known at the time, and that quote its body seemed

0:31:30.400 --> 0:31:34.800
<v Speaker 1>very well defined, having neither beard nor tail. Now that

0:31:34.920 --> 0:31:37.640
<v Speaker 1>struck me because I was like, what is a beard?

0:31:37.800 --> 0:31:40.800
<v Speaker 1>Comets are often said to have tails, but the idea

0:31:40.840 --> 0:31:43.280
<v Speaker 1>of a beard I was less familiar with. As best

0:31:43.320 --> 0:31:45.880
<v Speaker 1>I could figure out, this, I think seems to just

0:31:45.920 --> 0:31:49.760
<v Speaker 1>be another way of describing the tale of a comet, which,

0:31:49.880 --> 0:31:53.080
<v Speaker 1>of course the tale is an elongated cloud trailing off

0:31:53.120 --> 0:31:55.840
<v Speaker 1>of the comet away from the Sun, caused when the

0:31:55.840 --> 0:31:58.840
<v Speaker 1>comet approaches closer in its orbit to the Sun and

0:31:58.880 --> 0:32:02.520
<v Speaker 1>then solar radiation and heats the volatile materials on the

0:32:02.520 --> 0:32:05.400
<v Speaker 1>surface of the comet and they vaporize and stream away

0:32:05.440 --> 0:32:08.280
<v Speaker 1>into space. I don't know if the following is the

0:32:08.800 --> 0:32:12.320
<v Speaker 1>difference emphasized by beard versus tail, but comets often do

0:32:12.400 --> 0:32:16.000
<v Speaker 1>have two distinct tails. A dust tail made of the

0:32:16.400 --> 0:32:20.440
<v Speaker 1>dust to find particles coming off of the comet from

0:32:20.480 --> 0:32:23.320
<v Speaker 1>this outgassing when it's heated, and then also a gas

0:32:23.400 --> 0:32:27.640
<v Speaker 1>tail made of glowing ionized gases. However, I could find

0:32:27.760 --> 0:32:32.040
<v Speaker 1>archaic references to comets in general simply calling them quote

0:32:32.120 --> 0:32:35.640
<v Speaker 1>bearded stars. So I don't know. Maybe a beard means

0:32:35.680 --> 0:32:38.240
<v Speaker 1>either one. I guess the other ideas that it could

0:32:38.280 --> 0:32:41.720
<v Speaker 1>possibly refer to the idea of a coma, which is

0:32:41.800 --> 0:32:45.160
<v Speaker 1>the sort of tenuous atmosphere of a comet, seen usually

0:32:45.240 --> 0:32:48.560
<v Speaker 1>as a fuzzy spherical cloud around the solid nucleus.

0:32:49.480 --> 0:32:52.880
<v Speaker 2>I wonder too if this might come down to sort

0:32:52.920 --> 0:32:58.200
<v Speaker 2>of the distinction between sort of more modern telescope generated

0:32:58.240 --> 0:33:03.600
<v Speaker 2>imagery and your telescope observation. You know, we've talked about

0:33:03.600 --> 0:33:07.560
<v Speaker 2>that a little bit, like the role of the observer

0:33:07.720 --> 0:33:11.920
<v Speaker 2>in real time and sort of you know, classical telescope

0:33:11.920 --> 0:33:14.800
<v Speaker 2>astronomy versus the more modern use of imagery.

0:33:15.440 --> 0:33:19.120
<v Speaker 1>I don't know for sure about that, but so he's like, ah, okay,

0:33:19.400 --> 0:33:21.880
<v Speaker 1>it's a comet, but it just it doesn't have a

0:33:21.920 --> 0:33:24.120
<v Speaker 1>lot of the characteristics we would expect of a comment.

0:33:24.440 --> 0:33:27.280
<v Speaker 1>In fact, the paper cites a letter from the French

0:33:27.320 --> 0:33:31.600
<v Speaker 1>astronomer Charles Messier, who was known as quote the ferret

0:33:31.720 --> 0:33:34.320
<v Speaker 1>of comets. I'd never heard that before, but I think

0:33:34.320 --> 0:33:37.600
<v Speaker 1>he found a lot of them. Messier, the Ferret of comments,

0:33:37.640 --> 0:33:41.440
<v Speaker 1>wrote to Herschel in April of seventeen eighty one. It

0:33:41.560 --> 0:33:43.200
<v Speaker 1>was quoted in the paper in French, so I had

0:33:43.200 --> 0:33:45.920
<v Speaker 1>to translate. Apologies if this is a little bit approximate

0:33:46.600 --> 0:33:50.240
<v Speaker 1>but Messier says, I'm amazed at this comment, which does

0:33:50.280 --> 0:33:54.120
<v Speaker 1>not carry with it any distinctive character of comets, and

0:33:54.120 --> 0:33:56.400
<v Speaker 1>that it does not resemble any of those which I

0:33:56.400 --> 0:33:59.560
<v Speaker 1>have observed, which are eighteen in number. So I just

0:33:59.600 --> 0:34:01.760
<v Speaker 1>thought this was interesting. It seemed at first all of

0:34:01.800 --> 0:34:04.720
<v Speaker 1>the learned astronomers were calling it a comet, even though

0:34:04.720 --> 0:34:07.520
<v Speaker 1>they recognize that it's really not like a comet at all,

0:34:07.560 --> 0:34:10.160
<v Speaker 1>Like it doesn't have any of the characteristics we would expect,

0:34:10.440 --> 0:34:13.359
<v Speaker 1>doesn't behave like a comet. It seems that the first

0:34:13.400 --> 0:34:16.360
<v Speaker 1>person on record to have mentioned that this new comet

0:34:16.520 --> 0:34:20.800
<v Speaker 1>might actually be a planet was the British astronomer Royal

0:34:21.080 --> 0:34:25.120
<v Speaker 1>Neville Masculine, who argued that it might be a comet,

0:34:25.120 --> 0:34:27.919
<v Speaker 1>but it might also be a new planet, and if

0:34:27.960 --> 0:34:30.000
<v Speaker 1>it were a comet, it would be unlike any other

0:34:30.560 --> 0:34:34.680
<v Speaker 1>Herschel apparently did not refer to Uranus as a planet

0:34:34.960 --> 0:34:38.120
<v Speaker 1>until the summer of seventeen eighty two, when he called

0:34:38.160 --> 0:34:41.759
<v Speaker 1>it quote my planet and again he wanted to originally

0:34:41.760 --> 0:34:56.200
<v Speaker 1>call it GEORGI mciitas the George Star again lol. But

0:34:56.280 --> 0:34:58.319
<v Speaker 1>so I was just wondering, like, why is everybody so

0:34:58.400 --> 0:35:01.040
<v Speaker 1>quick to assume it's a comet? Why did it take

0:35:01.080 --> 0:35:03.239
<v Speaker 1>them a little while to come around to the conclusion

0:35:03.280 --> 0:35:05.920
<v Speaker 1>that it was actually a planet? And Schaeffer in this

0:35:06.000 --> 0:35:08.640
<v Speaker 1>paper argues that even though Maskerline was the first to

0:35:08.840 --> 0:35:12.800
<v Speaker 1>suggest it might be a planet, quote, Maskerline's own practice

0:35:12.880 --> 0:35:17.680
<v Speaker 1>was fundamentally conditioned by the eighteenth century triumphs in cometary astronomy.

0:35:18.080 --> 0:35:22.200
<v Speaker 1>Comets dominated the contemporary perception of the heavens. It seemed

0:35:22.280 --> 0:35:26.840
<v Speaker 1>inconceivable that a new planet could be discovered. And I

0:35:26.880 --> 0:35:30.000
<v Speaker 1>think this must just come back to the state of

0:35:30.040 --> 0:35:32.279
<v Speaker 1>astronomy as it was at the time, because as you

0:35:32.280 --> 0:35:35.480
<v Speaker 1>were talking about rob Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, all

0:35:35.480 --> 0:35:38.480
<v Speaker 1>the other planets up to this point had been known

0:35:38.520 --> 0:35:42.879
<v Speaker 1>about since antiquity. They were written about by Babylonian astronomers

0:35:42.960 --> 0:35:46.360
<v Speaker 1>thousands of years ago. They were charted with the naked eye,

0:35:46.400 --> 0:35:49.719
<v Speaker 1>and Copernicus had correctly figured out that they orbited the

0:35:49.760 --> 0:35:50.920
<v Speaker 1>Sun and not the Earth.

0:35:51.280 --> 0:35:53.799
<v Speaker 2>Now, I just want to drive home here that again, Yeah,

0:35:53.800 --> 0:35:56.480
<v Speaker 2>the classical planets are those that could be seen with

0:35:56.520 --> 0:35:58.960
<v Speaker 2>the naked eye, but also were distinct enough to be

0:35:59.040 --> 0:36:04.000
<v Speaker 2>of value. But if you're really looking with the naked eye,

0:36:04.040 --> 0:36:07.840
<v Speaker 2>and the conditions are just right, you apparently can see Urinus.

0:36:08.600 --> 0:36:11.799
<v Speaker 2>But again, the whole deal here is that what you

0:36:11.920 --> 0:36:15.120
<v Speaker 2>see is not significant enough to have, you know, had

0:36:15.160 --> 0:36:20.640
<v Speaker 2>any impact on these ancient astrological and astronomical systems. According

0:36:20.680 --> 0:36:24.000
<v Speaker 2>to Pete Lawrence, writing for BBC Sky at Night magazine

0:36:24.000 --> 0:36:27.799
<v Speaker 2>in twenty twenty, yeah, it is possible to see Uranus

0:36:27.840 --> 0:36:30.200
<v Speaker 2>with the naked eye conditions and preparations or just right.

0:36:30.400 --> 0:36:33.799
<v Speaker 2>He stresses, however, that the planet quote shines at the

0:36:33.960 --> 0:36:38.080
<v Speaker 2>edge of naked eye visibility, and any direct views of

0:36:38.360 --> 0:36:40.640
<v Speaker 2>Urinus aren't always conclusive.

0:36:41.120 --> 0:36:43.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that was my understanding from reading all this stuff

0:36:43.760 --> 0:36:45.920
<v Speaker 1>as well, that it's sort of right on the edge

0:36:45.960 --> 0:36:48.839
<v Speaker 1>of naked eye visibility, to the point where some people

0:36:49.000 --> 0:36:52.520
<v Speaker 1>argue that, oh, maybe this thing that somebody said, you know,

0:36:52.560 --> 0:36:55.440
<v Speaker 1>a naked eye astronomer in the ancient world observed was

0:36:55.520 --> 0:36:58.399
<v Speaker 1>actually an observation of Urinus. But it's hard to know.

0:36:58.840 --> 0:37:00.960
<v Speaker 2>To put it in terms of are weird how cinema

0:37:01.000 --> 0:37:04.239
<v Speaker 2>listeners might appreciate. It's like watching The Devil's Rain and

0:37:04.280 --> 0:37:07.520
<v Speaker 2>then asking is John Travolta in this is John Travolta

0:37:07.600 --> 0:37:08.040
<v Speaker 2>a star?

0:37:09.280 --> 0:37:12.040
<v Speaker 1>Evidence is inconclusive, right, but so coming back to this,

0:37:12.080 --> 0:37:14.560
<v Speaker 1>so like all the planets through Saturn had been known

0:37:14.600 --> 0:37:18.600
<v Speaker 1>since antiquity to multiple different cultures, there had been other

0:37:18.880 --> 0:37:23.160
<v Speaker 1>heavenly bodies identified since the invention of telescopes, but none

0:37:23.200 --> 0:37:27.080
<v Speaker 1>of them were planets in the Solar System. Galileo had

0:37:27.120 --> 0:37:32.440
<v Speaker 1>identified moons of Jupiter, Cassini and Heuygen's identified moons of Saturn,

0:37:32.960 --> 0:37:36.680
<v Speaker 1>but Herschel's identification of Uranus was actually the first time

0:37:36.880 --> 0:37:40.840
<v Speaker 1>since ancient times that the existence of a new planet

0:37:41.040 --> 0:37:44.200
<v Speaker 1>in the Solar System had been confirmed. That's just not

0:37:44.360 --> 0:37:48.400
<v Speaker 1>something these astronomers were really expecting to find. Comets, on

0:37:48.400 --> 0:37:52.000
<v Speaker 1>the other hand, were constantly being discovered. Discovering new comets

0:37:52.080 --> 0:37:55.040
<v Speaker 1>was one of the major endeavors of astronomers of the day.

0:37:55.040 --> 0:37:59.000
<v Speaker 1>You had the ferret of comets out there doing ferreting

0:37:59.040 --> 0:38:02.360
<v Speaker 1>them out, so you could think of this as a

0:38:02.440 --> 0:38:06.319
<v Speaker 1>kind of astronomical confirmation bias. Comets were just that's what

0:38:06.360 --> 0:38:08.720
<v Speaker 1>you discover, that's the thing you're expecting to see.

0:38:09.120 --> 0:38:11.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it's planets, and then just it's filthy with

0:38:11.640 --> 0:38:14.479
<v Speaker 2>comets and you got to send the comet truffle hog

0:38:14.520 --> 0:38:16.120
<v Speaker 2>out there to root them out.

0:38:16.640 --> 0:38:19.640
<v Speaker 1>So of course there were many subsequent discoveries of the

0:38:19.680 --> 0:38:22.319
<v Speaker 1>moons of Urinus, but a lot of what we now

0:38:22.400 --> 0:38:26.880
<v Speaker 1>know about Urinus really comes in the later twentieth century

0:38:26.960 --> 0:38:29.080
<v Speaker 1>with the fly by a Voyager two.

0:38:29.880 --> 0:38:32.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and as we'll really be driven home as we

0:38:32.960 --> 0:38:36.560
<v Speaker 2>discuss these moons one by one. It's like Voyager two

0:38:36.760 --> 0:38:39.640
<v Speaker 2>is the defining mission. Like a lot of what we

0:38:39.719 --> 0:38:43.759
<v Speaker 2>know comes either in it from that fly by or

0:38:44.080 --> 0:38:48.839
<v Speaker 2>it's the combination of that flyby information combined with say

0:38:48.880 --> 0:38:53.440
<v Speaker 2>Hubble telescope information as well. So it's a lot of

0:38:53.440 --> 0:38:57.960
<v Speaker 2>the mysteries of Uranus and its moons remains all right,

0:38:58.040 --> 0:39:00.920
<v Speaker 2>So when we come back in the next stepisodeisode, we

0:39:00.960 --> 0:39:05.160
<v Speaker 2>will blow through the twenty seven known moons of Urinus.

0:39:05.080 --> 0:39:06.600
<v Speaker 1>All twenty seven in one episode.

0:39:06.640 --> 0:39:08.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if we can do that all twenty

0:39:09.000 --> 0:39:12.839
<v Speaker 2>seven one episode. That's a guarantee. That's a guarantee, so

0:39:12.920 --> 0:39:15.759
<v Speaker 2>be sure to join us for that. And then I

0:39:15.800 --> 0:39:17.240
<v Speaker 2>don't know, And then at some point in the future

0:39:17.280 --> 0:39:21.360
<v Speaker 2>we'll move on to Neptune. But next episode will be

0:39:22.440 --> 0:39:25.680
<v Speaker 2>Moon by Moon the moons of Uranus. In the meantime,

0:39:25.719 --> 0:39:27.480
<v Speaker 2>if you would like to check out other episodes of

0:39:27.480 --> 0:39:30.200
<v Speaker 2>stuff to blow your mind. Well, check out the Stuff

0:39:30.200 --> 0:39:32.719
<v Speaker 2>to Blow Your Mind podcast feed. If you go back

0:39:32.760 --> 0:39:34.680
<v Speaker 2>far enough, you'll find those episodes we did about the

0:39:34.719 --> 0:39:38.600
<v Speaker 2>other moons in our solar system and Jupiter, Saturn, Mars,

0:39:38.880 --> 0:39:43.680
<v Speaker 2>et cetera. But yeah, core episodes published on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

0:39:43.719 --> 0:39:46.120
<v Speaker 2>On Mondays we do listener mail. Wednesdays we do a

0:39:46.160 --> 0:39:49.400
<v Speaker 2>short form monster fact or artifact, and tomorrow's will also

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<v Speaker 2>tie into Urinus, so tune in for that. And then

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<v Speaker 2>on Fridays we set aside most serious concerns and just

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<v Speaker 2>talk about a weird movie on Weird House Cinema.

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<v Speaker 1>Huge thanks to our audio producer JJ Pausway. If you

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<v Speaker 1>would like to get in touch with us with feedback

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<v Speaker 1>on this episode or any other, to suggest a topic

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<v Speaker 1>for the future, or just to say hello, you can

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<v Speaker 1>email us at contact at stuff to Blow your Mind

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<v Speaker 1>dot com.

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<v Speaker 3>Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For

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<v Speaker 3>more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

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<v Speaker 3>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're listening to your favorite shows.