1 00:00:01,040 --> 00:00:03,600 Speaker 1: I'm in a different stage of life, and menopause makes 2 00:00:03,640 --> 00:00:04,920 Speaker 1: you do very crazy things. 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:08,800 Speaker 2: Welcome to Off. 4 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 3: The Cup, my personal anti anxiety antidote. It's a special episode. Well, okay, 5 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:18,320 Speaker 3: all of them are special. I love talking to everyone. 6 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,960 Speaker 3: We just had an incredible conversation with Dennis Leary fellow Masshole. 7 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:26,440 Speaker 3: We had another good one with Broadway diva Maursha Wallace. 8 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:30,680 Speaker 3: We talked to authors here, actors, artists, politicos. I truly 9 00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:33,000 Speaker 3: do love each and every conversation. 10 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:35,559 Speaker 2: But that's it. 11 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 3: If you are a Bravo fan like I am, it's 12 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:43,280 Speaker 3: a special episode for you. Bravo, as you probably know, 13 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 3: is my safe space. It is my escape. It is 14 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:49,000 Speaker 3: my pull in case of emergency, and boy, when the 15 00:00:49,000 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 3: world is on fire like it is right now and 16 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:56,240 Speaker 3: I'm covering some of the worst stuff imaginable, I need 17 00:00:56,280 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 3: a break from it all too, believe me, and Bravo 18 00:01:00,520 --> 00:01:03,480 Speaker 3: delivers every time, y'all. My guest today is one of 19 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 3: my faves. You know her from the Real Housewives of 20 00:01:06,760 --> 00:01:10,320 Speaker 3: Orange County. You know her from Malibu Country and Hot 21 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:13,000 Speaker 3: in Cleveland and so many more credits. 22 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:18,280 Speaker 2: Check her IMDb. It's Miss fancy Pants herself Heather de Brow, Hi, 23 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 2: so good to see you. 24 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:21,680 Speaker 1: By the way, what you said is just so true. 25 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:26,399 Speaker 1: It's so crazy. The world is insane, and it's really 26 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:31,399 Speaker 1: hard to know because to your point, we need some 27 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:35,320 Speaker 1: relief from the news somewhere, right, everyone does. So whether 28 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:38,919 Speaker 1: you're going to the gym, or you're playing with kittens, 29 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: or you're hugging your kids, or you're watching Bravo, whatever 30 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:46,480 Speaker 1: it is, there's got to be some kind of escapism. 31 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 1: And then it's really hard to know when to jump, 32 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: like for me, when to jump in and say something. 33 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 1: And I do get messages from people saying, when are 34 00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: you going to say something? 35 00:01:58,680 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 2: Answer? 36 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 1: Post some things, I don't post other things, and privately 37 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: obviously have conversations with our children and our family and 38 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 1: our friends. 39 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:06,760 Speaker 2: But it's tough. 40 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 3: I have the reverse, So I post constantly about the news, 41 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 3: right and I'm like, when is it okay for me 42 00:02:15,480 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 3: to post like a picture of my dog in the snow? Right? 43 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 2: Like? 44 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:22,639 Speaker 3: Is the world too on fire for that right now? 45 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:25,920 Speaker 3: And the answer is, of course yes, But you still 46 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:28,679 Speaker 3: gotta you gotta do it. You've got I have to 47 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:33,840 Speaker 3: for my mental health as a journalist, I have. 48 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 2: To switch it off. 49 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 3: That doesn't mean I don't care. That doesn't mean I'm 50 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:41,560 Speaker 3: not following it and covering it and investing in it. 51 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:43,520 Speaker 3: It means I'm taking care of myself. So I can 52 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 3: keep doing that right and not have, you know, yet 53 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:50,200 Speaker 3: another nervous breakdown because it's a lot and we're all 54 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 3: feeling like, well, we got to do something. We all 55 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:55,440 Speaker 3: have to be doing something, and it never feels like 56 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:58,160 Speaker 3: enough and it never feels like it's going to solve 57 00:02:58,200 --> 00:02:58,799 Speaker 3: the problem. 58 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 2: You can drive yourself easy with that. So everyone needs 59 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 2: their escape, Yeah, they do. 60 00:03:05,600 --> 00:03:08,519 Speaker 3: I we just saw each other Bravocon where we got 61 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 3: to do a really fun interview sort of in the field, 62 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:14,359 Speaker 3: as we say in Bravocon Lexicon. 63 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:18,119 Speaker 2: It was a Bravocon in the wild fan engagement. Wasn't 64 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:22,240 Speaker 2: that insane? It was insane? Yeah, Bravocon is always insane. 65 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:26,120 Speaker 2: I love it. Do you love it? What's your Bravocon approach? 66 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 1: So you know, I've been to a bunch now, they're 67 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 1: each kind of different, but I'll tell you this one 68 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:33,680 Speaker 1: was very different for me. 69 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 2: Look, Bravocon's fun. 70 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 1: If you ever want to know what it feels like 71 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: to be the fifth member of the Beatles, you know, 72 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:45,400 Speaker 1: be a bravolebrity at Bravocan, it's insane. Yeah, you are, 73 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 1: I mean beloved, and people are dreaming for you and 74 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 1: you know all of those crazy things. 75 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 2: But for me this year in particular, I. 76 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 1: Always get, you know, people coming up to me to 77 00:03:58,160 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: talk to me as a mother about how I am 78 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 1: as a mother and our children and you know, and 79 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 1: mine and Terry's relationship at all those things. But I 80 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 1: will tell you that this season in particular, or this 81 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 1: year at Bravocon in particular, I cried so many times. 82 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:17,599 Speaker 1: I had so many people telling me stories about you know, 83 00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 1: their children and their parents and their family dynamics and 84 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,640 Speaker 1: what it's meant to see our family on television and 85 00:04:25,040 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 1: you know, just all of that. It was really it 86 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:30,560 Speaker 1: was beautiful and it was heavy, and I left Bravocan 87 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:34,040 Speaker 1: feeling very depleted. It's a lot of work and all 88 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 1: of that, but also my heart was really really full, 89 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 1: and Terry too. We looked at each other getting a 90 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 1: little Terry telling you, but we looked at each other 91 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 1: many times. And you know, Terry's a fame or he 92 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:45,840 Speaker 1: loves that stuff and running up and down the lines 93 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:49,159 Speaker 1: and taking pictures with everyone. But we had a lot 94 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 1: of very you know, connected moments there. 95 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:57,640 Speaker 3: I completely understand what you're talking about. And I've been 96 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 3: to all four U Bravocon and the first time it 97 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:05,320 Speaker 3: was at the Javit Center in New York, right. 98 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:09,840 Speaker 2: It was giant met crazy. It was crazy. 99 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:13,440 Speaker 3: But I remember walking around and I've told this story 100 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:17,120 Speaker 3: to Andy. I've told it on Andy's show, walking around 101 00:05:17,200 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 3: and seeing so many happy people so excited to meet 102 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 3: you and other housewives and Bravo leberties smiles on their faces. 103 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:31,839 Speaker 3: I left Bravo Con, I called my agent and I said, 104 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 3: I need more of this in my life. I am 105 00:05:35,839 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 3: in the business of making people angry and afraid. This 106 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 3: network is in the business of putting smiles on people's faces. 107 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 3: And you know, of course there's the other you know, 108 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 3: the tawdry, trashy, you know, all the fighting and stuff too, 109 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:56,039 Speaker 3: But really this network makes people really, really happy. And 110 00:05:56,279 --> 00:06:00,000 Speaker 3: I got emotional too, because it's an emotional experience. 111 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:00,840 Speaker 2: And so my husband. 112 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 3: I bring my husband now sometimes and he always reminds me, 113 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:06,719 Speaker 3: like he'll say, I see, there's nothing like this, Like 114 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,720 Speaker 3: I can't go to the Super Bowl and meet all 115 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 3: the players and spend three days with them, and take 116 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:15,920 Speaker 3: pictures and ask them questions and like meet their family, 117 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:19,760 Speaker 3: and there is nothing like Bravo kon nothing. 118 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:21,359 Speaker 2: I so agree with that. 119 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 1: And what's really crazy about it? And maybe you and 120 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:25,599 Speaker 1: I have discussed this before, but you know, coming from 121 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:30,960 Speaker 1: scripted television, yeah, to to reality and podcasting and YouTube 122 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:34,040 Speaker 1: and all the things that so many of us do now, yeah, 123 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 1: it's different. You know, you're on a scripted show back 124 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:38,920 Speaker 1: in the day and it was hey, you got to 125 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:41,480 Speaker 1: you gotta blip and praying for a blip and TV 126 00:06:41,600 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 1: guide right and to get your picture in there, and 127 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 1: people would come up to you and they'd say, oh, 128 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:46,360 Speaker 1: I love. 129 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 2: Your show or your characters sow this, and you know, 130 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:52,640 Speaker 2: it was like that. Now they know you, Yes, they 131 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:53,520 Speaker 2: never know about you. 132 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 1: They've been in our homes, They've laughed with us, they've 133 00:06:56,240 --> 00:06:59,760 Speaker 1: cried with us. It's a really interesting special bond. And 134 00:06:59,800 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 1: I have to tell you this many years in. I 135 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:03,840 Speaker 1: started the show when my youngest child was nine months 136 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: old and he's fifteen. 137 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:07,799 Speaker 2: I do not take it for granted. 138 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:12,160 Speaker 3: We can tell you're not phoning it in on episodes, 139 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 3: and you're not phoning it in at Bravo Con and 140 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 3: we can tell who does. 141 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 2: I So it was in Vegas the last two years. 142 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 2: I get why. 143 00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 3: I get why Vegas is a little too much for me. 144 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:26,880 Speaker 3: It's like a lot for my anxiety. You know, where 145 00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 3: I want to have it. I want to have it 146 00:07:29,160 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 3: in like Woodstock, Vermont, Oh my god. 147 00:07:31,840 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 2: That's why. 148 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:36,320 Speaker 3: And peaceful. We're drinking apple cider and ha Cooco. Everything 149 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 3: closes by ten pm, Like that would be my ideal Bravoca. 150 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 2: That's so funny. 151 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 1: That's like, who is it that always says there's is 152 00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:47,120 Speaker 1: it Jane Lynch? Someone always says that they want to 153 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 1: start having concerts at one pm. I can't remember who's 154 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:53,760 Speaker 1: Oh no, no, Jamie Lee Curtis. 155 00:07:54,080 --> 00:07:55,400 Speaker 2: Jamie Lee Curtis is the one. 156 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 1: She's like, can't we have a concert at two pm? Like, 157 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:02,360 Speaker 1: I'm so into the Mattin. I agree with you totally. 158 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 3: I want like a Bravocon in a cozy Vermont in 159 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 3: where there's just like a few people. You know, obviously 160 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:12,240 Speaker 3: that's not the vibe. 161 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 2: But what's to you? Vegas is a lot. What's to you, 162 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:17,680 Speaker 2: like the worst part of Bravocon or the hardest part. 163 00:08:18,720 --> 00:08:19,840 Speaker 2: It just doesn't stop. 164 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:22,320 Speaker 1: I mean literally from the moment you get there, I 165 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 1: think what people don't really, So you go to this event, 166 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 1: it's four nights. Not everyone is involved in everything, and 167 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 1: people have different schedules, but you know, basically, for four 168 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 1: nights you're doing these massive, you know, watch what Happens 169 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:38,120 Speaker 1: live type shows and during the day you have this 170 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:40,319 Speaker 1: schedule that takes. 171 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:41,360 Speaker 2: You from morning tonight. 172 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 1: And what the crazy part about it is there is 173 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:48,559 Speaker 1: no downtime. So the bts of it is you meet, 174 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:50,520 Speaker 1: you're doing meet and greets, and you're on panels, and 175 00:08:50,559 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: you're doing all these things, and you're down in the 176 00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: wild and everywhere you walk through, so you're always on. 177 00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:59,680 Speaker 2: But backstage you're still on. 178 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:06,959 Speaker 1: It's every executive from NBC Universal and every showrunner and 179 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 1: production company. And if you're someone like myself who you know, 180 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:16,240 Speaker 1: pitches shows or you know, does a desire to be 181 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:19,000 Speaker 1: in other lanes or whatever it is, this is a 182 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:23,600 Speaker 1: business opportunity totally, so you are never off. 183 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:26,600 Speaker 3: Same and I go for work too. It's work for 184 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 3: me too. I develop by right, I develop with Bravo. 185 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:34,920 Speaker 3: Even when you're backstage with all the just talent, there's 186 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:39,000 Speaker 3: podcasters in there, there's influencers in there, there's radio hosts 187 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:44,199 Speaker 3: like it is. You're on, there's no downtime. It's really draining. 188 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 3: Of course it's gratifying as well, but it's really draining 189 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 3: and it never stops. 190 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 2: You doesn't get but you're a little sleep It's true. 191 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:55,080 Speaker 1: But I mean I think like you can get it 192 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: together for a couple of days to go, put it on, 193 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: get it done, try to have a little fun. I 194 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 1: mean we did go see I had one night off 195 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:09,199 Speaker 1: of the four and so Jenny McCarthy and I are 196 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 1: friends for many many years. 197 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:13,000 Speaker 2: We had to sitcom together in the. 198 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:15,559 Speaker 1: Jenny in the When was that and don't remember, around 199 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:18,599 Speaker 1: two thousand, but we've been friends all these years. And 200 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:21,720 Speaker 1: now her husband, of course, who we adored, Donnie Wahlberg. 201 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 1: So he was playing with New Kids on the Block. Yes, 202 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:27,040 Speaker 1: so we met up with some friends they were also 203 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 1: in town and we went to go see New Kids. 204 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:30,959 Speaker 2: Oh, we had so much fun. I was going to 205 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:32,240 Speaker 2: go to this. I was going to go with Stu 206 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,920 Speaker 2: Chefs too. Oh you should have come with us. It 207 00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:37,240 Speaker 2: was great. I needed to rest, but I was going 208 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:40,760 Speaker 2: to do that. Yeah, it was great. Was it so fun? 209 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:42,640 Speaker 2: It was so fun that show. 210 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 1: I have to say, you want to see a stage 211 00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 1: of gratitude, Go see New Kids on the Block. First all, 212 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 1: Donnie Wahlberg is positively the nicest human you'll ever meet, 213 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 1: and he has more energy than anyone. 214 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:58,000 Speaker 2: He loves what he does. 215 00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 1: They are so talented and they put on such an 216 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: incredible show and you were just dancing and up the 217 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:05,600 Speaker 1: whole time. 218 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 2: It's funny. 219 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 1: We happened strangely to be sitting next to Jennifer Dilly 220 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:11,160 Speaker 1: and a friend and we ended up like hanging and 221 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:11,719 Speaker 1: dancing with it. 222 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 2: It was so so it was great. 223 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 3: Jenny and Donnie are two of the nicest just like 224 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 3: grateful to be there wherever there is, They're just grateful 225 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 3: to be there. 226 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:25,600 Speaker 2: She's the most generous person ever, the best lover. 227 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:40,800 Speaker 3: Okay, I want to talk more Ravo with you, but later, 228 00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:43,720 Speaker 3: because really this podcast is about you, and I want 229 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:46,080 Speaker 3: to talk about you. And you're a public figure, so 230 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:48,319 Speaker 3: a lot of people know about you. But I pride 231 00:11:48,320 --> 00:11:51,000 Speaker 3: myself on pulling things out of people that we didn't 232 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:53,200 Speaker 3: know before. And people love you and they want to 233 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:55,560 Speaker 3: know more about you. So let's dive in. And I 234 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:58,960 Speaker 3: always like to start by asking what kind of kid 235 00:11:59,000 --> 00:11:59,280 Speaker 3: were you? 236 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 2: Hm? 237 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: Hm, anxious, always had a stomach ache before school, Never 238 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 1: maybe felt like I really belonged until you know, I 239 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 1: started performing. 240 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:17,360 Speaker 2: Theater was my thing, musical theater. 241 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 1: That was you know, performing, singing, being on stage, and 242 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:24,040 Speaker 1: I think, but also happy. 243 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:26,600 Speaker 2: I was a happy kid. You grew up in Chappaqua, 244 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:28,640 Speaker 2: the mean streets of Chappaqua. 245 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 1: I like to tell people that I was born in 246 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 1: the Bronx because it gives me street cred. Yeah sure, 247 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:34,720 Speaker 1: then I'm like, and then I was raised in Chappaqua 248 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:36,120 Speaker 1: And okay. 249 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, no more street cred. 250 00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:41,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, you've talked about your parents. We got to see 251 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:44,959 Speaker 3: a really touching seen this past season where you go 252 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 3: to Amsterdam and you see the house that your dad 253 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 3: lived in and was really happy in and scatter his 254 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 3: ashes in the canal. Tell me more about the dynamic 255 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:54,559 Speaker 3: and your house growing up. 256 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:59,400 Speaker 1: So my parents, my mom's alive. She actually just moved 257 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:02,920 Speaker 1: to Los Angele, so stay tuned for season twenty. Okay, 258 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:07,600 Speaker 1: but my parents are very nineteen fifties, you know, great 259 00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:13,640 Speaker 1: parents provided us with wonderful you know, lives and schooling 260 00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:15,880 Speaker 1: and you know, the education and the home and the 261 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:19,240 Speaker 1: whole thing. And my dad worked very hard. He was 262 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:23,800 Speaker 1: a typical dad in Westchester County, New York, who commuted 263 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:26,320 Speaker 1: to work and really didn't come home until after we 264 00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 1: had dinner and saw him on the weekends and that 265 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 1: sort of thing. But they were nineteen fifties in that 266 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:33,839 Speaker 1: nothing was discussed. 267 00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:35,400 Speaker 2: Everything was brushed. 268 00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 1: Under the rug. You know, you should tell people things. 269 00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: Everything's private. And I think for me, I was very 270 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: sensitive growing up still am Terry. I'll tell you to 271 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:51,240 Speaker 1: a fault and you know, I would cry at a movie. 272 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:54,040 Speaker 1: I would be ridiculed by my family. They didn't understand. 273 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:57,320 Speaker 1: They didn't understand that, but that's okay because that's who 274 00:13:57,360 --> 00:13:58,839 Speaker 1: they were. It took me a long time to get 275 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,719 Speaker 1: to that space. But it was hard for me to 276 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:04,280 Speaker 1: grow up like that because I wasn't that animal. 277 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:11,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, and for someone like you in an environment like that, 278 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:18,839 Speaker 3: an armchair psychologist might say that pressure to either sweet 279 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 3: things under the rug or please or keep up appearances 280 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 3: might lead to a sort of type a perfectionist, and. 281 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:31,880 Speaker 1: They think adult who might be a little anxious. I'm 282 00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 1: just yeah, no, one hundred percent, and listen there. You know, 283 00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:39,120 Speaker 1: it's interesting. You know, Terry and I met when I 284 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: was twenty seven. I think and you know, you've totally 285 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:44,720 Speaker 1: just clogged me. 286 00:14:44,760 --> 00:14:47,440 Speaker 2: And I'll tell you. Also, what's so interesting is when 287 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:48,640 Speaker 2: I met Terry, he. 288 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 1: Was were like ten and a half important half ten 289 00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 1: and a half years apart, and so he was thirty 290 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: eight when I met him, almost forty, right, but he 291 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:01,840 Speaker 1: had been in school and I mean he took his 292 00:15:01,920 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 1: last board exam when he was forty. So he was 293 00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:07,320 Speaker 1: a you know, a general surgeon and then a plastic 294 00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:10,120 Speaker 1: surgeon all the things. So it's funny, even though we met, 295 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 1: maybe one would even say, like a little later, we 296 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:19,640 Speaker 1: really had to reparent each other and ourselves because tunnel 297 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 1: that Yeah, because I think he like had arrested development 298 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 1: because he was in a tunnel and you know, back 299 00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:29,560 Speaker 1: in those days, they never. 300 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:30,640 Speaker 2: Let them leave the hospital. 301 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:33,240 Speaker 1: You know, he was there, he was off a day, 302 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:35,920 Speaker 1: you know, in six days or whatever craziness it was. 303 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:38,040 Speaker 1: So he was just when I met him, he was 304 00:15:38,080 --> 00:15:40,160 Speaker 1: just ready to start his life. 305 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:40,760 Speaker 2: Yeah. 306 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:44,640 Speaker 1: And I think for me growing up in that environment 307 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:48,720 Speaker 1: and having those notions, you know, you know, who did 308 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:51,400 Speaker 1: they know? You know, how did she get that part? 309 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 1: And also I think in our business, especially as actresses, 310 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 1: there's so much competition and in those days, we weren't 311 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 1: taught to embrace each other and lift each other up. Yeah, 312 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:05,520 Speaker 1: it took a long time to reprogram myself because I'm 313 00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 1: not that person. I mean, I want all my friends 314 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 1: to be successful and you know, happy and great relationships 315 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 1: and all the things. But you know, when you don't 316 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:19,080 Speaker 1: grow up like that, you second guess things, you feel 317 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 1: a certain way. So it took a long time, and 318 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 1: it was really important to me. Most importantly, it was 319 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: really important to me that when we created our family 320 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 1: that it was different. 321 00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:29,440 Speaker 2: Yeah. 322 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, I grew up similarly, not not so much 323 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 3: external pressure, but a lot of sort of internal pressure 324 00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 3: and made me a very anxious adult, and that manifested 325 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:48,200 Speaker 3: in ways I was not aware of until it hit 326 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:50,960 Speaker 3: me like a truck and I had a nervous breakdown 327 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 3: and then really had to like unpack the way I'd 328 00:16:54,440 --> 00:17:00,240 Speaker 3: been dealing with my anxiety, compartmentalizing it, ignoring it, in 329 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 3: fact nurturing it. 330 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 1: Well, was it really hard for you because you were 331 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:07,880 Speaker 1: so smart? And I think when you know you were 332 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:11,880 Speaker 1: growing up, were girls allowed to be that smart? 333 00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:14,280 Speaker 2: No? I was definitely well. 334 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:16,680 Speaker 3: I moved a lot, so I was often in schools 335 00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:18,480 Speaker 3: where like, it wasn't cool to be smart, and so 336 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:20,960 Speaker 3: I was trying to be the thing that would be cool. 337 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 1: So I'd be you're smart and pretty, which is like 338 00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 1: a diabolical combination. 339 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:28,160 Speaker 2: But that must have been hard, especially moving. 340 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:30,440 Speaker 3: It wasn't that part wasn't hard. I wasn't cool. 341 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:34,600 Speaker 2: I wasn't cool. No, that wasn't it. 342 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 3: No, But how did your your childhood experience And listen, 343 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:42,200 Speaker 3: I had a great childhood too. 344 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 2: We're not We're not. 345 00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 3: Dissing our childhood, no, no, but how did it impact 346 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:51,040 Speaker 3: you as an adult where you had to like learn 347 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,600 Speaker 3: some different lessons of maneuvering through the world. 348 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:58,960 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I I honestly think it's everything. Yeah. 349 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:01,880 Speaker 1: I mean when you grow up in a situation where 350 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:06,280 Speaker 1: you should say nothing except what the party line is. Yeah, 351 00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:09,239 Speaker 1: And I would bet there are people that think I 352 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 1: am actually like that today maybe from my early seasons. 353 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:19,720 Speaker 1: What I would say is I have diary of the mouth. 354 00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:23,560 Speaker 1: I mean, like, I talk about everything. The only things 355 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 1: that I don't talk about are things that aren't my story. 356 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: So you know, I've got you know, four fabulous, very 357 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,880 Speaker 1: unique kids that are allowed and they started on TV 358 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 1: when they were really young. I had no idea what 359 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:39,240 Speaker 1: this was going to be or how it was going 360 00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:40,080 Speaker 1: to affect them. 361 00:18:40,160 --> 00:18:43,119 Speaker 2: And they're really honestly, they're great kids, they really are. 362 00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:47,479 Speaker 1: They're grounded, they're cool, they're they're nice, they're good humans. 363 00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:51,640 Speaker 1: They show up really nicely in the world. But I 364 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:55,440 Speaker 1: had no idea what I was thrusting them into. And 365 00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:57,880 Speaker 1: I can't really put the toothpaste back in the tube 366 00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:00,800 Speaker 1: at this point, So what I try to do is 367 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,919 Speaker 1: mitigate that as best that I can. But when it 368 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:07,280 Speaker 1: comes to me and my life and what I'm doing, however, 369 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 1: like when I first joined the show, I was dropped 370 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:13,119 Speaker 1: in the middle in the sea of blondes, right, I 371 00:19:13,119 --> 00:19:16,960 Speaker 1: didn't know anyone, and I'm in New Yorker, transplanted to 372 00:19:17,119 --> 00:19:19,480 Speaker 1: La dragged down to Newport Beach in Orange. 373 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 2: Count I had no It was like, Dorothy, where are we? 374 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:26,280 Speaker 1: And so I was very you know, buttoned up and 375 00:19:26,359 --> 00:19:29,359 Speaker 1: oh dear, and oh my. But the truth is, I 376 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 1: never when you meet people, you don't tell them everything. 377 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:36,479 Speaker 1: You have to get to know people, You have to 378 00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:43,280 Speaker 1: trust people, They have to earn your loyalty, yeah, and. 379 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:44,919 Speaker 2: All of that. 380 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:48,760 Speaker 1: So for me, it was a matter of Okay, I 381 00:19:48,760 --> 00:19:50,120 Speaker 1: don't know these people. 382 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 2: And they speak with a lot of expletives. 383 00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:57,639 Speaker 1: And we're on television and my grandmother, my mother is 384 00:19:57,680 --> 00:19:57,919 Speaker 1: going to. 385 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,120 Speaker 2: See this, you know what is going on? 386 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:03,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, But then over the years, you know, I got 387 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 1: more Comfortable's funny, Andy said to me after last season. 388 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:08,240 Speaker 2: He's like, who would have thought Heather. 389 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 1: Do Bro would be doing shrooms in Amsterdam. I'm like, yeah, 390 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:16,320 Speaker 1: but now we're all friends and now walking together a 391 00:20:16,320 --> 00:20:20,200 Speaker 1: long time. And I'm, you know, fifteen years older, and 392 00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: my kids are older, and I'm in a different stage 393 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:25,359 Speaker 1: of life. And menopause makes you do very crazy things. 394 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:28,400 Speaker 2: Girl, So here we are. 395 00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:31,760 Speaker 3: I'm blaming I'm in Perry menopause or whatever it's. 396 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:34,119 Speaker 2: I'm blaming. I blame it for everything, everything. 397 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 1: Everything, everything, And you're right because what they don't tell 398 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 1: us is that this whole my Lento curse, this whole 399 00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 1: shit show starts when we're in our thirties, and they 400 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:44,159 Speaker 1: don't tell us. 401 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 2: You don't even know it now. Yeah you go, oh, 402 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 2: I'm just tired of over worked, or it's the children, No, 403 00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 2: it's not. 404 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:51,840 Speaker 3: That, or my entire personality has changed overnight, like. 405 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 1: Or I hate my husband, anything like that. Anything in 406 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:58,800 Speaker 1: that category. It's just you know, no, he don't realize, 407 00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:01,919 Speaker 1: but you know, I'm just turned fifty seven, and you know, 408 00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:06,159 Speaker 1: I still have feelings of Wow, I'm still figuring out 409 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:09,960 Speaker 1: my body and my life and my emotions. 410 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 2: I get it. Maybe in a calmer way. 411 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:15,080 Speaker 1: I'd like to say I've become less reactive as I 412 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:17,920 Speaker 1: get older, But again, my husband might beg to difference. 413 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:25,240 Speaker 2: We do what we can do. Okay, that's the best 414 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 2: that we can do. Before I move on. 415 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:31,680 Speaker 3: I just I want to stay in childhood because I've 416 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 3: got your high school yearbook from Horace Greeley. 417 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:38,320 Speaker 2: Oh my god, that's so funny. 418 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:42,240 Speaker 3: There's Heather you write your senior quote when you lose 419 00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:43,040 Speaker 3: your dreams. 420 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:46,720 Speaker 2: You die exactly? Do you remember what that's from? 421 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:47,200 Speaker 1: Too young? 422 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:51,720 Speaker 3: So like Alice in Wonderland Flash Dance, Flash Dance, Oh 423 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 3: my god, well I was a dancer. 424 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:54,639 Speaker 2: I know that movie real. 425 00:21:54,520 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 1: Well, Flash Dance you lose your dreams die as it's 426 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:06,399 Speaker 1: very deep, but it was back in the day. No, No, 427 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:10,760 Speaker 1: I think her one her grandma, No, you know what, 428 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:12,439 Speaker 1: I don't remember, but I kind of think it was 429 00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:15,200 Speaker 1: the one that ended up going to the other place 430 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 1: to dance where they were naked because she needed the money. 431 00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:21,240 Speaker 1: Remember that one. Yeah, Okay, she might have had a 432 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:22,720 Speaker 1: drug problem. I'm not just okay. 433 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:24,480 Speaker 2: I just think that may have been my girl. The 434 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:25,680 Speaker 2: welder did not say that. 435 00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:28,080 Speaker 1: Okay, I don't think so, But that was the quote 436 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:32,600 Speaker 1: from that movie that always stuck with me, and I 437 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:34,560 Speaker 1: think it's true. And I will tell you in all 438 00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:37,159 Speaker 1: the different sort of iterations of my life, and I 439 00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 1: think of about my life in decades. Yeah, just like 440 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:42,640 Speaker 1: I still think about the year as school years, which 441 00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:43,200 Speaker 1: is so weird. 442 00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:45,680 Speaker 2: But I think about my life sort of in decades. 443 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:48,879 Speaker 1: And there was, you know, after college, there were you 444 00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:53,600 Speaker 1: know the television film, you know, the Actress years, and 445 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,400 Speaker 1: then there was I had you know, like seven eight years, 446 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 1: almost a decade of biggest stay at home mom, and 447 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:02,399 Speaker 1: then the reality. So I sort of think about it chunks, 448 00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:06,919 Speaker 1: like in chunks of time and and so mercurial, you know, 449 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 1: like really high heights and being the star of you know, 450 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:14,520 Speaker 1: an hour long drama with Paul Sorvino and Ellen Burst 451 00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 1: and all these you know, all this amazing stuff and 452 00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:18,720 Speaker 1: very low lows. 453 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:19,080 Speaker 2: You know. 454 00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:21,919 Speaker 1: Moving to Orange County was so hard for me, and 455 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:25,800 Speaker 1: there was no content creating, and there was no you know, 456 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:30,240 Speaker 1: social media, and it was very lonely to be at 457 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:33,679 Speaker 1: home with you know, twins and try to meet new friends, 458 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:37,520 Speaker 1: you know, all of that sort of thing. Has I 459 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:39,679 Speaker 1: don't remember the question now, I just went off on 460 00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:40,200 Speaker 1: a tangent. 461 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,679 Speaker 3: No, but I this is this is what looking back does. 462 00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:45,440 Speaker 2: Oh. When you lose your dreams, you die. Yeah. 463 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:50,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, so I think there have been times throughout those decades. 464 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 2: Where I've lost those dreams. Yeah. 465 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,600 Speaker 1: And I did feel dead inside at times, and I 466 00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,440 Speaker 1: shed a lot of tears in and out of those decades. 467 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:02,200 Speaker 1: And I remember Terry's saying to me, gosh, if I 468 00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:04,800 Speaker 1: could give you a crystal ball and show you what 469 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:07,159 Speaker 1: your life was going to be like, I think you 470 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 1: would relax. And I said, okay, but I don't have 471 00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:12,439 Speaker 1: a crystal ball, right and I need to keep this 472 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:16,120 Speaker 1: fire inside of me or else those things will never 473 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:16,879 Speaker 1: come true. 474 00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:17,200 Speaker 2: Now. 475 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:20,480 Speaker 1: Do I wish I could have relaxed more during those 476 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:21,600 Speaker 1: period of times? 477 00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 2: Yes, But I will tell you. 478 00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 1: And when I people ask for advice and all that, 479 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:31,400 Speaker 1: what I do say is, remember, right now, you don't 480 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:34,040 Speaker 1: have the crystal ball, but you have a long, long, 481 00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 1: road ahead, and you still your life is what you're 482 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 1: doing today, every day, your existence, and if you were 483 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,240 Speaker 1: just sitting around waiting for something to happen to make 484 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,360 Speaker 1: you happy or to feel successful or any of that, 485 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,840 Speaker 1: you have lost. Yeah, and that's why the competitive thing 486 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:53,360 Speaker 1: with me, and again I think this is age. 487 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:55,639 Speaker 2: And also the way the world is in our businesses. 488 00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: You know, I used to think, oh, if I don't 489 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:00,320 Speaker 1: get this show by the time I'm this age. 490 00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,080 Speaker 2: Who cares. 491 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:05,160 Speaker 1: It's not the one who you know does the most 492 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:07,840 Speaker 1: TV shows that wins. It's not the prettiest one. It's 493 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:10,919 Speaker 1: not the thinnest person that wins. It's not the richest person. 494 00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,439 Speaker 1: It's the happiest person. They're the one that wins. And 495 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:16,840 Speaker 1: what you're happy looks like is different than you're happy, 496 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:19,119 Speaker 1: and you're happy and you're happy, So you got to 497 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: find it and not worry about what other people are 498 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: thinking you're happy is. 499 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 3: It's such good advice and I would just tack onto 500 00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:29,600 Speaker 3: it because I've had to explore this myself too, because 501 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:31,520 Speaker 3: I'm very competitive and driven and I had all these 502 00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:33,560 Speaker 3: ideas in my head where I would be and I 503 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 3: get it. 504 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:36,800 Speaker 2: In addition to stopping. 505 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:43,159 Speaker 3: How you think about what other people are thinking. You 506 00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 3: also need to recalibrate your own what you think happy 507 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 3: looks like? Yeah, because I thought happy meant all of 508 00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:54,080 Speaker 3: these professional mile markers, right, And for a long time 509 00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:57,639 Speaker 3: I was convinced my happiness, my value, my worth, my 510 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:01,480 Speaker 3: everything comes from my work. And if that's not a 511 00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:03,120 Speaker 3: lion to I don't even know who I am. 512 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 2: Did you do that to yourself or did someone do 513 00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:07,960 Speaker 2: that to you? I did that to myself. 514 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:11,399 Speaker 1: See, someone did that to me. I am exactly the 515 00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:14,399 Speaker 1: same way. That so resonates with me. But you know 516 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,920 Speaker 1: where how that happened to you? Oh, I know exactly 517 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,680 Speaker 1: how it happened. And it's other people. It's your parents. 518 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:25,360 Speaker 1: It's your family putting this pressure on you of what 519 00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 1: they think you should be, yeah, and how you should 520 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 1: live your life and what success means to them. Even Like, 521 00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 1: here's a silly example, all right, college Yep. Back when 522 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: I was applying to college, things were very different, and 523 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:45,120 Speaker 1: there were good schools and there were lesser schools. 524 00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:45,840 Speaker 2: Yeah. 525 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:48,800 Speaker 1: I have four children. I have gotten three. I didn't 526 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:50,919 Speaker 1: get them into college. They got themselves into college. But 527 00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:55,359 Speaker 1: I'm saying I have watched and shepherded three children at 528 00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:57,880 Speaker 1: a four so far to their journeys to college. 529 00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:03,159 Speaker 2: It is so hard to get into college, any college, 530 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:04,680 Speaker 2: and those. 531 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:09,240 Speaker 1: Things don't This class system of schools does not exist anymore. 532 00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:11,560 Speaker 2: And my. 533 00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:16,600 Speaker 1: Parents might aunt and uncle like they're of a generation. 534 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,240 Speaker 1: And I know it's not just my family. They are 535 00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:24,480 Speaker 1: such school snops. Uh huh that like, I have a 536 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,600 Speaker 1: nephew who is you know, figure out where he's going, 537 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:32,680 Speaker 1: and they're so judgy yeah about the schools, and I'm going, 538 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:34,840 Speaker 1: you don't understand. 539 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:38,720 Speaker 2: It's insane out there right now. 540 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: Any school that they and wherever they are going to 541 00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 1: go that. Oh, and they'll say, oh, you know, they 542 00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:48,320 Speaker 1: should try for a better school. It's like, no, you 543 00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,360 Speaker 1: want them at a school they're going to succeed it. 544 00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:53,919 Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. Yeah. 545 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:58,760 Speaker 1: But when people put that pressure on you, then you start, oh, 546 00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:01,159 Speaker 1: maybe I should do that. I should go there, And 547 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:04,440 Speaker 1: maybe this career of carved out for myself isn't good enough. 548 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,399 Speaker 2: I found myself. I swear I've not told anyone this. 549 00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:11,480 Speaker 1: I found myself reading my resume to a family member recently, 550 00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:14,800 Speaker 1: like not literally reading it, but like ticking off, you know, 551 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 1: I've written through books. And I've had a podcast for 552 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:20,760 Speaker 1: eleven years and I I've hosted, you know, like and I'm. 553 00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:21,960 Speaker 2: Like, what am I doing? 554 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,120 Speaker 1: But because people put that on all right, So how 555 00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:26,879 Speaker 1: do you get yourself out of that? 556 00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:30,520 Speaker 2: Well, like I said, I had a nervous breakdown. 557 00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:33,400 Speaker 3: My body had enough of the pressure and the anxiety, 558 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:38,160 Speaker 3: and my body said you must stop doing this to us, 559 00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:42,120 Speaker 3: to me, And I started therapy and went on medication 560 00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:47,800 Speaker 3: and had to start reienting what I thought made me valuable. 561 00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:51,959 Speaker 3: M hm, what I thought was actually making me happy. 562 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:54,040 Speaker 3: Like I thought work was making me happy, and actually 563 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:59,080 Speaker 3: it was not. It was making me miserable, you know, 564 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,280 Speaker 3: news in the way I was covering it, or working 565 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:04,080 Speaker 3: where I had to work at the time, or what 566 00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 3: was making me miserable. And I was telling myself this 567 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 3: lie that like, this is what makes me happy. No, 568 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:14,800 Speaker 3: it it wasn't, clearly was not. So I just had 569 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 3: to do all this self expiration and questioning of the 570 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:22,200 Speaker 3: things I knew one hundred percent were true they were not. 571 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,560 Speaker 3: It was really painful, it was tough work. I'm still 572 00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:28,320 Speaker 3: in it. I'm writing a book about it now because 573 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:33,400 Speaker 3: you know, it was it totally changed my life. But 574 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:36,440 Speaker 3: I you know, it's one of the hardest things to do. 575 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 3: When you are driven and when you set goals for yourself, 576 00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:43,600 Speaker 3: whether they're internal or external, there's still your that's still 577 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 3: who you are. To reimagine, Okay, what if I don't 578 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:49,480 Speaker 3: get there? 579 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,120 Speaker 2: What if I'm already there? Right? 580 00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:54,480 Speaker 3: What if I'm not meant to be there and getting 581 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 3: there will make me miserable? 582 00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 2: Right? You know, all of these sort of shifts in. 583 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:04,800 Speaker 3: Paradigm and perspective. We're super super healthy, but in the 584 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:07,200 Speaker 3: beginning it's hard. You tell yourself, well, you're just letting 585 00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:11,120 Speaker 3: yourself off the hook, right, You're like giving yourself permission 586 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:11,600 Speaker 3: to fail. 587 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:13,280 Speaker 2: Oh my god, I can't. 588 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: You're You're like in my brain right now, I think 589 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:17,160 Speaker 1: we're really similar. 590 00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:18,600 Speaker 2: It's so similar. 591 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,320 Speaker 1: It was like, you know, if if I never do 592 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,400 Speaker 1: a sitcom again, you. 593 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:26,000 Speaker 2: Know, yeah, you're okay, but really, are you okay? But 594 00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 2: are you? Are you just saying it's okay? Are you 595 00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:29,760 Speaker 2: just saying that? 596 00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,120 Speaker 1: But I have to say, I really at this age 597 00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:36,280 Speaker 1: and this stage of life, and I will say right 598 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:38,880 Speaker 1: now knock on wood because it changes. But right now, 599 00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 1: with four kids, you know, someone's always up and down, 600 00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:43,400 Speaker 1: and whatever. But right now, everyone seems to be in 601 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:47,720 Speaker 1: a good trajectory. Right now, this one's on a good path. Yeah, 602 00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:50,960 Speaker 1: and I know it'll change. So I'm really seizing that moment, 603 00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 1: which is so great. But it's also allowing me to 604 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 1: look around and I'm really very very good right now 605 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:04,600 Speaker 1: at choosing things that bring me joy. And I used 606 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:06,720 Speaker 1: to be scared to say no to things because in 607 00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,200 Speaker 1: the same thing we're talking about, well if I say. 608 00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,080 Speaker 3: No, what if that was the thing that was going to. 609 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:12,800 Speaker 2: Bring that one thing? That I'm not going to be 610 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:14,640 Speaker 2: happy unless I have the one thing. And also what 611 00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:16,959 Speaker 2: are they going to think of me? WHOA what are 612 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:17,240 Speaker 2: they going to? 613 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:25,320 Speaker 1: Right I'm getting better at saying no, And oh my gosh, 614 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,520 Speaker 1: you love this one. So there was I have to 615 00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:32,480 Speaker 1: say this really like obtusely, so it's not like clear who. 616 00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:32,920 Speaker 2: I'm talking about. 617 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:38,640 Speaker 1: But there was a dinner and I opted out of 618 00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:41,480 Speaker 1: this dinner because this is a dinner with this couple 619 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,160 Speaker 1: that this person I've known in my life. 620 00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:44,920 Speaker 2: For many years. 621 00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,520 Speaker 1: I know her to say no, you don't I'll tell 622 00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:50,719 Speaker 1: you later, But you don't know I'm talking about this 623 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 1: person been in my life for a long time, and 624 00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:57,800 Speaker 1: this person messes with me with my career like could 625 00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:03,000 Speaker 1: do something, doesn't do anything, and just really like mind 626 00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:04,160 Speaker 1: f's me wait? 627 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 2: Intentionally yes, oh, And I realized it a long time 628 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:11,640 Speaker 2: when we won. But it was like Charlie Brown with 629 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:12,200 Speaker 2: the football. 630 00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 1: You know, you keep thinking, well maybe next time, maybe, 631 00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 1: And I went, you know what, not doing that, not 632 00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:24,160 Speaker 1: going to that dinner, not this time, Charlie Brown, Yeah, yep, 633 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:26,560 Speaker 1: or Linus or whoever holds the football, you know what 634 00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:26,920 Speaker 1: I mean. 635 00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:46,720 Speaker 3: Self advocating and setting boundaries huge, huge, And I've never 636 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:48,480 Speaker 3: felt more like an adult like. 637 00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 2: When I was young. 638 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:51,480 Speaker 3: When I was like in my late twenties, I felt 639 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:53,480 Speaker 3: like an adult. When I started taking clothes to like 640 00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 3: the dry cleaner, I was like, oh, this is adulting. 641 00:32:56,600 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 2: When I bought my first set of contact lenses, I 642 00:32:58,960 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 2: was like. 643 00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,560 Speaker 3: Okay, I'm an adult now, I'm an adult now. Well, no, 644 00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:07,240 Speaker 3: Adulting is advocating for yourself, saying no to things and 645 00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:08,120 Speaker 3: setting boundaries. 646 00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:10,240 Speaker 2: Yes, And it's so hard to do with life. 647 00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 3: Relationships, so hard to do. It's really hard to do. 648 00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,400 Speaker 3: It's really hard to do, and there's guilt. There's like 649 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 3: a lot of second guessing and for me at least, 650 00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:23,480 Speaker 3: there was a period where I didn't really even know 651 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,640 Speaker 3: who I was. Like I'm stripping all of this away, 652 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,720 Speaker 3: which was intentional and necessary and ultimately good, but in 653 00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:34,160 Speaker 3: stripping so much of it away, I felt identityless and like, yeah, 654 00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:38,320 Speaker 3: you know, I just wanted to be the confident, young girl, 655 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 3: young woman I had always thought I was. But I 656 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:45,400 Speaker 3: wasn't that either, you know, like I wasn't actually that either. 657 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:49,480 Speaker 3: I was deeply insecure, and I was deeply like unhappy, 658 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,840 Speaker 3: you know. So it's just, yeah, challenging yourself on the 659 00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 3: things you think. 660 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,840 Speaker 2: You know, it's really really good. 661 00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:56,280 Speaker 1: You know. 662 00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:58,720 Speaker 2: It's funny you were talking about therapy. I've I only 663 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:03,880 Speaker 2: went to therapy once. Okay, I was So I was 664 00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:05,600 Speaker 2: on a show. Tell me why and when if you 665 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:07,240 Speaker 2: don't mind, No, I'm telling it totally. 666 00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:09,600 Speaker 1: So I was on a show and we were trying 667 00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:12,640 Speaker 1: to get pregnant, and I just assumed, because you spend 668 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:14,680 Speaker 1: your whole life trying not to try not to not. 669 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:16,400 Speaker 2: Your whole life, but your whole sexually. 670 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:19,000 Speaker 1: Active life trying not to get pregnant before you're ready, 671 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:19,879 Speaker 1: and then I just. 672 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:21,479 Speaker 2: Figured it would be like not a big deal. 673 00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:23,920 Speaker 1: And so we had to do, you know, all the 674 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:28,320 Speaker 1: things in feature and whatever, and it was so depressing. 675 00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:32,680 Speaker 2: And then my show got canceled and I was like, 676 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:34,520 Speaker 2: I don't. 677 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,240 Speaker 1: I don't have a show, and I can't get pregnant 678 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:40,520 Speaker 1: and what what is my thing here? 679 00:34:40,840 --> 00:34:41,479 Speaker 2: And I don't. 680 00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 1: It was hard, and back then there were only a 681 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:45,440 Speaker 1: few networks, so it wasn't like, you. 682 00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:49,040 Speaker 3: Know, yeah, endless opportunity. Yeah, that's a lot at once. 683 00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:54,279 Speaker 1: So so so a friend of ours sent us to 684 00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:57,200 Speaker 1: gave Terry the name of this guy. So I go 685 00:34:57,239 --> 00:35:01,040 Speaker 1: to the guy and listen, I'm raised by nineteen fifty's parents. 686 00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:03,719 Speaker 2: You think I'm telling him anything? No, I see, I 687 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,360 Speaker 2: was doing an hour of Heather. I was so funny. 688 00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:11,000 Speaker 1: I was entertaining, I was charming, I told stories. 689 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 2: It was great. It was Heather in the scripted show. 690 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:17,799 Speaker 1: Yes, And then we got the bill and it was 691 00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 1: five hundred dollars. This is a long time ago, twenty 692 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:22,800 Speaker 1: three years ago. It was five hundred dollars a session. 693 00:35:22,800 --> 00:35:28,040 Speaker 1: And Terry goes, you're cured, and I'm like, okay, And 694 00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:30,719 Speaker 1: then I thought, yeah, I'd rather have a purse. That 695 00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:34,880 Speaker 1: might make me feel better than the therapy session. 696 00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:39,280 Speaker 2: Truthfully. Okay, okay, So because. 697 00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,520 Speaker 1: Of my background and now you understand my upbringing, Yeah, 698 00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:45,320 Speaker 1: therapy felt like, oh that was a thing you didn't do. 699 00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:48,640 Speaker 1: Now I'm totally into therapy. You know, some of my 700 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:49,800 Speaker 1: kids have been to therapy. 701 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:50,600 Speaker 2: They love it. 702 00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,439 Speaker 1: I think it's a beautiful tool. And in the same 703 00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:57,120 Speaker 1: way you have a trainer for your body, the idea 704 00:35:57,120 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 1: of having a trainer for your brain is brilliant. 705 00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:03,040 Speaker 2: I will also tell you that I have not. 706 00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:08,160 Speaker 1: Done it because I think if I open and I'm 707 00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:10,600 Speaker 1: probably wrong and I may end up doing it again someday, 708 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,560 Speaker 1: who knows. But I feel like if I open that 709 00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:17,240 Speaker 1: can of worms, yeah, some worms don't need to be opened. 710 00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:20,399 Speaker 1: And there are relationships that I really feel. Like when 711 00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,959 Speaker 1: you saw me with my dad last year, my joke 712 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,040 Speaker 1: about my dad was that he died like I don't know, 713 00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 1: six seven, eight years ago and we have the same 714 00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:29,759 Speaker 1: relationship now like not m as has changed. Yeah, that's 715 00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,759 Speaker 1: my joke about it. But you know that was odd. 716 00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:36,640 Speaker 1: It was odd to me how emotional I got that. 717 00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 1: I really needed that for me. Yeah, and here's the truth. 718 00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:43,600 Speaker 1: I don't need to sit with someone and go over 719 00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:47,160 Speaker 1: why I feel the way I feel about him or what. 720 00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:51,239 Speaker 1: All I know is I was I always was a 721 00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 1: little angry and whatever I went through and however I 722 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 1: handled this in my brain and whatever, you know, his 723 00:36:57,800 --> 00:36:59,319 Speaker 1: ashes and all of that did for me. 724 00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 2: Man anymore? 725 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:04,400 Speaker 1: Right, I feel good? Right, And so I do feel 726 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:08,560 Speaker 1: like if I had something that really like taxed me 727 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:10,160 Speaker 1: or I needed, I would do it. 728 00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:12,200 Speaker 2: But I also this is so stupid. But to me, 729 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,879 Speaker 2: it's like it's like dating. You know, if I. 730 00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:17,520 Speaker 1: Could just hand them a chip and they would know 731 00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:19,640 Speaker 1: everything and we could just start from today. 732 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,440 Speaker 2: I know it's exhausting. Probably, Yeah, it's too exhausting. It's 733 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:23,680 Speaker 2: exhausting to contemplate. 734 00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:27,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, we are working women right with full lives. 735 00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:30,160 Speaker 2: Totally, it's a lot. And I have the same fear 736 00:37:30,239 --> 00:37:30,560 Speaker 2: I didn't. 737 00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:33,440 Speaker 3: I didn't have the luxury of I wasn't in a 738 00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:35,600 Speaker 3: position in that time to be like should I or 739 00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:36,320 Speaker 3: shouldn't I? 740 00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:38,320 Speaker 2: It was like that or go back to institution. 741 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:43,759 Speaker 3: But you know, just I started with a therapist who 742 00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:47,000 Speaker 3: was very much like, let's get you through your day. 743 00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:49,040 Speaker 2: We don't need to look back and unpacked. Let's just 744 00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:49,319 Speaker 2: get you. 745 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:51,759 Speaker 3: Through your day and make some tweaks smart. And I 746 00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:53,200 Speaker 3: was like, this is great. I felt like I was 747 00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:55,040 Speaker 3: let off the hook. I don't have to like talk 748 00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:59,239 Speaker 3: about my childhood. Great, And eventually that got me through 749 00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:01,640 Speaker 3: my day. But I didn't deal with any of the 750 00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:05,080 Speaker 3: things that had gotten me to that point, right, And 751 00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:08,759 Speaker 3: so then I did. But in the in between, I 752 00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:11,400 Speaker 3: was like, oh, I have to tell my whole life story. 753 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,120 Speaker 3: It's exhausting to talk about my parents. 754 00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:15,200 Speaker 2: I don't want to do that. 755 00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:17,920 Speaker 3: And I didn't think any of that was relevant either 756 00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:19,840 Speaker 3: to what I was going through. I thought what I 757 00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:21,879 Speaker 3: was going through really had more to do with my job. 758 00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:24,160 Speaker 2: But of course it's all relevant. 759 00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:27,440 Speaker 3: Of course it is, and I'll you know, you know this, 760 00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:32,640 Speaker 3: But it is so gratifying to find things that work 761 00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:33,880 Speaker 3: in therapy. 762 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:35,120 Speaker 2: That's the best part of it. 763 00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:38,880 Speaker 3: It's not the indulgent talking about your self part that sucks. Actually, 764 00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,040 Speaker 3: it's the tools you're struggling, you're hurting, you know. For me, 765 00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,319 Speaker 3: I was catastrophizing on a loop twenty four to seven 766 00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:47,680 Speaker 3: and couldn't get through the day, and I couldn't sleep, 767 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:52,040 Speaker 3: and disaster was around every corner. To find things that 768 00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:56,480 Speaker 3: solve problems in your life amazing and tell you why 769 00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:59,839 Speaker 3: they're there and then help you look at life like 770 00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,160 Speaker 3: it's just it's a relief. If you're not at a 771 00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:05,759 Speaker 3: point where you need relief from your life, then I 772 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:08,160 Speaker 3: get it completely and maybe like put it in your 773 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:09,839 Speaker 3: pocket for a time when you really do. 774 00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:12,040 Speaker 1: One hundred percent. And I've almost done it a few 775 00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:14,440 Speaker 1: times but just didn't. But like I said, some of 776 00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:19,279 Speaker 1: my kids, whatever, I'm I think it's a fantastic tool, 777 00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:22,800 Speaker 1: and I love that the stigma of it has really 778 00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:27,279 Speaker 1: been released so people see it as a really helpful tool. 779 00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:30,360 Speaker 2: By the way, I hate to say this, but I 780 00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:34,840 Speaker 2: have a two thirty hard out. Oh you're fine, That's fine, Okay, No, 781 00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:37,480 Speaker 2: because I can talk to you for like three hours. 782 00:39:37,239 --> 00:39:40,160 Speaker 3: Heather, I have eight more pages that I'm throwing out 783 00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:42,080 Speaker 3: because the things we just talked about are so much 784 00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:42,640 Speaker 3: more important. 785 00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:45,200 Speaker 2: Okay, So I just I have to say I adore you. 786 00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:47,680 Speaker 1: Can I just tell you that I said this to you, 787 00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:49,319 Speaker 1: And I think when I saw your Bravo con but 788 00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:52,359 Speaker 1: we met so many years ago when you had your 789 00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:54,239 Speaker 1: show on where was. 790 00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:56,360 Speaker 3: It on cnncn N or HLN with one of the 791 00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:57,359 Speaker 3: two Yeah, And. 792 00:39:57,280 --> 00:39:58,840 Speaker 2: I was like, why does she want to meet me? 793 00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:04,560 Speaker 1: She's so smart and accomplished, and I was shocked you 794 00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:07,799 Speaker 1: wanted me on your show truly, and I are. 795 00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:09,120 Speaker 2: So smart and interesting. 796 00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:11,440 Speaker 1: No, I I just want you to know that that 797 00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:16,680 Speaker 1: was like, it was really just an honor. And I 798 00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:21,080 Speaker 1: remember Terry came with me and yeah, and I was 799 00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:23,440 Speaker 1: just thrilled to be there. So I just want you 800 00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:24,640 Speaker 1: to know it meant a lot to me. 801 00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:28,040 Speaker 3: It meant a lot that you came in. Okay, I've 802 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:30,280 Speaker 3: loved this conversation. Like I said, I have eight pages 803 00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:33,760 Speaker 3: of stuff that just doesn't doubt again because the stuff 804 00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:35,440 Speaker 3: we just talked about is what matters. 805 00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:38,120 Speaker 2: Let's end with the lightning round before you go. 806 00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:46,959 Speaker 3: Okay, favorite place to stay in New York City, My gosh, 807 00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:47,959 Speaker 3: I was just there. 808 00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:51,480 Speaker 2: Tell me, Okay, well, this isn't a favorite place. 809 00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:54,439 Speaker 1: But they redid the Waldorf Astoria top to tail. Yes, 810 00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:57,239 Speaker 1: and I have great memories as a child. Sorry, I'm 811 00:40:57,239 --> 00:40:58,719 Speaker 1: not good at the lightning round of brevity is not 812 00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:01,200 Speaker 1: my strong suit. But okay, they really I don't know, 813 00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:04,360 Speaker 1: it's not I wish they had. It feels a little corporate. 814 00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:07,799 Speaker 1: I'm looking for a new play. Where do you go? 815 00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:12,160 Speaker 2: Well, I live, I live here. I don't know you live, right. 816 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:14,680 Speaker 1: I mean, I used to love the Baccarat. I feel 817 00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:15,840 Speaker 1: like they could have a little refresh. 818 00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:16,560 Speaker 2: I'll tell you. 819 00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:19,400 Speaker 1: I think since the pandemic a lot of the hotels 820 00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:21,800 Speaker 1: in the city really need a refresh. 821 00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:24,919 Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, lately we do stay. 822 00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:28,040 Speaker 1: At the Four Seasons mid Town because that bar, that 823 00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:31,120 Speaker 1: red bar, is just really iconic and the service is 824 00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:35,640 Speaker 1: lovely and like and right when they reopened after the pandemic, 825 00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:38,640 Speaker 1: we were taking our daughter. She's a freshman at Yale 826 00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:40,480 Speaker 1: this year, and we were taking her there and they 827 00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:45,360 Speaker 1: wrote her notes and got flowers and was so sweet. 828 00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:50,319 Speaker 2: Oh okay, good, yay or nay. 829 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:55,839 Speaker 1: To high school reunions, I never went because every time 830 00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:58,839 Speaker 1: there was a reunion, I was either pregnant or I 831 00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:00,000 Speaker 1: was on a show that I couldn't go. 832 00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:00,680 Speaker 2: So I never went. 833 00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:02,719 Speaker 1: But my best friend since the fourth grade gen she 834 00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:06,280 Speaker 1: goes and she tells me, Okay, well that's the best 835 00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:09,720 Speaker 1: of all. Nay, but tell me what happened. 836 00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:11,399 Speaker 3: That's like having a friend that owns a boat. That's 837 00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:14,400 Speaker 3: better than owning a boat, exactly, yeah, one hundred percent. Okay, 838 00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:15,719 Speaker 3: what's the last book you read? 839 00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:18,320 Speaker 2: The Housemaid? 840 00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:22,120 Speaker 1: Okay, because why my daughter wanted to see the movie, 841 00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:23,920 Speaker 1: and I go, okay, give you two days and I 842 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:25,040 Speaker 1: went and I read the. 843 00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:28,120 Speaker 2: Book and I was glad I did. It was great. Okay, good? 844 00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:30,719 Speaker 2: What's your favorite movie? Oh? 845 00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:32,880 Speaker 1: That's so funny. My sister just texted me have you 846 00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:35,840 Speaker 1: seen this? Because I love anything with ice skating, the 847 00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:39,680 Speaker 1: cutting edge, ice castles, anything with ice skating. I am 848 00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:41,279 Speaker 1: so in And she just sent me I guess there 849 00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:43,720 Speaker 1: was like drama behind the scenes and ice castles. 850 00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:46,160 Speaker 2: And she literally right before we started texting me, he goes, 851 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:48,840 Speaker 2: have you seen this? Oh no, but I'm going to 852 00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:49,799 Speaker 2: take a dive later. 853 00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,880 Speaker 3: I love that. That's fantastic. I love that answer. What 854 00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:56,439 Speaker 3: is the retirement plan for you and Terry? You both 855 00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:58,600 Speaker 3: seem like you would love to work forever. Do you 856 00:42:58,680 --> 00:42:59,560 Speaker 3: have a retirement plan? 857 00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:02,680 Speaker 1: When you lose your dreams, you die? When you retire, 858 00:43:02,760 --> 00:43:05,960 Speaker 1: you die. I really, you know, it's funny to I don't. 859 00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:09,800 Speaker 1: We don't have a retirement plan. I think we're we've 860 00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:12,520 Speaker 1: clicked down in some areas and are. 861 00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:17,480 Speaker 2: Clicking up in others. Okay, and so you know we do. 862 00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:21,680 Speaker 1: You know we've had a supplement and skincare line for 863 00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:23,960 Speaker 1: one hundred years right, and we've sort of moved that 864 00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:26,319 Speaker 1: into a different direction. He does a lot of med 865 00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:29,680 Speaker 1: legal work that he loves, so he's kind of like 866 00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:30,799 Speaker 1: click that up a. 867 00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:33,280 Speaker 2: Bit, and. 868 00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:39,719 Speaker 1: You know, we are trying to balance our fun more. 869 00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:41,319 Speaker 2: We're really good at having fun. We're really good at 870 00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:41,839 Speaker 2: date nights. 871 00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:43,880 Speaker 1: Ever since we moved back to LA Like, we go 872 00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:45,640 Speaker 1: out all the time, to the point where I have 873 00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:47,080 Speaker 1: to go we need to stay home tonight. 874 00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:50,319 Speaker 2: It's crazy. We have a great time. We date each other. 875 00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:53,320 Speaker 1: We we we say when it comes to fun and travel, 876 00:43:53,360 --> 00:43:55,759 Speaker 1: we always say yes. But we're trying to even do 877 00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:59,319 Speaker 1: more of that. So I don't really think we. 878 00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:00,600 Speaker 2: Have a retire plan. 879 00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:05,320 Speaker 1: I think we have a pivot plan, and you're saying 880 00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:08,040 Speaker 1: yes to more interesting things and know to things that 881 00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:09,680 Speaker 1: we don't need to. 882 00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:13,840 Speaker 3: Love that Who do you play? In the production? Is 883 00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:15,160 Speaker 3: their life after high school? 884 00:44:16,280 --> 00:44:19,680 Speaker 2: I did that show? I know in high school? Who'd 885 00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:22,040 Speaker 2: you play? Oh? Who did I play? Or who would 886 00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:23,719 Speaker 2: I play? In real life? Who did you play? In 887 00:44:23,719 --> 00:44:25,160 Speaker 2: that show? I played? 888 00:44:26,600 --> 00:44:26,839 Speaker 1: You know? 889 00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:29,240 Speaker 2: It was there were sort of like a melgams of people. 890 00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:36,960 Speaker 1: But my character gave this whole monologue. 891 00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:35,960 Speaker 2: And this is so meat. 892 00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:39,560 Speaker 1: But the whole monologue was about she's talking about this 893 00:44:39,680 --> 00:44:41,799 Speaker 1: girl who did this to her and that dur in 894 00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:44,359 Speaker 1: high school and now she's like, you know, forty this 895 00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:46,480 Speaker 1: during that and after and the end she goes, but 896 00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:49,480 Speaker 1: you know what, the crazy thing is, I still care. 897 00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:54,200 Speaker 1: That is me, right, I do care. You know those 898 00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,480 Speaker 1: are people that give zero f's. I give a lot 899 00:44:56,520 --> 00:44:56,879 Speaker 1: of fs. 900 00:44:57,160 --> 00:44:57,520 Speaker 2: Me too. 901 00:44:57,640 --> 00:45:02,200 Speaker 3: I have so many yes, I give too many f's. 902 00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:03,440 Speaker 2: Okay. 903 00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:08,560 Speaker 3: Last question is a favorite place to eat in Beverly Hills. 904 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:13,080 Speaker 1: Oh, I mean, there's just so many places, but we 905 00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:15,240 Speaker 1: love Steak forty eight great. 906 00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:16,040 Speaker 2: And I lie. 907 00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:17,840 Speaker 3: This is the last question we ask it at the 908 00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:20,200 Speaker 3: end of every podcast. It's really important to me. When 909 00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:21,440 Speaker 3: is it iced coffee season? 910 00:45:22,680 --> 00:45:26,840 Speaker 1: I don't drink coffee, okay, so never, but I do 911 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:28,640 Speaker 1: drink espresso Martini's. 912 00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:33,520 Speaker 2: So the question is when is it over ice? Oh? 913 00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:37,680 Speaker 2: And I would tell you May June, south of France. 914 00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:39,400 Speaker 2: Let's do it. Okay. 915 00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:42,640 Speaker 3: This is the boogiest answer we've ever had, and I love. 916 00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:46,480 Speaker 2: That for us. I adore you. Thank you so much 917 00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:47,919 Speaker 2: for having me. Thank you, Heather. 918 00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,200 Speaker 1: I wish it's for more time to talk, but anytime 919 00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:51,759 Speaker 1: I'm always trying to jump on. 920 00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:53,120 Speaker 2: Okay, let's do it. 921 00:45:57,239 --> 00:45:59,640 Speaker 3: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as 922 00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:01,160 Speaker 3: part of the Reason Choice Network. 923 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,160 Speaker 2: If you want more, check out the other. 924 00:46:03,040 --> 00:46:07,479 Speaker 3: Reason Choice podcasts Spolitics with Jamel Hill and Native Land Pod. 925 00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,000 Speaker 3: For Off the Cup, I am your host, Se Cup. 926 00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:13,680 Speaker 3: Editing and sound design by Derek Clements. Our executive producers 927 00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:17,080 Speaker 3: are me Se Cup, Lauren Hanson, and Lindsay Hoffman. 928 00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:19,080 Speaker 2: Rate and review wherever you get your 929 00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:31,160 Speaker 3: Podcasts, Follow or subscribe for new episodes every Wednesday.