WEBVTT - Citi, Moderna, Arm, and AI 0:00:00.840 --> 0:00:04.000 Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney, alongside 0:00:04.040 --> 0:00:05.240 my co host Matt Miller. 0:00:05.640 --> 0:00:09.600 Every business day we bring you interviews from CEOs, market pros, 0:00:09.720 --> 0:00:13.600 and Bloomberg experts, along with essential market moving news. 0:00:14.160 --> 0:00:17.279 Find the Bloomberg Markets Podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever 0:00:17.360 --> 0:00:20.520 you listen to podcasts, and at Bloomberg dot com slash podcast. 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:21.720 All right, some big. 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:23.439 News out of City Group. Are good friends over there 0:00:23.720 --> 0:00:28.520 at Citygroup, former employer of mine. Big restructuring, so give 0:00:28.560 --> 0:00:31.480 me some headcount reductions. Let's break it down with two 0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:34.640 people who really know this stuff, and that is Shananibossk, 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:37.800 she covers all Wall Street for Bloomberg News, and of 0:00:37.840 --> 0:00:41.240 course Alison Williams. She is our senior bank's analyst at 0:00:41.560 --> 0:00:45.360 Bloomberg Intelligence. Alison, thanks you joined us zoom chanaledge here 0:00:45.400 --> 0:00:47.559 in studio. Ali to start with you. How big of 0:00:47.560 --> 0:00:50.519 a deal is this for City You've covered this stock forever, 0:00:51.720 --> 0:00:52.519 so I think. 0:00:52.760 --> 0:00:57.000 You know, I recharacterize it as a reorganization perhaps versus 0:00:57.000 --> 0:01:00.200 a restructuring, where I think they're just really trying to, 0:01:00.840 --> 0:01:04.880 you know, clean up the reporting lines and maybe help 0:01:04.959 --> 0:01:08.440 management to be a bit more focused and also you 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:11.360 know showcase. You know, as an analyst, I'm excited to 0:01:11.400 --> 0:01:14.559 get cleaner reporting where we can you know, finally see 0:01:14.560 --> 0:01:17.319 what's happening with their private bank, with their wealth unit. 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:20.319 You know, there was some hints at this over the 0:01:20.360 --> 0:01:23.399 summer just and you know even prior, I guess with 0:01:23.480 --> 0:01:26.080 some of the hires that they made, and I just 0:01:26.120 --> 0:01:30.840 think it's you know, another step in James's journey, if 0:01:30.880 --> 0:01:33.840 you will, in terms of just making this a cleaner, 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:37.880 more focused banks and bank and hopefully getting to the 0:01:38.040 --> 0:01:41.520 efficiency that investors have long wanted them to get to. 0:01:42.400 --> 0:01:46.040 So yeah, Shanali, I mean, is this going to help 0:01:46.319 --> 0:01:49.800 Jane Fraser boost the stock price? Because that's bottom line, right, 0:01:49.840 --> 0:01:53.000 And I'm looking at you know, over the last five years, 0:01:53.920 --> 0:01:57.520 they're down thirty percent, whereas Goldman's up sixty three percent, 0:01:57.560 --> 0:01:58.960 Morgan Stanley's more than doubled. 0:01:59.320 --> 0:02:01.560 It's certainly a time story for Citygroup. We have had 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:04.640 her first set of restructurings here, if you will, where 0:02:04.680 --> 0:02:07.480 she let go of certain consumer businesses around the world. 0:02:07.840 --> 0:02:11.359 And now what is difficult for Jane Fraser and their 0:02:11.520 --> 0:02:14.040 investors of Citygroup is that there are still a lot 0:02:14.080 --> 0:02:18.080 of unquestioned a lot of unanswered questions about this reorganization, 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:21.960 one being how many jobs will be lost. Underneath the surface, 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:24.519 our sources say that there could be significant had count 0:02:24.560 --> 0:02:27.480 reductions here because what City Group is doing is removing 0:02:27.600 --> 0:02:31.800 layers of management, and this only this announcement only addresses 0:02:32.200 --> 0:02:35.520 the top two layers. The reality is is they're going 0:02:35.560 --> 0:02:39.119 to be looking across management around the world, across divisions. 0:02:39.160 --> 0:02:42.040 One of the things they did in this reorg is 0:02:42.200 --> 0:02:45.200 they got rid of many of their regional divisions here. 0:02:45.600 --> 0:02:47.600 So the way you think about Citygroup now is that 0:02:47.600 --> 0:02:50.720 their Citygroup North America and their City Group International, and 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:54.400 you now have five main business lines. It's no longer 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:57.160 just the main two, which is institutional client group as 0:02:57.240 --> 0:03:00.320 well as the consumer offerings. Most of that can zoomer 0:03:00.360 --> 0:03:03.880 business now is the United States North America. Okay, So 0:03:04.560 --> 0:03:07.079 there was a real reason that they needed to do this. 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:10.360 City Group today does not look the same as City 0:03:10.400 --> 0:03:14.200 Group two decades ago, when the initial set of current 0:03:14.240 --> 0:03:14.880 structure is. 0:03:14.800 --> 0:03:15.440 What you see. 0:03:15.720 --> 0:03:17.560 In a way, you can see this as the most 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:22.440 significant reorganization in two decades because this is really getting 0:03:22.919 --> 0:03:25.760 rid of the groups that we have known for so 0:03:25.840 --> 0:03:26.240 long as. 0:03:26.120 --> 0:03:28.799 A day, Well, it strikes me, Allison, as it came 0:03:28.840 --> 0:03:31.200 out of my mouth, I realized, probably Golden Sachs and 0:03:31.200 --> 0:03:35.240 Morgan Stanley aren't the best comparison to City in terms 0:03:35.240 --> 0:03:39.640 of stock price performance. You know, WELLS Fargo over the 0:03:39.720 --> 0:03:42.360 last five years is also down only ten percent, not 0:03:42.400 --> 0:03:44.839 thirty percent, but also down. Bank America over the last 0:03:44.840 --> 0:03:47.839 five years is only up eight percent, So not down 0:03:47.840 --> 0:03:49.040 thirty percent, but up eight percent. 0:03:49.080 --> 0:03:50.680 Are those better comparisons for City? 0:03:52.480 --> 0:03:53.160 I think they are. 0:03:53.240 --> 0:03:55.200 I think at the end of the day, when we 0:03:55.280 --> 0:03:57.880 look at all of these banks, you know, the way 0:03:57.920 --> 0:04:01.880 that investors think about it is, you know, the valuation 0:04:02.280 --> 0:04:05.600 is going to be tied to returns as it should be, right, 0:04:05.680 --> 0:04:10.120 and so someone like someone like Morgan Stanley that you 0:04:10.160 --> 0:04:13.080 refer to, the comparison could you make, could that you 0:04:13.080 --> 0:04:16.640 could make is they've improved their structural returns through moving 0:04:16.640 --> 0:04:19.320 towards the wealth business. You know, looking at someone like 0:04:19.400 --> 0:04:23.040 JP Morgan, who's a very different bank, they're actually executing, 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:26.640 you know, above all of their peers. You know, part 0:04:26.680 --> 0:04:29.640 of that is the scale that helps the profitability across 0:04:29.680 --> 0:04:33.400 their businesses, and they have leading returns. And so the 0:04:33.480 --> 0:04:36.520 struggle with City and I think, you know, part of 0:04:36.520 --> 0:04:39.200 the reason why it's been tough for the stock is 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:43.039 they just have not been able to improve the returns. 0:04:43.040 --> 0:04:45.880 And if you look across the group, their returns are 0:04:45.920 --> 0:04:50.240 the worst. You know, wells Fargo, you know, during certain 0:04:50.240 --> 0:04:53.560 periods of times with all their big charges, had had 0:04:53.560 --> 0:04:55.320 some weaker returns. But they're sort of on the on 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:59.360 the path to better profitability and so that's really what 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:02.080 needs to deliver on at the end of the day, 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:05.159 it is those returns. And I think why this is 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:09.360 important is, you know, as you clear the structure, and 0:05:09.800 --> 0:05:12.000 you know that's been one of the biggest issues of 0:05:12.080 --> 0:05:15.039 City is all the bureaucracy and really sort of a 0:05:15.080 --> 0:05:17.960 massive organization. But if you can get that cleaner and 0:05:18.000 --> 0:05:20.800 you can improve the efficiency of those core businesses, they 0:05:20.839 --> 0:05:24.160 do have some good businesses to work with, some higher 0:05:24.160 --> 0:05:27.640 returning what should be high returning businesses, Chanalie, what. 0:05:27.560 --> 0:05:30.520 Do you think Jane Fraser wants the message to be 0:05:30.720 --> 0:05:33.320 about City group? And I think, like Morgan Stanley, I 0:05:33.320 --> 0:05:37.040 think if James Gorman pivot towards wealth management so successful, 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:40.320 what do you think Jane Fraser would like that view 0:05:40.400 --> 0:05:41.120 of City to be? 0:05:41.640 --> 0:05:44.679 You know, On one hand, it's simpler for James Gorman 0:05:44.760 --> 0:05:46.440 to sit there and say we're an investment bank and 0:05:46.480 --> 0:05:49.320 we're a wealth and asset manager. For Jane Fraser, it's 0:05:49.320 --> 0:05:52.920 a different story. Her goal here is to have all 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:57.560 of her managers essentially get one message, which is get leaner. 0:05:58.360 --> 0:06:00.440 They have one of the largest investment banks in the world. 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:02.680 But just take the M and A business for example. 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:04.480 The reason I bring up the M and A business 0:06:04.720 --> 0:06:07.360 is you are sitting there. They are sitting at it 0:06:07.640 --> 0:06:09.920 at number six and the lead tales. Actually I just 0:06:09.920 --> 0:06:11.479 looked at it and got kind of stunned because they're 0:06:11.480 --> 0:06:14.640 behind cent of you, which is a lot, you know, 0:06:14.680 --> 0:06:17.120 and that is in terms of deal volumes, and that 0:06:17.279 --> 0:06:19.520 you know, a year, two years, three years ago is 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:21.520 just the stunning thing to see this late in the year. 0:06:21.920 --> 0:06:24.280 And so the share that they need to gain to 0:06:24.360 --> 0:06:27.159 keep those fees up as well as squeeze every dollar 0:06:27.200 --> 0:06:29.160 out of the costs that they have. You know, it's 0:06:29.160 --> 0:06:32.120 a twofold story. It's one, get competitive and win two, 0:06:32.360 --> 0:06:35.960 be more efficient with every dollar we have to improve profitability. 0:06:36.200 --> 0:06:38.520 And so you know, the investment bank is a really 0:06:38.560 --> 0:06:42.799 good example because in this reorg one open question among 0:06:42.839 --> 0:06:46.000 those five business leaders is who will run the investment 0:06:46.040 --> 0:06:49.080 bank over at City the banking business. Currently they have 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:52.560 tapped an interim head, Peter Bubbey, who is the CEO 0:06:52.800 --> 0:06:55.960 at the Asia business. You have to consider this. This 0:06:56.040 --> 0:06:57.680 is one of the top five M and A businesses 0:06:57.720 --> 0:07:00.240 in the world. It is one of the hottest jobs 0:07:00.240 --> 0:07:00.960 on Wall Street. 0:07:01.200 --> 0:07:01.800 And guess what. 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:04.800 They have a huge IPO business, a huge det unready business, 0:07:05.080 --> 0:07:09.039 and that person, you can't imagine wouldn't one day be 0:07:09.120 --> 0:07:11.400 the successor for Jane Fraser herself. 0:07:12.320 --> 0:07:12.480 You know. 0:07:12.680 --> 0:07:15.320 Again, they have a consumer business that's quite large as well, 0:07:15.360 --> 0:07:17.720 but they have a massive investment bank and it is 0:07:17.880 --> 0:07:19.320 a seriously competitive spot. 0:07:19.360 --> 0:07:22.720 And my buddy Tyler Dixon still running the investment bank over. 0:07:22.600 --> 0:07:25.000 There, and he is under the new banking I. 0:07:24.920 --> 0:07:26.840 Know that's interesting, but Tyler is just one of the 0:07:26.880 --> 0:07:29.880 smartest guys in the room, every room he's in. Shanali Bassett, 0:07:29.880 --> 0:07:33.120 thank you so much. We got Allison Williams, thank you 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:34.120 so much as well. 0:07:35.120 --> 0:07:38.520 You're listening to the Team Ken's are Live program Bloomberg 0:07:38.560 --> 0:07:41.920 Markets weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:45.160 the iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app or listen 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:47.360 on demand wherever you get your podcasts. 0:07:49.280 --> 0:07:52.640 Lots going on here today. We want to pivot hard 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:56.120 here and we want to talk pharmaceuticals and we want 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:58.000 to talk drugs and all that kind of stuff. And 0:07:58.040 --> 0:07:59.000 we can do that well. 0:07:59.000 --> 0:08:01.120 And one of the biggest winners the day, biggest. 0:08:00.760 --> 0:08:03.720 Winners of the day, Stefan Bonsel, CEO of Moderna that 0:08:03.840 --> 0:08:07.000 is a Nasdaq traded stock. Mr NA is the ticker 0:08:07.360 --> 0:08:10.680 to put into your Bloomberg terminal. You know nobody. I 0:08:10.680 --> 0:08:13.240 guess when you sit around your Thanksgiving table, everybody likes 0:08:13.240 --> 0:08:16.000 to just complain about drug prices, right, everybody does it. 0:08:15.920 --> 0:08:18.720 It's crossed the aisle. But I turned it around a 0:08:18.720 --> 0:08:20.240 couple of years ago and said, okay, we can do 0:08:20.280 --> 0:08:23.080 that because we always like to complain about drug prices. 0:08:23.560 --> 0:08:26.800 But these guys in the farmer, in the biotech industry, mandad, 0:08:26.800 --> 0:08:28.360 they come through with COVID. 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:28.640 Yeah. 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:31.720 I think actually, as a society, we were all a 0:08:31.800 --> 0:08:33.000 little bit relieved. 0:08:33.280 --> 0:08:35.760 I'm like, in twelve months, these guys came up with 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:38.800 a vaccine. I mean, who does that, But you guys did. 0:08:39.080 --> 0:08:40.760 Thank you very much. Thank you to the five for 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:43.440 folks and all the other farmer and biotech folks out there, 0:08:43.440 --> 0:08:47.719 that mandad they come through with that vaccine. Appreciate it. Now, 0:08:47.760 --> 0:08:49.920 what are you doing modern now? Tell us that you 0:08:49.960 --> 0:08:52.280 guys have your R and D day today, you bring 0:08:52.320 --> 0:08:56.240 out all your new stuff for your investors, for your stakeholders. 0:08:56.480 --> 0:08:59.040 What's the big message for your R and D day today? 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:02.319 That's well, not the COVID company, yes for the kind 0:09:02.320 --> 0:09:05.800 of word yes, thank you though, and the money platform 0:09:05.840 --> 0:09:09.720 company and the platform is firing on every cylinders today 0:09:09.760 --> 0:09:13.440 went on seeing positive fluid data in phase three. So 0:09:13.480 --> 0:09:15.520 if you think about it in terms of vaccines, we 0:09:15.559 --> 0:09:19.079 are free out of free COVID working URSV file to 0:09:19.160 --> 0:09:24.280 VFDA and to the positive flugh data. In cancer, we 0:09:24.360 --> 0:09:29.040 are now products showing forty four percent improvement versus the 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:33.040 best drug available to patients today, which is immunotherapy in 0:09:33.320 --> 0:09:36.000 melanomas kin cancer. And we're going to start before the 0:09:36.120 --> 0:09:38.840 end of the year a phase free study in learn 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:40.439 cancer cancer. 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:42.360 We really going to transform as well. 0:09:43.120 --> 0:09:47.360 First that is that, by the way, because of MR 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:49.880 and A technology. And I'll just remind listeners we are 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:53.559 talking with Stephan Bansel right now. He's the chief executive 0:09:53.600 --> 0:09:57.920 officer of Moderna. And as you said, you're not just 0:09:57.960 --> 0:10:01.400 a COVID company. You did have have an mRNA vaccine 0:10:01.440 --> 0:10:04.480 for COVID that maybe save the world a lot more 0:10:04.480 --> 0:10:06.680 pain than it would have seen. But you also have 0:10:07.080 --> 0:10:09.640 a flu vaccine that is driving the stock up today 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:14.920 six and a half percent, and cancer treatments that we hope, 0:10:14.920 --> 0:10:17.359 we all hope, I think are going to be successful 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:20.200 and could drive revenue another fifteen billion starting in twenty 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:23.400 twenty eight. So tell us about the mRNA technology that 0:10:23.440 --> 0:10:25.280 we all kind of learned about a couple of years ago. 0:10:25.480 --> 0:10:25.760 Sure. 0:10:25.840 --> 0:10:29.640 So, Emmania, as you learned about, is an information molecule. 0:10:29.960 --> 0:10:33.440 We basically code in that molecule what protein we want 0:10:33.600 --> 0:10:36.800 your body to make. That would be your drug, your medicine. 0:10:37.240 --> 0:10:39.760 And in cancer, now what we have shown is a 0:10:39.880 --> 0:10:44.560 huge impact on survival and being able to not have 0:10:44.640 --> 0:10:47.360 recurrence of disease compared to the best drugs available to 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:50.199 the two patients. And the third chapter for us after 0:10:50.600 --> 0:10:55.120 infictio zas, vaccine and cancer is real genetic disease. We 0:10:55.160 --> 0:10:58.439 are now free out of free real genetic disease, showing 0:10:58.520 --> 0:11:01.040 positive data in kids with those diseases. 0:11:00.760 --> 0:11:03.080 That have no hope today, zero hope. 0:11:03.800 --> 0:11:07.480 All right, So back to the flu, because it's we're 0:11:07.520 --> 0:11:10.960 getting into flu season. What is your flu vaccine? What 0:11:11.120 --> 0:11:14.000 is new, what is different? It just tell us about 0:11:14.040 --> 0:11:16.840 what you start today. Why are people so excited about 0:11:16.840 --> 0:11:17.800 the flu vaccine? 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:20.360 Because first we're going to be able to participate and 0:11:20.400 --> 0:11:24.040 provide a very high efficacy flu vaccine. What we've showed 0:11:24.080 --> 0:11:27.440 in actually over studies is that actually it's as good as. 0:11:27.280 --> 0:11:28.880 The best vaccine on the market for flu. 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:31.360 But what people I think I excited about is the 0:11:31.400 --> 0:11:34.800 idea of combination, Meaning we're going to show before the 0:11:34.920 --> 0:11:38.240 end of the year flu and covid combine in the 0:11:38.280 --> 0:11:41.360 single shots, so in the following years you won't have 0:11:41.440 --> 0:11:42.959 to go and get a flu shot in one arm 0:11:42.960 --> 0:11:44.199 and the covid shot in ther arm. 0:11:44.559 --> 0:11:45.360 They'll be combined. 0:11:45.360 --> 0:11:47.600 And then over time we're going to keep adding more 0:11:47.640 --> 0:11:52.080 and more respiratory virus like RSV to the combination as well, 0:11:52.600 --> 0:11:54.319 so that you can have only one shot early in 0:11:54.400 --> 0:11:56.200 the four at the pharmacy, and then you have a 0:11:56.200 --> 0:11:58.000 happy follower in winter you're not sick. 0:11:58.760 --> 0:12:01.320 So but this is for next year, This is not 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.520 for this cournflusing Okay, got it. I just want to get 0:12:03.520 --> 0:12:04.800 clear on the timing. 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:06.440 You can still get your flu vaccine for this. I'm 0:12:06.440 --> 0:12:06.760 gonna go. 0:12:06.720 --> 0:12:08.600 Down to LL two and get my flu vaccine. I mean, 0:12:08.640 --> 0:12:13.640 who doesn't do that? So with mr mRNA tech technology, 0:12:14.600 --> 0:12:16.960 what's it three to five years down the road, what 0:12:17.040 --> 0:12:19.400 do you expect that technology to tackle next? 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:20.040 Maybe? 0:12:20.480 --> 0:12:24.160 So we're announcing today at Adiday that we should launch 0:12:24.320 --> 0:12:26.800 fifteen new drug in the next five years. 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:28.880 Fifteen new drugs in the next five that's. 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:32.800 How incredible across cancer, infect disease, and genetic disease. We're 0:12:32.840 --> 0:12:36.200 also working on an autoimmune disease I think althatries, chron 0:12:36.280 --> 0:12:39.200 disease and so on. We believe we're going to bring 0:12:39.440 --> 0:12:43.520 fifteen more drugs on top of forty we have in 0:12:43.600 --> 0:12:47.120 development fifty five zero okay from the lab into the 0:12:47.200 --> 0:12:48.960 clinic in the next five years, or around ten new 0:12:49.040 --> 0:12:51.959 drugs per year moving from the labs into developments. So 0:12:52.000 --> 0:12:54.920 what you see here is a true platform. There has 0:12:54.960 --> 0:12:57.280 never been platform in the biotech far my industry. As 0:12:57.280 --> 0:12:59.280 you know, most drugs go to the clinic. Yep, they're 0:12:59.320 --> 0:13:02.760 fair ninety percent of drug starting a phase one will 0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:06.839 never get launched Okay, I look at Moderna because of 0:13:06.880 --> 0:13:10.080 our platform, because am money is an information molecule. We 0:13:10.120 --> 0:13:12.199 are three out of three in vaccines, we have three 0:13:12.200 --> 0:13:16.800 out of three in real genetic disease cancer. Incredible improvements 0:13:16.840 --> 0:13:17.959 and it's just the beginning. 0:13:18.000 --> 0:13:21.120 All right, this is all because of the mRNA technology. 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:24.320 And I have a funding question. Then what happens if 0:13:25.480 --> 0:13:30.000 you know the COVID vaccine revenues don't meet your expectations? 0:13:30.040 --> 0:13:32.199 Can you still fund that kind of growth? 0:13:32.679 --> 0:13:32.880 Sure? 0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:34.320 I mean, if you look at it, we say that 0:13:34.360 --> 0:13:36.520 this year we should be six to eight billion dollars 0:13:36.520 --> 0:13:39.600 of cells, which is still a very significant number. 0:13:40.040 --> 0:13:40.679 For turnover. 0:13:41.240 --> 0:13:44.120 We are fourteen billion dollar on a balanch sheet that 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:46.720 we got through the COVID sales over the last two years, 0:13:47.040 --> 0:13:49.079 and so we can fund around we think twenty five 0:13:49.080 --> 0:13:52.200 billion dollar of RD growth by cash directing, by the 0:13:52.200 --> 0:13:55.480 business and the balance sheet. And we will also not 0:13:55.559 --> 0:13:57.960 be shy to partner if we have to. We're obsessed 0:13:57.960 --> 0:14:00.400 about getting those drugs to patients to be finish line. 0:14:01.000 --> 0:14:03.080 But if you look at for example, with Vertex, we 0:14:03.240 --> 0:14:07.000 partnered for cistic fibrosi, it's for inhale. The money getting 0:14:07.000 --> 0:14:09.199 to the long of a kid that have cistic fibrosis 0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:13.440 by inhalation, we develop that technology yet another fourth cylinder 0:14:13.440 --> 0:14:16.040 for moderna to develop a new family of drugs. And 0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:17.679 so that's what we're trying to do is push a 0:14:17.720 --> 0:14:20.080 boundary of science, get more and more drugs and if 0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:21.280 we have to partner, and we'll partner. 0:14:21.520 --> 0:14:22.880 But it's expensive to do. 0:14:23.120 --> 0:14:28.920 And you know, because of recent legislation the United States, 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:31.720 the bidance strategs past, the United States is going to 0:14:32.000 --> 0:14:36.560 not only negotiate prices with drug makers, but set prices 0:14:37.080 --> 0:14:39.040 with drug makers. 0:14:39.680 --> 0:14:42.120 Is that a concern to you very much? 0:14:42.160 --> 0:14:45.120 So as the rest of the industry as voiced, you 0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:49.280 cannot set prices because ird is risky. As we just 0:14:49.320 --> 0:14:53.600 talked about ninety percent of drugs entering the clinic failure, 0:14:54.640 --> 0:14:57.200 very high failure rate of the industry as a whole. 0:14:57.440 --> 0:14:58.640 If you start to set. 0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:00.880 Price and not look at value that is bringing by 0:15:00.920 --> 0:15:04.080 the drugs, you're going to reduce the ability of pharmasty, 0:15:04.120 --> 0:15:06.240 core and biotech companies to invest in innovation. 0:15:06.720 --> 0:15:07.720 And that's a big worry. 0:15:07.760 --> 0:15:09.600 But they're going to set prices, So how are you 0:15:09.600 --> 0:15:10.320 going to deal with it? 0:15:10.760 --> 0:15:13.240 So we just need to keep innovating and figure out 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:17.680 ways to go after smaller disease type selling around the world, 0:15:18.080 --> 0:15:20.320 because again the US of course is the number one 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:23.320 market in the world, but other markets are also very important, 0:15:23.480 --> 0:15:26.680 like Europe, you know, Japan, and so we're going to 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:28.040 have to grow internationally as well. 0:15:28.040 --> 0:15:30.480 But it's a big issue. I'm worried about it, all right. 0:15:30.520 --> 0:15:32.760 How about I always joke that in my next life 0:15:32.800 --> 0:15:34.760 I want to come back as a healthcare m and 0:15:34.800 --> 0:15:37.000 a banker because every Monday we come in and there's 0:15:37.040 --> 0:15:39.800 another healthcare deal that you are one of your competitors. 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:44.200 Do is there something that you need to buy in 0:15:44.240 --> 0:15:46.000 the next couple of years to get to where you 0:15:46.040 --> 0:15:48.240 want to go that maybe is not in your pipeline 0:15:48.280 --> 0:15:48.680 right now. 0:15:49.080 --> 0:15:49.120 No. 0:15:49.360 --> 0:15:51.440 What is cool about Amani is we are the world 0:15:51.480 --> 0:15:54.120 leader in AMANI. Even BioNTech, which is a great company, 0:15:54.560 --> 0:15:56.720 they are doing small molecule, a lot of molecule, a 0:15:56.760 --> 0:16:00.200 lot of different technologies. We are only doing AMMONI. What 0:16:00.240 --> 0:16:03.080 we're doing through obed activity is ever buying. We bought 0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:06.200 a company in Japan over the Christmas breaks a cool 0:16:06.200 --> 0:16:10.200 technology to make our EMMANI operating system stronger and bigger. 0:16:10.200 --> 0:16:11.480 So we can do more drugs. 0:16:11.800 --> 0:16:14.880 We are nowso mon there dealing cancer with a company 0:16:14.920 --> 0:16:18.120 in Germany that has very cool science and biology that 0:16:18.200 --> 0:16:21.680 we can code into the EMANI molecule to do new drugs. 0:16:21.680 --> 0:16:25.520 So this will do to expand the potential of impacting patients. 0:16:26.280 --> 0:16:27.760 All right, excellent to have you in here. 0:16:27.760 --> 0:16:29.240 I really appreciate it, and I know you're going to 0:16:29.320 --> 0:16:32.880 go on television in just a moment, so our listeners 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:35.680 will be able to watch you with Alex Steel and 0:16:35.680 --> 0:16:40.760 Guy Johnson on the European clothes. Just a fascinating discussion 0:16:41.200 --> 0:16:44.280 and also a fascinating move in the stock up six 0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:45.040 point seven percent. 0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:47.520 Yeah about that, Stefan Bansel, thank you so much for 0:16:47.600 --> 0:16:50.560 joining Usteffan as the CEO of Momoderna again the taker 0:16:50.640 --> 0:16:54.520 symbol free stock Jockey's out there, mr Na. We appreciate that. 0:16:55.040 --> 0:16:56.840 Thank you so much. All right, looking ahead here at 0:16:56.880 --> 0:17:01.320 this market here we are pretty much unchanged, so you know, 0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:03.400 we're gonna be very interesting to see how this market. 0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:05.600 But you know Moderna that again, that's stock, as you mentioned, 0:17:05.840 --> 0:17:10.080 Matt up six percent today, down thirty seven percent year 0:17:10.160 --> 0:17:10.600 to date. 0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:14.040 You're listening to the tape cans are live program Bloomberg 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:17.679 Markets weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:19.680 tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and. 0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:20.960 The Bloomberg Business App. 0:17:21.000 --> 0:17:23.800 You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 0:17:23.840 --> 0:17:28.240 flagship New York station Just Say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty. 0:17:30.119 --> 0:17:33.520 Uncle Crawford joins us. She's a portfolio manager and executive 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:35.880 VP at Aldre. Encour thank you so much for joining 0:17:35.920 --> 0:17:38.479 us here in our Bloomberg Interactive Broker studio. I just 0:17:38.520 --> 0:17:40.399 love looking at people's you know, kind of how they 0:17:40.480 --> 0:17:42.800 kind of came up through the business. So, but you've 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:46.520 been at Alger since September two thousand and four, so 0:17:46.560 --> 0:17:51.199 you've seen some market movements. What are you telling? What 0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:54.199 are you guys at Aldre doing now? Stock market's up 0:17:54.240 --> 0:17:55.760 double digits this year, We've had a little bit of 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:57.800 a bounce back off of an ugly twenty twenty two. 0:17:58.520 --> 0:17:59.199 Now what do we do? 0:18:00.200 --> 0:18:02.040 Yeah, I think it's not going to be quite as 0:18:02.080 --> 0:18:05.919 easy as it has been over the last nine months. Okay, 0:18:06.000 --> 0:18:09.800 and we're going into chop your waters, and in part 0:18:09.840 --> 0:18:13.560 because we're just waiting for the economy to respond and 0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:16.120 we just don't know the magnitude of how it's going 0:18:16.160 --> 0:18:18.600 to respond. Is it going to be a soft landing, 0:18:18.680 --> 0:18:21.720 hard landing, no landing? And I think no landing is 0:18:21.760 --> 0:18:26.160 coming off the table. I think the expectation is now 0:18:26.200 --> 0:18:29.320 for soft landing, and there's arguments for hard landing. So 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:33.160 I think because of that uncertainty in the market right now, 0:18:33.240 --> 0:18:37.639 the consumer resilience is starting to taper. The job market 0:18:37.880 --> 0:18:41.520 is starting to come off a boil. We're going to 0:18:41.520 --> 0:18:42.440 see you chop your market. 0:18:42.600 --> 0:18:44.440 Does landing imply cuts? 0:18:45.000 --> 0:18:47.879 I mean in hard landing, clearly think the fed's going 0:18:47.960 --> 0:18:51.160 to cut because that means we're in a bad recession. 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:55.040 I don't totally know what soft landing means in terms 0:18:55.040 --> 0:18:59.760 of a FED reaction, and do they cut or you know, 0:18:59.600 --> 0:19:01.400 I know what the soft landing is like in terms 0:19:01.400 --> 0:19:02.359 of an airplane. 0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:03.440 I'm just saying, like. 0:19:03.400 --> 0:19:07.080 When you come down right and just set it down gently. 0:19:07.280 --> 0:19:11.280 I guess growth doesn't contract, but it's also not expanding 0:19:11.280 --> 0:19:14.440 at a massive pace. And does the FED then cut 0:19:14.520 --> 0:19:16.520 or do they leave rate higher for longer? 0:19:16.600 --> 0:19:19.240 You know what? And that's the risk they could actually 0:19:19.359 --> 0:19:23.920 leave rates higher for longer in that scenario. So it's 0:19:23.920 --> 0:19:26.639