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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your guide to

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Speaker 1: the White Tail Woods presented by First Light, creating proven

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Speaker 1: versatile hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind. First

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Speaker 1: Light Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host, Mark Kenyon.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. This week on

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Speaker 2: the show, I'm joined by my buddy Tony Peterson to

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Speaker 2: discuss new ideas for better off season deer scouting, our

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Speaker 2: latest shed hunting exploits, and my very first mountain lion hunt.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to you

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Speaker 2: by First Light and their Camera for Conservation initiative, in

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Speaker 2: which a portion of every sale of First Light Spectr

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Speaker 2: Camlo Pattern is given back to the National Deer Association

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Speaker 2: to help them with things like their Public Lands initiative

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Speaker 2: for their field, the Fork Initiative, all the great education

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Speaker 2: work they do. I'm a big fan of it, glad

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Speaker 2: to see the First Light is supporting it. And today

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Speaker 2: I'm also hate to say this, but I am a

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Speaker 2: fan of my guest. Today. I'm a partner in crime. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know, it's kind of hard for the ego to

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Speaker 2: admit it, but I do enjoy catching up with you, buddy, well,

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Speaker 2: I appreciate it, man. I want to do a couple

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Speaker 2: of things today. It is February, kind of mid February

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Speaker 2: as we're chatting today, and so it's that time of

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Speaker 2: year that I think a lot of us are thinking

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Speaker 2: two things. We're thinking scouting and we're thinking shed on it.

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Speaker 2: So I want to kind of take a break here

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Speaker 2: during what was Habitat Month. I've been doing a series

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Speaker 2: of Habitat related podcasts, but I wanted to make sure

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Speaker 2: that we don't skip all the way through February without

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Speaker 2: talking about these two things. So we're gonna hit pause

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Speaker 2: on Habitat and we're going to talk about your latest

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Speaker 2: scouting exploits. A couple of things on my end related

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Speaker 2: to that. I want to talk shed hunting a little bit.

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Speaker 2: I've heard you know, you've got a mixed set of

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Speaker 2: opinions on shadhuting. It seems like you're writing about it,

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Speaker 2: you're talking about sometimes, but then other times like as

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Speaker 2: shed hunting sucks. So I want to see where you're

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Speaker 2: at on that lately. I've got some exciting shad hunting

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Speaker 2: news that we should talk about. And then I actually

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Speaker 2: also just got back from a mountain lion hunt that

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Speaker 2: might be worth talking about just a little bit, because

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Speaker 2: that's pretty exciting. So those are my main topics that

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Speaker 2: I thought we could touch on. But Tony, what is

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Speaker 2: what is new in your world? Is there anything lighten

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Speaker 2: me up right now? You know, any good sci fi books?

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Speaker 3: You know? The thing that's crazy for me right now

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Speaker 3: we're talking about this off air just a little bit,

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Speaker 3: is we don't have any snow. Yeah, I'm sitting here

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Speaker 3: in minute in central Minnesota. We have no snow. And

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Speaker 3: you know, I was out shed hunting with my daughter

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Speaker 3: this past weekend and we had to be pretty careful

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Speaker 3: about the ice we crossed, you know, even you know,

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Speaker 3: it wasn't anything major. But normally that is just such

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Speaker 3: not a consideration right now. I mean, normally we're worried

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Speaker 3: about too much snow covering up the antlers and being

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Speaker 3: kind of a pain to hike through. And it is

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Speaker 3: just weird right now. But I'll tell you, you know,

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Speaker 3: I know not everybody who's listening to this is in

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Speaker 3: this situation, but it's like the opportunity for shed hunting.

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Speaker 3: Like it's perfect shed hunting conditions, It's perfect winter scouting conditions.

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Speaker 3: And I'm I'm getting my stuff ready. I'm heading out

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Speaker 3: this weekend to go over to Wisconsin where they don't

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Speaker 3: have any snow either, to cut some trails and just

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Speaker 3: get some work done that normally I look at and

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Speaker 3: I go, I'm just I'm just waiting until sometime in

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Speaker 3: late March even or April sometimes to make that a possibility.

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Speaker 3: So it's kind of like it's just wild. I'm sitting

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Speaker 3: here going I'm getting stuff done, Like the opportunity is

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Speaker 3: just crazy. To be able to do this, I should say.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So the only downside I can well, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: maybe there are other downsides, but the one downside I

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Speaker 2: see to it is that I'm curious if you've seen this.

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Speaker 2: When we have mild winters, the shed hunting is different

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Speaker 2: than when we have hard winters, because it seems like

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Speaker 2: when we have a hard winter with a lot of snow,

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Speaker 2: it really hurts up the deer and you get a

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Speaker 2: lot of the deer concentrated into smaller areas where they

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Speaker 2: have that really good thermal cover, where they have that

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Speaker 2: really good food source for the late season, and those

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Speaker 2: are the times, those are the years where it seems

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Speaker 2: like we find a bunch of sheds like what I

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Speaker 2: take my annual trip to Iowa and the big winter years,

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Speaker 2: like you're finding them all in certain places, but these

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Speaker 2: years they're just spread out all over the place. There's

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Speaker 2: much less of a rhyme and reason to it. And

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Speaker 2: we struggle on years like this. Have you ever seen

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Speaker 2: anything like that?

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Speaker 3: For sure? And this year I think is going to be.

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Speaker 3: I haven't the only antlers I've seen while shed hunting

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Speaker 3: so far this year. We're still attached to deer. We

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Speaker 3: haven't found one yet, and we are finding on some

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Speaker 3: of the oak flats and like an incredible amount of

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Speaker 3: hard mass still left from last season. Yeah, which is

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Speaker 3: just you know, I mean it poortends good things for

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Speaker 3: the deer getting through the winner and the turkeys too.

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Speaker 3: The turkeys are all over them. But every time that happens,

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Speaker 3: or when I get into that situation, I'm like, they're

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Speaker 3: going to be so spread out because it's usually not

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Speaker 3: something that happens when there's two feet of snow, you know,

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Speaker 3: And so yeah, it's a different it's a different vibe

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Speaker 3: out there, but I'll still take it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So is there any like what's the ripple effects

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Speaker 2: of something like this when you have a mild winner,

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Speaker 2: and last year was like an extreme winner for a

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Speaker 2: lot of folks, and then this year we've got the

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Speaker 2: mild winner. You've got better mass, you've got less snow,

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Speaker 2: you've got more spread out deer populations. You would think

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Speaker 2: that all of this would lead to healthy fawn drop

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Speaker 2: in the spring, right, I mean, I don't think there's

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Speaker 2: a downside to this weather, specifically deer, right. I mean,

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Speaker 2: the only thing I can think about is like mild

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Speaker 2: winters equal more ticks making it through the winter, which

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Speaker 2: leads to problems for moose. I know, But is there

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Speaker 2: any other like trickle down effect that you can think

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Speaker 2: of of this kind of more I was gonna say unique,

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Speaker 2: it's becoming less unique, but.

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Speaker 3: I think the only thing that and I'm not smart

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Speaker 3: enough to actually know this, but I think the one

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Speaker 3: thing that you would see would be hot spots of

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Speaker 3: drought from it, just just because start it feels like

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Speaker 3: you're starting out pretty low moisture wise, and I know

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Speaker 3: some some areas are getting just hammered with snow so

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Speaker 3: they're not experiencing it, but it's not it doesn't feel

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Speaker 3: like an equal distribution, and so I don't know if

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Speaker 3: there will be something, you know, I mean, if this,

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Speaker 3: if this means that it's going to be a lot

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Speaker 3: drier in the spring and that will have some effects.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, the other one for sure is ticks. I mean,

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Speaker 3: I've got a buddy who is out shed hunting just

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Speaker 3: recently and he has he has a couple of Golden

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Speaker 3: retrievers and he's like, I'm finding deer ticks on my

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Speaker 3: golden retrievers in February.

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Speaker 2: Yikes.

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Speaker 3: Which is you know, I don't know if you've ever

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Speaker 3: like interviewed a TIC specialist. I did one time for

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Speaker 3: my Old Dog podcast, and it was like pure nightmare fuel,

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Speaker 3: Like the direction we're going with ticks and because not

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Speaker 3: only just you know, resident like native ticks that we have,

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Speaker 3: but also invasives like the Lone Star tick and some

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Speaker 3: of that stuff, or not the Lone Star there's a

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Speaker 3: different one I can't remember. Anyway, that future where the

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Speaker 3: winners get more mild, I think that's going to be

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Speaker 3: a rough one with tick borne diseases eventually. Man.

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Speaker 2: There we were just talking about how Steve was with

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Speaker 2: Rogan and Cam Haynes the other day on a podcast,

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Speaker 2: and then there were also some social media videos that

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Speaker 2: came out of that. Did you see the one where

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Speaker 2: Steve got convinced to throw a dead pig over his neck,

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Speaker 2: over his shoulders and carry it out, you know, the

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Speaker 2: way Cam always does. Yeah, I I just thought it

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Speaker 2: just crawling? How that thing all over you is the

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Speaker 2: first thing I thought.

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Speaker 3: Dude, I don't. I mean, it's probably it's probably not

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Speaker 3: as bad right now. I've shot a few pigs down

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Speaker 3: there on axis hunts in like May and June, and

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Speaker 3: you will walk up to them and it looks like

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Speaker 3: their skin is crawling. And so yeah, that's what I

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Speaker 3: thought of too. I mean, you if you throw a

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Speaker 3: turkey over your shoulder and carry it out in you know,

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Speaker 3: late late April or in May, I mean, it's a

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Speaker 3: lot of times you get a couple of ticks on

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Speaker 3: you from that. And when I saw him doing that,

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Speaker 3: I was like, gross, dude, Like you don't need to

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Speaker 3: What do you got left to prove? Like you don't

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Speaker 3: need to do that?

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Speaker 2: No, thank you, I'm not. I'm not. I'm not interested

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Speaker 2: in ticks like that. So so back to the shed thing.

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Speaker 2: Where do you personally stand on shed hunting these days?

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Speaker 2: I've seen you talk about it a lot and then

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Speaker 2: I've seen you talk about I don't do it anymore,

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Speaker 2: but you just went with your dog.

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Speaker 3: I don't. I don't know where you've heard me say that,

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Speaker 3: because I've I still shed hunt. I like shed hunting.

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Speaker 2: I just I feel like I feel like I've either

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Speaker 2: heard or read something from me in the past saying like,

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Speaker 2: you don't do it any much anymore, it's not that important.

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Speaker 3: I don't do it as much as I used to

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Speaker 3: just because of our schedule and and I don't have

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Speaker 3: as many spots as I used to. It's a it's

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Speaker 3: a little bit of a heavier lift for me. But

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Speaker 3: I probably what I said or wrote was something to

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Speaker 3: the effect of it used to be like a pretty

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Speaker 3: core component of my dear strategy. Like I spent a

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Speaker 3: lot of time shed hunting places that I'm going to hunt,

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Speaker 3: and it was kind of important to me to get

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Speaker 3: out there and really cover ground and try to find

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Speaker 3: some antlers. I'm kind of more in a stage now

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Speaker 3: where I'm like, I just enjoy it and honestly, what's

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Speaker 3: crazy about it? In fact, I wrote about it. I

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Speaker 3: think it I think it dropped today for foundations. But

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Speaker 3: we've been shed hunting some public land up here in

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Speaker 3: the cities, and the way that you know, not having

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Speaker 3: any snow this year, so the way that we're kind

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Speaker 3: a covering ground. It's like it's like sometimes you're out

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Speaker 3: there and you have this epiphany, right like you're like,

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Speaker 3: I've I've been through the woods a billion times and

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Speaker 3: something will occur to me like this is so important

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Speaker 3: and seeing the woods the way we're seeing it right now,

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Speaker 3: I'm looking at edges, like soft edges in the woods,

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Speaker 3: you know, the difference between a meadow and or you know,

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Speaker 3: a patch of dogwood and hardwoods or something like that.

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Speaker 3: And I'm just like it's almost like you can stand

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Speaker 3: in a deer bed now or like an area where

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Speaker 3: they might bed and look around you and see the

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Speaker 3: rubs because of like everything's just like a little brighter

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Speaker 3: out there right now, and really read deer travel and

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Speaker 3: deer movement and you know, like almost call your shots

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Speaker 3: on scrape lines and rub lines and it's so cool

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Speaker 3: and so in some ways, you know, people go shed

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Speaker 3: hunting and they're like, Okay, my focus is to find antlers, right,

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Speaker 3: Like that's that's why you're there. But sometimes when you're

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Speaker 3: doing this stuff and you just stop and think about it, like, Okay,

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Speaker 3: there's a rub there, big deal, Right, Well, there's an

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Speaker 3: rub there, and there's another rub there, and then I

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Speaker 3: can look up in the hill and I can see

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Speaker 3: that pine trees tore up. It's just it's even if

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Speaker 3: you're not in some place that you can hunt, the

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Speaker 3: lessons are like real important.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, do you I sometimes try to force it's hard

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Speaker 2: to do this, it's it's not even realistic to really

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Speaker 2: do this, but I sometimes try to force myself to

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Speaker 2: either do one or the other thing, because I know

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Speaker 2: if I go out into the woods and if I'm

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Speaker 2: trying to scout and shed hunt at the same time,

225
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Speaker 2: I inevitably miss you know, I miss stuff because you can't,

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Speaker 2: like you can't go out there shed hunting and then

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Speaker 2: constantly be looking around for sign and then like you're

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Speaker 2: gonna miss stuff, and the same vice versa. If you're

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Speaker 2: out there scouting but then you're also trying to look

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Speaker 2: for sheds, you're not paying attention to everything that you

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Speaker 2: should be paying attention to when scouting. So sometimes I

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Speaker 2: try to tell myself, Okay, just focus on the one thing,

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Speaker 2: Like today is a scouting day, and that's all you're doing,

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Speaker 2: maybe you get lucky and vice versa. But at the

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Speaker 2: same time, it's very hard to like turn off your

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Speaker 2: eyes to everything, so you're gonna always do a lot

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Speaker 2: with it both. But I had a similar situation happened

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Speaker 2: to me when I was out shed hunting yesterday and

239
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Speaker 2: I was I was trying to shed hunt. My main

240
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Speaker 2: focus was shed hunting, but I ended up, you know,

241
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Speaker 2: seeing something that caught my eye that made it a

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Speaker 2: very valuable scouting session. And what this was was, you know,

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Speaker 2: I've been in this area a million times before, scouted

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Speaker 2: it many times before, but I caught a little feature that,

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Speaker 2: for some reason on this particularly day popped out differently

246
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Speaker 2: than it has in the past. And I think it

247
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Speaker 2: was because it was very wet on this particular day

248
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Speaker 2: or this time of year here. And so what used

249
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Speaker 2: to be usually just a big grassy field that's got

250
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Speaker 2: tall grass and it seems like relatively flat and you

251
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Speaker 2: know it's just a big open grassy field, Well right

252
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Speaker 2: now it's very wet, and so you can actually see

253
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Speaker 2: two sides of this grassy field were filled with water

254
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Speaker 2: more than they usually are. And we're lower and so

255
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Speaker 2: this little not very high, but there's like a high

256
00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:05,319
Speaker 2: piece that connect that goes right across the middle of

257
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Speaker 2: this grassy field that's maybe a foot taller than everything else,

258
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Speaker 2: And so right now it stands out like a land

259
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Speaker 2: bridge that almost all the other times you never really

260
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Speaker 2: notice it. But right now I'm like, whoa, this is

261
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Speaker 2: the place that they're always going to want to cross

262
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Speaker 2: this big grassy field. If they're going to go across

263
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Speaker 2: this grassy field to connect from one side of the

264
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Speaker 2: brush to another, to cross from one bedding air to

265
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Speaker 2: the other, this is probably the place that they always

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Speaker 2: do it. And I've always I've had some assumptions about

267
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Speaker 2: how they move around, but I don't think I ever

268
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Speaker 2: saw so clearly as if somebody drew a line across

269
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Speaker 2: the map, like from A to B, here's the spot

270
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Speaker 2: within the spot. If you're gonna hunt somewhere on this edge,

271
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Speaker 2: that is the place to be, because there's this little

272
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Speaker 2: little bit of high ground that I bet you they run.

273
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Speaker 2: And I follow that high ground to where it hits

274
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Speaker 2: the timber, and bam, that just happens to be a

275
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Speaker 2: place that I marked last year when I bumpd a

276
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Speaker 2: buck from a bed there. It's like, oh, interesting, this

277
00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:04,240
Speaker 2: little point that he was betted on is also connected

278
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Speaker 2: to this slightly higher ground that crosses the grassy breast

279
00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:10,360
Speaker 2: you feel, and also has like six big old rubs

280
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Speaker 2: scattered all around it that I'd seen in the past,

281
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Speaker 2: But now like the dots are connecting better and like

282
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Speaker 2: the picture is coming into better focus. And so I

283
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Speaker 2: think that just reminded me of what I think is

284
00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:25,320
Speaker 2: a pretty good thing to write down and try to

285
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Speaker 2: remind yourself of. You can never scout the same place

286
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Speaker 2: too much, Like I think it's always worth even a

287
00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:36,480
Speaker 2: place you've hunted for years, it's worth coming back and

288
00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:38,960
Speaker 2: hitting it again, and like trying to look at with

289
00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:41,600
Speaker 2: new eyes. Like whenever I'm walking this list, I'm always

290
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Speaker 2: trying to zoom out or zoom in, look at it differently,

291
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Speaker 2: focus on something differently, Take what you learn last year

292
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Speaker 2: and apply it now as you're looking again. It just

293
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Speaker 2: seems like every time I do that, I keep on

294
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Speaker 2: learning something new, as long as I'm not just like

295
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Speaker 2: blindly walking just to walk. If I'm like looking with

296
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Speaker 2: intense these repeat scouting trips every single year, keep on

297
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Speaker 2: adding some real value, you know, I don't. I don't

298
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Speaker 2: think you can ever do it too much, as long

299
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Speaker 2: as you go into it like Okay, what can I

300
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Speaker 2: learn different this time?

301
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Speaker 3: Yeah? Well, and you know what happens there too, is

302
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Speaker 3: if you have like a private place you hunt a

303
00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:24,480
Speaker 3: lot at least Grandma's land whatever, it's so easy to

304
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Speaker 3: sort of condition yourself to think that the things don't change,

305
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Speaker 3: like deer movement doesn't change, you know. I mean we

306
00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:33,800
Speaker 3: were clued into you know, crop rotation and mast whatever,

307
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Speaker 3: but it's so easy to sort of default back to

308
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Speaker 3: like the big movement, you know, the rough movement whatever,

309
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Speaker 3: it's kind of consistent from year to year to year

310
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Speaker 3: to year, and it's just doesn't work that way. And

311
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Speaker 3: you know, I mean, there are there are ways to

312
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Speaker 3: you know, cheat the system, right, Like if you have

313
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Speaker 3: like just a banging you know, terrain trap, some kind

314
00:15:53,840 --> 00:15:56,320
Speaker 3: of funnel or something, you might kill a buck on

315
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Speaker 3: there ten years in a row. Like I'm not saying

316
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Speaker 3: you can't, but this kind of stuff that you're talking

317
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Speaker 3: about sometimes some of that stuff either just pops out

318
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Speaker 3: to you when you're scouting, or sometimes it's like a

319
00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:10,000
Speaker 3: realization that you've been thinking, Okay, the deer always do

320
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Speaker 3: this year to year to year on grandma's farm, So

321
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Speaker 3: I don't need to go look at that, like, I

322
00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:16,880
Speaker 3: don't need to walk through that acre. When I can,

323
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Speaker 3: I can walk the easy path. And there's so much

324
00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:22,240
Speaker 3: out there that we miss, like you're talking about. It's

325
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Speaker 3: just it's so easy to overlook and just just breeze

326
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Speaker 3: past things like that, and it's when you find them,

327
00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:33,080
Speaker 3: it's like, okay, like what else? What else are you missing?

328
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Speaker 2: And it's seeming like those little things, like when you

329
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:39,080
Speaker 2: are learning a brand new property, it's the big picture

330
00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:40,920
Speaker 2: stuff that matters the most, right just to get you

331
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Speaker 2: in the ballgame. So you're scouting for what's this big

332
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:45,240
Speaker 2: feature and how's this big feature? But when you know

333
00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:48,880
Speaker 2: a place really well, now, it's about the tiny tweaks.

334
00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:51,800
Speaker 2: It's the what's the fifteen yard move that I can

335
00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:54,480
Speaker 2: make that would take my shots from a forty yard

336
00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:57,320
Speaker 2: shot to a twenty five yard shot, Or it's the

337
00:16:57,720 --> 00:17:00,000
Speaker 2: you know, man, I've hunted this area a thousand times.

338
00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:03,200
Speaker 2: It's always been pretty good, but I tend to get

339
00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:05,480
Speaker 2: winded more often than I want. Or what's like the

340
00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:08,160
Speaker 2: little shift I can make or what's the tendency that man?

341
00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:10,800
Speaker 2: They they actually when they come through here they pass

342
00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:13,120
Speaker 2: on this side of the downtree six times out of ten,

343
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Speaker 2: So really I should tweak my setup five yards this

344
00:17:15,920 --> 00:17:19,600
Speaker 2: way or whatever. I think, like that's the stuff that

345
00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:22,920
Speaker 2: can really really help you when you're at that point.

346
00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:25,639
Speaker 2: But it only it only happens when you keep on

347
00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:29,080
Speaker 2: trying to polish that gemstone. I guess you just keep

348
00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:30,720
Speaker 2: on keeping all with it.

349
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Speaker 3: It's just it's time in the woods, man. I mean,

350
00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:35,520
Speaker 3: I had I had something like that happened to me.

351
00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:38,560
Speaker 3: I guess probably about three years ago. I was squirrel

352
00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:40,720
Speaker 3: hunting with a buddy of mine on a farm that

353
00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:43,000
Speaker 3: I've hunted since I was fifteen years old. I mean

354
00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:46,000
Speaker 3: I've been I've been everywhere in there, you know, a

355
00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:49,320
Speaker 3: million times. And I had run a camera. I had

356
00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:52,720
Speaker 3: left a camera on this ridgetop kind of this splayed

357
00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:54,720
Speaker 3: out ridgetop where they bet a lot. It's sort of

358
00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:56,560
Speaker 3: just like a travel hub. They can come in from

359
00:17:56,600 --> 00:18:00,720
Speaker 3: a bunch of different directions and you know, throughout the

360
00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:05,439
Speaker 3: pre rud, the rut, the travel was just chaotic, like

361
00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:07,200
Speaker 3: you know, a buck go this way, a buck you know,

362
00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:10,280
Speaker 3: way off, and frame buck comes through this way, like

363
00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:13,439
Speaker 3: no real rhyme or reason to the travel and I

364
00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:15,240
Speaker 3: remember just looking at it going like that was like

365
00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:17,399
Speaker 3: a it was like a circus in there, you know.

366
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,200
Speaker 3: I mean, obviously it's condensed because you're looking at the

367
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:22,720
Speaker 3: trail camera photos from lots of time, but I kind

368
00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:25,200
Speaker 3: of had forgotten about it. And then I went squirrel

369
00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,240
Speaker 3: hunting with my buddy and it was there's snow on

370
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:31,680
Speaker 3: the ground whatever, and there's this ravine right below that knob,

371
00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:34,239
Speaker 3: and I've hunted on the bottom of it where they

372
00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:36,760
Speaker 3: go around where it flattens out, and I've hunted the

373
00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:38,640
Speaker 3: top of it where it pinches up on the edge

374
00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:41,520
Speaker 3: of the of a field and it forces them around.

375
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:45,679
Speaker 3: I mean, for sure, dozens of times in my life,

376
00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:49,119
Speaker 3: maybe you know, maybe more right. And because I was

377
00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:51,960
Speaker 3: squirrel hunting and not really paying attention to the deer thing,

378
00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:55,479
Speaker 3: we cut down right in the middle of that ravine

379
00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:58,800
Speaker 3: and there was just a nice trail going through one

380
00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:00,960
Speaker 3: little spot like you're talking about, where there was like

381
00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:04,600
Speaker 3: a like somebody made a land bridge there. And I

382
00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:09,679
Speaker 3: have walked around that over and under so many times

383
00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:12,800
Speaker 3: in my life hunting everything, not just deer, not just scouting,

384
00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:16,399
Speaker 3: and even with that trail camera up there and looking

385
00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:18,720
Speaker 3: at the evidence that there were deer coming up, Like

386
00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:20,560
Speaker 3: it clicked as soon as I saw it. I was like,

387
00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:25,320
Speaker 3: oh my god, Like I totally missed this huge crossing

388
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,080
Speaker 3: right here. And so I came back there and hunted,

389
00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,800
Speaker 3: walked in there during the rut November first second whatever,

390
00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:34,399
Speaker 3: and hung a stand there. There was only one really

391
00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,000
Speaker 3: decent tree to set up, so it wasn't a great

392
00:19:37,119 --> 00:19:39,400
Speaker 3: set up there, but it was okay. And I mean

393
00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:42,240
Speaker 3: I got up into that stand or saddle or whatever

394
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:44,479
Speaker 3: I was doing, I don't remember, and the first thing

395
00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:45,919
Speaker 3: I did is I looked up on the hill and

396
00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:48,040
Speaker 3: there was a little buck coming down and he crossed

397
00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:51,280
Speaker 3: right through there, you know. I mean, just like just

398
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,199
Speaker 3: I didn't kill one on there, but I had a

399
00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:55,360
Speaker 3: couple deer come through there. And it's one of those

400
00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:58,080
Speaker 3: things you're talking about where it's like it's so easy

401
00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:00,639
Speaker 3: to convince yourself that you've got it figured out, and

402
00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:01,400
Speaker 3: you probably don't.

403
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:15,800
Speaker 2: Other than returning and like continuing to get that time

404
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,280
Speaker 2: in the woods, Like what have you done in recent

405
00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:23,280
Speaker 2: years that's helped you better see this stuff or makes

406
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:25,159
Speaker 2: sense of this stuff? Like you talk about scouting all

407
00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:28,960
Speaker 2: the time, but in the last five years, What have

408
00:20:29,119 --> 00:20:31,760
Speaker 2: you found has made your scouting more effective?

409
00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,439
Speaker 3: Just find an excuse to get out there. And so,

410
00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:38,760
Speaker 3: like that was a squirrel hunt, right, I'm carrying my

411
00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:41,359
Speaker 3: seventeen around my buddy. We're shooting a few squirrels, Like,

412
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:45,399
Speaker 3: clearly not a shed hunt, not a winter scouting mission.

413
00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:50,320
Speaker 3: I'm probably gonna head down or head over to western

414
00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:54,520
Speaker 3: Minnesota here before February's out and go rabbit hunt some

415
00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:57,480
Speaker 3: of that stuff that I muzzleloader hunted for white tails

416
00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:00,800
Speaker 3: this year on that public land because it'll be fun.

417
00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:03,280
Speaker 3: It's just fun to hunt rabbits, and it's gonna take

418
00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:06,159
Speaker 3: me into that area that I want to just learn more.

419
00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:08,720
Speaker 3: And it's hard. It's hard for me to justify a

420
00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:10,920
Speaker 3: three and a half four hour drive, you know, maybe

421
00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:12,920
Speaker 3: for a day or a day and a half of scouting,

422
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:15,199
Speaker 3: I could do it. But it's so much easier for

423
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:16,639
Speaker 3: me to think I'm gonna meet up with a buddy

424
00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:18,960
Speaker 3: of mine, We're gonna go push a few rabbits around,

425
00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:21,800
Speaker 3: which will get us into the stuff the deer bed in.

426
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:22,600
Speaker 2: Right.

427
00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:27,320
Speaker 3: And it's just any reason, any any way that you

428
00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,359
Speaker 3: can find to get out there, because I think I

429
00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:32,640
Speaker 3: think we paint this message or like we we portray

430
00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:38,200
Speaker 3: this message that you have to be so singularly focused, right,

431
00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:40,280
Speaker 3: Like a lot of a lot of the voices in

432
00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:42,639
Speaker 3: the industry for a long time have pushed that, like

433
00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 3: you know, I mean it's sort of like a Cameron

434
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:48,000
Speaker 3: Haynes thing, right, Like his message is sort of one

435
00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:51,600
Speaker 3: lane and you should do this right, And we've done

436
00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,440
Speaker 3: that with white tail scouting. But I don't think a

437
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,160
Speaker 3: lot of people have it in them to just go

438
00:21:57,359 --> 00:21:58,840
Speaker 3: and go, you know, like a lot of people aren't

439
00:21:58,840 --> 00:22:01,879
Speaker 3: worried like Ani may they're not gonna do it. But

440
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,000
Speaker 3: if you can find a reason to be there, or

441
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:07,560
Speaker 3: find a reason to go someplace new and just just

442
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:10,200
Speaker 3: spend time out there, I think that's what we're missing

443
00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:12,439
Speaker 3: with a lot of white tel hunters because and I

444
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:15,000
Speaker 3: know this happens to you all the time. It's like

445
00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:18,840
Speaker 3: once the season starts, you get all these messages of

446
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:22,840
Speaker 3: like here's my farm, I saw him one time, or

447
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:25,679
Speaker 3: I can't like I never see mature bucks or whatever,

448
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:28,320
Speaker 3: and it's like, this is not the time to remedy that.

449
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:31,520
Speaker 3: Like the time to do it was eight months ago,

450
00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:34,200
Speaker 3: so you didn't come into the season and going, well,

451
00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,840
Speaker 3: Now I gotta rattle or buy this decoy or something,

452
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:39,480
Speaker 3: try to make something happen instead of putting myself right

453
00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:42,760
Speaker 3: where I should have been. So it's it's it's a

454
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:45,120
Speaker 3: hard thing to get across, but it's important.

455
00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:49,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, you make a good point though, Like in this

456
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:53,920
Speaker 2: this is like a rule that applies to like any

457
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,480
Speaker 2: kind of good habit. Like there's a book I read

458
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,760
Speaker 2: called Atomic Habits. You ever read that? One very good

459
00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:03,359
Speaker 2: book by James Clear. I should have pulled it off

460
00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:04,760
Speaker 2: the shelf and had it with me right now. But

461
00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:08,439
Speaker 2: there's a couple different kind of frame, a framework of

462
00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:12,119
Speaker 2: guidelines that will help you either break a bad habit

463
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:15,359
Speaker 2: or add a new one. And if we want to

464
00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:18,800
Speaker 2: look at scouting as a good habit to ensure the

465
00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 2: things you need to do, I'm probably gonna forget some

466
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:23,640
Speaker 2: of this, but one of the big ones is you should.

467
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,200
Speaker 2: You got to make it convenient, you need to make

468
00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:30,680
Speaker 2: it fun. And I think in this case, like scouting

469
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:32,359
Speaker 2: is a thing that should be a good habit, right,

470
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:34,160
Speaker 2: it should be a habit for us, But there's always

471
00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 2: excuses not to do it right. We don't have enough time,

472
00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,720
Speaker 2: Maybe people don't know it's not as enjoyable as watching

473
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 2: the Super Bowl, and it's maybe not as fun as

474
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:44,600
Speaker 2: you know, I don't know whatever going to a game

475
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 2: or drinking beer at the house or whatever your thing is.

476
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:50,399
Speaker 2: So I think you gotta find ways to your point. Like, yeah,

477
00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:53,959
Speaker 2: a scouting trip slash rabbit trip slash hand with your

478
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:58,040
Speaker 2: buddy may not be quite as effective as a one

479
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:01,360
Speaker 2: just me focused on scouting walking for two days straight, right,

480
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,760
Speaker 2: But you probably won't do that. So the better version

481
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 2: is find a way to make it fun, find a

482
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 2: way to make it fit your schedule, and getting out

483
00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:13,119
Speaker 2: there doing the thing to a degree is better than

484
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:16,320
Speaker 2: not entirely. So I think that's a really it's a

485
00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:19,240
Speaker 2: really good idea, Like, find ways to make this part

486
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:22,280
Speaker 2: of your life, find ways to make it fun and

487
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:24,679
Speaker 2: and then yet you're going to get value out of it.

488
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 2: You don't have to do this is so much that

489
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:30,159
Speaker 2: we talk about. There's like the perfect way to do

490
00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:32,440
Speaker 2: something in the deer hunting world. There's like the way

491
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:38,560
Speaker 2: that the super most hardcore person does it, and that's,

492
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 2: you know, something we can aspire to. But most of

493
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:44,280
Speaker 2: us will look at that and be like, well, I

494
00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:46,520
Speaker 2: don't have time for that or I that doesn't really

495
00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 2: sound that much fun. If you can find the thing

496
00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:51,880
Speaker 2: that is fun, that is that can work into your schedule,

497
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:55,760
Speaker 2: that you can consistently do, you'll make progress. And making

498
00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:58,359
Speaker 2: progress that happens year after year after year, that you

499
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 2: can keep with, that you can stick to. That adds up.

500
00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:05,800
Speaker 2: I'm betting a lot of people see a thing and like, oh,

501
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 2: that's that's that's more than I could ever pull off,

502
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:09,399
Speaker 2: and then they never do anything because of that. It

503
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:14,360
Speaker 2: becomes intimidating just getting the ball rolling? Can you can

504
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 2: make a pretty big smoll ball if you start with

505
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,040
Speaker 2: something tiny and keep it going down the hill.

506
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:21,159
Speaker 3: You know, well, right, and there there's something too that

507
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:22,359
Speaker 3: I want to say on that, because you make a

508
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:24,760
Speaker 3: good point. One thing that I see a lot of

509
00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:27,040
Speaker 3: people do, and this is this isn't just like scouting

510
00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 3: or deer hunting. This is you know, at the gym,

511
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 3: whatever is, they rely too heavily on other people to

512
00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:37,280
Speaker 3: be a part of it. And so you know how

513
00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:39,040
Speaker 3: it is like you're training for a marathon and you're

514
00:25:39,119 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 3: running or whatever, like you know, you like running with

515
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:44,560
Speaker 3: people great or you like getting together with that running

516
00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:47,719
Speaker 3: group grade or whatever, but really it's on you. And

517
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,160
Speaker 3: so you see, you know, like just as an example,

518
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:53,840
Speaker 3: it's it's the new year, right, so you go to

519
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:57,080
Speaker 3: the gym, a lot of new faces, and a lot

520
00:25:57,119 --> 00:26:00,080
Speaker 3: of them are people who go with somebody. So some

521
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 3: some gym regular will talk one of their buddies and like, dude,

522
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 3: you got to come. And so they're there together lifting

523
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 3: every time you see them. But what happens when that

524
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 3: one person can't go? Do you have your built an excuse?

525
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 3: You know? And I think I think we don't. I

526
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 3: think this happens more than we think where people are like, Okay,

527
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 3: he's my hunting buddy. If he can go this weekend,

528
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,359
Speaker 3: we'll go. If not, no big deal, And it's like

529
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:26,000
Speaker 3: you have to just kind of figure out how to

530
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 3: do both, right, Like it's great if you have somebody

531
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 3: who will go winter scout with you, that you hunt

532
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,920
Speaker 3: with or whatever, but this is this stuff is sort

533
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:34,959
Speaker 3: of on you. And you can see this, you know,

534
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 3: like that example that I said earlier about people reaching

535
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:39,560
Speaker 3: out like I don't know what to do. It's like

536
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,199
Speaker 3: it's not on me to help you, like i'd love to,

537
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:47,240
Speaker 3: but it's on you to figure this stuff out. And

538
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,199
Speaker 3: I think you know, you see this especially on like

539
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:53,200
Speaker 3: traveling trips where people are like, we're going to hunt

540
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:57,359
Speaker 3: white tails in North Dakota or wherever together, and it's like,

541
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:00,440
Speaker 3: I get why you do that with buddies, one hundred

542
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 3: percent do but you have to be willing to do

543
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,000
Speaker 3: this stuff on your own. Like you have to be

544
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:07,960
Speaker 3: willing to just go. If I have three hours today

545
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:10,879
Speaker 3: and it's a Sunday in February and there's nothing going on,

546
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:13,000
Speaker 3: I'm gonna go to the woods. I'm just gonna I'm

547
00:27:13,040 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 3: going to do it, and you will change. You will

548
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 3: change the dynamic of how you learn out there same thing,

549
00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:22,399
Speaker 3: you know, Like just think if you go on a

550
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:26,240
Speaker 3: you know, a hunting trip somewhere with somebody and you're

551
00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:29,120
Speaker 3: you're trying to figure out public land together, You're you're

552
00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 3: going to have some benefit from their their recon and there,

553
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,880
Speaker 3: but it's going to change how you approach everything. If

554
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,200
Speaker 3: you go by yourself and you're like, I'm camping by myself,

555
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:41,720
Speaker 3: I'm feeding myself, I'm scouting, I'm glassing, I'm hunting by myself,

556
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 3: everything changes. And I honestly think those are like those

557
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 3: are the scenarios that really help you level up because

558
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 3: a lot of the background noise is gone.

559
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:57,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, there's some truth that something you said reminded

560
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,199
Speaker 2: me of a little epiphany I had the other day too.

561
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 2: You know, it's easy just in like the chaos of

562
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:09,480
Speaker 2: the day too. You know, feel like I'm too busy

563
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,120
Speaker 2: to go outside and do my run, or I'm too

564
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 2: there's too much going on for me to go outside

565
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:19,080
Speaker 2: for an hour walk or a quick scouting trip or

566
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:22,640
Speaker 2: shed hunting exploit, or you know, I'm just not feeling it.

567
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 2: It's too cold out, it's too whatever. There's there's plenty

568
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:27,959
Speaker 2: of ways to make excuse. It's for for why you

569
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:29,920
Speaker 2: just want to hang out tonight and just watch TV

570
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:34,000
Speaker 2: or or whatever. The thing is, right, But we do

571
00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:37,480
Speaker 2: this thing every day at dinner time, where my wife

572
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:39,719
Speaker 2: and I and the kids all around the dinner tables,

573
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:42,560
Speaker 2: you know, beginning at dinner talk about our favorite thing

574
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,200
Speaker 2: of the day, like one thing you're thankful for from

575
00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 2: that day that was your favorite thing. And almost always,

576
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,080
Speaker 2: if I go and do something outside, if I go

577
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,160
Speaker 2: do one of these things like go for a shed hunt,

578
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 2: go for a walk, go for the run, do some scouting,

579
00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 2: that always makes the list that is always is my

580
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 2: favorite thing of the day. So even if beforehand, I'm

581
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 2: like I don't feel like doing it, I don't want

582
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:05,640
Speaker 2: to go out, it's too cold, or I'm too busy

583
00:29:05,720 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 2: or whatever, I'm always, always, always thankful I did it afterwards.

584
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 3: Yep.

585
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:14,520
Speaker 2: It's like, and if I didn't, if I didn't have

586
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 2: this like reflective process to go back and look at

587
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 2: that and think about it, you might forget that. You

588
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,240
Speaker 2: might you might lose sight of that. But I've never

589
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 2: once regretted taking that hour or two and going to

590
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,040
Speaker 2: the property for a walk, or taking the kids out

591
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,640
Speaker 2: for a shid hunt or doing the thing. It's always

592
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 2: worth it once you do it. So you just got

593
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,360
Speaker 2: to find a way that remind yourself of that in

594
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 2: the moment when you're feeling busy or stressed or tired

595
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 2: or whatever it is ahead of it.

596
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:41,360
Speaker 3: Do Don't you feel the same way when you go

597
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 3: for a run?

598
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:42,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure.

599
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 3: Isn't that like the like a prime example of something

600
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 3: that you dread every time and then you do it

601
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 3: and you always feel better because of it. Yeah.

602
00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:55,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, It's like you almost need like a sticky notice

603
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,880
Speaker 2: something that just reminds you ahead of time, so like,

604
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 2: don't be stupid. You know you'll be happy afterwards, like

605
00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:03,800
Speaker 2: something like that. I need that reminder everywhere I walk.

606
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:09,480
Speaker 3: But it's a conditioning thing though, I mean, it's you

607
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:12,400
Speaker 3: have to go through it to learn that, like you

608
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:14,240
Speaker 3: you have to you have to do it a lot

609
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 3: to go even though you know, everything between my ears

610
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 3: is like, don't freaking do it. You don't want to

611
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 3: do it. This is gonna suck. And that happens, Like

612
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:25,560
Speaker 3: that's that's the other thing, Like what you bring up

613
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 3: there is a good point that happens with scouting, that

614
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:30,400
Speaker 3: happens with the deer work. We talk ourselves out of

615
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 3: a lot of the stuff that not only should we

616
00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:36,240
Speaker 3: just do because it'll help us out, but because it

617
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,560
Speaker 3: will actually make us feel better, like getting something accomplished,

618
00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 3: going and find that little crossing like you found, it's

619
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 3: a huge win. Yeah, you know, and it's it's easy

620
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 3: to not go do that stuff.

621
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 2: Yeah. So, speaking of these little things, you had mentioned

622
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:55,400
Speaker 2: earlier that you'd been focusing on soft edges while scouting,

623
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:57,200
Speaker 2: and I wanted to make sure we took some time

624
00:30:57,240 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 2: to dive into that a little bit further. Can you

625
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 2: can you expand a little bit about what you mean

626
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 2: when we're talking soft edges, what you're looking for, how

627
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 2: that's going to fit into your scouting plane, because I

628
00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 2: think that's something that probably folks could pay attention to

629
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 2: a little bit more in their own scouting.

630
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 3: Man. It's it's something that just it might be because

631
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 3: I've been spending so much time in the cattails the

632
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:24,480
Speaker 3: last few years, and it becomes I don't know, maybe

633
00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 3: a bad way to put it, but when you wade

634
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:30,640
Speaker 3: into a cattail slough, a big cattail slow, you find

635
00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 3: these tiny little micro climates or these like little micro

636
00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 3: habitats where you're like, there's always pheasants here, there's always deer,

637
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 3: there's always rabbits. Like this is it's you can stand

638
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 3: there and look out. I'm gonna go There's gonna be

639
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,240
Speaker 3: rubs there. There's gonna be rubs there. There's probably gonna

640
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 3: be a trail going from that point to that point.

641
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,480
Speaker 3: And so the more that I go out and I

642
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 3: start looking around, I'm like, I'm always thinking about things

643
00:31:57,320 --> 00:32:00,240
Speaker 3: too big, you know, like the cornfield's over there, they're

644
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:02,480
Speaker 3: going to end up there, right, Like the bluff is

645
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:04,479
Speaker 3: up there, they're going to start there because they're going

646
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 3: to bed or whatever. But you know how this is

647
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 3: when you get out there and you watch deer do

648
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 3: their thing, they are relating to stuff that we just

649
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 3: walk right on by. And so often, you know, I

650
00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:19,680
Speaker 3: really saw this when I was muzzler hunting this year,

651
00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 3: where there'd be patches of willows or patches of red

652
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:27,360
Speaker 3: osier dogwood where you would you would, like kind of

653
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:30,240
Speaker 3: intuitive intuitively look at those and go, Okay, they're gonna

654
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 3: walk around that, maybe rub on the outside. If they

655
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 3: want to bed, they'll wait in there. But what I

656
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 3: would see the deer do, and you see this out

657
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 3: west when you watch them a lot too, is they

658
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 3: would get in there and they would be browsing and

659
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,480
Speaker 3: looking around and paying attention, like they knew where the

660
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:50,360
Speaker 3: other deer were, but they were essentially invisible to everything else.

661
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:52,959
Speaker 3: And so they have these little places where it's like,

662
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 3: you know, I can walk through this grass, the crp

663
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 3: grass to get to the next point or get into

664
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,520
Speaker 3: the cattails, but they're just stopping off in there, into

665
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:03,960
Speaker 3: this little patch of dogwood, and they're killing time and

666
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:05,920
Speaker 3: they're doing their thing, and you watch it and go

667
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 3: this is like, this is like such a key component

668
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:12,360
Speaker 3: to their life. It's not just cover they walk past

669
00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 3: and leave rubs and like they know that little island

670
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 3: to cover, there is something they can hide in. They're

671
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:20,800
Speaker 3: not gonna like nothing's gonna sneak up on him quickly,

672
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 3: and they're they're really paying attention to the world around them.

673
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 3: And so it always makes me think, like we used

674
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 3: to have this neighbor. He died in a motorcycle accident.

675
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:34,040
Speaker 3: But when my little girls were little, they they loved

676
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,360
Speaker 3: him and he loved them, and so we would walk

677
00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:38,480
Speaker 3: around the block and he would He was one of

678
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 3: those guys who would drink a lot of beer in

679
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 3: his garage, you know, so in the summer you'd walk

680
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:47,000
Speaker 3: by and you never knew if he was in there

681
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,200
Speaker 3: because the sun's shine and bright and he's sitting in

682
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 3: the back of his garage. But you'd always be like,

683
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:53,200
Speaker 3: is Fred gonna like talk to us, like is he

684
00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 3: is he in there? But from him, from inside, he's

685
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 3: looking out and he sees you playing a day when

686
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 3: you're on the street looking at just because of the sun.

687
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 3: Same concept as a hunting blind, right, like a pop

688
00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 3: up blind. And I always think about that with these

689
00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 3: soft edges where I go, Yeah, that nice deciduous forest

690
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:11,960
Speaker 3: over there that everybody wants to hunt in because it

691
00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 3: looks pretty. But those deer can stand in this brush

692
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:19,479
Speaker 3: edge here where the meadow meets that you know, old

693
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 3: growth forest, and they're not invisible, but man, they're a

694
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:28,000
Speaker 3: lot closer than they would be in other types of habitats.

695
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 3: And I think that that's like, the more I'm around it,

696
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:32,760
Speaker 3: and the more I winter scout and find these little

697
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 3: tiny islands a cover or these little soft edges, I go,

698
00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:38,440
Speaker 3: this is so much more important to them than I

699
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:40,720
Speaker 3: give it credit for. Am I kind of looking past

700
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:42,760
Speaker 3: this for something bigger and more obvious?

701
00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:49,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I've noticed also bucks specifically utilizing some

702
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:52,360
Speaker 2: of those things more often than I used to realize

703
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:55,959
Speaker 2: in the past, Like an overlooked piece like this place

704
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:58,680
Speaker 2: I was just talking about earlier today, like this brushy

705
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 2: field than the past I kind of thought was, you know,

706
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 2: it's tall grass, but relatively blank inside that tall grass,

707
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 2: and then there's this little tiny point with a little

708
00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:15,920
Speaker 2: bit of brush on it, and you could so easily

709
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 2: overlook that, and it's not like deep, deep, deep in

710
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 2: the cover right, It's not like the deepest, darkest swamp.

711
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,520
Speaker 2: It's not the thickest, nastiest, farlest away from the road

712
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:27,640
Speaker 2: kind of place. It's kind of out there a little bit,

713
00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:31,400
Speaker 2: but it gives a buck a lot of advantages and

714
00:35:31,480 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 2: that he's got cover, and then he's got thick security

715
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,879
Speaker 2: cover behind him, he can see in another direction. It's

716
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:42,400
Speaker 2: in a zone that actually a couple different routes of

717
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 2: human travel passed within that with not right there, but

718
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:49,560
Speaker 2: within sight or smell. Like one of my main access

719
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:53,400
Speaker 2: routes into this property that I hunt goes relatively, it

720
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:56,400
Speaker 2: goes within sight of that. Probably one of the neighbor's

721
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 2: main access roads goes within sight of that. So a

722
00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 2: buck can sit in this place, bedded and get a

723
00:36:02,600 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 2: very good idea of what's happening around him, despite the

724
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:08,879
Speaker 2: fact that not being like the hell whole, it's it's

725
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 2: a it's a small soft edge and point that positions him. Well,

726
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:17,759
Speaker 2: I think that they use that stuff sometimes more than

727
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 2: we give them credit for.

728
00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:21,799
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, think about this, how often do you

729
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:25,920
Speaker 3: walk through some kind of grassy spot out there wherever

730
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,600
Speaker 3: and you're not like there's bucks around. I mean, it's

731
00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:32,320
Speaker 3: the same thing. You know, I wrote about this this week,

732
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:37,239
Speaker 3: Like when I'm out shed hunting and I'm I'm not

733
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 3: fighting thorns, I typically don't find antlers. Yeah, you know

734
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:44,440
Speaker 3: what I mean. Because if you're it's different. You know,

735
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 3: if you're on a nice private place or something like

736
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:48,160
Speaker 3: you it's it's a kind of a different scenario. But

737
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:50,200
Speaker 3: if you're and this this kind of equates to like

738
00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,759
Speaker 3: just public land hunting or pressured hunting. If you're not

739
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 3: somewhere where you're getting like poked a lot by prickly

740
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:00,640
Speaker 3: ash or you know, raspberry vines or something, you're kind

741
00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:03,799
Speaker 3: of out of the game for where they really want

742
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,759
Speaker 3: to be. And like you said, like that point, you

743
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 3: see this this amplified if you hunt a state like

744
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:13,799
Speaker 3: Iowa that has just like dreamy woods, you know, like

745
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:17,360
Speaker 3: dreamy cover and ice fields and everything where there aren't

746
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:22,680
Speaker 3: as many patches of gnarly you know, thick type of cover.

747
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:25,839
Speaker 3: So when you find that, you know who owns it,

748
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:29,080
Speaker 3: like it's not going to be a scrapper, and some does,

749
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:31,759
Speaker 3: like they're going to be bedded on that bench on

750
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:34,680
Speaker 3: the open bluff side or whatever. When you walk in there,

751
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 3: you know there's going to be somebody big who has

752
00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:40,279
Speaker 3: taken that over because the advance, the survival advantage is

753
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:41,239
Speaker 3: so real there.

754
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:48,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, So so talk a little bit more about

755
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 2: how you're spotting this stuff or what what you're looking for. So,

756
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 2: if you're walking through the woods and you're focusing on

757
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:58,399
Speaker 2: soft edges, I guess what I'm getting at is here,

758
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:01,040
Speaker 2: give me some more examples so people know how to

759
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:03,879
Speaker 2: identify this kind of thing. And and so we've talked

760
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 2: about the fact that deer will pull up on this

761
00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 2: kind of edge. I think there. I don't think you've

762
00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 2: mentioned it. But there's a lot of travel that happens

763
00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:15,399
Speaker 2: along these soft edges that aren't as stark as here's

764
00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:18,120
Speaker 2: a cornfield, here's a piece of timber. Right, we're talking

765
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:24,279
Speaker 2: more like this is a mostly hardwood region and this

766
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:27,359
Speaker 2: is the beginning of hardwood mixed with conifer something like that.

767
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:30,239
Speaker 2: Can you talk through you know, the kind of thing

768
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:33,359
Speaker 2: you're looking for and how you're seeing music otherwise.

769
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:36,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean an easy way to do it, at

770
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:39,160
Speaker 3: least in my experience. You know, like I'm when I

771
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:41,960
Speaker 3: winter scout, I'm into rubs, you know, like I like

772
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:44,680
Speaker 3: seeing scrapes whatever, I like seeing trails, beds. I just

773
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,359
Speaker 3: like rubs, like they they help me. They're easy for

774
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:50,600
Speaker 3: me to figure out typically, And so you know, if

775
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:54,200
Speaker 3: you're walking through that oak flat and there's a sapling

776
00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:56,719
Speaker 3: with a rub on it, I'm like, okay, you know,

777
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:58,919
Speaker 3: like maybe he was munching some acorns and he made

778
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:00,360
Speaker 3: it like it does. I can look around and go,

779
00:39:00,560 --> 00:39:02,839
Speaker 3: this doesn't feel like it does mean very much good.

780
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:05,879
Speaker 3: But so often if I'm walking along and I see

781
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 3: a rub and I stop, and then I'm like, okay,

782
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:10,440
Speaker 3: there's another one, and there's another one. Then I go,

783
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 3: it's almost always tied to some kind of soft edge,

784
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, because they bedded wherever, you know,

785
00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 3: or fed wherever, and ended up there, and it's just

786
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:27,640
Speaker 3: a place that they felt more confident standing around in daylight.

787
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:30,480
Speaker 3: And so if you're walking around you're like, I don't know.

788
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:33,759
Speaker 3: I mean, it's so easy to think of like an

789
00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:36,040
Speaker 3: edge as if you take you know, like where I

790
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 3: hunt Wisconsin, there's a lot of either forestry industry, you know,

791
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,399
Speaker 3: there's a lot of timber harvests, So you might have

792
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 3: that clear cut old growth new growth type of edge,

793
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:53,920
Speaker 3: right hard edge almost or you'll have all those pine trees,

794
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:57,719
Speaker 3: and then you'll have deciduous and it's like just you

795
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 3: know you're going to travel that there's gonna be rubs there.

796
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:03,360
Speaker 3: They might bed there, but when you start getting into

797
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 3: you know, you just walk through a woods that in

798
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 3: your head you're like, this is all just like old

799
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 3: growth deciduous forest. But there's a creek bottom or something,

800
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:13,120
Speaker 3: and then you look at it and you're like, it's

801
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:16,440
Speaker 3: just thicker. It's not like you're not looking at it

802
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:18,840
Speaker 3: like on aero photos and being like there's a hard

803
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:21,440
Speaker 3: edge there that's easy to follow and easy to understand.

804
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:26,359
Speaker 3: So often it's something that's this smaller little thing that

805
00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:30,920
Speaker 3: whatever more sunlight gets down there, there's more water, there's

806
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:34,080
Speaker 3: something that encourages a different type of plant growth. Sometimes

807
00:40:34,120 --> 00:40:37,560
Speaker 3: it's just like an abandoned fence line and some vines

808
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:40,399
Speaker 3: or something. But when you get out there, a lot

809
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:43,319
Speaker 3: of times for me, I'll kind of find myself being like, man,

810
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:44,719
Speaker 3: there's a lot of rubs here, and I'll look around

811
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:47,480
Speaker 3: and like, well, obviously there's like a little island of

812
00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 3: cover here, or this just sort of soft edge that

813
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:53,920
Speaker 3: mostly just looks like a patch of brush, you know,

814
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 3: But it's there's a lot going on in some of those,

815
00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:00,360
Speaker 3: especially if you start connecting them. You know, if you're like, Okay,

816
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:02,480
Speaker 3: well maybe he bedded here and it looks like they're

817
00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 3: walking out there because I can see a bunch of

818
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:07,400
Speaker 3: rubs going that way. Well what's over the hill, another swamp? Another?

819
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 3: What is it? And just the more you're out there

820
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,600
Speaker 3: and you see that stuff the morning you start going, okay,

821
00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:14,839
Speaker 3: this could be important somehow, you.

822
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:28,279
Speaker 2: Know, how you document all this kind of stuff? Has

823
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:30,279
Speaker 2: that evolved at all? Is this all still up in

824
00:41:30,280 --> 00:41:33,280
Speaker 2: your head? Or are you are you waypointing every single

825
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:35,440
Speaker 2: one of these things on an app of some kind?

826
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:37,839
Speaker 2: Like how do you keep track of all it? Because

827
00:41:37,840 --> 00:41:40,080
Speaker 2: you're you know, you're doing this to a scale that's

828
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:43,800
Speaker 2: probably higher than most folks. How do you keep trying?

829
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:49,359
Speaker 3: So I'm like the anti Mark Kenya. I'm like, I'm

830
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,399
Speaker 3: sure I'm way less organized with this than you are.

831
00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:57,600
Speaker 3: A lot of it is just I just try to

832
00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:00,399
Speaker 3: remember it. If it's if I'm if I I'm real

833
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:04,239
Speaker 3: serious about it, I'm dropping way points because I'll forget it.

834
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 3: So it depends if it's something that I can go

835
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 3: into a lot, like if it's close to home. I'm

836
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 3: not as concerned about dropping a waypoint and leaving notes

837
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,280
Speaker 3: on it. If I make that drive down to Iowa

838
00:42:14,360 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 3: to scout or you know, western Minnesota or whatever, that's

839
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 3: a different thing, because I know I'll forget it, you know,

840
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:22,719
Speaker 3: and I know I'm packing a lot of scouting into

841
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:26,120
Speaker 3: one one day, two day type of thing. And so

842
00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:28,839
Speaker 3: the easiest way to do it is just like pull

843
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:31,040
Speaker 3: up on X and be like waypoint here, and then

844
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:35,520
Speaker 3: give myself some notes like staging area, hunt, hunt during

845
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:39,000
Speaker 3: west wind or whatever, and at least there's a prompt there,

846
00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:41,480
Speaker 3: you know, and just to get you like kind of

847
00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 3: going okay, like I have this sort of like this

848
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:47,600
Speaker 3: isn't going to go away from my brain. And when

849
00:42:47,640 --> 00:42:50,520
Speaker 3: you do that on some of those spots that I like,

850
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 3: you know, a lot of the public land I try

851
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:55,799
Speaker 3: to figure out out a state, it just I can

852
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:58,239
Speaker 3: pull that up and look at it in a big

853
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:01,439
Speaker 3: picture thing and go, okay, well I left that waypoint there,

854
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:03,600
Speaker 3: that waypoint there. There's a pond there I looked at

855
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:06,320
Speaker 3: and then you can start to just piece it together

856
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:09,000
Speaker 3: because you can't, I mean, I guess I guess my

857
00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:12,520
Speaker 3: point here is if you have a place in your

858
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:15,640
Speaker 3: backyard a scout, you can go there a lot, you

859
00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:17,640
Speaker 3: can figure stuff out, and it's just going to sort

860
00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:21,120
Speaker 3: of become something you understand when you're trying to figure

861
00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:23,600
Speaker 3: out something that's not easy to access, or you don't

862
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:26,480
Speaker 3: get a lot of time out there, you don't have

863
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:30,960
Speaker 3: as much in field time to do this. You're behind

864
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 3: on that, so you have to make up for it

865
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:36,440
Speaker 3: digital scouting, and so it just depends on what the

866
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 3: scenario is. But that that just even just dropping waypoints

867
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:42,800
Speaker 3: and looking at how they connect, and you know, thinking

868
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:45,160
Speaker 3: about it in the off season, it's pretty valuable.

869
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:50,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that. So so back to what got me

870
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:54,680
Speaker 2: on that topic of that that land bridge that I discovered.

871
00:43:55,840 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 2: We gotta we gotta talk about my big find yesterday

872
00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 2: real quick. We got to shift back to shed hunting

873
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:07,719
Speaker 2: for a minute because the twenty twenty four story kicked

874
00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:11,719
Speaker 2: into high gear yesterday. So last year, as you know,

875
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:15,600
Speaker 2: I was after that buck with wide nine, right, but

876
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:17,359
Speaker 2: I had a number two deer that was in that

877
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:21,319
Speaker 2: same zone that I was thinking like, man, would I

878
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 2: shoot this buck? Would I not shoot this buck? And

879
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:27,319
Speaker 2: it's this deer that I probably mentioned at some point

880
00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:31,279
Speaker 2: in our conversations. My son named him two years ago.

881
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 2: Son named him bulldozer, and so two years ago, as

882
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:37,600
Speaker 2: a three year old, he was all over the place,

883
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:41,560
Speaker 2: passed him a bunch, really wanted to find his sheds

884
00:44:41,680 --> 00:44:46,359
Speaker 2: last year but couldn't. He grew as a four year

885
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:50,160
Speaker 2: old into like a really nice nine pointer. I was thinking, like,

886
00:44:50,400 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 2: I don't know, one P thirty somewhere in that ballpark,

887
00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:56,840
Speaker 2: but like a big body, like a huge body.

888
00:44:57,480 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, name come from or came from?

889
00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:02,520
Speaker 2: I don't know, you know it was. He was three

890
00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:04,399
Speaker 2: years old when he named him. So at the time,

891
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:06,520
Speaker 2: my son was three and the buck was three. Both

892
00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:08,319
Speaker 2: of them were three, So I don't know how much

893
00:45:08,360 --> 00:45:09,240
Speaker 2: thought went into.

894
00:45:09,040 --> 00:45:12,239
Speaker 3: It, right, he just likes bulldozers.

895
00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:14,560
Speaker 2: He just likes bulldozers, probably, but he was It was

896
00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 2: a spot on description because he became a bulldozer of

897
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 2: a deer, just like a hulking body, long, big like

898
00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:27,000
Speaker 2: hump on his back, big chest, like an impressive body deer.

899
00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:29,480
Speaker 2: So I kept looking at that and like, man like,

900
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:31,160
Speaker 2: if he walks right in front of me, I'd have

901
00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:34,000
Speaker 2: a hard time passing the deer like that kind of body,

902
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:36,600
Speaker 2: even though it would be nice to see him make

903
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:39,960
Speaker 2: it to five. But you know, eventually I decided, like, man,

904
00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:41,560
Speaker 2: I'm gonna stick to try and get the wide nine.

905
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:45,400
Speaker 2: He's the one. But you know, it was interested in

906
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:47,839
Speaker 2: seeing this deer, hoping to see him, and I never

907
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:49,960
Speaker 2: saw him like he was just like he was on camera,

908
00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:53,799
Speaker 2: he was around. I guess it's not entirely tru I

909
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:57,640
Speaker 2: saw him when I was scouting the night before the opener,

910
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:00,239
Speaker 2: when I was glassing for the wide nine, I saw

911
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:04,160
Speaker 2: him way down a power line, far away. And then

912
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:10,120
Speaker 2: on a late season hunt, late like late November I

913
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:12,279
Speaker 2: think again, when I was still trying to get the

914
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:15,120
Speaker 2: wide night, I saw him again far off in the distance.

915
00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:18,640
Speaker 2: And then at the very end of the year, I

916
00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:22,279
Speaker 2: was hunting with my son Everett, and we were trying

917
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:24,239
Speaker 2: to kill a doe together. I can't remember if we

918
00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:27,040
Speaker 2: talked about this. We probably did briefly talk about this

919
00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:28,839
Speaker 2: when we talked about our favorite moments of the year,

920
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 2: right because this was that hunt when we killed our

921
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:34,520
Speaker 2: first year together. And then Bulldozer came into like sixty

922
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:36,960
Speaker 2: five yards or something, So that was our closest call

923
00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:39,920
Speaker 2: last year. Very cool, so I knew he made it

924
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:41,759
Speaker 2: through the hunting season. He was going to be the

925
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:44,279
Speaker 2: one that I wanted to see the most this coming year,

926
00:46:45,200 --> 00:46:47,600
Speaker 2: and so my plan was to stay out. I wasn't

927
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 2: going to go out here at all until I knew

928
00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:52,800
Speaker 2: he dropped his antlers. I wanted to resist the temptation

929
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:54,920
Speaker 2: and get out there muck things up until I knew

930
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:58,440
Speaker 2: he dropped. And unfortunately, the area around here doesn't have

931
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:02,360
Speaker 2: as much food as usually does. The farmer like Chisel

932
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:04,919
Speaker 2: plowed the cornfields and stuff, so it's like a big

933
00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:07,360
Speaker 2: dirt field for most of the properties I can hunt.

934
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:12,359
Speaker 2: But I did have two food plots that I play

935
00:47:12,440 --> 00:47:17,240
Speaker 2: in this area that were okay, and in late January

936
00:47:17,320 --> 00:47:19,840
Speaker 2: we had that really was it late January? Yeah, I

937
00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:21,760
Speaker 2: think late January we had like a really good cold

938
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:24,239
Speaker 2: spell around here was kind of wintery still, and I

939
00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:26,560
Speaker 2: had pictures of him hitting that one of these food

940
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 2: plots like every day for six days in a row,

941
00:47:29,920 --> 00:47:32,080
Speaker 2: So that gave me some hope that was still in

942
00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:32,560
Speaker 2: the area.

943
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:34,400
Speaker 3: Well.

944
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:36,759
Speaker 2: Last week I was in Montana on a mountain lion

945
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:40,360
Speaker 2: hunt with the Honest and I kept a couple of

946
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:42,880
Speaker 2: my cameras running. I've turned off most of them, brought

947
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:45,160
Speaker 2: in most of them, but I kept a few out

948
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 2: around these food sources just to keep tabs on him.

949
00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:52,160
Speaker 2: And I don't know, five six days ago when I

950
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:55,880
Speaker 2: was there in Montana, finally got pictures of him, no antlers,

951
00:47:56,239 --> 00:47:58,239
Speaker 2: and you can tell it's him because A he's got

952
00:47:58,239 --> 00:48:02,040
Speaker 2: the big, huge, hulking body, and then be he got

953
00:48:02,040 --> 00:48:05,520
Speaker 2: an I poked out sometime like early in the fall,

954
00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:08,319
Speaker 2: his eye stopped reflecting. You know how you see like

955
00:48:08,320 --> 00:48:10,279
Speaker 2: a black eye in the pictures, and you can see

956
00:48:10,360 --> 00:48:12,880
Speaker 2: kind of like a scar down underneath his eye. So

957
00:48:12,960 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 2: he must have been, you know, tussling with one of

958
00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:19,160
Speaker 2: the other big guys in the area. And long story

959
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:21,520
Speaker 2: short shed. So I got back from Montana a couple

960
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:24,200
Speaker 2: of days ago. Yesterday was my first chance to get

961
00:48:24,200 --> 00:48:26,399
Speaker 2: out there and walk, and so my plan I had

962
00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:28,120
Speaker 2: like probably a couple hour window. I thought, I'm just

963
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:31,400
Speaker 2: gonna hit the very best stuff tomorrow and then you know,

964
00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:32,920
Speaker 2: the next time I've got a window, I'll do the

965
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:37,000
Speaker 2: B level stuff. And so my plan was to just

966
00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:40,240
Speaker 2: walk two of the best betting areas that are close

967
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:42,880
Speaker 2: to that late season food plot they seem to be

968
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:47,200
Speaker 2: hitting the most. Just scoured it. I hit it as

969
00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:48,840
Speaker 2: hard as I could, I hit the best stuff. I

970
00:48:48,880 --> 00:48:51,760
Speaker 2: focused on these areas that I thought he should be betted,

971
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:54,320
Speaker 2: probably where he spent a lot of time in the past,

972
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:58,880
Speaker 2: and covered it all and nothing, And I'm done with

973
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:00,799
Speaker 2: all the betting, and I'm kind of working my way

974
00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:04,959
Speaker 2: back up towards the road and sitting there walking thinking

975
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:07,520
Speaker 2: to myself, like, why don't I ever find antlers here?

976
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:11,759
Speaker 2: Like I know there's bucks in the area, I know

977
00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 2: there's some good deer around. It's so frustrating it just

978
00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:18,560
Speaker 2: so I find so few sheds around here, Like what

979
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:20,400
Speaker 2: the heck is going on? Where are these things go?

980
00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:23,000
Speaker 2: Like who's getting out here and finding them before I am?

981
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:26,040
Speaker 2: Or what squirrel is dragging these things into a hole?

982
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:29,600
Speaker 2: Where is the where are these stupid antlers? And then

983
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:33,120
Speaker 2: right as I'm saying that, like I almost step on

984
00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:36,960
Speaker 2: an antler right there in front of me, and uh,

985
00:49:37,480 --> 00:49:42,319
Speaker 2: I'm sure shit it was it was bulldozers. I guess

986
00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:47,560
Speaker 2: it's his right side, and uh yeah, I couldn't.

987
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:49,040
Speaker 3: Did you try to match it up?

988
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:52,640
Speaker 2: I did try to match it up, and I did

989
00:49:52,680 --> 00:49:56,239
Speaker 2: not succeed. Yet I thought, I thought, I felt very

990
00:49:56,239 --> 00:49:58,920
Speaker 2: Confident'm like, man, if you drop that antler, you know,

991
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:01,719
Speaker 2: I'm bet and he just kept on going down this trail.

992
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:04,480
Speaker 2: It was on a trail leaving that Betting area, heading

993
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:07,319
Speaker 2: towards that food plot, and so I thought, man, I

994
00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 2: bet you he dropped it somewhere, you know, on his

995
00:50:09,880 --> 00:50:12,799
Speaker 2: route continuing or maybe like in this kind of some thick,

996
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:15,160
Speaker 2: nasty transition stuff through there. It's got to be somewhere

997
00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:17,640
Speaker 2: in there. So I scoured it. I had it hard,

998
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:23,000
Speaker 2: did not find it, but I'm gonna keep looking, but encouraging,

999
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:25,400
Speaker 2: super encouraging to find that exciting.

1000
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:30,680
Speaker 3: Let me ask you about that buck. So you see

1001
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:32,640
Speaker 3: that where bucks get their eyes poked out once in

1002
00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:36,680
Speaker 3: a while, do you think that buck will it would

1003
00:50:36,760 --> 00:50:39,920
Speaker 3: be more hesitant to fight after that, or do you

1004
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:42,040
Speaker 3: think their brain doesn't work that way? I'm like, I'm

1005
00:50:42,360 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 3: I'm just curious because you know, I mean, every once

1006
00:50:44,960 --> 00:50:46,880
Speaker 3: in a while you'll see somebody post a video running

1007
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:49,720
Speaker 3: across a blind buck out there. You know that clearly

1008
00:50:49,840 --> 00:50:52,239
Speaker 3: just got just just lost his vision, doesn't know where

1009
00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:54,960
Speaker 3: to go. Yeah, And I always wonder about that, Like,

1010
00:50:55,360 --> 00:50:57,800
Speaker 3: you know, if you're a fighter in the deer woods

1011
00:50:58,280 --> 00:51:02,080
Speaker 3: and that happens, like are you are you aware that

1012
00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:04,160
Speaker 3: that was the result of fighting, you would think so,

1013
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:07,040
Speaker 3: And then can they put that together and be like, man,

1014
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:09,760
Speaker 3: I'm gonna I'm not gonna push anybody around.

1015
00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 2: Well yeah, But the flip side is like the deer

1016
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:15,600
Speaker 2: that that happens to, is that the deer that's like

1017
00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:19,920
Speaker 2: genetically predispositioned to be that bullybuck, you know, And so

1018
00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:22,160
Speaker 2: is he the buck that man that's his thing, Like

1019
00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:24,400
Speaker 2: he's going to beat up other deer and push him

1020
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:27,359
Speaker 2: around like poked out eye or not, like he's going

1021
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 2: to be that guy. I don't know. That's a really

1022
00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:31,600
Speaker 2: good question.

1023
00:51:31,760 --> 00:51:34,120
Speaker 3: What I'm asking though, is even if that buck is

1024
00:51:34,120 --> 00:51:36,839
Speaker 3: a bullybuck, right, Like, even if he's he's gonna fight

1025
00:51:37,560 --> 00:51:42,120
Speaker 3: fight on site, right, does he learn Like I mean,

1026
00:51:42,440 --> 00:51:44,759
Speaker 3: imagine if you were the toughest guy in town and

1027
00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:46,719
Speaker 3: then one day some stranger showed up and you were

1028
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:49,480
Speaker 3: at the bar and he stabbed you in the eye,

1029
00:51:49,840 --> 00:51:51,479
Speaker 3: I don't know, you know, like you'd be like, I'm

1030
00:51:51,880 --> 00:51:53,880
Speaker 3: I might be done with this lifestyle.

1031
00:51:54,480 --> 00:51:58,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. So so then it begs the question like if

1032
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:04,120
Speaker 2: that's just assume that's true. If that's true, does that

1033
00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:07,360
Speaker 2: mean that buck will be less interested in responding to

1034
00:52:07,480 --> 00:52:12,240
Speaker 2: rattling or aggressive calling. Is he all of a sudden

1035
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:14,400
Speaker 2: competition shy and so is that a buck? If I

1036
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:16,400
Speaker 2: snort weeza on this coming fall, is he gonna be like,

1037
00:52:16,520 --> 00:52:21,000
Speaker 2: uh uh, I'm not doing that again. Getting the answer

1038
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:23,160
Speaker 2: to that question would be very helpful. I don't exactly

1039
00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:24,160
Speaker 2: know how to get the answer.

1040
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:27,799
Speaker 3: Well, and here's another one. So you know, in the

1041
00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:30,800
Speaker 3: deer world, or in the turkey world, or probably everywhere

1042
00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:33,680
Speaker 3: in nature where a hierarchy exists between dominant and non

1043
00:52:33,760 --> 00:52:39,400
Speaker 3: dominant animals, if there's an obvious injury, the other animals

1044
00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:42,520
Speaker 3: can see that sense it instantly, you know what I mean?

1045
00:52:42,520 --> 00:52:44,480
Speaker 3: You see what turkey you see with deer, and I

1046
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:46,960
Speaker 3: wonder if there's a way for the other bucks to

1047
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:49,040
Speaker 3: know that or figure that out. Like this dude isn't

1048
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:51,920
Speaker 3: He's not all there. He never looks at me when

1049
00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:55,239
Speaker 3: I'm standing on this side of him, right, So I.

1050
00:52:55,200 --> 00:52:59,880
Speaker 2: Don't know enough about eyes to know if he's at

1051
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:03,040
Speaker 2: actually blinded, Like, can you get an injury to the

1052
00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:05,880
Speaker 2: eye that what's the thing that reflects? Is it the

1053
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:09,840
Speaker 2: retina that's reflecting? Is that right? I should know this.

1054
00:53:09,880 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 2: I don't know enough about min natomy.

1055
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:12,640
Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't think it is. I think

1056
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:15,760
Speaker 3: it's something else because it's all about night vision.

1057
00:53:16,760 --> 00:53:18,400
Speaker 2: So yeah, so I guess what I'm getting at is

1058
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:20,680
Speaker 2: like I don't know to what degree his eye is injured.

1059
00:53:20,680 --> 00:53:22,120
Speaker 2: There is still an eye there. I can see an

1060
00:53:22,160 --> 00:53:24,880
Speaker 2: eye there, it just doesn't reflect, so like one's reflecting

1061
00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:29,080
Speaker 2: and one's not. So you know, is he actually blind

1062
00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:33,040
Speaker 2: in that eye or is it just damaged in some way?

1063
00:53:33,239 --> 00:53:35,000
Speaker 2: That's another thing I'm not sure about. I should I

1064
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:37,360
Speaker 2: should look into that further because that would be interesting

1065
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:41,279
Speaker 2: to know. And I wonder, like, you know, how much

1066
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:43,279
Speaker 2: did that change his behavior? He was still around a

1067
00:53:43,280 --> 00:53:45,880
Speaker 2: lot on camera, but you know, like I said, he

1068
00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:49,640
Speaker 2: was around a lot up until like early fall, which

1069
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:52,440
Speaker 2: is right around when that injury happened, and then like

1070
00:53:52,480 --> 00:53:55,000
Speaker 2: he just was not as active, not quite as active

1071
00:53:55,000 --> 00:53:56,719
Speaker 2: as the least. So I wonder if that had any

1072
00:53:56,800 --> 00:53:59,960
Speaker 2: kind of bearing on on that behavioral chain.

1073
00:54:02,520 --> 00:54:05,680
Speaker 3: It's just well, and I mean, I know we're going

1074
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:10,360
Speaker 3: down a geeky rabbit hole here, but imagine I wonder

1075
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:12,719
Speaker 3: if you could follow a buck like that, like a

1076
00:54:12,719 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 3: GPS collar study or something, see his habits for four

1077
00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:19,040
Speaker 3: years gets his eye poked out, can't see on this

1078
00:54:19,120 --> 00:54:21,879
Speaker 3: side of his body if he if he leans way

1079
00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 3: more heavily into his nose, and how he beds and

1080
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:28,400
Speaker 3: how he travels to compensate for it. Probably Yeah.

1081
00:54:28,440 --> 00:54:32,600
Speaker 2: And then the final piece of the puzzle is how

1082
00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:34,960
Speaker 2: do I adjust my stand setups to make sure I'm

1083
00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 2: always on the blind side of him so that when

1084
00:54:38,280 --> 00:54:40,200
Speaker 2: he comes in he doesn't see me draw my bow.

1085
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:45,120
Speaker 3: Let's not promote hunting one idea and making it sound easier,

1086
00:54:45,160 --> 00:54:47,240
Speaker 3: because there's gonna be assholes out there with BB guns

1087
00:54:47,239 --> 00:54:48,800
Speaker 3: trying to shoot their year and a half all bucks

1088
00:54:48,800 --> 00:54:49,480
Speaker 3: in one eye.

1089
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:52,880
Speaker 2: That's a good point. We're not in no way condoning

1090
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:54,719
Speaker 2: the creation of one eyed bucks, all right, Let's be

1091
00:54:54,760 --> 00:54:59,960
Speaker 2: clear about that. If this buck somehow outsmarts me, though,

1092
00:55:00,120 --> 00:55:03,360
Speaker 2: it will be one more feather on the cap of

1093
00:55:03,440 --> 00:55:05,960
Speaker 2: incompetency if I can't kill the half blind eer.

1094
00:55:06,719 --> 00:55:08,839
Speaker 3: I I think if you were a real hunter who

1095
00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:11,640
Speaker 3: cared about ethics and the challenge, you'd wear an eye

1096
00:55:11,680 --> 00:55:12,480
Speaker 3: patch all season.

1097
00:55:15,960 --> 00:55:17,879
Speaker 2: Would you be more impressed if I pulled it off?

1098
00:55:20,920 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 3: I think that would be a wonderful experiment for you

1099
00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:24,879
Speaker 3: to try. Mark.

1100
00:55:25,239 --> 00:55:28,320
Speaker 2: That would be interesting. I'm thirty thirty yards and in

1101
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:34,040
Speaker 2: and one. I only now that's my new thing? Is

1102
00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:37,399
Speaker 2: there Is there anything else on the scouting or shed

1103
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:41,200
Speaker 2: hunting front that you think we should cover? To make

1104
00:55:41,239 --> 00:55:43,240
Speaker 2: sure folks have got a few things to think about here.

1105
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:46,200
Speaker 3: Just get out there, man, we got to talk about

1106
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:49,320
Speaker 3: lions and mingus. Oh I'm curious to hear this story.

1107
00:55:49,719 --> 00:55:52,440
Speaker 2: All right, I'll give you the cliff notes version of this.

1108
00:55:54,440 --> 00:55:57,120
Speaker 2: So the plan was that I was going to go

1109
00:55:57,160 --> 00:56:00,879
Speaker 2: out there to Montana and join Giannis for Mountain Hunt.

1110
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:04,080
Speaker 2: Working on a new book project, and one of the

1111
00:56:04,080 --> 00:56:09,759
Speaker 2: things I'm gonna be exploring is predator dynamics and in

1112
00:56:09,800 --> 00:56:14,000
Speaker 2: the future of big carnivores in America, and you know,

1113
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:15,520
Speaker 2: all sorts of stuff related to that. So as part

1114
00:56:15,560 --> 00:56:18,080
Speaker 2: of that, I want to go on a predator hunt

1115
00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:21,279
Speaker 2: and learn about what hunters think about big carnivores and

1116
00:56:21,320 --> 00:56:24,600
Speaker 2: predators and living alongside of them and managing them or

1117
00:56:24,880 --> 00:56:29,040
Speaker 2: all the different things related to that. So the night

1118
00:56:29,120 --> 00:56:32,160
Speaker 2: performs to fly out, Giannis calls me and he's like, hey, man,

1119
00:56:32,320 --> 00:56:38,440
Speaker 2: bad news. Mingus had a fall. He's badly injured. I

1120
00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:41,040
Speaker 2: don't think we're gonna be able to do this, and

1121
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:43,120
Speaker 2: I'll let Giannis go into all the details. I'm sure

1122
00:56:43,120 --> 00:56:45,239
Speaker 2: he'll tell folks about it on a media podcast or

1123
00:56:45,239 --> 00:56:47,360
Speaker 2: something at some point, so I won't steal his thunder.

1124
00:56:48,080 --> 00:56:51,680
Speaker 2: But the the cliff notes of that thing is that

1125
00:56:51,800 --> 00:56:56,200
Speaker 2: Mingus fell hurt his leg and is out for the

1126
00:56:56,239 --> 00:56:59,879
Speaker 2: rest of the lion season. The good news is that

1127
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:02,239
Speaker 2: the injury is not so bad that he won't be

1128
00:57:02,239 --> 00:57:04,640
Speaker 2: able to recover, So good news that Mingus is gonna

1129
00:57:04,680 --> 00:57:07,880
Speaker 2: be okay. And Giannas was able to still take me

1130
00:57:07,920 --> 00:57:09,520
Speaker 2: out with him, but we were gonna have to use

1131
00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:13,719
Speaker 2: his buddy's hounds. So we had three full days to

1132
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:16,960
Speaker 2: get out there after. And the first two days were

1133
00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:20,280
Speaker 2: just like hiking. We drove roads in the morning looking

1134
00:57:20,280 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 2: for tracks, crossing a crossing the roads, never found any,

1135
00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:25,840
Speaker 2: and so as soon as it was daylight we would

1136
00:57:25,880 --> 00:57:29,920
Speaker 2: then just start hiking up mountains, up drainages and just

1137
00:57:29,960 --> 00:57:33,200
Speaker 2: walk and walk and walk, and uh, you know, it

1138
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 2: was just like a death march. We did like twelve

1139
00:57:34,880 --> 00:57:36,760
Speaker 2: miles a day, twelve and a half miles a day,

1140
00:57:37,960 --> 00:57:41,680
Speaker 2: hiking in the snow off trail, just all over the place,

1141
00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:44,919
Speaker 2: so beautiful country. Fun. I'm glad I like to hike,

1142
00:57:44,960 --> 00:57:48,400
Speaker 2: because we just did a lot of hiking but did

1143
00:57:48,440 --> 00:57:52,160
Speaker 2: not find any line tracks, didn't really see any wildlife.

1144
00:57:53,120 --> 00:57:56,520
Speaker 2: I went out the second night with our mutual friend

1145
00:57:56,560 --> 00:57:59,439
Speaker 2: Garrett and did a wolf hunt with him, went wolf

1146
00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:01,439
Speaker 2: hunting with him and got to pick his brand about

1147
00:58:01,520 --> 00:58:04,840
Speaker 2: wolves and his thoughts on that and his experiences trying

1148
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 2: to catch up with one ever since they got delisted

1149
00:58:07,160 --> 00:58:12,440
Speaker 2: out there, you know, talked about you know, finding balance

1150
00:58:12,480 --> 00:58:16,280
Speaker 2: with with critters like that, and how you know a

1151
00:58:16,280 --> 00:58:19,440
Speaker 2: lot of hunters are worried about that competition, and we

1152
00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:22,439
Speaker 2: talked about, you know, how we might be able to

1153
00:58:22,920 --> 00:58:26,320
Speaker 2: live alongside of him. And then uh went to this

1154
00:58:26,720 --> 00:58:29,960
Speaker 2: beautiful hyped into another drainage. He turned on like a

1155
00:58:29,960 --> 00:58:33,480
Speaker 2: coyote howler and tried to try to call one in

1156
00:58:33,520 --> 00:58:37,600
Speaker 2: with that, and again no luck. So those first two days,

1157
00:58:37,600 --> 00:58:39,720
Speaker 2: two and a half days, it was just like a

1158
00:58:39,720 --> 00:58:42,760
Speaker 2: lot of beautiful country, a lot of walking, no no critters.

1159
00:58:43,760 --> 00:58:45,560
Speaker 3: But the last day, hold on a second though, When

1160
00:58:45,600 --> 00:58:48,240
Speaker 3: you say no no critters, do you mean like no

1161
00:58:48,360 --> 00:58:51,960
Speaker 3: elk tracks, no deer tracks, like pretty pretty empty.

1162
00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:54,600
Speaker 2: Uh, there were credit tracks.

1163
00:58:54,760 --> 00:58:57,760
Speaker 3: We did see deer truck didn't see just didn't see him.

1164
00:58:57,800 --> 00:59:00,240
Speaker 2: And on that wolf trip with Garrett, we did see

1165
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:02,320
Speaker 2: some elk. We went into an area that was an

1166
00:59:02,320 --> 00:59:06,000
Speaker 2: elk wintering area and and that was where you'd expect

1167
00:59:06,040 --> 00:59:08,320
Speaker 2: the wolves to be. Just didn't pan out, but the

1168
00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:13,440
Speaker 2: elk were there. So the last day though, we got

1169
00:59:14,840 --> 00:59:17,920
Speaker 2: we got a tip that a buddy of Giannis's friend

1170
00:59:18,160 --> 00:59:21,800
Speaker 2: had found a kill site in this zone. And so

1171
00:59:21,880 --> 00:59:24,200
Speaker 2: it went to that kill site and started me and Jannis,

1172
00:59:24,240 --> 00:59:26,439
Speaker 2: we're gonna start walking circles around it, try to cut

1173
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:29,200
Speaker 2: a track. And then his buddy went and drove a

1174
00:59:29,240 --> 00:59:32,040
Speaker 2: snowmobile up a four service road to try to cut

1175
00:59:32,080 --> 00:59:34,960
Speaker 2: a track up to the north of it, and sure

1176
00:59:35,040 --> 00:59:37,360
Speaker 2: enough he cut a track, came back and got us

1177
00:59:38,440 --> 00:59:43,080
Speaker 2: first line track of the trip. And you know, the

1178
00:59:43,800 --> 00:59:46,360
Speaker 2: interesting thing that happened from this point was that we

1179
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:50,320
Speaker 2: had to take snowmobiles to get there. And I've never

1180
00:59:50,320 --> 00:59:53,960
Speaker 2: wrote on a snowmobile before my life. What, Yeah, we

1181
00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:57,080
Speaker 2: don't have snow down where I'm at in Michigan growing up,

1182
00:59:58,280 --> 00:59:59,920
Speaker 2: and we just that wasn't the thing our family did

1183
01:00:00,320 --> 01:00:03,680
Speaker 2: was go up north to snowmobill, so never use them

1184
01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:07,240
Speaker 2: before my life. So I get like the tutorial. The

1185
01:00:07,280 --> 01:00:10,440
Speaker 2: tutorial is like, all right, here's the throttle, and don't

1186
01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:12,560
Speaker 2: sit down. You have to stand up the whole time

1187
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:16,960
Speaker 2: because we're gonna go around lots of We're riding on

1188
01:00:17,000 --> 01:00:19,720
Speaker 2: the side of a mountain on like hiking trails. Essentially,

1189
01:00:19,800 --> 01:00:22,040
Speaker 2: these are not like roads or forest service roads. We're

1190
01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:24,200
Speaker 2: gonna be going on trails on the sides of mountain,

1191
01:00:24,280 --> 01:00:27,040
Speaker 2: up and over into and out of drainages, over mountains,

1192
01:00:27,080 --> 01:00:29,360
Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff. So they describe me you

1193
01:00:29,400 --> 01:00:31,720
Speaker 2: need to stand up the whole time, and you need

1194
01:00:31,760 --> 01:00:35,200
Speaker 2: to switch your legs over to whichever side of the

1195
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:39,120
Speaker 2: snowmobile is uphill so you don't roll down the side

1196
01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:43,040
Speaker 2: of the mountain. And I'm like, what, like, while we're driving.

1197
01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:45,240
Speaker 3: Are you switching your legs so you can bail or

1198
01:00:45,280 --> 01:00:47,640
Speaker 3: because of the weight distribution both.

1199
01:00:48,680 --> 01:00:50,640
Speaker 2: The first thing is that you have to switch your

1200
01:00:50,680 --> 01:00:52,440
Speaker 2: legs to weight. So basically what they're telling me to

1201
01:00:52,440 --> 01:00:53,440
Speaker 2: do is like, when we're on the side of the

1202
01:00:53,480 --> 01:00:57,440
Speaker 2: mountain and the trail is leaning downhill, you need to

1203
01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:00,240
Speaker 2: put both your legs on the uphill side and hold

1204
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:02,360
Speaker 2: all of your weight to the right or towards the

1205
01:01:02,400 --> 01:01:05,480
Speaker 2: uphill side, so you don't roll the snowmobil over and

1206
01:01:05,520 --> 01:01:08,240
Speaker 2: fall off the side of the mountain. And so I'm like,

1207
01:01:08,320 --> 01:01:11,640
Speaker 2: holy shit, I've never even touched one of these things,

1208
01:01:11,680 --> 01:01:14,840
Speaker 2: and now I'm doing like acrobats acrobat moves on the

1209
01:01:14,880 --> 01:01:16,360
Speaker 2: side of it, on the side of a mountain, Like

1210
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:20,880
Speaker 2: is this Yeah, I was just I don't know. I

1211
01:01:20,880 --> 01:01:24,200
Speaker 2: had no idea. It wasn't getting myself into and but

1212
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:25,240
Speaker 2: at the same time, I'm like, all right, I'm just

1213
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:28,280
Speaker 2: gonna do it, Like, yeah, do it. And so we

1214
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:31,920
Speaker 2: drive this trail to where his friend cut the track.

1215
01:01:32,480 --> 01:01:35,280
Speaker 2: We stop, all right, I'm excited. We're gonna cut the

1216
01:01:35,320 --> 01:01:36,880
Speaker 2: dogs loose and go do the thing. We cut the

1217
01:01:36,880 --> 01:01:39,160
Speaker 2: dogs loose, they go tearing off and then they like

1218
01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:41,440
Speaker 2: go like we were hoping the line might be close,

1219
01:01:41,480 --> 01:01:43,920
Speaker 2: but no, it's like those dogs went over the mountain,

1220
01:01:44,080 --> 01:01:46,480
Speaker 2: down a drainage, over another mountain, down another dranche and

1221
01:01:46,520 --> 01:01:49,120
Speaker 2: they were gone and we lost track of them of

1222
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:51,800
Speaker 2: their GPS collars. And so now we had to like

1223
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:53,360
Speaker 2: go up to the top of the mountain or to

1224
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:55,240
Speaker 2: the next one to try to get the service again

1225
01:01:55,280 --> 01:01:58,800
Speaker 2: and find them. And to make a very long story short,

1226
01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:02,440
Speaker 2: over the next hour or two we drove up and

1227
01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:05,200
Speaker 2: down around like this is like there's no roads, there's

1228
01:02:05,200 --> 01:02:08,760
Speaker 2: nothing plowed. This is like fresh snow on the side

1229
01:02:08,760 --> 01:02:10,800
Speaker 2: of a mountain on a hiking trail that we're driving

1230
01:02:10,800 --> 01:02:14,200
Speaker 2: our snowmobills around with like hundreds of foot dropped down

1231
01:02:14,200 --> 01:02:17,000
Speaker 2: to the side, and I am like so puckered, I

1232
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:20,600
Speaker 2: can't even tell you. I mean, like my hands are

1233
01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:24,520
Speaker 2: gripped like white knuckling. I just know I'm gonna roll

1234
01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:26,440
Speaker 2: this thing off. Like at one point, I stop on

1235
01:02:26,480 --> 01:02:27,920
Speaker 2: the edge of one thing, look back at me on

1236
01:02:28,040 --> 01:02:31,160
Speaker 2: and I'm like, I'm gonna roll this mfror off the

1237
01:02:31,200 --> 01:02:34,280
Speaker 2: side of this mountain. So tell my wife goodbye. Like this,

1238
01:02:34,400 --> 01:02:38,680
Speaker 2: there's no way this is gonna work out. And it

1239
01:02:38,760 --> 01:02:43,080
Speaker 2: was bad, man. I rolled it. I rolled it twice,

1240
01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:46,400
Speaker 2: but both times I rolled it was not so steep

1241
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:48,240
Speaker 2: on the side that I couldn't catch myself in the

1242
01:02:48,240 --> 01:02:51,640
Speaker 2: sled before it went down. But it was an adventure.

1243
01:02:52,120 --> 01:02:54,400
Speaker 2: To make a long story short, it was an adventure.

1244
01:02:54,600 --> 01:02:56,920
Speaker 2: We made it to where the dogs were, We found

1245
01:02:56,920 --> 01:02:59,479
Speaker 2: the dogs. They lost the track, but we were able

1246
01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:01,680
Speaker 2: to after like an hour of walking around trying to

1247
01:03:01,720 --> 01:03:03,400
Speaker 2: cipher what was going on. There was all these deer

1248
01:03:03,440 --> 01:03:06,880
Speaker 2: tracks and boot tracks and YadA YadA YadA, we're able

1249
01:03:06,920 --> 01:03:09,280
Speaker 2: to find a fresh track coming out of this mess,

1250
01:03:09,360 --> 01:03:12,760
Speaker 2: put the dogs back on it, and maybe another hour later,

1251
01:03:12,880 --> 01:03:15,240
Speaker 2: more hiking up and down the mountain, another drive of

1252
01:03:15,240 --> 01:03:19,040
Speaker 2: the snow and bible down this mountain to another drainage.

1253
01:03:19,360 --> 01:03:23,000
Speaker 2: They treat a cat, They jumped it, treat it. And

1254
01:03:23,080 --> 01:03:27,640
Speaker 2: we bailed on down there, and I saw my first

1255
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:30,960
Speaker 2: mountain line ever in the wild at least. And she

1256
01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:36,240
Speaker 2: was beautiful, big female, just perched in this wide open,

1257
01:03:36,720 --> 01:03:40,000
Speaker 2: perfect branch that we could like very clearly sit in

1258
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:41,520
Speaker 2: the side of the mountain and sit next to her

1259
01:03:41,560 --> 01:03:44,080
Speaker 2: and watch her. And she just hung out there looking

1260
01:03:44,120 --> 01:03:45,720
Speaker 2: at us, and then like kind of took a nap.

1261
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:48,240
Speaker 2: She did not seem to care one bit that we

1262
01:03:48,240 --> 01:03:53,240
Speaker 2: were there. And it was just wild seeing a creature

1263
01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:57,040
Speaker 2: like that up close, something that's so wild and elusive

1264
01:03:57,120 --> 01:03:59,080
Speaker 2: most of the time. To be able to just be

1265
01:03:59,200 --> 01:04:01,400
Speaker 2: right there with it.

1266
01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:03,960
Speaker 3: It was pretty cool. Sea lions in a very often

1267
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:05,480
Speaker 3: no it was.

1268
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:09,320
Speaker 2: It was a special thing. And then you know they're like, yeah,

1269
01:04:09,320 --> 01:04:10,640
Speaker 2: you can like walk right to the base of the

1270
01:04:10,680 --> 01:04:12,760
Speaker 2: tree if you want, Like she's not gonna leave like

1271
01:04:12,840 --> 01:04:16,720
Speaker 2: she she wants to just hang out there. So I walked,

1272
01:04:16,720 --> 01:04:18,680
Speaker 2: you know, to the base of the tree and you

1273
01:04:18,720 --> 01:04:22,600
Speaker 2: can't help but like when there's one hundred and thirty

1274
01:04:22,640 --> 01:04:25,720
Speaker 2: pound one hundred and forty pound lion directly above you

1275
01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:29,320
Speaker 2: twenty yards, there's just like like the hair is on

1276
01:04:29,360 --> 01:04:31,720
Speaker 2: your neck stand up, like even though I know, like

1277
01:04:31,840 --> 01:04:34,200
Speaker 2: I should be safe, Like that was like a feeling.

1278
01:04:34,360 --> 01:04:37,440
Speaker 2: That was something that was something.

1279
01:04:37,320 --> 01:04:40,720
Speaker 3: That's that's a little undercurrent run and way back through

1280
01:04:40,720 --> 01:04:41,920
Speaker 3: your ancestry there.

1281
01:04:42,200 --> 01:04:46,520
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, it was. It was. It was really cool

1282
01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:50,080
Speaker 2: to have that kind of connection back to the the

1283
01:04:50,120 --> 01:04:51,480
Speaker 2: way stuff used to be a little bit.

1284
01:04:51,640 --> 01:04:54,360
Speaker 3: So was this a was it an actual hunt? Like

1285
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:56,200
Speaker 3: if it was it was a tom was there somebody

1286
01:04:56,200 --> 01:04:57,160
Speaker 3: there that would have shot it?

1287
01:04:57,960 --> 01:05:00,840
Speaker 2: So it was a hunt going into it. And then

1288
01:05:01,200 --> 01:05:03,880
Speaker 2: as we went along, Giannis ended up making a decision

1289
01:05:03,920 --> 01:05:05,760
Speaker 2: that he didn't want to shoot if it was a

1290
01:05:05,760 --> 01:05:07,440
Speaker 2: big time. He didn't want to shoot it without his

1291
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:11,000
Speaker 2: dog there. So, you know, we by the time we

1292
01:05:11,040 --> 01:05:13,200
Speaker 2: got there, we realized like he probably wouldn't shoot it anyways,

1293
01:05:13,200 --> 01:05:16,120
Speaker 2: because he wasn't going to be you know, the moment

1294
01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:18,400
Speaker 2: he wanted like he wanted his first line to be

1295
01:05:18,480 --> 01:05:22,800
Speaker 2: with his dog. He's been training so but you know,

1296
01:05:23,080 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 2: kind of going into it, we thought we thought it

1297
01:05:24,840 --> 01:05:27,840
Speaker 2: would be but just unforeseen circumstances led it to being

1298
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:32,200
Speaker 2: a tree and free. So it is.

1299
01:05:32,800 --> 01:05:35,160
Speaker 3: How did it make you feel about would you want

1300
01:05:35,200 --> 01:05:37,160
Speaker 3: to hunt him for yourself?

1301
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:41,520
Speaker 2: I think my old my number one. I have a

1302
01:05:41,520 --> 01:05:44,520
Speaker 2: whole new appreciation for hound hunters and like folks who

1303
01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:46,600
Speaker 2: do it this way. You know, it was not easy.

1304
01:05:46,760 --> 01:05:49,400
Speaker 2: I mean we we death marched for three days. I

1305
01:05:49,400 --> 01:05:54,360
Speaker 2: mean a lot of physical activity, hard, hard heard hunt.

1306
01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:56,720
Speaker 2: Now I know, like maybe not everyone who hound hunts

1307
01:05:56,800 --> 01:05:58,880
Speaker 2: hikes as much as we did. Maybe more guys do

1308
01:05:58,920 --> 01:06:01,360
Speaker 2: it by the road. But what I saw and what

1309
01:06:01,400 --> 01:06:03,560
Speaker 2: I got to be a part of was a serious

1310
01:06:03,640 --> 01:06:08,240
Speaker 2: hunt and like getting to the end like I think

1311
01:06:08,320 --> 01:06:10,600
Speaker 2: some I had looked and seeing like oh geez, these

1312
01:06:10,680 --> 01:06:12,720
Speaker 2: lions get treated and then you to shoot them. That

1313
01:06:12,760 --> 01:06:17,520
Speaker 2: seems so easy. And what I realized is like, that's

1314
01:06:17,720 --> 01:06:19,560
Speaker 2: not what the lion hunt is really about. The lion

1315
01:06:19,640 --> 01:06:23,840
Speaker 2: hunt is about finding it, following it, catching up to it.

1316
01:06:23,880 --> 01:06:25,560
Speaker 2: Like that's a ton of work, that's a ton of

1317
01:06:25,560 --> 01:06:28,480
Speaker 2: training that goes in these dogs. It's amazing how much

1318
01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:30,720
Speaker 2: these guys knew about lions, like how they're going to

1319
01:06:30,800 --> 01:06:32,880
Speaker 2: move through the landscape, and what they've learned over the

1320
01:06:33,000 --> 01:06:35,480
Speaker 2: years of following them and studying them, and the passion

1321
01:06:35,520 --> 01:06:37,720
Speaker 2: they have for it. So just like a lot of

1322
01:06:37,720 --> 01:06:42,400
Speaker 2: appreciation for it. And also seeing at least the folks

1323
01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:44,600
Speaker 2: I was around, like, have a real appreciation for the

1324
01:06:44,640 --> 01:06:46,960
Speaker 2: animal and respect for the animal, you know, just like

1325
01:06:47,000 --> 01:06:49,400
Speaker 2: we have for deer and the other critters that we hunt.

1326
01:06:50,320 --> 01:06:53,160
Speaker 2: And so I came out of it, I think with

1327
01:06:53,320 --> 01:06:56,560
Speaker 2: a stronger belief that, like, you know, when you can

1328
01:06:56,640 --> 01:06:59,200
Speaker 2: hunt an animal and manage an animal, it usually builds

1329
01:06:59,240 --> 01:07:03,240
Speaker 2: an advocate of the animal. So it's not like I

1330
01:07:03,280 --> 01:07:07,800
Speaker 2: don't In most cases, it seems like managed predator hunting

1331
01:07:08,400 --> 01:07:13,400
Speaker 2: can lead to more part predator and carnivore advocates sometimes

1332
01:07:13,520 --> 01:07:17,400
Speaker 2: because you're you're getting folks invested in the animal, and

1333
01:07:17,480 --> 01:07:20,680
Speaker 2: so I think that it leads to good things for

1334
01:07:20,720 --> 01:07:22,480
Speaker 2: the animal just as much as it leads to good

1335
01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:25,840
Speaker 2: things for the hunter and so and so this is

1336
01:07:25,880 --> 01:07:29,480
Speaker 2: a great illustration of that idea at least, And I

1337
01:07:29,480 --> 01:07:33,640
Speaker 2: would definitely, I would definitely like to be online hunts. Again,

1338
01:07:33,720 --> 01:07:35,800
Speaker 2: I'm still unsure if I want to shoot one, though

1339
01:07:36,960 --> 01:07:38,880
Speaker 2: I do not know if I want to shoot one myself.

1340
01:07:39,080 --> 01:07:42,160
Speaker 2: I don't. I wouldn't, you know, criticize anyone for wanting

1341
01:07:42,160 --> 01:07:44,280
Speaker 2: to do that themselves. I don't know if I want

1342
01:07:44,320 --> 01:07:46,880
Speaker 2: to shoot one. I've eaten line it's very good, so

1343
01:07:47,080 --> 01:07:49,120
Speaker 2: I could see myself doing it because I wouldn't eat it.

1344
01:07:49,600 --> 01:07:52,800
Speaker 2: But a little bit of me was like, man, that

1345
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:56,680
Speaker 2: is just like an amazing I don't know quite how

1346
01:07:56,680 --> 01:07:58,280
Speaker 2: to put words to it, but like, I don't know

1347
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:02,600
Speaker 2: if i'd want to shoot it. That's all wolf. Same question.

1348
01:08:02,680 --> 01:08:04,680
Speaker 2: I don't know, Yeah, same question.

1349
01:08:05,200 --> 01:08:09,280
Speaker 3: I wrote about predators for next week's Foundations, and it's

1350
01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:13,640
Speaker 3: just I'm like you, if people want to trap, they

1351
01:08:13,680 --> 01:08:15,480
Speaker 3: want to hunt them. I don't care at all. Like

1352
01:08:15,520 --> 01:08:19,120
Speaker 3: donuts for donuts, it just does not It's not appealing

1353
01:08:19,160 --> 01:08:22,640
Speaker 3: to me, and I can't really describe why. It's just

1354
01:08:22,680 --> 01:08:25,599
Speaker 3: not for whatever reason, I think it's I think it's cool,

1355
01:08:26,360 --> 01:08:28,960
Speaker 3: you know, like I know how like hardcore Garrett is

1356
01:08:29,000 --> 01:08:32,040
Speaker 3: and you're honest and those guys are and I get it.

1357
01:08:32,040 --> 01:08:34,479
Speaker 3: It's just for whatever reason, just does not work with me.

1358
01:08:35,280 --> 01:08:36,640
Speaker 3: It's not it's not that interesting.

1359
01:08:37,880 --> 01:08:40,200
Speaker 2: What's interesting to me though, is like, and this is

1360
01:08:40,240 --> 01:08:41,840
Speaker 2: maybe me getting I don't know if it's me getting

1361
01:08:41,880 --> 01:08:46,240
Speaker 2: soft or or what it is, but this is a

1362
01:08:46,280 --> 01:08:49,599
Speaker 2: little wulu. But I almost like see myself in them,

1363
01:08:49,600 --> 01:08:53,000
Speaker 2: Like we're both hunters, you know, like I can relate

1364
01:08:53,160 --> 01:08:57,760
Speaker 2: in a way. So I'm fascinated with them, but I'm

1365
01:08:57,760 --> 01:08:59,519
Speaker 2: more so like I want to see it and I

1366
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:01,760
Speaker 2: want to high five and good luck on your next

1367
01:09:01,760 --> 01:09:02,200
Speaker 2: deer hunt.

1368
01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:05,519
Speaker 3: So I want to just take a moment to pause

1369
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:08,240
Speaker 3: here and let everybody who's listening to this know that

1370
01:09:08,280 --> 01:09:11,280
Speaker 3: Mark Kenyon just compared himself to a mountain lion, and

1371
01:09:11,840 --> 01:09:15,160
Speaker 3: he's he's kindred spirits with a mountain lion.

1372
01:09:15,960 --> 01:09:17,639
Speaker 2: Hey, we're both deer hunters.

1373
01:09:17,640 --> 01:09:20,840
Speaker 3: Man, Hey, listen, you can be as delusional as you want, buddy,

1374
01:09:20,880 --> 01:09:21,680
Speaker 3: It's okay.

1375
01:09:23,080 --> 01:09:25,600
Speaker 2: You're probably right. But all I can tell you is

1376
01:09:25,640 --> 01:09:28,280
Speaker 2: that they are fascinating critters. I'm really glad I got

1377
01:09:28,320 --> 01:09:30,479
Speaker 2: to get out there and chase them around a little bit.

1378
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:35,040
Speaker 2: And and yeah, whether or not I want to shoot

1379
01:09:35,080 --> 01:09:39,240
Speaker 2: him or not, I I'm glad they're out there. And

1380
01:09:39,240 --> 01:09:41,040
Speaker 2: and I hope we can find a way that we

1381
01:09:41,080 --> 01:09:44,160
Speaker 2: can live alongside of them better and and manage them,

1382
01:09:44,200 --> 01:09:47,760
Speaker 2: but can serve them. And it was it was a

1383
01:09:47,760 --> 01:09:50,000
Speaker 2: really eye opening experience that I enjoyed a lot.

1384
01:09:50,800 --> 01:09:54,000
Speaker 3: I mean, the whole predator thing is is a category

1385
01:09:54,360 --> 01:09:58,280
Speaker 3: of hunting that needs the right pr for sure, Like

1386
01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:00,760
Speaker 3: because that's a that's an easy one for people to

1387
01:10:00,800 --> 01:10:03,000
Speaker 3: draw a line in the sand on, especially people who

1388
01:10:03,040 --> 01:10:07,479
Speaker 3: don't really understand predator pray relations. So yeah, anything any

1389
01:10:08,040 --> 01:10:10,519
Speaker 3: way to put that in a more positive educational light

1390
01:10:10,640 --> 01:10:11,760
Speaker 3: is probably a good thing.

1391
01:10:12,280 --> 01:10:16,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree. And on that note, man, I've got

1392
01:10:16,200 --> 01:10:19,160
Speaker 2: to shut this down because I've got a hard stop

1393
01:10:19,439 --> 01:10:23,000
Speaker 2: and appointment to get to. But thanks, thanks for joining me,

1394
01:10:23,080 --> 01:10:25,799
Speaker 2: thanks for talking sheds and scouting and all that good stuff,

1395
01:10:26,360 --> 01:10:30,280
Speaker 2: and nobuddy, let's do it again soon for sure. And

1396
01:10:30,400 --> 01:10:32,559
Speaker 2: with that, I will just say to everyone else listening,

1397
01:10:32,720 --> 01:10:35,760
Speaker 2: thank you for being here, thanks for tuning in. Get

1398
01:10:35,760 --> 01:10:39,280
Speaker 2: out there, get walking, do your scouting, do your shed hunting,

1399
01:10:39,439 --> 01:10:42,240
Speaker 2: and until next time, stay wired.

1400
01:10:42,760 --> 01:10:43,000
Speaker 3: Don