1 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: This episode is sponsored by FX's Fleischman Is in Trouble, 2 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:09,399 Speaker 1: starring Jesse Eisenberg, Claire Danes, Lizzie Kaplan, and Adam Brodie. 3 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:12,639 Speaker 1: The strama tells the story of recently divorce Toby Fleischmann, 4 00:00:12,800 --> 00:00:15,320 Speaker 1: who dies into the world of app bass dating with 5 00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 1: the kind of success he never had in his youth. 6 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:21,280 Speaker 1: Then his ex wife disappears, leaving him with their two 7 00:00:21,360 --> 00:00:24,880 Speaker 1: children and no hint of her return effectus. Fleischman Is 8 00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 1: in Trouble, streaming November seventeenth only on Hulu. Good morning, peeps, 9 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:45,720 Speaker 1: and welcome to WIKA f Daily with Me Your Girl. 10 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 1: Danielle Moody pre recording from my Brooklyn Silarium. Folks, Today, 11 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:56,000 Speaker 1: I'm really excited to bring a conversation to you with 12 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:00,400 Speaker 1: doctor Keisha Blaine. She's an associate professor of history at 13 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:04,000 Speaker 1: the University of Pittsburgh an author of the book Until 14 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 1: I Am Free, Fannie lou Hamer's Enduring Message to America. 15 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 1: I get into a really great conversation with doctor Blaine 16 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:20,160 Speaker 1: about how important history is, particularly right now, and what 17 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:28,319 Speaker 1: it means to her to see such a pushback against 18 00:01:28,400 --> 00:01:32,119 Speaker 1: the true history of this country. That she's dedicated her 19 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 1: professional life to not only studying, but in offering to 20 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: all of us pieces of that history through her work, 21 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 1: whether it is her writing for MSNBC dot com or 22 00:01:46,319 --> 00:01:51,279 Speaker 1: through her several books that she has. And I think 23 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 1: about history a lot, because for me, it was one 24 00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: of my favorite subjects in school. History, which would then 25 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:04,919 Speaker 1: turn into government. Into government and politics were always really 26 00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 1: interesting to me. I liked learning about the people that 27 00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:13,760 Speaker 1: came before me, about how they what their role was 28 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:16,880 Speaker 1: in moving our society forward, or what their role was 29 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:23,600 Speaker 1: in thwarting progress. I remember my first time going to 30 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:32,040 Speaker 1: the US capital, and it was my first day working 31 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 1: on Capitol Hill and I was coming up the Metro 32 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: Capitol South station in Washington, DC. When you come up 33 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:46,079 Speaker 1: that long escalator ride up the stairs, you look up 34 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 1: and around you can see the Capitol, which looks like, 35 00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:52,240 Speaker 1: you know, a three D pop up right, like a 36 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:54,720 Speaker 1: three member those three D books or cards that you 37 00:02:54,760 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 1: would get. It looks like that. It almost looks, you know, 38 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:02,680 Speaker 1: super imposed on the landscape. And then all of these 39 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:10,680 Speaker 1: huge white, you know, congressional buildings, offices, congressional offices surrounding. 40 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 1: And I remember coming up those escalators and catching my breath, 41 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 1: that I could not believe that I was going to 42 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 1: be walking the same paths as so many of my 43 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:33,520 Speaker 1: heroes and heroines. And what I think about history now, 44 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 1: and I particularly, you know, following the insurrection, which I 45 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: remember crying that day, I will be honest with you, 46 00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 1: the day of the insurrection one six. And why was 47 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:54,440 Speaker 1: I crying? Because these people, that angry white mob ruined 48 00:03:54,560 --> 00:04:00,520 Speaker 1: something that I treasure right, which is our democracy. But 49 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: these buildings, to me, are more than buildings there where 50 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 1: lives are changed, made better or worse. There where this 51 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 1: area is where history is made, where speeches that resonate 52 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 1: are made, where quotes are chiseled into marble. Knowing that 53 00:04:25,760 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 1: it was enslaved black people that created all of this, right, 54 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 1: and having that juxtaposition of emotion where on one hand, 55 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:41,160 Speaker 1: I am thinking, oh, my goodness, I'm going to be 56 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 1: a part of history, and I'm going to be a 57 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:47,840 Speaker 1: part of creating legislation and working on bills, you know, 58 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:52,040 Speaker 1: and shaping this country for the better. And then on 59 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 1: the other hand really thinking to myself, oh, dear God, 60 00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 1: this place is filled with the skeletons of people that 61 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:06,159 Speaker 1: we will never know, We'll never know the names of 62 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 1: the enslaved African people whose hands and bodies were broken 63 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 1: so that this country could be formed. It's a really 64 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 1: interesting place to kind of sit. And in my conversation 65 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 1: with doctor Kesha Blaine, you know, we both lament about 66 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:32,800 Speaker 1: who we would be if our history hadn't been robbed 67 00:05:32,839 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: from us. That there are so many actors, so many 68 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:43,839 Speaker 1: people important, people like Fanny leu Hamer, who people really 69 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:47,960 Speaker 1: don't know, which is why doctor Blaine wrote the book. 70 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:52,520 Speaker 1: She said, as a historian, somebody that went to school 71 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 1: to become a professional historian, she did not learn about 72 00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 1: Fanny leu Hammer until her senior year of college. And 73 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 1: so when we talk about this fight against truth, this 74 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:16,040 Speaker 1: fight against history, it we never really delve into how 75 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:23,599 Speaker 1: it has been robbed from all of us, not just 76 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:29,760 Speaker 1: about the whitewashing right. The whitewashing is a purposeful weapon, 77 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 1: right to weaponize and to demean, right to demean other 78 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:41,479 Speaker 1: communities and groups, to say that they have had nothing 79 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,560 Speaker 1: to offer, that they are not really Americans. And this 80 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:51,839 Speaker 1: is why you have angry white Americans these days pointing 81 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:55,360 Speaker 1: and telling you who is American and who isn't. Because 82 00:06:55,360 --> 00:07:00,120 Speaker 1: it has been indoctrinated, because if they learned who who 83 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:03,960 Speaker 1: created the cotton gin, who created the light filament, who 84 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:08,040 Speaker 1: created the stop light, who created the hair press, who 85 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:11,400 Speaker 1: created this, that and the other thing, Then if that 86 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:14,840 Speaker 1: had been taught as a part of their history, not 87 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:19,040 Speaker 1: just during Black History Month, but had been a part 88 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: of how they learned history, do you think that we 89 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 1: would be in this tormented, hate filled place that we 90 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 1: are now. I don't think so. And that is purposeful 91 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:36,720 Speaker 1: because I've said this before. If you can profit off 92 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:39,560 Speaker 1: of hate, and if hate and fear are easier to 93 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 1: sell than hope, and you're a snake oil salesman like Trump, 94 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:47,480 Speaker 1: like a Tucker Carlson, like the late piece of shit 95 00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:52,840 Speaker 1: Rush Limbaugh, if you are going to be like the Rogan, 96 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 1: you know, like, if you are going to be that 97 00:07:54,960 --> 00:08:05,120 Speaker 1: person who is going to capitalize on misery, then it 98 00:08:05,160 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 1: works for you to maintain that lie. And how do 99 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:12,680 Speaker 1: you do that through education. That's why I say that 100 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 1: education is one of the biggest ways that we keep 101 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:23,640 Speaker 1: white supremacy going. Just look through your child's history book. 102 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:30,440 Speaker 1: There is no mention of the contributions of really anybody 103 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:35,400 Speaker 1: outside of white men. So why then do you think 104 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 1: that white men are the only ones that are ever 105 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 1: in power, are allowed to have power. Why do you 106 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:45,320 Speaker 1: think that these people walk around and they get to 107 00:08:45,360 --> 00:08:49,120 Speaker 1: tell you or ask you where are you from? Where 108 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 1: did you come from? If you are not white? Because 109 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 1: our contributions, the myriad of contributions that are made by 110 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:04,600 Speaker 1: black people, Brown people, Asian, Pacific Islanders, everybody, Latin X people, 111 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:11,760 Speaker 1: Native Americans who we completely dismiss altogether contributed to the 112 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 1: story of America. But as I have often said, history 113 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 1: is told by the conqueror, not the conquered. That's what 114 00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:33,360 Speaker 1: the cricket player said. History is told by the conqueror, 115 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:40,320 Speaker 1: not the conquered. But we have an opportunity because we 116 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:44,760 Speaker 1: are conscious to the fuckory now. We are all aware 117 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 1: about the gaslight and how deep it goes because we 118 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:52,080 Speaker 1: are watching it play out right now. We wondered, how 119 00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 1: did people think about, you know, think you think about 120 00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:58,280 Speaker 1: back in the day when we were when we were 121 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: burning women at the state right, because any woman that 122 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 1: had an opinion of thought leadership was considered a witch. Right, 123 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:16,800 Speaker 1: how is it that we think that we have grown 124 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:21,319 Speaker 1: when those same people who would have burned women at 125 00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 1: the stake right, are the same people that are burning books, 126 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:28,679 Speaker 1: are the same people that are telling women that you 127 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:34,240 Speaker 1: can't have control over your bodies? Right. We haven't grown, really, 128 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 1: We just the tactics of oppression have just changed with 129 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:46,439 Speaker 1: time and technology. And I think that the reason why 130 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 1: it continues is because we don't know our history. We 131 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 1: take these isolated incidents that the powers that be want 132 00:10:56,840 --> 00:11:02,240 Speaker 1: to tell us right how to move, how they are, 133 00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:08,600 Speaker 1: but we don't really ask questions because you see, we 134 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:14,000 Speaker 1: don't teach in a way that we want people to 135 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:27,320 Speaker 1: ask questions. We want to deposit information. We don't want 136 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:32,319 Speaker 1: to teach critical thinking. And that makes sense given the 137 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 1: fact that we just initially wanted people to be on 138 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:41,440 Speaker 1: lines at factories. You put in this widget thing, the 139 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:43,840 Speaker 1: person next to you puts in their widget thing, and 140 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:48,160 Speaker 1: there was really no interrogation of the process. Right. You 141 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:52,120 Speaker 1: never even saw probably the end result. You just looked 142 00:11:52,120 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 1: at your piece. H there's no real critical thought. The 143 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 1: world has changed rapidly, and we would do a service 144 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 1: to each other if we actually asked more questions, if 145 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:18,120 Speaker 1: we knew the truth. And so I'm so excited for 146 00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 1: you all to hear the conversation with doctor Kesha Blaine, 147 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:28,319 Speaker 1: Because one, there are some very horrific things that have 148 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:33,040 Speaker 1: happened in this country, that continue to happen in this country, 149 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:40,280 Speaker 1: And I believe that we are in the midst of 150 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:49,080 Speaker 1: an extraordinary and extraordinarily dangerous breakthrough. They don't call them 151 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:56,120 Speaker 1: growing pains for no reason. Growth is painful. Breakthroughs are painful. 152 00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:02,000 Speaker 1: So are breakdowns. I believe that both of these things 153 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:06,560 Speaker 1: are happening right now. We have an opportunity. Who do 154 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:10,640 Speaker 1: we want to be? What do we want the next 155 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:15,000 Speaker 1: chapters of our story of America's story to be the 156 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:20,840 Speaker 1: continued perpetuation of the lies, or an opportunity to reimagine 157 00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:26,800 Speaker 1: the story not through the perception the prism of the conqueror, 158 00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:34,000 Speaker 1: but through those that have been conquered, through those who 159 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 1: have been invisibilized. What would that American history book look like? 160 00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:48,440 Speaker 1: What would that story be? You know, in societies that 161 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 1: are on the brink, a couple of things happen. You 162 00:13:56,679 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 1: begin to use the media as a tool for propaganda. 163 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 1: You spread lies, you discredit truth, scientist academics facts. Do 164 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:21,200 Speaker 1: you wear people out emotionally with anxiety, fear of loss, 165 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:27,320 Speaker 1: which creates tribalism, and then you go in for the kill. 166 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 1: We're in Act three right now, and I'm not quite 167 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:39,720 Speaker 1: sure how the play is going to end. I'm pretty 168 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: sure it's not a comedy. I'm pretty sure it's not 169 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:50,040 Speaker 1: even a dramedy at this point. But there is opportunity 170 00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:54,600 Speaker 1: in the obstacles that we are being presented with. How 171 00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: this story ends, I think is going to be up 172 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 1: to every single one of us. We will see coming 173 00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 1: up next, friends, is my conversation with doctor Kesha Blaine, 174 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 1: the author of Until I Am Free, Fanny lu Hamer's 175 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:19,920 Speaker 1: Enduring Message to America. And then the reality is is 176 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: that until all of us are free, none of us, 177 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:32,000 Speaker 1: none of us are free, folks. I am very excited 178 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: to welcome to woke f for the very first time, 179 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 1: doctor Kesha Blaine, who's Associate professor of history at the 180 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:44,200 Speaker 1: University of Pittsburgh, also an MSNBC columnists and the author 181 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 1: of Until I Am Free, Fanny lu Hamer's Enduring Message 182 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 1: to America. Doctor Kesha Blaine, let me first start off 183 00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 1: with saying that one of the things that I've always 184 00:15:57,080 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: troubled me in my life is how little I know 185 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 1: about some of the most extraordinary and exceptional black activists 186 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:10,040 Speaker 1: that are responsible frankly for the work that I do, 187 00:16:10,120 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 1: for me even being able to be here and speak 188 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 1: out on behalf of injustice. Fanny lu Hamer is one 189 00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:21,440 Speaker 1: of those people who, while the name may roll off 190 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 1: the tongue, the real understanding of what she endured right, 191 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 1: how she became an activist and why is something that 192 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:38,120 Speaker 1: you explore in this book. And I want to ask you, 193 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: you know again, from my vantage point, this type of 194 00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: history is necessary because it's been purposefully white, It's been 195 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:52,480 Speaker 1: purposefully whitewashed and denied right from our quote unquote mainstream education. 196 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:55,520 Speaker 1: We're watching this happen right now with the pushback and 197 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,800 Speaker 1: the white lash against critical race theory, which isn't even 198 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 1: taught in K three twelve. But nonetheless, what compelled you 199 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:11,200 Speaker 1: at this particular time to really delve into Fanny Luhimer's life? Wow, 200 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: so many factors, And you know, listening to you made 201 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:17,439 Speaker 1: me think about my own experience because it was not 202 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:21,240 Speaker 1: until senior year of college that I even found out 203 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:24,679 Speaker 1: about Fanny Luhimer. And I was majoring in history and 204 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 1: afrikan of Studies. I was taking courses particularly on the 205 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 1: black experience, but it still took me some time to 206 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:36,760 Speaker 1: get to her, and I think this is true for 207 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:39,679 Speaker 1: most people. One of the reasons why I wanted to 208 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 1: write this book in this particular moment was not only 209 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:47,720 Speaker 1: to introduce people to Fanny Luhimer, but more sort of 210 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:54,359 Speaker 1: to get people to start thinking about how Fanny Luhimer's ideas, 211 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 1: how her political strategies, how her activism could in fact 212 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:02,840 Speaker 1: provide a model for us. I think there was a 213 00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: particular moment where, you know, I was just sitting and 214 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 1: reflecting on everything that was going on, and this was 215 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,399 Speaker 1: in the context of the Trump presidency. This was also 216 00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:17,399 Speaker 1: the context of the uprisings that were taking place across 217 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:22,200 Speaker 1: the nation and also globally, and I think so many, 218 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:25,359 Speaker 1: like so many people, I felt discouraged. I was frustrated 219 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:29,680 Speaker 1: because I said to myself, we are constantly it seems 220 00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:31,720 Speaker 1: like we're fighting the same battles over and over again. 221 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 1: It seems like we're not making as much progress as 222 00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:37,120 Speaker 1: we think we're making, or even when we do make progress, 223 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:40,600 Speaker 1: we're making steps backwards. And so for me, it was 224 00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 1: about centering Fannie Wiheimer's voice and her words, which always 225 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 1: inspired me and I returned to Hammer, particularly during the pandemic, 226 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:54,960 Speaker 1: during the uprisings, uh, you know, reading more about her, 227 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:59,399 Speaker 1: you know, reading her speeches again, and I felt it 228 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,680 Speaker 1: was necessary to bring the story to a large republic, 229 00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 1: um that I believe needed to hear humorous voice, not 230 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:10,919 Speaker 1: only to find inspiration, but particularly to find political strategy 231 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:14,159 Speaker 1: and to figure out how we could make this nation 232 00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:17,199 Speaker 1: better and certainly this world better. You know. One of 233 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 1: the things that strikes me in your book and in 234 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:26,280 Speaker 1: the in the Discovery is that sanny Lu did not 235 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:32,600 Speaker 1: become an activist until in her mid forties. Um. Can 236 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 1: you speak to that, because you know, many folks when 237 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:39,879 Speaker 1: we think about activism, right, we think about marches and 238 00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:45,959 Speaker 1: young people, um, you know, getting um engaged in our 239 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:48,720 Speaker 1: in our teens. Right. And and for some people, again, 240 00:19:48,760 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 1: there are different moments, there are different catalysts. And for sure, 241 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 1: you know, during twenty twenty, when there was just so 242 00:19:56,760 --> 00:20:01,560 Speaker 1: much horrific racial injustice that was transpiring. I mean, right 243 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:05,000 Speaker 1: now we're watching the Kyle Rittenhouse case. Right now we're 244 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 1: watching you know, the murder trial of the men that 245 00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:12,919 Speaker 1: killed Ahmad Aubrey in cold blood, all of this having 246 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:17,679 Speaker 1: transpired over twenty twenty sparked activism in people that hadn't 247 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:22,639 Speaker 1: been before. What was the spark or sparks for Fanny 248 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:25,200 Speaker 1: leu Hamer at the age as you say at a 249 00:20:25,359 --> 00:20:29,080 Speaker 1: forty four, Well, there are so many factors, you know. 250 00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 1: One of the things that I emphasize in the book 251 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:34,919 Speaker 1: that I think is so important to think about is 252 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:38,360 Speaker 1: the crucial work of the Student Non Violence Coordinating Committee. 253 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 1: So this is an organization that we referred to as SMIKE. 254 00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 1: And what is so interesting about this is I think 255 00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 1: most people are pretty familiar with many of the activisms 256 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:53,520 Speaker 1: in SMIKE. We're talking about folks like John Lewis, Bob Moses, 257 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:56,119 Speaker 1: and you know, as you point out, many of the 258 00:20:56,119 --> 00:20:59,520 Speaker 1: activists who are involved were quite young. SNICK as an 259 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 1: organization had been established on a college campus that many 260 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:05,199 Speaker 1: of those who were leaders in the movement were in 261 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:09,119 Speaker 1: their early twenties when they got involved. But one of 262 00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:12,200 Speaker 1: the things that's so valuable about SNICK, which comes out 263 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 1: of really the vision of Ella Baker, who was the 264 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:18,440 Speaker 1: visionary of SNICK, is that they were committed to this 265 00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:21,159 Speaker 1: notion of grass roots leadership. So they were going to 266 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:24,520 Speaker 1: communities and they would bring information, they would bring resources. 267 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:27,720 Speaker 1: Above all, they would be looking for ways to tap 268 00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:31,840 Speaker 1: into the potential of people on the ground. And that's 269 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 1: exactly what they did in nineteen sixty two when they 270 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:39,159 Speaker 1: showed up Haymer's community in Mississippi. They were there to 271 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,439 Speaker 1: share information, you know, to help with voter registration. They 272 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:45,680 Speaker 1: were there to talk about the constitution, to make sure 273 00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:50,359 Speaker 1: that they were giving information and empowering local residents. But 274 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:55,200 Speaker 1: they were also trying to you know, really see who 275 00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 1: was there who might be interested in joining the movement, 276 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,960 Speaker 1: who could in fact emerge as the lead. And they 277 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,159 Speaker 1: found that in Hamer, as so many others. And so 278 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:06,480 Speaker 1: Hamer attended a meeting, a mass meeting that was held 279 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,520 Speaker 1: at a church in August nineteen sixty two. As you 280 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,840 Speaker 1: point out, she was forty four years old. According to Hamer, 281 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,640 Speaker 1: is the first time that she learned about her constitutional 282 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:18,439 Speaker 1: right to vote as a citizen of the United States. 283 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:21,800 Speaker 1: And I'll always pause when I think of that. It 284 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:25,680 Speaker 1: certainly helped us see really just the brutality, you know, 285 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 1: of Jim Crow, because it wasn't just about I mean, 286 00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:30,919 Speaker 1: absolutely the violence. We have to talk about that, but 287 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,120 Speaker 1: the one of the other strategies, which isn't surprising when 288 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,160 Speaker 1: you also when you look at you know, the history 289 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 1: of slavery was the effort to keep information from people, 290 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 1: to block people from having access to quality education, to 291 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: block people from just knowing what their rights and privileges are, 292 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:52,600 Speaker 1: you know, as citizens, in order to continue to keep 293 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:55,680 Speaker 1: them in a system of subjugation. And so Fanny will 294 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 1: Hammer learned in that meeting about her rights. She learned 295 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:02,200 Speaker 1: about the reconstruct from amendments. I mean, these were things 296 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:05,640 Speaker 1: that really I think transformed her. It was a political 297 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:08,879 Speaker 1: awakening as much as it was a religious awakening, you know. 298 00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:10,919 Speaker 1: As I explained, she saw that it was God's calling 299 00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:14,199 Speaker 1: for her to join the movement. You know, it's so 300 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:19,760 Speaker 1: interesting because I think about myself and my own calling 301 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:23,280 Speaker 1: into activism, and I think that in hindsight, I would 302 00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:26,520 Speaker 1: say that it really is a calling, right, that it 303 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:29,919 Speaker 1: is that that there is something to the extent that 304 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:34,959 Speaker 1: is divine about recognizing the struggles of other people of 305 00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:38,080 Speaker 1: yourself and wanting to do what it is that you 306 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,119 Speaker 1: can with the talents that you've been provided, you know, 307 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 1: to advance equity. Right, and that is that is what 308 00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:47,960 Speaker 1: I have always seen, you know, and looking at old 309 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:52,840 Speaker 1: images and video of Fanny lew Hamer is just that 310 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 1: the indignation of it all right, um, which I think 311 00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 1: is extraordinary, um, because we should be indignant in the 312 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 1: face of injustice, and you know, and talk about the 313 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,400 Speaker 1: fact that until I'm free, no one is free. Right. 314 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: Can you talk to also a part of our history 315 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 1: in this country that we never really delve into, which 316 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:22,120 Speaker 1: is sterilization and the forced sterilization of black and brown 317 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 1: women and poor women. And we love to say, you know, 318 00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:28,800 Speaker 1: this isn't the country I knew. It's one of it's 319 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:33,760 Speaker 1: one of the most frustrating phrases that I think come 320 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:35,720 Speaker 1: out of the mouths of many people. This isn't who 321 00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:39,119 Speaker 1: we are. Every time that we are faced with a 322 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:42,359 Speaker 1: mirror that shows us the brutality and cruelty that this 323 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:47,400 Speaker 1: country was founded on. Talk to us about that legacy 324 00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:52,400 Speaker 1: and why we don't talk about it enough? Wow, so much, 325 00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:55,840 Speaker 1: I could say. In fact, as you were speaking, I 326 00:24:56,160 --> 00:25:00,120 Speaker 1: thought of my own journey and one of the reasons 327 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,399 Speaker 1: that I came to the place where I realized that 328 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:05,919 Speaker 1: I needed to write books and articles that did not 329 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:10,400 Speaker 1: simply speak to you know, the needs and concerns of academics, 330 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 1: as much as that's important within academia, but I needed 331 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,200 Speaker 1: to make sure that I was writing books that anyone 332 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 1: you know, could read and really find useful. Was because 333 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:24,080 Speaker 1: of that that very same thing. You know, hearing people 334 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:29,480 Speaker 1: talk about moments in the contemporary context and you know, saying, 335 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 1: this is not who we are. That's shocking. We've never 336 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 1: seen this sort of violence in a black church. For example, 337 00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:37,440 Speaker 1: this happened, you know, I think in twenty fifteen with 338 00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:40,399 Speaker 1: the Charleston shooting. I can't tell you how many people 339 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,520 Speaker 1: were on television saying, oh, this is you know, this 340 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 1: is so different, this is this is not American. You know, 341 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:48,840 Speaker 1: this does not happen in American history, and you're thinking, really, 342 00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 1: have you read a history book. Lately? Black churches are 343 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,879 Speaker 1: constantly targeted and have been targeted for a long time. 344 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:59,800 Speaker 1: And so back to this point about forsterilizations, it's really 345 00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,159 Speaker 1: tracking to me. I think over the last year we've 346 00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 1: spoken a little bit about it, and every time it 347 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:09,359 Speaker 1: comes up in the news, people say exactly that, it's like, oh, 348 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:12,160 Speaker 1: this is this is so different. We you know, where 349 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:14,200 Speaker 1: where does this actually happen? Well, it happens in the 350 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:17,040 Speaker 1: United States, and if you pay attention to the experiences, 351 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:19,960 Speaker 1: as you point out a black and brown women, impoverished women, 352 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,480 Speaker 1: then you see a longer pattern. It's a brutal you know, 353 00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:26,200 Speaker 1: it's a brutal pat I mean, it's a brutal history, 354 00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:29,800 Speaker 1: is a traumatic history. You know. Hamer in nineteen sixty one, 355 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,480 Speaker 1: one year before she joined the movement, had been hospitalized 356 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:37,159 Speaker 1: to remove a small uterine tumor. This was a noncancerous tumor. 357 00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:40,679 Speaker 1: There should have been a fairly simple procedure. The white 358 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 1: doctor who performed the procedure I decided to remove Hamer's uterus. 359 00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:50,080 Speaker 1: That was traumatic enough, but he didn't even tell her. 360 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:53,080 Speaker 1: He didn't even tell her immediately after. He actually told 361 00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 1: others and Hammer found out about it through the whispering network. 362 00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:00,679 Speaker 1: When Hammer found out, she confronts to him and she 363 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:03,600 Speaker 1: demanded an answer, and he did not provide an answer. 364 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:05,720 Speaker 1: And as Hammer pointed out, he didn't have to because 365 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,000 Speaker 1: it was not it was not unusual. It was actually 366 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: quite common. It was quite common in the hospital where 367 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:16,080 Speaker 1: Hamer had the procedure done. It was quite common in Mississippi. 368 00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:18,320 Speaker 1: It was common throughout the South, and it was happening 369 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:22,760 Speaker 1: across the nation where why doctors were taking it upon 370 00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:29,360 Speaker 1: themselves to decide who they considered fit or unfit for reproduction. 371 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,960 Speaker 1: And of course, we understand the history of racism, we 372 00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:37,640 Speaker 1: understand eugenics, we understand how black women, how a women 373 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:43,000 Speaker 1: of color in particular, and impoverished women are often targeted 374 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 1: in these contexts. And so Hamer decided to talk about 375 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:50,439 Speaker 1: it as an activist, and to do so because she 376 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,639 Speaker 1: realized that a lot of people had no knowledge. You know, 377 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 1: there's a moment where in the book Hamer is giving testimony. 378 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 1: She's talking at this convention. She's talking about forcedialization. She's 379 00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:05,600 Speaker 1: talking about how this is a pattern there's happening in 380 00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:08,560 Speaker 1: the South, and it's happening in her community. And there's 381 00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:12,480 Speaker 1: a doctor there from Harvard and he's he's asking her, 382 00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:16,080 Speaker 1: you know, to clarify, because he's not he's not grasping 383 00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:19,360 Speaker 1: what she's saying. He's not even understanding it because to him, 384 00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:21,640 Speaker 1: this doesn't happen in the United States. And she tells 385 00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:23,119 Speaker 1: him and he says, I've never heard of this, and 386 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 1: she says, well, you don't have to hear about it. 387 00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:28,199 Speaker 1: I've experienced it. And so many people who look like 388 00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:30,960 Speaker 1: me have experienced it, and I think to this very 389 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:33,960 Speaker 1: day you will find people sort of puzzled, like, oh, 390 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,880 Speaker 1: this is this is interesting? When does this happen? Well, 391 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 1: it happens, and it has happened for a long time 392 00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:42,720 Speaker 1: if you pay attention to the experiences of black and 393 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:46,680 Speaker 1: brown women and impoverished women in particular. You know, Jeki Plan, 394 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:49,480 Speaker 1: I want to ask you something that just struck me 395 00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: as you're talking. And you know, I think that the 396 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 1: biggest power, the biggest win of white supremacy in this 397 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,880 Speaker 1: country around the world, has been the ability to disrupt 398 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 1: our history. Who we are, where we came from, what 399 00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:10,320 Speaker 1: we know, how we learn ourselves. The fact that you 400 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:14,720 Speaker 1: went to school to become a historian didn't learn about 401 00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:20,440 Speaker 1: Fanny leu Hamer until your senior year in university. I 402 00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:26,480 Speaker 1: also wasn't introduced to many different figures that should be 403 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:31,440 Speaker 1: names that we just know until college and after college, 404 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:35,040 Speaker 1: and in still discovering people like Paulie Murray, who I 405 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:40,840 Speaker 1: just learned about recently, right through the documentary that is 406 00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:47,800 Speaker 1: out now. What are your concerns about the conversations that 407 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 1: we are having right now, the debate about what kids learn, 408 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,480 Speaker 1: particularly white children because we don't care what black and 409 00:29:55,520 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 1: brown children learn. What are your concerns about this countries 410 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:07,240 Speaker 1: relationship to history, relationship to its history, and the direction 411 00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:11,000 Speaker 1: that we are moving in right now. Well, I think 412 00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 1: what is so disheartening at this particular moment is that, 413 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:20,160 Speaker 1: you know, there's so many people who have convinced themselves 414 00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:22,640 Speaker 1: quite frankly, I don't know how else to explain, and 415 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 1: have convinced themselves that somehow, if we teach the history 416 00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 1: and its fullest sense, if we talk about the experiences 417 00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 1: of marginalized groups in this country, that somehow is going 418 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:41,720 Speaker 1: to cause division. And there's this bizarre notion that division 419 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,480 Speaker 1: happens because people learn the history and because people know 420 00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:49,920 Speaker 1: exactly what led us to this particular moment. The irony 421 00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:53,600 Speaker 1: is that the nation has already divided. It has been divided, 422 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 1: and in fact, if you've paid attention to the history 423 00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:59,120 Speaker 1: and you learned the history, you would know why it 424 00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:03,160 Speaker 1: has been divided. And part of I think what is 425 00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:05,520 Speaker 1: sad about all these conversations, you know, as you point 426 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:07,240 Speaker 1: out for critical race theory, you know, I remember the 427 00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: first time I heard the discussion. I think I might 428 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:11,880 Speaker 1: have put on the television I heard someone talking about 429 00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:14,800 Speaker 1: critical race theory. I stopped and I thought, are they're 430 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:18,000 Speaker 1: talking about critical race theory. That's odd. Who's talking about 431 00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:21,200 Speaker 1: critical race theory? You know, I have a PhD in history. 432 00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:25,120 Speaker 1: I didn't learn critical race theory. I know my friends 433 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:28,440 Speaker 1: in law school do, but that's not something that I was, 434 00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: you know, taught in any class. I certainly read it, 435 00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:34,080 Speaker 1: you know, critical race theory when I had an opportunity 436 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 1: to do so, but that was on my own. This 437 00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:38,440 Speaker 1: was not some sort of common practice, and I heard 438 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:41,280 Speaker 1: people talking about it as if it was something you know, 439 00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:44,040 Speaker 1: common day. Everyone was talking about critical race theory, and 440 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 1: of course, you know, within ten minutes I realized, Oh, 441 00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:49,760 Speaker 1: they don't know what critical race theory is. They think 442 00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:52,600 Speaker 1: that means that whenever you talk about black history, you know, 443 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:55,320 Speaker 1: that's critical race theory, you know. And so it's I 444 00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:58,280 Speaker 1: think it's so strange that at the very same moment 445 00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:01,040 Speaker 1: that there's a lack of knowledge, as a lack of 446 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,320 Speaker 1: knowledge of the history in particular. Here I am pushing, 447 00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:07,360 Speaker 1: as so many others, trying to get this history out 448 00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 1: into the world, at the very same moment people saying, no, 449 00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,360 Speaker 1: don't teach these things. Don't teach these things because it's 450 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,280 Speaker 1: going to cause problems in our schools. And I think 451 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,280 Speaker 1: that's disheartening because I, you know, I teach courses at 452 00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: the college level. I'm mostly teach students you know, who 453 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,880 Speaker 1: are white. You know, I you know, I'm always happy 454 00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:29,400 Speaker 1: to teach students from any background, but but I teach 455 00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:32,200 Speaker 1: at the predominant white institution. Most of my students are white, 456 00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:35,160 Speaker 1: and most of my students walk into the classroom with 457 00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:38,880 Speaker 1: very little knowledge of even topics like the Civil Rights movement. 458 00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,840 Speaker 1: They know Martin Kicking Junior, they know Rosa Parks, and 459 00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,480 Speaker 1: then I mentioned Fan Luhimer and everyone stunned, right, And 460 00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 1: I talk about Ella Baker and never heard of her. 461 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:50,000 Speaker 1: And so I'm glad that they're taking my courses. And 462 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,239 Speaker 1: many of them have chosen to be there because they 463 00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:56,920 Speaker 1: just want to learn. But the fact is that most 464 00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:00,840 Speaker 1: people could in fact obtain a college degree, they could 465 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: go on to law school, they could go on to 466 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,800 Speaker 1: med school and not have even heard, you know about 467 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:09,320 Speaker 1: Henrietta Lacks, for example, how many doctors you know learned 468 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:12,640 Speaker 1: about Henrietta Lacks just recently. What does that tell you 469 00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:15,520 Speaker 1: about the history, and and and that is dangerous, and 470 00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 1: you know, when you don't even know the history of 471 00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:22,920 Speaker 1: medical racism and how you know, people's lives have been 472 00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:26,600 Speaker 1: shaped by by all of these developments. And so I 473 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,880 Speaker 1: just think it's so I think important in this moment 474 00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:35,520 Speaker 1: to push against all of these efforts to restrict you know, um, 475 00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:38,560 Speaker 1: the information that I think is so vital in knowing 476 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 1: the history of black people, in knowing the history of 477 00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:45,920 Speaker 1: every marginalized group in the United States. Yeah, it's just 478 00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:50,360 Speaker 1: you know, you realize that it isn't none of these 479 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 1: things are done by accident. And I think that you know, 480 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:56,480 Speaker 1: even the word disheartening doesn't you know, doesn't really fully 481 00:33:56,600 --> 00:34:02,240 Speaker 1: grasp what it means to know that we've been gas 482 00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 1: lit our whole lives, right, and that the intention behind 483 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:11,799 Speaker 1: that is to uphold a system of oppression that creates 484 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:18,080 Speaker 1: a invisibilized cast system in this country, because we don't 485 00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,080 Speaker 1: readily articulate that we have a cast system, but we 486 00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:27,120 Speaker 1: have all of the confines and the policies that say otherwise, right, 487 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:33,799 Speaker 1: And you know, and I just find you know, for 488 00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:37,839 Speaker 1: people like yourself or academics like yourself, that do you 489 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:41,040 Speaker 1: feel attacked in this day and age. Do you feel 490 00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,680 Speaker 1: do do you feel do you feel more I don't 491 00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:46,480 Speaker 1: want to put feelings in your mouth, but you know, 492 00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:49,600 Speaker 1: do you feel more guarded, more attack, more on edge? 493 00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:54,360 Speaker 1: As an academic in this particular discipline of history and 494 00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:58,400 Speaker 1: American history at that of the twenty of the twentieth century. 495 00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:02,480 Speaker 1: What what are your feelings and the feelings of your 496 00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:08,520 Speaker 1: colleagues in the field. It's not easy. And I have been, um, 497 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:14,720 Speaker 1: you know, writing I think just certainly been writing books, 498 00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:18,200 Speaker 1: been writing opeds. Been You've been writing about these topics, uh, 499 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:22,280 Speaker 1: for for some time. I think a lot has shifted. 500 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:26,680 Speaker 1: You know. When I write about black history, now, um, 501 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:30,680 Speaker 1: it doesn't even matter, you know how controversial the topic. 502 00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:33,600 Speaker 1: I mean, it appears that as soon as I even 503 00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:37,000 Speaker 1: talk about black people at all, I will get hate 504 00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,360 Speaker 1: mail with it, you know. And I sometimes chuckle that 505 00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:44,000 Speaker 1: I know when my opeds have have been released, because 506 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:47,840 Speaker 1: you know, like clockwork, the emails come in, the nasty 507 00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:50,640 Speaker 1: comments come in. Um, And I'm thinking to myself, people 508 00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:57,160 Speaker 1: are angry why because I am telling the history. I'm 509 00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 1: not making up stories. I you know, I'm giving you 510 00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:04,239 Speaker 1: the facts. And all you have to do is be 511 00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:07,920 Speaker 1: open to learning you know, click the links, read the books, 512 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,839 Speaker 1: and you see that this is not made up. This 513 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,800 Speaker 1: is a reality. When I talk about racial wealth gap, 514 00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:18,600 Speaker 1: I'm telling you, you know about history. I mean, I'm 515 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:20,759 Speaker 1: telling you about slavery. I'm telling you about Jim Crow. 516 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:23,520 Speaker 1: I'm telling you about all of these systems that were 517 00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:27,960 Speaker 1: in place that ultimately contributed to this wide divide. And 518 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,719 Speaker 1: you have to know that. You know, how do you 519 00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:35,000 Speaker 1: address economic inequality if you don't know the history. And 520 00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:37,759 Speaker 1: so there is so much resistance I think in this 521 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:41,200 Speaker 1: particular moment, and so of course folks like me are 522 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:45,960 Speaker 1: easily targeted and attacked by others who don't want these 523 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 1: narratives told. And you know, part of what I have 524 00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:53,000 Speaker 1: to do is pushed that aside and keep pushing. I mean, 525 00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: quite frankly, I have to draw inspiration from folks like 526 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:57,880 Speaker 1: I to b Wells. I have the draw inspiration from 527 00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:01,000 Speaker 1: folks like Fanny Lue Hammer, Annie who Hammer could have 528 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:04,400 Speaker 1: walked away a long time, you know, I mean quite frankly. 529 00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:07,080 Speaker 1: You know, there are days when I say to myself, 530 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:10,920 Speaker 1: how did Hammer keep going? I mean, people came after her, 531 00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:14,440 Speaker 1: you know, people tried to take her life. Why because 532 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:17,200 Speaker 1: she was trying to encourage people to exercise the right 533 00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:19,759 Speaker 1: to vote as a citizen of the United States. That 534 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:22,719 Speaker 1: was the crime that she committed, and she had to 535 00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:26,040 Speaker 1: look over her shoulder, and she had to be constantly 536 00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:30,640 Speaker 1: you know, you know, targeted, because she just wanted to 537 00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:33,920 Speaker 1: play a part in building this inclusive democracy that we 538 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:37,239 Speaker 1: say we are committed to according to the ideals of 539 00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:40,799 Speaker 1: the Constitution. Right And so you know, that to me 540 00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:43,319 Speaker 1: is a reminder that what I'm going through, what so 541 00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:46,600 Speaker 1: many others are going through, it's not new. It's really 542 00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:49,640 Speaker 1: part of the process, and quite frankly, it's part of 543 00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:53,560 Speaker 1: being black in the United States. And so as troubling 544 00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:55,719 Speaker 1: as it is to see, you know, a shift that 545 00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,799 Speaker 1: I think in the in the general sort of you 546 00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:03,719 Speaker 1: know atmosphere, it's also not surprising to me. You know, 547 00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:09,840 Speaker 1: as a historian, you have such a deep and wide 548 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 1: perspective of America, and I often find myself getting really 549 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 1: upset and saying things like nothing has changed, and you know, 550 00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:24,800 Speaker 1: everything is still the same. If if if a black man, 551 00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:30,880 Speaker 1: we can watch his murder happen, right eight minutes in 552 00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:37,600 Speaker 1: forty you know, seven seconds, and nothing changes, right still, 553 00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:42,400 Speaker 1: no law, right still still know nothing. We watch black 554 00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 1: people get cornered, shot down, you know, strangled, murder, I say, 555 00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:52,000 Speaker 1: nothing has changed. As a historian, how do you put 556 00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 1: spin perspective on where you think America is in its 557 00:38:56,239 --> 00:39:01,440 Speaker 1: growth towards actualizing its values and creed that it's it 558 00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:05,480 Speaker 1: purports around the world, but we don't necessarily feel it 559 00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:09,960 Speaker 1: here as black people. Well, there are several things that 560 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:13,520 Speaker 1: come to mind. One of the things that I often 561 00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:18,640 Speaker 1: reflect on, which in a way I think we have 562 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,239 Speaker 1: experienced it just in the last couple of months, over 563 00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:25,439 Speaker 1: the last year. But I find strange about and I'll 564 00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:29,680 Speaker 1: say strange, you know, about American history or even just 565 00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:35,520 Speaker 1: the way people respond. There is always a tendency to, 566 00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:41,160 Speaker 1: you know, recognize the problem, then come up with some strategy, 567 00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:43,879 Speaker 1: you know, and maybe that is the passenger for law. 568 00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:45,920 Speaker 1: And so here I'm thinking about, you know, which I 569 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:48,959 Speaker 1: think is probably the best example, the Voting Rights Act. 570 00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,000 Speaker 1: So you have the Voting Rights Act, which is past 571 00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:55,960 Speaker 1: the nineteen sixty five. This is absolutely a pivotal moment. 572 00:39:56,400 --> 00:40:00,000 Speaker 1: It's one that people celebrated as they should have celebrat. 573 00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:03,879 Speaker 1: It opened up the doors for so many people who 574 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:07,440 Speaker 1: could not cast a ballot and it finally cracked the 575 00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:12,319 Speaker 1: door open. But what is interesting is that when when 576 00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:15,960 Speaker 1: the door cracked open, a lot of people sort of 577 00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:19,480 Speaker 1: stepped back and sit and said, Wow, this is wonderful. 578 00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:22,680 Speaker 1: We've accomplished what we set out to accomplish. Now we're fine. 579 00:40:23,760 --> 00:40:26,680 Speaker 1: And guess what, we realized that we're not fine. You know, 580 00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:29,840 Speaker 1: for so many people, it took either Shelby Decision of twenty, 581 00:40:29,960 --> 00:40:32,040 Speaker 1: you know, thirteen to realize that we're not fine. But 582 00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:34,560 Speaker 1: the reality is that the Voting Rights Act has been 583 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:37,480 Speaker 1: on their attack for as long as it's been around. 584 00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:40,840 Speaker 1: And so what's interesting about American history is every time 585 00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:45,160 Speaker 1: there is a particular gain or win, we know the 586 00:40:45,239 --> 00:40:47,680 Speaker 1: backlash is coming, and we know that people are going 587 00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:51,360 Speaker 1: to try to pull back in terms of what had 588 00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:57,759 Speaker 1: been accomplished. And yet we somehow don't realize that we 589 00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:01,680 Speaker 1: cannot rest right. We somehow imagine that we can celebrate 590 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:05,440 Speaker 1: and and and and sit down. And so here we 591 00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:11,160 Speaker 1: find ourselves constantly in this, you know cycle, because we 592 00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:14,800 Speaker 1: see these moments and we celebrate and then we say, aha, 593 00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:18,480 Speaker 1: we've achieved it. We're done. Instead of saying, aha, we've 594 00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:21,240 Speaker 1: achieved it, let's make sure, we keep fighting to protect 595 00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:26,640 Speaker 1: that right. Let's not give up, because in fact, every 596 00:41:26,719 --> 00:41:31,239 Speaker 1: time there is a win, there will be an attempt 597 00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:33,919 Speaker 1: to roll back right, all of them, you know. So 598 00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:35,919 Speaker 1: it's just I mean, so this is what I find 599 00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:40,440 Speaker 1: so intriguing. And um, I think you know, have we 600 00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:43,560 Speaker 1: made progress? Yes, we could talk about the ways we've 601 00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:45,880 Speaker 1: made progress. But the irony is every time we have 602 00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:50,480 Speaker 1: made progress, we've also taken steps backwards, right, And and 603 00:41:50,719 --> 00:41:53,640 Speaker 1: that's partly why I think when it comes to activism, 604 00:41:54,560 --> 00:41:57,239 Speaker 1: people don't like to hear this because you you know, 605 00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:00,560 Speaker 1: you want to be involved in the struggle where you 606 00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:04,240 Speaker 1: can see ahead of you that things are going to change. 607 00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:07,800 Speaker 1: You don't want to be part of a struggle where 608 00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:11,040 Speaker 1: maybe you actually won't witness to change. Maybe it's not 609 00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:13,760 Speaker 1: until maybe your children will see it, maybe your children's 610 00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:17,520 Speaker 1: children will see it. Right, if we accept that this is, 611 00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:19,000 Speaker 1: I mean that we have to be in this for 612 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:22,120 Speaker 1: the long haul. Listen, you're going to march on the streets, 613 00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:24,680 Speaker 1: You're going to make demands. Folks are going to laugh 614 00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:26,759 Speaker 1: in your face, and you've got to go back into 615 00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:30,239 Speaker 1: the streets and make demands and they'll laugh again. And 616 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:31,840 Speaker 1: you have to be willing to go back into the streets. 617 00:42:31,880 --> 00:42:33,680 Speaker 1: You see what I'm going with this. You have to 618 00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:37,080 Speaker 1: keep pushing and pushing and pushing exactly. And you can't 619 00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:39,360 Speaker 1: just say, oh, well, you know, people aren't listening or 620 00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,200 Speaker 1: it didn't work out, so we failed, you know. I 621 00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:43,880 Speaker 1: mean I think even recently, I know, there was a 622 00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:47,160 Speaker 1: lot of debate, a lot of critique about like defund 623 00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:50,279 Speaker 1: the police. And I've heard people you're saying, oh, you know, 624 00:42:50,480 --> 00:42:52,600 Speaker 1: this is you know, it didn't work and it caused 625 00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,239 Speaker 1: people to get angry. And and I say, but take 626 00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:58,279 Speaker 1: a look at the stats. You know. For me, when 627 00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,880 Speaker 1: I see that, you know, seven percent and voted against 628 00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:07,520 Speaker 1: you know, changes that could have, you know, ultimately moved 629 00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:11,160 Speaker 1: us closer to reallocating funds from a police department to 630 00:43:11,239 --> 00:43:15,080 Speaker 1: actually opening up social services in a community. I see 631 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:18,800 Speaker 1: that as a step closer. Why because I'm thinking to myself, 632 00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:23,719 Speaker 1: probably ten years before, I think a lot more people 633 00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:28,000 Speaker 1: would have resisted that idea. The fact that you actually 634 00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:33,480 Speaker 1: have people willing to vote and say, okay, we can 635 00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:38,600 Speaker 1: support this. Granted, yes, the majority opinion challenged it, but 636 00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:42,040 Speaker 1: that's not the point. The point is that things are shifting. 637 00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:47,120 Speaker 1: People are getting upset, but others are listening and others 638 00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:49,839 Speaker 1: are being transformed. Right, this is a long haul. This 639 00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:52,440 Speaker 1: is not a quick thing. It's a long haul. And 640 00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:56,400 Speaker 1: so that's I think the way to view American history 641 00:43:56,640 --> 00:43:59,920 Speaker 1: is to understand. You know, when Fanny Luhamer in nine 642 00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:03,560 Speaker 1: sixty four stood up at the Democratic National Convention, she 643 00:44:03,640 --> 00:44:06,200 Speaker 1: did not know she could not have foreseen the passage 644 00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:08,080 Speaker 1: of a voting rights act a year later. She didn't 645 00:44:08,080 --> 00:44:11,560 Speaker 1: have a crystal ball. She walked away feeling really discouraged 646 00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:14,960 Speaker 1: and feeling that she had failed. She didn't fail, but 647 00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:18,160 Speaker 1: she didn't know it then, right. So if we take 648 00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:22,080 Speaker 1: that perspective, I think it will change a lot of 649 00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:25,600 Speaker 1: how we approach political activism, and we'll stop often looking 650 00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:29,040 Speaker 1: for the quick answer that quite frankly, may not come. 651 00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:34,480 Speaker 1: My last question for you, and I have enjoyed this 652 00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:38,759 Speaker 1: conversation so much, My last question for you is this, 653 00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:48,560 Speaker 1: you know, learning more about America and uncovering so many ills, right, 654 00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:53,640 Speaker 1: so many devastating things that have been done in this 655 00:44:53,800 --> 00:45:03,440 Speaker 1: country's name, right and hidden? Right? How do you maintain 656 00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:11,759 Speaker 1: a level of appreciation and like hopefulness for this country 657 00:45:12,480 --> 00:45:15,239 Speaker 1: when your work is too on earth? All of the 658 00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:22,920 Speaker 1: things that were purposefully hidden, the cruelty, the trauma, the tragedies. 659 00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:29,239 Speaker 1: How do you stay hopeful about who we are as 660 00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:34,800 Speaker 1: a nation and where we're going? You know, I believe 661 00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:38,520 Speaker 1: that it's my life's calling, and in fact, it takes 662 00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:41,360 Speaker 1: me right back to why I wrote this book until 663 00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:45,800 Speaker 1: I'm free. Once I encountered Hammer and I saw how 664 00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:50,120 Speaker 1: this disabled black woman from Mississippi with a sixth grade education, 665 00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:56,560 Speaker 1: with limited financial resources could use her voice and could 666 00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:59,200 Speaker 1: stand up in the face of injustice and make a difference. 667 00:46:00,200 --> 00:46:04,319 Speaker 1: I stopped making excuses for myself. I stopped focusing on 668 00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:06,839 Speaker 1: what I didn't have, and I started to focus on 669 00:46:06,840 --> 00:46:08,759 Speaker 1: what I did have. And I believe that what I 670 00:46:08,840 --> 00:46:12,160 Speaker 1: have is a gift as a writer and as a researcher, 671 00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:15,640 Speaker 1: and so I set out to become a professional historian 672 00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:19,040 Speaker 1: to uncover those stories. I am committed to telling the 673 00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:22,400 Speaker 1: stories of people who look like me, you know, and 674 00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:25,200 Speaker 1: so I you know, I just I'm very clear about 675 00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:28,680 Speaker 1: why I've devoted my life to this because learning that 676 00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:32,040 Speaker 1: history transformed me, and I know it's going to transform 677 00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:35,000 Speaker 1: someone else, and so that keeps me going. It keeps 678 00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:38,040 Speaker 1: me hopeful because I believe that every book that I 679 00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:42,080 Speaker 1: write could cost someone to change their perspective. It could 680 00:46:42,120 --> 00:46:44,920 Speaker 1: cost someone to open up their eyes to the reality 681 00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:49,040 Speaker 1: around them. It could it could compel someone to be 682 00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:51,880 Speaker 1: part of the effort to make this nation better. And 683 00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:55,920 Speaker 1: if I've done that, quite frankly, you know I've accomplished 684 00:46:56,040 --> 00:47:01,000 Speaker 1: everything then that I set out to accomplish. Takeisha Blaine, 685 00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:04,840 Speaker 1: The book is Until I Am Free. Fanny lu Hamer's 686 00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:08,719 Speaker 1: enduring message to America. I can't thank you enough for 687 00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:11,359 Speaker 1: making the time to join woke f And I can't 688 00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:14,839 Speaker 1: thank you enough for your work, your words, and your 689 00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:19,000 Speaker 1: continued effort to make us all conscious to who this 690 00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:21,600 Speaker 1: country is and who we have the ability to be. 691 00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:29,880 Speaker 1: I appreciate you, Thank you so much. That is it 692 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:33,480 Speaker 1: for me today. Here, Folks on woke f as always 693 00:47:33,840 --> 00:47:36,480 Speaker 1: Power to the people and to all the people. Power. 694 00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:38,839 Speaker 1: Get woke and stay woke as fuck.