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Speaker 1: Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 3: dot com. Good morning, everybody, Happy Tuesday. Have an amazing

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Speaker 3: show for everybody today.

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Speaker 1: When do we have Crystal, Indeed we do.

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Speaker 2: We're going to spend a bunch of time on this

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Speaker 2: alleged peace deal that Trump and Nana who have agreed

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Speaker 2: to sort of a take it or leave it offer

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Speaker 2: to Hamas. We're also gonna have Jeremy Scahe on to

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Speaker 2: break down Hamas's response, their view on this, what it

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Speaker 2: all means, where this all may be heading. So really

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Speaker 2: important stuff there Also today the government shuts down and

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Speaker 2: there is no deal in sight. So there's a big

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Speaker 2: meeting yesterday with Trump and the Democrats. We'll give you

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Speaker 2: the what they're saying coming out of that meeting and

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Speaker 2: where we think things might go with that drop site

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Speaker 2: with some really important and very insightful reporting with regard

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Speaker 2: to Jeffrey Epstein and the deals he was brokering on

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Speaker 2: behalf of Israeli intelligence services. Really fascinating stuff there. We're

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Speaker 2: also going to take a look at Brylin Hollyhand. Who

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Speaker 2: is this guy, where did he come from? What does

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Speaker 2: he mean for our society and for the Republican Party.

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Speaker 2: This is one soccer is particularly interested in, so I'm

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Speaker 2: curious to get his.

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Speaker 3: That's more of an it's not a personal interest. This

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Speaker 3: is like an anthropological study study guerrilla's in the zoo

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Speaker 3: and seeing what happens, you know, it's like or like

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Speaker 3: when you remove and why exactly. It's like in Yellowstone,

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Speaker 3: you know, everyone famously talks about it's like when you

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Speaker 3: reintroduce the wolf to see what happens. So that's kind

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Speaker 3: of the way that we're looking at this. Anyway, thank

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Speaker 3: you to everybody who's been supporting the show. We deeply

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Speaker 1: We did our ama for everybody yesterday.

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Speaker 3: Where we revealed what books we are reading, and I

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Speaker 3: ashamedly had to admit that I haven't been reading that

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Speaker 3: much because I'm so tired, and in fact, I've been

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Speaker 3: reading fiction again for the first time in a decade.

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Speaker 2: You can also wrong with reading fiction by the way, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: size is a different.

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Speaker 4: Part of the brain.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I resisted it for so long, but now I'm just

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Speaker 3: like I need the escape. But anyways, thank you everybody.

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Speaker 3: people find the show. But with that, let's go ahead

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Speaker 3: and get to this is real deal by far, the

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Speaker 3: biggest news they came out of this yesterday joined press

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Speaker 3: conference with President Trump and with Prime Minister b b Ntagna.

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Speaker 2: Yeah that's right, So Natanyahu in town again, and we

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Speaker 2: got this announcement that there was going to be this

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Speaker 2: big press conferences to take questions.

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Speaker 4: They didn't take questions anyway.

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Speaker 2: Putting that aside, Trump gives a long speech announcing what

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Speaker 2: he is describing as a peace deal. Now we'll get

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Speaker 2: into the specifics of what the offer is here, but

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Speaker 2: it is a deal that was negotiated exclusively between the

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Speaker 2: United States and Israel. Cording Tomas leadership, they had not

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Speaker 2: been made aware of this quote unquote deal whatsoever. In

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Speaker 2: any case, let me go ahead and throw to Trump

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Speaker 2: explaining some of the details here in his perspective.

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Speaker 5: To ensure the success of this effort, my plan calls

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Speaker 5: for the creation of a new international oversight body, the

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Speaker 5: Board of Peace. The leaders of the Arab world and

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Speaker 5: Israel and everybody involved asked me to do this, so

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Speaker 5: it would be headed by a gentleman known as President

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Speaker 5: Donald J. Trump of the United States. We're going to

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Speaker 5: put leaders from other countries on and leaders that are

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Speaker 5: very distinguished leaders, and we'll have a board. And one

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Speaker 5: of the people that wants to be on the board

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Speaker 5: is the UK former Prime Minister Tony Blair, good Man,

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Speaker 5: very good man, and some others, and they'll be named

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Speaker 5: over the next few days and it'll be quite the

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Speaker 5: board working. Everybody wants to be on it.

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Speaker 6: Now.

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Speaker 5: I don't know if that had anything to do. They

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Speaker 5: named me, and everybody else wanted to be on it.

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Speaker 5: A lot of our leaders are here, our great Vice President,

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Speaker 5: Susie Wiles, Steve Whitcoff, Jared Kushner, They've been so involved

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Speaker 5: in this, in this process, I don't think anybody else

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Speaker 5: could have done it, or even even come close. But

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Speaker 5: it's we're right there. We had big, strong talk. Nobody's

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Speaker 5: been better it is. You're No president's been better to

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Speaker 5: Israel than Donald Trump. But wait, a long strong talk

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Speaker 5: BB and I and he understands it's time. I noticed

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Speaker 5: that they have large crowds gathering in Israel all the time,

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Speaker 5: and they have my name up. They liked me for

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Speaker 5: whatever reason bybe I don't know, but they do like me.

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Speaker 5: She's a warrior. He doesn't know about getting back to

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Speaker 5: a normal way of life, but he is a warrior

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Speaker 5: and Israel is lucky to have him. Israel would have

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Speaker 5: my fall back into finish the job of destroying the

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Speaker 5: threat of Hamas. But I hope that we're going to

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Speaker 5: have a deal for peace, and if Hamas rejects the deal,

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Speaker 5: which is always possible, they're the only one left. Everyone

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Speaker 5: else has accepted it. But I have a feeling that

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Speaker 5: we're going to have a positive answer. But if not,

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Speaker 5: as you know, maybe you'd have our full backing to

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Speaker 5: do what you would have to do.

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Speaker 2: So very important what he says there at the end

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Speaker 2: in those clips where he says, you know, basically, if

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Speaker 2: Hamas does not accept this deal, then Israel have my

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Speaker 2: full approval to basically do whatever they need to do,

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Speaker 2: so very much to take it or leave it offer.

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Speaker 2: Let's also take a listen to a little bit of

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Speaker 2: what Nanyahu had to say before we dig into some

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Speaker 2: of these specifics of this plan.

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Speaker 6: This could be done the easy way, or it can

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Speaker 6: be done the hard way, but it will be done.

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Speaker 6: We prefer the easy way, but.

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Speaker 2: It has to be done easy way or the hardware.

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Speaker 2: Channeling a little Brandon car there. I think it's worth

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Speaker 2: before we dive in, it's worth setting the context of,

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Speaker 2: you know the fact that the last time there was

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Speaker 2: an alleged peace deal or alleged cease fire deal coming

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Speaker 2: together from the Trump administration, there were was a gathering

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Speaker 2: of Hamas leadership in Qatar, and Israel used that opportunity

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Speaker 2: to try to assassinate them in Qatar, something that there

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Speaker 2: was a.

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Speaker 4: Sort of apology allegedly apology.

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Speaker 2: From Netnatu to the Katari's over because that created you know,

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Speaker 2: some upset and a bit of a rift there. I

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Speaker 2: believe the time before that, one of the times of

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Speaker 2: negotiation between Hamas and the United States was over the

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Speaker 2: release of the Israeli American a Don Alexander, and the

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Speaker 2: promises that were made in the context of that deal,

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Speaker 2: which was actually struck, were not upheld by the Trump administration.

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Speaker 2: So that's sort of the you know, the backdrop not

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Speaker 2: to mention, and we could look at other negotiations. You know,

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Speaker 2: obviously you had another diplomatic opening with the Iranians where

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Speaker 2: they were supposedly, you know, on the doorstep of some

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Speaker 2: potential deal, diplomatic breakthrough with US. That was also used

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Speaker 2: as an opportunity for the Israelis to strike Iranian leadership.

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Speaker 2: So I think it's important to have that context as

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Speaker 2: you think about the way that the Palestinians may be

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Speaker 2: viewing these negotiations and this take it or leave it all.

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Speaker 3: Well, there's so much to say about it. Let's put

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Speaker 3: the map up here on the screen just to show

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Speaker 3: you all. This was released by the White House, and

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Speaker 3: for those of you who are watching, they show the

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Speaker 3: current IDF line of control. Then they have an initial

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Speaker 3: yellow line which pushes back several kilometers saying an initial

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Speaker 3: withdrawal of Ida forces which will entail a hostage release,

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Speaker 3: then a quote second withdrawal where the Israeli forces are

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Speaker 3: mobilized per Sandards quote set in a Trump plan, and

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Speaker 3: then finally a third and final withdrawal of a security

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Speaker 3: buffer zone. We also have a twenty two point plan

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Speaker 3: that was leased by the White House. Why don't we

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Speaker 3: go ahead and put this up here on the screen.

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Speaker 3: First and foremost are going to be the initial lines

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Speaker 3: here quote Gaza will be deradicalized terror frey zone that

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Speaker 3: does not pose a threat to its neighbors. Gaza will

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Speaker 3: be redeveloped for the benefit of the people of Gaza,

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Speaker 3: who have suffered more than enough. If both sides agree

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Speaker 3: to this proposal, the war will immediately end. Israeli forces

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Speaker 3: will withdraw to the agreed uponline to prepare for a

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Speaker 3: hostage release. During this time, all military operations will be suspended. Quote,

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Speaker 3: within seventy two hours of Israel publicly accepting this agreement,

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Speaker 3: all hostages alive and decease will be returned. Everybody stick

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Speaker 3: on that, because what they said is that Israel immediately

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Speaker 3: agreed to that as of what is about four pm yesterday,

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Speaker 3: three thirty pm maybe yesterday, So that's the clock is

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Speaker 3: already ticking. Some more than twelve hours have already passed.

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Speaker 3: What they continue on is that once all Israeli hostages released,

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Speaker 3: Israel will then release two hundred and fifty life sentenced

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Speaker 3: prisoners plus seventeen hundred Gozzins who were detained after October seventh,

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Speaker 3: including all women and children detained.

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Speaker 1: In that context.

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Speaker 3: For every Israeli hostage who remains are released, Israeli release

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Speaker 3: the remains of fifteen deceased Gosins. Once all hostages are returned,

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Speaker 3: Hamas members who commit to peaceful coexistence to decommission their

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Speaker 3: weapons will be given amnesty. This is by far maybe

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Speaker 3: one of the most important parts of the deal. They

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Speaker 3: say that members of Hamas who wish to leave Gaza

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Speaker 3: will be provided safe passage to receiving countries. Finally, upon

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Speaker 3: acceptance of this agreement. Full aid will be immediately set

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Speaker 3: into the Gaza Strip. Aid quantities will be consistent with

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Speaker 3: what was included in January nineteen, twenty twenty five agreement

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Speaker 3: regarding Humanitarian Aid. Let's go to the next part here, please,

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Speaker 3: because we'll continue. The body will set the framework and

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Speaker 3: handle the funding for the redevelopment of Gaza will until

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Speaker 3: such time as the Palestinian Authority has completed its reform

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Speaker 3: program as outlined in various proposals, including Trump's Peace Plan

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty and the Saudi French proposal, can securely

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Speaker 3: and effectively take back control of Gaza. This is, by far,

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Speaker 3: I think the most important one, because what they are

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Speaker 3: saying is that it will set a framework for the

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Speaker 3: future redevelopment and governance of Gaza, which may include the

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Speaker 3: Palestinian Authority, such that it reforms to basically an Israeli

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Speaker 3: proposal of twenty twenty. Why does that matter, because what

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Speaker 3: it means is that in the interim, a quote Trump

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Speaker 3: economic plan to rebuild and energized Gaza will be convened

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Speaker 3: by a panel of experts who have helped burt some

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Speaker 3: of the thriving modern miracle cities in the Middle East,

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Speaker 3: nobody's quite sure exactly what that means, and then continuing,

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Speaker 3: I'm going to skip over a few because this is

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Speaker 3: by far the most important and probably if this deal

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Speaker 3: were to go through, this is immediately the context which matters.

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Speaker 3: The committee will be made up of qualified Palestinians and

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Speaker 3: international experts, with oversight and supervision by a new international

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Speaker 3: transitional body, the quote Board of Peace, which will be

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Speaker 3: headed and shared by President Donald J. Trump, with other

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Speaker 3: members and heads of state to be announced, including former

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Speaker 3: Prime Minister Tony Blair. So basically Tony Blair, his name

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Speaker 3: has been floating out there for quite some time, along

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Speaker 3: with Trump, who I guess will be more of a

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Speaker 3: ceremonial figure of this Board of Peace. But this will

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Speaker 3: be the new quote governing authority over Gaza if this

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Speaker 3: were to happen. For those who are perhaps steeped in

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Speaker 3: a little bit of history, the last time that the

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Speaker 3: United States tried something like this, it was an abject disaster.

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Speaker 3: It was called the Coalitional Provisional Authority, which was put

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Speaker 3: into place for the governance of Iraq after we overthrew

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Speaker 3: the Saddam regime, and it ended up being the single

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Speaker 3: most disastrous decision the United States made other than invasion

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Speaker 3: in the first place, and it led to the collapse

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Speaker 3: of the entire society sectoria in civil war.

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Speaker 1: And this is only that's why.

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Speaker 3: I mean, when you look at the type of individuals involved,

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Speaker 3: the kind of the money grab that's happening, the involvement

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Speaker 3: of a guy who literally was involved with the invasion

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Speaker 3: of Iraq, Tony Blair, you should be a little bit

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Speaker 3: skeptical here. In particular, there's a lot of different ways

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Speaker 3: in which this deal could be rejected by Hamas and

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Speaker 3: or some future Palestinian authority. I mean, basically, what they're

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Speaker 3: telling them is you're not even going to have any

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Speaker 3: say over the future of Gaza until you reform yourselves

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Speaker 3: to whatever the.

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Speaker 1: Israelis want you too.

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Speaker 3: If you look at by the way, the PA has

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Speaker 3: no legitimacy right now in the eyes of even people

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Speaker 3: in the West Bank. Why would they they're basically under

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Speaker 3: you know, total Israeli subjugation from and in some cases,

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Speaker 3: I believe that they're like seen as collaborators effectively.

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Speaker 2: In some cases, I'm broadly yeah, I sure.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's kind of fair to be honest, if

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Speaker 3: you're looking in terms of them of some sort of

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Speaker 3: like governing authority that is anyway represents you know, you

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Speaker 3: if you are living in the West Bank. So it's

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Speaker 3: not like that's going to be a popular way to

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Speaker 3: make over. And if anything, Israeli just want them to

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Speaker 3: become even more you know of an Israeli subset. So

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Speaker 3: this all is very sketchy. I mean, there's a couple

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Speaker 3: of things which I will say are not bad about it. Like,

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Speaker 3: first of all, any end of the war I think

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Speaker 3: would be good. And at this point, having spoken with

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Speaker 3: Ryan and we're gonna have Jeremy Skahillan here in a

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Speaker 3: little bit. The people there have suffered so badly and

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Speaker 3: so much they will take almost anything at this point,

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Speaker 3: and who could possibly blame them. I've seen Palestinians actually

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Speaker 3: saying this goes, hey, if they take this deal, every

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Speaker 3: one of you needs to shut your mouth, because you

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Speaker 3: have no idea what it's like to have hundreds of

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Speaker 3: thousands of your people killed, wounded, destroyed in all of that.

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Speaker 3: And if you were in their position, you would.

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Speaker 1: Probably take it too.

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Speaker 3: An important part of the deal is that they say

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Speaker 3: that no Palestinian will be forcibly removed from the Gaza strip.

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Speaker 3: Now there are important things though, that are missing from

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Speaker 3: the deal, and that were also were made clear by

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Speaker 3: the Trump administration and might be in Yahoo not in Yahoo.

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Speaker 3: In his press conference explicitly said there can be no

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Speaker 3: Palestinian state period. So that is going to be a

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Speaker 3: very difficult sticking point for a lot of the West

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Speaker 3: and for the Middle Eastern nations, which would have to

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Speaker 3: involve themselves because they're declaring it at the top. Second,

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Speaker 3: although Trump said in his press conference and earlier that

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Speaker 3: he would not allow Israel to annex the West Bank

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Speaker 3: and Gaza, it is in no way present in this document,

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Speaker 3: and so as an explicit part of a so called

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Speaker 3: peace deal, it does not preclude a future annexation of

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Speaker 3: the West Bank and of Gaza. Of course, official annexation

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Speaker 3: is a little different than the de facto that we

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Speaker 3: already have, but that still does matter that those two

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Speaker 3: things were not put into place. And let's keep in

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Speaker 3: mind the Israeli contacts. Let's put a five please up

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Speaker 3: here on the screen. Member of the Israeli government, you know,

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Speaker 3: Finance Minister Smotriz quote set red lines for a ceasefire

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Speaker 3: before Bibe's visit to the United States, Hamas withdrawal no

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Speaker 3: Palestinian state. He also confirmed his red lines include the

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Speaker 3: IDF remaining in certain perimeter areas of the Gaza Strip

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Speaker 3: and a quote complete disarmament and withdrawal of Hamas. Many

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Speaker 3: of the withdrawal things that were allegedly agreed to here

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Speaker 3: by bb Net and Yahu would fly in the face

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Speaker 3: of Smotrich and in fact, news breaking overnight out of

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Speaker 3: Israel that they are not even going to bring this

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Speaker 3: for government approval. Amit Segal, pro Israeli journalist in Israel,

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Speaker 3: he says, in an attempt to keep Smotrich in ben Givere,

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Speaker 3: the government will not vote on the Trump plan, and

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Speaker 3: in agreement with the Americans, it was decided that will

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Speaker 3: be brought for government approval only the hostage deal itself,

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Speaker 3: which is the withdrawal and relief of the hostages in

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Speaker 3: exchange for the hospital, withdrawal and release of the palasing

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Speaker 3: and prisoners exchange for the hostages. The Religious Zionism Party

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Speaker 3: clarified yesterday they would leave the coalition if that plan

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Speaker 3: were brought for government approval. So that is actually the

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Speaker 3: sticking point is whether the Israeli government coalition itself can

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Speaker 3: even stand under this alleged piece deal not to mention Hamas,

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Speaker 3: and we're going to get Jeremy ska Hill's update here

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Speaker 3: in a little bit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, from the Israeli side, you know, the big

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Speaker 2: sticking point for the you know, Smow Church and Ben

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Speaker 2: Giverer people is that it doesn't contemplate Jewish resettlement of Gaza.

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Speaker 2: And that's what they've been dreaming of. They've been having conferences,

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Speaker 2: they've been asserting this is going to happen, that's what

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Speaker 2: they want, and so this plan doesn't explicitly at least

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Speaker 2: contemplate that occurring. So that's the big problem for them,

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Speaker 2: not to mention. They just you know, they enjoy continuing

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Speaker 2: the suffering, as does most of the country for that matter.

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Speaker 2: They're just to flesh out this deal and what it

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Speaker 2: really actually means. I mean, number one, as you pointed out, Sager,

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Speaker 2: not only do you have Yahoo out there just saying look,

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Speaker 2: there's not going to be a Palestinian state. There is

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Speaker 2: no even contemplation of a path to a Palestinian state

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Speaker 2: contained anywhere in this deal. So what you're signing up

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Speaker 2: for is endless continued subjugation by you know, it's no

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Speaker 2: longer directly Israel, but it's Israel's proxies the US and

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Speaker 2: Tony Blair, weirdly neocon were criminal from the Iraq War days.

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Speaker 2: Put in charge of this thing, you have a you know,

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Speaker 2: requirement that everybody laid down arms, that there's complete demilitarization,

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Speaker 2: which means any sort of armed resistance and struggle is

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Speaker 2: basically like you know, the intention is to push that

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Speaker 2: off the table.

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Speaker 7: You know.

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Speaker 2: On the other hand, like you said, Sager, look the

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Speaker 2: misery and the suffering is extreme, right. People want to

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Speaker 2: be able just to live, They want to be able

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Speaker 2: to eat. They don't want their children to starve to death.

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Speaker 2: The one improvement of this plan versus the things that

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Speaker 2: were being contemplated before is that they say at least

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Speaker 2: no forced displacement of Palestine. Even in that though, there

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Speaker 2: are question marks because you know, if you put enough

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Speaker 2: pressure on the population and make life miserable enough for

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Speaker 2: them and then open up the border, then you are

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Speaker 2: you know, they may not be literally leaving at the

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Speaker 2: barrel of the gun, but pretty much that's that's sort

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Speaker 2: of what is occurring when you put that much pressure

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Speaker 2: on a population. In addition, there's no guarantee that Israel

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Speaker 2: can't just go right back in, reinvade, restart the genocide

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Speaker 2: whenever they want to. So those are some of the

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Speaker 2: big I mean, sticking points is kind of to under

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Speaker 2: sell some of the problems with this plan. I mean,

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Speaker 2: we should be really clear. This is a plan that

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Speaker 2: was crafted with Israel's interest and desires of Net Naho

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Speaker 2: in mind.

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Speaker 4: That's what it is now.

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Speaker 2: Hamas has previously accepted deals that contained a lot of

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Speaker 2: things that were meant to be poison pills, and what's

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Speaker 2: happened at that point is Net NYAHUO has gone back

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Speaker 2: and inserted more provisions to make it even more unpalatable

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Speaker 2: and make it impossible for Hama's leadership to be able

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Speaker 2: to expect except I fully expect some sort of process

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Speaker 2: like that similarly to ultimately play out here because of

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Speaker 2: the coalitional problems that you are that you are referencing,

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Speaker 2: we can put up a six on the screen. What

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Speaker 2: Arab leaders throughout the region have said. Foreign Ministers of

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Speaker 2: Guitar Jordan, UAE, Indonesia, Pakistan, Turkey, Saudi Arabian Egypt have

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Speaker 2: released the following statement response to the Gaza Plan quote.

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Speaker 2: The foreign Ministers of those countries welcome President Trump's leadership

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Speaker 2: and his sincere efforts to end the war in Gaza,

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Speaker 2: and assert their confidence in his ability to find a

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Speaker 2: path to peace. So sort of like vague general endorsement

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Speaker 2: of you know, the fact that he's working on this,

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Speaker 2: and then you know, also just to the point of

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Speaker 2: Netnyahu immediately trying to undercut this deal and make sure

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Speaker 2: that it could never actually be brought to fruition. He

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Speaker 2: immediately then goes and gives a Hebrew speech to you know,

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Speaker 2: the domestic Israeli audience, saying effectively that there is no

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Speaker 2: intention of withdrawing Israeli troops from Gaza. He says, no way.

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Speaker 2: Quote that's not happening. A little bit of a longer

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Speaker 2: quote here that came from drop site. He said, this

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Speaker 2: is a historic visit. Instead of Hamas isolating us, we

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Speaker 2: turned the tables and isolated Hamas. Now the entire world,

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Speaker 2: including the Arab and Muslim world, is pressuring Hamas except

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Speaker 2: the terms we set together with President Trump to release

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Speaker 2: all our hostages, both living and deceased, while the idf

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Speaker 2: remains in.

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Speaker 4: Most of the strip.

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Speaker 2: Who would have believed this, After all, people constantly say

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Speaker 2: the IDF should withdraw. No way, that's not happening. So

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Speaker 2: that is Netanyahu's interpretation translation of this deal for his

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Speaker 2: own Israeli domestic audience.

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Speaker 3: Fiery, yeah, ellent, Well not a surprise. You know what

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Speaker 3: have I said here a million times Google translate. It's

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Speaker 3: your great friend in this war. And yet that is

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Speaker 3: not something that people in the White House just generally

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Speaker 3: seem to understand, or maybe they do. My personal favorite

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Speaker 3: member of time of the press conference is when Trump

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Speaker 3: said maybe we shouldn't take any questions because things are developing.

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Speaker 3: He said, Bibe, unless you want to take a question

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Speaker 3: from a friendly Israeli journalist, and Biebe was like, oh,

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Speaker 3: absolutely not. It's like Trump is unaware that Babe doesn't.

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Speaker 1: Do interviews with his own press corps.

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Speaker 4: I Actually the person he would want to take a

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Speaker 4: question is.

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Speaker 3: Israel, because they'd be like, hey, why did you take

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Speaker 3: money from Qatar? What's up with their corruption trial? He

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Speaker 3: recently it's funny if you go to the Israeli pressed.

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Speaker 3: Times of Israel recently wrote a piece where he said,

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Speaker 3: in rare Israeli interview.

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Speaker 1: Bbe says X, Y and C.

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Speaker 3: So inside Israel, everybody knows he doesn't talk the press.

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Speaker 4: Are the milk boys here?

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Speaker 8: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Question from can we.

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Speaker 1: Get is new in the building? Please be here? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's like Steiny, is that you? Where? Where are you?

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Speaker 1: Are you somewhere out there in the audience? So yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's they wait, so no questions.

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Speaker 3: Our press or thinks he does take a lot of

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Speaker 3: questions because he's always on Fox News. It's like the

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Speaker 3: guy's literally on Fox News more than he is on

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Speaker 3: his own channel thirteen in Israel. But hey, I guess

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Speaker 3: that tells you a lot about him, doesn't it.

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Speaker 4: All Right, we have Jeffany's not our press corp too.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's certainly correct.

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Speaker 3: So look broadly, there's I think the deal is not

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Speaker 3: bad considering where how horrible things are in Gaza. I'm

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Speaker 3: curious to see how Maas and all of them will

439
00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:11,000
Speaker 3: handle it. Something that we talked about. Interestingly, I'm going

440
00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:13,440
Speaker 3: to ask Jeremy about in the future, and he's talked

441
00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:15,159
Speaker 3: with us in the past of the Hamas itself has

442
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:17,760
Speaker 3: seen governance of Gaza as a problem, so they don't

443
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:22,080
Speaker 3: necessarily think giving that up is all that consequential. It's

444
00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:24,160
Speaker 3: really going to be more about some of the future

445
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:27,200
Speaker 3: sticking points about amnesty. Can you really trust that they're

446
00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:30,080
Speaker 3: going to give you amnesty? Right? Like, would you considering

447
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,760
Speaker 3: how the government has conducted itself for the civilian population,

448
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:39,320
Speaker 3: what this new coalitional authority, the Middle Eastern countries like Katar, Turkey,

449
00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:42,840
Speaker 3: Saudi Arabia, the UAE that would allegedly be footing the

450
00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 3: bill for a lot of this. Who else is going

451
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,959
Speaker 3: to be involved? I mean, these are the actually big questions.

452
00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:50,879
Speaker 3: The war itself could be simple compared to whats And from.

453
00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:54,320
Speaker 2: An American perspective and from an American first perspective, this

454
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,800
Speaker 2: contemplates a lot of US involvement.

455
00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:57,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly.

456
00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:00,840
Speaker 2: Putting Trump in charge of the Gaza starf it's insane

457
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,800
Speaker 2: with you know, Tony Blair as his underling like sort

458
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,320
Speaker 2: of running the day to day. I mean, it's it's

459
00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:09,040
Speaker 2: that's a that is a wild thing. What you're what

460
00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:11,280
Speaker 2: you're asking not just from us, but you're asking from

461
00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:15,080
Speaker 2: the palaestin people is like complete center surrender is complete surrender.

462
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:19,640
Speaker 2: It is being taken over by the American president and

463
00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:24,160
Speaker 2: his weird neo con Lackey. It is you know, giving

464
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 2: up on any sort of armed orssistance, giving up effectively

465
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:30,280
Speaker 2: on Palestinian statehood. I mean, that's not contemplated at all

466
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,120
Speaker 2: in this deal. You already have the Israeli saying, yeah,

467
00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:34,919
Speaker 2: where the IDF is going to stay in the strip,

468
00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:38,280
Speaker 2: We're not going anywhere. Yeah, So you know that's that's

469
00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:41,280
Speaker 2: the reality of what's being offered with this plan.

470
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:41,840
Speaker 1: That's true.

471
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:44,400
Speaker 3: And again I don't begrudge those people if they want

472
00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:46,520
Speaker 3: to take it, considering what they've all been through. So

473
00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:48,880
Speaker 3: with all that, let's get to Jeremy Skhill. He's the expert.

474
00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 3: He's been working the phones and everything overnight, so let's get.

475
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:51,800
Speaker 6: To him.

476
00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:56,920
Speaker 2: To further break down this deal and especially to give

477
00:22:56,960 --> 00:22:59,200
Speaker 2: us some of the perspective from the Palestinian side. We

478
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:01,679
Speaker 2: are joined by Jeremy ska Hill, of course, co founder

479
00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:02,520
Speaker 2: of drop site News.

480
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:03,840
Speaker 4: Great to see Zar, good as human.

481
00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:05,280
Speaker 1: Good to be with both of.

482
00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:07,520
Speaker 2: You, Yeah, of course, So just give us top line

483
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 2: what you were hearing from Hamas and others in the

484
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:12,439
Speaker 2: in the factions.

485
00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:14,200
Speaker 4: Ever, on the Palestinian side.

486
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 9: Well, Hamas had not been given any of the details

487
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 9: on this proposal. They were just reading what others were

488
00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:23,080
Speaker 9: reading over the past week or ten days. The leaks

489
00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:26,040
Speaker 9: that happened in the Hebrew media. They weren't consulted at

490
00:23:26,080 --> 00:23:28,439
Speaker 9: all about any terms of this. I mean, you had

491
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 9: Jared Kushner, the President's son in law, Steve whitkoff Ron Dermer,

492
00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 9: who's nettya, who's point man and top advisor basically working

493
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 9: on this. They then brought in some Arab and Muslim countries,

494
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:43,280
Speaker 9: and clearly you see some concessions, although a lot of

495
00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 9: it is sort of unenforceable, that were made to Arab

496
00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:48,399
Speaker 9: and Muslim nations in order to get there buy in.

497
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:52,520
Speaker 9: But there were no Palestinians whatsoever involved with the crafting

498
00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:56,040
Speaker 9: of what Trump says is a enduring peace plan for

499
00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:59,600
Speaker 9: the Palestinians. So the first reaction that I've heard from

500
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 9: people associated with the Palestinian resistance is, how can you

501
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:06,920
Speaker 9: announce a plan and not have consulted with any Palestinians. Now,

502
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:11,679
Speaker 9: while Hamas just now has formerly been given this framework,

503
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 9: they haven't officially taken a position out of yet. They

504
00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:18,400
Speaker 9: say they're going to do some consultations, etc. And come back.

505
00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:21,479
Speaker 9: But what I'm hearing behind the scenes from people in

506
00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 9: these Palestinian resistance factions is that they view this as

507
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:28,159
Speaker 9: a total farce, an attempt on the part of Trump

508
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:31,359
Speaker 9: and Israel to put an international stamp, a rubber stamp

509
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:35,640
Speaker 9: of legitimacy on what amounts to a long term Israeli

510
00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:40,120
Speaker 9: subjugation plan for the Palestinians. In the details of this plan,

511
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:44,199
Speaker 9: if you read carefully, it links the issue of humanitarian

512
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:48,200
Speaker 9: aid and other life essentials to the demilitarization and surrender

513
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:54,320
Speaker 9: of Hamas. It also imposes on the Palestinians a foreign

514
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:59,280
Speaker 9: led essentially kind of viceroy. It seems likely it's going

515
00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:02,840
Speaker 9: to be Tony Blae, which is quite ironic, bloody ironic,

516
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:06,840
Speaker 9: given his role in the invasion and occupation of Iraq.

517
00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,760
Speaker 9: And I'm hearing comparisons of what Bush and the neocons

518
00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:13,600
Speaker 9: did when they went into Iraq where they imposed l

519
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 9: Paul Bremer, who cut his teeth working under Henry Kissinger

520
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,640
Speaker 9: as the kind of viceroy of Iraq. So there are

521
00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:24,000
Speaker 9: and I heard you guys were talking about this earlier.

522
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:27,360
Speaker 9: There are terms in this agreement that clearly were lifted

523
00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:32,640
Speaker 9: from previous frameworks that Hamas had agreed to, the framework

524
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 9: about aid and saying that it's going to be run

525
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 9: by the United Nations and the red cross. The language

526
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:40,399
Speaker 9: about the Israelis are going to do a phased withdrawal

527
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 9: a significant number of Palestinians that are going to be

528
00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:46,679
Speaker 9: freed in exchange for the Israeli captives. But the devil

529
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,359
Speaker 9: is in the details on that issue of the captives.

530
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 9: What it says is that within seventy two hours, the

531
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:55,120
Speaker 9: Palestinian side has to release all Israelis living in dead

532
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:59,879
Speaker 9: and only then will there be a release of Palestinian prisoners.

533
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:04,960
Speaker 9: It also contemplates a total demilitarization of Gaza. Set aside

534
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:07,439
Speaker 9: Hamas and Islamic You had for a second, what this

535
00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:12,760
Speaker 9: is saying is that Palestinians must surrender any rights to

536
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,639
Speaker 9: defensive war against Israel. You know, these are still a

537
00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:19,479
Speaker 9: people that under international law are under occupation, and so

538
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 9: what this is saying is in return for ending the genocide,

539
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:25,479
Speaker 9: you have to bend the knee. That's how Palestinians are

540
00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 9: viewing this. The resistance on the Palestinian side is in

541
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,240
Speaker 9: a very complicated position right now. There's a lot of

542
00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:35,160
Speaker 9: pressure coming from within Gaza for people who just can't

543
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:38,879
Speaker 9: take it anymore. I mean, they're being exterminated, they're being starved.

544
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 9: So there is that level of desperation. At the same time,

545
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,639
Speaker 9: I think that there is a sense that if Hamas

546
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 9: formally agrees to this as written, it amounts to a

547
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:54,160
Speaker 9: surrender of the Palestinian cause of liberation. And I think

548
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 9: we're going to see again Hamas try to come back

549
00:26:56,920 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 9: and say, look, we agree to these things. We understand

550
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 9: we're going to follow some poison pills with this, but X,

551
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:04,439
Speaker 9: Y and Z need to change. The last time they

552
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:05,919
Speaker 9: were doing that was the last time I was on

553
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:09,840
Speaker 9: this show, and while we were talking, Israel bombed the

554
00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:13,439
Speaker 9: Hamas negotiators as they met to discuss a plan that

555
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:15,720
Speaker 9: Trump told them was going to be his final plan.

556
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:18,840
Speaker 9: So I'm hearing a lot of suspicion, a lot of

557
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:24,520
Speaker 9: critical feedback on this, but also a recognition that this

558
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 9: may be the time, the last time, that they have

559
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:29,440
Speaker 9: to make some sort of a deal. And finally, I'll

560
00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 9: just say, you can't get the Israeli captives freed unless

561
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 9: you make an agreement with Hamas and Islamic Chihad. So

562
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:37,960
Speaker 9: if Netnyahu's plan is to say we don't care about

563
00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 9: the twenty living Israeli captives and the twenty eight bodies

564
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 9: of the others. Then they move forward with this plan

565
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 9: and say it doesn't matter what Hamas says. But Israeli

566
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 9: society seems pretty clear that they want as many of

567
00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 9: those captives back living as possible, and if that's the case,

568
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 9: you have to make an actual deal with Hamas.

569
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's such so complicated, Jeremy. One of the things

570
00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,119
Speaker 3: that we talked about earlier, I'd seen I was watching

571
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:01,639
Speaker 3: box News to my own sugar in while this was

572
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:04,439
Speaker 3: all happening, and they kept speculating. They're like, well, why

573
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:06,679
Speaker 3: would Hamas agree to this? They would effectively have to

574
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:09,440
Speaker 3: give up power. Something that you really enlighten me on

575
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,639
Speaker 3: is that they don't necessarily want power after all of this,

576
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,720
Speaker 3: is that they view governance itself as a problem. But

577
00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:18,679
Speaker 3: they also it's intertwined, like you said earlier, to the

578
00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 3: very idea of Palestinian resistance. Could you break down how

579
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:27,000
Speaker 3: Palstini Islamic Jihad, Hamas and then generally the Palestinian population

580
00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:30,560
Speaker 3: the varying different cross cuts that are all feeding into

581
00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:32,040
Speaker 3: whether they would agree to this deal.

582
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,919
Speaker 9: Look, if you look at public opinion polling, not just

583
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 9: in Gaza, but across all of Palestine, the occupied West

584
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:44,920
Speaker 9: Bank Jerusalem. Hamas remains a very popular political institution. Yes,

585
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:48,719
Speaker 9: its popularity has declined, but it remains a premier player

586
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:52,000
Speaker 9: in the life of Palestinian politics. And it was controversial

587
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:56,360
Speaker 9: when Hamas, which started as a Islamic resistance movement in

588
00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,840
Speaker 9: the late nineteen eighties, decided to get involved with electoral politics.

589
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:02,120
Speaker 9: I've talked with members of Hamas would say that in

590
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 9: retrospect that was a mistake. But the fact is that

591
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 9: Hamas has been the governing authority for pederer or worse

592
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 9: over the last two decades in Gaza, and if there

593
00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:14,680
Speaker 9: were democratic elections held tomorrow throughout Palestine, Hamas would fare

594
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 9: pretty well in those elections. Palestinian Islamic Jihad has never

595
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:23,000
Speaker 9: gotten involved with any electoral politics organized under the framework

596
00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:27,080
Speaker 9: of the Palestinian authority, and they've always been a Palestinian

597
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:31,200
Speaker 9: resistance movement. What Hamas and Islamic Jihad have tried to do, though,

598
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 9: over the course of really the past six months, but

599
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 9: throughout the genocide, was to say we're not going to

600
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 9: just unilaterally make decisions about what happens in a ceasefire agreement,

601
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:44,880
Speaker 9: because it wouldn't be fair to the broader Palestinian society,

602
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 9: and so they've tried to pull in as many Palestinian

603
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 9: political groups and factions and leaders as possible, including those

604
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 9: that are political opponents of Hamas, prior to giving a response.

605
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,160
Speaker 9: So what I think we're going to see now is

606
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 9: Hamas and Islamic Jihad try to gather together as many

607
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:05,640
Speaker 9: political factions from Palestine as possible to offer what is

608
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:11,240
Speaker 9: a unified response to this American and Israeli ultimatum. But

609
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,200
Speaker 9: at the end of the day, Hamas, the bombing of

610
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 9: Hamas's headquarters in Qatar has created a real challenge for communication. Remember,

611
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 9: the external leadership of Hamas can make whatever declarations they wish,

612
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:29,400
Speaker 9: they can sign whatever paper they wish. But if the

613
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:32,479
Speaker 9: commanders on the ground inside of Gaza, from the Casam

614
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:35,120
Speaker 9: Brigades or Soriyah al Kulds, the forces that are holding

615
00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:38,880
Speaker 9: the Israeli captives, the forces that have the weapons inside

616
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:41,440
Speaker 9: of Gaza, if they don't sign off on this deal,

617
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 9: then it's just a piece of paper with some signatures

618
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 9: of people living in Doha, Egypt and Turkey. So at

619
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 9: the end of the day, what the Israelis did in

620
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:53,720
Speaker 9: this strike was make it quite difficult for the Palestinian

621
00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 9: side to actually mobilize everyone to get a unified answer,

622
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 9: it's going to happen. I'm told that they're using couriers,

623
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,320
Speaker 9: but I will say I've been told by several sources

624
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 9: Hamas leaders, and I don't know how much this has

625
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 9: been reported. The Hamas leaders who survived those Israeli strikes

626
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 9: are being held in conditions that they don't have regular

627
00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:18,480
Speaker 9: access to phones, they don't have regular access to computers.

628
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,080
Speaker 9: Many of them are not allowed to meet with each other.

629
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 9: It is extraordinarily difficult to communicate, and you know, and

630
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:27,080
Speaker 9: I'm someone who's been communicating as a journalist with ams

631
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:30,480
Speaker 9: for many, many months, it's very difficult right now to

632
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:33,600
Speaker 9: communicate with them. So that also has been an impact

633
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 9: of this, and I think it was intentional.

634
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's a great point. Jeremy, can you

635
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 2: speak This relates to what you were just saying, to

636
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:42,200
Speaker 2: the issue of trust. You know, the deal is only

637
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,360
Speaker 2: as good as your faith that it's going to be

638
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 2: executed according to the terms. There are no guarantees that

639
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 2: Israel won't you know, get their hostages back and then

640
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 2: say no, we're not giving you your captives. That we've

641
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 2: been holding. No, we're just going right back to the genocide,

642
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 2: et cetera. So what is the sense there from the

643
00:31:57,320 --> 00:31:58,320
Speaker 2: Palestinian side.

644
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 9: Well, look, you don't even need to ask a Palestinian.

645
00:32:01,440 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 9: Look what Benjamin Netanyahu did. He stands there next to Trump,

646
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:06,960
Speaker 9: he plays his role. He says, ah, yes, we've agreed

647
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 9: to this plan, and then he goes and he records

648
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:12,160
Speaker 9: a video in Hebrew, and what he says, essentially is,

649
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:16,040
Speaker 9: we've managed to get an international stamp of legitimacy, including

650
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:19,600
Speaker 9: an Arab stamp of legitimacy, on our agenda. No one

651
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:21,840
Speaker 9: thought that this was possible. And he even said in

652
00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 9: that statement, you know, people were saying, oh, Israel needs

653
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:27,240
Speaker 9: to withdraw from Gaza, and that's not going to happen.

654
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:29,320
Speaker 9: And in fact, if you look at the details of

655
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 9: the agreement and you look at the maps that were

656
00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:34,280
Speaker 9: produced by the Trump administration in rolling this thing out

657
00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:38,280
Speaker 9: on Monday, the maps look very similar to what Israel

658
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,000
Speaker 9: has been insisting the whole time. It allows a total

659
00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 9: encirclement of Gaza. It keeps Israeli forces entrenched in that

660
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 9: Philadelphi corridor along the border with Egypt. That would that

661
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 9: always has been Gaza's only gateway to the outside world

662
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 9: not controlled by Israel, and it says, you know that

663
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,240
Speaker 9: their forces are going to remain there until standards set

664
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 9: by Trump for our deployment of an international force are met,

665
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 9: which raises another issue. First of all, is Israel even

666
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 9: going to agree to allow foreign troops from Arab nations

667
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,840
Speaker 9: or Muslim nations to deploy inside of Gaza. That's a question,

668
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:16,600
Speaker 9: even though that it's in the agreement. But secondly, are

669
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 9: those Arab forces do they think that they're going to

670
00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:22,240
Speaker 9: disarm Palestinian resistance groups? I mean, you're gonna have what

671
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 9: Amarati troops, Katari troops, Jordan, They're going to go and

672
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 9: somehow disarmed Cassam brigades. If the Palestinians are saying, no,

673
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 9: we won't give up our right to bear arms against

674
00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 9: Israeli occupation, this thing is riddled with so many land mines.

675
00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:40,040
Speaker 9: And the great beneficiary of this, no matter what you know,

676
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 9: Trump friendly media outlets are saying or Barack revide reports

677
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,200
Speaker 9: about how net and Yahoo was dragged into this, kicking

678
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 9: and screaming. Net and Yahoo benefits from this tremendously because

679
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 9: Trump has gotten all these Arab nations to bend the knee.

680
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 9: They're putting the stamp of legitimacy on it. They threw

681
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:59,320
Speaker 9: a few chits to the Arab and Muslim countries and said,

682
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:01,960
Speaker 9: oh yeah, we'll put some language in about eventual self

683
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 9: determination in statehood. But at the end of the day,

684
00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 9: there's no enforcement mechanism, Crystal. That's the question that you're asking,

685
00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 9: and that's what I'm hearing from Palestinian negotiators who are

686
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:12,879
Speaker 9: going to have to deal with this thing, is this

687
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:17,440
Speaker 9: is wrapped up with the veneer of legitimacy. But the

688
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,359
Speaker 9: devil is in the details, and the details look very,

689
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 9: very favorable to Israel being able to continue the genocide,

690
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:27,120
Speaker 9: which Netanyahu and Trumpell said they will if Hamas doesn't surrender.

691
00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:28,720
Speaker 3: Right, And so what I was also what I pointed

692
00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:33,000
Speaker 3: out in our segment Jeremy, was not only no Palestinian

693
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:36,600
Speaker 3: statehood mentioned, but also no annexation, you know, that was

694
00:34:36,640 --> 00:34:39,120
Speaker 3: mentioned as well. Trump has independently said I will not

695
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,640
Speaker 3: allow Israel to annex the West Bank and or Gaza,

696
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:45,760
Speaker 3: but that was not present in the details. He also

697
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:49,319
Speaker 3: has his own coalition at home to worry about drop site.

698
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 3: We read on the show posted some Nettagnahu's comments in

699
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:57,919
Speaker 3: Hebrew which were very different about Israeli withdrawal. Given all

700
00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:01,799
Speaker 3: of that, though, considering the sentim inside of Gaza and now,

701
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:05,600
Speaker 3: how these Palestinian negotiators are seeing things. Are they seeing

702
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:09,080
Speaker 3: it as even having the ability to give a counter

703
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:12,360
Speaker 3: proposal and buy some time, or considering how things have

704
00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 3: gone when they say it within seventy two hours is

705
00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:18,160
Speaker 3: are they just seeing this as a basically, like you said,

706
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 3: something wrapped in legitimacy that allows them to continue the war.

707
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 1: What's their initial impression.

708
00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:25,800
Speaker 9: It's a great question and it's tough to know. I

709
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:29,160
Speaker 9: mean again, the last time they were supposedly reviewing a proposal,

710
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 9: there was an attempt to assassinate all of them in

711
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 9: previous rounds. Yes, Hamas has been able through the mediators

712
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:37,799
Speaker 9: from Katar and Egypt to give feedback. Then the Israelis comment.

713
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:40,240
Speaker 9: I have to say that at times, you know, with Coffin,

714
00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 9: Trump and others have sort of said to Israel, you

715
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 9: should take two steps toward the Palestinian position on this

716
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:49,439
Speaker 9: issue or that issue. Now typically they're just hardlining it, saying,

717
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 9: you know, you must accept Israel's conditions, but that's a

718
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:56,880
Speaker 9: real question. Qatar announced, because of this sort of apology

719
00:35:56,880 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 9: from NETANYAHUU yesterday made from the White House, that it

720
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:02,160
Speaker 9: was going to re enter the Fray as mediator, and

721
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 9: Qatar and Egypt and Turkey now is getting involved, are

722
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 9: holding consultative meetings. They say they're going to talk with Hamas.

723
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:12,880
Speaker 9: I don't think Hamas is just going to accept this

724
00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:15,600
Speaker 9: as written. I think they're going to ask some clarifying

725
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 9: questions and they're going to propose some amendments. All of

726
00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 9: the Hamas officials that have been permitted by Katar to

727
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:25,960
Speaker 9: speak in recent days and especially last night, we're indicating

728
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 9: that they have a very negative view of this, that

729
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,520
Speaker 9: they feel like this strips Palestinians of their right to

730
00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:36,120
Speaker 9: self determination. The question is, you know, is the response

731
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:37,720
Speaker 9: going to be to kid try to kill them all again,

732
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:40,200
Speaker 9: or is there going to be an actual negotiation. If

733
00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 9: there isn't an actual negotiation, net NYAHUO is sentencing those

734
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:44,879
Speaker 9: twenty living Israeli captives to death.

735
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 2: Almost certainly, do you think that Israel, that Israel and

736
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:51,000
Speaker 2: the US want Hamas to accept this deal, or do

737
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:53,160
Speaker 2: you think that they're sort of hoping that they've created

738
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:56,719
Speaker 2: enough poison pills in there under the veneer of legitimacy.

739
00:36:57,120 --> 00:36:59,719
Speaker 2: So when Hamas and Trump come back and say we've

740
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 2: got it, she's with X, Y and Z, they say, oh, well,

741
00:37:01,520 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 2: you can't negotiate with them.

742
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:04,480
Speaker 4: We've just got to continue. We have no choice.

743
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:08,120
Speaker 9: Net Yahoo absolutely wants Hamas to reject this, so that

744
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:11,000
Speaker 9: he then says, well, you know, the US tried all

745
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:13,399
Speaker 9: the Arab countries, did it. Hamas wouldn't listen to any

746
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 9: of them. We have no choice but to go ahead

747
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 9: and do that. I think that's pretty clear that that's

748
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:19,360
Speaker 9: what Netanyahu wants. Trump is a little bit different. Remember

749
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:22,120
Speaker 9: there's domestic politics at play here too, and some of

750
00:37:22,120 --> 00:37:27,400
Speaker 9: this has really become very accentuated since the assassination of

751
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 9: Charlie Kirk. Trump is facing a base within his Maga

752
00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:35,080
Speaker 9: movement that is starting to become very hostile toward the

753
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:39,320
Speaker 9: US position on Israel, and I think Trump also sees

754
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 9: huge dollar signs. You know, there was a moment during

755
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 9: this this public uh you know statement with net Yahoo

756
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:48,320
Speaker 9: on Monday at the White House, Trump kept referring to

757
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:51,840
Speaker 9: Ron Drmer and talking to Trump gave this really false

758
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:55,600
Speaker 9: history of how Israel gave Gaza to the Palestinians, but

759
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 9: he kept saying, they gave up what is the most

760
00:37:57,520 --> 00:38:00,520
Speaker 9: beautiful real estate in the entire Middle East. And in

761
00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:04,440
Speaker 9: this plan you have a neoliberal economic vision for development

762
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,759
Speaker 9: in Gaza. You had Jared Kushner, who is bankrolled to

763
00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:10,320
Speaker 9: the tune of billions of dollars now in the private

764
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:14,480
Speaker 9: sector by Saudi Arabia, Qatar and the UAE. The Trump

765
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:19,719
Speaker 9: family stands to benefit tremendously financially from pushing through a

766
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:23,440
Speaker 9: privatization agenda in Gaza. So I think that there may

767
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:27,439
Speaker 9: be a difference. Say that again as well, and yeah,

768
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:30,400
Speaker 9: I mean so these guys, I think, are also looking

769
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 9: at it as like, Okay, Trump didn't exactly do his

770
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,840
Speaker 9: Middle East riviera that he threatened in February, but I

771
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:39,920
Speaker 9: think he sees a path to it through Jared Kushner

772
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:42,120
Speaker 9: and other friends of his where they're going to cash

773
00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,920
Speaker 9: in on this. And it's no coincidence that they say, oh,

774
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 9: Tony Blair is going to be, you know, a major

775
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:50,680
Speaker 9: player in this. Blair has spent his entire life since

776
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 9: leaving office as the British Prime Minister getting bankrolled for

777
00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:57,960
Speaker 9: pedaling his influence by dictators and despots around the world.

778
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 9: And so this whole thing I think is becoming Gaza

779
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 9: incorporated for Trump in his inner circle. So it might

780
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,200
Speaker 9: be a case where Netanyah who wants Hamas to reject it,

781
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:09,800
Speaker 9: where Trump legitimately wants to find a way to achieve

782
00:39:09,840 --> 00:39:14,240
Speaker 9: through diplomatic means what Israel failed to achieve militarily because

783
00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:16,719
Speaker 9: they didn't actually defeat Hamas on the battlefield.

784
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:18,759
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, and that's the last thing here. You said

785
00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 3: that they were effectively sentencing the hostages to death. I'm curious,

786
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:24,920
Speaker 3: why do you see such finality we've seen, I mean

787
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 3: Trump from the first day he took office, release the

788
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:31,399
Speaker 3: hostages or else. In forty eight hours nothing happens. Yeah,

789
00:39:31,440 --> 00:39:34,360
Speaker 3: I will back Israel to the full hilt. It's like,

790
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:36,800
Speaker 3: well you already are, So what does that mean? You know,

791
00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:40,239
Speaker 3: all hell will break loose, Like if they militarily could

792
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:42,720
Speaker 3: do more to Gaza, they would, but they just can't.

793
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 3: And so you know what, Jeremy, why do you see

794
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:48,400
Speaker 3: it as this is the final straw and not just

795
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:52,960
Speaker 3: another you know, step in whatever the future negotiation will be.

796
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,400
Speaker 9: What I'm what I'm saying is that if the United

797
00:39:56,440 --> 00:40:00,319
Speaker 9: States and Israel decide, Okay, Hamas is rejecting this deal,

798
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 9: but we're going to move forward with this plan, and

799
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:05,760
Speaker 9: they go in and they try to deploy international forces,

800
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 9: and then you have sort of simultaneous operators where you

801
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:12,799
Speaker 9: have some international forces in areas that Israel has relinquished

802
00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 9: control to an Arab or international force, if that even happens,

803
00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:18,200
Speaker 9: But then you have Israel continuing to do its operations.

804
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:20,720
Speaker 9: And what I'm saying is if they've decided that they're

805
00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:23,920
Speaker 9: done with trying to negotiate the release of the Israeli captives,

806
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 9: and Netanyahu says, Okay, we're going to just intensify military

807
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:31,680
Speaker 9: operations to try to retrieve these captives. I think it's

808
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 9: very likely every single one of the living captives is

809
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:37,279
Speaker 9: going to be killed either by Israel many of them

810
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 9: already have been killed by Israel, or when they attempt

811
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:42,759
Speaker 9: to take them. The Casambragades have said they've put mechanisms

812
00:40:42,800 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 9: in place so that if Israel tries to rescue them

813
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:48,640
Speaker 9: from a tunnel or from an area where they are,

814
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 9: that their captors could essentially kill them as Israel tries

815
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:54,960
Speaker 9: to raid it. So that's what I mean by it.

816
00:40:55,000 --> 00:40:57,040
Speaker 9: I mean, I agree with your assessment that there's been

817
00:40:57,080 --> 00:40:59,279
Speaker 9: all these threats and it just continues on and on.

818
00:40:59,840 --> 00:41:03,279
Speaker 9: But I do think that this time it's Trump and

819
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:06,000
Speaker 9: net and Yahoo are either going to just do full

820
00:41:06,040 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 9: blown massive invasion as we're seeing in Gaza City and

821
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,879
Speaker 9: expand it out, or they're going to try to move

822
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:15,080
Speaker 9: forward with aspects of this plan, whether or not Hamas

823
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:17,319
Speaker 9: agrees to it, and in that case, I think the

824
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:18,239
Speaker 9: hostages die.

825
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:20,839
Speaker 2: And do you think that Israel was sort of pushed

826
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 2: towards the scambit by some of the international pressure that

827
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:24,880
Speaker 2: has increased recently.

828
00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:27,880
Speaker 9: I think Trump was pushed into it by that, not

829
00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:30,759
Speaker 9: that he necessarily cares what Europe says or others, but

830
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,279
Speaker 9: again Trump, remember in May, Trump took that trip we

831
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:37,520
Speaker 9: all were on this show talking about it to the Gulf.

832
00:41:37,680 --> 00:41:41,040
Speaker 9: I think Trump legitimately sees massive dollar signs in his

833
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:45,120
Speaker 9: relationship with all of these Arab countries, and I think

834
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 9: that he also is getting just fed up with having

835
00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:50,880
Speaker 9: to deal with Israel's war. He realizes that they're not

836
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 9: going to be able to win militarily on the battlefield,

837
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 9: and so I think he's trying to do what is

838
00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 9: in the best interests of his family, business, his friends, business,

839
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:03,520
Speaker 9: and politically in the United States. I think he recognizes

840
00:42:03,560 --> 00:42:08,839
Speaker 9: that the Marjorie Taylor, Green, Tucker Carlson wing of that

841
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:13,400
Speaker 9: movement is gaining popularity, not losing it, and that this

842
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 9: is becoming a problem politically for Trump among his own base.

843
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's all. It's true.

844
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,320
Speaker 4: Jeez, I got bb back at the White House again.

845
00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:24,399
Speaker 4: I gotta do with this. You can't have this guy

846
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:25,239
Speaker 4: here every other week.

847
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 2: All right, Jeremy, thank you so much as always for

848
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:30,879
Speaker 2: your in depth reporting and you know, great analysis.

849
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:32,560
Speaker 4: It's just absolutely invaluable.

850
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:33,360
Speaker 1: Thank you, Jeremy.

851
00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:36,040
Speaker 9: Always a pleasure to come on with you guys.

852
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:41,399
Speaker 3: Turning now to domestic politics, the government does shut down

853
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:45,399
Speaker 3: today at eleven fifty nine pm Eastern Time. No end

854
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 3: in sight now. Currently it does look like that's where

855
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:49,919
Speaker 3: things are going. I think, of course, things could change.

856
00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:52,160
Speaker 3: There was a high stakes meeting at the White House

857
00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:57,400
Speaker 3: immediately after Prime Minister Netanyahu left. The House Democratic Majority

858
00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:00,719
Speaker 3: Leader and House Democratic Leader Chuck or it's our Senate

859
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:02,759
Speaker 3: Leader Chuck Schumer came to the White House for a

860
00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:06,960
Speaker 3: quote negotiation where basically the Trump White House told them

861
00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:10,080
Speaker 3: give us whatever, give us what we want, or you're

862
00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:11,120
Speaker 3: going to shut down the government.

863
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:13,359
Speaker 1: The Democrats effectively said the same thing.

864
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:17,160
Speaker 3: Immediately afterwards, both sides kind of came to the microphone

865
00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 3: to lay out their view of whatever, of everything that's

866
00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 3: going on. Here was the Republican response from the Vice

867
00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:22,680
Speaker 3: President JD.

868
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:23,960
Speaker 1: Vance. Let's take a listen.

869
00:43:24,160 --> 00:43:26,480
Speaker 10: We just had a very frank conversation with the Senate

870
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 10: and House Democratic leadership. Look, the principle at stake here

871
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,200
Speaker 10: is very simple. We have disagreements about tax policy, but

872
00:43:32,239 --> 00:43:34,600
Speaker 10: you don't shut that government down. We have disagreements about

873
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:36,799
Speaker 10: healthcare policy, but you don't shut the government down. You

874
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:41,040
Speaker 10: don't use your policy disagreements as leverage to not pay

875
00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:43,920
Speaker 10: our troops, to not have officials for services of government

876
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 10: actually function.

877
00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:48,520
Speaker 4: All right, So, yeah, funny to hear Republicans tate opposition.

878
00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:50,880
Speaker 4: Now everybody, Yeah.

879
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:52,960
Speaker 1: Everybody says it when they're in power. I don't even

880
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:53,520
Speaker 1: know what to say.

881
00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:56,400
Speaker 3: I'm like, yeah, okay, whatever, that's what every executive has

882
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 3: always said about a government shutdown, and what the opposition

883
00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:03,080
Speaker 3: has always said that is precisely the point of actually

884
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:06,200
Speaker 3: using your leverage of power. But anyways, here was Chuck Schumer.

885
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:07,920
Speaker 3: What he had to say in terms of what he

886
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 3: laid out, Let's take a lesson.

887
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:13,280
Speaker 11: He laid out to the President some of the consequences

888
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:16,440
Speaker 11: of what's happening in healthcare, and by his face and

889
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 11: by the way he looked, I think he heard about

890
00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:21,520
Speaker 11: them for the first time. The closing of rural hospitals,

891
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:25,120
Speaker 11: the fact that so many clinics are closing. And I

892
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:28,320
Speaker 11: don't know if he knew this before, but the fact

893
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 11: that people will pay four thousand dollars more a year,

894
00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:36,200
Speaker 11: four hundred dollars more a month, close to five thousand

895
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:38,680
Speaker 11: dollars more a year on their healthcare premiums if we

896
00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:41,480
Speaker 11: don't do anything and people don't know what to do.

897
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 11: The average working family can't afford that. I told him

898
00:44:45,239 --> 00:44:48,000
Speaker 11: how I met a mother who was crying to me

899
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:52,239
Speaker 11: because our daughter had cancer and what has happened with

900
00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:56,840
Speaker 11: health care, with what they have done, She's gonna watch

901
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 11: her daughter suffer and maybe die. And so he seemed

902
00:44:59,880 --> 00:45:04,200
Speaker 11: to for the first time understand the magnitude of this crisis.

903
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:07,400
Speaker 11: And we hope he'll talk to the Republican leaders and

904
00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:12,440
Speaker 11: tell them we need bipartisan input on healthcare. On recisions

905
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:15,200
Speaker 11: into their bill. Their bill does not have these. They

906
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:16,279
Speaker 11: never talk to us.

907
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:23,000
Speaker 12: Dune didn't negotiate with me, Johnson didn't negotiate with hakem

908
00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 12: and on the key issues. The Appropriations Committee, which has

909
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:29,520
Speaker 12: talked about three of the smaller bills, they're good bills.

910
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 12: They said the appropriators couldn't agree and said kick it

911
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:35,000
Speaker 12: up to the four leaders. They still haven't talked.

912
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:35,840
Speaker 1: So there you go.

913
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:38,520
Speaker 3: The Democrats are centering here on healthcare and some of

914
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:42,000
Speaker 3: the consequences of the one big, beautiful bill. But as

915
00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 3: we extensively discussed yesterday, they kind of backed their way

916
00:45:44,840 --> 00:45:46,960
Speaker 3: into this. Basically, the base wants a shutdown, so they're

917
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 3: going to shut down. So what they did is they

918
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:50,560
Speaker 3: pull tested their best messages and they said this is

919
00:45:50,600 --> 00:45:53,600
Speaker 3: what we're going to shut down the government about. And look,

920
00:45:53,640 --> 00:45:55,480
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, kind of smarts what the Republicans

921
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,480
Speaker 3: did in twenty thirteen and elsewhere, and it does set

922
00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:01,720
Speaker 3: up the stakes for some sort of high stakes negotiations.

923
00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 3: The ultimate question, though, and that's where my money was,

924
00:46:04,280 --> 00:46:08,080
Speaker 3: is will Chuck Schumer cave? And yesterday he looked pretty

925
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:10,600
Speaker 3: close to caving. Let's put this up here on the screen,

926
00:46:10,680 --> 00:46:13,759
Speaker 3: just to give you all a little bit of a

927
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:17,239
Speaker 3: rundown of what happened. Initially, Chuck Schumer and his team

928
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 3: came out and floated to the press that maybe what

929
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:22,239
Speaker 3: they would do is something called a seven to ten

930
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:26,440
Speaker 3: day CR. A CR is called a continuing resolution. What

931
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:28,800
Speaker 3: it would have done is continue to fund the government

932
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 3: at the same levels for seven to ten days while

933
00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:35,600
Speaker 3: they reached some sort of negotiation. However, immediately there was

934
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:37,960
Speaker 3: outrage from a lot of Democrats saying, oh my god,

935
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:40,719
Speaker 3: look he's already caving. And so he came out and

936
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:42,719
Speaker 3: he said, actually, I won't support a.

937
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:44,760
Speaker 1: Seven to ten day CR.

938
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:48,520
Speaker 3: He also bashed media speculation about that trial balloon, which

939
00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:49,920
Speaker 3: he literally floated himself.

940
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:52,279
Speaker 1: But let's all just move past that a little bit.

941
00:46:52,440 --> 00:46:55,160
Speaker 3: The point remains that the government's probably going to shut

942
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:57,440
Speaker 3: down as of right now. Again, we're recording this in

943
00:46:57,480 --> 00:47:00,600
Speaker 3: the morning. Things certainly could change and they cave, but

944
00:47:00,640 --> 00:47:03,080
Speaker 3: that's where things are going. So now it becomes more

945
00:47:03,080 --> 00:47:05,239
Speaker 3: of a question about the politics of it. As we

946
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:07,920
Speaker 3: laid out extensively, the Democratic base wants to shut down.

947
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 3: They just want Trump to suffer. The Republican base also

948
00:47:10,719 --> 00:47:12,960
Speaker 3: kind of wants to shut down. What the Trump administration

949
00:47:13,239 --> 00:47:15,600
Speaker 3: is setting themselves up for is they're like, hey, great,

950
00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:17,960
Speaker 3: now we can just fire a ton of federal workers.

951
00:47:18,120 --> 00:47:21,080
Speaker 3: They have total discretionary authority. They could probably figure out

952
00:47:21,120 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 3: a way to keep ice in the military going. They

953
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:25,920
Speaker 3: don't care right about government services and the rest. They're like, cool,

954
00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:26,759
Speaker 3: this is actually what.

955
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:28,319
Speaker 1: We want to do. We didn't even want fund the

956
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:29,319
Speaker 1: Department of.

957
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:31,040
Speaker 3: Education, so it'd be kind of like a return to

958
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:35,080
Speaker 3: Doge almost in the initial days of the administration. And

959
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:37,239
Speaker 3: so that is kind of what I think is going

960
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 3: to be the bigges sticking point for a lot of

961
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:41,880
Speaker 3: the Democrats who are institutionally in power, because you know,

962
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:45,200
Speaker 3: they're addicted to norms and to institutions and to bureaucrats,

963
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:46,759
Speaker 3: and so, I don't know, it's going to be an

964
00:47:46,760 --> 00:47:47,319
Speaker 3: interesting one.

965
00:47:47,440 --> 00:47:48,839
Speaker 1: I don't know how this one's going to shake out.

966
00:47:49,120 --> 00:47:50,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, there's a lot to say about it.

967
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:52,839
Speaker 2: So, first of all, it does feel like a bit

968
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 2: of a role reversal because most of the shutdown fights

969
00:47:56,200 --> 00:47:58,719
Speaker 2: have come from the Republican side, and they're the ones

970
00:47:58,719 --> 00:48:01,160
Speaker 2: who really pioneered like the bnksmanship. It used to be

971
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:03,280
Speaker 2: just sort of automatic, like of course you fund the government.

972
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,320
Speaker 2: Of course you're not going to just have the government

973
00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 2: shut down. There was another, you know, incident in the nineties,

974
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 2: but by and large, it's been sort of like the

975
00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 2: modern Republican Party that has really pioneered this kind of

976
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:18,200
Speaker 2: like debt sealing and government shut down brinksmanship. And usually

977
00:48:18,239 --> 00:48:20,439
Speaker 2: it's the Democrats who are out their warning like, hey,

978
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:22,480
Speaker 2: if you do this, you're going to have all sorts

979
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:24,960
Speaker 2: of consequences, like things that people rely on for the

980
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 2: federal government that are not going to be there for them.

981
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:29,640
Speaker 2: The longer that it goes on, the more tenuous those

982
00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:31,959
Speaker 2: services become. So it's been kind of funny to watch

983
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:35,759
Speaker 2: like Mike Johnson go out and loud the importance of

984
00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:38,719
Speaker 2: the federal government and all of these government programs, and

985
00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:42,200
Speaker 2: you know, at the same time as literally today, one

986
00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:47,200
Speaker 2: hundred thousand federal government employees are resigning because of that.

987
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:48,920
Speaker 4: You guys remember back in the day.

988
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:52,239
Speaker 2: That fork in the Road email, So there was the

989
00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 2: deal then was basically you get to not work and

990
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:57,360
Speaker 2: get paid for a number of months. That time period

991
00:48:57,400 --> 00:48:59,960
Speaker 2: has expired, So today is the day that one hundred

992
00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:04,120
Speaker 2: thousand federal government employees are being resigning and we're essentially,

993
00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:06,800
Speaker 2: you know, sort of like pressured to leave the government.

994
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:11,000
Speaker 2: So this has been a very radical administration in terms

995
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:14,600
Speaker 2: of destruction of core government functions. That's been a lot

996
00:49:14,640 --> 00:49:16,680
Speaker 2: of what they've been about. Russ Vote, of course, as

997
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:19,800
Speaker 2: being one of the primary architects here. Elon Musk was

998
00:49:19,840 --> 00:49:22,239
Speaker 2: the public face of it obviously with Doge, but a

999
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:25,680
Speaker 2: lot of this work, even as Doge has faded into

1000
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:29,840
Speaker 2: the background, has continued, and Russ Vote said very clearly

1001
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:32,600
Speaker 2: like he wants to make government employees suffer. He wants

1002
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:34,880
Speaker 2: to put pressure on them and get them to leave

1003
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:37,239
Speaker 2: and force them out and cut their jobs and all

1004
00:49:37,320 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 2: of that. So that has been continuing apace.

1005
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:40,319
Speaker 1: They see it.

1006
00:49:40,600 --> 00:49:44,560
Speaker 2: People on his side see this as another excuse to

1007
00:49:44,800 --> 00:49:48,760
Speaker 2: accelerate the stripping of government and the firing of government

1008
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:52,319
Speaker 2: employees that you know, they aren't particularly fond of to

1009
00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:54,680
Speaker 2: begin with. So at the same time that you got

1010
00:49:54,680 --> 00:49:56,520
Speaker 2: the Mike Johnson's of the world out there singing the

1011
00:49:56,560 --> 00:49:59,560
Speaker 2: praise as the various federal government programs, behind the scenes,

1012
00:49:59,600 --> 00:50:01,680
Speaker 2: actual w work that is being done is to gut

1013
00:50:01,719 --> 00:50:04,000
Speaker 2: those programs and make them sort of fall apart.

1014
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:06,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is kind of ironic. Yeah, because look, they

1015
00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:08,719
Speaker 3: obviously want to shut down. They would love there's what

1016
00:50:08,760 --> 00:50:10,640
Speaker 3: do you think, what do we know about the first

1017
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:15,880
Speaker 3: Trump administration or the second Trump administration? They love unilateral power, right, Well,

1018
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:18,440
Speaker 3: the shutdown in a lot of ways, I explained for

1019
00:50:18,520 --> 00:50:22,279
Speaker 3: the Obama administration, you have almost unilateral power in how

1020
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:24,839
Speaker 3: to decide how to shut down. So, for example, you

1021
00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:27,480
Speaker 3: get to decide who's essential and who is not. If

1022
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:29,920
Speaker 3: you're not from DC, this is a fun game where

1023
00:50:30,040 --> 00:50:32,120
Speaker 3: people who are quote essential still have to come to

1024
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:34,680
Speaker 3: work whether they are being paid or not.

1025
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:37,200
Speaker 1: But everybody's not essential. You get to hang out. A

1026
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 1: lot of the bars around here do like shutdown happy hours.

1027
00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:40,279
Speaker 1: Let's be honest.

1028
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:41,880
Speaker 3: A lot of the federal governmentployees like it because they

1029
00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:43,759
Speaker 3: get back paid, they don't have to work, And so

1030
00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:46,560
Speaker 3: what happens is that it kind of becomes this great

1031
00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:48,920
Speaker 3: game of the executive who do you guys to decide

1032
00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:50,680
Speaker 3: and not this time around, they're like, listen, we're just

1033
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:53,839
Speaker 3: gonna fire people because the gfzis authority to basically come

1034
00:50:53,840 --> 00:50:56,279
Speaker 3: in and say, well, in order to keep with the budget, etc.

1035
00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:58,759
Speaker 3: That's what we're going to do. Russ vote as you

1036
00:50:58,800 --> 00:51:02,560
Speaker 3: said he's the budget director. Actually went on Steve Bannon

1037
00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 3: showed to lay some of this out. Let's take a listen.

1038
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,480
Speaker 7: I don't think anyone should be afraid of a government shutdown.

1039
00:51:07,640 --> 00:51:10,440
Speaker 7: I managed it for President Trump. We made it as

1040
00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:12,800
Speaker 7: painless and possible, consistent with the law.

1041
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:16,080
Speaker 9: And it's actually what's necessary to pass.

1042
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:18,880
Speaker 7: These bills individually is because how else are you going

1043
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:22,960
Speaker 7: to get moderates to vote for spending cuts if they're

1044
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:25,160
Speaker 7: not up against the fact that they need to pass

1045
00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:27,440
Speaker 7: these things to get out of a shutdown themselves. So

1046
00:51:28,280 --> 00:51:30,840
Speaker 7: I think there should be no talk about a stop

1047
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:33,760
Speaker 7: dep measure at this point. They need to be focused

1048
00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:35,560
Speaker 7: squarely on moving these bills.

1049
00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:36,560
Speaker 1: So there you go.

1050
00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:38,440
Speaker 3: We're not afraid of a shutdown they're going to use.

1051
00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:41,240
Speaker 3: So now it's actually a question of politics. The politics

1052
00:51:41,239 --> 00:51:44,400
Speaker 3: of this initially are actually pretty interesting. Let's go ahead

1053
00:51:44,440 --> 00:51:47,120
Speaker 3: and put C six please up on the screen. So

1054
00:51:47,160 --> 00:51:50,399
Speaker 3: there was some initial polling that was released here that

1055
00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:53,600
Speaker 3: shows with the forty eight hours to go quote, Republicans

1056
00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:56,399
Speaker 3: haven't entirely won the blame game with voters. A new

1057
00:51:56,440 --> 00:51:58,960
Speaker 3: Morning Console poll that was shared with Playbook reports at

1058
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:01,040
Speaker 3: forty five percent of voters are more likely to blame

1059
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:04,280
Speaker 3: Republicans if there's a shutdown compared to thirty two percent

1060
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:07,680
Speaker 3: blaming Democrats. That's some thirteen point margin. The split does

1061
00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:09,920
Speaker 3: get wider when looking at independent voters, who would be

1062
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:12,920
Speaker 3: more likely to blame Republicans by a seventeen point margin.

1063
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:16,280
Speaker 3: This was some two thousand voters that were surveyed last week. Quote,

1064
00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:18,399
Speaker 3: as is nearly always the case with shut down, all

1065
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:20,600
Speaker 3: parties will come out looking worse, at least for a

1066
00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:23,399
Speaker 3: brief period of time, was what they said. Republicans should

1067
00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:26,080
Speaker 3: also understand there is a palpable perception AMONGST voters that

1068
00:52:26,120 --> 00:52:29,759
Speaker 3: their majority status in Washington renders them responsible. This is

1069
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:32,400
Speaker 3: something that Democrats always have to contend with under.

1070
00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:33,160
Speaker 1: Obama as well.

1071
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:35,560
Speaker 3: GOP voters, they say, are more likely to blame their

1072
00:52:35,560 --> 00:52:38,279
Speaker 3: own party than Democrats are. Of the people surveyed, thirty

1073
00:52:38,280 --> 00:52:40,920
Speaker 3: three percent of GOP voters would blame Republicans, twenty two

1074
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:43,919
Speaker 3: percent we'll say they would blame it Democrats. Democrats say

1075
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:46,440
Speaker 3: that they have been banking their shutdown strategy on a

1076
00:52:46,480 --> 00:52:49,360
Speaker 3: thesis that voters will blame the party in power. Democratic

1077
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:52,360
Speaker 3: leaders have seen a similar trend across their polling and

1078
00:52:52,440 --> 00:52:54,640
Speaker 3: heard from voters on the ground. They are in charge.

1079
00:52:54,680 --> 00:52:55,960
Speaker 3: They have the House, they have the Senate, they have

1080
00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:58,080
Speaker 3: the presidency. That means that they're the ones who have

1081
00:52:58,120 --> 00:53:01,320
Speaker 3: to push the government. And then finally, the Democrats finally

1082
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:03,920
Speaker 3: centered on the healthcare issue as one that is the

1083
00:53:03,920 --> 00:53:07,239
Speaker 3: most poll tested for what they eventually come around to.

1084
00:53:07,880 --> 00:53:11,600
Speaker 3: There's a couple of big question marks here for shutdown politics.

1085
00:53:11,880 --> 00:53:15,040
Speaker 3: First is who gets the initial blame. Now, Initially, from

1086
00:53:15,040 --> 00:53:17,680
Speaker 3: what I remember covering the first shutdown under Donald Trump

1087
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:21,200
Speaker 3: in twy and eighteen, it was kind of like relatively equal.

1088
00:53:21,560 --> 00:53:24,120
Speaker 3: What eventually became a problem for Trump was a thirty

1089
00:53:24,120 --> 00:53:27,080
Speaker 3: five day shutdown is even though it was the Christmas season,

1090
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:29,120
Speaker 3: people get sick of not having government services.

1091
00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:30,120
Speaker 1: And you know, the.

1092
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:32,920
Speaker 3: Federal government is the largest employer in the United States,

1093
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:35,400
Speaker 3: which means that some two million people were going without

1094
00:53:35,400 --> 00:53:38,400
Speaker 3: pay for a month, especially during the Christmas season, right,

1095
00:53:38,480 --> 00:53:41,480
Speaker 3: and so it was starting to have all kinds of

1096
00:53:41,520 --> 00:53:43,719
Speaker 3: problems and people were getting real sick of and that's

1097
00:53:43,719 --> 00:53:46,520
Speaker 3: eventually why Trump caved. So it's actually a real question

1098
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:49,000
Speaker 3: on the Democratic side of whether they can stand up

1099
00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:52,480
Speaker 3: to a different administration this time around, which is basically

1100
00:53:52,560 --> 00:53:54,800
Speaker 3: going to use it as carte blanche to do whatever

1101
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:57,920
Speaker 3: they want. Now, the Democratic base, I think is probably

1102
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:00,360
Speaker 3: radicalized enough to say Trump is going to do whatever

1103
00:54:00,360 --> 00:54:04,280
Speaker 3: he wants anyways, so don't cave. The Republican base also

1104
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:07,279
Speaker 3: is one which is like, hey, great again, we can

1105
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:10,120
Speaker 3: continue to do mass deportation and fund the military.

1106
00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:11,360
Speaker 1: We don't give a shit.

1107
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:14,160
Speaker 3: About the Department of Education or the Department of Transportation.

1108
00:54:14,600 --> 00:54:18,160
Speaker 3: The risk will be probably something external. I mean, we're

1109
00:54:18,160 --> 00:54:20,680
Speaker 3: going into hurricane season, so you've got this whole National

1110
00:54:20,719 --> 00:54:25,000
Speaker 3: Weather Service problem, which was already having issues going into this.

1111
00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:28,200
Speaker 3: You just never know what some sort of external event

1112
00:54:28,680 --> 00:54:31,799
Speaker 3: could force it, and that's when the shutdown politics can

1113
00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:34,959
Speaker 3: become very dangerous. There's also we've always you know, people

1114
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:36,919
Speaker 3: always point to this, but it is a real risk.

1115
00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:40,680
Speaker 3: Remember TSA and all these other Sometimes during shutdowns you

1116
00:54:40,719 --> 00:54:44,000
Speaker 3: can actually you can have huge like airline delays, FAA

1117
00:54:44,080 --> 00:54:46,799
Speaker 3: air traffic control, all kinds of crazy things can start

1118
00:54:46,840 --> 00:54:50,240
Speaker 3: showing up in people's lives. In National Park Service, Obama

1119
00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:53,040
Speaker 3: famously shut all the parks during the shutdown, so it

1120
00:54:53,080 --> 00:54:56,080
Speaker 3: can start to show up in your life very quickly. Actually,

1121
00:54:56,120 --> 00:54:59,040
Speaker 3: if the administration wants it to. And that's where I

1122
00:54:59,120 --> 00:55:00,719
Speaker 3: just have no idea where the politics as to go.

1123
00:55:00,840 --> 00:55:03,160
Speaker 3: Why would the Democrats cave? They have no incentive on

1124
00:55:03,200 --> 00:55:06,840
Speaker 3: their base other than an institutional love for the bureaucrat,

1125
00:55:06,920 --> 00:55:08,359
Speaker 3: or if Trump is going to try to break them,

1126
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:11,400
Speaker 3: which I would not put past the current Democratic party.

1127
00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:14,719
Speaker 3: So but I guess there's a more moderate Republican faction also,

1128
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:17,080
Speaker 3: which is like, hey, you know a lot of normal

1129
00:55:17,120 --> 00:55:18,840
Speaker 3: people like government services. A lot of people use the

1130
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:21,359
Speaker 3: government every single day, So you have no idea how

1131
00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:23,400
Speaker 3: that will look like as well. The other question is

1132
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:26,439
Speaker 3: whether the Democrats will hold up troop pay.

1133
00:55:26,520 --> 00:55:27,480
Speaker 1: That's always a big one.

1134
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:30,759
Speaker 3: They probably won't. Everyone almost ALWAYE funds the troops. There's

1135
00:55:30,760 --> 00:55:33,160
Speaker 3: like certain things like that. The question is whether Republicans

1136
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:35,400
Speaker 3: would allow that to go through. So there's all kinds

1137
00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:37,759
Speaker 3: of machinations that you mean, well, and you know.

1138
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:40,120
Speaker 2: Who doesn't get paid it would likely be essential and

1139
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:42,000
Speaker 2: continue working but doesn't get paid would be ice.

1140
00:55:42,320 --> 00:55:43,960
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, they definitely are going to.

1141
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:46,839
Speaker 2: Get Democrats that definitely, you know, have taken note of

1142
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:49,399
Speaker 2: the fact that the ice thugs in the street would

1143
00:55:49,400 --> 00:55:49,960
Speaker 2: not be getting paid.

1144
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:52,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, but they're going to get their back pay eventually.

1145
00:55:52,680 --> 00:55:55,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, but you know that's not fun to mister paycheck.

1146
00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:56,480
Speaker 1: No, it certainly isn't.

1147
00:55:57,080 --> 00:55:58,799
Speaker 3: Keep in mind though, that they're not going to fire

1148
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:01,200
Speaker 3: them any of these name Vanbase, we're.

1149
00:56:01,080 --> 00:56:02,800
Speaker 1: Working in the doe. You people are the ones that

1150
00:56:02,840 --> 00:56:03,439
Speaker 1: are going to be out.

1151
00:56:03,360 --> 00:56:05,600
Speaker 2: On the sty They're already out, so it's not all

1152
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:08,040
Speaker 2: of them has already been broadly shut down. I mean,

1153
00:56:08,080 --> 00:56:10,359
Speaker 2: but that gets to the point of, like the Democratic base,

1154
00:56:10,560 --> 00:56:13,840
Speaker 2: you know, the Democratic leadership has tried to split the

1155
00:56:13,840 --> 00:56:16,880
Speaker 2: difference between what they think is the most politically palatable

1156
00:56:17,239 --> 00:56:22,040
Speaker 2: broad message around shutdowns, around a shutdown that puts Republicans

1157
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:24,320
Speaker 2: on the most defensive, and what the base actually wants.

1158
00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:26,839
Speaker 2: What the base actually wants, Yes, they care about healthcare. Well,

1159
00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:28,800
Speaker 2: what they really feel like is you should not be

1160
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:31,600
Speaker 2: funding a fascist government. They would like to see conditions

1161
00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:35,000
Speaker 2: like the National Guard needs to be withdrawn, Ice agents

1162
00:56:35,040 --> 00:56:38,360
Speaker 2: need to be required to have their faces revealed.

1163
00:56:37,960 --> 00:56:39,160
Speaker 4: And not be masked up.

1164
00:56:39,400 --> 00:56:41,880
Speaker 2: They want to see those sorts of you know, NSPM

1165
00:56:41,920 --> 00:56:44,040
Speaker 2: seven needs to be rot like those sorts of checks

1166
00:56:44,080 --> 00:56:47,680
Speaker 2: on the Trumpean authoritarian crackdown is what the base actually wants.

1167
00:56:47,680 --> 00:56:49,319
Speaker 3: You but that's not going to happen, right, But they're

1168
00:56:49,320 --> 00:56:51,640
Speaker 3: not in power, Like it's like you lost the election,

1169
00:56:51,680 --> 00:56:54,640
Speaker 3: you have a minority status, Like why were they explaining.

1170
00:56:54,160 --> 00:56:55,000
Speaker 1: What the view is that?

1171
00:56:55,400 --> 00:56:56,560
Speaker 4: So that's where the base is.

1172
00:56:56,920 --> 00:57:00,279
Speaker 2: The leadership is saying, like, we want to find the

1173
00:57:00,280 --> 00:57:03,319
Speaker 2: most poll tested friendly way to go about this. That's

1174
00:57:03,360 --> 00:57:06,200
Speaker 2: going to put the GOP in the most difficult position.

1175
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:09,799
Speaker 2: That's why they've settled on healthcare. There's an irony here too,

1176
00:57:10,080 --> 00:57:13,920
Speaker 2: because actually Republicans in a sense would be doing themselves

1177
00:57:13,920 --> 00:57:16,880
Speaker 2: some favors to just go ahead and fund the healthcare

1178
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 2: stuff that the Democrats want, because it's a genuine political

1179
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 2: problem for them that you have massive Medicaid cuts in

1180
00:57:23,240 --> 00:57:26,600
Speaker 2: the big beautiful bill, You have rural hospitals, many of

1181
00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:30,360
Speaker 2: them threatening threatened with closure because of the funding cuts there.

1182
00:57:30,720 --> 00:57:35,000
Speaker 2: And then you have these skyrocket looming, skyrocketing premiums in

1183
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:38,120
Speaker 2: the ACA that is going to hit some twenty million

1184
00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:40,760
Speaker 2: plus Americans at the end of this year. So that

1185
00:57:40,840 --> 00:57:44,720
Speaker 2: is coming really soon before the midterm elections. So there

1186
00:57:44,760 --> 00:57:47,280
Speaker 2: are a number of Republicans who look at this landscape

1187
00:57:47,280 --> 00:57:49,640
Speaker 2: are like, we actually do need to do something about healthcare.

1188
00:57:49,920 --> 00:57:50,800
Speaker 4: But their argument.

1189
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:52,840
Speaker 2: You even heard it there from Jdvans of like, oh, well,

1190
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:55,520
Speaker 2: we can negotiate for it. Outside of this, you shouldn't

1191
00:57:55,520 --> 00:57:58,720
Speaker 2: be using the shutdown to get your healthcare way. But

1192
00:57:58,760 --> 00:58:01,680
Speaker 2: in any case, that's what makes it a difficult political

1193
00:58:01,760 --> 00:58:05,280
Speaker 2: question for them, because it is actually a problem for

1194
00:58:05,320 --> 00:58:08,200
Speaker 2: them politically that people's health care costs are going to

1195
00:58:08,200 --> 00:58:10,600
Speaker 2: be going up and their local rural hospitals are going

1196
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:13,240
Speaker 2: to be threatened with closure because of the actions that

1197
00:58:13,280 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 2: they've taken. Now, do I think that means that Republicans

1198
00:58:16,520 --> 00:58:19,160
Speaker 2: are going to like cave on the No, not at all.

1199
00:58:19,320 --> 00:58:23,080
Speaker 2: But it is an intelligent place for Democrats to sort

1200
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:25,480
Speaker 2: of like place their chips. In terms of the messaging,

1201
00:58:25,840 --> 00:58:29,320
Speaker 2: I think the natural landscape, the natural political landscape sort

1202
00:58:29,320 --> 00:58:31,600
Speaker 2: of favors Democrats number one because they're not in power,

1203
00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:34,200
Speaker 2: and number two because people associate shut down politics and

1204
00:58:34,280 --> 00:58:38,560
Speaker 2: chaos or with the Republican side. But Republicans and Trump

1205
00:58:38,600 --> 00:58:41,800
Speaker 2: are much more effective messengers, much more disciplined messengers. They

1206
00:58:41,800 --> 00:58:44,760
Speaker 2: have much more backbone, they're much more clear, they're much

1207
00:58:44,880 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 2: more willing to get I mean, they're just they're better

1208
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:50,040
Speaker 2: at this right, So that gives them. That's why it

1209
00:58:50,240 --> 00:58:52,720
Speaker 2: becomes kind of a toss up who's ultimately going to

1210
00:58:52,800 --> 00:58:56,040
Speaker 2: win in the battle of public opinion because Democrats have

1211
00:58:56,080 --> 00:58:59,080
Speaker 2: some natural advantages here, but they have Chuck Schumer as

1212
00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:03,840
Speaker 2: a leader who is all already his denials, notwithstanding already

1213
00:59:03,880 --> 00:59:07,040
Speaker 2: trying to look for a way, an escape patch out

1214
00:59:07,080 --> 00:59:09,880
Speaker 2: of this where he can look like he put up

1215
00:59:09,920 --> 00:59:12,640
Speaker 2: some sort of a fight but didn't rock the boat

1216
00:59:12,720 --> 00:59:15,600
Speaker 2: too much in a way that is uncomfortable.

1217
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:17,520
Speaker 4: For him as someone who was not a boat rocker.

1218
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:23,280
Speaker 3: Obviously I'm biased, but to me, Jeffries and Cheff Schumer

1219
00:59:23,400 --> 00:59:25,680
Speaker 3: just look incredibly weak, like and I think a lot

1220
00:59:25,680 --> 00:59:27,680
Speaker 3: of the Democratic but like, to me, this whole, I think.

1221
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:29,400
Speaker 2: That's just a factual. I don't even think that's biased.

1222
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:30,320
Speaker 2: I think that's just factual.

1223
00:59:30,320 --> 00:59:32,800
Speaker 3: Well, the healthcare, the way they're talking about it, I'm like,

1224
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:35,200
Speaker 3: oh God, just shut up. You know, it just looks

1225
00:59:35,240 --> 00:59:37,240
Speaker 3: like it came out of some polling memo that was

1226
00:59:37,240 --> 00:59:40,439
Speaker 3: put on your desk. I don't know, I just think that.

1227
00:59:41,120 --> 00:59:43,040
Speaker 3: And at the end of the day, I mean, look,

1228
00:59:43,080 --> 00:59:44,680
Speaker 3: I get it. You know, they'll oh, we want to

1229
00:59:44,800 --> 00:59:46,840
Speaker 3: you know, stop ice. It's like, well, you know, win

1230
00:59:46,880 --> 00:59:48,800
Speaker 3: an election. It's not going to happen. So like that's

1231
00:59:48,800 --> 00:59:52,000
Speaker 3: where it's It just seems that the Democratic base, I

1232
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:54,120
Speaker 3: don't know, I mean, in some ways it's a lot

1233
00:59:54,160 --> 00:59:56,520
Speaker 3: like the Republican base back in the two thousands, where

1234
00:59:56,560 --> 00:59:59,120
Speaker 3: Obama would what did he say to Eric Candor? He said,

1235
00:59:59,160 --> 01:00:02,640
Speaker 3: elections f concept Quen's famously during a shutdown fight.

1236
01:00:02,720 --> 01:00:03,600
Speaker 1: In a way, that's true.

1237
01:00:03,640 --> 01:00:05,840
Speaker 3: It's like, dude, if you lose the election, you can't

1238
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:08,520
Speaker 3: just come around demanding that the country be run exactly

1239
01:00:08,520 --> 01:00:09,720
Speaker 3: the way that you wanted to be run.

1240
01:00:09,800 --> 01:00:11,520
Speaker 2: On the other hand, they got a lot of what

1241
01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:13,640
Speaker 2: they wanted out of those shutdown fights. I mean, do

1242
01:00:13,680 --> 01:00:16,760
Speaker 2: you remember the whole what was it called budgets questration?

1243
01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:19,560
Speaker 2: That's not what it was grand but they got, but

1244
01:00:19,640 --> 01:00:23,640
Speaker 2: they got. They were out of power right in even war.

1245
01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:25,560
Speaker 2: I mean they, you know, were out of power in

1246
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:29,040
Speaker 2: a more dramatic way than the Democrats even are right now,

1247
01:00:29,400 --> 01:00:32,640
Speaker 2: and they still were able to, you know, effectuate some

1248
01:00:32,720 --> 01:00:35,520
Speaker 2: of their goals and get some of what they wanted

1249
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:40,000
Speaker 2: by using these power politics, because the reality is Republicans

1250
01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:42,480
Speaker 2: do need Democrats in order to fund the government.

1251
01:00:42,920 --> 01:00:43,040
Speaker 3: Now.

1252
01:00:43,080 --> 01:00:45,960
Speaker 2: The other dynamic to keep in mind here is like

1253
01:00:46,320 --> 01:00:49,240
Speaker 2: you know there are some Democrats. So part of why

1254
01:00:49,920 --> 01:00:52,880
Speaker 2: the reason why Schumer immediately came out after the backlash

1255
01:00:52,920 --> 01:00:54,440
Speaker 2: and was like, oh, I don't want a seven to

1256
01:00:54,440 --> 01:00:56,880
Speaker 2: ten day CDR wasn't because of what the base wants.

1257
01:00:56,920 --> 01:01:00,840
Speaker 2: It's because there were Democrats elected democrats in the House

1258
01:01:00,880 --> 01:01:02,640
Speaker 2: and in the Senate that were like, what the hell

1259
01:01:02,680 --> 01:01:07,600
Speaker 2: are you doing? Absolutely not and so but you only

1260
01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:10,000
Speaker 2: need seven Senate Democrats.

1261
01:01:09,720 --> 01:01:11,640
Speaker 1: To be able to pass as It's just not that many.

1262
01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:13,000
Speaker 4: So if you can.

1263
01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:16,440
Speaker 2: Make a few of them a little nervous, that's all

1264
01:01:16,520 --> 01:01:19,320
Speaker 2: you really need as a Republican to be able to

1265
01:01:19,440 --> 01:01:21,880
Speaker 2: ultimately get this done. So you know the fact that

1266
01:01:21,880 --> 01:01:25,320
Speaker 2: Schumer's already looking for the escape patch here and trying

1267
01:01:25,360 --> 01:01:28,920
Speaker 2: to figure out how to back down from the shutdown threats,

1268
01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:31,720
Speaker 2: I think is very revealing, even though he's now denying

1269
01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:33,600
Speaker 2: this particular mechanism is on the tape.

1270
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:36,080
Speaker 3: It also gets to my grassroots point that I made yesterday.

1271
01:01:36,200 --> 01:01:38,760
Speaker 3: I don't see like, are there groups out there calling

1272
01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:43,160
Speaker 3: for a shutdown? Because not individual among these hey, right,

1273
01:01:43,280 --> 01:01:45,760
Speaker 3: like during the this is the thing people need to

1274
01:01:45,800 --> 01:01:49,160
Speaker 3: remember during the Obama administration, when those Republicans were going

1275
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:54,320
Speaker 3: for a shutdown. It was imagine like Fox News, you know,

1276
01:01:54,440 --> 01:01:58,480
Speaker 3: the entire tea party apparatus, all of the conservative radio

1277
01:01:58,480 --> 01:02:01,880
Speaker 3: hosts across the country, Eric Rush Limbaugh, all these people.

1278
01:02:01,960 --> 01:02:05,440
Speaker 3: It was one message, shut it down, shut it down,

1279
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:08,320
Speaker 3: like they had the apparatus, they had the calls. I

1280
01:02:08,360 --> 01:02:10,240
Speaker 3: don't see that right now. Maybe I'm biased. You know,

1281
01:02:10,280 --> 01:02:13,560
Speaker 3: obviously I don't watch MSNBC. I don't engage as much.

1282
01:02:13,600 --> 01:02:16,480
Speaker 3: But even the liberal pundit class I don't see in

1283
01:02:16,520 --> 01:02:18,560
Speaker 3: a full throated way. I mean, we had as reclined

1284
01:02:18,600 --> 01:02:21,240
Speaker 3: for example, Remember he's like, well they think shutdowns are terrible,

1285
01:02:21,240 --> 01:02:22,920
Speaker 3: but you know, maybe we should shut it down to

1286
01:02:22,920 --> 01:02:25,760
Speaker 3: show It's like, dude, what just say shut it down?

1287
01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:29,000
Speaker 3: Like it's a much more clear message Like the pundit class,

1288
01:02:29,080 --> 01:02:32,040
Speaker 3: I don't see the MSNBC class and others united in

1289
01:02:32,080 --> 01:02:35,200
Speaker 3: a fervent message discipline. That's kind of why I would

1290
01:02:35,200 --> 01:02:37,000
Speaker 3: put my money on the Republicans for this one, because

1291
01:02:37,000 --> 01:02:39,760
Speaker 3: they're clear, They're like, look, we want to fire these people.

1292
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:41,520
Speaker 3: We're just going to fire them, and so you know,

1293
01:02:41,640 --> 01:02:43,800
Speaker 3: at the end of the day, we're going to call

1294
01:02:43,800 --> 01:02:46,360
Speaker 3: your bluffy people love bureaucrats so much, come and save them.

1295
01:02:46,360 --> 01:02:47,800
Speaker 3: Then you know, if you want to come and fund

1296
01:02:47,800 --> 01:02:49,760
Speaker 3: the government, I would probably put my money on that

1297
01:02:49,920 --> 01:02:50,320
Speaker 3: as well.

1298
01:02:50,320 --> 01:02:51,720
Speaker 2: And this is where it gets back to what I

1299
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:53,920
Speaker 2: was saying about what the base actually wants them to

1300
01:02:54,000 --> 01:02:56,920
Speaker 2: fight on, and so they I think you're right that

1301
01:02:56,960 --> 01:03:00,480
Speaker 2: there's definitely not as much of an organized and like

1302
01:03:00,480 --> 01:03:03,880
Speaker 2: like you know, the Tea Party physician was oftentimes you know,

1303
01:03:04,280 --> 01:03:05,320
Speaker 2: completely unreasive.

1304
01:03:05,320 --> 01:03:06,720
Speaker 4: They want things like balanced.

1305
01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:09,120
Speaker 2: Budget amendments and we're not going to increase the deficit

1306
01:03:09,240 --> 01:03:11,040
Speaker 2: or the debt whatsoever. And this is all just like

1307
01:03:11,040 --> 01:03:13,720
Speaker 2: preposterous given the basic math of what was going on here.

1308
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:17,440
Speaker 2: But they they were sort of locked into a clear

1309
01:03:17,480 --> 01:03:19,800
Speaker 2: goal and they had organized around it, and they had

1310
01:03:19,840 --> 01:03:22,040
Speaker 2: Tea Party movements across the country and all of that.

1311
01:03:22,120 --> 01:03:25,840
Speaker 2: And you're right, the similar like parallel organizations and institutions

1312
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:29,120
Speaker 2: don't exist on the Democratic side right now. And I

1313
01:03:29,240 --> 01:03:33,280
Speaker 2: think that some of the energy that could be around

1314
01:03:33,320 --> 01:03:36,040
Speaker 2: the shutdown fight is also undercut by the fact that

1315
01:03:36,240 --> 01:03:39,160
Speaker 2: rather than the leadership going for the things that the

1316
01:03:39,200 --> 01:03:41,480
Speaker 2: democratic base really wants, which is, like I said, to

1317
01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,400
Speaker 2: stand up against some of the like authoritarian overreach, national

1318
01:03:44,440 --> 01:03:47,240
Speaker 2: guard in the cities and things like that it's sort

1319
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:51,120
Speaker 2: of because it's this like poll tested healthcare thing. Again,

1320
01:03:51,200 --> 01:03:52,840
Speaker 2: not to say it's not important, not to say that

1321
01:03:52,880 --> 01:03:55,800
Speaker 2: people don't care at all, that's just not the thing

1322
01:03:56,240 --> 01:04:01,000
Speaker 2: that is highly motivating the Democratic base right now. And

1323
01:04:01,040 --> 01:04:03,680
Speaker 2: so that also SAPs some of the energy that they

1324
01:04:03,680 --> 01:04:07,040
Speaker 2: could be getting from the grassroots around a strategy, whereas

1325
01:04:07,040 --> 01:04:08,960
Speaker 2: if they were, you know, if they were going more

1326
01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:11,400
Speaker 2: in that direction, I think you would see more of

1327
01:04:11,440 --> 01:04:13,919
Speaker 2: that like organic support. The other thing I would say

1328
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:17,120
Speaker 2: is like they just didn't particularly message around.

1329
01:04:16,840 --> 01:04:18,840
Speaker 4: This at all until like three days ago.

1330
01:04:19,320 --> 01:04:22,880
Speaker 2: So you know, that makes it difficult to rally grassroots

1331
01:04:22,880 --> 01:04:25,200
Speaker 2: based support when they don't know what you want where

1332
01:04:25,240 --> 01:04:28,360
Speaker 2: you are, like, there is no real there is no

1333
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:31,440
Speaker 2: leadership coming from the top of the Democratic Party for

1334
01:04:31,520 --> 01:04:32,760
Speaker 2: people then to rally around.

1335
01:04:32,760 --> 01:04:34,040
Speaker 1: I just don't get the Democrats.

1336
01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:37,840
Speaker 3: I really don't, because Mitch McConnell the do It's like,

1337
01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:40,640
Speaker 3: what are you guys doing? Mitch McConnell the most honest

1338
01:04:40,680 --> 01:04:43,080
Speaker 3: thing he ever said, and was it two thousand and nine,

1339
01:04:43,200 --> 01:04:45,720
Speaker 3: right after Obama's inauguration and they're like, are you going

1340
01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:46,480
Speaker 3: to work with Obama?

1341
01:04:46,520 --> 01:04:48,280
Speaker 1: And he's like, no, I have one job it's make

1342
01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:50,919
Speaker 1: sure he doesn't get reelected. That's it. That's the whole job.

1343
01:04:51,080 --> 01:04:53,520
Speaker 1: It's so that's why balance.

1344
01:04:53,600 --> 01:04:56,160
Speaker 3: But it's all bullshit, okay, like it was all just

1345
01:04:56,600 --> 01:04:59,480
Speaker 3: wrapped up. As many Democrats said at the time, they

1346
01:04:59,520 --> 01:05:00,920
Speaker 3: don't actually here about.

1347
01:05:00,640 --> 01:05:02,600
Speaker 1: Any of this. Yeah, you're right. They wanted to wound

1348
01:05:02,680 --> 01:05:03,160
Speaker 1: the president.

1349
01:05:03,160 --> 01:05:06,920
Speaker 3: They wanted to inflict pain on the administration and to

1350
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:09,800
Speaker 3: make sure that they caved in some way so that

1351
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:12,280
Speaker 3: the Republican base could feel like they were doing something

1352
01:05:12,280 --> 01:05:12,680
Speaker 3: about it.

1353
01:05:12,880 --> 01:05:13,320
Speaker 1: That's it.

1354
01:05:13,520 --> 01:05:16,240
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm not quite sure yet what the base

1355
01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:18,960
Speaker 3: is so animated about. In terms of my neighborhood. The

1356
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:21,440
Speaker 3: no King signs are everywhere. That seems to be like

1357
01:05:21,480 --> 01:05:24,000
Speaker 3: the uniting thing. Fine, whatever, But my point is just

1358
01:05:24,120 --> 01:05:26,680
Speaker 3: when you look at Chuck Schumer and all of those people,

1359
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:28,880
Speaker 3: they don't talk that way, like you know, they're the

1360
01:05:29,000 --> 01:05:31,960
Speaker 3: poll testing. They're not coming out and being like we

1361
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:34,880
Speaker 3: hate Trump, you hate Trump. We're gonna do everything in

1362
01:05:34,920 --> 01:05:37,160
Speaker 3: our power to make his life hell. That seems to

1363
01:05:37,160 --> 01:05:39,360
Speaker 3: be what the most that's the uniting message. Right if

1364
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:41,760
Speaker 3: you're a Democratic basis correct that you know, if you're

1365
01:05:41,760 --> 01:05:45,040
Speaker 3: an anti ice poster and you're some no Kings, boomer

1366
01:05:45,120 --> 01:05:46,800
Speaker 3: lady who lives in my neighborhood.

1367
01:05:46,920 --> 01:05:47,400
Speaker 1: There you go.

1368
01:05:47,560 --> 01:05:50,960
Speaker 3: You're together right on that one. It's the most uniting message.

1369
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:53,000
Speaker 3: And yet they're like, it's not just the poll testing.

1370
01:05:53,320 --> 01:05:53,720
Speaker 1: I don't know.

1371
01:05:53,760 --> 01:05:56,480
Speaker 3: I just see such lack of organization. I also see

1372
01:05:56,560 --> 01:05:59,439
Speaker 3: lack of stars. Where is buddhaj Edge? You know he's

1373
01:05:59,480 --> 01:06:02,320
Speaker 3: doing Andrew Callahan's Patreon.

1374
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:03,640
Speaker 1: You know, and the guy we don't even have to

1375
01:06:03,640 --> 01:06:06,160
Speaker 1: hear what he has to say. Where is Chris Murphy.

1376
01:06:06,200 --> 01:06:08,600
Speaker 3: I just interviewed the guy. He hasn't made a couple

1377
01:06:08,600 --> 01:06:11,200
Speaker 3: of comments. He's not an MSNBC the way that Mike

1378
01:06:11,280 --> 01:06:14,680
Speaker 3: Lee and Ted Cruz were. I mean, these guys were firebrands. Emily,

1379
01:06:14,960 --> 01:06:17,320
Speaker 3: by the way, did an incredible monologue with her and

1380
01:06:17,360 --> 01:06:20,600
Speaker 3: I on the show about the shutdown fight, and she

1381
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:23,360
Speaker 3: pulled a bunch of clips back from twenty thirteen. Everyone

1382
01:06:23,400 --> 01:06:25,840
Speaker 3: should go watch that if you're interested to mirror what

1383
01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:28,320
Speaker 3: their successful playbook was and how they were able to

1384
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:31,400
Speaker 3: rise to start them. I don't see a single Democratic

1385
01:06:31,440 --> 01:06:32,920
Speaker 3: senator doing any.

1386
01:06:32,760 --> 01:06:34,200
Speaker 4: Of that, And that's why that's a good point.

1387
01:06:34,280 --> 01:06:34,520
Speaker 1: I don't.

1388
01:06:34,640 --> 01:06:36,040
Speaker 4: I'm like, where a good point.

1389
01:06:35,920 --> 01:06:39,040
Speaker 3: Is the leadership like where even Bernie, where are you, dude?

1390
01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:42,760
Speaker 3: Like you should be laying stuff out barnstorming podcast scene.

1391
01:06:42,840 --> 01:06:46,320
Speaker 3: Everything should be united around this. Things are disparate, you

1392
01:06:46,320 --> 01:06:47,280
Speaker 3: know he said indivisible.

1393
01:06:47,320 --> 01:06:48,000
Speaker 1: I didn't even know.

1394
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:50,720
Speaker 3: I definitely knew that about the Tea Party groups. Remember

1395
01:06:50,800 --> 01:06:53,200
Speaker 3: the moms again still, you know, like all moms for

1396
01:06:53,600 --> 01:06:55,160
Speaker 3: whatever organization.

1397
01:06:55,440 --> 01:06:57,640
Speaker 1: I'm even blanking on the on the on these names.

1398
01:06:57,640 --> 01:07:00,000
Speaker 2: It's been so long, but I mean, the Tea Party

1399
01:07:00,120 --> 01:07:04,880
Speaker 2: chapters were genuinely Your point about the stars is an

1400
01:07:04,880 --> 01:07:08,280
Speaker 2: interesting one too, And this again comes from the very

1401
01:07:08,320 --> 01:07:12,000
Speaker 2: poll tested like, let me figure out, let me sort

1402
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:14,560
Speaker 2: of triangulate with the best places for us to make

1403
01:07:14,600 --> 01:07:18,440
Speaker 2: our stand, because then you don't have you don't necessarily

1404
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:21,200
Speaker 2: have people in the coalition, like elected leaders in the

1405
01:07:21,200 --> 01:07:23,600
Speaker 2: coalition who were like, this is my thing, this is

1406
01:07:23,640 --> 01:07:25,800
Speaker 2: where I'm going to make my stand, et cetera. And

1407
01:07:25,880 --> 01:07:27,960
Speaker 2: so in the Tea Party era, yeah, you had you

1408
01:07:28,000 --> 01:07:31,160
Speaker 2: had Ted Cruz, you had Mike Lee, you had you know,

1409
01:07:31,240 --> 01:07:34,680
Speaker 2: Paul Ryan was there in the mix, Jim Jordan, Mark Meadows,

1410
01:07:34,760 --> 01:07:37,160
Speaker 2: like you knew who these people were, and they were

1411
01:07:37,160 --> 01:07:42,320
Speaker 2: constant hardline spokespeople rallying the troops to the cause, and yeah,

1412
01:07:42,360 --> 01:07:46,240
Speaker 2: you don't have anything really approaching that on the Democratic side,

1413
01:07:46,280 --> 01:07:50,520
Speaker 2: partly because it's you know, they were very unified behind

1414
01:07:50,760 --> 01:07:53,880
Speaker 2: two things. One, let's just fuck up Barack Obama's presidency

1415
01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:56,080
Speaker 2: and number two like this fiscal austerity thing that you know,

1416
01:07:56,200 --> 01:07:57,960
Speaker 2: course ends up being nonsense, but that's what they were

1417
01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:01,040
Speaker 2: all very committed to at that moment, right, And you

1418
01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:05,000
Speaker 2: just don't have that same sort of direction within the

1419
01:08:05,000 --> 01:08:09,600
Speaker 2: Democratic Party where the leadership is aligned with what the

1420
01:08:09,640 --> 01:08:13,560
Speaker 2: base wants and is consistently messaging on you know, a

1421
01:08:13,600 --> 01:08:15,680
Speaker 2: few core things that the base really wants to see

1422
01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:18,679
Speaker 2: them fight on, even if they know that it's kind

1423
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:20,960
Speaker 2: of like a losing battle. They just I think you're

1424
01:08:21,040 --> 01:08:23,360
Speaker 2: right that really the energy is just they want to

1425
01:08:23,400 --> 01:08:25,840
Speaker 2: make things difficult for them. They want to put them

1426
01:08:25,880 --> 01:08:29,000
Speaker 2: in a difficult position and you know, for their leadership

1427
01:08:29,040 --> 01:08:31,519
Speaker 2: to get caught fighting, and that has yet to happen.

1428
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:33,920
Speaker 3: Look, I mean, you can't absolve you know, I've just

1429
01:08:34,000 --> 01:08:36,479
Speaker 3: check Bernie's timeline. You don't have a single tweet about shutdown,

1430
01:08:36,560 --> 01:08:38,280
Speaker 3: like what are we doing here? You know, like where

1431
01:08:38,320 --> 01:08:41,720
Speaker 3: are you people? You're not on TV? Like you know,

1432
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:45,360
Speaker 3: AOC all of them. I don't know what it is.

1433
01:08:45,439 --> 01:08:49,560
Speaker 3: It's like some weird norms brain virus that has infected

1434
01:08:49,600 --> 01:08:53,280
Speaker 3: all of them where they've attacked the It's like it's

1435
01:08:53,320 --> 01:08:55,559
Speaker 3: like they want they don't want to be called out

1436
01:08:55,560 --> 01:08:57,760
Speaker 3: for hypocrisy. By the way, guys, and I don't even

1437
01:08:57,760 --> 01:09:00,679
Speaker 3: think JD would care about saying this. Was tweeting about

1438
01:09:00,720 --> 01:09:03,680
Speaker 3: shutdowns two years ago. It was like, why wouldn't we

1439
01:09:03,760 --> 01:09:06,840
Speaker 3: use Why wouldn't we use the power that we have?

1440
01:09:07,960 --> 01:09:10,200
Speaker 4: How could they use the shutdown about leverage?

1441
01:09:10,280 --> 01:09:12,240
Speaker 3: Like there they right, nobody's gonna be like, oh, what

1442
01:09:12,320 --> 01:09:14,360
Speaker 3: the hypocrisy?

1443
01:09:14,520 --> 01:09:16,760
Speaker 4: They're dead right, you know, everyone's ah.

1444
01:09:16,960 --> 01:09:19,880
Speaker 1: Get over there, right exactly. They don't care about that.

1445
01:09:19,960 --> 01:09:21,840
Speaker 1: So why do you where are you?

1446
01:09:21,840 --> 01:09:22,000
Speaker 3: You know?

1447
01:09:22,040 --> 01:09:22,559
Speaker 1: I don't know.

1448
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:25,400
Speaker 3: If I was one of those, you know, boomer women

1449
01:09:25,720 --> 01:09:29,000
Speaker 3: who I live around, I would be so mad all

1450
01:09:29,000 --> 01:09:31,680
Speaker 3: those people right now they are what are you doing well?

1451
01:09:31,720 --> 01:09:33,040
Speaker 4: And that the things they are?

1452
01:09:33,520 --> 01:09:37,400
Speaker 2: You know, That's what's really different right now is people

1453
01:09:37,439 --> 01:09:40,719
Speaker 2: really liked Nancy, Like the Democratic base she was really

1454
01:09:40,800 --> 01:09:44,759
Speaker 2: liked Nancy Pelosi, you know, and and listen in her absence,

1455
01:09:44,880 --> 01:09:46,840
Speaker 2: she's way better than kme Jeffrey's I can tell you

1456
01:09:46,920 --> 01:09:50,040
Speaker 2: that as a strategist, as a spokesperson, as someone who

1457
01:09:50,080 --> 01:09:52,240
Speaker 2: has the appearance of a spine like she was a

1458
01:09:52,320 --> 01:09:55,800
Speaker 2: much more effective leader, no doubt about that. And it just,

1459
01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:58,880
Speaker 2: I don't know, there was a different moment now the

1460
01:09:58,880 --> 01:10:02,360
Speaker 2: there is a real sense that Democratic leadership has capitulated

1461
01:10:02,560 --> 01:10:04,799
Speaker 2: that they've led them, you know, them off a cliff,

1462
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:07,960
Speaker 2: that they have decided just to like croll up and

1463
01:10:07,960 --> 01:10:10,800
Speaker 2: fetal position rather than fighting, as Trump has ramped up

1464
01:10:10,840 --> 01:10:12,720
Speaker 2: his attacks in a much more aggressive way than we

1465
01:10:12,760 --> 01:10:14,479
Speaker 2: ever saw on Trump one point zero.

1466
01:10:14,840 --> 01:10:18,080
Speaker 4: And so there is a complete disgust and.

1467
01:10:18,040 --> 01:10:21,519
Speaker 2: Fury at Democratic leadership right now that is so different

1468
01:10:21,640 --> 01:10:24,320
Speaker 2: within the Democratic base, and that is going to express

1469
01:10:24,360 --> 01:10:26,720
Speaker 2: itself in some places. I don't know if it's you know,

1470
01:10:26,760 --> 01:10:28,559
Speaker 2: I don't think it's going to be in the shutdown fight,

1471
01:10:28,760 --> 01:10:30,680
Speaker 2: but down the road in primaries terms of.

1472
01:10:30,600 --> 01:10:33,080
Speaker 4: Twenty twenty eight, you know, the direction of the party.

1473
01:10:33,160 --> 01:10:35,920
Speaker 2: There is no doubt that that rage and discuss that

1474
01:10:35,960 --> 01:10:38,200
Speaker 2: the Democratic base has with their own leadership is going

1475
01:10:38,240 --> 01:10:40,320
Speaker 2: to be expressed and have consequences at some point, which

1476
01:10:40,320 --> 01:10:41,960
Speaker 2: is why Schimmer's doing this, because he knows on some

1477
01:10:42,120 --> 01:10:45,040
Speaker 2: level that their you know, their grip on the power

1478
01:10:45,400 --> 01:10:48,040
Speaker 2: within their own party is at stake right now if

1479
01:10:48,040 --> 01:10:50,639
Speaker 2: they don't at least appear to try to do a little.

1480
01:10:50,439 --> 01:10:50,960
Speaker 4: Bit of something.

1481
01:10:51,040 --> 01:10:53,160
Speaker 3: He's looking a lot like John Bayner to me right now.

1482
01:10:53,240 --> 01:10:58,960
Speaker 3: So let's get to the Epstein story.

1483
01:10:58,960 --> 01:10:59,080
Speaker 6: Man.

1484
01:10:59,120 --> 01:11:00,680
Speaker 1: I've been wanting to cover this for a while. It

1485
01:11:00,720 --> 01:11:02,520
Speaker 1: is so crazy.

1486
01:11:02,600 --> 01:11:05,920
Speaker 3: Credit to Mortaza and Ryan over a drop site for

1487
01:11:06,040 --> 01:11:06,519
Speaker 3: reporting it.

1488
01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:08,200
Speaker 1: Let's put this up here on the screen.

1489
01:11:08,320 --> 01:11:11,120
Speaker 3: So I'm going to read pretty extensively from this because

1490
01:11:11,120 --> 01:11:13,160
Speaker 3: it's one of the best pieces of evidence that we

1491
01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:17,519
Speaker 3: have right now about Epstein's actual involvement in explicitly brokering

1492
01:11:17,840 --> 01:11:20,760
Speaker 3: Israeli security agreements. So what they write here is that

1493
01:11:20,800 --> 01:11:24,960
Speaker 3: Epstein quote used his political network and financial resources to

1494
01:11:25,080 --> 01:11:29,000
Speaker 3: help broker a security cooperation agreement between the governments of

1495
01:11:29,160 --> 01:11:32,639
Speaker 3: Israel and Mongolia, according to a trove of leaked emails

1496
01:11:32,680 --> 01:11:35,599
Speaker 3: from the former Israeli Prime Minister Aud Brock. The new

1497
01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:39,200
Speaker 3: set of emails between Barack and Epstein has largely been

1498
01:11:39,240 --> 01:11:42,200
Speaker 3: ignored by the mainstream press, but it includes crucial new

1499
01:11:42,240 --> 01:11:45,639
Speaker 3: context on Epstein's operation. Well known that Epstein had personal

1500
01:11:45,680 --> 01:11:49,120
Speaker 3: ties to Israel, including Barack and Aodo Maher. But now

1501
01:11:49,200 --> 01:11:51,800
Speaker 3: what these emails show that were released by a pro

1502
01:11:51,880 --> 01:11:55,880
Speaker 3: Palstindian hacking group with ties to Iran. They say it

1503
01:11:56,040 --> 01:12:00,519
Speaker 3: shows extensive emails from twenty thirteen to twenty sixteen intimate,

1504
01:12:00,640 --> 01:12:04,759
Speaker 3: often daily correspondence between Barack and Epstein. Their conversations address

1505
01:12:04,800 --> 01:12:08,080
Speaker 3: political and business strategy, as Epstein coordinated meetings for Barack

1506
01:12:08,160 --> 01:12:10,760
Speaker 3: with other members of his elite circles. The article is

1507
01:12:10,800 --> 01:12:13,040
Speaker 3: the first in a series that will explore his work

1508
01:12:13,080 --> 01:12:16,360
Speaker 3: on behalf of Israeli military interests, particularly as it relates

1509
01:12:16,400 --> 01:12:18,600
Speaker 3: to his role in the israel in the development of

1510
01:12:18,720 --> 01:12:23,080
Speaker 3: israel cyber warfare industry. The rise of Israeli surveillance and

1511
01:12:23,120 --> 01:12:26,759
Speaker 3: weapons industry is explicitly linked to much of the Epstein

1512
01:12:26,800 --> 01:12:30,560
Speaker 3: investments which he helped broker for aid Barock. But potentially

1513
01:12:30,600 --> 01:12:33,240
Speaker 3: what they see here is the most explicit use of

1514
01:12:33,439 --> 01:12:36,240
Speaker 3: actual intervention for state power, and in terms of the

1515
01:12:36,280 --> 01:12:39,719
Speaker 3: security agreement with Mongolia and so, I know it sounds

1516
01:12:39,720 --> 01:12:42,240
Speaker 3: a little bit crazy, like how exactly did it all

1517
01:12:42,400 --> 01:12:44,920
Speaker 3: come about? But what it basically gets to is that

1518
01:12:45,360 --> 01:12:49,240
Speaker 3: Epstein was this critical node of power. And this is

1519
01:12:49,240 --> 01:12:51,360
Speaker 3: what we focus on for quite some time. What the

1520
01:12:51,400 --> 01:12:54,559
Speaker 3: emails show is that Barack even after he's out of

1521
01:12:54,560 --> 01:12:58,160
Speaker 3: office and he's staying at the Epstein mansion while having

1522
01:12:58,160 --> 01:13:00,360
Speaker 3: a mask on his face walking in their photograph by

1523
01:13:00,560 --> 01:13:03,360
Speaker 3: the near post, and while he's receiving this money from

1524
01:13:03,400 --> 01:13:07,800
Speaker 3: Epstein for his military intelligence, you know, investments, and why

1525
01:13:07,840 --> 01:13:09,840
Speaker 3: he also is getting paid some what is it two

1526
01:13:09,840 --> 01:13:13,040
Speaker 3: million dollars by the Leslie Wexner Foundation for two reports,

1527
01:13:13,080 --> 01:13:15,559
Speaker 3: one of which he never finished, which was controlled by

1528
01:13:15,560 --> 01:13:18,280
Speaker 3: the Jeffrey Epstein, by Jeffrey Epstein who was a chairman

1529
01:13:18,400 --> 01:13:20,519
Speaker 3: of said foundation. While he's doing all of this in

1530
01:13:20,560 --> 01:13:24,440
Speaker 3: the background, he is here setting up these daily correspondents

1531
01:13:24,439 --> 01:13:26,639
Speaker 3: and meetings for Barack. Keep in mind, this is all

1532
01:13:26,720 --> 01:13:30,120
Speaker 3: after Epstein is a registered sex offender, remember of the

1533
01:13:30,120 --> 01:13:34,559
Speaker 3: timeline twenty thirteen to twenty sixteen, and leading eventually to

1534
01:13:34,640 --> 01:13:38,400
Speaker 3: some sort of Israeli security cooperation agreement in the future. Now,

1535
01:13:38,840 --> 01:13:41,559
Speaker 3: let's be clear as well, this does not say he

1536
01:13:41,720 --> 01:13:44,720
Speaker 3: was explicitly an Israeli agent, and I've never actually even

1537
01:13:44,760 --> 01:13:46,720
Speaker 3: said that. What I have said is that he was

1538
01:13:46,720 --> 01:13:51,040
Speaker 3: a very useful individual to people in power and intelligence networks,

1539
01:13:51,160 --> 01:13:55,599
Speaker 3: probably the most odd Saudi Arabia, Russia KG or whatever,

1540
01:13:55,600 --> 01:13:59,000
Speaker 3: the FSB, CIA, all of these people. But you know

1541
01:13:59,320 --> 01:14:01,680
Speaker 3: it was when he got in trouble for some of

1542
01:14:01,720 --> 01:14:04,960
Speaker 3: his proclivities that that's when those apparatus is kind of

1543
01:14:05,000 --> 01:14:08,599
Speaker 3: kicked into gear. And it's been explicitly denied now at

1544
01:14:08,600 --> 01:14:12,360
Speaker 3: the highest level by you know, the former's really Prime Minister.

1545
01:14:12,600 --> 01:14:15,160
Speaker 3: Enough Tolly Bennett, now the head of MOSAD, who was

1546
01:14:15,160 --> 01:14:17,840
Speaker 3: recently on Barry Weiss's show, said oh, absolutely, he's never

1547
01:14:17,880 --> 01:14:21,160
Speaker 3: worked for MOSAD. Never worked for Mosador. Remember, not worked

1548
01:14:21,200 --> 01:14:23,840
Speaker 3: with MOSAD. Those were very different things that you could

1549
01:14:23,920 --> 01:14:24,439
Speaker 3: lay out there.

1550
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:26,200
Speaker 1: They can come out and deny that too.

1551
01:14:26,240 --> 01:14:28,479
Speaker 3: Would you believe it from the CIA if they said

1552
01:14:28,760 --> 01:14:32,160
Speaker 3: something like that. So anyway, very important piece of evidence

1553
01:14:32,479 --> 01:14:34,719
Speaker 3: in all of this, of course, has been completely ignored

1554
01:14:34,920 --> 01:14:38,280
Speaker 3: by most of the mainstream media on this, probably because

1555
01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:41,080
Speaker 3: you know, of this pro poust Indian hacking group. Who

1556
01:14:41,120 --> 01:14:43,880
Speaker 3: cares where the information come from? Emails or emails? All right,

1557
01:14:43,960 --> 01:14:47,320
Speaker 3: by the way, Iran, if you're listening, send it over, Okay,

1558
01:14:47,360 --> 01:14:49,320
Speaker 3: all right, I'll take it from anybody as long as

1559
01:14:49,320 --> 01:14:49,760
Speaker 3: it's real.

1560
01:14:49,800 --> 01:14:50,240
Speaker 1: I don't care.

1561
01:14:50,400 --> 01:14:54,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, and anyway, Yeah, so a final another piece in

1562
01:14:54,680 --> 01:14:57,040
Speaker 3: the puzzle that we can just put right there.

1563
01:14:57,160 --> 01:14:59,320
Speaker 1: We don't have all the other pieces, but the picture

1564
01:14:59,360 --> 01:15:00,320
Speaker 1: is all starting to together.

1565
01:15:00,360 --> 01:15:02,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean it's pretty extraordinary, right.

1566
01:15:02,080 --> 01:15:04,760
Speaker 2: And we knew that relationship that he had with the

1567
01:15:04,800 --> 01:15:07,559
Speaker 2: Formers really was it was very close. He was they

1568
01:15:07,560 --> 01:15:09,360
Speaker 2: were to gather all the time. You've got the famous

1569
01:15:09,360 --> 01:15:11,800
Speaker 2: photo of him going into the mansion all masked up.

1570
01:15:12,160 --> 01:15:15,040
Speaker 2: We knew they did business together, and this just sort

1571
01:15:15,040 --> 01:15:17,880
Speaker 2: of flesh puts puts flesh on the bone of what

1572
01:15:17,920 --> 01:15:19,080
Speaker 2: that relationship looked like.

1573
01:15:19,400 --> 01:15:20,400
Speaker 4: And it reminded me.

1574
01:15:20,520 --> 01:15:23,880
Speaker 2: Quite a bit of also the way that epstein ingratiated

1575
01:15:23,960 --> 01:15:28,080
Speaker 2: himself with JP Morgan, because it was the same. You know,

1576
01:15:28,600 --> 01:15:33,400
Speaker 2: he was seen as this real powerbroker where he was

1577
01:15:33,400 --> 01:15:36,840
Speaker 2: bringing business to them and you know, creating meetings for them,

1578
01:15:36,880 --> 01:15:39,200
Speaker 2: and then he had this network of wealthy and powerful

1579
01:15:39,240 --> 01:15:42,120
Speaker 2: individuals that he was providing benefit to them also by

1580
01:15:42,160 --> 01:15:44,519
Speaker 2: bringing them into these meetings with the bank. And so

1581
01:15:44,640 --> 01:15:46,360
Speaker 2: when the shit hits the fan and he's a registered

1582
01:15:46,439 --> 01:15:48,240
Speaker 2: sex offender and they have to decide what they're going

1583
01:15:48,320 --> 01:15:50,519
Speaker 2: to do, there are a lot of people there who

1584
01:15:50,560 --> 01:15:52,720
Speaker 2: also you know, some of the executives are directly in

1585
01:15:52,720 --> 01:15:55,639
Speaker 2: his circle and going to the island as well. Oh no,

1586
01:15:55,760 --> 01:15:59,120
Speaker 2: but he's so good for us business wise, and by

1587
01:15:59,160 --> 01:16:01,839
Speaker 2: the way, since he has all of these powerful connections,

1588
01:16:01,840 --> 01:16:03,960
Speaker 2: like if they're okay, if the former Prime Minister of

1589
01:16:04,040 --> 01:16:06,479
Speaker 2: Israel is okay with him, like who are we to judge?

1590
01:16:07,000 --> 01:16:08,160
Speaker 4: So this is part of.

1591
01:16:08,160 --> 01:16:11,040
Speaker 2: How I mean, this really shines a light on how

1592
01:16:11,080 --> 01:16:14,400
Speaker 2: he was able to operate with such total and complete

1593
01:16:14,479 --> 01:16:17,519
Speaker 2: impunity in the way that he was in the highest

1594
01:16:17,520 --> 01:16:20,920
Speaker 2: circles of global power, you know, both here in Israel

1595
01:16:20,960 --> 01:16:24,000
Speaker 2: and other places as well. So there's another story that's

1596
01:16:24,160 --> 01:16:26,760
Speaker 2: very worth keeping an eye on this week as well.

1597
01:16:26,760 --> 01:16:29,160
Speaker 2: Even put D two up on the screen, which is

1598
01:16:29,600 --> 01:16:34,040
Speaker 2: Supreme Court this week is considering whether they are going

1599
01:16:34,080 --> 01:16:39,599
Speaker 2: to take up the Gallaine Maxwell challenge to her, you know,

1600
01:16:39,680 --> 01:16:43,599
Speaker 2: to her one count of her criminal convictions for sex trafficking,

1601
01:16:43,600 --> 01:16:47,080
Speaker 2: and basically her argument is, hey, that sweetheart deal that

1602
01:16:47,160 --> 01:16:50,559
Speaker 2: was cut by alex Acosta back in Florida that said,

1603
01:16:50,800 --> 01:16:53,120
Speaker 2: not only is this this is it for Epstein, but

1604
01:16:53,240 --> 01:16:57,240
Speaker 2: also for his co conspirators named and unnamed. That applies

1605
01:16:57,280 --> 01:17:00,759
Speaker 2: to me, So you shouldn't have been able to indict

1606
01:17:00,880 --> 01:17:04,720
Speaker 2: and try me on this charge. And that appeal has

1607
01:17:04,760 --> 01:17:06,439
Speaker 2: now gone all the way up to the Supreme Court

1608
01:17:06,479 --> 01:17:09,240
Speaker 2: where they face the decision whether or not to consider

1609
01:17:09,960 --> 01:17:13,880
Speaker 2: to consider that appeal. The Department of Justices position is, no,

1610
01:17:14,000 --> 01:17:15,680
Speaker 2: you shouldn't take it up because there's all kinds of

1611
01:17:15,720 --> 01:17:17,280
Speaker 2: other stuff going on, So we don't want you to

1612
01:17:17,280 --> 01:17:19,479
Speaker 2: look at this right now. So we're waiting to see

1613
01:17:19,520 --> 01:17:21,439
Speaker 2: what the Supreme Court has ultimately got to do with it.

1614
01:17:21,720 --> 01:17:25,000
Speaker 2: But you know, it really exposes how just disgusting that

1615
01:17:25,120 --> 01:17:28,680
Speaker 2: original deal and illegal by the way, too violated, was

1616
01:17:28,720 --> 01:17:32,639
Speaker 2: found to have violated the victim's rights, that original sweetheart deal,

1617
01:17:32,960 --> 01:17:36,720
Speaker 2: that it could even absolve Glaine Maxwell, who was so

1618
01:17:36,880 --> 01:17:39,400
Speaker 2: complicit in all of the horrors and crimes that were

1619
01:17:39,400 --> 01:17:40,719
Speaker 2: committed by Jeffrey Epstein.

1620
01:17:40,760 --> 01:17:43,360
Speaker 3: We would hope that it doesn't go through. But with this,

1621
01:17:43,760 --> 01:17:46,160
Speaker 3: you know, you have no idea in some ways, and

1622
01:17:46,200 --> 01:17:48,920
Speaker 3: this is going to sound insane, but there is a

1623
01:17:49,000 --> 01:17:51,880
Speaker 3: legal argument to be made as horrible as the deal was. Right,

1624
01:17:51,920 --> 01:17:54,560
Speaker 3: her argument is basically, hey, you gain you may be

1625
01:17:54,600 --> 01:17:58,400
Speaker 3: a printed document from the United States Government, United States

1626
01:17:58,479 --> 01:18:01,640
Speaker 3: of America that's said I will not prosecute you, and

1627
01:18:01,680 --> 01:18:04,479
Speaker 3: you're good to go. If Epstein go ahead and pleads

1628
01:18:04,560 --> 01:18:07,519
Speaker 3: guilty or whatever, to this very narrow set of charges,

1629
01:18:07,680 --> 01:18:09,120
Speaker 3: which is the greatest sweetheart deal.

1630
01:18:09,280 --> 01:18:09,800
Speaker 1: She's like, you.

1631
01:18:09,720 --> 01:18:12,439
Speaker 3: Can't just go back on your word because some judge

1632
01:18:12,479 --> 01:18:15,360
Speaker 3: in twenty eighteen said it was illegal only because you

1633
01:18:15,400 --> 01:18:16,880
Speaker 3: didn't follow best practices.

1634
01:18:16,920 --> 01:18:18,280
Speaker 1: We held up our end of the bargain.

1635
01:18:18,320 --> 01:18:20,599
Speaker 3: If it's the government's fault for making the wrong deal,

1636
01:18:20,920 --> 01:18:22,720
Speaker 3: and that's the I mean, that's part of the most

1637
01:18:22,760 --> 01:18:25,360
Speaker 3: insane part about the seven Deal really in the in

1638
01:18:25,680 --> 01:18:29,040
Speaker 3: the first place, and part of why, in my you know,

1639
01:18:29,280 --> 01:18:33,000
Speaker 3: in my estimation, is one of the clearest evidences of

1640
01:18:33,120 --> 01:18:36,400
Speaker 3: immense government power or some force behind the scenes doing

1641
01:18:36,439 --> 01:18:40,439
Speaker 3: something to protect him. But it does also demonstrate that

1642
01:18:40,520 --> 01:18:45,120
Speaker 3: for Trump and with Maxwell, there are various different avenues

1643
01:18:45,160 --> 01:18:48,320
Speaker 3: which they're trying to have a release valve. Because they

1644
01:18:48,360 --> 01:18:51,439
Speaker 3: had her sit down with the Deputy Attorney General, they

1645
01:18:51,479 --> 01:18:54,559
Speaker 3: made sure that you know, she got all of her bs, you.

1646
01:18:54,520 --> 01:18:56,759
Speaker 1: Know, denials out in the open.

1647
01:18:56,880 --> 01:18:59,679
Speaker 3: By the way, I've already demonstrated many of the explicit

1648
01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:02,200
Speaker 3: lives that she said in that transcript. Not that Todd

1649
01:19:02,240 --> 01:19:04,840
Speaker 3: Blanche did anything to push back against him. But the

1650
01:19:04,880 --> 01:19:09,280
Speaker 3: point remains that for Maxwell herself, what we see is

1651
01:19:09,320 --> 01:19:11,720
Speaker 3: that she's scheming for two things. Both to get the

1652
01:19:11,760 --> 01:19:14,240
Speaker 3: Supreme Court to try to let her out. I don't

1653
01:19:14,400 --> 01:19:17,559
Speaker 3: think that's going to happen, but it is certainly possible,

1654
01:19:17,600 --> 01:19:19,880
Speaker 3: though I just wouldn't necessarily bet on it. The other

1655
01:19:20,000 --> 01:19:21,880
Speaker 3: is a pardon. I mean, she's already got the sweetheart.

1656
01:19:22,080 --> 01:19:25,080
Speaker 3: You know, she's transferred to this federal prison, federal prison

1657
01:19:25,160 --> 01:19:28,120
Speaker 3: camp in some sort of great you know, club fed

1658
01:19:28,479 --> 01:19:30,559
Speaker 3: or whatever, which she's not even supposed to be, and

1659
01:19:30,760 --> 01:19:32,840
Speaker 3: a lot of the victims and other people's families are

1660
01:19:32,880 --> 01:19:35,880
Speaker 3: outraged at the fact that that happened, and she's on

1661
01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:37,880
Speaker 3: her way to some sort of part in which could

1662
01:19:37,880 --> 01:19:40,200
Speaker 3: potentially absolve Trump. The thing is, and this is what

1663
01:19:40,320 --> 01:19:42,439
Speaker 3: I find sad about it. I already feel like the

1664
01:19:42,560 --> 01:19:44,720
Speaker 3: energy around this is dying. I know that there are

1665
01:19:44,760 --> 01:19:46,360
Speaker 3: a lot of people who are very interested in the story.

1666
01:19:46,479 --> 01:19:49,479
Speaker 3: We get temporary flashes of a certain pieces of release

1667
01:19:49,760 --> 01:19:52,080
Speaker 3: and all of that. But we had the Massy Rokana thing,

1668
01:19:52,280 --> 01:19:55,240
Speaker 3: now we're onto the shutdown. We did the Israel security

1669
01:19:55,280 --> 01:19:57,000
Speaker 3: and this is what the Trump administration was betting on.

1670
01:19:57,040 --> 01:19:58,200
Speaker 3: They're like, at the end of the day, we can

1671
01:19:58,240 --> 01:20:01,960
Speaker 3: survive this, and Trump if there was a long Well

1672
01:20:01,960 --> 01:20:04,599
Speaker 3: Street journal piece about the whole way that this Epstein

1673
01:20:04,680 --> 01:20:08,439
Speaker 3: saga developed and put Bondie allegedly and the infamous meeting

1674
01:20:08,520 --> 01:20:10,360
Speaker 3: tells Trump, you know your name is in there. Not

1675
01:20:10,520 --> 01:20:12,920
Speaker 3: you know, you're not implicating any wrongdoing or whatever, but

1676
01:20:12,960 --> 01:20:14,840
Speaker 3: your name is in there, and you know, he kind

1677
01:20:14,840 --> 01:20:17,599
Speaker 3: of freaks out about it. He starts getting upset at

1678
01:20:17,640 --> 01:20:20,680
Speaker 3: why his supporters and others are.

1679
01:20:20,400 --> 01:20:21,799
Speaker 1: So obsessed with Epstein.

1680
01:20:22,120 --> 01:20:24,880
Speaker 3: He apparently said, Palm Beach was a very different time.

1681
01:20:25,920 --> 01:20:28,080
Speaker 4: Don't they understand Palm Beach in the nineties was a

1682
01:20:28,120 --> 01:20:30,920
Speaker 4: different place. It's like, no, no, really, Actually.

1683
01:20:30,680 --> 01:20:32,840
Speaker 3: By the way, I do kind of understand that that's

1684
01:20:32,880 --> 01:20:34,720
Speaker 3: the problem exactly.

1685
01:20:35,400 --> 01:20:38,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I don't know. Look, we got to give

1686
01:20:38,479 --> 01:20:39,320
Speaker 1: credit where it's due.

1687
01:20:39,360 --> 01:20:41,719
Speaker 3: You know, there are some people who are actually still

1688
01:20:41,960 --> 01:20:44,360
Speaker 3: beating the drum. We have Marjorie Taylor Green. Let's put

1689
01:20:44,360 --> 01:20:47,519
Speaker 3: this up here on the screen. She recently says, quote,

1690
01:20:47,600 --> 01:20:50,320
Speaker 3: I am not suicidal. I am one of the happiest,

1691
01:20:50,360 --> 01:20:52,400
Speaker 3: healthiest people you will meet. I have full faith in

1692
01:20:52,439 --> 01:20:54,360
Speaker 3: God and Jesus Christ is my Lord and savior. With

1693
01:20:54,439 --> 01:20:56,320
Speaker 3: that said, if something happens to me, I ask you

1694
01:20:56,360 --> 01:20:58,920
Speaker 3: all to find out which foreign government or powerful people

1695
01:20:59,040 --> 01:21:01,639
Speaker 3: would take heinous actions and to stop information from coming out,

1696
01:21:01,800 --> 01:21:03,880
Speaker 3: not only about this issue, but because of the truth

1697
01:21:03,920 --> 01:21:04,719
Speaker 3: that I have been speaking.

1698
01:21:04,800 --> 01:21:06,360
Speaker 1: The people understand what I'm saying.

1699
01:21:06,400 --> 01:21:08,640
Speaker 3: That was in direct reply to her support for the

1700
01:21:08,680 --> 01:21:12,639
Speaker 3: Thomas Massey and Rocanna amendment to release the Epstein files.

1701
01:21:12,760 --> 01:21:15,640
Speaker 3: What's also interesting is she actually gave an interview to

1702
01:21:15,760 --> 01:21:18,880
Speaker 3: The New York Times, and what she discussed is that

1703
01:21:19,000 --> 01:21:22,920
Speaker 3: the White House put immense pressure on her too not

1704
01:21:23,040 --> 01:21:27,200
Speaker 3: to vote for that Massi and Rocanna amendment. She actually

1705
01:21:27,240 --> 01:21:29,479
Speaker 3: apparently told them, at least according to her, she said,

1706
01:21:29,479 --> 01:21:30,840
Speaker 3: I don't work for you. I was elected by the

1707
01:21:30,840 --> 01:21:32,559
Speaker 3: people of Georgia and you don't get to tell me

1708
01:21:32,800 --> 01:21:35,120
Speaker 3: what to do. And apparently Trump himself and others are

1709
01:21:35,240 --> 01:21:38,840
Speaker 3: furious with her for continuing to pour gas on the fire.

1710
01:21:39,080 --> 01:21:41,960
Speaker 3: It is amazing how he has effectively convinced so many

1711
01:21:42,000 --> 01:21:44,920
Speaker 3: of these people that it's all quote in Epstein hoax

1712
01:21:45,080 --> 01:21:49,080
Speaker 3: and anti Trump bullshit. I just it's you know again,

1713
01:21:49,400 --> 01:21:52,600
Speaker 3: it's very difficult to withstand, especially from cash Ptel. We

1714
01:21:52,640 --> 01:21:56,040
Speaker 3: played recently some of his more recent testimony around this

1715
01:21:56,120 --> 01:21:58,360
Speaker 3: where he's like, you know, oh, he absolutely committed suicide

1716
01:21:58,360 --> 01:22:00,160
Speaker 3: of review the files, but it's not like I can

1717
01:22:00,200 --> 01:22:01,960
Speaker 3: show them to you, So I don't know where else

1718
01:22:01,960 --> 01:22:04,599
Speaker 3: we can go from here. I like, hopefully we'll continue

1719
01:22:04,600 --> 01:22:07,400
Speaker 3: to get more reporting, more email release and all that,

1720
01:22:07,520 --> 01:22:11,240
Speaker 3: but notwithstanding some serious government action from the House and

1721
01:22:11,360 --> 01:22:13,800
Speaker 3: oversight stuff which I'm not putting aside, it definitely still

1722
01:22:13,840 --> 01:22:15,840
Speaker 3: could happen. This kind of seems like the end of

1723
01:22:15,840 --> 01:22:17,400
Speaker 3: the road, which is really unfortunate.

1724
01:22:17,800 --> 01:22:20,720
Speaker 4: I'm not sure I'm ready to say that yet. I'll

1725
01:22:20,720 --> 01:22:21,280
Speaker 4: come back to that.

1726
01:22:21,600 --> 01:22:24,200
Speaker 2: One note on MTG is APAC is looking a fund

1727
01:22:24,240 --> 01:22:27,519
Speaker 2: a challenger to her, so, you know, and not just

1728
01:22:27,600 --> 01:22:30,519
Speaker 2: over Epstein, I think more directly over her criticism of

1729
01:22:30,560 --> 01:22:34,080
Speaker 2: Apack criticism of the you know, Israel first position of

1730
01:22:34,120 --> 01:22:38,040
Speaker 2: this administration, calling it a genocide, et cetera. And you know,

1731
01:22:38,160 --> 01:22:41,000
Speaker 2: she has been Massey will take a stand in terms

1732
01:22:41,080 --> 01:22:43,599
Speaker 2: of like principled free speech things, but she has been

1733
01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:46,479
Speaker 2: the one who's been She is the only Republican who

1734
01:22:46,479 --> 01:22:47,840
Speaker 2: has said this is a genocide.

1735
01:22:48,160 --> 01:22:49,960
Speaker 4: She has been the most active.

1736
01:22:50,360 --> 01:22:52,360
Speaker 2: And you know, they know they have a problem in

1737
01:22:52,400 --> 01:22:55,840
Speaker 2: the Republican base with young Republicans in particular, and that

1738
01:22:56,040 --> 01:22:58,479
Speaker 2: what starts is one with Marjorie Taylor Green could easily

1739
01:22:58,560 --> 01:23:01,160
Speaker 2: grow to a handful and and go from there if

1740
01:23:01,200 --> 01:23:03,280
Speaker 2: they see that she's able to, you know, withstand this

1741
01:23:03,360 --> 01:23:05,640
Speaker 2: challenge and get a lot of attention and publicity, by

1742
01:23:05,680 --> 01:23:08,920
Speaker 2: the way, by being the sole Republican voice on this issue.

1743
01:23:08,960 --> 01:23:11,479
Speaker 2: So APAC is freaked out about that and trying to

1744
01:23:12,040 --> 01:23:16,040
Speaker 2: you know, use their vast treasure chest to be able

1745
01:23:16,080 --> 01:23:18,000
Speaker 2: to fund a primary challenge against her.

1746
01:23:18,320 --> 01:23:21,000
Speaker 4: So that's something to keep an eye on. What was

1747
01:23:21,040 --> 01:23:21,719
Speaker 4: the other piece we.

1748
01:23:21,600 --> 01:23:23,680
Speaker 2: Were talking about, I said, whether it's the end of

1749
01:23:23,720 --> 01:23:25,479
Speaker 2: the road, Whether this is the end of the road.

1750
01:23:25,640 --> 01:23:30,800
Speaker 2: So I think one of the reasons why Trump will

1751
01:23:30,840 --> 01:23:33,880
Speaker 2: be very concerned if Democrats do take back the House,

1752
01:23:33,920 --> 01:23:36,680
Speaker 2: which is certainly possible in the midterms. And obviously I

1753
01:23:36,720 --> 01:23:39,400
Speaker 2: say he's very concerned because he's doing this whole jerrymandering thing,

1754
01:23:39,479 --> 01:23:41,920
Speaker 2: he's casting down a mail in ballots. All of that

1755
01:23:42,880 --> 01:23:45,160
Speaker 2: is because then they would have the power, you know,

1756
01:23:45,200 --> 01:23:48,280
Speaker 2: subpoena power, and this is an area where they would

1757
01:23:48,280 --> 01:23:52,559
Speaker 2: certainly focus, not you know, whether they legitimately care about her,

1758
01:23:52,640 --> 01:23:54,840
Speaker 2: cared about in the past or not, this is an

1759
01:23:54,880 --> 01:23:57,840
Speaker 2: area where they think they can draw political blood. Now

1760
01:23:58,000 --> 01:24:00,559
Speaker 2: there's a possibility that they win the House and they

1761
01:24:00,600 --> 01:24:02,639
Speaker 2: try to subpoena in these records and the federal government

1762
01:24:02,760 --> 01:24:06,439
Speaker 2: is just like no, and if essentially acts like they

1763
01:24:06,439 --> 01:24:09,400
Speaker 2: don't exist. I think that's Ryan raised that possibility on Fridae.

1764
01:24:09,400 --> 01:24:12,120
Speaker 2: I think that's very possible as well. But you know

1765
01:24:12,200 --> 01:24:16,240
Speaker 2: that continues that continues to create a political problem for Trump.

1766
01:24:16,600 --> 01:24:21,120
Speaker 2: If he's actively stonewalling the Democrats in Congress over specifically

1767
01:24:21,120 --> 01:24:23,559
Speaker 2: that Epstein files, that's going to be an issue for him.

1768
01:24:23,760 --> 01:24:25,479
Speaker 2: And then the other thing is that you still have

1769
01:24:25,600 --> 01:24:29,479
Speaker 2: Glene Maxwell out there looking for her pardon, and very possible,

1770
01:24:29,560 --> 01:24:31,479
Speaker 2: if not likely, that some of the things that we

1771
01:24:31,600 --> 01:24:34,360
Speaker 2: have already come out, in particular the birthday book, may

1772
01:24:34,400 --> 01:24:38,040
Speaker 2: have come from her and from her associates. So if

1773
01:24:38,120 --> 01:24:40,760
Speaker 2: she feels like the need to up the ante or

1774
01:24:40,960 --> 01:24:43,360
Speaker 2: turn up the heat in terms of trying to get

1775
01:24:43,400 --> 01:24:45,679
Speaker 2: that parton, you never know what else could be released,

1776
01:24:45,680 --> 01:24:48,120
Speaker 2: what other information could be provided to the press, etc.

1777
01:24:48,760 --> 01:24:51,920
Speaker 2: So I feel like it's potentially gone into hibernation. But

1778
01:24:51,960 --> 01:24:53,680
Speaker 2: I don't think that this is a problem that has

1779
01:24:53,720 --> 01:24:56,960
Speaker 2: been completely solved by the Trump administration, like and put

1780
01:24:56,960 --> 01:24:57,559
Speaker 2: to bed for good.

1781
01:24:57,640 --> 01:24:59,679
Speaker 1: I would hope so. And you know, on the subpoena power.

1782
01:24:59,680 --> 01:25:02,479
Speaker 3: In all that what people don't understand to Ryan's point, yet,

1783
01:25:02,520 --> 01:25:05,639
Speaker 3: it's very possible that they just deny it. But it's

1784
01:25:05,680 --> 01:25:07,479
Speaker 3: going to cost. And what I mean by that is

1785
01:25:07,760 --> 01:25:10,640
Speaker 3: attention legal fees. I mean one of the things I've

1786
01:25:10,640 --> 01:25:13,679
Speaker 3: actually already seen people talking about this. If the House wins,

1787
01:25:13,960 --> 01:25:16,519
Speaker 3: every single person who works for Trump is going to

1788
01:25:16,560 --> 01:25:18,599
Speaker 3: be racking up some two to three hundred thousand dollars

1789
01:25:18,640 --> 01:25:20,400
Speaker 3: in legal bills, every single one of them.

1790
01:25:20,439 --> 01:25:21,879
Speaker 1: Because they're asses.

1791
01:25:22,160 --> 01:25:25,439
Speaker 3: I mean, can you imagine if your doze are look,

1792
01:25:25,520 --> 01:25:27,559
Speaker 3: Elon will be fine, but the rest of those guys,

1793
01:25:28,400 --> 01:25:30,160
Speaker 3: like the amount of time that they're going to be

1794
01:25:30,160 --> 01:25:34,400
Speaker 3: spending in transcribed interviews with the House of Oversight Committee,

1795
01:25:35,080 --> 01:25:36,800
Speaker 3: What did you do with the US and the two Peace?

1796
01:25:36,840 --> 01:25:38,640
Speaker 3: What did you do with the Social Security Administration?

1797
01:25:38,720 --> 01:25:39,680
Speaker 1: What did you do with that?

1798
01:25:39,760 --> 01:25:42,400
Speaker 3: You can't deny that forever, Like eventually you do actually

1799
01:25:42,400 --> 01:25:44,160
Speaker 3: have to meet with the House, and you know, meet

1800
01:25:44,160 --> 01:25:45,000
Speaker 3: behind our stores.

1801
01:25:45,120 --> 01:25:47,200
Speaker 4: You'll go to person the way that Bannon and Navarr.

1802
01:25:47,360 --> 01:25:49,160
Speaker 3: Well, you won't go to prison because the DJ won't

1803
01:25:49,160 --> 01:25:51,559
Speaker 3: prosecute you, but you will get a criminal referral.

1804
01:25:51,600 --> 01:25:53,080
Speaker 4: Administration is not gonna be there for us.

1805
01:25:53,080 --> 01:25:55,160
Speaker 3: Well, I was gonna say, you'll get a criminal referral

1806
01:25:55,200 --> 01:25:57,360
Speaker 3: maybe with no statute of limitation, and then future you

1807
01:25:57,400 --> 01:25:59,519
Speaker 3: might go to prison, as you might did, as you

1808
01:25:59,520 --> 01:26:03,000
Speaker 3: did early for Peter Navarro and Bannon. So yeah, it's

1809
01:26:03,520 --> 01:26:06,560
Speaker 3: it's gonna be not good if you work for the administration.

1810
01:26:06,680 --> 01:26:08,639
Speaker 3: I think a lot of them are starting to actually

1811
01:26:08,680 --> 01:26:09,280
Speaker 3: recognize that.

1812
01:26:09,280 --> 01:26:09,880
Speaker 1: They're like, oh my.

1813
01:26:09,840 --> 01:26:11,880
Speaker 3: God, They're like, we're gonna need millions of dollars in

1814
01:26:11,960 --> 01:26:14,559
Speaker 3: legal defense bills just to withstand, you know, at the

1815
01:26:14,600 --> 01:26:17,160
Speaker 3: lower level, because that's a traditional strategy. That's what most

1816
01:26:17,760 --> 01:26:20,320
Speaker 3: powers out of party do, is that they'll bring you in.

1817
01:26:20,680 --> 01:26:23,000
Speaker 3: I mean, I mean, how long do the Bengazi Commission

1818
01:26:23,040 --> 01:26:26,280
Speaker 3: last two and a half years? And imagine there's going

1819
01:26:26,320 --> 01:26:27,800
Speaker 3: to be a Doge comission, there's going to be in

1820
01:26:27,920 --> 01:26:31,080
Speaker 3: Epstein commission, there's going to bed I can't even remember.

1821
01:26:30,920 --> 01:26:33,040
Speaker 1: Your on strike Venezuela.

1822
01:26:33,360 --> 01:26:37,080
Speaker 3: I mean, all of these things, all that, Oh my god, Ice, yeah,

1823
01:26:37,360 --> 01:26:41,800
Speaker 3: National Guard. It's it will never end. If and if

1824
01:26:41,880 --> 01:26:45,200
Speaker 3: the Democrats win the Senate, good luck. I mean, you know,

1825
01:26:45,280 --> 01:26:48,479
Speaker 3: shutdown is going to be at nauseum until the end

1826
01:26:48,479 --> 01:26:50,519
Speaker 3: of time, which I don't think you could rule it out.

1827
01:26:50,520 --> 01:26:52,400
Speaker 3: I don't think it's very likely right now, but the

1828
01:26:52,400 --> 01:26:55,560
Speaker 3: House itself, you know, probably a lock. Just to demonstrate

1829
01:26:55,760 --> 01:26:59,440
Speaker 3: what the difference in our politics will be. Famously, Obama

1830
01:26:59,600 --> 01:27:03,040
Speaker 3: and I both wrote about what it was like to

1831
01:27:03,160 --> 01:27:06,360
Speaker 3: experience whenever you were both in power but having to

1832
01:27:06,400 --> 01:27:08,599
Speaker 3: deal with like an opposition to type Congress which would

1833
01:27:08,600 --> 01:27:11,320
Speaker 3: constantly do this, and they said, it just sucked the lifeblood,

1834
01:27:11,439 --> 01:27:12,439
Speaker 3: you know, out of your White House.

1835
01:27:12,479 --> 01:27:14,719
Speaker 1: And that's what Trump himself wants to avoid.

1836
01:27:14,800 --> 01:27:17,439
Speaker 3: Even with extraordinary power and all that, you have to

1837
01:27:17,439 --> 01:27:19,439
Speaker 3: play some ball, you know, at the end of the

1838
01:27:19,520 --> 01:27:22,320
Speaker 3: day with the opposition party, especially if they control the

1839
01:27:22,320 --> 01:27:24,760
Speaker 3: House of Representatives, and then the number of resolutions and

1840
01:27:24,800 --> 01:27:26,000
Speaker 3: other things that are all.

1841
01:27:25,840 --> 01:27:26,400
Speaker 1: Going to go through.

1842
01:27:26,520 --> 01:27:28,880
Speaker 3: So all of that to say is you're right, and

1843
01:27:29,520 --> 01:27:32,200
Speaker 3: we could potentially see something, but it might take a

1844
01:27:32,240 --> 01:27:34,080
Speaker 3: while before it all materializes.

1845
01:27:34,200 --> 01:27:39,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, move on to Brylin. They wanted to cover this

1846
01:27:39,400 --> 01:27:41,519
Speaker 1: for a long time. It's I don't know.

1847
01:27:41,600 --> 01:27:45,240
Speaker 3: It's like I said, it's like an anthropological experiment, and

1848
01:27:45,280 --> 01:27:46,640
Speaker 3: I don't want to make too much light of it

1849
01:27:46,680 --> 01:27:49,280
Speaker 3: because it is in the absence, obviously of Charlie Kirk,

1850
01:27:49,640 --> 01:27:52,880
Speaker 3: who was assassinated. And within that though, what kind of

1851
01:27:52,920 --> 01:27:55,680
Speaker 3: immediately became a fight within the conservative movement is like

1852
01:27:55,720 --> 01:27:58,240
Speaker 3: who's going to lead Turning Point? And I don't think

1853
01:27:58,240 --> 01:28:01,439
Speaker 3: it really meant Turning Point USA itself the organization because

1854
01:28:01,520 --> 01:28:04,840
Speaker 3: Erica Kirk's wife has now officially taken over that, but

1855
01:28:05,120 --> 01:28:09,120
Speaker 3: who will serve as a youth coalitional manager? And that

1856
01:28:09,280 --> 01:28:12,120
Speaker 3: is something that I think, in retrospect was so extraordinary

1857
01:28:12,160 --> 01:28:17,000
Speaker 3: about him is that he genuinely was a bridge between

1858
01:28:17,320 --> 01:28:21,040
Speaker 3: Tucker Carlson and Mark Levin. There's nobody else really who

1859
01:28:21,120 --> 01:28:23,959
Speaker 3: was able to do that and who was genuinely popular

1860
01:28:24,040 --> 01:28:26,840
Speaker 3: with a lot of young people. Had a youth organization

1861
01:28:27,200 --> 01:28:29,160
Speaker 3: he had, you know, one hundred million dollars or so

1862
01:28:29,479 --> 01:28:33,599
Speaker 3: at its disdisposal. It was a genuinely extraordinary thing where

1863
01:28:33,600 --> 01:28:36,360
Speaker 3: he could maintain connections with everybody in his institutional right

1864
01:28:36,560 --> 01:28:39,559
Speaker 3: with power at the White House level, take calls from JD. Vans,

1865
01:28:39,680 --> 01:28:41,720
Speaker 3: and then also appear on college campus tours and get

1866
01:28:41,840 --> 01:28:44,080
Speaker 3: that you know, twelve hundred people or whatever to show up.

1867
01:28:44,240 --> 01:28:47,960
Speaker 3: So afterwards, part of what has ignited this great influencer

1868
01:28:48,040 --> 01:28:53,559
Speaker 3: war of Canda Owens and Ben Shapiro and Matt Wall

1869
01:28:53,640 --> 01:28:57,080
Speaker 3: you know all these other folks, is that it's trying

1870
01:28:57,080 --> 01:28:59,640
Speaker 3: to a quote, control for his legacy. And really what

1871
01:28:59,680 --> 01:29:02,280
Speaker 3: that means, I think is like who speaks for the

1872
01:29:02,280 --> 01:29:05,160
Speaker 3: conservative youth if they exist at all? And there was

1873
01:29:05,280 --> 01:29:08,920
Speaker 3: quite a bit of speculation that what eventually would come

1874
01:29:09,240 --> 01:29:11,960
Speaker 3: would be some sort of apparatus which was not nearly

1875
01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:15,040
Speaker 3: as tolerant of the Tucker Carlison or Candice Owans who

1876
01:29:15,040 --> 01:29:17,240
Speaker 3: are much more skeptical of Israel. Part of the reason

1877
01:29:17,280 --> 01:29:19,800
Speaker 3: why I think that's very silly is that it's not

1878
01:29:19,880 --> 01:29:23,080
Speaker 3: just about them personally. It's a genuine view which is

1879
01:29:23,120 --> 01:29:26,000
Speaker 3: exploding in the Republican Party. Yeah, weren't you, especially among

1880
01:29:26,000 --> 01:29:28,080
Speaker 3: young people. You were looking at some New York Times poll.

1881
01:29:28,120 --> 01:29:30,240
Speaker 3: I'm sure they'll cover it tomorrow. But what was the

1882
01:29:30,240 --> 01:29:33,599
Speaker 3: Republican numbers in there? I'm sure it wasn't. It wasn't

1883
01:29:33,640 --> 01:29:36,280
Speaker 3: nearly what the boomer Republican you know, the youth Republican

1884
01:29:36,360 --> 01:29:38,840
Speaker 3: numbers in there. The net positive support for Israel has

1885
01:29:38,880 --> 01:29:40,760
Speaker 3: to be just devastating.

1886
01:29:40,920 --> 01:29:41,679
Speaker 1: It crazy.

1887
01:29:41,680 --> 01:29:43,519
Speaker 2: I don't remember all the time, my I have to look,

1888
01:29:43,640 --> 01:29:46,880
Speaker 2: but it has shifted significantly, But Republicans overall are still

1889
01:29:46,920 --> 01:29:49,519
Speaker 2: quite pro Israel, and they of all the groups, like

1890
01:29:49,600 --> 01:29:52,360
Speaker 2: of all the partisan groups, Independence, Democrats, and Republicans, they

1891
01:29:52,360 --> 01:29:55,479
Speaker 2: had actually shifted the least in terms of Israel. However,

1892
01:29:56,080 --> 01:30:00,799
Speaker 2: when you're talking about because the thing that Charlie pulled

1893
01:30:00,840 --> 01:30:06,920
Speaker 2: off was both making boomers in the Republican Party feel

1894
01:30:07,040 --> 01:30:10,960
Speaker 2: like Republicans were reaching out to young people and to

1895
01:30:11,000 --> 01:30:14,360
Speaker 2: some extent actually reaching out to young people. Now his

1896
01:30:14,640 --> 01:30:18,919
Speaker 2: people to polls, like, he was actually not very popular

1897
01:30:19,080 --> 01:30:21,960
Speaker 2: among young audiences, but I think among young conservatives he

1898
01:30:22,160 --> 01:30:25,400
Speaker 2: was genuinely very popular. Whereas there are you know, other

1899
01:30:25,479 --> 01:30:29,880
Speaker 2: figures in the Republican movement who you know, happened to

1900
01:30:29,960 --> 01:30:32,439
Speaker 2: be young and claim to speak to a young audience,

1901
01:30:32,520 --> 01:30:35,479
Speaker 2: but in reality they're just like making boomers feel like

1902
01:30:35,640 --> 01:30:38,479
Speaker 2: Republicans have a young coalition. And so that's one of

1903
01:30:38,520 --> 01:30:42,840
Speaker 2: the open questions is will First of all, I think

1904
01:30:42,880 --> 01:30:44,679
Speaker 2: even the question of like, is someone going to step

1905
01:30:44,720 --> 01:30:46,479
Speaker 2: into his shoes is a little bit of a flawed promise,

1906
01:30:46,479 --> 01:30:48,720
Speaker 2: but that is there going to be someone who can

1907
01:30:48,760 --> 01:30:53,120
Speaker 2: pull off both doing the like boomer performance and the

1908
01:30:53,120 --> 01:30:58,479
Speaker 2: donor performance and have some credibility that they're truly like,

1909
01:30:58,640 --> 01:31:01,000
Speaker 2: have a young base that are bringing to the table

1910
01:31:01,080 --> 01:31:05,160
Speaker 2: as well. And a key part of that question is

1911
01:31:05,240 --> 01:31:07,360
Speaker 2: going to be around where are they on this.

1912
01:31:07,600 --> 01:31:09,160
Speaker 3: It's going to be on Israel. It's also going to

1913
01:31:09,160 --> 01:31:11,240
Speaker 3: be on the economic question. I will get to that

1914
01:31:11,360 --> 01:31:13,479
Speaker 3: here in a little bit. But all of that is

1915
01:31:13,520 --> 01:31:16,680
Speaker 3: a lead up to this new gentleman who has emerged,

1916
01:31:17,080 --> 01:31:21,320
Speaker 3: Brylan Holland, who very recently went viral for trying to

1917
01:31:21,439 --> 01:31:24,800
Speaker 3: quote step into Turning Point USA and their shoes of

1918
01:31:24,840 --> 01:31:25,920
Speaker 3: a college campus tour.

1919
01:31:26,240 --> 01:31:28,920
Speaker 1: He filmed this video on board of a private jet.

1920
01:31:29,080 --> 01:31:30,280
Speaker 1: Here's what he had to say.

1921
01:31:30,320 --> 01:31:33,800
Speaker 8: South America. Ryan Holly in Tier about thirty thousand feet up.

1922
01:31:34,200 --> 01:31:36,960
Speaker 8: We are on the way to Arkansas. So everybody in

1923
01:31:37,040 --> 01:31:39,439
Speaker 8: line at the University of Arkansas to kick off my

1924
01:31:39,600 --> 01:31:42,920
Speaker 8: tenstoff campus tour. We are coming to you right here,

1925
01:31:43,200 --> 01:31:46,960
Speaker 8: right now. Stay in line. We have gotten a third rooms.

1926
01:31:46,960 --> 01:31:49,720
Speaker 8: We've sold out this campus stop three times, but we

1927
01:31:49,800 --> 01:31:52,080
Speaker 8: are coming to you. We will fit you in, Students

1928
01:31:52,120 --> 01:31:54,439
Speaker 8: will get priority, but we will make it happen. I

1929
01:31:54,520 --> 01:31:58,639
Speaker 8: cannot be more excited. We are back, we are on

1930
01:31:58,680 --> 01:32:01,240
Speaker 8: the road. We're coming to you one conversation at a time.

1931
01:32:01,439 --> 01:32:03,280
Speaker 8: If you're not at the University of Arkansas, We're coming

1932
01:32:03,280 --> 01:32:04,840
Speaker 8: to a campus near you, suit, so check out how

1933
01:32:04,920 --> 01:32:06,599
Speaker 8: towur days. We'll see super soon.

1934
01:32:07,000 --> 01:32:10,639
Speaker 1: Okay, So who is this guy? I mean, look, I'm

1935
01:32:10,640 --> 01:32:13,320
Speaker 1: pretty online in these circle. Yeah, I'd never heard of me.

1936
01:32:13,320 --> 01:32:16,320
Speaker 1: He actually follows me so well.

1937
01:32:16,360 --> 01:32:18,519
Speaker 2: And I do a couple of notes, especially for people

1938
01:32:18,520 --> 01:32:21,200
Speaker 2: who are just listening on the private jet in the

1939
01:32:21,640 --> 01:32:25,120
Speaker 2: master's golf Hello, classic sporting the rolex.

1940
01:32:25,160 --> 01:32:27,320
Speaker 4: So giving man of the people vibes.

1941
01:32:27,439 --> 01:32:30,800
Speaker 3: If you have the gates, if you I'm from College Station, Texas,

1942
01:32:31,040 --> 01:32:32,600
Speaker 3: I can I see these guys.

1943
01:32:32,360 --> 01:32:33,679
Speaker 1: Coming from a mile away.

1944
01:32:33,760 --> 01:32:35,760
Speaker 3: If you are from if you ever have been in

1945
01:32:35,760 --> 01:32:37,519
Speaker 3: an sec type and well you.

1946
01:32:37,439 --> 01:32:39,280
Speaker 4: Were like at debate club guy too.

1947
01:32:39,600 --> 01:32:41,839
Speaker 3: Well yeah, but this is more of like a college

1948
01:32:42,080 --> 01:32:46,960
Speaker 3: frat southern like an explicit individual and character a guy

1949
01:32:47,160 --> 01:32:49,240
Speaker 3: if you will that if you've ever I mean you

1950
01:32:49,280 --> 01:32:50,120
Speaker 3: went to UVA, you know.

1951
01:32:50,080 --> 01:32:51,200
Speaker 4: Oh yeah we had right had the time.

1952
01:32:51,400 --> 01:32:52,080
Speaker 1: We have plenty of.

1953
01:32:52,000 --> 01:32:57,880
Speaker 3: Bry's over in Virginia at the UVA campus. So my point,

1954
01:32:57,960 --> 01:33:00,240
Speaker 3: and look, not the stereotype too much, but it's it's

1955
01:33:00,360 --> 01:33:02,640
Speaker 3: like a little bit too perfect to see that the

1956
01:33:02,640 --> 01:33:05,680
Speaker 3: private jet is purp is what really makes the entire thing.

1957
01:33:05,760 --> 01:33:08,400
Speaker 3: But the point I think around mister by the way

1958
01:33:08,400 --> 01:33:11,439
Speaker 3: I mispronounce his name is Hollyhand I apologize.

1959
01:33:10,920 --> 01:33:12,719
Speaker 1: Is just like, who is this guy?

1960
01:33:13,120 --> 01:33:15,800
Speaker 3: What are the type of politics that are we're going

1961
01:33:15,840 --> 01:33:18,880
Speaker 3: to see here? And what people immediately started pointing to

1962
01:33:19,360 --> 01:33:21,240
Speaker 3: is not to say he is an op per se,

1963
01:33:21,560 --> 01:33:24,439
Speaker 3: but it's part of an example of what some sort

1964
01:33:24,479 --> 01:33:27,960
Speaker 3: of future Republican stile influencer trying to speak to the

1965
01:33:28,000 --> 01:33:30,720
Speaker 3: youth may look like. And in particular, they pointed here

1966
01:33:31,280 --> 01:33:34,519
Speaker 3: to an interview that he gave on Fox News hours

1967
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:37,920
Speaker 3: after hours after Trump announced the death of Charlie Kirk.

1968
01:33:38,040 --> 01:33:38,960
Speaker 1: Here's what he had to say.

1969
01:33:39,320 --> 01:33:42,719
Speaker 13: This is heartbreaking, Will, and I really hope, if anything,

1970
01:33:42,720 --> 01:33:45,000
Speaker 13: that people get off the sidelines. This weekend, I'm going

1971
01:33:45,080 --> 01:33:47,439
Speaker 13: to a youth rally in South Carolina, and you better

1972
01:33:47,439 --> 01:33:49,519
Speaker 13: believe that I've already had my team shooting text and brown.

1973
01:33:49,560 --> 01:33:50,680
Speaker 9: You really need to caution this.

1974
01:33:50,880 --> 01:33:52,560
Speaker 13: You really need to think about not standing in the

1975
01:33:52,560 --> 01:33:54,920
Speaker 13: middle of a park and speak to the next generation.

1976
01:33:55,200 --> 01:33:57,760
Speaker 13: But I am more energized than ever to carry on

1977
01:33:57,800 --> 01:33:59,760
Speaker 13: this torch, to carry this legacy, because that's what Charlie

1978
01:33:59,760 --> 01:34:01,640
Speaker 13: would have He would have wanted us to continue to

1979
01:34:01,640 --> 01:34:02,679
Speaker 13: fight the good fight, just.

1980
01:34:02,600 --> 01:34:03,040
Speaker 9: Like he did.

1981
01:34:03,640 --> 01:34:05,599
Speaker 3: So that's what we saw here. He said immediately, I'm

1982
01:34:05,800 --> 01:34:07,760
Speaker 3: willing to carry on his legacy. What is kind of

1983
01:34:07,800 --> 01:34:12,080
Speaker 3: interesting is that apparently there has been some controversy over

1984
01:34:12,280 --> 01:34:14,920
Speaker 3: his own role with Turning Point USA. Turning Point USA

1985
01:34:15,000 --> 01:34:18,679
Speaker 3: figures themselves say hey, actually we had some serious fights

1986
01:34:18,760 --> 01:34:22,559
Speaker 3: over the leadership of Iron McDaniel, specifically over at the

1987
01:34:22,720 --> 01:34:25,840
Speaker 3: RNC hollyand has apparently been very pro Israel. And so

1988
01:34:25,960 --> 01:34:28,920
Speaker 3: that's of course what a lot of the influencer types

1989
01:34:29,000 --> 01:34:31,599
Speaker 3: who we're involved in the war are pointing to. What

1990
01:34:31,680 --> 01:34:35,479
Speaker 3: I kind of saw was somebody what I saw there

1991
01:34:35,560 --> 01:34:37,280
Speaker 3: and I was saying this when we were preparing for

1992
01:34:37,320 --> 01:34:40,880
Speaker 3: our segment, is I genuinely see this as just a

1993
01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:42,679
Speaker 3: complete reversion to the mean.

1994
01:34:42,560 --> 01:34:44,600
Speaker 1: Of traditional GOP politics.

1995
01:34:44,720 --> 01:34:48,720
Speaker 3: And that's kind of what I'm curious about for what

1996
01:34:48,760 --> 01:34:51,880
Speaker 3: it means in the absence of Charlie's death, Because what Charlie,

1997
01:34:51,960 --> 01:34:54,719
Speaker 3: again was so effective at is he would take online

1998
01:34:54,840 --> 01:34:56,920
Speaker 3: energy and he would try to channel it into the

1999
01:34:56,920 --> 01:35:00,880
Speaker 3: traditional Republican apparatus. Israel perfect example, he will have somebody

2000
01:35:00,920 --> 01:35:03,360
Speaker 3: on and he'll say things like I'm allowed to criticize,

2001
01:35:03,479 --> 01:35:05,840
Speaker 3: I'm not allowed to criticize the Israel government more than

2002
01:35:05,880 --> 01:35:09,120
Speaker 3: israelis are right, which sounds like vaguely I don't know,

2003
01:35:09,200 --> 01:35:12,160
Speaker 3: like vaguely independent.

2004
01:35:12,160 --> 01:35:14,000
Speaker 1: I guess you would say, not as controlled.

2005
01:35:14,040 --> 01:35:16,560
Speaker 3: At the same time, there's just been this letter, infamous

2006
01:35:16,600 --> 01:35:21,120
Speaker 3: letter talked about released by or at least purportedly sent

2007
01:35:21,160 --> 01:35:23,280
Speaker 3: by Charlie Kirk to bb net Yaho.

2008
01:35:23,520 --> 01:35:24,799
Speaker 1: It's extremely pro Israel.

2009
01:35:24,880 --> 01:35:27,080
Speaker 3: And he also if you really listen to him, he

2010
01:35:27,160 --> 01:35:28,280
Speaker 3: was always very pro Israel.

2011
01:35:28,479 --> 01:35:29,599
Speaker 1: He was a little you know he.

2012
01:35:29,520 --> 01:35:31,040
Speaker 2: Was, and he's like, let me help you get a

2013
01:35:31,080 --> 01:35:34,040
Speaker 2: network influencer to carry the pro Israel message.

2014
01:35:34,240 --> 01:35:34,479
Speaker 4: Yeah.

2015
01:35:34,520 --> 01:35:36,640
Speaker 3: At the same time you did that, he did that

2016
01:35:36,640 --> 01:35:39,200
Speaker 3: focus group right where a lot of his own younger

2017
01:35:39,280 --> 01:35:41,559
Speaker 3: TPUSA members were like, yeah, I'm not really down with

2018
01:35:41,680 --> 01:35:44,599
Speaker 3: you know us support for Israel. He was grappling with

2019
01:35:44,640 --> 01:35:47,519
Speaker 3: it because it was a genuine coalitional fight, whereas a

2020
01:35:47,560 --> 01:35:51,000
Speaker 3: lot of these other people, people like Ben Shapiro, hollihand

2021
01:35:51,040 --> 01:35:54,240
Speaker 3: and others, are explicitly much more pro And I think

2022
01:35:54,400 --> 01:35:56,920
Speaker 3: that's why Candice Owens and many of the others are

2023
01:35:57,080 --> 01:36:00,479
Speaker 3: are fighting with them over that legacy is because that

2024
01:36:00,520 --> 01:36:04,360
Speaker 3: would mean that even entertaining that faction of the coalition

2025
01:36:04,760 --> 01:36:06,480
Speaker 3: comes completely out of the window.

2026
01:36:06,240 --> 01:36:08,120
Speaker 1: And that's what most of the fights are about.

2027
01:36:08,320 --> 01:36:10,360
Speaker 3: And so with this guy in particular, there's a lot

2028
01:36:10,360 --> 01:36:13,559
Speaker 3: of question about how does this stuff even come to be?

2029
01:36:14,000 --> 01:36:16,679
Speaker 3: And what I think is fascinating here, And this genuinely

2030
01:36:16,720 --> 01:36:19,400
Speaker 3: does rise the question of like, how do you how

2031
01:36:19,400 --> 01:36:23,160
Speaker 3: do you even put yourself in that position of immediately

2032
01:36:23,200 --> 01:36:25,920
Speaker 3: being like I'm gonna carry on his legacy, which Megan

2033
01:36:26,000 --> 01:36:27,719
Speaker 3: Kelly did, Tucker Carl so many of these other people

2034
01:36:27,720 --> 01:36:30,439
Speaker 3: say they'll be included. But this person who purportedly was

2035
01:36:30,479 --> 01:36:33,200
Speaker 3: not even having a good relationship with TPUSA. It's like,

2036
01:36:33,400 --> 01:36:36,280
Speaker 3: is this some sort of pushed thing, like, for example,

2037
01:36:36,320 --> 01:36:38,000
Speaker 3: you can put this up here on the screen and

2038
01:36:38,080 --> 01:36:43,120
Speaker 3: image which went very viral after mister Hollyhand himself, you know,

2039
01:36:43,200 --> 01:36:44,960
Speaker 3: came to the center of attention. Look at this, you

2040
01:36:45,000 --> 01:36:48,240
Speaker 3: know interest over time effectively nothing up until very recently

2041
01:36:48,880 --> 01:36:53,040
Speaker 3: for supposed campus tour, etc. So again I don't know

2042
01:36:53,439 --> 01:36:56,880
Speaker 3: what all of this speaks to, but anthropologically, like for

2043
01:36:56,920 --> 01:36:59,880
Speaker 3: the conservative movement, first, it shows how unique Charlie Kirk

2044
01:37:00,000 --> 01:37:03,439
Speaker 3: actually was in terms of his job and frankly just

2045
01:37:03,439 --> 01:37:05,240
Speaker 3: being so good at what he did. But it also

2046
01:37:05,439 --> 01:37:09,840
Speaker 3: just demonstrates like this this influencer who is going to

2047
01:37:09,880 --> 01:37:13,240
Speaker 3: be going on campus and in which direction that that

2048
01:37:13,360 --> 01:37:15,640
Speaker 3: youth conservative energy is going to go.

2049
01:37:15,800 --> 01:37:16,839
Speaker 1: Charlie was a person.

2050
01:37:16,600 --> 01:37:21,639
Speaker 3: Who could channel the Shane Gillis beer drinking watcher into

2051
01:37:21,680 --> 01:37:25,679
Speaker 3: an actual apparatus of like serious politics, can Ben Shapiro

2052
01:37:25,720 --> 01:37:26,800
Speaker 3: and these guys do the same?

2053
01:37:27,520 --> 01:37:28,240
Speaker 1: I'm skeptical?

2054
01:37:28,479 --> 01:37:30,519
Speaker 2: Well, there also just was this sense of like what

2055
01:37:30,560 --> 01:37:32,280
Speaker 2: did they like just turn these guys out in a

2056
01:37:32,320 --> 01:37:34,639
Speaker 2: factory and just like oh, here's the next one.

2057
01:37:34,640 --> 01:37:35,080
Speaker 1: Here you go.

2058
01:37:35,160 --> 01:37:37,080
Speaker 4: He's going on the campus tour. He's doing the thing.

2059
01:37:37,120 --> 01:37:40,559
Speaker 2: I mean, there was an ick factor of like an

2060
01:37:40,600 --> 01:37:43,439
Speaker 2: hour after Charlie's day's on Fox News smiling like I'm

2061
01:37:43,439 --> 01:37:44,120
Speaker 2: going to carry.

2062
01:37:43,880 --> 01:37:44,960
Speaker 4: The torches, who are you?

2063
01:37:45,280 --> 01:37:45,360
Speaker 8: Like?

2064
01:37:45,439 --> 01:37:45,960
Speaker 1: Who are you?

2065
01:37:46,040 --> 01:37:47,640
Speaker 2: What are we talking about here? And then he's on

2066
01:37:47,680 --> 01:37:49,920
Speaker 2: his private jen He's flying around and doing a campus tour.

2067
01:37:50,200 --> 01:37:52,800
Speaker 2: He was claiming that he was affiliated. My understanding is

2068
01:37:52,800 --> 01:37:55,320
Speaker 2: he was claiming there's some affiliation with TPUSA that they

2069
01:37:55,320 --> 01:37:57,240
Speaker 2: had to come out and say there's no affiliation here.

2070
01:37:57,600 --> 01:38:01,519
Speaker 2: So it felt very and it just felt very forced.

2071
01:38:01,640 --> 01:38:03,519
Speaker 2: It felt like it came out of nowhere. No one

2072
01:38:03,600 --> 01:38:05,920
Speaker 2: had ever heard of this dude. Now he's posted like, oh,

2073
01:38:05,920 --> 01:38:08,200
Speaker 2: here I am Charlie. Here's some text messages with Charlie.

2074
01:38:08,280 --> 01:38:10,439
Speaker 2: Like I didn't just come out of nowhere. I've been around,

2075
01:38:10,439 --> 01:38:14,400
Speaker 2: I've been doing this thing, etcetera, etcetera. But you know,

2076
01:38:14,760 --> 01:38:17,600
Speaker 2: it felt like there were powers that be that just

2077
01:38:17,640 --> 01:38:19,800
Speaker 2: were like, Okay, we've got the next one ready to go,

2078
01:38:19,880 --> 01:38:21,720
Speaker 2: and we're slotting him into place, and he's going on

2079
01:38:21,760 --> 01:38:23,320
Speaker 2: the campus tour and doing the thing, and it was like,

2080
01:38:23,400 --> 01:38:25,479
Speaker 2: where did this guy come from? And why are you

2081
01:38:25,520 --> 01:38:27,760
Speaker 2: so keen on this guy being the guy? I think

2082
01:38:28,040 --> 01:38:30,600
Speaker 2: was that was my sense as not being on the

2083
01:38:30,680 --> 01:38:33,320
Speaker 2: right of some of the reaction to him, and certainly

2084
01:38:33,560 --> 01:38:36,519
Speaker 2: the Israel pieces tied up in that, because again Charlie

2085
01:38:36,560 --> 01:38:38,600
Speaker 2: Kirk was extremely pro Israel. We read that letter to

2086
01:38:38,680 --> 01:38:41,520
Speaker 2: nana Ya, who's like, let me help you like propagandas

2087
01:38:41,520 --> 01:38:44,599
Speaker 2: so let's do this thing together, warning him that you've

2088
01:38:44,800 --> 01:38:46,360
Speaker 2: you've got a little bit of an issue here, like

2089
01:38:46,400 --> 01:38:49,760
Speaker 2: I'm seeing it, but ultimately I'm going to be on

2090
01:38:49,800 --> 01:38:52,120
Speaker 2: your side. We're going to do this propaganda thing together.

2091
01:38:52,280 --> 01:38:52,519
Speaker 4: Etc.

2092
01:38:53,240 --> 01:38:56,240
Speaker 2: But there was a sense that maybe Charlie was a

2093
01:38:56,280 --> 01:38:57,920
Speaker 2: little bit up for grant that he wasn't just going

2094
01:38:57,960 --> 01:39:02,080
Speaker 2: to be complete and totally endless lockstaff In the place

2095
01:39:02,080 --> 01:39:06,120
Speaker 2: where that was most notable was his criticism in advance

2096
01:39:06,120 --> 01:39:09,040
Speaker 2: of the Iran strike of a potential Iran strike.

2097
01:39:09,200 --> 01:39:11,080
Speaker 4: And you know that he was very vocal.

2098
01:39:11,160 --> 01:39:16,479
Speaker 2: Actually watched some of his coverage after the Iran strike happened,

2099
01:39:16,880 --> 01:39:19,320
Speaker 2: and to be on it was extremely tortured. He did

2100
01:39:19,320 --> 01:39:21,800
Speaker 2: not know what to say in that moment because.

2101
01:39:21,560 --> 01:39:24,000
Speaker 3: I mean, you guys, because story like, yeah, I've told

2102
01:39:24,000 --> 01:39:25,720
Speaker 3: it to you before, here's what happened, and this has

2103
01:39:25,720 --> 01:39:28,320
Speaker 3: all been reported, so I can just say JD and

2104
01:39:28,439 --> 01:39:30,200
Speaker 3: the White House called him and told him to shut up,

2105
01:39:30,200 --> 01:39:30,639
Speaker 3: and they were.

2106
01:39:30,560 --> 01:39:33,080
Speaker 1: Like, hey, dude, it's happening, so nuked.

2107
01:39:33,200 --> 01:39:35,599
Speaker 3: Yeah, and from this point forward, yeah, you need to

2108
01:39:35,720 --> 01:39:36,960
Speaker 3: zip it because you know.

2109
01:39:36,960 --> 01:39:38,080
Speaker 1: That's how it goes here.

2110
01:39:38,360 --> 01:39:41,160
Speaker 3: Charlie allegedly went to the White House and basically asked

2111
01:39:41,160 --> 01:39:43,120
Speaker 3: Trump not to do it, and Trump quote barked at

2112
01:39:43,200 --> 01:39:45,080
Speaker 3: him like a dog. And that's not just from Gray

2113
01:39:45,160 --> 01:39:47,439
Speaker 3: Zone and I've heard that too. My point just around

2114
01:39:47,520 --> 01:39:50,519
Speaker 3: all of this is that clearly what happened is he

2115
01:39:50,560 --> 01:39:53,160
Speaker 3: was upset and that was I think it was not

2116
01:39:53,240 --> 01:39:53,879
Speaker 3: just personal.

2117
01:39:54,320 --> 01:39:57,000
Speaker 1: He at the end of the day. He had insight

2118
01:39:57,040 --> 01:39:57,519
Speaker 1: into power.

2119
01:39:57,840 --> 01:40:00,719
Speaker 3: He could also see what was happening happening with Trump

2120
01:40:00,920 --> 01:40:02,320
Speaker 3: and the people were influencing him.

2121
01:40:02,400 --> 01:40:04,160
Speaker 1: Those were not Charlie Kirk people.

2122
01:40:04,320 --> 01:40:07,960
Speaker 3: Charlie, to his great credit, actually was deeply skeptical of

2123
01:40:08,000 --> 01:40:10,240
Speaker 3: a lot of the war machine and particularly a lot

2124
01:40:10,320 --> 01:40:11,880
Speaker 3: of these neocons. He had a lot of beef with

2125
01:40:11,920 --> 01:40:14,000
Speaker 3: Lindsay Graham and a lot of these other folks, and

2126
01:40:14,040 --> 01:40:16,400
Speaker 3: he was he was afraid at the rising power levels

2127
01:40:16,600 --> 01:40:19,040
Speaker 3: in the White House, and so, as you said, it

2128
01:40:19,120 --> 01:40:22,080
Speaker 3: was tortured because that's why they all what did they

2129
01:40:22,120 --> 01:40:23,920
Speaker 3: all land on? Remember, it was like you got to

2130
01:40:23,960 --> 01:40:28,120
Speaker 3: trust the president. He has the best that's yeah, exactly,

2131
01:40:28,240 --> 01:40:29,000
Speaker 3: and nonsense.

2132
01:40:29,080 --> 01:40:32,240
Speaker 2: He was, you know, taking like some some comments from

2133
01:40:32,280 --> 01:40:34,760
Speaker 2: his audience that were all basically like what the fuck

2134
01:40:34,840 --> 01:40:38,160
Speaker 2: you know, You've got a good point there, Like I

2135
01:40:38,320 --> 01:40:40,760
Speaker 2: understand where you're coming from, but at the end of

2136
01:40:40,760 --> 01:40:42,000
Speaker 2: the day, I don't know, what do you think? And

2137
01:40:42,040 --> 01:40:44,120
Speaker 2: he'd like toss to his whoever he had in there

2138
01:40:44,160 --> 01:40:49,200
Speaker 2: with him. So you could see the he understood that

2139
01:40:49,280 --> 01:40:53,120
Speaker 2: there was a big divide on Israel and ancillary issues

2140
01:40:53,160 --> 01:40:56,360
Speaker 2: including Iran, between the people he was supposed to be

2141
01:40:56,400 --> 01:40:59,200
Speaker 2: in touch with and the direction the Trump administration was

2142
01:40:59,240 --> 01:41:02,599
Speaker 2: going and that was playing out in these public ways,

2143
01:41:02,880 --> 01:41:07,840
Speaker 2: and the Brylan hollyhand phenomenon feels like, yeah, any of

2144
01:41:07,880 --> 01:41:10,800
Speaker 2: that reticence, we're just going to sweep that away, and

2145
01:41:10,840 --> 01:41:12,360
Speaker 2: we're going to get the guy in the seat who's

2146
01:41:12,400 --> 01:41:15,760
Speaker 2: just going to be like go net and Yahoo, love

2147
01:41:15,840 --> 01:41:20,639
Speaker 2: the genocide, please bomb ran, mister president, and have zero

2148
01:41:20,880 --> 01:41:23,400
Speaker 2: reticence about it. And I do think there's another piece

2149
01:41:23,400 --> 01:41:26,880
Speaker 2: here just on like maturity. We've seen a number of

2150
01:41:26,920 --> 01:41:32,759
Speaker 2: these young, you know, young either Democratic or Republican aligned

2151
01:41:32,880 --> 01:41:35,400
Speaker 2: influencers who come out of the gates and they get

2152
01:41:35,400 --> 01:41:37,559
Speaker 2: propped up by the parties because they're just willing to

2153
01:41:37,560 --> 01:41:40,000
Speaker 2: do the talking points. And Charlie was that guy, Like

2154
01:41:40,040 --> 01:41:43,800
Speaker 2: that's how he yeah, that's how he becomes this, you know,

2155
01:41:43,920 --> 01:41:46,519
Speaker 2: this person that we all know is because he's just

2156
01:41:46,560 --> 01:41:50,520
Speaker 2: out there relentlessly hammering like the Republican Party.

2157
01:41:50,280 --> 01:41:51,280
Speaker 4: Trump talking points.

2158
01:41:51,720 --> 01:41:54,040
Speaker 2: Well, when he died, he's thirty one years old, Like

2159
01:41:54,080 --> 01:41:56,360
Speaker 2: this is now a man with a family and kids,

2160
01:41:56,600 --> 01:41:58,680
Speaker 2: and at some point maybe you don't want to just

2161
01:41:58,720 --> 01:42:01,320
Speaker 2: be that like, what are my talking points and let

2162
01:42:01,360 --> 01:42:02,280
Speaker 2: me just recite them?

2163
01:42:02,400 --> 01:42:03,479
Speaker 4: Verbatim like that.

2164
01:42:03,400 --> 01:42:06,200
Speaker 2: Gets old and boring, and at some point you start

2165
01:42:06,200 --> 01:42:08,000
Speaker 2: to go, you know, who was it that said that

2166
01:42:08,040 --> 01:42:10,400
Speaker 2: he was less interested and he was sort of bored

2167
01:42:10,439 --> 01:42:12,639
Speaker 2: with politics, Like I kind of took one of his friends,

2168
01:42:12,680 --> 01:42:14,360
Speaker 2: I think said that he was kind of bored with politics.

2169
01:42:14,400 --> 01:42:15,840
Speaker 3: I don't know about that. I think he was more

2170
01:42:16,080 --> 01:42:17,679
Speaker 3: with the type of politics that we're talking about.

2171
01:42:17,840 --> 01:42:19,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's what I took from that is that

2172
01:42:19,720 --> 01:42:23,080
Speaker 2: he was sort of chafing at this very confined role

2173
01:42:23,360 --> 01:42:25,360
Speaker 2: that had been sketched out for him of just you're

2174
01:42:25,360 --> 01:42:27,240
Speaker 2: going to toe the line and that's really all we want.

2175
01:42:27,320 --> 01:42:29,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. Yeah, he was not. He's certainly. I mean, look,

2176
01:42:30,280 --> 01:42:30,600
Speaker 1: he was.

2177
01:42:31,160 --> 01:42:34,240
Speaker 3: He was in a difficult position. He was a coalitional operator.

2178
01:42:34,600 --> 01:42:36,760
Speaker 3: He was both a politician and a media star, which is,

2179
01:42:37,439 --> 01:42:39,840
Speaker 3: in my opinion, doesn't really mix all that well. And

2180
01:42:39,880 --> 01:42:41,880
Speaker 3: that's part of why, you know, the Iran thing, you

2181
01:42:41,960 --> 01:42:44,479
Speaker 3: have to be tortured a little bit, but even whenever

2182
01:42:44,520 --> 01:42:46,600
Speaker 3: you have a genuinely held belief, that's part of the

2183
01:42:46,640 --> 01:42:49,240
Speaker 3: issue with trying to be both. But with these guys,

2184
01:42:49,360 --> 01:42:51,640
Speaker 3: they don't even pretend. I also, you know, I was

2185
01:42:51,680 --> 01:42:53,240
Speaker 3: trying not to say it was an op, but it

2186
01:42:53,320 --> 01:42:54,880
Speaker 3: is crazy. How does a nineteen year old get to

2187
01:42:54,880 --> 01:42:56,800
Speaker 3: fly on private jet? Like, how does that even happen?

2188
01:42:57,960 --> 01:42:59,360
Speaker 4: I assume family people said that.

2189
01:42:59,360 --> 01:43:01,200
Speaker 3: I didn't know if it is actually true. He's nineteen

2190
01:43:01,280 --> 01:43:04,200
Speaker 3: years old, he's flying on a private jet. What It's like,

2191
01:43:04,200 --> 01:43:06,479
Speaker 3: where does this, there's this shit even come from? How

2192
01:43:06,479 --> 01:43:08,360
Speaker 3: do you even get booked on Fox News?

2193
01:43:08,360 --> 01:43:09,080
Speaker 1: How did that happen?

2194
01:43:09,200 --> 01:43:12,280
Speaker 3: It's like this show or again, I never heard of this.

2195
01:43:12,400 --> 01:43:14,600
Speaker 3: Now maybe that's my fault. There are a lot of

2196
01:43:14,600 --> 01:43:17,280
Speaker 3: people I've never heard of, but I'm pretty tapped into

2197
01:43:17,920 --> 01:43:19,080
Speaker 3: that internet wrap.

2198
01:43:18,840 --> 01:43:21,800
Speaker 2: Over time is that there wasn't a lot of there

2199
01:43:21,840 --> 01:43:22,720
Speaker 2: before the present moment.

2200
01:43:22,800 --> 01:43:25,800
Speaker 3: I was like, okay, I mean it is weird, you know,

2201
01:43:25,920 --> 01:43:28,720
Speaker 3: to go on Ben Shapiro and all this and to

2202
01:43:28,720 --> 01:43:32,400
Speaker 3: be held up as this new star for everything. That's

2203
01:43:32,439 --> 01:43:34,639
Speaker 3: my only part where I'm like, man, that really does

2204
01:43:34,680 --> 01:43:38,040
Speaker 3: feel like kind of a donor push in some ways.

2205
01:43:38,120 --> 01:43:39,559
Speaker 1: And I wouldn't put it past them either.

2206
01:43:39,640 --> 01:43:42,519
Speaker 2: He's got like a conservative Pete Booda Judge vibe to him. Yeah,

2207
01:43:42,680 --> 01:43:46,040
Speaker 2: like like you came out of the womb with your

2208
01:43:46,040 --> 01:43:48,680
Speaker 2: little briefcase, like, you know, excited to go to the

2209
01:43:48,800 --> 01:43:50,599
Speaker 2: rn C or what. I'm like, that's the vibe, and

2210
01:43:50,640 --> 01:43:53,599
Speaker 2: it's just it's very I remember Steve Bannon said something

2211
01:43:53,680 --> 01:43:55,080
Speaker 2: like that about Mark or Rubio once.

2212
01:43:55,280 --> 01:43:56,559
Speaker 4: It's like he like came out with.

2213
01:43:56,560 --> 01:43:58,960
Speaker 2: His briefcase and his blow dried hair, like going to

2214
01:43:59,000 --> 01:44:02,879
Speaker 2: work at the RNC, and it nails. It really captures

2215
01:44:02,960 --> 01:44:05,679
Speaker 2: this certain type that people just have an ick factor

2216
01:44:05,720 --> 01:44:09,080
Speaker 2: with because if you've been wearing this naked political ambition

2217
01:44:09,160 --> 01:44:11,679
Speaker 2: since we were like eight years old, it just is like, oh,

2218
01:44:11,800 --> 01:44:14,840
Speaker 2: I don't know, I think there's something you need, something

2219
01:44:14,840 --> 01:44:15,479
Speaker 2: else in your life.

2220
01:44:15,520 --> 01:44:17,599
Speaker 4: Embarrassing, it feels gross.

2221
01:44:17,800 --> 01:44:20,479
Speaker 2: It feels very strange to have someone who's been looking

2222
01:44:20,520 --> 01:44:23,040
Speaker 2: at themselves in the mirror since they could remember and

2223
01:44:23,080 --> 01:44:26,000
Speaker 2: thinking like that's the next senator or whatever. And he

2224
01:44:26,240 --> 01:44:27,679
Speaker 2: definitely has that energy.

2225
01:44:27,800 --> 01:44:30,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you are correct on that. So anyways,

2226
01:44:30,280 --> 01:44:32,320
Speaker 1: that's a long way of saying, who is this guy?

2227
01:44:32,360 --> 01:44:34,160
Speaker 1: Where did it come from? What does it mean?

2228
01:44:34,520 --> 01:44:37,160
Speaker 3: I'm not exactly sure, but I guess it is interesting.

2229
01:44:37,400 --> 01:44:39,479
Speaker 3: Thank you guys so much for watching. We appreciate it.

2230
01:44:40,040 --> 01:44:42,360
Speaker 3: Emily and Ryan on tomorrow, so they'll see you then.