1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:05,880 Speaker 1: Hi. This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of five, 2 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:10,240 Speaker 1: an author, journalist, and speaker. And this is Sarah hart Unger. 3 00:00:10,480 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: I'm a mother of three, a practicing physician and blogger. 4 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 1: On the side, we are two working parents who love 5 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,320 Speaker 1: our careers and our families. Welcome to best of both worlds. 6 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: Here we talk about how real women manage work, family, 7 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 1: and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping 8 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 1: out long term career goals. We want you to get 9 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 1: the most out of life. Welcome to best of both worlds. 10 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: This is Laura. This is episode one hundred and ninety seven, 11 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 1: which is airing May eleventh. This episode is all going 12 00:00:41,159 --> 00:00:43,600 Speaker 1: to be about returning to work. We have a great guest, 13 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:47,159 Speaker 1: Kurrent shifle Bin, which I say it right in the interview, 14 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:48,519 Speaker 1: but I'm not sure I just sat it right there. 15 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:50,840 Speaker 1: I need her coaching me through it. Sorry about that current. 16 00:00:51,680 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: She had a illustrious career as an engineer, she took 17 00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:58,880 Speaker 1: some time out with her kids or unfortunately her late 18 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 1: husband developed through a serious illness. She also had the 19 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:05,320 Speaker 1: time that she was caring for him before he passed away, 20 00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 1: and then as a widow, she re entered the workforce 21 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 1: with two kids, and so she's going to talk all 22 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,920 Speaker 1: about her strategies for doing that, what worked for her. 23 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:18,840 Speaker 1: What the rest of our listeners who have either taken 24 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:22,360 Speaker 1: a career break or are pondering doing so, should know 25 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 1: as they are going about this process too. And we're 26 00:01:26,040 --> 00:01:28,399 Speaker 1: really thankful for everyone who's sent in their ideas for 27 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:31,399 Speaker 1: an episode about this. I know we had a lot 28 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:33,640 Speaker 1: of interest in this sort of thing, as many people 29 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:36,360 Speaker 1: do take career breaks or would like to or have 30 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 1: at some point. So we got a few other tips 31 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:42,520 Speaker 1: from listeners. Sarah, you wanted to share some of those. Yeah. 32 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 1: One of our longtime listeners and blog readers, Chelsea, wrote 33 00:01:47,040 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 1: a great tip because she had some experiences to share 34 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 1: and I'm just going to read her comics. I thought 35 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 1: it was a great one. She said. The first thing 36 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: I would say is to feel free to be choosy 37 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:56,840 Speaker 1: about the position you take. I think it can be 38 00:01:56,920 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 1: easy to worry that you have to jump in any 39 00:01:58,920 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 1: job off or you get because you are less than 40 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 1: other candidates. But as Laura said, you still have very 41 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 1: desirable skills. In the day and age, lots of people 42 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:09,040 Speaker 1: have interesting or weird resume gaps. Because they say, try 43 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:10,920 Speaker 1: to start their own business or worked at a startup 44 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:12,920 Speaker 1: that didn't actually start up, and it's not going to 45 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:16,080 Speaker 1: come across as unusual as you might fear. The second 46 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:18,040 Speaker 1: is to not fear that your workload is going to 47 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,800 Speaker 1: go up proportionally to your paid time. I found that 48 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:23,519 Speaker 1: working full time is not four times as much work 49 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:26,519 Speaker 1: as teaching one part time class. In some cases, it's 50 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:28,720 Speaker 1: not even two times that much work. I was so 51 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:31,040 Speaker 1: used to hustling so hard that honestly having a full 52 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:34,919 Speaker 1: time job feels like a breeze moost days. Sarah, I 53 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 1: thought that was a great confidence on the margins. The 54 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:41,200 Speaker 1: extra hour may not require the same sort of startup 55 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:44,839 Speaker 1: and transition costs as the initial hours of work, So yes, 56 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 1: there may be some economies of scale of working forty 57 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:51,960 Speaker 1: versus working fifteen. Yes. And we also had a separate 58 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 1: comment from another listener named Laura who shared another resource 59 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 1: that we just wanted to have you guys be able 60 00:02:57,560 --> 00:02:59,840 Speaker 1: to check out if you're interested, called the Mom Project, 61 00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:03,480 Speaker 1: which is it looks like a company basically dedicated towards 62 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 1: building returnships and paid internships for mothers, specifically re entering 63 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 1: the workforce after a break, and it looks like they 64 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:12,760 Speaker 1: have a number of partnerships with a lot of corporate entities. 65 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 1: So if that, you know, describes what you are looking 66 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 1: for getting to go back into a sort of a 67 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: corporate or company situation, then that might be a really 68 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 1: cool place to look into starting. Yeah, there's also a 69 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:27,399 Speaker 1: nonprofit I think it's a nonprofit called a Path Forward 70 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 1: that specializes in mid career internship programs to ease the 71 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:35,640 Speaker 1: transition of professionals returning to work. And I mean that's 72 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 1: not just moms, but there is definitely a mom element 73 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: of that. You if you have particular skills, there are 74 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 1: certain companies that will place you for say a six 75 00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:47,920 Speaker 1: month stint that's like an adult internship, and that's a 76 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 1: way to get your foot in the door and get 77 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: a little bit of extra experience as you are on 78 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:53,720 Speaker 1: the job market. I mean a lot of these people 79 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 1: wind up hired by the company where they had the internship, 80 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 1: but you know, even if you didn't, that would be 81 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:02,960 Speaker 1: you know, six months of professional work experience somewhere. So yeah, 82 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:05,520 Speaker 1: those are great. We will probably cover this topic again 83 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 1: because as we all know, careers are not linear, particularly 84 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: these days, So let's go ahead and dive right in 85 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:15,480 Speaker 1: to hear what Kurran has to say. Well, I am 86 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:19,280 Speaker 1: so excited to be here interviewing current Chiefelbeint, who is 87 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:23,239 Speaker 1: a software engineer who has a great story about returning 88 00:04:23,279 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 1: to work after an extended absence. And we had many 89 00:04:26,120 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: people ask us to feature topics like this, and so 90 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 1: I'm really excited to talk to Kurent about her story 91 00:04:32,440 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: and what she thought mattered, because she has some great 92 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:36,720 Speaker 1: tips that she wants to share with all of you. So, Kurran, 93 00:04:36,760 --> 00:04:39,599 Speaker 1: welcome to the program. Thank you very much, thanks for 94 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 1: joining us. So tell us all just real quick about 95 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,279 Speaker 1: what you do professionally in your family. Sure, I'm a 96 00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 1: software engineer. I graduated from college in two thousand and 97 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:55,680 Speaker 1: two with the master's and computer science and started a 98 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,480 Speaker 1: job at a research lab of near Boston, and that's 99 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 1: where I'm at my husband, and after we had the 100 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:06,479 Speaker 1: first son, I stepped back a little bit. I kept 101 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:09,080 Speaker 1: working part time for a couple of years, and then 102 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:13,280 Speaker 1: son number two came along and I basically said, I 103 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: love you all, but I'm going to go work for 104 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 1: my kids for a few years. And I'd always planned 105 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: to come back to work at some point when they 106 00:05:20,640 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 1: were in elementary school, either part time or full time. 107 00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:27,560 Speaker 1: We would see how things went and had some happy 108 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 1: years connecting with other parents in our local Family Network 109 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 1: group ACT in Boxborough Family Network, did some volunteer work 110 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 1: with them, volunteered with the preschool. And then in twenty seventeen, 111 00:05:41,839 --> 00:05:44,400 Speaker 1: as we were starting to have some real conversations about 112 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 1: when I might go back to work, my husband was 113 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:50,600 Speaker 1: diagnosed with stage four melanoma, which put a whole new 114 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:56,080 Speaker 1: light on things, and we had three more years together. 115 00:05:56,600 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 1: And then when the kids were in kindergart in preschool, sorry, 116 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 1: when the kids were nine and six, so the youngest 117 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 1: was in kindergarten and the older one was in second grade, 118 00:06:10,680 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 1: he did pass away from melanoma. And so that following fall, 119 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: I did go back to work part time. Happened to 120 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: be at the same place where I was employed previously, 121 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 1: But I also looked around and intributed around, and I 122 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 1: would be happy to share whatever it might be helpful 123 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:29,479 Speaker 1: to your listeners about that process and what I brought 124 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 1: to it and what worked for me. Yeah, so what 125 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,520 Speaker 1: was the total length of time that you were out 126 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:38,440 Speaker 1: of the workforce then? But it wasn't like there were 127 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:40,560 Speaker 1: volunteer projects in there, and like you said, you were 128 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 1: part time for part of it. Yea, So maybe what 129 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:47,000 Speaker 1: was the length of time between full time job to 130 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: full time job and then sort of what was the breakdown? 131 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:51,960 Speaker 1: And sure, so full time job to full time job 132 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 1: was about nine years, and then at the beginning of it, 133 00:06:56,240 --> 00:06:59,400 Speaker 1: I worked about two and a half years very part 134 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:04,160 Speaker 1: time forty percent, and towards the end of it, I 135 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:08,239 Speaker 1: worked part time for my son's preschool actually, and then 136 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:12,160 Speaker 1: when I went back to work, it was actually at 137 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 1: sixty percent, so I think of it. I was thinking 138 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 1: of it as full time when I went back after 139 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 1: my husband died, because it was like all my cycles, 140 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 1: yes o, instead of getting the kids to and from school. 141 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 1: But I did go back at sixty percent, and then 142 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:28,560 Speaker 1: that was twenty eighteen, and then in twenty twenty I 143 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:30,880 Speaker 1: ramped up to full time for a few months, brought 144 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 1: it back down to eighty and now I'm at full 145 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 1: time again. So it's been quite a journey of different 146 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 1: employment options, and wonderfully at the same employer who's been 147 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 1: able to accommodate all of that, which was a great 148 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 1: first choice for you. Then out of school to get that. Yeah, 149 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:49,280 Speaker 1: so you had, you know, you and your late husband 150 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 1: had this plan that you would wind up going back 151 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 1: to work when your kids started school, and you wound 152 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:57,040 Speaker 1: up pretty much sticking with that timeline then, Yes, yeah, 153 00:07:57,040 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 1: but that was sort of uncertain then toward the end, 154 00:07:59,080 --> 00:08:01,880 Speaker 1: because you were in a care giving role for him. Yes, definitely, 155 00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:07,560 Speaker 1: I didn't really want to commit to a workplace when 156 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:11,040 Speaker 1: when we didn't know how long his health would be lasting. 157 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: Melanoma is not a friendly type of cancer to get, 158 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 1: and I was when he was first diagnosed. He was very, 159 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 1: very sick, and so I was managing appointments for him 160 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 1: and managing medications and everything, and you know, we did 161 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 1: mostly get our old life back for a few years, 162 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 1: but we knew that this was coming down the pike again, 163 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 1: and I wanted to be able to focus on his 164 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 1: needs when it mattered. And so, you know, if I 165 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: was going to work part time at all, it was 166 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:42,520 Speaker 1: going to have to be something where I'd have flexibility 167 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:46,199 Speaker 1: and where people would be understanding. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And 168 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:51,000 Speaker 1: so as you were then, you know, contemplating getting back 169 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: into the workforce, then after he passed away, you were 170 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 1: sort of making that decision. You you were. You said 171 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:01,200 Speaker 1: we were talking earlier that financially you didn't have to immediately. 172 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:06,440 Speaker 1: Not amazing it thought psychologically you actually did want to. Yes, yeah, 173 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: that was important to me. I didn't want to go 174 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:12,920 Speaker 1: back instantly because it was you know, it takes time 175 00:09:12,960 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 1: to get used to such a big change in your life. 176 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 1: But I didn't know that. I wanted to be back 177 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:22,600 Speaker 1: at work in some fashion before the first anniversary of 178 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 1: his death, because I just figured that would be it 179 00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:28,400 Speaker 1: would be healthy for me to have some structure around me, 180 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:32,920 Speaker 1: have people around me. Single parenting is very lonely, and 181 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:36,760 Speaker 1: I wanted to have You know, obviously my kids are 182 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 1: a wonderful reason to get out of bed in the morning, 183 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:42,840 Speaker 1: but I wanted to have some additional supports and bulwarks there, 184 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 1: and for mental health and for being part of something 185 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,120 Speaker 1: bigger than just the three of us that were left. 186 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:50,360 Speaker 1: And what did your kids think about that? How did 187 00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: you talk about it with them? They were used to 188 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:58,080 Speaker 1: me working for their preschool part time. I've got this picture. 189 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 1: I should frame it. My son's in preschool. It was 190 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:04,200 Speaker 1: around Mother's Day. My mother fill in the blank. You know, 191 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 1: my mother likes to he puts work and there's a 192 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:09,280 Speaker 1: picture like a picture of a stick figure with a 193 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:12,760 Speaker 1: stick laptop on the left. But you know, you know, 194 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 1: when they wanted to know why, why do you have 195 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 1: to do this on the computer right now? Mommy? For 196 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:18,720 Speaker 1: the preschool, I'd say, I'm doing this for your teachers, 197 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 1: and they could understand that that I was the work 198 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:23,840 Speaker 1: I was doing was supporting their teachers. And so when 199 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:26,920 Speaker 1: I went back to work more hours of the week 200 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:29,520 Speaker 1: and they needed to go to before care and aftercare 201 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:32,440 Speaker 1: at school, you know, I would explain a little bit 202 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,440 Speaker 1: about the type of project I was doing and the 203 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:36,960 Speaker 1: people that we were trying to help. And so since 204 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: they could grasp that part of the bigger picture at 205 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:43,160 Speaker 1: least a little bit, you know, they would complain about 206 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,200 Speaker 1: having to get out of bed early, but this is 207 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:48,840 Speaker 1: what we do now, right, Nobody likes to get out 208 00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:53,920 Speaker 1: of bed early. Yeah, so they were able to adjust 209 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:55,959 Speaker 1: to it. They were able to adjust. Yeah, they had 210 00:10:55,960 --> 00:10:58,880 Speaker 1: had practice adjusting to things by that point, it sounds 211 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:00,679 Speaker 1: like they did. Yeah. Well, we're going to take a 212 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:02,040 Speaker 1: quick break and then we're going to be back with 213 00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 1: Kurrn's advice for our listeners who are looking to reenter 214 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:08,720 Speaker 1: the workforce or are pondering taking a break how they 215 00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 1: might be able to ease their way back in. Well, 216 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 1: I am back here with Kurran. We are talking about 217 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:30,839 Speaker 1: managing time out of the workforce and getting back in. So, then, 218 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 1: when you did decide that you were looking for full 219 00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 1: time work or at least to ramp up eventually to 220 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: that take more of a career oriented thing back into 221 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 1: your field, how did you go about doing that? Sure? So, yeah, 222 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:45,560 Speaker 1: I was thinking about it years before I knew i'd 223 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:48,079 Speaker 1: be going back, because you've got a lot of time 224 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:50,480 Speaker 1: to think when you have small children and you're just 225 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 1: making sure that they don't eat the thing they shouldn't eat, 226 00:11:53,080 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: et cetera. So some of the things that I did 227 00:11:56,600 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 1: were just sort of lucky, meeting the right people, being 228 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 1: asked to do something that I was qualified for but 229 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:06,680 Speaker 1: felt like a stretch for me. One of those things 230 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 1: was taking on a volunteer chairperson role in the family 231 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 1: network that I mentioned earlier. A good friend was the 232 00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:14,720 Speaker 1: chair at the time, and she said, you can do 233 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:16,839 Speaker 1: this and I need your help, and I said, I'm 234 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 1: not sure, but I'll try. And it turned out to 235 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:23,080 Speaker 1: be the right thing at the right time. For me 236 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:27,640 Speaker 1: to build some build some of my softer skills with 237 00:12:27,679 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: team leadership and project management. And then I also decided 238 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:37,559 Speaker 1: to apply for the chairperson role at the cooperative Preschool, 239 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 1: which from the IRS's point of view is an employed 240 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:44,719 Speaker 1: position because we were getting a tuition credit and the 241 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:48,960 Speaker 1: chairperson at that school is jointly responsible with the director 242 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:51,680 Speaker 1: for the day to day operations of the school. So 243 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:54,080 Speaker 1: for me, it was not a full time job, but 244 00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:58,800 Speaker 1: it did involve things that were relevant to a resume anywhere, 245 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:01,959 Speaker 1: any kind of job. We were doing budgeting, I was 246 00:13:02,080 --> 00:13:06,439 Speaker 1: helping with hiring and writing contracts, we were doing fundraising, 247 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 1: looking for sponsors for the school auction. You know, they 248 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 1: say don't put anything that says mother or parent on 249 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:16,920 Speaker 1: your resume, but I chose. You know, I thought about 250 00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:18,800 Speaker 1: it pretty hard and I chose to put that right 251 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:22,440 Speaker 1: there in the employment section. On parallel with my technical work. 252 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:27,720 Speaker 1: I took my job there seriously, and the message that 253 00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 1: I wanted to send to people who were looking at 254 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:33,520 Speaker 1: my resume was, you know, I took this work seriously. 255 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 1: You should take it seriously too. This is a job. 256 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,240 Speaker 1: And as it turned out in one of my interviews 257 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 1: in a technical interview. One of the interviewers brought it 258 00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:46,079 Speaker 1: up and said, you know, my wife is doing that 259 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:48,360 Speaker 1: thing right now. I see how much work it is. 260 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:51,600 Speaker 1: Tell us what it was like for you, so you 261 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:54,360 Speaker 1: know it was it was it paid off for me, 262 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 1: I found. Yeah, and then you also reached out to 263 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 1: your former contacts. I mean, as yes mentioned, so you 264 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:04,679 Speaker 1: had this job out of school for a couple of years. 265 00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:06,199 Speaker 1: You had been out for a while, but many of 266 00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 1: the people who had been doing this were in their careers, 267 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:12,960 Speaker 1: and that was something that I had read about happening. 268 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 1: I was also reading while I was out. I was 269 00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 1: also considering a shift of career, switching to technical writing 270 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:23,560 Speaker 1: or science writing. I just loved the book about Henrietta 271 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: Lax and thought, my god, if I could write like that, 272 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 1: that would be a job I would love. I thought 273 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:35,520 Speaker 1: about freelancing, either as software or something else, and the 274 00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 1: return to work books that have been written for moms 275 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: and other parents who've been out for a while tend 276 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:49,760 Speaker 1: to encourage you to reach out and to not just 277 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:53,520 Speaker 1: think about your professional networks, but to think about the 278 00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:58,000 Speaker 1: folks who you know socially and talk to them about 279 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: professional work. Just sort of think outside the typical career box. 280 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:06,760 Speaker 1: And one of the things that also was highlighted that 281 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:09,800 Speaker 1: resonated with me was that the folks who are in 282 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 1: your traditional career network while you're out, they may have 283 00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:17,000 Speaker 1: been promoted, they may have gone to other places. And 284 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:20,240 Speaker 1: so my network, even though I'd only worked at one company, 285 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:23,160 Speaker 1: I found when I really wanted to start talking to 286 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:26,160 Speaker 1: people and doing informational interviews, my network was a lot 287 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:29,120 Speaker 1: broader than when I had stepped out of the workforce. 288 00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:32,920 Speaker 1: And it also had gotten a lot a lot higher 289 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: within my old company because people have been promoted into 290 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:38,440 Speaker 1: places where they could either choose to hire me or 291 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:41,080 Speaker 1: recommend to someone else to hire me. And so you 292 00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:44,120 Speaker 1: wound up back at your old employer, although you've had 293 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 1: other places you were interviewing, you did, you had other offers. 294 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 1: What led to you then coming back to your old employer? 295 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:55,680 Speaker 1: How exactly did that happen? Yeah, I was I was 296 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:57,520 Speaker 1: trying to push myself a little bit because I didn't 297 00:15:57,520 --> 00:16:00,600 Speaker 1: want to just, you know, pick the safe option. I 298 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:03,480 Speaker 1: knew the place and I liked it very much, but 299 00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 1: I didn't want to just sort of take that for granted. 300 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 1: It had a better benefits package all told than the 301 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:13,920 Speaker 1: other offers that I received, especially when it came to 302 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:18,920 Speaker 1: paid time off, and as a single parent, that was 303 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 1: really important to me to know that if I needed 304 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: to take sick time for myself or to care for 305 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,840 Speaker 1: someone else, that that wasn't going to cut into the 306 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: other category of paid time off. I also it was 307 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 1: just a little bit of loyalty. You know, my husband 308 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:37,160 Speaker 1: had worked for the same place, and they had been 309 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 1: very classy about his sick time and things like that, 310 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 1: and part of it was just the caliber of the 311 00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 1: people that we worked with. So and one of the 312 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:50,560 Speaker 1: things we had mentioned earlier, you know, we often talk 313 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 1: about like keeping up your skills, and I sort of 314 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,520 Speaker 1: naively was like, well, software, it sounds like a will 315 00:16:55,640 --> 00:16:58,840 Speaker 1: that would taint quickly. And then Current informed me that 316 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 1: note they were still pro I mean, it does brands 317 00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 1: of it. Yes, it's such a big field, right. Yes, 318 00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:12,200 Speaker 1: the industry that I'm in still uses C, still uses Java, 319 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: some people still use Fortran. I personally am not one 320 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:18,840 Speaker 1: of them. There is certainly adoption of newer things, but 321 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:22,360 Speaker 1: I knew that the skills that I already had would 322 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:25,199 Speaker 1: still be valuable if I wanted to go back to that. 323 00:17:25,760 --> 00:17:29,560 Speaker 1: And the other thing about about that particular environment and 324 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:33,640 Speaker 1: workplace is I've done a lot of prototyping systems, and 325 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 1: we're expected to learn new skills on the job. So 326 00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:41,240 Speaker 1: I knew that, you know, even if I tried to 327 00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:44,159 Speaker 1: brush up on whatever was the hot new thing in 328 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:47,520 Speaker 1: year three of my pause, by year five of my pause, 329 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:50,399 Speaker 1: it might not be as relevant anymore. And so that 330 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: was why I decided to consciously focus on the skills 331 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:57,080 Speaker 1: that would transfer from other things and be usable anywhere, 332 00:17:57,160 --> 00:18:02,040 Speaker 1: like business skills, leadership skills, people skills. Yeah, because those 333 00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 1: were the things that would always be useful. Yes, And 334 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 1: then you would brush up whatever new technical things you 335 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 1: needed to exactly. And when I went back, I ended 336 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:13,520 Speaker 1: up learning Android, which I hadn't ever done because it 337 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,640 Speaker 1: wasn't really a thing so much when I left. Yeah, 338 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 1: it was there, you go, now it's a thing. Yeah. 339 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,280 Speaker 1: So how has it been, Like? Do you like being 340 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 1: you know, back full? I mean, because now you're back 341 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:29,480 Speaker 1: full time and not for a while, but back back 342 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 1: full in Yeah. The pandemic made things even more interesting. 343 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 1: We were actually scheduled to go and do a field 344 00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:39,560 Speaker 1: test at the end of March twenty twenty that obviously 345 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 1: was canceled and replanned and done in a different way locally. 346 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:47,720 Speaker 1: We did that in July and it went well. Doing 347 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:51,280 Speaker 1: things over zoom has both you know, I like to 348 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,280 Speaker 1: see people in person, but on the other hand, we've 349 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 1: been able to reach more people and work more effectively 350 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: with folks who were spread around to the country or 351 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:03,880 Speaker 1: you know, one of my supervisors moved to Germany this year, 352 00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: and yet we can still talk face to face as 353 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 1: much as anybody who would have been in the next 354 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 1: office in normal life. So it's been easier to go 355 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:20,399 Speaker 1: back to full time work because I also am co 356 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 1: parenting again. I'm engaged. There are now four kids in 357 00:19:24,080 --> 00:19:27,120 Speaker 1: the picture because my fancy is widowed and he brought 358 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:30,440 Speaker 1: two kids. I brought two kids. We sold two houses, 359 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:34,879 Speaker 1: moved in together in the pandemic, and just sort of 360 00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 1: things go day to day, sometimes in terms of scheduling, 361 00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 1: but we make it work. And we are also very 362 00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 1: fortunate to have excellent childcare who comes to our house 363 00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:48,760 Speaker 1: five days a week and also makes dinner nice. Yeah 364 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:55,119 Speaker 1: you worlds here. I did, in fact, when Dave and 365 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 1: I got engaged, not I mean, not the moment we 366 00:19:57,280 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 1: got engaged, but within a couple of weeks, I gave 367 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:03,440 Speaker 1: him a copy of Tiffany Dufouz Dropped the Ball Excellent. 368 00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:08,840 Speaker 1: So yeah, he's He's very involved in the community locally 369 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:11,640 Speaker 1: as well. He's the one who goes to school committee meetings, 370 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: town meeting things like that. I handle the cub scouts side, 371 00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 1: he handles soccer. So we make a pretty good team, 372 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 1: I think, and that because that is really like I 373 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,560 Speaker 1: have to give him and our nanny a lot of 374 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:30,560 Speaker 1: credit because being able to focus, like you can only 375 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 1: make so many decisions in a day, right, and because 376 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:36,040 Speaker 1: I don't have to make decisions about what's for dinner 377 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,640 Speaker 1: and all of that junk every single day, I can 378 00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 1: make the decisions that I need can I can have 379 00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:46,119 Speaker 1: those decisions available for work. So it's not just hours 380 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 1: in the day, but it's also like brain cycles that 381 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 1: have been freed up by by having a partner again. 382 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:55,440 Speaker 1: And for that I can't be grateful enough. It's pretty 383 00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:59,840 Speaker 1: impressive that you managed to find time for dating as 384 00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 1: well with all that going on. I have very good 385 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:09,440 Speaker 1: friends who are very support of Yes they well no, 386 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 1: they didn't set me up. We actually met at our 387 00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: children's support group. But when I said I needed a 388 00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:19,440 Speaker 1: sitter so that I could go to a concert with 389 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 1: someone from my support group. They were like, they were 390 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:26,959 Speaker 1: lining up to babysit. So that is awesome. That is awesome. 391 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:30,639 Speaker 1: So just if you think back to when you were 392 00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:34,399 Speaker 1: first scaling down and pondering leaving the workforce for a 393 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:38,240 Speaker 1: while to focus mostly on caring for your children, is 394 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:40,399 Speaker 1: there anything you wish you would have done differently, or 395 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:43,119 Speaker 1: anything you would have altered as you went through this 396 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 1: now that you know how things would turn out, That 397 00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:49,600 Speaker 1: is a good question. I had just been people were 398 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:52,080 Speaker 1: just starting to ask me to take on more of 399 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:56,440 Speaker 1: a leadership role on my projects. So I felt while 400 00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:59,320 Speaker 1: I was out, I felt and wondered a little bit 401 00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:04,960 Speaker 1: if if maybe my timing had been off. But in retrospect, 402 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:08,520 Speaker 1: it didn't hurt at all because those same people who 403 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 1: had recognized my potential for doing that were still available 404 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:20,119 Speaker 1: to me as contacts and as friends when I wanted 405 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 1: to step back in. Okay, yeah, and I would say, 406 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,439 Speaker 1: I would say, don't be afraid, don't be afraid. Okay, 407 00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 1: if you if you know what you're capable of, and 408 00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:33,199 Speaker 1: you can and you can convey that to people in 409 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,040 Speaker 1: an interview and you can you can present that and 410 00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:40,199 Speaker 1: present yourself well. The time that you take out is 411 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:44,400 Speaker 1: is still time that you're growing and maturing and learning, 412 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,720 Speaker 1: even if you're not doing it in an office. And 413 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:51,280 Speaker 1: so when you when you want to come back, you 414 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 1: take the time to think about the strengths you have 415 00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:57,440 Speaker 1: developed or the strengths you want to develop while you're 416 00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:01,000 Speaker 1: out and work on that and then and make sure 417 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 1: to convey that to people as you're preparing to come 418 00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 1: back in because that will pay off. Think about your answers, 419 00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:12,000 Speaker 1: think about how you are presenting yourself. That's what I'm hearing. Yes, yes, 420 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,040 Speaker 1: and take like when you're out, you have the gift 421 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:17,399 Speaker 1: of time to think about things. You don't have to 422 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: make a career decision this month or next month. You know, 423 00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:24,280 Speaker 1: when you're out, necessarily you can be thinking about it 424 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:26,680 Speaker 1: for years and think about what you want to be doing, 425 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 1: and think about what you might want to do to 426 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,840 Speaker 1: strengthen gap or what you might want to step away 427 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 1: from and try something new. You have time to try 428 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,400 Speaker 1: something new without it being high profile. Yeah, now, that's 429 00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: what I thought was really interesting you had mentioned, is 430 00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:45,440 Speaker 1: that I mean in terms of the timing because if 431 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:47,280 Speaker 1: you're out for six years, it's be fine if you're 432 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:49,919 Speaker 1: out for seven, right, if you're out for if you're 433 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 1: out for eight. So it's not that you have to 434 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:54,360 Speaker 1: once you decide you want to go back into the workforce, 435 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:56,159 Speaker 1: if your family has set things up so that you 436 00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:59,560 Speaker 1: do not need to immediately find a job that if 437 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 1: that's not required, then you have the gift of time 438 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:06,040 Speaker 1: to be able to really think about what you want 439 00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:08,880 Speaker 1: to do, what would be good, and then what might 440 00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:11,800 Speaker 1: be available, and you don't have to say immediately, like 441 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,360 Speaker 1: the first thing that's there is, of course you could 442 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,200 Speaker 1: just go back to your old employer, as I think people, Yes, 443 00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 1: and so you guys had made that certain decisions and 444 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:24,399 Speaker 1: certain plans that enabled you to take that time to 445 00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,760 Speaker 1: a degree, yeah, yeah, And you have the emotional distance 446 00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:30,280 Speaker 1: from the day to day of work also to be 447 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 1: able to reflect on what you liked about it and 448 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 1: what you didn't think about if you want to change things. So, yeah, 449 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,919 Speaker 1: has there been anything that's been challenging getting back in, 450 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,959 Speaker 1: anything that was harder than you thought it might be 451 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:48,520 Speaker 1: other than the making the six pm pickup at an 452 00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 1: elementary school on the other side of the conquered Rotary 453 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:54,479 Speaker 1: en route too, and if anyone is in Boston, they 454 00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:57,320 Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about. Seeing things take a little 455 00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:04,920 Speaker 1: while to guess it was bad. No. The other thing is, 456 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,640 Speaker 1: you know you can you can count on your kids. Also, 457 00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:12,879 Speaker 1: my kids have they complained about getting up early, and 458 00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 1: they complain about not necessarily you know, having the lego 459 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,240 Speaker 1: set that they wanted or things like that. But you know, 460 00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:23,879 Speaker 1: if you if you are I'm not even sure how 461 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 1: I want to say this. If you want to be 462 00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:31,879 Speaker 1: able to count on your kids to step up, you 463 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,040 Speaker 1: show them a little bit of confidence in them at 464 00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:37,960 Speaker 1: a time, and they will start to have that confidence 465 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: in themselves. And I felt that, you know, when I 466 00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:44,960 Speaker 1: when I went back to work and I needed them 467 00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:47,680 Speaker 1: to be able to be just ten percent more patient 468 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,119 Speaker 1: because of something that was out of my control or 469 00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: out of their control. I felt that they were able 470 00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:56,359 Speaker 1: to deliver that most of the time. Not all the time, 471 00:25:56,800 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 1: but it's felt like it felt like when I went 472 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,840 Speaker 1: back to work, they were you know, they were on 473 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:06,959 Speaker 1: my team. So that's one it was. That's a good feeling. 474 00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:12,720 Speaker 1: They sound amazingly resilient, so that's a ghost of the time. 475 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:16,680 Speaker 1: This has been a trying year up for all of us. Yes, 476 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:20,200 Speaker 1: we always end with a love of the week, as 477 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 1: you best of both world glisser, you know that. Yeah, 478 00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 1: is there something that has been exciting for for you 479 00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:33,199 Speaker 1: of late? Sure? My love of the week would be, Uh, 480 00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:36,360 Speaker 1: we have at the moment all of the flowering trees, 481 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:39,919 Speaker 1: all of the flowers. We moved into a house that 482 00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:43,639 Speaker 1: is lovely and historic and had been landscaped to the teeth, 483 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:47,680 Speaker 1: so there, you know, there are nice shrubs, but there's 484 00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:49,800 Speaker 1: not a lot of a lot of flowers. So I 485 00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:53,840 Speaker 1: have been going to Low's and Aguay and I missed 486 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:56,160 Speaker 1: my old garden, so I've been I've been planting a lot. 487 00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:58,760 Speaker 1: That is my love of the week. And it's exciting 488 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:01,639 Speaker 1: to see things blooming in the neighborhood and now blooming 489 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,600 Speaker 1: in my own yard too. Oh that's good. And a 490 00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:06,680 Speaker 1: historic house that didn't need too much work. You have, 491 00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:11,520 Speaker 1: how much time do you have? We could, oh, my lord, 492 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: whole podcast. Yes, that's a whole other podcast where we 493 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,760 Speaker 1: talk about our historic home renovations and what needs to 494 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:21,440 Speaker 1: be done. But yeah, we've been buying like crazy from 495 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,400 Speaker 1: this place, like fast growing trees. I think it's the website, 496 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:27,800 Speaker 1: and I love the ornamental trees in my current yard, 497 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: and the new yard has some of them that we're 498 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:34,320 Speaker 1: moving to with our renovation, but not quite as many 499 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 1: and not quite as carefully landscaped in certain ways. So 500 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:41,480 Speaker 1: we've been buying ornamental trees and you know, if we're 501 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:43,800 Speaker 1: going to be there for many years, they should grow. 502 00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:47,880 Speaker 1: And also those are slated to go in after all 503 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 1: of the HVAC replacements. That's true. I mean I were 504 00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:55,639 Speaker 1: pacing ourselves finances of all this too. HVACS one of 505 00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,320 Speaker 1: those things that nobody ever wants. It's not a love 506 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:00,520 Speaker 1: of the week. Nobody wants to call me on that. Yeah, 507 00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:02,920 Speaker 1: but it is. It is the project of the air 508 00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:07,760 Speaker 1: and window restoration. Oh gosh, don't start me on that. 509 00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:13,680 Speaker 1: That we finally passed Historic Commission muster on that. Yes, yes, 510 00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:16,080 Speaker 1: all right, well, Current, thank you so much for joinding 511 00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 1: as we really appreciate it. Thank you for all the 512 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:22,200 Speaker 1: podcasts because they have made my commute so much better. 513 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:26,879 Speaker 1: Here's teers to that day care. All right, Well, we 514 00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:30,040 Speaker 1: are back after that interview with Current that was very inspiring. 515 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:34,119 Speaker 1: Our question is from a teacher who is about to 516 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:36,680 Speaker 1: transition back to full time working hours, Si, Sarah, you 517 00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 1: want to want to read that one? Sure? Okay? So 518 00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,760 Speaker 1: our listener writes in that she is a teacher about 519 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,720 Speaker 1: to transition to working full time regular hours Monday to 520 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:48,720 Speaker 1: Friday after maternity leave. And this person happens to be 521 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 1: in a non US country, so I think she had 522 00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:53,000 Speaker 1: a little bit of a longer leave. She says, my 523 00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:56,000 Speaker 1: son is currently almost a year old. We cannot afford 524 00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 1: daycare or a nanny, but my husband has the more flexible, 525 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 1: lower income job, so he reduces hours down to two 526 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 1: nights a week and Saturday is nine to five. My 527 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,120 Speaker 1: son goes to bed around seven thirty and I follow 528 00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,080 Speaker 1: around nine forty five. I wake up about six am, 529 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 1: and she writes, I need a weirdly long amount of sleep. 530 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,320 Speaker 1: I used to only need seven and a half hours, 531 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,360 Speaker 1: but since giving birth, my sleep needs have changed, and 532 00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 1: so does my son. With that being said, what do 533 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 1: you recommend for us so that my husband and I 534 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:23,360 Speaker 1: can get some alone time and together time at some 535 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,600 Speaker 1: point each week? So I'll share my little comments first, 536 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:29,680 Speaker 1: and the first is that I don't think eight point 537 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:32,440 Speaker 1: two five hours is like a super weird amount of sleep, 538 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:36,080 Speaker 1: because that would be nine to forty five to what 539 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,280 Speaker 1: time does she get up? Six? Yes, that's eight hours 540 00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 1: and fifteen minutes. That's not crazy. And then the second 541 00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:43,760 Speaker 1: thing is that you know, on paper the schedule actually 542 00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 1: sounds really really nice because you're getting two hours to 543 00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:49,880 Speaker 1: yourself after the kids' bedtime every night, Like, let me 544 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:51,680 Speaker 1: tell you that to me sounds like heavenly because I 545 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:55,240 Speaker 1: get about fifteen minutes. And you are going to have 546 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 1: some solo time automatically because your husband is going to 547 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: work two of those nights, so going to be on 548 00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:02,840 Speaker 1: your own and maybe, if you know what sounds like 549 00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:05,360 Speaker 1: would be missing would be I don't know, a solo 550 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 1: night for him, perhaps since he's either working at night 551 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:09,920 Speaker 1: or he's with you, So maybe creating some sort of 552 00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:11,800 Speaker 1: a trade off or a night if you wanted to 553 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:13,560 Speaker 1: actually leave the house and go out, you would have 554 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:16,360 Speaker 1: to kind of orchestrate a trade off in that way too. 555 00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:18,520 Speaker 1: And I think that sitting down on one of those 556 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 1: nights after your son goes to bed, when he's not 557 00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:22,840 Speaker 1: working and creating kind of an ideal week template might 558 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:24,960 Speaker 1: be a great idea so you don't fall into default 559 00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:27,720 Speaker 1: modes that you don't like. Yeah, I mean, it does 560 00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: sound to me like the schedule still allows for plenty 561 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:34,360 Speaker 1: of time, and particularly with his sort of more limited hours. 562 00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:37,000 Speaker 1: It's not like some couples who are trying to do 563 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:40,040 Speaker 1: both full time jobs trading off hours, in which case 564 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:42,440 Speaker 1: it can get a lot harder to see each other. 565 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,000 Speaker 1: But yeah, if he works Tuesday and Thursday nights, you 566 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,600 Speaker 1: automatically get those nights yourself post kid bedtime. Then you 567 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: could say Wednesday and Friday night, or a couple nights 568 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 1: after the kid's bedtime Monday. You each do your own 569 00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:56,960 Speaker 1: things so he has his own time too, with you 570 00:30:57,080 --> 00:30:59,720 Speaker 1: sort of as the on parent if your son wakes 571 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:01,680 Speaker 1: up for some reason or you know, so he can 572 00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:04,920 Speaker 1: have his alone time as well. And then on Sunday, 573 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 1: really treat Sunday as family time, right like that, if 574 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,800 Speaker 1: that's the day you all have together, then focus on 575 00:31:12,160 --> 00:31:14,400 Speaker 1: making the most of it. And I mentioned that there 576 00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:17,720 Speaker 1: are some families doing childcare swaps who you know, wind 577 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 1: up in this mindset of like, well, we have no 578 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:21,480 Speaker 1: time with us all together because we're doing that. And 579 00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:24,320 Speaker 1: if that's the case, you might decide to make childcare 580 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:28,440 Speaker 1: a financial priority so that you can have some time 581 00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:31,080 Speaker 1: together and sometimes that is the best family solution, even 582 00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 1: if it requires trading off other things. But in this case, 583 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,720 Speaker 1: I mean, you have all Sunday, so make the most 584 00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 1: of it. You know, have that as family time and 585 00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 1: don't tell yourself the story that you have zero time. 586 00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 1: And I second Sarah's idea of creating a schedule for 587 00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:48,040 Speaker 1: the realistic, ideal week so you can make sure that 588 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,680 Speaker 1: everyone is getting the time that they have for the 589 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 1: things that they want. Well, this has been best of 590 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:57,560 Speaker 1: both worlds. We have been discussing returning to work with 591 00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:01,720 Speaker 1: our great guest Current talk about how that works. We 592 00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:03,960 Speaker 1: will be back next week with more on making work 593 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:08,720 Speaker 1: and life fit together. Thanks for listening. You can find 594 00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:12,160 Speaker 1: me Sarah at the shoebox dot com or at the 595 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:16,440 Speaker 1: Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, and you can find me Laura 596 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:20,160 Speaker 1: at Laura vandercam dot com. This has been the best 597 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,720 Speaker 1: of both worlds podcasts. Please join us next time for 598 00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:26,200 Speaker 1: more on making work and life work together.