1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:03,080 Speaker 1: Make your business official with Google and square Space. When 2 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:06,120 Speaker 1: you create a custom domain and a beautiful business website 3 00:00:06,120 --> 00:00:09,320 Speaker 1: with Squarespace, you receive a free year of business email 4 00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: and professional tools from Google. It's the simplest way to 5 00:00:12,840 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 1: look professional online. Visit squarespace dot com slash Google to 6 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:20,479 Speaker 1: start your free trial. Use the offer code works w 7 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:22,919 Speaker 1: O r k S for ten percent off your first 8 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:26,760 Speaker 1: purchase Google and square Space Make it Professional, Make it Beautiful. 9 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works 10 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:40,120 Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh 11 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:44,040 Speaker 1: Clark with Charles W. Chuck Bryant, and Cherry. So this 12 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 1: is stuff you should know breaking news from two thousand 13 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:52,880 Speaker 1: fifteen editions. No, this is still very relevant to sure it. 14 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 1: It definitely is. But I mean, like at the end 15 00:00:55,160 --> 00:00:57,160 Speaker 1: of last year the beginning of this year, it's certainly 16 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 1: made the rounds a little more. While with the um 17 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 1: movie Concussion, which is apparently like roundly criticized by everyone 18 00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:08,399 Speaker 1: involved in the study of CTE, I didn't see it 19 00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:11,320 Speaker 1: just because you know, it didn't look that good at 20 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 1: me as a movie. Well, apparently I really like did 21 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:17,000 Speaker 1: a lot of oversimplification. It came to a lot of 22 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,280 Speaker 1: conclusions about the science that haven't been reached yet and 23 00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:24,559 Speaker 1: may never be reached. That it was just kind of like, um. 24 00:01:24,600 --> 00:01:27,920 Speaker 1: But there are some really good documentaries out there, and 25 00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: I want to tout one just right off the bat. 26 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 1: There's a two hour front line on this, a League 27 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 1: of Denial. Did you see it? Uh? No, Man, it 28 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:39,360 Speaker 1: is good. I'm not quite sure when it's from, maybe 29 00:01:39,360 --> 00:01:41,560 Speaker 1: too sometime between two thousand and twelve and two thousand 30 00:01:41,560 --> 00:01:45,080 Speaker 1: and fourteen or fifteen, but it was based on this 31 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 1: book by the Fana brothers who wrote League of Denial, 32 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: the book UM, and it was just about their investigation 33 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:57,080 Speaker 1: into what the NFL knew or didn't know about concussions 34 00:01:57,080 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: possibly leading to this this condition CTE. We can just 35 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:05,800 Speaker 1: call it CT right well, practicing you say it once, 36 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:08,160 Speaker 1: I'm definitely going to screw it, and then we'll just 37 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:12,160 Speaker 1: say CT after that. Okay, the condition is called chronic 38 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 1: traumatic encephalopathy. Yeah, great, ta yeah CT Jumping on that 39 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: grenade for the team. Yeah, we've known about it for 40 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:26,160 Speaker 1: a while. It's gone by other names farther back in 41 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 1: in the medical literature. Sure, and we did our own 42 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:34,399 Speaker 1: uh in two thousand nine. Long time ago, we did 43 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 1: one on concussions called do concussions called early Death? Yeah, 44 00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:41,120 Speaker 1: remember that one, Um, And I don't even think we 45 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:43,680 Speaker 1: I don't even know ct was on a radar at 46 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 1: the time. I don't know if maybe we might have 47 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,800 Speaker 1: mentioned it. It started to really seep out into the 48 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:53,920 Speaker 1: news around two thousand nine, so we probably mentioned it, 49 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:56,800 Speaker 1: but I don't think we understood it or recognized it 50 00:02:56,840 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 1: like we do now, meaning like you and me. Yeah, 51 00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 1: just two yokels behind the mica. Uh so you didn't 52 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 1: mention the other names. Um. Back in the day, In fact, 53 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 1: we can go all the way back, shockingly to there 54 00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 1: was a dude named Dr Harrison T. Martland and uh 55 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,680 Speaker 1: he published an article in the Journal of American Medical 56 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:28,160 Speaker 1: Journal of the American Medical Association, and he you know, 57 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 1: you've heard the term punch drunk in relation to boxers 58 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 1: like outside the ring, Like you know, he as as 59 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: big Ray, he's a little punch drunk. He was a boxer. 60 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:40,920 Speaker 1: What are he was talking about, although he didn't know 61 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:46,600 Speaker 1: it at the time, was CTE. Which is it? It's 62 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 1: really remarkable. It resembles if you had no idea and 63 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:53,080 Speaker 1: you were just a doctor looking at at a brain 64 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:57,280 Speaker 1: post more to my guess, let's really know. The way 65 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 1: to say it is in order to unfortunately, right now, 66 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 1: in order to study CT, you have to look at 67 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:05,560 Speaker 1: a brain under a microscope, right, which is the only 68 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: I can't really do while the person is alive. So 69 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 1: if you didn't know any better, you would see a 70 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 1: brain and say, well, this person has a had had 71 00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 1: a degenerative illness in the brain, neurological illness, and I 72 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:24,279 Speaker 1: would say Parkinson's and dementia. It's all here. But the 73 00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:27,320 Speaker 1: striking thing is is it's not an illness. It is 74 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,960 Speaker 1: literally from repeated blows to the head. Yeah, it's not 75 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 1: a disease causing or it's not caused by disease, right. Yeah, 76 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 1: it's a like a traumatic brain injury repeated. But some 77 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:45,040 Speaker 1: people put themselves into a situation over and over again 78 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 1: where they're going to be exposed to the possibility of 79 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:52,600 Speaker 1: traumatic brain injury, right, and chief among them as boxers. 80 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:55,640 Speaker 1: And this doctor Martlin was basically describing this in the 81 00:04:55,640 --> 00:04:58,840 Speaker 1: medical literature from what I understand, just the symptoms, right. 82 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:02,039 Speaker 1: I don't think he was king at brains, was he? No? 83 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: I don't think he was or trying to identify. I 84 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:14,159 Speaker 1: mean he called it punch drunk syndrome, but dementia pugilistic. Yeah, 85 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:17,440 Speaker 1: it's uh, what he was looking at was CT, and 86 00:05:17,480 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 1: we now we now know that, we know we know 87 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: that now. But again he was just kind of describing 88 00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:25,440 Speaker 1: the symptoms. It wasn't until I think the science got 89 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:27,360 Speaker 1: a little further that they really started to look at 90 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: brains and we understood the boxers were at risk for 91 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:36,799 Speaker 1: what we understand now is CT. Yeah, they reached middle age, 92 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 1: they would be like a little more confused, maybe get 93 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:45,120 Speaker 1: dizzy when they're walking around, be unsteady, maybe just slower 94 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 1: generally moving around, and they like, yeah, I got punched drunk. 95 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 1: Just basically just think of Rocky from Rocky four on 96 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:59,760 Speaker 1: m I get them confused after Rocky three. So Rocky 97 00:05:59,839 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 1: three was Mr T. It was Rocky to Mr T. 98 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:07,240 Speaker 1: Rocky three, Rockie two was the rematch with Apollo, Okay, well, 99 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:11,839 Speaker 1: then Rocky four was with Ivan Drago and Bridgete Nielsen. 100 00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: I didn't even really all the way through. I don't 101 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:19,040 Speaker 1: think what you didn't know? That's like lesser Rocky to me. 102 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:22,039 Speaker 1: Uh well that was that was when I was running 103 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: around in the woods like shooting Rooskis with my fake 104 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:27,720 Speaker 1: m c M sixteen as like as seven eight year old, 105 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 1: So this would have been like right there for me. Well, 106 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:33,119 Speaker 1: and it was big time. I saw in the theater. 107 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 1: I'm sure, like I saw it right when it came 108 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 1: out on video. I'm sure. I talked to my parents 109 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 1: and he getting show time so I could see it. 110 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:44,680 Speaker 1: He had burn Comie burn T shirts on. And then 111 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:46,680 Speaker 1: the iron curtain fell and I was like, wait a minute, 112 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:50,000 Speaker 1: none of the stuff that we were told holds up. Yeah, 113 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: people just trying to get by over there exactly just 114 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:58,360 Speaker 1: like us. So where were we, Well, this is where 115 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: we were talking. I think it's really important to say that, yes, 116 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: people knew there was such a thing as CTE. They 117 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 1: called it punch drunk syndrome for a very long time. 118 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 1: But everybody said, boxers know that this is going on 119 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 1: there and millions exactly, they're getting paid millions of dollars 120 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: to do this, They're doing it on their own accord. 121 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: And this is such a small tranche of the population 122 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 1: of the world. Really who cares and it we should 123 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:28,800 Speaker 1: definitely say the medical establishment, especially in the United States, 124 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:32,440 Speaker 1: that we care. We have been calling on the Boxing 125 00:07:32,440 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 1: Association and the government to ban boxing since the fifties, right, 126 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: But for the most part, America said, well, we love 127 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 1: a good fight, so we're not gonna go along with that. 128 00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:45,680 Speaker 1: You guys keep boxing, And that was the way it 129 00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: went until two thousand two. And ladies are boxing now, Yes, 130 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: they are bringing ct just like many. Uh yeah, I 131 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 1: mean that's not super new. But um, I think female 132 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:03,400 Speaker 1: boxing has grown a lot. I think especially since Muhammad 133 00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 1: Ali's daughter got into it. Oh yeah, she definitely brought 134 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:08,280 Speaker 1: a lot of attent tremendously. Do you remember when the 135 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 1: Boxing Association tried to make female boxers wear skirts when 136 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 1: they boxed? Did they really? Interesting? The whole thing was 137 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 1: just like an onion set up, but it was real life, 138 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:25,720 Speaker 1: and it was first of all, making any women in 139 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 1: any profession wear a skirt these days, it's kind of 140 00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:32,200 Speaker 1: untoward if you ask me. But secondly, choose the one 141 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 1: profession where you shouldn't attempt to tell a woman to 142 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 1: wear anything, let alone a skirt she doesn't want to. 143 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:41,600 Speaker 1: Female boxing is the first one that comes to mind. 144 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:45,560 Speaker 1: It's very interesting. Is a female boxing or women's boxing? 145 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 1: Probably both? All right? Okay, alright, So uh, two thousand two. 146 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: Let's flash forward a little bit, uh into the more 147 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 1: modern era. That was a neuropathologist still is name Bennett 148 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:03,400 Speaker 1: um Malu. Who That's who Will Smith played, right, Wasn't 149 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:06,320 Speaker 1: that about him? Right? Okay, I guess I should see that. 150 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 1: I'm not a big Will Smith fan. You should just 151 00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: watch a fan of bad biopics. Watch The League of Denial. 152 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 1: There's he's interviewed extensively in it. Yeah, he's better. He 153 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 1: does a better Omalu than does So there was a 154 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:25,959 Speaker 1: there was a man center for the Pittsburgh Steelers Hall 155 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:28,600 Speaker 1: of Famer Mike Webster died of a heart attack at 156 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,640 Speaker 1: age fifty, and he wound up uh in the care 157 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 1: of Amaliu for his autopsy, and he started looking around 158 00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: the brain and said, there's something going on here that's 159 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 1: really weird. Uh. If you remember when we did um 160 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 1: well the concussions, then then what was the other one 161 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 1: that Alzheimer's recently where we talked about, okay, dementia, where 162 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 1: we talked about beta am Lloyd proteins. Yeah, so they 163 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 1: build up as like a plaque, right, Yeah, they build 164 00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,040 Speaker 1: up like a plaque and then these towel proteins come 165 00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 1: along after and really do a lot of damage. He 166 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:06,079 Speaker 1: noticed that Webster had a lot of these towel proteins, 167 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:10,400 Speaker 1: but not the former beta amloid proteins, which is really weird. 168 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:13,480 Speaker 1: It was weird in that he when he opened up 169 00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:16,960 Speaker 1: Mike Webster's um skull and started poking around his brain 170 00:10:17,360 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 1: like Mike Webster had been showing all of the classic 171 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:25,320 Speaker 1: symptoms of Alzheimer's in dementia for many, many years now, 172 00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:28,560 Speaker 1: long before he died of a heart attack at age fifty, 173 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:30,959 Speaker 1: which is pretty young. So Amalu was like, surely I'm 174 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:34,040 Speaker 1: going to find these beta amaloids, and he didn't, so 175 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: that the the lack of beta amloids made him dig 176 00:10:36,960 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 1: a little deeper and really start looking at Mike Webster's brain, 177 00:10:41,280 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 1: and that's when he found the tow proteins. And he's like, 178 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 1: what are these doing here? Especially by themselves? Well, yeah, 179 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:49,719 Speaker 1: and that's like I said earlier, he everyone thought he 180 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 1: had Alzheimer's in dementia, but he just had dementia, which 181 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 1: is not the way it's supposed to work. So it 182 00:10:56,880 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 1: was a startling find, to say the least. And this 183 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 1: was I believe the first NFL player a former player 184 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 1: that is that had this disease and was diagnosed with it. Yeah, 185 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:11,800 Speaker 1: morm Malo, who is I think like the forensic pathologist 186 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:17,520 Speaker 1: with Pittsburgh Um diagnosed him with chronic traumatic and cephalic 187 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 1: and cephalopathy the like you said, the first football player 188 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:25,280 Speaker 1: ever to have this, this diagnosis. Up to this point, 189 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:27,280 Speaker 1: it had been boxers. Had he been a boxer, it 190 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,080 Speaker 1: would have made zero news whatsoever. But the fact that 191 00:11:30,080 --> 00:11:32,560 Speaker 1: he was a football player, this is kind of weird. 192 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: And well, we'll talk about why this was so strange 193 00:11:34,920 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 1: and weird right after this, So, Chuck, we were saying 194 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 1: that Bennett omalu Um diagnosed Mike Webster with CTE and 195 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,320 Speaker 1: when he did, it made huge waves. And the reason 196 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:12,160 Speaker 1: why it was because Mike Webster was the first NFL 197 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: player to be diagnosed with this. But for a very 198 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:18,160 Speaker 1: long time, for the pretty much the last decade, the 199 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 1: NFL had been fighting off this idea that concussions were 200 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:25,280 Speaker 1: worse than just having like your bell wrong or whatever 201 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,760 Speaker 1: cute thing you want to call, coming close to losing 202 00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:32,600 Speaker 1: consciousness because the acceleration of your brain smacking against the 203 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:38,520 Speaker 1: inside of your skull has cognitively disabled you temporarily. That's right. Uh. 204 00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 1: The NFL, Oh boy, this is we're getting into it now. 205 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:48,800 Speaker 1: They have they have a long checkered history with trying 206 00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:53,080 Speaker 1: to protect players from injury and trying to protect their 207 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:59,560 Speaker 1: own interests as either a a massive revenue generating UH 208 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:04,480 Speaker 1: core operation and UH one that wants to keep its 209 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,720 Speaker 1: players safe, but also not beyond that money well and 210 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 1: not beyond the hook for their injuries. Like oh yeah, yeah, 211 00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:13,839 Speaker 1: you're playing the NFL. You know what you're getting into. 212 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:18,120 Speaker 1: There's chances are And this was long. I mean everyone 213 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 1: always knew like, yeah, when you get old, you're you're 214 00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:22,199 Speaker 1: not able to walk that well, you're gonna have creaky 215 00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: knees and a bad back and all the stuff that 216 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 1: comes along with getting you know, hammered on the field 217 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 1: each and every week. But they always did try to 218 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 1: sort of downplay this concussion. And it's only in recent 219 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:37,960 Speaker 1: years that they've really made official a protocol for dealing 220 00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:40,839 Speaker 1: with concussions. Yes, it was always like, I want to 221 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:42,480 Speaker 1: get back in the game, coach, and they're like, how 222 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:44,280 Speaker 1: do you feel. You know where you are? Yeah, yeah, 223 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:46,400 Speaker 1: I'm good, all right, get back in there, right right, um. 224 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 1: And it was a direct result of this initial diagnosis 225 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:54,840 Speaker 1: from two two of CTE but by Bennett Omaliu of 226 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:57,360 Speaker 1: Mike Webster right that all of this change we're seeing 227 00:13:57,400 --> 00:14:00,600 Speaker 1: over the last couple of seasons, which apparently having like 228 00:14:01,559 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 1: like great effects already as it comes from this moment 229 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 1: in time. Right and part and parcel of that diagnosis 230 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 1: was also a lawyer that had been hired by Mike 231 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 1: Webster or his family either right before he died or 232 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 1: right after he died, and Um the lawyer was trying 233 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:24,560 Speaker 1: to build a case to get Mike Webster disability from 234 00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:30,520 Speaker 1: the NFL's um Disability Committee, and the disability Committee made 235 00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 1: a decision based on the science that was presented to 236 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:38,760 Speaker 1: them that said, yes, without a doubt, Mike Webster had 237 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:44,000 Speaker 1: severe brain damage and cognitive impairment from his years of 238 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:47,040 Speaker 1: playing football. And then it was the only time they'd 239 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:49,240 Speaker 1: admitted it. They've been putting it off for years, and 240 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:52,440 Speaker 1: it got buried. And from that moment on, the NFL 241 00:14:52,520 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: completely changed its its course and just denied, denied, deny 242 00:14:57,720 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 1: um and that was the state of affairs there for 243 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:03,560 Speaker 1: for a while. But as that was going on, simultaneously 244 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:08,480 Speaker 1: been in Omalu, who has been UM at times very 245 00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 1: much vilified. He's put his foot in his mouth a lot. 246 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 1: He speaks publicly out of line. UM. He said once 247 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:18,000 Speaker 1: that UM he would bet his medical license that O. J. 248 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:22,600 Speaker 1: Simpson had ct has CTE UM and the implication being 249 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:25,760 Speaker 1: that that's why he killed Ronald Goldman and Nicole Brown. 250 00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: I guess I should say allegedly. I don't know what 251 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:33,400 Speaker 1: what what do you say if somebody gets off for 252 00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 1: murder in a criminal trial but is convicted of it 253 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 1: in a civil trial. I don't know at any rate, 254 00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:43,480 Speaker 1: just just saying stuff that like a man of science 255 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:46,120 Speaker 1: shouldn't do. But the thing is is, when you look 256 00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: at the work that he's doing, his actual work is unimpeachable. 257 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 1: His public persona is kind of lacking. But at the 258 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: same time, the work he's doing stands up. And there's 259 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:00,600 Speaker 1: plenty of other people who have kind kind of come 260 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 1: and joined the cause or we're already researching ct who 261 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:06,760 Speaker 1: have really kind of redoubled their efforts to try to 262 00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:10,240 Speaker 1: figure out what's going on here. Yeah, Chiefly there's a 263 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:15,760 Speaker 1: neuropathologist named Ann McKee that has joined up UH with him, 264 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 1: and they're they're sort of the main face of this 265 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: uh CTE campaign. At this point, she's in League of 266 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:26,240 Speaker 1: denial as well. There there's just really interesting people because 267 00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 1: they're very much dedicated to getting to the bottom of it. Yeah. 268 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: And one of the big reasons why this is a 269 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 1: bigger deal than when you know, we're talking about boxing, 270 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:37,800 Speaker 1: and you know how many people boxing is pretty niche sport, 271 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 1: but a lot of kids play football. And what they're 272 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 1: finding out is that children especially are at risk because 273 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 1: they think and this is this is all they said. 274 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:51,200 Speaker 1: They're in the toddler phase of CTE research right now, 275 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: so they're really learning a lot um like as we speak. 276 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 1: But um, one thing they think is a big factor 277 00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:04,159 Speaker 1: is the length of the neck two. Yeah, to brace 278 00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:07,320 Speaker 1: and deal with these hits to the head. Um. Obviously 279 00:17:07,359 --> 00:17:09,040 Speaker 1: that doesn't mean like, oh, you got a strong neck, 280 00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:10,720 Speaker 1: you can just get hit in the head over and 281 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 1: over and over. But they're saying for kids, especially these 282 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 1: uh young boys and even girls now who play football 283 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:22,160 Speaker 1: as like early teenagers, that's super dangerous. There's also there's 284 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 1: a brain research name Robert Cantu from Boston University UM, 285 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:28,440 Speaker 1: and he was saying that in addition to the neck 286 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:32,880 Speaker 1: being less developed, the mile in sheaths, which UM UH 287 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:37,439 Speaker 1: protect our nerve endings are nerves, including our neurons in 288 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 1: our brain UM are less developed, so there's less protection UM. 289 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 1: And there's other factors to like, uh, girls are more 290 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:52,520 Speaker 1: susceptible to uh cte than boys, and like if you're dehydrated, 291 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 1: you're more likely to develop cte UM. There's a lot 292 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:58,360 Speaker 1: of different risk factors, but it does seem to be 293 00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:02,199 Speaker 1: ages playing one of them. And the problem is is 294 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:05,240 Speaker 1: if you send a kid in fourteen year old into 295 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:08,760 Speaker 1: a game and they get a concussion where they and 296 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 1: they keep playing. Yeah, they may stop playing football after 297 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:17,480 Speaker 1: high school, but decades later they could conceivably develop ct 298 00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:22,800 Speaker 1: They could develop ct without ever having officially had a concussion. Right. 299 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 1: You know they're doing these tests now with these uh 300 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:30,560 Speaker 1: these sensors inside helmets, and you don't necessarily have to 301 00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:35,760 Speaker 1: have a concussion. It's all about this sustained abuse over time. Right. 302 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:38,679 Speaker 1: So there's and it's not just football, no, it's not. 303 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:41,639 Speaker 1: There's a bunch of other uh activities I guess you 304 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:45,679 Speaker 1: could say, including sports, but non sports too, activities like 305 00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:48,639 Speaker 1: getting in car crashes over and overhere to get well true, 306 00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:53,600 Speaker 1: but you know, obviously UH hockey rugby, wrestling, Uh, soccer, 307 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:56,439 Speaker 1: all those header balls they say can have an impact 308 00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 1: over time. Yeah. As a matter of fact, soccer internationally 309 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:03,040 Speaker 1: and nationally is starting to um come under more scrutiny 310 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: because they're realizing, like, yeah, you don't have to get 311 00:19:05,080 --> 00:19:12,919 Speaker 1: a concussion to to develop CTE. Horseback riding the list, uh, lacrosse, skiing, Um, 312 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:16,400 Speaker 1: most of those are sports based. But anything where you 313 00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:21,720 Speaker 1: are getting that sort of impact repeatedly over time is 314 00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 1: gonna It's just it's it builds that damage up. It 315 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:27,840 Speaker 1: seems like it's not like once you get over that concussion, 316 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 1: then you're back at square zero exactly. That's exactly right. 317 00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:36,200 Speaker 1: It's progressive, right. So uh, and what they're finding based 318 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,400 Speaker 1: on some of these tests, like you were saying, there's 319 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: something called subconcussive events to where say like you're heading 320 00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:45,720 Speaker 1: a soccer ball, but you don't see stars afterward, or 321 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 1: you um are fine with bright lights. There's there's no 322 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:54,199 Speaker 1: symptoms of a concussion. But as far as your brains concerned, 323 00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 1: it just took an impact and it as these things 324 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 1: accumulate a little subconcussive e, especially when an actual concussion 325 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:05,840 Speaker 1: is thrown in or multiple concussions. That's what they think 326 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:10,560 Speaker 1: is the mechanism behind the development of ct Alright, so 327 00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:15,680 Speaker 1: symptom wise, Um, if you're talking to the average everyday person, 328 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:20,040 Speaker 1: they want to understand what it's like. Uh, there are 329 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:23,720 Speaker 1: different stages their three. In stage one, Um, you're gonna 330 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:27,399 Speaker 1: be dizzy and have headaches, and also, uh, your attention 331 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:30,000 Speaker 1: span is gonna be cut down. Um, you're gonna have 332 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:34,800 Speaker 1: that general difficulty concentrating on things. You're gonna be disoriented. 333 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:37,639 Speaker 1: You might be a little more aggressive and have that 334 00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:41,320 Speaker 1: impulse control, which and I know Amala probably shouldn't be 335 00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:45,040 Speaker 1: shooting his mouth off about o J, but um, I 336 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 1: mean that's possible. Like there have been all sorts of situations. 337 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 1: Real these NFL players of like their families are saying, 338 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 1: you know, they're not the same person. They're aggressive, they're 339 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:56,919 Speaker 1: getting in fights now which they never used to do. 340 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 1: They're depressed or suicidal. So uh, oddly they're not showing 341 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: I don't think they were conclusively showing that link yet, 342 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:09,760 Speaker 1: but no, it seems to sort of be obvious, and 343 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 1: in fact we should say that there there has not 344 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 1: been a conclusive link between repetitive head injuries from sports, 345 00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:24,960 Speaker 1: from contact sports and c t E. The science is 346 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:30,240 Speaker 1: still being worked out, and of course again there's never anything, 347 00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:33,240 Speaker 1: there's never there's no such thing as settled science. So 348 00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 1: if that's what you're looking for, it's never gonna get there. 349 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:38,119 Speaker 1: But what they're starting to do now is a mass 350 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:42,840 Speaker 1: enough of a medical literature, um that that yes, the 351 00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:48,200 Speaker 1: the link will be conclusive basically all right, so second stage, um, 352 00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:51,360 Speaker 1: in addition to all the first your behavior might get 353 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:55,200 Speaker 1: even more unpredictable and your memories even worse. And then 354 00:21:55,240 --> 00:22:01,080 Speaker 1: finally stage three. Uh, all those former stages us even 355 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 1: slower movements, literally staggering, trembling, deafness, maybe you can't even 356 00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:09,360 Speaker 1: speak correctly. Yeah, the final stage is very sad. Right. 357 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:13,879 Speaker 1: And so if you are a doctor and somebody comes 358 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:16,800 Speaker 1: to you presenting like this, you're gonna be like, wow, 359 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 1: this this guy's got Alzheimer's, or you would have before 360 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:21,719 Speaker 1: now you'd probably be a lot more likely to be 361 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 1: like my CTE. But we can't check. No, no, you can't. 362 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,480 Speaker 1: And let's go a little into the brain. The only 363 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:33,600 Speaker 1: way that you can diagnose ct E is postmortem, like 364 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:37,119 Speaker 1: you're saying, right, um, And what they're looking for is 365 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:40,840 Speaker 1: this accumulation of TOW proteins. And again they're not a 366 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 1: certain how this is going on, but this is what 367 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,720 Speaker 1: they think, especially when they start to include research on 368 00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,920 Speaker 1: tow proteins from Alzheimer's. So, normally, in your brain, tow 369 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:56,280 Speaker 1: proteins um give structure to what they're called microtubules, which 370 00:22:56,359 --> 00:22:59,160 Speaker 1: are inside the neurons and they basically act as little 371 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:04,040 Speaker 1: transport chain insidety to your little brain cells. Right. Well, 372 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 1: these tow proteins um strengthen and de strengthen these microtubules 373 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:13,280 Speaker 1: depending on whether the brain needs those microtubules at any time. 374 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 1: And there's some type of event called hyper phosphoration in 375 00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:26,480 Speaker 1: which the tow proteins actually become destabilized. They're they're weakened, 376 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:30,160 Speaker 1: which is normal, but they're not able to regain strength, 377 00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:33,320 Speaker 1: which is also normal. So as they become weaker and 378 00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:35,720 Speaker 1: weaker and weaker, these TOW proteins actually kind of break 379 00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 1: up and they start to accumulate within the neuron. They 380 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:43,720 Speaker 1: accumulate in the accent which is where a neuron transmits 381 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,919 Speaker 1: information there in the dendrites eventually, which is where it 382 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,639 Speaker 1: receives information, and then they start to accumulate even in 383 00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:52,040 Speaker 1: just the neural body, and with all of this starting 384 00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:55,240 Speaker 1: to clog up, the neuron itself dies And when enough 385 00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:58,480 Speaker 1: of this stuff happens, a whole region of the brain 386 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 1: can start to die off, been wither. And that's when 387 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 1: you have all of these symptoms that are basically identical 388 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:10,199 Speaker 1: to Alzheimer's. The the key is this there they have 389 00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:15,560 Speaker 1: associated the presence of this in former football players who 390 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,280 Speaker 1: are known to have gotten concussions, who are known to 391 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:21,720 Speaker 1: have gotten all of these subconcussive events on a daily basis, 392 00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 1: with um what they're seeing in these same deed football 393 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:29,800 Speaker 1: players brains. And at this point all they can do 394 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 1: is say, yeah, man, like, of course this caused this, 395 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:36,119 Speaker 1: but they can't say exactly how it's causing it. They 396 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 1: haven't reached that point yet. All right, Well, let's take 397 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:40,200 Speaker 1: a break and we'll come back and talk a little 398 00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,639 Speaker 1: bit more about where this is all headed and what 399 00:24:42,680 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 1: the NFL is doing about it. Alright, So, one of 400 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:12,680 Speaker 1: the big problems with c T e UM is that 401 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,920 Speaker 1: there is no cure at this point. So the best 402 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:20,640 Speaker 1: practice is to avoid the cause, which is getting hit 403 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,200 Speaker 1: in the head a lot, over and over and over. Yeah, 404 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 1: but how do you do that with football? Well, that's 405 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:31,120 Speaker 1: that's the rub. It's very tough. Uh. There are some 406 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:34,760 Speaker 1: schools of thought that say, these players know what they're 407 00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:38,680 Speaker 1: getting into. If you ask them, many of them would probably, 408 00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:42,680 Speaker 1: if not most, say, we know the risks. We are 409 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:47,440 Speaker 1: willing to shorten our lives. Our careers will be limited, 410 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,359 Speaker 1: all for the rush of being on that field, the 411 00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:53,919 Speaker 1: adoration of the fans, and all that money we know 412 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:56,679 Speaker 1: we're getting into. We know it's a dangerous thing, and 413 00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 1: we're willing to do so. Anyway, A lot of them 414 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:02,720 Speaker 1: would not. All of him, though, of course not. I mean, 415 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:04,840 Speaker 1: there have been some really high profile cases, like a 416 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: guy named Junior say ow Right, who's like a legend 417 00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 1: in the NFL. He committed suicide and his brain, after 418 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: a very long struggle, was um found to have was 419 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:21,560 Speaker 1: diagnosed as cte UM. There I oh, I can't speak 420 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,280 Speaker 1: for anybody who's died, but there are a lot of 421 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:29,680 Speaker 1: um people who are suffering now who are who wouldn't 422 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:32,440 Speaker 1: go back and do it again in the exact same way. Well, 423 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:36,560 Speaker 1: regret is different than I mean, you asked the young 424 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:40,080 Speaker 1: man exiting college and he says, yeah, I know where 425 00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:42,560 Speaker 1: this is going to lead me us the old person 426 00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,800 Speaker 1: suffering from dementia, and they'll say, well, young me didn't 427 00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:47,399 Speaker 1: know what he was talking about. I would trade all 428 00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:49,840 Speaker 1: the money and all the fame to go back and 429 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:53,480 Speaker 1: lead a fuller life. The key to this, the chuck 430 00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:56,800 Speaker 1: is would that young man's that if you go back 431 00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: even further to that ten year old boy, it what 432 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:05,199 Speaker 1: his mom knowing all this let him play. And if 433 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,640 Speaker 1: numbers are down in little league football, which is bad 434 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:11,880 Speaker 1: news for the NFL because those little league players who 435 00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:15,000 Speaker 1: are really good eventually become NFL stars that make the 436 00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:17,439 Speaker 1: NFL a lot of money, which is one of the 437 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,080 Speaker 1: main reasons why they tried very hard to clamp down 438 00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:23,640 Speaker 1: on public awareness of this. So the NFL, on their part, 439 00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:28,119 Speaker 1: have tried to limit concussions. Now, um, it's not working 440 00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:32,359 Speaker 1: so far as far as limiting concussions. Oh no, I 441 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 1: thought they were down In two thousand fourteen there were 442 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:36,760 Speaker 1: two hundred and six and two thifteen there were two 443 00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:41,280 Speaker 1: seventy one. So that's not what I saw. Yeah, it's 444 00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,480 Speaker 1: really depends on the year, like they're up and down 445 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 1: each year. They're definitely not in some downward trajectory though, overall, 446 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:54,040 Speaker 1: PBS has like gone all in on tracking CTE and 447 00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 1: they actually did a concussion watch and they counted the 448 00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:01,320 Speaker 1: concussions I guess diagnosed can since I'm not sure in 449 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 1: every game and they came up with, well, the NFLS 450 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:09,800 Speaker 1: is two seventy one, which is sort of commuch or 451 00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:12,120 Speaker 1: to what you would think NFL or PBS. As far 452 00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:14,840 Speaker 1: as the stance for football guests, Well, you think the 453 00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:17,679 Speaker 1: NFL would be the ones under playing it, you know. 454 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 1: But um, at any rate, Uh, they've tried to change 455 00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:24,439 Speaker 1: some of the rules as far as leading as a 456 00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 1: tackler with the crown of your helmet. They have moved 457 00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:32,240 Speaker 1: the kickoff forward so now there aren't as many runbacks 458 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: on kickoffs and that's where a lot of the high 459 00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:41,240 Speaker 1: impact collisions occur is on kickoffs and the special teams plays. Uh. 460 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:46,200 Speaker 1: It's a rub though, because fans like the NFL is 461 00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:49,440 Speaker 1: known and I'd love the NFL, Like I'm at odds 462 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 1: with myself on this because part of what you love 463 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:56,640 Speaker 1: about the game is the game as it is, and 464 00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:03,600 Speaker 1: you can't regulate, uh injury out of the NFL or 465 00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: head injury out of the NFL because it wouldn't be 466 00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:11,080 Speaker 1: football anymore. Like you literally couldn't have people tackling people. UM, 467 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 1: actually went to a game. Have you ever been to 468 00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 1: an NFL game and sat close to the field close fish? 469 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:21,720 Speaker 1: It's like I was talking to my buddies who I 470 00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:23,440 Speaker 1: was with. I was like, you get close down there, 471 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 1: and you're like, man, I would literally need an ambulance 472 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:31,640 Speaker 1: on any play that happened. Period. I don't see how 473 00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:33,920 Speaker 1: these men get up at all when you see these 474 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 1: collisions they take. But that's what the fans love about 475 00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:39,479 Speaker 1: the sport, and that's what the NFL is built on. 476 00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:43,720 Speaker 1: So to change that would fundamentally change the game. Um. 477 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 1: But at the same time, the NFL doesn't. You know, 478 00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 1: they've been really shady. UH as far as how they've 479 00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:53,680 Speaker 1: handled all this over the years. They there was a 480 00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:56,840 Speaker 1: congressional report that found that they they basically made a 481 00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:00,640 Speaker 1: thirty million dollar a gift unrestricted gift in two thousand 482 00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:03,720 Speaker 1: twelve to the National Institutes of Health to look into 483 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 1: head injuries. UH. They found out that they the research 484 00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,040 Speaker 1: wasn't so friendly to the NFL, so they tried to 485 00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:15,520 Speaker 1: get the the UH. The main researcher from UH. I 486 00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:18,440 Speaker 1: think it was either Boston College or bu stripped of 487 00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 1: his position even though there they weren't supposed to monkey 488 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:23,600 Speaker 1: around with any of it. It It was like, nope, you 489 00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:26,440 Speaker 1: do your unbiased research and we're staying out of it. 490 00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:29,719 Speaker 1: So yeah, they didn't stay out of it. They were 491 00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 1: found out. Then they said, you know what, We're not 492 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,160 Speaker 1: going to give you that full thirty million. Then oh, 493 00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:37,080 Speaker 1: you're joking. They pulled the final sixteen million from the 494 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:42,400 Speaker 1: from the research, and UM basically denied up until literally 495 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 1: this year. In March of this year was the first 496 00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:49,080 Speaker 1: time an NFL senior vice president stood up and acknowledged 497 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:53,280 Speaker 1: the link between CTE publicly and football. Well, they also 498 00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:57,640 Speaker 1: settled with five thousand former players for a billion dollars, 499 00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:01,120 Speaker 1: and they settled because it was found that they had 500 00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 1: tried to suppress evidence about concussions, leading to CTE keep 501 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:09,800 Speaker 1: the players unaware of this UM And there's a lot 502 00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:11,360 Speaker 1: of those players and that we're saying no, no no, no, 503 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:13,760 Speaker 1: Like now this all come out and they're like that 504 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:17,440 Speaker 1: payoff is nothing, sure, Like I want out of this suit. Yeah, 505 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:21,200 Speaker 1: because again, please please take the time to go watch 506 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:24,600 Speaker 1: League of Denial. They do such an amazing job talking 507 00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 1: about the Nefariu stuff that the NFL has done over 508 00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:29,600 Speaker 1: the years to try to like keep this out of 509 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:31,960 Speaker 1: the players awareness, keep it out of the public awareness. 510 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:33,960 Speaker 1: But they also do a really good job of getting 511 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:36,920 Speaker 1: across like what life can be like for some of 512 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,680 Speaker 1: these players. And we should say for some of people, 513 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 1: even players with CTE found to have ct after death 514 00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:48,320 Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily mean they're going to be suicidal or that 515 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:52,080 Speaker 1: they had um Alzheimer's symptoms or anything like that. But 516 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:55,640 Speaker 1: for the ones that do, they have a really rough life, 517 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 1: and so does their families as a matter of fact, 518 00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,520 Speaker 1: and that really comes across in the document Memory. Well, 519 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:04,240 Speaker 1: there's just one study they did that they took brains 520 00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:08,400 Speaker 1: of a hundred and sixty five former football players. Um, 521 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:11,120 Speaker 1: it could have been high school, college, NFL, or obviously 522 00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,840 Speaker 1: all three if you went to the NFL, A hundred 523 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:19,160 Speaker 1: and thirty one of the one had ct and of 524 00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:22,680 Speaker 1: the ninety one that played in the NFL of them 525 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:26,920 Speaker 1: had ct YE. And it's shocking. And they do make 526 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 1: the point in this article that those who choose, whose 527 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:35,360 Speaker 1: families or individuals chose to donate their brains are probably 528 00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:40,760 Speaker 1: people that likely have the CTE. Right when you're healthy, 529 00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:43,200 Speaker 1: you're not thinking I need to donate my brain to science. 530 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:46,800 Speaker 1: That's what they need, you know, they need like all 531 00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:51,320 Speaker 1: kinds of h people. I mean, you know athletes. Well, 532 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:55,000 Speaker 1: actually there's a test that was kind of fortuitous from 533 00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:57,520 Speaker 1: u c l A. Actually, they're people are trying to 534 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,720 Speaker 1: figure out how they can diagnose c t E in 535 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:05,719 Speaker 1: living people, right um, and it's there. They have not 536 00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 1: figured it out yet. They're trying to figure out how 537 00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:10,480 Speaker 1: to like die the tow proteins in the brain to 538 00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:13,720 Speaker 1: see accumulations and then check to see if there's beta 539 00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 1: amyloids too out they will. But this U c l 540 00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 1: A researcher duo of researchers found that um, they could 541 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:25,800 Speaker 1: check for the shrinkage of volume and parts of the 542 00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:29,040 Speaker 1: brain and correlate those two ones that have been found 543 00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:34,480 Speaker 1: through autopsies of football players with CTE. Right, and they 544 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:38,160 Speaker 1: scanned some guys brain still alive. Former football player has 545 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 1: all the um all the symptoms of CTE UM and 546 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:46,520 Speaker 1: crucially he also had a UM M r I done 547 00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:50,959 Speaker 1: like four years before, so they could compare his current 548 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:54,760 Speaker 1: brain size to what he had four years before and 549 00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:57,680 Speaker 1: see the regions that were shrinking and one region lost 550 00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:00,960 Speaker 1: like four of its volume and just the four years. 551 00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:03,960 Speaker 1: But they found that these regions correlate with stuff they're 552 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,840 Speaker 1: seeing in CTE and former football players. So they're thinking 553 00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 1: maybe they can use this as the test, just look 554 00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,719 Speaker 1: for shrinkage in different brain regions. Well, one thing they 555 00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:15,719 Speaker 1: do know is that, uh, in two thousand and eight, 556 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:19,880 Speaker 1: they did a survey and the NFL. Former NFL players 557 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:23,880 Speaker 1: get Alzheimer's at a rate about six times higher than 558 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:28,160 Speaker 1: the general population, which is no surprise. Um, But like 559 00:34:28,200 --> 00:34:31,799 Speaker 1: we're talking about earlier, that whole link to depression and suicide, 560 00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:37,400 Speaker 1: Apparently former NFL players are less likely to have depression 561 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:44,080 Speaker 1: and less likely to commit suicide, almost six less likely. Um, 562 00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 1: I don't know that that says a whole lot though. 563 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:49,960 Speaker 1: I don't think that disproves at all that depression and 564 00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 1: suicide can also be you know, part of CTE. That 565 00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:56,000 Speaker 1: smells like an NFL funded study. Yeah, just I don't know. 566 00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:58,840 Speaker 1: Something's not adding up with that. Yeah. Again, if you 567 00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:05,279 Speaker 1: watch the legal denial, you're like, question everything everybody. It's weird. 568 00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:08,399 Speaker 1: It's a really weird situation because it's on one side, 569 00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:12,400 Speaker 1: you've got the NFL fighting for its life, throwing everything 570 00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,560 Speaker 1: it can't money and lawyers, and doing really dirty stuff 571 00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:19,040 Speaker 1: like discrediting the doctors involved, trying to get an I H. 572 00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:23,239 Speaker 1: Researchers fired. And on the other side, you've got all 573 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:30,320 Speaker 1: of these incredibly well educated, incredibly in some cases egotistical 574 00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:35,680 Speaker 1: neuro neurologists and neuro researchers who are all vuying to 575 00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 1: be like the one who makes the connection with ct E. 576 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:43,640 Speaker 1: The science is out there enough that there's someone someone 577 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:47,040 Speaker 1: can come along and be like, here case closed, put 578 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:50,040 Speaker 1: my name on this. And there's a lot of gross 579 00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:54,000 Speaker 1: stuff like Junior Sayou's brain. Um had a lot of 580 00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:58,200 Speaker 1: people after it in like just the hours after he died, 581 00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,880 Speaker 1: and they were calling his family and ailing his family 582 00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:04,880 Speaker 1: and like bad mouthing one another when they were talking 583 00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:07,719 Speaker 1: to his son saying like, hey, give us the brain. 584 00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:09,879 Speaker 1: You don't want to give it to Boston University. Their 585 00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:13,080 Speaker 1: ghoules will probably eat some of it, you know. Um, 586 00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,719 Speaker 1: it's just a weird situation that's going on, very sad. Yeah, 587 00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:20,520 Speaker 1: you got anything else I do not well that is 588 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:23,400 Speaker 1: ct and I can assure you there will be plenty 589 00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:26,479 Speaker 1: more of that because they're still figuring it out, but 590 00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:28,760 Speaker 1: if you want to know more about it in the meantime, 591 00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:31,719 Speaker 1: type those letters into the search part how stuff works 592 00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:37,400 Speaker 1: dot Com. Since I said search bars signed for listener, ma'am, 593 00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:42,960 Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this Halloween response. Hey guys, UH, normally 594 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:45,200 Speaker 1: skip the Halloween podcast because I'm I'm not much a 595 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:48,640 Speaker 1: fan of ghost stories, but I thought it was broad daylight, 596 00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:51,200 Speaker 1: so I'll go ahead and listen. My first ghost story 597 00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:54,359 Speaker 1: actually gave me the creeps. The reason I'm writing, though, 598 00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: is you pointed out that the majority of horror stories 599 00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,200 Speaker 1: to pick violence against women. Being a fan of horror 600 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:02,920 Speaker 1: movies is interesting. He doesn't like ghost stories, but he 601 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:06,480 Speaker 1: likes horror moans. Not definite, but these aren't even ghost stories. 602 00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:11,359 Speaker 1: Being a fan of horror movies, I would be lying 603 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:13,720 Speaker 1: if I said it wasn't something I had wondered about myself. 604 00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:18,839 Speaker 1: After listening to some great true Prime true crime podcasts, though, 605 00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:21,520 Speaker 1: of which there are many, I've concluded that the reason 606 00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:24,799 Speaker 1: is that stuff is art imitating life. A lot of 607 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:27,240 Speaker 1: these movies or stories are based on true events. Unfortunately, 608 00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 1: in the real world, violence against women, especially with serial killers, 609 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,200 Speaker 1: is far more common. UH. When people set out to 610 00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:37,840 Speaker 1: write horror. They usually research existing crimes to base ideas 611 00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:40,200 Speaker 1: off of in order to make it more realistic and 612 00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:43,360 Speaker 1: in turn more frightening. So it may be easier to 613 00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:46,440 Speaker 1: change fiction to be less sexist. Uh, the real issue 614 00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:48,400 Speaker 1: lies more in the world that we live in, and 615 00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:50,799 Speaker 1: I guess we can probably convince cereal killers start killing 616 00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:55,160 Speaker 1: more men, we'll probably continue to see more violence. Until 617 00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 1: we do that, we'll see more violence against women in 618 00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,520 Speaker 1: horror films. I never thought about that, James. It's a 619 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:02,439 Speaker 1: good point. It's a pretty good hypothesis. Actually, it makes 620 00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:06,840 Speaker 1: a great case. Thanks James. H. If you want to 621 00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:09,919 Speaker 1: get in touch with us to say, hey, man, here's 622 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:12,759 Speaker 1: something smart we love hearing that, you can tweet to 623 00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:14,879 Speaker 1: us at s Y s K podcast. You can join 624 00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:17,080 Speaker 1: us on Facebook, dot com, slash stuff you Should Know. 625 00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:19,600 Speaker 1: You can send us an email This stuff podcast at 626 00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:22,200 Speaker 1: how stuff Works dot com and has always joined us 627 00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:24,239 Speaker 1: at our home on the web, Stuff you Should Know 628 00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:33,840 Speaker 1: dot com For more on this and thousands of other topics. 629 00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:44,200 Speaker 1: Is it how stuff Works dot com.