1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:06,280 Speaker 1: Now from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg's Sound on. 2 00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:10,840 Speaker 1: It's now safety in the evacuation area. That black smoke 3 00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:14,200 Speaker 1: indicates that there was incomplete combustion. Look, I think that 4 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: I would be drinking the bottle of water. The e 5 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:20,480 Speaker 1: p A is closely modering the situation and reporting rashes, 6 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:25,279 Speaker 1: and they were scared. Bloomberg Sound on Politics, Policy and 7 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: Perspective from DC's top name. The official word from the 8 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:31,480 Speaker 1: CBO is that deadline is going to be sometime between 9 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: July and September. Everything about the economy right now. Council's humility. 10 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:39,440 Speaker 1: Wall Street didn't build America. I even built. They did 11 00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:44,639 Speaker 1: little Classic America. Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on 12 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:49,040 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio. Authorities are still unclear on what is in 13 00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: the air and the extent of damage. No, not the 14 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:55,680 Speaker 1: spy balloons. It's a train derailment and chemical fire in 15 00:00:55,760 --> 00:00:59,200 Speaker 1: Ohio that has regulators in a community on edge. Welcome 16 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 1: to the fastest or in politics as we bring you 17 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 1: the latest from East Palestine, Ohio and a conversation with 18 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:07,320 Speaker 1: Steve Cook, former deputy administrator at the e p A. 19 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:10,120 Speaker 1: The CBO has done it. We put a date on 20 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 1: a default today as President Biden talks economy in Maryland. 21 00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:16,120 Speaker 1: Will be joined later by Maryland Senator Ben Cardon on 22 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:19,280 Speaker 1: the budget debate, and of course by our signature panel. 23 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Politics contributors Rick Davis and Genie Schanzano are back 24 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:24,760 Speaker 1: with us. We spent the last week and change here 25 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: talking about the threats from above, the Chinese spy balloon, 26 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: a series of UFOs calls for a presidential address to 27 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 1: the nation. You've heard it all on this program, But 28 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:38,000 Speaker 1: even before we shot down the balloon, there was a 29 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:42,480 Speaker 1: massive plume of black smoke rising over Ohio after a 30 00:01:42,560 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 1: train derailment and chemical spill led officials to vent and 31 00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:51,040 Speaker 1: burn vinyl chloride and other toxic chemicals into the year 32 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:54,920 Speaker 1: to avoid a bigger explosion. You've probably seen pictures of 33 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 1: it by now. You may have seen people posting photos 34 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:03,320 Speaker 1: on social media taken from airliners, this massive plume of 35 00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 1: acrid black smoke. It led to evacuations and a huge 36 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:10,960 Speaker 1: environmental mess, and many questions remain about the extent of 37 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:14,560 Speaker 1: damage and the potential long term effects of this accident 38 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:17,640 Speaker 1: environmental and health. The story has reached the White House 39 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 1: briefing Room Press secretary Koreine Jean Pierre says, they're watching 40 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:22,960 Speaker 1: the e p A is UH is closely modoring the 41 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: situation that we that we see in in the community 42 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 1: and our top priorities the health and safety of the community. 43 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:31,680 Speaker 1: So don't just don't want to get ahead of what's 44 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:34,359 Speaker 1: currently happening. So what is happening? Ohio Governor Mike de 45 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 1: Wine was asked what he would do if he lived 46 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:39,480 Speaker 1: in that community now that people have been allowed back 47 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:42,360 Speaker 1: in their homes. Would he go home? Would he drink 48 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:44,680 Speaker 1: the water? Look, I think that I would be drinking 49 00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:49,359 Speaker 1: the bottle of water UM, and I would be continuing 50 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:54,359 Speaker 1: to UM find out what the tests we're showing as 51 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:58,640 Speaker 1: far as the air UM, I would be alert and 52 00:02:58,639 --> 00:03:01,840 Speaker 1: and concerned. I think I would probably be back in 53 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 1: my house. I'd be drinking the bottled water, he says, 54 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 1: not instilling a lot of confidence in people. Bloomberg reports 55 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: the chemical spill and burn killed thirty fish, and while 56 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:17,280 Speaker 1: no people died, there are real concerns about the long 57 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:21,800 Speaker 1: term health risks here, including cancer specifically, as vinyl chloride 58 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,440 Speaker 1: is a known carcinogen linked to cancers of the liver, 59 00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:29,360 Speaker 1: the brain, the lungs and as the White House watches 60 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:33,080 Speaker 1: here from Washington. We get into all this with Stephen Cook, 61 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 1: former Deputy Assistant Administrator at the Office of Land and 62 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: Emergency Management at the Environmental Protection Agency. He's now at 63 00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:45,000 Speaker 1: Bracewell and Stephen, I'm glad that you're with us here. 64 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 1: Where to begin, Mike DeWine, the governor of Ohio, because 65 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: of course you're your expertise is in the clean up 66 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 1: here and the government response. He says that the state 67 00:03:56,880 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 1: is working well with the e p A. Is there 68 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 1: more that could have been done? Generally? When you think 69 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 1: about the government and its response, UM, in my time 70 00:04:06,560 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 1: at the agency, it was impressive how far the government 71 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 1: agencies have come since Vurricane Katrina. UM, there is an 72 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:16,920 Speaker 1: incident in command structure that gets set up and they're 73 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:22,120 Speaker 1: representatives from state, local SAIDs all get together, assignments are 74 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 1: given and there's a clear line of authority. So for 75 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,839 Speaker 1: the initial response, it should have worked under that instant 76 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:31,119 Speaker 1: man structure. My time of the agency show that didn't 77 00:04:31,160 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 1: work very well. Talk to me about the decision to 78 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 1: burn and vent the chemicals here. I know there was 79 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:41,839 Speaker 1: concern about a greater explosion but people are just looking 80 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: out their windows at this massive column of black smoke. 81 00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,640 Speaker 1: Stephen as it was that the right decision. Well, you 82 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: have to balance the response from a catastrophic exposion down 83 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 1: the road to the control burned that they did, and 84 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:02,080 Speaker 1: you're looking at long term effects concentrations for you know, 85 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 1: weeks at a time. To take that thing to burn out, 86 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: it could have been many days, if not weeks, those 87 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 1: to a couple of days, so that that's that's what 88 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 1: you're balancing trying to figure that out. Also, by doing 89 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: the control burn they were able to release it to 90 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 1: avoid you know, when those rail metal rail cars gastrophically 91 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 1: failing and cause these travenel to go throughout the town. 92 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:25,000 Speaker 1: Good lord, what was the right move to bring people 93 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 1: back into their homes a week ago. That's all dependent 94 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 1: upon the monitoring data in such. The agency has a 95 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:34,599 Speaker 1: lot of resources available to it for these kind of 96 00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:38,039 Speaker 1: emergency responses, and so they go out take the data 97 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:39,920 Speaker 1: and such. You know, as far as drinking the water 98 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:42,040 Speaker 1: depends on the source of the water, you know, is 99 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 1: it upgradient of wherever the spill is from people's individual wells. 100 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:49,440 Speaker 1: I'm not familiar with you know what their water sources. 101 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:52,279 Speaker 1: But you need to think about that, and then you 102 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:54,840 Speaker 1: know if they are have well its individual home welles 103 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:57,599 Speaker 1: and their downgrading of the spill, it could be a 104 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 1: while before um they get back on the regular water. 105 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: But that's where the agencies provide the monitory to check 106 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:06,600 Speaker 1: those those levels for them. I know you spent a 107 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:10,160 Speaker 1: career doing this, Steven, but you don't sound uh terribly 108 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 1: concerned about this. The governor says he wouldn't even be 109 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:15,200 Speaker 1: drinking the water if you lived in that neighborhood. Is 110 00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 1: that the right message, once again depends on the water source. 111 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 1: So if if I've got a well and it's downgrading 112 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: where the spill was, probably not going to drink the 113 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:26,919 Speaker 1: water right now. So I get a lot of sample 114 00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,159 Speaker 1: results that says if I've got a well that's a 115 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:31,919 Speaker 1: mile upgrading of it, probably not too worried about it. 116 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: So you can't understand why people are confused. People are scared. 117 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 1: They feel like they're not getting a straight answer when 118 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:43,839 Speaker 1: that's what they're being presented. Absolutely, and that's one of 119 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: the struggles the government and when I was there, is 120 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 1: the ability to communicate these very technical, scientific information in 121 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:54,960 Speaker 1: a way that informs the community, and what the government 122 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 1: oftentimes is not good at is explaining what they do 123 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:02,200 Speaker 1: know and what they don't know yet, and that's there's 124 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 1: a lot that you don't know, and so that that's 125 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:08,200 Speaker 1: a tough message to communicate. And then there should be 126 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,040 Speaker 1: strong coordination with the company to make sure they're doing 127 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 1: the right things as far as the response and the cleanup, 128 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 1: and they're gonna be there for a while to deal 129 00:07:17,440 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: with give us a sense of that, how how long 130 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:21,840 Speaker 1: should something like this take? Knowing that you've got a 131 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:24,200 Speaker 1: spill and you've got I don't know if there's anything 132 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 1: to do about what's in the atmosphere. At this point, Stephen, 133 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 1: the atmosphere has been dispersed and um that smoke is 134 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: are the reason why you have smoke, because you had 135 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 1: incomplete combustion, so that s it has long since probably 136 00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:44,440 Speaker 1: for the most part, descended to the ground. But it 137 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 1: to clean up the ground and for the water could 138 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 1: be weeks months, um could be longer. Depends on how 139 00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: much the geology of the area. You know, if there's 140 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 1: a nice clay liner just a few feet down and 141 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: it should stay fairly close to the surface, and you're 142 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 1: fine if it per lates way down and travels with 143 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 1: a lot of groundwater speed. You could be there for years. Stephen, 144 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:11,160 Speaker 1: you spent many years working as lead counsel at one 145 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:15,760 Speaker 1: of the biggest plastic and chemical companies, liondel Bassel. If 146 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 1: I'm saying it right, Uh, is this just screaming lawsuits 147 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 1: for the next many years? What's the legal side of this? Yes, 148 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 1: there there's already been lawsuits filed, and yes there will 149 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: be lawsuits. And that's always something that's a company. You 150 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 1: you run drills, you prepare for this and mind elba 151 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:34,439 Speaker 1: cell we did a number of the east. But yes, 152 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: there will be lawsuits. But the main thing right now 153 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:40,320 Speaker 1: is to make sure that accurate information is getting to 154 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 1: those responders and that they are powerfully addressing the clean up. 155 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:46,960 Speaker 1: The lawsuits will not get resolved in a week. No, 156 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:50,840 Speaker 1: it's gonna be years. Right. That generally takes quite a while. 157 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 1: Norfolk Southern is in the middle of this. The rail 158 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:56,559 Speaker 1: company obviously could break up tens of millions of dollars 159 00:08:56,600 --> 00:08:59,319 Speaker 1: in costs, but has promised the governor that they will 160 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 1: stay on site until this is cleaned up. What role 161 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:05,720 Speaker 1: should they be playing, Well, they're the responsible party, so 162 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:08,120 Speaker 1: they have the primary responsibility to go clean it up, 163 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:11,200 Speaker 1: and the government oversight looks at it. And if the 164 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: government doesn't think that they are doing enough or taking 165 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,199 Speaker 1: proper actions, there are laws in place that allow my 166 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 1: kPa to step in and take over the cleanup. So 167 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 1: right now the right party is paying for it and 168 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,559 Speaker 1: doing it. The company and the government should be looking 169 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:28,960 Speaker 1: over their shoulder and making sure that they are. And 170 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:30,800 Speaker 1: what you've got to look at is the long term 171 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: tail on this is that they don't go away after 172 00:09:33,080 --> 00:09:35,199 Speaker 1: just a week. That would you long enough to make 173 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 1: sure that it's done. Would you have gone home, write 174 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 1: your family back home, or would you have had your 175 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:44,080 Speaker 1: own due diligence before you made that decision. I would 176 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:47,199 Speaker 1: have looked at all the information and made a determination. 177 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:49,839 Speaker 1: Depends on where I was and what part of town 178 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 1: and what information I got from the government. So that's 179 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:56,720 Speaker 1: a tough question to answer without any information understood, no context. 180 00:09:56,880 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 1: I think that's how a lot of people in these 181 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:02,040 Speaker 1: Palestine feel right now. Stephen. We've been looking at these 182 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 1: balloons and UFOs for the last weekend change here. People 183 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:08,720 Speaker 1: have been demanding the President addressed the nation from the 184 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:11,360 Speaker 1: Oval office does this rise to that level, that that 185 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:15,439 Speaker 1: BP deepwater horizon level where the President says, something awful 186 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 1: has happened, here's what we're doing to fix it. I 187 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:24,080 Speaker 1: don't believe so. I mean, the immediate risk from acute 188 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:28,080 Speaker 1: exposure high concentrations is over because the chemical has been 189 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:30,880 Speaker 1: burned off and the initial clean up probably has taken 190 00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 1: care of that. So now it's longer term, but you've 191 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 1: controlled the source. You remember in deep water the oil 192 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:40,600 Speaker 1: kept coming up for many, many days and months. Here 193 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:42,720 Speaker 1: we're done. And that's one of the reasons for the 194 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,680 Speaker 1: control burn is that rather than having a fire burning 195 00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 1: for weeks as it's slowly burned off, you did it 196 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 1: all in one chunk, and so the fires out. Now 197 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:55,960 Speaker 1: it's just dealing with what's on the ground and in 198 00:10:56,000 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 1: the water. Stephen, thanks for your insights here. Before I 199 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:03,520 Speaker 1: let you go, what's the what's the real risk? What's 200 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:05,400 Speaker 1: the concern at this point? Is it the is it 201 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: the compounding of burning chemicals that presents a risk that 202 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:10,960 Speaker 1: we can't necessarily quantify or do you think we're out 203 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:17,000 Speaker 1: of the woods on this. The these chemicals is what 204 00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:20,000 Speaker 1: I know about them. Unless you were right next to 205 00:11:20,040 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: that plume and such. The concentrations you breed them probably weren't, 206 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:27,160 Speaker 1: you know, high enough for the acute effects. The immediate 207 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 1: effects are is really the long term, so if they 208 00:11:29,559 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 1: do a good job of cleaning up, and yes, you 209 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:34,199 Speaker 1: may have been exposed to levels above numbers that you 210 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:37,400 Speaker 1: would of concern, but they're concerned that you would be 211 00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 1: exposed at those numbers for many days a month, for many, 212 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 1: many years versus just a few days and you're done. 213 00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 1: So it's really making sure that long term that it 214 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:49,120 Speaker 1: doesn't get into your permanent drinking water supply and you 215 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:53,000 Speaker 1: keep drinking small amounts of this day after day after day. 216 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:55,600 Speaker 1: Um making sure that you know the air is clean. 217 00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:59,079 Speaker 1: So there is more testing to be done. But yes, 218 00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 1: you can get out of the US without significant um effects, 219 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 1: but it's something that you need to keep looking at 220 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:09,520 Speaker 1: over time. Thank you. Stephen Cook with brace Well now 221 00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 1: former Deputy Assistant Administrator at the Office of Land and 222 00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:16,040 Speaker 1: Emergency Managements at the e p A. People who live 223 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:21,200 Speaker 1: there are very skeptical. Ashley McCollum talked about this. She 224 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 1: lives in the neighborhood with her family. You can smell 225 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:24,960 Speaker 1: it there and even this morning when I took my 226 00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:27,400 Speaker 1: kids to school. When they were moving things at the tracks, 227 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:30,360 Speaker 1: you could smell it. It was a little bit overwhelming. 228 00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:33,360 Speaker 1: You can still smell it as we assemble our panel. 229 00:12:33,440 --> 00:12:37,559 Speaker 1: Now for more with Rick and Jennie Bloomberg Politics contributors 230 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:40,360 Speaker 1: Rick Davis Jeannie Schanzano are back with us today. God 231 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,080 Speaker 1: I missed you both yesterday. Genie, I'm gonna start with 232 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:46,199 Speaker 1: you here, because the White House has been asked about 233 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:48,680 Speaker 1: this more than once. I just played some brief remarks 234 00:12:48,679 --> 00:12:51,400 Speaker 1: from Karine Jean Pierre. The President has been briefed on this. 235 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 1: Does he need to say something? You know, I think 236 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 1: he should. Um. You know, one of the things we've 237 00:12:57,280 --> 00:13:00,440 Speaker 1: been hearing is that there is a question and you know, 238 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:03,760 Speaker 1: Steve was just saying that it probably doesn't rise to 239 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: the level of BP and that's very reassuring, But there 240 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:09,880 Speaker 1: are other people who are suggesting that this is significant 241 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:13,319 Speaker 1: enough that it may require or merit, if you will, 242 00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 1: a presidential commission. Um. And so if that's the case, 243 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,079 Speaker 1: you know, a commission like that would help address so 244 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 1: many of the questions that have arisen in that you 245 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:25,880 Speaker 1: were just talking about that the president really should address it. Um. 246 00:13:25,920 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 1: So I do think he should address it, and I 247 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,199 Speaker 1: am happy that they were addressing it from the White 248 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:32,680 Speaker 1: House today. We may need to hear from the President, 249 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:34,560 Speaker 1: but of course we're asking to hear from the President 250 00:13:34,640 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: a host of things at this point, so it may 251 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 1: be asking too much. But then again, you know, Rick, 252 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 1: I'm not sure that that the UFOs are posing a 253 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 1: threat to America. While it was obviously a big deal 254 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:48,599 Speaker 1: that we're shooting things down, we keep hearing from the 255 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,480 Speaker 1: Pentagon of the administration that Americans are not at risk here. 256 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 1: People in East Palestine may well be, should they hear 257 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:56,680 Speaker 1: from the federal government. Yeah, I don't think it's a 258 00:13:56,679 --> 00:14:02,079 Speaker 1: fair you know, comparison, um Steve, our intelligence from a 259 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,199 Speaker 1: Chinese balloon isn't the same thing as a public health emergency. 260 00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:07,959 Speaker 1: I would actually compare it more to sort of Flint, Michigan, 261 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:10,840 Speaker 1: you know, where there was a public health emergency, you know, 262 00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 1: but tainted water and and and nope, and and people 263 00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:16,320 Speaker 1: trusted the government that they knew what they were doing, 264 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:18,199 Speaker 1: and not only did they screw it up, but they 265 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 1: lied about it. And I think this is a healthy 266 00:14:20,680 --> 00:14:24,520 Speaker 1: skepticism we're hearing right now about this incident because uh, 267 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:26,720 Speaker 1: you know who trust Norfolk Southern. I mean, I'm sure 268 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 1: they're a really wonderful railroad, but they had a derailment 269 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:33,120 Speaker 1: that's not supposed to happen in a very you know, 270 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 1: uh sensitive cargo and and and nobody's really I think 271 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 1: giving it the attention it needs, certainly uh in Washington, 272 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:46,160 Speaker 1: because I think this is endemic of an aging rail system, 273 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:49,400 Speaker 1: uh and the importance of our public health. But I mean, 274 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:52,160 Speaker 1: I think it's appropriate for I think Joe Biden at 275 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: some point to travel to Ohio and address the state. 276 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 1: It's really doesn't affect everybody in the country, but it 277 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:01,480 Speaker 1: does affect people in a high and I'm sure Mike DeWine, 278 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 1: the governor, would love to have him because I think 279 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: they've got to reassure the community that their their air 280 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:10,440 Speaker 1: and their water safe, that that you know, the government 281 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,800 Speaker 1: will sponsor testing and the things that they need to 282 00:15:13,800 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 1: do to be reassured that this accident that they did 283 00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:21,240 Speaker 1: not cause on their community is not only monitored well 284 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:24,080 Speaker 1: but cleaned up to the to the best of possibilities. 285 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:26,080 Speaker 1: I mean, how many times have we heard, you know, 286 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:29,000 Speaker 1: the stories about toxic waste sites that were accidents that 287 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 1: never got cleaned up, right, And so I think you 288 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 1: have to be very skeptical about what people are saying. 289 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 1: And this is gonna be one of those things that 290 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 1: we're only gonna know with the test of time. None 291 00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 1: more skeptical than Aaron Brockovich, who is weighing in on this. Genie. 292 00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:46,440 Speaker 1: She tweets, this is why people do not trust government. 293 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 1: You can't tell people there's been and continues to be 294 00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 1: hazardous pollutants contaminating the environment. Will at the same time 295 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 1: saying all is well. Children who couldn't breathe, they were 296 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:02,200 Speaker 1: having asthma tacks, they were reported projectile vomiting, they were 297 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: reporting rashes, and they were scared. Aaron Brockovitch, Genie, this 298 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:11,360 Speaker 1: is a matter of trust, it is, and and people, 299 00:16:11,400 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: to Rick's point, and to Aaron Brockovitch's point, they have 300 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:17,120 Speaker 1: lost faith in the government or there's at least, you know, 301 00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 1: this skepticism out there, and Steve mentioned it. A lot 302 00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: of this has to do with mixed messages. On the 303 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:25,800 Speaker 1: one hand, you have the governor saying, you know, he'd 304 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 1: go home, and yet he'd be drinking that's right. So 305 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:33,320 Speaker 1: there are these mixed messages. I should say so we 306 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: wanted to touch this because it's not getting enough coverage 307 00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:39,000 Speaker 1: in Washington. As Rick Davis said, as we plant our 308 00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:41,320 Speaker 1: marker here on this story, we're gonna stay with it. 309 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 310 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at five pm Easter on Bloomberg Radio, 311 00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 1: the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg 312 00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:57,680 Speaker 1: Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa 313 00:16:57,760 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 1: from our flagship New York station, say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven. 314 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:06,600 Speaker 1: The White House could not have planned it better, really today, 315 00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,399 Speaker 1: not in terms of timing. With President Biden set to 316 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 1: speak in Maryland, his opening act was Philip Swagel, the 317 00:17:12,600 --> 00:17:16,320 Speaker 1: director of the CBO, who was out today with a 318 00:17:16,440 --> 00:17:19,119 Speaker 1: date for default. We project that if the debt limit 319 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: remains unchanged, the government's ability to borrow using these extraordinary 320 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:28,560 Speaker 1: measures will be exhausted. Between July and September, of generating 321 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:32,159 Speaker 1: the headline on the terminal Biden McCarthy budget challenge worsens 322 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 1: on new CBO estimates, and that is where we start with. 323 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 1: Senator Ben Cardon, the Democrat from Maryland, was with President 324 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,960 Speaker 1: Biden today as he spoke welcome back, Senator. Is this 325 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:46,200 Speaker 1: going to help to have a hard deadline to work against? Well, Joe, 326 00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:47,560 Speaker 1: first of all, it's good to be with you and 327 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:50,880 Speaker 1: the President, I thought laid out a very clear message 328 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:54,240 Speaker 1: on the debt and his speech to Maryland, pointing out 329 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:57,520 Speaker 1: that the Replicans desires to cut the I R s 330 00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 1: and to EXTENDAX bills. Why had three trillion dollars in 331 00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:05,359 Speaker 1: an accidental debt. We need to pay our bills. It 332 00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:08,679 Speaker 1: should not be a subject of negotiation. What needs to 333 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:13,800 Speaker 1: be negotiated is our budget plan moving forward. How are 334 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:15,439 Speaker 1: we going to deal with the deficit, How are you 335 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: going to deal with current needs, and how we're going 336 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 1: to pay for it? And that's legitimate debate that needs 337 00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:23,919 Speaker 1: to take place, and those those discussions need to take place, 338 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:26,159 Speaker 1: but it can't be with the threat I'm not paying 339 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:29,240 Speaker 1: our bills. That was certainly the refrain today from Senator 340 00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 1: Chuck Schumer, who's clearly in step with the White House here. 341 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 1: It's got to be a clean debt ceiling bill. But 342 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,280 Speaker 1: it's all hinging, Senator, and you don't need me to 343 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:42,840 Speaker 1: tell you this. Around Kevin McCarthy's demand to reform, we're 344 00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:49,160 Speaker 1: frankly cut spending, and the President returned to this line 345 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:50,679 Speaker 1: that he used in the State of the Union that 346 00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:54,080 Speaker 1: got everybody upset. They were yelling and Republicans in some 347 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 1: cases yelling liar when he talks about sunsetting social Security 348 00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:00,200 Speaker 1: and Medicare, this Rick Scott plan. Here's what he said 349 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:04,199 Speaker 1: today in Maryland. No, no, liar, liar. I said that 350 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:07,480 Speaker 1: means you know you're not gonna cut Medicare social Security? 351 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:09,119 Speaker 1: And I all stood up, started cloud. I said, we 352 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:14,639 Speaker 1: got to settle in Remember how well it's all on 353 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:17,480 Speaker 1: philm let's see who wants to cut it. Well, we 354 00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: are going to see at some point here, Senator, But 355 00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:23,400 Speaker 1: does that is that helping or hurting? Knowing that Rick 356 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 1: Scott is on an island compared to Mitch McConnell and 357 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy, who say those entitlement programs are off the table, Well, 358 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 1: I think it helps because we need to be realistic 359 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 1: of what we can get done. We need to have 360 00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:40,639 Speaker 1: a responsible program to reduce the deficit. It's interesting in 361 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:43,960 Speaker 1: Joe Biden's first two years, he's had a plan, it's implemented, 362 00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 1: a plan that does exactly that. The Placier Reduction Act 363 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:51,360 Speaker 1: reduced ourt to deficit, so there is action that can 364 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 1: do this. What we need to do is have an 365 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 1: agreement between Democrats and republic against as to what the 366 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:01,880 Speaker 1: four bills gonna appropriation are going to contain, the capsule 367 00:20:01,960 --> 00:20:04,880 Speaker 1: those that spending, as to how we're gonna pay for it, 368 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 1: and all. That's a responsible negotiations now as it include 369 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: so security and Medicare cuts. No, I think that's very clear. 370 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:16,240 Speaker 1: Both both the overwhelming majority have said that, if anything, 371 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,760 Speaker 1: we want to strengthen those two programs. So we need 372 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:21,000 Speaker 1: to take a look at where we can make savings 373 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:23,359 Speaker 1: and where we can bring revenues in that are needed 374 00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:26,800 Speaker 1: and still invest in America's future. You've been through this 375 00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: a few times Center for this dead ceiling debate. Does 376 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,080 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy need to make a deal with Joe Biden 377 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 1: or could there be a gang in the Senate, possibly 378 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 1: including you, that comes up with a deal and feeds 379 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 1: it to the House. Well, I think there's gonna be 380 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:43,880 Speaker 1: buy parties and discussions in the Senate. I think it's 381 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,880 Speaker 1: easier body to reach an agreement on this, So those 382 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:49,919 Speaker 1: discussions will take place. But make no mistake about it, 383 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 1: it's got to be an agreement that can pass the 384 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:55,679 Speaker 1: House of Representatives, and it won't have that chance unless 385 00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:58,320 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy's on board. In my view, So I think 386 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:01,119 Speaker 1: we have a Kevin McCarthy. Well, i'll tell you what 387 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 1: he tweets today. Democrats, reckless spending is plunging our country 388 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:07,440 Speaker 1: into deeper debt and jeopardizing our economy. A blank check 389 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:09,399 Speaker 1: from more spending will destroy our country. That's why we 390 00:21:09,520 --> 00:21:12,600 Speaker 1: must negotiate a responsible debt limit increase that gets our 391 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 1: fiscal house back in order. What's a responsible debt limit increase. Well, 392 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,240 Speaker 1: that's not a blank check, a dead limit. It's not 393 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 1: a blank check. It's paying for already spent. So this 394 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:28,119 Speaker 1: is whether we're gonna honor, whether our check left bound, 395 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:31,800 Speaker 1: not whether we we are obligated to pay the money. 396 00:21:31,800 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 1: We're obligated to pay the money to pay our bills. 397 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:37,160 Speaker 1: And let's let's use the right that they have all 398 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,399 Speaker 1: the leverage in the world. We can't spend one time 399 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 1: after October one this year unless the bill passes the 400 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:45,359 Speaker 1: House of Representatives. So they got plenty of leverage, but 401 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:48,399 Speaker 1: don't leverage the full faith and credit the United States 402 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:51,680 Speaker 1: and our credit worthiness. That that's not gonna cost us then, 403 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:55,320 Speaker 1: the taxpayers. How come the President is not connecting on 404 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:58,880 Speaker 1: deficit reduction. He talks about it a lot. He's he's 405 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,080 Speaker 1: got a story to tell, He's got actual numbers to 406 00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:05,439 Speaker 1: show from the the Inflation Reduction Acts and and his 407 00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:08,119 Speaker 1: his prior budget proposals. He says he wants to do 408 00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:13,200 Speaker 1: more here, the American people don't seem to be hearing it. Senator, 409 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:16,400 Speaker 1: how come, Well, I think that's one of the reasons 410 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 1: he chose the speech of Maryland today is that is 411 00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:24,000 Speaker 1: to talk about it directly. The fact that his record 412 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 1: has reduced the the Republican program will increase the deficit. 413 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,400 Speaker 1: He said, this is the Union dress, and he said 414 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:33,159 Speaker 1: it again in Maryland, and that is, let's put the 415 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:35,679 Speaker 1: Republican plan out there. He's gonna put his plan out 416 00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:38,439 Speaker 1: there in the next two weeks for the fiscal program 417 00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:42,400 Speaker 1: next year, next fiscal year. Let's negotiate then. Then then 418 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,480 Speaker 1: you have transparency and we can see exactly what the 419 00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 1: Joint Tax Committee says in the in the Congressional Budget 420 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:52,840 Speaker 1: Office as to who is responsible in reducing the debt 421 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 1: and how we're gonna go about doing it. So I 422 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:57,399 Speaker 1: think the facts are gonna be the facts, and and 423 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:00,800 Speaker 1: that will help the President get his message across. President 424 00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:03,399 Speaker 1: Biden has been very responsible. Look, it was the Trump 425 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:06,880 Speaker 1: years where we UH added so much to the deficit 426 00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:11,000 Speaker 1: of this country, and the primary culprit was tax got 427 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 1: to help wealthy Americans and large corporations. Your Finance Committee 428 00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:18,679 Speaker 1: in the Senate today held a confirmation hearing for the 429 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:22,640 Speaker 1: next likely I r S commissioner. I'm assuming that he 430 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 1: will get the job here, but there were a number 431 00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:29,679 Speaker 1: of questions about trust, about increased auditing, and of course 432 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:33,280 Speaker 1: the the now infamous fleet of eighty thousand armed I 433 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 1: r S agents that are going to be knocking on 434 00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:37,880 Speaker 1: your door. Of course that's been debunked, Senator, But what's 435 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,880 Speaker 1: going to happen to this agency that's in such bad 436 00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 1: need of funding. Well, uh, this agency used to be 437 00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:49,680 Speaker 1: that we have bipartisans supporting the state of Finance Committee, 438 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 1: particularly to make sure the I r S had the 439 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,600 Speaker 1: resources they needed to collect our taxes in a fair manner, 440 00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 1: to provide customer service, so that people can get clear 441 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,199 Speaker 1: direction from the I r S as to how to 442 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:07,720 Speaker 1: comply with their tax liabilits, and that we had audited procedures, 443 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: may or everybody was paying their fair taxes. That used 444 00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:13,320 Speaker 1: to be a high person commitment by the Senate Finance 445 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 1: Committee because it's our jurisdiction the Internal renew Service. But 446 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,399 Speaker 1: unfortunately those days seem to be over because now the 447 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,440 Speaker 1: bill that we passed try to catch up and give 448 00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:28,040 Speaker 1: them the resources they need to modernize to update their computers, 449 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:32,119 Speaker 1: to update their their customer service, as well as to 450 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:35,640 Speaker 1: have auditors necessary to make sure people are paying their taxes. 451 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:39,800 Speaker 1: So it was disappointing to see the commitment appeared to 452 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:43,040 Speaker 1: be only on one um from one party to get 453 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:44,840 Speaker 1: the i r S tools they need to carry out 454 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:48,679 Speaker 1: their mission. And by the way, if the Republicans are 455 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 1: successful and cutting the additional resources that we made available 456 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:55,960 Speaker 1: to the i r S, the Congress Budget Office indicates 457 00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:59,080 Speaker 1: that's going to cost um and add to the deficit 458 00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:02,000 Speaker 1: of our country because we won't collect as much revenues. 459 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:05,160 Speaker 1: If we we we actually collect a lot more revenues 460 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 1: than the extra money we're making available. Would you support 461 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,640 Speaker 1: legislation though that that put a stop on an increase 462 00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:15,720 Speaker 1: in audits for people making less than a certain amount individuals. No, 463 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:18,240 Speaker 1: I wouldn't I think everybody has paid their fair taxes, 464 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,960 Speaker 1: and I want to see the concentration on the where 465 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:26,720 Speaker 1: um people have the resources to try to get interpretation 466 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: of our rules more favorable to them. So it's higher 467 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:33,920 Speaker 1: income taxpayers that where the greatest return would be with audits. 468 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:35,720 Speaker 1: But I think everyone has to pay their fair scare 469 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:38,480 Speaker 1: and then there's need audit someone under for under thousand 470 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:41,359 Speaker 1: that should be able to audit those individuals. Lastly, Senator 471 00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 1: Ben Cardon, it's been suggested that speech we heard today 472 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:46,960 Speaker 1: the State of the Union last week sort of trial 473 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:49,200 Speaker 1: runs for what will be a campaign announcement. Do you 474 00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 1: want to see Joe Biden run for re election? Well, 475 00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,679 Speaker 1: I think he's had a great two years in office. 476 00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:58,160 Speaker 1: I'm very supportive of his policies, and uh, he should 477 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: decide to run for re election, will have a he 478 00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:04,120 Speaker 1: will have your support. He didn't tell you anything today 479 00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 1: backstage right. He didn't give you any whisper on that. No, 480 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:09,359 Speaker 1: he did not, a matter of fact, we had a 481 00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 1: great conversation that we do what is doing about Chrew Biden. Uh, 482 00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:17,200 Speaker 1: he takes his time and talk to people, really gets 483 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,360 Speaker 1: engaged and one of the things I think a lot 484 00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:21,760 Speaker 1: of us like about him that he's certainly listening to 485 00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:24,399 Speaker 1: other people. Thanks for coming on and talk to us again, 486 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 1: Ben Carton, the Senator from Maryland, Democrat from Maryland. And 487 00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:32,400 Speaker 1: a special tip of the hat to our listeners on 488 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 1: one here in the Washington region. You're listening to the 489 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:40,399 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us live week days at 490 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 1: five Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the r Herd Radio app, 491 00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:46,560 Speaker 1: and the Bloomberg Business Happen. We're listening on demand wherever 492 00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:50,399 Speaker 1: you get your podcast. So at least now we have 493 00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:54,199 Speaker 1: a date a date on a possible defaults as we 494 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:57,920 Speaker 1: were discussing with Senator Ben Carton. The CBO today out 495 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,080 Speaker 1: with news on when it will happen. The but a 496 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,720 Speaker 1: deficit for three now seen four hundred twenty six billion 497 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:08,440 Speaker 1: dollars worse than projected last May. Debt held by the 498 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 1: public seen climbing to forty six trillion by three, amounting 499 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:18,119 Speaker 1: to one percent of GDP that would be the highest 500 00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:23,360 Speaker 1: in US history. Philip Swiggle again, the CBO director, speaking 501 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:28,920 Speaker 1: with reporters today on what he calls an unsustainable fiscal trajectory. 502 00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:32,200 Speaker 1: So what happens if we hit the ceiling dead woman 503 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: is not raised or suspended before the extraordinary measures are 504 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,359 Speaker 1: measures are exhausted, the government would be unable to pay 505 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,800 Speaker 1: its obligations fully. As a result, the US government would 506 00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:44,879 Speaker 1: have to delay making payments for some activities, default on 507 00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:48,280 Speaker 1: its dead obligations, or both. And so we again queue 508 00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,840 Speaker 1: up the doomsday clock, because that, of course, is what's 509 00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:55,560 Speaker 1: going to get something going here. Right. You need a deadline, 510 00:27:55,800 --> 00:28:05,160 Speaker 1: You need to know weapons minutes coordinated universal time. There 511 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 1: it is. We need to make a deal, and Rick 512 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,080 Speaker 1: and Jr. With us to find the path here to freedom. 513 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:17,600 Speaker 1: Of course, Bloomberg Politics contributors. As the doomsday clock looms, now, 514 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:19,920 Speaker 1: we're not going to make it through summer, Rick Davis 515 00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:23,399 Speaker 1: without fixing this. We actually now realize we only have 516 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,399 Speaker 1: a few months to get a deal together. Here are 517 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:28,040 Speaker 1: they gonna push it to the last minute? Is that 518 00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:29,760 Speaker 1: the way it has to happen? Well? I may be 519 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:33,359 Speaker 1: just a hardened cynic, but it is noted that the 520 00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 1: new deadline is forecast to be July, right before the 521 00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:40,200 Speaker 1: August recess. And so it just seems to me this 522 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:42,200 Speaker 1: play is playing out to be like, oh, our backs 523 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 1: are up against the wall. Hal you know, everybody wants 524 00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:47,239 Speaker 1: to go home for August recess and uh, and now 525 00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:49,520 Speaker 1: let's get a deal cut. Um. Look, there's gonna be 526 00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:51,200 Speaker 1: a deal cut. And I and I don't think it 527 00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:53,880 Speaker 1: actually helps our country's positioning. Everyone worries about like, oh, 528 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 1: what's gonna happen to us if it faults. It's not 529 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,720 Speaker 1: gonna default. There's a higher likely chance that the Social 530 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:03,160 Speaker 1: Purity and Medicare defaults before the end of the decade 531 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: than this happening. Uh. And so I think all these 532 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:09,400 Speaker 1: you know, theatrics around it aren't actually helping get a 533 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 1: deal done. What will help you get a deal done 534 00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:14,720 Speaker 1: is for the President to invite you know, Mitch McConnell, 535 00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:18,080 Speaker 1: the majority leader in the Senate, uh and and the 536 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:20,520 Speaker 1: in the leadership in the House, over to the White 537 00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 1: House and just frame it out. Uh. He started well 538 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,400 Speaker 1: with with McCarthy by having that one on one uh 539 00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:30,040 Speaker 1: and and it hasn't been followed up on and now 540 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 1: everyone's like pointing fingers. There's a real problem with Social 541 00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:37,080 Speaker 1: Security and Medicare. And it's unfortunate that all this talk 542 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,120 Speaker 1: about the budget is actually going to be counter productive 543 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 1: to getting anything positive done so that they don't default. 544 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:45,840 Speaker 1: And I think that's a really bigger problem than than 545 00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:49,120 Speaker 1: the dead liment g D. Cbo says between July and September. 546 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:53,000 Speaker 1: Rick points out a very important point in that timeline 547 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,480 Speaker 1: here recessed in August, So we got to get this 548 00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,240 Speaker 1: thing done basically by the fourth of July. Right, what's 549 00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:00,400 Speaker 1: the next move for President by Do you fill the 550 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 1: Oval or wherever they're going to meet in the White House, 551 00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:07,160 Speaker 1: you fill the Roosevelt Room with all of the leaders, 552 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 1: or does he really need to work this out with 553 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,280 Speaker 1: a guy named Kevin. He needs to work this out 554 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:15,320 Speaker 1: with Kevin McCarthy. And the real question is not whether 555 00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:19,000 Speaker 1: President Biden and McCarthy can get together, but whether Kevin 556 00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:23,280 Speaker 1: McCarthy can hold his caucus together. And that has always 557 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:26,600 Speaker 1: been the issue. You know. I hope that we don't 558 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,480 Speaker 1: default on the debt, and I hope that they are 559 00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:32,840 Speaker 1: able to address this, But we just need to look 560 00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 1: back a few weeks and remember that it had been 561 00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:39,760 Speaker 1: what a hundred years since the speaker vote went over 562 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:43,600 Speaker 1: one vote. This is the reality of the Republican led 563 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,440 Speaker 1: House today, and so Kevin McCarthy needs to keep his 564 00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:50,880 Speaker 1: what he's now calling presumably his five families and the 565 00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 1: caucus together and that is a big task. I note 566 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: that the President did not call out Mitch McConnell or 567 00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,120 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy in the State of the Union. He's been 568 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:03,280 Speaker 1: sending signals of cooperation there, but he has been calling 569 00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:05,800 Speaker 1: out those back ventures and that's going to be Kevin 570 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:09,440 Speaker 1: McCarthy's real challenge. And of course Mitch McConnell has taken 571 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:11,960 Speaker 1: a very different tactic in the Senate. But this is 572 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,520 Speaker 1: all about the House at this point. Chuck Schumer today 573 00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,680 Speaker 1: Rick talking about budget cuts and a bill that's being 574 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,840 Speaker 1: forwarded by Democrats of belief. Senator stabbing out put this out, 575 00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:26,800 Speaker 1: UH to sort of catalog the cuts, to quantify the cuts. Now, remember, 576 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:29,560 Speaker 1: Chuck Schumer has been saying, show us your plan, and 577 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:31,360 Speaker 1: we really don't know what the plan is. We don't 578 00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 1: know what exactly what level of cuts to each agency 579 00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:38,240 Speaker 1: that Kevin McCarthy or his caucus are looking for. But 580 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:41,240 Speaker 1: but Chuck Schumer held a briefing today and he had numbers. Listen, 581 00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:46,640 Speaker 1: twenty one thousand law enforcement officers would be eliminated nationwide, 582 00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:52,360 Speaker 1: hurting hurting American security, reading awful lists, one million babies, 583 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 1: access to formula babies would would would be denied because 584 00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 1: of the cuts of w T of of where benefits 585 00:32:01,640 --> 00:32:04,880 Speaker 1: one million babies not getting their formula. This is not 586 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 1: some abstract exercise. This is real pain. Well, it would 587 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:12,760 Speaker 1: slash five eight two million dollars from opioid epidemic funding. 588 00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:14,840 Speaker 1: I don't know, Rick, these are compelling numbers, but but 589 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:17,560 Speaker 1: are they actually part of an abstract exercise where they 590 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 1: coming from? Yeah, I don't know where his numbers are 591 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,520 Speaker 1: coming from. I haven't seen a Republican plan, so there 592 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:24,760 Speaker 1: isn't one, So I don't know how he decides this. 593 00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,240 Speaker 1: And again it's just hyperventilating around this issue. Where's the 594 00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:30,960 Speaker 1: Schumer plan? Right? I mean, like Mitch McConnell solved this 595 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 1: problem from his perch in a in a divided White 596 00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:36,960 Speaker 1: House UH in two thousand eleven and walked across the 597 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:40,480 Speaker 1: aisle and cut the deal. Uh. Is Schumer any less 598 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,200 Speaker 1: accountable to getting a plan on the table in the 599 00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,480 Speaker 1: Senate than McCarthy is in the House of Representatives. I 600 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,560 Speaker 1: don't get it, McCarthy. You know he's he's gonna get 601 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:53,720 Speaker 1: what he's gonna get. You've got literally almost of the 602 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:56,360 Speaker 1: House of Representatives are going to be Democrats will vote 603 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:59,240 Speaker 1: in lockstep with a fix to the to the budget. 604 00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:01,800 Speaker 1: So you know, all you're gonna need is, you know, 605 00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:05,920 Speaker 1: some filler. You know, ten republicans walking across, we'll get 606 00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:08,840 Speaker 1: this debt limit fixed. Why is that such hard math? 607 00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:13,880 Speaker 1: And so, um, this is such an easy exercise that's 608 00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:17,080 Speaker 1: actually going to fall out this way because twenty Republicans 609 00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 1: will walk the plank and never be willing to vote 610 00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:21,480 Speaker 1: for this, And and then you've got a whole pool 611 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:23,920 Speaker 1: of another two hundred that will say, yeah, I can 612 00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 1: find twenty on that. There's a lot of It's really 613 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:28,160 Speaker 1: not hard math to figure this out. There's a lot 614 00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,480 Speaker 1: of messaging going on here, Jennie, and it's sometimes hard 615 00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:33,360 Speaker 1: to figure out what is real. Republicans have been taking 616 00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:36,200 Speaker 1: a lot of criticism for messaging things like the I R. 617 00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:40,080 Speaker 1: S Bill or denouncing socialism or whatever else. But Chuck 618 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 1: Schumer's doing some messaging of his own here. Where where 619 00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 1: is this coming from? And is a good politics? Yeah? 620 00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:47,400 Speaker 1: I mean we don't know where it's coming from. And 621 00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:50,560 Speaker 1: so Chuck Schumer has to speak to that. Um. Chuck 622 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,640 Speaker 1: Schumer will likely go along in many respects with what 623 00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:55,880 Speaker 1: the White House puts out in terms of their budget, 624 00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,760 Speaker 1: which we assume is coming out around March nine, so 625 00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:00,920 Speaker 1: we will see that, and we got a preview of 626 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,640 Speaker 1: what that White House is saying about that today. They're saying, 627 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 1: no new taxes over four thousand, protect social security, medicare 628 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:09,759 Speaker 1: not you know, cut the deficit. And also you know 629 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:12,399 Speaker 1: they're not going to hit defense spending. You can't say 630 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:14,840 Speaker 1: the same on the Republican side, where they are having 631 00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 1: real serious debates about spending and even about the defense issue. 632 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,719 Speaker 1: You've got Republicans in the Senate hitting back on Republicans 633 00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,000 Speaker 1: in the House saying, not so fast. You want to 634 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:30,200 Speaker 1: take defense back too levels, you can't do it. So 635 00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:32,880 Speaker 1: there are real debates to be had on that side 636 00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:35,600 Speaker 1: of the aisle. But you're right, the Democrats have taken 637 00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:38,600 Speaker 1: this Jerry McGuire app so us the show us the plan, 638 00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 1: Show us the plan, and that's what we're going to 639 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:43,680 Speaker 1: hear from and this messaging for a long time to 640 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,320 Speaker 1: come until it gets down to the wire and McCarthy 641 00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:48,120 Speaker 1: has got to come up with a plan. Well we 642 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:50,759 Speaker 1: could use a Jerry McGuire mission statement. Here is the point. Look, 643 00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:53,840 Speaker 1: check your mailboxes tomorrow morning. Rick is his defense spending 644 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:55,759 Speaker 1: it will be taken off the table or will that 645 00:34:55,800 --> 00:34:58,319 Speaker 1: be another form of messaging by by taking out so 646 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,560 Speaker 1: called waste in pentagonst ending. Yeah, look, there's always waste 647 00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:03,520 Speaker 1: in pentagon spending, and that's a good thing to try 648 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,879 Speaker 1: and figure out. Unfortunately, the Congress is the last place 649 00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:09,279 Speaker 1: to actually be good at finding waste. There there is 650 00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:17,359 Speaker 1: wasting the budget. You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. 651 00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:21,200 Speaker 1: Catch us Live weekdays at five Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, 652 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:23,759 Speaker 1: the r Heart Radio app, and the Bloomberg Business app 653 00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,640 Speaker 1: for listening on demand wherever you get your podcast. So 654 00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:33,239 Speaker 1: she made an official today, Nicky Haley for a Strong America, 655 00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 1: for a proud America. I am running for president of 656 00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:41,319 Speaker 1: all right, and there it is. We talked about it 657 00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:45,120 Speaker 1: at this time yesterday. Nicki Haley, former governor of South Carolina, 658 00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:50,799 Speaker 1: which she calls the Beast of the Southeast, former ambassador 659 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:54,040 Speaker 1: to the U N and the Trump administration, the second 660 00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:58,319 Speaker 1: official candidate to run for the Republican nomination. Yeah, she's 661 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:02,160 Speaker 1: running against Donald Trump. And she actually had an opening 662 00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:06,320 Speaker 1: act today that had endorsed Donald Trump in the last election. 663 00:36:06,320 --> 00:36:07,879 Speaker 1: I've got to give a shout out to the people 664 00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:11,960 Speaker 1: who took the podium before me. Um to Pastor Hagee, 665 00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:14,120 Speaker 1: I still say I want to be you when I 666 00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:16,640 Speaker 1: grow up. I want to be when I grow up, 667 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:21,120 Speaker 1: she says about the controversial pastor named John Hagey. Does 668 00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:23,680 Speaker 1: this name ring a bell? He endorsed Donald Trump last time. 669 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:27,239 Speaker 1: He also endorsed Senator John McCain in two thousand and eight, 670 00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:32,440 Speaker 1: but John McCain publicly renounced that endorsement after some of 671 00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:36,600 Speaker 1: his previous comments came to light. He referred to the 672 00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:41,840 Speaker 1: pope as the Antichrist. He said that Hurricane Katrina was 673 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:45,080 Speaker 1: an act of God to prevent a gay Pride parade, 674 00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:48,759 Speaker 1: said Adolf Hitler was half Jewish, sent by God to 675 00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:53,080 Speaker 1: drive Jews to Israel, and he's not a fan of 676 00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:56,120 Speaker 1: rock and roll. That parents explained to me, Well, I 677 00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:58,880 Speaker 1: let my teenager listen to rock music because that's all 678 00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,280 Speaker 1: here to listen to. Gonna tell you so, the lyrics 679 00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:06,240 Speaker 1: to real rock music is nothing more than satanic cyanide. 680 00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:09,319 Speaker 1: Get it out of your house, throw it out, and 681 00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:12,239 Speaker 1: burn it. It has no place in the house of 682 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:16,480 Speaker 1: the Righteous, the rock and rule. As we hear final 683 00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:19,120 Speaker 1: thoughts from our panel, Rick, I've got to turn to 684 00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:22,680 Speaker 1: you on this because, well, you've dealt with the pastor before. 685 00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:25,680 Speaker 1: Does this mean he's given up on Trump? Or does 686 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:29,080 Speaker 1: this mean that Nicky Haley is a lot more maga 687 00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 1: than we thought. I would even call it maga. I 688 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:35,120 Speaker 1: mean I had to do what I would call it 689 00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:38,560 Speaker 1: paggy pastor Hagy is a throwback. I mean, you know, 690 00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:40,960 Speaker 1: in two thousand and eight we had to disavow this guy, 691 00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:43,600 Speaker 1: and he's only gotten more since then. Um. And I 692 00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:46,600 Speaker 1: would think some knowledge of political history would indicate to 693 00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:51,839 Speaker 1: the the folks running uh, Nicky Haley's campaign, you don't 694 00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:55,560 Speaker 1: actually have the guy open up for you at an event. Um. 695 00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:59,360 Speaker 1: So I would say this was one of the stumbles 696 00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 1: um in an otherwise pretty good roll out. You know, 697 00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:05,440 Speaker 1: I think the setup was good. I think the speech 698 00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:07,759 Speaker 1: was good. I think you know, she she did a 699 00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 1: she did a you know, good job of creating expectations 700 00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:13,400 Speaker 1: with the video, so like I would have actually, you know, 701 00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:16,520 Speaker 1: without Hagey and and I would say one other um, 702 00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:20,759 Speaker 1: Ralph Norman. Right in her speech she talks about the 703 00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:24,800 Speaker 1: electionton hires, you know, obviously talking about Trump. But Ralph 704 00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:26,799 Speaker 1: Norman was an election, and he was part of the 705 00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:30,279 Speaker 1: warm up act, so booking, what do you think about 706 00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:35,600 Speaker 1: this genius? She gonna have to renounce Pastor Hagy. She should. 707 00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:38,279 Speaker 1: I mean, you know what was stunning. If this was 708 00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:41,279 Speaker 1: an error on the part of the campaign, it is 709 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:44,080 Speaker 1: an enormous one and not a good sign. She had 710 00:38:44,120 --> 00:38:47,200 Speaker 1: a pretty good day today except for this. And this 711 00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:49,080 Speaker 1: is somebody who stands on the stage and so she 712 00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,719 Speaker 1: wants to be him when she grows up. This is 713 00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:53,799 Speaker 1: of somebody who said women are only meant to be 714 00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:57,080 Speaker 1: mothers and bare children. And there she is pushing a 715 00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:00,440 Speaker 1: her campaign forward, talking about women running in high heels 716 00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:03,560 Speaker 1: and may the best woman win. You know, God bless her, 717 00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:06,360 Speaker 1: but this is not the person to make this pitch 718 00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:11,960 Speaker 1: for you. With apologies to the Reverend shaw Moore from 719 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,879 Speaker 1: the movie Footloose, I thought maybe they were. Lord wasn't 720 00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:18,239 Speaker 1: testing us? How would you account for the perliferation these days, 721 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:24,920 Speaker 1: yes scene rock and roll music with its gospel of 722 00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:31,040 Speaker 1: easy sexuality. With apologies as well to our panel, Rick 723 00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:32,600 Speaker 1: and Genie will meet you back here tomorrow on the 724 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:36,960 Speaker 1: fastest hour in politics. As the Reverend shaw Moore plays 725 00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:38,799 Speaker 1: us out, I'll meet you back here tomorrow, this