WEBVTT - We Are All Scientists 0:00:03.840 --> 0:00:06.720 Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff 0:00:06.720 --> 0:00:13.840 Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 0:00:13.880 --> 0:00:16.360 My name is Robert Lamb and my name is Trulie Douglas. 0:00:16.480 --> 0:00:19.200 We just finished recording an episode titled how to Think 0:00:19.239 --> 0:00:22.440 Like a Child, and now we're breaking into this idea 0:00:22.480 --> 0:00:24.480 that we are all scientists. And you're probably wondering, why 0:00:24.480 --> 0:00:27.040 aren't you guys hitting this information right now? Um, And 0:00:27.040 --> 0:00:29.040 certainly we've touched on some of these topics before in 0:00:29.080 --> 0:00:30.920 the past, and it's because we're hitting the road with 0:00:30.960 --> 0:00:34.919 this act. Uh. One week from now the time we're 0:00:34.960 --> 0:00:37.080 recording it, we're gonna be at the E four conference 0:00:37.360 --> 0:00:41.879 Excellence in Elementary Engineering in the Twin Cities, and we're 0:00:41.920 --> 0:00:43.760 gonna give a keynote when we're gonna talk about this 0:00:43.840 --> 0:00:46.680 idea that we are all scientists, because we're gonna be 0:00:46.720 --> 0:00:49.479 talking to elementary school teachers who are who want to 0:00:49.479 --> 0:00:52.520 engage with children and and get them excited about science 0:00:52.560 --> 0:00:56.240 and engineering, and there's often this false idea that it's 0:00:56.280 --> 0:00:59.040 something alien to them, where it's kind of like, let's 0:00:59.120 --> 0:01:02.040 let's give some children into a room and let's teach 0:01:02.080 --> 0:01:04.720 them to love sardines and broccoli. You know, let's let's 0:01:04.720 --> 0:01:08.199 get them excited about asparagus. But no, it's it's it's 0:01:08.240 --> 0:01:11.000 something that they already have in them, and it's it's 0:01:11.000 --> 0:01:14.040 it's ultimately more about about connecting with the inner scientists 0:01:14.040 --> 0:01:16.240 that is in all of us. Right, we're gonna make 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:19.040 the case today that science is not a part of us, 0:01:19.080 --> 0:01:22.440 it is actually intrinsic to our nature. And I will 0:01:22.480 --> 0:01:27.000 say that having worked on this podcast, I feel like, uh, 0:01:27.040 --> 0:01:30.520 it's very interesting to look at science as something that 0:01:30.720 --> 0:01:34.080 is innate rather than, as I've mentioned before, looking through 0:01:34.080 --> 0:01:37.240 the windows of science, because I feel like this podcast 0:01:37.280 --> 0:01:41.639 has really informed my worldview on how it's not apart 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:45.360 from us, how every gesture, word, thought can be pinned 0:01:45.360 --> 0:01:47.600 back to what you know. We've often talked about the 0:01:47.640 --> 0:01:50.920 magic of reality, and when I say the magic of reality, 0:01:51.040 --> 0:01:54.559 it's this idea that a single celled organism created an 0:01:54.640 --> 0:02:00.480 unbroken lineage extending fourth and time four billion years until 0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:04.000 we are sitting here before you guys, recording our voices. 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:07.920 To me. That is amazing and it all points back 0:02:07.960 --> 0:02:11.639 to the fact that science has helped frame our understanding 0:02:11.840 --> 0:02:14.440 of how we came to be in this world. Um, 0:02:14.480 --> 0:02:16.680 as well as why things are the way that they are. So, 0:02:16.680 --> 0:02:18.880 as we discussed in the previous podcast about being like 0:02:18.919 --> 0:02:20.799 a child, one of the big things here is that 0:02:21.320 --> 0:02:23.200 as as we get older and as we become adults, 0:02:23.480 --> 0:02:25.600 we take on all these different world views. We take 0:02:25.600 --> 0:02:27.799 on all these preconceived notions of how what the world 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:30.079 is and how it works, about who we are, how 0:02:30.080 --> 0:02:32.440 do we fit into the world, What is our group, 0:02:32.520 --> 0:02:35.440 what is our society? Who are the others? What laws 0:02:35.440 --> 0:02:38.240 are in place that we're obeying, What laws are in 0:02:38.240 --> 0:02:40.760 place that we are neglecting, What laws are in place 0:02:40.800 --> 0:02:43.720 that the other guys and gals out there should be obeying, 0:02:43.800 --> 0:02:47.920 but are not. All these complex, illusory ideas. We end 0:02:47.960 --> 0:02:51.240 up building this this fortress of ideas through which we 0:02:51.280 --> 0:02:53.480 try to understand the world around us. And we use 0:02:53.520 --> 0:02:56.160 a lot of labels, right like you begin to understand 0:02:56.160 --> 0:02:59.200 yourself as you're growing up, right and you people say 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:01.880 that you're good at X, Y or z, and then 0:03:02.080 --> 0:03:04.680 it's a liberal, you're a conservative, You're you're in the model, 0:03:04.800 --> 0:03:08.520 You're you're creative or number minded, you're you're very sensible. 0:03:09.280 --> 0:03:11.959 You know. We end up taking on all these labels, 0:03:11.960 --> 0:03:14.800 pinning them to our jacket and and that's who we 0:03:14.880 --> 0:03:17.880 are and that's what the world is now. But I 0:03:17.919 --> 0:03:21.440 would argue that in addition to what other label or 0:03:21.639 --> 0:03:24.560 the many labels that we can put on ourselves, we 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:29.520 are all inherently engineers. Right. Okay, Now, think you're probably 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:31.000 like kind of know what you're talking about. I don't 0:03:31.160 --> 0:03:34.520 use blueprints, or maybe I do use blueprints, but I 0:03:34.520 --> 0:03:38.400 don't build things times. Yeah, but now think about your 0:03:38.480 --> 0:03:42.280 childhood and think about treehouses or building something. You don't 0:03:42.280 --> 0:03:45.320 have to build a treehouse, It could be at all 0:03:45.320 --> 0:03:47.640 the things that if you're a lego person like I was, 0:03:48.160 --> 0:03:50.839 and I am not an engineer, I have to check 0:03:50.880 --> 0:03:53.520 things two or three times when I do simple calculations 0:03:53.640 --> 0:03:56.080 with a Google calculator. You know, I'm that type of person. 0:03:56.080 --> 0:03:59.000 I'm more of a liberal arts person. But as a child, 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:01.720 I had the out of legos and had build everything 0:04:01.760 --> 0:04:04.040 under the sun. You know, I'd see a helicopter, I'd 0:04:04.080 --> 0:04:06.000 have to build that helicopter. Then I have to crash 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:08.760 the helicopter because we shut down by another one. That 0:04:08.920 --> 0:04:10.960 was the evil helicopter. But then I would build another one, 0:04:10.960 --> 0:04:12.240 and then it would be maybe I'd build build a 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:14.640 building or a tank. I mean so even as as 0:04:14.680 --> 0:04:16.640 a child playing with blocks, or even if we're not 0:04:16.680 --> 0:04:20.479 playing with actual physical blocks, we're building things. We're building stories, 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:25.320 we're building ideas, we're engineering something. When we're engaging in play, well, 0:04:25.360 --> 0:04:28.400 you're also learning how the world works, how gravity works, right, 0:04:28.440 --> 0:04:30.600 and if you don't stack those blocks in a way 0:04:30.640 --> 0:04:33.520 that can support weight, then whatever you're creating is going 0:04:33.600 --> 0:04:37.520 to fall or just not work out. So every kid 0:04:37.520 --> 0:04:40.400 wants to build a giant tower, but you quickly learned 0:04:40.440 --> 0:04:42.040 that you've got to You've got to figure out how 0:04:42.080 --> 0:04:43.760 the base is gonna work. You gotta build a broader 0:04:43.800 --> 0:04:45.480 base to make the tower go up all the way. 0:04:45.640 --> 0:04:47.800 Otherwise it's just gonna be blocks falling over and making 0:04:47.800 --> 0:04:49.480 a loud no. Yeah, I see that. I've seen this 0:04:49.560 --> 0:04:52.719 so many times with kids, and kids can, by the way, 0:04:53.279 --> 0:04:55.920 with legos, and I know everybody knows this, but really 0:04:56.040 --> 0:04:58.680 they can create some of the most uh some of 0:04:58.720 --> 0:05:01.800 the coolest, most innovative buildings I've ever seen, because they 0:05:01.839 --> 0:05:04.200 will take these risks and put things where they're not 0:05:04.200 --> 0:05:06.320 really supposed to go. But then again they figure out 0:05:07.080 --> 0:05:10.320 how things are weighted. So again we don't think about it, 0:05:10.360 --> 0:05:13.320 but this is really the mind of an engineer at play. 0:05:13.400 --> 0:05:16.720 And by the way, kids are also born Euclideans. So 0:05:16.760 --> 0:05:18.839 when I say kids are this, that also means that 0:05:18.920 --> 0:05:21.920 we are Euclideans. And when I say Euclideans, I mean 0:05:22.040 --> 0:05:25.920 that we use geometric clues to navigate the world. Because 0:05:25.960 --> 0:05:28.720 you have bottom line, we are born into a world 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:32.719 of numerous fixed and movable objects. We live in a 0:05:32.800 --> 0:05:35.640 in a world of space and time. As a creature, 0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:38.040 you know, if you're a human and you're listening to this, 0:05:38.040 --> 0:05:39.880 this applies to you. If you're if you're a cat 0:05:39.920 --> 0:05:42.120 and you're listening to this, or a dog, this applies 0:05:42.160 --> 0:05:45.920 to you though in kudos for understanding the English language podcast. 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:48.800 But you have to engage in this world that is physical, 0:05:48.880 --> 0:05:51.880 that has space, that has time, that has physical laws 0:05:53.200 --> 0:05:57.400 governing what goes on. So part of our our evolutionary 0:05:57.440 --> 0:06:00.520 advantage is our ability to understand in that world to 0:06:00.600 --> 0:06:02.960 interact with and to do that we have to have 0:06:03.000 --> 0:06:05.680 a certain amount of numbers, since a certain understanding of 0:06:05.680 --> 0:06:09.080 how physics work more or less inborn. We've discussed in 0:06:09.080 --> 0:06:13.000 the past their concepts such as say teleportation, you try 0:06:13.040 --> 0:06:16.240 and you try and sell a kid on the idea 0:06:16.320 --> 0:06:19.280 that teleportation exists. They're not gonna believe it because they 0:06:19.320 --> 0:06:22.240 already have it in them in their selves. They're inborn 0:06:22.800 --> 0:06:24.880 this disbelief in the in the idea that could even 0:06:24.920 --> 0:06:28.400 be possible, because it doesn't conform to reality. To believe 0:06:28.400 --> 0:06:31.680 in something like that, you have to painstakingly build this 0:06:31.760 --> 0:06:35.320 fortress of ideas and beliefs as an adult, and then 0:06:35.400 --> 0:06:39.200 you can make the impossible seem plausible. Right, Because even 0:06:39.240 --> 0:06:42.320 little babies know about object permanence, meaning that I could 0:06:42.360 --> 0:06:45.000 have two cups. In one cup, I could deposit two 0:06:45.040 --> 0:06:48.240 cookies in another cup, I could pretend to be depositing cookies, 0:06:48.320 --> 0:06:51.400 same motions and everything. They will always want them one 0:06:51.480 --> 0:06:54.000 with the actual cookies in it. They understand that that 0:06:54.160 --> 0:06:59.440 is mimicking, that that is not object permanence. Uh. In addition, 0:06:59.720 --> 0:07:03.080 kids using geometric clues, they're more likely to use the 0:07:03.200 --> 0:07:06.200 length of walls in a room to remember where toys hidden. 0:07:06.240 --> 0:07:09.000 And this is true of kids even at ages three 0:07:09.040 --> 0:07:11.480 and four, when they can name the color of the 0:07:11.480 --> 0:07:15.960 wall um to orient themselves, they still navigate rooms by 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:19.680 length references. I also see this with my daughter at 0:07:19.680 --> 0:07:21.920 play with puzzles. You know. She she will be four 0:07:21.960 --> 0:07:27.560 in January, and she loves to put together puzzles using 0:07:27.880 --> 0:07:31.000 solely the shape. Now she can read and she can 0:07:31.120 --> 0:07:34.320 use the colors to try to piece together the clues 0:07:34.320 --> 0:07:36.760 of how they fit together. But always in this drives 0:07:36.800 --> 0:07:39.520 me crazy because to me, I'm oriented in the other 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:41.400 way where I'm like, hey, that says that that's part 0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:45.080 of the North Carolina for the for the map um 0:07:45.120 --> 0:07:47.520 she will always try to see how it fits together. 0:07:48.240 --> 0:07:51.320 And this is really interesting. Kids that play with puzzles 0:07:51.360 --> 0:07:55.600 between the ages of two inform perform significantly better and 0:07:55.680 --> 0:07:59.320 spatial tests by ages five and six. And again this 0:07:59.400 --> 0:08:03.080 is this idea that they can mentally transform shapes, and 0:08:03.400 --> 0:08:06.080 this turns out to be a really big predictor of 0:08:06.120 --> 0:08:12.040 abilities in science, technology, engineering, and mathematics. What we call stem. 0:08:12.080 --> 0:08:16.040 Another inborn ability that kids have that adults forget and 0:08:16.080 --> 0:08:19.680 then have to relearn is Bayesian logic. Beaesian logic is 0:08:19.680 --> 0:08:23.080 a branch of probability theory that allows one to model 0:08:23.200 --> 0:08:26.120 uncertainty about the world and outcomes of interest in that 0:08:26.160 --> 0:08:30.040 world related to common sense knowledge and observational evidence. So 0:08:30.240 --> 0:08:33.960 this is a concept that plays heavily into statistical evaluation 0:08:34.160 --> 0:08:37.120 of things such as ongoing elections, etcetera, any kind of 0:08:37.160 --> 0:08:38.719 situation where there's a there's a certain a group of 0:08:38.760 --> 0:08:42.040 chaos or unpredictability. It's also something that is key to 0:08:42.200 --> 0:08:46.679 our creation of aiyes of artificial intelligence, because we want 0:08:46.679 --> 0:08:50.160 to create something that thinks intelligently and can analyze the 0:08:50.200 --> 0:08:53.680 world and create believable recommendations on what's going to happen. 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:57.320 So we're using Baisian logic to create the machines will 0:08:57.320 --> 0:08:59.920 solve the problems of the future. But Baisian logic is 0:08:59.920 --> 0:09:03.040 already present in children. Experiments have shown that when a 0:09:03.120 --> 0:09:05.360 child looks at the world, they're able to weigh the 0:09:05.360 --> 0:09:08.240 observational data in the statistical data that they have observed 0:09:08.280 --> 0:09:10.920 in a way that is free of the conflicting judgments 0:09:11.080 --> 0:09:13.560 that adult humans bring to the table. Yeah, I mean 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:16.280 much like looking at a puzzle and seeing what fits 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:20.920 and what doesn't. Bayesian logic necessitates that children use a 0:09:20.960 --> 0:09:25.360 pattern of co variation. Co variation meaning correlated variation of 0:09:25.440 --> 0:09:28.800 two or more variables. And we talked about this blicket 0:09:28.800 --> 0:09:31.199 machine in the last podcast How to Think Like a Child, 0:09:31.520 --> 0:09:34.360 and this blicket machine is something that is lit up 0:09:34.480 --> 0:09:37.000 when you place an object on it. This object can 0:09:37.000 --> 0:09:41.160 be vary shape, sizes, colors, and kids will again use 0:09:41.240 --> 0:09:45.600 this co variation correlated variation of two or more variables 0:09:45.760 --> 0:09:49.560 to realize that if they do this, then this happens. 0:09:50.120 --> 0:09:53.640 If you do that, then that happens. Now, by the way, 0:09:53.960 --> 0:09:57.760 these objects aren't static, meaning that you know, it's not 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:01.440 just the red squares that make the machine go. You know, 0:10:01.520 --> 0:10:05.360 it could be the orange squares that have blue dots 0:10:05.400 --> 0:10:07.920 on them, or the triangle and so on and so forth. 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:10.240 So they are taking in a lot of data and 0:10:10.240 --> 0:10:13.280 trying to figure out, you know, like the three types 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:17.439 of shapes that are this color and this configuration stacked 0:10:17.480 --> 0:10:21.199 on top will make this machine go. That's actually pretty sophisticated. 0:10:21.440 --> 0:10:24.520 And as we mentioned last time in our podcast and 0:10:24.559 --> 0:10:26.959 how to Think Like a Child, kids are actually better 0:10:27.640 --> 0:10:30.880 in this exercise and figure out how certain toys work 0:10:30.960 --> 0:10:33.880 on the blicket machine. Then adults are, which brings us 0:10:33.880 --> 0:10:37.120 to mathematics. And this is a big one. As adults, 0:10:37.120 --> 0:10:39.560 so many of us, myself included, throw any kind of 0:10:39.559 --> 0:10:41.640 thing mathematical at us being and figuring out how to 0:10:41.640 --> 0:10:44.480 split a bill at a dinner party or trying to 0:10:44.480 --> 0:10:46.760 figure out I've got it down now, but for a 0:10:46.760 --> 0:10:48.960 while there, I didn't even understand how to properly figured 0:10:49.000 --> 0:10:53.240 tip before I figured out just generally that bad at math, 0:10:53.480 --> 0:10:55.560 and so we often fall into this idea that that 0:10:55.679 --> 0:10:57.880 we're born bad at math and then we just simply 0:10:57.920 --> 0:11:00.600 fail to learn it. And certainly there's a whole case 0:11:00.600 --> 0:11:03.080 to be made about what needs to be done to 0:11:03.080 --> 0:11:06.680 to engage children and the age students so more thoroughly 0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:09.840 in mathematics. I do want to mention too, that there 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:13.440 is no gender difference in abilities in science and math. 0:11:13.960 --> 0:11:16.680 And this has been something of subject that comes up 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:19.280 again and again. But if you want more information on it, 0:11:19.640 --> 0:11:24.240 check out Elizabeth Spelky spe l k E and her 0:11:24.320 --> 0:11:28.120 debate with Stephen Pinker on this point and the thirty 0:11:28.160 --> 0:11:31.080 odd years of research into child development in which she 0:11:31.120 --> 0:11:33.880 makes the case that this does not exist. This is 0:11:33.920 --> 0:11:36.520 some cultural garbage that we tend to heap on kids, 0:11:36.640 --> 0:11:38.800 because again, we all have to interact with the same world. 0:11:39.200 --> 0:11:42.080 We're all organisms that have all the equipment to interact 0:11:42.120 --> 0:11:44.559 with that world, and part of that is a number sense. Okay, 0:11:44.640 --> 0:11:48.920 so our brains naturally extract numbers from the surrounding environment 0:11:49.200 --> 0:11:51.559 in the same way that we identify colors. All right, 0:11:52.160 --> 0:11:54.360 we call it number cents, and our brains come fully 0:11:54.400 --> 0:11:56.560 equipped with it from birth. In fact, studies even show 0:11:56.600 --> 0:11:59.280 that while infants have no graphs of human number system, 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:01.760 you know, and it doesn't know what five is, doesn't 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:04.120 know what ten is, but they can tell the difference 0:12:04.120 --> 0:12:07.560 between five and ten on a on a non numerical 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:10.840 level because they can tell identify change in quantity. Show 0:12:10.840 --> 0:12:14.280 a kid five cookies and a kid ten cookies, and 0:12:14.360 --> 0:12:16.120 they will know the difference they have. There is an 0:12:16.120 --> 0:12:20.520 inborn math that governs that that kind of quantity differential. Yeah, 0:12:20.559 --> 0:12:23.520 they are essentially born accountants. And you will see this 0:12:23.679 --> 0:12:27.199 with babies who can estimate quantities and distinguish between more 0:12:27.240 --> 0:12:31.160 and less. For instance, and an experiment in which babies 0:12:31.200 --> 0:12:34.079 were shown an a ray of four dots and then 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:36.679 an a ray of twelve dots, it turns out that 0:12:36.679 --> 0:12:39.000 they will pay attention to the four dots sequence when 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:43.679 four sounds are played, okay, correlating that, and they will 0:12:43.720 --> 0:12:47.440 gaze at the twelve dots when the twelve sounds are played, 0:12:47.520 --> 0:12:50.280 even when the sounds are manipulated in terms of the 0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:55.120 note length. Kids still no babies still know that twelve 0:12:55.160 --> 0:12:58.120 noted song has to do with the twelve dots and 0:12:58.120 --> 0:13:00.680 that four noted song has to do with the four dot. Yeah, 0:13:00.720 --> 0:13:03.200 we can even drag in your own imaging research into it, 0:13:03.240 --> 0:13:04.880 and we found that when you when you look at 0:13:04.880 --> 0:13:07.240 an infant's brain, when they're say, looking at the five 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:12.400 cookie tin cookie difference, they're actually engaging in logarithmic counting, alright, 0:13:12.400 --> 0:13:16.720 counting based on integral increases in physical quantity. And this 0:13:16.800 --> 0:13:20.280 is so apparently this is something that we move away 0:13:20.320 --> 0:13:22.839 from as we get older, this logarithmic thinking, because we 0:13:22.960 --> 0:13:26.920 think in different modes of mathematics. But again, route to 0:13:27.040 --> 0:13:30.680 the baby, route to children is this logarithmic thinking. So 0:13:30.720 --> 0:13:34.080 we end up taking on human number systems. But the 0:13:34.080 --> 0:13:36.520 thing is, again, the human number systems are even this 0:13:36.600 --> 0:13:39.280 is not something that's coming from the outside. It's it's 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:41.720 something that's coming from within. At some point in our 0:13:41.760 --> 0:13:45.040 ancient past, prehistoric humans begin to develop a means of 0:13:45.080 --> 0:13:48.240 augmenting their natural number sense, all right, they started counting 0:13:48.240 --> 0:13:50.720 on their fingers and toes, and that's why so many 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:54.640 numerical systems depend on groups of five, ten, or twenty, 0:13:55.040 --> 0:13:57.840 So based ten or decimal system stem from the use 0:13:57.880 --> 0:14:01.800 of both hands, while base twenty or vegicial systems are 0:14:01.840 --> 0:14:04.400 based on the use of fingers and toes. Yeah, these 0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:08.440 vegicimal systems, I think are really interesting. Larger numbers are 0:14:08.480 --> 0:14:11.920 simply multiples of ten, right, because that would be a 0:14:11.960 --> 0:14:15.800 base of ten system. For example, ten tens make and 0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:18.040 we're so used to our base ten system that it 0:14:18.080 --> 0:14:20.720 may seem like the only possibility. But the green Landic 0:14:20.800 --> 0:14:23.360 number system has a base of twenty and others have 0:14:23.400 --> 0:14:26.520 a base of five, and of all the number systems 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.400 ever invented, five, ten, and twenty are the most common. 0:14:29.680 --> 0:14:33.200 So again, if you doubt that mathematics is something that 0:14:33.320 --> 0:14:35.440 is inherent to you, all you have to do is 0:14:35.440 --> 0:14:38.720 split down at your fingers. In fact, in Greenland, the 0:14:38.760 --> 0:14:44.360 word for seven, which is pronounced our punick marluk translate 0:14:44.760 --> 0:14:48.760 or something like that, translates as second hand to okay, 0:14:48.760 --> 0:14:50.520 So you put one hand up and then two fingers 0:14:50.520 --> 0:14:53.359 from from the next hand, and then thirteen is translated 0:14:53.400 --> 0:14:57.000 as first foot three, meaning both of your hands plus 0:14:57.000 --> 0:15:03.160 your first foot three toes. So again our digits are fingers. 0:15:03.200 --> 0:15:06.120 Just even think about the terminology have been the gold 0:15:06.240 --> 0:15:10.360 standard for how we itemize the world around us. All right, 0:15:10.360 --> 0:15:12.360 we're gonna take a quick break on that note, and 0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:14.960 when we come back, we're gonna shift a little outside 0:15:14.960 --> 0:15:17.120 of the mathematical understanding the world and we're gonna get 0:15:17.120 --> 0:15:20.240 into a little something called storytelling, because, believe it or not, 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:28.040 storytelling is science before we move on to storyteller. So 0:15:28.080 --> 0:15:30.320 that's just reminded as you were talking in that sponsortive 0:15:30.360 --> 0:15:33.720 message about mathematics and certain truths that they hold, and 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:35.760 I was thinking about the Fibonacci numbers, which is that 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:39.360 sequence of numbers, the golden ratio that we see again 0:15:39.360 --> 0:15:41.600 and again in nature. Yeah, it's like in a snail shell, 0:15:41.640 --> 0:15:45.600 it's in some cauliflower. You see this mathematical truth making 0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:49.320 it self evident just throughout the world and then in 0:15:49.320 --> 0:15:52.160 the cosmos and on your body, right, because even the 0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:54.880 ratio between your hand, the length of your hand and 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:57.440 the length of your arm, and the length of your 0:15:57.520 --> 0:16:00.440 arms to the height of your body, or even the 0:16:00.480 --> 0:16:02.960 space between your eyes and your nose in your mouth, 0:16:03.000 --> 0:16:05.920 these are all predicated on the golden ratio. So again, 0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:10.880 inherent within the blueprint our numbers. Yeah, we haven't. A 0:16:10.920 --> 0:16:13.520 past episode we did about mathematics, we asked a question, 0:16:13.880 --> 0:16:17.320 is mathematics a human discovery or human invention? Where we 0:16:17.360 --> 0:16:20.920 really go into the philosophical deep end about this, because 0:16:20.920 --> 0:16:24.120 it's really fascinating question. Again, mathematics, as we've discussed, is 0:16:24.200 --> 0:16:27.320 something that comes from within. But is it something that 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:31.480 is purely a human creation based on what is inside us? 0:16:31.600 --> 0:16:35.360 Or is it something that really permeates every aspect of 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:38.920 the universe? Right? Is it the tail wagging the dog? Yeah, 0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:41.480 it's really really mind blowing stuff. But we're moving a 0:16:41.560 --> 0:16:44.440 little beyond mathematics at this point and we're getting into 0:16:44.480 --> 0:16:48.240 something called storytelling. Storytelling is of course, is old as 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:50.720 human language. The idea that we can set down and 0:16:50.760 --> 0:16:53.760 we can tell a narrative, that we can talk about 0:16:53.800 --> 0:16:55.920 this character and what they did. Are these people and 0:16:55.960 --> 0:16:58.280 what they did, what challenge they overcame, how they came 0:16:58.320 --> 0:17:02.120 from point A to point B, And we naturally engage 0:17:02.120 --> 0:17:04.720 in it because the stories are linear. They have beginnings, 0:17:04.720 --> 0:17:08.159 they have metals, and they have ends, much like our lives, 0:17:08.240 --> 0:17:11.680 much exactly like our lives and exactly like our our 0:17:11.720 --> 0:17:14.800 experience of the world around us, so we naturally engage 0:17:15.080 --> 0:17:18.840 with stories well, and within this, I think about the 0:17:18.920 --> 0:17:21.720 neo cortex as part of our brains that was locked 0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:24.960 on is pretty much an upgrade, uh to the human brain. 0:17:25.040 --> 0:17:29.400 Scream ice cream style, swirled up high. It changed everything 0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:33.320 because no longer did we have just our reptilian brain, 0:17:33.400 --> 0:17:36.800 which was really concerned or is concerned with basic survival 0:17:36.840 --> 0:17:40.479 instincts like fear. But with the neo cortex, you have 0:17:40.600 --> 0:17:45.320 something that can manage so many different sophisticated, complex elements 0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:49.240 of life of modern life, from parenting to higher cognitive 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:53.000 functions like number systems and the prietal loop which which 0:17:53.080 --> 0:17:57.879 governs these number systems, and abstraction. So when I think 0:17:57.920 --> 0:18:01.560 about number systems, I think about abstractions because really that's 0:18:01.560 --> 0:18:06.160 what they are. And uh, these obstractions are stories, and 0:18:06.200 --> 0:18:10.720 these stories really are data. We're taking data, we're organizing it, 0:18:10.840 --> 0:18:13.920 and we're making it into a pattern that makes sense 0:18:13.960 --> 0:18:17.960 to us that can help explain our world. So when 0:18:17.960 --> 0:18:20.320 you think about storytelling, you don't normally think about it 0:18:20.400 --> 0:18:23.439 is involving science, but really you're you're talking about some 0:18:23.480 --> 0:18:26.600 of the same basic principles at play. So again, storytelling 0:18:26.680 --> 0:18:28.560 us how we see the world. I mean, on a 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:31.040 very basic level. I've talked about this before, and this 0:18:31.080 --> 0:18:34.639 is where especially adults get in get into trouble. And no, 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:37.400 I mean even in an early age, you're you're engaging 0:18:37.400 --> 0:18:40.040 in your ego. You're creating a story about the world 0:18:40.080 --> 0:18:43.240 in which you are the central character. And uh, you know, 0:18:43.359 --> 0:18:46.639 so everyone's life unless you can you can force yourself 0:18:46.680 --> 0:18:49.480 to think beyond it. After a while, it becomes this 0:18:49.480 --> 0:18:54.000 this very limited novel with this one character engaging with 0:18:54.040 --> 0:18:58.680 other people with their surroundings, with various successes and disasters 0:18:58.720 --> 0:19:02.840 that that line the road to death and elegant and 0:19:02.880 --> 0:19:04.760 then an uplifting way of putting it. But I mean, 0:19:04.800 --> 0:19:06.119 that's what kind of what comes when you when you 0:19:06.200 --> 0:19:07.520 end up viewing the world that way. But we end 0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:11.160 up viewing the world that way. So telling other stories 0:19:12.359 --> 0:19:15.560 ends up being this interesting way of tweaking that worldview 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:18.600 um in a way that can be both good and bad. 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:21.320 There's a book called Tell the Wind, Connect, Persuade, and 0:19:21.320 --> 0:19:24.240 Triumph with the Hidden Power of Story by a film executive, 0:19:24.440 --> 0:19:28.080 Peter Goober, and he makes this argument that the stories 0:19:28.359 --> 0:19:31.359 function as trojan horses. All Right, we all know the 0:19:31.440 --> 0:19:33.879 idea of the trojan horse, right, So you have you 0:19:33.880 --> 0:19:37.159 have the city of Troy. The opposing army wants to 0:19:37.240 --> 0:19:39.679 get inside that besieged city. So how do you do it. 0:19:39.720 --> 0:19:43.679 You give him a gift, a fabulous wooden horse hitting away, 0:19:43.680 --> 0:19:47.000 and that horse's belly happens to be a small group 0:19:47.040 --> 0:19:50.560 of soldiers, and after after the lights go off, after 0:19:50.600 --> 0:19:52.399 the sun goes down, they're going to creep out of 0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:54.399 the belly of that horse, unlock the gates, and let 0:19:54.440 --> 0:19:58.040 the rest of the army in. So the idea here 0:19:58.119 --> 0:20:00.080 is that. And we've discussed this about the power of 0:20:00.119 --> 0:20:02.520 storytelling before. You know, when when you have a story 0:20:02.760 --> 0:20:05.639 that contains a different idea, a different way of seeing 0:20:05.680 --> 0:20:10.359 the world, it can kind of virally infect our worldview 0:20:10.680 --> 0:20:12.960 and we end up trusting an idea more if it's 0:20:13.040 --> 0:20:15.360 presented to us in the form of a story, which 0:20:15.400 --> 0:20:17.920 is why you see we've we've talked about the importance 0:20:17.920 --> 0:20:20.800 of sitcom's You're Just in popular history, um or or 0:20:20.960 --> 0:20:23.360 or novels as well. When you engage a new cultural 0:20:23.480 --> 0:20:26.119 idea in the form of a narrative, we're more likely 0:20:26.160 --> 0:20:28.239 to take it in to eat it than we are 0:20:28.280 --> 0:20:30.240 if someone says, hey, here's the way you should maybe 0:20:30.320 --> 0:20:32.040 view the world. Why don't you do this? And then 0:20:32.200 --> 0:20:34.320 people are gonna double down. They're gonna say, no, no, 0:20:34.400 --> 0:20:35.800 that's not the way I view the world at all. 0:20:35.880 --> 0:20:38.760 Presenting a story, however, that's the spoonful of sugar on 0:20:38.800 --> 0:20:41.240 the medicine. Yeah, but I would I would actually argue 0:20:41.280 --> 0:20:45.120 that every single scientific paper that's ever been published has 0:20:45.200 --> 0:20:49.240 a trojan horse of sorts in the narrative. In other words, 0:20:49.320 --> 0:20:53.160 something that happens that's a surprise that turns our assumptions 0:20:53.400 --> 0:20:55.439 on its head, right, because because you've got to have 0:20:55.520 --> 0:20:57.720 conflict and story for to be good. Nobody wants to 0:20:57.760 --> 0:20:59.760 read a story about, hey, there's this person they marry 0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:02.600 and everything happened the way it needed to happen. It was. 0:21:02.760 --> 0:21:05.000 You know, you need some sort of conflict where suddenly 0:21:05.000 --> 0:21:07.760