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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, This is Chuck and welcome to Uh. I

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Speaker 1: guess this is week three of s Y S Kate Selects,

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Speaker 1: where we give you one of our favorite or maybe

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Speaker 1: a timely episode from our vault that maybe you didn't hear.

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Speaker 1: And uh we're curating these individually, and this is my

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Speaker 1: pick lying Liars colon how lying works? Liar, I think

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Speaker 1: that was It sounds like a Josh title. It's a

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Speaker 1: great one. This is from June of twelve, and um,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I just remember this being a pretty

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Speaker 1: good episode and lying is um just a pretty interesting

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Speaker 1: concept to me. And so I wanted to make this

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Speaker 1: my selection this week and I hope you enjoy it.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works

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Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark.

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Speaker 1: There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant, Right, Yeah, take it, Chuck,

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Speaker 1: Josh that that shirt looks great on you today. I

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Speaker 1: just want to say that, Uh, I really like a

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Speaker 1: checked pattern. Well, I see what you're doing. Um, you're

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Speaker 1: blinking and you're scratching your face. It looks like you

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Speaker 1: have scabies like my friend Dirty Mitch. Yeah. Um, but

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Speaker 1: that doesn't indicate necessarily that you're lying. I'm glad you

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Speaker 1: said necessarily, because they didn't say that in this article,

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Speaker 1: and that was a very important omission. Now they did.

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Speaker 1: They didn't say necessarily, they meaning Tom, Tom didn't say necessarily.

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Speaker 1: I had to write it in because what we're talking

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Speaker 1: about are potential tells whether or not whether that you

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Speaker 1: can recognize a lie. And people often associate blinking, scratching

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Speaker 1: the face, covering the mouth as uh, surefire indicators. And

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Speaker 1: that's not necessarily the cases. No, it's not. And let's

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Speaker 1: just get that out right now. Um. It's because there

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Speaker 1: aren't any sure fire behaviors where you're like, oh, you're lying,

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Speaker 1: Like the one I always heard was touching your touching

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Speaker 1: your face, right, that's it's based on the idea that

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Speaker 1: somebody might do that if they don't normally do that,

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Speaker 1: or if before this whole conversation started and a lie, Uh,

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Speaker 1: they're placed in a position where they're lying, where they're

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Speaker 1: choosing to lie, and they start doing that, they are

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Speaker 1: now deviating from their baseline behavior. And that's what the

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Speaker 1: important thing is exactly. That's where you add the qualifier necessarily.

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Speaker 1: Like Tom said, like maybe the dude has an eyelash

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Speaker 1: in his eye, Jason, he's rubbing his eyes or blinking

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Speaker 1: a lot, So yeah, it's interesting. Yeah, that's why he's

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Speaker 1: scratching his face um orca. Or maybe someone's self conscious

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Speaker 1: because of a missing front tooth, so they cover their

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Speaker 1: mouth when they talk. I cover my mouth when I talk, um,

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Speaker 1: especially when I'm eating. Oh yeah, sure, but you're just

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Speaker 1: not supposed to talk while you eat. Yeah, Emily does

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Speaker 1: that because she can't stop talking ever, so she'll just

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Speaker 1: talk while she eats and cover her mouth. So I'm

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Speaker 1: not even gonna bother to ask you if you've ever lied?

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Speaker 1: I've lied today? Have you some of you? I'm sure?

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Speaker 1: Apparently according to studies I have. Um, you found a

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Speaker 1: few studies that I've I've thought were a little let's

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Speaker 1: get into them, okay, I mean, so they're surprising. Like

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Speaker 1: one of them found that a quarter of of all

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Speaker 1: of our daily interactions involved lies. That's really high. I like,

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Speaker 1: I really, I don't think like I'm naive. I I

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Speaker 1: went back and just kind of like evaluated my behavior.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, it still seems high. Agreed, So, uh, who

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Speaker 1: does everyone else lying more than us? Are these just

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Speaker 1: a really rotten people. I don't know that happened to

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Speaker 1: be part of this random sample in the study. Well,

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Speaker 1: and you know, you pull up any study online and

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Speaker 1: you're going to find a different result, Like people are

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Speaker 1: every ninety minutes, people are every ninety seconds, she lied

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Speaker 1: twice a day, that kind of thing. Yeah, so, um

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Speaker 1: Phi psychologist failing miserably at studying lying is what you're

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Speaker 1: saying as far as coming up with hard because I

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Speaker 1: don't think there are any hard and fast rules. I

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Speaker 1: might not lie at all today, or I might like

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Speaker 1: ten times tomorrow. If you don't lie at all to day,

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Speaker 1: they'll make a movie about you. Don't They make movies

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Speaker 1: like that. You either can't lie Jim Carrey's case or yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's usually the plot. Yeah. So so I guess before

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Speaker 1: we get into the studies, do you want to talk

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Speaker 1: about what is a lie? Yeah? You dug this up.

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Speaker 1: I like these definitions. So there's this philosopher named Cecelia

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Speaker 1: Bach who is a Swedish philosopher who published a book

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Speaker 1: in the nine that apparently still to this day it's

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Speaker 1: like the the authority um lying and philosophically speaking. The

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Speaker 1: work in the seventies in psychology. I think they were

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Speaker 1: smoking a lot of weed, that's what it was. Um. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and she's a philosopher. Um, so this is the philosophical

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Speaker 1: ethical approach to lying. And so cecili Bach came up

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Speaker 1: with basically a definition of a lie, and she said

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Speaker 1: that it has three features, Um, that it communicates some information. Now,

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Speaker 1: philosophers tend to choose their words carefully. They're like almost

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Speaker 1: the poets of the humanities, especially if you don't include

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Speaker 1: poetry as a humanity. Um. The liar intends to deceive

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Speaker 1: or mislead, of course, and the liar believes that what

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Speaker 1: they're saying is not true. So they haven't tricked themselves

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Speaker 1: into believing, uh that they like O. J believes that

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Speaker 1: he did not kill his wife. Yeah. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I think that's a different conversation altogether, because that begs

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Speaker 1: the question is it really possible to fully trick yourself

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Speaker 1: into believing something you know is not true is true?

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Speaker 1: You always hear that that can happen, Like you become

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Speaker 1: so um entrenched in that lie for so long that

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Speaker 1: you don't even realize it's a lie anymore. I'd like

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Speaker 1: to see the study on that, though, yeah, I'm sure

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Speaker 1: somebody's got one out here. But so those three you

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Speaker 1: put those three things together, and um, you have a lie.

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Speaker 1: You're communicating information, right, yeah, Um, you're you're intend to

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Speaker 1: deceive and you don't believe what you're saying is true.

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Speaker 1: And I'll apologies to O J. By the way, that

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Speaker 1: was really uncalled for. Yeah, really sorry, that was very

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Speaker 1: uncalled for, Chuck, Shame on you for UM. So there's

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Speaker 1: a big debate though about whether or not, um, the

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Speaker 1: lie has to have false information to it. Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: what I don't quite understand. Can you explain that? Yes?

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Speaker 1: So example, UM, I I like your shirt, and I

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Speaker 1: know that you hate shirts that have armpit stains on them.

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Speaker 1: But I know at that at the present time you

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Speaker 1: also have a pinch nerve in your neck so you

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Speaker 1: can't see very clearly. Okay, So I want your shirt.

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Speaker 1: I know you'll give it to me if I tell

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Speaker 1: you there's an armpit stain. I don't think there's an

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Speaker 1: armpit stain. I don't believe what I'm saying is true.

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Speaker 1: But I say, Chuck that that modest master it is

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Speaker 1: an armpit stain. You should probably give it to me,

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Speaker 1: and you take it off and give it to me,

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Speaker 1: and the shirt actually has an armpit stain. And someone

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Speaker 1: pops their head and goes, want, want Want. That was

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Speaker 1: not false information. Even though I intended to deceive you.

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Speaker 1: I didn't believe what I was saying. I was just

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Speaker 1: communicating information. That's the that's the point. But that brings

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Speaker 1: up another philosophical question, like, is a lie of omission

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Speaker 1: then a lie because you're not communicating anything. In Tom's

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Speaker 1: article they talk about um, the reason the U. S.

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Speaker 1: Court system say the whole truth and nothing but the

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Speaker 1: truth is because a lie of omission sometimes is not

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Speaker 1: as UH look down upon, because you're not actually constructing

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Speaker 1: some falsehead. You're just not telling the whole truth. Interesting. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: a lot of the version of the yeah, you know, sure,

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Speaker 1: I think. I think ultimately you can follow. The conclusion

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Speaker 1: is that most philosophers believe that lying is bad, but

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Speaker 1: that there are exceptions to the rule. Like if a

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Speaker 1: murderer comes up and says, hey, I'm looking for my

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Speaker 1: next victim. Have you seen this man and you have

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Speaker 1: seen this man and you know where he is, then

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Speaker 1: I'm making this really basic gets But that's a that's

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Speaker 1: a that's an example of when a lie is beneficial.

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Speaker 1: You're thwarting a murderer and saving somebody's life. Yes, you

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Speaker 1: should lie, or obviously a white lie, which kids learned

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Speaker 1: early on, um, is something you do oftentimes to spare

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Speaker 1: the feelings of someone else. That that top does not

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Speaker 1: make you look bad. I think it's cut, just just fun. Sure,

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Speaker 1: but maybe you should wear that other one because you

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Speaker 1: look great and black. Well you, I imagine if you're

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Speaker 1: dealing with an intelligent person, you've showing your hand at

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Speaker 1: that point. Not necessarily. Yeah, um, but you did mention kids,

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Speaker 1: you mentioned white lies. Yeah, so you found a study. Supposedly,

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Speaker 1: according to Tom, around age two or three, we realized

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Speaker 1: that we're not being constantly supervised, that reality exists outside

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Speaker 1: of other people's view. Our reality sometimes does. When we

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Speaker 1: go into another room or Mom's in the other room,

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Speaker 1: I'm still here playing yes, and it comes becomes clear

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Speaker 1: to us that we are responsible for conveying that information.

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Speaker 1: But we have a choice e g. Free will that

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Speaker 1: allows us to decide whether that we convey that information

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Speaker 1: truthfully or dishonestly. Right. Yeah, and then after that it

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Speaker 1: just takes off like a rocket. Yeah, this one study, Um,

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Speaker 1: found that nine and ten of the kids that they

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Speaker 1: spied on, and this is just this is just cruel.

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Speaker 1: They put kids in a room with like a stuffed

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Speaker 1: animal or they called it a soft toy, which was

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Speaker 1: a little creepy um behind them, and said don't look

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Speaker 1: at that behind you, and they would leave the room

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Speaker 1: in videotape them, and of course nine out of ten

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Speaker 1: kids turned around looked at it. And then did I

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Speaker 1: actually say how many of them lied? Um, I don't

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Speaker 1: even see that. I guess they were just told not

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Speaker 1: to look at it. And I don't know if that's

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Speaker 1: a lie. You know, that's a little lanky. It's not

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Speaker 1: following orders, it's disobeying all right, Well, how about this?

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Speaker 1: The second part of that study was older kids. They

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Speaker 1: would give them a test with the answers on the

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Speaker 1: back and tell them not to look at the answers,

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Speaker 1: give them a fake answer, and when they were asked

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Speaker 1: to explain the fake answer, they would make up a

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Speaker 1: lie like, oh I learned that in history class, right,

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Speaker 1: And actually they the question was who discovered Tunisia? That's

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Speaker 1: one of them and the on the back the answer

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Speaker 1: um was a fake answer. Presidious Aikman and so some

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Speaker 1: the dumb kids from Star Wars who cheated said it

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Speaker 1: does doesn't. Um, the dumb kids who cheated put that

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Speaker 1: down and uh. But then Wayne, given the opportunity to

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Speaker 1: fest up with them lied. What I just disagree with

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Speaker 1: about this study was that, um, it said that the

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Speaker 1: smartest kids told the best lies. How do you qualify that?

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Speaker 1: What a you know, the best lies? Uh? If it's

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Speaker 1: believable and conveyed in a way that's uh. But that's

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Speaker 1: all subjective with confidence, totally subjective. It's methodologically unsound. But

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Speaker 1: the whole point of these studies was they believe that

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Speaker 1: children who are able to lie, um, have faster developing brains,

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Speaker 1: especially the areas involved in executive functioning. So they believe,

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Speaker 1: they concur that a child who lies early on might

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Speaker 1: be more successful later in life. Yeah. Well, I mean

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Speaker 1: you can make a case that lying is um, basically

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Speaker 1: using your imagination. Yeah, especially when you're a child. And

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Speaker 1: they they have other studies that support the fact that

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Speaker 1: rich people are more prone to lie and manipulate. So

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Speaker 1: rich people are more trying to do a lot of

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Speaker 1: shady stuff. You think, well, yeah, that's how a lot

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Speaker 1: of them get rich. Huh. Yeah, m hmm, chuck um.

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Speaker 1: You want to talk about why people tell lies, like

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Speaker 1: some of the great categories of lies, the Big six.

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Speaker 1: So what you call it? Sure? Number one, Josh, is

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Speaker 1: to conceal a misdeed instead of trouble. And even at

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Speaker 1: the advanced stage of forty one, this is the reason

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Speaker 1: I will most often lie because I hate being in

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Speaker 1: trouble and I will try and cover for myself. Uh sometimes,

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Speaker 1: even though in the end and in the long run,

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Speaker 1: it's better to tell the truth, agreed. The the short term,

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Speaker 1: you might get away with something, but you're not doing

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Speaker 1: yourself any favors. I call these lies of cowardice, thank you.

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Speaker 1: It's basically it sucks. I mean, it's that you're you're

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Speaker 1: having to like go through this terrible, uncomfortable, you know,

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Speaker 1: moment or whatever it is. But I'm really glad Tom

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Speaker 1: pointed out at least in the short term you might

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Speaker 1: not gain an advantage, but overall, like there is a

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Speaker 1: positive outcome. You're building trust by fessing out or whatever

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Speaker 1: you know. Number two to preserve a reputation. Um and

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Speaker 1: the example time uses a drug a drug addict recovering

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Speaker 1: drug addict who might lie about having gone to rehab

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Speaker 1: or something like that, or to like a perspective romantic partner. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I think that these are kind of understandable to

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Speaker 1: an extent. It's it's like, you know, we have walls up. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, you know if you're if you're just a

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Speaker 1: normal person, you don't walk down the street like, hey, Josh,

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Speaker 1: get to meet you. I spent some time in rehably,

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Speaker 1: like there's just a certain amount and then once you

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Speaker 1: get to that point, well then maybe you are kind

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Speaker 1: of short shrifting somebody who's who you consider close to

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Speaker 1: um if you're not telling them that. But as you

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Speaker 1: gain trust, then you open up more and you should um.

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Speaker 1: Number three this one, of course, we all get the

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Speaker 1: white lie to avoid hurting someone's feelings. We already kind

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Speaker 1: of covered that. Number four. To increase stature or reputation. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: these are just the boastful people. They're like, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: scored forty two in uh in a high school basketball

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Speaker 1: game one time and one county and track and you're like,

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Speaker 1: you do some investigation and you realize they weren't even

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Speaker 1: on the track team, right, And I've realized that, like

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Speaker 1: when you notice when you have a lot of these

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Speaker 1: people in your life, like there usually it's time to

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Speaker 1: get introspective because there's something wrong with the way that

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Speaker 1: you're living. If you have people like this, yeah, orbiting

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Speaker 1: you a lot. Those people wear me out, they really do.

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Speaker 1: I've done a pretty good job with shaking you know,

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Speaker 1: everybody like that off. I don't. I can't think of

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Speaker 1: anybody in my life like even acquaintance wise, and it's

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Speaker 1: like that just makes up lies about themselves, agreed. And

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Speaker 1: I have known people like that. They don't stick around. No,

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Speaker 1: especially once you get out of what you're like mid

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Speaker 1: twenties is like that edge of what you know where

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Speaker 1: you should be interacting with those people still well. And

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Speaker 1: I think that's sort of a an immaturity thing to

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Speaker 1: like if you're still doing that when you as you

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Speaker 1: grow older, then you've got some serious problems. But everyone

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Speaker 1: when they're younger probably stretches the truth about things they've done. Sure,

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Speaker 1: but even still don't you remember, like it's just kind

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Speaker 1: of being uncomfortable when somebody was doing this, and everyone

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Speaker 1: in this group that they're talking to is like, we

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Speaker 1: know you're lying, Like this is just please stop. This

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Speaker 1: is you might as well be putting bamboo shoots under

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Speaker 1: a fingernail number five to manipulate. And this is probably

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Speaker 1: something like I said, the rich people are more prone

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Speaker 1: to lie. Um, this is an evasive or defensive it's

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Speaker 1: to gain something for yourself. It's pretty pretty it's the

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Speaker 1: most vicious type of lying, probably because it also can

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Speaker 1: involve telling lies about other people right to get ahead.

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Speaker 1: That's all destroy someone else's reputation. Man, those people, there's

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Speaker 1: a special place in Dante circle for you. Agreed. Now,

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Speaker 1: those people you start to run into more of, especially

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Speaker 1: as you inter the corporate world. And you know what,

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Speaker 1: they may be the same people who were telling the

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Speaker 1: other lives when they were younger. You know what I'm saying,

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Speaker 1: They just evolved into to be manipulators. And the last one, Josh,

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Speaker 1: is to control information. Um. And this is what we

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Speaker 1: mentioned about indirect lying or like withholding parts of the

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Speaker 1: truth a liable mission. Yeah, which I'm more able to

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Speaker 1: forgive something like that. Um. So that's as you called it,

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Speaker 1: the Big six. Huh, the Big six, um, Chuck. Kind

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Speaker 1: Of one of the running themes that we've had here

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Speaker 1: is that everybody lies. I don't think that we've Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you said it, explicitly. Every the Dalai Lama doesn't lie.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I could see him wanting to preserve

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Speaker 1: harmony or balance or something like that at a diplomatic

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Speaker 1: dinner or something, or with one of his followers feelings

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Speaker 1: about like, yes, that is a really nice sand mandala.

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Speaker 1: Sure you know. Yeah, he's sent putting a lot of

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Speaker 1: high pressure social situations. So at the very least everyone

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Speaker 1: has little white lies, I imagine, like right, Um, but

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Speaker 1: there are some types of personalities that are much more

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Speaker 1: prone to lying, um the big five. Yes, like pathological liars. Yes,

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Speaker 1: they are the worst of the worst because they are

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Speaker 1: sociopathic and they don't understand right and wrong. Um, and

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Speaker 1: they have they're probably really good liars because they don't

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Speaker 1: understand right or wrong, because they're not gonna have the

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Speaker 1: stresses associated with guilt in line bad people. Yeah, their

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Speaker 1: consciences don't put them through their paces when they're lying,

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Speaker 1: because they lack in whole or in part consciences compared

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Speaker 1: to non sociopathic people. Right. Uh. Number two. I've known

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Speaker 1: one of these people, a compulsive liar, and I really

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Speaker 1: felt bad for him because they almost seem like they

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Speaker 1: can't help it. Yeah, and you would think a pathological

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Speaker 1: liar and a compulsive liar one and the same. Not

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Speaker 1: no compulsive liar UM. Pathological liar lies um as a strategy.

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Speaker 1: It's a means of gaining advantage. UM. A compulsive liar

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Speaker 1: like can't help it, like they have their brain has

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Speaker 1: been trained to lie as a first resort, even if

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Speaker 1: they're not, if there's no gain whatsoever in line, they

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Speaker 1: they will still just generally lie. It's the first thing.

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Speaker 1: It's their gut reaction. It's Uh, this guy knew. It

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Speaker 1: was really clear that he lied as a first option,

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Speaker 1: as his go to when he didn't need to. And

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Speaker 1: it was so frustrating. And I had a sort of

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Speaker 1: a big brotherly relationship to this guy, so it wasn't

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Speaker 1: he wasn't a peer, so I tried to help him

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Speaker 1: through that. But UM, I haven't talked to him a

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Speaker 1: long time. I don't know if it worked. So you

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Speaker 1: abandoned him faith that them um and one of the

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Speaker 1: and this of course makes sense in his case too,

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Speaker 1: without getting specific, but said that living in an abusive environment,

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Speaker 1: relying as necessary to self preservation might be where that

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Speaker 1: stems from. And I think that was the case for him. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's like the brain has been trained to um lie,

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Speaker 1: like this is what you do. It's But the good

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Speaker 1: thing is if you run across somebody in your life

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Speaker 1: who cares enough about you, they can be trained out

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Speaker 1: of you, I imagine, although I'm sure it's a painful

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Speaker 1: process for both people. Yeah, it's probably are you're really

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Speaker 1: waiting for me to say. People culty programming UM. Narcissists

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Speaker 1: of course will lie. These are the people who um

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Speaker 1: lie to increase stature and reputation, but they do themselves

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Speaker 1: no favors. Borderline personalities. I thought this one was kind

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Speaker 1: of interesting. They will go through wild mood swings and

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Speaker 1: engage in really risky behavior, but then they come back

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Speaker 1: down to normalcy and they're like, oh, um, I just

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Speaker 1: gambled away our savings count and then they'll lie to

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Speaker 1: cover those up, right. Uh. And then histrionic personalities, Uh,

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Speaker 1: these are people if you have like a true histrionic

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Speaker 1: personality disorder, you are attention seeking, excessively needy uh for

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Speaker 1: approval and emotional um. Apparently women are more prone to

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Speaker 1: be histrionic by ratio four to one. Oh is there

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Speaker 1: right what they say? Or at least I have the

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Speaker 1: disorder and you can, um, these are people desperate for attention,

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Speaker 1: like if you leave, if you walk out the door,

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Speaker 1: and to kill myself. That was a great example time used.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that's a lie, you mean. I were on this

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Speaker 1: air tram flight once in this UM we were waiting

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Speaker 1: to take off and this caterer was backing off of

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Speaker 1: the little his little sky ramp who was backing away

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Speaker 1: from the other door, the catering door UM, and apparently

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Speaker 1: it was still hooked a part of it or whatever.

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Speaker 1: The SHEI was like, no, no, don't do and he

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Speaker 1: kept going and she turned around, was like, well, we're

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Speaker 1: not going anywhere for a while. And the way she

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Speaker 1: said it, you could tell we were we were discussing this,

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Speaker 1: like neither one of us believed her. We just knew

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Speaker 1: she was wrong because just she's threw it out there like,

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Speaker 1: well we're not going anywhere for a while, like and

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Speaker 1: of course, like everything was fine within like fifteen minutes,

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Speaker 1: but the way she sounded, it was gonna be like

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Speaker 1: stuck on a tarmic for three hours. And it was weird.

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Speaker 1: Were afforded this glimpse into this woman's true personality, and

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't have hung out with histrionic. She was a

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Speaker 1: bit histrionic and that was probably low level you could tell,

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Speaker 1: all right, so stay away from her. How can you

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Speaker 1: tell if someone's lying. We've talked about micro expressions, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and the micro expression. Yeah, it was like three years ago.

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Speaker 1: Uh yeah, yeah, it has been well. Basically, the for

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Speaker 1: those people who don't know that, we have a good

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Speaker 1: hundred and thirty hundred and fifty at the sisodes still

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Speaker 1: not on iTunes, not um we the episode we did

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Speaker 1: on micro expressions. Basically, a micro expression is an uncontrollable fleeting,

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Speaker 1: like millisecond long facial expression that is linked to your

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Speaker 1: true feelings. That was longer than a millisecond. I just

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Speaker 1: made a quick frowny face. That was a grim was it?

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Speaker 1: You look like? Megan m ram I don't know this

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Speaker 1: is on Twitter girling like that. It's hilarious. Um anyway, Uh,

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Speaker 1: it's it's a you can't control it. It's linked to

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Speaker 1: your true feelings, and people have been shown to be

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Speaker 1: able to pick up on these without even consciously knowing it.

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Speaker 1: You just get what we would call a gut feeling

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Speaker 1: about somebody because their smile and that sudden fleeting micro

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Speaker 1: expression of like contempt back into a smile that you

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Speaker 1: didn't really see, but you're caught, don't add up, and

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Speaker 1: your body is like, why am I having a weird

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Speaker 1: reaction to this person? So that's a micro expression, and

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Speaker 1: they're they're apparently linked to lies and lying. So basically,

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Speaker 1: if you have a gut feeling that somebody's lying, you

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Speaker 1: might be onto something. Yes, and it might be because

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Speaker 1: of a micro expression that you saw. Interesting. You know this,

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Speaker 1: I know, but I still find it interesting. Okay, I'm

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Speaker 1: not lying. That's your new thing? Interesting? Did you know

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Speaker 1: that that I said that? Um, I've been on that

399
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Speaker 1: for a while. Yeah, if I ramped it up lately. Interesting. Uh.

400
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Speaker 1: These are non verbal cues, by the way, micro expressions.

401
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Speaker 1: Another one is a forced smile. And I think we've

402
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Speaker 1: talked about this too. That's when you smile with your

403
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Speaker 1: mouth only. Yeah. It's so creepy, is the seeing it?

404
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Speaker 1: You're just like, you know, what are you doing? Right?

405
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,760
Speaker 1: You look weird right now? Um? But seeing it described

406
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Speaker 1: the way Tom wrote it, which is a perfect description,

407
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Speaker 1: was creepy to me. Yes, it was. Um. Another thing

408
00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,840
Speaker 1: you can look for is like someone's nodding yes during

409
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Speaker 1: a denial some kind that could be a dead giveaway.

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Speaker 1: It's terrible. Sometimes it's like way more outward, Like you

411
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Speaker 1: get literally in a defensive position, right, like crossing your

412
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Speaker 1: arms or moving away, turning away from somebody who's questioning you,

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Speaker 1: and fidgeting. Finally we get to fidgeting. Like, fidgeting is

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Speaker 1: significant if the person is normally calm or doesn't normally fidget.

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Speaker 1: If it's a fidgety, nervous person to begin with, then

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Speaker 1: that doesn't it doesn't mean that they're lying. If they're

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Speaker 1: fidgety and then they get calm all of a sudden

418
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Speaker 1: while you think that they're lying, then you're onto something there.

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Speaker 1: But they're probably the weirdest person in the world, and

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Speaker 1: you should force them into lies just to watch them

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Speaker 1: go from fidgety to normal, because they'd be really odd

422
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:54,520
Speaker 1: to see. Um verbal Sometimes you know, you can pick

423
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:58,760
Speaker 1: up on nonverbal cues. Sometimes they are quite verbal. Um

424
00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 1: So like, ask asked me a question, asked me, why

425
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: didn't I come over last night and help you with

426
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:10,680
Speaker 1: your with your lawn mowing. Uh, that's a terrible question,

427
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,000
Speaker 1: all right, I'll ask me why did you tell me

428
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,240
Speaker 1: that the sweetwater thing doesn't have a date when it

429
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:21,359
Speaker 1: clearly does. Well, I'll fake it and then I'll tell

430
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: you the real answer, because that actually does ever real answer. Um,

431
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,480
Speaker 1: So what you're saying that you looked and saw that

432
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 1: my band gig for Sweetwater didn't have a date on it?

433
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,360
Speaker 1: Is that what you're asking me? Yes, well, I mean

434
00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 1: I could tell you, uh right now exactly. There's a

435
00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 1: very good reason for that, Josh, Then why don't you liar?

436
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:48,040
Speaker 1: So those are some of the not actually verbal cues,

437
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:52,360
Speaker 1: taking too long, not using contractions, repeating the question, basically

438
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:55,880
Speaker 1: buying yourself, sometimes not using contractions. It's hilarious to me, like,

439
00:25:56,000 --> 00:26:00,080
Speaker 1: I cannot believe that you want to know why and

440
00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:03,280
Speaker 1: tell you why I did not tell you this, and

441
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:06,879
Speaker 1: the reason why, the real reason why, No, the reason

442
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:09,520
Speaker 1: why you're not using contractions. Well, to draw it out

443
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 1: so your brain can the other part of you can

444
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:15,880
Speaker 1: come up with the answer. That's so hilarious. The real

445
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 1: reason why I said that about Sweetwater is because I

446
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:21,440
Speaker 1: just found out two days ago that they have gone

447
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:27,640
Speaker 1: with another band and its officially canceled. No, yeah, that's

448
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 1: a little bummed. Do you want me to talk to somebody? No? Now,

449
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:33,919
Speaker 1: I was told that one of the reasons why they

450
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 1: went with another band is because we didn't have like

451
00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:41,199
Speaker 1: video and things to send to show you caged up

452
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:45,399
Speaker 1: your two fifty gig computer with HD videos. Yeah, but

453
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:47,400
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff we don't want to send out,

454
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:52,639
Speaker 1: like a lot of pants lists, pencils, l cheap. Well,

455
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:55,879
Speaker 1: I think that stinks. If you're at Sweetwater Brewer right now,

456
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 1: shame on you. Now, this wasn't them, This was in GEO.

457
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,159
Speaker 1: This as a fundraiser. So the fan who wrote in

458
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:09,720
Speaker 1: to ask you bomped. You bumped me really for another band.

459
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 1: And I've looked at the other band too, like they

460
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:16,760
Speaker 1: have a website and videos and lady, stop listening right now. No,

461
00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 1: don't do that, at least for the rest of the episode.

462
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,639
Speaker 1: It's okay. It was humbling. Well, I'm sorry that I

463
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 1: brought it up. That's okay. Might as well get it

464
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:26,680
Speaker 1: out there. I'm glad you did, because you probably thought

465
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:30,680
Speaker 1: I was lying to you. Where are we? We are

466
00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:33,639
Speaker 1: now going to teach people how to lie? Which I

467
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:36,920
Speaker 1: thought was an interesting feature of this article. Okay, I um,

468
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: I thought it was interesting. I also refused to do it.

469
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,439
Speaker 1: I find it wholly a moral to teach people how

470
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:45,000
Speaker 1: to lie? Do you want to skip this in? No,

471
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,720
Speaker 1: but it's still information. I feel like we can say

472
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 1: people who are successful at lying tend to do certain things,

473
00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:57,280
Speaker 1: but teaching somebody how to lie, I think it's just

474
00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:00,400
Speaker 1: utterly wrong. Well, imagine there's been more than one attorney

475
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,639
Speaker 1: give these instructions to their clients. Definitely on the stand,

476
00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:07,840
Speaker 1: but I mean like attorneys, nobody. But we're making all

477
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:13,720
Speaker 1: kinds of friends today. It turneys in Detroit especially p you. Alright,

478
00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,240
Speaker 1: so here's how to lie, so says Tom Chief. So

479
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 1: this is what successful liars do. Okay, stay calm. That's

480
00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:24,600
Speaker 1: what they'll probably tell you before you get on the

481
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:27,240
Speaker 1: witness stand. Will put you up, especially with the polygraph.

482
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,760
Speaker 1: Yeah sure, because it measures all those fluctuations and what

483
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:36,000
Speaker 1: temperature and heart rate and yeah you're yeah, you're yeah,

484
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: those two things. Just keep it simple, stupid. And this one, boy,

485
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 1: you see this one when someone's cooking up a lie

486
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 1: and they you know they're lying when they start adding

487
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 1: all these details because they think, well the more detailed,

488
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,560
Speaker 1: like who could make this up? I was thinking about

489
00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: this and I was like, while I was reading this,

490
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:56,520
Speaker 1: I was like going over my own behavior. Is he's

491
00:28:56,600 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 1: using myself as a model. It's impossible not too I guess, right, Um,

492
00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:05,120
Speaker 1: this this I did not get. Like I I tried

493
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 1: to think back to like any lie or story I've

494
00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:11,719
Speaker 1: ever told him, like if if like just adding details

495
00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:14,479
Speaker 1: and like information that has nothing to do with anything,

496
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:17,200
Speaker 1: Like I don't get that. Yeah, well, you know it

497
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: probably means you're not a very good liar. That's a

498
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 1: good thing. I hope that's what it means. But that's

499
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:26,040
Speaker 1: like the Eddie Murphy. Uh remember his joke about you know,

500
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 1: the ladies called the guy like the car was at

501
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:30,880
Speaker 1: the other ladies house and it was just what me,

502
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 1: That's what he kept saying. Yeah, but I called you

503
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: and you know, I called you red hand and it

504
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 1: wouldn't me Oh yeah yeah, And that I guess that

505
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 1: kind of goes back to it and keep it as

506
00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 1: simple as possible. Richard Pryor apparently also had a little

507
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 1: bit where like, um, he said that he came in

508
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:48,560
Speaker 1: and found like his wife or his girlfriend in bed

509
00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 1: with another guy and she's like, who are you gonna

510
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:56,920
Speaker 1: believe me? Or your lion eyes? That's pretty good. Um

511
00:29:57,000 --> 00:30:02,440
Speaker 1: remains steady Um. And this goes back to the you

512
00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 1: will be you're being studied by. Let's go ahead and

513
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,360
Speaker 1: use the courtroom example, like we're coaching you to go

514
00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:10,000
Speaker 1: on the stand. This jury is gonna be watching you.

515
00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:14,560
Speaker 1: Just remain steady. If you're all fidgety, stay fidgety. People

516
00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:18,400
Speaker 1: who are good liars tend to remain steady, right, And

517
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 1: what do you mean by that is not just like

518
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,800
Speaker 1: you have to keep a steady hand. That was already

519
00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 1: covered in staying calm. People who are good liars continue

520
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:31,719
Speaker 1: the behavior that they were that they if they were

521
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 1: relaxed before there's a line of questioning started, they're relaxed

522
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 1: during it, and they're relaxed after. If they're fidgety, then

523
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:41,360
Speaker 1: they're fidgety before, during and after. Yeah, because they say

524
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:43,760
Speaker 1: one of the telltale signs is um or the way

525
00:30:43,840 --> 00:30:45,400
Speaker 1: of one way to trip up a liar, which we'll

526
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:48,600
Speaker 1: talk about is to change the subject and see if

527
00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 1: you see them relax because they think, oh man, that's over,

528
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:55,520
Speaker 1: thank god. Yeah, Tom says, um. Once the questioning is over,

529
00:30:55,560 --> 00:31:00,080
Speaker 1: don't suddenly relax and a pure really all right, I

530
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:04,240
Speaker 1: can get down now off the stand, um, And then

531
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: good liars generally are affable, which makes sense. They make

532
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,960
Speaker 1: people want to believe them because I think if you

533
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 1: don't like somebody, it's easier to be suspicious of them. Yeah. Well,

534
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,120
Speaker 1: how many people have gotten away with horrible stuff because

535
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:24,480
Speaker 1: they just seem likable? What about Ted Bundy? How many people?

536
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,440
Speaker 1: How many more people was he able to kill? And

537
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 1: he got caught? Remember we talked about him before he

538
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 1: got caught because he went in like just a completely reckless,

539
00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,960
Speaker 1: like killing rampage in his sorority house. Yeah, he killed

540
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 1: for years before that. Yeah, but he was white and

541
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 1: he had good haircut, so I mean he couldn't he

542
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:46,080
Speaker 1: couldn't have been any threat to anybody. I love that

543
00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:49,200
Speaker 1: serial killer stuff. I could do like every other show

544
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 1: on some aspect of that, We'll do another serial killer one. Okay, Okay,

545
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 1: so Chuck, I will. I don't find it a moral

546
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,960
Speaker 1: to teach people to tell when someone at lyne so

547
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:05,120
Speaker 1: that we can do five steps the Big five Big

548
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:07,880
Speaker 1: Part two, Part two. Um, and we kind of already

549
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:12,120
Speaker 1: talked about establishing the baseline, Like if you think someone

550
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 1: might be lying in your quizzing, hum, look at their

551
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:20,520
Speaker 1: behavior very closely and determine how they just normally act

552
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: and just go ahead and log that in your brain.

553
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 1: Let's step one, right, And I mean this is like

554
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 1: I guess if this is if you're a professional interrogator

555
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:31,440
Speaker 1: like the lady in that terrible show, um or on

556
00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 1: Law and Order, the Great Shows, um Or, if you're

557
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:36,920
Speaker 1: on a jury, this is good advice. If you sit

558
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:38,800
Speaker 1: on a jury to watch these people, that's a good

559
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:43,560
Speaker 1: one too, for sure. Um Or if you are um something, uh,

560
00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,479
Speaker 1: if you are really help bent on finding out if

561
00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 1: somebody that you interact with is lying to you, and

562
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:52,080
Speaker 1: you do a lot of pre planning, you could do

563
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,320
Speaker 1: this too. But yes, before you let on that there's

564
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:57,239
Speaker 1: a line of questioning that's going to be coming up.

565
00:32:57,360 --> 00:32:59,920
Speaker 1: You want to interact with the person in um may

566
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 1: notes about their behavior. Are they a fidgety Joe, not

567
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:07,280
Speaker 1: literally in front of them making notes? Or if you

568
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:10,720
Speaker 1: do do that, just don't lend them see what you're right? Alright?

569
00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 1: So number two is once you've established this, to look

570
00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 1: for deviations from that pretty much a no brainer, Like

571
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 1: did they start fidgeting all that stuff? Yeah? Or if

572
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 1: they're fidgety Joe, do they turn into a smooth Samuel

573
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, that's weird that that did would

574
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 1: just be so weird it would be it's weird. Or

575
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:32,120
Speaker 1: if they're smooth Samuel and they're trying into a fidgety joe,

576
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: there you go. That's a that's a deviation from the baseline.

577
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 1: That's right. Uh. Step three, you really gotta listen, um so,

578
00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 1: I might be pretty steely with their nonverbal cues. So

579
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:46,239
Speaker 1: just listen to what they're saying and is it adding up.

580
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:51,760
Speaker 1: If they're spouting off all kinds of details, maybe lead

581
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 1: them down a different path and then jump back to

582
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 1: those details and see if they're still on those. And

583
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: then you pick out a detail it seems a little

584
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,680
Speaker 1: hinky to you, as you would say, and started asking

585
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:06,240
Speaker 1: them questions about that, because then they may have to

586
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:09,400
Speaker 1: lie about the lie, right, And if none of it's fitting,

587
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 1: are they having to make up more information to explain

588
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 1: why certain things aren't fitting into this um? And eventually,

589
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 1: if you draw the line of questioning out enough, you're

590
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:24,120
Speaker 1: going to drive the person totally insane because their brains

591
00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 1: are going over time. Yeah, the tell tale heard, I think,

592
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:30,520
Speaker 1: and that would happen in that they actually they didn't

593
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:32,799
Speaker 1: even know what was going on those guys. Oh yeah,

594
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,040
Speaker 1: that's right. They were sort of innocently questioning and it

595
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 1: was all in his head. Either that or it was

596
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:40,759
Speaker 1: really a phantom heart, right, that's the I guess you

597
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,000
Speaker 1: just shouldn't murder. Yeah, boy, that John Cusack movie about

598
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:47,160
Speaker 1: Poe looks like one of the worst pieces of garbage

599
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,879
Speaker 1: for me, it really does. Whose idea was that, let's

600
00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:53,920
Speaker 1: make a movie about Edgar Allan Poe as a as

601
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 1: a murderous hunter And I'm thinking John Cusack? Yeah, really,

602
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:04,560
Speaker 1: although I have to say a Lincoln vampire hunter looks awesome. Yeah,

603
00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 1: I totally want to see that. Man, I can't see that.

604
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 1: That was no, but I'm sorry. I saw the the

605
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,920
Speaker 1: preview for the po one and for the um Abraham

606
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:17,320
Speaker 1: Lincoln one, like right next to each other. So I

607
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 1: linked the two and they look similar and mood her tone,

608
00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:26,239
Speaker 1: um oh, hold on with them with everything adding up

609
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:28,759
Speaker 1: and drawing it out. One of the other things we

610
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:32,840
Speaker 1: talked about the body language, where um, a body language

611
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:35,360
Speaker 1: might be lie what they're really thinking or what they

612
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:38,360
Speaker 1: really believe. Where if you're if you're denying something but

613
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 1: you're nodding your head, and she talked about um a

614
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,880
Speaker 1: rod or somebody like that who was involved in steroids,

615
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:48,960
Speaker 1: and he was on like sixty minutes and someone broke

616
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:52,440
Speaker 1: down their micro expressions yeah and found clearly that he

617
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:54,399
Speaker 1: was like he was nodding his head when he said

618
00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:57,640
Speaker 1: yes or something like that at one point, So, um

619
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 1: are so dumb? Yeah? And why you why you're doing that? Normally,

620
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,399
Speaker 1: our body language matches up to our thoughts because they're

621
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:07,359
Speaker 1: accurate and true and instinctual, right, and when they're when

622
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:09,760
Speaker 1: we're lying, not only do we have to think about

623
00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:14,200
Speaker 1: the words we're saying and fabricate this alternate reality that

624
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 1: doesn't really exist except in our heads, we also have

625
00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:19,640
Speaker 1: to come up with the body language that's supposed to

626
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:24,239
Speaker 1: match us being calm, us being truthful, whatever. And so

627
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 1: all of this thinky thinky can be confusing to um

628
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:31,640
Speaker 1: a liar. And if if you stretch it out over

629
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 1: the course of enough time a line of questioning, they're

630
00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 1: probably going to be like, why are you interrogating me?

631
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:41,439
Speaker 1: Or whatever? And you've broken them And at that point

632
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:45,359
Speaker 1: you just drive the hammer home and literally beat them

633
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 1: to death with the hammer. That's the inevitable conclusion of

634
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:51,600
Speaker 1: any line of questioning. Right now. What you could do, though,

635
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:56,440
Speaker 1: is pause, because a pause and the conversation might make

636
00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,440
Speaker 1: just a regular conversation feel uncomfortable. You talk about the

637
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 1: awkward pause, but man, if someone's cooking up a lie

638
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 1: and you're asking them questions and you pause, and this

639
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 1: is a big time tactic by an attorney with someone

640
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:11,000
Speaker 1: on the stand, that will seem like an eternity to

641
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:14,319
Speaker 1: those people. Yeah, they may get fidgety or whatever. They'll

642
00:37:14,360 --> 00:37:17,719
Speaker 1: turn into like Miranda July on that video tape and you,

643
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:19,839
Speaker 1: me and everyone we know where she's like, I can

644
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:24,719
Speaker 1: do anything right now? Is that? Did you see that?

645
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:26,319
Speaker 1: I did? I enjoyed that you know what I'm talking

646
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: about and know exactly what you're talking about. So if

647
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:31,399
Speaker 1: somebody does that in the middle of a pause during

648
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,800
Speaker 1: a line of questioning, yeah, they're lying, uh and finally,

649
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 1: or they're adorable and artsy right and or into mumble

650
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:42,160
Speaker 1: core um. And then we talked about the last one.

651
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:44,719
Speaker 1: Step five has changed the subject. And see if you

652
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:50,319
Speaker 1: see them visibly relax and then go ah ha yeah,

653
00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:53,239
Speaker 1: where they're like yeah and they're like, oh wait, no,

654
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:58,920
Speaker 1: I wasn't relaxing, right, I'm on meth. Yeah, that's a

655
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 1: good way to catch somebody off guard. Or you could

656
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:05,239
Speaker 1: do the Colombo method, let him off the hook, let

657
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:08,239
Speaker 1: them calm down, and then turn around be like one

658
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 1: more question. How was that what he would do? Oh yeah,

659
00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:12,560
Speaker 1: every time that thought we would catch somebody and that

660
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:14,960
Speaker 1: would be like that, like they didn't have an answer

661
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:16,880
Speaker 1: for that, and it totally caught him off guard and

662
00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:18,839
Speaker 1: then he beat him to death of the hammer at

663
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:23,000
Speaker 1: the end of every episode. Robert Blake, Right, I'm the

664
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,760
Speaker 1: Colombo Peter Fault, Peter Falk. I always get those guys confused.

665
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:29,799
Speaker 1: Robert Blake really did go to jail for murder. Yeah,

666
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 1: that's because he really killed his wife. He was Burretta.

667
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:36,160
Speaker 1: That's right. I always getting confused, But not with the

668
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:42,440
Speaker 1: Rockford Files. Oh no, that's a Jim. Yeah, it's great. Um,

669
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:44,880
Speaker 1: all right, so I didn't look at any of the

670
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,879
Speaker 1: famous lives in history. They weren't. They were pretty much

671
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:53,160
Speaker 1: whatever standard. So we talked about the Kids study. UM.

672
00:38:54,480 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 1: I found an interesting link from the University of Southern California, huh,

673
00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 1: where they found what they believe is proof that, uh,

674
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 1: the brain structure of a pathological liar is different. They're

675
00:39:10,520 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: actually wired differently than the rest of us. Oh yeah,

676
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:15,800
Speaker 1: I could totally see that because the brain is subject

677
00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:20,000
Speaker 1: to plasticity and so structurally it's different. Right, Well, that's

678
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,160
Speaker 1: what they say. They took subjects a D eight volunteers

679
00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 1: and then interviewed them with psychological tests and placed them

680
00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:30,080
Speaker 1: in different categories of like are you a repeated liar?

681
00:39:30,239 --> 00:39:34,440
Speaker 1: Are you anti social and pathological liar? Or are you normal?

682
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:38,080
Speaker 1: I guess a normal liar? And then they hooked him

683
00:39:38,120 --> 00:39:41,240
Speaker 1: up to the old m R I the Wonder machine,

684
00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:44,120
Speaker 1: and they found that liars had significantly more white matter

685
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:50,359
Speaker 1: and less gray matter, which they believe equates to um.

686
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:56,600
Speaker 1: Liars are quicker thinkers. Basically white matters the stuff that

687
00:39:56,680 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 1: transmits the electrical impulse. They're more equipped to lie physically,

688
00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:05,560
Speaker 1: their brains, their feet. I'm I'm like one big continuous

689
00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:08,759
Speaker 1: lump of gray matter. Yeah, I don't think I have

690
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,680
Speaker 1: any white matter whatsoever. There's like a little there's a

691
00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:14,399
Speaker 1: donkey on like a ferry that goes across the mighty

692
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:20,279
Speaker 1: mississipp that's my that's my neural transmission with Huck Finn. Yeah. Um,

693
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:24,560
Speaker 1: but huck fan is like really fat and kind of dumb.

694
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: There they go, right now I can chuck yeah. Uh.

695
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,759
Speaker 1: And then this other thing we've touched on, the thinking cap,

696
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:41,680
Speaker 1: transcranial magnetic stimulation. Yeah, and what was that again, TMS, Oh,

697
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 1: it's the it was the thinking cap. We did an

698
00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:47,600
Speaker 1: episode on this too, where there's a I guess that

699
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:52,560
Speaker 1: uses magnets magnetic pulses that can target very specific parts

700
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 1: of the brain without fighting others. Laying a magnet that

701
00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:58,000
Speaker 1: can pulse right over a specific part of your brain

702
00:40:58,120 --> 00:41:01,319
Speaker 1: and going woom woomp, and then high frequency stuff makes

703
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:04,400
Speaker 1: you like you twitch and stuff like that. Low frequency

704
00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 1: can give you a stutter depending on the region of

705
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 1: the brain. It's basically just messing with your brain and

706
00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 1: the neural firing. And it can make you more creative too.

707
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 1: Wasn't that one of them? Yeah, that's what they found

708
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 1: more creative and um people could pick out like prime

709
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 1: numbers out of a huge block of numbers. Whether they

710
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 1: couldn't do that right before, they could draw horse really

711
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:27,640
Speaker 1: well all of a sudden, so apparently if UM these

712
00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:32,320
Speaker 1: volunteers were hooked up to the TMS Thinking Cap machine,

713
00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 1: let's call it, and volunteered to have their dor dorsalateral

714
00:41:37,160 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 1: prefonal cortex stimulated, which is UM complex thought and deception

715
00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:46,200
Speaker 1: decision making. And they found and it has two sides

716
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,240
Speaker 1: like every other part of the brain. And they found

717
00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:54,279
Speaker 1: that people who had the left side stimulated lit more often. Uh,

718
00:41:54,400 --> 00:41:57,360
Speaker 1: and people on the right side were more likely to

719
00:41:57,400 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: tell the truth. And they asked him like obvious question.

720
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:02,440
Speaker 1: It's like what color is this piece of paper? Lie

721
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 1: to me or don't lie to me? And basically it's

722
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:08,319
Speaker 1: early in the going here. I think this is from

723
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 1: two thousand eleven, but they think this could lead to

724
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:16,040
Speaker 1: possibly one day instead of people taking a lie detector tests,

725
00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:19,720
Speaker 1: taking a lie prevention test, like hooking them up and basically,

726
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:22,600
Speaker 1: you cannot lie to me while you're getting pulse like this.

727
00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:26,360
Speaker 1: That is crazy. So did you kill your wife? That

728
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 1: is very crazy? Did I? No? I wasn't asking me

729
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:36,720
Speaker 1: although I haven't seen you mean awhile, okay, sorry this morning,

730
00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:41,200
Speaker 1: I'll have her send you an email. Sure. Well, actually,

731
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:43,680
Speaker 1: it's funny you brought that up because UM this last

732
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:49,479
Speaker 1: little study UM found the email people are only likely

733
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:52,720
Speaker 1: to lie in email four pent of the time, compared

734
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:55,880
Speaker 1: to thirty seven percent on the phone seven percent in

735
00:42:56,040 --> 00:43:02,439
Speaker 1: person via text. And I found that interesting. I find

736
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 1: it interesting to The phone makes sense because it's verbal communication,

737
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:12,759
Speaker 1: so you're more frightened. There's more intimidation, which I think

738
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:14,880
Speaker 1: probably is one of the things that leads to lying

739
00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:19,799
Speaker 1: among people more frequently than anything else, being intimidated face

740
00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:22,840
Speaker 1: to face, which probably helps exactly. So the phone is

741
00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:29,800
Speaker 1: the most um lie laden form of communication, but email

742
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,880
Speaker 1: is the least lie laden, and I think it's because

743
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:35,720
Speaker 1: you don't have to vocally express it. Plus the internet

744
00:43:35,800 --> 00:43:40,239
Speaker 1: makes us all very brassy. Uh well, plus email to

745
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:45,680
Speaker 1: also there's like documented evidence the paper trail or an

746
00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:49,279
Speaker 1: electric paper trail. Yeah, that's a good point too, Like

747
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:51,319
Speaker 1: I wouldn't line in an email because when somebody could

748
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:53,160
Speaker 1: take that email later on and bust me on it,

749
00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:56,759
Speaker 1: that's true. I would only do that fourteen percent in

750
00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 1: the time, evidently, right. Well, I record all of you

751
00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:04,040
Speaker 1: was in my conversation, so I've got it all documented,

752
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:11,359
Speaker 1: all of it. Oh bad, I guess that's it. That's

753
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:13,160
Speaker 1: all I got. That was a lot. That was a

754
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 1: lot online. We we covered the philosophical aspects you mentioned

755
00:44:17,120 --> 00:44:21,520
Speaker 1: the brain, We pood pood psychology. Um. We talked about

756
00:44:21,719 --> 00:44:24,200
Speaker 1: the Big five, the Big six, the other Big five.

757
00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:27,040
Speaker 1: We covered everything in him. Yeah, and let us finish

758
00:44:27,080 --> 00:44:30,319
Speaker 1: by saying, two kids out there. Although it may seem

759
00:44:30,360 --> 00:44:32,920
Speaker 1: like a good idea at the time, it is not

760
00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:35,439
Speaker 1: a good idea in the long run in your life.

761
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:38,319
Speaker 1: May just make things worse. In fact, it will very

762
00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 1: much likely make things much worse on you agreed to

763
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:43,520
Speaker 1: tell the truth. Agreed. It's a good habit to get

764
00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 1: into as you grow. Oh yeah, those are the people

765
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:49,320
Speaker 1: who really kind of become the best agreed later on.

766
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:54,280
Speaker 1: Not necessarily the richest, although that's not the Richard Brandson

767
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:56,759
Speaker 1: never told a lie in his life, probably, but there

768
00:44:56,800 --> 00:44:59,919
Speaker 1: are richest beyond the dollar exactly. That's what I'm driving

769
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:02,640
Speaker 1: and being honest as one and the true trust of

770
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 1: another person doesn't much wealthier than that. Agreed Uh a

771
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:11,040
Speaker 1: few while learn more about lying. You can look it

772
00:45:11,160 --> 00:45:14,279
Speaker 1: up by typing L Y, I, n G in the

773
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:16,879
Speaker 1: search bar at how stuff works dot com. I said,

774
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:20,200
Speaker 1: search bar in there no lie. This means it's time

775
00:45:20,239 --> 00:45:26,680
Speaker 1: for a listener mail. Whoa, Nelly, whoa. We got a

776
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:29,600
Speaker 1: couple of quick announcements to make a listener mail. The

777
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:32,880
Speaker 1: first is we have if you've listened to our Halloween episodes.

778
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:36,120
Speaker 1: The past two years we do readings that are royalty

779
00:45:36,200 --> 00:45:39,359
Speaker 1: free because they're old, right and they're good from po

780
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:42,320
Speaker 1: and Lovecraft and the like. This year, we want to

781
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 1: read one of your horror stories absolutely true, um, and

782
00:45:46,239 --> 00:45:49,920
Speaker 1: we're going to do that through this long, complicated process

783
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:53,040
Speaker 1: by which starting uh this well a little while ago

784
00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:58,239
Speaker 1: June eighth and running until July. You can submit your own,

785
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 1: um horror fiction not been published any anywhere else and

786
00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,759
Speaker 1: that is between three thousand and four thousand words. That's right.

787
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:09,240
Speaker 1: You can send it in an email to how Stuff

788
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 1: Works Underscore Contests at Discovery dot com. Right, yeah, and

789
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:17,480
Speaker 1: do yourself a favor. Uh go read the rules because

790
00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:19,440
Speaker 1: you don't want to take the time to do this

791
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:21,960
Speaker 1: and then be disqualified. No, there's a blog post on

792
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 1: the blogs that how Stuff Works and it's titled something

793
00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:28,200
Speaker 1: like stuff you should know his horror Fiction contest colon

794
00:46:28,560 --> 00:46:31,120
Speaker 1: get your official rules here something like that, and it's

795
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,320
Speaker 1: got all the rules that has like a pithy introduction

796
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:36,359
Speaker 1: to the rules that we came up with and then UM.

797
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:40,759
Speaker 1: So the key here though is no matter what, um,

798
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:44,920
Speaker 1: you have to in the email write the words by

799
00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:49,360
Speaker 1: entering into the contest. I agree to abide by the

800
00:46:49,440 --> 00:46:53,160
Speaker 1: contest rules. Any email that that has a submission that

801
00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:55,960
Speaker 1: doesn't have those words in it is automatically disqualified. Yeah,

802
00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:57,640
Speaker 1: and we don't want that because if you worked on this,

803
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:00,640
Speaker 1: you know we want you to be able to win. Yeah. Um,

804
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:03,279
Speaker 1: it's only open to residents of the US eighteen or

805
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:06,360
Speaker 1: older eighteen as of June eighteen. That's right. But anyway

806
00:47:06,360 --> 00:47:07,920
Speaker 1: you send him to us, we're gonna read all of them,

807
00:47:07,960 --> 00:47:10,560
Speaker 1: we're gonna judge them. Uh, and then that we're gonna

808
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:13,160
Speaker 1: pick the top sixteen, enterim into a bracket, and it's

809
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:16,640
Speaker 1: gonna be like the thunder Dome until everybody votes on

810
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:18,600
Speaker 1: their favorite, and that favorite one is the one we'll

811
00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:21,760
Speaker 1: read for our Halloween episode. Pretty cool, great idea, Josh's idea.

812
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 1: I think he's already regretting having thought of it because

813
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:29,400
Speaker 1: about complicated contests, are they really really are? Yeh? But

814
00:47:29,560 --> 00:47:31,520
Speaker 1: I don't regret it. No, I'm I'm very anxious and

815
00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:36,239
Speaker 1: um so comic Con to what. Yeah, we're gonna be

816
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:38,719
Speaker 1: at Comic Con in San Diego. You're going to Comic Con.

817
00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:41,360
Speaker 1: You are two? Pal? Oh, that's right, I know. I

818
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:44,279
Speaker 1: booked my ticket. Oh you booked your own. I had

819
00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:47,960
Speaker 1: people book mind for me. Well well, um so, uh

820
00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:50,560
Speaker 1: let's see, we're gonna be a comic Con on Thursday,

821
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:54,279
Speaker 1: July twelve, and we're going to do a live podcast

822
00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 1: at a panel right yeah, right there at the convention center. Uh,

823
00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 1: we do not know what time exactly it. Uh, well,

824
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:03,160
Speaker 1: we'll announce that on Facebook and the like in Twitter.

825
00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:06,160
Speaker 1: And they're supposed to be possibly a special guests. Maybe

826
00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:11,359
Speaker 1: there's gonna be Trappiezes, Monkeys, circus, peanuts, the whole thing. Yeah,

827
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:13,800
Speaker 1: and we can't announce the guests yet because we haven't

828
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:16,720
Speaker 1: locked it down, but hopefully they are in the fringe

829
00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:22,319
Speaker 1: of society. Alright, So comic con horror fiction contests. It's

830
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 1: time now for listen to mail. Uh Josh, I'm gonna

831
00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:30,560
Speaker 1: call this ss k uh teaching America's utes. Okay, Um,

832
00:48:30,920 --> 00:48:35,400
Speaker 1: hi guys and Jerry, I've written before you even mentioned

833
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 1: my podcast our list on your show once. Remember we

834
00:48:38,680 --> 00:48:41,120
Speaker 1: were the doppelgangers because we sent you T shirts that

835
00:48:41,280 --> 00:48:43,680
Speaker 1: you originally thought were you sure? And it was us?

836
00:48:43,719 --> 00:48:45,800
Speaker 1: I remember those guys. Anyway, I wanted to write and

837
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:48,440
Speaker 1: thank you besides being a podcaster. I'm a teacher. My

838
00:48:48,520 --> 00:48:51,919
Speaker 1: fourth graders were going to be dissecting earthworms, and help

839
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:55,600
Speaker 1: prepare them for their first ever dissection, I gave them

840
00:48:55,680 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 1: a homework assignment of listening to the earthworm podcast. Great idea. Um.

841
00:49:01,840 --> 00:49:04,680
Speaker 1: Many had never listened to a podcast before, and I

842
00:49:04,840 --> 00:49:07,280
Speaker 1: was wondering how they would react. And the overall response

843
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:10,440
Speaker 1: was great, except for the three that ended up with seizures.

844
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 1: For some weird reason. They found it funny that you

845
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 1: discussed species pronunciation, which turns out I was wrong. Remember

846
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:21,319
Speaker 1: I said I can't say species. Apparently you can see either.

847
00:49:22,239 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 1: Uh No, I said species. You said it's species or

848
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:29,680
Speaker 1: species or species or species and I said, no, it's

849
00:49:29,719 --> 00:49:33,520
Speaker 1: just species. So you were wrong in that. I just

850
00:49:33,719 --> 00:49:35,480
Speaker 1: just wanted to make sure. I don't really remember it,

851
00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:40,600
Speaker 1: but that's how it, right though. Uh. They found the

852
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:43,799
Speaker 1: facts that you shared amazing. I gave them a questionnaire

853
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:46,359
Speaker 1: to fill out in Mr Zach because spelled the word

854
00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:50,640
Speaker 1: question zach. As they listened in, almost everyone completed their homework,

855
00:49:50,719 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 1: which is no small feed. So thank you for giving

856
00:49:53,280 --> 00:49:55,840
Speaker 1: me another way to reinforce my lessons. You may have

857
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:58,120
Speaker 1: some new fans in exchange, and that is Mr Zach

858
00:49:58,520 --> 00:50:02,520
Speaker 1: at Ease Cooper monest Story Charter in Mount Pleasant, South Carolina.

859
00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:08,359
Speaker 1: Go Coops at Amount Coops Go barrel Makers. Yes, then

860
00:50:08,440 --> 00:50:12,200
Speaker 1: that what Cooper's do? Oh was that a Cooper? Sure?

861
00:50:12,400 --> 00:50:14,800
Speaker 1: I think so, man, I hope it is good. I

862
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:18,120
Speaker 1: hope it is. Um, thanks Zach. It's good to hear

863
00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:21,480
Speaker 1: from you guys again. Uh and uh, where can they

864
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:25,440
Speaker 1: find their podcast? Chuck, It's called our list on iTunes?

865
00:50:25,560 --> 00:50:30,440
Speaker 1: Probably Yeah? Sure, okay, um, usual old Google cool? Uh.

866
00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:34,040
Speaker 1: If we have helped shape children's lives, man, we are

867
00:50:34,280 --> 00:50:37,920
Speaker 1: crazy for that. We always love hearing about that kind

868
00:50:37,960 --> 00:50:40,640
Speaker 1: of stuff. Um, so we want to hear it. Send

869
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:42,759
Speaker 1: it to us. You can tweet to us at s

870
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:45,640
Speaker 1: y s K podcast. You can join us on Facebook

871
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:48,319
Speaker 1: at stuff you Should Know, Facebook dot com slash stuff

872
00:50:48,320 --> 00:50:50,160
Speaker 1: you Should Know um, and you can send us an

873
00:50:50,200 --> 00:51:00,680
Speaker 1: email at stuff podcast at Discovery dot com. For more

874
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:03,360
Speaker 1: on this and thousands of other topics, visit how Stuff

875
00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:06,960
Speaker 1: Works dot com. M