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Speaker 1: Hi. This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of four,

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Speaker 1: an author, journalist, and speaker. And this is Sarah Hart Hunger.

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Speaker 1: I'm a mother of two and soon to be three

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Speaker 1: and a practicing physician. We are two working parents who

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Speaker 1: love our careers and our families. Welcome to best of

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Speaker 1: both worlds. Here we talk about how real women manage work, family,

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Speaker 1: and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping

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Speaker 1: out long term career goals. We want you to get

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Speaker 1: the most out of life. Welcome the best of both worlds.

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Speaker 1: This is Laura, Sarah and I are very excited to

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Speaker 1: have our first guest joining us for episode eleven. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna be talking work life balance with our first guests,

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Speaker 1: and more on that in a little bit. But first, Sarah,

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Speaker 1: what's going on with your life right now? I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure this is like podcast worthy excitement, but the biggest

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Speaker 1: thing that's going on in our lives is that we

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Speaker 1: are moving on out of our house for several days

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Speaker 1: because we are getting tented. And for those who are

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Speaker 1: uninitiated to tinting, because I had actually never heard of

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Speaker 1: it really until moving down here. It's when you have

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Speaker 1: termites and they have to put a noxious gas in

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Speaker 1: your house to kill everything inside of it. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: apparently down here, you know, I could admit this on

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Speaker 1: the air because there's not really a stigma to having

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Speaker 1: such a thing in South Florida. It's pretty much a

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Speaker 1: given that at some point every five years, ten years, whatever,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna happen, just because it's part of our climate here.

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Speaker 1: But it doesn't mean it's very fun. So you have

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Speaker 1: to then move out they blast your house with this stuff,

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Speaker 1: and then how is it then like safe to move

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Speaker 1: back in. Yeah, so well you have to move all

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Speaker 1: your food and cosmetic items out, so anything that would

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Speaker 1: like touch your body or be ingested. So that's kind

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Speaker 1: of the pain of the buck because you have to

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Speaker 1: empty your fridge. I mean, it's actually kind of convenient

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Speaker 1: that we just had a hurricane because because seriously, we

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Speaker 1: like purpose, we're like, well, we know we're getting tented,

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Speaker 1: so we're just not going to buy much, so we're

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Speaker 1: pretty empty coffers to begin with. And then they do

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Speaker 1: the tinting, then they ventilated, and they have some system

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Speaker 1: to measure the chemicals so we'll know it's safe to

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Speaker 1: go back in. And it usually takes like two to

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Speaker 1: three days, so it's not the end of the world,

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Speaker 1: but it has dominated our week. What about you, But

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Speaker 1: it's got to be out of your house for that week,

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Speaker 1: as it was at the hurricane. Now you're out with

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Speaker 1: the termites. It's great, exactly. Now this is much easier, much, much,

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Speaker 1: much easier. Well, what's in your life? Yeah, no, I'm

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Speaker 1: excited that I just joined a choir. I sang for

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Speaker 1: years and years. I sang in choir in college, and

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Speaker 1: then I joined some community choruses when I lived in

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Speaker 1: New York as a young person, and I stayed with one.

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Speaker 1: It was called the Young New Yorker's Chorus for many

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Speaker 1: years until we moved to Pennsylvania about six years ago.

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Speaker 1: And then I hadn't really figured out what I would

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Speaker 1: do here with it, and with lots of little kids,

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Speaker 1: it was kind of hard to start anything. But then

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Speaker 1: I finally realized, well, I should just join my church choir.

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Speaker 1: And my church is large enough that it has a

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Speaker 1: professional director and they have actually hired staff singers, so

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Speaker 1: there's about eight professional singers in the choir to sort

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Speaker 1: of help things along and make it not sound like

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Speaker 1: your average church choir. So it's actually been a lot

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Speaker 1: of fun because we're doing real intense music and I

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Speaker 1: join the Chamber Singers, which is their small group that

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Speaker 1: we do, you know, more challenging stuff. And Sunday we

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Speaker 1: did our first Chamber Singers group singing, and so that

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Speaker 1: was really cool. I like to make music and be

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Speaker 1: singing fun stuff that I'm really learning from. So it's

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Speaker 1: taking quite a bit of time. I mean, that is

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Speaker 1: the one thing about a church choir, as you are

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Speaker 1: singing every week. So we have rehearsals on Thursday nights

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Speaker 1: and then we sing on Sunday mornings, and so it's

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Speaker 1: easily four hours a week. It's often closer to five,

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Speaker 1: which is not a small proportion of the disposable hours

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Speaker 1: I have. Yeah, but I'm loving it, Like I'm really

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Speaker 1: so happy to be getting back into singing, and so

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Speaker 1: you know, it's I felt like the kids are getting

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Speaker 1: a little bit older sometime is opening up. It was

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Speaker 1: it was time to take the plunge. No, that sounds awesome.

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Speaker 1: I think music is very kind of therapeutic. Josh is

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Speaker 1: actually super into the ukulele right now, so like every

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Speaker 1: night he's practicing songs, and I think it's I mean

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Speaker 1: both of us have sort of failed. Well, I was

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Speaker 1: successful for a little bit, but like getting on the

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Speaker 1: meditation train. But I think both of us gravitate more

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Speaker 1: towards like get lost in some other activities. So maybe

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Speaker 1: for you it's singing, for him, it's playing ukulele. I

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Speaker 1: think that's awesome. Maybe I need to take up the ukulele. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he would do duets with you if you did. We

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Speaker 1: are so excited to have our first guest, this time

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Speaker 1: on Best of Both Worlds, Sarah's friend Chavn. Sir, you

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Speaker 1: want to go ahead and introduce chaven to us. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is my really good friend, Chavonn Brady. We met

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Speaker 1: as running partners in North Carolina way back in the day,

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Speaker 1: and I wanted to have her as our very first guest,

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Speaker 1: first of all, because I think she deserves such an honor,

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Speaker 1: and second of all, because this is our first time

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Speaker 1: doing any kind of three way recording session, so we

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Speaker 1: wanted it to go smoothly with someone who might understand

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Speaker 1: if it didn't. Chavon was picked as the guest who

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Speaker 1: is least likely to have plane screwed. That's right, A

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Speaker 1: really interesting and cool choice because she is a genetics

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Speaker 1: professor at the UC Davis in Davis, California, near Sacramento,

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Speaker 1: and she has a pretty wild and crazy job that

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Speaker 1: she's going to tell us all about. She also has

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Speaker 1: two boys. Tell me exactly how old they are right now.

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Speaker 1: So Kieran is eight years old and Shia is four

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Speaker 1: years old but almost turning five. Oh my goodness. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: you are a great representative of someone who's sort of

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Speaker 1: out of the baby phase completely, so that'll be new

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Speaker 1: for this podcast as well. I mean, Laura's in both

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Speaker 1: places and I still feel like my kids are so young,

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Speaker 1: but you you have big kids, so that's exciting. And

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Speaker 1: you and your husband have some really unusual and interesting

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Speaker 1: circumstances that I think will make your situation interesting to

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Speaker 1: our listeners. And we're just so excited to start having

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Speaker 1: some guests so we can have other voices chime in

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Speaker 1: on how they do things and make life work. And

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Speaker 1: Savon's also an amazing choice because she makes it work

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Speaker 1: in a very a least it appears from the outside

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Speaker 1: a very happy and exciting and full way. I'm always

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Speaker 1: looking at amazing pictures that she takes on her travel opportunities.

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Speaker 1: But yet when I see her with her kids, it's

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Speaker 1: clear that there's a bond and they enjoy their family

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Speaker 1: time too, So I thought she'd be a great one

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Speaker 1: to open up and tell us how she does it.

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Speaker 1: I am super honored to be here. Thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for thinking of me as your first guest. You're welcome. So, Okay,

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Speaker 1: before I get into some of my questions, tell us

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Speaker 1: a little bit about sort of the nature of your

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Speaker 1: the time, nature of your work, because as a professor,

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Speaker 1: I would assume that it's pretty all encompassing. So tell

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Speaker 1: us a little bit abo about that, including the travel,

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Speaker 1: and then also how your husband's schedule fits into things.

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Speaker 1: Got it, Okay, So my schedule is super all encompassing

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Speaker 1: in that I think that as a university professor, particularly

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Speaker 1: in the research domain, so where you're at like a

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Speaker 1: Division one university, that's where if you're a scientist, you

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Speaker 1: have to run a research lab. You also have to teach,

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Speaker 1: and then you also have to participate in your international

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Speaker 1: in your community, both internationally nationally as well as within

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Speaker 1: your campus. So you could spend every single hour a

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Speaker 1: day working if you could continue to exist as a

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Speaker 1: human being. But I can't, so I try to be

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Speaker 1: at work actually in the university building during the working

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Speaker 1: hours during the day, and so that for me usually

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Speaker 1: is between eight thirty in the morning to five thirty

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Speaker 1: at night. I also try a couple of days a

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Speaker 1: week because that's not enough time for me to be

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Speaker 1: able to finish everything I need to do. I try

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Speaker 1: two days a week to come in a little bit earlier,

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Speaker 1: so between seven thirty to eight o'clock, and to stay

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Speaker 1: until six o'clock in the evening. That's what's required of

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Speaker 1: me in terms of my physical work face to face hours,

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Speaker 1: but my day starts extra early, so I try to

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Speaker 1: wake up between five o'clock and five thirty. I try

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Speaker 1: to work for a half an hour to an hour

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Speaker 1: before I exercise, and then in the evenings I usually

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Speaker 1: spend about a half an hour working, and then weekends,

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Speaker 1: I usually try to work for at least two hours

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Speaker 1: on Sundays and then answer emails occasionally. Do you tend

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Speaker 1: to take Saturdays off? Is that your day of rest

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Speaker 1: or what I tend to take Saturdays off? Yes, one

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Speaker 1: hundred percent. That is my day of rest. And that's

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Speaker 1: and also Friday night, and those are the I mean,

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Speaker 1: I really try to never do anything work wise, because

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Speaker 1: I've realized that if I do end up working those days,

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Speaker 1: then I'm pretty miserable and grumpy during the week. So

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Speaker 1: does your lab work because I know I hear a

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Speaker 1: lot from professors and the sciences that the lab work

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Speaker 1: can be pretty unpredictable. Is that something? Yes? And I

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Speaker 1: am in actually the fortunate position or unfortunate, so I

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Speaker 1: don't do much lab work. I mean, I got my

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Speaker 1: job because of my ability to do lab work well,

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Speaker 1: but I mostly spend my time these days managing You

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Speaker 1: got the writing emails? Yeah, the graduate students and the

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Speaker 1: postocs and undergraduates are the ones doing the work, and

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Speaker 1: I am the one trying to identify research funds and

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Speaker 1: to write up our research findings. Okay, that's cool. And

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Speaker 1: the kids, what's kind of their schedule? With the kids'

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Speaker 1: schedule is actually fairly predictable in that so the youngest

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Speaker 1: wakes up around six thirty in the morning, and the

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Speaker 1: oldest would happily sleep until seven fifteen, but the youngest

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Speaker 1: wakes up the older one a little bit earlier, and

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Speaker 1: then the oldest one goes into school, so he's in

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Speaker 1: the third grade. School starts at eight twenty five in

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Speaker 1: the morning, woo, and so yes, for those morning hours.

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Speaker 1: Are your kids old enough now that you're actually able

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Speaker 1: to just get some work done or do you Is

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Speaker 1: your husband sort of in charge of them at that point?

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Speaker 1: Or how do you guys manage it? I see so,

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Speaker 1: Actually so Jeremy so he leaves for work anywhere between

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Speaker 1: six forty five and seven fifteen in the morning early, yes, early,

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Speaker 1: So it's impossible to get work done once they're awake,

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Speaker 1: and I try to not. Actually, so, I feel like

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Speaker 1: because during the work week there's so little time that

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Speaker 1: I get to spend with them. Anytime that they're awake

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Speaker 1: and I'm home, I'm just with them. So you try

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Speaker 1: to get that work done. You say, to get up

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Speaker 1: at like five, do some work? You fit in a

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Speaker 1: workout at home? I guess because they're still there, Yes,

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Speaker 1: at home, or I go to the gym. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: got it. And then as soon as you get home,

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Speaker 1: Jeremy's usually off. It's like that kind of Jeremy is

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Speaker 1: usually off. Yep, exactly, okay, yes, And then so along

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Speaker 1: the way, over the last couple of years, actually, inspired

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Speaker 1: by you, Sarah, so we finally decided to get a

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Speaker 1: babysitter to come in and help me along the way

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Speaker 1: in those mornings, so that instead of me just like

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Speaker 1: rushing everybody along their way and feeling completely panicked and

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Speaker 1: anxiety ridden by the time that I would leave the house,

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Speaker 1: she just she's kind of like a mother's helper, so

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Speaker 1: she helps me, you know, like we do everything together

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Speaker 1: so collectively. You know, like one person will get the

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Speaker 1: kids dressed, one person will be unloading the dishwasher, you know,

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Speaker 1: and then you know, the person who's onloading the dishwasher

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Speaker 1: is also helping make breakfast for the kids. And then

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Speaker 1: you know, and then I'm getting my lunch ready and

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm getting changed, and then she's making sure

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Speaker 1: that they eat, and then we do homework together. And

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Speaker 1: then I try, I really really try hard to have

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Speaker 1: at least like twenty minutes of like playtime or reading

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Speaker 1: time together. Oh that's awfo we head off. I feel

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Speaker 1: like you've hired out what, you know, if your husband

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Speaker 1: didn't have to leave so so early, what he would

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Speaker 1: normally be doing. So that totally makes sense, beautiful, What

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Speaker 1: what hours does she work? That's that's kind of cool

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Speaker 1: because I think a lot of ours it depends on

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Speaker 1: my workout schedule. So usually I like to work out

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Speaker 1: between like I like to be done between six forty

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Speaker 1: five and seven, So she comes around six forty five,

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Speaker 1: so she kind of like starts getting everything in place

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Speaker 1: so that when I arrive, we can just start. Oh

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Speaker 1: that's perfect, speaking of word, it's very structured. How So

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Speaker 1: a little background for everyone. Fun and I met when

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Speaker 1: we were in the throes of like marathon mania. Neither

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Speaker 1: of us had kids, we had you know, jobs, but

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Speaker 1: we wanted something really exciting and fun on the side,

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Speaker 1: So we did a lot of distance running. We got

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Speaker 1: really like nerdy into it. We actually met, I love

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Speaker 1: it fun on this side with distance running, like let's

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Speaker 1: just all pass like it's like eighteen mile runs in

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Speaker 1: Duke Forest with a group like that kind of a thing.

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Speaker 1: And then we eventually became running partners. But both of us,

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Speaker 1: well at least I have definitely had to slow down

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Speaker 1: in the past couple of years since having kids. I

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Speaker 1: still run quite a bit, but not nearly of that intensity.

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Speaker 1: So what are you like how Like this is a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a segue, but tell us a little

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Speaker 1: bit about what kind of workouts you do now and

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Speaker 1: how you fit that in and also how you handle

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Speaker 1: it when you're on the road. So workouts, okay. So

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Speaker 1: one thing that I know and that Sarah knows, is

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Speaker 1: like I absolutely need to exercise in order to keep

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Speaker 1: my sanity. I used to be super into distance running,

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Speaker 1: and I loved running marathons, and I loved training and

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Speaker 1: getting faster. But the amount of time input that it

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Speaker 1: takes to train for a marathon is just not really

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Speaker 1: conducive with my schedule. And I realized that kind of

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Speaker 1: pretty much as soon as I had my first son.

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Speaker 1: I would still like to run another marathon one day,

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Speaker 1: but I think it's good because we're going to do

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Speaker 1: one together eventually. Yeah, yes, we're going to run one together.

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Speaker 1: So what do I do in the meantime. So I've

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Speaker 1: actually really transformed my workout routines over the last two years,

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Speaker 1: in part because I also had a bad accident. So

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Speaker 1: I fell off my bike in a very slow, non

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Speaker 1: graceful motion and tore my acl and broke my tibia,

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Speaker 1: and then I broke my ankle a few months later,

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Speaker 1: and then I had to have reconstructive surgery. I cannot

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Speaker 1: run as much as I used to, so I try

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Speaker 1: to run a couple of days a week anywhere from

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Speaker 1: three to five miles. And then I have really started

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Speaker 1: to embrace spinning and cycling, and so I try to

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Speaker 1: go to spin class two days a week. I've also

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Speaker 1: started doing a little bit more long distance cycling. So

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Speaker 1: I'm going to run, I'm gonna ride my first century,

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Speaker 1: and then I throw in yoga once a week, and

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Speaker 1: and then my husband and I with two of our

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Speaker 1: other friends, we actually go to a personal trainer as

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Speaker 1: like our fun date night date to day once a

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Speaker 1: week and then we work out together. That is awesome.

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Speaker 1: That is so how do you handle all that when

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Speaker 1: you're traveling. I've seen you do some beautiful runs in

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Speaker 1: different locales. Yes, So when I travel, I find that

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Speaker 1: the like the easiest thing to do is to run,

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Speaker 1: because you can, you know, you just have to put

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Speaker 1: your running shoes. I always pack my running shoes. I

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Speaker 1: never don't pack my running shoes, and so I always

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Speaker 1: try to Whenever I get to whatever destination I get to,

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Speaker 1: I usually have a few hours before I end up

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Speaker 1: having to do anything, and those are the times that

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Speaker 1: I always immediately go and run for at least a

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Speaker 1: half hour, and I find that that really adapts my

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Speaker 1: clock to the environment that I'll be in. And then

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Speaker 1: you know, I usually try to run every other day

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Speaker 1: when I'm away at work, or I do yoga, So

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Speaker 1: I subscribe to Yoga Glow, and so I do online

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Speaker 1: practice in the mornings, and then I always try to

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Speaker 1: do some sort of like hike or walk or something

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Speaker 1: during my trips away. Do you have to sort of

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Speaker 1: scout that out beforehand and so that you make sure

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Speaker 1: you're not staying in some like I don't know, horrible

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Speaker 1: strip moment. Yeah, there's no light. And there are times

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Speaker 1: where like like for instance, so especially when I go

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Speaker 1: to foreign countries, like so I was in Brazil and

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Speaker 1: once and I did not look properly and I started

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Speaker 1: running and I clearly ran into a neighborhood where like

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Speaker 1: I started to feel really unsafe. So I usually I

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Speaker 1: usually tried to map out my runs ahead of time,

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Speaker 1: and so I just go online and I figure out

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Speaker 1: where my hotel is and where the nearest you know,

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Speaker 1: kind of park is, and then I look online for

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Speaker 1: runners who post their runs in the nearby areas and

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Speaker 1: I make sure that it's it's it's kind of safe.

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Speaker 1: And then I also ask as soon as I arrive

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Speaker 1: at whatever hotel I'm staying at, I go over my

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Speaker 1: routes with them to make sure that it's safe. That

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Speaker 1: sounds very smart, yes, yeah, And then there are some

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Speaker 1: places where I can't run, right, like in Ethiopia. Like

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Speaker 1: I can't run in Ethiopia, so you know, So then

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Speaker 1: I always try to pick a hotel that has a

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Speaker 1: gym if it's clear that there aren't any areas outside

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Speaker 1: where I can run. So tell us a little more

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Speaker 1: about So you do tons of travel for work, how

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Speaker 1: do you manage or maybe you do, maybe you don't.

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Speaker 1: It looks to me like some you managed to fit

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Speaker 1: in fun during those times. How do you do that,

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Speaker 1: like without the guilt factor when you know, like you know,

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Speaker 1: the whole thing could be work, But it seems like

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Speaker 1: you're able to kind of find a balance there, right,

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Speaker 1: So I have. I think I'm lucky in that I

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Speaker 1: work really really well on planes. So if I'm if

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Speaker 1: I'm flying during the day or during like daylight hours,

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Speaker 1: because I don't have like the kids around, I can

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Speaker 1: just like plug in my headphones and I can just

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Speaker 1: like work nonstoff and not be interrupted. So I usually

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Speaker 1: end up having my plane rides be so productive that

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Speaker 1: I am able to schedule some time in during whatever

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Speaker 1: conference I'm in to do something fun. And I love

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Speaker 1: traveling like I've always loved traveling. I think my family

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Speaker 1: thinks that I have something wrong with me in terms

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Speaker 1: of how much I love traveling. I feel like give

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Speaker 1: them an idea of scale. Here, like lists the last

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Speaker 1: five places you've been. Okay, so the last here, I

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Speaker 1: have to look okay, So the last five places. So

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Speaker 1: I was in Chile last week, and then I didn't

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Speaker 1: travel for a while, except for in the beginning of August,

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Speaker 1: I was in Vermont, and then I had another UH

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Speaker 1: and then I went to Toronto to pick up my kids.

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Speaker 1: And then I was in New York, and then I

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Speaker 1: was in Hawaii, and then I was in Saint Louis, Missouri,

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Speaker 1: and then I was in Belgium. Okay, and all there

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Speaker 1: you go. All that work related. For the most part,

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Speaker 1: all was work related. All is work related, except for

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Speaker 1: picking up my kids in Toronto, and except for and

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Speaker 1: then my husband and I went to Hawaii. How did

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Speaker 1: you pull off the Hawaii as a work destination? So

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Speaker 1: the Hawaii we actually had an editorial board meeting in Hawaii.

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Speaker 1: My son, my oldest son, he has started going to

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Speaker 1: a camp in Ontario for it's like a four week

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Speaker 1: long sleep away camp, which he absolutely adores. And then

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Speaker 1: my youngest son for four weeks during the summer when

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Speaker 1: I'm in the middle of all of my work travel,

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Speaker 1: children go to Canada. So our family is from Canada,

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Speaker 1: and so the oldest son goes to a sleep away camp,

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Speaker 1: to a Jewish sleepway camp, and then the youngest one

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Speaker 1: stays with his grandparents and goes to a day camp.

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Speaker 1: This overlaps completely with an editorial board meeting that I

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Speaker 1: had in Hawaii. So I went to the editorial board meeting.

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Speaker 1: My husband dropped the kids off in Toronto and then

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Speaker 1: he flew directly to Hawaii. So we had three nights

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Speaker 1: in Hawaii. That sounds really awesome. It was really nice.

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Speaker 1: Sounds amazing, and we were kind of lame and we

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Speaker 1: mostly just like slept in very comfortable beds. As the

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Speaker 1: therapeutic in its own, right, I mean, sometimes that's all

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Speaker 1: you need. It was really really nice here, so intense

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Speaker 1: the rest of the time, right right, exactly. Yeah, So

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Speaker 1: going back to your husband, since we went on that

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Speaker 1: big travel tangent. We kind of went through the beginning

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Speaker 1: of your day. At the end of the day, do

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Speaker 1: you have the same babysitter come back? And what time

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Speaker 1: does Jeremy get back or does he stay away for

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Speaker 1: is he flying every day or does he stay away

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Speaker 1: for like four days at a time. So I'll start

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Speaker 1: off with when I come back, I arrive home sometime

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Speaker 1: between five thirty and six, And then with the babysitter,

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Speaker 1: we figure out who is so we figure out who

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Speaker 1: is going to pick up or drop off Keran. So

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Speaker 1: the most of our babysitters have so we've been really

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Speaker 1: really lucky. We had one for a long time who

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Speaker 1: was basically like part of our family, and she traveled

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Speaker 1: us with us when we went to the Netherlands. She

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Speaker 1: handled both morning and evenings. She actually identified a new

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Speaker 1: babysitter for us who's part of her program, and she

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Speaker 1: is amazing, but she does she has a class eight

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Speaker 1: o'clock in the morning. So now we have like a

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Speaker 1: different babysitter in the morning from the one in the evening,

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Speaker 1: which like schedule wise, is not what I wanted, but

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Speaker 1: the one in the evening is like, she's so amazing

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Speaker 1: that I wanted to make it work, and she's really

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Speaker 1: really she's like, she's really really good with my youngest son.

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Speaker 1: So she and I work it out so that like

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Speaker 1: some days, so I tried two days a week to

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Speaker 1: pick up my youngest son from school by bicycle because

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Speaker 1: he likes to ride to school by bicycle. And then

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Speaker 1: she picks up the younger one from his daycare and

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Speaker 1: we come home, and then she helps prepare dinner, and

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Speaker 1: we kind of all prepare dinner together and then work

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Speaker 1: through my son's homework, the oldest son's homework. The youngest son,

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Speaker 1: you know, also needs like a lot of attention during

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Speaker 1: that time. And then we go ahead and then we

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Speaker 1: all eat dinner together. When my husband comes home anywhere

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Speaker 1: between six forty five to seven fifteen. Oh, so he

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Speaker 1: comes home every night. Now that's le So he comes

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Speaker 1: home every night except for the well, he comes home

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Speaker 1: every night most of the time. Some days he doesn't.

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Speaker 1: So he actually flies to work on yeah, which sounds

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Speaker 1: a little bit crazy. He has a friend who flies

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Speaker 1: to Palo Alto because if he drives, it's like literally

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Speaker 1: a three and a half hour drive each way. So

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Speaker 1: for two years he stayed away from Monday to Thursday,

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Speaker 1: which was really really really really hard. And so now

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Speaker 1: he either flies or he drives, and so he probably

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Speaker 1: if you were to like average it out, about seventy

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Speaker 1: five percent of the time he flies and then the

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Speaker 1: other twenty five percent of the time he drives, which

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Speaker 1: is really just horrible for him because it's like a

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Speaker 1: seven hour commute. No that's total. That's awful. I mean

431
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:06,120
Speaker 1: three and a half hours in one way as a commute.

432
00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:10,280
Speaker 1: That's awful. But you guys have chosen to live closer

433
00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:15,640
Speaker 1: to Davis than Yes, and so this was like our

434
00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:20,880
Speaker 1: big compromise. So we're like a two career couple. I

435
00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 1: was really really lucky that he followed me around during

436
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:28,960
Speaker 1: my post graduate training and then he you know, got

437
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 1: this job opportunity at Apple, which was like really the

438
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,600
Speaker 1: opportunity of his dreams, and so we just we had

439
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:36,119
Speaker 1: to figure out how to make it work. Like we

440
00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:38,720
Speaker 1: chose to live in Davis because Davis is a great

441
00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 1: community to raise children in and it's closer for me

442
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:46,520
Speaker 1: to work, and I'm close to an airport for travel

443
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 1: if I need. And the thing that kind of suffers

444
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,320
Speaker 1: is that some days he has to drive. But the

445
00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:55,280
Speaker 1: most important thing is is that he's home every single night,

446
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:58,240
Speaker 1: which was really really hard for those two years when

447
00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:01,680
Speaker 1: he was away from Monday to Thursday. I can imagine

448
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 1: that would be really hard, especially because that was when

449
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:08,720
Speaker 1: your kids were little. Yeah, exactly, and then I, you know,

450
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 1: like and then I didn't have so I didn't have

451
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:14,000
Speaker 1: a babysitter for a while, And so when I say

452
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:15,479
Speaker 1: it was hard, I would say it was probably the

453
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 1: hardest time of my life because I just I was

454
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 1: trying to do it all without any help and to

455
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 1: be like a super mother, and I thought that I was,

456
00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:26,760
Speaker 1: you know, many times that I was going to break,

457
00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 1: Like it was too much stress for like one person

458
00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:32,720
Speaker 1: to have to deal with, and so just having somebody

459
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 1: else to help now it turns out, has made things

460
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 1: like a lot easier. And it was probably hard on

461
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:40,399
Speaker 1: the relationship too. I mean, I can certainly sympathize that

462
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,879
Speaker 1: if one's partner was gone from Monday to Thursday, that

463
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,879
Speaker 1: your interactions with him from Friday to Sunday may not

464
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:53,159
Speaker 1: have been the most loving constantly both It's like you

465
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:55,480
Speaker 1: were both working, but you felt like you were doing

466
00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:57,119
Speaker 1: all the home stuff, so you'd kind of want it

467
00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:58,960
Speaker 1: you'd be like, Okay, now it's your turn, but he'd

468
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 1: be like, but I was working, you know exactly, and

469
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 1: she was hired too. Yeah, and then and then your

470
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:06,920
Speaker 1: time is spent, you know, trying to be like one

471
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 1: hundred percent present for the kids. But then there's there's

472
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,120
Speaker 1: no downtime, right, and so so we really really worked

473
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,400
Speaker 1: on it. Right, Like we have date nights once a week,

474
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 1: and you know, we we we try to carve out

475
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:21,639
Speaker 1: like the time that we have with the children. We

476
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,639
Speaker 1: tried to make it very you know, when both of

477
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 1: us are present as well as just when I'm present.

478
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:29,399
Speaker 1: We try to make it like very full on just

479
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:33,240
Speaker 1: the kids without any other distractions. And then the time

480
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:34,800
Speaker 1: for work is the time for work. And then we

481
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:37,640
Speaker 1: also now carve out very specifically time for the two

482
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,919
Speaker 1: of us. That is awesome. Well, I had one last question,

483
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:44,840
Speaker 1: which has to do with kind of how things have evolved.

484
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:47,080
Speaker 1: Now there's in your case, there's a lot of variables

485
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:50,040
Speaker 1: because things have changed, but you have also kind of

486
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 1: graduated from little kidland to big kid land, which, as

487
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 1: I talked about, Laura and I, you know, haven't really

488
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,959
Speaker 1: made that transition yet because she still has a two

489
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 1: year old and I still have a almost four year old,

490
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 1: but being pregnant kind of mess all that up. So

491
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:06,240
Speaker 1: I want to hear what it's like on the other

492
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 1: side and whether what you find harder what you find easier.

493
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 1: You know. One thing that we've gotten some reader you know,

494
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:15,199
Speaker 1: feedback on was sort of people saying thank you for

495
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,160
Speaker 1: admitting that, like, the toddler years are really really difficult.

496
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,400
Speaker 1: And something that I kind of winset sometimes is people

497
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:24,320
Speaker 1: are like bigger kids, bigger problems, blah blah, and I'm like, yeah,

498
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:26,479
Speaker 1: but you're not following them around to make sure they

499
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:30,200
Speaker 1: don't die. So I was just I was just curious

500
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:32,560
Speaker 1: on your perspective on how things have changed and what

501
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:35,720
Speaker 1: you're enjoying more or what you miss and what it's like.

502
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:40,600
Speaker 1: The toddler years are so hard. There is like it's

503
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,280
Speaker 1: exhausting because the time that you spend with them, you're

504
00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:49,399
Speaker 1: they aren't moving logically irrationally yes, and you're always trying,

505
00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 1: like you said, to make sure that they survive. My

506
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:57,119
Speaker 1: oldest was so much easier. Always the youngest. I gleaned

507
00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 1: that the youngest from the age which is like three

508
00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 1: and a half to four and a half. He just

509
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 1: developmentally like he was. He doesn't like change. He requires

510
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 1: like a you know, a huge amount of interaction. He's

511
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: you know, like the oldest one is very extroverted. The

512
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,160
Speaker 1: youngest one is very introverted. And so it's really taken

513
00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 1: time and the development of a lot of patience for

514
00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,560
Speaker 1: me to figure it out. But I feel like now

515
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,119
Speaker 1: with so the youngest one, he's he's going to be

516
00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 1: five in a month, and he it's so much easier.

517
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,280
Speaker 1: It's so much easier because I can like talk with

518
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: him and we can work things out together. I can

519
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,680
Speaker 1: figure out when he's upset, and I can ask him

520
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 1: why he's upset, and we can kind of work it

521
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: out a little bit more. And then the older one. Actually,

522
00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:50,760
Speaker 1: the one thing that I would say that's the hardest

523
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:53,879
Speaker 1: for the older one right now is that when he

524
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:58,719
Speaker 1: has free time, he doesn't necessarily want to spend that

525
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 1: free time with me. He wants to spend his free

526
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:04,439
Speaker 1: time with his friends. That is hard. That is that

527
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 1: is like so hard, right and so and so he

528
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: even says, like the other day he said to me,

529
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:10,480
Speaker 1: like he was like, oh, I want to go see

530
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 1: my friend. I want to go see my friend next door.

531
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:14,960
Speaker 1: I see he's outside, and I was like, oh, but

532
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:17,000
Speaker 1: but I just came home. And then he goes, oh,

533
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,600
Speaker 1: I don't want to disappoint you, and I was like, oh,

534
00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:23,399
Speaker 1: it's okay, You're not disappointing me. This is important. You

535
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:24,960
Speaker 1: go and you see your friend, and then we're just

536
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 1: going to make sure that we have like quality time.

537
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 1: So we try to work in like quality time. Yeah.

538
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:33,400
Speaker 1: The other really exciting thing that we can do now

539
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 1: is we can have like just one on one time

540
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 1: with each child, which was always harder because the youngest

541
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 1: really just like you know, monopolized a huge amount of

542
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 1: our attention. But now because he's you know, growing a

543
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:49,160
Speaker 1: little bit in maturity, you know, we can have just

544
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:51,920
Speaker 1: like mommy and Shya days or Daddy and Shya days,

545
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 1: and mommy and Kuran days and Daddy and Kuran days.

546
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:57,560
Speaker 1: So that's actually something that's really really nice that we're

547
00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:59,080
Speaker 1: able to do, and that for me at least, feels

548
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 1: like very enriching and that I think I really love.

549
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,120
Speaker 1: I totally get that because I'm there with my older

550
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 1: one who actually has been here this whole time, and

551
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: it's been like silent and good, and yet my younger

552
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:12,240
Speaker 1: one like like, forget it, it's not really fun yet.

553
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:15,200
Speaker 1: It will be probably right around that five mark, the

554
00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:18,520
Speaker 1: four to five that development will switch, that goes off.

555
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 1: So okay, that's one wonderful And then and then the

556
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:23,840
Speaker 1: other thing that has also become so much easier now too,

557
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:28,840
Speaker 1: is like dinnertime. So dinner time used to be uh this,

558
00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: this is the way to perfectly describe dinnertime. You know,

559
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 1: you come home, you spend a huge amount of time

560
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:37,040
Speaker 1: cooking a meal that is healthy, you know, that has

561
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 1: everything separated into like their little categories already, and you've

562
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 1: got your protein and you've got your fiber and you've

563
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 1: got your carbs, and you know, it's like colorful. And

564
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: then they sit down and then you know, next ensues

565
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 1: five minutes of I don't like this, Why I don't

566
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 1: want to eat this. I just want macaroni and cheese.

567
00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,360
Speaker 1: And then you know, and then you're exhausted and you're tired,

568
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 1: and you know, I really think that family dinners are

569
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:05,720
Speaker 1: super important, but then you just sometimes just like leave

570
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 1: your family dinner just feeling exhausted and totally drained. Right,

571
00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 1: But now lately we've actually started having conversations Like last

572
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,560
Speaker 1: night we asked, you know, what what the kids thought

573
00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:21,960
Speaker 1: marriage was and what they thought love was. And this

574
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 1: was like the first time in like so like that

575
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 1: I can even really remember where we had this like

576
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:31,360
Speaker 1: really lovely conversation with them, So so that makes it

577
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:34,840
Speaker 1: a lot easier. That is so so cool. They become

578
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:38,880
Speaker 1: really like eventually they do become real people, right and

579
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:40,680
Speaker 1: then like you know, like I miss the baby stage.

580
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:43,480
Speaker 1: I miss like holding and cuddling them, and then you

581
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:47,040
Speaker 1: know kind of like they're like watching them learn how

582
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,719
Speaker 1: to you know, kind of take on the world. But

583
00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:53,440
Speaker 1: then there is that yeah, like when they're discovering things

584
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: for the first time, it's beautiful, but it's it's exhausting.

585
00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 1: And then and then accompanying that with just also like

586
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 1: the guilt of like I'm exhausted, but like I haven't

587
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:08,440
Speaker 1: seen them, right, and so now I feel like we're

588
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:13,080
Speaker 1: all used to our schedule and we're happy with what

589
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: we with what we have in the time that we have,

590
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:19,080
Speaker 1: and so there's like there's there's less guilt involved. So

591
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 1: that's a good thing. Definitely a good thing. Oh my gosh, Well,

592
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:25,360
Speaker 1: our listeners I think are gonna love hearing this. If

593
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,360
Speaker 1: you have questions for Chavon, you can you can direct

594
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:31,560
Speaker 1: them to me or to Laura, either through social media

595
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 1: or on Laura's blog or my blog. But I am

596
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 1: thrilled to have gotten to share her with everyone and

597
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:41,840
Speaker 1: stay tuned because I don't think we plan on a

598
00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:45,240
Speaker 1: guest every week, but certainly every other or at least

599
00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 1: every few episodes will be having new and exciting voices

600
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 1: on this podcast. So thank you so much, Chevon for

601
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: being the very first. Wait wait, chaven has agreed to

602
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:58,160
Speaker 1: stick around to give her Love of the week too,

603
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 1: so before we let put up very I'm very intrigued

604
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:07,720
Speaker 1: about her love. I heard a little taste of it first.

605
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:12,719
Speaker 1: My love of the week is time Trackers, which sounds

606
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:17,080
Speaker 1: so ridiculous, but like, I really, but why do you?

607
00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 1: Why don't you explain why you love them so? Time

608
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:24,560
Speaker 1: Trackers because I feel like I have only a certain

609
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 1: number of hours in a day to do things, and

610
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 1: I want to make sure that each time I do

611
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 1: one of those things that I give them my full attention,

612
00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:35,840
Speaker 1: and I want to make sure that I can maximize

613
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 1: my productivity and efficiency so that I can spend the

614
00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:41,160
Speaker 1: time that I need to with my family, and so

615
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 1: I've been I've been doing this program lately, which it's

616
00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:48,440
Speaker 1: like this National Center for Faculty Development and Diversity, and

617
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 1: they have this writing timer which is part of their program.

618
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:55,479
Speaker 1: And I have learned in the meantime that there's this

619
00:32:55,600 --> 00:33:00,680
Speaker 1: whole suite of other timers that you can have to

620
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 1: actually go through your day and to figure out how

621
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 1: much of your time you're spending on specific topics. So,

622
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 1: for instance, I like to time the amount of time

623
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 1: that I write for work. I like to time the

624
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:16,880
Speaker 1: amount of time that I spend for exercise. I like

625
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:19,280
Speaker 1: to time the amount of time that I spend on

626
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:27,760
Speaker 1: looking at email or Facebook or sadly, celebrity gossip curiosity.

627
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:30,360
Speaker 1: How much time does the celebrity gossip get in your

628
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:33,320
Speaker 1: time track. I'm trying so hard to reduce it. So

629
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 1: I think I'm down to like twenty minutes, but I

630
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:37,480
Speaker 1: can tell you that it used to be a whole

631
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 1: lot more. I'm working on I'm working on it. I

632
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,520
Speaker 1: figure it's like, you know, everybody's got to have like

633
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:47,600
Speaker 1: their little you know habit. Right, it's not smoking cigarettes,

634
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 1: it's celebrity gossip. Yeah, And if it makes you happy

635
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:53,640
Speaker 1: and you're intentionally doing it and you're cool with twenty minutes,

636
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:57,200
Speaker 1: then that's perfect. Ye. Yeah. I think the big thing

637
00:33:57,240 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 1: is that I'm trying to like spend the time that

638
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 1: I spend doing the day in intentionally yes, you awareness,

639
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,080
Speaker 1: with absolute purpose, Yes, because that is I felt, like,

640
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 1: you know, several years ago, I was just rushing from

641
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:09,839
Speaker 1: task to task to task and just thinking like where

642
00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:12,759
Speaker 1: is time going? And so you actual act of just

643
00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:15,839
Speaker 1: recording my time every day and then getting all these

644
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:19,319
Speaker 1: numbers in a spreadsheet and looking to see how much

645
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 1: time I spend on each of these tasks has been

646
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:26,200
Speaker 1: really revealing. That is so cool. Do you have a

647
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:27,960
Speaker 1: specific is there an app that you use that you

648
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,800
Speaker 1: want to share with everyone? So there is this app

649
00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 1: called time Logger and time Tracker. You can find it

650
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:36,719
Speaker 1: on Google. And then there's and then there's another app

651
00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: that I'm using as part of as part of the program,

652
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 1: the program. Okay, cool, Well I love that level of

653
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:44,320
Speaker 1: the week. We'll keep you captive while we share ours

654
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:46,239
Speaker 1: really quick, because I thought you might like you might,

655
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:48,120
Speaker 1: I think you know about mine. But my love of

656
00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:51,840
Speaker 1: the week this week is bar workouts b A R R.

657
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 1: Not like going to a bar, which I feel like

658
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:55,879
Speaker 1: confuses everybody when I'm like, I'm going to a bar

659
00:34:55,960 --> 00:35:01,120
Speaker 1: and they're like, what, you're really pregnant. But bar has

660
00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:03,680
Speaker 1: been the only way that I don't hate strength training,

661
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 1: and I want to not hate strength training because I

662
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,040
Speaker 1: think it's like such a huge bang for your buck

663
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:13,360
Speaker 1: in terms of like vanity, and that's what matters right now.

664
00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:16,040
Speaker 1: I'm just kidding, but seriously, I mean, I feel like

665
00:35:16,120 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 1: I could run as many miles as I used to,

666
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:21,839
Speaker 1: and it's you get so much, you know, just more

667
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:24,200
Speaker 1: like vitality and just the physical kind of results. And

668
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,320
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about like bouncing back from the baby and

669
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,320
Speaker 1: all that with strength. But I hate, like actually lifting

670
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:32,160
Speaker 1: weights in a gym. Bar to me is like the

671
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:35,800
Speaker 1: only compromise that is actually fun for me that I've found.

672
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: Yoga's kind of but I don't feel like it's quite

673
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:42,040
Speaker 1: like burney enough to quite provide that effects. So this

674
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:45,760
Speaker 1: is more probably like your personal training. And specifically I've

675
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:47,879
Speaker 1: gone to some studio classes which are great, but they

676
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 1: take a lot of time. I do BAR three online

677
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:55,359
Speaker 1: and again non sponsored, but it's a monthly thing where

678
00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:57,400
Speaker 1: you could do as many as you want it's awesome

679
00:35:57,400 --> 00:35:59,880
Speaker 1: for travel. You can do ones that have like small weights.

680
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 1: There's even ones that don't use weight, some of the

681
00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:05,960
Speaker 1: US resistance bands, and they are my only non hated

682
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:08,880
Speaker 1: strength training. So that's my love of the week. I

683
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 1: love bar two. It is awesome. I should do more strength.

684
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 1: I have not been doing anything I really should. But

685
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,399
Speaker 1: my love of the week is something my kids are

686
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 1: doing active. I have two of my kids are in karate,

687
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 1: and the really cool thing about the studio we go

688
00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 1: to is they have about six classes per week for

689
00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:30,640
Speaker 1: each of the sort of age group and ability levels,

690
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 1: and you don't have to commit to which one or

691
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 1: two you want to go to. So I love that flexibility.

692
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:40,640
Speaker 1: So if one week we want to bring them to

693
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 1: Monday and Thursday, that's fine. If the next week we're

694
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 1: at Tuesday and Friday, or Wednesday and Saturday, or Monday

695
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 1: and Tuesday, it's okay. And they don't force you to

696
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 1: commit to any particular schedule. And that has been awesome

697
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:55,560
Speaker 1: for our family because we have so many other things

698
00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 1: going on too that if there's can you even put

699
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:01,879
Speaker 1: multiple in the same class, Sometimes well they're far enough

700
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:04,279
Speaker 1: apart in age that they can't because I mean, you

701
00:37:04,320 --> 00:37:06,000
Speaker 1: just wouldn't have like the ten year old sparring with

702
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:10,600
Speaker 1: a five year old and stuff. But it's probably a

703
00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 1: bad idea in general, but you know, because of that,

704
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:18,920
Speaker 1: it's much more parent friendly than if you have to

705
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,880
Speaker 1: declare like we are in the Tuesday and Thursday class

706
00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 1: and then you know, go through the rigamarole of doing

707
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:27,279
Speaker 1: a makeup if you don't go to that particular one.

708
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 1: And so you know, there's a lot of kid activity

709
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 1: places where I think they could do that they just

710
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:36,879
Speaker 1: don't and if they would consider doing it, they might

711
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:41,160
Speaker 1: find a lot of very happy parents. So please kid

712
00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 1: activity places, think flexibility. I find sometimes like you could

713
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:47,800
Speaker 1: spend as much time signing up a kid for a

714
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:50,120
Speaker 1: class as you can for trying to figure out how

715
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:54,680
Speaker 1: to do all the makeup classes. That exactly. I think

716
00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 1: that's an awesome idea. Awesome. Well again, thank you so much.

717
00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:02,279
Speaker 1: We'll have future guests in you know, someday and if

718
00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 1: you have suggestions for a guest by the way, listeners,

719
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:06,400
Speaker 1: or if you want to be a guest. We've certainly

720
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:09,560
Speaker 1: had some volunteers already, but we are thrilled to add

721
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:12,879
Speaker 1: multiple people. We want diverse backgrounds and careers. We want

722
00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:15,840
Speaker 1: women who are enjoying their jobs and their families just

723
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 1: let us know. Thank you so much. So today's listener

724
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 1: question is from someone who listened to our childcare episode

725
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:28,760
Speaker 1: a few episodes back and wanted to ask a follow

726
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 1: up question about that. So here's the edited version of it.

727
00:38:31,719 --> 00:38:34,160
Speaker 1: She says, my son started kindergarten this year, and here's

728
00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:38,000
Speaker 1: the thing. Daycare was easy. Daycare was open six thirty

729
00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:41,160
Speaker 1: am to six thirty pm, and although we didn't use

730
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:44,160
Speaker 1: it that entire time, there was some flexibility in it. Now,

731
00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:47,680
Speaker 1: her son started school this year and this particular school

732
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:51,520
Speaker 1: has an aftercare program, but it only goes until five pm,

733
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:53,480
Speaker 1: and there's some chance he might not be able to

734
00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:55,439
Speaker 1: go to that school next year. So then they've got

735
00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:58,279
Speaker 1: another problem with that. So she says, potentially next year

736
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 1: at our local public school, he's not a lot to

737
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:02,239
Speaker 1: arrive before eight, and then we'll have to figure out

738
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 1: what to do during the week. From two twenty five

739
00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 1: until five, she says, I think our only option will

740
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:09,279
Speaker 1: be a babysitter of some kind. I don't really love

741
00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:12,839
Speaker 1: that option because who is realistically available reliably every day

742
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,879
Speaker 1: From two fifteen to five fifteen. I'm wondering how other

743
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 1: parents cope with this. You mentioned nanny's in the childcare episode,

744
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:21,480
Speaker 1: but we don't have multiple children, nor do we have

745
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 1: the need for someone more than about fifteen hours a week.

746
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:26,520
Speaker 1: I thought the school years would be easier from a

747
00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:30,200
Speaker 1: childcare perspective, and so far they're cheaper than full time daycare.

748
00:39:30,239 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 1: But it's the exact opposite in terms of logistics. And

749
00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:36,360
Speaker 1: you know, we hear that from people a lot. So

750
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:38,960
Speaker 1: you know, if you've got like two working parents, you've

751
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,840
Speaker 1: been doing the daycare option, you've gotten used to the

752
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 1: fact that it's it's open for a long period of

753
00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:48,759
Speaker 1: time and open reliably every day, and then we start thinking, hey,

754
00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:51,200
Speaker 1: school years, it'll be easier. But then you got to

755
00:39:51,239 --> 00:39:53,480
Speaker 1: deal with the afternoon and in the morning if you have,

756
00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:57,440
Speaker 1: you know, an early work start time. And I've definitely

757
00:39:57,440 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: gotten a lot of emails from people asking me about this,

758
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:02,000
Speaker 1: like do you just hire an after school sitter? And

759
00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:04,319
Speaker 1: who wants to work for you know, two hours, five

760
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:06,840
Speaker 1: days a week, And it's sort of a harder market

761
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:09,319
Speaker 1: to find. So, I mean, Sarah, we were thinking, I

762
00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:11,759
Speaker 1: wonder if she had any sort of flexibility or ways

763
00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:15,400
Speaker 1: we could think about outside the box, right, Yeah, so

764
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:18,439
Speaker 1: both of us took some time to brainstorm and I'll

765
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:21,640
Speaker 1: share my thoughts. Okay. So one kind of outside the

766
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:23,959
Speaker 1: box option would be to see if there are any

767
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,000
Speaker 1: other families in the neighborhood that do have a full

768
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:30,239
Speaker 1: time nanny where she could piggyback onto it for share

769
00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:32,160
Speaker 1: of costs, because if she only has the one school

770
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:36,120
Speaker 1: age kid, honestly, if anything, that kid would probably make

771
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:40,000
Speaker 1: it easier on that nanny, you know, by entertaining the

772
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,680
Speaker 1: other kids or being an extra set of hands, rather

773
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:44,920
Speaker 1: than making it harder. So she might be surprised to

774
00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 1: find that another caregiver would be thrilled, and then it

775
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:49,440
Speaker 1: might reduce the costs for another family. So that was

776
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 1: one outside the box option. Yeah, that was great. We

777
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:56,400
Speaker 1: also thought, you know, if they had any flexibility, if

778
00:40:56,440 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: she and her partner had any flexibility in their jobs,

779
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:03,520
Speaker 1: they might be able to rethink what the work hours

780
00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 1: would be required on the part of a sitter, because yeah,

781
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 1: I agree, it's not a great job to have to

782
00:41:07,960 --> 00:41:10,320
Speaker 1: commute somewhere and then only get two or three hours

783
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:12,720
Speaker 1: per day, so it might be harder to find someone.

784
00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:15,360
Speaker 1: But what if you did, like three days a week

785
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:19,799
Speaker 1: from two to eight, and then they could work late

786
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,759
Speaker 1: those days and come home at two o'clock on the

787
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:25,319
Speaker 1: other days, if they did have some flexibility with their jobs,

788
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 1: or one of them could come home at two o'clock,

789
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:29,319
Speaker 1: you know, one day week. So what they'd basically be

790
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:32,120
Speaker 1: asking their managers for is one day a week, I

791
00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 1: could come home at two, I could work till eight,

792
00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:38,640
Speaker 1: like two days a week, you know, be available to that.

793
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 1: That's not really a bad trade off on the part

794
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:43,520
Speaker 1: of a manager, So that might be a way to

795
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 1: make the hours more appealing for a caregiver. We also

796
00:41:47,560 --> 00:41:50,080
Speaker 1: thought you could also rethink what you were looking for

797
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:52,840
Speaker 1: in a caregiver. If you wanted to maybe outsource some

798
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:56,799
Speaker 1: of the housekeeping tasks, one option might be to give

799
00:41:56,840 --> 00:42:00,600
Speaker 1: people more hours. Have them come at like noon, right

800
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:05,719
Speaker 1: and work noon to five or something and do the

801
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,720
Speaker 1: housework during that time, or like yeah, noon to six

802
00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:11,720
Speaker 1: or even like one to six would be that's twenty

803
00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:14,400
Speaker 1: five hours a week. So yes, it's ten hours extra,

804
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:16,560
Speaker 1: but if that meant the difference between finding somebody and

805
00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:18,800
Speaker 1: not and if you could think of some things that

806
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,080
Speaker 1: I bet if you dug deep you could think of

807
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:23,080
Speaker 1: things that you'd really not like to be doing there

808
00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:26,239
Speaker 1: in that time. It might actually improve your quality of

809
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:29,719
Speaker 1: life more than you ever, it's not possible. Yeah, and

810
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:32,200
Speaker 1: it's also sort of I mean, when we're talking about

811
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 1: hours paid, you know, this is also a question of

812
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:38,320
Speaker 1: what people are looking to earn and a certain amount

813
00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:40,319
Speaker 1: of time to make it worthwhile. So obviously, if you

814
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:44,080
Speaker 1: pay above market rates for three hours, you'll have an

815
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,359
Speaker 1: easier time getting someone willing to work three hours. Then

816
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:50,399
Speaker 1: if you're trying to sort of get the flat, you know,

817
00:42:50,640 --> 00:42:52,719
Speaker 1: amount of what you think you could you could pay

818
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:56,120
Speaker 1: for that, So that's something. So we either think about

819
00:42:56,400 --> 00:42:59,040
Speaker 1: a nanny share with another family to tack on some

820
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:02,239
Speaker 1: hours to if you have some flexibility with your work

821
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,560
Speaker 1: hours in order to get kind of different hours for

822
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 1: a potential caregiver, adding on the housekeeping option to get

823
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:12,279
Speaker 1: more hours, or just you know, thinking of paying a

824
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:14,439
Speaker 1: little bit more than you might have normally thought because

825
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,600
Speaker 1: it's probably still cheaper than full time daycare, right, Yes,

826
00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:21,080
Speaker 1: I would think that it would be absolutely when you're

827
00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:24,560
Speaker 1: used to paying that. So yeah, absolutely, Although that was

828
00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:27,880
Speaker 1: interesting that you know, Chabon had mentioned Shavon had mentioned

829
00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:31,600
Speaker 1: earlier about you know that one time she did have

830
00:43:32,239 --> 00:43:34,760
Speaker 1: a caregiver who was willing to work in the morning

831
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 1: and in the afternoon after school. I mean, I guess

832
00:43:37,080 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 1: you never really know. It could be that there's somebody

833
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:43,960
Speaker 1: who's like starting her own business, for instance, and is

834
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:49,160
Speaker 1: okay with having flexibility on what hours she's working and

835
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:52,600
Speaker 1: then having the day free. I mean that that students, yeah,

836
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:55,440
Speaker 1: or college student might be usually their classes are mostly

837
00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:59,160
Speaker 1: daytimes and don't usually even start that early, so it

838
00:43:59,160 --> 00:44:02,440
Speaker 1: double's split bullshift. The person who submitted this question, it

839
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:04,319
Speaker 1: doesn't sound like they live in a college town, so

840
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:06,840
Speaker 1: that that probably wouldn't work for them. But if we

841
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:09,560
Speaker 1: have other listeners who are listening to this, then that

842
00:44:09,600 --> 00:44:13,200
Speaker 1: could totally work. And I'm gonna throw my last thing

843
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:15,160
Speaker 1: in which you know, I've never had an O pair,

844
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:17,960
Speaker 1: but I do think it sounds pretty sweet, and this

845
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:21,680
Speaker 1: might be one of the situations in which that would

846
00:44:21,680 --> 00:44:25,000
Speaker 1: be something to consider to have somebody. Now, that might

847
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:27,279
Speaker 1: be problematic if there's a lot of driving that's needed

848
00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:29,040
Speaker 1: and we don't necessarily have an O pair that can

849
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:31,600
Speaker 1: safely drive your children around. But if not, and you're

850
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:33,840
Speaker 1: able to get the driving done in some other fashion.

851
00:44:34,000 --> 00:44:36,640
Speaker 1: Then that's a very flexible option for sort of the

852
00:44:36,719 --> 00:44:40,000
Speaker 1: before and after. And when you have a school age child,

853
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:43,160
Speaker 1: you know, the nice thing is that child can kind

854
00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:46,600
Speaker 1: of tell you what's going on, like you know, you're

855
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:49,239
Speaker 1: of course, you need to have a very high level

856
00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:52,160
Speaker 1: of trust in somebody, no matter how old your child is.

857
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:55,279
Speaker 1: But I guess I'd be less nervous if I had

858
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:56,960
Speaker 1: a five or six year old they would tell me

859
00:44:57,080 --> 00:44:59,239
Speaker 1: if their O pair was always on the phone, you know,

860
00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 1: versus a on year old who wouldn't be able to

861
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 1: tell you that. So and some of parents can do

862
00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:05,759
Speaker 1: driving too, I mean, if they have a license, they

863
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 1: learn to drive with American driving laws. I mean that's

864
00:45:09,560 --> 00:45:11,520
Speaker 1: you know, it should be that could that could work

865
00:45:11,560 --> 00:45:14,760
Speaker 1: just fun. So lots of options you do have. I agree,

866
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: though it is it is a transition. If parents have

867
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:20,080
Speaker 1: been doing daycare for five years, then suddenly you're dealing

868
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:23,160
Speaker 1: with the school schedule. It's a whole different game. And

869
00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:26,439
Speaker 1: I know many people do think that automatically it would

870
00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:28,359
Speaker 1: have been would be easy because hey, now my kids

871
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:30,400
Speaker 1: in school, like I've got all this time accounted for,

872
00:45:30,560 --> 00:45:33,560
Speaker 1: but it's not as many hours as you're working at

873
00:45:33,560 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 1: school is one hundred and eighty days a year usually

874
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:38,160
Speaker 1: and it's only for about six hours, whereas if you're

875
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:41,280
Speaker 1: working it's more like, you know, two hundred and forty

876
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 1: days a year and for eight hours, so different schedules,

877
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:49,239
Speaker 1: and that's kind of unfortunate in many ways. And there's

878
00:45:49,360 --> 00:45:52,200
Speaker 1: another evidence that not all of the universe is designed

879
00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:54,399
Speaker 1: to be working parent friendly, in case anyone needed more

880
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:57,759
Speaker 1: evidence of that, but it is something that parents have

881
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:00,719
Speaker 1: to deal with, so we welcome your suggestions on Feel

882
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:04,440
Speaker 1: free to email us. I'm at elvandercamat yahoo dot com.

883
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 1: Feel free to reach out to Sarah through her blog

884
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,480
Speaker 1: and through social media. This has been best of both

885
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:13,839
Speaker 1: worlds and we look forward to joining again next time.

886
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:20,040
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the

887
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 1: shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram,

888
00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:29,160
Speaker 1: and you can find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com.

889
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:32,480
Speaker 1: This has been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please

890
00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:35,120
Speaker 1: join us next time for more on making work and

891
00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:36,360
Speaker 1: life work together.