Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: This is a joy. My book of the summer is
Speaker 2: a guy out at Berkeley. That's a school Simon out
Speaker 2: in the West. I don't know if you've heard of it.
Speaker 2: Barry chen Green with a wonderful book on that currency.
Speaker 2: But this is the cool book at the beach. Like,
Speaker 2: if you're looking for a man in finance six', five
Speaker 2: you're out in The. Hampton's you need a book that
Speaker 2: you're going. To it's. Slim it's a fabulous must read
Speaker 2: of one hundred and forty. Pages Elizabeth reynolds With Simon
Speaker 2: johnson and they join us now from The Massachusetts institute Of.
Speaker 2: TECHNOLOGIES i can't say enough about the directness of. That
Speaker 2: what's it like dealing with a forward from A nobel,
Speaker 2: Laureate like do you edit?
Speaker 3: Him you?
Speaker 4: Know, cautiously very.
Speaker 2: CAUTIOUSLY i look at the technology here and it's affecting every,
Speaker 2: listener every person's. Life what's the priority technology right now
Speaker 2: for people not enjoying the technology.
Speaker 3: Juggernaut, well we in.
Speaker 4: The book point to six different technologies that we think
Speaker 4: are really. Important obviously there are. MORE i would start
Speaker 4: with some of the foundational, Technologies so the critical minerals
Speaker 4: that go into all of our, products including. Semiconductors semiconductors
Speaker 4: in our we talk about as the oxygen of the modern.
Speaker 4: Economy so those are two of the technologies we talk,
Speaker 4: about but we also talk about advanced.
Speaker 2: Manufacturing are you surprised that the technology juggernaut semi conductors
Speaker 2: is in the price is in a pricing, moonshot like
Speaker 2: the costpy is straight? Up semi conductors are straight. Up
Speaker 2: were you taken aback by?
Speaker 4: That not? PARTICULARLY i think we see the writing on
Speaker 4: the wall in terms of the, demand particularly with data,
Speaker 4: centers et. Cetera so the strategy to build more capacity
Speaker 4: in THE US i think is going to pay.
Speaker 5: Off, Simon do you think THE us, Government, well first of,
Speaker 5: all the markets are trying to figure out WHAT ai
Speaker 5: is on a daily. Basis IF i weren't for this
Speaker 5: war In, iran that would be front and center as
Speaker 5: it has been for three. Years do you think THE
Speaker 5: us government has an industrial policy for technology for some
Speaker 5: of these critical issues that you guys hold, Out.
Speaker 1: Well they certainly have something that has industrial policy. ELEMENTS
Speaker 1: i think it's a bit random and not sufficiently. COHERENT
Speaker 1: i think they're also having to rethink it in a
Speaker 1: hurry because of What anthropic has just shown. Them so
Speaker 1: they realize that just sitting back and let the market
Speaker 1: decide is not great if all your cybersecurity is on the.
Speaker 5: Line And, elizabeth it seems once again that THE us
Speaker 5: is leading. HERE i look To, EUROPE i see. NOTHING
Speaker 5: i look To, ASIA i do see some very good
Speaker 5: technology coming out Of. China, well once again it seems
Speaker 5: to be THE us is on the cutting edge of
Speaker 5: some of THESE ai and other, technologies AND i think
Speaker 5: historically that's because we've had a very light touch from the.
Speaker 3: Government how do you expect that to go.
Speaker 5: Forward do you expect THE us to continue to be a.
Speaker 3: Leader here or is that not a?
Speaker 2: Given?
Speaker 4: WELL i think certainly AN ai we're seeing all the
Speaker 4: benefits of THE us ecosystem playing. Out but As simon AND,
Speaker 4: i you, know have, written winning THE ai race is not, enough,
Speaker 4: right it's how you apply THE ai across technologies that.
Speaker 4: Matter and that's where actually we see The chinese are
Speaker 4: very strong on the implementation and on the, adoption and
Speaker 4: that's WHERE i think we need to.
Speaker 2: Be and This monday Across, America Elizabeth reynolds is with
Speaker 2: us in The Massachusetts institute Of. Technology The ford Is Simon.
Speaker 2: Johnson of, course you, know The Nobel prize winner this
Speaker 2: year for any number of good. Things AND i have
Speaker 2: stated many many times over the years the most singular
Speaker 2: pressient person on the financial crisis THAT i. Know we'll
Speaker 2: talk about that in a, Bit, simon why did you
Speaker 2: get behind this? BOOK i, mean you can do anything
Speaker 2: you want if you're going to fix the red, Sox
Speaker 2: i'm told In, June but why did you get behind this?
Speaker 1: Book more good, Jobs, Tom that's what we. NEED i
Speaker 1: think that's what's going wrong with this democracy is that
Speaker 1: we haven't delivered For Middle, america middle, skills middle, education
Speaker 1: middle of the.
Speaker 3: Country. Geographically we lost.
Speaker 2: It it feels like it's not everybody can learn, calculus
Speaker 2: not everybody can Learn. Claude, right, yeah, right.
Speaker 1: Absolutely so there's a lot of jobs that require different
Speaker 1: kind of coulfnur, abilities different kind of manual. Abilities that's
Speaker 1: what we used to have in. MANUFACTURING i don't think
Speaker 1: you can bring back the jobs in traditional, manufacturing although that's.
Speaker 3: Going to be, automated is already being.
Speaker 1: Automated but you can own the frontier you can push
Speaker 1: hard on the, frontier and the frontier of technology will
Speaker 1: deliver more good.
Speaker 5: JOBS i think the discussion OF ai has overshadowed something
Speaker 5: that people were talking about and, saying boy, this we
Speaker 5: better get this, right and that is quantum. Computing what
Speaker 5: does that mean to you, guys and how do you
Speaker 5: guys look at it?
Speaker 4: Right so quantum is one of the chapters that our
Speaker 4: Colleagues Will oliver And Jonathan royne Wrote quantum, is you,
Speaker 4: know the next frontier and opens, up you, know billions
Speaker 4: of dollars of, opportunity not just for defense and encryption,
Speaker 4: issues but also across all sorts of applications and financial
Speaker 4: services and. Biopharma and what we hear from our colleagues
Speaker 4: is the big risk for THE us is some kind
Speaker 4: of quantum. Winter that what quantum really requires right now
Speaker 4: is continued investment and the science and. Technology and it's
Speaker 4: not just the, science it's also the.
Speaker 2: Engineering two heavyweights for, this. Folks did you see this
Speaker 2: weekend somebody at a private, survey like a real survey
Speaker 2: of fancy schools and the number one school was on
Speaker 2: The Charles river In boston and they don't have a football. Team,
Speaker 2: yeah it was. Amazing M i t came in number,
Speaker 2: one which was. Great WHAT i love about this Is
Speaker 2: elizabeth footnotes. Throughout here's A johnson Footnote baker And. Johnson
Speaker 2: will THE us continue to dominate? Science most of our
Speaker 2: listeners and viewers question, that are we at risk of
Speaker 2: losing our? Science?
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, well not losing our, science but losing our
Speaker 1: leadership to that's two To. China china has come up
Speaker 1: a long way in the past twenty Five, Yes china's
Speaker 1: running now connect WITH us and a lot of these
Speaker 1: frontier technology.
Speaker 2: They're doing legit research like AT, mit like, it Cal
Speaker 2: tech like, it the. Others. Yes.
Speaker 1: Absolutely our expert friends Include rafael rifle, or president OF,
Speaker 1: mit looked at that technologies in great detail and they
Speaker 1: come away impressed that now they're not in the lead,
Speaker 1: yet but they're running neck and neck.
Speaker 3: With, us AND i think this is a very real
Speaker 3: threat that we need to take.
Speaker 5: Seriously So simon going to that, point Since World War,
Speaker 5: two one could, argue this is HOW i understand it
Speaker 5: that some of the technological leadership that THE us has
Speaker 5: had has been a public private. Partnership THE us government
Speaker 5: and universities such AS mit and My duke and you
Speaker 5: do it, together and that's where the great medicines come.
Speaker 5: From that's where the great technologies come. From how much
Speaker 5: is that at risk right?
Speaker 3: Now, OH i think it's very much at. RISK i
Speaker 3: think it's been called into.
Speaker 1: Question the funding is obviously down roughly speaking ten percent
Speaker 1: in terms of impact on the flow of graduate. Students
Speaker 1: one new graduate student who doesn't go to school now
Speaker 1: is a loss of, innovation a loss of new companies
Speaker 1: down the, road because once they've been in school for a, five, six,
Speaker 1: seven eight, years they become extremely, knowledgeable they very.
Speaker 3: Specialized they know where the opportunity these. Are they set up.
Speaker 1: Companies the post docs are some of the most productive
Speaker 1: people in terms of generating new companies and new. Jobs
Speaker 1: so we're going to we're losing all of that, already
Speaker 1: and the trajectory is not positive at this particular.
Speaker 3: Moment is there a fix?
Speaker 5: There From MIT's, PERSPECTIVE i, mean is It i'm guessing
Speaker 5: the taser the world and everybody's got to adapt somehow.
Speaker 4: WELL i think there's, adaption but there's also. CHECKING i
Speaker 4: think some of the bad policies and steps we've, seen
Speaker 4: so cutting back on funding not. Great the uncertainty not.
Speaker 4: Great throwing sand in the gears not. Great and then
Speaker 4: immigration policy THAT i think is essentially trying putting at
Speaker 4: bay a lot of the best. Talent, well, look mean
Speaker 4: this is.
Speaker 2: Critical this came up like eight times this week and
Speaker 2: including good Morning Bard college up The Hudson. River fabulous
Speaker 2: time There friday at The Levy. INSTITUTE i, mean as
Speaker 2: simple AS i can do you look at the immigration
Speaker 2: realities of twenty twenty. Six is, reversible, Simon.
Speaker 3: Yes they can be.
Speaker 1: Reversed we can understand again as we used to, understand
Speaker 1: that letting foreign graduate students into THE us is important
Speaker 1: for our national. Security that's how you race With china
Speaker 1: in terms of. Talent china has one point four billion,
Speaker 1: people as you, know but we have the rest of
Speaker 1: the world if we let the talented people, in which
Speaker 1: is what we did in the nineteen fifties sixties After,
Speaker 1: sputnik A National Defense Education act put money into Educating.
Speaker 1: Americans that's. Complimentary you're letting in the foreign graduate. Students
Speaker 1: of COURSE i was a foreign graduate, student so that's.
Speaker 2: Declear Spot mick is a personal thing of the. Family
Speaker 2: and you know the skunk works at ninety and all, That.
Speaker 2: Elizabeth can we have a Spot nick? Moment can we
Speaker 2: all Go Donald fagan and have an ig y? AGAIN
Speaker 2: i think so for.
Speaker 4: Sure if you, look, actually we have a fair amount
Speaker 4: of consensus about what we need to. Do previous, administration
Speaker 4: this administration doubling down on, semiconductors critical, minerals, defense. Drones
Speaker 4: there's a lot of consensus on what we have to.
Speaker 3: Do can we call That?
Speaker 2: PHOENIX i was just out In phoenix and it's. Amazing
Speaker 2: it's a boom. Economy can we Do phoenix on The East? Coast?
Speaker 4: Oh, yeah it's a little. Bit it's perhaps going to
Speaker 4: be in other niche, areas but we have extreme capabilities
Speaker 4: in the semiconductor, space also in the defense, space in
Speaker 4: the biopharma.
Speaker 2: Space of, Course pau'll get one more in, here because
Speaker 2: THEN i got to Beat Simon johnson to. Death.
Speaker 5: Simon if the talented folks from around the world are
Speaker 5: not coming to THE, us where are they?
Speaker 1: Going, well a little bit In, europe Although europe is
Speaker 1: not upping its, game so they're missing that.
Speaker 3: Opportunity THE uk is trying hard in the.
Speaker 1: Space The british recently maybe AN ai, ambassador which is
Speaker 1: a great, honor Whether i'm an ambassador TO ai or FROM.
Speaker 1: Ai we're still talking about. That BUT i think a
Speaker 1: lot of times they're going into other. Areas they're not
Speaker 1: going into. Research they're going to have, good productive lives.
Speaker 1: Elsewhere so you're losing the talent from the scientific machinery
Speaker 1: and you never get it.
Speaker 2: BACK i got to do a digression. Here the book
Speaker 2: Is Priority technologies Of Elizabeth. Reynolds but since we Have
Speaker 2: Professor johnson in the studios and he's taken parchment here
Speaker 2: From scandinavian, elite we're going to have to bug. Here
Speaker 2: your book in two thousand and eight nine had one
Speaker 2: paragraph in chapter four which, said this was the moment
Speaker 2: where the sec let the genie out of the bottle
Speaker 2: and they brought forward the financial. Crisis do we have
Speaker 2: the lack of humility now to repeat that, exercise given private,
Speaker 2: credit given some of the excesses of our. Financialization, Yes i'm.
Speaker 3: Afraid So i'm.
Speaker 1: Amazed actually told me it's taken so long because usually
Speaker 1: you forget everything, right and people into markets they. Did
Speaker 1: many people in markets today weren't working in two thousand and.
Speaker 3: Eight SO i fear not so.
Speaker 1: Much the private credit although of course that could be
Speaker 1: the ignition for what. HAPPENS i think it's the big
Speaker 1: banks reducing the levels of, capital reducing their buffers against.
Speaker 3: Losses we had really seen that movie.
Speaker 1: Before in, fact it was made into many movies tom
Speaker 1: which we, saw and still we're going to repeat that same.
Speaker 2: Mistake one final, Question, elizabeth can you just tell me about?
Speaker 2: IT i, mean the other school on The Charles rivers
Speaker 2: mental about great inflation right? Now is great inflation AT?
Speaker 2: MIT i mean it's.
Speaker 4: BRUTAL i think it's been a problem generally in the,
Speaker 4: country AND i think schools are addressing it. NOW i
Speaker 4: THINK i should leave it at.
Speaker 2: That so the Alumnus Troy gayski would tell me that
Speaker 2: there's no great inflation in engineering because he got a
Speaker 2: one point five is freshman year. There as everybody, said,
Speaker 2: oh this is. Hard but the great inflation even AT, mit,
Speaker 2: NO i don't.
Speaker 3: Think so that's WHAT i wanted to get go.
Speaker 2: Away of, course there's great inflation there priority, technologies. Folks
Speaker 2: this is the mustering summary ON ai manufacturing, technology all of.
Speaker 2: It it's just a fabulous effort By Elizabeth, reynolds With
Speaker 2: Simon johnson helping out from The Massachusetts institute Of, technology