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Speaker 1: Hello, everyone. This is Charles W. Chuck Bryant here, co

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Speaker 1: host of Stuff you Should Know. That's the podcast you're

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Speaker 1: listening to right now. If you didn't know, on Saturdays

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Speaker 1: we played reruns. That's right. We call them selects because

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Speaker 1: we hand pick them ourselves and do these goofy little intros,

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Speaker 1: which is kind of a lot of fun, actually, but

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Speaker 1: that's what they're called. They're called Saturday Selects, and it's

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Speaker 1: a chance for you to either re listen to a

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Speaker 1: classic episode or to hear it for the very first time.

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Speaker 1: If you didn't start listening to the podcast a gazillion

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Speaker 1: years ago when we started. This is from March twenty ninth,

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Speaker 1: twenty twelve. Oh boy, that's a long time ago. How

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Speaker 1: music sampling works. Hope we got this one right.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 3: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark with

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Speaker 3: me as always is Charles W. Chuck Bryant. And that

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Speaker 3: makes this the suit were sample version of Stuff you Should.

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Speaker 1: Know, The super Stuff Guide to Sampling. Could that be

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Speaker 1: an audiobook? Why not?

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Speaker 3: Let's try. As a matter of fact, if you're listening

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Speaker 3: to this right now, youoe us a dollar. Mail it in, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: mail it into thirty three fifty Peachtree Road, Atlanta and Georgia.

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Speaker 3: Carry up, Josh Clark three zho three one three three

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Speaker 3: two sixes sweet fifteen hundred. Okay, all right, with that done,

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Speaker 3: we can continue on with the podcast. You know what

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Speaker 3: we should have gotten really creative and just like sampled

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Speaker 3: old podcasts and put them together in too. Jerry, do

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Speaker 3: you feel like doing that?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 1: I do a mashup. That's what they call that.

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Speaker 3: Sure, that's what the kids call it these days. Yeah, yeah, no,

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Speaker 3: we'll just do it straight instead boring and guess is

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Speaker 3: what you call it. I have an intro.

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Speaker 1: Let's hear it?

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Speaker 3: Have you heard chuck of a man named Arman Bulladian?

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Speaker 1: Arm in Tanzerian? Nope, no, I have not done.

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Speaker 3: Arman Balladian is the owner and sole employee of a

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Speaker 3: company called Bridgeport.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, okay, now I have.

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Speaker 3: Bridgeport is a music catalog company. Yeah, and like many

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Speaker 3: other music catalog companies, they basically just sit on a

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Speaker 3: lot of copyrights to popular songs the musical composition of

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Speaker 3: those songs.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's almost like owning stock, yes, like you buy

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Speaker 1: stock in these musics and wait for them to be

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Speaker 1: worth something.

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Speaker 3: Sure, or you can allegedly shadily get your hands on

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Speaker 3: already valuable music. Sure, and then like stocks, do to

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Speaker 3: what Bridgeport did, which is start suing anyone and everyone

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Speaker 3: whoever sampled it. So Bridgeport made a big flap in

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Speaker 3: two thousand and five when they sued Jay Z for

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Speaker 3: his song Justify My Thug. Yeah, I want to go

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Speaker 3: ahead and add a disclaimer here. I am far too

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Speaker 3: square to talk seriously about hip hop. Like I'm really

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Speaker 3: into elevator music right now, seriously. Yeah, So when I

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Speaker 3: say things like justify my Thug or jay Z or

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Speaker 3: breaks right, I'm speaking strictly as an outside observer, an

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Speaker 3: interested outside observer. But I'm not I'm not from the streets.

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Speaker 1: So like, yeah, I was. I was down, as they say,

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Speaker 1: from like eighty seven to ninety five ish. That was

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Speaker 1: those were my big hip hop years. Nice and then

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Speaker 1: but these days you say jay Z, and I know

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Speaker 1: that's the that's the handsome man married to that pretty lady. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So we had I'm not down with the new stuff.

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Speaker 3: We had a similar trajectory.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, except I used to be into it and it

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Speaker 1: sounds like you never were right. What in the name

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Speaker 1: of God is a walk of flokka?

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Speaker 3: You know?

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Speaker 1: Yes?

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Speaker 3: All right? So anyway, Bridgeport sued jay Z for sampling

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Speaker 3: Madonna's Justify My Love. Somehow Bridgeport got its hands on

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Speaker 3: the copyright to Justify My Love. That's a pretty big song, sure,

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Speaker 3: and when jay Z sampled it, they suit him. Now,

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Speaker 3: this guy runs around suing everybody. Apparently he had like

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Speaker 3: seven hundred lawsuits against just people who sampled George Clinton's work.

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Speaker 1: Well that's a big attorney fees right there.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it is. And but when it pays off, it

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Speaker 3: pays off. So this guy has come to be known

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Speaker 3: a Bridgeport. People like him have come to be known

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Speaker 3: where called sample trolls. Remember patent trolls when I gave

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Speaker 3: like the absolute wrong definition of that. Well, sample troll

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Speaker 3: is somebody who just buys up songs, hangs on to

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Speaker 3: the copyrights, and then sues people who sample them without asking.

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Speaker 3: On the one hand, you can make a case that, well,

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Speaker 3: these people are breaking copyright lawcher by not asking and

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Speaker 3: getting permission to use samples of this. On the other hand,

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Speaker 3: Bridgeport has made it their aim to sue anybody who

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Speaker 3: sampled it at all, even if they've taken the work

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Speaker 3: and made it unrecognizable, right, which that kind of a

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Speaker 3: lot of people are on the other side of the

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Speaker 3: aisle going like that's ridiculous, that stifles creativity. This is

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Speaker 3: just one of the many interesting aspects of music sampling.

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Speaker 1: Wow, that was a proper intro.

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Speaker 3: It's been a while.

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Speaker 1: And that's one, but it's probably the biggest as far

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Speaker 1: as what people think about how music is used in

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Speaker 1: creativity and ownership. And one of the things that you

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Speaker 1: just mentioned was Bridgeport is some big corporation and if

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Speaker 1: you talk to like Hank Shockley, the former producer of

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Speaker 1: Public Enemy, he will say that, you know, we don't

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Speaker 1: have any problems paying music to artists who created the stuff,

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Speaker 1: he said, but they're own by these corporations now, and

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Speaker 1: it's just it's greed on their part.

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Speaker 3: Yes, which is not There are two sides to every

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Speaker 3: story now, and the music industry, as we'll see, kind

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Speaker 3: of went on a tear of like suing everybody and

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Speaker 3: protecting themselves. And now you kind of understand like, oh,

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Speaker 3: that's why no one feels bad about this whole music

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Speaker 3: piracy thing.

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Speaker 1: Well, and there was a big rush at one point,

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Speaker 1: because it was a new genre. I mean, we'll get

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Speaker 1: into the history of how it came to be in

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Speaker 1: all but it was a new thing and so all

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Speaker 1: of a sudden, you know, for the first you know,

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Speaker 1: several years, that was open territory. Yeah, and that's when

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Speaker 1: like that was the heyday aps me.

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Speaker 3: Well, folks nerdier than us might be confused at this

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Speaker 3: point because sampling also refers to digitizing music. Yes, what

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Speaker 3: we're talking about is taking a piece of an already

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Speaker 3: established piece of music, right, a selection of it, and

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Speaker 3: then recreating it using it put maybe putting it back

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Speaker 3: to back to back in a.

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Speaker 1: Loop sometimes oftentimes actually.

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Speaker 3: And then creating something new using this right. Yeah, So

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Speaker 3: that's what we're talking about with music sampling, all right,

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Speaker 3: it's been around for a while too.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Well you mentioned taking a snippet. Let's go ahead

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Speaker 1: and just get a couple of examples out there. If

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Speaker 1: we want to start out with trying to explain to

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Speaker 1: people what a sample is. And most people know this, ok,

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Speaker 1: there are no further places to look than James Brown's

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Speaker 1: nineteen seventy song Funky Drummer. Let's go ahead and hear

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Speaker 1: that little break beat Oh it's like that. Huh yeah,

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Speaker 1: all right, so that's instantly recognizable.

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Speaker 3: So that's funky drummer.

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Speaker 1: That's Funky drummer. And that was who was the drummer.

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Speaker 3: There, Clyde Stubblefield.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Clyde Stubblefield, who has never gotten a scent.

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Speaker 3: No, but he's pretty cool man. He is not trying

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Speaker 3: to sue anybody. He's not seeking anything any damage from this. Literally,

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Speaker 3: thousands of songs have used that drum break, right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, James Brown has been sampled and this is not

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Speaker 1: just that song, but a lot of it comes from

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Speaker 1: Funky Drummer twenty seven and twenty nine times. Okay, so

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Speaker 1: the leader.

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Speaker 3: And you can make a case that Funky Drummer provided

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Speaker 3: the basis for hip hop. Like all early hip hop songs,

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Speaker 3: especially in like the mid to late eighties, all used

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Speaker 3: that drum break, right, Stubblefield's not going after anybody for that.

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Speaker 3: But what he did was get together with some documentarians

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Speaker 3: who made something called Copyright Criminals, a documentary called Copyright

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Speaker 3: Criminals to release a special version of the DVD that

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Speaker 3: has all new ready to sample Clyde Stubblefield drum brakes

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Speaker 3: nice that he created just for this, and if you

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Speaker 3: want to use them, he's give him like fifteen percent

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Speaker 3: of your sales. Nice, So he's like doing it, he's

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Speaker 3: trying out a different model.

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Speaker 1: Well, on the other side too, which we haven't mentioned,

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Speaker 1: is and this is the point that a lot of

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Speaker 1: the hip hop producers would make, is that some of

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Speaker 1: these people are being pulled from obscurity. For instance, the

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Speaker 1: second clip we're gonna play, which is the Amen break

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Speaker 1: from Amen Brother and it was a B side from

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Speaker 1: a very little known song from a group called the Winstons.

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Speaker 1: We can hear this one, dude, Yes, and we'll hear

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Speaker 1: that right now. So that one, to me is slightly

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Speaker 1: better than Funky Drummer.

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Speaker 3: So that's the Amen brank.

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Speaker 1: That's the Amen break. And dude, that one has been

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Speaker 1: sampled thousands of times.

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Speaker 3: So that one gave birth to drum and bass in jungle,

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Speaker 3: like all all jungle music is based on the deconstruction

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Speaker 3: of the amen break. If you're interested in hearing about

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Speaker 3: there's a really cool movie, like a video. It's like

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Speaker 3: eighteen minutes long. It's a YouTube video and the title

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Speaker 3: is video explains the world's most important six second drum loop. Wow,

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Speaker 3: so it gave rise to Jungle. NWA straight out of

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Speaker 3: Compton used that. Yeah, Cold Cut used it. Yeah, and

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Speaker 3: Third Base famously used it as well.

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Speaker 1: And hundreds of others. Yeah, I like their Base, And

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Speaker 1: that was because we want to give due to some

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Speaker 1: of these folks who created this stuff. That was Gregory

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Speaker 1: Sylvester Coleman, who was the actual drummer that played that lick.

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Speaker 3: And that was the Winston's.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the Winston's excellent Gregory Sylvester Coleman.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, I think what you're originally saying is some

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Speaker 3: producers are saying, like you ever heard of Gregory Coleman?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. So they're they're bringing some of these folks

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Speaker 1: out of obscurity and giving them their due.

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Speaker 3: And I'm sure selling some records for him here or there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, although that record's really hard to find obviously, Well

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Speaker 1: they need to press it again, maybe they should. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So you take an loll cool j Ladies Love Cool

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Speaker 1: James for instance.

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Speaker 3: Is that what l ALL stands for?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? You never knew that, No, Yeah, I even listened

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Speaker 1: to him extensively. He was James something and you know

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Speaker 1: the ladies Love Cool James or.

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Speaker 3: E O Z Cool Jake Cookies, I'm bad see you know, No,

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Speaker 3: I did know. I've just fallen off like you.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So you take the funky Drummer from James Brown

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Speaker 1: song and you take uh sli in the Family Stones,

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Speaker 1: Trip to Your Heart the the background vocals, and then

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Speaker 1: basically you loop those over and over and over and

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Speaker 1: you have a little song called Mama said Knock you out.

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Speaker 3: Oh we're about to hear that.

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Speaker 1: Well, we're gonna hear him separately. Obviously we already played

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Speaker 1: the Funky Drummer, and now this is the Trip to

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Speaker 1: your Heart backing vocals from Slying the Family Stone whom

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Speaker 1: I love. All right, So that's it, dude, over and

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Speaker 1: over and over with ladies love cool James rapping. Okay,

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Speaker 1: and you got a huge, huge hit.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, oh that was a big one.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah huge. I wasn't a big local Jake though.

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Speaker 3: I like the one. I don't remember what it's called,

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Speaker 3: but it had like the boom box on the cover

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Speaker 3: of the tape. I don't like the album artwork was

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Speaker 3: a boombox.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that was good. Uh, it had I'm bad on

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Speaker 1: Oh it did. Yeah. Okay, it's not always songs that

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Speaker 1: you're sampling. Sometimes you're sampling stuff from like a TV

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Speaker 1: show or a movie, or like the Living Color song

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Speaker 1: called a Personality. You remember that.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, they had like an FDR speech.

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Speaker 1: I think it was Kennedy or no, it was FDR.

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Speaker 3: Kennedy too, Okay, but that that was Kennedy. But he

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Speaker 3: said the only thing we have to fear his fear itself. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 3: doubting Thomas. They were like a skinny puppy offshoot. They

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Speaker 3: sampled I think the Day the Earth Stood Still extensively

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Speaker 3: throughout this one album that they created. It was pretty good.

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Speaker 1: Well, and guns and Roses on their song civil War,

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Speaker 1: remember at the beginning of that they played the cool

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Speaker 1: hand Luke bit over the you know guitar, and then

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Speaker 1: Axel's weasley little voice comes through.

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Speaker 3: Oh and Metallica is one, oh yeah, yeah, sample Johnny

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Speaker 3: got his gun.

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Speaker 1: That's right in the video too. Right, So those are

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Speaker 1: all samples. You might just think, oh, that's a snippet

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Speaker 1: from a movie, but it's a sample, just like you

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Speaker 1: would use the amen brake. Right, Okay. The first sampler,

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Speaker 1: if you want to go back in time a bit,

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Speaker 1: was the melotron.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the actual not the person but the machine that

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Speaker 3: someone used that was creative for sampling, right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it was. It was the first time

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Speaker 1: that they had ever you know, it's basically a little keyboard.

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Speaker 1: They're very basic. I wish I had one. They're really sweet,

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Speaker 1: and it has a volume, a tone, and a pitch

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Speaker 1: control a low and high octave you can switch between,

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Speaker 1: and then three samples A, B and C flutes, violins,

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Speaker 1: and cello. And it was the first time that they

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Speaker 1: basically had ever sampled anything like that. So you press

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Speaker 1: the keyboard and it plays back a pre recorded loop

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Speaker 1: of a single note of that single note on a flute,

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Speaker 1: let's say, okay, which seems you know, you take that

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Speaker 1: for granted now when you buy these keyboards where you

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Speaker 1: can do a million different things. But back then, the

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Speaker 1: melotron was huge.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah. And even before that, people would take magnetic tapes,

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Speaker 3: like real, real tapes and literally cut and splice them, yeah,

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Speaker 3: to create their own samples.

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Speaker 1: Well, and if you want to hear a classic example

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Speaker 1: of the melotron flute and I do, listen to this

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Speaker 1: little clip right here?

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Speaker 3: Is it aqualong no?

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Speaker 1: Ready?

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Speaker 3: Aquaalongue no.

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Speaker 1: That was the intro for the Beatles Strawberry Fields, and

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Speaker 1: that was Paul McCartney playing the flute sample of the

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Speaker 1: melotron on the melotron. Crazy, pretty cool, huh.

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Speaker 3: I always thought it was just flutes.

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Speaker 1: And then like King Crimson and Yet and Genesis, like

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Speaker 1: they went crazy with a melotron.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Genesis was awesome early on. Yeah, they awesome, but

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Speaker 3: in a different way, you know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, a very different way. Very okay. So you talked

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Speaker 1: about the origins with the tape splicing.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean you were. You can go back

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Speaker 3: even further than the melotron. It was at the sixties.

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Speaker 1: Yes, there were these two dudes.

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Speaker 3: They were the two Pierre's I call them Pierre Schaeffer

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Speaker 3: and Pierre Henry, but probably Pierre Omri, I bet. And

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Speaker 3: they were I guess what you would call a couple

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Speaker 3: of avant garde musical artists, and they created what's called

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Speaker 3: music concrete.

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Speaker 1: S freaky stuff. Did you hear any of it?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? I did. There's again the YouTube factors in heavily

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Speaker 3: in this episode.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: If you want to find out a little bit about

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Speaker 3: music concrete, check out the nineteen seventy nine BBC documentary

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Speaker 3: The New Sound of Music that is very awesome.

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Speaker 1: I did watch that actually, Yeah, that guy was a

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Speaker 1: really great host. Yeah it was. He really laid it down.

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Speaker 3: So he talks about music concrete where it's basically like

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Speaker 3: these people before there were tape recorders. Even I don't

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Speaker 3: know how they were doing this, I guess real the

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Speaker 3: real Yeah, and then these guys were doing splicing. They

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Speaker 3: would record the sound of a can falling or the

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Speaker 3: sound of a metronome or you know, a piece of

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Speaker 3: music off of you know, the radio, and then they

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Speaker 3: would splice it all together into something that's like barely listenable, right.

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Speaker 3: It was. It was electronically reproduced music, and it formed

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Speaker 3: the basis of everything that came after it that had

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Speaker 3: anything to do with electronic from like Pink Floyd to

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Speaker 3: all electronic music, to the Residents to Silver Apples, to

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Speaker 3: all these people who craftwork, who created electronic music. It's

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Speaker 3: all based on this, these two guys creating this in

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Speaker 3: like nineteen forty eight or something like that.

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Speaker 1: That's crazy. Did you see the part of the video

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Speaker 1: where they took the tape by hand and were dragged

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Speaker 1: it through. Yeah, that ended up sounding like and I

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Speaker 1: think was sort of the origins of record scratching.

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Speaker 3: That's what it sounded like to me as well.

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Speaker 1: Of course it was produced back in the day, so

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Speaker 1: they didn't say it was before record scratching.

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Speaker 3: This is about to give rise to this. Actually it

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Speaker 3: was coming out at the same time, because it was

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Speaker 3: nineteen seventy nine and that's when like DJ Cool Hurt

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Speaker 3: and Grandmaster Flash, We're starting to get really good. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: they were playing high school so people were taking notice.

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Speaker 1: That is true. So jumping back again in nineteen sixty one,

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Speaker 1: James Tenny Huh took blue Swede shoes from Elvis Presley

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Speaker 1: and have you heard this thing?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's very avant garde, is the way to put it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good way to put it into Collage

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Speaker 1: number one was what he called it. And it is

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Speaker 1: in many many parts virtually unrecognizable.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Oh yeah, it's really hard to listen to.

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Speaker 1: It is very hard to listen to.

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Speaker 3: It's a it's a piece of electronic music that's deconstructed.

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Speaker 3: It's Bluth Suade. She's deconstructed.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, big time.

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Speaker 3: And I mean if you look back and you're like,

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Speaker 3: holy cow. The video on YouTube shows like the guy

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Speaker 3: sitting in front of his setup. Yeah, and It's like

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Speaker 3: pretty extensive, and the guy was obviously, you.

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Speaker 1: Know, out of his mind lots of drugs, wasn't he.

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Speaker 3: But when you look back at it and you're like, oh,

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Speaker 3: that was what nineteen sixty one, that's pretty impressive work.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, Jo Job, Dicky Goodman and Bill Buchanan in

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Speaker 1: nineteen fifty six had a more commercial version of I

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Speaker 1: guess you would call it music concrete with Flying Saucer.

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Speaker 1: Did you listen to that one? I did? That was

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Speaker 1: the stuff we heard on FM radio growing up. Remember

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Speaker 1: all that mashup stuff they used to do, like.

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Speaker 3: Pat Midler's from a Distance with like the during the

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Speaker 3: First Gulf War.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't remember that, No, I mean

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Speaker 1: like when the radio stations would do these well, let

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Speaker 1: me go and say what it was and play a

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Speaker 1: snippet flying Saucer. They took rock and roll hits from

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Speaker 1: that era and mashed it up with a fake news

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Speaker 1: report about aliens landing from outer space, and it sounded

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Speaker 1: a little something like this, we.

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Speaker 2: Interrupt this record to bring you a special bulletin the

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Speaker 2: Reports of a flying saucer hovering over the city have

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Speaker 2: been confirmed. The flying saucers are real, Captain. See that

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Speaker 2: was the clutters recording to real. We switch you now

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Speaker 2: on the Spoder Reporter down town, Take it away, John.

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Speaker 1: So that's the stuff that we heard on FM radio.

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Speaker 1: Like they would do. I remember when I was a kid.

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Speaker 1: They would say, like, we're gonna call so and so

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Speaker 1: right now, and they would say, Hey, how you feeling,

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Speaker 1: And all of a sudden you'd hear Buck couldn't sleep

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Speaker 1: at all last night, and then they would ask him

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Speaker 1: in another question. It'd be like an interview, and the

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Speaker 1: answers were snippets from rock songs answering, which is really like,

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Speaker 1: I mean, it had its hey day in the seventies

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Speaker 1: and eighties. For sure.

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Speaker 3: I don't have a clip, so I'm gonna have to

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Speaker 3: describe it. But the bet Miller thing was slightly different.

375
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Speaker 3: It would be like Bette Miller's From a Distance, interspersed

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Speaker 3: with patriotic speeches.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, I remember that.

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Speaker 3: You remember that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that was sampling, I guess. So it's most jingoistic form.

380
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Speaker 3: At the very least. It was a mashup right those Oh,

381
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Speaker 3: by the way, those Flying Saucer guys, Buchanan and Goodman. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: they went on to do a lot of those things,

383
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Speaker 3: like they did one during the energy crisis of seventy four,

384
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Speaker 3: the energy crisis of seventy nine, but it'd be like

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Speaker 3: how much gas will be rationed just enough for the city.

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Speaker 1: Dude, I remember that, That's what I was remembering.

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Speaker 3: Really. Yeah, oh, eight years old, I was not cognizant

388
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Speaker 3: at that time. I had a lot of like poop,

389
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Speaker 3: my own poop on my hands from like playing with

390
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Speaker 3: it when you were thinking, wow, this is really neat stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I was a little radio kid back then.

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Speaker 3: Oh. Also, I want to say one more thing, I

393
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Speaker 3: went a little deeper in the music concrete thing. Okay,

394
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Speaker 3: and apparently Phillips right the manufacturing concern. Oh yeah, they

395
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Speaker 3: tried to get into electronic music in like the late

396
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Speaker 3: fifties and had this whole little wing that let a

397
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Speaker 3: couple of guys just go to town like trying to

398
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Speaker 3: make popular electronic music. And if you search acid House

399
00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,960
Speaker 3: from nineteen fifty eight on YouTube, these guys did a

400
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Speaker 3: pretty good job of it.

401
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Speaker 1: Really.

402
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Speaker 3: It is very clearly like the predecessor of like it's listenable.

403
00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:07,120
Speaker 3: It's not just like yeah, yeah, just it's not even

404
00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:09,080
Speaker 3: avant garde. It has like a beat to it in

405
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Speaker 3: a melody, and it's just it's really neat interesting. I

406
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Speaker 3: don't have that clip either.

407
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Speaker 1: We should do a podcast on the mogue. That should Okay,

408
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 1: that'll be coming.

409
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Speaker 3: Didn't you guys do that on the B side? Uh?

410
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Speaker 1: I think so, but we'll do it up.

411
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Speaker 3: Okay.

412
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Speaker 1: We've gotten requests for more music stuff. That's why I

413
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Speaker 1: picked this one up.

414
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Speaker 3: Oh gotcha.

415
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Speaker 1: So you flash forward a little bit and you mentioned

416
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Speaker 1: cool DJ Hirk Graham, DJ grand Master Flash, who a

417
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Speaker 1: lot of people think that was the group. It was

418
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Speaker 1: grand Master Flash and the Furious Five if you remember,

419
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Speaker 1: and they hit it big in nineteen eighty with the

420
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Speaker 1: song Freedom, which sampled get Up and Dance by the

421
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Speaker 1: band Freedom. Yeah, pretty straight up.

422
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Speaker 3: Well that that kind of took this whole thing into mainstream.

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Speaker 1: Well, and that's when scratching started too, wasn't it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Grandmaster Flash definitely started scratching. DJ Cole Hirk started

425
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Speaker 3: sampling very clearly, like he's the guy, right. He's from Kingston, Jamaica,

426
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Speaker 3: and he moved to New York in nineteen sixty seven

427
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Speaker 3: I think, and started bringing like his turntables to block

428
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Speaker 3: parties and he would just he'd find like a drum

429
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Speaker 3: break or something, and then a drum break from another song,

430
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Speaker 3: and he'd just keep like putting him together. So it

431
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 3: was like one long drum break, maybe bring in a

432
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Speaker 3: little bit of a bassline. And I went back and

433
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Speaker 3: listened to some of it and it was good stuff, man.

434
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Speaker 3: And he's doing this in like the mid seventies. And yeah,

435
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:37,040
Speaker 3: he started sampling as we know it, like turntable sampling.

436
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:42,600
Speaker 1: Crazy, yeah, innovating, Josh, that's even better than crazy. Marley.

437
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:44,920
Speaker 1: Marl is someone else we should mention if we're talking

438
00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:48,280
Speaker 1: about the early heyday. He was a house producer for

439
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:51,640
Speaker 1: the Juice Crew, which was Big Daddy, Kane and Bismarckys

440
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:57,320
Speaker 1: among others, but he also produced Eric b and raheem Ello,

441
00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:00,920
Speaker 1: Cool Jay, and he was like, he's off insided as

442
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:02,560
Speaker 1: like the early Leader.

443
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:04,320
Speaker 3: What about Redhead Kingpin?

444
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 1: I don't know that.

445
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:08,800
Speaker 3: What is that he's like in there somewhere. Yeah, Big

446
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:12,280
Speaker 3: Daddy came in. You just blasted me with the nostalgia.

447
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:14,040
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, remember the hat?

448
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,280
Speaker 3: Yeah? Remember the Gumby haircut?

449
00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:19,679
Speaker 1: Yeah? Oh yeah, the uh what they call that the

450
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:22,360
Speaker 1: high High? Right? Oh? I always thought it was called

451
00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:26,159
Speaker 1: the Gumby that's what you call it. Huh, Well, they

452
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 1: may call it the Gumby hair cut. I don't know.

453
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:32,359
Speaker 1: In Toledo it's a fade essentially, Big Daddy Cane. The

454
00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,800
Speaker 1: Beastie Boys, see what I was talking about, Like back

455
00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 1: in the day, in the in the eighties, late eighties,

456
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:43,400
Speaker 1: they were constructing full songs from dozens of samples. And

457
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 1: this was before you had to pay permission rights and

458
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:47,960
Speaker 1: stuff like that. So you get a song like Hey

459
00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:51,280
Speaker 1: Ladies from Paul's Boutique, which is, if you ask me,

460
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:56,000
Speaker 1: the pinnacle for the Beastie Boys, Paul's boutiqu or Hey Ladies,

461
00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:57,240
Speaker 1: Paul's boutique.

462
00:24:57,520 --> 00:24:59,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know if it's the pinnacle, it's well,

463
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 3: I think it's one of several pinnacles.

464
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:03,880
Speaker 1: Well check your head was great too, But Paul's boutique

465
00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:06,000
Speaker 1: was great. Hey ladies, who's sixteen samples? And that was

466
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:11,000
Speaker 1: not on the low side. But Terminator X of Public

467
00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:14,800
Speaker 1: Enemy and the beast Boys would craft songs out of

468
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:16,360
Speaker 1: dozens and dozens of samples.

469
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:19,720
Speaker 3: And that's that's DJ Hurricane. You're giving props too. He's

470
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 3: the Beastie Boys. DJ was he always I believe so okay, but.

471
00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:26,959
Speaker 1: I think they all like wrote the stuff together. Okay,

472
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 1: as we'll find out, because the the court case against

473
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 1: the Beast Boys was Newton versus Diamond Ouch, and we

474
00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:37,320
Speaker 1: all know who Diamond.

475
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:40,240
Speaker 3: Is, Dustin Diamond, Mike D's brother.

476
00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 1: No No No. Groups like De La Soul, Public Enemy

477
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,600
Speaker 1: and the Beasts were crafting these songs whereas nowadays, partially

478
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:53,320
Speaker 1: because I think they're not as good and creative, and

479
00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 1: partially because you have to pay rights. You'll get like

480
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:59,440
Speaker 1: a kid rock who just plays this one loop over

481
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:02,080
Speaker 1: and over and that's the sample he uses in his song. Yeah,

482
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 1: so it's not like he's crafting these songs out of

483
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:05,400
Speaker 1: dozens and dozens of samples.

484
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:09,320
Speaker 3: Well. Public Enemy even said like, after all these lawsuits

485
00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 3: and threats of lawsuits, if you're crafting a song out

486
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 3: of seventeen other songs, you basically have to like figure

487
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,359
Speaker 3: out something else because you can't do it anymore. And

488
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 3: I mean, what a buzzkill too to make a song

489
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,639
Speaker 3: and then take it to the to your record company

490
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,120
Speaker 3: overlords who say like, Okay, we can get this cleared,

491
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:31,000
Speaker 3: we can get this cleared. This one we can't clear

492
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 3: no way wherever clearing this. Yeah, so you have, like,

493
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 3: I don't know, two thirds of your song is intact,

494
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:41,960
Speaker 3: but the other third is it has holes in it.

495
00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,560
Speaker 3: You know. That's it kind of takes away from the

496
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:48,680
Speaker 3: whole thing. But at the same time, yeah, I mean again,

497
00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:51,640
Speaker 3: it's breaking a law. It's a copyright law, and it's

498
00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 3: not an arbitrary law. It's not a superfluous law. There

499
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:57,439
Speaker 3: is validity to it. You know.

500
00:26:57,640 --> 00:26:59,560
Speaker 1: Well, let's go ahead and talk about it then, okay,

501
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 1: right law.

502
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 3: The one that changed everything, it was. It was not

503
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 3: the first copyright lawsuit. I think those guys who did

504
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,600
Speaker 3: the flying Saucer thing were the first to start attracting

505
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 3: copyright lawsuits. Yeah. Yeah, But the first one as far

506
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:18,920
Speaker 3: that that changed hip hop, I guess was Bismarquys landed

507
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:22,920
Speaker 3: a beef from one Gilbert O'Sullivan who wrote the song

508
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:24,920
Speaker 3: alone Again naturally.

509
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 1: And what seventies for You Got What I Need or whatever?

510
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 3: No Alone Again his nineteen ninety one song from I

511
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:35,600
Speaker 3: Need a Haircut. That album it's called alone Again, and

512
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 3: bis Marquis lifted pretty heavily from that, and he was

513
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 3: signed to Warner Brothers and Warner Brothers got sued by

514
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 3: the owners of Alone again naturally right, and the judge

515
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:51,359
Speaker 3: ruled in the copyright holders favor against Warner Brothers. So

516
00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:53,880
Speaker 3: all of a sudden, Warner Brothers, big business, big company,

517
00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:58,000
Speaker 3: starts circling the wagons like okay, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. There,

518
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,479
Speaker 3: we're really exposed right now because yeah, all of our

519
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,560
Speaker 3: hip hop artists are runninground sampling anybody they want to, right,

520
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:07,639
Speaker 3: and now we can get sued for it. And the

521
00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 3: judge caught a lot of flak because he said, and

522
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,679
Speaker 3: not only not only am I ruling in your favor,

523
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:15,320
Speaker 3: I think that this should go to some sort of

524
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:20,280
Speaker 3: criminal prosecution. Wow, right, because this is their defense. Warn't

525
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 3: Brother's defense was it's a rampant everybody's doing this and

526
00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:25,480
Speaker 3: we've been doing it for ten years, Like what's your problem?

527
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:27,840
Speaker 3: And the judge was like, well, if that's the case,

528
00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:30,159
Speaker 3: then we need to really start looking into this. And

529
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 3: that shut everything down. That's when sampling went from art

530
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:36,000
Speaker 3: to business.

531
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm surprised it took that long for people to

532
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,239
Speaker 1: catch on. Yeah, and it was money is what did it?

533
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 1: As sales and you know, it was just like DJs

534
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,680
Speaker 1: and queens, was no big deal. In the nineteen seventies

535
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 1: and early eighties, right, but all of a sudden, these artists,

536
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 1: these hip hop artists were making money, yeah, on work

537
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 1: from that was previously recorded by other people, and people

538
00:28:56,040 --> 00:29:00,760
Speaker 1: saw green essentially, It's true, it's all dollar signs they did.

539
00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:05,080
Speaker 3: But let me ask you, this, should the original people,

540
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:08,360
Speaker 3: the original artists, Like I can understand just hating on

541
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 3: corporations because they didn't create this at all. These right

542
00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 3: happen to own it or whatever, But it should the

543
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 3: original artists expect some sort of compensation for somebody who's

544
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 3: making millions of dollars by taking some of that original work.

545
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:25,240
Speaker 3: Do they deserve any kind of consideration?

546
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 1: I think so.

547
00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:30,760
Speaker 3: I think I agree too, depending on how like what

548
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:33,720
Speaker 3: degree the work has changed, right, you know.

549
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 1: I say, use the crap out of it, but get

550
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:41,960
Speaker 1: permission and pay royalties. Yeah, Like, if that's the genre

551
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 1: you're if that's what you're choosing to do, Like no

552
00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:46,480
Speaker 1: one's forcing these people to do that, that's what you're

553
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,240
Speaker 1: choosing to do, then you've got to play by the rules,

554
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:51,840
Speaker 1: That's what I think, and then go wild with it.

555
00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 3: Well, I guess that's kind of like the status quo now.

556
00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,280
Speaker 3: And that's not working necessarily. It's leading to like your

557
00:29:58,320 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 3: beef with kid.

558
00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:03,160
Speaker 1: Rock, Well, my beef is that he's just not very good.

559
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 3: It's large. It's larger than that. You'd be careful, man.

560
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 3: He gets in fights and stuff.

561
00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:09,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, waffle houses in Atlanta.

562
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:11,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, so he knows where we live.

563
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:14,000
Speaker 1: I saw Bizmarque at the airport one time.

564
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 3: By the way, you we hung out with biz Marquie once.

565
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 3: Really yeah, played PlayStation.

566
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:19,360
Speaker 1: Yeah. I saw him on the on the little internal

567
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,959
Speaker 1: train and I was like, is that yeah? That is

568
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: I mean I thought for about a half a second and.

569
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 3: I was like, yeah, they're worrying the gray curly powdered wig.

570
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,360
Speaker 1: No, no, he didn't wear that marque. All right, So

571
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 1: let's talk about what the cost of it is. Ten dollars, No,

572
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:38,800
Speaker 1: not ten dollars. At first, it was something it was

573
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:41,680
Speaker 1: called a buyout, so you purchased rights to sample a song.

574
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: It wasn't that much money. But like I said, as

575
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 1: sales grew in the rap and hip hop world, and uh,

576
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 1: you know rock Band said it too, they started paying

577
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: rollover rates, which is you got to pay per your sales, right,

578
00:30:56,800 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 1: which all of a sudden, you know, the bill got

579
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:00,320
Speaker 1: larger and large and.

580
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:04,040
Speaker 3: Larger, And you're not necessarily just paying one person. No, No,

581
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 3: you might pay the copyright owner of the composition of

582
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 3: the music. And if you use a specific recording rather

583
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 3: than record that composition yourself and use it, then you

584
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 3: have to pay the owner of that particular recording, which

585
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,720
Speaker 3: aren't necessarily one and the same right, and they both

586
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 3: might want equal amounts of money rather than giving you

587
00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:23,720
Speaker 3: a deal.

588
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 1: You know, or if you're Vanilla Ice, you would just

589
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 1: slightly alter Queen's famous baseline from under pressure, not even

590
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 1: so much as credit them on your album. Forget asking

591
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,680
Speaker 1: for rights. He didn't even say like special thanks to

592
00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: Queen and settle out of court eventually for an undisclosed

593
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 1: sum of money.

594
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:49,400
Speaker 3: He raises jet skis now under the name Vanilla Ice.

595
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 1: Does he also he has a home renovation show too?

596
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 3: Does he really?

597
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 1: Yeah?

598
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:55,360
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, he flips houses.

599
00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, it's pretty weird. Well it's not weird, it's

600
00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:00,600
Speaker 1: weird for him to do it.

601
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:02,480
Speaker 3: Uh.

602
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 1: Mc hammer very famous for his sampling of and Can't

603
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: Touch This and his pants super Freak? Oh yeah yeah?

604
00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:14,280
Speaker 3: Did he royalties?

605
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 1: No? He did? That was all on the up and up.

606
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 1: Is he really? Yeah? He was back then.

607
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 3: Well he's he.

608
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: Got a pray angelist. You got to pray just to

609
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 1: make it.

610
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 3: Today, says Run from Run DMC.

611
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 1: Really yeah, huh. And and Ice Ice Baby is out

612
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:32,040
Speaker 1: there flipping houses.

613
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:35,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, they all got to do something. And Dustin Diamond

614
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 3: from Saved by the Bell, Uh.

615
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 1: It was not a rapper.

616
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:41,840
Speaker 3: He was evicted. He was in the process of being evicted,

617
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,480
Speaker 3: and he had he launched a web campaign to save

618
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 3: his house.

619
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 1: I remember that.

620
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:47,160
Speaker 3: I wonder whatever happened.

621
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:51,239
Speaker 1: I don't know. The drum intro for led Zeppelins when

622
00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:54,280
Speaker 1: the levee breaks, that thing has been sampled dozens and

623
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:55,680
Speaker 1: dozens and dozens of times.

624
00:32:55,760 --> 00:33:02,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, but it's so massive and it's so immediately recognizable

625
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,600
Speaker 3: that it takes over a song, you know what I'm saying, Like,

626
00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:09,360
Speaker 3: I don't. I don't think it's a it's just it's

627
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:13,040
Speaker 3: basically like, oh, this this is a led Zeppelin sample,

628
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:16,720
Speaker 3: rather than like that's a great thing about a men brother,

629
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:18,760
Speaker 3: It's like no one ever ever heard of that. But

630
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 3: it was a perfect drum break. Yeah, that LEDs that

631
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,120
Speaker 3: when the lovey breaks, it's just it's too led Zeppelin.

632
00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:26,120
Speaker 1: So too recognizable and you're off of it.

633
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:29,479
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just started thinking about Robert Plant right.

634
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 1: I think they were down with it though. Jimmy Page,

635
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:35,840
Speaker 1: I remember, was totally cool with it. Yeah, yeah, with

636
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,719
Speaker 1: the musing that. Of course it wasn't his lick. No,

637
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 1: it was John Bonham. Uh, he's not around to say

638
00:33:42,560 --> 00:34:16,279
Speaker 1: anything no and things jogging job. In two thousand and three,

639
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 1: the b C Boys, I said, the landmark case Newton v. Diamond.

640
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:25,480
Speaker 1: They did a sample and we'll hear it right now,

641
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,359
Speaker 1: the very beginning of past the mic contains this six

642
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:44,479
Speaker 1: second flute stab, so you hear that. It's like three

643
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:48,880
Speaker 1: notes on a flute. And they got the rights, the

644
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:53,000
Speaker 1: sample rights for the sound recording, but not the compositional

645
00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:55,719
Speaker 1: rights because they were like, you know, this guy played it,

646
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 1: so we'll pay him, but it's three notes on a flute, Like,

647
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:01,520
Speaker 1: we don't feel like we should have to pay compositional rights. Yeah.

648
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:03,640
Speaker 3: I've always thought it was something like eight notes. Was

649
00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:06,359
Speaker 3: the cutoff or something like that, Like there's a number

650
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 3: of notes. I remember that from being a kid. I

651
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 3: don't know why that would have come up when I

652
00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 3: was a kid, but I seem to remember that.

653
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:15,520
Speaker 1: Well. The BC Boys won their case, actually, and the

654
00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:20,240
Speaker 1: judge said that the brief composition consisting of three notes

655
00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:23,440
Speaker 1: separated by a half step, is not sufficient to sustain

656
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 1: a claim for copyright infringement. So that was we already

657
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,279
Speaker 1: played the clip, didn't we. Yeah? Yeah, so that was it.

658
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:32,480
Speaker 1: And you also you not only heard at the very

659
00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:35,160
Speaker 1: beginning of that song, but you hear it underlying the

660
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:35,879
Speaker 1: entire song.

661
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:40,200
Speaker 3: What's the best sample of all time? Best use of

662
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:45,080
Speaker 3: a sample? Your favorite? How about that doesn't have to

663
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:45,479
Speaker 3: be best?

664
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:48,040
Speaker 1: You know what my favorite is from the b C Boys.

665
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: Hey ladies, remember when it's from Ballroom Blitz. You know

666
00:35:55,120 --> 00:36:00,880
Speaker 1: that song, Ballroom Blitz? Yeah, a terrible, terrible song. Yeah sampled.

667
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:03,719
Speaker 1: BC boy sampled that song, and hey ladies, when they

668
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,480
Speaker 1: break that one part down, it goes she thinks she's

669
00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: the passionate one that's from Ballroom Blitz.

670
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:11,160
Speaker 3: Huh wow.

671
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:12,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, So that's my favorite one.

672
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 3: I definitely wouldn't have ever ever caught that.

673
00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 1: U still love the BC Boys Back in the day.

674
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:23,720
Speaker 3: Have you ever heard the pop will eat Itself?

675
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:24,480
Speaker 2: Uh?

676
00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:25,160
Speaker 1: Yeah?

677
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,760
Speaker 3: Back in like the early nineties are kind of electronic.

678
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 3: They had a song, well, they're one big song psycho

679
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:37,719
Speaker 3: Sexual actually sampled a classical composition, Eric Sati's Jinna Pedi Nice.

680
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:41,479
Speaker 3: It's really awesome. I'd heard I loved Gina Pedi and

681
00:36:41,719 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 3: I love Psychosexual, and then one day I just heard

682
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:46,240
Speaker 3: it just where I was like, oh.

683
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 1: My god, that's that's.

684
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,600
Speaker 3: That's one of my favorites. Favorite, like probably of all

685
00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:55,440
Speaker 3: time was Ice Cubes Good Day, Yeah, using the Isley

686
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:56,759
Speaker 3: Brothers Footsteps in the Dark.

687
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was good. And then Doctor Dre's The Chronic

688
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 1: was like, that was just the soundtrack of one year

689
00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:04,759
Speaker 1: of my college life. Oh yeah, and that was a

690
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:08,480
Speaker 1: lot of George Clinton in there. Tons and Dre was

691
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,319
Speaker 1: actually one of the first people to stop sampling and

692
00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:16,800
Speaker 1: start recreating stuff with live musicians.

693
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:20,799
Speaker 3: Himself, which is called producing. Yeah, you're right, And now

694
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:22,360
Speaker 3: he has his own line of headphones.

695
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:24,399
Speaker 1: Should we talk about Danger Mouse real quick?

696
00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 3: Sure?

697
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:26,440
Speaker 1: The Gray Album?

698
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:27,279
Speaker 3: Yeah.

699
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:29,720
Speaker 1: He famously in two thousand and four did a mashup

700
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 1: of the Beatles White Album and Jay Z's The Black

701
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:37,400
Speaker 1: Album and called it the Gray Album. Very creative, and Emi,

702
00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:40,759
Speaker 1: who owned the Beatles recordings, even though Jay Z and

703
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:43,239
Speaker 1: Paul McCartney were totally fine with it, they shut it

704
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 1: down and said, you're not selling this.

705
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:47,360
Speaker 3: No, but it made his career.

706
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it got around on the internet such that

707
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 1: he was like, fine, I'm not selling it, but everyone's

708
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:52,880
Speaker 1: going to hear it anyway.

709
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:54,440
Speaker 3: I'll go hang out with ce Lo and do some

710
00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 3: stuff in MF Doom and we'll just make some money

711
00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:01,400
Speaker 3: from that instead. Oh, chuck, what about cover songs?

712
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:04,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, since nineteen o nine, you can cover songs.

713
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 3: You can play a song faithfully, especially live, Yeah, and

714
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 3: not pay the owner of the composition as cent, as

715
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:15,840
Speaker 3: long as you don't alter it, like play it in

716
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:21,359
Speaker 3: a different language or something like that. Right, And there's

717
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:23,440
Speaker 3: a lot of people who say, well, wait a minute,

718
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:27,759
Speaker 3: that's like that's a sample in its entirety. This is crazy. Yeah,

719
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:30,880
Speaker 3: what is the deal? And everyone has said, we don't know,

720
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:32,760
Speaker 3: we'll figure it out in another ten years.

721
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:35,480
Speaker 1: You know what bugs me is when these new country

722
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: artists will cover a song that's like a year old,

723
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:42,600
Speaker 1: like another song and release it's a great acclaim.

724
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:46,480
Speaker 3: Well, that used to happen like a lot, like more

725
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 3: than one person would record the same song and they

726
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,719
Speaker 3: get released about the same time, like in the fifties

727
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:56,439
Speaker 3: and the sixties. So just be glad you don't live then,

728
00:38:57,400 --> 00:38:58,840
Speaker 3: because you'd be going crazy.

729
00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:02,440
Speaker 1: That's true. And just so you guys know, the reason

730
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:05,080
Speaker 1: we're able to play these clips is because something called

731
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:08,120
Speaker 1: fair use, which we've talked about a lot with Jerry.

732
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, because just put your pens down, lawyers, because we

733
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:12,399
Speaker 3: know what we're doing.

734
00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:14,840
Speaker 1: It's only in the United States and it is the

735
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:19,440
Speaker 1: exclusive right granted to us to play a snippet of

736
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 1: something without acquiring permission, as long as we use it

737
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:28,000
Speaker 1: as commentary, criticism, research, teaching, or news reporting. Well wait

738
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:29,600
Speaker 1: a minute, this is what we're doing.

739
00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 3: Does that mean that if this is heard in Australia, though,

740
00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 3: are we still covered by fair use that?

741
00:39:37,080 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 1: I don't know.

742
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:41,239
Speaker 3: I we'll find out. All right, Well, let's it for

743
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:43,400
Speaker 3: music sampling. This turned out better than I thought. You

744
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:46,360
Speaker 3: got anything else? No, I mean you got any more samples?

745
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:50,320
Speaker 1: No, I'm putting my turntable back in my pocket. Okay,

746
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:56,080
Speaker 1: and you know they have those little iPhone turntables now, yeah,

747
00:39:56,120 --> 00:40:03,400
Speaker 1: which is eh. Come on, Jerry and Sid gave us it.

748
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:06,719
Speaker 3: If you want to learn more about music sampling, you

749
00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:09,959
Speaker 3: can type that into the handy search part HowStuffWorks dot Com,

750
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:13,320
Speaker 3: which means it's time for listener mail.

751
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:19,600
Speaker 1: Before listener mail, Josh, I want to point people who

752
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 1: are into sampling in the history of sampling to go

753
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 1: to who sampled dot com.

754
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:27,480
Speaker 3: I'm glad you mentioned this. I meant to mention it too.

755
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,600
Speaker 1: It's a really awesome website and it allows you basically

756
00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:33,440
Speaker 1: you can you can search for artists who have sampled

757
00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:38,040
Speaker 1: and who have been sampled, and search for songs and

758
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 1: they basically throw them up side by side as two turntables,

759
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 1: like the original sample or the original uh you know,

760
00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:46,560
Speaker 1: break or whatever than how it was used. It's pretty cool.

761
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 3: You can plain I'm simultaneously.

762
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's awesome.

763
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:49,360
Speaker 3: It's something.

764
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 1: So that is WhoSampled dot com. Yeah, all right, Josh,

765
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:54,120
Speaker 1: I'm gonna read this. It's kind of a long one,

766
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 1: but this is about spies. And this is from Tom

767
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:02,320
Speaker 1: and he said that his family has a strange tendency

768
00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:06,799
Speaker 1: of being arrested on suspicion of being Kiwi spies New

769
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:08,160
Speaker 1: Zealand spies in France.

770
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:09,640
Speaker 3: They all wear trench coats.

771
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 1: The first story concerns my parents on their honeymoon in

772
00:41:13,120 --> 00:41:16,480
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty five. It was immediately following the sinking of

773
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:21,080
Speaker 1: the Rainbow Warrior in Auckland Harbor by French saboteurs. My

774
00:41:21,160 --> 00:41:23,400
Speaker 1: parents were traveling into France from the UK when they

775
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:26,880
Speaker 1: were arrested and detained on suspicion of being New Zealand

776
00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:29,960
Speaker 1: counter terrorists. Nothing could be further from the truth by

777
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:32,640
Speaker 1: the way they were held in separate holding cells for

778
00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:36,080
Speaker 1: two days. When French agents would come inside the cell,

779
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:38,800
Speaker 1: smoking cigarettes and yelling at them in French. It was

780
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:40,880
Speaker 1: pretty terrifying for my mother, who was only twenty one

781
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:43,280
Speaker 1: at the time, And after two days they were released

782
00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: and dropped off at the New Zealand Embassy where they

783
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:49,200
Speaker 1: learned of the incident back in Auckland. So that's one incident.

784
00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:54,240
Speaker 1: The second story is comes from great great Anti Anne

785
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:57,759
Speaker 1: or Sister Marie. She's a nun with an order of

786
00:41:57,760 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: the Little Sisters of the Poor, and she is ninety

787
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:03,080
Speaker 1: eight years old this year and is still going strong.

788
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:07,560
Speaker 1: Her story originates with the Nazis. She had been with

789
00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 1: her fellow nuns in rural France looking after the elderly

790
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:13,799
Speaker 1: who had been abandoned as the Nazis approached. They were

791
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:16,160
Speaker 1: also sheltering three to four British airmen who had been

792
00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:19,480
Speaker 1: shot down nearby. When the Nazis arrived, they rounded up

793
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 1: the nuns, and the airmen accused the nuns of being spies.

794
00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:26,040
Speaker 1: She and her fellow nuns, of which she was mother superior,

795
00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:31,040
Speaker 1: were taken to a pow camp interrogated by Gestapo officers

796
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:36,200
Speaker 1: He's nuns. Eventually she was marched into the commandant's office

797
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:39,359
Speaker 1: told she was being taken away. Believing she was going

798
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 1: to be shot, she told them she would not cooperate

799
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 1: unless her nuns were also set free. Turned into a

800
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:48,239
Speaker 1: pretty hostile negotiation, and she stuck to her guns, even

801
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:50,240
Speaker 1: though at one point she was looking down the barrel

802
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 1: of one. The commandant finally agreed and bundled all the

803
00:42:53,719 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 1: sisters together on a freight train, where they believed they

804
00:42:56,200 --> 00:42:59,440
Speaker 1: were going to be executed together. Suddenly the train stopped.

805
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 1: The gar cauards on the train threw the nuns out

806
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,279
Speaker 1: one by one into the snow, The doors closed, and

807
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:07,440
Speaker 1: the train sped off. Sister Marie eventually led her nuns

808
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:09,759
Speaker 1: to the convent, where they spent the last two years

809
00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:12,320
Speaker 1: of the war, not only helping the elderly, but also

810
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:17,919
Speaker 1: sheltering and feeding members of the French resistance, so he said.

811
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 1: Tom said, if I could read this on the podcast,

812
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: I know Auntie Anne would really appreciate the airtime for

813
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:27,399
Speaker 1: the convent in which she is dedicated over seventy years too,

814
00:43:27,760 --> 00:43:31,040
Speaker 1: and I would appreciate letting people know about why nobody

815
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:35,120
Speaker 1: and my family feel safe in France. Man, So, ninety

816
00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:39,239
Speaker 1: eight year old Auntie Anne, the nun, We thank you

817
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:42,319
Speaker 1: for all your work over the years, and I hope

818
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 1: you make it to one hundred and twenty.

819
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:46,080
Speaker 3: Yeah. Way to thwart the Nazis.

820
00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:49,080
Speaker 1: Yeah nice? How about that? That's from Tom R.

821
00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:51,800
Speaker 3: Thanks a lot, Tom for letting us know that we

822
00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:56,399
Speaker 3: appreciate it. Wow. I guess if you have a cool

823
00:43:56,440 --> 00:43:58,920
Speaker 3: family story, we want to hear that. We're always We're

824
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 3: always up for us and you can send us an

825
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:08,120
Speaker 3: email to Stuff podcast at iHeartRadio dot com.

826
00:44:08,239 --> 00:44:11,120
Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For

827
00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:15,400
Speaker 1: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

828
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:17,360
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.