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Speaker 1: The Book of Joe Podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey there, welcome back. It's The Book of Joe Podcast,

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Speaker 1: World Series Edition. I'm Tom Berducci. He's Joe Madden. Joe.

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Speaker 1: How you doing good?

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Speaker 2: Tommy?

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Speaker 3: I didn't realize we're three hours difference out there in Arizona.

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Speaker 3: My kids are there even realize that that we just

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Speaker 3: dropped like maybe two hours different.

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Speaker 2: So early tip of the hat to you this morning. Man.

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Speaker 1: I could never keep it straight. Sometimes it's three, sometimes

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Speaker 1: it's two. Right now it happens to be three, and

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Speaker 1: we're at Halloween eve. How about that it's Halloween already, Joe.

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Speaker 1: Do you have a favorite like Halloween costume that you

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Speaker 1: had or a Halloween story as a kid?

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Speaker 3: Was a kid, I went to my cousin's crazy in

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Speaker 3: a little hamlet, little whatever you want to call it.

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Speaker 3: A Harwood was the name of the little town. And

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Speaker 3: it's about four or five miles from where I just

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Speaker 3: pointed my hand and cousin Joe Seppin, and he took

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Speaker 3: me this old schoolhouse. I mean, if I showed you

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Speaker 3: a picture of it, now you think, God, it might

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Speaker 3: have been eighteen fifty or whatever it was that antiqueish,

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Speaker 3: So I went.

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Speaker 2: There as you know, Tom and Jerry.

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Speaker 3: I can't remember if I was Tom or Jerry, the

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Speaker 3: cat or the mouse, but I went there as one

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Speaker 3: of the two and walked into this old school with

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Speaker 3: kids that I didn't even know, petrified and you walk

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Speaker 3: down a dirt road, you go into this old yellow building,

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Speaker 3: You go into this room and you're having a good time,

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Speaker 3: but you're scared out of your mind at the same time.

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Speaker 3: But my trip to Hartwood Minds is actually the name

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Speaker 3: of the little town. Cousin Joe Seppin as either Tom

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Speaker 3: or Jerry, cater or mouse in it is frightening Tom,

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Speaker 3: when you're that young. I mean, there's some kids that

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Speaker 3: adapt so well to My granddaughter Carson would like not

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Speaker 3: even blanche about something like that. But at that time

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Speaker 3: I was afraid to sleep in any bed but my own,

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Speaker 3: so there was a certain amount of a concern as

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Speaker 3: I walked into that old decrepit school.

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Speaker 1: Building, Tom and Jerry. It brings me back one year

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Speaker 1: in college as a freshman. My roommate was named Jerry,

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Speaker 1: and we had had a comic front page of the

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Speaker 1: comic strip Tom and Jerry on our shore for me

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Speaker 1: at the Calloween. I think about two things. One time,

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Speaker 1: when I was a kid, I didn't have a costume.

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Speaker 1: I threw something together last minute. I decided I was

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Speaker 1: going to be a track athlete. So going out the door,

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Speaker 1: remember it's October thirty. First, I'm going out the door

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Speaker 1: and like a running singlet in shorts. My mom said,

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Speaker 1: what are you doing? Get back there? Come up with

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Speaker 1: something else. I didn't know what I came up with,

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Speaker 1: but I wasn't going out in the middle of the

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Speaker 1: night with a tank top and shorts. And the other

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Speaker 1: was after freshman football practice, right a bunch of us

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Speaker 1: started walking around the neighborhood after practice with our football uniforms.

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Speaker 1: We used our helmets as bags. Gets some a little

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Speaker 1: bit of candy that night, that makes sense.

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Speaker 3: And the other time with the Cubs, we went to

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Speaker 3: Cleveland to play after we won Game five, to play

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Speaker 3: six and seven in Cleveland on Halloween night. I'm pretty

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Speaker 3: sure because I had this really bizarre shyness ty. It's

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Speaker 3: made by a company called Chinesety out of Boulder, Colorado,

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Speaker 3: shoot with like this macabre kind of a hatchets and

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Speaker 3: blood and all kinds of things on my suit as

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Speaker 3: they walked to the bus as some pictures of that,

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Speaker 3: so that should actually live for a long time.

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Speaker 1: I believe it's amazing how Halloween has become a grown

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Speaker 1: up holiday. It used to be a big kids thing,

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Speaker 1: and now it is. Everybody's dressing up. And I think

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Speaker 1: at the ballpark for Game four Halloween night, you'll see,

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Speaker 1: if not for Game three, you'll see plenty of costumes

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Speaker 1: at Chase Field in Arizona. This World Series, Joe, we're

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Speaker 1: tied one game apiece. Give me your quick thoughts on

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Speaker 1: how we got to one one after two.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, like we had talked about before we began,

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Speaker 3: Arizona is really an interesting team to watch play baseball.

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Speaker 3: I thought, you know, quite frankly, they should be two

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Speaker 3: and one. We all agree with that. I mean, Seawall

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Speaker 3: has been so good. He makes one mistake to the

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Speaker 3: to Seeger and all of a sudden, it's a they

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Speaker 3: win that first game.

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Speaker 2: We get to one on one.

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Speaker 3: I typically we talked about this with the Diamondbacks, to

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Speaker 3: their ability to come back not only in a game,

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Speaker 3: but now you're seeing it in a series. There's a

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Speaker 3: there's a high level of enthusiasm and energy among this group,

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Speaker 3: right now and we're all talking about the throwback game.

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Speaker 3: And yes, it's it's wonderful to watch the pitcher, Kelly pitching.

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Speaker 3: He wasn't out there just trying to spin the ball

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Speaker 3: at the top of the strike zone. They're stealing bags

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Speaker 3: or taking extra bases. They're Bunny, even long ago, bunning

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Speaker 3: for a hit, which just permeates the rest of the team.

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Speaker 3: When a veteran player like that attempts to give himself

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Speaker 3: up for the greater good, they are really demonstrating, you know,

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Speaker 3: what we've learned about, we talked about, we learned in

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Speaker 3: the eighties, primarily seventies and eighties, that style of baseball

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Speaker 3: that is baseball, that's not a style that is baseball.

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Speaker 2: So you know, quite frankly, I'm really rooting for that

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Speaker 2: right now.

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Speaker 3: It's and not to denigrate the Rangers at all, you know,

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Speaker 3: they they're doing a nice job and they still may

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Speaker 3: win this whole thing, absolutely, but to rubber stamp this

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Speaker 3: whole thing with the Diamondbacks. At the end of this poem,

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Speaker 3: you see Diamondbacks role series winners and really.

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Speaker 2: Taken to heart.

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Speaker 3: You know, they they've they've probably ingratiated the new rules

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Speaker 3: changes as well as anybody and uh ingratiated with and

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Speaker 3: and on top of that, they're just playing this very

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Speaker 3: interesting game of baseball that how could you how could

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Speaker 3: you not agree with that? Uh?

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Speaker 2: The Yes Day have power.

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Speaker 3: Yes they can hit home runs, but they're they're able

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Speaker 3: to do different things in different ways. I've always said,

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Speaker 3: I want it all. I want power, I want the

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Speaker 3: ability to move the baseball. I want to hit and run.

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Speaker 3: I want to put score running from there with us

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Speaker 3: in two outs. I want pitchers going the third time

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Speaker 3: with the batting owner because they know how to pitch,

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Speaker 3: and they have more than two pitches.

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Speaker 2: All this stuff that's what we're seeing on display right now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Bengo, I'm glad you said that, Joe get to

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Speaker 1: this in the moment, because I think some of the

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Speaker 1: small ball stuff is getting way overrated. But as far

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Speaker 1: as the series, yes, I think that d Bax could

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Speaker 1: be up to nothing. The pitch from seawalld to me

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Speaker 1: in my book, that's not a mistake. It's a fastball

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Speaker 1: top of the zone. Now I know Seger dead fastball,

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Speaker 1: hit or first pitch, I get it. Paul Sewald had

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Speaker 1: thrown two years worth of fastballs at the top of

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Speaker 1: his own and nobody had hit a home run on

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Speaker 1: that pitch. Gives Seager credit. That was an amazing job

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Speaker 1: of hitting. Adulis Garcia wins the game with another amazing

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Speaker 1: job of hitting. It's a sinker down on the zone

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Speaker 1: from Castro high nineties that he just carves out to

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Speaker 1: the opposite field. Those were not two bad pitches. That

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Speaker 1: was great hitting that defeated the Diamondbacks that night. So

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Speaker 1: we've got that. But I like what you said, Joe.

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Speaker 1: You still want power now if you'll have to realize

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Speaker 1: that we're not going to see the return of what

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Speaker 1: he Herzog's Royals or Cardinals. What you want is a

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Speaker 1: team like the Diamondbacks that has a diversity of ways

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Speaker 1: to win a game, and not everybody has the kind

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Speaker 1: of speed that they have. I mean, they pressure you

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Speaker 1: even when they don't run. Because the fielders know the

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Speaker 1: clock in their head is moving quickly. Pitchers have to

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Speaker 1: be quicker to the plate. I love the fact that

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Speaker 1: the game is played, as Tory Labello likes to say,

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Speaker 1: fast and loose, right. I actually did not like Longoria's

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Speaker 1: bunt his first time up. He's in the eighth spot

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Speaker 1: in the lineup, leadoff guys on base, left handed pitcher

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Speaker 1: on the mound. Longoria. We've seen him already. Carb hits

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Speaker 1: the other way that fold on the right side is

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Speaker 1: wide open. I don't like bunting up to the number

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Speaker 1: nine hitter for the out there. I didn't like that,

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Speaker 1: But I like the thought process, if that makes any sense.

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Speaker 1: Here's Evan Longoria with one career sack in his career,

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Speaker 1: and he is part of this team and this is

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Speaker 1: how they play. Nothing's off the table. That's what I

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Speaker 1: like about Arizona. They have multiple ways to win a game.

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Speaker 1: And right Joe, they do have some power there too,

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Speaker 1: and once Christian Walker gets going, you're gonna see that. Still,

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Speaker 1: the biggest thing that's going to influence the outcome of

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Speaker 1: the game is out homering your opponent period. The winning

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Speaker 1: percentages is like, uh, you can't do that all the time, though,

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Speaker 1: And that's what I love about Arizona. If you don't

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Speaker 1: have a home run, they can still beat you in

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Speaker 1: other ways. That's what I think, Joe, other teams should

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Speaker 1: be chasing, and especially with the new rules. To me,

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Speaker 1: like Corbyn Carroll, he is the pre eminent player that

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Speaker 1: you want to find now you know he puts the

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Speaker 1: ball in play, he's got some slug he's a good defender.

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Speaker 1: But if you got an over eighty percent success rate,

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Speaker 1: give you more of those guys that can pressure the

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Speaker 1: other team.

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Speaker 2: What is harder to game plan against?

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Speaker 1: Oh, no question.

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Speaker 3: Simeon and Seger or Martin Carroll. I mean at the

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Speaker 3: first two guys in the batting room. I'm just I

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Speaker 3: was thinking about that yesterday or today whatever, just purely

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Speaker 3: from game planning perspective. To me, it's more difficult Martine

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Speaker 3: and Carol as opposed to Simon and Siagret. I still

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Speaker 3: believe you plan against Simey and you you get try

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Speaker 3: to get ahead, and then you just expand his own

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Speaker 3: and then you never pitch the secret. That's I still

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Speaker 3: believe that. I still believe that secret is that good.

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Speaker 3: But those other two guys, Martain Carroll, they both have

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Speaker 3: a little pop, but they also once they get on there,

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Speaker 3: the mindset of the pitcher.

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Speaker 2: Changes, the mindset of the defense changes.

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Speaker 3: There's there's more, there's more arrows coming at this at

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Speaker 3: you when those two guys get out there. So if

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Speaker 3: I was in a meeting, in a pre series meeting,

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Speaker 3: and I got, you know, I got Simeon and Sieger

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Speaker 3: hitting well, and I.

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Speaker 2: Got Martin Carroll both hitting well.

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Speaker 3: Man, I think, you know, again, from a game planning perspective,

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Speaker 3: I think it'd be easier or I would be prefer

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Speaker 3: I don't want to say easier, prefer planning against the

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Speaker 3: first two hitters of the Rangers lineup as approach to

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Speaker 3: the first two hitters of the Diamondbacks line up.

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Speaker 1: I'm with you, Joe, and I think because of all

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Speaker 1: the things we talked about, it's not just the pitches

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Speaker 1: you have to make, it's once they do get on base,

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Speaker 1: and the way it's going to affect everybody on defense.

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Speaker 1: That's not really going to happen with Simon and Sieger.

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Speaker 1: They're going to wait for Garcia behind them hit the

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Speaker 1: ball out of the park. One thing on Sieger, that

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Speaker 1: home running hit off seawalled, you know, as amazing as

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Speaker 1: it was, I can tell you for a fact that

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Speaker 1: kind of put a shock in the system of the Diamondbacks.

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Speaker 1: I belie leave you will not see the Diamondbacks throw

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Speaker 1: another fastball in the zone to Corey's Sieger.

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Speaker 2: And then what they.

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Speaker 1: Want to do? He fit He hunts fastballs doesn't miss them.

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Speaker 1: They now know that. So what they're going to do

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Speaker 1: and what they did, Kelly did this perfectly in game two.

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Speaker 1: You throw Corey Seger pitches that look like fastballs to

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Speaker 1: get him to swing out. What are we talking about.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about change ups and cutters. You can't challenge

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Speaker 1: him at any point. First pitch three doesn't matter with

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Speaker 1: a fastball in the zone. You want to show him

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Speaker 1: a fastball in the zone or out of the zone

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Speaker 1: maybe once in a while. In fact, in game two,

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Speaker 1: they threw Corey Seeger one fastball the entire game and

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Speaker 1: it was way outside the zone. So keep an eye

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Speaker 1: on that going forward. They will not challenge Seger. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they won't pitch to him, but they'll take advantage of

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Speaker 1: his progressiveness by throwing him cutters and changeups that look

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Speaker 1: like fastballs. And you better not miss with those either,

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Speaker 1: by the way, but to get hit, go all off

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Speaker 1: the barrel. Don't challenge him with a fastball.

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Speaker 2: I mean, and.

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Speaker 3: Listen, I figured that out with the Angels there. It

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Speaker 3: might have been a second year middle or my sophomore

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Speaker 3: or junior year. It was it was like it was safe.

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Speaker 3: I'm watching from the sidelines said, damn, this is really obvious.

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Speaker 3: And I went to I don't know it was Wiser,

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Speaker 3: Eddie Wise or whomever I spoke with. Right after that,

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Speaker 3: I said, listen, no more strikes to this guy. I

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Speaker 3: mean no more like you're saying hit able strikes. I

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Speaker 3: wanted to test his patience. I felt you could frustrate

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Speaker 3: him to the point where he's going to start chasing

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Speaker 3: your pitch. But if you think you've set him up

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Speaker 3: for anything, you have not. And like I said, if

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Speaker 3: you think you've set him up for fastball anywhere in

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Speaker 3: his own you have not. And it's not unlike Vladimir

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Speaker 3: Guerrero when I had Vladdie on the other side, when

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Speaker 3: I was working against him, I used to tell my guys, listen,

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Speaker 3: don't ever think you have him set up for anything.

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Speaker 3: Don't ever especially a breaking ball. He's not set up.

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Speaker 3: I promise he's not set up. So you have Sometimes

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Speaker 3: what happens. His pitchers say, well, he hasn't seen I

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Speaker 3: fast board, he hasn't seen my slider, he hasn't seen

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Speaker 3: Matty Garza said that one time, and the ball is

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Speaker 3: still going. It might have been about David Ortiz, so

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Speaker 3: you know, these are the kind of things you got

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Speaker 3: to put your eg in the back pocket. It's the

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Speaker 3: part of game planning to me that is very interesting

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Speaker 3: and very very effective. And that's where Mike Borsella was

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Speaker 3: so good and Danny Herron. So Herron and Borsey are

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Speaker 3: kind of like they're not kind of cut from the

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Speaker 3: same cloth. They are, And I think Danny got a

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Speaker 3: lot of his inspiration of methods from Borzy. For a

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Speaker 3: couple of years, I used to do postgame press conferences

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Speaker 3: and I would say that team got Borzello tonight because

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Speaker 3: I would sit there and watch the whole thing unfold.

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Speaker 3: It's it's about breaking this down to the point where

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Speaker 3: it's usable. It's it's usable information. Small nuggets in the

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Speaker 3: dugout could be transmitted very quickly, talked about before, but

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Speaker 3: transmitted during the game. That Silman sometimes you forget, Catcher forgets,

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Speaker 3: Pitcher forgets. It could be transmitted very easily with a

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Speaker 3: really good game planner. So that's what I'm seeing. I

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Speaker 3: saw that we're seeing that with Danny and Haron versus

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Speaker 3: the Ringers right now. I'd be surprised. You're right, I mean,

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Speaker 3: I can't just I mean, we talked about Seawell's pitch,

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Speaker 3: but I just think I know how hard is elevated

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Speaker 3: fastball is Seger was looking for that. He was sold

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Speaker 3: out to that pitch. Absolutely a big dog. He sold

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Speaker 3: out to it. And that's why I was able to

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Speaker 3: get there on time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Hey, I'm glad you brought up Danny Heron. Now,

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Speaker 1: as you mentioned run prevention coordinator, I think that's his title,

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Speaker 1: but it's pretty much what he does with the Arizona

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Speaker 1: Diamondbacks because if you've been watching this postseason, man, I

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Speaker 1: think coming up with game plans and adapting the course

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Speaker 1: of the game has been so much of what's winning

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Speaker 1: and losing this game. And we got some good stories

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Speaker 1: to tell you about how the Diamondbacks are doing that.

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Speaker 1: We're going to get back to that right after this. Okay, Joe,

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Speaker 1: game planning, it's huge I'm seeing in this series so far.

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Speaker 1: Texas and they came in mad red hot.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: What was the talk about the World Series was the Rangers,

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Speaker 1: the depth of the lineup, how they can hurt you quickly.

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Speaker 1: Put it's like a fast break offense. They get rolling,

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Speaker 1: it's just hard to stop. Well, Arizona stopped them the

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Speaker 1: two home runs really save them in game with number one.

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Speaker 1: Otherwise Texas is hitting a buck eighty eight. And if

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Speaker 1: you watch Merrill Kelly pitch in Game two, my goodness,

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Speaker 1: what a toward the force of precision pitching he put

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Speaker 1: on in that game. I think he threw about eighty

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Speaker 1: nine or ninety pitches, none more than ninety five. The

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Speaker 1: pitch he used the most was to change up everything

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Speaker 1: on the edge. When the Rangers were aggressive early in

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Speaker 1: the count, he made sure he had his pitches right

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Speaker 1: off the edge get them the chase. When they were

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Speaker 1: giving him early strikes, he was putting them on the

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Speaker 1: edge to get those strikes. It was just amazing to watch.

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Speaker 1: And I want to talk about the two pitching coaches,

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Speaker 1: Mike and Brent Strom. Mike Maddox has been a pitching

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Speaker 1: coach for twenty one years in the big leagues. Brent Strom,

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Speaker 1: I believe it's thirty three years as a pitching coach.

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Speaker 1: If you don't think that matters, folks, you're missing something.

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Speaker 1: Because these guys not only are putting together game plans,

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Speaker 1: they're making adjustments on the fly. They're reacting to what

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Speaker 1: the hitters are telling them in the course of a game,

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Speaker 1: and I think both have done an amazing job. They're

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Speaker 1: both great at mound visits. You're paying attention to these games,

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Speaker 1: you see how they slow the game down with the

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Speaker 1: pitch timer. Mound visits are even more important than ever.

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Speaker 1: Strom and Maddix will both go out there when a

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Speaker 1: pitcher's pitch count is getting up towards thirty. Sometimes it's

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Speaker 1: not to go over scouting reports. People love to say,

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Speaker 1: oh he's going over the scouting report. No, slow the

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Speaker 1: game down. Give your pitcher literally a physical breather, get

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Speaker 1: a reboot at that point, let them get back to work.

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Speaker 1: So I'll get more into that, Joe, But I want

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Speaker 1: your take on the value of these experienced pitching coaches.

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Speaker 1: I'm seeing it. I don't know if the fans are

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Speaker 1: seeing it, but I'm seeing it throughout the postseason, especially

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Speaker 1: here in the World World Series.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god, of course. I mean.

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Speaker 3: My first real mentor with all of this was Marcel Latchman.

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Speaker 3: Latch is still working in some capacity with the Colorado

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Speaker 3: Rockies for years. I saw the impact latch had on

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Speaker 3: those really good Angel staffs with Jimmy Abbott, Mark Langston,

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Speaker 3: Chuck Finley. Even before that, Bruce Keyson, Kenny Forsch, Tommy John,

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Speaker 3: Tommy John and Jeff saw In love Marshall and to

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Speaker 3: this day, if I have a question, I'm going to

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Speaker 3: go to Marcel. I'm going to go to Latch and

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Speaker 3: ask him about it, because the guy had such a.

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Speaker 2: Great way I've been partying.

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Speaker 3: His information is such a wonderful calming influence on a

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Speaker 3: picture during the course game. Furthermore, the thing I love

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Speaker 3: about Marshall and Joe Colem was another one I had

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Speaker 3: junior for a long time. Their ability to help a

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Speaker 3: pitcher make an adaptation during the course of the game

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Speaker 3: based on what he's seeing. Just by watching the picture.

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Speaker 3: He knows when he's off, he knows something that they

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Speaker 3: had worked on that is not working right now. And

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Speaker 3: Marcel was always a big proponent of the breath, just

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Speaker 3: being able to breathe in a moment. So that's an

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Speaker 3: example I've had, you know, uh with the and I

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Speaker 3: talked about the game planning and we talked.

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Speaker 2: We had Mike Borsello on our program earlier this year.

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Speaker 2: I've seen it. I watch it, I listened to it

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Speaker 2: in the dugout.

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Speaker 3: That's to me, these guys, if you could hire a

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Speaker 3: Borzello or a Danny Herron to compliment a a Brent

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Speaker 3: Strom and uh and Maddox.

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Speaker 2: Every organization, that's what you should be striving for.

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Speaker 3: It. It's normally somebody with the experience, a former pitcher

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Speaker 3: with the brain. I think the White Sox is tired.

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Speaker 3: Brian Banister, I believe Banny's another guy. That's another guy

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Speaker 3: that is from this school of thought. Many example, the

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Speaker 3: last out of the World Series twenty sixteen, Michael Martinez

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Speaker 3: chopper to third versus Mikey Montgomery.

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Speaker 2: We've gone over this, but Bors he knew. He knew that.

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Speaker 3: Martinez said, like, one hundred against leftendant curveballs, that's it.

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Speaker 3: So he had this little sign with Mickey Montero, we're

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Speaker 3: doing nothing but curve, nothing but curve, nothing but curve

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Speaker 3: this whole at bat, and Money had a decent hook

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Speaker 3: and you got a chopper to third base. As an example,

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Speaker 3: this is game planning. This is the ability to impact

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Speaker 3: the game in the moment. This is what real major

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Speaker 3: league coaches do. And it's not just working off with

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Speaker 3: the script, although that had something to do with that,

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Speaker 3: but it's the ability to communicate during the game, watch

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Speaker 3: the game and make adaptations as it's in progress. A

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Speaker 3: Maddex goes out there, covers his mouth all the time.

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Speaker 2: St.

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Speaker 3: Strawbie used to go out more, I thought, And it's

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Speaker 3: probably the rule changes when he was with Houston. But nevertheless,

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Speaker 3: the language, the commentary they're speaking like you're saying, it's

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Speaker 3: not all this dissertation. When they go out there, it's

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Speaker 3: normally a break or maybe to remind him about one

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Speaker 3: little thing, but it's not a dissertation. And furthermore, it's

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Speaker 3: just the influence when if you have a good relationship

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Speaker 3: with your pitching coach, when he comes out there in

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Speaker 3: that hot moment, I know from a catcher's perspective, the

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Speaker 3: same thing.

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Speaker 2: It settles things down, man, and.

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Speaker 3: This guy speaking that same nice slow language that you

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Speaker 3: heard before the game that gets you in that back

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Speaker 3: into that space that permits you then to go out

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Speaker 3: and locate or make that pitch. And it could just

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Speaker 3: be something like, hey, they sometimes they choreograph we're going

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Speaker 3: to go we're gonna go elevated fastball, the we're just

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Speaker 3: going to bury three breaking balls underneath them. As an example,

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Speaker 3: they'll choreograph the hole at bat with. Of course they

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Speaker 3: can send them both the pitcher and a catcher. This

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Speaker 3: is what's happening there, man. And so I'm I'm running

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Speaker 3: an organization. I'm hiring Mike Borsello right off the street

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Speaker 3: right now or somebody like that, and I'm among my

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Speaker 3: young coaches. I'm going to nurture that ability and understand

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Speaker 3: how to do this, not only the breakdown prior to

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Speaker 3: the game, but how to be helpful during the game.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think Joe, especially in the post season, you

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Speaker 1: know it's it's it really can win a game for you.

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Speaker 1: There's no question. I love your example about the curve

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Speaker 1: ball from Montgomery to Martinez. There's a lot that we

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Speaker 1: don't see and don't know about, pitched by pitch, inning

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Speaker 1: by inning. One example for you with Brent Strom. The

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Speaker 1: guy pitching for Game three tonight is Brandon Fought, who

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Speaker 1: actually was devoted. This is amazing. Demoted to the minor

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Speaker 1: leagues three times this year, did not make the team

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Speaker 1: in spring training, goes to Reno, comes back, makes about

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Speaker 1: five starts or appearances for Arizona. They sent him back down,

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Speaker 1: comes back to Arizona, makes one appearance. They sent him

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Speaker 1: back down. Each time Brent Strown gave him something to

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Speaker 1: work on. In one case, it was throw fewer fastballs.

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Speaker 1: This is a kid in Triple A struck out more

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Speaker 1: than two hundred batters just throwing his fastball past Triple

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Speaker 1: A hitters. He it's not a high ve low pitch,

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Speaker 1: but he's got tremendous extension. He's got a low arm angle,

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Speaker 1: and the Triple A hitters weren't catching up to it.

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Speaker 1: Guess what major league hitters. They're slugging six point fifty

429
00:21:06,198 --> 00:21:08,838
Speaker 1: against his fastball. So Strom said, go down to the

430
00:21:08,838 --> 00:21:11,638
Speaker 1: minor leagues, work on your secondary pitches. You're going to

431
00:21:11,718 --> 00:21:14,358
Speaker 1: need those more often in the big leagues. Did that

432
00:21:14,798 --> 00:21:16,838
Speaker 1: The other thing that he did, Joe, he moved him

433
00:21:16,838 --> 00:21:18,678
Speaker 1: on the pitching rubber. This is a kid who would

434
00:21:18,678 --> 00:21:20,878
Speaker 1: pitch on the third base side of the rubber. And

435
00:21:20,918 --> 00:21:23,638
Speaker 1: I mentioned he's got this low release point, so the

436
00:21:23,678 --> 00:21:26,758
Speaker 1: ball was coming of his hand literally offset to the plate.

437
00:21:27,038 --> 00:21:29,198
Speaker 1: So the ball is not on the plate out of

438
00:21:29,198 --> 00:21:32,678
Speaker 1: his hand. So in too many cases he's not getting

439
00:21:32,718 --> 00:21:35,878
Speaker 1: swings and misses because hitters are reading ball out of

440
00:21:35,918 --> 00:21:38,678
Speaker 1: the hand and each pitch can't tunnel off the next

441
00:21:38,758 --> 00:21:41,798
Speaker 1: one when it's starting so off center. What does Strom do?

442
00:21:42,158 --> 00:21:44,318
Speaker 1: He moves him to the first base side of the rubber.

443
00:21:44,638 --> 00:21:47,438
Speaker 1: Now his hand when he releases the baseball is in

444
00:21:47,518 --> 00:21:50,638
Speaker 1: line with home plate. Now, as a hitter, that pitch

445
00:21:50,638 --> 00:21:53,078
Speaker 1: out of his hand is competitive as as soon as

446
00:21:53,118 --> 00:21:55,958
Speaker 1: it leaves his hand. Now you have to think, is

447
00:21:56,078 --> 00:21:58,758
Speaker 1: that a fastball, it's going to stay straight? Is it

448
00:21:58,798 --> 00:22:02,038
Speaker 1: going to go down? Curveball? Change up? Is it going

449
00:22:02,078 --> 00:22:04,638
Speaker 1: to go away from me? Is the hitter that's a sweeper?

450
00:22:04,998 --> 00:22:07,478
Speaker 1: Is he going to come into me? That's a two seemer.

451
00:22:08,158 --> 00:22:11,038
Speaker 1: Everything works off the pitch being competitive. Nobody does this

452
00:22:11,118 --> 00:22:13,438
Speaker 1: better in baseball than Garrett Cole. And it was Brent

453
00:22:13,478 --> 00:22:17,558
Speaker 1: Strom who did that with Garrett Cole in Houston as well.

454
00:22:17,678 --> 00:22:21,998
Speaker 1: So there's reasons why these pitching coaches are getting things done.

455
00:22:22,038 --> 00:22:23,798
Speaker 1: And now this kid is pitching Game three of the

456
00:22:23,798 --> 00:22:27,398
Speaker 1: World Series. He has the highest, the best strikeout to

457
00:22:27,518 --> 00:22:29,758
Speaker 1: walk ratio of any rookie pitcher in the history of

458
00:22:29,758 --> 00:22:32,638
Speaker 1: postseason ball. I'm telling you, look at the game in

459
00:22:32,678 --> 00:22:34,998
Speaker 1: Game three, and Max Schurz has got some still rust

460
00:22:35,078 --> 00:22:36,598
Speaker 1: on him. And you've got a kid who's been thrown

461
00:22:36,638 --> 00:22:38,838
Speaker 1: in the minor league three times, and right now, the

462
00:22:38,958 --> 00:22:40,678
Speaker 1: kid who went to the minor League three time is

463
00:22:40,718 --> 00:22:42,918
Speaker 1: bringing better stuff from the mountain to Max Schurz. And

464
00:22:42,958 --> 00:22:45,238
Speaker 1: I think the way Brent Strong works as the pitchers

465
00:22:45,598 --> 00:22:46,838
Speaker 1: has a whole lot to do with that.

466
00:22:47,478 --> 00:22:50,438
Speaker 3: You know, just has nothing to do with anything except

467
00:22:50,438 --> 00:22:53,318
Speaker 3: that you're talking about adjustments by pitching coaches with pitchers.

468
00:22:54,438 --> 00:22:57,838
Speaker 2: The bullpen coach with the Diamondbacks, Mike Beetters wonderful.

469
00:22:58,318 --> 00:23:01,758
Speaker 3: I love Pat. That was original Angel. He was struggling

470
00:23:02,078 --> 00:23:04,718
Speaker 3: one of the nastiest sinkers you've ever seen. So what

471
00:23:04,758 --> 00:23:07,598
Speaker 3: does Marcel do. He makes him throw his glove out

472
00:23:07,638 --> 00:23:10,958
Speaker 3: in front of his face, uh, and with part of

473
00:23:10,998 --> 00:23:12,878
Speaker 3: his wind up to really make sure that he pulls

474
00:23:12,958 --> 00:23:15,398
Speaker 3: down and gets on top of the baseball. He was

475
00:23:15,398 --> 00:23:19,118
Speaker 3: a short strider with this nasty sink and just an

476
00:23:19,158 --> 00:23:22,038
Speaker 3: adjustment that Marcel gave to him. There was nobody that

477
00:23:22,438 --> 00:23:24,238
Speaker 3: you know, Marcell had done that probably in the past,

478
00:23:24,238 --> 00:23:26,558
Speaker 3: whether it was at USC or pitching with the Oaklan Age,

479
00:23:26,678 --> 00:23:28,518
Speaker 3: but he saw somebody do it or heard it at

480
00:23:28,558 --> 00:23:31,678
Speaker 3: some stop along the minor league way or big leagues.

481
00:23:32,278 --> 00:23:34,238
Speaker 3: Throw you throw your glove in front of your face

482
00:23:34,278 --> 00:23:36,598
Speaker 3: and really pulled down hard with your left arm and

483
00:23:36,638 --> 00:23:38,998
Speaker 3: see what happens. Wow, I mean it was, it was

484
00:23:39,078 --> 00:23:41,998
Speaker 3: really electric, an electric singer. Now, Michael was prone to

485
00:23:42,038 --> 00:23:43,598
Speaker 3: bounce the ball a little bit from the home place

486
00:23:43,638 --> 00:23:46,038
Speaker 3: he had As a catcher, you get balpened on occasion.

487
00:23:46,158 --> 00:23:48,918
Speaker 3: But this is an example that they'll they'll see somebody,

488
00:23:48,918 --> 00:23:51,638
Speaker 3: they'll look at him, and they'll make the physical adjustment

489
00:23:51,678 --> 00:23:55,158
Speaker 3: based on history. What do I know from my pass

490
00:23:55,198 --> 00:23:58,238
Speaker 3: as a player, myself or different players I'd worked with,

491
00:23:58,318 --> 00:24:01,598
Speaker 3: and Fett became a very very productive major league relief

492
00:24:01,598 --> 00:24:04,598
Speaker 3: pitcher with a nasty sinker based on them suggested for

493
00:24:04,718 --> 00:24:05,198
Speaker 3: more self.

494
00:24:05,638 --> 00:24:08,318
Speaker 1: In my mind's eye, I can still see Mike Feeder's

495
00:24:08,358 --> 00:24:10,878
Speaker 1: delivery there and that glove flashing towards the hitter. Y

496
00:24:11,998 --> 00:24:14,918
Speaker 1: as I didn't know the background too. That's a great story.

497
00:24:15,598 --> 00:24:17,638
Speaker 1: One more switch I have for you. You didn't mention this

498
00:24:17,718 --> 00:24:20,958
Speaker 1: also with Brandon Fought. You talk about the delivery. He

499
00:24:21,118 --> 00:24:23,358
Speaker 1: had this and you've seen it before, Joe or guys

500
00:24:23,358 --> 00:24:25,558
Speaker 1: at the top of their delivery, they may tap the

501
00:24:25,598 --> 00:24:28,158
Speaker 1: ball their glove, they take it out, put it back in.

502
00:24:29,078 --> 00:24:30,678
Speaker 1: He did have one of those you want to call

503
00:24:30,718 --> 00:24:33,718
Speaker 1: it a tick whatever, He did have one of those

504
00:24:33,758 --> 00:24:37,398
Speaker 1: and always did and actually used that in game one

505
00:24:37,958 --> 00:24:40,758
Speaker 1: of the Wildcard series. It wasn't good. He gave up

506
00:24:40,838 --> 00:24:43,998
Speaker 1: seven hits, gave up three runs. He comes back his

507
00:24:44,198 --> 00:24:47,198
Speaker 1: next start and the ball is in his glove throughout

508
00:24:47,278 --> 00:24:50,598
Speaker 1: the top of his delivery. They took it out. This

509
00:24:50,638 --> 00:24:53,758
Speaker 1: is in the course of the postseason. Now, I would

510
00:24:53,798 --> 00:24:56,198
Speaker 1: imagine Brandon's probably been thrown that way his whole life,

511
00:24:56,278 --> 00:24:59,758
Speaker 1: or most of it, and he's been almost unhittable since

512
00:24:59,878 --> 00:25:02,718
Speaker 1: that change. So somebody keeping an eye on tonight when

513
00:25:02,718 --> 00:25:05,598
Speaker 1: he takes the top of the delivery leg up, the

514
00:25:05,598 --> 00:25:07,678
Speaker 1: ball is staying in the glove. Now you know Joe

515
00:25:07,718 --> 00:25:10,558
Speaker 1: in the game. Today, teams actually are using AI. They've

516
00:25:10,558 --> 00:25:12,998
Speaker 1: got cameras on all these pictures to see is this

517
00:25:13,038 --> 00:25:15,238
Speaker 1: guy giving me any tells. It used to be it

518
00:25:15,238 --> 00:25:17,158
Speaker 1: took somebody like a ride carew and your dugout to

519
00:25:17,198 --> 00:25:18,798
Speaker 1: have eyes on the picture and say, hey, this is

520
00:25:18,798 --> 00:25:21,918
Speaker 1: what he's doing. Now they use these algorithms and can

521
00:25:21,958 --> 00:25:24,158
Speaker 1: see if he's doing something different. I'm not sure if

522
00:25:24,158 --> 00:25:26,198
Speaker 1: base coaches were able to see his grip as he

523
00:25:26,238 --> 00:25:28,958
Speaker 1: took the ball at the glove, or it was just

524
00:25:29,038 --> 00:25:32,078
Speaker 1: something that you know, was throwing off his timing. I'm

525
00:25:32,118 --> 00:25:33,678
Speaker 1: not sure the reason for it, but they took it

526
00:25:33,718 --> 00:25:36,318
Speaker 1: out and he's been lights out ever since.

527
00:25:36,878 --> 00:25:40,718
Speaker 3: Probably, like you're saying, a timing mechanism, and maybe the

528
00:25:40,758 --> 00:25:44,158
Speaker 3: timing of the pack could have differed and all of

529
00:25:44,158 --> 00:25:47,838
Speaker 3: a sudden you're either quick or late, just weirdly.

530
00:25:47,878 --> 00:25:50,158
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know I remember this, but I guess.

531
00:25:50,078 --> 00:25:52,158
Speaker 3: John Elway back in the day throwing a football would

532
00:25:52,158 --> 00:25:54,638
Speaker 3: always tap right before we threw the ball, and it

533
00:25:54,678 --> 00:25:57,718
Speaker 3: was something that the defenders could be and although he listen,

534
00:25:57,758 --> 00:26:00,758
Speaker 3: he didn't have many problems with the balls being intercepted whatever,

535
00:26:00,798 --> 00:26:02,198
Speaker 3: but you knew and the ball was coming by the

536
00:26:02,238 --> 00:26:05,878
Speaker 3: pad obviously, and with the again, it's a timing mechanism

537
00:26:06,438 --> 00:26:09,278
Speaker 3: that you get at the top. Maybe the different pitches,

538
00:26:09,598 --> 00:26:13,758
Speaker 3: different grips, fastball to slider, change up, whatever, that little

539
00:26:13,798 --> 00:26:16,798
Speaker 3: pat is different and thus it takes you in a

540
00:26:16,798 --> 00:26:19,278
Speaker 3: different path as you're ready to throw the baseball. There's

541
00:26:19,318 --> 00:26:22,478
Speaker 3: just a more consistent pattern to when you when you

542
00:26:22,678 --> 00:26:25,158
Speaker 3: reproduce that all the time, which would be without that

543
00:26:25,198 --> 00:26:26,798
Speaker 3: little movement before you throw the ball.

544
00:26:27,198 --> 00:26:28,958
Speaker 2: As a as a as a.

545
00:26:28,678 --> 00:26:31,998
Speaker 3: Pitcher, a thrower of a batting practice, for years I

546
00:26:31,998 --> 00:26:33,998
Speaker 3: did have a little tap and that was a rhythm.

547
00:26:33,998 --> 00:26:34,878
Speaker 2: But that's something different.

548
00:26:34,878 --> 00:26:37,318
Speaker 3: That's that's batting practice when you're trying just trying to

549
00:26:37,318 --> 00:26:40,238
Speaker 3: throw the ball down the middle. So it's a timing mechanism.

550
00:26:40,678 --> 00:26:44,358
Speaker 3: It could be altered. It could be longer, shorter, different pitches,

551
00:26:44,358 --> 00:26:47,678
Speaker 3: could create different kinds of feel with it. It just

552
00:26:47,798 --> 00:26:50,638
Speaker 3: makes sense to limit that kind of movement before the

553
00:26:50,678 --> 00:26:51,198
Speaker 3: ball is thrown.

554
00:26:51,758 --> 00:26:54,198
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm into all those little details. By the way,

555
00:26:54,198 --> 00:26:57,398
Speaker 1: the minutia, if you will, little tells my favorite story

556
00:26:57,478 --> 00:26:59,358
Speaker 1: and goes back to the last time in the World

557
00:26:59,398 --> 00:27:02,878
Speaker 1: Series was an Arizona. The Yankees go to Arizona up

558
00:27:02,878 --> 00:27:07,278
Speaker 1: three to two. He need one more win and extend

559
00:27:07,278 --> 00:27:09,998
Speaker 1: their dynasty, right, going for four in a row in Arizona.

560
00:27:10,358 --> 00:27:12,998
Speaker 1: Andy Pettitt, you know, mister postseason, takes the ball for

561
00:27:13,038 --> 00:27:16,518
Speaker 1: the Yankees. He got clocked that night. The final score

562
00:27:16,638 --> 00:27:19,558
Speaker 1: was something like fifteen and nothing. He just they were

563
00:27:19,678 --> 00:27:23,798
Speaker 1: on everything, and as it turned out, they literally knew

564
00:27:23,798 --> 00:27:26,038
Speaker 1: what was coming when he was in the stretched position.

565
00:27:26,158 --> 00:27:29,438
Speaker 1: So Renner gets on base and Andy would fan his

566
00:27:29,558 --> 00:27:32,598
Speaker 1: hands away from him when he came to the belt

567
00:27:32,638 --> 00:27:34,798
Speaker 1: position when he was going to throw an off speed pitch,

568
00:27:34,878 --> 00:27:37,998
Speaker 1: and he'd bring them straight down on a fastball. Arizona

569
00:27:38,078 --> 00:27:40,878
Speaker 1: knew exactly what was coming every pitch with a run

570
00:27:40,918 --> 00:27:43,758
Speaker 1: around base, and that's exactly what it looked like, and

571
00:27:44,438 --> 00:27:47,118
Speaker 1: you know it turned the series obviously. Arizona then wins

572
00:27:47,158 --> 00:27:50,278
Speaker 1: Game seven with the blue pit by Luis Gonzales, part

573
00:27:50,278 --> 00:27:52,518
Speaker 1: of postseason history. One of the best games you'll ever see,

574
00:27:52,558 --> 00:27:55,798
Speaker 1: by the way, but people forget in Game six the

575
00:27:55,878 --> 00:27:59,478
Speaker 1: Yankees had a chance to avoid that Game seven, and

576
00:27:59,518 --> 00:28:03,278
Speaker 1: it's a case where a pitcher tipping his pitches literally

577
00:28:03,318 --> 00:28:04,518
Speaker 1: tipped a balance into the game.

578
00:28:05,518 --> 00:28:08,438
Speaker 3: I had Eddie Perez, and I've had Jimmy Edmonds. I've

579
00:28:08,438 --> 00:28:11,598
Speaker 3: had Rod Carew and the bench. I've had Alfredo Griffin

580
00:28:11,638 --> 00:28:13,518
Speaker 3: at first base. I've had run Around he had third.

581
00:28:14,718 --> 00:28:17,718
Speaker 3: These guys are really good at picking stuff up. West Western.

582
00:28:17,758 --> 00:28:20,518
Speaker 3: I used to sit with West Western at Arizona State.

583
00:28:20,678 --> 00:28:22,918
Speaker 3: Is a scout in nineteen.

584
00:28:24,078 --> 00:28:24,958
Speaker 2: Eighty two, eighty.

585
00:28:24,758 --> 00:28:27,598
Speaker 3: Three, whatever that was with West former catchup for the

586
00:28:27,638 --> 00:28:29,038
Speaker 3: New York Giants. I think he caught in the World

587
00:28:29,118 --> 00:28:31,878
Speaker 3: Series in nineteen fifty four from Minnesota. Used to call

588
00:28:31,878 --> 00:28:35,878
Speaker 3: home runs or really made from first base by picking

589
00:28:35,958 --> 00:28:37,318
Speaker 3: up or from I think it was first base and

590
00:28:37,358 --> 00:28:38,158
Speaker 3: maybe the dugout.

591
00:28:38,438 --> 00:28:40,398
Speaker 2: He had little signs with him in McCovey.

592
00:28:40,878 --> 00:28:46,358
Speaker 3: To relay signs so devastating to the opposition, so beneficial

593
00:28:46,638 --> 00:28:49,078
Speaker 3: to the group that's doing it and furthermore the runner

594
00:28:49,118 --> 00:28:51,198
Speaker 3: at second base. There are some teams historically that were

595
00:28:51,238 --> 00:28:55,678
Speaker 3: really good at passing along signs are location from second

596
00:28:55,678 --> 00:28:58,438
Speaker 3: base was an art form for different teams for a

597
00:28:58,478 --> 00:29:01,438
Speaker 3: long time. Toronto. We used to hate going to Toronto.

598
00:29:01,438 --> 00:29:02,598
Speaker 3: We used to go out there and check them out

599
00:29:02,638 --> 00:29:05,598
Speaker 3: center field all the time. We always thought something was

600
00:29:05,598 --> 00:29:08,398
Speaker 3: going on in Toronto. But it could have just been

601
00:29:08,718 --> 00:29:11,438
Speaker 3: the fact that their players were really together in regards

602
00:29:11,438 --> 00:29:13,278
Speaker 3: to taking signs of giving to the hitter to play.

603
00:29:13,278 --> 00:29:16,438
Speaker 2: Cleveland, same thing when they had like Lofton.

604
00:29:16,238 --> 00:29:21,678
Speaker 3: And Tomey and Viscille and Alamar, these guys, I mean

605
00:29:22,238 --> 00:29:26,878
Speaker 3: Vierga baseball players, baseball players. When you have that group,

606
00:29:26,918 --> 00:29:29,678
Speaker 3: it was really you're always worrying. That's when the trips

607
00:29:29,718 --> 00:29:32,878
Speaker 3: to the mound became so vital. And now, of course

608
00:29:32,918 --> 00:29:37,558
Speaker 3: with the little PitchCom thing that that's eliminated all that.

609
00:29:37,598 --> 00:29:39,238
Speaker 3: But it was kind of cool. It was kind of

610
00:29:39,238 --> 00:29:41,078
Speaker 3: cool that to me was not cheating. That was just

611
00:29:41,158 --> 00:29:44,798
Speaker 3: good baseball. Reconnaissance. That was one team not hiding their

612
00:29:44,838 --> 00:29:48,518
Speaker 3: signals well enough or becoming tubidestrian and they're not careful.

613
00:29:48,558 --> 00:29:50,518
Speaker 3: And then of course, I mean I used to really

614
00:29:50,598 --> 00:29:52,438
Speaker 3: I think we talked about this. I was really good

615
00:29:52,438 --> 00:29:54,838
Speaker 3: at stealing the third base coaches signed and in the

616
00:29:54,918 --> 00:29:57,158
Speaker 3: nineties as a bench coach, because that's I would just

617
00:29:57,198 --> 00:30:00,038
Speaker 3: lock in on him during the course of the game,

618
00:30:00,078 --> 00:30:02,118
Speaker 3: and I would just I would unplug from the ball.

619
00:30:02,998 --> 00:30:05,718
Speaker 3: A real good coach or a bench coach during the

620
00:30:05,758 --> 00:30:07,958
Speaker 3: course of a game, to me, never follows the ball,

621
00:30:08,358 --> 00:30:10,678
Speaker 3: like from the pitcher to the catcher. As a as

622
00:30:10,718 --> 00:30:12,478
Speaker 3: a manager, I would do that more often. I'm just

623
00:30:12,678 --> 00:30:15,078
Speaker 3: more focused right there in the middle. But as a

624
00:30:15,078 --> 00:30:17,238
Speaker 3: bench coach, my duties were all over the field, whether

625
00:30:17,238 --> 00:30:20,238
Speaker 3: it was watching a defender, whether it was watching sign

626
00:30:20,278 --> 00:30:22,478
Speaker 3: from a third base coach, watching a lead at first base.

627
00:30:23,518 --> 00:30:25,958
Speaker 3: I rarely ever watched the ball as it was pitched

628
00:30:26,278 --> 00:30:29,238
Speaker 3: because I'm looking for things, and that's how you accumulate

629
00:30:29,278 --> 00:30:32,078
Speaker 3: this kind of information. So I know the PitchCom is

630
00:30:32,078 --> 00:30:34,718
Speaker 3: really has helped in regards to speeding up the game.

631
00:30:35,238 --> 00:30:38,238
Speaker 3: I get all that cool, but I'll tell you what

632
00:30:38,438 --> 00:30:43,158
Speaker 3: it was. The way it had been before, the legitimate

633
00:30:43,198 --> 00:30:45,438
Speaker 3: stealing of the signs because you weren't careful enough, or

634
00:30:45,438 --> 00:30:48,318
Speaker 3: your key was too obvious, or hitters or your third

635
00:30:48,318 --> 00:30:50,518
Speaker 3: base coach would go faster or then slower when he

636
00:30:50,558 --> 00:30:54,438
Speaker 3: gave an active sign, or hitter would look away before

637
00:30:54,438 --> 00:30:56,598
Speaker 3: the third base coach was done giving us signs.

638
00:30:57,158 --> 00:30:58,158
Speaker 2: There was so many things.

639
00:30:58,158 --> 00:31:01,118
Speaker 3: The runner had a different lead at first base, so cool,

640
00:31:01,518 --> 00:31:05,998
Speaker 3: and a really big part of you at being a

641
00:31:05,998 --> 00:31:08,078
Speaker 3: student of the game and trying to be helpful to

642
00:31:08,118 --> 00:31:09,958
Speaker 3: your group. It was a big part of it.

643
00:31:10,078 --> 00:31:12,798
Speaker 1: Yeah, listen, I love the Dark Arts as much as anybody,

644
00:31:12,838 --> 00:31:15,278
Speaker 1: but I am thankful for PitchCom. It does move the

645
00:31:15,318 --> 00:31:19,238
Speaker 1: game along. Game two, folks, took two hours and fifty

646
00:31:19,318 --> 00:31:24,278
Speaker 1: nine minutes. That broke a streak of thirty seven consecutive

647
00:31:24,318 --> 00:31:27,678
Speaker 1: World Series games that took three hours or more. The

648
00:31:27,718 --> 00:31:31,798
Speaker 1: first World Series game under three hours since Game one

649
00:31:31,838 --> 00:31:36,118
Speaker 1: of twenty seventeen. So bring it on, keep it going, folks,

650
00:31:36,158 --> 00:31:40,598
Speaker 1: and remember the commercial breaks are longer in the World Series. Joe,

651
00:31:40,638 --> 00:31:45,638
Speaker 1: you know this, That World Series it's like exponentially bigger,

652
00:31:46,038 --> 00:31:49,158
Speaker 1: more exciting, more pressurized than even the LCS. And you

653
00:31:49,198 --> 00:31:52,278
Speaker 1: don't know that until you get there. If you haven't

654
00:31:52,278 --> 00:31:55,598
Speaker 1: heard it, there's an amazing story involving Tommy Famm and

655
00:31:55,678 --> 00:31:58,718
Speaker 1: the World Series that we are going to talk about,

656
00:31:58,838 --> 00:32:00,558
Speaker 1: and we're also going to talk about, at least I

657
00:32:00,598 --> 00:32:04,838
Speaker 1: will of why Tory Lavello reminds me of Joe right

658
00:32:04,878 --> 00:32:19,918
Speaker 1: back after this, Hey, welcome back, Joe. I'm not sure

659
00:32:19,958 --> 00:32:22,318
Speaker 1: if you heard this story, but Tommy Fam in Game

660
00:32:22,398 --> 00:32:26,238
Speaker 1: two was sitting on a four for fortnight. He's gotten

661
00:32:26,318 --> 00:32:28,438
Speaker 1: one more at bet as the lineup begins to come

662
00:32:28,438 --> 00:32:32,038
Speaker 1: back to him as the DH for Arizona. There's been

663
00:32:32,118 --> 00:32:34,598
Speaker 1: no one in the history of the World Series that

664
00:32:34,638 --> 00:32:37,038
Speaker 1: has had a five for five night. I happened guys

665
00:32:37,078 --> 00:32:40,078
Speaker 1: with five hits Paul mollinor Albert Poohols, but they each

666
00:32:40,118 --> 00:32:42,918
Speaker 1: had six at bats to get there, a perfect five

667
00:32:42,998 --> 00:32:46,678
Speaker 1: for five night. Tommy Fam is sitting on the opportunity

668
00:32:46,718 --> 00:32:48,558
Speaker 1: to do that for the first time of the World Series.

669
00:32:49,318 --> 00:32:52,118
Speaker 1: What does he do? He goes up to Jace Peterson

670
00:32:52,878 --> 00:32:56,358
Speaker 1: and tells Jace Peterson, dog, you got my next at bet?

671
00:32:57,318 --> 00:33:00,398
Speaker 1: He gave up as a bet to Jace Peterson. Why well,

672
00:33:00,558 --> 00:33:02,958
Speaker 1: Tommy Fam broke into the big leagues in twenty fourteen,

673
00:33:03,278 --> 00:33:05,358
Speaker 1: This is the first time he got to the World Series.

674
00:33:05,398 --> 00:33:07,318
Speaker 1: He's been in the postseason before, never got out of

675
00:33:07,358 --> 00:33:11,318
Speaker 1: the first round. Jace Peterson also broke into the big

676
00:33:11,398 --> 00:33:15,558
Speaker 1: leagues in twenty fourteen. Both guys Fam and Peterson have

677
00:33:15,678 --> 00:33:20,198
Speaker 1: been with seven different organizations. This is the first World

678
00:33:20,278 --> 00:33:22,998
Speaker 1: Series for both of them. Tommy Famm knew better than

679
00:33:23,038 --> 00:33:25,678
Speaker 1: anybody else what the World Series means to Jace Peterson,

680
00:33:25,758 --> 00:33:28,278
Speaker 1: and he wanted to make sure the guy who, by

681
00:33:28,278 --> 00:33:31,318
Speaker 1: the way, lockers next to him got into the World

682
00:33:31,398 --> 00:33:35,598
Speaker 1: Series with at bet. So Tommy Fam went to Tory Leavello

683
00:33:36,078 --> 00:33:39,078
Speaker 1: and told him that he wanted Jace Peterson to take

684
00:33:39,078 --> 00:33:41,998
Speaker 1: his at bet. And at the time, Tory is like, well,

685
00:33:42,038 --> 00:33:44,638
Speaker 1: you know, there's a lefty on the mound, and you

686
00:33:44,678 --> 00:33:47,238
Speaker 1: know the game stays close. You know, I still want

687
00:33:47,278 --> 00:33:49,558
Speaker 1: you to take your at bet, which is the right

688
00:33:49,598 --> 00:33:51,558
Speaker 1: thing to do, of course. But they started adding on

689
00:33:51,598 --> 00:33:54,518
Speaker 1: some teck On runs and lo and behold, Jace Peterson

690
00:33:54,598 --> 00:33:58,438
Speaker 1: took the bet at the request of Tommy Fam. I

691
00:33:58,518 --> 00:34:00,598
Speaker 1: thought that was so cool, Joe. It says a lot

692
00:34:00,598 --> 00:34:04,918
Speaker 1: about Tommy Fam. It also talks about to me, underscores

693
00:34:04,958 --> 00:34:07,558
Speaker 1: how close this Arizona team is now listen, you're gonna

694
00:34:07,598 --> 00:34:09,038
Speaker 1: hear that from every team that made it to the

695
00:34:09,038 --> 00:34:10,798
Speaker 1: World Series. You know, you don't get to the World

696
00:34:10,798 --> 00:34:13,358
Speaker 1: Series with a disjointed team. Everybody talks about how close

697
00:34:13,398 --> 00:34:15,238
Speaker 1: they are, and it's true, you've been through the ringer

698
00:34:15,278 --> 00:34:17,438
Speaker 1: at that point, you've been on the you know, postseason

699
00:34:17,438 --> 00:34:19,278
Speaker 1: grind for a month. How could you not be close.

700
00:34:19,718 --> 00:34:22,438
Speaker 1: But there's something a little bit different about this Arizona team,

701
00:34:22,758 --> 00:34:26,758
Speaker 1: and that, to me is a great example of as

702
00:34:26,798 --> 00:34:30,038
Speaker 1: Tory Lavello likes to say, a connected team is a

703
00:34:30,118 --> 00:34:30,918
Speaker 1: dangerous team.

704
00:34:31,478 --> 00:34:34,398
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, FAM's history. I don't know most people do.

705
00:34:34,438 --> 00:34:36,558
Speaker 3: But this guy spend a lot of time in the

706
00:34:36,558 --> 00:34:38,838
Speaker 3: minor leagues with the Saint Louis Cardinals before he got

707
00:34:38,838 --> 00:34:40,958
Speaker 3: his first opportunity. I saw him when he got called up,

708
00:34:41,478 --> 00:34:43,398
Speaker 3: and damn, I mean, what's this guy been? And I

709
00:34:43,438 --> 00:34:45,318
Speaker 3: thought he's like twenty two or twenty three, and he's

710
00:34:45,358 --> 00:34:47,638
Speaker 3: like twenty seven or twenty eight at that particular moment.

711
00:34:47,678 --> 00:34:50,358
Speaker 3: It was surprised me. He played with a lot of energy,

712
00:34:50,398 --> 00:34:52,438
Speaker 3: a lot of enthusiasm. He played like it took him

713
00:34:52,438 --> 00:34:54,478
Speaker 3: a long time to get to the big leagues. It's

714
00:34:54,518 --> 00:34:58,678
Speaker 3: like he's that kind of guy that doesn't take advantage

715
00:34:58,718 --> 00:35:02,278
Speaker 3: of take anything for granted, knows how difficult it is

716
00:35:02,318 --> 00:35:04,158
Speaker 3: to get there, how special it is to be there,

717
00:35:04,958 --> 00:35:06,318
Speaker 3: and I respect him for that. I mean, this is

718
00:35:06,358 --> 00:35:09,198
Speaker 3: a guy that he'll he'll make some really awful mistakes,

719
00:35:09,198 --> 00:35:11,838
Speaker 3: like when he got picked off at second base, Johnny

720
00:35:11,878 --> 00:35:13,838
Speaker 3: Lester picked him off one time, he got caught nap

721
00:35:13,958 --> 00:35:17,238
Speaker 3: in the first base at in Wrigley. And he'll do

722
00:35:17,278 --> 00:35:19,878
Speaker 3: some things like that. He'll have these little moments of

723
00:35:19,958 --> 00:35:24,278
Speaker 3: flare ups of he just just lose his sense of

724
00:35:24,318 --> 00:35:27,358
Speaker 3: what's going on. In a sense. However, he shows me

725
00:35:27,358 --> 00:35:29,918
Speaker 3: a lot of self awareness too. I hear him speak,

726
00:35:29,958 --> 00:35:31,798
Speaker 3: and he speaks, he speaks kind of brightly, you know.

727
00:35:31,878 --> 00:35:34,278
Speaker 3: He talks about things, and he talks about things, and

728
00:35:34,598 --> 00:35:38,278
Speaker 3: it's well thought out. Always, I think, whether you agree

729
00:35:38,278 --> 00:35:40,478
Speaker 3: with him or not, he's well thought out. And I

730
00:35:40,518 --> 00:35:43,918
Speaker 3: appreciate him for that. And so I guess this doesn't

731
00:35:43,958 --> 00:35:47,518
Speaker 3: surprise me. High level of self awareness. He knows what

732
00:35:47,558 --> 00:35:49,798
Speaker 3: it takes to get to that moment, and he knows

733
00:35:49,798 --> 00:35:53,678
Speaker 3: that if under the circumstances, this might be Peterson's or

734
00:35:54,158 --> 00:35:57,558
Speaker 3: only opportunity to get this at bat. Makes all this

735
00:35:57,638 --> 00:35:59,638
Speaker 3: sense in the world to me tells you about the guy,

736
00:35:59,638 --> 00:36:02,958
Speaker 3: and I agree with Tory internally, he wanted those couple

737
00:36:02,998 --> 00:36:05,478
Speaker 3: extra runs to be a comfortable bout doing this. He

738
00:36:05,558 --> 00:36:07,118
Speaker 3: got him and then it became an easy get.

739
00:36:07,478 --> 00:36:07,678
Speaker 2: Yeah.

740
00:36:07,678 --> 00:36:09,998
Speaker 1: A good scatting report on Tommy fam by the way,

741
00:36:09,998 --> 00:36:12,478
Speaker 1: because you know, Joe, when you bounce around a lot

742
00:36:12,518 --> 00:36:14,918
Speaker 1: like that, you get traded a bunch of times. You know,

743
00:36:14,958 --> 00:36:17,118
Speaker 1: people start wondering, well, what's wrong with this guy? Why

744
00:36:17,158 --> 00:36:18,838
Speaker 1: is he moving? And he did have something of a

745
00:36:19,038 --> 00:36:22,638
Speaker 1: reputation in that regard. But I can tell you this

746
00:36:22,638 --> 00:36:26,078
Speaker 1: about Tommy fam The only trouble he had in the

747
00:36:26,078 --> 00:36:29,118
Speaker 1: big leagues or has is with guys who don't work.

748
00:36:29,558 --> 00:36:33,478
Speaker 1: Tommy fam Is is incredibly hard worker and if you're

749
00:36:33,518 --> 00:36:36,958
Speaker 1: not up to his standards and as blunt speaking as

750
00:36:36,958 --> 00:36:39,598
Speaker 1: Tommy fam Is, he might rub you the wrong way,

751
00:36:39,638 --> 00:36:43,518
Speaker 1: he will call you out. And as the Diamondbacks pitcher

752
00:36:43,638 --> 00:36:46,038
Speaker 1: Zach Gallon told me, we have a team that loves

753
00:36:46,078 --> 00:36:48,918
Speaker 1: to work, so he fits right in. And it was

754
00:36:48,958 --> 00:36:51,198
Speaker 1: a great pickup by Mike Haysen at the deadline to

755
00:36:51,238 --> 00:36:54,798
Speaker 1: get you know, the experience. Obviously, the bat this guy

756
00:36:54,838 --> 00:36:56,158
Speaker 1: can hit in the middle of the order. He's already

757
00:36:56,198 --> 00:36:57,518
Speaker 1: hit a home run and had a four hit game

758
00:36:57,558 --> 00:37:00,198
Speaker 1: in the World Series. He's already paid off. But the

759
00:37:00,238 --> 00:37:02,518
Speaker 1: way he dovetails with his younger team and they see

760
00:37:02,518 --> 00:37:04,718
Speaker 1: this thirty five year old out there and his butt off.

761
00:37:04,758 --> 00:37:08,238
Speaker 1: Speaking plainly as you said, Joe, that's a glue guy.

762
00:37:08,558 --> 00:37:10,838
Speaker 1: Tommy fam is a glue guy. For a guy who's

763
00:37:10,878 --> 00:37:13,878
Speaker 1: bounced around the seven different organizations. I'm telling you, don't

764
00:37:13,958 --> 00:37:17,398
Speaker 1: underestimate the impact this guy is having in the clubhouse,

765
00:37:17,438 --> 00:37:18,678
Speaker 1: in the dugout, on the field.

766
00:37:19,118 --> 00:37:20,558
Speaker 2: He doesn't give up in at bat.

767
00:37:20,638 --> 00:37:22,718
Speaker 3: I mean, one of the greatest examples of that, to

768
00:37:22,758 --> 00:37:27,598
Speaker 3: me was Albert Bell. Albert Bell never gave up and

769
00:37:27,678 --> 00:37:30,998
Speaker 3: at bat never. I don't care what the square was,

770
00:37:31,038 --> 00:37:33,398
Speaker 3: I don't care where, I don't care. The dude walked

771
00:37:33,438 --> 00:37:36,398
Speaker 3: up there with the same look all the time, put

772
00:37:36,438 --> 00:37:38,318
Speaker 3: out that at bat, good at bat.

773
00:37:39,038 --> 00:37:40,518
Speaker 2: Then he'd walk back to the dugout.

774
00:37:40,518 --> 00:37:43,678
Speaker 3: I don't know it was immediately after, but soon thereafter,

775
00:37:44,078 --> 00:37:45,998
Speaker 3: and he would he would log his at bat and

776
00:37:46,078 --> 00:37:49,238
Speaker 3: whatever he was thinking, whatever he did, but every at

777
00:37:49,278 --> 00:37:52,918
Speaker 3: bat was logged. And so this guy, again a reputation

778
00:37:53,038 --> 00:37:55,718
Speaker 3: a little bit different. But you did not want to

779
00:37:55,758 --> 00:37:57,678
Speaker 3: see him. You did not want to see him in

780
00:37:57,718 --> 00:38:00,318
Speaker 3: a big moment because I know this, that bat was

781
00:38:00,358 --> 00:38:02,958
Speaker 3: real and if you screwed up at all, you're gonna

782
00:38:02,958 --> 00:38:06,078
Speaker 3: get hurt. It's got that same kind of an attitude

783
00:38:06,078 --> 00:38:07,278
Speaker 3: when he walks up to the plate. For me, this

784
00:38:07,358 --> 00:38:12,078
Speaker 3: guy never gives up anything. He's there, He's there in

785
00:38:12,118 --> 00:38:13,278
Speaker 3: a moment for every moment.

786
00:38:13,318 --> 00:38:14,598
Speaker 2: He's gonna screw up. Sometimes.

787
00:38:14,758 --> 00:38:16,958
Speaker 3: He said he'll take ad when he got picked off

788
00:38:16,998 --> 00:38:18,838
Speaker 3: second base, was trying to do that jump time the

789
00:38:18,878 --> 00:38:20,678
Speaker 3: jump le. He didn't go and he really didn't have to,

790
00:38:21,558 --> 00:38:23,478
Speaker 3: but he did, and then he gets picked off easily

791
00:38:23,478 --> 00:38:26,238
Speaker 3: at second base Johnny Lester. Lester would not throw over

792
00:38:26,238 --> 00:38:27,918
Speaker 3: to the first base, so he did the same thing there,

793
00:38:27,918 --> 00:38:30,398
Speaker 3: got in no man's land, and Johnny just flipped a

794
00:38:30,478 --> 00:38:34,358
Speaker 3: frigging bomb, like a little arcing bomb over there and

795
00:38:34,398 --> 00:38:36,918
Speaker 3: he's out. So he'll do things like that on occasion.

796
00:38:37,278 --> 00:38:40,398
Speaker 3: But the energy and enthusiasm he brings every day is

797
00:38:40,478 --> 00:38:45,598
Speaker 3: contagious and it's effective. So I think for me, a

798
00:38:45,638 --> 00:38:47,518
Speaker 3: guy like him on your team, Yeah, I would love

799
00:38:47,518 --> 00:38:51,358
Speaker 3: to have Tommy Fan on my team absolutely, And anybody

800
00:38:51,398 --> 00:38:53,838
Speaker 3: that didn't understand that I would defend him. I would

801
00:38:53,878 --> 00:38:56,998
Speaker 3: defend him with that group or that person, although he's

802
00:38:57,238 --> 00:39:00,638
Speaker 3: very capable of defending himself. So I'm a big fan

803
00:39:00,758 --> 00:39:01,278
Speaker 3: of FAM.

804
00:39:02,118 --> 00:39:02,638
Speaker 2: I like that.

805
00:39:02,878 --> 00:39:06,318
Speaker 1: I like that too, Tommy. FAM has given them a

806
00:39:06,318 --> 00:39:09,798
Speaker 1: lot of energy, and saw has Tory Lavello. And I said, Joe,

807
00:39:09,838 --> 00:39:12,398
Speaker 1: he reminds me of you, and maybe it's uh, you know,

808
00:39:12,478 --> 00:39:16,398
Speaker 1: the Italian heritage that I'm seeing there. And he told

809
00:39:16,438 --> 00:39:20,518
Speaker 1: a funny story that on Game seven of the NLCS,

810
00:39:20,558 --> 00:39:22,438
Speaker 1: they're won out away from going to the World Series,

811
00:39:23,478 --> 00:39:26,078
Speaker 1: and there was a shot of Tory the dugout and

812
00:39:26,118 --> 00:39:29,398
Speaker 1: his mom watching the game on TV saw it and

813
00:39:29,478 --> 00:39:33,398
Speaker 1: later told Tory, what is wrong. I've never seen you

814
00:39:33,438 --> 00:39:37,438
Speaker 1: look so nervous? She said, The look on your face

815
00:39:37,518 --> 00:39:41,558
Speaker 1: was unlike anything I've ever seen before. That's what moms do, right,

816
00:39:41,598 --> 00:39:44,518
Speaker 1: They see things nobody else does. And Tory has made

817
00:39:44,518 --> 00:39:46,998
Speaker 1: an effort, he really has this whole postseason to just

818
00:39:47,038 --> 00:39:49,838
Speaker 1: take things in and enjoy them. But that's what he

819
00:39:49,878 --> 00:39:51,758
Speaker 1: can do. What you know this better than anybody, Joe.

820
00:39:51,838 --> 00:39:54,278
Speaker 1: You're one out away from realizing a dream of going

821
00:39:54,278 --> 00:39:56,518
Speaker 1: to the World Series. His mom saw it on his face,

822
00:39:56,918 --> 00:39:59,438
Speaker 1: but I could tell you Joe. The similarities, the way

823
00:39:59,478 --> 00:40:03,118
Speaker 1: he runs a game, the way he connects with his players,

824
00:40:03,398 --> 00:40:05,998
Speaker 1: I'm not sure sure. I've seen many managers who have

825
00:40:06,198 --> 00:40:09,278
Speaker 1: conversations with their players in the course of the game.

826
00:40:09,678 --> 00:40:12,758
Speaker 1: I mean, not hey, nice job, or hey, you got

827
00:40:12,758 --> 00:40:16,318
Speaker 1: the rudd, but I'm talking about sitting down with players.

828
00:40:16,638 --> 00:40:20,038
Speaker 1: Ryan Nelson threw a really tough relief out of the

829
00:40:20,118 --> 00:40:22,838
Speaker 1: other day to keep the game tied extra innings. Tory

830
00:40:22,998 --> 00:40:25,158
Speaker 1: came over, had a long conversation with him. He had

831
00:40:25,158 --> 00:40:28,278
Speaker 1: a long conversation with Zach Gallon after Gallon grinded through

832
00:40:28,798 --> 00:40:31,398
Speaker 1: five innings with ninety pitches when the first inning looked

833
00:40:31,438 --> 00:40:35,038
Speaker 1: like everything was going to fall apart. It's what he does.

834
00:40:35,198 --> 00:40:37,518
Speaker 1: He walks up and down that dugout. He's got a

835
00:40:37,558 --> 00:40:41,438
Speaker 1: smile on his face. He told me. He said, I

836
00:40:41,478 --> 00:40:45,798
Speaker 1: made a point to make sure that I enjoy this experience,

837
00:40:45,878 --> 00:40:47,758
Speaker 1: and I think he's doing that. It's hard to do, Joe,

838
00:40:47,798 --> 00:40:49,198
Speaker 1: as you know, when you sit in a dugout in

839
00:40:49,198 --> 00:40:52,598
Speaker 1: the World Series, a million things going on, but the

840
00:40:52,678 --> 00:40:56,038
Speaker 1: awareness of this guy to realize where he is. I've

841
00:40:56,078 --> 00:40:58,478
Speaker 1: been really impressed with how he runs a game, and

842
00:40:58,758 --> 00:41:00,678
Speaker 1: specifically how he connects with his players.

843
00:41:00,918 --> 00:41:04,358
Speaker 3: Appreciate all that, but I know specifically, I could think

844
00:41:04,398 --> 00:41:06,558
Speaker 3: of all the conversations that I've had with different guys

845
00:41:06,558 --> 00:41:09,318
Speaker 3: and the course of the dugout and also sometimes I

846
00:41:09,318 --> 00:41:12,278
Speaker 3: don't want to use the word confrontations, but can get

847
00:41:12,358 --> 00:41:15,118
Speaker 3: kind of upset. But there was some in a moment

848
00:41:15,158 --> 00:41:18,558
Speaker 3: for me regarding the snapshot, I'm gonna enjoy this.

849
00:41:18,558 --> 00:41:21,198
Speaker 2: This is I'm not gonna let this go too quickly,

850
00:41:21,758 --> 00:41:22,998
Speaker 2: work too hard to get here.

851
00:41:24,198 --> 00:41:27,758
Speaker 3: This is the moments I've always wanted and I often

852
00:41:28,118 --> 00:41:29,758
Speaker 3: refer to this when I talk to my teams.

853
00:41:29,758 --> 00:41:30,718
Speaker 2: Prior to the playoffs.

854
00:41:31,198 --> 00:41:32,958
Speaker 3: The two thousand and three All Star Game was in

855
00:41:33,038 --> 00:41:35,798
Speaker 3: Chicago that I don't know what there was called at

856
00:41:35,798 --> 00:41:39,478
Speaker 3: that time, was the New Komiski or whatever, But you

857
00:41:39,558 --> 00:41:41,798
Speaker 3: always take a team photograph at the All Star Game.

858
00:41:41,878 --> 00:41:44,198
Speaker 3: So that was the first year that the game mattered

859
00:41:44,198 --> 00:41:46,998
Speaker 3: to that that mattered with wins who got the home

860
00:41:46,998 --> 00:41:49,878
Speaker 3: field advantage in the World Series. And you go through

861
00:41:49,918 --> 00:41:52,278
Speaker 3: all this stuff with your autograph. But I'm putting together

862
00:41:52,318 --> 00:41:54,478
Speaker 3: all of the scout reports. There was no there was

863
00:41:54,518 --> 00:41:57,198
Speaker 3: no help. This was like the angel stuff, right, And

864
00:41:57,238 --> 00:41:59,198
Speaker 3: I put all my stuff together and I get everything

865
00:41:59,198 --> 00:42:00,598
Speaker 3: ready on time, and you go outside.

866
00:42:00,678 --> 00:42:01,878
Speaker 2: O't care. We take our picture.

867
00:42:02,438 --> 00:42:04,198
Speaker 3: So he got out to centerfield, you and take your

868
00:42:04,238 --> 00:42:07,158
Speaker 3: team photograph, and you're looking around with everybody that's involved.

869
00:42:07,478 --> 00:42:10,878
Speaker 3: Remember talking to Hank Blaylock specifically saying, listen, be ready

870
00:42:10,878 --> 00:42:12,438
Speaker 3: in the latter part of this game, we're gonna be

871
00:42:12,438 --> 00:42:13,118
Speaker 3: looking for this moment.

872
00:42:13,198 --> 00:42:14,478
Speaker 2: Swear to God, that's how we did it.

873
00:42:15,078 --> 00:42:18,558
Speaker 3: But I'm sitting in there, I take the picture, get

874
00:42:18,598 --> 00:42:20,358
Speaker 3: up from the picture. I'm walking back in to home

875
00:42:20,398 --> 00:42:22,518
Speaker 3: plate to whatever I have to do next, and I'm

876
00:42:22,558 --> 00:42:26,518
Speaker 3: looking up and it's got that computer graphic like kind

877
00:42:26,558 --> 00:42:28,998
Speaker 3: of clouds in the sky whatever in the beautiful setting

878
00:42:29,078 --> 00:42:31,478
Speaker 3: over the top of the ballpark. And I told myself,

879
00:42:31,598 --> 00:42:34,958
Speaker 3: slow it down, take a snap, snapshot, don't let this

880
00:42:35,078 --> 00:42:35,998
Speaker 3: happen too fast.

881
00:42:36,278 --> 00:42:37,478
Speaker 2: I'm replaying it right now.

882
00:42:38,198 --> 00:42:40,158
Speaker 3: And from that moment on, when I got into those

883
00:42:40,198 --> 00:42:43,878
Speaker 3: hot moments, I would ask myself to do those things,

884
00:42:44,198 --> 00:42:47,758
Speaker 3: because quite frankly, up to that point, deff having played

885
00:42:47,758 --> 00:42:50,078
Speaker 3: into big leagues, you know, kind of just being a

886
00:42:50,118 --> 00:42:52,758
Speaker 3: minor league grunt and then being a coach, and I

887
00:42:52,918 --> 00:42:55,278
Speaker 3: coached into the World Series the year before that, but

888
00:42:56,118 --> 00:43:00,358
Speaker 3: never really was able to slow it down to the

889
00:43:00,358 --> 00:43:03,718
Speaker 3: point where I took that mental snapshot well or when

890
00:43:03,718 --> 00:43:06,078
Speaker 3: that was that I would remember and they did. And

891
00:43:06,118 --> 00:43:08,718
Speaker 3: so from that moment on, every time we got into

892
00:43:08,718 --> 00:43:14,118
Speaker 3: big moments or situation, I would always stop and slow down, breathe,

893
00:43:14,398 --> 00:43:17,198
Speaker 3: and take that mental snapshot of where I'm at, and

894
00:43:17,318 --> 00:43:19,998
Speaker 3: I try to do that. I've done that ever since then.

895
00:43:20,478 --> 00:43:23,558
Speaker 3: I think it's been very helpful in regards to being

896
00:43:23,758 --> 00:43:26,598
Speaker 3: in a quote unquote big moment and being able to

897
00:43:26,598 --> 00:43:27,438
Speaker 3: be in the present tense.

898
00:43:27,798 --> 00:43:31,078
Speaker 1: I love that. And if I remember correctly, I think

899
00:43:31,118 --> 00:43:33,718
Speaker 1: he told this story about you know, being at regular

900
00:43:33,798 --> 00:43:36,918
Speaker 1: field and realizing the privilege of managing games and before

901
00:43:36,918 --> 00:43:39,718
Speaker 1: a game looking up and seeing that top seat and

902
00:43:39,798 --> 00:43:42,958
Speaker 1: right field, the top of the ballpark basically filled all

903
00:43:42,998 --> 00:43:46,238
Speaker 1: the time. And that's a little reminder of what baseball

904
00:43:46,318 --> 00:43:52,078
Speaker 1: means to Chicago baseball fans and your responsibility to you know,

905
00:43:52,198 --> 00:43:55,318
Speaker 1: honor them and their commitment to the game is something

906
00:43:55,318 --> 00:43:57,358
Speaker 1: that you would recognize before a game. I think that's

907
00:43:57,358 --> 00:44:00,398
Speaker 1: so cool, and for me, I also think about Joe

908
00:44:00,398 --> 00:44:03,438
Speaker 1: Torri when Joe Tory spent a lifetime waiting to get

909
00:44:03,478 --> 00:44:05,358
Speaker 1: to the World's Series as a player and then as

910
00:44:05,358 --> 00:44:09,438
Speaker 1: a as a manager, his welcome of the World Series

911
00:44:09,518 --> 00:44:12,198
Speaker 1: moment was standing on the line for the national anthem,

912
00:44:12,398 --> 00:44:15,158
Speaker 1: the teams that are introduced. He said, you look up

913
00:44:15,198 --> 00:44:17,438
Speaker 1: at the out of town scoreboard and there are no

914
00:44:17,598 --> 00:44:20,518
Speaker 1: other games going on. This is the center of the

915
00:44:20,518 --> 00:44:24,638
Speaker 1: baseball universe. It's what you have worked for your entire career.

916
00:44:25,238 --> 00:44:27,798
Speaker 1: And in that moment of quiet, of course the anthem

917
00:44:27,878 --> 00:44:30,998
Speaker 1: is playing, but everybody's being quiet. You're at the center

918
00:44:31,038 --> 00:44:34,638
Speaker 1: of the baseball universe. You've made it, and there's this

919
00:44:34,758 --> 00:44:38,078
Speaker 1: realization you know that those two minutes when that anthem plays,

920
00:44:38,518 --> 00:44:41,358
Speaker 1: there's a lot of self reflection that goes on. And

921
00:44:41,398 --> 00:44:44,838
Speaker 1: I asked Tory Lavello about that, and he said it

922
00:44:44,878 --> 00:44:48,918
Speaker 1: actually began first when he was introduced, came out first,

923
00:44:48,998 --> 00:44:51,198
Speaker 1: and then they introduced the Rangers. Of course, the game

924
00:44:51,238 --> 00:44:54,158
Speaker 1: was in Arlington, and Bruce Bochie's been to the World

925
00:44:54,198 --> 00:44:57,838
Speaker 1: Series what now four or five times, came over and

926
00:44:57,918 --> 00:45:01,798
Speaker 1: said enjoy it, good luck Tory. And Tory said, first

927
00:45:01,798 --> 00:45:05,558
Speaker 1: of all, I couldn't believe he actually remembered name. He said,

928
00:45:05,558 --> 00:45:08,918
Speaker 1: I was blown away by that. Uh, and just seeing

929
00:45:08,958 --> 00:45:11,558
Speaker 1: Bruce Bochie and like, I'm matched up against Bruce Boach

930
00:45:11,638 --> 00:45:14,478
Speaker 1: in the World Series for Tory Leavello blew him away.

931
00:45:14,558 --> 00:45:18,478
Speaker 1: So he did have that moment where, like you said, Joe,

932
00:45:18,678 --> 00:45:21,998
Speaker 1: you can stop, you know, don't let everything go by

933
00:45:22,198 --> 00:45:26,118
Speaker 1: so fast you can't see anything or feel anything, but

934
00:45:26,158 --> 00:45:28,758
Speaker 1: stop and appreciate where you are in life and in

935
00:45:28,758 --> 00:45:29,478
Speaker 1: this great game.

936
00:45:30,398 --> 00:45:32,678
Speaker 3: I appreciate your memory in the story about the seat,

937
00:45:33,838 --> 00:45:36,238
Speaker 3: you know, I do remember that I and I told

938
00:45:36,278 --> 00:45:40,078
Speaker 3: it often when I first thought about it, but more

939
00:45:40,078 --> 00:45:42,318
Speaker 3: specifically when you stand in it. I always stood in

940
00:45:42,318 --> 00:45:44,238
Speaker 3: that right side corner of the dug out a wriggling.

941
00:45:44,318 --> 00:45:46,998
Speaker 3: You look straight out, like into that right field corner,

942
00:45:47,558 --> 00:45:49,878
Speaker 3: and the way the seats it's kind of like bows

943
00:45:49,918 --> 00:45:52,958
Speaker 3: out a little bit, and it's just glorious. Man.

944
00:45:53,038 --> 00:45:55,998
Speaker 2: The way that ballpark is constructed, it's just glorious.

945
00:45:55,998 --> 00:45:58,678
Speaker 3: Nothing like it. I still believe it's the best. It's

946
00:45:58,678 --> 00:46:01,758
Speaker 3: the best venue in this country, and maybe it's in

947
00:46:01,798 --> 00:46:03,398
Speaker 3: the world. I don't know, but I look at that scene.

948
00:46:03,398 --> 00:46:06,238
Speaker 3: The thing, damn that seats. There's somebody in that seat,

949
00:46:06,598 --> 00:46:09,078
Speaker 3: and there's somebody in that seat every every game. There's

950
00:46:09,118 --> 00:46:12,558
Speaker 3: somebody in practically every game except when it's like twenty

951
00:46:12,598 --> 00:46:13,078
Speaker 3: degrees out.

952
00:46:13,078 --> 00:46:16,318
Speaker 2: But there's somebody in that seat and it's like wow.

953
00:46:17,158 --> 00:46:18,278
Speaker 2: So that just.

954
00:46:18,318 --> 00:46:22,038
Speaker 3: Speaks to effort to me when you that seed represents

955
00:46:22,038 --> 00:46:25,078
Speaker 3: to me, like you said, while we're doing this, how

956
00:46:25,118 --> 00:46:27,198
Speaker 3: I got here, what it should mean to me, what

957
00:46:27,278 --> 00:46:29,118
Speaker 3: it does mean to me, and then what it means

958
00:46:29,158 --> 00:46:32,598
Speaker 3: to the fans, and what our efforts should be like

959
00:46:32,678 --> 00:46:33,958
Speaker 3: and where why we are here?

960
00:46:34,598 --> 00:46:37,358
Speaker 2: You remember we remember during COVID no fans in the ballpark.

961
00:46:37,478 --> 00:46:38,278
Speaker 2: It was kind of weird.

962
00:46:38,278 --> 00:46:41,918
Speaker 3: And it's not really the same kind of there's no inspiration,

963
00:46:41,958 --> 00:46:45,358
Speaker 3: it's not the inspiration that you normally would have. Somebody

964
00:46:45,398 --> 00:46:48,598
Speaker 3: in that last seed in that right field corner creates inspiration.

965
00:46:49,518 --> 00:46:50,078
Speaker 2: I love that.

966
00:46:50,598 --> 00:46:53,718
Speaker 1: Well said listen, when I go to a ballpark, Joe.

967
00:46:53,798 --> 00:46:56,278
Speaker 1: There's kind of two things that I really don't like.

968
00:46:56,598 --> 00:46:59,438
Speaker 1: One is when, and it usually happens with media people.

969
00:46:59,518 --> 00:47:02,398
Speaker 1: I don't think fans necessarily say this. They say, well,

970
00:47:02,438 --> 00:47:04,478
Speaker 1: I hope it's not a three hour game. I hope

971
00:47:04,478 --> 00:47:06,758
Speaker 1: the game's quick. I mean, you got someplace to go.

972
00:47:06,958 --> 00:47:09,958
Speaker 1: Come on, I'm there because I want to stay long.

973
00:47:10,118 --> 00:47:12,558
Speaker 1: You give me extra innings, I'll take it. Once you're

974
00:47:12,558 --> 00:47:15,038
Speaker 1: there at the ballpark, play on, brother. I don't care

975
00:47:15,078 --> 00:47:17,958
Speaker 1: about how long it takes. Now, listen, I'm all about

976
00:47:18,398 --> 00:47:20,598
Speaker 1: time of action, pace of action in the game. That's

977
00:47:20,638 --> 00:47:24,158
Speaker 1: a separate issue. But if it's a great game, I'm

978
00:47:24,158 --> 00:47:25,998
Speaker 1: not in a rush to get out of there. Don't

979
00:47:25,998 --> 00:47:27,678
Speaker 1: show up and being a rush to get out of there.

980
00:47:27,758 --> 00:47:30,038
Speaker 1: That bothers me. The other thing is people will say

981
00:47:30,078 --> 00:47:34,238
Speaker 1: who's going to win? That's why I'm here, folks. I

982
00:47:34,478 --> 00:47:37,678
Speaker 1: like not knowing the outcome of the game. Now I

983
00:47:37,758 --> 00:47:39,358
Speaker 1: did say, and they used it on air. I had

984
00:47:39,358 --> 00:47:41,558
Speaker 1: a feeling the Rangers were gonna blow out the Astros

985
00:47:41,558 --> 00:47:44,078
Speaker 1: in Game seven, and they did. It wasn't something I

986
00:47:44,118 --> 00:47:46,198
Speaker 1: was rooting for. I just passed, not a feeling I

987
00:47:46,238 --> 00:47:48,598
Speaker 1: had before the game. I felt strongly about where Texas

988
00:47:48,718 --> 00:47:51,158
Speaker 1: was at that point really had nothing to do with Houston,

989
00:47:51,758 --> 00:47:53,838
Speaker 1: and in this case, Joe, I feel this way about

990
00:47:53,838 --> 00:47:56,478
Speaker 1: the World Series. If you ask me who's going to

991
00:47:56,558 --> 00:47:59,958
Speaker 1: win the World Series, I'd rather not say something, because

992
00:47:59,998 --> 00:48:02,358
Speaker 1: first of all, I don't have a rooting interest, and

993
00:48:02,398 --> 00:48:05,158
Speaker 1: they don't have a strong feeling it this point, and

994
00:48:05,238 --> 00:48:07,958
Speaker 1: usually you pick something and then and then you have

995
00:48:08,278 --> 00:48:12,518
Speaker 1: like this unconscious bias that you're you're feeling should come true.

996
00:48:12,798 --> 00:48:15,118
Speaker 1: And you start leaning that way. I like not knowing

997
00:48:15,118 --> 00:48:17,798
Speaker 1: what's going to happen in this case. I can truly say, Joe,

998
00:48:17,878 --> 00:48:19,998
Speaker 1: I don't know where this series is going. I think

999
00:48:20,038 --> 00:48:22,038
Speaker 1: these teams are evenly matched. I thought coming in it

1000
00:48:22,078 --> 00:48:24,918
Speaker 1: was a seven game series. We've never had three game

1001
00:48:24,998 --> 00:48:28,558
Speaker 1: sevens and one postseason. We may be getting there. So

1002
00:48:28,598 --> 00:48:31,158
Speaker 1: I like the fact that this series can go any direction.

1003
00:48:31,278 --> 00:48:34,118
Speaker 1: I will say Game three is a pivotal, pivotal game

1004
00:48:34,278 --> 00:48:37,798
Speaker 1: because you've got Schurzer and fought. You've got a bullpen

1005
00:48:37,838 --> 00:48:41,318
Speaker 1: game pretty much in Game four, so bullpens are going

1006
00:48:41,358 --> 00:48:42,598
Speaker 1: to be taxed. I think you'll have a lot of

1007
00:48:42,678 --> 00:48:45,278
Speaker 1: runs in these three games in Arizona. But man, anything

1008
00:48:45,318 --> 00:48:47,958
Speaker 1: goes at this point in this series. And I absolutely love.

1009
00:48:47,878 --> 00:48:50,198
Speaker 2: That unconscious biased. I love that.

1010
00:48:50,398 --> 00:48:53,758
Speaker 3: Actually it applies to so many different things just in

1011
00:48:53,878 --> 00:48:57,798
Speaker 3: our life, in and a game specifically going in a prognosticator,

1012
00:48:58,718 --> 00:49:01,478
Speaker 3: then you might form your opinions just based on that,

1013
00:49:02,158 --> 00:49:05,478
Speaker 3: and you're going to walk away from something that truly

1014
00:49:05,638 --> 00:49:08,558
Speaker 3: something else may make may make more sense to you,

1015
00:49:09,038 --> 00:49:11,118
Speaker 3: and you want to walk to that side. But because

1016
00:49:11,158 --> 00:49:13,678
Speaker 3: you said this, you got to stay with that. It's

1017
00:49:13,678 --> 00:49:17,518
Speaker 3: no different than uh, you know organization, there was a scout,

1018
00:49:17,558 --> 00:49:20,638
Speaker 3: I was a scout and you signed. I signed Tom Berducci.

1019
00:49:20,718 --> 00:49:23,398
Speaker 3: And then when it comes to evaluating Tom on an

1020
00:49:23,438 --> 00:49:26,278
Speaker 3: annual basis in meetings whatever, there's there might be a

1021
00:49:26,278 --> 00:49:29,878
Speaker 3: bias attached to that. Because I signed Tommy, uh, and

1022
00:49:29,878 --> 00:49:31,958
Speaker 3: because I did. I want Tom to do well.

1023
00:49:31,998 --> 00:49:32,878
Speaker 2: And even though I know.

1024
00:49:34,438 --> 00:49:36,278
Speaker 3: Jimmy Salmon's been playing a little bit better and I

1025
00:49:36,358 --> 00:49:39,518
Speaker 3: like him more, but I signed Produce, so I'm gonna

1026
00:49:39,518 --> 00:49:43,358
Speaker 3: I'm gonna pump him in this meeting. It's really it's

1027
00:49:43,398 --> 00:49:46,238
Speaker 3: a human quality, of course, but I gosh, I always

1028
00:49:46,238 --> 00:49:50,278
Speaker 3: wanted to believe that I could rise above that my opinion.

1029
00:49:50,318 --> 00:49:55,238
Speaker 2: I always wanted to believe would be independent of bias.

1030
00:49:55,318 --> 00:49:58,598
Speaker 2: I mean, we talk about this a lot. Outcome.

1031
00:49:58,638 --> 00:50:00,038
Speaker 3: Bias is a big part of our game, is a

1032
00:50:00,078 --> 00:50:02,358
Speaker 3: big part of the world right now. One thing I

1033
00:50:02,398 --> 00:50:03,958
Speaker 3: really work hard at. And I don't know if I

1034
00:50:04,198 --> 00:50:06,438
Speaker 3: or not. I think I am, but I guess maybe

1035
00:50:06,438 --> 00:50:09,078
Speaker 3: that's a bias. But I really try to stay independent

1036
00:50:09,198 --> 00:50:12,838
Speaker 3: of my biases as much as I possibly can. To me,

1037
00:50:12,878 --> 00:50:16,838
Speaker 3: that's where truth lies. I mean most the word truth

1038
00:50:16,838 --> 00:50:19,278
Speaker 3: and bias pretty much have become synonymous terms, I think,

1039
00:50:19,878 --> 00:50:23,678
Speaker 3: and those that could rise above their own personal biases

1040
00:50:23,718 --> 00:50:27,198
Speaker 3: and really attempt to see both sides, that gray area

1041
00:50:27,198 --> 00:50:28,638
Speaker 3: that nobody wants.

1042
00:50:28,398 --> 00:50:29,838
Speaker 2: To enter into. We want to be black or white

1043
00:50:29,838 --> 00:50:31,238
Speaker 2: with everything that to.

1044
00:50:31,158 --> 00:50:35,398
Speaker 3: Me is important. So yeah, right on unconscious bias. I

1045
00:50:35,438 --> 00:50:36,478
Speaker 3: want to stay away from that.

1046
00:50:37,358 --> 00:50:37,838
Speaker 2: I will do.

1047
00:50:37,918 --> 00:50:40,918
Speaker 3: I'll give you my opinion on who might win only

1048
00:50:40,958 --> 00:50:42,758
Speaker 3: based on the fact that it's interesting to people that

1049
00:50:42,838 --> 00:50:45,638
Speaker 3: might be listening. But beyond that, you you've got to

1050
00:50:45,678 --> 00:50:50,038
Speaker 3: keep an open mind and understand that there are two sides,

1051
00:50:50,238 --> 00:50:52,158
Speaker 3: and you don't want to be polarized with anything. You

1052
00:50:52,238 --> 00:50:55,518
Speaker 3: just really want to understand and attempt to come to

1053
00:50:55,558 --> 00:50:56,358
Speaker 3: the right conclusion.

1054
00:50:56,718 --> 00:50:59,718
Speaker 1: As always, brother Well said right there by the way,

1055
00:50:59,758 --> 00:51:02,158
Speaker 1: I know you usually always take us out of here

1056
00:51:02,198 --> 00:51:04,878
Speaker 1: with a closing thought. Yeah, that's a pretty good one

1057
00:51:04,958 --> 00:51:08,718
Speaker 1: right there. That truth and bias have become basically synonymous terms.

1058
00:51:08,718 --> 00:51:12,278
Speaker 1: It's also a little bit scary. But do you have

1059
00:51:12,358 --> 00:51:14,558
Speaker 1: something else to take it on us today, Joe?

1060
00:51:15,438 --> 00:51:18,878
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess again, it's weird, man. I sit around

1061
00:51:18,918 --> 00:51:21,118
Speaker 3: in a warning and again I have no idea what

1062
00:51:21,158 --> 00:51:23,918
Speaker 3: Tommy's going to present, And I love that part of it.

1063
00:51:23,958 --> 00:51:26,798
Speaker 3: I love the extemporaneous nature of our our show. But

1064
00:51:27,398 --> 00:51:30,038
Speaker 3: this came from Stephen Hawking. You know, pretty bright Fellow

1065
00:51:30,838 --> 00:51:36,638
Speaker 3: overcame so much adversity in his life. But intelligence is

1066
00:51:36,678 --> 00:51:42,158
Speaker 3: the ability to adapt to change, and that, in a

1067
00:51:42,238 --> 00:51:43,758
Speaker 3: nutshell is.

1068
00:51:45,278 --> 00:51:45,758
Speaker 2: What you all.

1069
00:51:45,838 --> 00:51:47,758
Speaker 3: I think, I want to believe I'm able to do,

1070
00:51:48,278 --> 00:51:50,398
Speaker 3: but I hope I'm able to do that because that's

1071
00:51:50,438 --> 00:51:53,918
Speaker 3: so necessary. You have to adapt to change. Now, there's

1072
00:51:53,958 --> 00:51:56,998
Speaker 3: times that I think it could be construed, like you know,

1073
00:51:57,078 --> 00:52:04,878
Speaker 3: my stance sometimes apparently against analytics may be misinterpreted because

1074
00:52:04,918 --> 00:52:07,518
Speaker 3: I was at the forefront of the ability to adapt

1075
00:52:07,558 --> 00:52:10,358
Speaker 3: to that change in the game in the mid two thousands,

1076
00:52:11,078 --> 00:52:14,558
Speaker 3: and at some point you could change so much, but

1077
00:52:14,598 --> 00:52:17,478
Speaker 3: you also have to adhere to what you believe in

1078
00:52:17,518 --> 00:52:19,518
Speaker 3: your heart of hearts is the right way to do things.

1079
00:52:19,918 --> 00:52:24,278
Speaker 3: So when I read this, you know, again I'm analyzing myself.

1080
00:52:24,798 --> 00:52:28,678
Speaker 3: So intelligence and the ability to adapt to change. But

1081
00:52:28,718 --> 00:52:31,878
Speaker 3: there's a component of that that when it comes to

1082
00:52:31,918 --> 00:52:34,838
Speaker 3: the word change and what that means, you just change

1083
00:52:34,838 --> 00:52:37,638
Speaker 3: for just change sake, to me is not appropriate either.

1084
00:52:38,038 --> 00:52:39,998
Speaker 3: So there's got to be balance, and everything, I guess

1085
00:52:40,078 --> 00:52:43,238
Speaker 3: is what I'm driving at a balance. Gray matters. It's

1086
00:52:43,238 --> 00:52:46,398
Speaker 3: not always polarized. It should not always be one way

1087
00:52:46,478 --> 00:52:48,798
Speaker 3: or the other. And that's to me when I read

1088
00:52:48,798 --> 00:52:52,878
Speaker 3: that from Stephen Hawking, that's kind of like my interpretation

1089
00:52:52,998 --> 00:52:53,318
Speaker 3: of it.

1090
00:52:53,958 --> 00:52:57,958
Speaker 1: Agreed, Joe, And yes, obviously you were at kind of

1091
00:52:57,998 --> 00:53:01,438
Speaker 1: the cutting edge as analytics came into the game, and

1092
00:53:01,478 --> 00:53:03,838
Speaker 1: whether that was back with the Angels with your hand

1093
00:53:03,958 --> 00:53:07,278
Speaker 1: written charts, or certainly with the rays and shifts and

1094
00:53:07,678 --> 00:53:10,358
Speaker 1: matchups with bullpen guys right on right, all of that.

1095
00:53:10,518 --> 00:53:13,358
Speaker 1: But you're also you've been at the forefront of the game,

1096
00:53:13,798 --> 00:53:16,638
Speaker 1: you know, swinging back the pendulum, swinging back towards a

1097
00:53:16,718 --> 00:53:19,078
Speaker 1: more balanced game. And I think what we're watching here

1098
00:53:19,118 --> 00:53:23,518
Speaker 1: in the World Series, especially on the Arizona sign side,

1099
00:53:23,638 --> 00:53:26,678
Speaker 1: is a sign of that. I mean, sacrifice bunts. We're

1100
00:53:26,678 --> 00:53:28,518
Speaker 1: seeing a lot of those in the World Series. We

1101
00:53:28,558 --> 00:53:30,398
Speaker 1: went three years without seeing a sack butt in the

1102
00:53:30,438 --> 00:53:33,558
Speaker 1: World Series. Now we're almost expecting it, or at least

1103
00:53:33,558 --> 00:53:37,158
Speaker 1: the defenses is on alert for it, on alert for

1104
00:53:37,198 --> 00:53:40,358
Speaker 1: a stolen base. It's so much more entertaining, so much

1105
00:53:40,398 --> 00:53:44,718
Speaker 1: more exciting. The anticipation of something happening is back in

1106
00:53:44,798 --> 00:53:47,398
Speaker 1: the game, rather than sitting back and waiting for a

1107
00:53:47,478 --> 00:53:52,798
Speaker 1: three true outcome, home run, walk strikeout. So it's credit

1108
00:53:52,798 --> 00:53:54,758
Speaker 1: to you, Joe that you've been at the forefront of that.

1109
00:53:54,878 --> 00:53:58,198
Speaker 1: And I think the fans are enjoying, at least stylistically

1110
00:53:58,278 --> 00:54:00,038
Speaker 1: aesthetically a much better game.

1111
00:54:00,598 --> 00:54:02,558
Speaker 3: I agree, and the last plant I'll leave alone with

1112
00:54:02,598 --> 00:54:04,478
Speaker 3: this one, but I would it comes down to the

1113
00:54:04,558 --> 00:54:05,598
Speaker 3: lineups I don't understand.

1114
00:54:05,638 --> 00:54:06,958
Speaker 2: I mean, listen, we all love home runs.

1115
00:54:06,958 --> 00:54:09,158
Speaker 3: Who doesn't love a home run, But you're not going

1116
00:54:09,238 --> 00:54:12,398
Speaker 3: to get that consistently from one through nine all the time.

1117
00:54:12,438 --> 00:54:14,558
Speaker 3: And I think the last time I saw twenty plus

1118
00:54:14,598 --> 00:54:17,598
Speaker 3: home runs for pre playing the lineup was the Baltimore Orioles.

1119
00:54:17,598 --> 00:54:19,798
Speaker 3: I remember Chris Hoyle is hitting ninth with twenty some

1120
00:54:19,918 --> 00:54:23,518
Speaker 3: home runs, but normally that doesn't occur. So stylistically, like

1121
00:54:23,558 --> 00:54:25,838
Speaker 3: you said, you know, you're gonna have your better hitters

1122
00:54:25,878 --> 00:54:28,718
Speaker 3: probably one through six. And I always thought, you know,

1123
00:54:29,518 --> 00:54:32,038
Speaker 3: the Cleveland Indians taught me when I first started with

1124
00:54:32,038 --> 00:54:35,638
Speaker 3: the Angels as a bench coach and stuff. Was David

1125
00:54:35,758 --> 00:54:38,478
Speaker 3: Justice hitting seventh. I always looked at the seventh hole

1126
00:54:38,518 --> 00:54:40,958
Speaker 3: hitter in American league lineup to really tell me how

1127
00:54:41,438 --> 00:54:42,558
Speaker 3: potent this lineup is.

1128
00:54:42,758 --> 00:54:43,718
Speaker 2: To me, that was potent.

1129
00:54:44,318 --> 00:54:46,518
Speaker 3: But if you've got and down a lineup, why is

1130
00:54:46,558 --> 00:54:50,918
Speaker 3: it so difficult to understand attempt to at least nurture speed, speed,

1131
00:54:50,958 --> 00:54:53,878
Speaker 3: and ability to do different things to create the bottom

1132
00:54:53,918 --> 00:54:55,878
Speaker 3: part of your lineup leading back into the top of

1133
00:54:55,878 --> 00:54:56,438
Speaker 3: your lineup.

1134
00:54:56,478 --> 00:54:57,038
Speaker 2: I like that.

1135
00:54:57,718 --> 00:55:00,078
Speaker 3: I like, you know, a little bit of a diversity

1136
00:55:00,198 --> 00:55:03,558
Speaker 3: in your lineup. Also, I want power, I want speed.

1137
00:55:03,958 --> 00:55:05,598
Speaker 3: I want the ability to move to baseball. I want

1138
00:55:05,638 --> 00:55:07,838
Speaker 3: the ability to have a two striker b hack approach.

1139
00:55:08,358 --> 00:55:09,038
Speaker 2: I want all of that.

1140
00:55:09,038 --> 00:55:10,398
Speaker 3: I want to be able to steal bases. I want

1141
00:55:10,438 --> 00:55:13,638
Speaker 3: to advance on balls in the dirt. Why why can't

1142
00:55:13,678 --> 00:55:15,918
Speaker 3: we nurture all of that within our groups? That's the

1143
00:55:15,998 --> 00:55:19,238
Speaker 3: part last point with the THEO. I used to tell Leo,

1144
00:55:19,638 --> 00:55:22,158
Speaker 3: how many rounds do we draft? You know, it's forty rounds?

1145
00:55:22,198 --> 00:55:26,238
Speaker 3: I think, okay, so why not rounds thirty to forty,

1146
00:55:26,278 --> 00:55:28,638
Speaker 3: which is normally it's very hard to hit on anybody.

1147
00:55:28,918 --> 00:55:32,598
Speaker 3: I thought, just get really, and I might be speaking

1148
00:55:32,638 --> 00:55:35,958
Speaker 3: to the old Kansas City Roads Academy method. Just draft

1149
00:55:35,958 --> 00:55:39,278
Speaker 3: speed guys thirty to forty. Just speed guys, so you

1150
00:55:39,318 --> 00:55:41,958
Speaker 3: get ten speed guys a year, ten guys that could

1151
00:55:41,998 --> 00:55:44,558
Speaker 3: really go and you try to nurture them in the

1152
00:55:44,558 --> 00:55:45,118
Speaker 3: minor leagues.

1153
00:55:45,278 --> 00:55:45,918
Speaker 2: I would say with.

1154
00:55:45,918 --> 00:55:48,598
Speaker 3: The course of three four years, you had at least

1155
00:55:48,598 --> 00:55:50,438
Speaker 3: one or two you're going to hit on that were

1156
00:55:50,438 --> 00:55:52,318
Speaker 3: going to help you in the major league level. By

1157
00:55:52,358 --> 00:55:55,478
Speaker 3: having that, like forty guys that could really run after

1158
00:55:55,518 --> 00:55:58,598
Speaker 3: four years through the draft, to me, that's an interesting concept.

1159
00:55:58,878 --> 00:56:02,478
Speaker 3: So diversity, we all want diversity. Madam at their diversity.

1160
00:56:02,558 --> 00:56:06,238
Speaker 3: Guy Hazel's an integrate project. I love diversity in my

1161
00:56:06,238 --> 00:56:06,718
Speaker 3: lineup two.

1162
00:56:07,118 --> 00:56:08,638
Speaker 1: Yeah, it reminds me of the year. I think you

1163
00:56:08,678 --> 00:56:11,358
Speaker 1: were there, COVID year the Angels drafted a picture in

1164
00:56:11,438 --> 00:56:13,718
Speaker 1: every round. I think it's twenty for twenty or twenty

1165
00:56:13,718 --> 00:56:16,958
Speaker 1: one for twenty one. So yeah, Yeah, the game's coming back.

1166
00:56:17,198 --> 00:56:19,318
Speaker 1: I truly believe that. In this World Series is a

1167
00:56:19,318 --> 00:56:22,158
Speaker 1: good showcase of that. So I'm looking forward to more

1168
00:56:22,198 --> 00:56:24,638
Speaker 1: of the same. Joe, exciting baseball. I think we're going

1169
00:56:24,638 --> 00:56:26,518
Speaker 1: to see a lot of runs in these three middle

1170
00:56:26,558 --> 00:56:28,718
Speaker 1: games in Arizona. Have fun and enjoy them.

1171
00:56:28,838 --> 00:56:30,118
Speaker 2: You two brother have a great night.

1172
00:56:39,278 --> 00:56:42,518
Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

1173
00:56:42,758 --> 00:56:47,718
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app Apple podcasts,

1174
00:56:47,838 --> 00:56:49,558
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts