1
00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:07,280
Speaker 1: Hey there, folks, it is Friday, fourth of July twenty

2
00:00:07,560 --> 00:00:09,800
Speaker 1: twenty five. If we're hopping on here because we have

3
00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:13,720
Speaker 1: heard for the first time from Adjuror in the Diddy trial,

4
00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:17,360
Speaker 1: a bunch of stuff to go through. One of the highlights,

5
00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:21,880
Speaker 1: at least for me, the freakoffs were tame and welcome

6
00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:25,520
Speaker 1: to this episode of Amy and TJ Road. We didn't

7
00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:27,800
Speaker 1: expect to do an update today. Lokt so much interest

8
00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:29,320
Speaker 1: in this, and yes it is a holiday, but we're

9
00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:31,440
Speaker 1: hopping on because we're hearing from Ajur for the first time.

10
00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:33,720
Speaker 1: That is a big deal. We're getting a lot of insights.

11
00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:37,240
Speaker 1: But you looked at me funny when I said that

12
00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:39,360
Speaker 1: was a highlight. But some of the stuff, that's one

13
00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:40,720
Speaker 1: of the things that jumped out. We heard so much

14
00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:43,080
Speaker 1: about freak offs. Someone who actually saw a freak Off

15
00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:45,200
Speaker 1: video is telling us it was kind of tame.

16
00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:49,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, said it was just basically a lot of people

17
00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:52,480
Speaker 2: rubbing baby oil on one another and not a lot

18
00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:55,880
Speaker 2: of sex, So that was interesting. He pointed out George

19
00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:59,200
Speaker 2: he was an alternatur who gave this detail, but he

20
00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:02,200
Speaker 2: claimed that as they were watching the videos it sounded

21
00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:05,920
Speaker 2: or seemed salacious, but actually it was tame. That is

22
00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:06,800
Speaker 2: the word he used.

23
00:01:06,920 --> 00:01:10,920
Speaker 1: Isn't that wild to think all this we've heard and

24
00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:13,760
Speaker 1: all of this we think of how nasty, and we

25
00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:17,360
Speaker 1: hear how people have described them. He actually saw it.

26
00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:21,280
Speaker 1: And look, they didn't show them everything, but they saw

27
00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:24,880
Speaker 1: sweet are on some days forty I remember forty minute

28
00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:26,000
Speaker 1: video that was played.

29
00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,320
Speaker 2: Sh I mean, I don't know what this alternate juris

30
00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:32,560
Speaker 2: perspective is. It might not have seemed tame to me.

31
00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:36,400
Speaker 2: You know, that is something to consider. It's through the eyes,

32
00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:39,360
Speaker 2: through his lens, which might be different than my life.

33
00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:42,440
Speaker 1: Relatively, it was, oh, that was nothing. You should see

34
00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:43,720
Speaker 1: the stuff right.

35
00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:46,520
Speaker 2: No, but who knows. Some people have a lot of

36
00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:49,720
Speaker 2: experience in looking at certain types of Maybe they thought

37
00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:52,240
Speaker 2: the quality was too homemade, or who knows what his

38
00:01:52,280 --> 00:01:54,680
Speaker 2: perspective was, but it was interesting and the point being,

39
00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:58,640
Speaker 2: the defense definitely tried to show excerpts of these freak

40
00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,040
Speaker 2: off sex parties were or they were just kind of

41
00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:04,160
Speaker 2: hanging out and chilling and playing music and talking. They

42
00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:06,000
Speaker 2: wanted to see or at least show the jurors that

43
00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:09,200
Speaker 2: it wasn't all sex field, that there were other elements

44
00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,480
Speaker 2: and other aspects to these parties beyond sex.

45
00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:14,200
Speaker 1: Okay, and we should be clear about who we're talking about.

46
00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:18,520
Speaker 1: This person has been only identified as George, no last name.

47
00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:21,480
Speaker 1: He did, however, put his face in front of a camera.

48
00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:23,680
Speaker 1: He did do an interview with CNN. He also did

49
00:02:23,720 --> 00:02:25,400
Speaker 1: an interview with The New York Times, but they're not

50
00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:30,880
Speaker 1: giving his full identity. But beyond just calling him George,

51
00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:33,560
Speaker 1: I thought in something you just said, ropes, it stood

52
00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:35,320
Speaker 1: out to me as much as we've been talking about

53
00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:39,120
Speaker 1: in public and maybe in press and even tabloid press,

54
00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:42,760
Speaker 1: freak all freak afll freakof I heard him during the interview.

55
00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:45,440
Speaker 1: He kept referring to it as a hotel night like

56
00:02:45,520 --> 00:02:49,720
Speaker 1: it seemed as if everything salacious we think we think

57
00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:53,959
Speaker 1: about freak offs. He as a juror who has more

58
00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,639
Speaker 1: access to any of this stuff than we do, seemed

59
00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:59,600
Speaker 1: to have a different tone in talking about.

60
00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,639
Speaker 2: These he did, and it was interesting too, just this

61
00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:04,800
Speaker 2: is somebody who said he I think he said. He

62
00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:07,840
Speaker 2: took more than three hundred pages of notes, three hundred

63
00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:10,040
Speaker 2: and fifty pages of notes during this trial because he

64
00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:12,639
Speaker 2: wanted to remember what he thought. He thought maybe he

65
00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:15,280
Speaker 2: could be deliberating, so he was preparing himself to make

66
00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:18,680
Speaker 2: the decision. But yes, hearing it from his perspective, someone

67
00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:21,320
Speaker 2: who sat in that courtroom day in and day out

68
00:03:21,400 --> 00:03:27,120
Speaker 2: and took copious notes, it didn't feel as salacious coming

69
00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:31,079
Speaker 2: from him. Hearing his impressions, and he had very specific

70
00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:33,440
Speaker 2: thoughts about how he thought the prosecution did, how he

71
00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:36,240
Speaker 2: thought the defense did, which witnesses he thought were credible,

72
00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:39,040
Speaker 2: which ones he thought weren't as credible, And first.

73
00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:41,800
Speaker 1: And foremost, he was not in a deliberation room, but

74
00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:44,720
Speaker 1: he was asked his opinion about the decision that the

75
00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:48,040
Speaker 1: jury made. He said, absolutely, he agrees, one hundred percent.

76
00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:51,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, he said, I understand why they came up with

77
00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:55,080
Speaker 2: that mixed verdict, and he said, I'm almost certain that

78
00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:57,960
Speaker 2: that would have been the verdict I would have agreed

79
00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:00,920
Speaker 2: to present as well, So he said he would be

80
00:04:01,000 --> 00:04:05,000
Speaker 2: he would have been in that unanimous decision. And he

81
00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:07,520
Speaker 2: didn't think that the government met the rico charges. He

82
00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:10,440
Speaker 2: didn't think the government meant the sex trafficking charges, and

83
00:04:10,520 --> 00:04:13,240
Speaker 2: he thought the defense did an excellent job at discrediting

84
00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:16,760
Speaker 2: several witnesses, he said, with one witness in particular, he

85
00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:18,480
Speaker 2: described he went back and looked at his notes and

86
00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:20,600
Speaker 2: said it was a takedown by the defense. He wanted

87
00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:22,719
Speaker 2: to remember key moments in the trial.

88
00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:26,080
Speaker 1: Stay on that point, Don Rechard, Don Richard was a problem.

89
00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:28,279
Speaker 1: She was up there. I can't remember how many days,

90
00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:31,040
Speaker 1: but she was a key, key witness who talked about

91
00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:35,560
Speaker 1: what she saw violence against Cassiventur or fine, but the

92
00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:39,280
Speaker 1: defense went at her, went at her hard, and some

93
00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,320
Speaker 1: people that look in some circles think she was a

94
00:04:43,240 --> 00:04:45,080
Speaker 1: I guess, a minion if you will. She was doing

95
00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:48,120
Speaker 1: a lot of his bidding and now has come out

96
00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:49,479
Speaker 1: she's suing him, right.

97
00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:50,680
Speaker 2: She issuing him.

98
00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:53,479
Speaker 1: Yet so they didn't at least going to this juror

99
00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:55,560
Speaker 1: didn't buy her for a second, it seems.

100
00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:57,039
Speaker 2: And that's true. And you know what, he even said,

101
00:04:57,080 --> 00:04:59,799
Speaker 2: it wasn't even with the Cassie Ventur and the money.

102
00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,359
Speaker 2: We talked about this before. That took away some of

103
00:05:02,360 --> 00:05:04,640
Speaker 2: the credibility from some of these key witnesses. He said

104
00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:07,919
Speaker 2: that was not the issue. She just he specifically said

105
00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,919
Speaker 2: she was not very credible, that is how he put it.

106
00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:14,839
Speaker 2: And yes that he wrote that the defense had a

107
00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:18,600
Speaker 2: takedown of her, and so it seemed like he and

108
00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:23,159
Speaker 2: perhaps even other jurors had lost all. I mean, once

109
00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:25,240
Speaker 2: the defense and even the judge said this, if you

110
00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:28,400
Speaker 2: don't think someone's credible, something they said was incredible, you

111
00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:31,839
Speaker 2: can basically eliminate all of their testimony from you for

112
00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:34,479
Speaker 2: your consideration. And it sounds like that's what George was

113
00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:35,039
Speaker 2: prepared to do.

114
00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:38,880
Speaker 1: It sound like he'd put he singled her out.

115
00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:39,440
Speaker 2: He did.

116
00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:42,480
Speaker 1: He absolutely did. I mean, he sounded like he didn't

117
00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,440
Speaker 1: buy anything in the rest of his And again he said,

118
00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:47,000
Speaker 1: a lot of them they had lunch together every day,

119
00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:49,120
Speaker 1: but they abide it by the rules. They didn't discuss

120
00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:51,680
Speaker 1: this or anything. But if this one guy sitting through it,

121
00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:55,360
Speaker 1: he was very strong in his react when he was asked.

122
00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:58,640
Speaker 1: He was very direct in answering about don Richard, who

123
00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:00,240
Speaker 1: you had a problem with credibility?

124
00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,000
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he dropped her name immediately.

125
00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:05,800
Speaker 1: We listen to him immediately. The other thing Robes that

126
00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:09,600
Speaker 1: was fascinating to me is that he said they walked

127
00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:14,760
Speaker 1: into the room with doubt. Right, it's reasonable doubt is

128
00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:17,679
Speaker 1: what the bar is supposed to be, not all doubt,

129
00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:20,240
Speaker 1: but a reasonable doubt. So he said, before the case

130
00:06:20,279 --> 00:06:24,960
Speaker 1: even started, he came in with a doubt about like

131
00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:29,080
Speaker 1: why are we here? Almost why are we talking about racketeering?

132
00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:33,200
Speaker 1: The prosecution seemed like they had a very, very steep

133
00:06:33,279 --> 00:06:36,920
Speaker 1: hill to climb before the case even started, before opening argument.

134
00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:39,800
Speaker 2: Yes, and you know, obviously, lay people like you and

135
00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:44,000
Speaker 2: I we've talked about how racketeering and conspiracy charges are confusing, complex,

136
00:06:44,360 --> 00:06:46,599
Speaker 2: and yes, we think of them when we think of

137
00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:48,599
Speaker 2: mob bosses. We think of them when we think about

138
00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:52,880
Speaker 2: criminal enterprises. We don't think about someone who is using

139
00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:57,359
Speaker 2: sex for pleasure in perhaps you could say deviant ways,

140
00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:59,800
Speaker 2: or even just in non traditional ways, but you wouldn't

141
00:06:59,800 --> 00:07:03,760
Speaker 2: put racketeering and conspiracy charges with that. And so yes,

142
00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:06,320
Speaker 2: to hear him say that he and he said he

143
00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:11,800
Speaker 2: believed other jurors walked into the trial thinking how are

144
00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:14,040
Speaker 2: they going to prove this? So it was as if

145
00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:16,880
Speaker 2: the cards were already stacked against the prosecution. And sort

146
00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:18,720
Speaker 2: of what we talked about in a previous podcast that

147
00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:22,360
Speaker 2: when you overreach, when you try to people aren't dumb.

148
00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:25,120
Speaker 2: Even if we aren't legal minds or we haven't been

149
00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:28,840
Speaker 2: trained in the law specifically, we still get the fact

150
00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:30,880
Speaker 2: that that didn't make a lot of sense and was

151
00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:32,600
Speaker 2: going to be an uphill battle, and it proved to

152
00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:33,720
Speaker 2: be for sure, you know what.

153
00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:36,680
Speaker 1: I am, and I think a lot in a lot

154
00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:40,520
Speaker 1: of ways robes and reading this yur in particular, I

155
00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:44,800
Speaker 1: felt validated. And I say that in that the last

156
00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:49,360
Speaker 1: it probably at least three, but certainly two weeks of

157
00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:52,480
Speaker 1: this trial, you and I were having different conversations about

158
00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:55,240
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, that doesn't make sense. Wait that's a

159
00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:57,520
Speaker 1: little bit of a stretch, isn't it. They're going that far.

160
00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:01,720
Speaker 1: He is saying some of the same exact doubts, like oh,

161
00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:03,600
Speaker 1: I didn't think that, or I didn't think that, or

162
00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:07,080
Speaker 1: that was It seems like a lot of people were

163
00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:10,280
Speaker 1: viewing this case from the outside exactly like the people

164
00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:11,200
Speaker 1: in that jury box.

165
00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:15,320
Speaker 2: For exactly exactly. And when he started talking about the

166
00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,520
Speaker 2: credibility of other witnesses, specifically, he was asked about Cassie

167
00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:23,280
Speaker 2: venture a Fine and he first of all wanted to say,

168
00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:26,560
Speaker 2: both with Cassie and with Jane, he did not believe

169
00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:28,880
Speaker 2: after hearing their testimony that either one of them were

170
00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:32,280
Speaker 2: sex trafficked. He said that he did not think that

171
00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:35,680
Speaker 2: that sex was forced. Ever, and so he said he

172
00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:39,480
Speaker 2: not only watched the footage, but listening to the testimony,

173
00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:43,080
Speaker 2: all of those things in his mind made him believe

174
00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:46,000
Speaker 2: that both of those women were there because they wanted

175
00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:46,240
Speaker 2: to be.

176
00:08:46,280 --> 00:08:48,520
Speaker 1: Okay, And the other thing he said about them is

177
00:08:48,559 --> 00:08:53,200
Speaker 1: what they were both credible. I believe they went through

178
00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:56,720
Speaker 1: what they went through. But then at the same time,

179
00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:59,760
Speaker 1: I wouldn't have voted to convict him on rackets hearing

180
00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,679
Speaker 1: or sex trafficking. Isn't that what the rest of the

181
00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:05,800
Speaker 1: country or a lot of people in a lot of

182
00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:08,280
Speaker 1: circles were saying that thing.

183
00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:10,000
Speaker 2: And both things be true.

184
00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:12,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's interesting to hear him he's the one

185
00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:14,400
Speaker 1: that had to decide, or the jurors had to decide.

186
00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,840
Speaker 1: They had to make the call. We didn't, but they

187
00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,679
Speaker 1: made the call that in a lot of ways, it

188
00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:23,199
Speaker 1: was fascinating to hear that. Wow, that's the exact same thing.

189
00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:24,400
Speaker 1: A lot of people were thinking.

190
00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:26,560
Speaker 2: Yes, you can still be a victim of something, have

191
00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:29,840
Speaker 2: suffered something, but it doesn't mean that you were forced

192
00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:32,680
Speaker 2: to do something against your will. So that's kind of interesting.

193
00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:35,880
Speaker 2: And he even specifically said that Cassie was very credible,

194
00:09:36,280 --> 00:09:38,080
Speaker 2: and he said, I don't think she would have come

195
00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:42,440
Speaker 2: here and just lied. It just didn't seem right. So

196
00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:47,439
Speaker 2: they believed her and they believed still Jane, and they

197
00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:51,000
Speaker 2: still didn't believe that either one of those women were

198
00:09:51,120 --> 00:09:52,920
Speaker 2: forced to do what they did.

199
00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:57,040
Speaker 1: It was interesting. George is someone identified as someone who

200
00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:00,960
Speaker 1: knew the name. He knew Sean did he combed, but

201
00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:02,880
Speaker 1: he said he wasn't familiar with his music. Agin, Yeah,

202
00:10:03,040 --> 00:10:06,560
Speaker 1: didn't know who this guy was. So celebrities wasn't a

203
00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:09,400
Speaker 1: part or a factor at all for him.

204
00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:10,240
Speaker 2: What do you?

205
00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:14,280
Speaker 1: I am surprised. Why come out? Why do it? Why

206
00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:16,880
Speaker 1: agree to an interview? Why go talk to the Times?

207
00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:19,800
Speaker 1: Why go go put your face on television? Why? Why

208
00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:22,040
Speaker 1: do it? This is speculative, Maybe we shouldn't, but it's

209
00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:23,760
Speaker 1: just it's just interesting.

210
00:10:23,840 --> 00:10:25,720
Speaker 2: It's interesting to me that he put his face on

211
00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:28,960
Speaker 2: television and I'm guessing that's his actual first name. Maybe

212
00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:31,959
Speaker 2: it's not. But he didn't want his last name used.

213
00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:34,800
Speaker 2: And he also said that, you know, he was concerned

214
00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:36,800
Speaker 2: and the reason why he didn't want his last name

215
00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:39,959
Speaker 2: used about any sort of retribution because people have strong

216
00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:42,720
Speaker 2: feelings about the verdict and whether or not the jurors

217
00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,000
Speaker 2: made the right decision. Now, again, he wasn't one of

218
00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:46,760
Speaker 2: the jurors in the deliberation room, so.

219
00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:50,040
Speaker 1: Consider that he is protecting himself from a decision he

220
00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:50,800
Speaker 1: didn't even have to.

221
00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:53,920
Speaker 2: Make correct But I thought it was interesting to I mean,

222
00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:56,360
Speaker 2: I guess he just felt like he wasn't identifiable, But

223
00:10:56,760 --> 00:10:57,959
Speaker 2: I don't know if he's.

224
00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:02,760
Speaker 1: Wherever he's from, everybody knows who you are. This isn't

225
00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:07,079
Speaker 1: his identity was out there. But it turns out George

226
00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:20,880
Speaker 1: is not the only juror we heard from. Yes, let's

227
00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:23,680
Speaker 1: continue now we've been talking about George. George came out,

228
00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:25,839
Speaker 1: the jur the alternate came out, did an interview with

229
00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:28,640
Speaker 1: the New York Times, did an interview with CNN. Didn't

230
00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:30,720
Speaker 1: give his last name, but as an alternate, he didn't

231
00:11:30,760 --> 00:11:34,040
Speaker 1: vote on the ultimate verdicts, but he sat through the

232
00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:36,480
Speaker 1: entire trial, just like the rest of the jurors. But

233
00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:43,160
Speaker 1: Robes we did hear and very briefly from a juror

234
00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:47,680
Speaker 1: who was actually in that deliberation room, and I guess

235
00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:50,000
Speaker 1: it was just a couple of sentences, but I guess

236
00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:51,440
Speaker 1: some insight in there as well.

237
00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:54,840
Speaker 2: Yes, so the juror. It seems as if this person

238
00:11:54,880 --> 00:11:59,960
Speaker 2: who did not want to reveal name, gender, nothing identifiable,

239
00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:01,079
Speaker 2: So we just know it's the.

240
00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:03,240
Speaker 1: Juror didn't want to be bothered, it seems.

241
00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:05,120
Speaker 2: And it seems as though we don't know exactly how

242
00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:08,120
Speaker 2: it happened, but some journalists must have been able to

243
00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:11,400
Speaker 2: cold call this juror or run into this juror, and

244
00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:13,240
Speaker 2: it was almost as if the juror didn't want to

245
00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:17,200
Speaker 2: say anything but was kind of not don't why he

246
00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:20,120
Speaker 2: was tempted or they were tempted to talk because of

247
00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:26,319
Speaker 2: the accusation that somehow jurors, these jurors were swayed by

248
00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,040
Speaker 2: the celebrity of Ditty. There was a legal analyst and

249
00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:31,520
Speaker 2: there have been legal experts who say, hey, we think

250
00:12:31,559 --> 00:12:33,560
Speaker 2: that perhaps celebrity could have been a part of this,

251
00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:35,920
Speaker 2: and that's why they let him off so easy without

252
00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:39,520
Speaker 2: actually convicting him on the more serious charges. And so

253
00:12:39,559 --> 00:12:41,800
Speaker 2: that's when this juror felt like they had to say something,

254
00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:44,680
Speaker 2: and they said that that was highly insulting and belittling

255
00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:47,439
Speaker 2: to the jury and the deliberation process. But the juror

256
00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:49,840
Speaker 2: didn't stop there, said a few more sentences, and we

257
00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,400
Speaker 2: think it's pretty interesting. So they went on to say this,

258
00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:56,120
Speaker 2: we spent over two days deliberating. Our decision was based

259
00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:58,880
Speaker 2: solely on the evidence presented and how the law is stated,

260
00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:01,640
Speaker 2: we would have treated any defendant in the same manner,

261
00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:04,480
Speaker 2: regardless of who they are. I have nothing else to say.

262
00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:07,120
Speaker 2: That's my favorite part of the comment, but that lets.

263
00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:09,640
Speaker 1: You know they didn't want they didn't plan to be talking,

264
00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:11,320
Speaker 1: and they didn't want to be talking. They didn't want

265
00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:17,320
Speaker 1: to and again they grabbed a comment. I think, look,

266
00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:19,800
Speaker 1: we got to give everybody a break, like we need

267
00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:21,679
Speaker 1: to give. Whatever you think about this, you got to

268
00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:24,360
Speaker 1: give these folks of grace. They spent two months of

269
00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:27,520
Speaker 1: their lives during this sacrifice, and you know it wasn't

270
00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:30,560
Speaker 1: easy in that deliberation room hearing all that stuff. They

271
00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:33,280
Speaker 1: might be fearful of their own lives or families or

272
00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:38,760
Speaker 1: any This is not This was a major in my

273
00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:43,480
Speaker 1: life changing potentially undertaking for these folks. And to just

274
00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:47,160
Speaker 1: come out simply and say, you idiots are caught up

275
00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:49,839
Speaker 1: in the celebrity that is offensive.

276
00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,480
Speaker 2: Highly offensive. And I do appreciate the fact that the

277
00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:55,760
Speaker 2: juror did speak out on that specifically and wanted to

278
00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:58,559
Speaker 2: talk to the level of professionalism among the jurors, and

279
00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,600
Speaker 2: we as we were following, we saw it's a tough

280
00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:03,240
Speaker 2: thing to do to sit there, not only through the

281
00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:05,920
Speaker 2: whole trial, but then in those deliberation rooms with twelve

282
00:14:06,040 --> 00:14:08,839
Speaker 2: or eleven other people who have come from very different

283
00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:11,000
Speaker 2: walks of life, who have very different opinions, who have

284
00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:13,360
Speaker 2: very different lenses that they see things through, and to

285
00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,120
Speaker 2: have to send notes and say we can't get there,

286
00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:18,800
Speaker 2: We're at a stalemate. People aren't budging. And then to

287
00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:21,880
Speaker 2: see the process work the way it's supposed to, which

288
00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:26,320
Speaker 2: was pretty impressive, and it seems as though the decisions

289
00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:30,400
Speaker 2: they made everyone agreed to it ultimately, which is remarkable.

290
00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:33,000
Speaker 2: And yeah, to then have it be questioned is not

291
00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:34,560
Speaker 2: the way it should go.

292
00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:38,400
Speaker 1: I don't feel necessarily outrage on either side. There are

293
00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:40,840
Speaker 1: people who are disappointed in some way, form or fashion,

294
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:44,000
Speaker 1: but there's I don't feel there's an overwhelming sense in

295
00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:48,760
Speaker 1: the country that and a severe injustice was done in

296
00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:51,840
Speaker 1: the verdict. Maybe an injustice in the charges that were brought,

297
00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:54,760
Speaker 1: maybe an injustice in how the case was brought, a

298
00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:57,480
Speaker 1: few other things, and how the victims were let down

299
00:14:57,520 --> 00:14:59,880
Speaker 1: in several ways, But the fact that the jury came

300
00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:02,560
Speaker 1: to this decision. Do you feel or see somewhere in

301
00:15:02,600 --> 00:15:03,880
Speaker 1: some circles I'm not seeing.

302
00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:04,160
Speaker 2: No.

303
00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:06,280
Speaker 1: I think there's an outrage over this.

304
00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:08,560
Speaker 2: Verdict, I think disappointment is a good way to put it.

305
00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:11,200
Speaker 2: And there certainly we did hear from people who testified

306
00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:16,440
Speaker 2: and people who put their names through the ringer to

307
00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:19,280
Speaker 2: try and explain what happened to them at the hands

308
00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:21,680
Speaker 2: of Ditty. So they say they were upset. I think

309
00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:24,000
Speaker 2: they claim that they're afraid. They claim that they believe

310
00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:27,760
Speaker 2: Ditty is somebody who is revenge oriented or revenge seeking,

311
00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:29,480
Speaker 2: and so they were concerned. And I know that there

312
00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:32,480
Speaker 2: was that chatter a bit, But in terms of being

313
00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:35,120
Speaker 2: outraged at the verdict, no, And I think look, if

314
00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:37,120
Speaker 2: he had gotten off completely, if he had been not

315
00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:39,080
Speaker 2: guilty on all charges, I think you would have seen

316
00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:43,440
Speaker 2: raise a lot more outrage from those groups who feel

317
00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:46,000
Speaker 2: like their side wasn't taken seriously enough.

318
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:48,120
Speaker 1: No, if we were told he was found guilty of

319
00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:51,680
Speaker 1: racketeering and he's facing life in prison, I think there

320
00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:56,240
Speaker 1: might have been more outrage as well about that. So

321
00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:59,520
Speaker 1: I think that what we always say in our career

322
00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:04,000
Speaker 1: is do a story about politics, and Republicans and Democrats

323
00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:06,640
Speaker 1: are equally upset with you, then you probably got it

324
00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:07,120
Speaker 1: about right.

325
00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:07,520
Speaker 2: Yeah.

326
00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:09,760
Speaker 1: So in this case, it seems like there's some kind

327
00:16:09,760 --> 00:16:13,000
Speaker 1: of a balance to where maybe they got it right

328
00:16:13,080 --> 00:16:14,680
Speaker 1: from a public standpoint.

329
00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:16,760
Speaker 2: I kind of I agree with you on that. I

330
00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:18,520
Speaker 2: think when you look at it from that perspective, one

331
00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:23,040
Speaker 2: hundred percent. And I'm curious if we will hear and

332
00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:26,760
Speaker 2: if any juror will actually say I was on the

333
00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:30,120
Speaker 2: jury and here's what happened. I'm curious, maybe more time

334
00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:33,120
Speaker 2: needs to pass. It's I'm sure this is something they

335
00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:36,000
Speaker 2: had to take with them each night. They weren't supposed

336
00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:38,320
Speaker 2: to talk about it with friends or families, So I'm

337
00:16:38,360 --> 00:16:41,640
Speaker 2: sure there's so much just digest and then maybe maybe

338
00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:43,680
Speaker 2: someone would talk. But I mean, I just in the

339
00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:46,320
Speaker 2: world we live in in social media, people are so

340
00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:48,680
Speaker 2: cruel and people are like to put your name out there,

341
00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:52,280
Speaker 2: to put your face out there with a decision like

342
00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:54,360
Speaker 2: that that people do have strong opinions on. I think

343
00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:57,040
Speaker 2: it is a little scary and unnecessary. Do you really

344
00:16:57,120 --> 00:17:00,480
Speaker 2: want to bring all the negativity that you know is coming?

345
00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:05,840
Speaker 2: You know it is, That's true, and people there's a

346
00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:08,080
Speaker 2: way for journalists to pay for certain interviews, you get

347
00:17:08,080 --> 00:17:10,320
Speaker 2: paid for photos, you get paid for whatever.

348
00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:12,400
Speaker 1: Certain outlets don't care, and certain out.

349
00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,760
Speaker 2: Let's pay regardless, get a free trip to New York,

350
00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:16,600
Speaker 2: you get an all much but yeah, a.

351
00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:19,000
Speaker 1: Book deal to talk about the deliberations and the trial,

352
00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:20,320
Speaker 1: the new trial of the century.

353
00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:25,720
Speaker 2: Okay, yes, that is capitalism and uh well the way

354
00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:27,879
Speaker 2: it works here in America. But anyway, it was interesting

355
00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:29,600
Speaker 2: to get some of the details we did get from

356
00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:34,280
Speaker 2: George and of course from this uh unidentifiable juror. But

357
00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:38,479
Speaker 2: certainly just you know, I think that they did an

358
00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:41,919
Speaker 2: incredible civic duty and we appreciate their time. And I

359
00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:45,600
Speaker 2: know it's our justice system depends on people like George

360
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:47,879
Speaker 2: and the unnamed duror. So anyway, thank you all for

361
00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:49,399
Speaker 2: listening to us. I hope you got a little insight

362
00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:53,280
Speaker 2: from what we're hearing from what happened inside that courtroom.

363
00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:56,160
Speaker 2: But hope you have an even better fourth of July

364
00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,840
Speaker 2: and a great weekend. Everybody.

365
00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:04,560
Speaker 1: The pitcher, the kitchen, p