1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,040 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hello, and welcome 3 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:15,280 Speaker 1: to the podcast. I'm Holly Fry and I'm Tracy V. 4 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:18,440 Speaker 1: Wilson and Tracy. Before we get to the show today, 5 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: we have to talk. We have a little business to 6 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:24,320 Speaker 1: talk about an upcoming live show, very exciting. We UH 7 00:00:24,360 --> 00:00:27,200 Speaker 1: were lucky enough to be invited to participate in Great 8 00:00:27,240 --> 00:00:31,159 Speaker 1: Conversations at Gettysburg, which is a series of programs that 9 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:33,440 Speaker 1: they have there that draw on the themes of Gettysburg. 10 00:00:33,520 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 1: And that's going to take place on June at the 11 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:41,239 Speaker 1: rough House History Center and it's free. You can just 12 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:43,839 Speaker 1: go see us chat. There is cool programming going on 13 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 1: all day long. That day, we are going to have 14 00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:49,800 Speaker 1: our live podcast, which is called Fearless, Feisty and Unflagging 15 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:52,919 Speaker 1: the Women of Gettysburg at four pm. But if you're 16 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: up for a day of interesting history, there is a 17 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 1: lot of other stuff to check out that day, so 18 00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:01,040 Speaker 1: come and see us. And if you want more detail 19 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: about that, you can come to our website and up 20 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 1: at the top of the page at misson History dot 21 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 1: com is the link that says live shows. Or you 22 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 1: can just go to missed in history dot com slash 23 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:14,200 Speaker 1: shows and it's there too. Yeah, super handy. Uh So, 24 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 1: now to the topic at hand, and I feel like 25 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:18,679 Speaker 1: I need to say that there was accidental good timing. 26 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:21,160 Speaker 1: I am not as good at planning head and looking 27 00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:23,800 Speaker 1: at calendars and basing programming on it as Tracy is. 28 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:25,959 Speaker 1: I fly a little bit more by the seat of 29 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:29,880 Speaker 1: my pants, but entirely by accident. I started researching this 30 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 1: topic because I knew, because of poor time management and 31 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: me getting a little caught up with some other non 32 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:38,480 Speaker 1: history class work over the past week, that I was 33 00:01:38,520 --> 00:01:39,880 Speaker 1: going to have to do some work over the weekend. 34 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:41,720 Speaker 1: And I thought was, how to do some work on 35 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:44,400 Speaker 1: the weekend, I'm gonna pick a topic I'm really into. 36 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:48,800 Speaker 1: So we're talking about donuts today. So but then I 37 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 1: realized about halfway through it that when we publish, it 38 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 1: is actually going to fall on National Donut Day, which 39 00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:59,560 Speaker 1: is June five. Complete accidental good fortune unless I just 40 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 1: have been heternalized the concept of National Donut Day to 41 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:06,480 Speaker 1: such a degree that my subconscious was like, you should 42 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 1: do the episode now, right, So we're actually gonna talk 43 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:12,600 Speaker 1: a little bit about how National Donut Day started A 44 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:15,960 Speaker 1: little later on that was actually UM started in a 45 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:19,120 Speaker 1: more official capacity than maybe some of the other food 46 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:22,919 Speaker 1: based national days you may hear about UM. But first 47 00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the early predecessors of donuts 48 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 1: in history and kind of how donuts evolved over time. 49 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 1: And then the last segment of the show, which is 50 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 1: the longest for this one, is a nutty little battle 51 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 1: about donut nomenclature that played out over the course of 52 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:40,720 Speaker 1: several decades in the pages of the New York Times, 53 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: primarily in their Letters to the Editors section. So if 54 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: you fancy a donut now, it's a good time to 55 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: get one, because you're in for a lot of fried 56 00:02:48,880 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 1: dough talk and you might be craving one by the end. Otherwise. Yeah, 57 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: I I will say it does not surprise me at 58 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:57,360 Speaker 1: all that there was a debate about donut nomenclature that 59 00:02:57,400 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: went on for decades, because I feel like the Internet 60 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:02,520 Speaker 1: has been talking about whether a hot dog is a 61 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:07,320 Speaker 1: sandwich for decades exactly the same idea. So we've talked 62 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:09,960 Speaker 1: about food histories on the podcast enough that it is 63 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 1: not new knowledge for our regular listeners when we say 64 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: that as far back as the Neolithic period, people were 65 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:19,800 Speaker 1: making does and cooking them on hot stones. We have 66 00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:22,480 Speaker 1: discoveries along those lines that show up in our unearthed 67 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 1: episodes pretty regularly. And that concept of a simple paste 68 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:29,960 Speaker 1: made of a ground grain flower mixed with a liquid 69 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 1: and then fried up developed in some form or another 70 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: in cultures all around the globe in human kinds early years. 71 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:41,760 Speaker 1: Instructions for cooking cake in boiling fat can be found 72 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: in Egyptian tombs going back to the fifteenth century b c. E. 73 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:49,800 Speaker 1: Fried dough coated with honey was given to winners in 74 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:53,840 Speaker 1: the early Olympic Games as prizes. Marcus Porcius Cato the 75 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 1: Elder included recipes for a number of dough based confections 76 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 1: in his writing on Agriculture, which he wrote in the 77 00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: second century BC, and that writing includes one recipe that 78 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: specifies frying balls of cheesy dough in hot oil, and 79 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: another that describes spiraling a thinned dough in oil to 80 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 1: create these coiled pastries that would then be coated with honey. 81 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:19,920 Speaker 1: The Chinese poem Summoning the Soul, written in the third 82 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:23,599 Speaker 1: century BC, also speaks of fried honey cakes, and the 83 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 1: Arabic world has long loved and written down recipes for 84 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:29,159 Speaker 1: sweets that start with a fried dough base as well. 85 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 1: There are fritters and similar delights mentioned all through the 86 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:36,040 Speaker 1: one thousand and one Night's Folk Tales. Evidence of a 87 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:41,000 Speaker 1: fifteen hundred BC fossilized acorn cake was discovered in Oklahoma 88 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:43,919 Speaker 1: in the nineteen twenties, and what was unique about that 89 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: discovery was that it was a round cake with a 90 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:49,840 Speaker 1: hole in the center, and the archaeologist who made that 91 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 1: find et No, believed that the whole was likely there 92 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:55,880 Speaker 1: so that the cakes could be stored in suspension as 93 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:58,599 Speaker 1: a way to keep animals from eating them. But as 94 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,560 Speaker 1: that discovery became public news and media picked it up, 95 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:06,280 Speaker 1: the popular opinion became that Renault had clearly discovered an 96 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:09,799 Speaker 1: early donut. So it's a good time to talk about 97 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:12,280 Speaker 1: what a donut is by definition, and that is a 98 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 1: harder question than you may imagine. The most common response 99 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,479 Speaker 1: is usually something along the lines of a deep fried 100 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 1: dough ball, and that is one way to classify it. 101 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 1: But there have also been waffle iron style doughnut makers 102 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:29,360 Speaker 1: and doughnut pans so that home donutmakers can pop them 103 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:32,279 Speaker 1: in the oven. Those are really more like cakes that 104 00:05:32,320 --> 00:05:35,360 Speaker 1: are shaped like doughnuts than what most folks would consider 105 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:38,200 Speaker 1: a true donut. But then there are also cake doughnuts, 106 00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:41,279 Speaker 1: which use making powder rather than yeast as their leavening agent. 107 00:05:41,839 --> 00:05:44,839 Speaker 1: And while the donut in its circular shape with a 108 00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 1: hole in the middle is a very US centric treat, 109 00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 1: there have been as we said, fried dowed suites all 110 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:55,160 Speaker 1: over the world four centuries so. For example, in India, 111 00:05:55,279 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 1: jube are a common treat. They're made by swirling battery 112 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:01,360 Speaker 1: in hot oil and then and they are soaked in 113 00:06:01,480 --> 00:06:04,680 Speaker 1: warm syrup for several minutes. And desserts very similar to 114 00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:07,360 Speaker 1: julet can be found throughout the Middle East and in 115 00:06:07,400 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 1: some parts of Africa as well, and their lineage goes 116 00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:13,440 Speaker 1: all the way back to the Middle Ages. Fritters of 117 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:15,720 Speaker 1: various kinds have been part of the sweets of Europe 118 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,040 Speaker 1: going back hundreds of years as well. Many of these 119 00:06:18,080 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 1: are based on what's called a shoe paste, and that's 120 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 1: a simple dough made with flower water, sometimes egg and 121 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:27,240 Speaker 1: possibly butter. There's not a leavening agent involved. That's how 122 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:30,320 Speaker 1: beign Yet's started out in France, but as they migrated 123 00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 1: to the southern United States, yeast entered the recipe and 124 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:35,920 Speaker 1: they took on the more pillowy characteristics that they're known 125 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:38,440 Speaker 1: for today. Yeah, it would have been less puffy and 126 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 1: airy the way they are now in its original form. 127 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 1: Another favorite fried dough, especially for Disney Park fans, is 128 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,000 Speaker 1: the turo. So uros are normally made also with a 129 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:52,600 Speaker 1: shoe paste dough, and while they're closely associated with Latin 130 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: American culture, it's more likely that their roots are actually 131 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 1: in China. So the Chinese version was savory, was assalted 132 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 1: fried dough that Portuguese merchants discovered while they were traveling 133 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:06,560 Speaker 1: in Asia, and then when those merchants got home, they 134 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:09,160 Speaker 1: tried to replicate the Chinese food, but they opted to 135 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:12,679 Speaker 1: sweeten it up. And then the turo, named after Tura sheep, 136 00:07:13,120 --> 00:07:16,240 Speaker 1: started to look more like what we know it today. Uh. 137 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:18,160 Speaker 1: And then that was picked up by the shepherds of 138 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: Spain because that was a pretty easy food that they 139 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 1: could make while they were out in the pastures for 140 00:07:22,920 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 1: long periods of time and with minimal ingredients that were 141 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 1: easy to carry with them. So from Spain, the curo 142 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:32,040 Speaker 1: spread to South America, where the stuffed versions became standard 143 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 1: in both savory and sweet iterations. I will go on 144 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:37,560 Speaker 1: record as saying I love a savory turro like there's 145 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 1: no tomorrow. Here in the US, donuts are abundance, and 146 00:07:41,200 --> 00:07:43,880 Speaker 1: there is certainly a tradition of fried dough in Native 147 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:47,680 Speaker 1: American cultures. But the pastry that we normally call a 148 00:07:47,800 --> 00:07:51,240 Speaker 1: doughnut and the whole local donut shop since has its 149 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: roots in the Netherlands. When Dutch colonists made their way 150 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 1: to the New World, especially New Amsterdam, the capital of 151 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:01,680 Speaker 1: the New Nettling Netherlands colony at the time, they brought 152 00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:05,239 Speaker 1: with them a deep fried suite known as ali kix. 153 00:08:05,720 --> 00:08:09,080 Speaker 1: This translates to oily cakes because of the way they 154 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:13,520 Speaker 1: were prepared. The US mythology around donuts grew from there. 155 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 1: So Elizabeth Gregory is kind of a prominent figure in 156 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:20,240 Speaker 1: the story of donuts in the US, particularly in New England. 157 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:23,760 Speaker 1: So her son Hanson Gregory was a ship captain, and 158 00:08:23,760 --> 00:08:26,760 Speaker 1: Elizabeth took advantage of the spices that he often carried, 159 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:30,560 Speaker 1: particularly cinnamon and nutmeg, and combined them with dough and 160 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 1: lemon rind to deep fry a delicious pastry that also 161 00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: allegedly kept scurvy at bay. And her story is also 162 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 1: one of the sources that people use as the advent 163 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 1: of the word doughnut, as she put nuts in the 164 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:46,800 Speaker 1: center of the pastries as well, uh usually walnuts or 165 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:50,560 Speaker 1: hazel nuts, according to lore, but Hansen always claimed that 166 00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:53,520 Speaker 1: he was the one who really revolutionized the donut by 167 00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: poking a hole in the center. Late in his life, 168 00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:58,559 Speaker 1: he told the press that he had just used a 169 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:01,439 Speaker 1: round tin to cut a hole, but even so, exactly 170 00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 1: why he did as a matter of greater debate. He 171 00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 1: might have done it to stretch the ingredients a little 172 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 1: bit further because his mother was making these treats for 173 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: the crew as well, that way they could all have 174 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:13,960 Speaker 1: them on voyages. Or he may have done it so 175 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:15,840 Speaker 1: he could hang his pastry on one of the spokes 176 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:18,200 Speaker 1: of the ship's wheel to keep it handy while he 177 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:21,839 Speaker 1: was working. That is the story I heard in my childhood, 178 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:23,839 Speaker 1: and I was always like, but that doesn't make sense, 179 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:28,240 Speaker 1: because it's only gonna, yeah, only gonna stick there until 180 00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:29,720 Speaker 1: you turn the wheel, and then if you take a 181 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:32,320 Speaker 1: bite out of it, it's not going to stay there anymore. Yeah. 182 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 1: I guess if you're on very steady seas and you 183 00:09:34,679 --> 00:09:39,040 Speaker 1: want to maybe stack some for like your you're a 184 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 1: long time standing at the wheel, maybe, but yeah, those 185 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:45,000 Speaker 1: you would have to take one off stuff it in 186 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:47,680 Speaker 1: your mouth otherwise than you're still standing there holding a 187 00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:52,080 Speaker 1: sticky pastry. Um. Donuts became a commonly baked item in 188 00:09:52,280 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 1: US kitchens in the second half of the nineteenth century, 189 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 1: but the initial surge in the donuts popularity in the 190 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 1: US is actually pretty closely to World War One. So 191 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:05,200 Speaker 1: during the war, the Salvation Army had women volunteers baking 192 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:08,680 Speaker 1: donuts in huge quantities to deliver to US soldiers station 193 00:10:08,760 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 1: in France, even delivering them directly two men on the 194 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:15,320 Speaker 1: front lines. So these young women that were carrying donuts 195 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 1: out two soldiers were nicknamed dough girls or doe lasses, 196 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:22,199 Speaker 1: and the combination of young women and baked goods really 197 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:25,200 Speaker 1: did help morale and it left a lasting impression on 198 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 1: the soldiers. So when the war ended, the men who 199 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:31,400 Speaker 1: came back sought donuts in their own neighborhood. Coming up, 200 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:33,440 Speaker 1: we will talk about how donuts went from this whole 201 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:36,080 Speaker 1: baked good to a whole industry, But before we do that, 202 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:37,920 Speaker 1: we will take a quick break and here from one 203 00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 1: of the sponsors that keeps us going. As demand for bakery, 204 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:52,719 Speaker 1: made donuts, grew one enterprising man at off, Levett changed everything. 205 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 1: And Levitt's story doesn't exactly start out a massive success. 206 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 1: He was a Russian born immigrant who moved with his 207 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: parents to the U s and tend three at the 208 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:03,800 Speaker 1: age of eight, and he didn't get much formal schooling 209 00:11:03,880 --> 00:11:06,200 Speaker 1: because his family was poor and he had to start 210 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:08,560 Speaker 1: working when he was tended to help keep things afloat. 211 00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:11,560 Speaker 1: He taught himself as much as he could by reading 212 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 1: books on his own, and as a young man he 213 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 1: was pretty ambitious. He was really hard working. He opened 214 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:19,200 Speaker 1: up a series of businesses and worked in retail for 215 00:11:19,240 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 1: a long time, but none of those efforts were really successful. 216 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:25,120 Speaker 1: When he was thirty seven, Lovett moved from Milwaukee to 217 00:11:25,160 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 1: New York and started a bakery there. He started making 218 00:11:27,840 --> 00:11:31,280 Speaker 1: donuts to accommodate this post war rise in their popularity, 219 00:11:31,320 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 1: but he got some complaints from the adjacent businesses about 220 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:37,960 Speaker 1: the fumes from the deep briar. He brainstormed a machine 221 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:40,480 Speaker 1: that could do the job without making so many fumes, 222 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:43,400 Speaker 1: and eventually met an engineer on the train, got to 223 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:46,880 Speaker 1: talking and explained the idea to him. This machine was 224 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 1: comprehensive in its design because it mixed the dough, formed 225 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 1: it into ringlets drop them into oil, flipped them and 226 00:11:52,679 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 1: then pulled them out of the oil and onto a 227 00:11:54,679 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 1: conveyor belt. Finally they landed in a basket to be served. Yeah. 228 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:02,520 Speaker 1: It's also to note that there's no point where the 229 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:05,240 Speaker 1: doughnut gets the whole punched in it. It's actually formed 230 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 1: as a ring. That's something people maybe don't always know. Uh. 231 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:12,800 Speaker 1: It took a dozen tries at making this machine before 232 00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:16,679 Speaker 1: it worked properly, but once it did in it was 233 00:12:16,720 --> 00:12:20,040 Speaker 1: an instant hit. Levitt did not hide his donut maker 234 00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: in the back. He displayed it in the window and 235 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:25,240 Speaker 1: it drew onlookers who also came in to buy donuts 236 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 1: and at off Lovett finally found success. He became known 237 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,720 Speaker 1: as the Donut King, and his bakery, the Mayflower Coffee Shop, 238 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:36,080 Speaker 1: was replicated throughout the country and under his company, the 239 00:12:36,160 --> 00:12:39,600 Speaker 1: Donut Corporation of America, his doughnut machines, as well as 240 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 1: donut mixes to use in them, were being shipped all 241 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:45,439 Speaker 1: over the world. Donut machines were on display at the 242 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:49,439 Speaker 1: Chicago World's Fair and they were lauded as an emblem 243 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,200 Speaker 1: of the century. They were inexpensive enough that most people 244 00:12:52,240 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 1: could afford one, and they were made via automation, so 245 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:58,840 Speaker 1: they seemed really futuristic. Yeah, this is you know, depression times, 246 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:00,560 Speaker 1: so it was pretty exciting that you could get a 247 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 1: really yummy treat for a few cents that made you 248 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: feel like you were part of the country's progress into 249 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: future technologies. And around this same time, a man named 250 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,640 Speaker 1: Joe Lebou, who was a French chef from New Orleans, 251 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 1: sold his donut recipe, which was just handwritten out on 252 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:19,160 Speaker 1: a piece of paper and the name Crispy Kreme that 253 00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 1: he used for it, to a man named Ishmael Armstrong 254 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 1: in Paduca, Kentucky, and Armstrong made donuts up based on 255 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:28,240 Speaker 1: this recipe in batches and he had his nephew sell 256 00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 1: those donuts door to door. But after mediocre sales in Paduca, 257 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:35,200 Speaker 1: Armstrong moved to Nashville to open a donut shop there, 258 00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 1: but soon he sold that business to his brother and 259 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 1: he went back to Kentucky. In seven his nephew, Vernon 260 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: Rudolph made donuts with Lebo's recipe and sold them in 261 00:13:45,679 --> 00:13:49,080 Speaker 1: Winston Salem, North Carolina with friends in a grassroots effort 262 00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 1: to try to expand with the company business. Vernon and 263 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,000 Speaker 1: his friends have been traveling for a bit trying to 264 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: find the right spot, and they were so broke that 265 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:58,240 Speaker 1: when they started up in North Carolina, they had to 266 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:01,959 Speaker 1: borrow the ingredients for their first batches of donuts. They 267 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:05,480 Speaker 1: sold mostly to grocers, but the scent of baked, freshly 268 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:08,959 Speaker 1: glazed donuts lured people to the bakery space that they rented, 269 00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:13,400 Speaker 1: so he started selling directly to the customers. Within a decade, 270 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,559 Speaker 1: he had expanded to have donut shops in seven states 271 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 1: and still totally attract people by the fact that it 272 00:14:21,400 --> 00:14:24,040 Speaker 1: there is a Hot Donuts Now sign informing you that 273 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 1: there are hot donuts now. Yes, even the Dalai Lama 274 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 1: Eats Crispy Creez. The closest ones to me are in 275 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 1: New York City at I think Union Station. But they're 276 00:14:35,920 --> 00:14:38,600 Speaker 1: not like, there's not a donut friar. They're they're shipped 277 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 1: in from somewhere, which is not really the same. Um. 278 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,560 Speaker 1: So when we were out on the West Coast for 279 00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 1: our tour last year, I was taking a car from 280 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 1: the hotel that I had stayed into the ferry terminal 281 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:51,680 Speaker 1: and we passed a crispy cream with the hot Donuts 282 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 1: now sign on, and I was almost like stop right here. 283 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:56,680 Speaker 1: Then I was afraid I would miss my ferry. And 284 00:14:56,720 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 1: then I missed my ferry anyway, and I knew I 285 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:00,880 Speaker 1: had made it and you had of donuts. Yep, I 286 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 1: had no donut. It's no good. In eight National Donut 287 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 1: Day was born, and that was a fundraising initiative that 288 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 1: was launched by the Salvation Army to harken back to 289 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 1: the World War One efforts of the women volunteers who 290 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:16,160 Speaker 1: brought donuts to soldiers and also to remember their work, 291 00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 1: and the tradition of delivering donuts to men in combat 292 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:22,960 Speaker 1: continued in World War Two. Both the Salvation Army and 293 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:27,480 Speaker 1: the Red Cross ran wartime donut morale programs. In ninety four, 294 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,360 Speaker 1: Life Magazine ran a story on the donut morale effort 295 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:33,640 Speaker 1: with the tagline donuts will Win the War. While it 296 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,920 Speaker 1: undoubtedly helped some soldiers maintain a connection to home during 297 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:40,280 Speaker 1: tough times, it also was excellent for the donuts image 298 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 1: around the world and back home, as this pastry came 299 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:46,720 Speaker 1: to be associated with the war effort, volunteerism, and cheer. 300 00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: They also talked about them on The Great British Bakeoff. 301 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:54,080 Speaker 1: These were the donut dollies. Yes, after they were on 302 00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 1: that show, people ask us to do a podcast about them. 303 00:15:56,840 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 1: Krispy Kreme's Vernon Rudolph shipped out to fight in the war. 304 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:02,280 Speaker 1: When he came home, he went right back to making donuts. 305 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:04,760 Speaker 1: He developed a new donut machine that came to be 306 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: known as the ring King, and he also made a 307 00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:10,480 Speaker 1: ring King Junior that could be used in smaller retail spaces. 308 00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 1: The ring King Junior could turn out about sixty dozen 309 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: donuts an hour, and modern donut machines can make eight 310 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 1: hundred dozen donuts an hour. The Smithsonian has a ring 311 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:26,000 Speaker 1: King Junior, and the National Museum of American History. Yeah, 312 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 1: I think it is not on display. It's part of 313 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 1: the archives that are not out for visitors. But it's there, 314 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 1: and there's a page about it on their website, which 315 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:35,920 Speaker 1: is going to be in our show notes. And as 316 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:39,280 Speaker 1: Rudolph was perfecting his machine to make all those dozens 317 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 1: of donuts, another major player in the donut game opened 318 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 1: its first shop. Bill Rosenberg. Duncan Donuts debuted in Quincy, Massachusetts, 319 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 1: in nineteen fifty and five years later, it started franchising 320 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:54,320 Speaker 1: and grew into the behemoth it is today. Duncan has 321 00:16:54,360 --> 00:16:57,440 Speaker 1: stores in forty six countries worldwide. Uh and there are 322 00:16:57,440 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 1: more than twelve thousand different locations. Yeah, well, I have 323 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:02,240 Speaker 1: to go to New York City to get a shipped 324 00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 1: in Crispykreme donut. If I want a donut from Duncan, 325 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:11,679 Speaker 1: I'm always like four feet from one. I the first 326 00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:15,320 Speaker 1: time that my husband spent any substantial time in Manhattan, 327 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:18,360 Speaker 1: he was like, are people really afraid that they might 328 00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: have to walk a block without a donut? There really 329 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 1: isn't Duncan on almost every other block, which is pretty funny. So, 330 00:17:25,080 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: as we alluded to earlier, there's a whole other story 331 00:17:27,440 --> 00:17:29,679 Speaker 1: about donuts and drama in the United States, and we 332 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 1: will jump into that right after we pause for a 333 00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:41,520 Speaker 1: quick sponsor break. So while I was researching this episode, 334 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:43,879 Speaker 1: I started looking at old digitized stories from the New 335 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 1: York Times, which is one of my favorite things, and 336 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 1: I stumbled across this interesting pattern. Starting in nineteen thirteen, 337 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:52,959 Speaker 1: there were full on debates happening in the letter section 338 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,520 Speaker 1: about whether cruelers could be considered donuts and which pastry 339 00:17:56,560 --> 00:17:59,879 Speaker 1: was superior, and I honestly had no idea this was 340 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,040 Speaker 1: so hotly debated. As Tracy mentioned earlier, Yes, people will 341 00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:05,440 Speaker 1: argue about anything forever, but I just did not know 342 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: the level of fervor with the crullers versus donut situation 343 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:13,600 Speaker 1: had happened. Um. While I never managed to find the 344 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 1: original article which The Times published that kicked off a 345 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 1: lot of this debate, I did find one, dated December one. 346 00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:23,000 Speaker 1: It was a letter from William L. Henry. And that 347 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:25,359 Speaker 1: letter to the editor is brief, and it reads quote 348 00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 1: one way of stating the question is is a donut 349 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:30,960 Speaker 1: ever a crueler? In other words, I defy you to 350 00:18:31,040 --> 00:18:33,520 Speaker 1: find any agreement of authorities so that one may know 351 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:36,920 Speaker 1: whether these two terms define the shape or the materials 352 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 1: out of which both delicacies are made. Perhaps your correspondence 353 00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:43,560 Speaker 1: will rush to the defense of their own favorite nomenclature, 354 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: and some standard usage may be discovered. To put my 355 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:50,960 Speaker 1: question another way, does the whole itself determine the baptismal name? 356 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:54,680 Speaker 1: Two days later, a letter from reader Casey put forth 357 00:18:54,720 --> 00:18:58,000 Speaker 1: the following opinion quote an old New England housewife and 358 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:00,159 Speaker 1: the vintage of forty eight and a descendant of the 359 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:04,320 Speaker 1: mayflower feels able to speak authoritatively on the donut crullers question. 360 00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,920 Speaker 1: The donut is born of leisure and forethought, the child 361 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:10,920 Speaker 1: of silence and slow time, being raised with yeast set 362 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 1: in sponge overnight behind the kitchen stove, needed in the morning, 363 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:17,080 Speaker 1: and left to rise again before being fried. The crueler 364 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:20,320 Speaker 1: is a creature of impulse, quickly stirred together, raised with 365 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,199 Speaker 1: baking powder it or its equivalent, and fried upon the 366 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:26,960 Speaker 1: spur of the moment. The donut is a nobler nutriment 367 00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: and was the fair of the Pilgrims, But the swift 368 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:34,119 Speaker 1: and humble crueler had his place in this hurrying, progressive time. 369 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:37,639 Speaker 1: By the way, I did not find any evidence that 370 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 1: Pilgrims eight donuts. No, I don't. I don't want a dog, 371 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 1: Miss Casey with her knowledge, But I don't think the 372 00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:50,120 Speaker 1: Pilgrims said, don't. I. I am just thinking about how 373 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:53,199 Speaker 1: my mother made donuts, which was to buy a can 374 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:58,119 Speaker 1: like a tube of biscuits from the refrigerator, section, shape 375 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:01,119 Speaker 1: it into a donut shape, and deep fry it in 376 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,840 Speaker 1: the fried Daddy fryar that we had in the kitchen. 377 00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:07,280 Speaker 1: That sounds delicious. It was put powdered sugar on it. 378 00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 1: The powdered sugar on everything. I don't I don't know 379 00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:12,640 Speaker 1: why that would even be a question um. This letter 380 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: was quickly followed up by reader J. L. A. Fowler, 381 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:18,040 Speaker 1: who wrote, quote, crawler and doughnut are of the same 382 00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 1: family and have names to distinguish them. Only doughnut is 383 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 1: a common name, but the word crawler is a dignified, refined, 384 00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:28,440 Speaker 1: an appropriate name. A doughnut is a ball of dough, 385 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 1: while a crawler is the same dough rolled thin cut 386 00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:33,720 Speaker 1: in strips with a slit cut lengthwise in the center, 387 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 1: with one end turned through the slit, producing the familiar hole. 388 00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:40,879 Speaker 1: The debate seems to die down for a bit, and 389 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:43,720 Speaker 1: then there was a lengthy letter from nineteen thirty three 390 00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:47,680 Speaker 1: titled donut holes in the Crawler. Reader VH. Pen responded 391 00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:50,199 Speaker 1: to a suggestion that the size of the doughnut holes 392 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:53,960 Speaker 1: needs to be regulated. Pen's letter is full of punnury 393 00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:56,800 Speaker 1: and word play, and it doesn't seem especially serious, but 394 00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:59,680 Speaker 1: it's content outlines the fact that we should just ditch 395 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:03,280 Speaker 1: nuts altogether and switched to the far superior cralor, which 396 00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:07,240 Speaker 1: will solve the problem. Automatically. Pen writes, quote, the cruler 397 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,200 Speaker 1: form of the pastry is really superior to the donut 398 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 1: in many ways and taste, the difference is nil. The 399 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:18,159 Speaker 1: crawlers usually have a sugarcoating that few donuts possess. In design. However, 400 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 1: the donuts form and function are traceable only to the 401 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: prosaic life preserver, while the crawler, deriving its motif from 402 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:31,280 Speaker 1: the cute twisted columns of Spanish architecture, is authentic and artistic. Pensays, 403 00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:33,800 Speaker 1: the best thing about crawlers is how they how good 404 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 1: they are for dunking. I love the curlers are described 405 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 1: as authentic and artistic. I absolutely love that. So that 406 00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:45,880 Speaker 1: brings us to dunking, which we got to talk about 407 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 1: for a minute, because dunking ones donut in coffee or 408 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:52,439 Speaker 1: tea or cocoa or milk or whatever tickles your fancy began, 409 00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 1: according to legend, by accident. Popular actress May Murray accidentally 410 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 1: dropped her donut into her coffee at a New York restaurant, 411 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,240 Speaker 1: which restaurant is a matter of debate. Uh. And after 412 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:07,280 Speaker 1: fishing that pastry out, she took a bite and proclaimed 413 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:10,040 Speaker 1: it delightful. And as she was one of the most 414 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:13,680 Speaker 1: popular actresses of the nineteen twenties. This started a craze 415 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:17,680 Speaker 1: as everyone started dunking their donuts to emulate the starlet. So, 416 00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:21,280 Speaker 1: talking about ramping up the donut crueler debate of the 417 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:24,280 Speaker 1: earlier early twentieth century, we also need to talk about 418 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:28,679 Speaker 1: the National Dunking Association. This was an organization started in 419 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,159 Speaker 1: the nineteen thirties by none other than Adolf Levitt's Donut 420 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:34,439 Speaker 1: Corporation of America, and it was a cute way to 421 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,920 Speaker 1: promote donuts and give customers a fun club to belong to. 422 00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:41,720 Speaker 1: The group didn't seem to take itself especially seriously. It 423 00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:45,600 Speaker 1: always named a comedian as its president. Red Skelton, Jimmy Durranty, 424 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:48,520 Speaker 1: and Johnny Carson all served as head of the organization 425 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:51,639 Speaker 1: at various times. The back of the membership card for 426 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 1: the National Dunking Association read dunka donut and be merry, 427 00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:57,679 Speaker 1: and it included the text of what it called the 428 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:01,400 Speaker 1: Optimists Creed, which read as you ramble on through life, brother, 429 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:04,560 Speaker 1: whatever be your goal, keep your eye upon the donut 430 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:08,040 Speaker 1: and not upon the whole. There were also guidelines on 431 00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:11,359 Speaker 1: the card for dunking which read quote, the National Dunking 432 00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:16,639 Speaker 1: Association respectfully requests all members to observe the official dunking rules. 433 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 1: Splashing is taboo. Any member caught getting his fingers wet 434 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: will be subject to suspension. With that, we wish you 435 00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:25,440 Speaker 1: happy dunking, and when you dunk, be sure you dunk. 436 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:29,760 Speaker 1: Donuts identified with the official Seal of Tested Quality for delightfully, 437 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:33,080 Speaker 1: delicious and winningly wholesome donuts enjoyed by millions of people. 438 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:37,680 Speaker 1: But those guidelines were just an abbreviation of the official 439 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 1: Club Dunking Guide. So the longer form guide cautions amateurs 440 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 1: about not getting too cocky because watching a professional dunker 441 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 1: can make it look easy. Uh. And then it outlines 442 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:51,720 Speaker 1: an eight step guide to perfect dunking, which included, and 443 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 1: this is again abbreviated, one tuck and napkin under your 444 00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:58,479 Speaker 1: chin to break your donut in half. Three, pick up 445 00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:00,720 Speaker 1: the donut carefully and keep the fingers that are not 446 00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:03,560 Speaker 1: holding the donut up and out of the way. Four 447 00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 1: quote swish the donut rhythmically in the beverage with a 448 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: free and easy movement of the entire arm. Five keep 449 00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,960 Speaker 1: the donut immersed for exactly two point five seconds. Six, 450 00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:16,679 Speaker 1: remove the donut from the liquid and let any excess 451 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,439 Speaker 1: liquid drip back into your cup. Seven quote swerve the 452 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:23,080 Speaker 1: donut in a graceful curve towards your mouth and close 453 00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:26,840 Speaker 1: your teeth tenderly over the dunked portion. And eight repeat 454 00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:29,439 Speaker 1: the above process until all the donuts on the table 455 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 1: are simply fond memories. There are also some admonishments about 456 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 1: being careful not to splash around, never trying to duck 457 00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:39,720 Speaker 1: a whole donut, and never getting your fingers wet. That's 458 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: all pretty hardcore about not making a mess for an 459 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 1: activity that's alleged to have started when a starlet dropped 460 00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:47,960 Speaker 1: a donut into her cut by accident. But still it's 461 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:50,399 Speaker 1: written in this very cavalier, jaunty style that has a 462 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:53,920 Speaker 1: little edge of wit. As duncan continued to be popular, 463 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:59,440 Speaker 1: the debate over donut versus crueler revived periodically. In May, 464 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:03,000 Speaker 1: then You Times ran a story about Major Helen Pervians, 465 00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:05,000 Speaker 1: who was one of the women who had supplied donuts 466 00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:07,919 Speaker 1: to soldiers in France during the First World War, and 467 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,680 Speaker 1: the subheader on that article read major Perviance warns mere 468 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 1: crueler won't do but in the actual article. The only 469 00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,440 Speaker 1: distinction that she really makes is that donuts have holes 470 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:21,080 Speaker 1: and cruelers do not, and she made very clear in 471 00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:24,480 Speaker 1: her interview with the newspaper that the soldiers preferred donuts. 472 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 1: In n one, the AP ran an article about the 473 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:32,200 Speaker 1: National Dunking Association. They had written to the Federal Security Administrator, 474 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 1: Paul V. McNutt, who please step in and have the 475 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,359 Speaker 1: Food and Drag Administration make an authoritative ruling on the matter. 476 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,440 Speaker 1: McNutt was convinced that a dictionary definition could be used 477 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:46,040 Speaker 1: to settle the matter without the US government getting involved. 478 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 1: There was an interesting outcome to this request. The National 479 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:54,000 Speaker 1: Dunkers Association asked McNutt to become an honorary member, and 480 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:57,760 Speaker 1: he accepted, but that meant that there was still debate 481 00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:00,840 Speaker 1: because they had not gotten their government ling. So on 482 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:04,400 Speaker 1: October ninety one, The Times ran a letter written by 483 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: Burton Evans, vice president of the National Dunking Association, And 484 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,159 Speaker 1: as an aside, Nevian's name comes up a lot, and 485 00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:13,600 Speaker 1: he was actually a publicist that was hired to get 486 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:16,720 Speaker 1: donuts in the public eye, and he was clearly really 487 00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:19,119 Speaker 1: good at that job. In his letter to the editor, 488 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 1: Nevin's tries to present quote the dunker's side of the situation. 489 00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: He first states the association is a quote bona fide 490 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,640 Speaker 1: organization which is non commercial and non political. At that point, 491 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,440 Speaker 1: the group had more than a million members. He went 492 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:35,960 Speaker 1: on to say, quote our reason for seeking assistance from 493 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,480 Speaker 1: Administrator McNutt is that donuts are called crawlers, and many 494 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:43,520 Speaker 1: sections of the country, especially throughout Pennsylvania, by laws of 495 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,639 Speaker 1: our organization, call for the dunking of donuts and not 496 00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:50,959 Speaker 1: crawlers or any other outlaw cakes. And naturally, many of 497 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,919 Speaker 1: our members have complained that they have had difficulty in 498 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,680 Speaker 1: practicing their dunking properly. I will forever look at a 499 00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 1: crawler and call it an outlaw CAKEE going for uh. 500 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:03,800 Speaker 1: He goes on to say that the whole in the 501 00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:07,360 Speaker 1: donut is the key, and that quote crawlers, coffee cake, 502 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:11,160 Speaker 1: lady fingers, and other items are conducive to sloppy technique 503 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,080 Speaker 1: and do not enable one to get the real enjoyment 504 00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:17,680 Speaker 1: out of the art of dunking. Nevin's concludes by saying 505 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:19,600 Speaker 1: that the matter will be brought up at the annual 506 00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:21,800 Speaker 1: convention a few weeks later, and that they will then 507 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:25,560 Speaker 1: petition all dictionary publishers to help, and he ends with 508 00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,840 Speaker 1: the quote, if that fails, we shall probably seek government aid. 509 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:35,800 Speaker 1: In December, the Times ran yet another donut or crueler article. 510 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,919 Speaker 1: This one discussed the many letters they had received on 511 00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:42,320 Speaker 1: the matter, and also included a quote from Burton Evins, 512 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:46,280 Speaker 1: who was credited as the director of the National Dunking Association. Yeah, 513 00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:48,159 Speaker 1: he was actually the vice president. I'm not sure why 514 00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:50,600 Speaker 1: they listed him as director, but there you go. Uh. 515 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:53,920 Speaker 1: Nevin's gave The Times the following quote on the matter, quote, 516 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:56,080 Speaker 1: The question of the difference between the donut and the 517 00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:58,680 Speaker 1: crueler came up at our annual convention three years ago 518 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,400 Speaker 1: and was settled for all time, at least we thought so. 519 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:05,640 Speaker 1: They had in the end gone with shape. The crueler 520 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,480 Speaker 1: was an elongated, twisted piece of dough. The donut was 521 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:10,440 Speaker 1: a round cake with a hole in the middle, per 522 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: their definition. And that same article, Ted Robinson of the 523 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,800 Speaker 1: Cleveland Plane Dealer discussed that what he did and didn't 524 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,560 Speaker 1: believe constituted a donut based on all the evidence, and 525 00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:22,800 Speaker 1: then it said, quote, but usage is the law of 526 00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:26,360 Speaker 1: language and will finally win over rule and precedent and correctness. 527 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:30,639 Speaker 1: Crawlers and fried cakes are called donuts by the population, 528 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 1: so it is silly to hold out for purism. I 529 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:36,919 Speaker 1: am content to call them all donuts all that is, 530 00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:42,080 Speaker 1: except those monstrosities with jelly inside them. Later that month, 531 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 1: Kenneth Wiggins Porter wrote The Times on the matter, and 532 00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: first he mentioned that he had long been keeping up 533 00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 1: with this debate that played out in the paper over 534 00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:53,320 Speaker 1: what is and isn't a donut, And then Porter shared 535 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,680 Speaker 1: his unique experience of what he and his family often 536 00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,080 Speaker 1: made when he was growing up in Kansas, and how 537 00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,360 Speaker 1: he did not grow up with the same nomenclature for 538 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 1: the fried dough pastries so that the bakers of Manhattan 539 00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: seemed to. He was startled when he discovered that what 540 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:10,719 Speaker 1: they were calling colors were an item that his family 541 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:15,200 Speaker 1: had only ever called tangle bridges, and he closed with 542 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:17,760 Speaker 1: a question about whether anyone else had ever heard of 543 00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:20,239 Speaker 1: such an alternate name, or if maybe it was just 544 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:22,880 Speaker 1: his family. I never found any evidence that anyone wrote 545 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: back about tangle bridges. In any case, there does not 546 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:28,959 Speaker 1: seem to have been any official ruling on what is 547 00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 1: or isn't a donut. The National Dunkers Association disbanded at 548 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 1: some point, but it's a little unclear when that happened. 549 00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 1: And there are certainly some regional differences and what people 550 00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:42,040 Speaker 1: call various baked goods and various other things and various 551 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:47,440 Speaker 1: other words. And I'm like, everyone, just chill out. Yeah, 552 00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 1: that will go on and on and on forever. I 553 00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 1: will tell a slightly embarrassing story of how it took 554 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:57,200 Speaker 1: me probably twelve years of marriage before I figured out 555 00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,240 Speaker 1: what Brian meant when he said a chocolate donut was 556 00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:04,200 Speaker 1: like a regular doughnut with chocolate icing, and not a 557 00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 1: chocolate cake doughnuts. And it came to be this thing 558 00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:10,080 Speaker 1: where like our friends, we would walk into a donut 559 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:12,160 Speaker 1: shop and they would all get tense because they knew 560 00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 1: I would always get Brian the wrong donut. Mess it up. 561 00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,560 Speaker 1: It's fine, we've figured it out now. But for the record, 562 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:22,600 Speaker 1: in more modern discussion of the matter, crawlers, it is 563 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,880 Speaker 1: pointed out, can actually exist in two different forms. One 564 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:29,360 Speaker 1: is a hand twisted cake doughnut, but there are also 565 00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:32,040 Speaker 1: curlors made with shoe paste, like we mentioned earlier in 566 00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:35,120 Speaker 1: the episode, those are unleavened, and in the book Doughnut 567 00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:37,120 Speaker 1: a Global History, which was one of my sources for 568 00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 1: this author Heather de Lancey Hunwick is very clear that 569 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,240 Speaker 1: the shoe paste crawlors do not count as donuts, but 570 00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:48,840 Speaker 1: the twisted cake ones do. Donut or e h, do 571 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:52,320 Speaker 1: you have some listener mail? I do. Uh. This is 572 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:55,200 Speaker 1: from our listener Megan, or perhaps she pronounces it Megan. 573 00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:58,280 Speaker 1: Either way, I'm not sure, she writes. Dear Tracy and Hanley, 574 00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:00,000 Speaker 1: thank you so much for the wonderful show. You pretty 575 00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: My best friend introduced me to the concept of podcast 576 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 1: when I was complaining about how boring driving to all 577 00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:08,280 Speaker 1: my residency interviews in my fourth year of medical school. Was. 578 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:11,280 Speaker 1: Since then, nearly two years ago, you guys have kept 579 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:14,600 Speaker 1: me company during road trips, moves, chores, and my constant 580 00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:18,360 Speaker 1: knitting projects, even on people and subjects I've heard about before, 581 00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:21,400 Speaker 1: like dr Apgar. I always learned something new, of course 582 00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:23,800 Speaker 1: I I love to share these cool tidbits I learned 583 00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 1: from you, to the point where one of my co 584 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,600 Speaker 1: workers playfully bellowed at me, how do you know stuff 585 00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,360 Speaker 1: about everything? Of course I don't, but I do love 586 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 1: constantly learning. More so, keep up the good work. Um 587 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:37,760 Speaker 1: When I'm always sort of in awe by people who 588 00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:40,800 Speaker 1: gets through medical school and go on to have careers 589 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 1: in medicine. So kudos Megan, and thank you for the 590 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:48,680 Speaker 1: lovely postcard, which is a really beautiful piece of Japanese 591 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,320 Speaker 1: art and we appreciate it. Um. It is from the 592 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 1: Honolulu Museum of Art from the Edo period and it's 593 00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,360 Speaker 1: absolutely beautiful, So thank you, thank you for that. If 594 00:31:57,360 --> 00:31:58,640 Speaker 1: you would like to write to us, you can do 595 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:01,240 Speaker 1: so at History podcast at how stuff works dot com. 596 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:03,479 Speaker 1: You can also find us everywhere on social media as 597 00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:05,720 Speaker 1: Missed in History and Missed in History dot com is 598 00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:08,960 Speaker 1: also our website address, but you can find every single 599 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,920 Speaker 1: episode of the show that has ever existed. Uh, you 600 00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:14,360 Speaker 1: might want to subscribe to the show, that would be grand, 601 00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:16,640 Speaker 1: and you could do that on the I heart Radio app, 602 00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:20,040 Speaker 1: at Apple podcasts, or wherever else you listen to podcasts. 603 00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,800 Speaker 1: Stuffy Missed in History Class is a production of I 604 00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,960 Speaker 1: Heart Radio's How Stuff Works. For more podcasts for my 605 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 1: heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 606 00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:35,120 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.