WEBVTT - #449 Jason Flom with Frederick Willie Kearse 0:00:02.440 --> 0:00:06.120 On August sixth, nineteen ninety three, shots were fired in 0:00:06.160 --> 0:00:10.479 front of bodega in East New York, Brooklyn. One young 0:00:10.560 --> 0:00:14.240 man named Ray Frasier survived, while his friend, Devon Brown 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:20.400 did not. Eventually, two alleged witnesses gave police a suspect, 0:00:20.680 --> 0:00:25.720 someone nicknamed Guns. On August thirtieth, a car was pulled 0:00:25.720 --> 0:00:28.680 over and two guns were found inside, along with a 0:00:28.720 --> 0:00:33.199 man who had an outstanding arrest warrant. His name was 0:00:33.240 --> 0:00:38.720 Frederick Willie Curse and his nickname was Guns. Even though 0:00:38.760 --> 0:00:40.920 Frederick claimed to have been in Boston on the day 0:00:41.000 --> 0:00:43.680 and time of the crime, he was identified by two 0:00:43.720 --> 0:00:46.600 alleged witnesses and a gun from the car was said 0:00:46.600 --> 0:00:50.120 to have matched ballistics from the crime scene. But this 0:00:50.720 --> 0:00:59.560 is wrongful conviction. Wrongful conviction has always given voice to 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:03.320 people in prison, and now we're expanding that voice to you. 0:01:04.040 --> 0:01:07.280 Call us at eight three, three, two oh seven four 0:01:07.319 --> 0:01:09.679 six sixty six and tell us how these stories make 0:01:09.720 --> 0:01:12.160 you feel and what you've done to help the cause, 0:01:12.480 --> 0:01:14.959 even if it's something as simple as telling a friend 0:01:15.200 --> 0:01:18.840 or sharing on social media. We've really appreciated hearing from 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:21.080 our audience so much so that we've included one of 0:01:21.080 --> 0:01:23.479 the messages at the end of this episode, so stick 0:01:23.520 --> 0:01:25.919 around for that and if you have something to say, 0:01:26.240 --> 0:01:29.039 we definitely want to hear it, and you might just 0:01:29.120 --> 0:01:33.080 hear yourself in a future episode. Call us A three three, 0:01:33.280 --> 0:01:46.040 two oh seven, four six sixty six. Welcome back to 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:51.440 Wrongful Conviction. Today's case comes from an era when wrongful 0:01:51.480 --> 0:01:56.920 convictions were just an everyday occurrence in the borough of Brooklyn, 0:01:57.360 --> 0:02:02.160 East New York, specifically the Torrius seventy Precinct in New 0:02:02.240 --> 0:02:05.920 York City. And with us to tell it is the 0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:11.440 man himself, Frederick Willie Curse, who lived through this nightmare. Frederick, 0:02:11.800 --> 0:02:13.800 I appreciate you being here. I know you know a 0:02:13.800 --> 0:02:16.520 lot of guys who've been on the show already, and 0:02:16.840 --> 0:02:19.520 we need to continue to paint this picture of what 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:22.280 was going on in Brooklyn in the nineties. So thanks 0:02:22.320 --> 0:02:23.799 for being here and sharing your story. 0:02:23.960 --> 0:02:24.799 Thank you for having me. 0:02:25.120 --> 0:02:28.680 And with him is his civil rights attorney Mark Cannon 0:02:29.000 --> 0:02:32.080 of Bell, doc Levigne and Hoffman. Mark. I think it's 0:02:32.120 --> 0:02:33.920 your first time on the show, so welcome. 0:02:34.160 --> 0:02:34.520 Thank you. 0:02:34.919 --> 0:02:37.320 By the way, while we're on the subject of the 0:02:37.400 --> 0:02:40.320 seventy fifth Precinct, this is not hyperbole to say they 0:02:40.320 --> 0:02:42.840 were one of the most corrupt in history. In fact, 0:02:42.919 --> 0:02:45.640 there's even a movie about them called The Seven Five 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:49.760 that was released in twenty fourteen. So I encourage people 0:02:49.840 --> 0:02:52.320 to watch the movie to get some context on what 0:02:52.480 --> 0:02:56.880 was going on back then and why Frederick was doomed 0:02:56.960 --> 0:02:57.720 from the beginning. 0:02:57.960 --> 0:03:00.640 That's exactly right. And it was all about out closing 0:03:00.760 --> 0:03:03.160 cases back then. And you talked about the early nineties 0:03:03.200 --> 0:03:05.880 and the crack epidemic. But you know, Michael Race, who 0:03:05.960 --> 0:03:08.400 was a detective sergeant at the precinct around that time, 0:03:08.520 --> 0:03:11.440 admitted that over the seven hundred and fifty murder investigations 0:03:11.440 --> 0:03:14.720 that he supervised at the seventy fifth Precinct, only one 0:03:15.040 --> 0:03:15.919 was done correctly. 0:03:16.639 --> 0:03:19.919 Incredible. I mean, they were playing by their own set 0:03:19.960 --> 0:03:23.200 of rules, to say the least, and framing somebody was 0:03:23.280 --> 0:03:27.079 nothing to them. So, Frederick, before you got hit by 0:03:27.120 --> 0:03:31.799 this tornado of the seventy fifth Precinct, what was your 0:03:31.840 --> 0:03:33.720 life like? Did you grow up in Brooklyn? 0:03:33.880 --> 0:03:36.680 Yes, I was born and raised in East New York, Brooklyn. 0:03:36.960 --> 0:03:40.800 Several years later I moved to bethhor Stuyvesant, the Massy Houses, 0:03:40.920 --> 0:03:43.360 and my family lived in Eastern York. So I used 0:03:43.400 --> 0:03:45.480 to always go and chill out with them over the 0:03:45.520 --> 0:03:48.920 summer and spend time with them over there, and I 0:03:49.000 --> 0:03:51.560 really played a lot of basketball and just tried to 0:03:51.560 --> 0:03:53.760 find my way through school. You know, I really didn't 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:57.000 grab hold of the academic process when I was young 0:03:57.520 --> 0:04:00.720 for numerous reasons. I think one of the ones was 0:04:00.960 --> 0:04:04.160 how terrible the public schools were and weren't able to reach. 0:04:04.000 --> 0:04:04.839 Me where I was at. 0:04:05.120 --> 0:04:08.000 Unfortunately, later on in life, while I was incarcerated, I 0:04:08.040 --> 0:04:10.720 found out that, you know, the way that I was 0:04:10.760 --> 0:04:13.440 so competitive in basketball, that I was able to apply 0:04:13.560 --> 0:04:16.120 that with anything that I can do. So that later 0:04:16.200 --> 0:04:19.040 propelled me to go and earn my ged and go 0:04:19.120 --> 0:04:22.320 to Bard College and you know, graduate from there. 0:04:22.400 --> 0:04:24.920 So it's sad to think of what could have been 0:04:24.960 --> 0:04:27.680 had Frederick not come of age during the crack epidemic 0:04:27.720 --> 0:04:29.960 in a historically poor area of New York where he 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:33.400 was hustling in the streets, leading to a few related 0:04:33.480 --> 0:04:36.919 charges which he escaped by going on the lamb to Boston. 0:04:37.360 --> 0:04:40.160 Yes, I had a few drug chargers and a weapon charge. 0:04:40.520 --> 0:04:42.400 You know, this is where my level of thinking was. 0:04:42.440 --> 0:04:45.640 I was, you know, not understanding that the same energy 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:48.040 I put into the streets and thinking negative, I could 0:04:48.040 --> 0:04:49.160 have did something positive. 0:04:49.400 --> 0:04:51.760 So that's how I was up in Massachusetts. 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:55.640 And unfortunately, being caught up in crime can lead to 0:04:56.120 --> 0:04:58.719 being wrongfully convicted and accused of other things, you know, 0:04:58.720 --> 0:05:01.279 which is something I couldn't fathom because my mind didn't 0:05:01.440 --> 0:05:04.160 expand that far at the time, and I didn't understand 0:05:04.400 --> 0:05:07.800 the risks once you get into any type of criminal activity. 0:05:07.880 --> 0:05:10.799 So you know, that's how the Massachusettstate coming to play. 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:13.640 But it helped in the case because I had an alibi. 0:05:14.240 --> 0:05:17.080 Frederick was in Boston on August sixth, nineteen ninety three, 0:05:17.080 --> 0:05:19.839 when a drive by shooting occurred in East New York, Brooklyn. 0:05:20.360 --> 0:05:23.000 Nine one one calls reported a buick century that had 0:05:23.000 --> 0:05:25.479 been traveling north on Ashred Street and made a wide 0:05:25.560 --> 0:05:28.640 left turn onto Dumont Avenue, pulling up to a bodega 0:05:28.680 --> 0:05:31.640 on the northeast corner, and more than ten shots were fired, 0:05:31.680 --> 0:05:34.799 striking two young men. Ray Frasier was hitting the legs 0:05:34.800 --> 0:05:37.359 and survived, while Devon Brown was fatally shot in the 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:41.120 torso and the vehicle finished the left turn fleeing west 0:05:41.200 --> 0:05:45.400 on Dumont. EMTs responded and took the victims to Brookdale Hospital, 0:05:45.640 --> 0:05:47.080 where Devon was pronounced dead. 0:05:47.720 --> 0:05:51.240 So police showed up pretty quickly and they immediately started 0:05:51.279 --> 0:05:55.400 canvassing for witnesses. Unsurprisingly, even though this was during the 0:05:55.520 --> 0:05:59.160 daytime in a somewhat populated neighborhood, there were no witnesses. 0:05:59.200 --> 0:06:01.600 Nobody wanted to talk to the police, you know, because 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:07.000 that's generally not something people did. They send officers to 0:06:07.040 --> 0:06:11.320 the hospital. They talked to Ray. Ray says he couldn't 0:06:11.360 --> 0:06:14.320 see who shot at him, has no idea, doesn't know 0:06:14.320 --> 0:06:17.680 why they wanted to shoot him. And they talked to 0:06:18.240 --> 0:06:22.120 two women who we now know. One woman who is 0:06:22.160 --> 0:06:25.760 Devon's girlfriend at the time, Yolanda Pandler, also known as 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:29.640 Barbara Garth. She told the officers that she was at 0:06:29.680 --> 0:06:32.200 Devon's house, which was about a half blocked down from 0:06:32.200 --> 0:06:35.279 the corner of Asher in Dumont. She heard shots fired 0:06:35.400 --> 0:06:37.760 and you know, saw people running, and she saw the 0:06:37.800 --> 0:06:40.160 car turn the corner, but she didn't see anything. They 0:06:40.200 --> 0:06:42.839 talked to Ray's girlfriend, he's also at the hospital. She 0:06:43.279 --> 0:06:45.880 pretty much sees the same thing. The car turned a corner. 0:06:46.000 --> 0:06:48.159 It's a green car, and that's about the only information 0:06:48.240 --> 0:06:49.280 she's able to provide. 0:06:49.400 --> 0:06:52.640 Another witness, Greg Maloney, had a similar initial account since 0:06:52.640 --> 0:06:55.279 he was also in front of Devon's house five point 0:06:55.240 --> 0:06:58.040 fifty five Asherd Street, which was about a football fields 0:06:58.120 --> 0:07:01.279 length north of the corner. Either of these witnesses could 0:07:01.279 --> 0:07:03.880 have made a reliable ID from that distance, leaving the 0:07:03.880 --> 0:07:07.440 police with little to go on. Meanwhile, Devon's family and 0:07:07.520 --> 0:07:10.040 friends had their own ideas about who the shooter was. 0:07:10.760 --> 0:07:13.160 One of the names that kept coming up was this 0:07:13.240 --> 0:07:18.240 person known as Guns because Guns and Devon's supposedly they 0:07:18.240 --> 0:07:20.960 had known each other and been friendly at one point, 0:07:21.000 --> 0:07:24.840 but the relationships supposedly went sour, and that's what people suspected. 0:07:25.120 --> 0:07:28.000 So the police pick up the rumor that people think 0:07:28.040 --> 0:07:31.680 Guns did it, and Greg Maloney, he actually was probably 0:07:31.680 --> 0:07:35.200 pointed out to the police by members of Devon's family 0:07:35.280 --> 0:07:38.000 because people knew he was kind of a pushover. The 0:07:38.040 --> 0:07:39.600 police go to him, they ask him, do you know 0:07:39.640 --> 0:07:41.760 who Guns is? He's like, yeah, I know who Guns is. 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:43.600 Did you see who did shooting? 0:07:43.760 --> 0:07:43.840 No? 0:07:44.120 --> 0:07:46.560 In the coughs tell them, well, if you saw the shooter, 0:07:46.760 --> 0:07:48.920 you saw Guns, because at that point they were going 0:07:48.960 --> 0:07:51.440 to take the position that Guns was the person who 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:53.640 did it. Although even though they didn't have a witness, 0:07:54.040 --> 0:07:56.720 and they give him a story about why Guns is 0:07:56.720 --> 0:07:59.840 a bad person, and they think he's involved in other 0:08:00.280 --> 0:08:03.040 misconduct that's going on in the neighborhood, and you know, 0:08:03.200 --> 0:08:04.880 they want to make an example of him. They wanted 0:08:04.880 --> 0:08:06.680 to get him up the street. They didn't have to 0:08:06.720 --> 0:08:10.480 hold anything specific over his head. They basically threatened that 0:08:10.520 --> 0:08:13.200 they would arrest him and he would be deported, trying 0:08:13.240 --> 0:08:16.760 to pressure Greg into helping him. Greg eventually gives a 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:19.800 statement basically describes what he saw, but he places Guns 0:08:19.840 --> 0:08:21.600 as the shooter, even though he didn't actually see that. 0:08:22.080 --> 0:08:25.640 Unfortunately, this important context around Greg Maloney, as well as 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:28.240 the initial police reports from the interviews at the hospital 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:32.040 with Barbara Garth, were not discovered until the reinvestigation of 0:08:32.080 --> 0:08:36.000 this case and Maloney's eventual recantation. But back in nineteen 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:39.480 ninety three, Greg Maloney and Barbara Garth were convinced to 0:08:39.520 --> 0:08:43.160 give statements identifying the shooter as a guy nicknamed Guns, 0:08:43.520 --> 0:08:46.840 which coincidentally was very similar to Frederick's nickname. 0:08:47.640 --> 0:08:49.880 My name is Guns U n ce. 0:08:50.240 --> 0:08:53.120 It always got misinterpreted as Guns, but you know, there 0:08:53.200 --> 0:08:55.760 was other people in the neighborhood also known as guns, 0:08:55.800 --> 0:08:59.160 So you know, that's what they used to call me 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:01.880 and I on fortunately never really corrected it as being 0:09:01.960 --> 0:09:03.240 guns instead of guns. 0:09:03.240 --> 0:09:04.720 So where does guns come from? 0:09:04.840 --> 0:09:06.120 Well, you know, in the South. 0:09:06.240 --> 0:09:08.959 My grandmother gave me that name, so I never really 0:09:09.040 --> 0:09:11.360 asked her what it meant, you know, question, Grandma, did 0:09:11.360 --> 0:09:14.080 you just go with the nickname and be thankful that 0:09:14.559 --> 0:09:17.520 she holds you on a specially little nickname category. 0:09:18.679 --> 0:09:22.000 While the police were focused on the guns rumor, Frederick 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:24.719 came back into town from Boston on August thirtieth to 0:09:24.840 --> 0:09:27.720 visit with family, traveling with three others in a white 0:09:27.760 --> 0:09:31.120 convertible with Massachusetts plates, and it appears that they were 0:09:31.120 --> 0:09:32.840 pulled over without any cause. 0:09:33.280 --> 0:09:36.160 What I suspect is that they profiled the card is 0:09:36.200 --> 0:09:39.400 convertible with Massachusetts plates. Two women in the front, two 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:40.120 guys in the back. 0:09:40.440 --> 0:09:43.480 Unfortunately, two people who are carrying weapons. I didn't have 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:44.600 no WEP anything on me. 0:09:44.840 --> 0:09:47.079 And so the two women, one of whom was a 0:09:47.160 --> 0:09:49.760 former parole officer who had ability to have the gun 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:52.280 on her, and this other woman who I don't know, 0:09:52.320 --> 0:09:54.360 but you know, they pulled the car over. There's people 0:09:54.400 --> 0:09:55.240 with guns on it, so. 0:09:56.400 --> 0:10:00.600 They ran everyone's IDs, which revealed Frederick's outstanding arrest. 0:10:00.840 --> 0:10:04.440 When he's being brought to the precinct, there's another woman there, 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:10.680 Darlene Cook. She recognizes Frederick and says, hey, guns. And 0:10:11.400 --> 0:10:15.280 when she did that, obviously the detectives realized this is 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:17.559 the person who they'd been hearing about the name that 0:10:17.600 --> 0:10:18.560 they'd been looking for. 0:10:19.080 --> 0:10:21.600 And since it appears that this stop and search was 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:24.600 done without cause but had turned up these weapons and 0:10:24.679 --> 0:10:27.760 arrest warrant, the police were in a little bit of 0:10:27.760 --> 0:10:29.040 a civil rights pickle. 0:10:29.559 --> 0:10:31.880 I think they profiled the car they stopped and then 0:10:31.960 --> 0:10:35.080 created the justification. Afterwards, they got this person, Darlene Cook, 0:10:35.160 --> 0:10:38.480 to say, this convertible with Massachusetts plates pointed a gun 0:10:38.480 --> 0:10:40.880 at me and threatened me. That's what I suspect. 0:10:41.120 --> 0:10:44.640 It's quite strange that charges related to those allegations from 0:10:44.720 --> 0:10:49.120 Darlene Cook never materialized. However, Frederick was already facing plenty, 0:10:49.320 --> 0:10:52.079 starting with the prior charges that he evaded by moving 0:10:52.080 --> 0:10:52.640 to Boston. 0:10:53.240 --> 0:10:56.160 I take full responsibility for my actions dealing with that. 0:10:56.520 --> 0:10:59.199 I ended up getting sentenced to two one to three 0:10:59.280 --> 0:11:02.640 years sentences running consecutively, which was two to six years 0:11:02.640 --> 0:11:04.560 far as in this case, I had no idea that 0:11:04.640 --> 0:11:06.960 I was even a suspect until I got to the precinct. 0:11:07.000 --> 0:11:08.560 You know, then they put me in a lineup and 0:11:08.559 --> 0:11:09.320 told me everything. 0:11:09.960 --> 0:11:13.800 By this time, police had found another witness named Carmen Torado, who, 0:11:13.920 --> 0:11:16.880 unlike Barbara Garth and Greg Maloney, had said that she 0:11:16.960 --> 0:11:21.160 could reliably identify the shooter. Yet during this lineup, Torodo 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:25.520 identify someone else, while Garth and Maloney idd Frederick, who 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:29.240 was now facing murder and attempted murder while serving two 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:30.680 to six years for his priors. 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:34.040 So I ended up going back and forth from rackets 0:11:34.080 --> 0:11:37.120 backup state fighting the murder charge here from ninety three 0:11:37.200 --> 0:11:40.400 to nineteen ninety five. Like every time, if they post 0:11:40.400 --> 0:11:42.680 formed my court date for like any more than two weeks, 0:11:42.760 --> 0:11:44.160 they would send me back up state. 0:11:44.000 --> 0:11:45.920 And I'll be going back and forth. You know. 0:11:45.960 --> 0:11:48.200 I had no real communication with my attorney, you know, 0:11:48.280 --> 0:11:50.880 he would not come visit me. I felt like I 0:11:50.880 --> 0:11:53.800 would get off only because I know I didn't do it. 0:11:54.000 --> 0:11:56.120 That's all that was on my mind. You know. 0:11:56.160 --> 0:11:59.120 It was so much violence. Multiple people were getting killed 0:11:59.120 --> 0:12:02.200 and stabbed. More because I've seen so many horrific situations 0:12:02.280 --> 0:12:04.800 myself have to add I did get cut on Rockets 0:12:04.840 --> 0:12:07.199 Island too. Be honest, I don't know how I got 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:07.560 through it. 0:12:21.480 --> 0:12:24.040 Freedom Agenda is a proud sponsor of this episode of 0:12:24.080 --> 0:12:28.240 Wrongful Conviction. Freedom Agenda is led by people directly impacted 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:31.240 by incarceration, and they're organized in to get Mayor Eric 0:12:31.280 --> 0:12:34.400 Adams to follow the law and shut down Rikers Island. 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:37.760 Right now, thousands of people are awaiting trial there in 0:12:37.840 --> 0:12:41.960 life threatening conditions. Freedom Agenda is committed to creating a 0:12:42.000 --> 0:12:45.280 safer and more just city by winning investments in long 0:12:45.320 --> 0:12:48.400 neglected communities, protecting the rights of people involved in the 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:51.600 criminal legal system, and ending the cycle of violence that 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:55.040 Rikers perpetuates. To learn more about the campaign to Close 0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:57.640 Rikers and to sign up for Freedom Agenda's mailing list, 0:12:57.840 --> 0:13:01.600 go to Campaign to Close Rikers dot org, slash, get involved, 0:13:01.880 --> 0:13:05.240 or follow and Freedom Agenda and Why on social media. 0:13:10.960 --> 0:13:15.040 While communication was strained with his assigned counsel, Stephen Chakin, 0:13:15.920 --> 0:13:18.480 they were able to find one of his roommates outside 0:13:18.520 --> 0:13:22.360 Boston to testify on his behalf at trial in nineteen 0:13:22.440 --> 0:13:22.960 ninety five. 0:13:23.720 --> 0:13:26.480 Here's how to alibi witness a woman he was living with. 0:13:26.679 --> 0:13:29.959 It was actually Springfield Massachusetts at the time. She didn't 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:32.640 remember the exact day, but testified how they lived together 0:13:32.720 --> 0:13:34.920 and usually had dinner together during that time. 0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:37.280 It was a lot of things that couldn't be recalled 0:13:37.320 --> 0:13:39.360 from her with the timings and all that, I think 0:13:39.400 --> 0:13:41.920 got misconstrued and made it a little bit more harder 0:13:41.920 --> 0:13:44.080 for the jury and the court to believe that I 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:47.079 was not actually in New York when his crime happened. 0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:49.880 That's basically all I had was the alibi, and I 0:13:49.920 --> 0:13:51.800 thought that's really all I needed, but. 0:13:51.800 --> 0:13:54.840 That was not enough to counteract to other evidence against him. 0:13:55.400 --> 0:13:58.920 The state presented Barbara Garth and Craig Maloney, whose testimonies 0:13:58.920 --> 0:14:01.760 were stark departure from their initial statements in which they 0:14:01.760 --> 0:14:04.800 could not make an id, but now they were both 0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:06.720 certain that Frederick was the shooter. 0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:11.840 Greg described this car slowly coming down Ashford and around Dumont, 0:14:11.880 --> 0:14:14.319 where somebody came out of the car and started shooting, 0:14:14.320 --> 0:14:17.360 whereas Barbara Garth had a much more dramatic story and 0:14:17.440 --> 0:14:21.000 she claims she saw Kierris driving the car before the shooting, 0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:24.760 and then she claims she was coming down Dumont, approaching 0:14:25.000 --> 0:14:27.200 Devon and Ray as they came out of this bodega, 0:14:27.280 --> 0:14:29.640 and she was waving to them, and all of a 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:33.240 sudden she sees this car with Kars in. It comes 0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:36.480 around and actually runs sint to Ray. She says, it 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:40.280 knocks him onto the sidewalk, and then she says Kirs 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:44.160 comes out and starts shooting at Devon and Ray before 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:47.360 taking off. And then she claimed she runs to Devon 0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:49.640 and you know, says I love you, and he says 0:14:49.680 --> 0:14:52.360 I love you, and he squeezes her hand and his 0:14:52.440 --> 0:14:53.320 eyes roll over. 0:14:53.840 --> 0:14:58.040 Barbara Garth also testified that even though she allegedly already 0:14:58.120 --> 0:15:00.760 knew it was Frederick, while Devon Brown was dying in 0:15:00.800 --> 0:15:03.440 her arms, she claimed to have asked him if he 0:15:03.560 --> 0:15:06.320 knew who had shot him, quote, to see if he 0:15:06.360 --> 0:15:10.240 would lie end quote, which sounds just like cop logic 0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:14.520 to establish an id untainted by suggestion, not the logic 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:18.080 of assumed to be grief stricken girlfriend. Either way, Barbara 0:15:18.160 --> 0:15:21.480 Garth was completely absent from Greg Maloney's version of events, 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:24.560 which is a jarring inconsistency. 0:15:25.120 --> 0:15:28.920 Even though they had these inconsistent stories, they also had 0:15:29.280 --> 0:15:31.760 the gun that was recovered from the woman who was 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:33.880 driving the car that Cures got picked up in a 0:15:33.920 --> 0:15:37.520 month later, August thirtieth. It's a ballistics expert testify that 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:42.040 he examined the ballistics evidence. The ammunition casings recovered from 0:15:42.080 --> 0:15:44.680 the crime scene compared to two a bullet shot out 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:46.960 of the gun recovered from this woman who was driving 0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:49.080 a car that Kirs was in on August thirtieth, and 0:15:49.160 --> 0:15:52.520 they said it's the same gun, and Curius's defense counsel 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:54.240 he didn't challenge that claim. 0:15:54.680 --> 0:15:56.760 You can listen to our coverage of ballistics evidence on 0:15:56.840 --> 0:16:00.040 Wromful Conviction Junk Science, in which you'll find that the 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:04.000 ballistics analysis can really only be useful in ruling out 0:16:04.040 --> 0:16:08.040 a weapon, but you can not identify a weapon to 0:16:08.120 --> 0:16:11.400 the exclusion of all others. That's exactly what was done here. 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:17.600 The nypdalistics expert testified that scientifically it was a perfect match, 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:21.160 and that's impossible. My impression is that the defense council 0:16:21.240 --> 0:16:24.000 didn't even look at the ballistics evidence. The only thing 0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:26.480 he did to challenge it was to say, well, maybe 0:16:26.520 --> 0:16:29.520 the bullets were there before the shooting, which of course 0:16:29.640 --> 0:16:30.840 is not a strong defense. 0:16:31.280 --> 0:16:33.360 And the jury goes out, how long did they. 0:16:33.240 --> 0:16:34.760 Deliberate for wow? 0:16:34.960 --> 0:16:36.560 I think for like a day and a half because 0:16:36.600 --> 0:16:38.360 I had to come back, and it was a lot 0:16:38.400 --> 0:16:43.160 of readbacks with them asking for clarification with certain contradictions 0:16:43.200 --> 0:16:45.440 that was with the witness's statements. 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:48.120 And by the way, more power to them, because after 0:16:48.160 --> 0:16:50.240 two or three weeks of a bunch of bullshit, it 0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:51.800 wouldn't have been surprising to me if you would have 0:16:51.800 --> 0:16:53.680 said they deliberated for an hour, came back and said 0:16:53.680 --> 0:16:56.360 guilty and now we're going home. That's not what they did. 0:16:56.400 --> 0:17:00.160 So they had questions, they had doubts, but ultimately they 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:04.359 sentenced you to twenty years to life for the murder, 0:17:04.720 --> 0:17:07.719 eight and the third years to twenty five for attempted murder, 0:17:07.960 --> 0:17:10.359 five to fifteen for the possession of the weapon, and 0:17:10.400 --> 0:17:12.920 two in a third to seven for the assault. All 0:17:12.960 --> 0:17:15.520 three served consecutively to the twenty of the life. 0:17:15.640 --> 0:17:17.199 You know, my family was in the courtroom when they 0:17:17.320 --> 0:17:20.160 came back with a guilty verdict, and I can still 0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:23.199 hear my sister screaming inside the courtroom, and to me, 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:26.080 everything seemed like the courtroom just was drinking. 0:17:26.200 --> 0:17:26.359 You know. 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:27.880 I just wanted to get out of there. It felt 0:17:27.880 --> 0:17:30.560 like everything was collapsing on me and I couldn't really 0:17:30.600 --> 0:17:34.720 believe it. That's just something that continuously to this day 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:54.040 I go through as I think about those moments at 0:17:54.080 --> 0:17:56.480 a fourth and fifth grade reading level at the time. 0:17:56.600 --> 0:17:58.920 So that was very hard for me, and I think 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:01.600 kind of maybe prolong my stay in prison because after 0:18:01.640 --> 0:18:05.720 I did get educated, I put my bunk, so to speak, 0:18:05.800 --> 0:18:09.440 inside the law library and started studying and writing everybody 0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:10.959 in the country for assistance. 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:15.119 So you put your buff inside the law library. I 0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:15.960 never heard that before. 0:18:16.240 --> 0:18:17.879 That's what we used to say, like you live in 0:18:17.880 --> 0:18:20.240 a law library when you're trying to get some type 0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:22.720 of resolve. So I just was there every day in 0:18:22.720 --> 0:18:24.239 so many where I was just trying to say that. 0:18:24.720 --> 0:18:27.479 So who somebody must have helped you because you come 0:18:27.560 --> 0:18:29.120 in there, you know you have a fourth fifth grade 0:18:29.160 --> 0:18:31.320 reading level. Did you have a mentor in there who 0:18:31.440 --> 0:18:34.920 was able to help you persevere and find a way 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:35.600 out of this mess? 0:18:35.680 --> 0:18:37.679 Yes, I had quite a few people that and I 0:18:37.760 --> 0:18:39.960 used to work in a messoor. So was this brother 0:18:40.040 --> 0:18:42.640 there by the name of Alame And he was very 0:18:42.640 --> 0:18:44.520 good at the law and he used to help me 0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:47.000 a lot. And I think that's what he taught me most, 0:18:47.080 --> 0:18:49.440 just to write and how to write the cause for 0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:52.280 a request or whatever, try to get some type of 0:18:52.320 --> 0:18:54.840 corresponse going on with the attorney, mister Chakin, that never 0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:57.080 wrote me back in the whole twenty eight years. But 0:18:57.520 --> 0:18:59.280 yes I had a lot of help in that regard. 0:18:59.359 --> 0:19:01.919 But the almost hope I got was just understand that 0:19:01.960 --> 0:19:03.600 I didn't do the crime and that I was not 0:19:03.680 --> 0:19:05.879 going to stop until I got some type of answers. 0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:09.479 Fortunately I ended up in a prison, Kaksaki Correction facility. 0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:13.560 And again the name gun Sa was my gift at 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:16.280 this point because someone was in a few sales down 0:19:16.320 --> 0:19:18.800 for me. They heard the name and then they were 0:19:18.840 --> 0:19:21.600 the porter on the block and came out and started 0:19:21.640 --> 0:19:24.040 asking me who I am, where I'm from. And long 0:19:24.080 --> 0:19:27.240 story short, that person knew the witness that testified against me. 0:19:27.680 --> 0:19:30.160 And this man's name is Gavin Johnson. 0:19:30.480 --> 0:19:32.920 So Gavin Johnson lived a couple of houses down from 0:19:32.960 --> 0:19:36.600 Devon Brown and he was actually at home on Ashfrid 0:19:36.640 --> 0:19:39.479 Street at the time of the murders. He recalled hearing 0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:42.320 the shooting and then running outside and running up the 0:19:42.320 --> 0:19:44.760 street to see what happened and seeing that Devon got shot. 0:19:44.840 --> 0:19:49.919 So when he came across Frederick in Koksaki. He was 0:19:50.800 --> 0:19:52.960 shocked to find out that one of the witnesses he 0:19:53.040 --> 0:19:57.040 testified against him was Greg Maloney because he knew that 0:19:57.080 --> 0:20:00.240 Greg Maloney had never said anything about knowing who the 0:20:00.320 --> 0:20:01.840 murderer was of Devon Brown. 0:20:01.960 --> 0:20:04.320 And after that, you know, he just was really willing 0:20:04.400 --> 0:20:06.480 to try to get alone to talk to my lawyer. 0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:09.080 First, well, the witness, Greg Bloney didn't want to get 0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:12.040 in trouble himself and say, you know, I perjured myself 0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:14.199 at trial, and he wanted to wait for the statue 0:20:14.240 --> 0:20:17.160 limitations to run out. When that finally happened and Frederick 0:20:17.160 --> 0:20:19.960 finally got Craig to give him a statement in two thousand, 0:20:20.000 --> 0:20:22.639 he immediately gets I think it was a legal aid 0:20:22.720 --> 0:20:24.640 lawyer involved to try to help him with the four 0:20:24.800 --> 0:20:28.240 forty And that whole process ends up taking several more 0:20:28.320 --> 0:20:32.120