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Speaker 1: This is me eat your podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,

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Speaker 1: bug bitten, and in my case, underwear. Listening to hunt podcast,

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Speaker 1: you can't predict anything presented by first, like creating proven

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Speaker 1: versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to technical outerwear

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Speaker 1: for every hunt. First like go farther, stay longer, Listen up.

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Speaker 1: This is honest pitelist from meat Eater, and I need

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Speaker 1: your help. I'm going to be at the National Wild

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Speaker 1: Turkey Federation's Annual Convention in Nashville, Tennessee this year, and

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Speaker 1: I'm looking for the best Turkey storytellers alive. Now. I

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Speaker 1: know we all have a good turkey story to tell,

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Speaker 1: but I want you to think about who you know

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Speaker 1: that tells an absolutely riveting turkey tale a person and

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Speaker 1: that draws everyone in the room to their story. Bring

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Speaker 1: them to me. I'm going to be at Ryman's Studios

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Speaker 1: in the same building as a convention, set up with

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Speaker 1: recording equipment and fill. The engineer is going to be

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Speaker 1: there to make sure it sounds great. I have a

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Speaker 1: goal of creating a national archive of hunters stories, and

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Speaker 1: my first stop is the Southeast because I know you

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Speaker 1: all down there. It can spend a good story. This

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Speaker 1: is our oral history. I believe there's immense historical value

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Speaker 1: to these stories and they should be preserved for future generations.

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Speaker 1: Don't let your grandpa's stories die with him. Bring him

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Speaker 1: to the convention and have him spin a yarn for me.

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Speaker 1: The stories can be funny, sad, educational, exciting, but most importantly,

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Speaker 1: they have to be engaging. This is where the good

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Speaker 1: storyteller part comes in. All storytellers will get twenty minutes

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Speaker 1: to tell their story, and I will be on hand

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Speaker 1: to ask questions to fill in the blanks. We'll be

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Speaker 1: recording at Ryman's studio see from nine am to four

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Speaker 1: pm Thursday, Friday, and Saturday of the convention, which is

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Speaker 1: February and eighteen. There will be posters directing you to

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Speaker 1: our location to sign up for a time slot. Ahead

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Speaker 1: of time, go to the meat eater dot com and

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Speaker 1: search Turkey Story sign up. We will also have sign

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Speaker 1: up available on location at the door of Ryman Studio See.

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Speaker 1: Met Eater will use these stories in a forthcoming audio project,

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Speaker 1: most likely in podcast format, so they will be available

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Speaker 1: to everyone as long as the Internet is alive. So

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Speaker 1: please come to Nashville for the National Wild Turkey Federation

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Speaker 1: Convention and bring me the best Turkey storyteller you know.

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Speaker 1: Are hunting legacy depends on it? Okay? Joined today by

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Speaker 1: Brodie cal Spencer, Phil Crinn, and Dr Jonathan Riceman. Krin

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Speaker 1: described some as a medical doctor, hunter author, and the

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Speaker 1: man who wants to overturn the federal law against selling

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Speaker 1: and eating long I want to overturn uh Yeloso National Park.

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Speaker 1: Let's join forces. You know, well do mine. There's a

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Speaker 1: couple of things I want to make it so the

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Speaker 1: whole country is the blaze orange laws or orange hat

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Speaker 1: crossing cart like Supreme Court ruling orange hat nothing more,

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Speaker 1: nothing less for firearm, honey less, but not more. Then

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Speaker 1: I want Yellowstone to be turned into a wilderness area

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Speaker 1: and all the infrastructure removed, just the main highways going

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Speaker 1: through it, and just a giant just to restore it

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Speaker 1: to a pristine state. Think about that. I'd support it,

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Speaker 1: And you wanna um make it that people can buy

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Speaker 1: and sell long right, you can buy and sell it

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Speaker 1: as a dog treat for dog food, but you cannot

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Speaker 1: buy it or sell it or serve it in a

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Speaker 1: restaurant for human food. I got one for you. The

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Speaker 1: says nothing, do a long. I thought we'd put this

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Speaker 1: question to rest, but this is a medical question for you.

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Speaker 1: There is a phenomena. This is gonna get mighty scatological

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Speaker 1: because there's a lot of stuff. So if you don't

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Speaker 1: like scatological stuff, just move on. Do you guys remember

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Speaker 1: when we explored the phenomenon known as deja who meaning Spencer,

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Speaker 1: I wrote about this for our website and get a

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Speaker 1: fact checker on, go ahead? What would you come up

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Speaker 1: with on that? I don't even remember that. Uh that

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Speaker 1: it's it's going to explain what it is. Deja poo

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Speaker 1: would be where say you just got done hunting deer

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Speaker 1: the day before and you were successfuldn't do that one,

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Speaker 1: but go ahead, now you go ahead and laid out

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Speaker 1: then rabbit, Okay, rabbit is the worst offender. I'm just

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Speaker 1: going to quickly define scatological relating to or characterized by

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Speaker 1: an interest in ex from the next creation. Started really

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Speaker 1: wearing me out. It's starting to wear me out. But

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Speaker 1: you know how stuff like leads. Okay, Spencer, they defined

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Speaker 1: deja pop. I'll read you the claim for how I

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Speaker 1: This is how I lay out fact checkers on our

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Speaker 1: website in this article is called fact checker. Does gutting

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Speaker 1: dear make your farts smell like guts? That lays it

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Speaker 1: right out, Okay, And here's the claim. After field dressing

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Speaker 1: a kill, your gas will start to smell like animal

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Speaker 1: organs within twenty four hours. This observation has been made

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Speaker 1: by those who pursued deer ducks, pheasants, and other game.

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Speaker 1: So in this hypothetical, you were successful rabbit hunting on say,

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Speaker 1: Saturday morning, and then Saturday evening you have a bowl

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Speaker 1: movement and you notice that your bomb movement smells like

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Speaker 1: the rabbit guts, and that's what you call deja puh. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So Dr Riceman, you'll come into this in a minute.

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Speaker 1: So we had explored this and I think someone want

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Speaker 1: to saying the reason they call it dejacu? Who is

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Speaker 1: he thinking? He was? Some person was explaining and some

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Speaker 1: medical professional was explaining that it's a trick of the mind.

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Speaker 1: It's a trick of the brain. Um. I was just

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Speaker 1: on Rogan's podcast and he and I were doing some

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Speaker 1: hunting afterwards, and he brought it up to me because

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Speaker 1: he knew a person who was a bear guide and

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Speaker 1: their daughter was exposed to so much bear skinning and

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Speaker 1: bear gutting, and she was having such bad gas that

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Speaker 1: smelled so terribly of bear guts that she had to

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Speaker 1: go home from school. Wow, had to call her mom

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Speaker 1: to come get her. I told, I told, I told Joe.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, it's not I said, we we kind of

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Speaker 1: explored this. I don't remember the details, but it's not.

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Speaker 1: It's a trick of the brain. And I said, alternately,

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Speaker 1: if it's not a trick of the brain, what it

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Speaker 1: means is somehow those microbes have gone in your nose,

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Speaker 1: gotten into your gut, proliferated in your gut, and it

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Speaker 1: inhabited your gut and then passed out as flatulence, which

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Speaker 1: just like seemed far fetched to me. Who sent her home?

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Speaker 1: That's what I want to know. She opted to go home,

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Speaker 1: She called, here's the gut, here's the takeaway I got

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Speaker 1: from from the physician. I talked to you about this phenomenon.

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Speaker 1: And then then as Dr Riceman's turned but they final

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Speaker 1: because this is this is probably right up his alley.

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Speaker 1: They said, there were potentially two things that are happening here.

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Speaker 1: One is that the nose hairs are tramping some like

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Speaker 1: microparticles that were related to what you were doing. And

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Speaker 1: then when you have like a strong smell later, you're

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Speaker 1: you're smelling that again. So it's like you're physically smelling

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Speaker 1: that same thing you smelled earlier. It's one possible explanation.

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Speaker 1: The other explanation is that, uh, your old factory receptor

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Speaker 1: cells are strongly tied to your memory, and that smells

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Speaker 1: are like the strongest thing that you can tie to

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Speaker 1: your brain when it comes to recalling something, and that

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Speaker 1: your mind is just playing a trick on you. And

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Speaker 1: then when you smell something bad down the line, it

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Speaker 1: makes me makes you think of that thing that you

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Speaker 1: just smelled earlier the same way. That's the conclusion that

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Speaker 1: we can do before. But this was not satisfactory to

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Speaker 1: my interlockertor. And this this physician said, the same thing happens,

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Speaker 1: like if you smell cookies and it makes you think

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Speaker 1: of being at Grandma's house or something like that. Memory

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Speaker 1: is strongly tied to smells. But what they did rule

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Speaker 1: out it is absolutely not that you're inhaling um a

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Speaker 1: bunch of fumes that get into your gut, that come

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Speaker 1: out your brand. They're breathing your gut. Yeah, that's not.

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Speaker 1: That's not the case. Dr Roisman Scott aloge Go was

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Speaker 1: definitely up my alley and my my daily job. Basically,

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Speaker 1: I would say, I guess a few questions. You know,

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Speaker 1: whenever we try to show causality or do a medical study,

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Speaker 1: we always think of confounders, things that are confusing it

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Speaker 1: and leading you astray from I already like this answer,

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Speaker 1: So one did the I guess My question is did

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Speaker 1: the person eat any of that meat between gutting it?

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Speaker 1: And we'll eat the gut taking a dump, or eat

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Speaker 1: the guts or the meat. I guess. I'm not positive

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Speaker 1: that would then change the smell of their stool, but

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Speaker 1: that could be something. Whether or not they ate it

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Speaker 1: is a question if not my hands. And I want

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Speaker 1: to give you another ex like the hypothetical that happens

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Speaker 1: to me if I were to be um like bow

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Speaker 1: fishing or duck hunting, and I'm wading through some like

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Speaker 1: really swampy, nasty water um that has like some deep

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Speaker 1: mud into that swamp smell is the one that I

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Speaker 1: recall worst, like way worse than a gut pile or

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Speaker 1: something like that. But it's that swampy water smell, So

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Speaker 1: I'm not eating that. What's that got to do with parts,

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Speaker 1: because that's that's what I smell. La, I'm smelling the swamp.

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Speaker 1: That word he flagellates that swamp essence back again. This

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Speaker 1: is a phenomenon I've never experienced. But I can't just

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Speaker 1: shot a rabbit. He got some pellets and the guts

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Speaker 1: smelled real bad. No problem. Do you know what I'm

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Speaker 1: talking about? When you're waiting, like through some cat tails

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Speaker 1: in a swamp, and that's that's what I smell the

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Speaker 1: strongest later But then later on I don't really smell

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Speaker 1: that stuff. That's because it's not traumatic to you. This

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Speaker 1: is this is a symptom of a post traumatic stress.

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Speaker 1: I want to some context. It's not always about eating it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I want to rule out he's saying confounding factors. Eating

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Speaker 1: is not a factor. Right. So another thing, I would

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Speaker 1: wonder if the flatus or the stool always smelled that bad.

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Speaker 1: What was that word flatus? Oh that's like fart stuff

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Speaker 1: like that. Yeah, you never already today Like wow, this

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Speaker 1: flatus smells like the animal I got it earlier. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So I guess I wondered that the plate is always

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Speaker 1: smell that way and just because you had this stinky

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Speaker 1: experience in the recent past, you're now associating it with it.

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Speaker 1: The other thing is I seriously doubt you're inhaling microbes

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Speaker 1: that are then populating your gut. Otherwise you could do

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Speaker 1: like a fecal medical transplant just by inhaling stool, and

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Speaker 1: that has not been demonstrated yet, but maybe more research

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Speaker 1: is needed there. So you're buying, you're weighing in on

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Speaker 1: the memory thing. I think it maybe I guess if

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Speaker 1: I had to put my money down to be a

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Speaker 1: trick of the memory that it maybe it smelled that

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Speaker 1: way or similar, uh, and it just reminds you of

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Speaker 1: that recent smell your head. Or the person who's hunting

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Speaker 1: also eats a lot of maybe wild game or or

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Speaker 1: oh full or something that makes their stool smell in

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Speaker 1: that particular way. Or I can't remember the last time

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Speaker 1: I gut it an animal and then had like a

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Speaker 1: full change of clothes ready with, you know, within a

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Speaker 1: period between them in my next constitutional movement, you know.

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Speaker 1: So I think there's all sorts of traces of smell.

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Speaker 1: If my dogs tell me anything on my pants, on

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Speaker 1: my hands, on my jacket, nose hairs, do but what

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Speaker 1: does that have to do with I think that would

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Speaker 1: be like somebody taking the poop and they are smelling,

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Speaker 1: you know, parts of the animal gut and stuff like that,

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Speaker 1: but it's remnants on their boots, remnants on their pant cuffs,

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Speaker 1: or reminance on there be there whether they went and

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Speaker 1: defecated or not. Yes, it would, it would, but they're

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Speaker 1: picking up on that extra scent and and saying like,

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Speaker 1: yes exactly. And when you go to the bathroom you

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Speaker 1: kind of ruffle your clothes in some way. Maybe that

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Speaker 1: releases some more of it. That's not it, dude. What

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Speaker 1: it is is this. It's it's a trick of the memory.

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Speaker 1: Here's the way to test it. Get a bunch of

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Speaker 1: season to rabbit hunters old rap okay, Get a bunch

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Speaker 1: of seasoned rabbit hunters who have rabbit hunted in forever.

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Speaker 1: Not hard to do, right. You get some guys who

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Speaker 1: haven't been rabbit hunt for five years, ten years, Put

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Speaker 1: them with a person who's prone to deja pu, okay,

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Speaker 1: have him. You pay attention to this because this is

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Speaker 1: a little do you do you publish much in academic

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Speaker 1: not as much these days. More you're more and well

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Speaker 1: if you get back into academic check this out. Get

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Speaker 1: all these people and you get a rabbit hunter. You

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Speaker 1: haven't got a whole bunch of rabbits. Okay. He then

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Speaker 1: changes his clothes, takes a shower, goes into the room

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Speaker 1: full of old rabbit hunters who haven't rabbit hunted. What's

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Speaker 1: the verb for for? What's the verb for flat weights? Um?

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Speaker 1: To be honest, I'm not sure if there is one

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Speaker 1: produced latest Perhaps he produces this individual produces flate is

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Speaker 1: He's like, God smells like rabbits, right, Well, they're in

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Speaker 1: an air tight room warm. Do the other people think

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Speaker 1: it smells like rabbit guts? That's how you test this.

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Speaker 1: So when when we publish this article, the Facebook comments

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Speaker 1: were littered with mostly dudes being like, my wife claims

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Speaker 1: that my farts are the worst after a pheasant hunt,

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Speaker 1: which I think is is awesome. I want to tell

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Speaker 1: you how I know that. It's it's in your memory,

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Speaker 1: It's in your head. I wrote this article in November.

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Speaker 1: This had never happened to me before a few days later,

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Speaker 1: I killed the deer, and that night it happened to

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Speaker 1: me because I had been thinking about this and he

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Speaker 1: was on my mind the same way. When I was

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Speaker 1: in college, I had never heard of sleep paralysis, didn't

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Speaker 1: know what it will. And then we had a whole

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Speaker 1: class one day about sleep paralysis, and it happened to

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Speaker 1: me like two months later. And I think it was

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Speaker 1: just like I have a weak mind when it came

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Speaker 1: to that kind of thing. Uh. And then I was

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Speaker 1: exposed to it and it happened. Yeah, Like if you

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Speaker 1: told me right now you had testicular cancer, heaven forbid,

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Speaker 1: my nut would start hurting, like I had that same

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Speaker 1: type of problem. That's specific. Oh yeah, if someone tells

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Speaker 1: you they have a problem, instantly I get an ache there.

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Speaker 1: It's either I'm like very self centered or very very

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Speaker 1: what's it called, uh, empathetic? Empathetic, incredibly empathetic or or

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Speaker 1: uh or something worse. Okay, I'm gonna we got a

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Speaker 1: bunch more medical questions. This one. I don't want to

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Speaker 1: let me do it kind of quick. A lot of

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Speaker 1: people backed up Krin on cilium fiber. Krinn was saying

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Speaker 1: as a backwoods technique, staying in scatological as a backwards technique.

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Speaker 1: She eats cilium fiber, which is meta mucil. It's in

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Speaker 1: meta mucil. But this is the just the pure ingredient,

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Speaker 1: single ingredient itself. Yeah. It uh forms a gel inside

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Speaker 1: your intestines. I mean in a way because it absorbs

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Speaker 1: a lot of water. Yeah. Yeah, helps keep things clean.

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Speaker 1: As Krim mentioned, also grabs cholesterol on its way out.

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Speaker 1: This guy says it's more than safe for your listeners

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Speaker 1: to take it while they're out in the woods to

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Speaker 1: have a cleaner stool or a white bliss pooh. Where

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Speaker 1: do you buy? What do you buying? That? Definitely um, well,

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Speaker 1: Meta mucil or any other cilium containing product is or

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Speaker 1: any fiber supplement is really good at keeping your regular

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Speaker 1: getting rid of cholesterol and other things, slowing the absorption

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Speaker 1: of sugars and other things. I've thought said recently, if

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Speaker 1: fiber was a new pharmaceutical drug be held as like

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Speaker 1: a medical miracle, like the effects on metaball like health

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Speaker 1: CARDIVASCAR health are pretty astounding. They get a Nobel Prize too.

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Speaker 1: Maybe those health benefits plus you don't you have a

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Speaker 1: white bliss poop so many I like, I put this

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Speaker 1: to bed. This frozen we're talking about how to be

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Speaker 1: responsible out on the ice or responsible in the wintertime.

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Speaker 1: Or whatever when you're when you need to go number

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Speaker 1: two out in the woods or out on the ice,

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Speaker 1: and so many microbiole just rode in to contest the

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Speaker 1: idea that somehow the cold temperatures will render it safe.

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Speaker 1: That I can't put it the rest and I have

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Speaker 1: to bring it up once again. People like, if you're

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Speaker 1: trying to save back here, you make it cold. They're

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Speaker 1: like heat kills it. There's no it's like, that's how

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Speaker 1: you preserve it is by freezing it. Don't make the

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Speaker 1: mistake of thinking that if you vaulted in the ice

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Speaker 1: and somehow will later be safe for users of the

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Speaker 1: water in the summertime. We got letters from a septic processor,

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Speaker 1: multiple microbiologist. Everybody's fired up about that. I'm glad we

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Speaker 1: got that cleared up because I didn't like your vaulting idea.

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Speaker 1: One one bit oh, one last thing to add um

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Speaker 1: before we get into the before we get into better stuff.

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Speaker 1: I was I was laying out for my kid, my

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Speaker 1: argument about how my growing unease and skepticism of of

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Speaker 1: these fall turkey seasons where you can just rape and

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Speaker 1: pillage for turkeys in the fall, and how I think

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Speaker 1: it's shortsighted and taking the turkey for granted. I told

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Speaker 1: my kid, I was saying to him my argument that

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Speaker 1: I said to him, if God didn't want your hunting

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Speaker 1: turkeys in the spring, he wouldn't have made spring. And

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Speaker 1: he said, why do you make fall? A great question? Sharp?

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Speaker 1: So I had stuff saying that. All right, Dr Riceman,

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Speaker 1: where do we begin? Man? Um, where do we begin?

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Speaker 1: Let's talk talk about your background a little bit. Sure,

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Speaker 1: I grew up in northern New Jersey and suburbs of

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Speaker 1: New York City. Um, normal suburban um upbringing, had no

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Speaker 1: way what makes it normal? Well? What is normal? I guess? Um?

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Speaker 1: I guess typical maybe typical suburban New Jersey upbringing. Um

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Speaker 1: I guess by normal, I mean uh, specifically like related

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Speaker 1: to outdoors and hunting and fishing. I had no exposure

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Speaker 1: as a child to any of that. Never ate any

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Speaker 1: kind of wild game, probably till my twenties. Didn't know

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Speaker 1: anyone who hunted, didn't know anyone. No one in my

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Speaker 1: family even fished. I never went fishing as a kid, Like,

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Speaker 1: had zero exposure to it. Didn't know anyone who owned

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Speaker 1: a bow or a gun, never even thought about it.

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Speaker 1: I mean meat meat came from the store, you know,

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Speaker 1: cuts and meat. I mean, I knew they came from animals.

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Speaker 1: I just never thought more about it. Wasn't interested in

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Speaker 1: it from either a being horrified perspective or interested I

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Speaker 1: want to learn more perspective. It just was not It

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Speaker 1: just wasn't on my radar. I mean, I guess if

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Speaker 1: you you know, if you don't know anyone who does it,

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Speaker 1: you never I never read read about it. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I guess I didn't even really read like adventure books

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Speaker 1: about the Old West, as many maybe young boys do,

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Speaker 1: so maybe maybe that would have piqued my interest. I

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Speaker 1: guess I just wasn't exposed to it in any way.

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Speaker 1: So it's a complete blank in my knowledge and experience.

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Speaker 1: What what happened to uh to burst the bubble? Um? Well,

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Speaker 1: I was an undergrad in New York University, and I

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Speaker 1: don't even know how. I just got interested in wilderness survival. Um.

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Speaker 1: I took a wild edible plants tour of Central Park

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Speaker 1: in Manhattan and kind of learned to identify my first

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Speaker 1: few plants, um, first few trees and first few edible

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Speaker 1: We have found some raspberries, things like that Central Park

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Speaker 1: in Central Park yeah, what else did you find? Like ginko?

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Speaker 1: Beloba trees are kind of all over Manhattan. They're supposed

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Speaker 1: to be sort of the non fruit bearing um sex,

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Speaker 1: but I guess a lot of them end up bearing

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Speaker 1: tons of these stinky fruits that have an edible nut inside.

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Speaker 1: You often see um, actually elderly Chinese people gathering them

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Speaker 1: in New York, and many times I've gone up to

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Speaker 1: them and been like, what, how do you process it?

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Speaker 1: What do you do with it? And they didn't speak

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Speaker 1: any English, so I didn't learn anything that way. What's

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Speaker 1: your exposure to that? I've often heard that every since,

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Speaker 1: like like the Chinese women will gather the gek. I

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Speaker 1: actually didn't know that. The My exposure to ginko was

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Speaker 1: probably in high school. Um, just going to health food

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Speaker 1: stores and seeing that in the shape of the leaf

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Speaker 1: on a on a box of tea and starting to buy,

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Speaker 1: like the teas are supposed to be kind of calming effects, supposedly,

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Speaker 1: and then looking up around me and seeing the leaf

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Speaker 1: like on falling from trees in New York, and so

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Speaker 1: I really exactly and then I was like, I wonder

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Speaker 1: if this is the same exact thing or something slightly different.

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Speaker 1: And I do remember seeing these little kind of fresh

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Speaker 1: you know, it's like a I don't know, it's kind

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Speaker 1: of like an uh an acorn hazel nut size, kind

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Speaker 1: of green outer shelf. It's fresh. And I just remember

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Speaker 1: seeing those and wondering, like if I can pick them

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Speaker 1: up and eat them like a squirrel, you know, but

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Speaker 1: maybe it's nasty because it's New York City, so I

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Speaker 1: shouldn't do that. So what would you define as elderly?

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Speaker 1: Elderly Chinese woman? How far behind his crew? So she's

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Speaker 1: got we'll check back in with your in forty years.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna get a tax message. Are you picking? Well? Now,

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Speaker 1: I might start. I might start real early the next

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Speaker 1: time I go back to New York City. Let's see.

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Speaker 1: So that did it? You guys like Lamb's Quarter and

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Speaker 1: Lambs Quarters. We didn't see the station. We saw poor

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Speaker 1: Man's Pepper. Um, we did see Lamb's Quarters. Um what

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Speaker 1: we saw Kentucky coffee tree. I mean a lot of

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Speaker 1: the I guess all those trees were planted by a

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Speaker 1: human at some point. Um probably the poor Man's Pepper,

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Speaker 1: the Lamb's Corridor, the raspberries were not and just sort

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Speaker 1: of naturally ended up there, but I guess either way,

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Speaker 1: it was sort of being able to identify a tree

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Speaker 1: and then later seeing that tree again, especially Ginko below

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Speaker 1: was kind of all over Manhattan. UM, that sort of

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Speaker 1: just got me interested and just lets I wanted to

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Speaker 1: learn everything about while that will funge I wanted to.

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Speaker 1: I hadn't gotten into hunting yet, but it was sort

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Speaker 1: of getting into you know, tracking and trapping and making

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Speaker 1: everything from stone tools to wooden longbows, high tanning. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Living in Manhattan. Actually my dorm room I lived right

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Speaker 1: off four Street, UM near Union Square Park, and like

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Speaker 1: my dorman literally literally started having like you know, half

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Speaker 1: made baskets and like bark shavings. It was a mess

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Speaker 1: and some like dried animal hides. UM. My roommate was

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Speaker 1: not happy. Was it like, was it motivated when you

396
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Speaker 1: got into early now, I was motivated by a reverence

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Speaker 1: um for like Native American skills. Was motivated by that

398
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Speaker 1: you were going to go live in the woods. I

399
00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:25,240
Speaker 1: think both of those were important. There's definitely that like

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Speaker 1: romantic romanticization of the past and pre contact Native Americans

401
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Speaker 1: and how they lived you know, quote unquote in harmony

402
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Speaker 1: with nature and when you read a lot of that literature,

403
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Speaker 1: you end up getting sort of infected with that romanticization.

404
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Speaker 1: And I definitely thought about going off, maybe not living

405
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Speaker 1: in the wild, but certainly exploring it, understanding it, learning

406
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Speaker 1: how to you know, to identify all the wild critters

407
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Speaker 1: in it, how to live off at least knowing how

408
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Speaker 1: to live off of it was a big interest. And

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Speaker 1: you got into braintand yes, Braintanding started picking up road kill.

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Speaker 1: To my parents dismay, and how was that going? Um?

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Speaker 1: I loved it. I mean, you know in suburbia is

412
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Speaker 1: like great for roadkill, I mean the deer, hasta fed

413
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Speaker 1: deer or littering the streets basically, And uh, I started

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Speaker 1: picking up squirrels and making you know, raw hide songs

415
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Speaker 1: out of their skins, and braintanding the deer, highest raccoons,

416
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Speaker 1: not the underwear, just like long leather strips. Yeah, long

417
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Speaker 1: leather strip I got excited for a minute. I suppose

418
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Speaker 1: you could. But it was turning a tidy profit out

419
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Speaker 1: of the dorm room and we could put some of

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Speaker 1: that on the website. So were you learning how did

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00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:47,640
Speaker 1: you learn how to braintand like actually like using the Yeah, um,

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Speaker 1: sometimes just from the animal I picked up, sometimes buying separately. Um,

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Speaker 1: whatever brain was on sale at some ethnic market or

424
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Speaker 1: grocery store. Um. All this before we went to med school. Yeah,

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00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:03,399
Speaker 1: this is all before I went to med. So I

426
00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:05,679
Speaker 1: came to med school sort of with this kind of

427
00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 1: understanding of um, you know, of skin from the high

428
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 1: tanner's perspective, and sort of just a deep interest in

429
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 1: early humanity, how they lived, how they made everything, where

430
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 1: they got their materials from, and how they used different

431
00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 1: parts of the animals body to make tools and other things.

432
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 1: And were you eating a lot of wild game at

433
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:25,520
Speaker 1: that point? I was not. I did. I did have

434
00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 1: a few instances where some as you know, my friends

435
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:32,520
Speaker 1: and family knew of my strange interest in road killing.

436
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,919
Speaker 1: More than once someone called me about a deer that

437
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 1: was not dead yet. Um by the time both times,

438
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:40,840
Speaker 1: by the time I got there, it was dead, and

439
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,600
Speaker 1: so I butchered them and ate them. What was the

440
00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:45,960
Speaker 1: variety of road kill you were picking up? Squirrels, deer?

441
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:48,680
Speaker 1: Did you like, have any cats, dogs, coyotes, anything like that. No,

442
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:53,119
Speaker 1: raccoon's possums, although I guess I wasn't impressed with the first,

443
00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:55,160
Speaker 1: so I didn't end up keeping it. But I would

444
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:57,800
Speaker 1: say raccoon, squirrels and white tailed deer were the big ones.

445
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,480
Speaker 1: And where were you in this tanning? Like in your

446
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:05,360
Speaker 1: dorm room? So a little bit in my parents garage

447
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:08,680
Speaker 1: and my parents backyard. And after a while they kind

448
00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:11,160
Speaker 1: of stopped asking me what is that smell? Because they

449
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 1: really didn't like hearing the answer. Um, But yeah, I had,

450
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,120
Speaker 1: you know, like my father came home from work one day,

451
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:20,800
Speaker 1: I was scraping the hair off squirrel hide in the garage,

452
00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 1: or you know, they'd go into the backyard and to

453
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:25,600
Speaker 1: be a deer hide and laced into a frame back there.

454
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:29,240
Speaker 1: Stuff like that. Yeah, I mean I loved it and

455
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:31,480
Speaker 1: still love it. I don't have as much time to

456
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,119
Speaker 1: do it, but it opened my eyes in many different ways.

457
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:39,439
Speaker 1: How familiar you were familiar as a youngster with kosher law? Correct,

458
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:42,240
Speaker 1: though I didn't follow it, But you're familiar with it,

459
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:44,199
Speaker 1: vaguely familiar with it. Now I know a bit more

460
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:46,159
Speaker 1: about you know a bit more about it. Are you

461
00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:47,960
Speaker 1: familiar with I don't know if you'd call him a

462
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:50,679
Speaker 1: sect or what the hell you'd call the habbad? What

463
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:52,720
Speaker 1: would you call the habbad? Yeah? I mean it's one

464
00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:54,640
Speaker 1: of the I don't know if sect is the word.

465
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 1: It's one of the kinds of ultra Orthodox or it's like,

466
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,520
Speaker 1: it's kind of an organization of um that ultra Orthodox

467
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:05,640
Speaker 1: that tries to proselytize two Jews that are less religious,

468
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:09,240
Speaker 1: never to non Jews. Jews don't proselytize the non Jews. Yeah,

469
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,760
Speaker 1: So I was tagging along with a Jew who is

470
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 1: being proselytized to by the Hubbad and I got so

471
00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:19,959
Speaker 1: since I was there anyways, I asked a question, and

472
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 1: I said, how would it? How would you go about?

473
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 1: I'd like you to back this person up or elaborate

474
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:29,720
Speaker 1: on this. I said, how would someone who's keeping kosher

475
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:37,440
Speaker 1: how would they be able to consume wild game? He said,

476
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 1: you'd have to catch it in the net and then

477
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:47,040
Speaker 1: bring it unharmed to a kosher slaughter. Is that is

478
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 1: that your understanding? Can you explain why that is so? Um?

479
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: There's many many rules in kash rout, which is kind

480
00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:56,360
Speaker 1: of the collection of rules that we think of as

481
00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:59,840
Speaker 1: you know, to produce kosher food. UM. Many many rules,

482
00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:02,200
Speaker 1: like mind boggling number of rules that you have to follow.

483
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 1: But one of the big ones is that all blood

484
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 1: must be drained out of the animal. Um. So there's

485
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 1: some rules in Kosher where let's say, you don't eat

486
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:12,320
Speaker 1: pork because it's quote unquote dirty, but you don't eat

487
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:15,520
Speaker 1: blood because it's so holy it should be left for God.

488
00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:18,880
Speaker 1: And some say that's left. Yeah. So it's sort of

489
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:21,520
Speaker 1: the spirit, the animating force of the animal or the

490
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:24,239
Speaker 1: human is in the blood. And so actually, you know,

491
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 1: in before I'm not sure what year, but many centuries

492
00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:33,080
Speaker 1: ago millennia, go Jews ritually slaughtered animals and the big

493
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 1: temples in Jerusalem. People describe it as look running with

494
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:39,200
Speaker 1: volumes of blood. Um. So some think it might be

495
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:41,840
Speaker 1: left over, even though we don't ritually slaughter in that

496
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:46,520
Speaker 1: way anymore. Um something maybe that blood letting or getting

497
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: all the blood out is part of the it's sort

498
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 1: of left over from that ancient tradition of of slaughtering

499
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:54,720
Speaker 1: and it was offering to God. I gotta interrupt because

500
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,400
Speaker 1: I wish we had that Remember that picture someone sent

501
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:00,200
Speaker 1: to score in We're when we were on the when

502
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 1: talk about Samaritans, bunch, what were they in? What the

503
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,400
Speaker 1: hell country were they in? Think where they had that

504
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,520
Speaker 1: place where you hang all the lambs and kill them.

505
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:12,720
Speaker 1: And they had those special troughs to collect all the

506
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:16,640
Speaker 1: blood and diverted into like a big master took that up.

507
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:20,000
Speaker 1: I wonder if that was if that was in the

508
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 1: West Bank. Actually, I was kind of half paying attention

509
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 1: to anyhow elaborate like blood collecting. Right well, Brad, I, right, well,

510
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:30,440
Speaker 1: you're getting rid of the blood in the case. In

511
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 1: this case, so you would have to catch the animal,

512
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 1: hang it upside down from its time quarters and slit

513
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:38,520
Speaker 1: its neck. Specifically, uh, someone trained to be what's called

514
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 1: the show it would have to do the slaughtering. Um.

515
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 1: That's how you say that word. Yeah, And usually that's

516
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,680
Speaker 1: a rabbi, though not always so. For instance, in in

517
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 1: a halal, the sort of Muslim version of Kosher, any

518
00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 1: Muslim can do the actual slicing of the neck, but

519
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:56,120
Speaker 1: in in Kasha has to be someone trained to do that.

520
00:30:56,360 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 1: So if you're if you're slaughtering cattle, you're not obligated

521
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:04,160
Speaker 1: to get that thing hanging up by it's hawk alive?

522
00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 1: Are you you are? You have been to a Kosher slaughterhouse.

523
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 1: They put chains around the back legs and lift it

524
00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 1: up and the cows moving its face off and then

525
00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:15,640
Speaker 1: if someone gets in there with a knife about this long,

526
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 1: you would be like a knife fighter to get in there.

527
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 1: I don't know, perfect man, that part can like hypothetically

528
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:26,240
Speaker 1: be botched as well, right, Like if they don't have

529
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 1: a clean knife swipe that animal then is not kosher

530
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 1: if it doesn't die a certain way within a certain

531
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 1: amount of time. Is that correct? I believe the rules

532
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 1: do stipulate that. Yet it has to be like a

533
00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 1: very sharp knife. It has to be very quick and clean. Um.

534
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: But yeah, so getting the blood out of the meat

535
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 1: is a big part of it. Even the liver. You

536
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:46,880
Speaker 1: actually have to to take the liver out of the

537
00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,720
Speaker 1: body is not kosher. Even if that animal is kosher,

538
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 1: you have to actually cook it over a fire, uh

539
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 1: in some way to get the blood to all drain out.

540
00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:59,960
Speaker 1: And only then is it kosher to eat what It's true?

541
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:03,200
Speaker 1: Explain it to me again. You have to get the

542
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 1: blood out of the liver. You know. The liver is

543
00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 1: a very bloody organ, like when it sits in your

544
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 1: fridge every day it does a new pool of blood

545
00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: around it. Um, So you have to actually slowly cook it.

546
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:16,480
Speaker 1: So buying raw kosher liver these days is basically impossible

547
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:19,640
Speaker 1: in the US. It has it's already slightly cooked and

548
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:21,760
Speaker 1: to get the blood to drip out can't be cooked

549
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:23,719
Speaker 1: in a pan because the blood would then sit around it.

550
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 1: They cook it on like a great basically, so all

551
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:28,680
Speaker 1: the blood can drip out of it. So they're not

552
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 1: eating blood sausage. Definitely not only God can do that,

553
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 1: I guess. And then just to stay on this subject

554
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:39,320
Speaker 1: for a second, on the kosher slaughter subject, is there

555
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 1: is there's an inspection of the animal then to determine

556
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:48,160
Speaker 1: had it been healthy correct, correct, And it focuses on

557
00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 1: the lungs. And there used to be actually a more

558
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,600
Speaker 1: involved process where you have to check I forget if

559
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 1: it's seventeen or twenty something body parts. But sometime in

560
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 1: the Middle Ages, all the grabbis decided that we can

561
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 1: just check the lungs and they'll sort of be a

562
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: proxy for the health of the whole animal. So when

563
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 1: you're in the kosher slaughterhouses, a bunch of slaughterhouse workers,

564
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,200
Speaker 1: you know, moving the half carcasses along the ceiling and

565
00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 1: the racks that are moving along the ceiling, and then

566
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:17,600
Speaker 1: there's a bunch of show hits and rabbis that are

567
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:20,040
Speaker 1: looking at the lungs. So after they cut the animal

568
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 1: and open its chest cavity, they pull the lungs out,

569
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 1: bring it over to a table and look at the

570
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:26,520
Speaker 1: surface of it to see if there's any white scar

571
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,600
Speaker 1: tissue on it, which would be evidence of pneumonia or

572
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,880
Speaker 1: other lung infections in the past. And these are religious figures,

573
00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 1: not not food specialists, correct, But there it is. It's

574
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:40,480
Speaker 1: a career path you can go on. Many rabbis do

575
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:43,640
Speaker 1: choose to get trained as a show hit to then

576
00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:46,560
Speaker 1: go into that industry as well, like a side hustle.

577
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:48,760
Speaker 1: I suppose. I like to imagine that they all started

578
00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:55,280
Speaker 1: the same and uh, there's some back and forth and like, hey,

579
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 1: so what are you gonna do? Right? And I feel

580
00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: like I would be much more on the um slaughterhouse

581
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 1: floor path then um, you know, having a congregation of sorts, right.

582
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:09,840
Speaker 1: It's like choosing your medical specialty. It's like do you

583
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,120
Speaker 1: want to be hanging around cows hanging upside down or

584
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 1: just want to do bar mitzvas for suburban brass rightly?

585
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:20,200
Speaker 1: And and this slaughterhouse equipment, he's not doublings like non

586
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,279
Speaker 1: kosher slaughter house equipment as well, right, like they're they're

587
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:26,600
Speaker 1: not doing all the same process with meat that's also

588
00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 1: going to the local grocery store that's non kosher. No,

589
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:31,799
Speaker 1: you can't. You cannot have any non kosher animals in

590
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,279
Speaker 1: that facility at all. Although, to be fair, the one

591
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 1: that I wrote about in my book the Slaughterhouse, another

592
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:38,680
Speaker 1: time I went there and there was a pig hanging

593
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:40,400
Speaker 1: on the side and the guy's like, you didn't see that.

594
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:44,359
Speaker 1: What was going on with that? I don't know, just

595
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:47,439
Speaker 1: you know, he had the walk in freezer space and

596
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: someone with a pig wanted to put it there, and

597
00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:54,239
Speaker 1: so he's like, wow, And I think that. I think

598
00:34:54,320 --> 00:34:56,760
Speaker 1: that happens a lot. Like let's say you slice the honestly,

599
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,239
Speaker 1: you slice, the animal doesn't die right away, like I'm

600
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 1: sure sometimes they're out, you know, sl sliced lfe again. Um,

601
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 1: that's why a lot of there's so many gradations of

602
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:08,480
Speaker 1: how strict you are, and there's a lot of fudging,

603
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:11,399
Speaker 1: which is why some very religious people will not eat

604
00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 1: even something stamped kosher, depending who stamped it, they might

605
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:17,600
Speaker 1: not eat it because they don't trust that person or

606
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:25,400
Speaker 1: this person. Yeah, exactly, your your your knife man. Would

607
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:30,080
Speaker 1: he also then be more uh, sought after to perform

608
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:33,920
Speaker 1: a bress good? Good question. It's like I did a

609
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:40,600
Speaker 1: couple of thousand kosher beef. Different technique, also different knife size,

610
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:53,040
Speaker 1: machete down. Uh. You got into buying hole animals? Yes, um,

611
00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 1: not live but actually that same slaughterhouse they had um

612
00:35:56,640 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 1: they would do lamb or sheep and go, And so

613
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:03,720
Speaker 1: I picked up a whole animal from them several times.

614
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:07,040
Speaker 1: That was while I was in medical school studying anatomy.

615
00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:09,359
Speaker 1: But were you doing it just because we like, why

616
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:13,080
Speaker 1: did you know what was going to tie into your career? No?

617
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 1: I mean I was just curious. I guess I'm still

618
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:17,439
Speaker 1: not sure it has tied into my career. I guess

619
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:20,439
Speaker 1: just right writing made it tied into my career. Coming

620
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: on podcasts like this made it tie in. But I

621
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 1: think I was just curious. I mean I was, I

622
00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:28,239
Speaker 1: was sort of fascinated. So once I started dissecting the

623
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,120
Speaker 1: human in anatomy lab in medical school, like on the

624
00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 1: first day of medical school, we start the process in

625
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: this class called anatomy lab. You meet your cadaver and

626
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,720
Speaker 1: start dissecting. They're they're laying face down on the metal

627
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:42,880
Speaker 1: gurney and you start with learning the superficial muscles of

628
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:46,080
Speaker 1: the back, like the lats or latismus, Dorsey and others.

629
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 1: So um, but that first day for me, it was

630
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:52,479
Speaker 1: very eye opening. It was really revelatory in some ways.

631
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:56,880
Speaker 1: I just absolutely loved it. And actually there's a triangle roast. Yeah. Well,

632
00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:58,880
Speaker 1: so I didn't know too much about different kinds of

633
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,279
Speaker 1: cuts yet, but I did decide on that first day

634
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,759
Speaker 1: to donate my own body to that same process, like

635
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,360
Speaker 1: to donate it to a medical school to be dissected

636
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 1: by medical students, just because I was super fascinated with

637
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 1: the process. Does every med student cut into a person nowadays? Less? So,

638
00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:18,839
Speaker 1: there's actually some really very high quality virtual dissection programs. Um,

639
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:21,560
Speaker 1: there's actually this digital It's the size of a table,

640
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:23,800
Speaker 1: the size of a metal gurney lying in front of you.

641
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 1: It's called the anatomage and uh, you literally can go

642
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:32,240
Speaker 1: through it, um to an amazing degree that I before

643
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 1: I saw that, I thought that virtual could be no substitute.

644
00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:37,560
Speaker 1: But after I saw that, honestly not sure. But I'm

645
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:40,800
Speaker 1: still very glad I got to cut open an actual person.

646
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 1: What's that feel like? Man? Does it feel like like sinful,

647
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:47,359
Speaker 1: Like what's that feel like? I think it's the most

648
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:50,279
Speaker 1: surprising thing was how quickly everyone got used to it.

649
00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 1: I think everyone was super worried when they were going

650
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:55,880
Speaker 1: in like holy crap, day one, like here's a dead body,

651
00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,520
Speaker 1: now start cutting it apart, and like I think within

652
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:01,040
Speaker 1: a week everyone it was just like another day at

653
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: the office. Honestly, which is a sign? Who was your person?

654
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:09,920
Speaker 1: Some overweight old man? That's what I was gonna ask.

655
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 1: There's no way for you to get any like history

656
00:38:13,120 --> 00:38:16,520
Speaker 1: of that, like getting curious about that person and figuring

657
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:18,719
Speaker 1: out who they were and what their deal was. No,

658
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:21,200
Speaker 1: I mean they're I mean to be graphic. Their face

659
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:24,799
Speaker 1: is sort of smushed um and just because they're laying

660
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:27,799
Speaker 1: face down on the kourney um and so their face

661
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:30,960
Speaker 1: is sort of like stuck in that smushed uh. Not

662
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,359
Speaker 1: that seeing them would tell you who it is, but

663
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:38,440
Speaker 1: not fresh. So they're embombed. So they drain the blood

664
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:42,000
Speaker 1: out not too dissimilar from kosher meat, and then put

665
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:44,680
Speaker 1: a big hose into the big veins of the neck

666
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:48,320
Speaker 1: or upper chest and running you know, formaldehyde or whatever

667
00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:50,640
Speaker 1: the latest version of formaldehyde is. So the body is

668
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 1: generally preserved and smells like preservative, and you don't know

669
00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:57,279
Speaker 1: where they came from, how they died. No, I mean

670
00:38:57,320 --> 00:38:59,399
Speaker 1: you can tell, like you can see things. You can

671
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:02,080
Speaker 1: see medical evidence of disease. You know, Like my guy

672
00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 1: had bad coronary artery disease. Like literally the coronary arteries

673
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:08,480
Speaker 1: were like crunchy, you could crunch them with your hand,

674
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:13,520
Speaker 1: like calcification, which goes along with CORNERI just sort of

675
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:16,920
Speaker 1: spongy soft tissue like like muscle. Let's say, um, but

676
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:19,360
Speaker 1: things get calcified as the age, especially when you have

677
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:23,000
Speaker 1: hardening of the artery. The hardening is actually calcium being deposited.

678
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:25,760
Speaker 1: He also had like he was clearly a smoker based

679
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,440
Speaker 1: on the um the color of his lungs, which were

680
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:32,319
Speaker 1: like ash gray. Uh. And also they looked like emphysema.

681
00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:35,879
Speaker 1: Emphysema lungs look like extra bubbly, kind of extra big

682
00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:39,320
Speaker 1: and extra bubbly. Um, So he's a smoker, which probably

683
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 1: contributed as coronary artery disease. And I don't know what

684
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:44,560
Speaker 1: he died of specifically, Like you could look at the

685
00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:47,160
Speaker 1: heart and actually see evidence of a heart attack. You know,

686
00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:50,840
Speaker 1: part of the heart muscle would die and turn another color.

687
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:53,600
Speaker 1: Depending on how long you live after the heart attack,

688
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 1: it goes through color changes. You know, if you die

689
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:58,800
Speaker 1: right away, it would be stuck in that initial color,

690
00:39:58,880 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: but if you live another ivors, it continues to remodel

691
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 1: and scar, so you can't tell. I mean that's what

692
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:06,759
Speaker 1: pathologists do when they do an autopsy to find the

693
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:08,480
Speaker 1: cause of death. You know, you could cut open the

694
00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:11,239
Speaker 1: lung arteries and find a huge clot in there and maybe, oh,

695
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:13,600
Speaker 1: they died of a pulmonary embolism. Did you check see

696
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 1: were you able to check his stomach contents? I don't

697
00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 1: think we opened the No, we didn't open the g

698
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:24,480
Speaker 1: I tract. I've done that on animals many times now.

699
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:28,960
Speaker 1: Having no background in this um, it doesn't seem like

700
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 1: this guy fits the profile somebody who normally donates their body.

701
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:35,360
Speaker 1: I would imagine those folks are like quite fit and

702
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:37,480
Speaker 1: proud of what they got going on, not not an

703
00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:42,440
Speaker 1: overweight I think you're reading the let's let's hear right,

704
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:46,399
Speaker 1: like you want to show people donate their bodies. The body.

705
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:52,320
Speaker 1: I would imagine that's more likely where they're gonna remember

706
00:40:53,239 --> 00:40:55,760
Speaker 1: appreciate it. Yeah, So what what is like the normal

707
00:40:55,800 --> 00:40:58,719
Speaker 1: profile of the cadaver. Yeah. Don't you think the vein though,

708
00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:01,839
Speaker 1: would want to keep it all to themselves. I think

709
00:41:01,840 --> 00:41:04,880
Speaker 1: they'd want rooting around in there. I really let myself go.

710
00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:07,879
Speaker 1: I think I'm gonna update my I'm gonna update my

711
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 1: body donors ship on the back of my driver's license

712
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 1: because I'm just not looking at my best. Thankfully we

713
00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:13,960
Speaker 1: have someone here you can tell me if I'm right

714
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:15,880
Speaker 1: or wrong. So what's like the normal profile? I mean,

715
00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:18,360
Speaker 1: all the bodies and it was probably about thirty bodies

716
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:21,879
Speaker 1: in that room, and they were all elderly, um so

717
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:25,520
Speaker 1: not not in the prime of life. I mean, I

718
00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:28,359
Speaker 1: can't say any looked great, but I didn't really look

719
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:32,040
Speaker 1: at them. None of them caught your eye. I wasn't.

720
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:35,040
Speaker 1: I mean they all smelled terrible and look of course

721
00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:39,920
Speaker 1: sort of gray, but definitely like my cadaver was very obedes.

722
00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:42,799
Speaker 1: Like the layer of blubber on his back was you know,

723
00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:45,719
Speaker 1: to three inches at least. And that made me think,

724
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:48,560
Speaker 1: while thinking I want to donate my body to this process,

725
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:51,560
Speaker 1: like I should really stay fit, um so that the

726
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:54,280
Speaker 1: medical students who are picking me up apart my carcass

727
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 1: don't have to fat it's just you get grease spots

728
00:41:57,560 --> 00:41:59,919
Speaker 1: all over her, the scrubs you're wearing his little bits

729
00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:02,480
Speaker 1: fat ale over your gloves and on your scalpel and

730
00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:05,560
Speaker 1: scissors and stuff. It's slippery, it's hard to you know,

731
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:17,560
Speaker 1: grab stuff. It really gets in the way. Here's something

732
00:42:17,600 --> 00:42:20,479
Speaker 1: my I learned not too long ago, which is something

733
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:23,000
Speaker 1: I like to think about during these winter driving conditions,

734
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,879
Speaker 1: is that there's mobile cadaver labs. Did you know that?

735
00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 1: I don't know what that means. So they well like

736
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:35,800
Speaker 1: different facilities, right, they don't have the space two offer

737
00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:41,240
Speaker 1: like full oh medical learning, they're right, And so there's

738
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:45,960
Speaker 1: companies that are mobile they like the book mobile, but

739
00:42:46,080 --> 00:42:52,000
Speaker 1: with dead bodies exactly brody and occasionally like during like

740
00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:59,399
Speaker 1: our ultra horrid, right horrible for the children, and you're like, oh,

741
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:04,680
Speaker 1: there's a set my laying over on its side. How

742
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:07,879
Speaker 1: like what level of dissection did you go to where

743
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:09,719
Speaker 1: you like peel them back all the skin and the

744
00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:12,960
Speaker 1: muscle and get into the bone and like a breaking

745
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:16,520
Speaker 1: things down or yes, um, you know the first day

746
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:18,600
Speaker 1: was just the superficial muscles of the back, then the

747
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,880
Speaker 1: deeper muscles of the back um, and then maybe we

748
00:43:21,920 --> 00:43:23,520
Speaker 1: turned them over and started doing you know, you do

749
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 1: all the muscles first, you do the extremities. Um. The

750
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:29,160
Speaker 1: forearm is particularly interesting. You see all the muscles and

751
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:31,400
Speaker 1: the tendons, how they go down into the hand, and

752
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:33,680
Speaker 1: you really, you know, look like a puppet from that

753
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:36,640
Speaker 1: perspective of string puppet um. And then you know the

754
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 1: head and the neck. We um we ended up. I

755
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:43,080
Speaker 1: think we saw the head down the middle to look

756
00:43:43,120 --> 00:43:45,480
Speaker 1: at the cross section. And we also used a circular

757
00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:47,879
Speaker 1: saw to like cut down each side of the chest

758
00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:50,400
Speaker 1: and sort of lift the chest off like a plate,

759
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 1: like a big plate to expose the lungs and heart. Um,

760
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:58,600
Speaker 1: regular circular saw. Yeah, just know what kind? I'm not

761
00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:00,480
Speaker 1: even sure do you mean like that? You'd get it

762
00:44:00,520 --> 00:44:03,080
Speaker 1: a hardware store. It looked pretty similar. It didn't say

763
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:06,200
Speaker 1: like Drama on it, but it did look similar and

764
00:44:06,239 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: probably was a knockoff brand of that. Where do they

765
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:11,680
Speaker 1: drain the blood from on a could ever? Like into

766
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:16,520
Speaker 1: I think it's probably just the veins of the neck,

767
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 1: the internal jugular or the subclavian, which are too um,

768
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:22,360
Speaker 1: the two big veins that joined together to make the

769
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:25,840
Speaker 1: superior vena cava. The superior vena cava is sort of

770
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:27,719
Speaker 1: deeper in the chest, so not as accessible, but the

771
00:44:27,719 --> 00:44:30,839
Speaker 1: internal jugular is very easily accessible in the subclavian as well.

772
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:33,600
Speaker 1: We often put large i vs. Called central lines in

773
00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:36,480
Speaker 1: those veins because they're pretty accessible. In the phemeral also

774
00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:39,120
Speaker 1: kind of right there in the ingland O crease, you

775
00:44:39,120 --> 00:44:42,359
Speaker 1: know where your leg meets your torso is another big

776
00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:46,000
Speaker 1: vein drain from or get access to with a big ivy.

777
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:48,120
Speaker 1: You do what I wanted to ask you about. I

778
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:50,200
Speaker 1: didn't listen to you. You have to go on Fresh Air?

779
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 1: I did. Was it Terry girls? So you have to

780
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 1: settle for Dave Davis. It was Terry not knocking them,

781
00:44:58,080 --> 00:45:00,880
Speaker 1: not not no, but my career to go. My career

782
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,719
Speaker 1: goals to go on Fresh Air. But I want to

783
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:07,400
Speaker 1: have the Terry girls. I know. I got very lucky.

784
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:10,399
Speaker 1: I didn't get to go into the studio even though

785
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,759
Speaker 1: she's in Philly. Then I live in West Philly. But

786
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:19,160
Speaker 1: the remote they're doing it remote. Yeah, just I never

787
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:21,880
Speaker 1: listened to it. We talked about, you know, anatomy and

788
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:26,080
Speaker 1: food quite a bit about different my experience of dissecting

789
00:45:26,080 --> 00:45:29,960
Speaker 1: at Caldaver. Huh, maybe you could go on Fresh air

790
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:42,400
Speaker 1: and talk about dejah pooh pitch that just my career goal. Man. Um,

791
00:45:42,680 --> 00:45:46,840
Speaker 1: talk about eating liver or like you point out that

792
00:45:46,880 --> 00:45:48,840
Speaker 1: you can eat everything on a person except the teeth

793
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:51,719
Speaker 1: and the bones. Yeah, I mean they'll you know, if

794
00:45:51,719 --> 00:45:55,160
Speaker 1: you try to bite them. Sorry sorry, not a person.

795
00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:57,759
Speaker 1: I mean you could that do that too. It's like

796
00:45:57,800 --> 00:46:01,480
Speaker 1: it's in imoral. But the nature is a creature is edible,

797
00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:05,240
Speaker 1: barring the what well, I mean, anything that's gonna break

798
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:07,520
Speaker 1: your tooth or stabby in the esophagus when you try

799
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:10,520
Speaker 1: to swallow it. Um, that's the limiting factor. I mean,

800
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:12,880
Speaker 1: you can make a bone broth still, you could boil it,

801
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:15,920
Speaker 1: make the broth, you know, soften it. I mean some bones,

802
00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:18,400
Speaker 1: as you know, are soft enough to just eat. Bigger

803
00:46:18,400 --> 00:46:21,359
Speaker 1: bones not so much. I mean everything everything else or

804
00:46:21,400 --> 00:46:23,640
Speaker 1: as what we call what we would call soft tissue

805
00:46:23,800 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: is just that it's soft, like you can chew it

806
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:29,399
Speaker 1: up and swallow it. It might not be great, I mean,

807
00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:33,320
Speaker 1: as long as it's not overtly toxic. Um. You know,

808
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:36,480
Speaker 1: I wouldn't eat like lungs filled with tuberculosis or something

809
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:40,160
Speaker 1: like that. But but yeah, everything's edible. I mean and

810
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:42,239
Speaker 1: when you when you look around the cuisines around the

811
00:46:42,239 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: world and what body parts they have cooked. I mean

812
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 1: people cook absolutely everything. This boy, it's not like a

813
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:53,479
Speaker 1: goofy question, but like, what is how different is meat

814
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:59,520
Speaker 1: like muscle from liver? Say? Very different? I mean in

815
00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: compass a shie, it's different looking at it. It's different

816
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:04,440
Speaker 1: on the microscopic level. It's different in terms of what

817
00:47:04,520 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 1: it's made of. I mean, the muscle fibers that comprise

818
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: most of meat are just you know, protein laid out

819
00:47:11,800 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 1: in that linear arrangement to contract and create force. And

820
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:16,960
Speaker 1: the liver is kind of just like a bunch of

821
00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:20,839
Speaker 1: cells and veins and arteries and bile ducts. So it's

822
00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:26,680
Speaker 1: pretty different. Tastes different too. Oh yeah, uh, but you

823
00:47:27,120 --> 00:47:30,399
Speaker 1: enjoy eating it? Yeah. I never liked it as a kid,

824
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:32,560
Speaker 1: so just you know, I grew up with my family

825
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:35,040
Speaker 1: eat ate a lot of chopped liver on every holiday,

826
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:37,759
Speaker 1: and I thought it was absolutely gross. And also I

827
00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 1: never like meat. I never thought beyond that that it's

828
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:42,600
Speaker 1: gross and I don't want And I never thought, oh,

829
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:44,600
Speaker 1: this is a liver that came from the abdomen of

830
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 1: an animal, and I have a very similar organ in

831
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:49,319
Speaker 1: my abdomen, and how how interesting I want to learn

832
00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:53,319
Speaker 1: more like chopped liver on toast or on crackers or

833
00:47:53,400 --> 00:47:58,400
Speaker 1: just spoon straight, which is totally you know, acceptable, and

834
00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 1: I do that too. So now now I learned to

835
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:05,200
Speaker 1: like it through through medical school learning all about the liver.

836
00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:06,879
Speaker 1: I mean, you just learned so much about the liver.

837
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:09,200
Speaker 1: I've probably forgotten more about the liver than I know

838
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:12,719
Speaker 1: right now wherever we'll know. And and that got me

839
00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:16,319
Speaker 1: fascinated that, oh, this, you know, this muck that my

840
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:18,719
Speaker 1: family likes to spread on crackers, there is the same

841
00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:22,360
Speaker 1: incredible organ that lives inside of us and inside of

842
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:25,040
Speaker 1: animals and does a million and one even more than

843
00:48:25,080 --> 00:48:26,960
Speaker 1: other organs. The liver does a million and one things

844
00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:30,880
Speaker 1: to keep us healthy from moment to moment. And and

845
00:48:30,920 --> 00:48:34,160
Speaker 1: then that becomes liver or becomes something edible, or you're

846
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:36,920
Speaker 1: eating the exact same thing that that thing is in life.

847
00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:39,120
Speaker 1: And so that realization got me interested, and then I

848
00:48:39,200 --> 00:48:41,200
Speaker 1: learned to like it just by trying it and trying

849
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:46,040
Speaker 1: it again. People point out that what people who don't

850
00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:49,319
Speaker 1: like liver or who think you shouldn't eat liver will

851
00:48:49,320 --> 00:48:51,760
Speaker 1: point out, why would you eat a thing whose job

852
00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 1: it is to filter impurities out of your body, you know,

853
00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:01,520
Speaker 1: which is a great question, right, Well, so it's not

854
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:04,719
Speaker 1: totally accurate. I mean, the liver does metabolize a lot

855
00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:08,239
Speaker 1: of toxins, so for instance, drinking alcohol or taking two

856
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:10,359
Speaker 1: high dose as a tylan all, you know, things that

857
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:13,279
Speaker 1: toxins that come from the outside that we ingest. The

858
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:16,640
Speaker 1: liver is responsible for detoxifying that. And the liver can

859
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:19,439
Speaker 1: be injured in the process of detoxifying it. That's why

860
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:21,800
Speaker 1: it is injured, let's say in the tilean all overdose,

861
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:24,960
Speaker 1: because it's the one detoxifying it and all those sort

862
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:28,240
Speaker 1: of radicals that are produced injure it. But that doesn't

863
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 1: mean that that liver has that toxin in it, and

864
00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:33,000
Speaker 1: if you eat it, you will be you know, you

865
00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 1: will be poisoned. Um And even the liver processes toxins

866
00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:39,400
Speaker 1: that we ourselves make, like we turn over all the

867
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:42,440
Speaker 1: protein in our body constantly. There's a constant turnover, and

868
00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:45,000
Speaker 1: when you break down protein, you create ammonia. It's just

869
00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:48,360
Speaker 1: a natural byproduct because of proteins, the the molecule with

870
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 1: nitrogen in it. Right, Carbs and fat do not have nitrogen,

871
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:53,720
Speaker 1: but protein is the nitrogen containing molecule that were mainly

872
00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:56,640
Speaker 1: made of and so by breaking that down you end

873
00:49:56,680 --> 00:49:59,600
Speaker 1: up with ammonia, which injures your liver, injures your brain,

874
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:02,279
Speaker 1: can kill you if it gets too high. And so

875
00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:05,480
Speaker 1: it's the liver's job to detoxify that. Um, the liver

876
00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:07,360
Speaker 1: can be injured by it as well, because it's the

877
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:09,680
Speaker 1: one that's doing the detoxification. But that does not mean

878
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:12,399
Speaker 1: that eating it will poison you. I mean that being said,

879
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:14,480
Speaker 1: some things are also stored in the liver, which I

880
00:50:14,480 --> 00:50:17,720
Speaker 1: think that's the that's the question, is like some heavy

881
00:50:17,719 --> 00:50:19,919
Speaker 1: metals and other things can be stored in the liver,

882
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:23,279
Speaker 1: and so you might not want to eat those. Why

883
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:26,400
Speaker 1: why why would it be that? Like you shoot a

884
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:30,600
Speaker 1: yearling white tail and the livers like super mild, not

885
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:34,560
Speaker 1: real strong flavors taste good, But then you shoot a

886
00:50:34,640 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: six year old buck and the flavor is just way

887
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:42,800
Speaker 1: stronger and not as pleasant. Is it just stuff building

888
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:45,920
Speaker 1: up over years? Because you said, you know, it's it's

889
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:49,799
Speaker 1: detoxifying in some capacity. So are there things that are

890
00:50:49,840 --> 00:50:53,120
Speaker 1: building up in the liver that cause it to taste

891
00:50:53,200 --> 00:50:55,920
Speaker 1: much different? That's a great question. I do I do

892
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:58,480
Speaker 1: think that is true. You know, older animals, the liver's

893
00:50:58,880 --> 00:51:02,600
Speaker 1: heart like um stronger in flavor and sometimes tougher in texture.

894
00:51:03,200 --> 00:51:05,719
Speaker 1: And I don't know why exactly that is. It could

895
00:51:05,719 --> 00:51:08,440
Speaker 1: also be a normal part of aging, like muscle also

896
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 1: becomes more tough as you age due to things like

897
00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:14,680
Speaker 1: collage and cross linking and other things, so it could

898
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:16,759
Speaker 1: be part of the normal aging process of Also knows

899
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:20,000
Speaker 1: like chicken livers are much softer and almost like drippy.

900
00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:22,200
Speaker 1: If you put a bunch of chicken livers on a skewer,

901
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:24,680
Speaker 1: they're almost like dripping off of it as where like

902
00:51:24,680 --> 00:51:28,040
Speaker 1: a even a young calves liver is not that drippy,

903
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:31,839
Speaker 1: which is more solid. I'm not totally sure why that is.

904
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:38,480
Speaker 1: What about eating kidneys, I think they're good. I just

905
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:41,279
Speaker 1: gotta snip off that little triangle where the renal artery

906
00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:43,839
Speaker 1: and renal vein to the organ. But people say, when

907
00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:47,600
Speaker 1: you eat kidneys, you're eating piss. I don't think that's true.

908
00:51:47,640 --> 00:51:50,799
Speaker 1: Well it's not true. I mean the similar to the liver,

909
00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:54,040
Speaker 1: as we discussed, you know, the your the kidneys make urine.

910
00:51:54,040 --> 00:51:57,359
Speaker 1: They get blood through the renal artery, extract things into

911
00:51:57,440 --> 00:52:00,360
Speaker 1: the urine, and then whatever's left overflows back out to

912
00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:03,680
Speaker 1: the systemic circulation through the renal vein. There's not much

913
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:06,200
Speaker 1: storage for urine in the kidney. It's not like the

914
00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:08,200
Speaker 1: bladders up there in the kidney, right, there's just a

915
00:52:08,239 --> 00:52:11,560
Speaker 1: few little beginnings of what will coalescent to the eurotor,

916
00:52:11,640 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 1: which is the tube that brings urine from the kidney

917
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:17,080
Speaker 1: to the bladder. So there's very minimal space for urine.

918
00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:19,440
Speaker 1: It doesn't really sit in the liver, sort of drains

919
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:23,040
Speaker 1: out immediately, y yes, sorry, in the kidney and whatever

920
00:52:23,120 --> 00:52:25,200
Speaker 1: is left probably when you take it out of the animal.

921
00:52:25,239 --> 00:52:27,960
Speaker 1: Now that the the urtor is like severed, when you

922
00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,080
Speaker 1: take it out of the animal, whatever little bit is

923
00:52:30,120 --> 00:52:34,080
Speaker 1: in there probably drips out immediately. Have you yourself or

924
00:52:34,080 --> 00:52:39,759
Speaker 1: did you ever encounter anybody who had eaten a fetus? Um? No,

925
00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:42,840
Speaker 1: but I am curious about that. I know there's a

926
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:47,400
Speaker 1: Filipino dish called bullute, and and I understand some of

927
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:51,560
Speaker 1: the plains Indians particularly liked what was the fetus? What

928
00:52:51,600 --> 00:52:53,879
Speaker 1: was the fetus from that? You ate? Blue? Is you're

929
00:52:53,920 --> 00:52:59,600
Speaker 1: eating a um embryonic duck? Oh? The Chinese have a

930
00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:05,040
Speaker 1: thing that with chicken and they the I like if

931
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 1: if the if the egg would normally hatch at twenty

932
00:53:08,239 --> 00:53:13,000
Speaker 1: seven days, you're getting you know, my numbers are off.

933
00:53:13,080 --> 00:53:16,080
Speaker 1: Let's say that egg would hatch a days. You know,

934
00:53:16,239 --> 00:53:21,279
Speaker 1: there's fifteen day ballue, there's twenty day ballue, and you're

935
00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:23,239
Speaker 1: when you're eating it, you got you could even be

936
00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 1: so late in the development that you're And this is

937
00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:28,960
Speaker 1: a popular dish in the Philippines, and they also kind

938
00:53:28,960 --> 00:53:31,440
Speaker 1: of like to serve it to outsiders to make them

939
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:34,239
Speaker 1: squirm a little bit. So you're always getting presented with

940
00:53:34,239 --> 00:53:37,759
Speaker 1: with embryonic ducks and you'll be eating it and there's

941
00:53:37,800 --> 00:53:40,040
Speaker 1: like little kind of like you know, there's like bone

942
00:53:40,080 --> 00:53:42,640
Speaker 1: and starting to solidify inside there. I know I didn't

943
00:53:42,680 --> 00:53:45,840
Speaker 1: enjoy it, But you never encounter anybody who was eating

944
00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:50,319
Speaker 1: the fet is from a mammal um. No, I never did.

945
00:53:50,360 --> 00:53:54,320
Speaker 1: I did actually remember in Iceland gathered some wild goose

946
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:56,600
Speaker 1: eggs and boiled them and there were tiny little birds

947
00:53:56,600 --> 00:54:00,040
Speaker 1: inside that we just crunched on through. Um. But I

948
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:03,120
Speaker 1: have read that some of the planes bison hunting Native

949
00:54:03,120 --> 00:54:07,080
Speaker 1: Americans eight fetus um. I got to think of it

950
00:54:07,120 --> 00:54:10,799
Speaker 1: as superveal. It must be delicious. Yeah, there was a

951
00:54:10,840 --> 00:54:14,080
Speaker 1: few dishes I've stumbled into and reading about that. The

952
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:21,360
Speaker 1: thought we're interesting is one, uh, from calves getting the

953
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:26,240
Speaker 1: curdled mother's milk from the stomachs of calves that are nursing.

954
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:29,920
Speaker 1: Is that the same as marrow gut? I don't know, No.

955
00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:33,160
Speaker 1: From the chuck wagon. Um, there is like there's a

956
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:36,359
Speaker 1: dish I think Mexican dish called trepas de lech, which

957
00:54:36,440 --> 00:54:41,280
Speaker 1: is intestine with partially digested milk in it from from youngsters,

958
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:44,279
Speaker 1: from youngsters. Yeah, And there's also in there's this like

959
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:48,960
Speaker 1: the chuck wagons, which used to follow the cowboys around Texas.

960
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:50,759
Speaker 1: I guess they used to cook for them. And there

961
00:54:50,840 --> 00:54:53,080
Speaker 1: was a dish called Son of a Bitch stew that

962
00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:56,080
Speaker 1: supposedly had this ingredient called marrow gut, which is a

963
00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:58,759
Speaker 1: similar It looked like marrow I gather because it was

964
00:54:58,760 --> 00:55:01,200
Speaker 1: sort of a tube filled with this partially digested milk.

965
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:04,120
Speaker 1: So I'm on the sort of researching this to figure

966
00:55:04,160 --> 00:55:05,800
Speaker 1: out what it is. Some people say it's a little

967
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 1: tube that connected the third stomach to the fourth stomach,

968
00:55:09,200 --> 00:55:10,840
Speaker 1: but then in the same breath they'll say it's the

969
00:55:10,840 --> 00:55:12,920
Speaker 1: same as traps lech. And if you ever look up

970
00:55:12,920 --> 00:55:15,160
Speaker 1: a YouTube video someone cooking trapast to let. It is

971
00:55:15,200 --> 00:55:18,160
Speaker 1: not a little tube, it's a really long, clearly intestine,

972
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:20,960
Speaker 1: so I'm not totally sure what that is. We had

973
00:55:21,080 --> 00:55:24,200
Speaker 1: somebody who wrote in um to the podcast that they

974
00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:26,799
Speaker 1: had taken the fetus from a cow elk that they

975
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:30,120
Speaker 1: had killed in the winter, and they described it as

976
00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:32,040
Speaker 1: though they were they had air in their mouth when

977
00:55:32,080 --> 00:55:34,319
Speaker 1: they were eating it. It was so tender and like

978
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:38,680
Speaker 1: almost non existent that they they were just chewing on air. Incredible.

979
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:42,200
Speaker 1: I guess that. I think fetuses and feces might be

980
00:55:42,400 --> 00:55:48,360
Speaker 1: the last frontier for anatomical cuisine. Talk about why you

981
00:55:48,360 --> 00:55:51,640
Speaker 1: can't eat long in America or like why you can't

982
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:56,120
Speaker 1: sell why it's illegal to sell long in America, But

983
00:55:56,120 --> 00:55:58,080
Speaker 1: they're eating it all over the not all over the world.

984
00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:02,040
Speaker 1: Let me let's start this way. Who eats law um?

985
00:56:02,080 --> 00:56:04,280
Speaker 1: Everyone but the US? Now. I think it's also legal

986
00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:07,920
Speaker 1: in Canada actually, but so common things. You'll find it

987
00:56:07,920 --> 00:56:11,840
Speaker 1: in our in hagus. It's an ingredient in haggis from Scotland,

988
00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:17,000
Speaker 1: which is one of the UK's biggest culinary exports besides

989
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:20,320
Speaker 1: Scotch whiskey. Um, which is why they want to overturn

990
00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:22,640
Speaker 1: the law. In the US, there's like because when they

991
00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:26,440
Speaker 1: send their hags over here, they have through a long

992
00:56:26,560 --> 00:56:30,000
Speaker 1: free hags. Correct. So they the US government said either

993
00:56:30,080 --> 00:56:33,960
Speaker 1: submit a scientific brief that shows with rigorous studies that

994
00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:38,440
Speaker 1: lungs are not dangerous to ingest, or create a haggis

995
00:56:38,560 --> 00:56:40,600
Speaker 1: recipe that does not contain lungs. And so obviously they

996
00:56:40,600 --> 00:56:43,040
Speaker 1: went with the ladder since it's much cheaper to do

997
00:56:43,120 --> 00:56:47,880
Speaker 1: that and sub oh yeah, big time, especially like to Canada.

998
00:56:47,880 --> 00:56:50,759
Speaker 1: In the US there's a big you know, descendant of

999
00:56:50,800 --> 00:56:55,200
Speaker 1: Scottish immigrant population. I'm not they think they'd be super

1000
00:56:55,239 --> 00:56:58,359
Speaker 1: interested in haggess. I guess I'm not so sure. But well,

1001
00:56:58,440 --> 00:57:00,239
Speaker 1: the only time I've had it was at a abby

1002
00:57:00,280 --> 00:57:04,080
Speaker 1: Burns festival in the US and they had a hagas

1003
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:06,640
Speaker 1: and it wasn't even in the stomach really, it was

1004
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:08,680
Speaker 1: in like a bag of some sort and no lungs

1005
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:12,560
Speaker 1: in it. Probably what's the long substitute? Then, that's a

1006
00:57:12,600 --> 00:57:15,560
Speaker 1: good question that might be proprietary, though I'm not totally

1007
00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:17,520
Speaker 1: sure what they do. I guess I've heard that lungs

1008
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:21,840
Speaker 1: provide this traditional this desired crumbly texture. To guess that

1009
00:57:22,520 --> 00:57:26,880
Speaker 1: people swear By, And there's somebody in the Hagas marketing

1010
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:29,960
Speaker 1: world sitting over there going, if we can only overturn

1011
00:57:30,040 --> 00:57:34,920
Speaker 1: this law in the US, sales are gonna explode, right

1012
00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:40,240
Speaker 1: dollar bills in his eyes that demands. That's what they think.

1013
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:43,320
Speaker 1: I've like, we've all pulled a bunch of lungs out

1014
00:57:43,320 --> 00:57:47,560
Speaker 1: of various big game animals, and it's hard for me

1015
00:57:47,600 --> 00:57:49,800
Speaker 1: to imagine, like what would happen to it when you

1016
00:57:49,840 --> 00:57:51,480
Speaker 1: cook it? Like if you took a chunk of a

1017
00:57:51,520 --> 00:57:54,080
Speaker 1: deer lung the size of like a piece of pie

1018
00:57:54,160 --> 00:57:56,640
Speaker 1: and threw it in a frying pan, Like I can

1019
00:57:56,640 --> 00:58:01,040
Speaker 1: feel that question, what would happen? I'll tell you. So

1020
00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:06,880
Speaker 1: when I was in so you know, mof Alon, Okay,

1021
00:58:07,960 --> 00:58:10,600
Speaker 1: when MO was working on all the board, like working

1022
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:13,480
Speaker 1: on all the board ain stuff, traveling for that show

1023
00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:16,720
Speaker 1: their eyes wherever the hell and he was somewhere and

1024
00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:19,040
Speaker 1: maybe in North Africa, I can't remember. It was working

1025
00:58:19,080 --> 00:58:25,240
Speaker 1: on no reservations. Was that the first one parts of

1026
00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:29,240
Speaker 1: no Yes, No reservations was before and they're eating all

1027
00:58:29,320 --> 00:58:32,560
Speaker 1: kind of lamb lung wherever he was. So then I

1028
00:58:32,600 --> 00:58:34,240
Speaker 1: was with Mo when we were in New Zealand. We

1029
00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:39,400
Speaker 1: shot a wild wild lamb, and he was real we

1030
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:42,640
Speaker 1: made a big organ scramble and he was real indo

1031
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:46,680
Speaker 1: emphatic about putting dicing up the lung and putting it

1032
00:58:46,680 --> 00:58:53,439
Speaker 1: in there. It's it's frothy, you had brain. There's no cheer, yeah,

1033
00:58:53,480 --> 00:58:56,000
Speaker 1: but there's no like chew to it or anything. It's

1034
00:58:56,040 --> 00:59:00,200
Speaker 1: like it's like a I don't, I haven't on the

1035
00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:02,080
Speaker 1: way that I enjoy it. You have to think about

1036
00:59:02,080 --> 00:59:04,760
Speaker 1: what it's made of, right, like it it had, it

1037
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:08,400
Speaker 1: holds oxygen right, And so I was talking to yeah,

1038
00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:12,000
Speaker 1: when he shot his first book, he said that his

1039
00:59:12,400 --> 00:59:14,200
Speaker 1: you know, dad did all the butchering. He didn't want

1040
00:59:14,200 --> 00:59:16,000
Speaker 1: anyone to touch it and needed to be butchered the

1041
00:59:16,040 --> 00:59:19,360
Speaker 1: proper way with everything preserved because they eat everything. And

1042
00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:22,480
Speaker 1: he was actually saying that there's among dish that includes

1043
00:59:22,520 --> 00:59:25,840
Speaker 1: a whole bunch of oh fall together and the lung.

1044
00:59:27,560 --> 00:59:29,720
Speaker 1: You know, it's kind of like, if I remember correctly,

1045
00:59:29,720 --> 00:59:33,000
Speaker 1: it's almost like a little bit foamy or a little

1046
00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:38,800
Speaker 1: bit slimy to foolish thinking like chocolate mouse when I

1047
00:59:38,960 --> 00:59:42,880
Speaker 1: like seawee or head in my hands. But then cooking

1048
00:59:42,880 --> 00:59:45,200
Speaker 1: the water out would be well, I don't know, I'm

1049
00:59:45,240 --> 00:59:47,120
Speaker 1: sure Jonathan can speak to that. I mean it is

1050
00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:49,680
Speaker 1: the organ is more air than flesh, which makes it

1051
00:59:49,720 --> 00:59:52,800
Speaker 1: a little weird in texture. But I guess I've just

1052
00:59:52,880 --> 00:59:55,680
Speaker 1: thrown a deer lung in the pott. It does firm

1053
00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:57,640
Speaker 1: up a little bit, and you can't take a bite

1054
00:59:57,640 --> 00:59:59,800
Speaker 1: of it. I wouldn't. I mean I did that with

1055
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:03,920
Speaker 1: at any seasoning or anything, just to see what it

1056
01:00:03,920 --> 01:00:06,240
Speaker 1: would the texture would be like. And you can, you know,

1057
01:00:06,320 --> 01:00:08,240
Speaker 1: just like any protein, it sort of firms up when

1058
01:00:08,280 --> 01:00:11,080
Speaker 1: you boil it um and so they did get some

1059
01:00:11,160 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 1: firmness to it and you could cut slices out of

1060
01:00:13,680 --> 01:00:17,920
Speaker 1: it un seasoned. What did it tastes like? Like? Not much?

1061
01:00:19,480 --> 01:00:21,200
Speaker 1: Just yeah, not much. I mean I had like a

1062
01:00:21,240 --> 01:00:24,200
Speaker 1: little bit of a organy, unpleasant taste to it. I

1063
01:00:24,200 --> 01:00:27,400
Speaker 1: would say I have had delicious lungs though. Um. One

1064
01:00:27,440 --> 01:00:31,280
Speaker 1: dish I had in Israel actually at a Bulgarian restaurant.

1065
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:33,760
Speaker 1: It was called Lungs and Juice, and it was basically

1066
01:00:33,800 --> 01:00:38,840
Speaker 1: a tomato juice soup with lungs and they were, yeah,

1067
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:40,600
Speaker 1: kind of cubed up and you could see I was

1068
01:00:40,640 --> 01:00:43,400
Speaker 1: sort of dissecting. You could see airways and how they

1069
01:00:43,440 --> 01:00:47,400
Speaker 1: branch and the lung had broken down into what we'd

1070
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:50,160
Speaker 1: call lobules. You know, lung is broken down into lobes

1071
01:00:50,200 --> 01:00:52,200
Speaker 1: and those are broken down further into lobules, and just

1072
01:00:52,280 --> 01:00:54,520
Speaker 1: like you know, collagen holds the whole thing together like

1073
01:00:54,560 --> 01:00:56,720
Speaker 1: it does everybody parts when you boil it, the college

1074
01:00:56,720 --> 01:00:58,800
Speaker 1: and turns to gelatine and the thing kind of falls apart.

1075
01:00:59,360 --> 01:01:04,440
Speaker 1: But that was actually delicious. So when like, what was

1076
01:01:04,480 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 1: the timeline on the on you not being able to

1077
01:01:06,920 --> 01:01:09,200
Speaker 1: sell the stuff in the US, right, so began in

1078
01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:12,400
Speaker 1: nineteen sixty nine, Uh, the U. S d A decided

1079
01:01:12,440 --> 01:01:14,800
Speaker 1: to determine kind of once and for all, this is

1080
01:01:14,800 --> 01:01:18,280
Speaker 1: the language in the Federal Code, you know, determine if

1081
01:01:18,440 --> 01:01:22,600
Speaker 1: lungs are fit for human consumption or not. And who

1082
01:01:22,640 --> 01:01:25,520
Speaker 1: pushed for this or why is unclear. I did a

1083
01:01:25,520 --> 01:01:27,560
Speaker 1: bunch of research to the National Archives, and it's not

1084
01:01:27,600 --> 01:01:29,600
Speaker 1: clear who or why they pushed for it, but they

1085
01:01:29,600 --> 01:01:32,240
Speaker 1: set up a study where U. S d A pathologists,

1086
01:01:32,800 --> 01:01:36,640
Speaker 1: uh like, in the late sixties started examining livestock lungs

1087
01:01:36,680 --> 01:01:40,280
Speaker 1: specifically from I forget if those calves or or cattle

1088
01:01:40,400 --> 01:01:42,400
Speaker 1: or what age, but um, they took about a hundred

1089
01:01:42,480 --> 01:01:44,880
Speaker 1: or so lungs and started cutting open all the airways

1090
01:01:45,240 --> 01:01:47,040
Speaker 1: kind of all the way down, you know, with a scissor,

1091
01:01:47,160 --> 01:01:48,840
Speaker 1: the same way you would look through lungs. Let's say,

1092
01:01:48,840 --> 01:01:50,440
Speaker 1: as I mentioned, to look for a clot in the

1093
01:01:50,480 --> 01:01:53,640
Speaker 1: branching pulmonary arteries, you can do the same with the airways.

1094
01:01:53,680 --> 01:01:55,160
Speaker 1: So you just cut down the track and then cut

1095
01:01:55,200 --> 01:01:57,320
Speaker 1: down the bronchi and cut down the bronchials and all

1096
01:01:57,360 --> 01:01:59,960
Speaker 1: the way. And they sort of sampled from these deep

1097
01:02:00,040 --> 01:02:04,880
Speaker 1: for deeper airways and found things that alarmed them specifically

1098
01:02:04,920 --> 01:02:10,120
Speaker 1: like uh, pollen that the animal had inhaled dust, fungal spores,

1099
01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:13,840
Speaker 1: and room and contents, so stomach contents had you know,

1100
01:02:13,880 --> 01:02:16,080
Speaker 1: come up the esophagus and down into the lungs, maybe

1101
01:02:16,080 --> 01:02:19,880
Speaker 1: after death, maybe before death. And so because they were

1102
01:02:19,920 --> 01:02:21,960
Speaker 1: in such deep airways, you know, I feel like the

1103
01:02:22,080 --> 01:02:25,520
Speaker 1: USDA is always making decisions on what's practical and what's efficient,

1104
01:02:26,280 --> 01:02:28,600
Speaker 1: um And so they decided that when they do a

1105
01:02:28,600 --> 01:02:31,280
Speaker 1: post mortem examination of an animal and look at the lungs,

1106
01:02:31,280 --> 01:02:33,640
Speaker 1: they're not cutting down into the deep airways. And a

1107
01:02:33,680 --> 01:02:36,640
Speaker 1: significant proportion of these hundred or so animals had these

1108
01:02:36,720 --> 01:02:39,880
Speaker 1: quote contaminants in their deep airways, and so for the

1109
01:02:39,880 --> 01:02:42,440
Speaker 1: sake of efficiency and practicality is that, well, we're not

1110
01:02:42,440 --> 01:02:46,480
Speaker 1: gonna examine every long specimen that deeply, and since a

1111
01:02:46,560 --> 01:02:49,720
Speaker 1: large proportion of them have these quote contaminants, will just

1112
01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:54,080
Speaker 1: ban it completely from you know, human consumption basically, so

1113
01:02:54,120 --> 01:02:57,360
Speaker 1: they declared it unfit for human consumption. That's what the

1114
01:02:57,360 --> 01:03:01,400
Speaker 1: Federal Code says. But this aim declaration that there's no

1115
01:03:01,480 --> 01:03:08,000
Speaker 1: declaration about that about kidney, liver, and testine brain, Well

1116
01:03:08,040 --> 01:03:10,520
Speaker 1: they don't they're not, I guess exposed to those very

1117
01:03:10,560 --> 01:03:15,760
Speaker 1: specifically airborne contaminants. Right, So the lungs are exposed. You know,

1118
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 1: the atmosphere just continues on deep into our chest. It's

1119
01:03:18,440 --> 01:03:21,200
Speaker 1: contiguous with the atmosphere. So whatever is in the atmosphere

1120
01:03:21,200 --> 01:03:24,280
Speaker 1: we're getting in our lungs, including spores and pollen and

1121
01:03:24,400 --> 01:03:27,840
Speaker 1: dust um and our lungs do have a cleaning mechanism.

1122
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:30,200
Speaker 1: In animals and us, we have a what's called the

1123
01:03:30,280 --> 01:03:34,840
Speaker 1: mucociliary elevator or mucus elevator. So are lunglining constantly secretes

1124
01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:39,080
Speaker 1: mucus that flows and picks up all these debris, picks

1125
01:03:39,160 --> 01:03:42,560
Speaker 1: up pollen and spores and whatever, and sort of drags

1126
01:03:42,600 --> 01:03:44,520
Speaker 1: it all the way up the airways, and these these

1127
01:03:44,560 --> 01:03:47,880
Speaker 1: microscopic hairs called celia sort of beat in a very

1128
01:03:47,960 --> 01:03:51,680
Speaker 1: rhythmic pattern that moves the mucus along. The mucus gathers up,

1129
01:03:51,720 --> 01:03:54,560
Speaker 1: the trachea comes into our throat and we subconsciously swallow it.

1130
01:03:54,960 --> 01:03:57,840
Speaker 1: So the lungs are always cleaning themselves through this mechanism.

1131
01:03:57,920 --> 01:04:00,880
Speaker 1: So when you kill an animal, the air born contaminants

1132
01:04:00,920 --> 01:04:02,840
Speaker 1: you find in their lungs at that moment would have

1133
01:04:02,880 --> 01:04:04,880
Speaker 1: been just what they've inhaled. And you know, I don't

1134
01:04:04,880 --> 01:04:07,000
Speaker 1: know the last few minutes, a few hours, because their

1135
01:04:07,040 --> 01:04:11,080
Speaker 1: lungs constantly cleaning itself. But at any specific moment when

1136
01:04:11,120 --> 01:04:13,720
Speaker 1: you kill them, there's some left in there that has

1137
01:04:13,760 --> 01:04:17,040
Speaker 1: not yet been cleared. Um. So then the question is like,

1138
01:04:17,200 --> 01:04:20,160
Speaker 1: is that unhealthy? Well, why would that be determined to

1139
01:04:20,160 --> 01:04:26,160
Speaker 1: be more dangerous than for instance, when you brought Worst.

1140
01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:29,360
Speaker 1: When you brought Worst, it's in a casing, it's in

1141
01:04:29,400 --> 01:04:32,120
Speaker 1: a hog middle. Now if you went and try to

1142
01:04:32,160 --> 01:04:35,680
Speaker 1: find some dangerous stuff, I would go looking around in

1143
01:04:35,720 --> 01:04:40,000
Speaker 1: a hog's gut. Well, they might argue that, well, that

1144
01:04:40,040 --> 01:04:42,560
Speaker 1: gut has been totally cleaned and the inner surface, which

1145
01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:45,160
Speaker 1: is the mucosa has been scraped off and any remnant

1146
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:48,560
Speaker 1: of microbe that might hurt you is totally gone. Maybe

1147
01:04:48,600 --> 01:04:50,200
Speaker 1: they soaked it in you know what, are they soak

1148
01:04:50,240 --> 01:04:52,880
Speaker 1: it in lime or lie or something like that, So

1149
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:54,680
Speaker 1: they'd say you can clean it out real good. Yeah,

1150
01:04:54,720 --> 01:04:56,960
Speaker 1: the lungs you can't clean out specifically in the much

1151
01:04:57,000 --> 01:05:00,920
Speaker 1: deeper airways there, there wasn't like a specific pathogen they

1152
01:05:00,920 --> 01:05:05,520
Speaker 1: were worried about. It was just a general this stuff's

1153
01:05:05,560 --> 01:05:09,960
Speaker 1: not good for humans. Correct, It's always obviously been you

1154
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:12,800
Speaker 1: know U s d A code and the Federal Safety

1155
01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:15,800
Speaker 1: Inspection Service, you know the code about which lungs or

1156
01:05:15,840 --> 01:05:17,840
Speaker 1: which organs must be discarded. You know, if you find

1157
01:05:17,880 --> 01:05:22,000
Speaker 1: actual disease or infection, um, you discard it. So if

1158
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:23,840
Speaker 1: the lung has an abscess you know, I don't know,

1159
01:05:23,880 --> 01:05:28,080
Speaker 1: has assisted worms in, it has whatever evidence of anthrax

1160
01:05:28,240 --> 01:05:31,240
Speaker 1: something like that, obviously that's you know, you should that

1161
01:05:31,240 --> 01:05:34,080
Speaker 1: should be condemned, as they say, um. But yeah, this

1162
01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:37,680
Speaker 1: was just they were afraid of people ingesting literally dust,

1163
01:05:37,880 --> 01:05:40,760
Speaker 1: pollen and fungal sports from the air. So when you

1164
01:05:40,840 --> 01:05:44,160
Speaker 1: found this out, what prevented you from just being from

1165
01:05:44,240 --> 01:05:51,200
Speaker 1: saying to yourself hmm, that's interesting. And then moving on, well,

1166
01:05:51,240 --> 01:05:54,360
Speaker 1: I think so I came at medical school from the

1167
01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:59,200
Speaker 1: like interest in, um, you know, kind of early humans

1168
01:05:59,240 --> 01:06:01,120
Speaker 1: and how we get everything, how we eat everything, how

1169
01:06:01,120 --> 01:06:03,360
Speaker 1: we make everything. So I came to medicine from that,

1170
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:06,120
Speaker 1: and then that combined into my interest in food. So

1171
01:06:06,120 --> 01:06:08,800
Speaker 1: I was bringing my kind of that sort of wilderness

1172
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:13,560
Speaker 1: survival sort of idea with my anatomical and physiologic knowledge

1173
01:06:13,560 --> 01:06:15,760
Speaker 1: that I was learning in medical school, and that made

1174
01:06:15,760 --> 01:06:18,720
Speaker 1: me question these things, you know, I was like, oh,

1175
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:21,280
Speaker 1: is that actually dangerous? Like does that make sense? I

1176
01:06:21,280 --> 01:06:24,400
Speaker 1: guess I'm always questioning everything. Like there's a lot of

1177
01:06:24,400 --> 01:06:27,560
Speaker 1: stuff that we take for granted, dogma that's been passed down.

1178
01:06:27,680 --> 01:06:29,760
Speaker 1: That's true in the medical field. So much of what

1179
01:06:29,800 --> 01:06:33,600
Speaker 1: we do is bullshit for lack of a better term, Um,

1180
01:06:33,640 --> 01:06:36,160
Speaker 1: there's so much dogma. I mean in food, the dog

1181
01:06:36,320 --> 01:06:38,480
Speaker 1: was just off the mean. Give me a couple examples,

1182
01:06:38,480 --> 01:06:42,120
Speaker 1: not medicine or and food. Food Damn, give me, give

1183
01:06:42,160 --> 01:06:46,240
Speaker 1: me a couple of bullshit food beliefs. Um. Well, I

1184
01:06:46,280 --> 01:06:48,800
Speaker 1: would say that the lungs is a great example, Like

1185
01:06:48,880 --> 01:06:51,560
Speaker 1: I don't believe those things are unhealthy in any way

1186
01:06:51,640 --> 01:06:53,720
Speaker 1: to eat and let me just say, when you when

1187
01:06:53,720 --> 01:06:57,400
Speaker 1: your own mucous elevators cleaning out your lungs, your subconsciously

1188
01:06:57,440 --> 01:07:00,280
Speaker 1: swallowing all that stuff anyway, all day, every day of

1189
01:07:00,280 --> 01:07:03,840
Speaker 1: our lives, we're all swallowing everything we inhale subconsciously. And

1190
01:07:03,920 --> 01:07:07,200
Speaker 1: it's unco good point. And it's uncooked right because it's

1191
01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:09,200
Speaker 1: directly from our lungs. If you're going to cook an

1192
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:11,640
Speaker 1: animals lung like, there's no way that's dangerous. I just

1193
01:07:11,680 --> 01:07:15,440
Speaker 1: don't believe it makes no medical sense. Another thing I questioned,

1194
01:07:15,480 --> 01:07:19,760
Speaker 1: like you see this said everywhere, which is that tender

1195
01:07:19,800 --> 01:07:23,960
Speaker 1: cuts come from muscles that the animal used less in life.

1196
01:07:24,400 --> 01:07:28,360
Speaker 1: That makes no anatomic sense. Is it true, because when

1197
01:07:28,400 --> 01:07:31,480
Speaker 1: you don't use a muscle, it atrophies like the bodies.

1198
01:07:31,680 --> 01:07:34,080
Speaker 1: I think it that that statement assumes the body is

1199
01:07:34,120 --> 01:07:37,120
Speaker 1: inefficient and would maintain muscle it's not using or using

1200
01:07:37,280 --> 01:07:40,800
Speaker 1: you know, inadequately. But bodies don't do that. They maintain

1201
01:07:40,880 --> 01:07:44,120
Speaker 1: just the amount of muscle that they need. Um, it's

1202
01:07:44,120 --> 01:07:47,000
Speaker 1: not it's sort of indirectly has a point to make

1203
01:07:47,080 --> 01:07:51,439
Speaker 1: about which muscles have more collagen in them, but it's

1204
01:07:51,440 --> 01:07:53,480
Speaker 1: not that they were used less. So it's it's a

1205
01:07:53,480 --> 01:07:56,840
Speaker 1: little bit of semantics. But you know, I understood think

1206
01:07:56,840 --> 01:08:01,520
Speaker 1: about hard point, medium, rare. Heart is tender, stuffy, some

1207
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:07,480
Speaker 1: bitches working away. You got a big problem if it's not. Yeah,

1208
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:10,280
Speaker 1: that's a great point. And I was sinking to um,

1209
01:08:10,520 --> 01:08:14,000
Speaker 1: tongues are real tender. Yeah, Well, I mean, and it's

1210
01:08:14,000 --> 01:08:16,759
Speaker 1: a hard work and I don't know they work. Doesn't

1211
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:24,840
Speaker 1: seem like it's working away. I think people assume that,

1212
01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:27,679
Speaker 1: you know, muscles from the legs and the arms work

1213
01:08:27,720 --> 01:08:30,000
Speaker 1: a lot as opposed to like say, in a quadruped,

1214
01:08:30,120 --> 01:08:32,560
Speaker 1: the muscles along the spine, like the tender loin or

1215
01:08:32,560 --> 01:08:35,160
Speaker 1: the backstrap don't work as much because they're not upright

1216
01:08:35,200 --> 01:08:37,920
Speaker 1: like us. But I do not believe that's true at all.

1217
01:08:38,000 --> 01:08:40,599
Speaker 1: So when just as I said, the body is constantly

1218
01:08:40,600 --> 01:08:43,800
Speaker 1: remodeling itself and breaking down protein and rebuilding it. If

1219
01:08:43,840 --> 01:08:45,880
Speaker 1: you're not using a muscle, it wastes away. Just like

1220
01:08:46,120 --> 01:08:48,679
Speaker 1: someone has a limb and a cast. For some months

1221
01:08:48,720 --> 01:08:50,680
Speaker 1: they can't use that muscle, and when they take off

1222
01:08:50,680 --> 01:08:53,200
Speaker 1: the cast, it looks like skeletal because all the muscles

1223
01:08:53,200 --> 01:08:55,439
Speaker 1: wasted away. Before we get back into the longs, what

1224
01:08:55,479 --> 01:08:59,280
Speaker 1: does your tender loin do Um, I believe. So the

1225
01:08:59,360 --> 01:09:02,200
Speaker 1: tender loin connects, so it's the so s major muscle,

1226
01:09:02,280 --> 01:09:05,360
Speaker 1: and it kind of combines with the iliachis muscle, which

1227
01:09:05,439 --> 01:09:07,880
Speaker 1: is on the inside your iliac crest. And they go

1228
01:09:07,960 --> 01:09:10,559
Speaker 1: down and test your legs. So I believe it's hip flexion.

1229
01:09:10,840 --> 01:09:14,160
Speaker 1: They're involved in hip flexion. M hmm, that's what a

1230
01:09:14,240 --> 01:09:18,439
Speaker 1: DearS one is. Uh. I believe. So those are tender,

1231
01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:23,639
Speaker 1: very but they're working every time he flexes his hips. Yeah,

1232
01:09:23,960 --> 01:09:26,679
Speaker 1: and I mean even though and so there's another way

1233
01:09:26,720 --> 01:09:29,200
Speaker 1: that meat scientists will say it, which is that locomotive

1234
01:09:29,280 --> 01:09:34,720
Speaker 1: muscles are tougher than postural muscles. So muscles like the

1235
01:09:34,800 --> 01:09:37,479
Speaker 1: legs that make you move are working harder than postural

1236
01:09:37,560 --> 01:09:40,839
Speaker 1: muscles that are maybe just doing small adjustments to your spine,

1237
01:09:41,680 --> 01:09:44,519
Speaker 1: let's say in a quadruped But that also doesn't make sense.

1238
01:09:44,560 --> 01:09:47,439
Speaker 1: You know, when they did these the sheer force tests

1239
01:09:47,479 --> 01:09:49,760
Speaker 1: of all the muscles in the body, they discovered, Oh

1240
01:09:49,760 --> 01:09:53,040
Speaker 1: my god, the flat iron is super tender like um,

1241
01:09:53,040 --> 01:09:55,760
Speaker 1: which surprised everyone. Even though it's a locomotive muscle. It's

1242
01:09:55,760 --> 01:09:58,840
Speaker 1: involved in the the four quarter and there's some other

1243
01:09:58,880 --> 01:10:00,680
Speaker 1: ones in the back of the high nme quarter that

1244
01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:03,240
Speaker 1: they found were super tender. And none of that makes

1245
01:10:03,280 --> 01:10:06,600
Speaker 1: sense with the locomotive postural dichotomy doesn't make sense with

1246
01:10:06,640 --> 01:10:10,280
Speaker 1: the using the muscle more or less dichotomy. I have

1247
01:10:10,360 --> 01:10:13,200
Speaker 1: heard that a hundred million times. Yeah, you hear it

1248
01:10:13,200 --> 01:10:16,000
Speaker 1: absolutely everywhere and it again. It has a point, but

1249
01:10:16,320 --> 01:10:19,480
Speaker 1: anatomically it makes no sense. It assumes the bodies inefficiently

1250
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:22,720
Speaker 1: maintaining a muscle. It's not using or using less than

1251
01:10:22,760 --> 01:10:25,680
Speaker 1: it needs to. To get back to the long thing,

1252
01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:29,160
Speaker 1: you actually took the time to write a letter to

1253
01:10:29,200 --> 01:10:32,639
Speaker 1: the U. S d A to say, you boys got

1254
01:10:32,640 --> 01:10:37,240
Speaker 1: it all wrong on lungs right. Did they take you seriously?

1255
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:40,879
Speaker 1: I haven't heard back yet, though they did acknowledge receipt

1256
01:10:41,160 --> 01:10:44,080
Speaker 1: of the petition. You know you can This is the FSI,

1257
01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:47,240
Speaker 1: Well that's what they call it. You can you know

1258
01:10:47,240 --> 01:10:49,519
Speaker 1: on their website you can submit a petition by emailing

1259
01:10:49,520 --> 01:10:51,720
Speaker 1: this address. Um it's the f s I as the

1260
01:10:51,720 --> 01:10:55,200
Speaker 1: Federal Safety Inspection Service, which sort of, um, you know,

1261
01:10:56,000 --> 01:10:57,800
Speaker 1: creates the rules for what you're supposed to do with

1262
01:10:57,840 --> 01:11:01,439
Speaker 1: different body parts. I submitted this the explanation that I

1263
01:11:01,520 --> 01:11:04,000
Speaker 1: just gave about the mucociliary elevator, and how we're all

1264
01:11:04,040 --> 01:11:06,479
Speaker 1: eating this stuff anyway, and there's no evidence that it's

1265
01:11:06,520 --> 01:11:10,200
Speaker 1: unhealthy in any way, especially cooked. And I submit, you know,

1266
01:11:10,240 --> 01:11:13,320
Speaker 1: I printed out or included a chapter from a lung

1267
01:11:13,360 --> 01:11:16,919
Speaker 1: physiology textbook and highlighted the part about the mucociliary elevator.

1268
01:11:17,720 --> 01:11:20,080
Speaker 1: So let's see, I mean, there's no there's no push this.

1269
01:11:20,080 --> 01:11:22,320
Speaker 1: This law makes no medical sense and it's not keeping

1270
01:11:22,360 --> 01:11:25,519
Speaker 1: anyone safe, but there's no great push to turn it

1271
01:11:25,560 --> 01:11:28,839
Speaker 1: over because no one cares about lungs, only the Haggis

1272
01:11:28,920 --> 01:11:32,320
Speaker 1: lobby apparently, um even I I read. I spoke with

1273
01:11:32,400 --> 01:11:34,680
Speaker 1: the dean of the law school University of Pennsylvania, which

1274
01:11:34,720 --> 01:11:36,400
Speaker 1: is down the street from my house, and he he

1275
01:11:36,479 --> 01:11:38,559
Speaker 1: is a specialist in food and drug law. He never

1276
01:11:38,600 --> 01:11:40,799
Speaker 1: heard of this law, like, no one's ever heard of it.

1277
01:11:40,800 --> 01:11:43,760
Speaker 1: It's just on the books and forgotten. And it's there

1278
01:11:43,760 --> 01:11:46,400
Speaker 1: because of what we call regulatory inertia, like no one's

1279
01:11:46,439 --> 01:11:50,840
Speaker 1: pushing to overturn it. Where where do lungs, like from

1280
01:11:50,880 --> 01:11:53,880
Speaker 1: a slaughterhouse, where do they end up? Like do they

1281
01:11:53,920 --> 01:11:57,479
Speaker 1: get used elsewhere or end up in the trash or

1282
01:11:58,040 --> 01:12:00,040
Speaker 1: so that's a great question actually in the law that

1283
01:12:00,200 --> 01:12:03,320
Speaker 1: bands lungs for human consumption. There's a stipulation that pharmaceutical

1284
01:12:03,360 --> 01:12:06,800
Speaker 1: companies can still get them because they harvest something from

1285
01:12:06,840 --> 01:12:10,600
Speaker 1: them called surfactant, which is a soap like molecule that

1286
01:12:10,640 --> 01:12:13,800
Speaker 1: helps the lungs not collapse when you exhale, and it's

1287
01:12:13,800 --> 01:12:16,600
Speaker 1: actually turned into a drug that is squirted into the

1288
01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:20,479
Speaker 1: tray ch as of premature babies. Um, I've done that before.

1289
01:12:20,960 --> 01:12:22,800
Speaker 1: So one of the last things to develop in your

1290
01:12:22,800 --> 01:12:25,000
Speaker 1: body before you come out of the womb is this surfactant.

1291
01:12:25,640 --> 01:12:27,719
Speaker 1: Because you're not breathing the whole time you're in the womb.

1292
01:12:27,760 --> 01:12:30,320
Speaker 1: You're about to take your first breath. So this surfactant

1293
01:12:30,560 --> 01:12:33,719
Speaker 1: helps the soap like molecule, you know, half is dissolved

1294
01:12:33,720 --> 01:12:37,400
Speaker 1: and water half dissolves and lipids. It keeps the alveoli,

1295
01:12:37,479 --> 01:12:40,280
Speaker 1: the microscopic air sax open when you exhale. Otherwise they

1296
01:12:40,280 --> 01:12:42,960
Speaker 1: would just collapse on themselves. And that's what happens when

1297
01:12:43,040 --> 01:12:45,880
Speaker 1: babies are born premature and don't have surfactant yet, they

1298
01:12:45,920 --> 01:12:49,519
Speaker 1: have respiratory distress syndrome and often have trouble breathing. So

1299
01:12:49,600 --> 01:12:52,120
Speaker 1: you actually take this stuff that is I think there's

1300
01:12:52,160 --> 01:12:55,519
Speaker 1: some synthetic varieties but some are actually still harvested from

1301
01:12:55,800 --> 01:12:59,080
Speaker 1: from bovine lungs, and you literally, you know, like you're

1302
01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:01,360
Speaker 1: intibating someone put a breathing tub and you actually just

1303
01:13:01,400 --> 01:13:03,920
Speaker 1: squirt this stuff and you actually you roll the baby

1304
01:13:03,920 --> 01:13:05,720
Speaker 1: to one side, squired a little in to get into

1305
01:13:05,760 --> 01:13:07,160
Speaker 1: that long and then you roll them over to the

1306
01:13:07,200 --> 01:13:08,880
Speaker 1: other side, squired a little more and to get into

1307
01:13:08,920 --> 01:13:11,760
Speaker 1: that long after they're born, after they're born, immediately after

1308
01:13:11,800 --> 01:13:14,439
Speaker 1: they're born. Actually, well, I guess depending on the eight

1309
01:13:14,479 --> 01:13:17,280
Speaker 1: you might wait to see if they have the respiratory difficulties,

1310
01:13:18,520 --> 01:13:20,400
Speaker 1: or depending on their age, you might just give it

1311
01:13:20,520 --> 01:13:23,200
Speaker 1: because they're very likely to have it if they're very premature.

1312
01:13:23,240 --> 01:13:25,800
Speaker 1: That was written in the law. Yeah, so I've heard

1313
01:13:25,800 --> 01:13:28,720
Speaker 1: a conspiracy theory that the pharmaceutical companies are behind the

1314
01:13:28,840 --> 01:13:35,760
Speaker 1: law they wanted more. Yeah, how much. I don't find

1315
01:13:35,800 --> 01:13:38,080
Speaker 1: that there's no short I think there's no shortage of lunges.

1316
01:13:38,400 --> 01:13:40,960
Speaker 1: There are they synthetic alternatives? Are they used for like

1317
01:13:41,080 --> 01:13:43,680
Speaker 1: dog food or fertilizer or anything like that. So there's

1318
01:13:43,720 --> 01:13:46,519
Speaker 1: dog treats also that are you can see them in

1319
01:13:46,560 --> 01:13:51,760
Speaker 1: grocery stores, like lung dog treats. Yeah, like a drop Yeah,

1320
01:13:52,520 --> 01:13:55,000
Speaker 1: how about a long term v O two max study

1321
01:13:55,040 --> 01:13:59,439
Speaker 1: on these kids with the bovine lung juice shot into them. Yeah,

1322
01:13:59,479 --> 01:14:01,559
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of them do end up with

1323
01:14:01,640 --> 01:14:04,960
Speaker 1: chronic lung issues. I mean I think the the surfactant

1324
01:14:05,000 --> 01:14:07,760
Speaker 1: lessens them. But does isn't you know? Perfectly curative because

1325
01:14:07,760 --> 01:14:10,200
Speaker 1: a lot of those kids still have trouble breathing and

1326
01:14:10,240 --> 01:14:14,080
Speaker 1: need a lot of support. Um, So it's probably much

1327
01:14:14,080 --> 01:14:15,920
Speaker 1: better than it would be if you didn't do it,

1328
01:14:15,920 --> 01:14:18,320
Speaker 1: though I don't know the evidence behind it. Are the

1329
01:14:18,439 --> 01:14:21,280
Speaker 1: specifics of the law that you can't sell long or

1330
01:14:21,320 --> 01:14:23,360
Speaker 1: that you can't eat long? Like can we legally eat

1331
01:14:23,360 --> 01:14:26,720
Speaker 1: the lung from a deer? Yes, there's nothing about It's

1332
01:14:26,800 --> 01:14:29,599
Speaker 1: it's more about selling um or serving in a restaurant,

1333
01:14:29,600 --> 01:14:33,240
Speaker 1: which is sort of indirectly selling um. Wild game or

1334
01:14:33,240 --> 01:14:39,680
Speaker 1: if you slaughter your own you can absolutely eat lung. Uh,

1335
01:14:40,080 --> 01:14:41,920
Speaker 1: this is off lung too. Bath. Look, you might answer,

1336
01:14:41,920 --> 01:14:43,960
Speaker 1: you might know the answer to this question. What does

1337
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:48,160
Speaker 1: all the hubbub um? Do you know about the Do

1338
01:14:48,200 --> 01:14:50,560
Speaker 1: you do you know much about the like non pasteurized

1339
01:14:50,600 --> 01:14:53,920
Speaker 1: milk craze and all that I'm aware of it. I

1340
01:14:53,960 --> 01:14:57,120
Speaker 1: don't know a ton about it. Do you know what's

1341
01:14:57,200 --> 01:15:01,040
Speaker 1: dangerous about it? Um? Well, I know once. I mean,

1342
01:15:01,040 --> 01:15:02,880
Speaker 1: I feel like I was just thinking about this the

1343
01:15:02,880 --> 01:15:04,600
Speaker 1: other day. There's a lot of movement towards you know,

1344
01:15:04,720 --> 01:15:08,320
Speaker 1: raw milk and just everything raw and less process and

1345
01:15:08,400 --> 01:15:12,920
Speaker 1: less over you know, less oversight, less um, pasteurization, whatever,

1346
01:15:13,520 --> 01:15:15,400
Speaker 1: and I think, I mean, there are you know, probably

1347
01:15:15,400 --> 01:15:17,640
Speaker 1: nowadays we have a cleaner food supply than they did

1348
01:15:17,680 --> 01:15:20,120
Speaker 1: a hundred years ago, when these laws are probably more important.

1349
01:15:20,120 --> 01:15:22,559
Speaker 1: But there probably will be some disease. I don't think

1350
01:15:22,560 --> 01:15:24,160
Speaker 1: it will be common, but you know, the risk is

1351
01:15:24,280 --> 01:15:26,960
Speaker 1: very small, I think, not zero. One of the things though,

1352
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:30,479
Speaker 1: is there's actually something called bovine TB where there's a

1353
01:15:30,600 --> 01:15:34,120
Speaker 1: kind of it's um Microbacterium bovis I believe, as opposed

1354
01:15:34,160 --> 01:15:36,720
Speaker 1: to the one that infects humans and I don't I

1355
01:15:36,720 --> 01:15:39,760
Speaker 1: don't know what it's prevalences and cow milk these days

1356
01:15:39,760 --> 01:15:42,240
Speaker 1: in the US, but there is a kind of that

1357
01:15:42,320 --> 01:15:44,120
Speaker 1: kind of tuberculous is that can and it would go

1358
01:15:44,120 --> 01:15:46,759
Speaker 1: to your intestines and cause kind of an intestinal TB

1359
01:15:47,000 --> 01:15:48,519
Speaker 1: or we'd call it a t B and too right,

1360
01:15:48,600 --> 01:15:50,519
Speaker 1: it's not like in the lungs because you're not inhaling it.

1361
01:15:51,400 --> 01:15:54,360
Speaker 1: That was one of the you know, reasons for the

1362
01:15:54,760 --> 01:15:57,439
Speaker 1: processing of milk, and I'm sure there's others as well.

1363
01:15:57,560 --> 01:16:03,880
Speaker 1: I don't know as much about. Uh. When you why, like,

1364
01:16:03,960 --> 01:16:07,519
Speaker 1: do you do you really care about the long issue

1365
01:16:07,920 --> 01:16:10,720
Speaker 1: or is it just academic for you? Well, it's I

1366
01:16:10,760 --> 01:16:13,880
Speaker 1: don't care a lot. I mean, I surely I want

1367
01:16:14,080 --> 01:16:16,920
Speaker 1: the laws of our country to be sensible, especially when

1368
01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:18,920
Speaker 1: they're in the area that I know most about, which

1369
01:16:18,960 --> 01:16:22,680
Speaker 1: is medicine and health. Um, they shouldn't be stupid. I

1370
01:16:22,720 --> 01:16:27,200
Speaker 1: feel like don't be stupid is a good philosophy for laws.

1371
01:16:27,280 --> 01:16:32,280
Speaker 1: But um, I mean part of it's fun. Um maybe

1372
01:16:32,280 --> 01:16:34,360
Speaker 1: bragging rights. If they actually overturn it, I don't know,

1373
01:16:34,600 --> 01:16:36,160
Speaker 1: it would be great. I put it on your resume.

1374
01:16:37,760 --> 01:16:43,639
Speaker 1: Have you followed c W D much a little bit? Yeah? Uh?

1375
01:16:43,680 --> 01:16:48,320
Speaker 1: What's your take on on the idea that that you

1376
01:16:48,360 --> 01:16:52,559
Speaker 1: know those those prions? Are you a prion or preon?

1377
01:16:52,880 --> 01:16:57,960
Speaker 1: Say pry on that the prions. I've heard people smarter

1378
01:16:58,000 --> 01:17:00,800
Speaker 1: than me say pre on though, but I still like saying, okay,

1379
01:17:00,880 --> 01:17:10,000
Speaker 1: the prions that that caused mad cow disease. Uh scrapy uh.

1380
01:17:10,400 --> 01:17:14,600
Speaker 1: Jako Kreutz felt whatever all these things. What is it?

1381
01:17:14,920 --> 01:17:18,040
Speaker 1: Kuru kay? You are you? That's the one that was

1382
01:17:18,080 --> 01:17:20,000
Speaker 1: the common in Papua New Guinea when they would eat

1383
01:17:20,000 --> 01:17:25,759
Speaker 1: their ancestors, eat their relatives. That in an animal, those

1384
01:17:25,880 --> 01:17:34,439
Speaker 1: prions are apparently more prevalent in the nervous system, so

1385
01:17:34,560 --> 01:17:41,120
Speaker 1: more prevalent in brain and spine. So you'll have people

1386
01:17:41,560 --> 01:17:45,479
Speaker 1: like guys like me whatever who maybe used to saw

1387
01:17:46,200 --> 01:17:51,559
Speaker 1: um little chops, little bone in chops, and people be like, oh,

1388
01:17:51,640 --> 01:17:56,240
Speaker 1: don't do that, because you're getting the prions all over everything.

1389
01:17:57,280 --> 01:18:00,000
Speaker 1: Are we? Is that all mental masturbation if you're eating

1390
01:18:00,080 --> 01:18:04,320
Speaker 1: the animal anyway? Well, I think I'm not an expert

1391
01:18:04,320 --> 01:18:07,519
Speaker 1: in this area, but I do think that the danger

1392
01:18:07,680 --> 01:18:11,400
Speaker 1: is very low and might be zero. Um. I mean,

1393
01:18:11,560 --> 01:18:14,200
Speaker 1: I guess when you're cooking it. I mean, prions can

1394
01:18:14,240 --> 01:18:17,679
Speaker 1: survive thousands of degrees they can survive. Can they survive

1395
01:18:17,760 --> 01:18:21,880
Speaker 1: like cooking temperatures that they can survive? No. I heard

1396
01:18:21,920 --> 01:18:24,439
Speaker 1: they can survive the surface of the sun like that.

1397
01:18:26,320 --> 01:18:32,760
Speaker 1: It's like wildly Remember when some politician was making some

1398
01:18:32,800 --> 01:18:37,920
Speaker 1: politician made a thing against c W d UH research

1399
01:18:38,080 --> 01:18:39,800
Speaker 1: and he was saying, we'll just cook your meat, and

1400
01:18:39,840 --> 01:18:41,680
Speaker 1: someone pointed out that you have to be cooking your

1401
01:18:41,680 --> 01:18:45,160
Speaker 1: meat the nine degrees, which is for several hours. I

1402
01:18:45,240 --> 01:18:48,599
Speaker 1: just which is which is way outside the capacity of

1403
01:18:48,640 --> 01:18:54,439
Speaker 1: your average any homeowner, of any homeowners oven is hitting

1404
01:18:54,520 --> 01:18:58,360
Speaker 1: nine degrees. Isn't gonna happen? Well, I guess I'm mistaken

1405
01:18:58,360 --> 01:19:00,880
Speaker 1: about that. But I mean there's a lot of people

1406
01:19:00,920 --> 01:19:04,080
Speaker 1: out there eating similar chops as you, And if there

1407
01:19:04,080 --> 01:19:07,040
Speaker 1: haven't been any cases yet, I'd say that's pretty reassuring.

1408
01:19:07,200 --> 01:19:09,800
Speaker 1: So are you not worried about cw D from it

1409
01:19:09,840 --> 01:19:11,599
Speaker 1: from a eating from I'm not saying you're given I'm

1410
01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:14,920
Speaker 1: not trying to put in given medical device, but when

1411
01:19:15,000 --> 01:19:17,280
Speaker 1: you look at the fact that no one's gotten it

1412
01:19:17,280 --> 01:19:21,920
Speaker 1: from dear meat, Yeah, if you shot if you shot

1413
01:19:21,960 --> 01:19:25,439
Speaker 1: one and got it tested, would you just like you

1414
01:19:25,560 --> 01:19:27,280
Speaker 1: personally would just be like to health that I'm eating

1415
01:19:27,280 --> 01:19:30,680
Speaker 1: it anyway, like and I know that it has CWD

1416
01:19:30,840 --> 01:19:36,439
Speaker 1: this animal good question. Honestly, I would probably not eat

1417
01:19:36,479 --> 01:19:41,479
Speaker 1: the nervous tissue in that case, but you eat the meat. Maybe,

1418
01:19:41,600 --> 01:19:52,840
Speaker 1: I guess I would have to do more research. Well,

1419
01:19:52,880 --> 01:19:55,920
Speaker 1: here's one for you, jumping back to our milk question. Okay,

1420
01:19:57,160 --> 01:20:02,600
Speaker 1: the Journal Tuberculosis Independent Study. They you know, gathered a

1421
01:20:02,600 --> 01:20:06,519
Speaker 1: bunch of studies from two thousand sixty seven articles eighty

1422
01:20:06,600 --> 01:20:15,599
Speaker 1: three studies and found a consensus of five percent uh

1423
01:20:15,960 --> 01:20:20,800
Speaker 1: milk would be infected with with bovine TV if it

1424
01:20:20,840 --> 01:20:25,160
Speaker 1: wasn't pasteurized, If it wasn't pasteurized, I guess that a

1425
01:20:25,240 --> 01:20:28,160
Speaker 1: gamble you'd be willing to take, good question. I guess

1426
01:20:28,160 --> 01:20:30,479
Speaker 1: I'd want to know what, you know, do all of

1427
01:20:30,520 --> 01:20:32,960
Speaker 1: those have an infectious dose worth in them? How much

1428
01:20:33,000 --> 01:20:35,240
Speaker 1: you'd have to drink to get infected? And what's the

1429
01:20:35,760 --> 01:20:37,439
Speaker 1: you know, what's the infection rate? I mean, a bunch

1430
01:20:37,439 --> 01:20:39,240
Speaker 1: of humans drink salmonella and not all of them are

1431
01:20:39,240 --> 01:20:42,240
Speaker 1: gonna get sick. So I guess you know, it's always

1432
01:20:42,240 --> 01:20:45,519
Speaker 1: a percentage. Yeah, Salmonilla was a big one when I

1433
01:20:45,560 --> 01:20:50,960
Speaker 1: was punching in milk, like, yeah, salmonilla is the seems

1434
01:20:51,000 --> 01:20:55,320
Speaker 1: to raise more hairs than bovine TV does. I spent

1435
01:20:55,400 --> 01:20:58,120
Speaker 1: some time with a I did a story years ago

1436
01:20:58,160 --> 01:21:02,000
Speaker 1: about livestock theft out of wrestling, and I got to

1437
01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:05,759
Speaker 1: spend much time with the stock detective in California, also

1438
01:21:05,760 --> 01:21:10,720
Speaker 1: an idol. But this guy in California had been tasked

1439
01:21:10,840 --> 01:21:18,160
Speaker 1: with breaking up these little non pasteurized milk schemes, and

1440
01:21:18,200 --> 01:21:21,400
Speaker 1: the way it goes is this undercover well it checked

1441
01:21:21,400 --> 01:21:23,360
Speaker 1: this out. So here's how they get around it. You

1442
01:21:23,400 --> 01:21:28,040
Speaker 1: don't buy the milk. You buy a share of a cow,

1443
01:21:30,120 --> 01:21:35,400
Speaker 1: and then you get your portion of your You get

1444
01:21:35,439 --> 01:21:41,280
Speaker 1: your shares worth of your cow's milk because you own it. Okay.

1445
01:21:41,640 --> 01:21:45,360
Speaker 1: So I have a dairy cow, I sell ten shares

1446
01:21:45,640 --> 01:21:49,160
Speaker 1: to people and then they get one tenth of that

1447
01:21:49,240 --> 01:21:54,040
Speaker 1: dairy cow's output. I haven't sold them the milk. I

1448
01:21:54,080 --> 01:21:56,800
Speaker 1: haven't sold them the raw milk. I've sold that. I've

1449
01:21:56,800 --> 01:21:58,840
Speaker 1: just told them part of my cow. What they do

1450
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:03,920
Speaker 1: with their cow's milk because their business. Okay. When he

1451
01:22:04,000 --> 01:22:08,080
Speaker 1: was working these little schemes, um, what he started doing

1452
01:22:08,200 --> 01:22:11,479
Speaker 1: was finding out who are okay, who are the owners?

1453
01:22:12,840 --> 01:22:16,200
Speaker 1: Give me their names. I'd like to go visit with

1454
01:22:16,280 --> 01:22:20,720
Speaker 1: them and and see their brand, inspection papers and all

1455
01:22:20,760 --> 01:22:24,680
Speaker 1: their paperwork for the cow that they own, which for

1456
01:22:26,640 --> 01:22:30,679
Speaker 1: any idea what he was talking about, so you yeah,

1457
01:22:30,760 --> 01:22:34,519
Speaker 1: it was like, so you don't own the cow because

1458
01:22:34,560 --> 01:22:38,479
Speaker 1: you don't have anything that signifies your legal ownership of

1459
01:22:38,600 --> 01:22:41,880
Speaker 1: livestock registered to the state. And that was how they

1460
01:22:41,880 --> 01:22:45,880
Speaker 1: got after these milk shares that's a I don't mean

1461
01:22:45,920 --> 01:22:49,479
Speaker 1: the stereotype, but that's that's a real hippie business. But

1462
01:22:49,560 --> 01:22:51,720
Speaker 1: that that's probably one of those. That's one of those

1463
01:22:51,760 --> 01:22:55,599
Speaker 1: areas where the left, the radical left, and the radical

1464
01:22:55,680 --> 01:22:59,920
Speaker 1: right come around and meet. They come around and meet

1465
01:23:00,160 --> 01:23:03,559
Speaker 1: like in a weird land, because like hippies are you know,

1466
01:23:03,680 --> 01:23:07,439
Speaker 1: like natural is good, right then on the rights, on

1467
01:23:07,479 --> 01:23:09,760
Speaker 1: the left you got like everything anything natural is good.

1468
01:23:10,040 --> 01:23:12,120
Speaker 1: On the right, you got the garment. Can't tell me

1469
01:23:12,160 --> 01:23:15,080
Speaker 1: what to do. They don't want me eating raw milk,

1470
01:23:15,120 --> 01:23:18,000
Speaker 1: therefore I'm gonna eat it. And they come back around

1471
01:23:18,000 --> 01:23:21,639
Speaker 1: and they meet where hippies meet. It's like the crazy

1472
01:23:21,680 --> 01:23:29,200
Speaker 1: ass right wing people. That that would be like a

1473
01:23:29,320 --> 01:23:32,240
Speaker 1: great um You'd never be able selled as a TV show,

1474
01:23:32,280 --> 01:23:34,360
Speaker 1: but it would be a good book if you did

1475
01:23:34,439 --> 01:23:41,559
Speaker 1: ten chapters and each chapter was where crazy ass hippies

1476
01:23:42,880 --> 01:23:46,519
Speaker 1: and super right wingers meet up and just spend time

1477
01:23:46,520 --> 01:23:49,080
Speaker 1: in those ten worlds. That's what I love about dive

1478
01:23:49,160 --> 01:23:52,519
Speaker 1: bars in Bozeman, like during ski season, is that you

1479
01:23:52,560 --> 01:23:55,040
Speaker 1: are at the bottom of the horseshoe for both sides,

1480
01:23:55,280 --> 01:23:57,400
Speaker 1: like especially if you go to like Stacy's or something

1481
01:23:57,760 --> 01:24:01,120
Speaker 1: like the the Horseshoe is very apparent. It's great. I

1482
01:24:01,160 --> 01:24:02,720
Speaker 1: used to go to a bar in Missoula and it

1483
01:24:02,760 --> 01:24:07,920
Speaker 1: was like ranchers and earth firsters, you know, And I

1484
01:24:07,920 --> 01:24:08,960
Speaker 1: always want to be like, do you know what the

1485
01:24:09,000 --> 01:24:17,400
Speaker 1: guy down the bar does? He keeps buying around? Yeah,

1486
01:24:17,479 --> 01:24:19,160
Speaker 1: I gotta think about that book where I might be

1487
01:24:19,200 --> 01:24:22,040
Speaker 1: on something. Man, there's some good would be called the

1488
01:24:22,040 --> 01:24:25,120
Speaker 1: Bottom of the Horseshoe. Yeah, you gotta like Stacy's like

1489
01:24:25,200 --> 01:24:27,160
Speaker 1: this time of your ski season. You'll have fellas that

1490
01:24:27,200 --> 01:24:30,280
Speaker 1: are in like cowboy hats and chaps like real cowboys,

1491
01:24:30,479 --> 01:24:33,240
Speaker 1: and they'll be listen, there's no real cowboy at a

1492
01:24:33,280 --> 01:24:36,360
Speaker 1: bar and chaps I have the point and they'll be bellied.

1493
01:24:37,320 --> 01:24:41,519
Speaker 1: You might be a different kind of bar like. So

1494
01:24:41,560 --> 01:24:50,080
Speaker 1: it's like, but they have had Spencer. I'd like to

1495
01:24:50,080 --> 01:24:53,679
Speaker 1: show you the hitching posts you got me there. They'll

1496
01:24:53,680 --> 01:24:55,519
Speaker 1: be bellied up next to somebody who's got like a

1497
01:24:55,600 --> 01:24:58,680
Speaker 1: Hemp sweatshirt and dreadlocks. And it's great. I love it.

1498
01:24:58,840 --> 01:25:00,960
Speaker 1: That book idea is so good you just might want

1499
01:25:00,960 --> 01:25:04,479
Speaker 1: to edit it out of this podcast. Man. Plus, I mean,

1500
01:25:04,520 --> 01:25:06,360
Speaker 1: I'm gonna piss enough people off to her, you know,

1501
01:25:06,439 --> 01:25:10,080
Speaker 1: its gonna sell real, Well, it's good ship. Do we

1502
01:25:10,120 --> 01:25:12,120
Speaker 1: cut it out, Phil or do you think me talking

1503
01:25:12,120 --> 01:25:16,200
Speaker 1: about it has gotten Here's the thing. I am writing

1504
01:25:16,640 --> 01:25:22,120
Speaker 1: a book your helmet, Okay, just started it. I have

1505
01:25:22,280 --> 01:25:25,120
Speaker 1: the gun work on a book called the Bottom of

1506
01:25:25,160 --> 01:25:28,799
Speaker 1: the Horseshoe, and it is about where crazy ass hippies

1507
01:25:28,840 --> 01:25:37,240
Speaker 1: and radical right wingers meet, guns, unpasteurized milk, home school vaccines.

1508
01:25:37,439 --> 01:25:39,680
Speaker 1: It exists. I've I've actually read the first chapter. It's

1509
01:25:39,760 --> 01:25:43,640
Speaker 1: it's just says chapter one. It's great The Bottom of

1510
01:25:43,640 --> 01:25:46,720
Speaker 1: the horse Shoe Steven Ronella where it's the subtitles where

1511
01:25:46,760 --> 01:25:50,400
Speaker 1: crazy ass hippies and radical right wingers agree. It includes

1512
01:25:50,520 --> 01:25:56,200
Speaker 1: chapters on firearms, um, oh, chickens, backyard chickens would be

1513
01:25:56,200 --> 01:26:03,520
Speaker 1: a great backyard chickens, vaccines, elk, non pasteurized milk, homeschooling.

1514
01:26:05,040 --> 01:26:15,479
Speaker 1: I'll think it's more. That's kind of Livingstone's whole tourism campaign. Literally, yeah,

1515
01:26:15,520 --> 01:26:19,439
Speaker 1: we're artists, artists and cowboys meet, yeah, or something like that.

1516
01:26:20,080 --> 01:26:23,040
Speaker 1: So Dr Rice, and what's your uh now that you've

1517
01:26:23,040 --> 01:26:27,080
Speaker 1: become familiar over the last six years with with hunters hunters, okay,

1518
01:26:27,120 --> 01:26:32,280
Speaker 1: in wild game consumption, what are your um, what are

1519
01:26:32,280 --> 01:26:35,519
Speaker 1: your warnings? And your hot tips for people that that

1520
01:26:35,720 --> 01:26:38,280
Speaker 1: butcher their own stuff, eat their own stuff. Do you

1521
01:26:38,320 --> 01:26:41,000
Speaker 1: see our community doing ship where you're like, I would

1522
01:26:41,080 --> 01:26:46,559
Speaker 1: not do that from a medical professional standpoint, or where

1523
01:26:46,560 --> 01:26:52,400
Speaker 1: you're like, I wonder why those people don't do that? Um, well,

1524
01:26:53,200 --> 01:26:56,040
Speaker 1: I guess you know, all doctors give advice based on

1525
01:26:56,080 --> 01:26:59,000
Speaker 1: their own levels of fear and worry and things, and

1526
01:26:59,040 --> 01:27:02,000
Speaker 1: I kind of don't worry too much about those things.

1527
01:27:02,040 --> 01:27:05,519
Speaker 1: I mean, I you know, process animals, gut hums and

1528
01:27:05,720 --> 01:27:10,040
Speaker 1: butcher them without gloves. I do. I mean maybe I shouldn't.

1529
01:27:10,040 --> 01:27:11,880
Speaker 1: I mean, when I was in India, I also ate

1530
01:27:12,160 --> 01:27:15,519
Speaker 1: everything street food. You know, the restaurants with more roaches

1531
01:27:15,560 --> 01:27:18,960
Speaker 1: had the better food. Honestly, Um, I'm just not like

1532
01:27:19,600 --> 01:27:21,760
Speaker 1: nervous about those things. Maybe it should be more so,

1533
01:27:22,280 --> 01:27:25,200
Speaker 1: but my usually, like with milk, I kind of feel

1534
01:27:25,240 --> 01:27:27,640
Speaker 1: like the people who are saying it's dangerous or exaggerating,

1535
01:27:27,640 --> 01:27:29,360
Speaker 1: and the people who say it's going to make you

1536
01:27:29,400 --> 01:27:33,200
Speaker 1: live forever or exaggerating, I kind of think everyone's just exaggerating.

1537
01:27:33,479 --> 01:27:36,640
Speaker 1: So you don't you don't impulsively put on not impulsively,

1538
01:27:36,680 --> 01:27:39,240
Speaker 1: you don't in a calculated fash and put latex gloves

1539
01:27:39,240 --> 01:27:41,960
Speaker 1: on one handling game. I don't. I mean, I guess

1540
01:27:42,000 --> 01:27:45,559
Speaker 1: sometimes when I'm trying to keep the fur and you know,

1541
01:27:45,680 --> 01:27:49,200
Speaker 1: tarso glands off the meat and stuff like that, sometimes

1542
01:27:49,200 --> 01:27:52,200
Speaker 1: I will, but not because I'm afraid of like hurting,

1543
01:27:52,400 --> 01:27:56,560
Speaker 1: you know, getting any contracting a disease myself. But that

1544
01:27:56,760 --> 01:27:59,479
Speaker 1: I'm just kind of like not not like a nervous,

1545
01:27:59,479 --> 01:28:05,000
Speaker 1: precautious person, pre cautious, nervous Nellie. I'm not who is

1546
01:28:05,080 --> 01:28:12,320
Speaker 1: Nellie nervous Nellie? There's a nervous ned both. I don't know.

1547
01:28:12,880 --> 01:28:16,760
Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever heard ned. Yeah, pick your audience, though,

1548
01:28:17,000 --> 01:28:20,280
Speaker 1: we'll get it. So there's that one. What about if

1549
01:28:20,280 --> 01:28:22,400
Speaker 1: you're eating a whole bunch of bone marrow all the time?

1550
01:28:22,439 --> 01:28:25,320
Speaker 1: Is that super bad for you? Not that I know of.

1551
01:28:25,640 --> 01:28:28,840
Speaker 1: It's delicious. Why what what's the danger? I don't know. Man,

1552
01:28:28,840 --> 01:28:30,760
Speaker 1: when we've got into eating love, but I always felt

1553
01:28:30,760 --> 01:28:34,200
Speaker 1: like I was doing something bad. I'm not sure you know,

1554
01:28:34,200 --> 01:28:37,440
Speaker 1: I'm sure you know infectious disease or food inspection specialists

1555
01:28:37,520 --> 01:28:40,280
Speaker 1: might specialist might have more to say. I've been saying

1556
01:28:40,280 --> 01:28:42,479
Speaker 1: eat all thee you want. I've been making a lot

1557
01:28:42,520 --> 01:28:47,240
Speaker 1: of duck stock lately, and I have found that the

1558
01:28:47,360 --> 01:28:51,280
Speaker 1: duck stock is better like the nasty or your duck

1559
01:28:51,320 --> 01:28:56,200
Speaker 1: carcasses look on the way in. So like basically, all

1560
01:28:56,240 --> 01:28:58,519
Speaker 1: I do at this point is make sure that that

1561
01:28:59,200 --> 01:29:01,519
Speaker 1: the end of the aggestive tract is out of there,

1562
01:29:02,160 --> 01:29:05,879
Speaker 1: so it's basically poop free. But there's no rinse involved

1563
01:29:05,960 --> 01:29:10,519
Speaker 1: or anything like that. But there's chunks along kidneys, you know,

1564
01:29:10,800 --> 01:29:14,680
Speaker 1: lots of congealed blood stuff like that, and that does

1565
01:29:15,680 --> 01:29:18,320
Speaker 1: I mean, it doesn't smell good on the way am,

1566
01:29:18,400 --> 01:29:20,160
Speaker 1: But I'll roast a batch or I'll just throw it

1567
01:29:20,160 --> 01:29:22,920
Speaker 1: all in the pressure cooker or roast it and then

1568
01:29:22,920 --> 01:29:25,719
Speaker 1: put it in the pressure cooker, and it is within

1569
01:29:25,840 --> 01:29:30,800
Speaker 1: five minutes of basically heating that stuff it you're ready

1570
01:29:30,840 --> 01:29:35,479
Speaker 1: to dig in. It's awesome. You're taking You're roasting in

1571
01:29:35,520 --> 01:29:37,439
Speaker 1: the oven the carcasses just to put a little brown

1572
01:29:37,520 --> 01:29:40,640
Speaker 1: on them. And then you're pressure cooking yours just just

1573
01:29:40,720 --> 01:29:44,840
Speaker 1: for the speed. For how long you're doing it half

1574
01:29:44,880 --> 01:29:46,960
Speaker 1: an hour, you know, because I'm trying to put a

1575
01:29:46,960 --> 01:29:48,800
Speaker 1: lot of liquid in there too, so and then you're

1576
01:29:48,840 --> 01:29:51,640
Speaker 1: siving it off and clarifying it and ship. Yeah, I'm

1577
01:29:51,640 --> 01:29:54,880
Speaker 1: not a big clarifying like the clarifying with the egg yolks.

1578
01:29:54,880 --> 01:29:57,479
Speaker 1: You don't do any now. No, I like it. Well,

1579
01:29:57,720 --> 01:30:00,560
Speaker 1: like the stock to look like it's gonna provide some

1580
01:30:01,600 --> 01:30:06,080
Speaker 1: cloud stock. Where are you guys at in the medical

1581
01:30:06,080 --> 01:30:08,160
Speaker 1: world right now about eating all kind of animal fat.

1582
01:30:09,720 --> 01:30:13,400
Speaker 1: Things seem to be in flux. Um, I know, like,

1583
01:30:13,439 --> 01:30:16,759
Speaker 1: for instance, with salt. I spoke to a nutrition researcher

1584
01:30:16,800 --> 01:30:20,120
Speaker 1: from Canada a few weeks back, and it seems like,

1585
01:30:20,200 --> 01:30:23,120
Speaker 1: you know, I guess they did the largest study ever,

1586
01:30:23,760 --> 01:30:27,920
Speaker 1: multinational study, you know, better high quality study, better ability

1587
01:30:27,960 --> 01:30:31,360
Speaker 1: to compute the data than ever before, and found that

1588
01:30:31,479 --> 01:30:34,559
Speaker 1: basic You know, everyone agrees that super high salt is bad.

1589
01:30:34,560 --> 01:30:36,280
Speaker 1: But I guess the question is where's the cut off?

1590
01:30:36,800 --> 01:30:39,200
Speaker 1: And the cut off this study suggested that cut off

1591
01:30:39,200 --> 01:30:41,479
Speaker 1: people have been giving is much too low. Like you

1592
01:30:41,479 --> 01:30:43,479
Speaker 1: can have more AsSalt than people have been saying and

1593
01:30:44,200 --> 01:30:47,920
Speaker 1: suffer no ill consequences. I do think, you know, there's

1594
01:30:47,920 --> 01:30:50,799
Speaker 1: a lot more coming out on saturated fat and stuff

1595
01:30:50,840 --> 01:30:53,760
Speaker 1: like that. I feel like the whole nutrition world is

1596
01:30:53,800 --> 01:30:56,600
Speaker 1: in flux, and people think doctors are a bunch of

1597
01:30:56,680 --> 01:30:59,759
Speaker 1: idiots on nutrition and they're correct. Um, I think people

1598
01:30:59,760 --> 01:31:01,880
Speaker 1: don't what to think, and honestly, most doctors don't want

1599
01:31:01,920 --> 01:31:06,040
Speaker 1: to think either, So I would say, eat animal fat.

1600
01:31:06,720 --> 01:31:08,880
Speaker 1: Do you picture a world in the future where all

1601
01:31:08,880 --> 01:31:14,080
Speaker 1: of a sudden, um, someone's like, damn sugar, lots of sugar,

1602
01:31:14,280 --> 01:31:17,080
Speaker 1: super good for you. Like one of the things that

1603
01:31:17,080 --> 01:31:19,519
Speaker 1: that we right now think are bad, that you think

1604
01:31:19,560 --> 01:31:21,320
Speaker 1: will always be bad. And what do you think are

1605
01:31:21,400 --> 01:31:23,559
Speaker 1: kind of basils when you look at it, Well, like

1606
01:31:23,640 --> 01:31:27,600
Speaker 1: saturated fat, cholesterol was and salt were sort of the

1607
01:31:27,640 --> 01:31:31,400
Speaker 1: old enemies. Um, and now it seems like sugar is

1608
01:31:31,439 --> 01:31:34,160
Speaker 1: more of an enemy. You know. Cholester the new and

1609
01:31:34,200 --> 01:31:36,400
Speaker 1: better I guess the thing is they're doing new, better

1610
01:31:36,479 --> 01:31:40,439
Speaker 1: and bigger studies with better methodology, better ability to compute

1611
01:31:40,520 --> 01:31:43,280
Speaker 1: and process the huge amounts of data, and they're finding

1612
01:31:43,320 --> 01:31:45,000
Speaker 1: that a lot of the old studies are not not

1613
01:31:45,080 --> 01:31:47,840
Speaker 1: so great. So, you know, cholesterol, eating it does not

1614
01:31:48,080 --> 01:31:52,120
Speaker 1: change your cholesterol. It's eating cholesterol does not change your cholesterol. Correct,

1615
01:31:52,160 --> 01:31:55,280
Speaker 1: it seems with the latest studies. That's why we thought

1616
01:31:55,280 --> 01:31:56,760
Speaker 1: bone marrows. I don't know what. I don't even know

1617
01:31:56,760 --> 01:31:58,400
Speaker 1: if it has a lot, but that's why we thought

1618
01:31:58,400 --> 01:32:00,360
Speaker 1: bone marrow was bad. I know it has a lot

1619
01:32:00,400 --> 01:32:03,240
Speaker 1: of saturated fat. I'm not totally sure about cholesterol content,

1620
01:32:03,479 --> 01:32:06,160
Speaker 1: but um, yeah, I mean I think I would say,

1621
01:32:06,280 --> 01:32:08,960
Speaker 1: if you're being truly scientific, you should never say network

1622
01:32:09,080 --> 01:32:11,320
Speaker 1: will never think sugar is good for you. I mean

1623
01:32:11,360 --> 01:32:13,280
Speaker 1: that you should never say never because you never know.

1624
01:32:13,360 --> 01:32:15,400
Speaker 1: I mean, you should do large studies and see what

1625
01:32:15,479 --> 01:32:19,280
Speaker 1: they show. But I kind of I eat saturated fat.

1626
01:32:19,400 --> 01:32:20,760
Speaker 1: I don't you know. I feel like when I was

1627
01:32:20,760 --> 01:32:23,560
Speaker 1: a medical student advising my primary care patients, it was

1628
01:32:23,600 --> 01:32:27,000
Speaker 1: sort of like, eat more greens, you know, but don't

1629
01:32:27,200 --> 01:32:29,639
Speaker 1: fry it in anything that will make it actually taste good.

1630
01:32:29,800 --> 01:32:30,960
Speaker 1: I feel like they're gonna be like, what are you

1631
01:32:31,000 --> 01:32:33,080
Speaker 1: kidding me? Like, I'm just gonna continue eating what I

1632
01:32:33,120 --> 01:32:35,519
Speaker 1: was like. Um, I feel like if you tell people like,

1633
01:32:35,600 --> 01:32:38,200
Speaker 1: fry your vegetables and bacon fat, they'll probably eat a

1634
01:32:38,200 --> 01:32:42,280
Speaker 1: lot more vegetables, and I think overall that might be healthier.

1635
01:32:42,760 --> 01:32:45,280
Speaker 1: Got got that's my own again, my own personal take.

1636
01:32:45,320 --> 01:32:48,160
Speaker 1: Every doctor has their own style, and the science is

1637
01:32:48,240 --> 01:32:51,160
Speaker 1: so in flux. The evidences in flux. I know you've

1638
01:32:51,160 --> 01:32:55,840
Speaker 1: had strictly carnivore people on this podcast before, Yeah, but

1639
01:32:56,000 --> 01:32:59,519
Speaker 1: I don't know that that's Yeah, it seems a little extreme.

1640
01:32:59,560 --> 01:33:04,960
Speaker 1: To me, I in my long absence from the podcast,

1641
01:33:04,960 --> 01:33:10,040
Speaker 1: have you guys covered the the recent find of like

1642
01:33:10,200 --> 01:33:14,479
Speaker 1: Paleo man and their diet, like all the interesting things

1643
01:33:14,479 --> 01:33:21,080
Speaker 1: that popped up and a big basically like of of

1644
01:33:21,280 --> 01:33:25,679
Speaker 1: like actual meal making, right and this just this concurring

1645
01:33:25,720 --> 01:33:28,360
Speaker 1: theme that we have, that long, long running theme of

1646
01:33:28,760 --> 01:33:33,880
Speaker 1: um like Neanderthal, right like, now we have a better

1647
01:33:33,920 --> 01:33:38,960
Speaker 1: picture of the fact that Neanderthal was combining ingredients at

1648
01:33:39,000 --> 01:33:45,120
Speaker 1: the old time versus this carnivore belief of it was

1649
01:33:45,200 --> 01:33:48,559
Speaker 1: just pure protein, animal protein, animal fat all the time

1650
01:33:49,200 --> 01:33:52,400
Speaker 1: or there was nothing. They're using grains and other things

1651
01:33:52,479 --> 01:33:55,280
Speaker 1: and making like what one might describe as a recipe

1652
01:33:56,000 --> 01:33:59,400
Speaker 1: right right, Like it's a we have a better picture

1653
01:33:59,400 --> 01:34:03,120
Speaker 1: now of that was very likely, which if you do

1654
01:34:03,320 --> 01:34:06,040
Speaker 1: think about it, like if you watch a small child

1655
01:34:06,840 --> 01:34:10,960
Speaker 1: or any other animal wander around like they're constantly try

1656
01:34:11,000 --> 01:34:16,080
Speaker 1: and stuff, it's hard to imagine Neanderthal was like nope,

1657
01:34:16,680 --> 01:34:20,960
Speaker 1: like I'd rather starve. Yeah, I think you need to

1658
01:34:20,960 --> 01:34:23,679
Speaker 1: take it into larger context of activity level and what

1659
01:34:23,840 --> 01:34:26,240
Speaker 1: you know, just the diet overall. But I feel like

1660
01:34:26,240 --> 01:34:29,160
Speaker 1: a mixed diet variety is good, you know, like the

1661
01:34:29,160 --> 01:34:31,760
Speaker 1: the Inuit ate a super high fat diet in the

1662
01:34:31,800 --> 01:34:34,320
Speaker 1: past and needed it. Do they need it today? You know,

1663
01:34:34,560 --> 01:34:36,720
Speaker 1: where they're not expending as many calories. I guess it's

1664
01:34:36,720 --> 01:34:40,240
Speaker 1: a totally different setting, a totally different contexts. So context

1665
01:34:40,360 --> 01:34:43,840
Speaker 1: is important for what the healthiest diet is. I got

1666
01:34:43,840 --> 01:34:48,680
Speaker 1: one last one for you Arctic explorers and others that

1667
01:34:48,720 --> 01:34:53,960
Speaker 1: would get vitamin A poisoning from eating polar bear liver.

1668
01:34:54,479 --> 01:34:59,040
Speaker 1: The hell does that mean? So? Um, you can overdose

1669
01:34:59,160 --> 01:35:02,920
Speaker 1: on the fat saw able vitamins which are A, D, E,

1670
01:35:03,040 --> 01:35:06,960
Speaker 1: and K. You cannot overdose on the water soluble vitamins,

1671
01:35:07,000 --> 01:35:09,400
Speaker 1: which are all the others, B, C and the rest.

1672
01:35:09,520 --> 01:35:12,640
Speaker 1: So the fat soluble I'm not totally sure why that is,

1673
01:35:12,640 --> 01:35:15,840
Speaker 1: but you can't overdose on any of those. And we

1674
01:35:15,920 --> 01:35:19,760
Speaker 1: all are the fat soluble ones A, D, E, and K,

1675
01:35:20,920 --> 01:35:24,280
Speaker 1: and you can overdose on them. So you could overdose

1676
01:35:24,280 --> 01:35:26,040
Speaker 1: in vitamin D as well, and that could make your

1677
01:35:26,080 --> 01:35:28,320
Speaker 1: calcium go very high and cause a whole lot of

1678
01:35:28,360 --> 01:35:31,080
Speaker 1: problems and other things. But um, so yeah, you can.

1679
01:35:31,160 --> 01:35:34,320
Speaker 1: You know, a lot of animals store, especially fat soluble

1680
01:35:34,680 --> 01:35:38,720
Speaker 1: nutrients in the liver, and the polar bear happens to

1681
01:35:38,760 --> 01:35:41,160
Speaker 1: store a lot of vitamin A, so you can overdose

1682
01:35:42,040 --> 01:35:44,360
Speaker 1: on it if I don't know how much, if you know,

1683
01:35:44,400 --> 01:35:46,360
Speaker 1: eat a molecule of it, If you eat a tiny

1684
01:35:46,400 --> 01:35:48,759
Speaker 1: little portion of polar bail level, you'll probably be fine.

1685
01:35:49,160 --> 01:35:50,880
Speaker 1: I'm not sure how much the lethal dose would be

1686
01:35:51,160 --> 01:35:55,240
Speaker 1: down might be? And why do they have so much

1687
01:35:55,600 --> 01:35:58,880
Speaker 1: vitamin A in their like? Do they have a vitamin

1688
01:35:58,920 --> 01:36:01,360
Speaker 1: A rich diet from eating all the all the marine

1689
01:36:01,400 --> 01:36:05,160
Speaker 1: mammals or something. I'm I'm not totally sure, to be honest.

1690
01:36:05,200 --> 01:36:07,080
Speaker 1: I mean, they eat a lot of very high fat

1691
01:36:07,120 --> 01:36:09,920
Speaker 1: diet um as all animals in the architect do, I guess,

1692
01:36:09,920 --> 01:36:13,360
Speaker 1: but they so. I'm sure they get a lot of it. Uh,

1693
01:36:13,520 --> 01:36:15,320
Speaker 1: but I don't know why they need so much or

1694
01:36:15,320 --> 01:36:17,479
Speaker 1: why they store so much on their liver, to be honest.

1695
01:36:17,479 --> 01:36:19,679
Speaker 1: But it's the only animal I know of where there's

1696
01:36:19,680 --> 01:36:23,519
Speaker 1: that vitamin overdose danger. He's not here right now, but

1697
01:36:23,560 --> 01:36:29,479
Speaker 1: our colleague seth h large pelagics large pelagic fish for

1698
01:36:29,479 --> 01:36:33,400
Speaker 1: about thirty days in a row and got mercury poisoning,

1699
01:36:33,520 --> 01:36:38,840
Speaker 1: or got some mercury poisoning, do you believe him? Um,

1700
01:36:39,200 --> 01:36:42,720
Speaker 1: his hands went numb. I'm not totally sure what was

1701
01:36:42,760 --> 01:36:47,519
Speaker 1: his mercury level, like memory issues too issues. His wife's

1702
01:36:47,560 --> 01:36:49,519
Speaker 1: hands got nome. She didn't mention it to him until

1703
01:36:49,560 --> 01:36:51,400
Speaker 1: he mentioned it to her, and she's like, oh my god,

1704
01:36:51,439 --> 01:36:54,320
Speaker 1: I've had the same problem. Did he go crazy? You

1705
01:36:54,320 --> 01:36:57,120
Speaker 1: know that mad? Hatters mad? Because he was no, but

1706
01:36:57,200 --> 01:36:59,560
Speaker 1: he went well, a little bit crazy, he went a

1707
01:36:59,560 --> 01:37:02,680
Speaker 1: little bit seth. He's gonna be here for trivia if

1708
01:37:02,680 --> 01:37:05,280
Speaker 1: you want to talk about it, then I'm curious what

1709
01:37:05,400 --> 01:37:08,320
Speaker 1: his what the blood levels showed another doing that? Now

1710
01:37:08,520 --> 01:37:10,960
Speaker 1: he just laid off, But I had him over there

1711
01:37:11,120 --> 01:37:15,439
Speaker 1: night at some bitches digging back in blue fin tuna belly.

1712
01:37:16,520 --> 01:37:21,439
Speaker 1: So basically eating blue fin tuna fat sounds okay. I

1713
01:37:21,479 --> 01:37:23,320
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know a lot about it, but

1714
01:37:23,560 --> 01:37:27,320
Speaker 1: this guy's a cautious maybe in moderation, what insight can

1715
01:37:27,360 --> 01:37:30,880
Speaker 1: you provide on how a buck would taste different? Say

1716
01:37:30,880 --> 01:37:33,640
Speaker 1: you're hunting in Indiana. Peak rut is November twelve, you

1717
01:37:33,680 --> 01:37:36,439
Speaker 1: kill a buck on November twelve versus if you killed

1718
01:37:36,439 --> 01:37:40,040
Speaker 1: one on September one? Um, should those animals taste different

1719
01:37:40,360 --> 01:37:42,840
Speaker 1: like before the rut and during the rut? Yeah, like

1720
01:37:42,880 --> 01:37:44,880
Speaker 1: when when they're at like kind of a baseline of

1721
01:37:45,479 --> 01:37:48,280
Speaker 1: just have a very stable pattern of their hitting this

1722
01:37:48,360 --> 01:37:50,960
Speaker 1: cornfield every night. They're not chasing Doe's anything like that.

1723
01:37:51,080 --> 01:37:55,519
Speaker 1: Versus a buck who is rutting real hard in mid November. Well,

1724
01:37:55,560 --> 01:37:58,000
Speaker 1: I guess, and you're talking about just taste, not tenderness

1725
01:37:58,040 --> 01:38:01,080
Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, tenderness, taste anything. Well, I guess there's

1726
01:38:01,080 --> 01:38:03,160
Speaker 1: some thought about the hormones of the rut and what

1727
01:38:03,200 --> 01:38:05,040
Speaker 1: they can do to meet I guess. Do do the

1728
01:38:05,080 --> 01:38:08,599
Speaker 1: bucks lose weight also in the rut? Yeah? They kind

1729
01:38:08,640 --> 01:38:11,040
Speaker 1: of they throw caution to the wind, and they don't

1730
01:38:11,120 --> 01:38:12,920
Speaker 1: drink as much as they should, they don't eat as

1731
01:38:13,000 --> 01:38:14,960
Speaker 1: much as they should, they don't sleep as much as

1732
01:38:15,040 --> 01:38:18,719
Speaker 1: they should. Um. I would say it's like a stressor

1733
01:38:19,080 --> 01:38:21,240
Speaker 1: for them sort of because of the the activities they're

1734
01:38:21,240 --> 01:38:24,200
Speaker 1: participating in. Right. Well, I guess um I am also

1735
01:38:24,240 --> 01:38:26,920
Speaker 1: avoiding hunters at that period, right. I guess I've heard

1736
01:38:26,920 --> 01:38:28,880
Speaker 1: a lot about hormones, like, you know, just sort of

1737
01:38:28,880 --> 01:38:32,320
Speaker 1: the rut related hormones like testosterone and such versus the

1738
01:38:32,360 --> 01:38:35,600
Speaker 1: stressed out, running away and dying slowly hormones like adrenaline,

1739
01:38:35,640 --> 01:38:37,960
Speaker 1: cord is all other ones. I guess my understanding is,

1740
01:38:37,960 --> 01:38:40,639
Speaker 1: I don't that it's inconsistent in terms of I guess

1741
01:38:40,680 --> 01:38:42,240
Speaker 1: you guys would know more than I do about that,

1742
01:38:42,280 --> 01:38:45,320
Speaker 1: But it's inconsistent in terms of how it affects taste

1743
01:38:45,800 --> 01:38:48,800
Speaker 1: and tenderness UM. But I guess less fat, you know,

1744
01:38:48,880 --> 01:38:53,760
Speaker 1: intramuscular fat in particular or marbling um, contributes a lot

1745
01:38:53,840 --> 01:38:56,200
Speaker 1: to the quote unquote tenderness you feel in your mouth

1746
01:38:56,240 --> 01:39:00,680
Speaker 1: because you're biting through fat in addition of protein fibers um.

1747
01:39:00,760 --> 01:39:03,599
Speaker 1: So maybe losing less fat might affect the texture. Having

1748
01:39:03,680 --> 01:39:05,680
Speaker 1: less fat might affect the texture. I guess I'm not

1749
01:39:05,720 --> 01:39:07,720
Speaker 1: totally sure. I've heard meat scientists on this show and

1750
01:39:07,760 --> 01:39:09,560
Speaker 1: other shows talk about the role of hormones, and I

1751
01:39:09,600 --> 01:39:14,479
Speaker 1: guess I'm a little confused, and it seems inconsistent. How

1752
01:39:14,520 --> 01:39:17,000
Speaker 1: about specific to like the testicles. I've tried to take

1753
01:39:17,080 --> 01:39:19,439
Speaker 1: note of this, and I've never noticed a difference in

1754
01:39:19,479 --> 01:39:23,480
Speaker 1: taste between like a buck in September versus November versus January.

1755
01:39:23,600 --> 01:39:26,040
Speaker 1: Should I notice any taste or like texture difference with

1756
01:39:26,120 --> 01:39:28,759
Speaker 1: those when you're eating the bark nuts? Yeah, I wouldn't

1757
01:39:28,760 --> 01:39:30,439
Speaker 1: think so. I mean, there's a lot of those hormones

1758
01:39:30,479 --> 01:39:32,320
Speaker 1: are released into the blood stream, you know, there's not

1759
01:39:32,360 --> 01:39:35,800
Speaker 1: really a testosterone storage in the testicles, Unlike something like

1760
01:39:35,840 --> 01:39:38,400
Speaker 1: the thyroid, which has a lot of thyroid hormone stored

1761
01:39:38,479 --> 01:39:41,400
Speaker 1: in it ready to be released. The testicles just sort

1762
01:39:41,400 --> 01:39:45,719
Speaker 1: of released testosterone into the bloodstream. Um so I don't

1763
01:39:45,760 --> 01:39:48,320
Speaker 1: think that would you know, the hormone shouldn't. Should affect

1764
01:39:48,320 --> 01:39:50,679
Speaker 1: them the same it affects any other tissue that's being

1765
01:39:51,000 --> 01:39:54,720
Speaker 1: perfused by the testosterone containing blood. Testosterone is made in

1766
01:39:54,720 --> 01:39:59,840
Speaker 1: your testicle, is it? It is sperm is too? I get.

1767
01:40:02,400 --> 01:40:06,000
Speaker 1: Can can we speak about a bit about thyroid hormone?

1768
01:40:06,320 --> 01:40:10,880
Speaker 1: And then uh, what hormones you can and can't technically

1769
01:40:11,000 --> 01:40:13,439
Speaker 1: consume and why not? And then also like can you

1770
01:40:14,000 --> 01:40:18,400
Speaker 1: in the cooking process, like what what does that turn?

1771
01:40:18,479 --> 01:40:22,559
Speaker 1: I mean, do you like kill hormones when you cook meat? So? Sure,

1772
01:40:22,640 --> 01:40:27,200
Speaker 1: So there's this condition called hamburger thyroid toxicosis where you

1773
01:40:27,240 --> 01:40:32,360
Speaker 1: get dangerous or toxic dose of thyroid hormone in your hamburger.

1774
01:40:32,800 --> 01:40:35,599
Speaker 1: And there's some medical literature I read read a bunch

1775
01:40:35,600 --> 01:40:37,880
Speaker 1: of studies, Like in the eighties, I think it was

1776
01:40:38,120 --> 01:40:42,120
Speaker 1: in like Minnesota, Iowa, South Dakota area, there was a

1777
01:40:42,120 --> 01:40:46,000
Speaker 1: few slaughterhouses that were not dissecting the neck properly of

1778
01:40:46,080 --> 01:40:50,400
Speaker 1: the cows there slaughtering, and some thyroid tissue was ending

1779
01:40:50,479 --> 01:40:52,439
Speaker 1: up in the ground meat. And so if some of

1780
01:40:52,439 --> 01:40:53,960
Speaker 1: that ends up in the middle of the burger where

1781
01:40:53,960 --> 01:40:56,000
Speaker 1: you're cooking, at last, some of the thyroid hormone can

1782
01:40:56,040 --> 01:40:59,760
Speaker 1: survive intact to be swallowed by you. And unlike many

1783
01:40:59,760 --> 01:41:03,120
Speaker 1: horr armones, you can eat thyroid hormone. You know, many

1784
01:41:03,280 --> 01:41:05,760
Speaker 1: are broken down either in your intestines or by your

1785
01:41:05,760 --> 01:41:09,120
Speaker 1: liver before they get anywhere. But thyroid you can eat

1786
01:41:09,200 --> 01:41:12,040
Speaker 1: and it can arrive into your bloodstream intact and you

1787
01:41:12,080 --> 01:41:15,960
Speaker 1: know active, which is why um. You know, hormone replacement

1788
01:41:16,000 --> 01:41:18,760
Speaker 1: like thyroid replacement or pills, you can take them by mouth.

1789
01:41:18,800 --> 01:41:21,880
Speaker 1: And some people even take desiccated cow thyroid, which is

1790
01:41:21,920 --> 01:41:25,479
Speaker 1: literally dried cow's thyroid, and that provides you with the

1791
01:41:25,560 --> 01:41:28,600
Speaker 1: T three and T four um that you need to

1792
01:41:28,640 --> 01:41:31,640
Speaker 1: replace your underactive thyroid. So these so there was like

1793
01:41:31,680 --> 01:41:35,360
Speaker 1: an outbreak of thyroid, you know, high severe hyper thyroid

1794
01:41:35,400 --> 01:41:37,599
Speaker 1: ism to the point where makes your heart raise, makes

1795
01:41:37,600 --> 01:41:41,400
Speaker 1: you sweat, um, it makes you feel terrible horrible diarrhea

1796
01:41:41,439 --> 01:41:44,360
Speaker 1: and things like that. UM. And so that condition hamburger

1797
01:41:44,400 --> 01:41:47,800
Speaker 1: thyroid thyrotoxicosis is um you know, sort of well known,

1798
01:41:47,920 --> 01:41:50,799
Speaker 1: and it's actually also very common in dog chew toys

1799
01:41:50,840 --> 01:41:53,679
Speaker 1: because the gullet or the trait chea is often dried

1800
01:41:53,760 --> 01:41:56,640
Speaker 1: and given the dogs. It's just sort of toy and

1801
01:41:56,680 --> 01:42:00,360
Speaker 1: there's less oversight of the butchering process that goes to

1802
01:42:00,439 --> 01:42:02,759
Speaker 1: dog toys. Just like lungs, you know they're too dangerous

1803
01:42:02,760 --> 01:42:04,960
Speaker 1: for humans, but let the dogs eat them. So these

1804
01:42:05,000 --> 01:42:07,960
Speaker 1: two toys, there's actually often every few years like an

1805
01:42:07,960 --> 01:42:11,160
Speaker 1: outbreak of dogs getting hyper thyroidism. Well, how many hunters

1806
01:42:11,200 --> 01:42:15,559
Speaker 1: got to be grinding up a deer's thyroid? Probably a lot.

1807
01:42:15,600 --> 01:42:18,639
Speaker 1: I mean, but I butcher two deer earlier this week.

1808
01:42:18,640 --> 01:42:21,559
Speaker 1: Actually someone gave them to me and I was really

1809
01:42:21,600 --> 01:42:23,519
Speaker 1: looking in the neck. I could not find the thyroid.

1810
01:42:23,560 --> 01:42:26,160
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's very small or what. I'm

1811
01:42:26,160 --> 01:42:29,680
Speaker 1: not sure, but maybe it's so small, or maybe just

1812
01:42:29,720 --> 01:42:32,960
Speaker 1: people cook it's not as bad as with beef. Maybe

1813
01:42:33,160 --> 01:42:37,920
Speaker 1: Spencer makes this raw deer dish that we've all eaten before.

1814
01:42:38,240 --> 01:42:40,599
Speaker 1: Are you are you being careful because maybe like I

1815
01:42:40,640 --> 01:42:44,760
Speaker 1: had the sweats after eating that would not say being

1816
01:42:44,800 --> 01:42:47,439
Speaker 1: careful in trying to not have neck meat in her

1817
01:42:47,560 --> 01:42:53,240
Speaker 1: now tiger meats real heavy on the Yeah, there's also

1818
01:42:53,320 --> 01:42:55,640
Speaker 1: like you know, certain species hormones can be active in

1819
01:42:55,680 --> 01:42:58,120
Speaker 1: the human while others are not. So it could be

1820
01:42:58,160 --> 01:43:01,519
Speaker 1: that dear thyroid hormone is not active in humans as

1821
01:43:01,680 --> 01:43:04,320
Speaker 1: cow is. I do not know. If so, you could

1822
01:43:04,360 --> 01:43:08,040
Speaker 1: be eating you could get a cow's hormones and then

1823
01:43:08,080 --> 01:43:10,360
Speaker 1: they run in your body and act on your body

1824
01:43:10,400 --> 01:43:12,679
Speaker 1: and you're acting. That would be like a great would

1825
01:43:12,720 --> 01:43:17,120
Speaker 1: be like a great defense. If testosterone would I like

1826
01:43:17,360 --> 01:43:19,720
Speaker 1: start like growing hair out of my face if I

1827
01:43:19,760 --> 01:43:22,599
Speaker 1: was eating like buck nuts during the rut or like

1828
01:43:22,680 --> 01:43:27,880
Speaker 1: sashimi buck nutsa's testosterone digests right, correct, It's not not

1829
01:43:27,960 --> 01:43:30,760
Speaker 1: digest in the gut, but is processed in the liver

1830
01:43:31,200 --> 01:43:34,599
Speaker 1: and actually mostly turned to estrogen made. Which is why

1831
01:43:34,640 --> 01:43:37,040
Speaker 1: people when people say, like I was at a testical

1832
01:43:37,080 --> 01:43:40,040
Speaker 1: cooking contest in Serbia and all the men super drunk

1833
01:43:40,120 --> 01:43:42,280
Speaker 1: or like yeah, we're you know, getting viril or whatever,

1834
01:43:42,479 --> 01:43:45,840
Speaker 1: you know, it's actually yeah, it's actually they're getting loaded

1835
01:43:45,880 --> 01:43:48,800
Speaker 1: with estrogen probably. But the other thing is, you know,

1836
01:43:48,800 --> 01:43:52,120
Speaker 1: if you've ever seen like commercial testosterone preparations, it's usually

1837
01:43:52,160 --> 01:43:55,760
Speaker 1: like a foam or an injection. It's rarely pills UM

1838
01:43:56,000 --> 01:43:58,160
Speaker 1: and the pharmaceutical companies trying to you know, they take

1839
01:43:58,160 --> 01:44:01,360
Speaker 1: the testosterone molecule and try to add on little molecular

1840
01:44:01,520 --> 01:44:03,519
Speaker 1: branches to it to try to make the liver not

1841
01:44:03,680 --> 01:44:05,400
Speaker 1: act on it as much. And there is one called

1842
01:44:05,439 --> 01:44:08,240
Speaker 1: methyl testosterone that doesn't get broken down the liver, but

1843
01:44:08,280 --> 01:44:11,240
Speaker 1: it severely injures your liver, so it's no good. Um.

1844
01:44:11,240 --> 01:44:13,040
Speaker 1: But that's that's one of the holy grails. You know,

1845
01:44:13,080 --> 01:44:16,759
Speaker 1: if you could find an orally active and safe testosterone preparation,

1846
01:44:17,240 --> 01:44:20,000
Speaker 1: that would be a big hit. UM. So estrogen and

1847
01:44:20,000 --> 01:44:23,000
Speaker 1: progesterone you can eat and get into your body right

1848
01:44:23,040 --> 01:44:25,880
Speaker 1: the pill. It's a pill because it arises into your bloodstream.

1849
01:44:25,920 --> 01:44:30,960
Speaker 1: Active testosterone really mostly comes in foams, transdermal and injections.

1850
01:44:31,200 --> 01:44:33,840
Speaker 1: For that reason. Cortisol is active, you could take it

1851
01:44:33,880 --> 01:44:36,600
Speaker 1: by mouth. Insulin is not, you know, you have to

1852
01:44:36,600 --> 01:44:39,760
Speaker 1: inject it. But pig insulin used to you know, pig

1853
01:44:39,760 --> 01:44:41,920
Speaker 1: and cow insulin used to be the treatment for diabetes

1854
01:44:42,360 --> 01:44:45,840
Speaker 1: type one. UM, but it would have to be injected obviously,

1855
01:44:46,080 --> 01:44:48,960
Speaker 1: And now we have bacteria in vats churning out true

1856
01:44:49,040 --> 01:44:51,120
Speaker 1: human insulince, so we don't need to extract it from

1857
01:44:51,120 --> 01:44:57,160
Speaker 1: Pacreas of animals anymore? Man? Yeah? Uh think that Spencer?

1858
01:44:58,320 --> 01:45:00,160
Speaker 1: Do you think the long thing will get changed? That's

1859
01:45:00,160 --> 01:45:02,640
Speaker 1: what I'm wondering, Like in your lifetime, are folks going

1860
01:45:02,680 --> 01:45:05,040
Speaker 1: to be sailing lungs? Well, if we start a petition,

1861
01:45:06,280 --> 01:45:09,479
Speaker 1: do you get money from the hagas industry? I have

1862
01:45:09,800 --> 01:45:12,280
Speaker 1: written to them saying I want to join forces, not

1863
01:45:12,360 --> 01:45:16,640
Speaker 1: expecting any not expecting any communeration. But who do you

1864
01:45:16,760 --> 01:45:18,360
Speaker 1: right when you want to get ahold of hagues? People?

1865
01:45:18,400 --> 01:45:21,439
Speaker 1: So I've spoken to to. One is the former kind

1866
01:45:21,439 --> 01:45:24,040
Speaker 1: of the U s d A secretary version in the UK,

1867
01:45:24,200 --> 01:45:26,679
Speaker 1: who I spoke to on the phone, and another guy

1868
01:45:26,760 --> 01:45:29,320
Speaker 1: just by email with one of his like secretaries who

1869
01:45:29,360 --> 01:45:32,400
Speaker 1: answers the email. I think he's might have been acting

1870
01:45:32,439 --> 01:45:35,880
Speaker 1: at that time in a similar capacity. But every time

1871
01:45:35,920 --> 01:45:37,479
Speaker 1: they come to the US they try to convince the

1872
01:45:37,560 --> 01:45:39,840
Speaker 1: U s d A to change the rule. I guess

1873
01:45:39,880 --> 01:45:41,519
Speaker 1: at this point they've just given up. They're selling the

1874
01:45:41,600 --> 01:45:43,760
Speaker 1: lung free haggas. I love it that there's someone out

1875
01:45:43,800 --> 01:45:45,400
Speaker 1: there that you could call and be like, hey, I

1876
01:45:45,400 --> 01:45:47,519
Speaker 1: want to talk to about this long deal in the US,

1877
01:45:47,600 --> 01:45:50,880
Speaker 1: and they're like, oh, don't even get me started right,

1878
01:45:51,000 --> 01:45:54,200
Speaker 1: like someone that lives that problem. Yeah he was. He

1879
01:45:54,320 --> 01:45:56,640
Speaker 1: was in that tone. He was pissed about it. You know,

1880
01:45:56,680 --> 01:46:00,120
Speaker 1: he's like, well, the US gets upset when we know

1881
01:46:00,439 --> 01:46:03,760
Speaker 1: when we limit their food and drink exports or when

1882
01:46:03,760 --> 01:46:05,640
Speaker 1: we put extra rules on it. So why should they

1883
01:46:05,680 --> 01:46:07,679
Speaker 1: do that? And there's no evidence. And we've been eating

1884
01:46:07,680 --> 01:46:10,160
Speaker 1: this for generations in the UK, and we exported to

1885
01:46:10,200 --> 01:46:15,160
Speaker 1: many other countries. No one's ever reported a problem. You

1886
01:46:15,200 --> 01:46:17,360
Speaker 1: know how you need on your side the bottom of

1887
01:46:17,400 --> 01:46:21,640
Speaker 1: the horseshoe. Those folks are loudy extremists. Oh yeah. You

1888
01:46:21,720 --> 01:46:27,280
Speaker 1: get a bunch of hippies, a bunch of crazy right wingers,

1889
01:46:27,280 --> 01:46:29,439
Speaker 1: and you say, like say to the hippies, like, listen,

1890
01:46:29,600 --> 01:46:32,559
Speaker 1: it's all natural, man, it's as long as it's natural.

1891
01:46:33,479 --> 01:46:34,600
Speaker 1: And you go to the and you go to the

1892
01:46:34,640 --> 01:46:37,160
Speaker 1: other room. You'd like the government over each bro, who's

1893
01:46:37,160 --> 01:46:39,360
Speaker 1: the government telling you what to eat? Nothing bad has

1894
01:46:39,360 --> 01:46:42,040
Speaker 1: ever happened by putting radicals, by giving him a lot

1895
01:46:42,080 --> 01:46:45,280
Speaker 1: of power. Well no, I got him two separate rooms. Okay.

1896
01:46:45,840 --> 01:46:47,880
Speaker 1: He goes into the one room and brings says like,

1897
01:46:47,920 --> 01:46:49,519
Speaker 1: why why is the garment? Tell us about to eat? Man?

1898
01:46:49,840 --> 01:46:51,320
Speaker 1: We should eat more of this. If they're saying not

1899
01:46:51,400 --> 01:46:53,720
Speaker 1: to you go to the hippies, it's you switch your hat.

1900
01:46:53,800 --> 01:46:57,679
Speaker 1: It's all natural. Yeah, and mentioned the pharmaceutic of companies

1901
01:46:57,680 --> 01:47:03,000
Speaker 1: that both sides and you get this problem, takeing care

1902
01:47:03,000 --> 01:47:04,840
Speaker 1: of and then the hagues people will pay all the money.

1903
01:47:06,680 --> 01:47:10,880
Speaker 1: I'm not right. There is. There's usually some green. It's

1904
01:47:10,960 --> 01:47:13,600
Speaker 1: usually lungs, heart and liver, ground up stuff into the

1905
01:47:13,600 --> 01:47:16,240
Speaker 1: stomach and also mixed with um some kind of green

1906
01:47:17,520 --> 01:47:21,360
Speaker 1: sounds lish. Oh, we can't forget to talk about an

1907
01:47:21,479 --> 01:47:24,439
Speaker 1: enemy eats. Yes, well that's the last thing I was

1908
01:47:24,439 --> 01:47:26,679
Speaker 1: gonna do, is letting plug his stuff. Yes, talk about

1909
01:47:26,720 --> 01:47:29,680
Speaker 1: anatomy eats. Um. So, Anatomy Eats is kind of a

1910
01:47:29,720 --> 01:47:33,400
Speaker 1: dinner series that I started with one particular chef that

1911
01:47:33,479 --> 01:47:36,360
Speaker 1: I now worked with several different chefs, where we sort

1912
01:47:36,400 --> 01:47:39,160
Speaker 1: of one chef jealous when you did that. No, it was,

1913
01:47:39,400 --> 01:47:41,880
Speaker 1: I mean he's moved on to other things as well,

1914
01:47:41,920 --> 01:47:45,040
Speaker 1: but he I mean we're still sort of working together.

1915
01:47:45,439 --> 01:47:47,639
Speaker 1: We did a dinner about a year ago in Philly,

1916
01:47:47,720 --> 01:47:49,800
Speaker 1: so he I had heard he's a friend who's also

1917
01:47:49,920 --> 01:47:53,280
Speaker 1: chef and Philly. He had done a heart uh course

1918
01:47:53,560 --> 01:47:56,559
Speaker 1: at the Philly Free Public Library which has this great

1919
01:47:56,600 --> 01:48:01,000
Speaker 1: culinary space where they do um classes and cookbook authors

1920
01:48:01,040 --> 01:48:03,679
Speaker 1: come through and do sessions there as well on their

1921
01:48:03,760 --> 01:48:06,479
Speaker 1: you know, publicity tours. And so he was telling me

1922
01:48:06,520 --> 01:48:08,080
Speaker 1: how he did a course on the heart, and I

1923
01:48:08,120 --> 01:48:10,040
Speaker 1: was saying, oh, did you point out the valves and

1924
01:48:10,080 --> 01:48:14,080
Speaker 1: the coronary arteries and the different ventricles and atria, And

1925
01:48:14,080 --> 01:48:15,880
Speaker 1: he said, no, why don't you come do that next time?

1926
01:48:15,880 --> 01:48:17,760
Speaker 1: And so so we did. We ended up doing a

1927
01:48:17,800 --> 01:48:20,400
Speaker 1: dinner at a series of dinners at the library, did

1928
01:48:20,400 --> 01:48:24,400
Speaker 1: a cardiovascular system dinner where we served we served three

1929
01:48:24,439 --> 01:48:27,519
Speaker 1: species of heart cooked in three different ways. We served

1930
01:48:27,520 --> 01:48:30,320
Speaker 1: some blood sausage and blood cookies, which are sort of

1931
01:48:30,320 --> 01:48:34,320
Speaker 1: like whipped like meringue. Blood has a similar albumen profile

1932
01:48:34,360 --> 01:48:36,000
Speaker 1: to egg whites. You can kind of whip it, though

1933
01:48:36,000 --> 01:48:38,360
Speaker 1: it doesn't maintain its form as well, but it does

1934
01:48:38,439 --> 01:48:40,960
Speaker 1: to some extent. And bone marrow of course, where all

1935
01:48:40,960 --> 01:48:43,520
Speaker 1: the blood cells come from. Then we did a digestive

1936
01:48:43,520 --> 01:48:46,200
Speaker 1: system dinner where we did we serve tongue, and I

1937
01:48:46,200 --> 01:48:48,719
Speaker 1: talked about how digestion starts in the mouth. We served

1938
01:48:48,720 --> 01:48:53,839
Speaker 1: liver like a liver sausage with intestinal casing, and tripe

1939
01:48:54,400 --> 01:48:56,840
Speaker 1: and then finally we did a muscular skeletal dinner where

1940
01:48:56,880 --> 01:49:00,960
Speaker 1: we served like a tendon soup or now puffed tendon

1941
01:49:01,280 --> 01:49:03,080
Speaker 1: where it's sort of cooked and then thrown in hot

1942
01:49:03,120 --> 01:49:06,840
Speaker 1: oil and puffs up. Um, a bone broth soup, and

1943
01:49:06,920 --> 01:49:10,200
Speaker 1: two kinds of muscle cuts. One that was sort of

1944
01:49:10,320 --> 01:49:11,920
Speaker 1: you know, good for steaks, where you could cook it

1945
01:49:12,080 --> 01:49:14,400
Speaker 1: high dry heat, flip it over like a steak and

1946
01:49:14,439 --> 01:49:17,120
Speaker 1: eat it, versus one that required slow cooking, and we

1947
01:49:17,160 --> 01:49:19,439
Speaker 1: talked about connective tissue and things like that. And the

1948
01:49:19,840 --> 01:49:22,040
Speaker 1: steak cut was the skirt steak, which is of course

1949
01:49:22,080 --> 01:49:25,479
Speaker 1: the diaphragm, the main breathing muscle. Um. So then and

1950
01:49:25,479 --> 01:49:27,519
Speaker 1: then since I've done, you know, for each dish, I

1951
01:49:27,520 --> 01:49:29,960
Speaker 1: talked about the anatomy and physiology. I kind of talk

1952
01:49:30,040 --> 01:49:33,439
Speaker 1: about what's going on inside the people who are listening

1953
01:49:33,840 --> 01:49:35,880
Speaker 1: talk about their anatomy and how it relates to what

1954
01:49:35,920 --> 01:49:39,760
Speaker 1: they're eating. Gives some anecdotes from my medical practice, sometimes

1955
01:49:40,520 --> 01:49:42,479
Speaker 1: sort of gross ones. But you know, people who are

1956
01:49:42,479 --> 01:49:44,600
Speaker 1: coming to this dinner, you know, it's self selecting for

1957
01:49:44,640 --> 01:49:47,200
Speaker 1: people who are going to be okay with that. And um,

1958
01:49:47,280 --> 01:49:49,479
Speaker 1: so since then I don't didn't a dinner in d C,

1959
01:49:49,720 --> 01:49:53,400
Speaker 1: did a dinner in um Oxford, Mississippi with two great chefs,

1960
01:49:53,479 --> 01:49:57,719
Speaker 1: and did a dinner at a fourth dinner in Philly. Um. Yeah,

1961
01:49:57,720 --> 01:50:00,240
Speaker 1: so it's kind of exploring your own anatomy, understand ending

1962
01:50:00,240 --> 01:50:03,519
Speaker 1: how your own body works through eating oh fual and

1963
01:50:03,560 --> 01:50:08,519
Speaker 1: internal organs. You charge for that, Yes, it tends to

1964
01:50:08,560 --> 01:50:10,640
Speaker 1: be a little fancy. The one in d C was

1965
01:50:10,720 --> 01:50:13,840
Speaker 1: a Halloween theme. I was right around the hot time

1966
01:50:13,880 --> 01:50:17,960
Speaker 1: of Halloween and they did a drink pairings with each dish. Um.

1967
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:19,720
Speaker 1: But the Halloween theme was fun because we got to

1968
01:50:19,760 --> 01:50:23,320
Speaker 1: talk about like mummies and how making a mummy from

1969
01:50:23,360 --> 01:50:26,479
Speaker 1: human flesh is basically the same as making charcuterie, just

1970
01:50:26,600 --> 01:50:30,040
Speaker 1: longer time spam. That's awesome. So how do people find

1971
01:50:30,040 --> 01:50:31,720
Speaker 1: out if they want to go to an anatomy Eats.

1972
01:50:31,720 --> 01:50:34,800
Speaker 1: You guys got a website, Yeah, anatomy eats dot com,

1973
01:50:34,840 --> 01:50:40,800
Speaker 1: anatomy eats at anatomy Eats on Instagram and Twitter and TikTok. Yeah.

1974
01:50:41,200 --> 01:50:45,599
Speaker 1: I don't know about little dances about it? Should there

1975
01:50:45,680 --> 01:50:47,439
Speaker 1: is there a special room in the back where you

1976
01:50:47,479 --> 01:50:50,599
Speaker 1: get to eat some lung, Like secretly, we did think

1977
01:50:50,600 --> 01:50:56,120
Speaker 1: about doing like an underground lung dinner, Like maybe people

1978
01:50:56,120 --> 01:51:00,280
Speaker 1: could buy shares in the lungs and sell. Um, yeah,

1979
01:51:00,320 --> 01:51:03,000
Speaker 1: we've thought about underground lung dinners and things like that,

1980
01:51:03,080 --> 01:51:06,120
Speaker 1: but yeah, well you could probably do it where like

1981
01:51:06,200 --> 01:51:08,840
Speaker 1: if people are I talked to a game ward and

1982
01:51:08,880 --> 01:51:12,000
Speaker 1: about this, I'm definitely not you know, like a proponent

1983
01:51:12,040 --> 01:51:15,519
Speaker 1: of it. But it's like if you attend one of

1984
01:51:15,520 --> 01:51:20,400
Speaker 1: these dinners, you're paying for let's say, like the other dishes,

1985
01:51:20,560 --> 01:51:25,000
Speaker 1: but like the lung could be potentially served in a

1986
01:51:25,040 --> 01:51:30,479
Speaker 1: way whereby like you, I think people do that, but

1987
01:51:30,520 --> 01:51:32,519
Speaker 1: you're getting a little cute that's kind of like a

1988
01:51:32,600 --> 01:51:36,800
Speaker 1: little cute. It's kind of like the da you're getting

1989
01:51:36,800 --> 01:51:39,559
Speaker 1: like oh no, no, no no, no, I didn't sell them

1990
01:51:39,600 --> 01:51:45,439
Speaker 1: that parted. Yeah, but when they walk in. There was

1991
01:51:46,400 --> 01:51:48,320
Speaker 1: businesses in New York City that we're doing that with

1992
01:51:48,360 --> 01:51:51,519
Speaker 1: marijuana that you could get it delivered to you, but

1993
01:51:51,560 --> 01:51:53,640
Speaker 1: you'd pay them like a hunter Bucks, right, um, and

1994
01:51:53,920 --> 01:51:55,960
Speaker 1: they would bring you like a candy bar, and then

1995
01:51:56,320 --> 01:51:59,559
Speaker 1: for free they would give you, you know, like a

1996
01:51:59,640 --> 01:52:05,599
Speaker 1: bryl exactly, a little baggy. Tell people about your books. Yeah,

1997
01:52:05,640 --> 01:52:08,320
Speaker 1: So my my first book, The Unseen Body, came out

1998
01:52:08,320 --> 01:52:12,800
Speaker 1: about a year ago. Um, and it's kind of exploration

1999
01:52:12,840 --> 01:52:16,240
Speaker 1: of the human body, um, tying tying it into my

2000
01:52:16,320 --> 01:52:20,280
Speaker 1: training as a medical student, my medical career, uh, my

2001
01:52:20,360 --> 01:52:23,280
Speaker 1: interest in food. Some of these Anatomy Eats topics show

2002
01:52:23,320 --> 01:52:25,000
Speaker 1: up in there as well, like the lungs and how

2003
01:52:25,040 --> 01:52:28,200
Speaker 1: I came to like liver, a lot of travel as well.

2004
01:52:28,800 --> 01:52:31,840
Speaker 1: Great story of me getting horrible diarrhe in India, which

2005
01:52:32,000 --> 01:52:35,599
Speaker 1: should be a bathroom scene in every memoir, I think, um,

2006
01:52:35,720 --> 01:52:39,519
Speaker 1: and uh, yeah, that's how we got on fresh airbitary growth.

2007
01:52:40,040 --> 01:52:43,000
Speaker 1: Very grateful for that. And um, my next book I

2008
01:52:43,000 --> 01:52:46,040
Speaker 1: think will be along the lines of Anatomy Eats, probably

2009
01:52:46,240 --> 01:52:50,320
Speaker 1: just sort of an exploration of anatomy through food that's

2010
01:52:50,360 --> 01:52:52,519
Speaker 1: eaten and prepared in different ways all over the world,

2011
01:52:52,880 --> 01:52:55,120
Speaker 1: kind of I imagine the table of contents will look

2012
01:52:55,160 --> 01:52:58,280
Speaker 1: like a medical textbook, similarly like Cardiovascular dinner digest sorry,

2013
01:52:58,280 --> 01:53:03,240
Speaker 1: cardiovascular system digestives, the endocrine system, reproductive system, and then

2014
01:53:03,280 --> 01:53:05,080
Speaker 1: just sort of an exploration of all the different body

2015
01:53:05,120 --> 01:53:08,080
Speaker 1: parts and how they are cooked throughout the world. And

2016
01:53:08,080 --> 01:53:12,439
Speaker 1: your books are on Amazon obviously, books on Amazon. Dr

2017
01:53:12,560 --> 01:53:17,959
Speaker 1: Jonathan Riceman, author of hit the title Again The Unseen

2018
01:53:18,040 --> 01:53:21,320
Speaker 1: Body that came out about a year ago. Yeah, it

2019
01:53:21,400 --> 01:53:23,240
Speaker 1: was kind of. Actually one of my favorite books of

2020
01:53:23,240 --> 01:53:24,720
Speaker 1: all time, which I've heard you talked about two is

2021
01:53:24,840 --> 01:53:29,400
Speaker 1: Arctic Dreams by Barry Lopez and I My idea of

2022
01:53:29,400 --> 01:53:32,240
Speaker 1: writing the book was to do an Arctic Dreams where

2023
01:53:32,240 --> 01:53:34,920
Speaker 1: it's an exploration of not the Arctic but the human body.

2024
01:53:35,120 --> 01:53:36,680
Speaker 1: So that's what I that's what I tried to do.

2025
01:53:37,680 --> 01:53:40,400
Speaker 1: I tried to emulate Barry Lopez, one of my favorite writers. Yeah,

2026
01:53:40,439 --> 01:53:42,760
Speaker 1: he's great man, a body man. On the other days,

2027
01:53:43,240 --> 01:53:45,040
Speaker 1: I had recommended it to him and he sent me

2028
01:53:45,080 --> 01:53:49,120
Speaker 1: about how blown away was by his passage on Polar Bears,

2029
01:53:49,240 --> 01:53:53,720
Speaker 1: which is astounding. So good. All right, thanks coming on

2030
01:53:53,760 --> 01:53:56,040
Speaker 1: the show, Maan, you're gonna stick around for trivia? Yes?

2031
01:53:56,280 --> 01:53:59,800
Speaker 1: Are you canna throw up a bone? Yes? M hmm.

2032
01:54:01,360 --> 01:54:04,519
Speaker 1: It seems unnecessary. I think he's going to do really well.

2033
01:54:04,600 --> 01:54:06,040
Speaker 1: If you have doctor in front of your name, you

2034
01:54:06,040 --> 01:54:08,680
Speaker 1: shouldn't get a get a bone thrown to you. Your

2035
01:54:08,680 --> 01:54:14,120
Speaker 1: whole life's been a bone thrown to you. Come on,

2036
01:54:14,760 --> 01:54:16,280
Speaker 1: what kind of bone are you throw You'd love it

2037
01:54:16,320 --> 01:54:19,439
Speaker 1: if you had doctor in front of your name. Dr Steve,

2038
01:54:19,920 --> 01:54:24,479
Speaker 1: question to me, question three? Only detail I'll give you

2039
01:54:25,520 --> 01:54:28,160
Speaker 1: stay two for trivia, where I beat Dr Jonathan Riceman

2040
01:54:29,040 --> 01:54:33,680
Speaker 1: soundly despite the bone and Brody. I thought a good

2041
01:54:33,760 --> 01:54:35,720
Speaker 1: joke about Brody and I was making my kids breakfast

2042
01:54:35,720 --> 01:54:40,040
Speaker 1: this morning. Did they think it was funny? Well, no,

2043
01:54:40,080 --> 01:54:42,080
Speaker 1: because you're doing pretty good on the scoreboard, you know,

2044
01:54:42,120 --> 01:54:45,120
Speaker 1: like that turn of the reigning champion. I was think

2045
01:54:45,160 --> 01:54:50,520
Speaker 1: about how you're the waning champion. Listen. It's we got

2046
01:54:50,600 --> 01:54:54,640
Speaker 1: all year to square things up. Man, I'm not waiting champion.

2047
01:54:54,680 --> 01:55:24,640
Speaker 1: That's so funny. Thanks. Yeah,