Speaker 1: Welcome to had the Money.
Speaker 2: I'm Joel, I am Matt, and today we're talking bad raps,
Speaker 2: price match murder, and premium points credit cards.
Speaker 1: That's right, Joel. Everyone can tell that we're back in
Speaker 1: the studio, back in the clubhouse. We're back in the
Speaker 1: saddle here talking about personally very very western saying back
Speaker 1: in the saddle. Yeah, I guess I was thinking about
Speaker 1: was think about Rydan Horse. I talked about falling off
Speaker 1: the horse and getting back on it again. Zealander quote. Man,
Speaker 1: we it's just good to be able to kick folks off, right,
Speaker 1: you know, Like that's one of the things that's so
Speaker 1: great about Friday Flight episodes is I feel like I
Speaker 1: get that we get to join our listeners as they
Speaker 1: kick off their weekend. They're thinking about us as they're
Speaker 1: like hanging out Friday night doing fun things on Saturday,
Speaker 1: which Matt and Joel were here. Yeah exactly. It's like
Speaker 1: we're tagging along with you. We wish we were too.
Speaker 2: I'd love to be at your grandma's birthday party or
Speaker 2: speaking of actually grandma's birthday parties. My next door neighbor.
Speaker 1: Is any grandma birthday parties? Recently?
Speaker 2: I have so my next door neighbor is actually a
Speaker 2: great grandma. She just turned one hundred years old this
Speaker 2: past weekend, so we.
Speaker 1: Have your one hundred. You should be like a great
Speaker 1: great grandma, I know, right, I mean may as well.
Speaker 1: I don't think she's close to that status. Okay.
Speaker 2: So she's just awesome, lovely person. And actually she's got
Speaker 2: an older sister, which is which is cool. So her
Speaker 2: geens are incredible. But one of the things that they
Speaker 2: had displayed at her birthday party that her son put
Speaker 2: together was this like fake newspaper article and it was
Speaker 2: hearkening back to simpler times of one hundred years ago
Speaker 2: when she was born and what things cost back then.
Speaker 2: And I took a picture and my daughter and I
Speaker 2: were like looking over it, and she was like, how
Speaker 2: did stuff cost that little? Until we were it's really cool.
Speaker 2: So I figured I would share a couple of things.
Speaker 2: A new house in nineteen twenty five cost six thousand dollars.
Speaker 1: A new car.
Speaker 2: Can you guess how much a new car costs Matt
Speaker 2: in ninety twenty five six hundred dollars three hundred ninety
Speaker 2: dollars two.
Speaker 1: LUs six hundred for the for the premium model, right, yes,
Speaker 1: which you would have been if you wanted the leather
Speaker 1: appointed seats with a nice wood. They weren't doing that thing.
Speaker 1: They weren't doing that back then. That's another reason why
Speaker 1: things are so expensive now is because everything is so nice. Yeah,
Speaker 1: as opposed to just being kind of like the point
Speaker 1: A to point B. This is made of steel. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: at onone break gotten fancy or bigger, lots more amenities. Okay,
Speaker 1: what do you think a loaf of bread cost? Oh
Speaker 1: a loaf of bread? Was that like ten cents? Spot on?
Speaker 1: Is it really? Yeah? Well I'm thinking about when it
Speaker 1: like five cents to go see like a movie? So
Speaker 1: was it? Was it? What a state cost a steak? Yeah?
Speaker 1: If a loaf of bread was ten cents the a steak,
Speaker 1: iman's say seventeen thirty six cents? Oh okay, okay, but
Speaker 1: here's the kicker. That's the thing. I bet beef. Back then,
Speaker 1: everything was free range, grass fed, no antibiotics because none
Speaker 1: of that stuff existed. That's true to one hundred years ago.
Speaker 1: What do you think the average income was one hundred
Speaker 1: years ago? Per year one hundred years ago, I don't
Speaker 1: know man average income. Okay, So you said a house
Speaker 1: costs six thousand dollars, So I'm going to say that
Speaker 1: it would make sense back in the day if you're
Speaker 1: like I saved up to buy this house for five years,
Speaker 1: so I'm going to say about a.
Speaker 2: Thousand bucks okay, close fourteen hundred Okay, Yeah, so you
Speaker 2: made pretty good guesses there.
Speaker 1: Put me in the hot seat. Well, I didn't like that.
Speaker 2: I wanted to know, like, because I think it can
Speaker 2: be dispiriting at times for people to see like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: my grandma paid like fifteen grand maybe for her house
Speaker 2: and that would have been an expensive house. Right.
Speaker 1: It's important to pay attention to the income side of
Speaker 1: things too. It's not just the outgoing what were yeah,
Speaker 1: what were they earning back then?
Speaker 2: It is and also much more than that, it's important
Speaker 2: to pay attention to investment returns. So I was curious, Okay,
Speaker 2: what if you invested one hundred dollars, which is obviously
Speaker 2: a lot more than one hundred dollars today, But what
Speaker 2: if you had invested one hundred dollars and you never
Speaker 2: invested again for the rest of your life. And it
Speaker 2: depends obviously on the rate of return, but.
Speaker 1: Just a one time I'm lump sum depositive one time deposit. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you would have an idea. You know, it depends on
Speaker 1: like returns and inflation and all that stuff, but you'd
Speaker 1: have what I do know that as ten percent average,
Speaker 1: a nearly compounded Yeah, because that's that I am familiar
Speaker 1: with that we have talked about over the course of
Speaker 1: the past hundred year. O.
Speaker 2: Well, I looked it up on a site called official
Speaker 2: data dot com. Give it to me hundred bucks. Put
Speaker 2: it in nineteen twenty four and year twenty twenty five
Speaker 2: in the s and P five hundred, you would have
Speaker 2: two million, seven hundred and sixty eight thousand dollars.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, so one hundred right, one hundred bucks. So
Speaker 1: what do you think about that?
Speaker 2: I mean, most of us don't have one hundred year
Speaker 2: investing timeline, right, We've got maybe half that at most
Speaker 2: because we start spending down that money at some point too.
Speaker 2: But I just think investing is the way to counteract
Speaker 2: a higher rising prices. And yeah, I saw a quote
Speaker 2: or I saw Warren Buffett. Resounds like looking at old
Speaker 2: warm buffet videos on YouTube because that's what I do
Speaker 2: in my spare time because I'm weird, and you know,
Speaker 2: he was talking about, Yeah, how just saving. Think about
Speaker 2: how much it's going to cost to go to Disney
Speaker 2: World next year. That's what he used as an example,
Speaker 2: And well, the price on that's gonna go up. If
Speaker 2: you're saving, yeah, maybe your saving straight will keep up,
Speaker 2: maybe with the price higher price of Disney World tickets.
Speaker 2: But if you're investing, that's how you grow your money
Speaker 2: so that you can much more easily afford Disney World
Speaker 2: tickets in the years to come. And I think that's
Speaker 2: just a practical way to think about it. So I
Speaker 2: looking back at those prices, I think the first initial
Speaker 2: knee jerk for a lot of people at Miss Betty's
Speaker 2: party was like, gosh, wouldn't it be nice depression if
Speaker 2: my state, Yeah, if my state costs thirty six cents,
Speaker 2: and now it's like eighteen dollars a pound. But you
Speaker 2: look at the flip side of it, and it's like, oh, man,
Speaker 2: if you were savvy with your money, actually inflation didn't
Speaker 2: toast you like you. If you invested, you would more
Speaker 2: than keep up with inflation, you would far surpass it.
Speaker 1: Indeed, indeed, all right, this is our Friday flight, though
Speaker 1: we're going to cover a lot of the different stories
Speaker 1: that we've come across, not just this past week, but
Speaker 1: we have some lost ground to catch up on, Joel.
Speaker 1: The Big Beautiful Bill, which it's no longer called that
Speaker 1: now is now it's the One Big Beautiful Bill Act.
Speaker 1: So ohbbb OBBBA is what we have to call it. OBA.
Speaker 1: But that passed about a month ago, which, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: prioritize the current goals of the current administration over the
Speaker 1: long term fiscal responsibilities of our country. But it did
Speaker 1: cover a lot of ground, including extending the tax cuts
Speaker 1: and jobs at.
Speaker 2: I can say just from like how the sausage gets made.
Speaker 2: Wouldn't it be nice if we had more bills that
Speaker 2: were smaller in scope that we can more easily understand
Speaker 2: how it used to go down, But sadly everything gets
Speaker 2: shoved into one big the most.
Speaker 1: Bill is how it goes down now. Yeah. So, but
Speaker 1: what we're gonna do, we're gonna do old old school,
Speaker 1: old school like Congress used to do it. We're gonna
Speaker 1: break things down. So instead of doing one long, boring,
Speaker 1: walky episode, we'll cover some of the A lot of
Speaker 1: the different elements kind of sprinkled throughout the episodes. In
Speaker 1: the coming weeks the ones that we think are going
Speaker 1: to be most impactful to listeners. And so the raising
Speaker 1: of the salt deductions from ten thousand dollars to forty
Speaker 1: thousand dollars, that was a quite a contentious part of
Speaker 1: the bill, but it's going to particularly benefit folks in
Speaker 1: the most expensive states out there, like New York or California.
Speaker 2: That comes to mind, and some people were saying, well,
Speaker 2: the reason that population they're getting having population drain, especially
Speaker 2: at the higher end of the income ladder in those states,
Speaker 2: was because of that salt deduction cap, because it was
Speaker 2: really costing people in high tax states a lot of
Speaker 2: money on their taxes by having that in place. So
Speaker 2: that was kind of part of this.
Speaker 1: It felt like they're leaving money on the table basically
Speaker 1: when they're just like when they're capped at ten thousand
Speaker 1: dollars and they're saying, I've got plenty more I could
Speaker 1: itemize here to get deducted off my taxes. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's lifted up to forty thousand dollars. Now. Another group
Speaker 1: of folks who are going to see their taxes go down
Speaker 1: are folks who are sixty five and older, which certainly
Speaker 1: isn't a huge portion of our audience, but it's a
Speaker 1: straight up six thousand dollars deduction per person. And this
Speaker 1: is for couples who are earning less than one hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty thousand dollars. This is quite significant. So you're
Speaker 1: looking at a total of twelve thousand dollars straight up deduction.
Speaker 2: And again, we talked about we talked about this like
Speaker 2: maybe a couple of months ago, about the finitude of
Speaker 2: this bill, that oh, it's all this stuff that's happening,
Speaker 2: but really it's only locked in. A lot of the
Speaker 2: changes are baked in for a few years. So even
Speaker 2: those the tax cuts, right, the tax cuts and job
Speaker 2: backed that we're supposed to be made permanent in this well,
Speaker 2: even though they're extended for a few more years. So
Speaker 2: this is going to be another political battle, you know
Speaker 2: that we can see on the timeline and then not
Speaker 2: too distant future, we're gonna have a lot more discussions
Speaker 2: about this, and we're going to have another bill passed.
Speaker 1: Re visit it, which I've heard arguments for that for
Speaker 1: this sort of natural sunsetting of some of these provisions,
Speaker 1: and there's arguments for it, there's also arguments against it,
Speaker 1: of course, because it's like, oh, this is the short
Speaker 1: term kind of let's make the people happy. But I
Speaker 1: think it's also from a fiscal again responsibility standpoint, it
Speaker 1: can be helpful to be like, hey, this is going
Speaker 1: to come back on the table and we're going to
Speaker 1: talk about it again. Don't assume that this is going
Speaker 1: to stick around, yeah, forever.
Speaker 2: I think it's more of a political feet to the
Speaker 2: fire thing though, and it's like, well, you're not for
Speaker 2: so that's where that's this. We're going to how we're
Speaker 2: going to run against you, and that's what the ads
Speaker 2: are going to say. Another random part of this bill
Speaker 2: is the car loan interest deduction up to ten thousand
Speaker 2: dollars a year that people can take if they buy
Speaker 2: a US assembled car and they have a loan on
Speaker 2: that car. Right, Matt, what do we think of this?
Speaker 1: Are?
Speaker 2: We are we fans? This is like one of my
Speaker 2: least favorite parts random things thrown into this bill because
Speaker 2: I think it's going to help some people rationalize taking
Speaker 2: out a loan on a new car when car loans
Speaker 2: are pretty much always a bad idea. The average person,
Speaker 2: like think about, you know, cars are more expensive. Interest
Speaker 2: rates have gone up on cars, and this feels like
Speaker 2: throwing a bone into people. Hey, you bought that expensive
Speaker 2: new car and you got this nine percent interest rate.
Speaker 2: You're probably paying something like two twenty five hundred dollars
Speaker 2: a year in interest on that car. So we'll at
Speaker 2: least allow you to save taxes on that. The average
Speaker 2: person new car buyer is going to save something like
Speaker 2: four hundred dollars a year in taxes because of this
Speaker 2: thing included in the bill. And yeah, I'm just not
Speaker 2: a fan because I think people will be able to
Speaker 2: rationalize and say, now I get the tax incentive, I
Speaker 2: might as well keep that loan around. When car loans
Speaker 2: are a bad idea, dig into the details about your
Speaker 2: income because of income over a certain threshold, you won't qualify.
Speaker 2: And also what car make and model qualifies, because you
Speaker 2: need to know that before buying it. And even still,
Speaker 2: don't let that sway you into buying a new car
Speaker 2: and taking out a sick loan that's going to cost
Speaker 2: you a lot of money every month on the car.
Speaker 2: Note too, ev tax credits on both new and used vehicles.
Speaker 2: They are going away because of the One Big Beautiful
Speaker 2: Bill Act September thirtieth thirtieth is the last day you're
Speaker 2: going to be able to get that tax incentive for
Speaker 2: buying an electric vehicle. So the effective price of EV's
Speaker 2: is going to go up significantly. I think it's going
Speaker 2: to make it less enticing to switch. I mean, I
Speaker 2: told you that I canceled my.
Speaker 1: No, I'm just gonna be out here driving my Slate truck,
Speaker 1: my slate, my cool little Lego truck, all by myself.
Speaker 1: I thought we're gonna have I know, sorry, man, I
Speaker 1: guess it's just gonna be me.
Speaker 2: And they're they're adorable and we would have looked good
Speaker 2: riding next to each other in those trucks. But part
Speaker 2: of the appeal was not just its low price point,
Speaker 2: but low price price point with EV tax credit. And
Speaker 2: I actually just bought a new used car we should
Speaker 2: talk about on the show, a twenty year old car,
Speaker 2: not not anything close to new. But that's why I
Speaker 2: canceled my order. It is because oh I got this
Speaker 2: new used car that's gonna last me, I think a
Speaker 2: long time. Also, the Slate card.
Speaker 1: Is not it's not gonna be as cheap as I
Speaker 1: thought it was going to be. If they take away
Speaker 1: the tax credits, seventy five hundred dollars tax or a
Speaker 1: price bomp as we're straight up, I mean, that's a
Speaker 1: big deal. It's it's crazy that some folks that was
Speaker 1: like real money, right Like, I mean, that was an
Speaker 1: instance to where it's not this it's not a deduction
Speaker 1: of your income that's going to then reduce your tax bill.
Speaker 1: This is a tax that was a tax credit. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so dollar for dollar is how the price of those
Speaker 1: evs was reduced, which is quite significant.
Speaker 2: Well on that, on that front, we should just mention
Speaker 2: they didn't. This bill didn't only pull back ev tax credits.
Speaker 2: It's also pulling back energy efficient home repair tax credits
Speaker 2: because yeah, that was supposed to have a long way
Speaker 2: I think long runway. I think it was supposed to
Speaker 2: expire in like twenty thirty two something like that, but
Speaker 2: they're going away at the end of this year. So
Speaker 2: if you have upgrades you're planning on making to your home,
Speaker 2: well then get them done in a timely manner. If
Speaker 2: you're planning on doing it next year, you probably want
Speaker 2: to do it in just you know, November December something
Speaker 2: like that of this year. So you may all have
Speaker 2: to tax credit. But after this year they're going away.
Speaker 1: Something else I saw. So while we're talking about cars though,
Speaker 1: before we leave that, another reason to avoid buying new cars,
Speaker 1: whether we're talking about electric vehicles or traditional internal combustion
Speaker 1: engine cars, and that's because of a one thousand dollars
Speaker 1: monthly car payment that is no longer the anomaly. I
Speaker 1: saw that one in five buyers are signing up for
Speaker 1: one of these. This is according to Edmunds. And not
Speaker 1: even for thirty six months, not for three years. This
Speaker 1: is often for over six years, which is insane. Man.
Speaker 1: The risk of just blowing your budget and being underwater
Speaker 1: in that loan for a long time is serious. And
Speaker 1: I just crunch them numbers because I'm like, one thousand
Speaker 1: dollars is so much money, man, So I can't fathom
Speaker 1: were you to take that thousand dollars and invest it
Speaker 1: in the market. Two thousand dollars a month agay, which
Speaker 1: is a lot of money. I mean, if you're paying
Speaker 1: that to I don't know. Some folks are like, well,
Speaker 1: I gotta have a car, but you don't need to
Speaker 1: have a brand new car, as Joel just mentioned to
Speaker 1: you're twenty years old, you've got you got.
Speaker 2: A two thousand and six Toyota. I think it's gonna
Speaker 2: last me another decade.
Speaker 1: Four hundred baby, Yeah, yeah, awesome, But it would take
Speaker 1: you twenty seven years before that one thousand dollars a
Speaker 1: month turns into one million dollars. Yeah, one million, Like
Speaker 1: and I know you were just talking about inflation and
Speaker 1: one hundred years ago, one million isn't what it used
Speaker 1: to be, right, It's still still one million dollars is
Speaker 1: a lot of money. And the reason part of why
Speaker 1: we talk about these kind of things here on the
Speaker 1: show is we want people to make informed decisions. They
Speaker 1: just think they have to sign up for these things
Speaker 1: to make these payments. And some folks are gonna be like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a million dollars, but that's in twenty seven years, guys,
Speaker 1: and they're gonna choose to go with a nice new car.
Speaker 1: But there's gonna be other folks who say, wait, a
Speaker 1: million dollar dollars. I didn't realize that. That's okay, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna say no to the car, sign me up for
Speaker 1: a million bucks. We want folks to make informed decisions.
Speaker 1: Speaking of home energy things, it makes me think of
Speaker 1: like the yellow energy you stickers. It's like what is
Speaker 1: the cost of this to me over the long haul,
Speaker 1: and essentially that's what you're giving up.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, selling my other used car, the accurate
Speaker 2: that so well, the guy, the guy that came over
Speaker 2: and he ended up buying it. Yesterday we were talking
Speaker 2: about that. He was like, the whole point nice of
Speaker 2: me buying this car is so that I don't have
Speaker 2: to have a car payment. And I'm like, I'm with you, man,
Speaker 2: and so we can all for you. You'll have solidarity
Speaker 2: on that point.
Speaker 1: That's that's why you do it. Man.
Speaker 2: I was like proud of him, man as a young
Speaker 2: kid getting started, and I'm like, this thing's going to
Speaker 2: treat you well. And I hope, I mean, I think
Speaker 2: you can treat me well. So I hope that this
Speaker 2: allows you to avoid having a car payment for many.
Speaker 1: Don't make a promise like that where you've got zero
Speaker 1: there's nothing you can do about.
Speaker 2: Hey, this is treating you well. Yeah, it's a depress
Speaker 2: I think you know, I'm like couching it. I'm not
Speaker 2: telling him that this thing's like gold and going to
Speaker 2: run forever.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you're right. I can't promise that.
Speaker 2: Let's talk about student loans for a second, like, something
Speaker 2: thing else that changed? Can we say, Bigley, is that
Speaker 2: a is that a President trump ism? That's up to you. Okay,
Speaker 2: so I said, I try not to adopt trump isms. Yeah, personally.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 2: Well, something else that changed in a big way because
Speaker 2: of this new bill is student loans. Gone are the
Speaker 2: days of past payments and generous repayment plans. The safe
Speaker 2: plan is gone for good and there's something new in
Speaker 2: its place, the Repayment Assistance Plan or RAP. That's that's
Speaker 2: the new thing in town. So if you borrow money,
Speaker 2: does it sound more hip to you because it's rap? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I think so. Let's rap kids, right, Hello, fellow children.
Speaker 1: I forget what Steve Amy says. Oh yeah, what is
Speaker 1: that in? What's that? Happy to go more? I don't
Speaker 1: even know. It's been a while. Yeah.
Speaker 2: If you if you borrow money though from the federal
Speaker 2: student loan program after July first, and we are past
Speaker 2: that date, this is the repayment program you'll be under.
Speaker 2: Our friends at Student Loan Planner. We had Travis hornsbyond
Speaker 2: a few months ago.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 2: They they are advising extreme caution right now for people
Speaker 2: when they're considering my especially people who already have have
Speaker 2: student loans from the federal government under their belt. They're
Speaker 2: even telling folks, they are telling those folks to consider
Speaker 2: private student loans to avoid having all of your loans,
Speaker 2: because if you already have existing student loans and you
Speaker 2: take out more, they'll all be put onto the rap plan,
Speaker 2: which isn't as generous as the plans you might already
Speaker 2: be on, So be wary for that. We'll link to
Speaker 2: a blog post from them on that, detailing kind of
Speaker 2: some of the intricacies. Also, student loans are accruing interest. Again,
Speaker 2: the average borrower is going to pay more than like
Speaker 2: thirty five hundred dollars a year in interest alone. And
Speaker 2: at the headlines and the details of what's happening to
Speaker 2: student loan borrowers in this country, there's just there's a
Speaker 2: lot of people wringing their hands because they're nervous about
Speaker 2: what this is going to mean and how they're going
Speaker 2: to be able to handle these increased payments back in
Speaker 2: their lives.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I will say moving forward, I don't know. Maybe
Speaker 1: maybe it's because I never had student loans with the
Speaker 1: different income based for payment plans. I feel like I
Speaker 1: could never fully get my head around it. It's like
Speaker 1: just the complexity involved with all the different places.
Speaker 2: All the alphabet soup, and the tiny sliver detailed differences
Speaker 2: in between them.
Speaker 1: I will say the simplicity of Wrap it took me
Speaker 1: five minutes of kind of like reading some of the
Speaker 1: details to fully understand at least I think as to
Speaker 1: what it offers, which I appreciate the simplicity. Yeah, the
Speaker 1: simplicity is great, and it's because it's got this flat
Speaker 1: fee regardless of how much you make. So like basically,
Speaker 1: if you make ten thousand dollars or less, you're still
Speaker 1: going to pay ten bucks. But then beyond that, for
Speaker 1: every thousand dollars, every ten thousand dollars of income, you
Speaker 1: just pay one percent more of your income. So basically,
Speaker 1: if you make thirty seven thousand dollars, you're paying three percent,
Speaker 1: If you make seventy seven thousand dollars, you're paying seven percent.
Speaker 1: If you make one hundred and twenty thousand, well, you're
Speaker 1: still your capped at that ten percent. It doesn't go
Speaker 1: above that ten percent. That's not something I could say
Speaker 1: with the previous plans.
Speaker 2: Yes, at the very least, that's why we had to
Speaker 2: have experts on to talk about all the details, like
Speaker 2: the people who eat, breathe, and sleep sudent longs. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so that's one thing I can appreciate about RAP. But
Speaker 2: generally speaking, this this means that student in bars aren't
Speaker 2: doing so well with interest accruing. Again, in particular, many
Speaker 2: are feeling the financial pinch, and I think for others
Speaker 2: it's just going to feel like a full on chainsaw
Speaker 2: to their budgets. And as we've mentioned before the government
Speaker 2: has the ability to dock your pay and they seem
Speaker 2: likely to pursue payment by garnishing wages. So we feel
Speaker 2: for you if you are impacted by this jarring pie
Speaker 2: change when it comes to student loan policy. I like
Speaker 2: the current the way things are looking now moving forward
Speaker 2: if we can just stick with that, But I don't
Speaker 2: like how things to be. Things seem to be whipping
Speaker 2: back and forth perhaps.
Speaker 1: Every four years.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's that's the tough part in the stomach,
Speaker 2: is like the promises that seem sure that don't get kept,
Speaker 2: and then the next person's like, we're going to do
Speaker 2: the exact opposite, and you're like, I don't they actually
Speaker 2: get accomplished their goals and they this time around.
Speaker 1: It's it's tough. Know that not paying making these payments.
Speaker 1: This isn't a great option, like we don't want you
Speaker 1: to not put food on the table or anything like that.
Speaker 1: But just know that the FEDS are serious about collecting
Speaker 1: on that student loan debt. The government. They even have
Speaker 1: the ability to dock Social Security payments from older Americans
Speaker 1: who have student loan debt. I can't imagine there's too
Speaker 1: many of those folks. There's more than a think really, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the folks who have taken out student loans made
Speaker 1: for their press rand kids.
Speaker 2: Depressing to think, but there are people collecting SoCal Security
Speaker 2: owe money on students.
Speaker 1: That being said, that has been paused at least for
Speaker 1: a now. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Also watch out for student loan advice on TikTok. We've
Speaker 2: talked about just financial advice in general and social media.
Speaker 2: Some of it's great, but there's a lot of like
Speaker 2: crummy stuff too and just flat out lies. At the
Speaker 2: same time, there are people out there saying, oh, no,
Speaker 2: there's an easy path to student loan forgiveness, but it's wrong.
Speaker 2: They basically say, hey, dispute your student loan debt with
Speaker 2: the credit bureaus. It's going to get removed from your
Speaker 2: credit report whil your student loans are gone from your life,
Speaker 2: and that sounds nice and that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it might.
Speaker 2: Actually get removed from your credit report for a hot minute,
Speaker 2: but it could just be temporary and it does nothing
Speaker 2: to eliminate the debt or pause the need for you
Speaker 2: to make payments. So I don't know, maybe stick to
Speaker 2: TikTok dance videos. If people still doing that, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I'm sure they are relationship advice. That's probably you think
Speaker 2: that's good on TikTok, Matt, of course, Okay, yeah, everything's
Speaker 2: right on TikTok except for the financial advice. So yeah, yeah, okay, yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't I wouldn't know because I literally I have
Speaker 2: never been on there.
Speaker 1: So all right, but we've got plenty more to get to.
Speaker 1: We're gonna talk about one of the bigger retailers out there, Amazon,
Speaker 1: among others. We'll get to all of that and more
Speaker 1: right after the break. Right, we're back in just a minute.
Speaker 2: We're going to talk about some new credit card products
Speaker 2: that come with really high annual fees. Oftentimes the perks
Speaker 2: are sick on those cards. But are these new ones
Speaker 2: worth it. We'll talk about that, but Matt first, let's
Speaker 2: get to the ludicrous headline of the week. This one
Speaker 2: comes from the Wall Street Journal and the title is
Speaker 2: the origin of the eighty dollars popcorn Bucket.
Speaker 1: Too rich for my blood?
Speaker 2: Yeah, man, I mean, I spend on things you love,
Speaker 2: but if you love eighty dollar popcorn buckets, I got
Speaker 2: questions for you.
Speaker 1: So this is a phenomena that all started with Dune, Yes,
Speaker 1: with the Dune Bugget, which just going back, I saw
Speaker 1: they I think they included pictures of that because it's
Speaker 1: just so insane.
Speaker 2: It's tough to fathom reaching your hand in that bucket
Speaker 2: to get the popcorn out.
Speaker 1: He's going to do that. It's kind of creepy.
Speaker 2: But you know, the movies are back. I think I'm
Speaker 2: curious if the f one movie performed. Well, I kind
Speaker 2: of wanted to see that in theaters, but also, I
Speaker 2: can't tell you the last time I saw a movie
Speaker 2: in theater, so I knew it wasn't gonna happen, even
Speaker 2: though I thought it would have been cool.
Speaker 1: I know the last movie I saw, what which was
Speaker 1: the How to Train Your Dragon? Oh, okay, real life
Speaker 1: or what do you call it. I don't know, it's
Speaker 1: not realize you went by yourself without the kids, right, exactly. No,
Speaker 1: this was the first movie that we've ever taken the
Speaker 1: entire family to. Oh wow, ever, isn't that crazy? That's crazy? Yeah,
Speaker 1: your kids live a sheltered life. Well, it's just there
Speaker 1: aren't that many great movies out there. And why do
Speaker 1: you like, why do you go to the movie theater
Speaker 1: when you've got a solid size TV at home and
Speaker 1: it's comfortable. We make our own popcorn with like oil
Speaker 1: in the pot and pop it on the stovetop, as
Speaker 1: opposed to whatever stale preserve popcorn they've got there. So
Speaker 1: yet another reason to not pay for the eighty dollars popcorn.
Speaker 1: Come up with your own cool vessels at home. Yeah,
Speaker 1: just plain ole bwles.
Speaker 2: But this one is interesting. It's like some New Fantastic four,
Speaker 2: which apparently, this New Fantastic for movie is actually good,
Speaker 2: but it's this eighty dollars popcorn bucket attached to it.
Speaker 2: And I guess these popcorn buckets have taken on a
Speaker 2: life of their own. But what do you do with
Speaker 2: a popcorn bucket once you're done with it? I'm even
Speaker 2: reluctant to buy popcorn at all of the movie theaters. Yeah,
Speaker 2: we got like a there's a you know, we rarely
Speaker 2: go to the movies, maybe like four or five times
Speaker 2: a year with the kids, but we got the on
Speaker 2: Black Friday. There are local theater which is far less
Speaker 2: expensive than the other theaters. For some reason, probably just
Speaker 2: a little rundown, they were selling like the actual refillable
Speaker 2: bucket I forget. I was like eight dollars or something
Speaker 2: like that, and the refills are just like like four
Speaker 2: dollars every time we go, And so that felt okay,
Speaker 2: I think I'm willing to pounce on that and don't
Speaker 2: drop that bucket to let it break right over there
Speaker 2: tape in his to give it together. But yeah, the
Speaker 2: eighty dollars popcorn bucket makes zero sense to me.
Speaker 1: What are you gonna do? Put it on your shelf
Speaker 1: when you're done with it. It feels like a like
Speaker 1: a movie theater status symbol. Yeah, which, like is that
Speaker 1: the kind of status symbol you'd have? Which okay, So
Speaker 1: this makes me think of this is like an impulse
Speaker 1: purchase that someone would totally make the theater be like, yeah,
Speaker 1: that looks cool. I guess I'll get it. I guess
Speaker 1: so okay, so I guess I've got a frugal or
Speaker 1: cheap So that when we went and saw How to
Speaker 1: Train Your Dragon ahead of Time Kate and Night, we
Speaker 1: told all the kids, hey, you can take some candy
Speaker 1: to the movie theater because we're not going to buy
Speaker 1: the crummy, expensive, overpriced popcorn there in the theater. Is
Speaker 1: that frugal or cheap showing up with your own candy?
Speaker 1: I think it's Is it instilling improper virtue or tactics
Speaker 1: in the minds of our children.
Speaker 2: You're just you're, yeah, bring, I don't care. I'm totally
Speaker 2: down to stop by the gas station, get your candy
Speaker 2: bar there and bring it.
Speaker 1: Oh no, we were picking up Halloween candy that we
Speaker 1: still have in our pantry from last year. That might
Speaker 1: be stale and nasty at this point too. Candy lasts forever.
Speaker 1: We well, I don't know, man, Yeah, maybe not. It
Speaker 1: was just one of those instances to where we're kind
Speaker 1: of catching ourselves. We're like, well, are we teaching the
Speaker 1: kids to like be scofflaws? I don't know. We dialed
Speaker 1: it back because initially they had like handfuls of candy.
Speaker 1: We're like, no, it needs to fit in your hand.
Speaker 1: That's that's how we basically limited how much candy they
Speaker 1: they could show up with. Anyway, I'm glad you hear.
Speaker 1: At least you are not judging me, Joel. All of
Speaker 1: our listeners are judging us. Let's talk about some of
Speaker 1: our favorite businesses out there, the ones who don't seem
Speaker 1: to be treating their customers all that well. Oh, first
Speaker 1: of all, did you see that Delta they're getting ready
Speaker 1: to launch that AI pricing model. It's like dynamic pricing
Speaker 1: two point zero. I love there to take it to
Speaker 1: the next level. Their response because they were basically like,
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? We never even were considering this,
Speaker 1: when clearly they were, but they were like backing away quickly,
Speaker 1: like Homer subsident. Normally, normally everyone's jumping all over the AI,
Speaker 1: but in this case they're like, oh, wait a minute,
Speaker 1: I guess in this case, we're using the AI against you.
Speaker 1: So actually it's not AI. It's just a fancy dynamic pricing,
Speaker 1: which you've always done. Guys. Now, I feel like there
Speaker 1: are more and more stories about different retailers, in particular
Speaker 1: not taking the high road target in particular, they are
Speaker 1: ending a favorable price match policy that it's had for years.
Speaker 1: It's basically the way it worked if you found an
Speaker 1: item that you bought at Target for less money within
Speaker 1: fourteen days within two weeks of purchase at a competitor,
Speaker 1: you get a refund for the difference. And this is
Speaker 1: not something that they're honoring anymore as of last week.
Speaker 1: Evidently Target doesn't want to compete on price in that way.
Speaker 1: And this is something that you've taken taken advantage of.
Speaker 1: Right you are one of the few people that I
Speaker 1: know who's willing to see something that you purchased in
Speaker 1: the past and then go and make a case for
Speaker 1: why it is that they should give you some money back.
Speaker 2: Well, I even this is going to sound weird. I
Speaker 2: was buying a backpack from my daughter going back to
Speaker 2: school backpack, and then I saw that it was thirty
Speaker 2: percent off like a few days later, so I ordered
Speaker 2: it again. So I had two of the same backpack,
Speaker 2: and then I took back the one and returned it
Speaker 2: on under the full price skew.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, sometimes that's what you gotta do, Yeah.
Speaker 2: Because I mean, that's just the easiest way to go
Speaker 2: about it sometimes, but it's slightly more automated.
Speaker 1: I think this is okay. So one of the reasons
Speaker 1: I think targets why they are not doing this anymore
Speaker 1: is because there's like a judgment call that's involved, Like
Speaker 1: someone has to be there making a case, making an argument,
Speaker 1: pointing to a price somewhere else, and someone else has
Speaker 1: to be looking at it saying, oh, yeah, I guess
Speaker 1: that's legit. Did you photoshop this? I don't know, it's
Speaker 1: on your phone, as opposed to something like what you
Speaker 1: just described, which was a return, which is much more automated.
Speaker 1: It's just more streamlined, and I think there are more
Speaker 1: folks who are finding ways to be savvy shoppers by
Speaker 1: essentially making returns things that they are like, you know what, actually,
Speaker 1: I don't see the value in that, even though I
Speaker 1: purchased it, and let's be honest, and they're sending it back.
Speaker 2: Prices are far more dynamic these days, so the Amazon
Speaker 2: might offer an incredible price on an item that you
Speaker 2: just bought from Target, and then you go over to
Speaker 2: Target and you're like, hey, look look how cheap it is.
Speaker 2: Give me my money back, and they're like, but that
Speaker 2: they had it that way. For like a day or
Speaker 2: maybe less than that, so we don't feel compelled to
Speaker 2: price to match that price. So I get why is
Speaker 2: doing it?
Speaker 1: I don't.
Speaker 2: I'm not throwing shade at Target. I think actually Target's
Speaker 2: done a pretty good job attracting customers in recent years.
Speaker 2: And guess what, none of their competitors had a policy
Speaker 2: like this, So for them to be able to compete,
Speaker 2: they just got It's almost like they're at a disadvantage
Speaker 2: if they keep a policy like that around.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I wish that they could keep a policy like that,
Speaker 2: but it's just not the way.
Speaker 1: The modern market works. That's how I feel. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: they just can't can't play that game. Well, I mean
Speaker 1: I see it. It's more like forward looking, whereas you
Speaker 1: keep tabs on like previous purchases that you made. I'm
Speaker 1: always just like, all right, what's next, which maybe put
Speaker 1: says more like in like lumps us with the typical
Speaker 1: American consumer, Like you're talking about back to school shop,
Speaker 1: and I mean, I don't know how many pairs of
Speaker 1: shoes there are at our house currently, but we've got
Speaker 1: a lot because you order a bunch, see which ones fit.
Speaker 1: Like we're not going to go into the store into
Speaker 1: the shoe store. We're gonna find the ones that the
Speaker 1: kids like, that fit the best, that actually fit because
Speaker 1: the sizes are all over the place, and then you
Speaker 1: send the rest of them back. And I think that's
Speaker 1: one of the ways that Amazon has competed, and like
Speaker 1: they've kind of changed our behavior to a certain extent
Speaker 1: because folks are taking advantage of the ability to make
Speaker 1: those returns, which is probably why we're starting to see
Speaker 1: prices with Amazon starting to tick up a.
Speaker 2: Little bit, because they're taking advantage behavioral reliance on them.
Speaker 1: Right, So, Okay, this is why we can't have nice things.
Speaker 2: I hope she's listening today, because returns, well, the Wall
Speaker 2: Street Journal actually has been tracking a basket of like
Speaker 2: hundreds of goods that Amazon sells, and Amazon's over here
Speaker 2: saying like, we've been keeping our prices low for customers,
Speaker 2: and the Wall Street Journal is saying, all contraire, You've
Speaker 2: actually been raising prices on a lot of these goods.
Speaker 2: And I think for a lot of years, Matt, Amazon
Speaker 2: did keep prices pretty low. They were trying to mass
Speaker 2: customer share, and so that's why so many people became
Speaker 2: incredibly reliant on Amazon and It became their go to
Speaker 2: place to shop for stuff because they were like, it's
Speaker 2: easy and it's cheap. But that is becoming less the case.
Speaker 2: And you know, free markets are great, but when we
Speaker 2: don't take advantage of free markets, when we are knee
Speaker 2: jerk going to Amazon to buy stuff, we are more
Speaker 2: likely to pay more than we should or need to,
Speaker 2: or more than other retailers are charging because Amazon realizes
Speaker 2: that we are we have we got the Prime membership,
Speaker 2: we're super down with the convenient delivery, and so we're
Speaker 2: just going to pay whatever price Amazon tells us they're
Speaker 2: charging now instead of shopping around and think this is
Speaker 2: just should be a good reminder for how to money
Speaker 2: listeners that as Amazon was raising prices over the last
Speaker 2: few months on a bunch of these goods, Walmart was
Speaker 2: lowering prices on the goods. So the price gap has
Speaker 2: increased between what Amazon sells stuff for and Walmart sells
Speaker 2: stuff for. And that's you know, a couple hundred goods.
Speaker 2: It's not pervasive, necessarily, or indicative of everything you might
Speaker 2: buy exactly, but it's a good reminder tonot just rely
Speaker 2: on Amazon for your shopping.
Speaker 1: That's true, honestly, guilty as charge, because like I think
Speaker 1: that's just our default. Like literally this morning, I purchased
Speaker 1: some air filters and it's so easy to look back
Speaker 1: at the previous order. You should have done it from Costco. Buddy,
Speaker 1: I saw that there were that they were there, but
Speaker 1: I never have the size. What I should do is
Speaker 1: put my sizes on my phone. That way I've always
Speaker 1: got it. I put other stuff on my phone. Yeah, like,
Speaker 1: for instance, the price of beef. Like anytime I go
Speaker 1: into Costco, I'm always walking by the stakes looking at
Speaker 1: the ribbuys and you're monitoring that. Yeah. Ok, I've got
Speaker 1: a note in my notes app and it's called to
Speaker 1: consume What have you seen? What have you seen? Okay,
Speaker 1: So beef prices are up ten to thirteen percent year
Speaker 1: over year, and that's not because that's something I've kept
Speaker 1: track of. That's something I saw on the news as well,
Speaker 1: but it's been in my notes app though it's been
Speaker 1: what three years, I think since I've been able to
Speaker 1: snag a prime ribbi at fifteen dollars a pound. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's just not where prices are. And in part it's
Speaker 1: evidently due to high expenses due to the cost of
Speaker 1: feed evidently has gone through the roof as well, so
Speaker 1: beef prices. While other prices have gone down, we've seen
Speaker 1: inflation cool, so beef prices are still sky high.
Speaker 2: Makes me think about our conversation back in the day
Speaker 2: with Frankie Solenza, who like struggle meals, right, he's all
Speaker 2: about super struggle tasty meals, and he talks about he
Speaker 2: talked about using meat more as like a garnish in
Speaker 2: your dishes.
Speaker 1: Oh that's that was that's Kate's line. That's that's our line.
Speaker 1: Is that your rank? He didn't say that, he's told
Speaker 1: it from you. He did, Okay, Well, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe he said it. He can say it too.
Speaker 1: But he's the one that's got the cooking show. Yes, sure, yeah,
Speaker 1: nobody's listening to I swear, I mean listeners. If you
Speaker 1: remember the episode when we first started uh poor not poor,
Speaker 1: before we change it to how to Money, I'm pretty
Speaker 1: I think I remember literally us talking about slashing your
Speaker 1: grocery budget. Yeah, episode seventeen or something, especially when beef prices.
Speaker 1: That's how we treated meat though as a garnish. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like a little it was almost like, you know, like
Speaker 1: bacon on a wedge salad. That's how we did all
Speaker 1: of our meat. Well, getting steaks is the main feature
Speaker 1: now at your meal. Yeah, granted it's probably still cheaper
Speaker 1: than eating out, but it's it's going to be so expensive,
Speaker 1: so much so it's got to be like few and
Speaker 1: far between, and changing your shopping habits and saying, I
Speaker 1: guess we're I guess we're more of a chicken family
Speaker 1: right now. That might be a good move. I will say, Okay,
Speaker 1: what Frankie did say. I do remember him specifically saying that, hey, Joel,
Speaker 1: don't you know that broccoli has got more protein than
Speaker 1: Ribbi's than beef does. And in the moment we were
Speaker 1: like really, He's like, oh yeah, he's like those cruciferous vegetables.
Speaker 1: I was like, no way, But in fact what it
Speaker 1: was was it broccoli has more protein per calorie than
Speaker 1: beef does per calorie, and so sure it's got to
Speaker 1: get it's got a decent amount of prosy, but you
Speaker 1: you also have to eat like thirty pounds of broccoli
Speaker 1: in order to get the same amount of wheat protein
Speaker 1: and like two pounds of stakers you told me recently,
Speaker 1: and I wouldn't have guessed this that chicken has more
Speaker 1: protein than chicken breast stake. Yeah. Yeah, so I think
Speaker 1: that's pronounced.
Speaker 2: For those of you crossfitters out there trying to get
Speaker 2: your protein in, hey man, chickens cheaper and you're gonna
Speaker 2: get more more of that protein you move to improve.
Speaker 1: All the folks out there who are looking to uh optimizer,
Speaker 1: I mean, all the Huberman, all the Peter Rittia listeners
Speaker 1: out there, they know it's up when it comes to protein. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they do are.
Speaker 2: Let's talk credit cards. So the new Chase Sapphire Reserve
Speaker 2: went live at the end of June, and it comes
Speaker 2: to a much higher annual fee than it did before.
Speaker 2: So I'm sure, Matt, a lot of how to money
Speaker 2: listeners are like, this, is this credit card still worth it?
Speaker 2: What are the changes that got made? Well, Chase is
Speaker 2: thinking that customers are gonna willingly pay seven hundred and
Speaker 2: ninety five dollars a year to have this credit card.
Speaker 2: The annual fee, it's more than the Amex Platinum, which
Speaker 2: is also set to get in overhaul, I think, but
Speaker 2: the perks can potentially add up for savvy users. Some
Speaker 2: of the major selling points points are A three hundred
Speaker 2: dollars annual travel credit, one hundred and twenty dollars credit
Speaker 2: for TSA pre check, and up to five hundred dollars
Speaker 2: in credit towards high end hotel stays. But maybes, I Matt,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm less keen on these credit cards.
Speaker 1: Now. You want to tell us about the City New City.
Speaker 2: Card and Strata elites, and then maybe we'll give like
Speaker 2: our diagnosis of what's happening in the high end credit
Speaker 2: card space.
Speaker 1: Well, here's the thing. I'm not even gonna share specific details,
Speaker 1: because I feel the way that some of these nicer
Speaker 1: credit cards are going. They are reminding me of those
Speaker 1: coupon books that you could buy for twenty bucks back
Speaker 1: when you're in like middle school, the blue Ones entertainment
Speaker 1: on the front where they were they blue Crown. You
Speaker 1: could completely save a ton of money by buying those
Speaker 1: back in the day. But a lot of folks what
Speaker 1: did they do? They just let them linger and they're
Speaker 1: junk drawer and oh there's an expiration date.
Speaker 2: I oh no.
Speaker 1: The downside of the coupon buk model is that it
Speaker 1: often incentivizes you to spend more than you otherwise would.
Speaker 1: So you've got the same model here, but the stakes
Speaker 1: are so much higher with these incredibly fancy credit cards
Speaker 1: that have these insane annual fees. And sure, for the
Speaker 1: right person, right like, I think this could be a
Speaker 1: no brainer if you're going to optimize to the nth degree.
Speaker 1: But I think for the average person, especially if you're
Speaker 1: kind of on the fence about this, this is a
Speaker 1: hard pass. So I would simply recommend just going to
Speaker 1: something basic like the City Double. You know, forget the
Speaker 1: City Strata Elite. Go with the City Double Cash card.
Speaker 1: That's the card that we're using very regularly. Because was
Speaker 1: it lot sometime last year that we talked about I
Speaker 1: think for years we'd been using the Amex Blue Cash Preferred,
Speaker 1: and I was like, wait a minute. They cap the
Speaker 1: six percent CA back on the groceries at a certain
Speaker 1: amount per year, and I realized, may we're we've got
Speaker 1: a family of six, we might I think we're hitting
Speaker 1: that like halfway through the year, and I was blindly
Speaker 1: still putting my grocery charges, obviously my non costco grocery
Speaker 1: charges on that card, still earning one percent. I felt duped.
Speaker 1: So because the details matter, they do, and so because
Speaker 1: of that earlier this year, I was like, I'm going
Speaker 1: to make sure that old AMEX they don't take advantage
Speaker 1: of me. They you know, I'm a profit center for them.
Speaker 1: Not really, but we stopped using the blue cash preferred
Speaker 1: about halfway through the year, and now all of our
Speaker 1: food charges are going on to the double cash car
Speaker 1: to get that solid two percent back at the very least. Well,
Speaker 1: and yeah, like they gotta be smart about it. That's
Speaker 1: details in some of these cards are really like really interesting.
Speaker 1: So for instance, yeah, you'll.
Speaker 2: Get a credit for staying at certain hotels, but that
Speaker 2: credit is broken up into two different times of year
Speaker 2: like January through.
Speaker 1: June and oops, yeah and then too many hoops for me, dude.
Speaker 2: And guess what the credit comes if you book a
Speaker 2: hotel well and essentially some of the most expensive hotel
Speaker 2: chains in existence. So you have to be like a
Speaker 2: high flyer. I think if you got to be a baller,
Speaker 2: I think if some of these cards actually less as
Speaker 2: travel cards now and more as like big city six
Speaker 2: figure dink sort of credit cards.
Speaker 1: Right like Bagatti, sure get you get you to these
Speaker 1: fancy cards, right, it's like the same same classes.
Speaker 2: Because you're probably the kind of person who's going to
Speaker 2: use stub Hub regularly, Apple TV, Peloton Like these are
Speaker 2: less travel and more like, hey, do you buy into
Speaker 2: and do business with fancy fancy companies like Apple and Peloton?
Speaker 2: You know on the leg you're going to get a
Speaker 2: credit for that, but you got to make sure that Like,
Speaker 2: I think these also the one of the problems. It
Speaker 2: just incentivizes you to spend, just like those cup books.
Speaker 2: It's like you save more when you spend more. And
Speaker 2: so the only way you're going to get value from
Speaker 2: the twenty dollars book is if you cut out at
Speaker 2: least ten q pons. Like the goal is to maximize
Speaker 2: your savings, but how do you maximize your savings by
Speaker 2: spending more money? And so I think these credit cards
Speaker 2: could incentivize a lot of people to spend more, sign
Speaker 2: up for services they otherwise wouldn't have signed up for
Speaker 2: in an effort to save money and justify the annual fee.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying they don't make sense for anyone. I'm
Speaker 2: just saying for a lot of people, they're probably out
Speaker 2: of each and they really don't spend in a way
Speaker 2: that these credit cards will make much sense.
Speaker 1: Totally agree, all Right, let's call it before we wrap.
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Speaker 1: a fantastic weekend. We'll see you back here with a
Speaker 1: fresh ass kind of money episode. We'll see here on Monday.
Speaker 1: Until next time, Best friends Out, Best Friends Out.