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Speaker 1: So honestly just comes down to not being full of yourself.

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Speaker 1: Comprehend that you're a complete idiot and there are smarter

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Speaker 1: people doing you out there, and you should be knowledgeable

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Speaker 1: that you have a blind spot. Yes I'm great in engineering,

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Speaker 1: I'm horrible, and other things like a marketing I need

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Speaker 1: to hire somebody that's great at that. I neither hire

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Speaker 1: a person that's great as a finance xyz, so I

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Speaker 1: can then focus on the overall a big vision of

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Speaker 1: just growing the company.

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Speaker 2: Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of button Nomics. I'm

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Speaker 2: your host, Brandan Butler, founder CEO of Butter atl and

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Speaker 2: today we got a special guest in the studio. I mean,

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Speaker 2: we always had special guests in the studio, but this

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Speaker 2: is a special this guest right here, man, even though

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Speaker 2: he gets on my last dagon nerves last, it is.

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Speaker 3: A guest that's close to my heart, man, I gotta

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Speaker 3: be honest, I appreciate that.

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Speaker 2: It's a friend the homie mister Justin Saniels, founder of

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Speaker 2: render aka Renderfest.

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Speaker 3: Justin, how you doing, man?

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Speaker 1: I would just say that is probably the best guest

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Speaker 1: a pastor introduction I've ever had in my life. Like

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Speaker 1: when you're at church and you got a guest pastor

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Speaker 1: up there, and they come in and they're just going

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Speaker 1: down on the resume. I thank you, thank you for that.

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Speaker 3: Oh man.

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Speaker 2: You know, look man, absolutely, man. Look I've been there,

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Speaker 2: been there with you, watching you built this whole render

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Speaker 2: thing out. You know what I'm saying, Seeing how you're

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Speaker 2: making an impact. It's good to see the stuff you've

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Speaker 2: been doing around Atlanta.

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Speaker 1: You can hijack the name. You try to change our

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Speaker 1: name twice now, you know, to render Fest. But it's okay, though,

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Speaker 1: it's okay, I'm gonna let that go, even though the

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Speaker 1: people seem to kind of gravitate towards it.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I'm two. I'm two for.

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Speaker 2: Two, man, render Fest Silicon South like hit. I'm saying

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Speaker 2: on two.

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Speaker 1: For two, bro, I'll know two for two. I would

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Speaker 1: say you're one for two, but I'm gona let the

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Speaker 1: other one go, the other one?

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Speaker 3: Which one? Which one was a miss?

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Speaker 1: I'm just saying, render has not taken hold in my heart. Oh.

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Speaker 2: I mean, that don't matter that people love it. It's

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Speaker 2: the people out here all the time when it's Renderfest happening.

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Speaker 2: So well, you know what for right now, We're not

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Speaker 2: gonna call it render Fest. We're gonna refer to it

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Speaker 2: by its business name, which is Render one of the

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Speaker 2: largest software engineering conferences in the country. There we go,

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Speaker 2: now justin tell us, man, how do you define Render?

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Speaker 2: Like when people ask you what render is, how do

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Speaker 2: you define it?

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Speaker 1: I mean, are we going for the a pr answer

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Speaker 1: or are we going for.

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Speaker 3: The like for the culture man, culture for culture man?

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Speaker 1: Right? Great? So Render is probably the best tech conference

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Speaker 1: you will ever go to, not just only because it's

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Speaker 1: like a black folks everywhere, but because we are unapologetic

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Speaker 1: about the culture happening at the conference. You could learn

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Speaker 1: from people from all walks of life at the conference

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Speaker 1: doing the latest, greatest thing in their respective job. Where

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Speaker 1: we've even had people dressed in a full shaistison giving

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Speaker 1: crazy lectures that you're like, wait, I'm learning from the

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Speaker 1: guy dressed in a mask right now? That is pretty

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Speaker 1: a dope, right. And we do an entire music festival,

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Speaker 1: we do an entire food truck parking lot, We do

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Speaker 1: stuff all around a city. Because it's a I t

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Speaker 1: at tech Week and it's just a great time. You're

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Speaker 1: around other people who I know a bullshit, they're just

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Speaker 1: there to have a great time, learn and then just

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Speaker 1: honestly go to hell home after it.

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Speaker 2: Now, for full disclosure, I have been an advisory on Render,

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Speaker 2: so I got a little bit of inside information. I'm

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Speaker 2: not gonna I'm not gonna share anything too crazy right now.

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Speaker 2: But again, some of the questions I'm gonna ask just

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Speaker 2: want to help t that up because I want to

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Speaker 2: make sure people fully understand the Render story, you know.

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Speaker 1: And add a virus that he means he comes to

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Speaker 1: the meetings twice a year.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean that's what I'm supposed to do.

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Speaker 2: Man, I'm making an impact. I show up, I making

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Speaker 2: an impact, and I get the hell on. Just like

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Speaker 2: you said, come do what you got to do and leave, right,

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Speaker 2: you can leave. Come do what you got to do

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Speaker 2: and leave, you know. But no, man, I remember, man,

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Speaker 2: you started this during the pandemic and it's kind of

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Speaker 2: grown a lot since then. What made you start this

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Speaker 2: whole idea behind Render?

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Speaker 1: Man? I was honestly just tired of going into the

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Speaker 1: West Coast all the time. Like are you come from

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Speaker 1: a come computer science a background? When you graduated here,

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Speaker 1: They're like, yo, if you're trying to get a cool job,

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Speaker 1: you gotta go to Cali, you gotta go to Silicono

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Speaker 1: a valley. But folks like us are like, eh, screw that,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna try to blaze my own a path here, right,

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Speaker 1: And what you come to find out is, while you're

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Speaker 1: talking about screw that, I'm gonna blame my own path,

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Speaker 1: it's actually much harder here to accomplish that. So I

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Speaker 1: started to fall into the trap of like, well, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna have ATLS my home base, but I'm gonna go

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Speaker 1: out to Cali and go to conferences. I'm gonna go

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Speaker 1: out to Cali and go meet great and dope people.

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Speaker 1: But after you start doing that week to week back

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Speaker 1: to back, you're like, yo, Like I'm spending four hours

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Speaker 1: on a plane each way. I'm not making a lot

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Speaker 1: of money at the time. So I'm in economy. I mean, like,

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Speaker 1: scratch that. I'm not even an economy. I'm not even

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Speaker 1: on a delta. I'm on like a frontier going across

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Speaker 1: the country week after week. That shit gets old quickly, right,

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Speaker 1: So I said, all right, if atl has a global

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Speaker 1: airport and we have all these different neighborhoods, why the

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Speaker 1: hell don't we just have this huge conference here that

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Speaker 1: could do the same exact thing that you see everybody

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Speaker 1: else doing in a Silicon valley. And that right there

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Speaker 1: was the overall genesis of it was I was just

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Speaker 1: tired of having to constantly travel across the country, so

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Speaker 1: I said, let's just a build it here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it always seems like, you know, Atlanta's

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Speaker 2: right for a lot of those big cultural conferences and festivals.

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Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, man, I remember again like back in

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Speaker 2: the day. When I say back in the day, you know,

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Speaker 2: ten fifteen years ago, back in the days, it's like

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Speaker 2: it's like pre COVID and post COVID, right, yes, because

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Speaker 2: even you think about it, right before COVID, like people

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Speaker 2: didn't even want to do zoom meetings and virtual meetings

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Speaker 2: and stuff. It was like they it almost was like disrespectful. Yes,

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Speaker 2: if you ask somebody like hey can we jump on

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Speaker 2: a Google call, They're like what wow, Now it's like

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Speaker 2: disrespectful for you want me to come somewhere a person

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Speaker 2: half the time, you know. But it was even worse,

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Speaker 2: especially if you're in tech and you're in some of

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Speaker 2: these industries to where yeah, like if you were in Atlanta,

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Speaker 2: even with all the great you know, schools like Georgia

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Speaker 2: Tech and all the places we have out here. Like,

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Speaker 2: you weren't considered serious about a startup in a lot

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Speaker 2: of areas unless you went to the West coast, right,

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Speaker 2: and it was like that's where all the opportunity and

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Speaker 2: money was. People were just playing around out here in Atlanta.

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Speaker 2: But like if you really were serious about going to

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Speaker 2: the next level, you had to go out west. And

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Speaker 2: first it was first it was you know, San fran

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Speaker 2: Then it kind of became Austin in that whole area.

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Speaker 2: But like you've really kind of like opened up the

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Speaker 2: East coast now to a lot of these opportunities.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, absolutely, and it's beginning to get easier but also

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Speaker 1: getting harder because they keep moving the carrot of like, well,

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Speaker 1: if you only have a fifteen hundred of people, then

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Speaker 1: we could do more in Atlanta. Then the conference achize

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Speaker 1: fifteen hundred. You were there, you had fifteen hundred people

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Speaker 1: packed out a TGS. I don't know a house of

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Speaker 1: this day.

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Speaker 3: That was crazy.

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Speaker 2: I don't know how thoughts a terrible packed out TGS.

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Speaker 1: It was a great time. And then I'm like, all right,

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Speaker 1: y'all approved of y'all that we have technical people here.

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Speaker 1: We could do greatness. They're like, uh, not yet. Then

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Speaker 1: a Microsoft moved here, then SAP moved here, then a

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Speaker 1: Cisco moved here. All these companies kept on moving here,

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Speaker 1: even when Milchim got acquired by in to it. We're like, yo,

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Speaker 1: we have technology here, but why do y'all keep on

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Speaker 1: skipping over us? And the answer is people are just like, well,

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Speaker 1: it'll just take more work to have to move to

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Speaker 1: the South. But it's crazy to me that they don't

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Speaker 1: kind of consider a Miami the South because everybody moved

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Speaker 1: down there. And I'm like, yo, like, Miami's cool, but

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Speaker 1: it only has a beach. That's all Miami got. Goes

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Speaker 1: down there, and I don't know about you, but there's

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Speaker 1: only so many days I could just go hang out

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Speaker 1: at the beach. And then you're like, Okay, where's the

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Speaker 1: culture at, where there's the people at? And you learn

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Speaker 1: really quickly that it's a place that if you are

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Speaker 1: not making a copious amount of money, you're gonna be like, yo,

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Speaker 1: I got shit to do that. You know.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: It's also I mean even too, it's also interested about Miami.

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Speaker 2: I remember, even with Miami, it really impacted the trajectory

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Speaker 2: of what Butter became. I remember that we did the

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Speaker 2: Butter we launched Butter was at like twenty eighteen, I think.

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Speaker 2: And I remember I had to go down to Miami

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Speaker 2: literally the day after our launch party. Really, I had

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Speaker 2: to go down there for some family stuff, and I

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Speaker 2: was walking around and I remember looking around and saying, Man,

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Speaker 2: I don't think that Butter would work in Miami. And

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Speaker 2: the reason why is because Miami won. If it's not

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Speaker 2: you know, seventy five percent Spanish, it's instantly not gonna work.

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Speaker 2: But even beyond that, Miami has like so many types

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Speaker 2: of cultures. It does in so many types of like

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Speaker 2: areas and neighborhoods, right Like I noticed then, I was like,

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Speaker 2: you know, it's gonna be very hard to create a

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Speaker 2: definitive kind of like culture channel for Miami because you

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Speaker 2: have to speak to so many different areas. I felt

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Speaker 2: the same thing about La even about New York. Last means,

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Speaker 2: I said, you know that I feel like it worked

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Speaker 2: really well in Atlanta because Atlanta's a little bit more

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Speaker 2: binary that folks want to admit.

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Speaker 3: Sometimes.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Hell, let's just be real. In atl your out

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Speaker 1: there all right, or you are black? Right now, and

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Speaker 1: you got everything else in between. Like I think I

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Speaker 1: had already report the other day that the Asian population

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Speaker 1: is the fastest growing population here. And I don't know

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Speaker 1: about you, but I've been down abut for the Highway

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Speaker 1: within the last couple of months, and I see Asian

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Speaker 1: restaurants popping up everywhere, and I enjoy the food. It's amazing,

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Speaker 1: you know.

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Speaker 3: So.

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Speaker 1: But outside of that, to your point, atl is still

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Speaker 1: very You throw right, or you are black, and you

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Speaker 1: could choose what side you want to play on. And

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Speaker 1: really the cool thing about what a Butter and what

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Speaker 1: a render has done is we kind of play with

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Speaker 1: everybody side, Like, Okay, you can be right over here,

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Speaker 1: you could be a black over here, you could be

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Speaker 1: anything else, I mean, tween over here. Right. We don't

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Speaker 1: like really care. All we care about is your support

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Speaker 1: at the end.

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Speaker 3: Of the day. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Now, I remember again besides that gathering spot time and

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Speaker 2: everything was super crowded. Wow, you crowd It was crowded, man. Look,

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Speaker 2: I remember standing the line trying to get some food

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Speaker 2: and stuff like that. But you know, I also remember

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Speaker 2: like that was when that was the year we had

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Speaker 2: Big Boy and some other folks, right I think I

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Speaker 2: think I made that phone call. But anyway, besides that, though, man,

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Speaker 2: like the bigger point is that to me, that's when

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Speaker 2: you kind of started really adding more of the culture

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Speaker 2: elements to Render, right, which again started to grow. And

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Speaker 2: again big Boy was just a speaker on a panel.

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Speaker 2: He wasn't performing. But then you know you started then

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Speaker 2: adding in the performances. You started adding in the event

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Speaker 2: with Kate Trenada, right, you know he had Anderson Pac

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Speaker 2: last year. You know what I'm saying, Like, like what

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Speaker 2: made you want to kind of add that element on

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Speaker 2: to the festival so that it just wasn't just a

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Speaker 2: straight up conference but kind of had that cultural fun

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Speaker 2: element to it.

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Speaker 1: Also, Yeah, and like I just want to touch on

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Speaker 1: what you just I said too, which is you're the

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Speaker 1: one that made that call happen. And I always tell

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Speaker 1: people that's the magical thinking about ATL is you don't

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Speaker 1: know who you're sitting next to you at any given

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Speaker 1: moment that could actually open the doors up for you quickly.

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Speaker 1: If I didn't come to the bar at TGS that

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Speaker 1: day pissed off, if like you remember, I pissed off

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Speaker 1: because I forget who we were about to book but

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Speaker 1: they had pulled out, and I was like, man, I

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Speaker 1: got cash, I got people coming, Why the hell can

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Speaker 1: I get anybody? And then you looked at me and

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Speaker 1: said you want to get a big boy? And I said, okay,

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Speaker 1: man cool. And then like you just walked off and

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Speaker 1: you came back in and said, all right, it's now happening.

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Speaker 1: I said, oh.

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Speaker 3: Shit, okay, cool.

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Speaker 1: And I think about could that same thing happen in

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Speaker 1: any other other place you'd call it? Couldn't happen in La?

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Speaker 1: Can it happen in NYC?

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Speaker 3: A flute?

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Speaker 1: Yes, I can. But I think that the density here

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Speaker 1: of people that you're just connected to is so tight

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Speaker 1: that you have a higher likelihood of it happening here

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Speaker 1: than any a place south.

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Speaker 2: You know, yeah, it kind of reminds me of that

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Speaker 2: moment specifically, kind of reminds me of when I used

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Speaker 2: to go to south By Southwest all the time, right,

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Speaker 2: and you know, it was it was very similar right

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Speaker 2: where there were just there's just certain areas to where

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Speaker 2: I always tell people when you're at south By, I

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Speaker 2: don't know how much it is now like it used

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Speaker 2: to be, but I would always say, yeah, no, I

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Speaker 2: mean went, we went, you know, it's definitely a lot

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Speaker 2: different now. But I used to tell people, like, when

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Speaker 2: you go to south By, you need to talk to

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Speaker 2: every single person with a badge on. Yes, because the

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Speaker 2: sheer amount of investment that's needed to even go.

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Speaker 3: To that conference. Oh god, And this was you know, yeah, five.

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Speaker 2: Six, seven, almost ten years ago, right, like you're still

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Speaker 2: in you know, two three grand for a ticket, easy,

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Speaker 2: you're still in, you know, another five hundred thousand bucks

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Speaker 2: for a plane ticket.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know.

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Speaker 3: I remember I stayed at the Courtyard by Marriott.

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Speaker 2: I think they charged me like seven hundred dollars a

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Speaker 2: night racking up, right, So like just me going alone

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Speaker 2: probably costs damn near ten grand. And so I always

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Speaker 2: tell people like, you know, but at the same time,

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Speaker 2: any person you see with a badge on, you got

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Speaker 2: to understand there there's somewhere in that same range too, right,

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Speaker 2: So it just makes sense you never know who you're

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Speaker 2: talking to. To your point, you know, Atlanta kind of

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Speaker 2: has that density. We were specifically at the gathering spot

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Speaker 2: where again you even kind of double down a little

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Speaker 2: bit more, and there's just so many people here at

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Speaker 2: opportunity to kind of make things happen. Would have been

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Speaker 2: some other kind of like you know, inflection points or

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Speaker 2: like serendipitous moments that you think of kind of like

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Speaker 2: you know, always say like when you look back, there's

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Speaker 2: just moments where you're like, all right, that's a moment

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Speaker 2: where when that happened, it took us to the next level.

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Speaker 2: Like what are some other moments that have happened with

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Speaker 2: render as you look back that have kind of like

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Speaker 2: taken y'all from what's this spot's kind of the next spot?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's such as on your question too,

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Speaker 1: of like the culture piece, which was I was at

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Speaker 1: a TGS and I was thinking out at the bar

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Speaker 1: and one of the folks asked me a question which

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Speaker 1: was like, hey, have you met Jordan A. Gibbs? And

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Speaker 1: I was like, no, who is Jordan's Like, oh, Jordan

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Speaker 1: knows this a festival. It's called a milk and cookies.

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Speaker 1: They haven't came around in a while. I think y'all

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Speaker 1: both should like work to gather because I could I

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Speaker 1: see the cultural element of the conference coming to a

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Speaker 1: life and these are my homies over here, and I

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Speaker 1: think y'all both can do a greatness well to a

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Speaker 1: flash forward. Now we had to work with them in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty two to do the A Block A party

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Speaker 1: first pulled that off. That was a great time. And

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Speaker 1: then we tripled down in twenty twenty three and we

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Speaker 1: had the entire belt Line Park and had a kitchenada

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Speaker 1: out there with over eight thousand people. It was just

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Speaker 1: a nuts And if I wasn't at TGS at that

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Speaker 1: particular date and time, sitting in that particular seat, I

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Speaker 1: would have never been introduced to a Jordan and then

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Speaker 1: everything else. Yes, over time would have had a concert. Yes,

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Speaker 1: over time would have added more culture. But knowing the

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Speaker 1: right people like that opened it up much quicker, you know.

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Speaker 1: Being able to only do that in the first a

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Speaker 1: year and a half of us having a conference, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I don't know about y'all at home, but try and

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Speaker 1: do a festival and conferences. That shit is capital intensive,

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Speaker 1: extremely capital intensive, you know, and most people don't get

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Speaker 1: to that point where they're having a headline artist like

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Speaker 1: k Trnado or having someone like an innocent a Pod

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Speaker 1: until like eight years in, ten years in and we

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Speaker 1: pulled it off in a year two and a half.

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Speaker 1: That was just craziness, you know. So that's a big

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Speaker 1: inflection point of our success right here. I think another

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Speaker 1: inflection point is just sitting at TGS at the bar

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Speaker 1: and watching people just gravitate towards me to say, hey,

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Speaker 1: you're the guy building that cool thing that Brandon tells

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Speaker 1: me is called a render Fest. And I'm like, yes,

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Speaker 1: it's called render ATL, not render Fest, but rend the

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Speaker 1: ATL And They're like, yeah, how can I be down

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Speaker 1: and learning to just hear people's thoughts on it help

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Speaker 1: shape my own thoughts on what it should become because

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Speaker 1: it's not all about me. It's a ode to the culture.

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Speaker 1: So the culture feels included in a tech overall.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I'll give it to you know, y'all have scaled.

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Speaker 2: You know, you have an amazing team, Like roughly how

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Speaker 2: many people when Render kind of like ramps up. I

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Speaker 2: remember talking to Jay Carter and he was talking about,

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Speaker 2: you know, they have hundreds of people, you know, when

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Speaker 2: it comes to time for one music fest, right then

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Speaker 2: you know they obviously ramped down to kind of the

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Speaker 2: core team. But like when Render is ready to ramp up,

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Speaker 2: like how many people are actually working, you know, under

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Speaker 2: the Render flag.

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Speaker 1: So everybody that is internal to the company And when

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Speaker 1: we get to a full on ramp, which is usually

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Speaker 1: in April, it's about a forty okay, But then if

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Speaker 1: you count all the external agencies and contractors and people

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Speaker 1: that just helping from third parties, we're probably closer to

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Speaker 1: a double dat if not at one hundred.

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Speaker 3: Okay, Yeah, it's dope, man.

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Speaker 2: And so with all those people, I mean, obviously you

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Speaker 2: got to come up with systems and processes. I think

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Speaker 2: that's the part, right, Like everybody talks about how hard

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Speaker 2: it is to get the right team in.

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Speaker 3: Place, it's very hard. How hard is to scale certain things.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: Again, I've seen the way y'all use I mean obviously,

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Speaker 2: you know, being on the team in the past, I've

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Speaker 2: seen the way we use you know, technology to communicate,

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Speaker 2: but all just also different tools like how is your

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Speaker 2: tech background you know, really kind of helped you create

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Speaker 2: some of those systems and processes. It's going to help

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Speaker 2: you scale the company to where it's gotten so far.

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Speaker 1: Oh man. I think that's the best part of our journey,

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Speaker 1: is that I'm an engineer by trade. But it's also

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Speaker 1: the hardest part because we like to be over in

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Speaker 1: analytical of everything. I mean, once again, you're an engineer

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Speaker 1: by trade too, and we like to have a processes.

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Speaker 1: We like to look at data, we like to see

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Speaker 1: how are you doing particular actions. But you know what,

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Speaker 1: engineer is a horrible at. We're a horrible at actual

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Speaker 1: user feedback. You know, we're terrible at that. So, like

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Speaker 1: currently we do all of our password sharing through an

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Speaker 1: application called a one password for everybody at home. If

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Speaker 1: you do not share passwords using either like one password

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Speaker 1: or a last password, I highly recommend you take it

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Speaker 1: out of a damn a Google doc just called passwords.

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Speaker 1: And it's crazy to me when I hire people and

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Speaker 1: their mind is blown because they will tell me like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I came from a blankly blank company and we shared

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Speaker 1: everything and a Google doc. So they're struggling to learn

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Speaker 1: how to use things like one password to access particular

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Speaker 1: critical data points. Right. The cool thing is that we

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Speaker 1: as engineers know how to put the processes in place,

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Speaker 1: and it helps you scale much quicker because you comprehend

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Speaker 1: that your time is more valuable. But the upfront cost

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Speaker 1: of that is exponential though, meaning you got to know

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Speaker 1: how to have a code half of the things that

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Speaker 1: you want I want to do, or you got to

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Speaker 1: know what particular systems can talk to other particular systems too,

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Speaker 1: which is very time and labor and intensive. But once

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Speaker 1: that shit starts to work, oh man, like people, I

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Speaker 1: think that a render is like over one hundred people

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Speaker 1: are deep and we all work a full time and

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Speaker 1: I'm like dog like at any given time, like currently

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Speaker 1: as we're recording this in January, there's probably only eight

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Speaker 1: of us on the team right now. But we moved

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Speaker 1: like a huge fortune ten company because of the fact

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Speaker 1: that we got so much automation in place. We have

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Speaker 1: been on the automation AI wave prior to the coolness.

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Speaker 1: It was like back in twenty twenty two, twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 1: I was like, yo, I only got X amount of dollars,

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Speaker 1: How can I do more with less? And I had

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Speaker 1: a foundancy, Bro, you're an engineer. You could just code

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Speaker 1: everything up and get the job done as easy And

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Speaker 1: I highly encourage folks. And we talked about this off

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Speaker 1: offline that you still stuff like Sappier. We use the

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Speaker 1: hell out of that. Hey, it automates everything you know,

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Speaker 1: or use things like chat to GBT to write your

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Speaker 1: PR real at least like you and I. When we

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Speaker 1: were going to announce at the conference with going up

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Speaker 1: back and forth in the group chat like I like

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Speaker 1: my PR, I released more than your PR release, asking

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Speaker 1: chat GBT to tweak each of them to get it

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Speaker 1: to work, you know what I mean? Versus having to

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Speaker 1: hire a person that you really can afford so highly

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Speaker 1: encourage companies to invest in AI and automation it up

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Speaker 1: change your lives quickly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and and and as you built that too, again,

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Speaker 2: like as a person that's been working on the inside

434
00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:48,520
Speaker 2: also works as an advisor. Yeah, I know, it's like

435
00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:51,280
Speaker 2: mentors have been kind of a big part that successful.

436
00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:54,159
Speaker 2: How was you know again having because I think I

437
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,200
Speaker 2: think a lot of times, you know again, people try

438
00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:57,520
Speaker 2: to build stuff and they kind of act like they

439
00:20:57,520 --> 00:20:58,840
Speaker 2: have to go to loan, have to figure it out,

440
00:20:58,880 --> 00:20:59,600
Speaker 2: Like you're not you're not.

441
00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:01,200
Speaker 3: You're not the first person ever done a conference.

442
00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:04,000
Speaker 2: Yea, the first person's ever built a company, right, So, like,

443
00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:06,800
Speaker 2: how did you find you know, mentors to help you

444
00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:08,119
Speaker 2: and kind of support you in building this?

445
00:21:09,520 --> 00:21:17,000
Speaker 1: I comprehend a old Zelda quote. Yeah, okay, the old one,

446
00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:18,200
Speaker 1: the old one.

447
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:19,000
Speaker 3: What's older?

448
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:20,640
Speaker 2: You you mean you mean like the legend of Zela

449
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:23,400
Speaker 2: like links to eat my like Superintendo or Nintendo.

450
00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:27,199
Speaker 1: Okay, all right, that's cool. Telling about the cartridge go

451
00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:32,560
Speaker 1: When you go with a link in the cave the

452
00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:36,440
Speaker 1: first time, there's a question that pops up about would

453
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:39,960
Speaker 1: you like to go alone? And then it says it

454
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:44,159
Speaker 1: is dangerous to go alone. Take a disc where you

455
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:47,360
Speaker 1: could choose like what you need, which is the sword? Right?

456
00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:51,160
Speaker 1: And I internalize that quote because I comprehend, like, yo,

457
00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:54,400
Speaker 1: like you will get your block knocked off out here

458
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:59,440
Speaker 1: very quickly. If you think you could solve everything. It's impossible. Yes,

459
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:02,200
Speaker 1: you could do war with a less but it's also

460
00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:05,960
Speaker 1: very helpful to comprehend that you do not know everything.

461
00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:09,159
Speaker 1: I tell people all the time that the president of

462
00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:12,119
Speaker 1: the country, and I'm gonna just say, oh Obama for

463
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,560
Speaker 1: all intensive purposes right now, because that's my main guiding light.

464
00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:21,360
Speaker 1: Oh Obama was a very great president. But the president

465
00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:24,760
Speaker 1: isn't the smartest person in the room. It's the people

466
00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 1: that he hires right to help add advise him. Because

467
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,680
Speaker 1: it's impossible to be a subject matter expert in every

468
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:35,359
Speaker 1: single thing. He hires a person to help with the

469
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:39,720
Speaker 1: Apartment of Agriculture, Department of whatever. And that's because he

470
00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:42,480
Speaker 1: cannot know everything about agriculture. He can't know everything about

471
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:46,040
Speaker 1: f DA regulations like whatnot. But he could hire that

472
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:50,640
Speaker 1: key person to help advise him, and he could then

473
00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:53,800
Speaker 1: formulate it and say, Okay, I think we should do X,

474
00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:56,560
Speaker 1: y Z next based upon what my ad advisor. But

475
00:22:56,680 --> 00:23:00,280
Speaker 1: also getting your advisors to talk to other ada is

476
00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 1: on the team helps a ton too. So it's honestly

477
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:07,280
Speaker 1: just comes down to not being full of yourself. Comprehend

478
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:12,760
Speaker 1: that you're a complete idiot and there are smarter people

479
00:23:13,119 --> 00:23:15,919
Speaker 1: doing you out there, and you should be knowledgeable that

480
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,000
Speaker 1: you have blind spots. Yes, I'm great in engineering, I'm

481
00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:23,000
Speaker 1: horrible in other things like marketing. All right, I need

482
00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:25,040
Speaker 1: to hire somebody that's created at that. I neither hire

483
00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 1: a person as great as a finance it's a YZ.

484
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,840
Speaker 1: So I can then focus on the overall a big vision,

485
00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:33,840
Speaker 1: a picture of just growing the company.

486
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:36,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, now, how do you do that though while building

487
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:39,240
Speaker 2: a business, because again to your point, like we have

488
00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:40,800
Speaker 2: a lot of people that are in place to help

489
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:43,399
Speaker 2: support these things, but obviously you got to build a

490
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:46,240
Speaker 2: business around this thing too to make sense. You know,

491
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:49,159
Speaker 2: how did you approach getting people involved and kind of

492
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,199
Speaker 2: coming up with like different structures, right, Like there are

493
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:53,800
Speaker 2: some people that are you know they they they probably

494
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:55,640
Speaker 2: have like a profit sharing element. There are other people

495
00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:57,680
Speaker 2: that you know they work and invest and I think

496
00:23:57,680 --> 00:23:58,840
Speaker 2: that's something I've also noticed.

497
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:01,720
Speaker 3: It's like really interesting. And how you built the business yeah, is.

498
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,200
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? You kind of have different

499
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:05,479
Speaker 2: situations set up with different people to say, you know what,

500
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:06,600
Speaker 2: like I want you to be a part of this,

501
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:08,960
Speaker 2: but like we're going to compensate you like this, so

502
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:10,800
Speaker 2: we can still get your talent, but we're gonna make

503
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:12,119
Speaker 2: it move differently, Like how did you come up with

504
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:13,160
Speaker 2: those kind of models?

505
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:17,120
Speaker 1: Talking to a lot of folks. So all I did

506
00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: was I looked at different companies and I said I

507
00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,120
Speaker 1: would ask them like how do you pay your employees?

508
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:26,679
Speaker 1: How do you pay your folks? And that was like,

509
00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 1: oh okay, there is more than one answer here. I

510
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:32,160
Speaker 1: think we get into the trap of like you gotta

511
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:34,760
Speaker 1: do just cash or you just got to do equity.

512
00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:37,400
Speaker 1: I got put on a game a long time ago

513
00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 1: that was like hello, like equity being handed out as

514
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 1: a pretty new con accept around the late nineties early

515
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 1: to a thousands, which was actually brought on by a

516
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,560
Speaker 1: tech folks said, Oh, I'm gonna work at this tech company.

517
00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:54,440
Speaker 1: They're going to give me x amount of the company,

518
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 1: and I'm happy, all right. But prior to that, it

519
00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:01,560
Speaker 1: was only a cash So once I learned that, I said, oh,

520
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,600
Speaker 1: there's other compensation models out here. Let me learn them

521
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 1: all and let me go talk to other founders. And

522
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:13,800
Speaker 1: the biggest piece of this equation was just being inspirational

523
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:18,479
Speaker 1: EI enough that people want to follow you and they'll say, yo, like,

524
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:22,879
Speaker 1: I like what you are doing, even though you can't

525
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: afford me. I am down to a ride for the cause.

526
00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:31,600
Speaker 1: But also as a founder, comprehending that when you get

527
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:34,879
Speaker 1: to a point that you want to uplift them to

528
00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:37,520
Speaker 1: One of the things I'm extremely proud about is that

529
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:41,919
Speaker 1: we always I figure out ways on how to subport

530
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 1: each other in the company, you know, like we worked

531
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 1: with Italian Twine right now, the co founder of Italian

532
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,600
Speaker 1: Twine came on as our COO. When we got to

533
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,760
Speaker 1: a point where we can afford a custom watch order,

534
00:25:57,119 --> 00:25:59,920
Speaker 1: what do we do? We've turned around and spent a

535
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:03,400
Speaker 1: lot of money out a bunch of custom watches from

536
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,879
Speaker 1: Italian Twine, which our audience loved, and that is just

537
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:10,000
Speaker 1: one example of like, this is a person who we

538
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:15,679
Speaker 1: couldn't afford, so we had to get inspirational. Yes we

539
00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 1: still pay to them, but not at a market rate.

540
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 1: But then we made the sure when we got to

541
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 1: a place that we can send the money back down

542
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,360
Speaker 1: or like they say, send the elevator back down. Said,

543
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:27,560
Speaker 1: I had great hopping down.

544
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:29,760
Speaker 3: You know, no, that's dope, man.

545
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 2: Now again you kind of touch on things like equity,

546
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:34,280
Speaker 2: like it's understanding you're you're.

547
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,400
Speaker 3: The bootstrap this business, so you strap baby.

548
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:42,639
Speaker 2: And that's that's that's another accomplishment too, because again I

549
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,200
Speaker 2: think a lot of times we you know, glorify going

550
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:46,080
Speaker 2: out and raising money.

551
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 3: I'm sure to come out and we do.

552
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 2: But obviously, you know you've retained that because you have

553
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:52,920
Speaker 2: a bigger idea and a bigger vision in mind.

554
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,879
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely absolutely. And I like to give credit to

555
00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:01,880
Speaker 1: my uh I CEO at the time of a Melchum.

556
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,320
Speaker 1: He was a founder and CEO, which is a ben

557
00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 1: a chestnut. He's a close mentor of a minds. It's

558
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:12,320
Speaker 1: I joke all the time. It helps when you know

559
00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:16,719
Speaker 1: you got a close mentor who is worth twenty plus

560
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:19,359
Speaker 1: a billion. You're like hey, man, like, what would you

561
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 1: do right now? You know, because you've obviously been there

562
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:27,840
Speaker 1: and you're a multi a billionaire, right, but he always

563
00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,119
Speaker 1: showed that, hey, you don't got a handout equity, but

564
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:35,440
Speaker 1: you do got to understand how to be inspirational towards

565
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: other folks and help them along the way too, same

566
00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:42,240
Speaker 1: way he's helping me now.

567
00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, now, and as your growth again, you talk about

568
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:47,879
Speaker 2: bootstrapping and growing a business. Obviously you can't do this

569
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,800
Speaker 2: without money. One of the things is always amazing you

570
00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 2: know that I've always see advendor is you know, not

571
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:54,600
Speaker 2: only do y'all have the conference, but you're kind of

572
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 2: have like this whole kind of like talent and trade

573
00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 2: show element on top of like the music element too, right,

574
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,920
Speaker 2: Like how did y'all go about finding you know, brands

575
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:06,159
Speaker 2: and sponsors that want to actually you know, partner with

576
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 2: render in the early days.

577
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, so in the early days, we were all thinking

578
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:15,120
Speaker 1: about how do we do heavy talent of recruiting and whatnot?

579
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:18,360
Speaker 1: Not until I talk to are you actually and you

580
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 1: were like, yo, trade show, that's what we need to

581
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 1: do next? I said, interesting, actually three, but yeah, like

582
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:33,480
Speaker 1: we had maybe a one or two, a minute convo

583
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 1: about trade shows, and I was like, damn, that's a

584
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 1: good point. I never even I thought about trade shows.

585
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:44,400
Speaker 1: And that's when things change from just being a talent

586
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:48,440
Speaker 1: acquisition conference. So like you could come here a demo

587
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: what's happening at your company and do a b to

588
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 1: be a sales at the conference now, which is a

589
00:28:56,120 --> 00:29:00,720
Speaker 1: huge a portion of our business now of a growing

590
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:03,959
Speaker 1: the company, is that be to be a element. How

591
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:08,240
Speaker 1: were going about getting those partners, honestly, is just hand

592
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 1: to hand to combat. I tell you all the time.

593
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:14,360
Speaker 1: It was me in the early days waking up at

594
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 1: a four am sending out emails coldly saying, hey, come

595
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 1: to my conference. I want you to give me five

596
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:28,840
Speaker 1: a thousand, ten a thousand at the time, right, and

597
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 1: I guarantee you this is what's going to happen. The

598
00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:35,760
Speaker 1: great thing is that when you do a good business

599
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:39,840
Speaker 1: like that, people go and tell others, hey, you should

600
00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 1: go check this out. And that's honestly what happened was

601
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 1: we just made sure we did a right by everybody

602
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:49,600
Speaker 1: early on, and we currently do too. Just to be clear,

603
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 1: like our number one mission here is all about customer

604
00:29:54,240 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 1: status faction, both for partners and attendees, but make sure

605
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,760
Speaker 1: that people, whether you're an attendee or a partner, have

606
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,880
Speaker 1: a good time and you get the ROI too, which

607
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:09,240
Speaker 1: and now will justify you coming back a year over

608
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 1: a year.

609
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:23,960
Speaker 2: One of the things that y'all do is also I've

610
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,640
Speaker 2: noticed it's also you know, like interesting and I'm sure

611
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:29,920
Speaker 2: it's helpful. Is you also take all that information, all

612
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:32,840
Speaker 2: that data, all the insights and people that have come out,

613
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 2: and you all put together like a what you kind

614
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 2: of call like an economic impact report? Yes, like what

615
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:39,040
Speaker 2: kind of gave you that inspiration? And also how has

616
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 2: that helped y'all grow the business?

617
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 1: Oh man, that's a great question. So I was on

618
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:47,239
Speaker 1: Instagram on one day and on ig they had an

619
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 1: impact report from a non profit and completely for I

620
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:53,959
Speaker 1: get the name right now right, And I was like,

621
00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 1: this is really cool. I'm not a non a profit though,

622
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 1: but it gives you a lot of sights into what

623
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 1: the company has are done and with the company is going.

624
00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:08,840
Speaker 1: And it kind of evinced me that I should probably donate, right,

625
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 1: I said, if that thing could get their point in

626
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:15,960
Speaker 1: their vision across to me that quickly, why the hell

627
00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 1: can I do this too? I don't. I think there's

628
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:22,640
Speaker 1: some a law out there that claims economic impact report

629
00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 1: can only be made for non profits. That's a great

630
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 1: thing that you learn becoming a entre repreneur that this

631
00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:34,200
Speaker 1: whole concept of rules really doesn't exist. I mean, we

632
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 1: can even talk about how Trump is in the White

633
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: House right now as a feeling, you know, like we

634
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:45,479
Speaker 1: could go down this road that once you open your

635
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:49,760
Speaker 1: eyes to this whole concept of rules doesn't exist, You're like, oh,

636
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:53,080
Speaker 1: we could get a money all day, every single day.

637
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: It's just all about what innovative way can you go

638
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 1: about doing it right? So the Economic Impact a Report

639
00:32:01,440 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 1: came from that concept of like, yo, it works for others,

640
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 1: I'm gonna apply it here and we're gonna see what happened.

641
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,600
Speaker 1: We caught lightning in a damn bottle because we were

642
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: the first a tech conference to actually do that, and

643
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:21,160
Speaker 1: other people now copy that. I mean it's crazy just

644
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 1: to like watch them copy it, just to be real,

645
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:27,760
Speaker 1: but yeah, we were the first ones, and it gave

646
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 1: a partner's confidence of like, Wow, this is what they're

647
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,520
Speaker 1: trying to do. Isn't just about aligning their own pockets.

648
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:38,479
Speaker 1: It's about atl growing as a whole and my an

649
00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 1: investment into a render is gonna help that. You know,

650
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 1: anytime a person partners, we don't call them a partner,

651
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 1: We call them a a family, a member, And when

652
00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:55,800
Speaker 1: we take their money, we say thank you for your investment.

653
00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:58,560
Speaker 1: So now it makes them feel like, wow, like I

654
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 1: really invested in this thing beyond just the conference.

655
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean and again at the end of the

656
00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 3: day two.

657
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 2: It also helps make their job easier because those people

658
00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 2: internally have to go in and justify like why they're

659
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 2: spending money and why they're doing things, especially if things

660
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:17,920
Speaker 2: get tight the economy gets tighter, right, So to even

661
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 2: just have an asset, you know, on top of whatever

662
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:23,560
Speaker 2: reporting that they get back, but an additional asset that says, long,

663
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,280
Speaker 2: here's an actual report that it shows the impact. It

664
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 2: makes that person's job easier to help, you know, clear

665
00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:31,680
Speaker 2: clear things out, to get funds allocated and open up

666
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 2: new opportunities. So strategically that probably helps, you know, check

667
00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 2: a lot of boxes, you know, and also too, like

668
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:39,520
Speaker 2: as you all have grown, like you know, another thing

669
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:41,720
Speaker 2: that y'all do a lot of is events outside of Atlanta.

670
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 1: We do a lot of them.

671
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,320
Speaker 3: What's the reasy what's the reason behind that?

672
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: Man, again, you want the real answer or the a

673
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 1: PR answer.

674
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 3: You know, let's do both. How about that, let's do

675
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 3: both well.

676
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:55,280
Speaker 1: The a PR answer is that we wanted to spread

677
00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 1: technology to the entire world and just we want people

678
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:04,240
Speaker 1: everywhere to feel the impact of our growing brand. The

679
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:08,520
Speaker 1: actual answer was, we just made a boatload of money

680
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty one. A boatload is kind of a

681
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:15,840
Speaker 1: relative just get clear, right, And I was like, wow, hey, y'all,

682
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 1: what should we do next? And folks were like, I

683
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:23,279
Speaker 1: don't know, And I said, what's coming up around the

684
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,360
Speaker 1: country And they said, oh, it is this ear event

685
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:30,239
Speaker 1: called a Miami Art Aboso. And I said, let's just

686
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 1: go try it out. And that's how we ended up

687
00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:37,320
Speaker 1: doing our first off site activation was at the Aboso

688
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:40,839
Speaker 1: and I said, this is pretty cool. Let's just keep

689
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:43,640
Speaker 1: it like a going, and then we went from Aboso,

690
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,359
Speaker 1: then we did south By, and then we just kept

691
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:49,200
Speaker 1: doing more and more things, like we did a Miami

692
00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:53,440
Speaker 1: Tech Week or two, and people just enjoyed it. And

693
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 1: the reason why people enjoyed it was because at the time,

694
00:34:56,680 --> 00:35:00,360
Speaker 1: COVID just got done and there wasn't a lot of

695
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:05,840
Speaker 1: groups outside. Yet thankfully Georgia never closed if you remember,

696
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 1: and wide open, We're wide open, so all of us

697
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,160
Speaker 1: here we're like, yo, it is a prime time. Let's

698
00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:14,799
Speaker 1: go outside and let other people have a good time.

699
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:18,680
Speaker 1: And that's honestly all it became as was like, let's

700
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 1: have a good time with the ego a system, and

701
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:24,480
Speaker 1: I think that was what was the needed at the time. Honestly,

702
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:27,720
Speaker 1: it was if I was at home for the last month,

703
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:31,080
Speaker 1: the last month and a half, and now you're giving

704
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:34,160
Speaker 1: me an outlet to come meet new folks, dance, have

705
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:37,399
Speaker 1: a great time, that's all I need. Once we got

706
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 1: the people's attention, it then became into like a strategic

707
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:45,640
Speaker 1: mission of like, Okay, we got their attention, now let's

708
00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:48,080
Speaker 1: add some education on top of it. Because at the

709
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:50,399
Speaker 1: end of the day, Render likes to have a good time,

710
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 1: but I am dead serious about the educational value that

711
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:56,680
Speaker 1: we want to add too. So that's when we started

712
00:35:56,680 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 1: doing things like come have a good time, but we're

713
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:00,960
Speaker 1: gonna do is educational workshop, or were going to do

714
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,960
Speaker 1: just educational a seminar, or we're gonna do this hardcore

715
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:07,600
Speaker 1: hands on technical training at that same time, so it

716
00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:10,720
Speaker 1: just kind of morphed over time into what the people need.

717
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:11,239
Speaker 3: Yeah.

718
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,520
Speaker 2: I mean then again you also launch things like Atlanta

719
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 2: Tech Week, right, So like there's all these kind of

720
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,319
Speaker 2: different extensions of the brand and different elements, right, and

721
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:20,680
Speaker 2: partnerships y'all have done strategically to kind of just help,

722
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:22,560
Speaker 2: you know, extend it out. I almost kind of think

723
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 2: about it like similar to how we do four L

724
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 2: four day, right, Like the start off as like a day,

725
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 2: but now it's kind of become a weekend and a

726
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 2: whole week to we kind of expand this thing and

727
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:33,439
Speaker 2: make it more you know, make it again more year round,

728
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:35,520
Speaker 2: and then even now to the point of, you know,

729
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:37,719
Speaker 2: similar to how you all do events year round from

730
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:39,759
Speaker 2: a four or four element, we have now the four

731
00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:42,600
Speaker 2: or four fund, yes, which allows us to now do

732
00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:45,440
Speaker 2: donations and activations and events kind of year round. So

733
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 2: it kind of comes that natural extension to keep it

734
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:49,439
Speaker 2: top of mind for folks, because again, there's a moment

735
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 2: in time, but then there's you know, three hundred and

736
00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:53,239
Speaker 2: sixty other plus days of the year that you've got

737
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:54,919
Speaker 2: to figure out how to keep people engaged.

738
00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:57,480
Speaker 1: Which is hard, which is really hard, right, Yeah, very hard.

739
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:01,800
Speaker 1: I will never forget when I've felt a very down

740
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:05,080
Speaker 1: on myself. I was like, yo, like, I don't think

741
00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:08,400
Speaker 1: I'm doing a good job. I don't think i'm building

742
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,920
Speaker 1: the ecosystem well, not just here, but like everywhere or

743
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:14,880
Speaker 1: there were at and I had one a person like

744
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 1: it's crazy how timing works right, And he was like, hey, man,

745
00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:20,280
Speaker 1: how are you? And I'm like, man, I'm doing good,

746
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:24,239
Speaker 1: but here's how I feel. And he was like, I'm

747
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:28,400
Speaker 1: gonna tell you, building a come up immunity is probably

748
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:32,440
Speaker 1: the hardest thing to do because it's easy to build

749
00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:34,879
Speaker 1: a product, like you got the thing that you got

750
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 1: to build, and then you're done technically right, But building

751
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:42,400
Speaker 1: a come immunity takes a lot of work because you

752
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:46,000
Speaker 1: got to actually, like to your point, keep them constantly

753
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 1: engaged and there is no room for failure. If you

754
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,960
Speaker 1: take off a month or two, they're gonna go gravitate elsewhere.

755
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 1: It's kind of like a sheep. You got to continuously

756
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,440
Speaker 1: hurt them constantly. And if you're like, all right, I'm

757
00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:05,040
Speaker 1: gonna go on a PTO over here, they're like, well,

758
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:06,880
Speaker 1: what about nothing else to do? We're just going to

759
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:10,080
Speaker 1: gravitate over there now. And then you come back from

760
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:11,879
Speaker 1: a paid time off and you're like, where the hell

761
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:15,959
Speaker 1: am I sheep at? And you're like, oh, I can't leave.

762
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:18,640
Speaker 1: Well that's crazy, you know what I mean? So yeah,

763
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 1: it's easily the hardest thing to do.

764
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 3: I think, all.

765
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 2: Right, where do you see render going? Like what's I

766
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:25,600
Speaker 2: want to say the end game? Because I again, I

767
00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:27,080
Speaker 2: think this is something that's going to be around for

768
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:29,240
Speaker 2: a while, but like over the next five to ten years,

769
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 2: Like how do you see render evolving as a conference

770
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:33,879
Speaker 2: and even bigger than that?

771
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:38,920
Speaker 1: So our ultimate goal is to build a entire and

772
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 1: I hate to call it a tech week because if

773
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:44,799
Speaker 1: we're already doing that, but truly build an entire tech

774
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:48,520
Speaker 1: week out the entire city is thriving, the entire city

775
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:52,120
Speaker 1: is active on it, and it becomes like a south

776
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:56,799
Speaker 1: By almost where it's infused with that ato culture that

777
00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:02,880
Speaker 1: atl eqo, a system of we're all coming to gather here,

778
00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:07,759
Speaker 1: and I want it to be a destination that folks

779
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 1: are now lining up on their calendar every single year

780
00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:12,680
Speaker 1: like yo, I gotta go in June. Like I could

781
00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:15,399
Speaker 1: ask you right now, do you know what the dates

782
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:17,239
Speaker 1: are for us to south By and your vibly, Like

783
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:20,000
Speaker 1: I don't know, but you do know it's in a march.

784
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:20,479
Speaker 3: March.

785
00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:22,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's in the March. That's all you need to know.

786
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:26,359
Speaker 1: And if anybody asks to hop on your calendar in March,

787
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:28,759
Speaker 1: wait a minute, I gotta check to see and when

788
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:33,240
Speaker 1: that's south by? Is I need that same exact headroom

789
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:37,799
Speaker 1: for a render where it's like, yo, can we do

790
00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:40,400
Speaker 1: aning in June? Like, oh, I don't know our renders

791
00:39:40,440 --> 00:39:42,960
Speaker 1: happening in June. Let me see what's happening, or can

792
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:45,680
Speaker 1: we do anyting in June? A whole atl technik is

793
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:49,359
Speaker 1: happening in June. Let me see first, right, That's what

794
00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:51,759
Speaker 1: we owes we want to do is become that destination

795
00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:57,160
Speaker 1: that a brands people in the entire world wants to

796
00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:00,520
Speaker 1: come to you because obviously our airport can handle it.

797
00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:02,080
Speaker 1: She just fine, Yeah, you know.

798
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 2: Cool man, cool man. Well look man, this has been

799
00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 2: a great conversation. Before we get out of here, one

800
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:10,359
Speaker 2: thing I love to ask people is what's one piece

801
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 2: of advice, one lesson that you've learned that you would

802
00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 2: share with somebody that wants to, you know, build a

803
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:16,719
Speaker 2: conference or an experience.

804
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:18,160
Speaker 3: Get don't build no competition.

805
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 2: Now, you know, if y'all want to play I'm telling

806
00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:22,359
Speaker 2: you right now, just don't play fair.

807
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:25,160
Speaker 3: So just be careful. Wow, you know, but just I

808
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:26,919
Speaker 3: mean that's business man, yes there.

809
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:29,560
Speaker 2: But what piece of advice would give to somebody that

810
00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:34,359
Speaker 2: wanted to build a community, an experience a conference based

811
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:35,560
Speaker 2: on what you've learned building render?

812
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 1: Well, there is a quote that I keep on talking about,

813
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:45,200
Speaker 1: which is cowards. I had never start and a week

814
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:50,320
Speaker 1: die along the away. And yes, that sounds a brutal,

815
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:53,839
Speaker 1: but it's true though that if you have a dream,

816
00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 1: if you have a vision, the hardest thing, like eighty

817
00:40:57,760 --> 00:41:01,960
Speaker 1: to ninety percent the hard work, just even trying. Yeah,

818
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:06,000
Speaker 1: and not just that one time, like you and I

819
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: I've been on calls around like y'all, I have a

820
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,000
Speaker 1: dream of doing blah blah blah something else crazy and

821
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 1: half y'all like, hell no, that sounds crazy. And then

822
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 1: I got like, all right, cool, we're gonna do it.

823
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:19,200
Speaker 1: And that takes a guts, that takes a curt So

824
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:24,279
Speaker 1: cowards I never even try. In along though, away you'll

825
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:27,480
Speaker 1: encounter people who just quit, you know, and they're like yo,

826
00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:29,719
Speaker 1: like you can't quit just because it's not a going

827
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:32,919
Speaker 1: You're away, right, now it's it's sometimes you just gotta

828
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 1: a pivot or you gotta just open your eyes and see, Okay,

829
00:41:35,120 --> 00:41:38,480
Speaker 1: I tried x y Z. Let me go try QRS next. Right,

830
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:42,920
Speaker 1: So internalize that quote, but also understand like what Nelson

831
00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:47,880
Speaker 1: Mandella said it, which is everything seems impossible until it's finished,

832
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 1: you know, and think back to the time that you

833
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:54,239
Speaker 1: were in a college and you're like, man, I'm never

834
00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:58,080
Speaker 1: gonna graduate, Like I'm trying to take this class. This

835
00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:01,399
Speaker 1: is one thing done and you're like graduation. They come,

836
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,200
Speaker 1: You're like, whoa, I'm here. You're having like an out

837
00:42:04,239 --> 00:42:07,719
Speaker 1: of a body ex periods of the time you're like,

838
00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:10,600
Speaker 1: I actually I finished it. And that goes back to

839
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 1: the quote that everything seems impossible until it's actually I've finished,

840
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:17,279
Speaker 1: and you at home can also do it too. It's

841
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:19,319
Speaker 1: a long win. They answer to say, you just gotta

842
00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:24,239
Speaker 1: do the damn a thing and learn learn why you

843
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:28,560
Speaker 1: are doing it. Why I began a render has transformed

844
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 1: many different ways, you know, in terms of like my

845
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:36,680
Speaker 1: why along the way it changes, you know, which is okay.

846
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 1: I think people think that it got to be the

847
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 1: same thing constantly. Know. Only thing that's ever guaranteed in

848
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:47,880
Speaker 1: life is a change changes, it's guarantee, and be okay

849
00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:50,799
Speaker 1: with that, you know, learn from those at home that

850
00:42:50,840 --> 00:42:51,600
Speaker 1: you're trying.

851
00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 2: To serve absolutely absolutely Before we got out of here,

852
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 2: justin where can people, you know get more information about render? Know,

853
00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:00,960
Speaker 2: y'all it's not renderfested com. I'll not talk.

854
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:03,680
Speaker 1: Actually we should have owned that. We own that.

855
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,919
Speaker 2: Well, get I'm four for four okay, so but but again,

856
00:43:06,960 --> 00:43:09,200
Speaker 2: give them the official website.

857
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:11,520
Speaker 3: How can they officially buy tickets? If not going to

858
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:12,359
Speaker 3: renderfest dot com?

859
00:43:12,360 --> 00:43:14,880
Speaker 2: Where can they get take some information about render or

860
00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:17,720
Speaker 2: get involved as a volunteer and all that kind of stuff.

861
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:22,360
Speaker 1: So d o official website is a render at L

862
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:25,239
Speaker 1: dot com r E N d E R a t

863
00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:28,760
Speaker 1: L dot com. You can also go to a render

864
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:31,160
Speaker 1: fess dot com and it will also take you there too.

865
00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:35,800
Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, we are on all social platforms. Render

866
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 1: at L on all social platforms, including a blue sky

867
00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 1: if I call that out. If you want to learn

868
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:46,960
Speaker 1: more about a t L a techweek, just go to

869
00:43:47,320 --> 00:43:50,480
Speaker 1: a t L dot tech. Yes, that is the entire

870
00:43:50,520 --> 00:43:53,640
Speaker 1: website a t L dot tech Use that website. I

871
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 1: pay a lot of money for that website. You know

872
00:43:56,080 --> 00:43:59,200
Speaker 1: how domains work, You're like, whoa you you own a

873
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:03,200
Speaker 1: three her name? Yeah, spend a lot of money on there.

874
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:04,839
Speaker 3: Put some dollars behind that ape.

875
00:44:05,080 --> 00:44:06,880
Speaker 1: So yeah. If you want to learn more about atl

876
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:11,759
Speaker 1: Tech Week, atl dot tech or at the Atlanta Tech

877
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:15,080
Speaker 1: Week is on all our social platforms, including a blue

878
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 1: Sky again.

879
00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:19,120
Speaker 3: For sure, Man, well justin Man, appreciate you coming out.

880
00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:20,680
Speaker 2: Glad you got a chance to talk on the pod,

881
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:24,560
Speaker 2: share a background, and also glad for you to document

882
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:26,399
Speaker 2: that I'm four for four because I try to tell

883
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:26,799
Speaker 2: y'all I know.

884
00:44:26,840 --> 00:44:29,239
Speaker 3: What I'm talking about. And with that said, we out.

885
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:29,799
Speaker 3: That's the pod.

886
00:44:30,280 --> 00:44:31,960
Speaker 2: You've been listening to buttteron Nomics and no im your

887
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 2: hosts Brandon Butler, got comments, feedback? Want to be on

888
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:37,279
Speaker 2: the show, send us an email today at hello at

889
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:40,840
Speaker 2: butternomics dot com. Butter Nomics is produced in Atlanta, Georgia

890
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:44,359
Speaker 2: at iHeartMedia by Ksey Pegram with marketing support fro Queen

891
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:47,479
Speaker 2: and Nikki music provided by mister Hanky. If you haven't

892
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:50,080
Speaker 2: already hit that subscribe button, then never missed an episode

893
00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:51,959
Speaker 2: and be sure to follow us on all our social

894
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 2: platforms at butter dot ATL. Listen to Better Nomics on

895
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

896
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 2: Out out

897
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:03,520
Speaker 1: Thump