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Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome to the Bob Left Sets podcast. My

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Speaker 1: guest this week is super Mention himself, Jeff Gordon. Good

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Speaker 1: to be here. Okay, you were the first time I

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Speaker 1: might have seen you face to face and talk to you.

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Speaker 1: Was that AIBA for those people don't know, that's a

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Speaker 1: conference in Nashville primarily for fair grounds and you were

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Speaker 1: being honored along with Alice Cooper and they gave you

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Speaker 1: the word first and you said, I've learned in my

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Speaker 1: career who's in front and I should be behind Coope

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Speaker 1: And you really said almost nothing. That must have been

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Speaker 1: two thousand and eight maybe, okay, but in the last

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Speaker 1: handful of years you've been on a run of publicity.

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Speaker 1: So what changed? Um? The documentary Mike Meyer is making

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Speaker 1: that documentary. UM first to change because I had an

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Speaker 1: obligation to promote it. UM. I I would have been

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Speaker 1: hard to look in the mirror and not promote someone's work.

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Speaker 1: After beating up all my artists to make sure they promote,

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Speaker 1: they did their promotions. So that was the first wave.

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Speaker 1: Very uncomfortable, UM making speeches. I have real self worth

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Speaker 1: issues that come out strongly. UM. But I'm I found

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Speaker 1: that I loved moderated discussions UM, so I went through

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Speaker 1: my promotion part of the journey and enjoy the interaction

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Speaker 1: as long as I didn't know the questions that were

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Speaker 1: being asked. UM. It really was sort of like psychotherapy

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Speaker 1: and really fun UM. And people would come in the

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Speaker 1: audiences that I knew from past lives, so reconnected some stuff.

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Speaker 1: And then when I thought it was over, I started

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Speaker 1: to get a lot of young musicians, managers, UM, at

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Speaker 1: risk people UM who were reaching out to me thinking

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Speaker 1: that I had maybe some frozen food answer, that maybe

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Speaker 1: I could make them happy and with two or three

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Speaker 1: war words, And although I know I can't UM, I

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Speaker 1: wanted to try and really fulfill them. I didn't want to,

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Speaker 1: you know, UM, not give them some hope of a

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Speaker 1: good life or a successful career. So I started responding

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Speaker 1: to the people and that just led to more and

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Speaker 1: more of it. And now I sort of I find

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Speaker 1: myself in a really bizarre position of UM being an

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Speaker 1: inspiration to so many young people and maybe not to

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Speaker 1: myself all the time. Yeah, how does that cross with

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Speaker 1: your self worth issues? Uh? It's really bizarre because it's

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Speaker 1: it's I sort of step into the character and it's

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Speaker 1: ironic because your biggest act is a character. No, I

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Speaker 1: was gonna say, it's very much like Alice who steps

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Speaker 1: in tell Us Cooper. For those who were just starting up,

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Speaker 1: shep was the manager through the heyday and it's still

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Speaker 1: the man it so you know, for him, he steps

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Speaker 1: into Alice Cooper, he leaves Alice on the stage. And

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Speaker 1: I found that sort of in that same thing. I

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Speaker 1: try and I try and be that person that the

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Speaker 1: documentary made it up here. I am, and there's certainly

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Speaker 1: a part of me that are in that movie. But

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Speaker 1: I'm a human. I mean, you know, I failed a

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Speaker 1: million times, which is what I want these people to know. Um,

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Speaker 1: and I've done a lot of stupid things and I

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Speaker 1: don't have great self worth and I still got to

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Speaker 1: where I wanted to be. Okay, But you also wrote

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Speaker 1: a book. What was the inspiration? How did that come together?

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Speaker 1: The book was really interesting? The book was I went

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Speaker 1: to just about everything in my life is um knee

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Speaker 1: jerk reaction. Although it appears that I'm very calculated. Um,

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Speaker 1: I don't really plan, so I didn't think about doing

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Speaker 1: a book. I got a lot of people asking me

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Speaker 1: to do a book after the movie, but it wasn't

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Speaker 1: even in my wheelhouse at all. But I went to

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Speaker 1: Roy Choi chef here who started Kogi Trucks, who was

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Speaker 1: one of my heroes, and he had a book come out,

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Speaker 1: so I went. I wanted to support him. I happened

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Speaker 1: to be in New York. I went to his book

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Speaker 1: signing party and Anthony Bourdain was there, and he came

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Speaker 1: over him and he said, I got to do your

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Speaker 1: book with you. I have a publishing company. I published

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Speaker 1: roy Choice book. I wouldn't be here if it wasn't

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Speaker 1: for you. And I said why, why? What does that mean?

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Speaker 1: He said, you made Emerald Lagas famous. I became famous

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Speaker 1: by beating up Emerald Lagas. I owe you big time. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so what did we learn? Although you've given a pretty

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Speaker 1: good answer from suddenly coming out from the shadows and

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Speaker 1: being in this movie, what did we learn? Um? I'm

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Speaker 1: still learning. I I learned that, um, the service is

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Speaker 1: really beautiful. UM, I get a whole bit. Whole life

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Speaker 1: is based on service. But it's usually with people that

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Speaker 1: I know that I have a history that has a purpose.

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Speaker 1: But I'll get an email from someone who's fifteen years

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Speaker 1: old and had an abusive childhood and writes poetry and

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Speaker 1: always depressed and what can I do? And I spend

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Speaker 1: a few minutes either in an email or I talked

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Speaker 1: to him, and I think I really helped their lives

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Speaker 1: for that moment. It's all about the human connection and

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Speaker 1: that it's been beautiful because I didn't really have that

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Speaker 1: in my life before. I was so behind the curtains.

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Speaker 1: You talk about your whole life, not only growing up,

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Speaker 1: you were behind the curtains, emotionally, irrelevantive. Okay, so it's

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Speaker 1: totally different. I mean, you grew up in the era

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Speaker 1: I used the line of demarcations really the Beatles. There's

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Speaker 1: before and after the peace and you were of the

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Speaker 1: age and I was. We were conscious, but from six

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Speaker 1: to let's say eighty, and then the empty v era

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Speaker 1: was a twist upon this. If you were successful, everybody

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Speaker 1: knew and there was a thin layer of what was successful,

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Speaker 1: whereas today you can make a record, a movie, a book,

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Speaker 1: and if you can have zero impact or you could have.

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Speaker 1: The other thing is these things exist forever. Prior to

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Speaker 1: the VCR, basically a movie was in the theaters, might

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Speaker 1: go to the revival houses, but if you haven't seen it,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't go on TV. It's like it doesn't exist.

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Speaker 1: We're Superman continues to be on all these streaming services.

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Speaker 1: So what is it like to be the featured person

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Speaker 1: in that movie? Where movies tend to have less of

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Speaker 1: an impact but longer of a life. I'm actually filling

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Speaker 1: in the holes here. I'm more interested in what it's

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Speaker 1: like being on your side of the equation. Yeah, it's Um,

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Speaker 1: it's funny. Always really ever asked me, So I haven't

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Speaker 1: really guarded there in my brain. But um I I UM,

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Speaker 1: I'm sort of proud of myself. Um that your parents

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Speaker 1: proud of you? Um, I have my answer. Yeah. I

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Speaker 1: think my father was always very proud of me. Um.

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Speaker 1: I think my mother became proud of me when I

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Speaker 1: could afford to pay the rent exactly. But let's say

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Speaker 1: even say that for later discussion. But you're proud of yourself,

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Speaker 1: and I'm sort of proud of myself that Um that

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Speaker 1: I that I take the time too to respond to

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Speaker 1: people who who are in need. Um, I went, I

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Speaker 1: went out to dinner last night. Was someone who was

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Speaker 1: a staple of MTV, and this particular person got there

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Speaker 1: before we did and sat in the corner of a

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Speaker 1: restaurant in the b room. Obviously did not want to

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Speaker 1: be recognized, wanted to have a night out. When you

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Speaker 1: go out in Los Angeles, other where are you recognized?

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Speaker 1: Sometimes not not overly, um, I mean, not pop star yet,

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Speaker 1: but but I enjoy it when I yeah, I really

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Speaker 1: enjoy it. Okay, let's go back to the beginning. You're

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Speaker 1: from Buffalo from note from Long Island. I was born

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Speaker 1: in Jackson Heights, raised on Long Island, the ocean side,

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Speaker 1: right during that Levitt Town period um when middle class

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Speaker 1: families were going out to a place where it was

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Speaker 1: a backyard at basketball courts. It's um great, great place

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Speaker 1: to be raised. Went from there to school. Your father

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Speaker 1: did what for a living? My father was an accountant

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Speaker 1: who never got his c p A. Because he just

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Speaker 1: didn't bother No, he supported his family, his brother and

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Speaker 1: his mother, and he just went right to work and

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Speaker 1: just did his brother's mother, who was still growing up

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Speaker 1: when he became an accountant. And your mother worked outside

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Speaker 1: the home or not, yes, in the early days she did.

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Speaker 1: She worked to the sales lady or whatever she could do.

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Speaker 1: And you have a brother. I have a brother who's

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Speaker 1: a veterinarian veterinarian, really older or younger older three years? Okay,

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Speaker 1: so you're growing up. What's your life like out on

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Speaker 1: the island. Um, it wasn't a happy life. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think you only know the life you have, so

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Speaker 1: it's hard to tell what it is. Um. But in retrospect,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't for me A very I always feel. I

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Speaker 1: say that the first day of my life started at

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Speaker 1: the University of Buffalo. That was my starting point before

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Speaker 1: we get there, and that's important. You're growing up oceanside.

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Speaker 1: Do you are you a popular kid? Do you have friends?

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Speaker 1: Have friends? I wouldn't say popular. Um was it? I

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Speaker 1: was on the golf caddy and on the golf team,

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Speaker 1: played basketball, had some good friends. Um was Jewish, so

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Speaker 1: got bullied. In those days that bullying was um part

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Speaker 1: of the fabric, especially if you were Jewish. There was

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Speaker 1: always somebody and you handled that. How cried. You're a

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Speaker 1: pretty You're a physically someone imposing guy when you were

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Speaker 1: growing up? Were you also a big guy? Talk? I

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Speaker 1: was pretty big, but I was never a physical I

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Speaker 1: never had to fight. My first fight in my life

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Speaker 1: and only fight was Bill Graham. Okay, wait wait, wait, wait,

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Speaker 1: what what's what's killed down there? What was that about? That?

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Speaker 1: Was Bill like to have a fight at his shows?

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Speaker 1: He was pretty famous for that. You know, he'd like

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Speaker 1: to bought. He'd pull a guy out of the stage

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Speaker 1: or have he had he had to do it it

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Speaker 1: shows and um he promoted al Us in Phoenix at

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Speaker 1: the Colisseum. Alice's father is a minister. And I come

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Speaker 1: down and I see Bill Grab holding Alice's farther by

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Speaker 1: the collar, putting them up against the wall. And I

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Speaker 1: was a pretty big guy, and I was pretty rowdy,

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Speaker 1: and I was you know, I used them substances to

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Speaker 1: get me to places. And I said, you want to

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Speaker 1: fight with someone, pal let's go. And we had a

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Speaker 1: really we had a knockout, like through the doors Danny's

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Speaker 1: Aleskoes first job as a security guard was that night

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Speaker 1: at the show. For those who don't know, that's a

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Speaker 1: constroma based in Arizona. That this first night working, he

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Speaker 1: sees Bill Grab come flying through the doors. Then I

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Speaker 1: come flying through the doors. Chairs of a flying thing

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Speaker 1: to going The irony is though sometimes with bullies, if

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Speaker 1: you stand up to them, that neutralizes it, and they

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Speaker 1: liked it. I didn't give me a chance it was just,

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Speaker 1: what was your relationship like after that? Oh, yeah, no problem,

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Speaker 1: did he ever mention it? We'd off the battle a

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Speaker 1: little bit, but they were there. Neither one who us

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Speaker 1: really got hurt, a little bruise, a little this, and

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Speaker 1: it was just it was over. So, how do you

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Speaker 1: decide to go to the University of Buffalo Region scholarship

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Speaker 1: furthest place in New York State Region scholarship you can

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Speaker 1: only use in New York State universities. That was the

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Speaker 1: farthest place from where I lived in New York State.

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Speaker 1: For those peop don't know, Buffalo was really far. That's

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Speaker 1: gonna be like, it was about a seven hour drive,

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Speaker 1: eighty miles something like that. Okay, So you took the

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Speaker 1: bus to go to college. If the bus met my

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Speaker 1: partner Joe Greenberg, who was my partner up through Alice,

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Speaker 1: probably more significant in the early days of Alice than

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Speaker 1: I was um and we stayed. We met on the bus.

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Speaker 1: We both were in the Greyhound bus station in Manhattan,

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Speaker 1: both of us staying away from our parents, were sort

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Speaker 1: of embarrassed to be with our parents. Who was that

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Speaker 1: time in our life. And we sat next to each

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Speaker 1: other on the bus and became buddies and partners and

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Speaker 1: we both signed Alice together. Okay, so but you say

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Speaker 1: your your life began first day of Buffalo. Amplify that

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Speaker 1: a little, cause that was the first time I started

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Speaker 1: to see that I had a life. That I didn't

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Speaker 1: know what my life was. But I spent most of

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Speaker 1: my life either on a basketball court or locked in

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Speaker 1: my room. Um, those are the only two things I

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Speaker 1: really knew. And now when I got to Buffalo, I

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Speaker 1: had friends who could come to my house. Nobody could

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Speaker 1: come to my house and the child because that my

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Speaker 1: brother had this dog that bid people, so I never

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Speaker 1: had anybody over. Now, all of a sudden, I'm living

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Speaker 1: in a community of my peers and I can come

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Speaker 1: out of my door. Um, that's mind blowing for me. Um,

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Speaker 1: first time early my life that I had any social

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Speaker 1: contact other than my father. Now this is pre internet,

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Speaker 1: pre cable TV. And one could argue that Buffalo was

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Speaker 1: kind of off the grid. Well, it was called the

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Speaker 1: Berkeley of the East, very very liberal. I went to

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Speaker 1: the first year it became a state university. Um, and

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Speaker 1: it was that that they wanted to be the Berkeley,

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Speaker 1: and they tipped. It was when the scales were tipping

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Speaker 1: too far. So I had three courses taught by Dr

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Speaker 1: Marty Kriegel. There were something, nothing and everything. Something. You

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Speaker 1: brought a record and they would play one record. Anything,

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Speaker 1: you brought two or more records. Nothing, you brought no

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Speaker 1: records and just sat in the room for a half hour,

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Speaker 1: and that was I got credits. Doesn't all the sixties? Sixties?

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Speaker 1: I love it? Okay, But you will start college? What? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I graduate, So it must be that's a very transitional year.

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Speaker 1: It's the Vietnam time. We burned down the Roxy building.

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Speaker 1: It we met. Kennedy died the first year as a freshman,

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Speaker 1: and I remember all of us meeting in the middle

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Speaker 1: of the street, hugging each other and crying. And then

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Speaker 1: we activated. We act. We actively fought against the war

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Speaker 1: or in Vietnam. We didn't complain, we didn't get angry.

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Speaker 1: We acted, which is what these kids in Florida are doing. Now.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna ask you about that. So what do you

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Speaker 1: think about those kids? And I know you sponsored I am.

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Speaker 1: I am so proud um to be on the same

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Speaker 1: planet as these humans. Um. I was starting to lose

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Speaker 1: faith in humans and seeing them and listening to them,

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Speaker 1: I'm completely remotivated. Um so, what do you think happens?

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Speaker 1: Because we live in a very divided country where half

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Speaker 1: the country seems to say I can't believe what's going on,

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Speaker 1: and then Trump and his minions just keep marching. You know,

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Speaker 1: I think on the political reality side of life, it's

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Speaker 1: a very dark moment. But that's my that's my view,

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Speaker 1: and I know there are people who have different views.

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Speaker 1: What these kids are doing that I think is so

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Speaker 1: important is they're driving us back to democracy. So as

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Speaker 1: opposed to I am, as I am to the things

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Speaker 1: Trump is doing, and personally, I'm really post. If of

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Speaker 1: the people in America voted for a dirty water, I

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Speaker 1: could live with it, then maybe I choose to move.

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Speaker 1: But and that's where they're focused. For me, the gun

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Speaker 1: issue is the tip of the iceberg. It's really about

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Speaker 1: getting the voice of the people back into our governing body.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I wake up every morning angry, listening to

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Speaker 1: the news and watching seeing these things, simple things like

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Speaker 1: you can't the Census Bureau now can't tell you how

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Speaker 1: many people were at the march. That's insane, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's insane. There's almost a separate podcast, but The only thing,

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Speaker 1: the only interesting thing is is that I wait in

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Speaker 1: on this early and I was made aware of the

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Speaker 1: blowback we're talking about. And so what I find is

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Speaker 1: and even you know, the the election was called wrong

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Speaker 1: by the New York Times many other things. Unless you

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Speaker 1: have a name with a face, you were not coming

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Speaker 1: up against these people who disagreed with you. And Frank

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Speaker 1: rich Now at the New York magazine he says, because now,

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Speaker 1: what are we gonna do about some people are saying, well,

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Speaker 1: we should try to convince these people that their ideas

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Speaker 1: are wrong. And then Frank which says, you can't do that.

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Speaker 1: You just have to get out the vote. You have

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Speaker 1: to get out of the vote. And so the interesting

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Speaker 1: thing is we sit here and talk. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: just like the demonstrations themselves. Will they make a difference.

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Speaker 1: Having lived through the sixties, you're optimistic. Having lived through

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Speaker 1: the last few decades, you're pessimistic. I think I think

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Speaker 1: they have a real I think if there era has

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Speaker 1: been a chance, this is a chance. And the things

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Speaker 1: they're doing is so brilliant. I tried to support the

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Speaker 1: kids of Maui to help him out, and we did

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Speaker 1: a big benefit. We did a free concert. Jack Johnson

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Speaker 1: play and Steven Tyler and Willie Nelson, Chris Christofferson all

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Speaker 1: donated time said yes in a minute, and all of

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Speaker 1: us talked about and we talked on stage. We had

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Speaker 1: fifteen kids talking. Everybody's concern was how do we move

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Speaker 1: forward and not how do we move forward to beat

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Speaker 1: some political party. How do we move forward to get

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Speaker 1: people to vote, because that's what makes our country so great.

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Speaker 1: And it stopped in Mauie. We get fift vote to turnout.

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Speaker 1: We have the lowest voted turnout in the world. Everybody stoned.

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Speaker 1: It's wild. It's just they don't care. And then I

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Speaker 1: don't think there's they realize that they can affect the

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Speaker 1: world they live in. Well, I mean, after what happened

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Speaker 1: in the year two thousand and in Virginia a couple

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Speaker 1: of months ago, the individuals vote really does count, does count?

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Speaker 1: So so what they did a couple of days ago,

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Speaker 1: the kids from from Florida, they started an organization for kids,

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Speaker 1: students who are under eighteen to get their parents and

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Speaker 1: their grandparents to pledge to vote. White grandparents is going

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Speaker 1: to say no to the twelve year old kid. None

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Speaker 1: And in Maui. We're gonna take it one step further.

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Speaker 1: We're going to provide transportation if you're under eighteen to

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Speaker 1: pick up your parents and your grandparents and take them

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Speaker 1: to vote, assuming they don't rig the voting. So that

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Speaker 1: that's a whole other question. Yeah, that's hard for me

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Speaker 1: to help. But you know, you know that I've actually

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Speaker 1: experienced that, which growing up in Connecticut, I never had that.

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Speaker 1: You want to go to vote, maybe wait five minutes,

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Speaker 1: you can wait like an hour to vote. I mean,

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Speaker 1: if you're someone that's responsibility. No, no, it's it's terrible thing. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So you're at you be and you're thinking your future

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Speaker 1: is going to be what. Um, I didn't know really

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Speaker 1: at all, never thought about it. I um started in

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Speaker 1: ub I started selling drugs. Um selling drugs as a

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Speaker 1: hobby or saying this is a way to make money,

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Speaker 1: way to make money. Yeah. And now this, of course

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Speaker 1: is when most people harrow and his death, they don't

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Speaker 1: know what marijuana is. And are you afraid at all

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Speaker 1: of getting arrested? Um? No, absolutely, yeah, no, absolutely. It

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Speaker 1: wasn't that I wanted to do and I just didn't

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Speaker 1: ever resources and that it's voke. But my freshman year.

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Speaker 1: I loved it. I wanted it for myself, and then

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Speaker 1: people started asking, Um, so it made sense and I

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Speaker 1: ran poker games. Okay, I have to ask because you're

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Speaker 1: talking about Buffalo, and I'm not that Buffalo fluid. But

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Speaker 1: a few in the early seventies, the Weinstein brothers were

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Speaker 1: the concert promoters in Buffalo. I knew Harvey. Well that's

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Speaker 1: the question. What was Harvey doing when you were in Buffalo?

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Speaker 1: Probably the same thing, but I'll never tell what. But

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Speaker 1: what was his day to day life? Harvey and Corky

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Speaker 1: they had a promotion company even when you were there. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was very successful. I think it maybe start at

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Speaker 1: sixty sixty seven. Um, in the sixty this is right

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Speaker 1: in the beginning. Um, I think I went to a

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Speaker 1: James Brown show they did or something. So h Anyway,

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Speaker 1: you're selling Marilana and running a poker game, running a

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Speaker 1: poker game, and so you are inherently entrepreneurial. Yeah, I'm

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Speaker 1: I'm now learning who I am. I'm learning about myself.

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Speaker 1: I'm finding way to survive, um, things that I never

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Speaker 1: really did before. So for me, this is again it's

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Speaker 1: like the first day in my life and up seeing

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Speaker 1: who I am. I'm starting to realize some of the

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Speaker 1: skills that I have, although I don't think of as skills.

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Speaker 1: I think of as life support at that time, and skills.

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Speaker 1: Wasn't okay while you're there. Your parents checked out leaning

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Speaker 1: on you. No, No, they were, they were. Um, they

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Speaker 1: moved to Florida. My dad had a series had ten

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Speaker 1: or eleven heart attacks. It was it was during the days,

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Speaker 1: and they didn't have bypass or stints, so he would

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Speaker 1: have that uhly nitro glycer in capsules which he took

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Speaker 1: all the time. Um, and they moved out to Florida.

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Speaker 1: I checked out of school on a psychiatric leave for

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Speaker 1: six months, well a little slower. So how long were

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Speaker 1: you in college before this happened. I was there three years,

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Speaker 1: I think it was. So what was the psychiatric leave about?

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Speaker 1: It was I had I always had teachers who gave

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Speaker 1: me grades for giving him marijuana, and I had a

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Speaker 1: couple of teachers pull out and I would have failed

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Speaker 1: the causes and the only way to not fail him

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Speaker 1: was to get a psychiatric leave. So okay, So there

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Speaker 1: was no real psychiatric event, and so what did that mean?

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Speaker 1: You gotta go away for six months? So I went

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Speaker 1: down to Florida. I live with my parents. Um, they

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Speaker 1: had a want a studio apartment, so I slept in

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Speaker 1: a big closet. And how you know these are Jewish parents,

381
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Speaker 1: How how do they feel about your absence from school?

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Speaker 1: My mother was always tough on me. My father just

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Speaker 1: loved me purely. It was like pure love. So he

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Speaker 1: would go along with my mother. But and did you

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Speaker 1: work when you were in Florida? So six months you're

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Speaker 1: crying in your beer, so to speak. And then you

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Speaker 1: go back to you be and then I go back

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Speaker 1: to you be. Graduate. Um, I don't know what I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna do? Was the sociology major? Not much you can

390
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Speaker 1: really do. My cousin offered me a job in New York.

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Speaker 1: He had a place called Divine Garments, which made suits

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Speaker 1: and dresses for funerals. Um, so I knew I had

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Speaker 1: a job. So I applied to the New School for

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Speaker 1: Social Research because it had just started and I heard

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Speaker 1: about him. By that point in my life, I started

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Speaker 1: thinking of myself like on a white horse. Um, as

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm going to save the day kind of guy. Um,

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Speaker 1: just I don't know where that came from. What you're

399
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Speaker 1: gonna and you're living in New York, going to a

400
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Speaker 1: new school, working in the garment. You're gonna save who

401
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Speaker 1: and what? I don't even know, but I just a

402
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,440
Speaker 1: new school for social research would lead you to either

403
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Speaker 1: a welfare worker or a probation officer. Those were the

404
00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:38,119
Speaker 1: two jobs there were actually okay at the time when

405
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Speaker 1: new school started. Was there actual degree program? Yes, it

406
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:45,919
Speaker 1: was no doctorate, but I think a master's um. And

407
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:48,960
Speaker 1: you paid for this house, um going to the vine

408
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Speaker 1: garments so you can make it. Ye, maybe had a scholarship.

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Speaker 1: I don't quite really remember. I do remember that the

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Speaker 1: first blimpies was on the corner. So I had a

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Speaker 1: blimpie sub a thing, all right, and it had great lighting.

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Speaker 1: So I would study there a little bit. UM and

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Speaker 1: a recruited came from California. From you felt I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: be a probation officer. I didn't know what I was.

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Speaker 1: I was gonna be something to help people. Um that

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Speaker 1: that seemed to be my inclination. Um and a recruited

417
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Speaker 1: came from the California Probation Department. It was during the

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Speaker 1: Reagan era, he was governor, and they were really abusive

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Speaker 1: to hippies. There were always pictures of them up against

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Speaker 1: the wall. There was that big song some Flower in

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Speaker 1: My Hair in San Francisco. So I always wanted to

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Speaker 1: go to California. They came in and I said, you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna go do this job if I get accepted.

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Speaker 1: And they accepted me. So I went out to California.

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Speaker 1: It's a probation officer Los Petrinos Juvenile Hall. It's been

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Speaker 1: an hour outside of l A still exists, which direction

427
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:53,119
Speaker 1: I don't remember, I don't even know it. Okay, so

428
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,320
Speaker 1: you get this at about an hour. Okay, at this

429
00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:59,399
Speaker 1: point you fly to California, you drown, hitchhike to California

430
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 1: only in the Yeah, hit shike maybe three quarters of

431
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:08,000
Speaker 1: the way, and end up somewhere along the way selling

432
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,119
Speaker 1: some acid to someone. So I had enough money to

433
00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:13,400
Speaker 1: get an aeroplane ticket for the last quarter, then hitchhike

434
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:18,120
Speaker 1: in a friend of mine named Richie Lawrence, who just retired.

435
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,440
Speaker 1: He he ended up owning Abrahams, Ruby, Uff and Lawrence,

436
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:25,400
Speaker 1: the big commercial agency. He was. He'd gotten a job

437
00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:28,600
Speaker 1: as a producer and I can't think of the name.

438
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:32,639
Speaker 1: That was one of the talk shows, Crane less crane

439
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:36,720
Speaker 1: talk show. So I slept on his floor until school

440
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:44,240
Speaker 1: till probation office started and went down. And the first day, UM,

441
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 1: I had long hair past my shoulders. And the first

442
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:51,159
Speaker 1: day at the probation department, UM, they told me to

443
00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:53,560
Speaker 1: take the kids out to play softball, but they didn't

444
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:56,359
Speaker 1: tell me I was going to be the softball and

445
00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:59,240
Speaker 1: the kids. There were no other guys around, and the

446
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:01,600
Speaker 1: kids really kind to me. They could have hurt me,

447
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 1: but they got around me. They started hitting me a

448
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:07,399
Speaker 1: little bit with the bats, and I knew this is

449
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,159
Speaker 1: I was set up. It was by this point I

450
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,400
Speaker 1: had some street smarts so for my stuff in Buffalo,

451
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 1: so I knew they was set up. And I just

452
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:17,960
Speaker 1: went back in and took my badge off and said, okay,

453
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:21,560
Speaker 1: I'm leaving. So one day, you're not even a whole day.

454
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:25,359
Speaker 1: I didn't make the whole day. UM. Drive into l

455
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:29,600
Speaker 1: A and however it's still clearly getting in. I get

456
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:34,480
Speaker 1: off the freeway on Highland and I get trapped in

457
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 1: the right lane where you can't keep going. So I

458
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 1: make that right and now I'm on found on Franklin

459
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:45,239
Speaker 1: Avenue and there's a motel signed vacancy. So I had

460
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,760
Speaker 1: maybe five hundred dollars in my pocket and a couple

461
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:52,359
Speaker 1: of hundred hits of acid, and I pulled in. It

462
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 1: was like thirty dollars for the night. Give me a

463
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:58,040
Speaker 1: room two two four up in the corner. I go

464
00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:03,720
Speaker 1: up into the corner um and I take some of

465
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: my products and uh, I hear a girl screaming, and

466
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,720
Speaker 1: I've just come from a jail. So I had never

467
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:14,760
Speaker 1: thought of anything but something bad. And I go down

468
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:18,760
Speaker 1: on my white horse. Did jew from Long Island saving

469
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 1: the day? Here he comes to save the day. And

470
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:24,959
Speaker 1: I separate the two of them, and she punches me,

471
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:27,640
Speaker 1: and I've been hit again. It's like and she they

472
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 1: were making love. It wasn't you know. It was a

473
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: beautiful thing. And when I go down to the pool

474
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 1: in the morning, the girl ends up being Janis Chopolin,

475
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,359
Speaker 1: just completely random, like okay, But I have to ask

476
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,719
Speaker 1: at this point, Jannis Chopolin is famous. When you went

477
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:44,480
Speaker 1: into the light of the day, do you realize it's

478
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:47,919
Speaker 1: Jannis Choplin. Yes, but I wasn't that much of a

479
00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:50,720
Speaker 1: music free but but she was sitting with Jimmy Hendrix,

480
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 1: which blew my mind. Almost speechless. Okay, so you certainly

481
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:59,320
Speaker 1: recognized and the Chambers brothers, UM and people I didn't know,

482
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: who Paul Rothschild, who I got to know, who was

483
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:06,679
Speaker 1: a great producer for the doors, Um, who else? A

484
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 1: couple of the Credens clear Water guys with it that

485
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:12,440
Speaker 1: day was it was called the Hollywood Landmark Motel. Sadly

486
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:16,200
Speaker 1: it's where Janice um. But it was rock and roll

487
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,640
Speaker 1: heaven for people who hadn't I didn't have in those days.

488
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 1: There was no scale of economy, you know. Alice Alice

489
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,080
Speaker 1: played sold that Madison Square Garden in seventy two. It

490
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:30,159
Speaker 1: was a dollar fifty a ticket, so acts didn't make money.

491
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 1: It wasn't like you made money. Chambers, whether it's cousins,

492
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 1: slept in my car in the in the lot at

493
00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:39,680
Speaker 1: the hotel, um and when I saw him. So now

494
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:45,040
Speaker 1: now it's I've been one day in probation department. I

495
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:47,280
Speaker 1: get hit at night. Now all of a sudden, I'm

496
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:51,160
Speaker 1: in front of Jimmy Hendricks, Janis Joplin, Credence clear Water,

497
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,680
Speaker 1: all these people, and my mind says to me, oh

498
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 1: my god, I now have the greatest customer base for

499
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 1: my business in the history of the world. Okay, Okay, okay,

500
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 1: let's just go back. I want to go really slow.

501
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: You're literally driving down Fountain and your Franklin okay, and

502
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 1: nearly say that it could have been a different hotel

503
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:17,439
Speaker 1: in the whole story. Never gonna happen, It never happened,

504
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:25,480
Speaker 1: never happened. Okay, Well, return to this conversation with Chef Gordon,

505
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 1: super mentioned manager extraordinaire in a moment. You're listening to

506
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 1: the Bob Left Sets podcast, recorded here at the tune

507
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,439
Speaker 1: In Studios in Venice, California. Each week, I interview a

508
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:39,280
Speaker 1: new guest and dive into their lives and careers. If

509
00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:42,600
Speaker 1: you enjoy listening to it, subscribe, rate, and review the show.

510
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:45,680
Speaker 1: Please also check out some of the earlier episodes, like

511
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 1: my conversation with songwriter Diane Warren or they head of

512
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:51,480
Speaker 1: music for YouTube and Google, Lee or Cone. You can

513
00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 1: hear them all on tune in, Apple Podcast or your

514
00:28:54,240 --> 00:29:00,320
Speaker 1: podcast player of choice. And now Morley, Chef Gordon, Okay,

515
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,960
Speaker 1: you obviously have a product these people want, absolutely, So

516
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:08,000
Speaker 1: then what happened? So we start a relationship, we become friendly.

517
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 1: Um I saw you know, getting a little money, Um

518
00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 1: I buy a nineteen fifty four Cadillac limousine because I

519
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:19,240
Speaker 1: was a jerk, but I bought it. Chamber's brother's kids

520
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 1: started sleeping in it. That cousins, and you're continue to

521
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:24,080
Speaker 1: live in the hotel. I'm in the motel. You lived

522
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 1: in a motel for I think a year and a half,

523
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:28,400
Speaker 1: two year and one day. Was sitting around a pool

524
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: and Jimmie Hendrick says, I think I had just gotten

525
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 1: like a new watch or something. And Jimmie Hendrick says,

526
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:36,719
Speaker 1: what are you going to tell the police if they

527
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:38,080
Speaker 1: ask you? Where did you get the money for the

528
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,840
Speaker 1: rent in the car and this stuff? And I said,

529
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 1: I'm a middle class kid from Long Island. The police

530
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:46,280
Speaker 1: don't ask you. And he said where I was raised.

531
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:48,200
Speaker 1: They asked you. You better have a story. He said

532
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 1: you Jewish and I said yeah. And he said he

533
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 1: should be a manager. All the managers are Jewish. And

534
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 1: I said, great, who should I manage? And Lester says,

535
00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 1: I have this guy from Phoenix in my basement, Alice Cooper.

536
00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:01,920
Speaker 1: I bet you if you give him ten dollars a week,

537
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 1: you could be a manager. So Dallas tell us a

538
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 1: story of Lester Cubby Gett is saying I found that

539
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 1: jew is Lester cham Chambers. I don't give you ten

540
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:14,160
Speaker 1: dollars a week to be your manager. So they all

541
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:17,000
Speaker 1: come over to the motel and I give him all

542
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 1: the bag. By that time, I was selling grass, also marijuana,

543
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 1: and then I give him a bag of it if

544
00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 1: we go. Okay, you're the young jew from Long Island.

545
00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 1: Does Jimmy Hendricks and Janice job and they accept you.

546
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,760
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Albert Grossman was their manager, right, but even

547
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:40,240
Speaker 1: before you, before you become the manager, you're an unknown

548
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:43,400
Speaker 1: quantity of a young age and I had what they wanted. Okay.

549
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:46,160
Speaker 1: So and you have the gift of gab. You ingratiated yourself.

550
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that was okay. So at the time you

551
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:53,600
Speaker 1: become Alice and I made groupies. My first experience with

552
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: groupies because those days it was free. Sex was part

553
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: of the fabric. There was no age. It was the

554
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:02,600
Speaker 1: worst thing you got, okay, but you weren't famous. No,

555
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:04,520
Speaker 1: But I was in now, I was in that circle.

556
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:07,200
Speaker 1: I was in the hotel. The hotel was sort of

557
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,680
Speaker 1: the group they all, you know, girls thought if they

558
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 1: could get to anybody in the hotel, then then maybe

559
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 1: they could beat Jimmy exactly. Okay, so then you know

560
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: you're very young at the time. But for those who

561
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,040
Speaker 1: have been around for a while, very few of these

562
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:29,880
Speaker 1: people live up to the image Jimmy Hendrix, Janis Joplin.

563
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 1: They were. They were amazing to me. They were amazing

564
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 1: to me. I mean, I can't say enough good stuff.

565
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 1: They treated me like an equal. Um, help me and

566
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 1: so many things. Yeah, I didn't know anything. I didn't

567
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:49,920
Speaker 1: know anything. So um, I said, what do I do?

568
00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 1: And they said, well, you get them jobs and you

569
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:54,960
Speaker 1: get him a record contract. How do I get them jobs?

570
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 1: And let's just said, you know, we're playing a big festival.

571
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:00,479
Speaker 1: I forgot the name of in that, but I'll get

572
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 1: I'll I'll tell our agent. They gotta put Alice on

573
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:04,920
Speaker 1: the show. And it was our first show. We played

574
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:08,640
Speaker 1: to like thirty or forty people down. No, it was

575
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: I'm not really important. But okay, you obviously run out

576
00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 1: of product at some point, how do you know? No, no, no, uh,

577
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:20,040
Speaker 1: we had supplies. We we had you know, we had

578
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 1: It was a business. Okay, So your supplies came from

579
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,800
Speaker 1: your usual connections. Okay, so you didn't have to find

580
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 1: new connections in Los Angeles, which would raise your risk.

581
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 1: Do you get involved with Alice Cooper? And is he

582
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:35,680
Speaker 1: already put out his records with Frank's APPA. He's done nothing,

583
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 1: He's done nothing, Okay, so how do you get the

584
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 1: deal with straight records? As soon as I meet Alice,

585
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 1: he says to me, oh, by the way, Um, we

586
00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:47,200
Speaker 1: played a couple of days ago for Frank's APPA and

587
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 1: his manager, Herbie Cohne, offered us a deal and said

588
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:52,160
Speaker 1: he was going to manage us. So you have to

589
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:55,600
Speaker 1: tell him that you're doing it, not him Herb Cone,

590
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:59,200
Speaker 1: because I was giving a ten could be. So I

591
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:02,719
Speaker 1: go to Herb Cone office on will Chair Boulevard. Also

592
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 1: living at the motel the Landmark with the G T

593
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 1: O s who rolls together outrageously. I became very friendly

594
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 1: with um. They would feed me um. They were great,

595
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:17,040
Speaker 1: great girls. UM. So I knew them. And I get

596
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 1: to the lobby and they're in the lobby of Herb's

597
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 1: office and what are you doing it? He manages us?

598
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:25,600
Speaker 1: Where on his lay? Wise that guy that I signed,

599
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 1: Alice Cooper, he's on the label too, but I'm going

600
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:32,280
Speaker 1: to manage him. So I get called into hers What

601
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:34,160
Speaker 1: are you doing here. I said, I'm Alice Cooper's manager.

602
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 1: He said, no, no, I'm Alice Cooper's manager. No no,

603
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:39,680
Speaker 1: they He ends up running after with a chair, screaming

604
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 1: with the chair and uh Mrs Christie and Mercy and

605
00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 1: Pamela get in the middle of the here the screaming,

606
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 1: run into the office and get me out of the office,

607
00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:54,240
Speaker 1: and like stand between me and her while he's got

608
00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 1: a chair trying to hit me. Get me out of office.

609
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: I get the Wow, this management thing is pretty weird.

610
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: It's what everybody in l A. What's they hit me?

611
00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:08,560
Speaker 1: And so we got through it. Um, it wasn't a

612
00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 1: great experience. The Frank Zapper error. Okay, so he a lot.

613
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:15,359
Speaker 1: He agrees to let you manage the band. You put

614
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 1: out two records. This isn't in an era with as

615
00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:20,800
Speaker 1: much less cacophony, so you could get noticed. But the

616
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:24,040
Speaker 1: records were not highly reviewed or did they sell well

617
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:27,839
Speaker 1: at the time. Don't completely god disasters, I think less

618
00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 1: their bangs. And Rolling Stone said, uh something. Walt Disney

619
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:35,880
Speaker 1: had the good sense to leaving the can So, okay,

620
00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:39,640
Speaker 1: you had this deal. Was there any money involved in

621
00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 1: the deal? Nothing? And the records came out. I shouldn't

622
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:44,360
Speaker 1: say nothing. I think it was six thousand dollars was

623
00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:47,960
Speaker 1: the minimum to make it legal, but they made deductions

624
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:51,480
Speaker 1: in the six thousand. We owed them money to make it.

625
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 1: And then what was the being living on? Um my dealing? Basically? Okay,

626
00:34:57,120 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 1: and two records that you know, the momentum is an

627
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 1: heavy here. What are you still believing in the dream? Well?

628
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:08,320
Speaker 1: We we yes, because we had no other dreams. This

629
00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:13,319
Speaker 1: has to work. This has to work, and we um

630
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 1: we make a pact amongst us. I remember the conversation

631
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:19,839
Speaker 1: I had with him, which I said, listen, it took

632
00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:22,600
Speaker 1: twelve guys or eleven or twelve. I'm not a religious

633
00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:25,520
Speaker 1: guy to make Christianity. We don't have to be that big.

634
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: We got six. I'll take care of the amount of people.

635
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:35,959
Speaker 1: We just got to believe because just like in Christianity,

636
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:40,279
Speaker 1: it's belief. It doesn't necessarily be reality. So if we

637
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:43,200
Speaker 1: believe strong enough, we are going to make this happen.

638
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:45,239
Speaker 1: And we all shook hands that we were going to

639
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:50,960
Speaker 1: stay together until we got to the place, and we, uh,

640
00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:54,320
Speaker 1: how are we going to do it? That became the

641
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,200
Speaker 1: first conversation, Okay, how how are we going to do

642
00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:00,239
Speaker 1: it obviously doing a record, which happen. That's none of

643
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 1: that stuff is gonna work. And we talked about what

644
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 1: what was our strength, and our strength was that everybody

645
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:17,560
Speaker 1: hated Alice Cooper. Um, we'd play holes, everybody would leave. Um,

646
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:20,840
Speaker 1: Lester Banks are saying it's something Walt Disney. So that

647
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 1: that was our strength, which is not easy. When you're

648
00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:25,800
Speaker 1: opening for the doors and you can get two thousand

649
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:29,399
Speaker 1: people to leave a building, that's not easy. So I said,

650
00:36:29,440 --> 00:36:32,800
Speaker 1: you know, let's when I was in college at social

651
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 1: at New School, one of the professors talked about he

652
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:41,359
Speaker 1: was talking about art and social culture and how, um,

653
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 1: people's likes are very narrow. So when you pick up

654
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 1: when when you deal with an art you have get

655
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:52,520
Speaker 1: a narrow audience. The things that get big our social waves.

656
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,239
Speaker 1: And he used the example of Elvis Presley. He said,

657
00:36:56,760 --> 00:37:00,400
Speaker 1: when Elvis Presley's hips couldn't be shown on its sullivan

658
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:04,680
Speaker 1: he became an overnight success because he tapped into what

659
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:09,399
Speaker 1: every child goes through, which is rebellion of their parents. Um,

660
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:14,439
Speaker 1: it's the clothes, it's the music, it's it's everything. There's

661
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:18,480
Speaker 1: a there's a wave that every kid goes through a

662
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 1: rebelling against the parents, and we said, well, wait a second,

663
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:23,400
Speaker 1: that's what we know how to do. We know how

664
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 1: to get people to hate us. We can get those

665
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:30,400
Speaker 1: parents to say Alice Cooper is the most disgusting thing

666
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,040
Speaker 1: in the world. At breakfast, we will get the kids

667
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: to do anything to go see Alice Cooper. Now, at

668
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 1: this late day, there's been a re evaluation of those

669
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:42,920
Speaker 1: first two records more positive than it was at the time.

670
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 1: But there is a gigantic leap between those first two

671
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:50,319
Speaker 1: records and Love It to Death. And one would say

672
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:52,400
Speaker 1: that no matter what the philosophy was, that you just

673
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:56,800
Speaker 1: lucidated without good music, and well, no, no, we realize that.

674
00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:59,439
Speaker 1: So so that the first part was that, okay, here's

675
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:03,440
Speaker 1: our strength. So that led us to doing Alice Cooper.

676
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:05,600
Speaker 1: That led us to trying to do you know, going

677
00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:08,919
Speaker 1: on stage naked to the chicken biting. But we also

678
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 1: realized without great music, there's no way to make it.

679
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:13,319
Speaker 1: So in the same way we did that, we sat

680
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:16,439
Speaker 1: down and we said, okay, who is the least significant

681
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: band and I don't mean this in a bad way,

682
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:21,680
Speaker 1: who's had the most amount of hit records? The Beatles

683
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 1: had hit records, but they're significant. The Rolling Stones had

684
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 1: hit records. That's significant. The guests who from Canada. It

685
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:31,560
Speaker 1: was a band. Nobody really knew they were making the

686
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:36,400
Speaker 1: greatest records ever American woman. Well, so we went to

687
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:40,839
Speaker 1: the back. The greatest records but not thought of as

688
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:43,880
Speaker 1: the real deal. So he said, who's doing these records?

689
00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:46,400
Speaker 1: So we looked on the back. It was Jack richardson

690
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:50,279
Speaker 1: Nimbus nine Toronto. My partner and I got on an

691
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 1: airplane and we flew to Toronto. We sat in his

692
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:57,320
Speaker 1: office for three days. He wouldn't even see us, but

693
00:38:57,480 --> 00:39:01,440
Speaker 1: we made this guy was doing the record. And the

694
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:05,359
Speaker 1: back story is that he hired Bob Ezra two days

695
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:08,560
Speaker 1: before and the first thing he told Bob, and your

696
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:10,920
Speaker 1: first job is get these guys out of my office

697
00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:14,000
Speaker 1: and do not say yes. But we got him to

698
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,440
Speaker 1: say yes, and he came to Max's Kansas City, he

699
00:39:17,560 --> 00:39:21,400
Speaker 1: saw Alice. He said he would do it. We assumed

700
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:23,400
Speaker 1: we had Jack Richardson, which we did. He did do

701
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:26,919
Speaker 1: the first record. Jack and the rest of the sort

702
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:29,440
Speaker 1: of history before we go there. You talk about your partner,

703
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:32,120
Speaker 1: and you mentioned it earlier, but how did you You're

704
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:34,120
Speaker 1: living in l a in the Landmark. How is your

705
00:39:34,120 --> 00:39:36,600
Speaker 1: partner moved in with me? So you called him up

706
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:38,759
Speaker 1: and said, hey, you gotta come out here? And how

707
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:41,480
Speaker 1: what was the division of labor um? I think he

708
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:43,520
Speaker 1: carried much more of the ball than I did. Probably

709
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 1: in the beginning days. He got Alice's first show with

710
00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 1: Bill Graham and San Francisco, opening for Icentina Turner. He

711
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 1: did tell him that Alice was a female folk singer,

712
00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:58,960
Speaker 1: and Bill threw him off the stage. His exact line was,

713
00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:03,120
Speaker 1: on I fucking stage, you either do music or you act.

714
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 1: You're not doing both of them on my fucking stage.

715
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:09,359
Speaker 1: Get out of here. Really, how long did it last

716
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:14,160
Speaker 1: with you and Joe? I'm less than until I would

717
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:21,120
Speaker 1: say seventy five? End um. We had some personal issues.

718
00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:24,480
Speaker 1: We ended up flipping a coin, one person to take

719
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 1: the business, one person to take the money, and he

720
00:40:27,719 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 1: won the coin flip and he chose the money. If

721
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:31,520
Speaker 1: you would won the coin flip, would you have taken

722
00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 1: the money? Probably? Yeah? Okay, So you get involved with

723
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:39,239
Speaker 1: Bob bes Wind and Jack Richardson does Love It to

724
00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:42,359
Speaker 1: Death album. Now that record doesn't do the album he does.

725
00:40:42,719 --> 00:40:46,000
Speaker 1: It's more complicated than that. So I go to my

726
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 1: representative at Warners, Clyde Bachimo, and say I got Jack Richardson.

727
00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:56,000
Speaker 1: He's agreed to do four tracks, start the record and

728
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:58,919
Speaker 1: see how it goes. And Clyde's flipped out. He said,

729
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:00,680
Speaker 1: we've been trying to get to do business with Jack

730
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:02,839
Speaker 1: Richard Are you kidding me? That is the greatest thing.

731
00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:04,880
Speaker 1: And then he called him back and he says, we

732
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 1: can't do it. Herb Cone won't allow it. What do

733
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 1: you mean? Her conelt he doesn't want to hit. He's

734
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:16,680
Speaker 1: scared you've gotta hit. What never made sense to me

735
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 1: too till years later, Right, so what was the sense?

736
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:24,720
Speaker 1: What what happened was And I'm not looking for a lawsuit,

737
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: but Herb and his brother were dead. Yeah, so so

738
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:33,239
Speaker 1: what happened as I put the pieces together. Herb and

739
00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 1: the head of Warner Brothers Records at the time, More Austin,

740
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,360
Speaker 1: were very good friends. And I don't mean to denigreat

741
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 1: Mo at all. Life is life. You do what you

742
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 1: have to do U. And they used to travel to

743
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:48,880
Speaker 1: France every year. Herb had an apartment in France they

744
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:52,279
Speaker 1: stayed in. They brought drugs together, they did a lot

745
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:57,920
Speaker 1: of things together. They were very very close. Warner Brothers

746
00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 1: gave her and Frank's Appa label UM and a lot

747
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:07,279
Speaker 1: of money, and that money was to record albums. The

748
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:09,799
Speaker 1: way the way record deals worked was if you had

749
00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:13,360
Speaker 1: a label, maybe they'd commit to four artists, two albums.

750
00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:15,880
Speaker 1: Each artist would be a budget. In our case, the

751
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:19,000
Speaker 1: budget but I think two hundred thousand record UM. So

752
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 1: now they have an eight album distribution deal. And let's

753
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 1: say it's two hundred thousand a record, that's a million six. Well,

754
00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 1: if they only spend one dollar on the record, that

755
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 1: million six goes in their pocket. So if you look

756
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,120
Speaker 1: at the artists the Bizarre signed, it was wild Man Fisher,

757
00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:40,600
Speaker 1: who didn't have a band, didn't play a guitar, was

758
00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:43,920
Speaker 1: in an insane asylum. The g t o S who

759
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:47,520
Speaker 1: are in a group Alice, who everybody thought was the

760
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:51,160
Speaker 1: laughing stock of the world. There was no chance these

761
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:53,640
Speaker 1: guys were ever going to sell one record. We did

762
00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:56,680
Speaker 1: our first album. We showed up at Whitney Studios to

763
00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:00,440
Speaker 1: work with Frank's Appa. He came at nine o'clock, introduced

764
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:04,560
Speaker 1: us to his brother. The band thought they would rehearsing.

765
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 1: He came back at five o'clock took the tapes and

766
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:11,520
Speaker 1: that was the end of the album. That was it.

767
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: It was nine o'clock to five o'clock. So he pocketed

768
00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:17,239
Speaker 1: a lot of money. The only way he would have

769
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:21,120
Speaker 1: to give up that money if anybody sits the producers,

770
00:43:21,360 --> 00:43:24,400
Speaker 1: if anybody sold records. So the last thing he wanted.

771
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 1: We ended up in a major lawsuit because a team

772
00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:31,120
Speaker 1: came out of those four tracks and the label change

773
00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:33,960
Speaker 1: probably twenty times because I would I would go in

774
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:36,440
Speaker 1: and say, you're not putting this out on straight. He

775
00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:39,920
Speaker 1: wouldn't pay for it, um, And then he would go

776
00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:42,120
Speaker 1: in and MO would call me up, I gotta put

777
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:44,440
Speaker 1: it if I have to put it on straight, um.

778
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:47,359
Speaker 1: So the label changed the copy I have sets straight, Yeah,

779
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,960
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of Warner Brothers ones so um.

780
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:54,200
Speaker 1: But in any event, he does four tracks and Edrind

781
00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:57,279
Speaker 1: does uh the rest of the track, and I think

782
00:43:57,440 --> 00:43:59,120
Speaker 1: Edd's part of it. I think they sort of do

783
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:02,320
Speaker 1: it together. But what happened was one of the reasons

784
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:04,360
Speaker 1: that I wanted Richardson so bad was because there was

785
00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:10,800
Speaker 1: Canadian content and c KALW was the breakout station in America.

786
00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:15,400
Speaker 1: It was out of Canada, but Wixie in Cleveland and

787
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:19,640
Speaker 1: Rosemary Trumbley, who was programming with c KLW. If she

788
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:24,439
Speaker 1: played a record, you had a hit. And by doing

789
00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:27,000
Speaker 1: it in Canada with Jack Richardson, we came under the

790
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:30,160
Speaker 1: Canadian content rule and she had a place seventy five

791
00:44:30,239 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 1: or eight percent Canadian content, and that got us on

792
00:44:34,000 --> 00:44:37,520
Speaker 1: and when it went on the radio, Um, you could

793
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 1: still manipulate sales. You know you you knew the record

794
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 1: stores were the singles were, so you could send people

795
00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 1: into buy them. And I had every relative I had

796
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 1: in the world, and every Alice relative calling c kl W,

797
00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:55,160
Speaker 1: A hundred times of data requested and it just popped

798
00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:57,239
Speaker 1: and then it took off on its own. But a

799
00:44:57,320 --> 00:45:02,319
Speaker 1: good album, nonetheless, dream Oh My Out of Dwight, Okay,

800
00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:05,840
Speaker 1: but suddenly you have airplay. But to someone who's not

801
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 1: involved in the center, it doesn't. It looks like it's

802
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:10,400
Speaker 1: more than a blip, but not a whole hell of

803
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 1: a lot more than a blip. Okay, So what's the

804
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:16,279
Speaker 1: thought after that? Everything all the same, The thought is

805
00:45:16,360 --> 00:45:20,320
Speaker 1: all the same. It's where the more power we're getting,

806
00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:21,880
Speaker 1: the easier it's going to be for us to hear

807
00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:24,840
Speaker 1: atate parents. So we now have a record that's starting

808
00:45:24,880 --> 00:45:28,520
Speaker 1: to hit. I do. I get Barbara gear Warners, who

809
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 1: by now is having a little faith in me, to

810
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:35,279
Speaker 1: do a coming out party at the Ambassador Hotel for

811
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 1: a debutante named Alice Cooper. We don't tell the hotel,

812
00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:42,960
Speaker 1: we don't tell anyone. Um, and you get up to

813
00:45:43,320 --> 00:45:46,480
Speaker 1: what we invide all the music people that Bob calls everybody,

814
00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:48,640
Speaker 1: you know, the important people, and said, you've got to

815
00:45:48,680 --> 00:45:50,480
Speaker 1: be here for this. You won't believe it. And it's

816
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:54,640
Speaker 1: debutante season and everybody's at the Ambassador. Well every debutant

817
00:45:54,719 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 1: party is. So you pull up to the thing in

818
00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:00,520
Speaker 1: it the dis these girls would trade to meet you.

819
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 1: They weren't girls. They were the cockettes from San Francisco, transvestites.

820
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:10,000
Speaker 1: And this is in seventy um with cigars, cigarettes vasiline,

821
00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:15,200
Speaker 1: which I still love. Then there were guerrillas. The entertainment

822
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 1: was TV Mama, who was four d pounds who came

823
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:21,360
Speaker 1: out of a cake. Um. I went over to her

824
00:46:21,400 --> 00:46:24,279
Speaker 1: manager during the afternoon and I said, is there any

825
00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:26,839
Speaker 1: way we could get TV Mama to take her top off?

826
00:46:28,160 --> 00:46:31,600
Speaker 1: And he said to me, Son, to you, she's TV Mama.

827
00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 1: To me, she's TV dinner. That would be two hundred

828
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:39,560
Speaker 1: extra and we have a great picture of her breast

829
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 1: hitting am it her again in the face of the

830
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 1: front row. And that started the journey. And then we

831
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:49,040
Speaker 1: just did everything we could to tell how people say,

832
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:51,440
Speaker 1: this is the most disgusting thing I've ever seen. That

833
00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:55,440
Speaker 1: was our That was what we wanted for us. Winning

834
00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:58,520
Speaker 1: was getting a parent at the breakfast table to tell

835
00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 1: their kids if they ever here. I'm listening to Alice Cooper,

836
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:03,960
Speaker 1: they grounded for a month and to what degreed do

837
00:47:04,040 --> 00:47:06,800
Speaker 1: you believe? The success of hip hop today is based

838
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:09,160
Speaker 1: on the same theory, exactly the same theory. I can

839
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:13,400
Speaker 1: remember I walked I have four adopted kids. I walked

840
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,160
Speaker 1: past their room at one o'clock in the morning, I

841
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 1: heard for the first time wrap in hip hop. I

842
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:21,240
Speaker 1: opened the door and I said, how can you listen

843
00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:24,520
Speaker 1: to this ship? And as I said it, I looked

844
00:47:24,560 --> 00:47:27,759
Speaker 1: at him and I said, oh God, here's the next wave.

845
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:32,279
Speaker 1: Well staying here, you know, of course, of course, you know,

846
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:34,240
Speaker 1: we used to have a new sound every three years.

847
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:37,800
Speaker 1: You know, we had here being music replaced by Seattle

848
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:40,520
Speaker 1: Sound in the twenty one century. It hasn't gone down

849
00:47:40,600 --> 00:47:43,160
Speaker 1: that way. But the same tiking people are aging every day.

850
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:45,200
Speaker 1: So we have parents who grew up with hip hop.

851
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:48,080
Speaker 1: This may not be your number one focus this days,

852
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 1: but you're certainly a sociologist. Is something going to come

853
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:53,600
Speaker 1: along to bump off hip hop? Oh yeah, I think.

854
00:47:53,719 --> 00:47:55,720
Speaker 1: I think you see the edge sharing, you start seeing

855
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:59,120
Speaker 1: real songs coming back. There's definitely gonna be a reaction.

856
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:01,879
Speaker 1: I don't know what it is, but there's always a reaction. Okay.

857
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:05,600
Speaker 1: So from my viewpoint as an avid fan and music

858
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:07,840
Speaker 1: drove the culture back then. We were all aware of

859
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:10,520
Speaker 1: the song I'm eighteen, heard a little bit and then

860
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:13,800
Speaker 1: it is the end of nineteen seventy one and in

861
00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:19,040
Speaker 1: a boxed out review in Rolling Stone, Lester Bangs gives

862
00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:22,200
Speaker 1: a rave of Alice Cooper's Love It to Death and

863
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:25,440
Speaker 1: they at the time, uh, rolling Stone was famous for

864
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:27,840
Speaker 1: doing hoaxes. They had the Great White Wonder. This was

865
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:31,440
Speaker 1: such an over the top rave, Great White Wonder exactly

866
00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 1: that you said, I'm going to buy this record even

867
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:36,080
Speaker 1: if it sucks, because i want to see what's going on.

868
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:39,640
Speaker 1: I remember literally buying the record, dropping the needle on

869
00:48:39,800 --> 00:48:42,439
Speaker 1: under my wheels, and you got it immediately. The Great

870
00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:45,360
Speaker 1: White One. The financed us buying all our amplifiers. I was,

871
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:47,319
Speaker 1: I did the Great White One there, okay, well tell

872
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:49,440
Speaker 1: my audience what that is. Great White There was a

873
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:53,000
Speaker 1: time in the history of copyright lore where it was

874
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 1: not illegal to record a live concert and sell it.

875
00:48:57,520 --> 00:49:00,680
Speaker 1: So I was able to record Rolling Stones Bob Dylan

876
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:03,920
Speaker 1: and sell it, sell it legally. We did it in

877
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 1: white album jackets and the Great White One that was

878
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:09,239
Speaker 1: I think Dylan. I don't remember which was which, Um,

879
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:11,480
Speaker 1: but we did Rolling Stones. We did a bunch and

880
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 1: then the copyright law changed. Was that when it was

881
00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:19,040
Speaker 1: seventy that's wild? Yeah, okay, so did you ever get

882
00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:23,720
Speaker 1: in trouble? I had one interesting moment I had done

883
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:26,520
Speaker 1: Oh that's that's right. So it's seventy two. I had

884
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: done the Toronto Pop Festival, which was seventy two and

885
00:49:30,880 --> 00:49:34,279
Speaker 1: with John Lennon and the co promoters were people who

886
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:37,880
Speaker 1: owned the big department store chained the Eatons in Canada

887
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:42,839
Speaker 1: and a film named Kenny Walker. And um, they knew

888
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 1: I was did the Great White One because it was legal,

889
00:49:45,239 --> 00:49:47,720
Speaker 1: so I wasn't hiding it from anyone, and they called

890
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 1: me up to buy the master tapes. They offered me

891
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:53,120
Speaker 1: two hundred thousand dollars, which was a lot of money.

892
00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:56,399
Speaker 1: Oh my god, master tapes. I had everything, even thought

893
00:49:56,440 --> 00:50:02,040
Speaker 1: about thousand dollars um. And I said to him, you

894
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:05,320
Speaker 1: know there are no master tapes, and he said, I

895
00:50:05,360 --> 00:50:07,239
Speaker 1: don't care. I want to buy the master tapes from it.

896
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 1: And I just my streets nose went up. So I

897
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:12,279
Speaker 1: went to a lawyer named David Ruddick. I don't know

898
00:50:12,280 --> 00:50:14,680
Speaker 1: if you remember him. He he was on Sunset Boulevard

899
00:50:14,760 --> 00:50:17,319
Speaker 1: as a music business attorney. I told him the story.

900
00:50:17,360 --> 00:50:21,000
Speaker 1: I said, what could they be trying to do? Why?

901
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:23,160
Speaker 1: And they won't come to me. I have to go

902
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 1: to them. And he said, you know, the only thing

903
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:27,880
Speaker 1: I can think of is if you bring something at

904
00:50:27,920 --> 00:50:30,560
Speaker 1: the Canada and you sell it for two hundred thousand

905
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:34,919
Speaker 1: and you didn't report it, that's a serious thing, he said.

906
00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:38,160
Speaker 1: So I'll tell you what to do, he said. I

907
00:50:38,239 --> 00:50:41,480
Speaker 1: had a customer, Sam, the record man. He was one

908
00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:43,480
Speaker 1: of my big customers for the Great White One. There.

909
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,240
Speaker 1: So I went, I flew up. I went to Sam's

910
00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:49,160
Speaker 1: over the counter, bought Great White One. They got a

911
00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:52,680
Speaker 1: receipt for it. I went to a recording studio in Toronto,

912
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:56,000
Speaker 1: took that record, put it on a piece of tape,

913
00:50:56,719 --> 00:51:02,200
Speaker 1: got a bill from the recording studio, so now legitimize legitimized.

914
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:05,680
Speaker 1: I go to the hotel on Avenue Road whose name

915
00:51:05,719 --> 00:51:10,960
Speaker 1: I can't think of, and I walk into the suite

916
00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:13,160
Speaker 1: where the exchange is going to be made, and Kenny

917
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:15,400
Speaker 1: Walker and then come in and have a suitcase two

918
00:51:15,480 --> 00:51:18,279
Speaker 1: hundred thousand knowledge Canadian. They open it up, I give

919
00:51:18,360 --> 00:51:21,080
Speaker 1: him the tape and Alan Klein comes out of the

920
00:51:21,160 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 1: bathroom with four maltis. Alan Clyde was the Beatles manager

921
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:30,160
Speaker 1: and I had done Beetles and rolling stones were part

922
00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:33,320
Speaker 1: of the come out. They put handcuffs on me and

923
00:51:33,440 --> 00:51:38,960
Speaker 1: my partner Joe, because we were still partners then, and uh,

924
00:51:39,400 --> 00:51:41,560
Speaker 1: we say listen, we knew what they were up to.

925
00:51:42,080 --> 00:51:44,799
Speaker 1: They take us to the station house and I said, oh,

926
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:47,560
Speaker 1: lawyer knew exactly what they were doing. I said, unless

927
00:51:47,600 --> 00:51:50,400
Speaker 1: you have a law in Canada that it's illegal to

928
00:51:50,520 --> 00:51:54,480
Speaker 1: get two hundred thousand for something that's worthless. Here's the receipt.

929
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:56,680
Speaker 1: We bought it at Sam the record man. Here's the

930
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 1: receipt for the studio. They took about half an hour

931
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:03,200
Speaker 1: a prosecutor came. We waited for him to come. You

932
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:06,560
Speaker 1: look through the receipts and they let us go. It's

933
00:52:06,560 --> 00:52:08,560
Speaker 1: the last time I ever saw Alan Klein and you

934
00:52:08,600 --> 00:52:17,960
Speaker 1: didn't get to stay right there, We'll be back with

935
00:52:18,080 --> 00:52:21,560
Speaker 1: more of Chef Gordon, legendary manager of rock stars chefs

936
00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:24,560
Speaker 1: and even Groucho Marks right here on the Bob left

937
00:52:24,600 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 1: Sets podcast. Hi, this is Bob left Sets. My guest

938
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:32,320
Speaker 1: come to the tune In studios in Venice, California to

939
00:52:32,400 --> 00:52:34,600
Speaker 1: have these conversations with me. And if you ever want

940
00:52:34,640 --> 00:52:36,560
Speaker 1: to see what they look like where we take the show,

941
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:40,080
Speaker 1: check out the photos and videos search at tune In

942
00:52:40,280 --> 00:52:45,040
Speaker 1: on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram. Let's dive right back in

943
00:52:45,160 --> 00:52:51,640
Speaker 1: with my guest, Sheep Gordon. So, uh, now Killer comes out.

944
00:52:52,040 --> 00:52:54,719
Speaker 1: You start to feel the momentum. Yeah yeah, we could

945
00:52:54,880 --> 00:52:58,040
Speaker 1: feel it, off of it to death, but we couldn't

946
00:52:58,280 --> 00:53:03,880
Speaker 1: turn it into monetary success um. Killer. We start, you know,

947
00:53:04,440 --> 00:53:08,360
Speaker 1: billion dollar babies Killer. We start to really fuel our oats.

948
00:53:08,680 --> 00:53:12,320
Speaker 1: Now we're in stride and having a good time, okay,

949
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:16,960
Speaker 1: and then of course the tipping point is schools Out,

950
00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:21,600
Speaker 1: which becomes an anthem and says everything we've focused all

951
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:25,160
Speaker 1: that angst for us, it was like doing a Who

952
00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:28,960
Speaker 1: song that was sort of the top of the wrong

953
00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:33,000
Speaker 1: was that Who? Who knew how to do anthems of rebellion? Okay,

954
00:53:33,040 --> 00:53:36,560
Speaker 1: you had all these innovative packages, you know, whether it

955
00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:40,480
Speaker 1: be Muscle of Love with certain stains on the box

956
00:53:41,080 --> 00:53:43,840
Speaker 1: or whether it be the panties on. That was one

957
00:53:43,880 --> 00:53:46,400
Speaker 1: of my biggest mistakes in my career with Alice, was

958
00:53:46,480 --> 00:53:52,040
Speaker 1: that box. Why? Because I didn't realize that the thickness

959
00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:55,440
Speaker 1: in those days, most of your sales were rack sales,

960
00:53:55,880 --> 00:53:58,640
Speaker 1: which means you walked into a store that wasn't a

961
00:53:58,719 --> 00:54:02,320
Speaker 1: record store and they have twenty or thirty records in

962
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:05,320
Speaker 1: the stack. I could only do if it held twenty,

963
00:54:05,360 --> 00:54:09,000
Speaker 1: I could only do ten. So my Alice's bins were

964
00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:13,360
Speaker 1: empty all the time because they only were read. However,

965
00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:16,239
Speaker 1: as a big fan, that album was not as good

966
00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:18,040
Speaker 1: as its spread us, and I think that was part

967
00:54:18,080 --> 00:54:19,919
Speaker 1: of it. Also. It was it was when the group

968
00:54:20,080 --> 00:54:25,279
Speaker 1: was starting to come apart. Okay, Bob Green goes on

969
00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:27,799
Speaker 1: the road, writes a book. How does that come still?

970
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:29,840
Speaker 1: And the book still holds up? But how does that

971
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:33,400
Speaker 1: come together? Comes together? My idea, I think he had

972
00:54:33,440 --> 00:54:39,320
Speaker 1: done a book on the Kennedy campaign on and I

973
00:54:39,480 --> 00:54:42,800
Speaker 1: wanted real credibility for Alice. UM. I felt that it

974
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:46,200
Speaker 1: was time to now go from hatred of the parents

975
00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:50,359
Speaker 1: to put some steaks in the ground and a book

976
00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:52,880
Speaker 1: by a guy who did the Kennedy thing to me

977
00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:54,879
Speaker 1: was putting a stake in the ground. And the same

978
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:58,759
Speaker 1: thing with the golf uh no golf. I that was

979
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:02,080
Speaker 1: to help him with this alcoholism. I knew it was

980
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:06,200
Speaker 1: difficult for his career, um, and a truth to be

981
00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:10,080
Speaker 1: very difficult for his career. Okay, so then the band

982
00:55:10,239 --> 00:55:13,040
Speaker 1: breaks up, there's a solo album. What's really going on

983
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:17,360
Speaker 1: at that point? You know, Um, it's really interesting. Living

984
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:20,600
Speaker 1: in the bubble of stardom is really tough. UM. I

985
00:55:20,680 --> 00:55:26,880
Speaker 1: have a lot of sympathy for it, and and it

986
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:30,200
Speaker 1: became very different points of view on the success. UM.

987
00:55:30,920 --> 00:55:34,520
Speaker 1: The rhythm of a day was that Alice would get

988
00:55:34,600 --> 00:55:36,880
Speaker 1: up at eight o'clock or nine o'clock in the morning,

989
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:40,520
Speaker 1: drink all day, but work all day. He would do

990
00:55:40,680 --> 00:55:43,719
Speaker 1: fifty interviews every day because it was everywhere in the

991
00:55:43,800 --> 00:55:45,920
Speaker 1: world and we was so hot, and he was the

992
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:50,239
Speaker 1: only one who really could do good interviews. So he

993
00:55:50,440 --> 00:55:53,760
Speaker 1: was our focal point. We early on in the career,

994
00:55:54,920 --> 00:55:59,440
Speaker 1: um we met it. We maybe ten weeks after I

995
00:55:59,520 --> 00:56:01,879
Speaker 1: had met him, we went to a lady named pat

996
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:06,320
Speaker 1: King police office, who she was the PR person, and

997
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:10,680
Speaker 1: we had this idea about parents hating. I said, who's

998
00:56:10,680 --> 00:56:12,560
Speaker 1: the best person to do with? Someone gave me her name,

999
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 1: she was gracious enough to meet me. I've brought the

1000
00:56:15,200 --> 00:56:17,759
Speaker 1: band with me and after I talked to she has

1001
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:20,359
Speaker 1: the band, to go out in the lobby and she said, listen, Chef,

1002
00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:24,640
Speaker 1: give me one person named now. Because Alice was named Vincent,

1003
00:56:25,120 --> 00:56:28,000
Speaker 1: he wasn't. Oh okay, So what point in the career

1004
00:56:28,080 --> 00:56:29,799
Speaker 1: did this is it? I'm going to tell you the story.

1005
00:56:30,200 --> 00:56:33,840
Speaker 1: So she said, they're going to lobby. Says, Chef, you

1006
00:56:33,920 --> 00:56:36,120
Speaker 1: gotta give me one person named Alice Cooper. I don't

1007
00:56:36,160 --> 00:56:39,800
Speaker 1: know how to make five guys with a girl's name famous.

1008
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:42,319
Speaker 1: You give me one of them that I know how

1009
00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:44,480
Speaker 1: to do. It's the right time. You have a great idea.

1010
00:56:45,120 --> 00:56:48,319
Speaker 1: So I go out in her lobby and I said, listen, guys,

1011
00:56:48,800 --> 00:56:50,640
Speaker 1: we gotta pick one of you to be Alice Cooper.

1012
00:56:52,040 --> 00:56:53,839
Speaker 1: Because she said, that's you know the way it's gonna work.

1013
00:56:53,880 --> 00:56:56,080
Speaker 1: And she's great, and right there in the lobby we

1014
00:56:56,360 --> 00:57:00,920
Speaker 1: picked Alice. This is before any records. This is before anything. Okay,

1015
00:57:01,160 --> 00:57:03,160
Speaker 1: So now, no, no, I think it's maybe after the

1016
00:57:03,239 --> 00:57:05,640
Speaker 1: first record. If you look on the first couple of records,

1017
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:09,640
Speaker 1: I think it's Vincent Fernie. It's not Alice Cooper, I believe. Okay,

1018
00:57:09,920 --> 00:57:12,759
Speaker 1: So what point does the band wake up and say, hey,

1019
00:57:12,840 --> 00:57:14,600
Speaker 1: wait a minute. So I'm gonna tell you what the

1020
00:57:14,680 --> 00:57:18,440
Speaker 1: rest of it. So he's working hard all day. So

1021
00:57:18,680 --> 00:57:21,960
Speaker 1: but but right at that point, shortly thereafter, we sit

1022
00:57:22,040 --> 00:57:25,479
Speaker 1: him all down and Alice in the group and I say, listen,

1023
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:29,320
Speaker 1: we're going to change his name illegally, which means you

1024
00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:34,040
Speaker 1: guys are in real jeopardy. But um, what we need

1025
00:57:34,120 --> 00:57:38,280
Speaker 1: to do right now we shake hands. The tour all millionaires.

1026
00:57:39,080 --> 00:57:44,000
Speaker 1: Nobody is leaving this thing. Once you're all millionaires. We

1027
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:47,360
Speaker 1: sit and talk, but and I was very focused on Alice,

1028
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:51,800
Speaker 1: basically saying, we're giving you the gauntlet. You're not taking

1029
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:54,920
Speaker 1: this right away from us. This is like you know, um,

1030
00:57:55,680 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 1: And we all shook hands on it. So we got

1031
00:57:57,800 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 1: to the point where we were almost million airs maybe

1032
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:05,440
Speaker 1: we had three hundred four, which was like millionairess not

1033
00:58:05,560 --> 00:58:07,440
Speaker 1: even know if we had that much, but everyone now

1034
00:58:07,480 --> 00:58:10,080
Speaker 1: could afford a car. Now for the first time, they

1035
00:58:10,120 --> 00:58:13,400
Speaker 1: were all living on their own. Wasn't a group house. Um.

1036
00:58:13,520 --> 00:58:16,000
Speaker 1: We were able to fly places. I didn't have to

1037
00:58:16,040 --> 00:58:18,640
Speaker 1: bounce checks. We were starting to really make it and

1038
00:58:18,760 --> 00:58:21,600
Speaker 1: you could see on the horizon. Nine seventy two they

1039
00:58:21,640 --> 00:58:24,400
Speaker 1: had the biggest tour in the world. Led Zeppelin was

1040
00:58:24,440 --> 00:58:27,600
Speaker 1: the second big so he could see it's we're right there.

1041
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:31,720
Speaker 1: And the guys asked me if I would come to

1042
00:58:31,800 --> 00:58:33,800
Speaker 1: a meeting. They never asked me to come to a meeting.

1043
00:58:34,920 --> 00:58:36,680
Speaker 1: And I go up to Connecticut and I sit down

1044
00:58:36,880 --> 00:58:40,040
Speaker 1: and they just fomb it out. They said that, Um,

1045
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:44,240
Speaker 1: I had let me back up. I had this running

1046
00:58:44,240 --> 00:58:48,000
Speaker 1: battle with him for the year previous, which was every

1047
00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:50,320
Speaker 1: night they wanted to just do the show in dungarees

1048
00:58:50,320 --> 00:58:53,120
Speaker 1: and not do the theatrics, and every night I would

1049
00:58:53,120 --> 00:58:57,959
Speaker 1: have to get really intense about you know, think about

1050
00:58:58,040 --> 00:59:00,120
Speaker 1: the people in the audience, what they're here for, or

1051
00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:04,320
Speaker 1: forget yourselves. Um and I beat him into it. But

1052
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:06,560
Speaker 1: it wasn't a happy thing. It was. It got to

1053
00:59:06,640 --> 00:59:11,080
Speaker 1: be very intense every night, and that was what the

1054
00:59:11,120 --> 00:59:16,760
Speaker 1: meeting was about people don't appreciate our music. They think

1055
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:20,520
Speaker 1: of as a novelty. Alice gets all the attention. We

1056
00:59:20,640 --> 00:59:22,440
Speaker 1: wanted to leave. We want to break up. We want

1057
00:59:22,440 --> 00:59:24,240
Speaker 1: to put it on hold for a year or two

1058
00:59:25,000 --> 00:59:27,080
Speaker 1: and do our own records so people will see that

1059
00:59:27,120 --> 00:59:32,680
Speaker 1: we're really talented musicians. And my take on it was, hey,

1060
00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:37,120
Speaker 1: we shook hands. It was so close, like, let's just wait,

1061
00:59:38,080 --> 00:59:42,920
Speaker 1: and they wouldn't do it. Um, And I said, you know,

1062
00:59:43,560 --> 00:59:46,320
Speaker 1: I said, I'm gonna go with Alice. I'm not going

1063
00:59:46,360 --> 00:59:50,800
Speaker 1: to be part of your guys journey. It's not First

1064
00:59:50,840 --> 00:59:53,120
Speaker 1: of all, I don't break my word. Secondly, I don't

1065
00:59:53,560 --> 00:59:57,400
Speaker 1: really know what you do. Um. I know you know. Um.

1066
00:59:59,080 --> 01:00:01,200
Speaker 1: And we never had a right, we never had an argument.

1067
01:00:01,240 --> 01:00:05,480
Speaker 1: We're still all friendly. They just played shows with England. Um. Okay.

1068
01:00:05,600 --> 01:00:11,080
Speaker 1: So slowly the band walked from Alice. So at what

1069
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:14,640
Speaker 1: point did the band, because these are human beings, have

1070
01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:19,120
Speaker 1: sour grapes. I don't know, but I'm sure fairly soon.

1071
01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:22,840
Speaker 1: And did they ever come crawling back? Oh? No, that

1072
01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:24,720
Speaker 1: we've both it's not a matter of crawling or anything.

1073
01:00:24,720 --> 01:00:28,120
Speaker 1: We've been really good friends. Um. There's never been a

1074
01:00:28,280 --> 01:00:31,800
Speaker 1: moment of anything but friendship and respect for each other.

1075
01:00:32,320 --> 01:00:34,760
Speaker 1: They made a bad decision. They made a bad decision,

1076
01:00:34,760 --> 01:00:36,200
Speaker 1: but they didn't knock on the door ready to be

1077
01:00:36,240 --> 01:00:39,120
Speaker 1: the backing big they'd love to be back in Yeah, yeah,

1078
01:00:39,400 --> 01:00:41,120
Speaker 1: but no reason. So why in the last couple of

1079
01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:43,520
Speaker 1: years have they suddenly been playing with Alice? Because it's

1080
01:00:43,560 --> 01:00:45,720
Speaker 1: a really nice thing to do. Alice loves that, the

1081
01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:49,600
Speaker 1: audience loves it. Um, it's great for them. It's you know,

1082
01:00:49,960 --> 01:00:51,959
Speaker 1: it's been a long time. I think it's a great moment.

1083
01:00:52,600 --> 01:00:56,400
Speaker 1: I mean, our job is to make the audience happy.

1084
01:00:57,280 --> 01:01:00,400
Speaker 1: It's not to make ourselves happy. It's the and I

1085
01:01:00,800 --> 01:01:02,400
Speaker 1: you know, when we're writing it, we know that that

1086
01:01:02,600 --> 01:01:05,360
Speaker 1: makes the audience happy. There is a part of the audience.

1087
01:01:05,520 --> 01:01:07,360
Speaker 1: So they do three or four songs. At the end,

1088
01:01:07,920 --> 01:01:09,640
Speaker 1: Alice can still do a show and the way he

1089
01:01:09,720 --> 01:01:12,720
Speaker 1: wants to um, And it's nice for them. They're back

1090
01:01:12,760 --> 01:01:15,320
Speaker 1: on stage and all of them together. They all love

1091
01:01:15,400 --> 01:01:17,800
Speaker 1: each other, these kids who went to high school together.

1092
01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:22,200
Speaker 1: So if it's you know, if it's basically is his bifurcation,

1093
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:26,160
Speaker 1: when do you get your next client? I got my

1094
01:01:26,280 --> 01:01:30,040
Speaker 1: next time. Before that, I got Um and Murray was

1095
01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:34,360
Speaker 1: probably seventy three, ish if I maybe a little later.

1096
01:01:34,440 --> 01:01:38,200
Speaker 1: Okay in Murray this is before Snowbird. No, this is

1097
01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:41,240
Speaker 1: as Snowbird is number one. Okay, how does she find you?

1098
01:01:41,240 --> 01:01:44,560
Speaker 1: Who's the previous record company? Go? Brian to Hearn producer

1099
01:01:44,920 --> 01:01:47,280
Speaker 1: met me during the John Lennon days when I did

1100
01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:50,240
Speaker 1: the festival up there. Um I had helped him get

1101
01:01:50,800 --> 01:01:54,360
Speaker 1: his recording studio together, an actron I got want us

1102
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:56,840
Speaker 1: to finance. We had a good relationship and he called

1103
01:01:56,880 --> 01:01:59,840
Speaker 1: me up about managing her and the record was number one,

1104
01:01:59,880 --> 01:02:02,640
Speaker 1: and I I was. I was sort when he called.

1105
01:02:02,680 --> 01:02:04,240
Speaker 1: I said, you know, let me this is a great

1106
01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:06,160
Speaker 1: way for me to see if I have any skills

1107
01:02:06,280 --> 01:02:09,400
Speaker 1: or not. Alice was, you know, I have no idea

1108
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:11,360
Speaker 1: how much I was of it and how much it

1109
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:13,680
Speaker 1: was fate. So let me see if the principles work

1110
01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:16,040
Speaker 1: for any And I was very open with her and

1111
01:02:16,120 --> 01:02:18,080
Speaker 1: honest that I you know, I don't know what kind

1112
01:02:18,120 --> 01:02:20,320
Speaker 1: of job I can do, and you know I may

1113
01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:22,840
Speaker 1: have gotten lucky, but if you want to take a role.

1114
01:02:23,640 --> 01:02:26,240
Speaker 1: And it went on for how long? I went on

1115
01:02:26,360 --> 01:02:29,520
Speaker 1: for about four years, five years, and everybody was happy. Okay,

1116
01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:31,920
Speaker 1: let's go back to this era. As we've established, ticket

1117
01:02:31,960 --> 01:02:35,520
Speaker 1: prices were cheaper, the world was both smaller and bigger

1118
01:02:35,520 --> 01:02:38,600
Speaker 1: at the same time. In retrospect that you let a

1119
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:41,920
Speaker 1: lot of money flow through your fingers. Oh yeah, absolutely,

1120
01:02:42,400 --> 01:02:44,840
Speaker 1: well we still do. I never been. I used to

1121
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:46,680
Speaker 1: tell every actor would come in. If you're looking to

1122
01:02:46,720 --> 01:02:48,440
Speaker 1: make the most amount of money, I am so the

1123
01:02:48,520 --> 01:02:50,840
Speaker 1: wrong guy for you. But if you're looking to not

1124
01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:55,080
Speaker 1: need your second name, I'm your guy. Like I know

1125
01:02:55,200 --> 01:02:58,360
Speaker 1: how to make your famous. I'm not the best in monetizing.

1126
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:02,040
Speaker 1: And you look at someone like her career and what

1127
01:03:02,240 --> 01:03:05,440
Speaker 1: he's done to monetize is just so brilliant. My hats

1128
01:03:05,480 --> 01:03:08,000
Speaker 1: off to him every time. Um brilliant. But it's not

1129
01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:12,240
Speaker 1: what I It's just not what I do. Okay. So

1130
01:03:12,480 --> 01:03:15,640
Speaker 1: after we had Murray, then what's next? A couple of

1131
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:18,919
Speaker 1: really great ones in the middle gradual marks you John

1132
01:03:19,040 --> 01:03:22,400
Speaker 1: or Raquel Welsh? What did you do for Raquel? Raquel

1133
01:03:22,520 --> 01:03:24,600
Speaker 1: was a great one to Raquel called me up and said,

1134
01:03:24,760 --> 01:03:27,360
Speaker 1: I'm literally I yew that freak that helped make Alex

1135
01:03:27,400 --> 01:03:30,840
Speaker 1: Cooper famous said, he said, you take immediate Academy Awards

1136
01:03:30,880 --> 01:03:34,040
Speaker 1: tomorrow night. And I went within the Academy Awards, which

1137
01:03:34,120 --> 01:03:37,240
Speaker 1: was unbelievable. I remember I wore something green and the

1138
01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:40,080
Speaker 1: sweater around my arg pitch made it dark by the

1139
01:03:40,160 --> 01:03:43,520
Speaker 1: time I got there. And she was very honest. She

1140
01:03:43,560 --> 01:03:46,560
Speaker 1: said that she was aging, had two children, she had

1141
01:03:46,600 --> 01:03:49,520
Speaker 1: a support on her own, knew that as a sex

1142
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:53,360
Speaker 1: star movie Starr, her years were limited in her income

1143
01:03:54,240 --> 01:03:57,000
Speaker 1: and that she needed to make a living in that

1144
01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,600
Speaker 1: maybe I could figure out something. And to me, it

1145
01:03:59,680 --> 01:04:03,480
Speaker 1: was so obvious, And Margaret was gigantic in Vegas UM,

1146
01:04:03,640 --> 01:04:05,560
Speaker 1: so it was so obvious to me. The highway was

1147
01:04:05,640 --> 01:04:08,200
Speaker 1: already built. I just had to put her on that train.

1148
01:04:08,880 --> 01:04:12,560
Speaker 1: So I hired UH and Margaret's choreographer, guy named Robbit Scuff,

1149
01:04:13,160 --> 01:04:15,800
Speaker 1: and UM got her a long term deal with Caesar's

1150
01:04:16,560 --> 01:04:18,880
Speaker 1: UM and and was it saying, I mean, you obviously

1151
01:04:18,920 --> 01:04:21,080
Speaker 1: got paid, but people wanted to go, oh yeah, yeah,

1152
01:04:21,120 --> 01:04:23,520
Speaker 1: we did really well. Why do you think uh, sex

1153
01:04:23,640 --> 01:04:28,400
Speaker 1: symbol Vegas UM right setting, and Margaret said, a fantastic

1154
01:04:28,560 --> 01:04:32,960
Speaker 1: blazing UM. You know, she was the trailblazer and her

1155
01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:36,160
Speaker 1: shows were incredible. So it was an entertaining night and

1156
01:04:36,200 --> 01:04:38,120
Speaker 1: you got to see rac yel was safe for a

1157
01:04:38,200 --> 01:04:40,760
Speaker 1: guy to bring his wife and still maybe get a

1158
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:46,040
Speaker 1: heart on Okay, So then how do we come with

1159
01:04:46,920 --> 01:04:50,320
Speaker 1: Blondie and Luther V Andrew's uh. And then by then

1160
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:54,200
Speaker 1: I started to get a reputation, um and and I

1161
01:04:54,280 --> 01:04:59,400
Speaker 1: made a decision, UM that the toughest part of management

1162
01:05:00,200 --> 01:05:04,960
Speaker 1: how the artists would react to fame into having a voice.

1163
01:05:05,520 --> 01:05:08,000
Speaker 1: So I decided I would only take on acts I had.

1164
01:05:08,240 --> 01:05:12,960
Speaker 1: I was fortunate enough that most artists wanted me to

1165
01:05:13,080 --> 01:05:16,120
Speaker 1: manage him. They knew I didn't sign contracts. The word

1166
01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:20,000
Speaker 1: had gotten around I did unique stuff. So I would

1167
01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:22,959
Speaker 1: only take acts if they had number one records, because

1168
01:05:23,040 --> 01:05:26,080
Speaker 1: then I knew they were sort of fire tested, had survived.

1169
01:05:26,800 --> 01:05:32,520
Speaker 1: So Blondie I think was Chrysalis who came to me, Um,

1170
01:05:32,680 --> 01:05:35,960
Speaker 1: Luther Vandross was okay. So you got involved with Blondie

1171
01:05:36,320 --> 01:05:39,320
Speaker 1: after Heart of Glass hit, after their Heart of Glass

1172
01:05:39,440 --> 01:05:43,920
Speaker 1: before Rapture, and Luther v Andros Luther was after his

1173
01:05:44,000 --> 01:05:46,800
Speaker 1: first record. Let's go a little bit deeper into fire

1174
01:05:46,920 --> 01:05:50,720
Speaker 1: tested with their fame. Give us those people obviously could

1175
01:05:50,760 --> 01:05:53,880
Speaker 1: handle it. Give us examples of people who couldn't. Um,

1176
01:05:54,080 --> 01:05:55,960
Speaker 1: I don't know, because you don't hear about them. No,

1177
01:05:56,440 --> 01:05:58,320
Speaker 1: I don't need the names. Yeah, not not in my life?

1178
01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:00,680
Speaker 1: What would it? What would it look like? Um? It

1179
01:06:00,720 --> 01:06:03,720
Speaker 1: could look like anything. It looks like drugs, it could

1180
01:06:03,760 --> 01:06:10,160
Speaker 1: look like um, um, insanity, it could look like ego, UM,

1181
01:06:11,040 --> 01:06:13,480
Speaker 1: so many things. Well, how hard is it to be famous?

1182
01:06:13,720 --> 01:06:16,960
Speaker 1: Really tough? Really tough? What are the key elements to

1183
01:06:16,960 --> 01:06:19,480
Speaker 1: be able to cope? I think having people around you

1184
01:06:19,560 --> 01:06:23,600
Speaker 1: that don't say yes, it's really important. Um. And I

1185
01:06:23,720 --> 01:06:29,320
Speaker 1: think am I found I loved hearing Open Winfrey the

1186
01:06:29,400 --> 01:06:31,520
Speaker 1: other day saying the kind of thing I try and

1187
01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:35,440
Speaker 1: always tell my clients. They asked her why she feels

1188
01:06:35,480 --> 01:06:38,440
Speaker 1: she successful, and she says, the most important thing in

1189
01:06:38,520 --> 01:06:40,640
Speaker 1: my life is I wake up every day and the

1190
01:06:40,760 --> 01:06:42,360
Speaker 1: first thing I do before I get out of bed

1191
01:06:42,440 --> 01:06:45,040
Speaker 1: is say thank you. And I say thank you for

1192
01:06:45,360 --> 01:06:49,120
Speaker 1: waking up, thank you for giving me this day, he says.

1193
01:06:49,160 --> 01:06:52,720
Speaker 1: And it starts my day with gratitude. Um. And that's

1194
01:06:52,920 --> 01:06:56,560
Speaker 1: what I always tried to really push into the artist

1195
01:06:56,640 --> 01:06:59,280
Speaker 1: that I worked with brain, is that it's not about you,

1196
01:06:59,560 --> 01:07:04,800
Speaker 1: it's about them. Um. Okay, you know who was it? Somebody? Uh? Oh.

1197
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:07,360
Speaker 1: The book about Joan Winner and Rolling Stone came out

1198
01:07:07,720 --> 01:07:11,440
Speaker 1: four or five months ago, and Johan is telling relating

1199
01:07:11,480 --> 01:07:15,040
Speaker 1: the story of becoming friendly with John and Yoko showing

1200
01:07:15,120 --> 01:07:18,880
Speaker 1: around San Francisco, going to lunch and somebody comes up

1201
01:07:19,560 --> 01:07:23,840
Speaker 1: for John Lennon's autograph and Lennon says, fuck off. Okay,

1202
01:07:24,600 --> 01:07:27,880
Speaker 1: that's the opposite of someone like Jon bon Jovi, who's

1203
01:07:27,960 --> 01:07:30,800
Speaker 1: being nice to everybody. Benning oldly got angry with his

1204
01:07:30,880 --> 01:07:34,000
Speaker 1: record company ironically about a year ago. But you know,

1205
01:07:34,120 --> 01:07:37,600
Speaker 1: you have someone like Bob Dylan, who's elusive and an icon,

1206
01:07:38,120 --> 01:07:39,560
Speaker 1: and you have other people are glad he and he

1207
01:07:39,720 --> 01:07:44,240
Speaker 1: isn't what makes you famous being the beacon and being

1208
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:48,560
Speaker 1: different and not worrying about what the audience thinks. I think.

1209
01:07:48,800 --> 01:07:50,840
Speaker 1: I think there's a different paths for everything, but for

1210
01:07:51,080 --> 01:07:55,600
Speaker 1: in my journey, I can't take that path. Look at

1211
01:07:55,640 --> 01:07:59,280
Speaker 1: your personal journey, but the and the journey with my art. Okay,

1212
01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:03,080
Speaker 1: you know you So we're in a strange era now

1213
01:08:03,160 --> 01:08:05,360
Speaker 1: where unless you're hip hop act, no one's listening to

1214
01:08:05,400 --> 01:08:09,320
Speaker 1: the new music anyway. But do you want to tell

1215
01:08:09,360 --> 01:08:11,840
Speaker 1: you to tell your artists just give them what they want,

1216
01:08:11,960 --> 01:08:15,440
Speaker 1: take the pay day, move on. I don't think. I

1217
01:08:15,480 --> 01:08:16,840
Speaker 1: don't think it's a matter of just giving it. I

1218
01:08:16,880 --> 01:08:19,040
Speaker 1: didn't mean it that way, So tell me how you

1219
01:08:19,120 --> 01:08:26,040
Speaker 1: meant it. I meant it. Um. If Alice knows that

1220
01:08:26,400 --> 01:08:29,160
Speaker 1: his audience would really enjoy having the old guys on

1221
01:08:29,439 --> 01:08:34,800
Speaker 1: stage with them, why not do it. It doesn't compromise

1222
01:08:34,920 --> 01:08:38,040
Speaker 1: his art at all. Um. Okay, Let's let's use someone

1223
01:08:38,080 --> 01:08:41,880
Speaker 1: of Alice's vintage. Okay, and let's leave Alice aside. Let's

1224
01:08:41,920 --> 01:08:44,679
Speaker 1: say you were representing, and there's tons of them. Acts

1225
01:08:44,800 --> 01:08:47,960
Speaker 1: had gargantuan hits in the seventies who were still on

1226
01:08:48,000 --> 01:08:50,880
Speaker 1: the road or maybe even the eighties. Do be Brothers

1227
01:08:50,920 --> 01:08:55,080
Speaker 1: in the seventies def Leopard in the eighties, these were gigantic,

1228
01:08:55,200 --> 01:08:59,920
Speaker 1: identic and can still sell tickets today. Generally speaking, one

1229
01:09:00,040 --> 01:09:02,360
Speaker 1: believes people want to pay their money and hear the

1230
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:04,360
Speaker 1: hits per Actually, you have to play the hits. What

1231
01:09:04,400 --> 01:09:06,360
Speaker 1: do you tell an act like that, That is you

1232
01:09:06,479 --> 01:09:09,080
Speaker 1: just say, be thankful that anybody wants to see you,

1233
01:09:09,760 --> 01:09:13,080
Speaker 1: or yeah, and play your hits. Okay, And you have

1234
01:09:13,240 --> 01:09:15,880
Speaker 1: to play your hits and what about And I said

1235
01:09:15,920 --> 01:09:17,800
Speaker 1: the same to the chefs when I manage them. You

1236
01:09:17,920 --> 01:09:20,439
Speaker 1: have to play your hits. It's exactly like songwriting. If

1237
01:09:20,479 --> 01:09:22,960
Speaker 1: you went to Spago and they didn't have pizza. That

1238
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:24,920
Speaker 1: would be like going to the Rolling Stones and not

1239
01:09:25,080 --> 01:09:28,000
Speaker 1: hearing their hits. And then when the artist says, I'm stifled,

1240
01:09:28,040 --> 01:09:30,519
Speaker 1: I have to express my creativity. You try and make

1241
01:09:30,560 --> 01:09:32,680
Speaker 1: a balance and help them work through it and get

1242
01:09:32,760 --> 01:09:35,840
Speaker 1: some kind of a balance, um, and try and make

1243
01:09:35,920 --> 01:09:41,920
Speaker 1: it work. And they, unless they're completely unconscious, if they'll

1244
01:09:41,920 --> 01:09:45,000
Speaker 1: see it immediately with the reaction of the audience. And

1245
01:09:45,680 --> 01:09:47,840
Speaker 1: there's I don't know any entertainer who's been in it

1246
01:09:47,920 --> 01:09:51,960
Speaker 1: for a while who doesn't want the the emulation of

1247
01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:53,920
Speaker 1: their audience, all right, right, you know, it's all about

1248
01:09:53,960 --> 01:09:56,120
Speaker 1: the attention. That's where they're doing much more than the money.

1249
01:09:56,760 --> 01:10:02,519
Speaker 1: So when the artist says, I'm frustrated, I have to

1250
01:10:02,600 --> 01:10:05,120
Speaker 1: express myself, but I don't think my audience can handle this.

1251
01:10:05,680 --> 01:10:07,360
Speaker 1: How do you cope with that? I mean I would

1252
01:10:07,400 --> 01:10:09,040
Speaker 1: It depends on who it is, but I try and work.

1253
01:10:09,439 --> 01:10:10,880
Speaker 1: Maybe I would say to me, why don't we go

1254
01:10:10,920 --> 01:10:13,680
Speaker 1: to a small club somewhere, try it out, see how

1255
01:10:13,720 --> 01:10:18,920
Speaker 1: it feels. Well, let's do an invited audience. Um, each

1256
01:10:19,000 --> 01:10:22,000
Speaker 1: one is pliable, but but try and keep him on

1257
01:10:22,160 --> 01:10:26,360
Speaker 1: focus about it's a service business, okay, So let's go

1258
01:10:26,439 --> 01:10:29,679
Speaker 1: specifically to Alice Cooper. Alice Cooper certainly has a number

1259
01:10:29,720 --> 01:10:32,040
Speaker 1: of hits, can play to the end of his career,

1260
01:10:32,280 --> 01:10:35,320
Speaker 1: selling a certain number of tickets because of the change

1261
01:10:35,400 --> 01:10:38,240
Speaker 1: in society and Halloween becoming such a big deal he's

1262
01:10:38,280 --> 01:10:42,760
Speaker 1: been associated with that. Is there any way to make

1263
01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:48,439
Speaker 1: him bigger than he already is? Um? You know it's

1264
01:10:48,520 --> 01:10:54,320
Speaker 1: it's um. It's hard for me to determine that he's

1265
01:10:54,360 --> 01:10:59,040
Speaker 1: been on a rising. He's been rising. Um. And we

1266
01:10:59,200 --> 01:11:01,280
Speaker 1: just keep trying to the right things. We keept trying

1267
01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:05,040
Speaker 1: to make interesting new product. We try and make the

1268
01:11:05,080 --> 01:11:08,559
Speaker 1: shows as exciting as we can. Um. And we try

1269
01:11:08,600 --> 01:11:10,479
Speaker 1: and be as pure at Alice Cooper, which we can be.

1270
01:11:10,960 --> 01:11:14,680
Speaker 1: Everything we judge is what would Alice do? Um? But

1271
01:11:15,640 --> 01:11:21,040
Speaker 1: are we going to be Justin Bieber again? We would

1272
01:11:21,080 --> 01:11:24,320
Speaker 1: love to, of course, we'd love to. But is that reality?

1273
01:11:24,400 --> 01:11:26,920
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's reality. But all we have

1274
01:11:27,400 --> 01:11:30,280
Speaker 1: he a happy artist. He just loves what he does.

1275
01:11:30,520 --> 01:11:32,639
Speaker 1: How many dates do he does? A hundred and thirty?

1276
01:11:34,720 --> 01:11:37,280
Speaker 1: He does a radio show five nights a week. Um,

1277
01:11:37,320 --> 01:11:40,639
Speaker 1: he loves it. He truly loves it. Yeah, I tell

1278
01:11:41,200 --> 01:11:43,200
Speaker 1: he would pay to do it if they didn't pay him.

1279
01:11:43,880 --> 01:11:46,160
Speaker 1: So How did you get involved with the Chefs? Um

1280
01:11:46,240 --> 01:11:50,120
Speaker 1: The Chefs was a a work of passion, sort of

1281
01:11:50,200 --> 01:11:53,080
Speaker 1: like I won the con Film Festival in nineteen seventy seven.

1282
01:11:53,960 --> 01:11:57,000
Speaker 1: I got taken to a restaurant in the south of France.

1283
01:11:57,320 --> 01:12:00,320
Speaker 1: It was Ridley Scott's first movie called The Duellist. In

1284
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,240
Speaker 1: my first movie, And how do you decide to get

1285
01:12:03,280 --> 01:12:05,720
Speaker 1: in the movies? I got in. There was a girl

1286
01:12:05,840 --> 01:12:08,840
Speaker 1: named Carolin Pheiffer who were in, who was Pat Kingsley's

1287
01:12:08,880 --> 01:12:14,639
Speaker 1: associate in England, and she was very instrumental in Alice's career.

1288
01:12:15,400 --> 01:12:18,840
Speaker 1: England was very important to us and she was very,

1289
01:12:19,000 --> 01:12:22,080
Speaker 1: very instrumental, and we developed a love for her. Alice

1290
01:12:22,120 --> 01:12:24,840
Speaker 1: and I. Alice had a love hate because she worked

1291
01:12:24,880 --> 01:12:29,600
Speaker 1: them so hard. I had a pure love. And the

1292
01:12:29,880 --> 01:12:33,200
Speaker 1: baby on Billion Dollar Babies was her daughter, Lola, the

1293
01:12:33,280 --> 01:12:36,200
Speaker 1: one that Alice is holding up. And the baby had

1294
01:12:36,200 --> 01:12:40,680
Speaker 1: a crib death for six months and Carolin worked out

1295
01:12:40,720 --> 01:12:45,599
Speaker 1: of her house. Charlie Chaplin was the baby's godfather. Um,

1296
01:12:46,479 --> 01:12:48,880
Speaker 1: so you know you'd walk into the apartment to be

1297
01:12:48,960 --> 01:12:52,840
Speaker 1: Mick Jagger, Paul McCartney, Charlie Chaplin, oh, Marshal Reef. That

1298
01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:56,439
Speaker 1: was the life she lived in, and she called me

1299
01:12:56,560 --> 01:12:59,000
Speaker 1: up and she said, you know, Um, I can't go

1300
01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:03,000
Speaker 1: back into my apartment. I gotta leave the happy job

1301
01:13:03,080 --> 01:13:06,280
Speaker 1: for me. So I said, come on that. She she

1302
01:13:06,400 --> 01:13:09,400
Speaker 1: represented rack Heel, So I said, come on, just work

1303
01:13:09,479 --> 01:13:11,519
Speaker 1: with me on rack Keel. Come to you know l

1304
01:13:11,600 --> 01:13:14,920
Speaker 1: A and we got you covered. So she came in.

1305
01:13:15,000 --> 01:13:16,400
Speaker 1: She worked with rack Heel. She brought it in a

1306
01:13:16,479 --> 01:13:20,519
Speaker 1: couple of other artists, Sarah Miles. I don't remember, sis um,

1307
01:13:21,040 --> 01:13:25,519
Speaker 1: Sarah Miles. She had read that great controversy which one

1308
01:13:25,760 --> 01:13:29,920
Speaker 1: the guy in the bathtub exactly. So she said, I

1309
01:13:30,200 --> 01:13:33,400
Speaker 1: an article and Esquire about twenty years ago. Exhausted said,

1310
01:13:33,479 --> 01:13:38,720
Speaker 1: three guys committed suicide over her. Yeah, well, okay, I'm

1311
01:13:38,760 --> 01:13:41,719
Speaker 1: not a witness. Okay, she that cares. She was certainly

1312
01:13:41,760 --> 01:13:44,080
Speaker 1: attractive though she was very cool. But it is that

1313
01:13:44,200 --> 01:13:46,599
Speaker 1: charismatic that the guy just could not get over quirky.

1314
01:13:46,720 --> 01:13:51,400
Speaker 1: But she was great. Um. We did. She wanted to

1315
01:13:51,520 --> 01:13:53,800
Speaker 1: vomit up that whole thing, so we did with Bill

1316
01:13:53,840 --> 01:13:56,280
Speaker 1: Graham at the A c T in San Francisco. We

1317
01:13:56,360 --> 01:14:01,240
Speaker 1: did a one woman show s smiles as me smiles um,

1318
01:14:02,240 --> 01:14:05,599
Speaker 1: where she vomited up that whole thing about the finding

1319
01:14:05,640 --> 01:14:09,160
Speaker 1: the guy in the bathtub and it was really beautiful

1320
01:14:09,240 --> 01:14:12,840
Speaker 1: for her. Carolin came and she didn't like management at all.

1321
01:14:13,200 --> 01:14:14,160
Speaker 1: So I said, what do you want to do? And

1322
01:14:14,280 --> 01:14:16,439
Speaker 1: she said, you know, I'd love to make movies. As

1323
01:14:16,479 --> 01:14:19,280
Speaker 1: a younger person. She had been an assistant to Omar

1324
01:14:19,320 --> 01:14:22,519
Speaker 1: Sharief on the set of Lawrence of Arabia. It was

1325
01:14:22,560 --> 01:14:26,080
Speaker 1: in her blood. So UM I asked her who she

1326
01:14:26,280 --> 01:14:28,000
Speaker 1: thought she'd like to learn from, and it was a

1327
01:14:28,080 --> 01:14:31,160
Speaker 1: young guy named David Putnam. So I found David and

1328
01:14:31,439 --> 01:14:35,120
Speaker 1: hired him. Hired David. They were on a film company.

1329
01:14:36,479 --> 01:14:39,560
Speaker 1: We started a live films in. Our first project was

1330
01:14:39,720 --> 01:14:42,760
Speaker 1: a duelist with FRIDDLEI Scott David produced that the money

1331
01:14:42,800 --> 01:14:45,479
Speaker 1: came from where. Um there was a wonderful man and

1332
01:14:45,600 --> 01:14:49,200
Speaker 1: United artist named David Picker who loved Karen and the

1333
01:14:49,240 --> 01:14:52,439
Speaker 1: way we all did. And Um, David Putnam and I

1334
01:14:52,520 --> 01:14:54,360
Speaker 1: went into his office and we told him the story

1335
01:14:54,400 --> 01:14:57,639
Speaker 1: about Carolin doing the man and we didn't even finish

1336
01:14:57,680 --> 01:14:59,200
Speaker 1: the story and he said, you got a million dollars,

1337
01:14:59,720 --> 01:15:02,080
Speaker 1: do anything you want to do as long as Caroline

1338
01:15:02,439 --> 01:15:06,439
Speaker 1: is involved. So UM, the Duelists ended up being the project,

1339
01:15:07,320 --> 01:15:10,080
Speaker 1: and so we win the con Film Festival with it.

1340
01:15:11,320 --> 01:15:13,599
Speaker 1: Ever make you ever get paid on that? We got

1341
01:15:13,720 --> 01:15:17,240
Speaker 1: some small producers feed it never got released although we

1342
01:15:17,320 --> 01:15:21,120
Speaker 1: won the con Film Festival. It was David Picker at

1343
01:15:21,200 --> 01:15:23,760
Speaker 1: Finance when we won. We brought it back to show

1344
01:15:23,840 --> 01:15:27,360
Speaker 1: him at the studio at Paramount on Merrows. He had

1345
01:15:27,439 --> 01:15:31,160
Speaker 1: been fired that weekend and Michael Eiser and Barry Dilla

1346
01:15:31,240 --> 01:15:34,960
Speaker 1: took over the studio. They came from ABC TV and

1347
01:15:35,000 --> 01:15:36,920
Speaker 1: they watched five minutes of the movie with us. We

1348
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:40,080
Speaker 1: were all in the screening room so proud, Oh my god,

1349
01:15:40,160 --> 01:15:42,200
Speaker 1: that cod We're gonna be these guys. We're gonna rape

1350
01:15:42,240 --> 01:15:45,000
Speaker 1: these guys for our next movie, you know, ovitually thinking

1351
01:15:45,040 --> 01:15:47,880
Speaker 1: of twelve pickured deal. They stopped the movie after ten

1352
01:15:47,960 --> 01:15:50,720
Speaker 1: minutes and got up and said, listen, we come from television.

1353
01:15:51,200 --> 01:15:53,720
Speaker 1: We don't really like this kind of stuff. Um, we're

1354
01:15:53,760 --> 01:15:55,840
Speaker 1: not gonna put it out. And that was it never

1355
01:15:55,880 --> 01:15:58,200
Speaker 1: got to put up. But what played Boston one week?

1356
01:15:58,720 --> 01:16:01,080
Speaker 1: Um so they could get it on paid, you think. Um.

1357
01:16:01,240 --> 01:16:03,840
Speaker 1: But anyway, so I go into this restaurant called the

1358
01:16:03,880 --> 01:16:06,639
Speaker 1: Mulan Dejan south of France. It's where all the big

1359
01:16:06,680 --> 01:16:12,320
Speaker 1: shots are. Clint Eastwood's in there, and uh, Anthony, could

1360
01:16:12,320 --> 01:16:15,400
Speaker 1: I not think of his name? Anthony Quinn, James Coburn,

1361
01:16:15,439 --> 01:16:19,519
Speaker 1: we're all there. Days you could smoke poveratti Boba strives

1362
01:16:19,600 --> 01:16:22,680
Speaker 1: in and we've just won the festival where like you know,

1363
01:16:23,920 --> 01:16:26,920
Speaker 1: and um, I'm looking around. Everybody's smoking cigarettes and their

1364
01:16:27,000 --> 01:16:30,479
Speaker 1: knees are bouncing up and down. They're looking around the room.

1365
01:16:30,720 --> 01:16:34,479
Speaker 1: Nobody's looking really at their table. And I thinking to myself,

1366
01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:36,640
Speaker 1: and I'm at this time, I'm now doing way too

1367
01:16:36,760 --> 01:16:40,720
Speaker 1: much cocaine and everything and drinking too much, and and

1368
01:16:40,840 --> 01:16:43,400
Speaker 1: I look around. I'm a young kid, and I said,

1369
01:16:43,400 --> 01:16:47,120
Speaker 1: wait a second, I'm becoming one of them. My knee

1370
01:16:47,240 --> 01:16:51,840
Speaker 1: is gonna start bouncing and sweating and boom. And I

1371
01:16:52,320 --> 01:16:56,280
Speaker 1: started to really think about it, and into the room

1372
01:16:56,360 --> 01:16:59,800
Speaker 1: walked this elderly white head man in a white suit,

1373
01:17:00,680 --> 01:17:03,679
Speaker 1: and this hush came over the room and James Cockburn

1374
01:17:03,800 --> 01:17:06,880
Speaker 1: jumped up and hugged him, and Anthony Quinn and people

1375
01:17:07,000 --> 01:17:09,680
Speaker 1: waiting in line to hug him. And I said, that's

1376
01:17:09,680 --> 01:17:12,360
Speaker 1: who I want to be. I want to be that calm,

1377
01:17:13,280 --> 01:17:15,120
Speaker 1: the you know, pool in the middle of the storm.

1378
01:17:15,720 --> 01:17:17,519
Speaker 1: Who is this guy? And they told me he owned

1379
01:17:17,560 --> 01:17:20,040
Speaker 1: the place and he was a chef. And I waited

1380
01:17:20,200 --> 01:17:23,160
Speaker 1: till um to everybody left, I said, I take a

1381
01:17:23,240 --> 01:17:25,519
Speaker 1: cab home, and I went over to him. He was

1382
01:17:25,560 --> 01:17:27,920
Speaker 1: alone with that he was having to drink with someone,

1383
01:17:28,640 --> 01:17:30,520
Speaker 1: and I told him I wanted to be his grasshopper.

1384
01:17:30,560 --> 01:17:32,599
Speaker 1: But this I was pretty fucked up at this point,

1385
01:17:33,160 --> 01:17:35,519
Speaker 1: and the grass in the Kung Fu had There was

1386
01:17:35,560 --> 01:17:39,240
Speaker 1: a TV show and David was the grasshopper for this

1387
01:17:39,400 --> 01:17:42,040
Speaker 1: wise man. So I said, I didn't realize he didn't

1388
01:17:42,040 --> 01:17:44,479
Speaker 1: speak English. Wise, I want to be a grasshopper. What

1389
01:17:44,720 --> 01:17:47,920
Speaker 1: is this grasshopper? So I explained to I just wanted

1390
01:17:47,920 --> 01:17:50,080
Speaker 1: to be around them. And he said that you cook,

1391
01:17:50,280 --> 01:17:51,680
Speaker 1: and I said no. He said, well, if you learned

1392
01:17:51,720 --> 01:17:53,519
Speaker 1: to cook, I'll let you work in the kitchen one day.

1393
01:17:54,160 --> 01:17:56,080
Speaker 1: And he gave me the names of some cooking schools

1394
01:17:57,600 --> 01:17:59,639
Speaker 1: and I left and I went to the cooking schools really,

1395
01:17:59,680 --> 01:18:05,200
Speaker 1: which Marcella Hanson in Bologna and um Charlie's in Bangkok

1396
01:18:05,600 --> 01:18:08,000
Speaker 1: at the Oriental. Those are the two names he wrote down.

1397
01:18:08,240 --> 01:18:09,600
Speaker 1: And then I came back. The next year. I was

1398
01:18:09,680 --> 01:18:13,160
Speaker 1: very lucky. I had a moving in the festival. Maybe

1399
01:18:13,200 --> 01:18:15,200
Speaker 1: the next twelve or thirteen years in a row. So

1400
01:18:15,280 --> 01:18:18,120
Speaker 1: I come back. I showed up at the restaurant. Okay,

1401
01:18:18,160 --> 01:18:20,120
Speaker 1: I'm here. I went to the schools and he had

1402
01:18:20,240 --> 01:18:23,800
Speaker 1: no idea who I was at all, and they said, oh,

1403
01:18:23,840 --> 01:18:27,639
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. I'm leaving for Bangkok right after the festival,

1404
01:18:28,360 --> 01:18:30,200
Speaker 1: and I said, can I go with you? And he

1405
01:18:30,240 --> 01:18:33,160
Speaker 1: said yes. And I was with George Griff who actually

1406
01:18:33,240 --> 01:18:35,439
Speaker 1: knew him. So I said, George, come with me, so

1407
01:18:35,640 --> 01:18:38,720
Speaker 1: he'll deal with me. And we went to Bangkok and

1408
01:18:38,800 --> 01:18:43,280
Speaker 1: stayed with him. And that started, UM, this really close

1409
01:18:43,360 --> 01:18:48,160
Speaker 1: relationship where I was his grasshopper for the next twenty years. UM,

1410
01:18:48,439 --> 01:18:50,800
Speaker 1: take his jacket off, put it on, moved the chair out,

1411
01:18:52,479 --> 01:18:54,160
Speaker 1: and I loved it. I mean, I just love that.

1412
01:18:54,240 --> 01:18:57,559
Speaker 1: And UM, at one point he said to me, I said,

1413
01:18:57,600 --> 01:18:59,679
Speaker 1: what can I do for you? You? I can't imagine

1414
01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:04,639
Speaker 1: my life without you. And you said, give my give

1415
01:19:04,680 --> 01:19:08,960
Speaker 1: my profession some dignity. Um. You know, in Europe they

1416
01:19:09,040 --> 01:19:12,639
Speaker 1: treat us like we deserve to be treated. In America,

1417
01:19:12,760 --> 01:19:15,880
Speaker 1: it's and I had gotten to know all the chefs

1418
01:19:15,880 --> 01:19:18,360
Speaker 1: because I was his groupie. They all ad they no

1419
01:19:18,400 --> 01:19:19,880
Speaker 1: one knew who I was. They just knew that I

1420
01:19:20,000 --> 01:19:22,240
Speaker 1: was this guy who pulled his chair out and paid

1421
01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:25,400
Speaker 1: the bills and did everything. So I knew I got

1422
01:19:25,479 --> 01:19:28,200
Speaker 1: to meet all the guys wolf Gang Nobu because wherever

1423
01:19:28,360 --> 01:19:31,719
Speaker 1: Verge was, they were all congregated, so like Chuck Berry

1424
01:19:31,840 --> 01:19:36,479
Speaker 1: was in town for the rock and Rollers. And when

1425
01:19:36,560 --> 01:19:43,280
Speaker 1: they Wolfgang asked me to come over to Spago, and uh,

1426
01:19:43,439 --> 01:19:45,720
Speaker 1: I had told him about Mr Vige asking me to,

1427
01:19:46,360 --> 01:19:49,559
Speaker 1: you know, try and do something maybe change in ninetamics.

1428
01:19:49,600 --> 01:19:53,160
Speaker 1: Nobody was making any money. Nobody had two restaurants. Um,

1429
01:19:53,280 --> 01:19:57,280
Speaker 1: this is there was nobody with two restaurants. Wolf Gang

1430
01:19:57,360 --> 01:19:59,839
Speaker 1: maybe made a hundred thousand, that was probably the biggest

1431
01:20:00,040 --> 01:20:03,120
Speaker 1: the country. And he uh, it was the first year

1432
01:20:03,240 --> 01:20:06,640
Speaker 1: he was doing his festival at Universal, so he had

1433
01:20:06,640 --> 01:20:09,320
Speaker 1: all the chefs in town. And I went over to

1434
01:20:09,400 --> 01:20:14,439
Speaker 1: Spago lunchtime wasn't opening. There were like a Norman rockwall

1435
01:20:14,520 --> 01:20:17,680
Speaker 1: painting of you know, Paul Prude home, Alice Waters um

1436
01:20:18,160 --> 01:20:21,680
Speaker 1: no Bood Daniel and a big banner in the back

1437
01:20:21,760 --> 01:20:27,040
Speaker 1: that just said help. So I decided I sort of

1438
01:20:27,040 --> 01:20:29,200
Speaker 1: owed it to Mr Verge and that I had the

1439
01:20:29,280 --> 01:20:31,640
Speaker 1: skills that I knew how to do. So what did

1440
01:20:31,680 --> 01:20:34,320
Speaker 1: you start to do? Well? At first? I thought about it,

1441
01:20:35,120 --> 01:20:38,920
Speaker 1: and UM, I realized I did some studying. I looked

1442
01:20:38,960 --> 01:20:43,560
Speaker 1: at other art forms that UM that came to prominence.

1443
01:20:44,120 --> 01:20:49,439
Speaker 1: UM golf was was one because McCormick had written a

1444
01:20:49,520 --> 01:20:53,439
Speaker 1: book about how he took it from Yeah. He talked

1445
01:20:53,479 --> 01:20:58,240
Speaker 1: about Arnold Palmer being his first client, driving overnight from

1446
01:20:58,280 --> 01:21:02,519
Speaker 1: tournament to tournament, barely getting gas money, and then he

1447
01:21:02,600 --> 01:21:05,800
Speaker 1: got ABC wide World of Sports Jim McKay to broadcast

1448
01:21:05,880 --> 01:21:10,759
Speaker 1: the tournament. Once he got broadcast everything he started happening

1449
01:21:10,880 --> 01:21:13,880
Speaker 1: fast and now on a Palmer owned the golf courses.

1450
01:21:14,760 --> 01:21:17,280
Speaker 1: So I went to the guys and I at the

1451
01:21:18,160 --> 01:21:20,760
Speaker 1: second meeting, I sent them all the book and then

1452
01:21:20,800 --> 01:21:23,479
Speaker 1: I said, listen, we authorized me to if I can

1453
01:21:23,520 --> 01:21:26,680
Speaker 1: find a broadcast partner, will you authorize me to give

1454
01:21:26,760 --> 01:21:28,960
Speaker 1: up your services for three or four years for free

1455
01:21:29,560 --> 01:21:33,320
Speaker 1: because if you get on TV, we win, game said

1456
01:21:33,400 --> 01:21:36,240
Speaker 1: match it's over. And I was doing everything pro bono.

1457
01:21:36,360 --> 01:21:38,360
Speaker 1: So I just wanted to get out of there, and

1458
01:21:38,520 --> 01:21:40,599
Speaker 1: I got the Food Network. Helped to get the Food

1459
01:21:40,640 --> 01:21:43,160
Speaker 1: Network on the air. The big star, of course, was Emerald,

1460
01:21:43,680 --> 01:21:47,080
Speaker 1: because Emerald was willing. He was the only one who

1461
01:21:47,479 --> 01:21:50,400
Speaker 1: was willing to treat it as a different profession. He

1462
01:21:50,520 --> 01:21:54,240
Speaker 1: went to tutoring school. He he had a videographer's work

1463
01:21:54,320 --> 01:21:58,880
Speaker 1: with him. Um, we developed BAM, we developed a personality

1464
01:21:59,000 --> 01:22:03,560
Speaker 1: for him. It was fit the medium. Um. He was

1465
01:22:03,640 --> 01:22:05,559
Speaker 1: the only one willing to do and everybody else wanted

1466
01:22:05,600 --> 01:22:08,880
Speaker 1: to be who they were and do their cooking. They

1467
01:22:08,920 --> 01:22:12,360
Speaker 1: didn't see it as an entertainment form. Emerald got it eventually.

1468
01:22:12,439 --> 01:22:14,519
Speaker 1: Emerald was the biggest start and then it ended. Why

1469
01:22:14,560 --> 01:22:17,679
Speaker 1: did it end? What the Food TV? The TV Food

1470
01:22:17,760 --> 01:22:22,040
Speaker 1: Network ended not Emerald. They made a decision and I

1471
01:22:22,120 --> 01:22:25,880
Speaker 1: guess in some way rightfully so although it was difficult

1472
01:22:25,960 --> 01:22:29,960
Speaker 1: for the chefs to take that um it was too

1473
01:22:30,680 --> 01:22:34,479
Speaker 1: organic and too real, and that they wanted to move

1474
01:22:34,520 --> 01:22:38,000
Speaker 1: in more towards reality television. And they brought in a

1475
01:22:38,120 --> 01:22:43,840
Speaker 1: new lady to run the network, UM who was completely

1476
01:22:44,120 --> 01:22:46,439
Speaker 1: the felt the people who started a network, Reece and

1477
01:22:46,479 --> 01:22:49,719
Speaker 1: his wife were very vocal about how they hated chefs,

1478
01:22:50,479 --> 01:22:53,360
Speaker 1: like vehemently talked about it. I thought they were like,

1479
01:22:53,479 --> 01:22:56,360
Speaker 1: you know, um, but they they made that a living.

1480
01:22:56,400 --> 01:22:59,960
Speaker 1: This new girl who came in was a TV executive

1481
01:23:00,000 --> 01:23:03,640
Speaker 1: of who was very bizarre. UM. I remember I had this.

1482
01:23:03,880 --> 01:23:05,800
Speaker 1: I think Emerald wrote about it in his book, so

1483
01:23:05,920 --> 01:23:09,840
Speaker 1: I think I can talk about it. But I had

1484
01:23:10,080 --> 01:23:12,680
Speaker 1: stopped managing and I did it all for free. So

1485
01:23:13,200 --> 01:23:14,680
Speaker 1: once it'd worked over, there was a great moment. We

1486
01:23:14,760 --> 01:23:17,600
Speaker 1: were walking that park avenue out of a cab. A

1487
01:23:17,680 --> 01:23:20,680
Speaker 1: guy stuck his head out and said bam, and I

1488
01:23:20,760 --> 01:23:26,840
Speaker 1: third to em and I said, I'm out right. So uh,

1489
01:23:29,320 --> 01:23:30,880
Speaker 1: he said, you gotta come down. We just got a

1490
01:23:30,920 --> 01:23:33,080
Speaker 1: one rating, and that was our dream when we started,

1491
01:23:33,160 --> 01:23:35,000
Speaker 1: was to get a one rating. I left before they

1492
01:23:35,040 --> 01:23:37,439
Speaker 1: got a one rating, so I go down. When I

1493
01:23:37,520 --> 01:23:39,439
Speaker 1: get there, he's just I'm so sorry. I can't go

1494
01:23:39,560 --> 01:23:42,400
Speaker 1: to dinner with it tonight the Neon they just named

1495
01:23:42,439 --> 01:23:44,280
Speaker 1: the new head of the network. She's here tonight. She

1496
01:23:44,360 --> 01:23:46,400
Speaker 1: wants me to go to dinner and she'd love to

1497
01:23:46,479 --> 01:23:48,920
Speaker 1: talk to you. So he brought me over, introduced me.

1498
01:23:49,000 --> 01:23:52,800
Speaker 1: He went to tape the show, and she was very complimentary.

1499
01:23:52,800 --> 01:23:54,680
Speaker 1: I said, listen, can I tell you what I want

1500
01:23:54,680 --> 01:23:57,600
Speaker 1: to talk to Amaron about the night? It's true, you know,

1501
01:23:57,720 --> 01:24:00,200
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell him. He's really going to make a decision. Um,

1502
01:24:00,320 --> 01:24:03,360
Speaker 1: he's got to either be a TV personality or a cook.

1503
01:24:04,479 --> 01:24:07,559
Speaker 1: He's gonna have to give up the restaurants or give

1504
01:24:07,640 --> 01:24:10,439
Speaker 1: up the TV. I'm not going to re up his contract.

1505
01:24:11,400 --> 01:24:13,280
Speaker 1: And I said, you realize you just got one rating

1506
01:24:13,320 --> 01:24:15,560
Speaker 1: this week? Said yeah, but that's and I said, you

1507
01:24:15,640 --> 01:24:18,640
Speaker 1: realize you pay him two hundred dollars a show. How

1508
01:24:18,720 --> 01:24:20,320
Speaker 1: much are you gonna raise that I can't afford to

1509
01:24:20,360 --> 01:24:23,000
Speaker 1: give him a raise? I said, you're gonna actually tell

1510
01:24:23,080 --> 01:24:25,000
Speaker 1: him on the day you got a one rating that

1511
01:24:25,120 --> 01:24:27,839
Speaker 1: he has to give up his income, move his family

1512
01:24:27,880 --> 01:24:32,000
Speaker 1: into like warehouse, um housing. Go on, So go on

1513
01:24:32,160 --> 01:24:35,439
Speaker 1: welfare in order to do your TV shows. You are

1514
01:24:35,520 --> 01:24:37,920
Speaker 1: out of your mind. And they go to a restaurant

1515
01:24:38,760 --> 01:24:42,680
Speaker 1: on Madison Avenue and seventy great with the best bolonaise

1516
01:24:42,720 --> 01:24:46,320
Speaker 1: in the world. By the way, send send something. And

1517
01:24:48,720 --> 01:24:50,719
Speaker 1: I get a call from the major d Paulo Della

1518
01:24:50,760 --> 01:24:53,080
Speaker 1: Pooper at about eleven thirty at night that the police

1519
01:24:53,080 --> 01:24:56,160
Speaker 1: have just come because Emerald threw the table on some woman.

1520
01:24:57,120 --> 01:25:03,120
Speaker 1: Wo He did end up having a talk show right

1521
01:25:03,600 --> 01:25:06,800
Speaker 1: on ABC, which didn't quite work. Okay, So if we

1522
01:25:07,000 --> 01:25:10,960
Speaker 1: pull the curtain back, the problem is this is like

1523
01:25:11,040 --> 01:25:13,479
Speaker 1: reading a self help book. I mean read a self

1524
01:25:13,520 --> 01:25:17,120
Speaker 1: help book and it and there's a huge business in that. Okay,

1525
01:25:17,800 --> 01:25:20,559
Speaker 1: and I remember I would go to the psychiatrist who

1526
01:25:20,560 --> 01:25:23,519
Speaker 1: would reinforce it. The self help book may be good,

1527
01:25:23,720 --> 01:25:25,920
Speaker 1: but you're not the person who fits with that self

1528
01:25:25,960 --> 01:25:31,799
Speaker 1: help book. Okay, so you've obviously been ultra successful. Someone

1529
01:25:32,000 --> 01:25:34,880
Speaker 1: comes to you and says, I want to be you.

1530
01:25:35,680 --> 01:25:38,400
Speaker 1: What do you tell them or evaluate them to steer

1531
01:25:38,439 --> 01:25:40,960
Speaker 1: them on a course so that they will be successful?

1532
01:25:41,200 --> 01:25:43,880
Speaker 1: You know? I tell him that, UM, I wish I

1533
01:25:43,960 --> 01:25:46,920
Speaker 1: had the power to snap my fingers and help them,

1534
01:25:47,640 --> 01:25:50,439
Speaker 1: and that I don't have any answers, but I can

1535
01:25:50,840 --> 01:25:52,959
Speaker 1: tell them some of the things that I think are important.

1536
01:25:53,439 --> 01:25:56,479
Speaker 1: And I think it's waking up earlier and going to

1537
01:25:56,560 --> 01:26:01,000
Speaker 1: sleep later and working during the time Europe UM. I

1538
01:26:01,160 --> 01:26:08,720
Speaker 1: think that UM Embracing failure is really important. UM. And

1539
01:26:09,200 --> 01:26:12,799
Speaker 1: I try to then hone in onto what their specific

1540
01:26:12,960 --> 01:26:16,639
Speaker 1: need is, but not to be scared of failure. Live

1541
01:26:16,720 --> 01:26:20,000
Speaker 1: at your dreams. I always tell them, you are going

1542
01:26:20,120 --> 01:26:25,120
Speaker 1: to die. You're going to die. Make the time between

1543
01:26:25,200 --> 01:26:28,800
Speaker 1: now and you're dying really important. Do what you want

1544
01:26:28,840 --> 01:26:31,120
Speaker 1: to do, don't do something out of fear of failure.

1545
01:26:32,880 --> 01:26:37,320
Speaker 1: Lived for the the excitement of success, and if you fail,

1546
01:26:37,560 --> 01:26:40,040
Speaker 1: that just gets you one inch closer to making it.

1547
01:26:40,720 --> 01:26:43,160
Speaker 1: And if you're if the person who's calling me is

1548
01:26:43,240 --> 01:26:45,800
Speaker 1: trying to be a successful musician or trying to be

1549
01:26:45,840 --> 01:26:48,519
Speaker 1: an actor, or trying to be a player, right, I

1550
01:26:48,680 --> 01:26:53,360
Speaker 1: remind them that every rejection is one step closer to acceptance.

1551
01:26:54,120 --> 01:26:57,200
Speaker 1: And any star they talked to in any field has

1552
01:26:57,240 --> 01:27:00,720
Speaker 1: been rejected for years before they become famous. Well, now,

1553
01:27:00,920 --> 01:27:03,400
Speaker 1: the barrier to entry and so many things is very low.

1554
01:27:04,320 --> 01:27:08,680
Speaker 1: And I certainly hear from people who believe in themselves,

1555
01:27:09,120 --> 01:27:11,760
Speaker 1: but if you are exposed to the work, they could

1556
01:27:11,800 --> 01:27:16,400
Speaker 1: never make it. Yeah, it's a reality. Okay, So you

1557
01:27:16,479 --> 01:27:18,880
Speaker 1: know on some level failure is good for a certain

1558
01:27:19,000 --> 01:27:22,080
Speaker 1: subset of the overall population. Then there's other mean, I

1559
01:27:22,160 --> 01:27:26,080
Speaker 1: believe Bob Dylan from a dear loan landlord. It's each

1560
01:27:26,120 --> 01:27:28,479
Speaker 1: of us has his own special gift and you know

1561
01:27:28,600 --> 01:27:31,080
Speaker 1: that was meant to be true. And if you don't

1562
01:27:31,160 --> 01:27:34,400
Speaker 1: underestimate me, I won't underestimate you. But you have to

1563
01:27:34,520 --> 01:27:37,880
Speaker 1: find out what it is that you do well. When

1564
01:27:37,920 --> 01:27:39,760
Speaker 1: I guess when I say failure, I mean on the

1565
01:27:39,960 --> 01:27:42,960
Speaker 1: on your journey. So if you're a manager of a

1566
01:27:43,080 --> 01:27:45,960
Speaker 1: young artist, don't be scared to do the wrong thing,

1567
01:27:46,439 --> 01:27:50,280
Speaker 1: but do something that's where I mean failure. I don't.

1568
01:27:50,600 --> 01:27:53,040
Speaker 1: That's sort of where I focus what you're basically saying,

1569
01:27:53,160 --> 01:27:56,839
Speaker 1: don't be paralyzed by the situation. If you were twenty

1570
01:27:56,920 --> 01:27:59,519
Speaker 1: two today, do you think you would take the same path,

1571
01:28:00,840 --> 01:28:02,880
Speaker 1: I have no idea. I think my path was so

1572
01:28:04,160 --> 01:28:09,680
Speaker 1: a a result of opportunities that came rather than calculated that.

1573
01:28:09,800 --> 01:28:12,320
Speaker 1: I can't tell you yes, but you took advantage of

1574
01:28:12,360 --> 01:28:15,080
Speaker 1: the opportunities. Yes, when you first of all, you were

1575
01:28:15,120 --> 01:28:19,280
Speaker 1: willing to quit the job with the probation the probation

1576
01:28:19,360 --> 01:28:24,200
Speaker 1: department be I don't care who you are. It is

1577
01:28:24,280 --> 01:28:27,479
Speaker 1: not easy to ingratiate oneself with famous people. It is

1578
01:28:27,520 --> 01:28:30,639
Speaker 1: not there on guard. They've been hit up a million times.

1579
01:28:30,920 --> 01:28:32,719
Speaker 1: So not only did you have a product they wanted,

1580
01:28:32,760 --> 01:28:35,280
Speaker 1: you obviously have the gift of gab whatever that they

1581
01:28:35,360 --> 01:28:38,800
Speaker 1: liked him. Okay, so these are certain skills that not

1582
01:28:39,000 --> 01:28:43,800
Speaker 1: everybody has. Well, I always had. Service was part of

1583
01:28:43,840 --> 01:28:46,519
Speaker 1: my aim before I realized that. And in the life

1584
01:28:46,560 --> 01:28:49,639
Speaker 1: of an artist, if you do things for him, that's big.

1585
01:28:50,120 --> 01:28:53,040
Speaker 1: So I naturally would like, you know, drive him somewhere

1586
01:28:53,080 --> 01:28:56,360
Speaker 1: if they needed to be driven. Nobody had cars except me, um,

1587
01:28:56,479 --> 01:28:58,560
Speaker 1: I would drive him home if they were drunk, not

1588
01:28:58,760 --> 01:29:02,720
Speaker 1: because they were are, but because I could in the

1589
01:29:02,760 --> 01:29:05,200
Speaker 1: back of your mind, though you thought this will bond

1590
01:29:05,280 --> 01:29:09,599
Speaker 1: me to this person. I wouldn't say. Maybe some self

1591
01:29:09,720 --> 01:29:12,320
Speaker 1: interest in everything you do, I think, Um, but it

1592
01:29:12,400 --> 01:29:14,640
Speaker 1: was just my natural. It was always my natural. My

1593
01:29:14,760 --> 01:29:17,920
Speaker 1: dad was very much like that. UM, and I think

1594
01:29:17,960 --> 01:29:21,519
Speaker 1: I I I'm lucky enough to have some of it

1595
01:29:21,720 --> 01:29:23,920
Speaker 1: rubbed it off. Okay, so you've obviously been let go

1596
01:29:24,080 --> 01:29:27,479
Speaker 1: by a certain number of clients. Okay, and Murray and

1597
01:29:27,640 --> 01:29:30,799
Speaker 1: Murray was really any Loggins and Murray? And what happened

1598
01:29:30,840 --> 01:29:32,920
Speaker 1: with both of those how today? And Murray I never

1599
01:29:33,000 --> 01:29:35,400
Speaker 1: knew until I read her book, which was what which

1600
01:29:35,520 --> 01:29:38,080
Speaker 1: was really interesting. She said that they realized that they

1601
01:29:38,200 --> 01:29:40,280
Speaker 1: needed something if they were going to make it big,

1602
01:29:41,479 --> 01:29:44,800
Speaker 1: and they heard about me, and they knew that I

1603
01:29:44,840 --> 01:29:48,960
Speaker 1: didn't make them sign contracts. So her and her manager

1604
01:29:49,000 --> 01:29:52,360
Speaker 1: at the time decided they would hire me, learn everything

1605
01:29:52,400 --> 01:29:54,280
Speaker 1: they could, get to the goal they wanted, and then

1606
01:29:54,360 --> 01:29:58,040
Speaker 1: fire me. And that's what they did. So when she

1607
01:29:58,120 --> 01:30:00,560
Speaker 1: did fire you decades back, you must have said, I

1608
01:30:00,560 --> 01:30:02,040
Speaker 1: have no idea what's going on here? I didn't care.

1609
01:30:02,080 --> 01:30:05,280
Speaker 1: I was it didn't matter and what app with Kenny Loggins.

1610
01:30:05,800 --> 01:30:11,200
Speaker 1: Kenny Loggins it's um I can't actually talk about, but

1611
01:30:11,320 --> 01:30:15,400
Speaker 1: it was personal. It was you had done something he

1612
01:30:15,560 --> 01:30:19,720
Speaker 1: no no, he UM wanted me to do something I

1613
01:30:19,800 --> 01:30:22,800
Speaker 1: was uncomfortable doing. And we're still great friends, okay, and

1614
01:30:22,880 --> 01:30:25,880
Speaker 1: then you parted ways. A guy from my office I

1615
01:30:25,920 --> 01:30:28,599
Speaker 1: think went off to management. UM. I just saw him.

1616
01:30:28,640 --> 01:30:30,920
Speaker 1: Were just how Hi up at Botle Rock, which was

1617
01:30:31,000 --> 01:30:35,200
Speaker 1: really great. So in the time you have left, what

1618
01:30:35,280 --> 01:30:38,559
Speaker 1: would you like to accomplish? If anything? I have no idea.

1619
01:30:39,240 --> 01:30:44,479
Speaker 1: I'm really UM. I get excited when I can use

1620
01:30:44,600 --> 01:30:49,519
Speaker 1: my skills that I've hoped to do something that maybe matters. UM.

1621
01:30:50,439 --> 01:30:53,120
Speaker 1: So this Saturday in Maui, I put together a free

1622
01:30:53,160 --> 01:30:56,760
Speaker 1: concert for the students. Kids came and it was to

1623
01:30:56,840 --> 01:31:03,040
Speaker 1: support the Florida students and it was Concert for Our

1624
01:31:03,080 --> 01:31:07,839
Speaker 1: Lives with Jack Johnson, Willie Nelson, Chris Christofferson, Steven Tyler,

1625
01:31:08,920 --> 01:31:12,760
Speaker 1: Lily Miolay named Willie Kay who was amazing there and

1626
01:31:13,320 --> 01:31:18,320
Speaker 1: I think ten students, speakers, UM and Senator Corono, Representative

1627
01:31:18,320 --> 01:31:23,320
Speaker 1: gavern Um. The Maui News wrote a beautiful review that

1628
01:31:24,160 --> 01:31:25,760
Speaker 1: sort of brought a tear to my eye. I felt

1629
01:31:25,800 --> 01:31:29,759
Speaker 1: so proud. But it was last night at the mac.

1630
01:31:31,400 --> 01:31:37,519
Speaker 1: Hundred people entered the the concert an hour and a

1631
01:31:37,600 --> 01:31:43,880
Speaker 1: half later, people whose lives had been changed permanently. That's

1632
01:31:44,040 --> 01:31:47,120
Speaker 1: that's a review. You don't usually got left the concert.

1633
01:31:48,080 --> 01:31:51,160
Speaker 1: Never on the island of Maui, as our feeling of

1634
01:31:51,240 --> 01:31:55,760
Speaker 1: Ohanna been stronger. Um. And that really was touching to

1635
01:31:55,840 --> 01:31:58,519
Speaker 1: me because that's what we tried for. Now you're on Maui.

1636
01:31:58,720 --> 01:32:01,200
Speaker 1: How much of the year I lived there, But yeah,

1637
01:32:01,240 --> 01:32:03,519
Speaker 1: but we all try today nine months a year, nine

1638
01:32:03,560 --> 01:32:05,519
Speaker 1: months a year. So what does the typical day look like?

1639
01:32:05,880 --> 01:32:09,360
Speaker 1: It's beautiful, Um, the weather is beautiful. Um. I wake

1640
01:32:09,439 --> 01:32:12,559
Speaker 1: up in the morning, have a cup of coffee. Um,

1641
01:32:12,840 --> 01:32:15,720
Speaker 1: where surrong most of the day. But I put on

1642
01:32:15,800 --> 01:32:18,120
Speaker 1: a bathing So now to take a walk, so I yeah,

1643
01:32:18,120 --> 01:32:21,120
Speaker 1: that's a my emails. Then I take a walk down

1644
01:32:21,160 --> 01:32:23,280
Speaker 1: the beach. If there's somebody around that I know, they

1645
01:32:23,360 --> 01:32:26,559
Speaker 1: walk with me and come back to some more emails.

1646
01:32:28,240 --> 01:32:31,439
Speaker 1: And then there's always some project that takes some time,

1647
01:32:31,479 --> 01:32:34,640
Speaker 1: whether it's Alice's new tour, I'm working with the Hollywood Vampires.

1648
01:32:34,720 --> 01:32:37,040
Speaker 1: We we sort of put that together, so we work

1649
01:32:37,080 --> 01:32:40,360
Speaker 1: on that, think about what I'm gonna have for dinner.

1650
01:32:40,720 --> 01:32:43,679
Speaker 1: That's usually the first I get in the jacuzzi after

1651
01:32:43,760 --> 01:32:46,040
Speaker 1: my walk and think about dinner. This is what time

1652
01:32:46,080 --> 01:32:49,280
Speaker 1: of day now we're at about seven o'clock. Um, some

1653
01:32:49,439 --> 01:32:55,040
Speaker 1: poor coffee, too much coffee. Um, smoke a joiner to um,

1654
01:32:57,000 --> 01:32:59,600
Speaker 1: do my thinking, because that's that's sort of what I

1655
01:32:59,680 --> 01:33:02,040
Speaker 1: try do for Alice and everyone, to get ahead of

1656
01:33:02,080 --> 01:33:06,080
Speaker 1: them for a year and visualize and try and manifest

1657
01:33:06,160 --> 01:33:09,120
Speaker 1: what I want to see and then try and create, um,

1658
01:33:09,840 --> 01:33:12,479
Speaker 1: what I want. And then I usually go play some golf.

1659
01:33:12,920 --> 01:33:16,920
Speaker 1: I'm not good at all. What's your handicap? I'm a

1660
01:33:17,040 --> 01:33:19,880
Speaker 1: fifteen it is probably a twenty. Now I'm not terrible,

1661
01:33:21,200 --> 01:33:23,759
Speaker 1: and I play three I know gambo, don't keep scoring,

1662
01:33:24,360 --> 01:33:26,960
Speaker 1: play five six holes and then have dinner. And we

1663
01:33:27,479 --> 01:33:33,040
Speaker 1: have such an amazing community on Maui of um, both

1664
01:33:33,200 --> 01:33:38,479
Speaker 1: visiting people because everybody visits, and people from my world

1665
01:33:38,880 --> 01:33:42,240
Speaker 1: of experience who lived there. So Steven Tyler lives there,

1666
01:33:42,320 --> 01:33:47,719
Speaker 1: Mick Fleetwood lives there, Um, Sammy Hagar, Owen Wilson, Woody Harrelson,

1667
01:33:48,400 --> 01:33:52,760
Speaker 1: and they're just people on Maui and we hang and

1668
01:33:53,280 --> 01:33:56,920
Speaker 1: they play music and backyards and we have good meals

1669
01:33:57,040 --> 01:33:59,439
Speaker 1: and we do great stuff for the community. How how

1670
01:33:59,520 --> 01:34:02,240
Speaker 1: often are you seeing these people if you're that's my life.

1671
01:34:03,400 --> 01:34:06,720
Speaker 1: We did seventy birthday party for Stephen Saturday night. I

1672
01:34:06,760 --> 01:34:11,639
Speaker 1: helped put together. Um. I don't think a week doesn't

1673
01:34:11,680 --> 01:34:13,760
Speaker 1: go by where I'm not just involved with him. We

1674
01:34:13,840 --> 01:34:17,640
Speaker 1: have dinners and we hang out Stephen. All all of

1675
01:34:17,720 --> 01:34:20,360
Speaker 1: them care about MAUI. Stephen just went to the Drug

1676
01:34:20,439 --> 01:34:25,560
Speaker 1: Court for graduation unannounced, gave the whole speech which was

1677
01:34:25,680 --> 01:34:29,240
Speaker 1: just so beautiful. Um. Mc fleetwood has a club there

1678
01:34:29,960 --> 01:34:32,160
Speaker 1: where he plays whenever he's in town. He plays a

1679
01:34:32,240 --> 01:34:35,280
Speaker 1: couple of nights a week. This week he had Neil

1680
01:34:35,360 --> 01:34:38,879
Speaker 1: Finn with him. Yeah, who came and did our concert Saturday.

1681
01:34:39,640 --> 01:34:44,760
Speaker 1: Hey now hey now, great song, great guy. Um. So

1682
01:34:45,040 --> 01:34:48,880
Speaker 1: it's just it's an amazing community. You never get Island fever,

1683
01:34:49,080 --> 01:34:51,640
Speaker 1: never for a second. Ever. When did you move there?

1684
01:34:51,920 --> 01:34:56,080
Speaker 1: Moved there? I'm in the same house. So what you

1685
01:34:56,120 --> 01:34:59,240
Speaker 1: would say is your expertise is thinking. Probably would say

1686
01:34:59,320 --> 01:35:02,040
Speaker 1: my uh, because there are things we didn't cover here

1687
01:35:02,080 --> 01:35:03,880
Speaker 1: that I'm aware of. You certainly had a number of

1688
01:35:03,920 --> 01:35:07,080
Speaker 1: publicity stunts, whether it be with stuff in London with

1689
01:35:07,160 --> 01:35:10,439
Speaker 1: Alice Cooper or Luther, Van and Ross and the women's

1690
01:35:10,479 --> 01:35:14,839
Speaker 1: on these concerts, etcetera. To what degree are those stunts

1691
01:35:14,960 --> 01:35:17,040
Speaker 1: that has a negative connotation? But I don't mean in

1692
01:35:17,080 --> 01:35:20,360
Speaker 1: a negative way, integral to the success of these I think,

1693
01:35:20,640 --> 01:35:23,000
Speaker 1: I think really important. I think that's why I always

1694
01:35:23,040 --> 01:35:26,760
Speaker 1: had great relationships with the artists, because I mean, let's

1695
01:35:26,760 --> 01:35:31,360
Speaker 1: take Teddy for an example. So how do I separate

1696
01:35:31,479 --> 01:35:37,479
Speaker 1: Teddy from Luther? How do I Teddy from Luther? How

1697
01:35:37,520 --> 01:35:42,120
Speaker 1: do I define to why I'm at a point in

1698
01:35:42,160 --> 01:35:46,439
Speaker 1: his career. I have every black woman in America getting

1699
01:35:46,479 --> 01:35:50,000
Speaker 1: wet panties everyone? How do I move them to the

1700
01:35:50,040 --> 01:35:52,760
Speaker 1: white arena? I have a black elvis? How do I

1701
01:35:52,920 --> 01:35:59,720
Speaker 1: move them? Um? So I have you joined it to

1702
01:36:00,000 --> 01:36:02,680
Speaker 1: sit in my hot tub? I think about, Okay, what

1703
01:36:02,840 --> 01:36:06,599
Speaker 1: would I like to see? What would tell people out

1704
01:36:06,680 --> 01:36:10,240
Speaker 1: there who maybe you're peeking in what we well? What

1705
01:36:10,360 --> 01:36:12,720
Speaker 1: about if he did a concert and it was just

1706
01:36:12,960 --> 01:36:16,320
Speaker 1: women in the audience and I can get do it

1707
01:36:16,560 --> 01:36:19,479
Speaker 1: at a big enough level that people white women will

1708
01:36:19,600 --> 01:36:23,000
Speaker 1: hear that there's this artist that those shows for women only.

1709
01:36:23,400 --> 01:36:26,240
Speaker 1: What the hell is going on? So I go back

1710
01:36:26,280 --> 01:36:29,080
Speaker 1: to Teddy and I say, I think I know how

1711
01:36:29,120 --> 01:36:33,040
Speaker 1: to get this across women only. And he looks at

1712
01:36:33,080 --> 01:36:35,479
Speaker 1: me like I'm crazy and he can we do it?

1713
01:36:35,560 --> 01:36:38,719
Speaker 1: And as lawyer tells us, we can't do it because

1714
01:36:38,920 --> 01:36:43,280
Speaker 1: it's discrimination lawyers. He can't just sell to uh. And

1715
01:36:43,360 --> 01:36:44,920
Speaker 1: I said, no, we'll sell to anybody. I work my

1716
01:36:45,000 --> 01:36:47,840
Speaker 1: way around that. I get another lawyer's opinion. I go

1717
01:36:47,920 --> 01:36:49,599
Speaker 1: to a record company. You can't do it, will kill

1718
01:36:49,680 --> 01:36:53,400
Speaker 1: his career. Every man in the world burned the records. No, no,

1719
01:36:53,479 --> 01:36:56,720
Speaker 1: I'm doing it. You know this is gonna work. Um.

1720
01:36:57,240 --> 01:36:59,120
Speaker 1: And then I manifest what do I want those women

1721
01:36:59,200 --> 01:37:03,080
Speaker 1: doing on them? Like going crazy? So I make chocolate

1722
01:37:03,120 --> 01:37:06,479
Speaker 1: Teddy Bear lollypops up to take a lick on. But

1723
01:37:06,600 --> 01:37:09,519
Speaker 1: that's all because I thought about it. What do I

1724
01:37:09,680 --> 01:37:15,880
Speaker 1: want to see that day? And then manifested to be reality, um,

1725
01:37:16,600 --> 01:37:21,240
Speaker 1: which is you know, that's what I did as a manager.

1726
01:37:21,520 --> 01:37:23,200
Speaker 1: So I was never the best of making the most

1727
01:37:23,280 --> 01:37:27,320
Speaker 1: money on that path, but I was good at thinking

1728
01:37:27,439 --> 01:37:31,760
Speaker 1: of So how do let me Luther? So how do

1729
01:37:31,840 --> 01:37:34,840
Speaker 1: you do that for Luther? You know, how do I

1730
01:37:34,920 --> 01:37:39,680
Speaker 1: define where Teddy is pure sex? It's women licking lollypops,

1731
01:37:39,760 --> 01:37:45,479
Speaker 1: It's just pure unadulterated sex. Luther is romance? How do

1732
01:37:45,640 --> 01:37:49,320
Speaker 1: I how do I do the same thing for romance?

1733
01:37:50,160 --> 01:37:52,559
Speaker 1: What we ended up doing was in the top ten

1734
01:37:52,680 --> 01:37:57,240
Speaker 1: markets in America. You got married by Luther on the air,

1735
01:37:59,720 --> 01:38:02,080
Speaker 1: the the priest marriage that he sank to you on

1736
01:38:02,200 --> 01:38:04,280
Speaker 1: the air, And how many people lined up for that?

1737
01:38:04,520 --> 01:38:07,680
Speaker 1: Oh my god. But his songs became the biggest thing

1738
01:38:07,720 --> 01:38:10,000
Speaker 1: in weddings for the next two years. And it's a

1739
01:38:10,080 --> 01:38:15,640
Speaker 1: fine romance as opposed to sex. So it became I

1740
01:38:15,800 --> 01:38:18,360
Speaker 1: was very proud of that. In today's god confidence world,

1741
01:38:18,520 --> 01:38:20,800
Speaker 1: do you think you can achieve the same thing with publicity?

1742
01:38:21,520 --> 01:38:26,960
Speaker 1: Look at I mean I this may be completely off base,

1743
01:38:27,360 --> 01:38:30,120
Speaker 1: and I'm sorry if it is, but I thought the

1744
01:38:30,280 --> 01:38:35,800
Speaker 1: Elevator incident with Beyonce and jay Z, I knew there

1745
01:38:35,880 --> 01:38:37,560
Speaker 1: was gonna be two or three albums out of it.

1746
01:38:38,400 --> 01:38:41,600
Speaker 1: Now I may be wrong, but to me, that was

1747
01:38:41,680 --> 01:38:45,360
Speaker 1: one of the great ones. Janet Jackson's top coming. Well,

1748
01:38:45,360 --> 01:38:47,080
Speaker 1: what do you think that the thinking was? I did

1749
01:38:47,160 --> 01:38:49,639
Speaker 1: that with Rackel. That was how I got around HBO

1750
01:38:49,760 --> 01:38:52,880
Speaker 1: many many years before one of the one ofver straps

1751
01:38:52,920 --> 01:38:55,920
Speaker 1: we guaranteed would sort of fall off. It wasn't the

1752
01:38:55,960 --> 01:38:58,400
Speaker 1: first time. Um, but no, I think it's being done.

1753
01:38:58,560 --> 01:39:00,960
Speaker 1: I think you know, this guy's like Scooter Braun, who

1754
01:39:01,040 --> 01:39:04,800
Speaker 1: are so brilliant, who just get it so good. You know,

1755
01:39:05,800 --> 01:39:10,559
Speaker 1: Arian the Grandes tragedy was one of the brilliant management things.

1756
01:39:10,800 --> 01:39:14,240
Speaker 1: How do you turn that horrible incident into a career

1757
01:39:14,360 --> 01:39:17,560
Speaker 1: builder and a win win for everybody? And that's what

1758
01:39:17,640 --> 01:39:20,760
Speaker 1: a great manager does. You take the failure in the

1759
01:39:21,400 --> 01:39:23,560
Speaker 1: horrible and you turn into something strong. And do you

1760
01:39:23,640 --> 01:39:27,519
Speaker 1: think the acts are grateful? I think for the most part, yeah,

1761
01:39:28,040 --> 01:39:29,680
Speaker 1: I think for the most part. You know, they get

1762
01:39:29,760 --> 01:39:36,120
Speaker 1: reputations that really aren't deserved. And I think, um, if

1763
01:39:36,200 --> 01:39:40,000
Speaker 1: you're if if you're do an honest, good job. Um,

1764
01:39:40,400 --> 01:39:43,000
Speaker 1: you know you see guys like irving him with acts

1765
01:39:43,040 --> 01:39:46,320
Speaker 1: for thirty years, I'm scooed it will be with his

1766
01:39:46,439 --> 01:39:50,840
Speaker 1: actual life. Then never let him go. Um. I was

1767
01:39:50,920 --> 01:39:53,600
Speaker 1: with all my acts except for a couple forever. I

1768
01:39:53,680 --> 01:39:56,680
Speaker 1: think if they see that you really, you know, not

1769
01:39:56,800 --> 01:39:59,880
Speaker 1: just getting him a Coca Cola, But if they if

1770
01:40:00,000 --> 01:40:04,679
Speaker 1: they perceive that they need you, you're in a pretty

1771
01:40:04,720 --> 01:40:07,160
Speaker 1: good shape. And then if you're happy to be, if

1772
01:40:07,200 --> 01:40:10,000
Speaker 1: your intentions are right and they feel they need you.

1773
01:40:10,479 --> 01:40:13,120
Speaker 1: You have the basis of a very strong relationship, and

1774
01:40:13,280 --> 01:40:15,759
Speaker 1: need is a big part of it. And the difference

1775
01:40:15,840 --> 01:40:20,240
Speaker 1: between the great managers, in my opinion, and and the

1776
01:40:20,360 --> 01:40:22,880
Speaker 1: managers who are just there are the ones where an

1777
01:40:22,960 --> 01:40:27,080
Speaker 1: artist perceives they need them. Yeah, yea are on a

1778
01:40:27,120 --> 01:40:31,160
Speaker 1: ground they could have been a disaster. It was a triumph. Um.

1779
01:40:32,240 --> 01:40:37,240
Speaker 1: So and so in terms of legacy, does that concern

1780
01:40:37,320 --> 01:40:39,439
Speaker 1: you at all? And what are you gonna do with

1781
01:40:39,479 --> 01:40:41,280
Speaker 1: all that said? I made I say that, but I

1782
01:40:41,400 --> 01:40:43,160
Speaker 1: have an ego like everybody else. What are you gonna

1783
01:40:43,200 --> 01:40:46,680
Speaker 1: do with the money you have? Um? Probably spend it

1784
01:40:46,760 --> 01:40:50,200
Speaker 1: all my one. I don't have a lot of things

1785
01:40:50,280 --> 01:40:53,640
Speaker 1: that I I fear and one is it the I'm

1786
01:40:53,680 --> 01:40:55,920
Speaker 1: gonna have wine left in my cellar when I die.

1787
01:40:57,560 --> 01:41:00,559
Speaker 1: If we started tonight, you know, I don't get a lot.

1788
01:41:01,160 --> 01:41:02,439
Speaker 1: I know. I know a lot of people say the

1789
01:41:02,520 --> 01:41:04,200
Speaker 1: same thing. But if we started tonight, we couldn't work

1790
01:41:04,200 --> 01:41:06,920
Speaker 1: our way all the way through. It's a problem. I'm

1791
01:41:06,960 --> 01:41:09,519
Speaker 1: gonna have to live, log down and other things personal

1792
01:41:09,640 --> 01:41:12,479
Speaker 1: irrelevant of business that you would like to do or

1793
01:41:12,520 --> 01:41:16,240
Speaker 1: achieve that you haven't done yet. Um. I always wanted

1794
01:41:16,280 --> 01:41:17,840
Speaker 1: to have a child in my own I have for

1795
01:41:18,000 --> 01:41:22,280
Speaker 1: adopted a little bit past the point if you met

1796
01:41:22,280 --> 01:41:25,439
Speaker 1: a woman of child bearing age at seventy two, would

1797
01:41:25,439 --> 01:41:27,879
Speaker 1: you have a child? It was the right relationship. Absolutely,

1798
01:41:28,120 --> 01:41:29,920
Speaker 1: you know a lot of this, And if I'm shooting bullets,

1799
01:41:31,439 --> 01:41:34,800
Speaker 1: what statistics are that most of the birth defects come

1800
01:41:34,880 --> 01:41:36,800
Speaker 1: from older men, from men as opposed to with a

1801
01:41:36,920 --> 01:41:41,920
Speaker 1: problem with that absolutely hesitatement. But you know, one of

1802
01:41:41,960 --> 01:41:44,120
Speaker 1: my heroes in life is normally and he had a

1803
01:41:44,200 --> 01:41:47,680
Speaker 1: child at eight, so as did what's his name, the

1804
01:41:48,320 --> 01:41:51,920
Speaker 1: close to a seventy eight the Broadway actor Tony whatever is, yeah,

1805
01:41:52,320 --> 01:41:55,800
Speaker 1: from the odd couple, And uh so, anything specifically you

1806
01:41:55,880 --> 01:41:57,840
Speaker 1: need to say before we wrap it up here, now,

1807
01:41:57,960 --> 01:42:02,479
Speaker 1: just what that's it's I live in and I'm really

1808
01:42:02,640 --> 01:42:06,000
Speaker 1: distant from the community that I grew up in the

1809
01:42:06,120 --> 01:42:09,760
Speaker 1: music community, and your stuff is fantastic because it keeps

1810
01:42:09,800 --> 01:42:12,040
Speaker 1: me plugged in. So I am a huge fan that's

1811
01:42:12,120 --> 01:42:15,280
Speaker 1: so happy to be here. I actually just so everyone knows,

1812
01:42:15,439 --> 01:42:18,800
Speaker 1: I called him exactly. So you know, as I say,

1813
01:42:19,160 --> 01:42:21,920
Speaker 1: it's interesting because there's a lot of stuff that as

1814
01:42:21,960 --> 01:42:23,880
Speaker 1: they say, we have the movie and there's a lot

1815
01:42:23,920 --> 01:42:25,840
Speaker 1: of things I would have liked to have covered, but

1816
01:42:25,960 --> 01:42:29,080
Speaker 1: we have a limited amount of time. Blonde okay, Blondie

1817
01:42:29,360 --> 01:42:33,200
Speaker 1: and the videos. Who paid for those? Um, the record

1818
01:42:33,240 --> 01:42:37,600
Speaker 1: company paid from Chrysalis was very supportive. Okay. So traditionally,

1819
01:42:38,360 --> 01:42:41,080
Speaker 1: as uh, someone whose name I won't mention, who ran

1820
01:42:41,160 --> 01:42:43,800
Speaker 1: one of these record companies said, the record major label

1821
01:42:43,840 --> 01:42:47,479
Speaker 1: model is theft. Okay, so there are certain Alan Klein

1822
01:42:47,600 --> 01:42:50,960
Speaker 1: being a good example, he would specialize on extracting money

1823
01:42:51,479 --> 01:42:54,599
Speaker 1: from the label. To what degree were you in your career?

1824
01:42:54,800 --> 01:42:58,600
Speaker 1: Hardass that way? Um, not my strongest thing, but I

1825
01:42:58,600 --> 01:43:01,320
Speaker 1: would try and get a lawyer involved who could really help,

1826
01:43:01,400 --> 01:43:06,280
Speaker 1: because beating him up for creativity stuff they cost money. Yes,

1827
01:43:06,960 --> 01:43:08,880
Speaker 1: beating him up for the big check. I used to

1828
01:43:08,960 --> 01:43:10,519
Speaker 1: try and get a lawyer to do if I could

1829
01:43:11,000 --> 01:43:14,080
Speaker 1: continue my fight. Okay, there's so much to talk about,

1830
01:43:14,160 --> 01:43:16,840
Speaker 1: but that's the most we're gonna talk about today. Chef

1831
01:43:17,000 --> 01:43:19,840
Speaker 1: is so wonderful to have you here. Pleasure Okay, until

1832
01:43:19,920 --> 01:43:23,280
Speaker 1: next time, Chef Gordon on the Bob Left Sets podcast.

1833
01:43:28,000 --> 01:43:30,240
Speaker 1: That wraps up this week's episode of the Bob Left

1834
01:43:30,280 --> 01:43:33,960
Speaker 1: Sets podcast, recorded here at the tune In Studios in Venice, California.

1835
01:43:34,439 --> 01:43:37,120
Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Chef Gordon about

1836
01:43:37,160 --> 01:43:40,280
Speaker 1: his roller coaster ride of a career and the music industry,

1837
01:43:40,560 --> 01:43:44,759
Speaker 1: film and cuisine has always I welcome your feedback. Email

1838
01:43:44,880 --> 01:43:47,920
Speaker 1: me at Bob at left sets dot com. Until next time,

1839
01:43:48,240 --> 01:44:04,440
Speaker 1: I'm Bob left Sets. Me reason, I don't know me exactly?

1840
01:44:05,160 --> 01:44:12,599
Speaker 1: Why must be its out of the season filling dry