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Speaker 1: Hey guys. Is Shagart Ebinez here from the Professional Homegirl podcast,

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Speaker 1: and on this week's episode, we're taking a deep dive

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Speaker 1: into the history of the show. A significant part of

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Speaker 1: New York City landscape. Nested along the iconic stretch of

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Speaker 1: West fourteenth Street in Manhattan's Meatpacking District, this area holds

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Speaker 1: a unique place in time, serving as a community hub

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Speaker 1: where many transgender individuals engage in sex work, foraging connections

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Speaker 1: in the face of limited societal support. Joining us as

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Speaker 1: a special guest is someone with firsthand experience sharing her

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Speaker 1: personal journey as a sex worker on the show. She

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Speaker 1: not only opens up about her own story, but also

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Speaker 1: invites us into a broader conversation exploring the diverse love

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Speaker 1: and experiences shared by individuals who have walked the role.

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Speaker 1: So get ready for a compelling dialogue that goes beyond

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Speaker 1: the surface of this historical neighborhood. Its starting now. To

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Speaker 1: my guests, we've been kicking, but thank you so much

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Speaker 1: for coming on the show. How you doing. How you

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Speaker 1: feeling good?

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Speaker 2: Good? That's feel good right now? Good? Good?

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Speaker 1: You look happy.

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Speaker 2: I am happy. Actually, I think I'm the happiest I've

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Speaker 2: been in a very long time.

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Speaker 1: I can tell, I can tell, why is it?

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Speaker 2: Oh wow, just so much is going on. I mean, like,

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Speaker 2: we finally released our film on HBO after spending two

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Speaker 2: and a half years in my dungeon. You know, I

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Speaker 2: got to enjoy this summer because last summer I didn't.

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Speaker 2: I was like we were in the trenches. That's what

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Speaker 2: I call it, because my room is little, only a

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Speaker 2: trench because I'm in the basement. I got my basement, Brooklyn,

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Speaker 2: my Brooklyn basement space and the film and we went

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Speaker 2: straight to Sundance with it, and we came home with

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Speaker 2: a Sundance Award night. Then I was traveling. I went

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Speaker 2: to London, I went to Toronto and you know some places

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Speaker 2: here in the country. I got another award that was

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Speaker 2: presented to me by mother Elektra.

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Speaker 1: Come on, now, come on, come on.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I feel great. And that's just the overwhelming

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Speaker 2: love and response of the film. You know, it has

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Speaker 2: been amazing. You know, I feel so good about it

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Speaker 2: because my intentions were set and the film's out there

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Speaker 2: in the world and just hearing all of the beautiful

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Speaker 2: messages that I get back from so many people around

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Speaker 2: the world. Yeah, you know, it's it's a beautiful thing,

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Speaker 2: you know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like the documentary the show is a

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Speaker 1: captivating portrayer that not only dives into the historical aspects

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Speaker 1: of the show, but also it captures the essence of joy,

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Speaker 1: happiness in sisterhood that radiates throughout. So do you feel

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Speaker 1: like the narratives within the trans community often is overlooked

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Speaker 1: the presence of joy and happiness and their storytelling or

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Speaker 1: is it just me?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, And it's something that I've been monitoring closely for

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Speaker 2: over a decade. I think one of my first, my

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Speaker 2: early films was about media representation in the media of

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Speaker 2: trans women, of particularly black trans women, and it was horrendous. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know, it was absolutely horrendous. It was the most

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Speaker 2: vilifying thing that you could see. You know. It was

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Speaker 2: just like where thieves were, you know, fighting and carrying on.

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Speaker 2: Then you see these shows and you know they're out

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Speaker 2: there carrying on or whatever, and these are the only

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Speaker 2: opportunities allotted. You know, for so long society has kept

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Speaker 2: trans people in a box, particularly black trans women.

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Speaker 1: Right, you know, and so especially the darker trans women. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I noticed it, which I don't like because I'm a

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Speaker 1: dark skinned woman. I feel like the level of respect

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Speaker 1: that is towards the passing trans woman compared to the

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Speaker 1: darker skinned trans woman is disgusting.

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Speaker 2: It is. And you know, I picked up on all

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Speaker 2: of that, and it's like, you know, okay, addressing those issues,

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Speaker 2: you know, in the early days, and then like moving forward,

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Speaker 2: you see the tipping point and you see Laverne Cox

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Speaker 2: and she's very visible and at the time of the

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Speaker 2: probably the most visible black trans woman ever. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 2: but then like you know, she's in prison, her characters

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Speaker 2: in prison.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and.

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Speaker 2: That was the only representation we were really seeing. And

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Speaker 2: then it was just like this this boom of trans

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Speaker 2: visibility and inclusion and the narrative of sex workers was

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Speaker 2: being erased. I would hear a lot of the young

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Speaker 2: girls about, well, that wasn't my experience and we shouldn't

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Speaker 2: talk about that, and you know, like, you know, because

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Speaker 2: that wasn't all of our experience. Well, you didn't come

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Speaker 2: from an era where it was almost everybody's experience. You

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Speaker 2: came around when everything was sweet, like you know, And

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Speaker 2: so I would always tell them we cannot tell authentic

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Speaker 2: stories without uplifting the narrative transsex workers. Those are ones

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Speaker 2: that paved the way. Those are the ones that were

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Speaker 2: living out and taking the punches of being arrested for

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Speaker 2: walking down the street basically because it wasn't really being

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Speaker 2: arrested for prostitution, because when you get arrested for prostitution,

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Speaker 2: you should be in the act of prostituting, right, So

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Speaker 2: you're literally getting snatched up off the street just for existing.

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Speaker 2: And so it was important to me because you know,

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Speaker 2: as a young person, I came into New York City,

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Speaker 2: I ran away from home in the streets and in

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Speaker 2: these shelters.

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Speaker 1: Not because I'm like, yea, is she from New York

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Speaker 1: or like, but I'm like, I don't know, I'm not

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Speaker 1: let me ask, because I was doing research on you

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, I cannot find where she's from.

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Speaker 2: I'm from New York.

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Speaker 1: But before we get into your story, because I want

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Speaker 1: to get also ask you this opinion, because you made

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Speaker 1: a good point about how this generation is not respectful

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Speaker 1: towards the older generation, and do you feel like this

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Speaker 1: generation understands the history of the trans community, because I

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Speaker 1: do feel like the ogs definitely paid the way.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, definitely, even though olds before me paid the way, right,

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Speaker 2: And so I'm in this unique group where we see

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Speaker 2: the old way and the new way, right, So we

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Speaker 2: got to witness all of what was before, and we

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Speaker 2: watched the AIDS epidemic, you know, we watched the impact

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Speaker 2: of that. We've seen how society treated us, you know.

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Speaker 2: And I think it was when I was coming out

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Speaker 2: and coming up up, it was like I refuse to

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Speaker 2: be treated right, right, you know what I mean, and

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Speaker 2: like and then but then of course I was treated

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Speaker 2: in these ways, you know what I mean. But it

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Speaker 2: was an eye opener to like the dehumanizing, you know,

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Speaker 2: ostracization of us because of who we are right as people,

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Speaker 2: you know, And so it was important to remind people

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Speaker 2: that this history existed, that this is the history that

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Speaker 2: the meatpacking district gloss Over made the shine.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I go down there now, and I'm still like,

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Speaker 1: what is going on down here?

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Speaker 2: You know? So and then I see like one of

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Speaker 2: those post things there was a drag queen on like

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Speaker 2: a flyer situation, and I was like, that's interesting, you know,

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Speaker 2: out of all the history in this area, right right.

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Speaker 2: So it was like, you know, it was just so much,

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Speaker 2: so much going on at the time, and you know,

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Speaker 2: at the time, I was also because I was a

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Speaker 2: homeless season because I was trans, and because I was

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Speaker 2: sex working. You know, I ran into a group of

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Speaker 2: people that politicized me, you know what I mean, and

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Speaker 2: broke it down like these are the structures and things

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Speaker 2: in place that are oppressing you, and it's up to

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Speaker 2: y'all to change things. It's up to y'all to fight

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Speaker 2: for your rights, right. And that's when I ran into

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Speaker 2: a legendary LGBT activist like Sylvia or Rivera, Bob Cole,

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Speaker 2: like the legends Sweetie and YC. Yeah, you know what

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Speaker 2: I mean. And it's like, you know, just listening to

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Speaker 2: the elders and what they were saying, or listen to

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Speaker 2: girls that were out there for like thirty something years

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Speaker 2: and here I am the new bitch right right, like

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Speaker 2: thirty years.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah.

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Speaker 2: And then after like being out there for ten years,

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Speaker 2: once that decade was closing, it was like, damn, I

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Speaker 2: can for one, I can see how quickly ten years

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Speaker 2: can go by.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, facts, I feel like I remember when

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Speaker 1: I was a kid and now I'm a grown ass woman.

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Speaker 1: Like the time in between went by so fast it

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Speaker 1: is insane.

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Speaker 2: It's weird, right because I'm like now how like, how

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Speaker 2: did I get to the age that I'm at now?

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Speaker 2: Like I just still like like it's almost like you

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Speaker 2: jump into a time machine, like you know, you you know,

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Speaker 2: you were alive and you were doing things to get

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Speaker 2: It doesn't really set in until you're like, right.

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Speaker 1: I know, I know this may sound crazy, but I

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Speaker 1: feel like to Tom cannot be real.

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Speaker 2: I know we have to keep a clock, but I

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Speaker 2: don't believe in it any other time because it messes

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Speaker 2: with you, like when you thing about time and keeping

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Speaker 2: track of time and you know.

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Speaker 1: Right, and the fact that everything is so fast paced,

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Speaker 1: and maybe because we live in New York City, but

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Speaker 1: it's just like, it's just no way that Tom keeps

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Speaker 1: escaping me.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes I think for me, it's not even New York City.

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Speaker 2: It's I think when the smartphones came about facts, I

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Speaker 2: don't know, like when I look at my Google Photos

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Speaker 2: and I see the ten years worth of photos and

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Speaker 2: I'm like, damn, yeah.

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Speaker 1: Oh when technology got better. Yeah. Now, we do have

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Speaker 1: listeners from everywhere, from different walks of life. So for

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Speaker 1: those who've been living under a rock, can you explain

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Speaker 1: what the stroll is?

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Speaker 2: Okay, well, the film or the area.

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Speaker 1: The area, because we're gonna get into the field.

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Speaker 2: Okay. The Stroll is an area and in New York City,

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Speaker 2: in the New York City's meatpacking district. It's from pretty

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Speaker 2: much Fourteenth Street on down to Christopher right and then

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Speaker 2: like right and that between like i'd say, Ninth Avenue

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Speaker 2: down to Christopher. Then you have like the whole pier

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Speaker 2: in the water. Extuff. It's like this this area and

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Speaker 2: there's no other place in New York City like it. Right,

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Speaker 2: you can go to South Street, Seaport and me by

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Speaker 2: the water, but it's still not the same vibe, you

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Speaker 2: know what I mean. District vibe. Especially in the nineties

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Speaker 2: and the eighties, it was such a vibe, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's that Yes, it's that old New York vibe. It's

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Speaker 2: got the cobblestones, the smoke coming out of the sewer grades.

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Speaker 2: It was just it was a fascinating area. And plus

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Speaker 2: not only that, there was a lot going on.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, they.

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Speaker 2: Were tink clubs, the transsex workers, and it was just

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Speaker 2: so cinematic. It was. It's a very cinematic place even

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Speaker 2: to this day. It's beautiful now, but it still has

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Speaker 2: this this certain beauty to it. The area, right.

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Speaker 1: You know, now, what inspired you to create the documentary

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Speaker 1: and how important was it for you get the story right?

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Speaker 1: So that's what I love about this story. That's what

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Speaker 1: I love about the documentary. I feel like it embodies

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Speaker 1: like obviously, sheddn't light of what trans women went through

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Speaker 1: during that time, but I also feel like it's just

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Speaker 1: it's just oh, y'all in a different light. And I

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Speaker 1: even though that I know a lot of women went

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Speaker 1: through a lot during that time, I just feel like

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Speaker 1: y'all have a good time, like y'all really had a sisterhood,

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Speaker 1: and I think a lot of times that's missing when

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Speaker 1: it comes to y'all stories. And I thought that was

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Speaker 1: really beautiful for what you did.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, thank you. And it stands a course of

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Speaker 2: fifty years right when you really think about it, that's

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Speaker 2: fifty years of transistory.

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Speaker 1: In that film, and representation is important.

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Speaker 2: Rights and you would think like, oh my god, there's

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Speaker 2: trans people are Yes, we have history, like we come

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Speaker 2: together like any group of people or culture or whatever.

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Speaker 2: We have history. And I wanted to know that because

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Speaker 2: you know, in my younger days, I'm looking and setting

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Speaker 2: LGBT history and stuff, and I found images from back

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Speaker 2: in the nineteen thirties from this artist Luigi, you know,

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Speaker 2: and they were putting the cross dresser, transwomen, you know

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Speaker 2: whatever they were calling at the time, you know, in

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Speaker 2: the back of the patioc those old school you know,

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Speaker 2: like those movies they got the paddy wagon right, and

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Speaker 2: like the girls are ducked out, and you know, studying

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Speaker 2: this history and knowing it goes back way more than

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Speaker 2: the fifty years. There's fifty more years before that.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it was used to be in the Victorian

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Speaker 1: days too. Yeah, but I don't understand why not tell

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Speaker 1: all of the history, Like why would you want to

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Speaker 1: lead people out? Because it's going to come to.

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Speaker 2: Light exactly and we're figuring this stuff out now. And

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Speaker 2: I think as a trans young person and like I

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Speaker 2: have the unique opportunity I guess to be around. So

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Speaker 2: like Sophia Rivera and her legacy and care taking part

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Speaker 2: of her legacy right when she had you know, when

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Speaker 2: she passed, she wanted a shelter open up for LGBT

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Speaker 2: young people in New York. It was the first one

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Speaker 2: of its kind of the Civiets place, and I worked

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Speaker 2: there for ten years, you know, and we were an

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Speaker 2: emergency shelter. So as soon as the day as the

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Speaker 2: kids get off the bus from wherever they're from and

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Speaker 2: they're in New York City trying to figure themselves out,

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Speaker 2: they came there, right, and we took them right off

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Speaker 2: the streets, right off the streets, like no questions asked, like, oh,

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Speaker 2: you need a place to stay your LGBT right, right,

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Speaker 2: you know, And so that's what we did. And so

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Speaker 2: just knowing before like her, and like you know what

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Speaker 2: led up to Stone Wall, Like people don't know, like

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Speaker 2: everything that we're fighting for today is what led up

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Speaker 2: to the Stone Wall. Right, It was like the making

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Speaker 2: sure because it was against the law to be drumed,

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Speaker 2: you know, and you had to present, you know, with

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Speaker 2: one article of mail clothing another article of women's clothing

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Speaker 2: if you were going to cross dressed, right, right, and

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Speaker 2: or that's the word that they were calling it at

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Speaker 2: the time, right, you know. And so and it was

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Speaker 2: against the law for homosexuals consume alcohol. So there was

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Speaker 2: like this prohibition era in the sixties in the LGBT community.

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Speaker 2: So the mob owned a lot of the bars and

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Speaker 2: clubs of course, so they can peddle their liquor and stuff.

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Speaker 2: To the gags and they would the police would come

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Speaker 2: and they would you know, beat everybody up, see who's

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Speaker 2: wearing what, who's drinking? You know, and they were drinking,

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Speaker 2: they get beat up and thrown into jail, you know.

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Speaker 2: And so there is just so much history and players

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Speaker 2: involved in making the Stroll in itself and just being

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Speaker 2: a part of that, like when I was younger and

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Speaker 2: being homeless and you know, living in the youth shelter

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Speaker 2: and then going onto the Stroll with my girlfriends and

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Speaker 2: then we're adults now and then that reality sets in

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Speaker 2: and then you realize, oh, life is getting a little harder.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, what I'm going to do.

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Speaker 2: I'm a transfoman. Societies you know, scriminating against me. Now

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Speaker 2: they're throwing you in and out of jail. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 2: what do you do? And thankfully and I think I

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Speaker 2: am so thankful that I ended up working at Sylvia's.

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Speaker 2: They got me off the streets and you know, and

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Speaker 2: that's so starting Fears, which is fabulous and educated radicals

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Speaker 2: for community empowerment and being part of the new neutral zone.

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Speaker 2: You know, we went to a lot of we were

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Speaker 2: doing a lot of you know, going to a lot

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Speaker 2: of demonstrations and holding demonstrations and taking the police to

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Speaker 2: accountability and all that stuff in the late nineties and

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Speaker 2: early two thousands, you know, and just me remembering all

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Speaker 2: of this stuff, and I was like, well, damn, that's

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Speaker 2: all history, right, that's right screening now. Like the reason

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Speaker 2: why everybody is jumping around and living their best trans

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Speaker 2: lives now is because of this stuff.

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Speaker 1: The sacrifices that were made.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And so I was like I have to. I

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Speaker 2: have to because if I don't tell it, who's going

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Speaker 2: to And how long will we have to wait? And

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Speaker 2: it was like, now is the time. And it had

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Speaker 2: been something that's been sitting with me for a minute,

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Speaker 2: but it was the day I got I was working

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Speaker 2: another film called The Guard Left Behind. You can see

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Speaker 2: it on YouTube to be in the likes. It was

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Speaker 2: it's a good story. But that was when I became

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Speaker 2: a producer. And a friend of mine, JD, called me

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Speaker 2: and was like, oh, they're showing Fenced Out, which is

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Speaker 2: a film that was May twenty years ago about the

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Speaker 2: shutdown of the Hudson River piers that we were all

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Speaker 2: involved in, and they're doing it, you know, a thing

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Speaker 2: at the Whitney Bienniyalaal and I'm like fine, So I

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Speaker 2: go and I met Matt Wolf, who's my producer, and

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Speaker 2: I was telling him that I'm collecting this archive, right,

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Speaker 2: and I just left him alone. Right. I went to

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Speaker 2: Artists Academy at Lincoln Center, right, and I was sitting

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Speaker 2: there in the theater and it was Martin Scorsese's and

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Speaker 2: he was talking and he's like, New York Stories. This

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Speaker 2: in New York. So he said, I'm zoned out a

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Speaker 2: little bit, and I'm like new York Stories. I was like,

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Speaker 2: but you know what, Martin in my head like better

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Speaker 2: New York City story to tell in the stroll, like, right,

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Speaker 2: who want to tell it? So I was like, I'm

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Speaker 2: going to do this. I'm going to do this. My

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Speaker 2: Artist Academy members they were you know, gassing me and

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Speaker 2: me on and do it and stuff and yeah. So

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Speaker 2: then Matt calls me back and he's all like, I've

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Speaker 2: been thinking it was just the stars were aligned for it.

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Speaker 2: I think the story just wanted to come out with

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Speaker 2: the story like whatever the universe. But me was just

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Speaker 2: like now at the time, now it's the time to

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Speaker 2: tell the story, right, And we did it, and you know,

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Speaker 2: even like in the early days of like getting greenlit

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Speaker 2: and stuff. I'm all skeptical and like, right, you know,

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Speaker 2: are they really going to make this? Are we really

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Speaker 2: going to make this? You know? And it took months.

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Speaker 2: It's a year, a big year to get everything finalized,

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Speaker 2: and so it was like when it was finally done,

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Speaker 2: it all just became a fever dream.

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Speaker 1: But I don't see how they I don't see how

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Speaker 1: they would say no, because this documentary is a pivotal

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Speaker 1: moment in New York history. Like when you think of

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Speaker 1: New York you cannot think of this, right.

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Speaker 2: Say, everybody knows everybody around, Like if you were from

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Speaker 2: the nineties and the two thousands, you know where Fourteenth

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Speaker 2: Street wide, right, you know what was down there, you know,

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Speaker 2: and it's so boring now when you go down there,

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Speaker 2: Like I go go down there now and it's like.

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Speaker 1: Well, New York is definitely not this there you go,

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Speaker 1: New York is definitely not the same now.

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Speaker 2: Like back in the old days, we walked for we

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Speaker 2: get on there Christopher Street and we walked down to

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Speaker 2: the pier. Every five seconds, what's up? Oh my god,

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Speaker 2: how you're going? You know, and you know everybody you

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Speaker 2: see everybody. Now, I don't know nobody's down there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we look like us down there.

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Speaker 2: And that was the main point if you watch Fenn

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Speaker 2: Style it's on YouTube. If you watched Fenn Stylen, that

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Speaker 2: was the main point. They said, these black children and

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Speaker 2: the other children.

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Speaker 1: Coming down, That's what they were saying. These niggas they

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Speaker 1: try to get us out. Child, these are coming down

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Speaker 1: right before I continue. When I was watching a documentary,

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Speaker 1: you shed like Sylvia's history and I feel like the

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Speaker 1: way she was handled it is sit will with me?

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Speaker 1: Do you feel like that the.

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Speaker 2: Way Sylvia are there is handled Yeah, in terms of.

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Speaker 1: Just the terms of like support and that she was

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Speaker 1: getting older and like not having people to like look

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Speaker 1: after her or like I feel like she gave so

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Speaker 1: much and I don't think she gets she received anything

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Speaker 1: in return as much as she should have.

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Speaker 2: It was very elated. Like later on and I was

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Speaker 2: seeing in the last couple of years of her life

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Speaker 2: is when she was around us for the young people,

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Speaker 2: and that really motivated her. Like when we were doing

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Speaker 2: fenced Out, we're getting ready to do fenced out. They

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Speaker 2: were getting ready to do Fenstout, and I became the

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Speaker 2: youth leadership organizer at the Neutral Zone, and I remember

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Speaker 2: Jessie was like, oh, we're going to do this documentary

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Speaker 2: about Stonewall veterans and to go out and look for

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Speaker 2: Stonewall veterans. So I got in contact with some guy.

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Speaker 2: He used to drive the stone wallmobile or something, and

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Speaker 2: I was talking to him and I was like, well,

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Speaker 2: I found this guy. He says he's a Stonewall vet.

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Speaker 2: And they were like, oh, well, let's do people of color, like,

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Speaker 2: we need to find people of color. And somehow Cylpia

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Speaker 2: came about, and this is how we met her, right,

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Speaker 2: you know. And before then it was like, you know

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Speaker 2: a few years before what fenced out was two thousand,

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Speaker 2: and Sylvia was out there in ninety four. They started

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Speaker 2: to spend it off. She was going for a while.

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Speaker 2: I think she was maybe in Yonkers, but I think

395
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Speaker 2: the reach out looking for the Stowwall veterans is what

396
00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:17,640
Speaker 2: reinvigorated her. And too, you know, like oh my god,

397
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Speaker 2: people are actually like interested in this, you know what

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Speaker 2: I mean, Like people want to hear this and be

399
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Speaker 2: part of it. So she started to clean herself up

400
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Speaker 2: and stopped or tried to stop drinking, get more involved

401
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Speaker 2: and then did you see with the Amanda Milan situation

402
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Speaker 2: that really really pissed her off and sent her Scott

403
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Speaker 2: rocketing and so let her last two years she was

404
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Speaker 2: a busy woman and you know she was fighting for

405
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Speaker 2: the Ginger Quality Nondiscrimination Act, which passed. She was going, yeah, ago,

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Speaker 2: she made sure I had a job, right, right, right,

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Speaker 2: Sure I had a job, and like, you know, she

408
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Speaker 2: had her redemption. I don't even want to say redemption.

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Speaker 2: I mean, like I said, you know, the community drove

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Speaker 2: them crazy. And that's the overlooked heart. Yeah, you know

411
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:07,439
Speaker 2: what I mean, like the community doesn't real life. And

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Speaker 2: when I say, they literally drove her crazy. After that

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Speaker 2: nineteen seventy three situation where she's screaming at everybody. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: if you watch David France's The Death in Life of

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Speaker 2: Marsha P. Johnson, you discover that she tried to kill

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Speaker 2: herself slip her wrist and Marcia nerves her back to help.

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Speaker 1: Was now on Netflix. Yes, it was okay, I saw

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Speaker 1: that one, yes.

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Speaker 2: And so I didn't know that. I did not know that.

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Speaker 2: And then she disappeared and just was over it. She

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Speaker 2: put the community behind her, and then you see Marsha

422
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Speaker 2: and you see her decline as well. Yeah, you know,

423
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Speaker 2: and it's like, how are these women so important to you?

424
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Speaker 2: But yet they're still like living in the streets, right

425
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Speaker 2: or I just never understood it, you know. And then

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Speaker 2: there was a rasure. There was a time of ratire.

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Speaker 2: I think it was us young people then that was

428
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Speaker 2: making sure that those narratives were uplifted, that there was

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Speaker 2: a Silvia Vera, that there was a Marshi Johnson, you

430
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Speaker 2: know what I mean. And these people are the reasons why,

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Speaker 2: you know, we have the rights and things that we

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Speaker 2: have today, or we're fighting for them the little bits

433
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 2: that we had, you know, and it was important to

434
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:30,239
Speaker 2: uplift their narratives. And that's exactly what happened, right you know.

435
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:34,959
Speaker 2: And so now they're icons and that the civil rights movement,

436
00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:41,959
Speaker 2: you know, takes on different shades and experiences and gender

437
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,199
Speaker 2: as well. Like there was a you know, Sylvia was

438
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 2: fascinated with the young lords of Black Panthers. She modeled

439
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:53,480
Speaker 2: Star Street translut Site Action Revolutionaries after the Black Panther model.

440
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:56,919
Speaker 2: She was, you know, she was elated when you he

441
00:24:57,040 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 2: knew and sent out that manifesto, you know, bringing the

442
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:07,399
Speaker 2: LGBT community into the Black Panther movement, you know, And

443
00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:10,440
Speaker 2: so that's why she said, you know, and another video

444
00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:12,720
Speaker 2: I have heard and she's like, in the word revolutionary

445
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:16,400
Speaker 2: stays and star because we are revolutionary groups.

446
00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 1: Because at the end of the day, when they see us,

447
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,159
Speaker 1: they see skin color. Yeah, so we all in this

448
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:21,800
Speaker 1: fight together.

449
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 2: Mm hmm. And Marcia, you know, she was saying like,

450
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 2: how you know, I was reading one one snippet of

451
00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 2: how like you know, how Sylvia's for the gun too.

452
00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,280
Speaker 2: You gotta like you know now it's like, oh no, no,

453
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:39,040
Speaker 2: that's what it is. You got to pick up that gun. Yeah,

454
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:39,800
Speaker 2: you want want to be.

455
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 1: Revolution Listen, sometimes you just need some hands.

456
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 2: Oh that part too, right now.

457
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 1: Was it challenging to encourage everyone to share their stories

458
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:04,440
Speaker 1: because I feel like some people were a little hesitant

459
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 1: at first?

460
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 2: Oh yeah they were. They most certainly were. And a

461
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:11,760
Speaker 2: lot of people that I've wanted to be a part

462
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:14,200
Speaker 2: of it didn't want to.

463
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:17,160
Speaker 1: That's want to be seeing that light, That's my next question.

464
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,440
Speaker 2: They didn't want to be seeing that a light. Or

465
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:22,320
Speaker 2: like there were certain girls they just like some girls

466
00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:26,400
Speaker 2: were like when they're telling stories, I'm like that's you're

467
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:28,840
Speaker 2: making your lifestyle like it was just so perfect out there,

468
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:32,520
Speaker 2: Like I just can't fathom your life being so perfect.

469
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:34,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, because all of us over here can go through

470
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 1: one thing and then you're going through something so amazing,

471
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:37,640
Speaker 1: Like come on, Elsa's.

472
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 2: Right, I'm just like, but she was hiding. She didn't

473
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:46,040
Speaker 2: want it divulged because people's lives have changed since then too.

474
00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:50,240
Speaker 2: It's been now like wow, when did I leave the

475
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:53,880
Speaker 2: stroll officially in two thousands? Yeah, two thousand and six,

476
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:57,480
Speaker 2: so that's like what sixteen years ago. Now I'm a

477
00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 2: saying that was just like oh I don't want to

478
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 2: get it, or I try to sweep it on the rug.

479
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:02,280
Speaker 2: They're trying to be rebuild.

480
00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:04,159
Speaker 1: Their image or or just forget.

481
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 2: Or forget it. And for some people it was traumatic,

482
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,200
Speaker 2: you know. For some people it was a little easier,

483
00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 2: I guess, you know, but it was hard to get

484
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:18,760
Speaker 2: people to share. Like even if you see like like Kashmir,

485
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 2: who I had to work very closely with, and like,

486
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:24,199
Speaker 2: you know, are you sure you want to do this

487
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:26,199
Speaker 2: and this thing, like you're revealing to the world that

488
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:30,120
Speaker 2: you used to be transsextual, right right, you know, and

489
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:32,880
Speaker 2: you know, explaining that you're a person of trans experience

490
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:35,399
Speaker 2: because you are, like you know, if they feel sometimes

491
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:37,760
Speaker 2: showner in the community because they de transition. I was like, well,

492
00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 2: I know you, you know what I mean, Like, I'm

493
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 2: not going to leave my friend because they de transition

494
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 2: and people think they're a whole new person. It doesn't

495
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 2: make sense, right, you know what I mean. But and

496
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 2: you still are of trans experience, just not one of

497
00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:50,640
Speaker 2: the girls.

498
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:54,480
Speaker 1: You're a transman now right right, right now, I can

499
00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 1: tell he was definitely uh he I can just say

500
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,119
Speaker 1: it was just so much pain that he did not

501
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,960
Speaker 1: want to remember. And even there was a particular part

502
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 1: in the documentary where y'all was walking through and y'all

503
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 1: was remembering someone in particular, and he just broke down,

504
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,399
Speaker 1: and I'm like, my god, Like it's just it was

505
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,600
Speaker 1: just heartbreaking because you know, some things you just don't

506
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:17,600
Speaker 1: want to remember. But then again, it's like you kind

507
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 1: of have an obligation because it's bigger than.

508
00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:22,960
Speaker 2: You, right it is. And that was and that's what

509
00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:25,280
Speaker 2: I was explaining, And that's why like bringing them out

510
00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:28,520
Speaker 2: and stuff, and like them being so vulnerable. You know,

511
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:32,440
Speaker 2: it's like and it happens, like, you know, a lot

512
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,520
Speaker 2: of people then do to the fact that we were

513
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 2: young people when we started transitioning that have d transitioning.

514
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 2: Now that I've discovered, I'm like, okay, well, where's this

515
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 2: person or where's that person I'm looking and then I

516
00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 2: finally get in contact with them and de transition. Yeah,

517
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,840
Speaker 2: so there's still only a few of us that are

518
00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 2: still you know, how does that.

519
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 1: Make you feel when you find out that some of

520
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 1: your friends have D transitioned.

521
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 2: I mean, and I totally understand that we all knew

522
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:08,400
Speaker 2: back then that being a trans woman's built, we have

523
00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:13,400
Speaker 2: to be built. Yeah, yeah, no, it's it can be

524
00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:16,600
Speaker 2: a hard life for you as a black woman now, yeah,

525
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Now it's like and then

526
00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 2: add that onto a black trans woman, right and the

527
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 2: fact that you know we've transitioned and we're black, right,

528
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 2: it all boils and it being a brownie and where

529
00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:33,160
Speaker 2: we're even scarier.

530
00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: Right right, No, right, And I'm not gonna lie. I

531
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:38,360
Speaker 1: don't want to touch on this because I really don't

532
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:39,840
Speaker 1: care to touch on this, but I really hate the

533
00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:47,440
Speaker 1: conversations that's being had between exactly I's getting you know

534
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 1: what the only reason why I don't because I just

535
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:51,520
Speaker 1: feel like I always been to one of those people.

536
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 1: I want people to be happy, especially black people, because

537
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 1: it's already hard for us. So whatever makes you happy,

538
00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:58,760
Speaker 1: as long as you are safe, that's all I care about.

539
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 1: And I just feel like it's just so much hatred,

540
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 1: so much misunderstanding, and I just really don't like it,

541
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 1: not one bit at all. It makes me.

542
00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 2: I hate it.

543
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 1: I hate that we have to go back and forth

544
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:16,560
Speaker 1: with each other, like I just I just don't like it.

545
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,480
Speaker 2: It's very I don't like it because the thing for

546
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 2: me is this, and I always say this because sometimes

547
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:24,719
Speaker 2: I hear the girls and like I'm missing. Don't do that.

548
00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 2: I cannot because let me tell you something, My best

549
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 2: friends in the world have been black women, right, Okay,

550
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:34,040
Speaker 2: I identify as a black woman. I'm not gonna let

551
00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:36,239
Speaker 2: you sit think like and now it's one thing if

552
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:41,080
Speaker 2: it's an individual, okay, right, but then like you know,

553
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:49,200
Speaker 2: when you're categorizing or whatever, Now for our sisters, you know,

554
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 2: like I mean, that's all we want to do is

555
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:54,240
Speaker 2: called you say yeah, right, Like, whether you see in

556
00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:57,240
Speaker 2: front of her or an ass, you're my sister, right,

557
00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 2: you know, like what it's like what like what? Like?

558
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 2: Why is that word? So?

559
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 1: Like what's the problem? Like list, I'm just so over it,

560
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 1: Like every other week is just something. I'm just like

561
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 1: home on y'all. Like there's so much other shit we

562
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 1: can argue about for a topic they really get people going.

563
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: I feel like we need to have like a real

564
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 1: conversation because I want to know what is the disconnect

565
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 1: because it's something that's it's something that's disconnecting that's causing

566
00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 1: a lot of black women to feel away and also

567
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 1: caused a lot of trans women to feel away. And

568
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:32,160
Speaker 1: I'm just like, why we just can't have a conversation.

569
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: Do you feel like that?

570
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 2: I do, and I you know, I get it, you know,

571
00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:44,000
Speaker 2: and I think the disconnector is you know, men mm hmm.

572
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 2: And the men who choose to love either of.

573
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 1: Us niggas, Yes, I think. I think niggas play a

574
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,280
Speaker 1: very vital role in this. I agree they do.

575
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 2: And you know, and I get it. You know, whether

576
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:00,440
Speaker 2: it's a CIS woman or a trans woman. Of course,

577
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 2: if it's my man, I'm gonna be looking at him

578
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 2: some type of way right or man too for that matter,

579
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:06,480
Speaker 2: you got to look you got to look at it.

580
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:10,040
Speaker 1: From we don't talk about it. Let's talk about.

581
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 2: It, right. I don't put nothing past nobody, period. That's

582
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,600
Speaker 2: just how it is. You can't, you know what I mean.

583
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 2: So it's not powerful over there. It's your man's fault.

584
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,960
Speaker 2: So I can't like trying to be mean thing me.

585
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:26,680
Speaker 2: I mean, like, I mean, we come from black women,

586
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:34,160
Speaker 2: so of course, like I'm gonna like you or be

587
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 2: like you, right, that's what I'm saying. I'm not trying

588
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 2: to replace you. I can't do that. So I can't,

589
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:43,720
Speaker 2: you know. And so it's a lot to think about

590
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:45,120
Speaker 2: because I think about it like certain things. And I

591
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 2: know it's like you know, if you watch Conkomo City,

592
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:49,360
Speaker 2: oh my gosh.

593
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 1: Streaming, Yes, I saw that the other day and oh

594
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:58,640
Speaker 1: my god, what's the lady's name that that was murdered Coco? Yeah,

595
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 1: oh my just I'm just like wow, like is it's heartbreaking.

596
00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 2: It was what Daniella said in the film about how

597
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:13,280
Speaker 2: you know, being mad that you know that you have

598
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:16,120
Speaker 2: this child and the man that you loved and thought

599
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:20,080
Speaker 2: was going to protect you left. Oh man, then you

600
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 2: know that was some powerful ship right there. And I

601
00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:25,480
Speaker 2: was just like listen, Professor Carter.

602
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 1: Now, yes, listen, Professor Carter. Was she she was giving

603
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:31,960
Speaker 1: it up. Like I had to rewind just to hear

604
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:35,280
Speaker 1: what she was saying, and it just made so much sense,

605
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:38,800
Speaker 1: and I'm just like wow, like it's oh man, she

606
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 1: she spoke.

607
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 2: A word I hate.

608
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 1: I think we all hated. I think we all hated.

609
00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, I don't want to do this. Like the

610
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 2: only thing I want is for my sister to be

611
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 2: my fucking sister, right, that's it.

612
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:57,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, that Coco. So I have a homegirl and she's trans,

613
00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 1: and I'd be so afraid for her safety because she's

614
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:05,120
Speaker 1: in Miami and you know, she's lit, and I'd be like, girl,

615
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,400
Speaker 1: I know you having a good time and everything I say,

616
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 1: but you gotta protect yourself because I'm like, you know,

617
00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,279
Speaker 1: I just see too many stories, and I'm pretty sure

618
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: she sees it as well, and I'm just like, I

619
00:34:14,120 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 1: don't put nothing past these niggas, Like you have to

620
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 1: protect yourself. So I'm always like checking in on her,

621
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:22,920
Speaker 1: making sure she's good and stuff, because I'm just like, girl, like,

622
00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:25,839
Speaker 1: just seeing what happened to Cocoa and so many other

623
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 1: women that were murdered is it's heartbreaking.

624
00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 2: When I heard the news on the news, I was like,

625
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,160
Speaker 2: now you got to be kidding me, Like what the fuck?

626
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:35,040
Speaker 1: Right?

627
00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:37,360
Speaker 2: And I've known so many people that have needed onto

628
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 2: these lists, and it's just like why why God, Like why.

629
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 1: How does that make you feel?

630
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:45,080
Speaker 2: Like?

631
00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:47,520
Speaker 1: Are you does that make you afraid?

632
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:51,200
Speaker 2: I mean I can concern. I mean I'm like, I'm

633
00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 2: like Joslyn said, I'm from the streets.

634
00:34:54,960 --> 00:35:00,680
Speaker 1: Nah, I don't quote Jocelyn crazy. No, No, we ain't

635
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:03,160
Speaker 1: even go down. I got my money on Josie.

636
00:35:03,719 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 2: Right. I mean, you have to think about it every

637
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 2: time you step out of your house, right, that some

638
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,480
Speaker 2: fool out of nowhere is gonna attack you nine times

639
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:14,279
Speaker 2: out of ten. And this is what I hole. Black

640
00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 2: men hear me nine times out of ten. Yeah, it

641
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:22,360
Speaker 2: ain't never the one that I'm even worried about. Yeah,

642
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:24,560
Speaker 2: I could be minded my business. And then here comes

643
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:27,359
Speaker 2: to school and it's like and then the ones that

644
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 2: aren't secure in themselves or whatever. I can play with

645
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:31,840
Speaker 2: them all day and they go back and do what

646
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 2: they do or whatever the case may be, and that's it,

647
00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:35,640
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. But they are secure in

648
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 2: themselves to know who they like right, it be the

649
00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:40,359
Speaker 2: most insecure ones or the one I'm not even paying

650
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:42,319
Speaker 2: attention to that just jumps out of nowhere. I'm like,

651
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,800
Speaker 2: g need some attention. Yeah, and it's just like, no,

652
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:47,319
Speaker 2: I was not thinking about you in the first place.

653
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:50,719
Speaker 2: Go mind your business like and that's because they want

654
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 2: your attention. So they're gonna jeer and or play it

655
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:56,399
Speaker 2: off like it's their homeboy that like you or something,

656
00:35:56,400 --> 00:36:00,279
Speaker 2: which it's really them. It never fails, It never fails.

657
00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 1: Right now. Is there a particular story or moment within

658
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 1: the documentary that you believe captures its core essence and purpose.

659
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:17,440
Speaker 2: Or essence and purpose of the straw? Yes? For me,

660
00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:22,440
Speaker 2: it was you know the police thing and uh incarceration

661
00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 2: and how you know it amplified we like to call

662
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 2: it in fearce or like the whole thing is a

663
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 2: fierce lesson when I really think about it, like the school,

664
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:34,839
Speaker 2: the prison pipeline, right, you know that sort of thing.

665
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 2: So for me, yeah, it kind of like we dealt

666
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 2: into those things. There was another thing that it also

667
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:45,839
Speaker 2: touched on that was oh like intro to oppression. Yeah,

668
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:49,520
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, like sometimes like passibility plays

669
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:53,600
Speaker 2: more into you know who gets what. There are things

670
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 2: that were left out. There were things that we could

671
00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 2: have gotten into that or get more into the weeds

672
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 2: or specific people. But I think my main purpose was

673
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:07,120
Speaker 2: to highlight that that history of how the Giuliani and

674
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 2: the Bloomberg era impacted New York as a whole and

675
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 2: specifically the trans community. Yeah, you know, because you know

676
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 2: I also here, Oh, the trans people care all these

677
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:22,879
Speaker 2: rights and we don't got nothing. You know, I'm like, what, right,

678
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:25,400
Speaker 2: Like just because you see us on TV, don't mean

679
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:27,360
Speaker 2: we have all the rights in the world. Like we

680
00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:31,399
Speaker 2: still we barely working. What are you talking about? Right?

681
00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:34,799
Speaker 2: And we can't even work? No one, so like what's

682
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 2: going on?

683
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:36,279
Speaker 1: Right?

684
00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:40,440
Speaker 2: So you know they talk about that and stuff, and

685
00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:42,919
Speaker 2: it's just like, you know, to show that like, no

686
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,239
Speaker 2: we have like you know, we're black, especially black transfomen.

687
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:48,360
Speaker 2: We're right on that island with y'all.

688
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:51,920
Speaker 1: Yes, I want to touch on that, yeah, because I

689
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:55,160
Speaker 1: can't even imagine like what it was like navigating in

690
00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 1: jail environments as a trans woman.

691
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:00,279
Speaker 2: No, and like it's just it's a lot, you know.

692
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 2: I Mean, it was just important for me to highlight

693
00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:08,000
Speaker 2: that part of history because it all went by so

694
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,480
Speaker 2: fast that we don't really think about as history. We

695
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,520
Speaker 2: think about it as current things that are current. But

696
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:16,520
Speaker 2: twenty something years that went by. Now, how long has

697
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:19,799
Speaker 2: it been since ninety I came into New York City

698
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:22,919
Speaker 2: in ninety seven down till my age, but you know,

699
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 2: the winter of ninety seven ninety eight I started getting

700
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 2: up in them and taking hormones and all that stuff.

701
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 2: So that's twenty something years. Yeah, A whole new generation

702
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:40,719
Speaker 2: is out here. Yeah, and they don't know anything. Like

703
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:43,200
Speaker 2: like I speak to some young people like nine to eleven,

704
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 2: what's that child? What do you mean? What's that like?

705
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:52,319
Speaker 1: Yeah? No, seriously, a lot I don't even know. It's

706
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 1: so funny because so much, so much we were talking

707
00:38:54,640 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 1: about time early going by so fast, and so much

708
00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:00,000
Speaker 1: history is just going with it. And it's like these

709
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 1: a lot of these kids or people that's younger than us,

710
00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:04,480
Speaker 1: they don't even know. And it's just like wow, Like

711
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: we really lived in a lot of monumental moments in history.

712
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:13,480
Speaker 2: Right and because it's not being it's not documented yet,

713
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:16,439
Speaker 2: right like now us that we're in our you know,

714
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:19,960
Speaker 2: we're getting in up there in age, you know, and

715
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:21,920
Speaker 2: now we're trying to tell these stories or get these

716
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:24,840
Speaker 2: stories out there or focused on particular points in time,

717
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 2: Like there's so much from like the late nineties or

718
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:30,920
Speaker 2: early two thousands of stories that can be told that

719
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:34,600
Speaker 2: are historical and d young people don't know about it, right,

720
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:36,879
Speaker 2: It's like, like what do they learning? Like it makes

721
00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:38,680
Speaker 2: me wonder what do they learn in school these thies?

722
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:40,839
Speaker 2: Like do they learn about the Warren Terror? Not all

723
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,880
Speaker 2: that band? You know, things like that, Like what are

724
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:47,759
Speaker 2: they learning about? Like I want to see a school book?

725
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 2: I gotta I gotta find.

726
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:53,120
Speaker 1: You don't even have school books, right that part.

727
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 2: I mean they have the Internet, right, but that's.

728
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,520
Speaker 1: The school book, even the Google what you need to find? Shit?

729
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 1: Call it day.

730
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:05,120
Speaker 2: Right. But in lots of movies though, too. I've noticed

731
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:06,799
Speaker 2: there are a few movies that came out about the

732
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:09,840
Speaker 2: same time, and they're all starting to focus on especially

733
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,040
Speaker 2: if it's based in New York. Yeah, like that era,

734
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:17,360
Speaker 2: Leani era and you know and stuff. So it's it's.

735
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:19,960
Speaker 1: Going you ran away from home at the age of fifteen.

736
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,160
Speaker 1: Why did you run away? And what made you? How

737
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:30,000
Speaker 1: would you introduce to the show? Oh, she's making a face, y'all.

738
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:31,520
Speaker 2: Know, because you know, like I had just come out,

739
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,879
Speaker 2: and I mean people to me, I felt like people

740
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:37,000
Speaker 2: were acting funny. I didn't feel like I was being

741
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:40,279
Speaker 2: one hundred accepted because I wasn't, you know. I got

742
00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 2: teased all the time for I don't know. People would

743
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:46,439
Speaker 2: say I sound like a white girl. And I knew

744
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:48,359
Speaker 2: I was a girl, but I didn't think I sounded

745
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:51,640
Speaker 2: like a white girl. But whatever, you know. And so,

746
00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:55,200
Speaker 2: you know, it just got as I got older, and

747
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 2: dysphoria because it does set in as you you know,

748
00:40:57,800 --> 00:41:02,080
Speaker 2: get older and you're not developing them that you want

749
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:04,879
Speaker 2: and stuff, and I just I needed to figure out

750
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 2: who was going to be. I would go back and

751
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 2: forth between New York City and Yonkers. So fifteen I

752
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 2: ran away and went to Times Square. I see the

753
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,719
Speaker 2: covered in house and you know, the may threatened my

754
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:19,239
Speaker 2: mother with acs case and she's like, what are you

755
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:21,840
Speaker 2: doing down there? Even brings home right.

756
00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 1: Because you trying it right now?

757
00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:25,839
Speaker 2: Right?

758
00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:27,840
Speaker 1: Not the coach. Well, but did you know anybody that

759
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:29,520
Speaker 1: was trans and Yonkers.

760
00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:33,960
Speaker 2: There was a few there, you know, Yonkers. Has Sylvia

761
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:36,600
Speaker 2: lived in Yonkers for a while. Sometimes the girls would

762
00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:40,319
Speaker 2: push up to Yonkers, okay, you know, and then knowing them,

763
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:44,280
Speaker 2: knowing that I could transition, and I was like, okay.

764
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:47,799
Speaker 2: So sixteen, I was coming down. I was working. I

765
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:50,360
Speaker 2: got a job. I was doing messenger work, so it

766
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:54,160
Speaker 2: required me to come down to the city and pick

767
00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 2: up the checks or donations because it was like this

768
00:41:57,200 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 2: telemarketing thing. And that's how I I kind of got

769
00:42:00,520 --> 00:42:03,319
Speaker 2: introduced into sex work, not as a trans woman though,

770
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:07,319
Speaker 2: by just sex working in general. You know. It was like, oh,

771
00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:11,320
Speaker 2: I can go into this boothstore you're in Times Square

772
00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:17,839
Speaker 2: and uh right, you know. And I did that for

773
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:22,239
Speaker 2: a while and like for a few years, and then

774
00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:24,960
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm ready to transition. And so when

775
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:28,439
Speaker 2: I met Kashmir, who was like Cashmi was the baddest bitch.

776
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:35,080
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, dumb pictures. I said, come on now, come.

777
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,359
Speaker 2: On now, okay, And so I was like, oh my god,

778
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 2: I love her and we're friends, and you know, she

779
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:45,440
Speaker 2: would tweet my eyebrows and tell me about the stroll

780
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 2: and and I was like, what about hormones and stuff.

781
00:42:48,040 --> 00:42:50,640
Speaker 2: She's like, oh that she got you, and right, you know,

782
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:53,120
Speaker 2: I was like, okay, did give a beat. Took me

783
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 2: right to the spot to go get up, and I

784
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,239
Speaker 2: was like okay, and so she kind of was like

785
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:01,160
Speaker 2: my my, my transister guide, like how to take care

786
00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:03,600
Speaker 2: of myself when I'm on the stroll? Is it is?

787
00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 2: It was a completely different ball game than going into

788
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 2: the goof stores versus jumping in out of the cars, right,

789
00:43:08,920 --> 00:43:12,400
Speaker 2: you know, and you know, just the things that I

790
00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:15,759
Speaker 2: need to like present and be more feminine, and and

791
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 2: then you know, when she left, and then it was

792
00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 2: just me. You know, I had to deal with me

793
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:26,200
Speaker 2: and the world as a trans woman, you know, and

794
00:43:26,239 --> 00:43:30,200
Speaker 2: it hasn't been easy, you know, transitioning finding hormones and

795
00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:33,400
Speaker 2: stuff and finding medical providers to do so because back

796
00:43:33,440 --> 00:43:35,879
Speaker 2: then we didn't really have any right. You know. It's

797
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:37,920
Speaker 2: just like we go to the spot down in the village,

798
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:40,840
Speaker 2: you put in your order, he came back with your pills. Female.

799
00:43:41,480 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 2: There was this pharmacy that we would go to out

800
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:46,520
Speaker 2: here in Brooklyn and it was a Jamaican woman and

801
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 2: this isidic jew, I know, this is the story, right,

802
00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:54,400
Speaker 2: And you got to go there and that's when you

803
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:56,320
Speaker 2: that's when you get the good stuff. That's when you

804
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:57,920
Speaker 2: would go get the good stuff. Now you're getting the

805
00:43:58,680 --> 00:44:02,440
Speaker 2: sh dolls and the sermon queens and stuff. Work the

806
00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:04,759
Speaker 2: night before, make your coin, hop in the cab, go

807
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 2: out to Brooklyn, get your mone gets stocked up, mone down.

808
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:13,240
Speaker 2: But then that becomes expensive and then you know, but luckily,

809
00:44:13,360 --> 00:44:15,160
Speaker 2: you know, in the early days of like Helen Lord,

810
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,640
Speaker 2: I was able to get hormones and stuff and just

811
00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 2: so much has changed, so much a change.

812
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:25,000
Speaker 1: When I hear you talk about this, I feel like,

813
00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:26,800
Speaker 1: and correct me if I'm wrong. Do you feel like

814
00:44:26,840 --> 00:44:30,320
Speaker 1: you was introduced to womanhood? Because I feel like Cashmere,

815
00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:32,480
Speaker 1: like really like took you under her wing and like

816
00:44:32,520 --> 00:44:33,319
Speaker 1: showed you the way.

817
00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,040
Speaker 2: I guess she guided me into my womanhood. I was

818
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:39,399
Speaker 2: already a lady and she will tell you that that's

819
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:41,200
Speaker 2: why she started to tweeting my eyebrows.

820
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 1: But like, but not, maybe you're right, not introduce you

821
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:48,200
Speaker 1: to it, but like, like you said, showed you how

822
00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:49,480
Speaker 1: to navigate through it.

823
00:44:50,080 --> 00:44:52,920
Speaker 2: Yes, because it was near to me. I mean, you know,

824
00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:56,120
Speaker 2: it's something that I wanted to do. You know, it

825
00:44:56,160 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 2: was who I was. But like she did, she did,

826
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 2: and she stuck around as long as she could to

827
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:06,280
Speaker 2: make sure that, you know, we were on the right

828
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:08,879
Speaker 2: path and she had our own shit. You know. Yeah,

829
00:45:09,520 --> 00:45:11,680
Speaker 2: A couple of years older than her. And then there

830
00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:13,839
Speaker 2: was another person they weren't in the film, they didn't

831
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:16,840
Speaker 2: want to be in the film. It was our thief, Sadie.

832
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 2: She was there too, and they kind of like took

833
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:21,640
Speaker 2: care of us and made sure that we were safe

834
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 2: because they had more experience as being a trans one

835
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:26,880
Speaker 2: at the time, and just the things. You know, we

836
00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 2: all get it, you know, it's like that rundown. You know,

837
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:32,520
Speaker 2: it's like, here are the ground rules, missaying, don't do this,

838
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:35,919
Speaker 2: don't do that for us, like tell them first, Yeah,

839
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 2: you might get hurt if you don't, you know. And

840
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:40,600
Speaker 2: I always told I was always taught because you know,

841
00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:43,440
Speaker 2: some girls pussy stunt you don't want to tell them

842
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:46,160
Speaker 2: and play and all that other stuff, and sometimes they

843
00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:48,719
Speaker 2: get hurt or something. But I was always from the

844
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:52,160
Speaker 2: you know, you tell them you don't even gonna be

845
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:55,320
Speaker 2: one one of the other yes or now right right,

846
00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:58,840
Speaker 2: And a man respects you more for just telling that.

847
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:01,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, give them the two right.

848
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:03,160
Speaker 2: And nine times out of ten you tell them and

849
00:46:03,160 --> 00:46:06,080
Speaker 2: they're like, I don't care, okay, So there you go.

850
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:08,200
Speaker 2: So you don't even have to do all of that.

851
00:46:08,600 --> 00:46:12,240
Speaker 2: But I think going back to the cysts versus trans

852
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:18,160
Speaker 2: thinging like thinking about like men are attracted to you know, well,

853
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:22,279
Speaker 2: straight men are attracted to femininity and women female features,

854
00:46:22,320 --> 00:46:25,640
Speaker 2: and gay men like other men, you know, and so

855
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:29,160
Speaker 2: we're part of the sacred feminine. You possess it embody

856
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:31,880
Speaker 2: like like androgyny when you really thinking about androgyny, when

857
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:35,200
Speaker 2: they say that transis isn't naturally occurring, when it truly is.

858
00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:38,920
Speaker 2: Before hormones and implants, there were people being born with

859
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:43,760
Speaker 2: very androgynists or not their gender looks.

860
00:46:43,880 --> 00:46:45,279
Speaker 1: Would you consider that intersex?

861
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 2: No, not even they don't even talk to the intersect.

862
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 2: Sometimes they just present. Like I've known some girls that

863
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 2: could just they didn't even need not one hormone and

864
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:55,960
Speaker 2: not one implant, just if you look at them and

865
00:46:56,000 --> 00:47:00,840
Speaker 2: you're like, oh wow, you know it is something that

866
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:04,000
Speaker 2: happens naturally. You know, there's all this talk about it's

867
00:47:04,040 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 2: not natural, but it is, Yeah, it is. You know.

868
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:09,040
Speaker 1: That was gonna be my next question. How did you

869
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 1: navigate safety and well being while engaging in sex work

870
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:13,800
Speaker 1: because you were so young.

871
00:47:14,719 --> 00:47:17,719
Speaker 2: Well, of course we carry things pepper spray. Right now,

872
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:21,000
Speaker 2: if there are times that I've been attacked, one of

873
00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:23,879
Speaker 2: my very first my first week on the straw, some

874
00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:26,120
Speaker 2: guy snatched me up on the pier and had a

875
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 2: raisonably to my neck trying to take my cookies. Robberies.

876
00:47:31,080 --> 00:47:33,000
Speaker 2: You know, New York City back in the day, you know,

877
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:37,040
Speaker 2: they'll snatch a purse, run off, pretend like they like you,

878
00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 2: and snatch the coins and run off or something. It

879
00:47:41,160 --> 00:47:47,160
Speaker 2: was hard navigating then, you know, but it's gotten easier

880
00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:49,879
Speaker 2: and people have been more accepting. Like I mean, I'm

881
00:47:49,960 --> 00:47:53,239
Speaker 2: kind of proud of this new little generation that's going

882
00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:56,520
Speaker 2: on out because they don't even flench anymore. And that's

883
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:59,320
Speaker 2: all you want. We don't need all of the Jerry Springer,

884
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 2: Mario Pope, Plainton's fingers that some mean or is it

885
00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:04,839
Speaker 2: a animals of a woman like y'all know what it

886
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 2: is if you if you know what it is, right

887
00:48:07,120 --> 00:48:09,120
Speaker 2: and just mind your business. It's like, we don't need

888
00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:10,920
Speaker 2: all of that right right. You know.

889
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:14,200
Speaker 1: I had a question about that. But before we get there,

890
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:15,640
Speaker 1: how many times were you arrested?

891
00:48:17,040 --> 00:48:17,720
Speaker 2: Oh my god?

892
00:48:18,080 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 1: But I know you said you spend also your twenties

893
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:22,479
Speaker 1: in in and out of jail.

894
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:27,280
Speaker 2: I did. It was like, okay, So when we first started,

895
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:28,799
Speaker 2: it's like you know, when you first started, it's all

896
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 2: a key, key.

897
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 1: Right, it's always a key.

898
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:35,640
Speaker 2: Now it's all lacking when you first started, right, right,

899
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 2: it's you know, it was like Pleasure Island. Okay, you're

900
00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 2: running around with the girls, you're duking on a church,

901
00:48:40,440 --> 00:48:42,920
Speaker 2: you hot on the police or whatever and that, and

902
00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,839
Speaker 2: that's how it had always been. Like they just chase

903
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:47,960
Speaker 2: you around a little bit. You're not really going to

904
00:48:48,080 --> 00:48:50,200
Speaker 2: arrest it. And if they do getch you, you'll probably

905
00:48:50,239 --> 00:48:53,800
Speaker 2: do community service. You'll get out right, you'll do community service,

906
00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:58,239
Speaker 2: and that's it. But when you're on the streets and

907
00:48:58,280 --> 00:49:02,399
Speaker 2: you're young, you don't give us buck, right, And I'm

908
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:05,720
Speaker 2: not gonna allow y'all to stop me from eating, period,

909
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:09,200
Speaker 2: Like I'm not dumpster diving. I'm not like, I'm not

910
00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:11,279
Speaker 2: doing none of that. If I got to do something

911
00:49:11,320 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 2: strange for a little change, so be it, right, especially

912
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:17,279
Speaker 2: dead in the winter in New York and you got

913
00:49:17,320 --> 00:49:20,920
Speaker 2: a life, slay out, yeah, and you need to make

914
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:23,160
Speaker 2: money for that hotel room at the Jane or something

915
00:49:23,239 --> 00:49:27,759
Speaker 2: like no, right, no, And so it did get more

916
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:29,840
Speaker 2: intense than I remember. I lost the place I was

917
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 2: living because I remember I was living in the Lower

918
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:35,520
Speaker 2: east Side, and I was doing little like community work,

919
00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:39,440
Speaker 2: community you know work, the little internships and stuff, and

920
00:49:39,520 --> 00:49:44,240
Speaker 2: that's kind of was my cloak. And I got into

921
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:46,040
Speaker 2: this this place and I was, you know, in a

922
00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:48,640
Speaker 2: roommate situation. But I got arrested and went to jail

923
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:49,360
Speaker 2: for like a week.

924
00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:50,440
Speaker 1: Wow.

925
00:49:50,719 --> 00:49:53,120
Speaker 2: And I came back, they were like, oh, you're you're

926
00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 2: a foster that you can stay here? Wow, me out

927
00:49:58,680 --> 00:50:01,880
Speaker 2: and so that and I really became hopeless and I'm like, well,

928
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:03,400
Speaker 2: what the fuck am I going to do now?

929
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:07,080
Speaker 1: And so wait, how did they find out they were.

930
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:11,080
Speaker 2: A community member? First of all? But the job that

931
00:50:11,160 --> 00:50:13,319
Speaker 2: I had, like they thought I was doing this line

932
00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:16,560
Speaker 2: of work, but it was only an internship. So and

933
00:50:16,560 --> 00:50:21,480
Speaker 2: I'm not getting right right, Like I was getting paid.

934
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:24,400
Speaker 2: But when the when the the internship ended, I had

935
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:26,239
Speaker 2: to make ends. Mean, I got to pay this rent, right,

936
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:28,399
Speaker 2: so what you want me to do? But the thing

937
00:50:28,600 --> 00:50:30,520
Speaker 2: was is that I had the keys to their house

938
00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:33,319
Speaker 2: or something, and so being born a week and they

939
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 2: had just started a new job and they couldn't lock

940
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 2: the doors, so that they were pissed at me. So

941
00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:41,000
Speaker 2: that's why they threw me out. And so now I'm

942
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:43,720
Speaker 2: really on the streets. It's the winter. And I remember

943
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:47,440
Speaker 2: going to Cashman's house and they had started the transition process.

944
00:50:47,480 --> 00:50:50,160
Speaker 2: And I would go to their house here in Brooklyn

945
00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:51,880
Speaker 2: and I was living in their closet.

946
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:56,000
Speaker 1: Oh wow, and we.

947
00:50:55,960 --> 00:50:58,960
Speaker 2: I would go there. Their mother would be their mother

948
00:50:59,080 --> 00:51:01,520
Speaker 2: to this dale. My god, she'll find out if she

949
00:51:01,560 --> 00:51:05,520
Speaker 2: hears this, but never knew that I was there. I

950
00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:08,960
Speaker 2: would be there the whole week, go to the bathroom

951
00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:11,799
Speaker 2: when she's in her room, and she never knew I

952
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:12,160
Speaker 2: was there.

953
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:18,800
Speaker 1: Wow, that is insane.

954
00:51:19,120 --> 00:51:22,239
Speaker 2: And so you know, and then Kashmir laughed because they

955
00:51:22,400 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 2: you know, they would always have issues and things, you know,

956
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:27,839
Speaker 2: and they moved to pa and I had to stay

957
00:51:27,840 --> 00:51:31,960
Speaker 2: in New York and I haven't seen them for years,

958
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:34,399
Speaker 2: Like we literally just got in contact with each other

959
00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:40,200
Speaker 2: ten years ago, oh wow. And so you know, it

960
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:45,000
Speaker 2: was just, yeah, it was it was hard navigating that.

961
00:51:45,120 --> 00:51:47,400
Speaker 2: So then getting arrested more frequently, so it was like

962
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:50,120
Speaker 2: the cops, you know, it would be the squad cars,

963
00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:53,600
Speaker 2: then it would then it became vice because once nine

964
00:51:53,600 --> 00:51:57,440
Speaker 2: to eleven happened and he packed up and left, Bloomberg

965
00:51:57,520 --> 00:52:00,759
Speaker 2: came and that's when it really got more intense. You know,

966
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:03,360
Speaker 2: vice fog is out there and they'll just snatch you

967
00:52:03,400 --> 00:52:06,399
Speaker 2: off a corner and no questions asked. Yeah it's time

968
00:52:06,480 --> 00:52:07,799
Speaker 2: to go. You know.

969
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:12,120
Speaker 1: It was like it was like a game to them.

970
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:14,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, well for real, Like it was like I always

971
00:52:14,920 --> 00:52:17,279
Speaker 2: I always like just to remember the Looney Tunes and

972
00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:22,120
Speaker 2: it was you know, the Wiley Coyote.

973
00:52:21,719 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 1: Or y.

974
00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:27,799
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And so I always like, this is that

975
00:52:27,920 --> 00:52:30,240
Speaker 2: you gotta pay, you know, you gotta do the gazoom.

976
00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:34,000
Speaker 2: And then as they started, the more arrest that you accumulate,

977
00:52:34,080 --> 00:52:37,080
Speaker 2: so you know, they're they're they're slamming you with more

978
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:39,440
Speaker 2: and more time. So how they were doing some of us,

979
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:41,319
Speaker 2: and I felt like sometimes I was being picked on,

980
00:52:41,520 --> 00:52:43,520
Speaker 2: like because I feel like I'm getting an arrest is

981
00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:47,840
Speaker 2: more than others, right right, Like why am I always

982
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 2: up in here? You see nobody else really, you know,

983
00:52:52,239 --> 00:52:56,400
Speaker 2: and so it's like, you know, it was it was

984
00:52:57,440 --> 00:52:58,959
Speaker 2: then it was just like you know, the more arrest

985
00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:00,920
Speaker 2: you get, the more time you could be doing. Like

986
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 2: first I'll start to for like thirty days and you

987
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:07,600
Speaker 2: do twenty out of thirty, you know, that's sixty days

988
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:11,080
Speaker 2: though ninety days, right, so now you can there for

989
00:53:11,120 --> 00:53:12,320
Speaker 2: them in three months?

990
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:14,239
Speaker 1: Right? And how was that experience for you?

991
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:17,760
Speaker 2: It depends because, like you know, we said in the film,

992
00:53:17,800 --> 00:53:21,200
Speaker 2: there was the special housing unit and then there is

993
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:25,239
Speaker 2: general population, right, And you know it depends on Now,

994
00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:28,359
Speaker 2: if you're a detainee trying to fight the case mm hmm,

995
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:31,839
Speaker 2: or you're going to just take the plead feel and

996
00:53:31,880 --> 00:53:33,600
Speaker 2: go to the sentence house to just get it over it.

997
00:53:33,640 --> 00:53:35,319
Speaker 2: And nine times out of ten you're just gonna be like,

998
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:38,319
Speaker 2: I take the pleae feel because I need to take

999
00:53:38,360 --> 00:53:39,480
Speaker 2: the buck out of him. How much time are you

1000
00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:39,920
Speaker 2: giving me?

1001
00:53:40,360 --> 00:53:47,799
Speaker 1: Right, Like, let's get this shit over with, yes and so.

1002
00:53:48,360 --> 00:53:50,560
Speaker 2: And that's another thing. We don't have the access of

1003
00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:55,120
Speaker 2: the resources to be posting bail, finding lawyers to fight

1004
00:53:55,200 --> 00:53:59,320
Speaker 2: these cases. Because eventually I learned that like prostitution, loitering,

1005
00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:02,120
Speaker 2: with the intel the charge they're usually trying to get you,

1006
00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:05,520
Speaker 2: it's not even a crime. It has always been a violation, right,

1007
00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:09,160
Speaker 2: Julian fash it up into a misdemeanor with sashing pitches

1008
00:54:09,160 --> 00:54:12,799
Speaker 2: like and right, you know it was a violation. It

1009
00:54:12,880 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 2: was never a cry.

1010
00:54:14,440 --> 00:54:16,600
Speaker 1: But you would never know that because we don't have

1011
00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:21,279
Speaker 1: the resources. We don't have the information and they and

1012
00:54:21,320 --> 00:54:22,160
Speaker 1: they knew that.

1013
00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:25,680
Speaker 2: They got to tell Helen how Water. Yeah, with that

1014
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:28,759
Speaker 2: law's prostitution sh and I always wondered about because I

1015
00:54:28,760 --> 00:54:32,239
Speaker 2: would be like, how are you doing this, like violating

1016
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:35,879
Speaker 2: my constitutional rights? Like you tell me who I could

1017
00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:36,239
Speaker 2: talk to?

1018
00:54:36,800 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 1: Right?

1019
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:40,480
Speaker 2: Right? Okay? If we thought you talking to three people?

1020
00:54:40,719 --> 00:54:43,600
Speaker 2: And so it's not like I was sucking dick on

1021
00:54:43,640 --> 00:54:46,440
Speaker 2: the right child.

1022
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:51,600
Speaker 1: But you know what, I also felt like when I

1023
00:54:51,640 --> 00:54:53,880
Speaker 1: was watching a documentary, I feel like, because I was

1024
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:55,719
Speaker 1: going to ask you, was there any moments that was

1025
00:54:55,800 --> 00:54:57,840
Speaker 1: difficult for you? But I feel like when you was

1026
00:54:57,880 --> 00:55:01,759
Speaker 1: watching yourself and the other document I feel like to me,

1027
00:55:01,920 --> 00:55:03,239
Speaker 1: when I also looking in it, I feel like that

1028
00:55:03,280 --> 00:55:04,319
Speaker 1: was kind of difficult for you?

1029
00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:07,080
Speaker 2: Was it? It was? And I have to mom myself

1030
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:10,319
Speaker 2: because I hated that person I talked to my about

1031
00:55:10,320 --> 00:55:13,880
Speaker 2: myself in a third person. I did, and I was like,

1032
00:55:14,200 --> 00:55:16,320
Speaker 2: you know, because you know, I'm transitioning and stuff, and

1033
00:55:16,320 --> 00:55:18,640
Speaker 2: I'm proud of the woman I became right at the

1034
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:20,400
Speaker 2: end of the day, and I have to think homage

1035
00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:23,879
Speaker 2: to that. That bitch pulled me through so much shit.

1036
00:55:24,080 --> 00:55:25,160
Speaker 1: So where are you at now?

1037
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:29,719
Speaker 2: Facts? Right? So I can't hate on her. Somebody just

1038
00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:31,160
Speaker 2: sent me a clip from the film and it was

1039
00:55:31,200 --> 00:55:34,040
Speaker 2: like me and that era and he was like, oh,

1040
00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:37,440
Speaker 2: you're so beautiful here, and I'm like, I hated that.

1041
00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:40,440
Speaker 2: I was like, you're beautiful here.

1042
00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:40,680
Speaker 3: Mom.

1043
00:55:40,760 --> 00:55:43,560
Speaker 2: I was like, okay, okay, okay, I'll take that. But

1044
00:55:44,120 --> 00:55:46,640
Speaker 2: I did at the time, you know. And then like

1045
00:55:46,800 --> 00:55:51,680
Speaker 2: you know, sometimes we self distract. Yeah, and I'm on

1046
00:55:51,800 --> 00:55:54,000
Speaker 2: the drugs and I'm thinking, nobody know her own cares

1047
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:56,040
Speaker 2: about me because I'm a trans woman and I'm going

1048
00:55:56,080 --> 00:56:00,000
Speaker 2: in and a jail and I can't get an apartment

1049
00:56:00,040 --> 00:56:01,799
Speaker 2: and I can't do this, Like what is my life

1050
00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:07,200
Speaker 2: turned into? Yeah, realizing that there that you can't stand

1051
00:56:08,160 --> 00:56:09,919
Speaker 2: is the one that put you on this path.

1052
00:56:10,239 --> 00:56:14,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, she definitely held it down. That's a fact.

1053
00:56:14,640 --> 00:56:18,799
Speaker 2: So it's like she did hold it down because baby,

1054
00:56:19,040 --> 00:56:20,399
Speaker 2: I'm not built like that no more.

1055
00:56:29,880 --> 00:56:32,000
Speaker 1: I've thinking about the ship that I've done in my past,

1056
00:56:32,239 --> 00:56:34,479
Speaker 1: and I had to forgive myself for being so hard

1057
00:56:34,520 --> 00:56:36,320
Speaker 1: on who I used to be because I'm like, listen,

1058
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:40,280
Speaker 1: that bitch got us through it. Like we are comfortable

1059
00:56:40,280 --> 00:56:46,320
Speaker 1: because of that bitch. Okay, But it's real though, sometimes

1060
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:48,719
Speaker 1: you know, Yeah, yeah, fact.

1061
00:56:48,640 --> 00:56:50,600
Speaker 2: Because that was a fierce little cookie. When I think

1062
00:56:50,640 --> 00:56:53,280
Speaker 2: and retrospect, that's a fierce little cookie.

1063
00:56:53,440 --> 00:56:58,839
Speaker 1: That was a warrior right there. Now, you also make

1064
00:56:58,880 --> 00:57:01,040
Speaker 1: a good point we talked about the earlier in the

1065
00:57:01,080 --> 00:57:05,960
Speaker 1: conversation about how the portrayal of transgender individuals in the

1066
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:10,200
Speaker 1: media has influenced perceptions and attitudes. And I remember being

1067
00:57:10,200 --> 00:57:12,280
Speaker 1: a little kid, and I'm like, yo, you are absolutely

1068
00:57:12,400 --> 00:57:15,520
Speaker 1: right because the way that they introduced the trans community

1069
00:57:15,840 --> 00:57:19,840
Speaker 1: on Jerry Springer and Maury. Looking back on it, I'm like, Yo,

1070
00:57:19,920 --> 00:57:24,120
Speaker 1: are y'all serious, y'all cannot be serious.

1071
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:26,800
Speaker 2: It was that right there. And I grew up watching

1072
00:57:26,800 --> 00:57:30,760
Speaker 2: that stuff, you know. I'd be home schools watching, you know,

1073
00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:34,240
Speaker 2: and then when it came to the transfer and knowing

1074
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:37,040
Speaker 2: it myself and turnally, I'm like, I know, I'm one

1075
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:41,080
Speaker 2: of them. Yeah, you know, and it's like this is

1076
00:57:41,120 --> 00:57:42,240
Speaker 2: so fucking degrading.

1077
00:57:42,720 --> 00:57:43,120
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1078
00:57:43,160 --> 00:57:44,640
Speaker 2: And that was one of the other things I used

1079
00:57:44,640 --> 00:57:46,360
Speaker 2: to do, Like I used to go to the Moray Shaw.

1080
00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:49,480
Speaker 2: I've been to the Jerry spring and show. I've done Maury.

1081
00:57:49,520 --> 00:57:50,960
Speaker 2: I used to go there for the pizza when I

1082
00:57:51,000 --> 00:57:55,360
Speaker 2: was home less. Oh wow, I'd be right up in

1083
00:57:55,360 --> 00:57:59,280
Speaker 2: that audience, and I remember I took some old school

1084
00:57:59,360 --> 00:58:01,920
Speaker 2: cell phone, but like if you turned into a dance

1085
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:06,040
Speaker 2: party and you see everybody around and then Maury comes

1086
00:58:06,040 --> 00:58:07,960
Speaker 2: out and stuff. And I always waited for the ones

1087
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:13,000
Speaker 2: where they would do that, and I'm just like, that's

1088
00:58:13,040 --> 00:58:14,960
Speaker 2: oh and every time everyone's like screaming into me, I'm

1089
00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:18,400
Speaker 2: like and acting the most.

1090
00:58:18,960 --> 00:58:20,280
Speaker 1: Right, right.

1091
00:58:21,120 --> 00:58:26,440
Speaker 2: I would I have to see herself. I would carry

1092
00:58:26,480 --> 00:58:28,240
Speaker 2: on me I'm carrying it. And I would use the Mari'

1093
00:58:28,280 --> 00:58:32,040
Speaker 2: show for pizza. Yeah, I was like, fucking, I gotta

1094
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:33,840
Speaker 2: know SWS today. Let me go to the Morray's show

1095
00:58:33,960 --> 00:58:38,000
Speaker 2: stand in this lawn. Yeah, free pizza for lunch, watch

1096
00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:41,160
Speaker 2: a show, have some place to be, and then I

1097
00:58:41,160 --> 00:58:43,440
Speaker 2: would bust them down and through like three, you know,

1098
00:58:43,760 --> 00:58:45,200
Speaker 2: three episodes a day.

1099
00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:47,800
Speaker 1: Oh wow, you know, yeah, you survive.

1100
00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:50,920
Speaker 2: I'd be right there in the audience. But it was

1101
00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:53,600
Speaker 2: shows like that, and it was like, you know, and

1102
00:58:53,640 --> 00:58:55,520
Speaker 2: that's what started it. It was like, you know, when I

1103
00:58:55,560 --> 00:58:58,240
Speaker 2: was starting to realize like damn Maury and Jerry and

1104
00:58:58,320 --> 00:59:01,240
Speaker 2: all these other shows like back in the day, and

1105
00:59:01,280 --> 00:59:04,840
Speaker 2: then like how they're portraying trans people in a particular point,

1106
00:59:05,040 --> 00:59:07,000
Speaker 2: you know, before the tipping point, and I was like,

1107
00:59:07,080 --> 00:59:09,480
Speaker 2: this is this degrading. This is why nobody takes trans

1108
00:59:09,520 --> 00:59:12,240
Speaker 2: people seriously. Like, I know, I'm a smart woman, not

1109
00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:14,880
Speaker 2: that you're not gonna sit here and have me looking

1110
00:59:14,920 --> 00:59:17,080
Speaker 2: crazy as if I'm a joke. Now I can tell

1111
00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:18,160
Speaker 2: jokes all day.

1112
00:59:18,120 --> 00:59:23,080
Speaker 1: Right, but because a bit is funny, right.

1113
00:59:23,200 --> 00:59:25,680
Speaker 2: But you're not gonna sit here and made me look

1114
00:59:25,680 --> 00:59:31,520
Speaker 2: look crazy, right, right for it being who I am. Like,

1115
00:59:31,600 --> 00:59:33,840
Speaker 2: I'm like, I just got tired of that shit. It's

1116
00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:35,720
Speaker 2: like I've seen girls that came before me, and I

1117
00:59:35,760 --> 00:59:37,800
Speaker 2: see how the world drags them down. You see that

1118
00:59:37,800 --> 00:59:41,000
Speaker 2: through Sylvia, you see that through Martia. That's not just

1119
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:43,400
Speaker 2: because they're drug addicts and stuff. It's about the world,

1120
00:59:43,640 --> 00:59:47,320
Speaker 2: the treating that's the reflection of the world. Yeah, when

1121
00:59:47,360 --> 00:59:49,640
Speaker 2: you see them look like and including myself, you see me,

1122
00:59:49,720 --> 00:59:53,480
Speaker 2: that's the reflection of society and how they see us

1123
00:59:53,480 --> 00:59:55,800
Speaker 2: and how they want us to be. Yeah, you know,

1124
00:59:55,840 --> 00:59:58,880
Speaker 2: and it's just you're beating down because it just it's just.

1125
00:59:58,800 --> 01:00:02,480
Speaker 1: Like an old I was also reading an article that

1126
01:00:02,560 --> 01:00:05,120
Speaker 1: you you was being an interview and you also mentioned

1127
01:00:05,120 --> 01:00:07,880
Speaker 1: sex in the city, and I just recently rewatched the

1128
01:00:07,920 --> 01:00:10,280
Speaker 1: whole Sex and the City series, and I'm like, yo,

1129
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:13,320
Speaker 1: I didn't like it didn't even dawn on me what

1130
01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:15,320
Speaker 1: was going on. And you made a good point on

1131
01:00:15,440 --> 01:00:18,280
Speaker 1: how when Samantha moved to a meatpacking district like that

1132
01:00:18,400 --> 01:00:23,720
Speaker 1: is that's exactly what happened, like things started to shift.

1133
01:00:22,640 --> 01:00:24,400
Speaker 2: Are but they're the ninety film that scene.

1134
01:00:25,040 --> 01:00:26,240
Speaker 1: Oh wow.

1135
01:00:26,920 --> 01:00:30,040
Speaker 2: I lived on Covenant House on Seventeenth Street. I came

1136
01:00:30,040 --> 01:00:33,040
Speaker 2: out that night and I walked down and I seen

1137
01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:38,320
Speaker 2: them so bad. Wow. And I didn't know years, like

1138
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:40,360
Speaker 2: a few years later that it was Sex and the City,

1139
01:00:40,480 --> 01:00:43,520
Speaker 2: like like you just thought it was until a couple

1140
01:00:43,560 --> 01:00:44,320
Speaker 2: of years later.

1141
01:00:44,400 --> 01:00:46,160
Speaker 1: Right, So you just started with some show.

1142
01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:50,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so I seen it and we had it

1143
01:00:50,560 --> 01:00:51,680
Speaker 2: in the film where we had to think it out.

1144
01:00:51,720 --> 01:00:55,400
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna plain. Wow, it's not that bad though,

1145
01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:59,200
Speaker 2: but you know, right, And the show aired re aired

1146
01:00:59,280 --> 01:01:02,480
Speaker 2: with just like that the same day that The Stroll

1147
01:01:02,640 --> 01:01:06,720
Speaker 2: was released. Oh wow, I can't wow.

1148
01:01:08,360 --> 01:01:09,520
Speaker 1: Look at god, y'all.

1149
01:01:10,240 --> 01:01:12,720
Speaker 2: You've seeing the scene and what happened in the area.

1150
01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:14,520
Speaker 2: And I always said it and we allude to it

1151
01:01:14,560 --> 01:01:16,600
Speaker 2: because we had to take it out. But then you

1152
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:20,200
Speaker 2: hear the girls, yeah, and the transvestites are up the street.

1153
01:01:20,240 --> 01:01:22,720
Speaker 2: I went to what role Samantha played and you know,

1154
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,120
Speaker 2: right in all of this and then you see that

1155
01:01:26,160 --> 01:01:28,200
Speaker 2: scene and it was like, and then she becomes Google

1156
01:01:28,200 --> 01:01:30,720
Speaker 2: girl friends with the girls? You know what I think

1157
01:01:30,720 --> 01:01:32,320
Speaker 2: about what I think about, I like it. Where are

1158
01:01:32,320 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 2: those I know, Karen Cover girls not around? But where

1159
01:01:34,680 --> 01:01:38,080
Speaker 2: are carrying them trans friends? Well, Samantha is not on

1160
01:01:38,120 --> 01:01:42,880
Speaker 2: the show them. It's like I say, with being her friends, right, But.

1161
01:01:42,080 --> 01:01:44,400
Speaker 1: Well, listen, I feel like with this new series and

1162
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:46,880
Speaker 1: just like that, I feel like, I mean, it took

1163
01:01:46,920 --> 01:01:48,320
Speaker 1: us a little minute to get here, because I do

1164
01:01:48,360 --> 01:01:51,920
Speaker 1: love the franchise, but I feel like they are now

1165
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:57,600
Speaker 1: introducing more of us. But I do feel like, well,

1166
01:01:57,600 --> 01:01:59,280
Speaker 1: I could tell you don't watch you, do you because

1167
01:01:59,280 --> 01:02:04,080
Speaker 1: you're like, okay, But I will say that I do

1168
01:02:04,120 --> 01:02:07,000
Speaker 1: think it's important that Okay, yeah, we gotta get with

1169
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:09,840
Speaker 1: the program, like where's the trans woman at? Where's the

1170
01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:12,440
Speaker 1: trans man at? Like let's let's let's tell all stories

1171
01:02:12,480 --> 01:02:13,560
Speaker 1: that we're gonna tell some stories.

1172
01:02:14,120 --> 01:02:15,840
Speaker 2: Is in the village?

1173
01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:18,880
Speaker 1: What child the tea is? She sol her apartment because

1174
01:02:18,880 --> 01:02:20,640
Speaker 1: she got back with her one of her old niggas.

1175
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:23,240
Speaker 1: But now he low key eighty six her to be

1176
01:02:23,360 --> 01:02:25,840
Speaker 1: with his kids. So now she's moved. I can't think

1177
01:02:25,840 --> 01:02:30,360
Speaker 1: the neighbor I know, I know, I know an even

1178
01:02:30,440 --> 01:02:34,880
Speaker 1: big die child. So oh, you need to watch it.

1179
01:02:35,560 --> 01:02:36,400
Speaker 1: It's it's really good.

1180
01:02:36,640 --> 01:02:37,640
Speaker 2: I've south.

1181
01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:43,360
Speaker 1: Okay, we're almost finish because I feel like we can

1182
01:02:43,400 --> 01:02:49,440
Speaker 1: KICKI all night. So because of nine to eleven, obviously

1183
01:02:49,560 --> 01:02:51,400
Speaker 1: it affected the girls on the show. So do you

1184
01:02:51,440 --> 01:02:55,560
Speaker 1: feel like the rise of technology and online platforms helped

1185
01:02:55,640 --> 01:02:57,160
Speaker 1: change the landscape of sex work?

1186
01:02:58,320 --> 01:03:01,200
Speaker 2: I do, I ain't wholeheartly because I was there for it.

1187
01:03:01,320 --> 01:03:04,080
Speaker 2: It was like I remember we had the pagers, we

1188
01:03:04,200 --> 01:03:07,000
Speaker 2: had our little pages, and you know, you get the

1189
01:03:07,280 --> 01:03:10,280
Speaker 2: voicemails and the messages and stuff. And then I remember

1190
01:03:10,320 --> 01:03:13,440
Speaker 2: I got my first little Sony ericson cell phone, like

1191
01:03:13,840 --> 01:03:17,200
Speaker 2: it was a voice stream, and you know, and as

1192
01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:19,800
Speaker 2: the years progressed with you know, and the technology is

1193
01:03:19,840 --> 01:03:22,480
Speaker 2: getting better, and then we have her getting the crackslist

1194
01:03:22,640 --> 01:03:23,920
Speaker 2: and stuff, and we would go to the pizza and

1195
01:03:23,960 --> 01:03:26,200
Speaker 2: the computers were popping up all over the place, like

1196
01:03:26,320 --> 01:03:29,800
Speaker 2: in Times Square we had easy everything, like twenty four

1197
01:03:29,880 --> 01:03:33,160
Speaker 2: hour internet cafes and stuff, and we're going in, We're

1198
01:03:33,200 --> 01:03:36,640
Speaker 2: making these ads and stuff. It did change, but I

1199
01:03:36,760 --> 01:03:38,400
Speaker 2: still like street basics.

1200
01:03:39,200 --> 01:03:42,400
Speaker 1: Really just saying well, I'm not gonna lie yet, because

1201
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:45,400
Speaker 1: there's more involved when it comes to technology.

1202
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:47,440
Speaker 2: Right, I think you know after all, like it was

1203
01:03:47,520 --> 01:03:49,920
Speaker 2: qewed at first, and it's cute as a companion to

1204
01:03:50,040 --> 01:03:52,600
Speaker 2: street based work as far as I'm concerned, right, you

1205
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:54,600
Speaker 2: know what I mean? And it was cute, like, oh

1206
01:03:54,800 --> 01:03:56,720
Speaker 2: I can just you know, go over here to this

1207
01:03:56,840 --> 01:04:00,200
Speaker 2: person's house. Now it's like, oh no, the date to

1208
01:04:00,280 --> 01:04:04,440
Speaker 2: your house, that's where the problem becomes. That's where the

1209
01:04:04,520 --> 01:04:06,720
Speaker 2: problem begans. But inviting.

1210
01:04:07,280 --> 01:04:09,680
Speaker 1: But you don't think that it's more safety, more safer

1211
01:04:09,760 --> 01:04:12,720
Speaker 1: for you to do it that way apposed to the

1212
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:13,520
Speaker 1: traditional way.

1213
01:04:13,920 --> 01:04:16,840
Speaker 2: No, because we see so many chances when being murdered

1214
01:04:16,840 --> 01:04:17,520
Speaker 2: in there on home.

1215
01:04:17,760 --> 01:04:23,080
Speaker 1: Well there you go facts, and so you know, at

1216
01:04:23,200 --> 01:04:24,200
Speaker 1: least and me and each.

1217
01:04:24,080 --> 01:04:25,760
Speaker 2: Of are talking about this at this one thing that

1218
01:04:25,800 --> 01:04:28,240
Speaker 2: we were doing it. It's like, you know, why we

1219
01:04:28,440 --> 01:04:31,280
Speaker 2: like street based sex work better than the internet is

1220
01:04:31,320 --> 01:04:34,520
Speaker 2: because you do get a certain connection when you can

1221
01:04:34,600 --> 01:04:37,240
Speaker 2: see a person face to face. You don't know what

1222
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:40,200
Speaker 2: picture that who's behind that picture that's sending you unless

1223
01:04:40,200 --> 01:04:41,840
Speaker 2: you're doing like I guess you could do face time

1224
01:04:41,960 --> 01:04:45,600
Speaker 2: or whatever. That's fine, right, you know, but you can

1225
01:04:45,640 --> 01:04:48,960
Speaker 2: still get a vibe, you can read the energy. You

1226
01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:52,000
Speaker 2: can still right, you can still tell the energy. And

1227
01:04:52,200 --> 01:04:54,480
Speaker 2: with now, with the videos and stuff, it's a lot easier,

1228
01:04:54,960 --> 01:04:57,440
Speaker 2: I guess because now people are more willing to video

1229
01:04:57,600 --> 01:05:00,280
Speaker 2: and face time. Right before we were want to be

1230
01:05:00,320 --> 01:05:02,720
Speaker 2: anonymous on an internet. We wasn't trying to have everybody

1231
01:05:02,800 --> 01:05:05,520
Speaker 2: up in our business right right, you know, And then

1232
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:08,280
Speaker 2: like you know, you get those discreet dates or whatever

1233
01:05:08,360 --> 01:05:10,480
Speaker 2: that don't want to send you their pictures because they

1234
01:05:10,560 --> 01:05:13,240
Speaker 2: got you know, they're cheating on whatever the case may be.

1235
01:05:13,440 --> 01:05:15,240
Speaker 2: And then they just it could be anybody to just

1236
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:17,720
Speaker 2: pop up into your house and you don't know what

1237
01:05:17,840 --> 01:05:21,000
Speaker 2: their intentions are. And I just like the idea that,

1238
01:05:21,120 --> 01:05:23,200
Speaker 2: like I can see who it is I'm talking to,

1239
01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:26,840
Speaker 2: I can sense what is going on in this situation,

1240
01:05:26,960 --> 01:05:29,360
Speaker 2: whether I need to jump out the car or whatever

1241
01:05:29,440 --> 01:05:34,080
Speaker 2: the case may be, or control where we're going. I

1242
01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:35,640
Speaker 2: don't know. It's just maybe because I just come from

1243
01:05:35,640 --> 01:05:38,800
Speaker 2: a different era, Like you know, I prefer that because

1244
01:05:38,800 --> 01:05:42,040
Speaker 2: I think it's just more game playing on the Internet

1245
01:05:42,120 --> 01:05:45,640
Speaker 2: than just the straight up business part of seeing and

1246
01:05:45,720 --> 01:05:48,280
Speaker 2: meeting people face to face, like time are you going

1247
01:05:48,320 --> 01:05:50,000
Speaker 2: back and forth on the text message that you want

1248
01:05:50,000 --> 01:05:50,200
Speaker 2: to say?

1249
01:05:50,720 --> 01:05:51,800
Speaker 1: Like what what are we going to do?

1250
01:05:52,400 --> 01:05:53,439
Speaker 2: Right right?

1251
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:56,480
Speaker 1: Like let's get to it now? What are we doing nigga?

1252
01:05:56,520 --> 01:05:56,680
Speaker 3: Yeah?

1253
01:05:58,400 --> 01:06:00,760
Speaker 2: Old day. If you make a decision, it's like it's

1254
01:06:00,800 --> 01:06:03,400
Speaker 2: either we're going on right now or what Like I

1255
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:06,120
Speaker 2: don't have time for this. I don't I don't have

1256
01:06:06,240 --> 01:06:07,400
Speaker 2: time right.

1257
01:06:09,840 --> 01:06:12,000
Speaker 1: I feel like you a non nonsense person, Like what

1258
01:06:12,160 --> 01:06:16,160
Speaker 1: do you want nigga? Do you want it enough? Because

1259
01:06:16,200 --> 01:06:18,040
Speaker 1: I ain't got time. I got I got ship to.

1260
01:06:18,040 --> 01:06:21,240
Speaker 2: Do exactly, Like the negotiation is easier then it was

1261
01:06:21,320 --> 01:06:23,840
Speaker 2: just like okay, come, come, come one, like give me

1262
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:27,560
Speaker 2: my coin, like stop playing you know now they want

1263
01:06:27,600 --> 01:06:29,920
Speaker 2: to play with you now they want to sit there

1264
01:06:29,960 --> 01:06:32,760
Speaker 2: and be undecided or they're probably talking to twenty other

1265
01:06:32,800 --> 01:06:36,360
Speaker 2: girls at once. Yeah, so they're undecided, and it's like,

1266
01:06:36,400 --> 01:06:40,680
Speaker 2: I don't have time. I don't like my money right

1267
01:06:40,720 --> 01:06:44,040
Speaker 2: now right now.

1268
01:06:44,120 --> 01:06:46,920
Speaker 1: After avoiding the meatpacking district for years due to your

1269
01:06:46,960 --> 01:06:50,160
Speaker 1: personal fears, how does it feel to come full circle

1270
01:06:50,280 --> 01:06:51,240
Speaker 1: and be present in this.

1271
01:06:51,400 --> 01:06:54,160
Speaker 2: Moment we were talking about going back to the beginning

1272
01:06:54,200 --> 01:06:56,920
Speaker 2: of the conversation and that I'm the happiest I've ever been.

1273
01:06:57,080 --> 01:07:00,240
Speaker 2: I think it is a full circle moment. Yeah, it is,

1274
01:07:00,320 --> 01:07:02,480
Speaker 2: because if you think about those days and the gritty,

1275
01:07:02,720 --> 01:07:06,120
Speaker 2: dark sank ass streets. Yeah, I've always wanted to be

1276
01:07:06,160 --> 01:07:10,880
Speaker 2: a filmmaker and thought meet my transitioning stifled any chance

1277
01:07:10,960 --> 01:07:14,960
Speaker 2: of doing that. And so to sit here today and

1278
01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:20,400
Speaker 2: actually be a filmmaker, yeah, and to have a sun

1279
01:07:20,520 --> 01:07:25,080
Speaker 2: Dance Award, yeah, you know, and it's just like wow,

1280
01:07:25,680 --> 01:07:29,760
Speaker 2: like it is a full socle moment, and remembering younger

1281
01:07:30,560 --> 01:07:35,040
Speaker 2: the warrior, you know, and like all the steps it

1282
01:07:35,080 --> 01:07:36,920
Speaker 2: took to get here and stuff, and it has not

1283
01:07:37,120 --> 01:07:39,320
Speaker 2: been an easy road, you know, but none of it

1284
01:07:39,520 --> 01:07:39,960
Speaker 2: was in vain.

1285
01:07:40,520 --> 01:07:41,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know.

1286
01:07:41,440 --> 01:07:44,480
Speaker 2: And we're still here. We're blessed, we're alive, we're breathing.

1287
01:07:45,040 --> 01:07:47,360
Speaker 2: I was just telling my friend last night about how

1288
01:07:47,720 --> 01:07:49,760
Speaker 2: I was always so worried about the future, always so

1289
01:07:49,840 --> 01:07:51,680
Speaker 2: worried about the future, and now the future is here.

1290
01:07:52,280 --> 01:07:53,560
Speaker 2: I gotta worry about the future again.

1291
01:07:53,640 --> 01:07:59,080
Speaker 1: I know, like we never satisfying, right, It's like.

1292
01:07:59,160 --> 01:08:01,280
Speaker 2: Now when you're present in the future that you wish

1293
01:08:01,360 --> 01:08:05,440
Speaker 2: to now, it was like, Okay, what's the future going

1294
01:08:05,520 --> 01:08:08,360
Speaker 2: to look like? Now? You know, especially when you ain't

1295
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:09,160
Speaker 2: getting no younger.

1296
01:08:09,280 --> 01:08:15,000
Speaker 3: Now listen, you know, yes, right, start preparing for them,

1297
01:08:15,560 --> 01:08:20,680
Speaker 3: the older old and olden day years, you know, right right,

1298
01:08:20,840 --> 01:08:23,840
Speaker 3: And so it's like, what's the next adventure now?

1299
01:08:23,920 --> 01:08:26,800
Speaker 1: At this point, is your family proud of you?

1300
01:08:28,880 --> 01:08:32,040
Speaker 2: Yes? They are. That's good because you know, one of

1301
01:08:32,120 --> 01:08:35,840
Speaker 2: my cousins is a corrections officer and he was who

1302
01:08:36,240 --> 01:08:37,920
Speaker 2: he's I have older cousins because my mother was the

1303
01:08:37,960 --> 01:08:40,120
Speaker 2: only kid, so all her cousins or my cousins, but

1304
01:08:40,320 --> 01:08:45,000
Speaker 2: they're older, and he's a corrections officer at Rikers, and

1305
01:08:45,160 --> 01:08:47,479
Speaker 2: I'm you know, of course, like, oh my god, my

1306
01:08:47,640 --> 01:08:51,840
Speaker 2: little ass on Rikers Allen as a trans woman when

1307
01:08:51,840 --> 01:08:53,560
Speaker 2: I used to hear all the ship they used to

1308
01:08:53,640 --> 01:08:57,799
Speaker 2: talk right back in the day, but he had cold instead.

1309
01:08:57,800 --> 01:09:01,479
Speaker 2: He's seen it and he loved dead and they're proud

1310
01:09:01,520 --> 01:09:03,280
Speaker 2: of me. All that stuff.

1311
01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:08,559
Speaker 1: So good. Well, listen, I'm super proud of that. I'm

1312
01:09:08,600 --> 01:09:11,400
Speaker 1: super proud of you, sus I feel like, you know,

1313
01:09:11,560 --> 01:09:14,280
Speaker 1: just watching that documentary, I thought it was so beautiful.

1314
01:09:14,439 --> 01:09:20,000
Speaker 1: I thought that it show the full spectrum of pretty

1315
01:09:20,080 --> 01:09:24,400
Speaker 1: much everyone experience because not only did Giuliani and everything

1316
01:09:24,439 --> 01:09:27,240
Speaker 1: that went on within that area affected the trans community,

1317
01:09:27,240 --> 01:09:31,400
Speaker 1: but it also affected all of us because, like we said, yeah,

1318
01:09:31,720 --> 01:09:35,120
Speaker 1: because like you said, yeah, that area is no longer

1319
01:09:35,200 --> 01:09:36,680
Speaker 1: New York is not what it used to be.

1320
01:09:38,040 --> 01:09:40,559
Speaker 2: And it started with that area. If you look through

1321
01:09:40,600 --> 01:09:44,519
Speaker 2: the stuff he started, that was the pilot program for

1322
01:09:44,720 --> 01:09:48,680
Speaker 2: his quality of life. Yeah, and then it stretched out

1323
01:09:48,720 --> 01:09:51,240
Speaker 2: into Times Square and well they were already trying to

1324
01:09:51,280 --> 01:09:53,600
Speaker 2: clean up Times Square before he got there. But you know,

1325
01:09:54,120 --> 01:09:57,720
Speaker 2: he really like me troll the boothstores and such. I mean,

1326
01:09:57,800 --> 01:09:59,439
Speaker 2: he was playing in my money period.

1327
01:09:59,680 --> 01:10:02,120
Speaker 1: And now, Chah, you took the words out of my

1328
01:10:02,160 --> 01:10:05,960
Speaker 1: fucking mouth. I'm like, look at this nigga with little mugshot, child,

1329
01:10:07,880 --> 01:10:10,040
Speaker 1: I'm like, yo, God got a sense of humor, child,

1330
01:10:12,160 --> 01:10:14,679
Speaker 1: He got a sense of humor. He it's clean as shop.

1331
01:10:15,200 --> 01:10:17,479
Speaker 1: But I thought this was amazing and I'm super proud

1332
01:10:17,520 --> 01:10:20,600
Speaker 1: of you. So, last, but not least, what impact do

1333
01:10:20,680 --> 01:10:23,800
Speaker 1: you hope this documentary would have on when it comes

1334
01:10:23,840 --> 01:10:28,080
Speaker 1: to increasing the awareness and understanding of transgender experiences?

1335
01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:32,679
Speaker 2: Oh? I hope for one, for the younger trans people

1336
01:10:32,880 --> 01:10:34,760
Speaker 2: know that they have a history and that these are

1337
01:10:34,920 --> 01:10:38,240
Speaker 2: things that have been fought for and for people who

1338
01:10:38,360 --> 01:10:41,600
Speaker 2: know nothing about trans people and their experiences here. It

1339
01:10:41,720 --> 01:10:43,400
Speaker 2: is a lot of people contact me and it was like,

1340
01:10:43,439 --> 01:10:45,479
Speaker 2: oh my god, I had no clue that that was

1341
01:10:45,560 --> 01:10:47,640
Speaker 2: even going on, or like that's what it was like.

1342
01:10:47,800 --> 01:10:50,040
Speaker 2: I mean, you only see what you've seen in the film,

1343
01:10:50,120 --> 01:10:53,160
Speaker 2: but it can get it yeah, more than just that,

1344
01:10:53,600 --> 01:10:56,560
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. And so just taking away that,

1345
01:10:56,880 --> 01:11:02,200
Speaker 2: like you know, we have always been here, we will

1346
01:11:02,240 --> 01:11:05,519
Speaker 2: always be here, just like y'all. Like you know, I

1347
01:11:05,680 --> 01:11:08,920
Speaker 2: was all these conversations have been having, but it's just

1348
01:11:09,080 --> 01:11:12,720
Speaker 2: like like like I was just saying, like how we

1349
01:11:12,880 --> 01:11:15,320
Speaker 2: have the AIDS epidemic and how they eats epidemic wiped

1350
01:11:15,360 --> 01:11:20,400
Speaker 2: out so many people, right, and you know for those

1351
01:11:20,479 --> 01:11:23,519
Speaker 2: that hated homeoons and trans people, right, they're like yes,

1352
01:11:23,960 --> 01:11:27,000
Speaker 2: it's you know, depopulate them and all this other stuff.

1353
01:11:27,040 --> 01:11:29,880
Speaker 2: And the thing, look how we came back. Look how

1354
01:11:30,000 --> 01:11:33,120
Speaker 2: the bounce back happened. And if that's not nature or

1355
01:11:33,280 --> 01:11:36,200
Speaker 2: God's will, I don't know what is. Because we came

1356
01:11:36,280 --> 01:11:38,600
Speaker 2: back out of that epidemic in full force, and we

1357
01:11:38,720 --> 01:11:43,800
Speaker 2: are not planning right, Like the community has been replenished

1358
01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:47,519
Speaker 2: with all those souls loss from four and now look

1359
01:11:47,680 --> 01:11:50,280
Speaker 2: now look at everything, Look at all the visibility and

1360
01:11:50,439 --> 01:11:53,920
Speaker 2: look how you know many queer people are out here now.

1361
01:11:53,960 --> 01:11:56,040
Speaker 2: It seems like, you know, sometimes I think the Straits

1362
01:11:56,080 --> 01:12:00,840
Speaker 2: are actually outnumbered. I mean to when you really think

1363
01:12:00,920 --> 01:12:04,640
Speaker 2: about it. Yeah, yeah, people just want to like experience

1364
01:12:04,720 --> 01:12:07,519
Speaker 2: and be free, and you know, people.

1365
01:12:07,400 --> 01:12:10,519
Speaker 1: Just want to be fun. Yeah, I think that's what

1366
01:12:10,640 --> 01:12:12,360
Speaker 1: it is. I feel like people are just tiring to

1367
01:12:12,439 --> 01:12:14,640
Speaker 1: be tired of being in a box. Like people. I

1368
01:12:14,680 --> 01:12:16,320
Speaker 1: think people just want to be in a space where

1369
01:12:16,360 --> 01:12:17,880
Speaker 1: they can just do whatever the fuck they want to do.

1370
01:12:17,920 --> 01:12:19,479
Speaker 1: And that's why I think that as long as you're

1371
01:12:19,560 --> 01:12:22,080
Speaker 1: happy and you're safe, I don't care what you do.

1372
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:24,360
Speaker 1: I want you to be happy, because it's hard being

1373
01:12:24,400 --> 01:12:28,080
Speaker 1: a person of killing this wid exactly and who you

1374
01:12:28,240 --> 01:12:31,920
Speaker 1: love right and keep it moving.

1375
01:12:32,280 --> 01:12:34,600
Speaker 2: Ain't nobody right about Who've go mind of it and

1376
01:12:34,720 --> 01:12:36,680
Speaker 2: let them love who they love, and you love who

1377
01:12:36,840 --> 01:12:39,560
Speaker 2: love and just be happy. It's too short, like I

1378
01:12:39,640 --> 01:12:42,160
Speaker 2: realized now, like as you get alter, it's like life.

1379
01:12:42,479 --> 01:12:44,719
Speaker 2: Why do we fight about the things that we fight about?

1380
01:12:45,160 --> 01:12:46,840
Speaker 2: Why do we have these systems and things set in

1381
01:12:46,920 --> 01:12:49,080
Speaker 2: place for something that is so short that we will

1382
01:12:49,120 --> 01:12:52,120
Speaker 2: take with us into our grades, Like why go through

1383
01:12:52,200 --> 01:12:55,400
Speaker 2: all of that? It doesn't make any sense. Yeah, I'm

1384
01:12:55,439 --> 01:12:57,160
Speaker 2: not trying to live life like that. That's why I'm

1385
01:12:57,240 --> 01:12:59,320
Speaker 2: just like, I'm not even paying attention to none of that,

1386
01:12:59,680 --> 01:13:01,320
Speaker 2: you know. It's just like I just want to just

1387
01:13:01,760 --> 01:13:05,120
Speaker 2: be me like and be happy and live my life

1388
01:13:05,200 --> 01:13:09,639
Speaker 2: and have friends and live life and you know, until

1389
01:13:09,680 --> 01:13:11,439
Speaker 2: I can't live it no more. Like I don't want

1390
01:13:11,479 --> 01:13:16,320
Speaker 2: to be stressing about who hates me to color my

1391
01:13:16,520 --> 01:13:18,840
Speaker 2: skin or what gender they perceive me.

1392
01:13:20,160 --> 01:13:23,560
Speaker 1: It's so silly, right right, And listen, you can have

1393
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:29,599
Speaker 1: a whole documentary on HBO Max. Like listen, life is good, okay,

1394
01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:33,320
Speaker 1: And speaking of new documentary, woman, this last question, I

1395
01:13:33,400 --> 01:13:35,599
Speaker 1: feel like a lot of things was probably left out.

1396
01:13:35,720 --> 01:13:38,320
Speaker 1: So are we in the stroll too? Because if we are,

1397
01:13:38,439 --> 01:13:40,200
Speaker 1: I need tickets.

1398
01:13:39,920 --> 01:13:43,040
Speaker 2: Question, And you are so right, because there are lots

1399
01:13:43,080 --> 01:13:45,479
Speaker 2: of things that were left out, and there's still lots

1400
01:13:45,520 --> 01:13:48,720
Speaker 2: of things that I've been thinking, like damn, if this

1401
01:13:48,960 --> 01:13:50,559
Speaker 2: is there, I think it would have made the song

1402
01:13:50,720 --> 01:13:53,840
Speaker 2: so much better, or like I get a lot of that.

1403
01:13:55,439 --> 01:13:57,800
Speaker 2: I don't know, it's something I have to think about.

1404
01:13:57,880 --> 01:14:03,559
Speaker 2: I mean, the material is definitely there, you know, let's

1405
01:14:03,560 --> 01:14:05,880
Speaker 2: see how the story really does and then how could

1406
01:14:05,960 --> 01:14:08,920
Speaker 2: my nunage them to give us like a follow up

1407
01:14:09,040 --> 01:14:10,519
Speaker 2: for but what would I name it?

1408
01:14:10,600 --> 01:14:14,120
Speaker 1: Was it the stroll to or to Let's keep it

1409
01:14:14,200 --> 01:14:19,639
Speaker 1: going the aftermath or whichever angle you want to take

1410
01:14:19,720 --> 01:14:21,160
Speaker 1: it from. But I feel like because even when I

1411
01:14:21,240 --> 01:14:22,840
Speaker 1: was watching, I was like, Wow, I wonder what this

1412
01:14:22,920 --> 01:14:25,400
Speaker 1: would have been if this was included or this was

1413
01:14:25,479 --> 01:14:27,560
Speaker 1: not included, or if this route was taken. Like, I

1414
01:14:27,640 --> 01:14:29,920
Speaker 1: feel like there's just so much history that we can

1415
01:14:29,960 --> 01:14:31,400
Speaker 1: definitely get maybe the documentary.

1416
01:14:31,760 --> 01:14:36,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think like now because I do like part

1417
01:14:36,160 --> 01:14:40,000
Speaker 2: of my dream was to, you know, be a filmmaker.

1418
01:14:40,160 --> 01:14:41,960
Speaker 2: I kind of want to get into narrative, and I

1419
01:14:42,040 --> 01:14:44,920
Speaker 2: think all the stories that were missed out on or

1420
01:14:45,040 --> 01:14:48,760
Speaker 2: people that we couldn't highlight or you know, or things

1421
01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:53,479
Speaker 2: that were possibly overlooked in a narrative setting. Yeah, definitely

1422
01:14:53,760 --> 01:14:56,560
Speaker 2: tell a lot of stories in a dramatic way, you know,

1423
01:14:56,880 --> 01:15:00,240
Speaker 2: and it's something that I would I would really like

1424
01:15:00,320 --> 01:15:00,839
Speaker 2: t explore.

1425
01:15:01,720 --> 01:15:04,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, So however I can support you, please let me

1426
01:15:04,560 --> 01:15:07,919
Speaker 1: know because I need to be at the private screening

1427
01:15:08,920 --> 01:15:12,640
Speaker 1: at this movie, at the second documentary, and then just

1428
01:15:12,720 --> 01:15:16,000
Speaker 1: imagine the amount of stories that you would share that

1429
01:15:16,080 --> 01:15:19,000
Speaker 1: would help others find their voice to share their story,

1430
01:15:19,400 --> 01:15:20,960
Speaker 1: Like that's what it's all about. And that's why I

1431
01:15:21,080 --> 01:15:23,400
Speaker 1: keep telling people like if you have a vision or

1432
01:15:23,439 --> 01:15:26,800
Speaker 1: a got some shit, just be bigger than us. Yeah,

1433
01:15:27,360 --> 01:15:29,639
Speaker 1: but thank you so much. I appreciate you. I feel

1434
01:15:29,640 --> 01:15:31,680
Speaker 1: like we've been key keying for a minute, so I

1435
01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:35,439
Speaker 1: appreciate your time. We were talking about our teeth, y'all.

1436
01:15:35,720 --> 01:15:37,719
Speaker 1: So I know she is about to say some taling

1437
01:15:37,800 --> 01:15:41,400
Speaker 1: on and call it a night, because I know t

1438
01:15:41,600 --> 01:15:44,040
Speaker 1: pain is no joke. But to the listeners, if you

1439
01:15:44,080 --> 01:15:46,120
Speaker 1: have any questions, comings, and concerns, please make sure to

1440
01:15:46,160 --> 01:15:49,280
Speaker 1: email me at hello at the psgpodcast dot com. And

1441
01:15:49,560 --> 01:15:50,679
Speaker 1: until next time.

1442
01:15:50,680 --> 01:15:55,120
Speaker 2: Everyone Later, by everybody.

1443
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:05,080
Speaker 1: The Professional Homegirl Podcast is a production of the Black

1444
01:16:05,120 --> 01:16:09,080
Speaker 1: Effect podcast Network. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the

1445
01:16:09,160 --> 01:16:12,320
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

1446
01:16:12,360 --> 01:16:15,400
Speaker 1: favorite shows. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show,

1447
01:16:15,720 --> 01:16:18,120
Speaker 1: and you can connect with me on social media at

1448
01:16:18,200 --> 01:16:19,439
Speaker 1: the PHG podcast