WEBVTT - The Algorithm

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<v Speaker 1>The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely

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<v Speaker 1>those of the authors and participants and do not necessarily

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<v Speaker 1>represent those of iHeart Media, Tenderfoot TV, or their employees.

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<v Speaker 1>This series contains discussions of violence and sexual violence. Listener

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<v Speaker 1>discretion is advised. Last time an algorithm. Lorie Townsend more

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<v Speaker 1>in the death of her daughter, Africa Hardy, don't think

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<v Speaker 1>that you know everything about child, because there's something that

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<v Speaker 1>they're not telling you. After moving to Chicago when she

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<v Speaker 1>was nineteen, Africa started escorting. In October, detectives found her

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<v Speaker 1>strangled in the bathtub of an Indiana motel. I just

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<v Speaker 1>think a lot of it, and I think it could

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<v Speaker 1>have been prevented. Years earlier, journalist Thomas Hargrove had learned

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<v Speaker 1>about the concept of linkage blindness. Most connected murders go unrecognized,

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<v Speaker 1>and I kept that in the back of my mind.

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<v Speaker 1>And then when Hargrove discovered an FBI database that tracked homicides,

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<v Speaker 1>it gave him an idea, could we teach a computer

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<v Speaker 1>to identify connected cases to find serial killings? From my

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<v Speaker 1>Heart Media and Tenderfoot TV, this is algorithm I'm ben

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<v Speaker 1>Keebrick I mentioned in the last episode that Africa's case

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<v Speaker 1>flipped what I knew about crime on its head this

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<v Speaker 1>episode you'll see why. Let's jump back to my conversation

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<v Speaker 1>with Thomas Hargrove. So, at what point in my um

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<v Speaker 1>you were saying that we shouldn't ignore her. Grove told

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<v Speaker 1>me that back in two thousand four, when he was

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<v Speaker 1>working as an investigative reporter in Washington, d C. He

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<v Speaker 1>had come across a database with information about homicides all

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<v Speaker 1>across the US. He wondered whether an algorithm could find

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<v Speaker 1>patterns within that data and to text serial killers. Maybe

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<v Speaker 1>it could even be used to detect active serial killers

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<v Speaker 1>who had not yet been caught. I did not know

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<v Speaker 1>that such an algorithm was possible. I was going on faith.

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<v Speaker 1>I did believe that it was important, and I did

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<v Speaker 1>believe that it could save lives, but I didn't know

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<v Speaker 1>that it would work. I begged my editors, let me

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<v Speaker 1>try this. Let's do a project looking at murder, with

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<v Speaker 1>the understanding that the actual goal is to see if

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<v Speaker 1>we could create a computer program that would identify serial murder.

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<v Speaker 1>But remember this was back in two thousand four, years

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<v Speaker 1>before people were talking about things like machine learning or

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<v Speaker 1>the power of big data. Because Harder was on the

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<v Speaker 1>cutting edge of these ideas, it was sometimes difficult to

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<v Speaker 1>get other people to understand him or to take him serious.

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<v Speaker 1>Lee My editors recognized that this could be something very cool,

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<v Speaker 1>that this could make news, but it's hard to commit

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<v Speaker 1>to a project you don't know upfront whether it's possible. Ultimately,

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<v Speaker 1>his editors told him that trying to design an algorithm

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<v Speaker 1>sounded too risky. It's normal for story pitches, especially ambitious

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<v Speaker 1>ones like this, to get rejected, but what's unusual is

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<v Speaker 1>that Hargrove didn't give up For the next six years.

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<v Speaker 1>He kept pitching the story six years, and he says

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<v Speaker 1>that his editors always considered it but would end up

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<v Speaker 1>assigning him to another safer story. Then, in two thousand ten,

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<v Speaker 1>Hargrove got his big break. He had just published a

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<v Speaker 1>provocative piece called Saving Babies, exposing sudden infant death. Hargrove

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<v Speaker 1>had analyzed data from Corners offices all across the US

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<v Speaker 1>and found that many times when infant deaths were listed

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<v Speaker 1>as sid's sudden infant death syndrome, the evidence actually showed

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<v Speaker 1>that the infants had died of accidental cufifocations. Most of

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<v Speaker 1>the time, babies don't die mysteriously. They die from avoidable

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<v Speaker 1>accidents and unsafe sleeping conditions. They got covered up because

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<v Speaker 1>of what was intended to be a very kindly diagnosis

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<v Speaker 1>called SIDS. That was meant to be a kindness to parents.

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<v Speaker 1>There was a mistake. This project prompted a national conference

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<v Speaker 1>to re examine infant death. It caused the creation of

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<v Speaker 1>a sudden Infant Death monitoring system by the CDC. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>it was tremendously successful. It had got rave attention. Finally,

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<v Speaker 1>after six years, my stock was high enough in the

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<v Speaker 1>newsroom that I was able to get them to look

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<v Speaker 1>at murder. My editors that, okay, Tom, you've got a year.

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<v Speaker 1>I could do a national reporting project looking at unsolved murder,

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<v Speaker 1>with the understanding that what we were really about was

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<v Speaker 1>to try to develop a statistical means to identify overlooked

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<v Speaker 1>serial murder. Could we teach a computer to find serial killings?

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<v Speaker 1>After years of dreaming about making this algorithm, now Hargrove

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<v Speaker 1>had this chance to try and make it work. Hargrove

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<v Speaker 1>starting to design a computer program, one that could comb

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<v Speaker 1>through the five hundred thousand supplemental homicide reports and find

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<v Speaker 1>patterns between victims, patterns that might suggest the work of

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<v Speaker 1>a serial killer. So what is an algorithm? These days?

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<v Speaker 1>Algorithms dictate much of our digital lives. They determine what

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<v Speaker 1>TV shows get suggested to us, post we see on Facebook,

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<v Speaker 1>what route our GPS takes us on. Often these algorithms

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<v Speaker 1>are black boxes. We're not sure what data is being

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<v Speaker 1>fed into them and how they're deciding what to spit

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<v Speaker 1>back out. But at their core, algorithms aren't mysterious. They're

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<v Speaker 1>not even really that complicated. Algorithms are just sets of

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<v Speaker 1>instructions used to accomplish a specific task. You could say

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<v Speaker 1>a cake recipe is an algorithm for baking a cake.

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<v Speaker 1>You wouldn't say that, but you could. But while following

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<v Speaker 1>an algorithm might be simple, designing a whole new algorithm

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<v Speaker 1>is trickier. It wasn't like Cargroove was just baking a

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<v Speaker 1>cake from scratch. It was more like he was trying

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<v Speaker 1>to invent a brand new dessert. What we were doing

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<v Speaker 1>with the algorithm was the process literally of trial and error.

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<v Speaker 1>The ability to experiment with data was critical. If you're

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<v Speaker 1>trying to come up with a new dessert, might experiment

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<v Speaker 1>with ingredients until you come up with a combination that

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<v Speaker 1>tastes good. Hargrove knew what ingredients he had to play with.

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<v Speaker 1>That was the data from the supplemental homicide report, which

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<v Speaker 1>listed the weapon that was used he was shot with

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<v Speaker 1>a handgun, the time and location of the murder January,

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<v Speaker 1>and the age, race, and sex of the victim. Victim

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<v Speaker 1>is a blackmail eighteen years old. But as he experimented

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<v Speaker 1>with how an algorithm might sort through that data, Hargrove

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<v Speaker 1>needed a way to check if he was on the

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<v Speaker 1>right track. So we decided to test each new prototype

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<v Speaker 1>of his algorithm to see if it could detect a

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<v Speaker 1>known serial killer. We used as our test bed the

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<v Speaker 1>forty eight victims of serial killer Gary Ridgeway, so called

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<v Speaker 1>Green River Killer. He was convicted convicted in a court

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<v Speaker 1>of law of murdering forty eight girls and women in

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<v Speaker 1>the Seattle area. The question was, we'd teach a computer

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<v Speaker 1>a process that would tell us that something god awful

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<v Speaker 1>happened in Seattle. At the time, Gary Ridgeway was thought

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<v Speaker 1>to be the most prolific serial killer in America. Her

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<v Speaker 1>group figured if he could create an algorithm that could

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<v Speaker 1>detect Ridgeway. Maybe it would also detect other serial killers

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<v Speaker 1>that had gone unrecognized. To motivate himself, Hargrove stuck up

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<v Speaker 1>a picture of Gary Ridgeway in his office. It was

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<v Speaker 1>one of his booking photographs. He was glowering and looked

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<v Speaker 1>like it was glowering at me. Under that picture, I

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<v Speaker 1>typed the headline, what do serial victims look like? Statistically?

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<v Speaker 1>For over two decades, Ridgeway had killed women and dumped

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<v Speaker 1>their bodies along the Green River outside Seattle. In most cases,

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<v Speaker 1>by the time anyone had discovered those corpses, they were

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<v Speaker 1>already skeletal. Ridgeway has snuffed out does sense of lives.

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<v Speaker 1>He'd killed women and girls with their own hopes and dreams.

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<v Speaker 1>But Hargrove needed to approach their deaths like the algorithm would,

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<v Speaker 1>looking at their cases by their numbers, using only the

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<v Speaker 1>data from the FBI's supplemental homicide reports. So what did

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<v Speaker 1>ridgeways victims look like? Statistically? And more broadly, what do

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<v Speaker 1>a serial killer's victims look like? To find out, I

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<v Speaker 1>reached out to one of Hargrove's collaborators, Dr Mike A. Mott.

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<v Speaker 1>A Mott is a forensic psychology professor at Radford University,

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<v Speaker 1>and he curates the world's largest database of serial killers

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<v Speaker 1>and their victims. If you look at how serial killers

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<v Speaker 1>are portrayed in movies or on TV, the stereotypes not

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<v Speaker 1>really very consistent with with the back Are these also

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<v Speaker 1>stereotypes that law enforcement might have when they're trying to

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<v Speaker 1>decide could this murder possibly be a serial murder? Well,

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<v Speaker 1>law enforcement certainly has the same stereotypes. When we've done

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<v Speaker 1>presentations to law enforcement groups and even clinical psychologists that

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<v Speaker 1>are police psychologists, they're very surprised at the results. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>talking to Professor Mike al Mott about what serial murders

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<v Speaker 1>look like statistically, because statistical differences between serial killings and

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<v Speaker 1>other homicides are the kind of signatures and algorithm could

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<v Speaker 1>use to detect a serial killer. Professor Amatt has built

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<v Speaker 1>a database with information on thousands of serial killers, and

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<v Speaker 1>he told me that there are many misconceptions about these killers,

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<v Speaker 1>even within law enforcement and the true crime community. The

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<v Speaker 1>stereotypes about the profile of a serial killer or pro

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<v Speaker 1>file of the victims is not really very consistent with

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<v Speaker 1>the facts. If we want to catch serial killers, we

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<v Speaker 1>need to know who they really are in the reality

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<v Speaker 1>of their crimes. I want you to stop for a

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<v Speaker 1>moment and try to conjure up a mental image of

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<v Speaker 1>a typical serial killers victim. How old are they, what

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<v Speaker 1>do they look like? Now, imagine all of the victims

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<v Speaker 1>of a single killer. What would you guess they have

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<v Speaker 1>in common with one another? If we look at the

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<v Speaker 1>victims of serial killers, of the victims or women or

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<v Speaker 1>forty nine or men, so there's not really much of

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<v Speaker 1>a difference there. One of the stereotypes about serial killers

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<v Speaker 1>is that they have a type, you know, kinde of

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<v Speaker 1>victim that they're going to kill. The most consistent profile

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<v Speaker 1>we can have is really in the age category of

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<v Speaker 1>who they're killing. About are going to kill people that

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<v Speaker 1>are in the same age categories, so it's children, or

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<v Speaker 1>its teens, or its adults or elderly. Serial Killers are

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<v Speaker 1>less consistent when it comes to other attributes of their victims.

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<v Speaker 1>For example, only six kill victims there are all male

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<v Speaker 1>or all female. And then if you look at race,

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<v Speaker 1>for example, of serial killers only kill somebody of the

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<v Speaker 1>same race. And while the stereotypical victim of a serial

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<v Speaker 1>killer is white, actually a third of victims or people

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<v Speaker 1>of color. For Gary Ridgeway, the serial killer that Hargrove

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<v Speaker 1>picked as his test case, all his known victims were

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<v Speaker 1>young women, but they were diverse in terms of race.

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<v Speaker 1>In an interview with an FBI agent, Ridgeway says he

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<v Speaker 1>targeted prostitutes out of convenience, and studies show that there's

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<v Speaker 1>actually been a dramatic rise in serial killers targeting sex workers.

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<v Speaker 1>In the seventies, prostitutes are thought to have made up

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<v Speaker 1>around six of the female victims of serial killers. By

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<v Speaker 1>the two thousands, more than two thirds of women murdered

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<v Speaker 1>by serial killers were sex workers. Many serial killings are

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<v Speaker 1>sexual in nature. About one third of serial killers rape

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<v Speaker 1>at least one of their victims. Ridgeway told detectives he'd

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<v Speaker 1>have sex with his victims before he strangled them, and

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<v Speaker 1>when asked why he chose to choke all his victims,

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<v Speaker 1>Ridgeway replied because that was more personal and more rewarding

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<v Speaker 1>than shooting them. And compared to typical murderers, serial killers

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<v Speaker 1>are more likely to use methods that are up close

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<v Speaker 1>and personal, like strangulation or bludgending. So if we're looking

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<v Speaker 1>at victims in the US about were shot, were strangled

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<v Speaker 1>were stabbed and ten percent were blugend and serial killers

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<v Speaker 1>tend to be consistent in the method they used to kill.

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<v Speaker 1>Amont says that two thirds of serial killers use only

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<v Speaker 1>a single means to kill their victims. So what are

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<v Speaker 1>the takeaways from a MOOTS data? Serial killers show some

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<v Speaker 1>but not perfect consistency in terms of their victims age, race,

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<v Speaker 1>and sex, and also in their method of killing. But

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<v Speaker 1>it turns out that there's one more thing that serial

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<v Speaker 1>homicides tend to have in common, a property that would

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<v Speaker 1>be crucial for hard Groves algorithm. We spent the summer

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<v Speaker 1>of two thousand and ten finding at least the hundred

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<v Speaker 1>procedures that crashed and burned. Does the presence of a

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<v Speaker 1>serial killer increase the rated which women are murdered? No?

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<v Speaker 1>Does it increase the rate of which women are murdered

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<v Speaker 1>through unusual means? No? And do you get any indications

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<v Speaker 1>that you're getting closer? Yeah, So as we were progressing

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<v Speaker 1>through the hundred and one things that don't work, we

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<v Speaker 1>were starting to get closer. So um, the last thing

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<v Speaker 1>was to look at what the clearance rate was for

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<v Speaker 1>particular types of weapons. That term clearance rate refers to

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<v Speaker 1>the percentage of cases that police end up arresting someone

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<v Speaker 1>for the crime. Hard Group realized that Ridgeway had gotten

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<v Speaker 1>away with his murders for so long that they've been

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<v Speaker 1>listed as unsolved in the database. So if you looked

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<v Speaker 1>at killings in Seattle that matched his method, the number

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<v Speaker 1>of cases police had cleared was much lower than expected.

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<v Speaker 1>The presence of an active serial killer often destroys the

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<v Speaker 1>batting average for the local police department. They're able to

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<v Speaker 1>solve most murders, but not that type of murder because

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<v Speaker 1>there's a serial killer who's avoiding arrest hert group was

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<v Speaker 1>making progress. He'd picked up the hint of a signal

0:15:51.480 --> 0:15:54.400
<v Speaker 1>from Bridgeway in Seattle, but it wasn't enough to make

0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:58.280
<v Speaker 1>the algorithm useful as a tool. He racked his brain

0:15:58.520 --> 0:16:00.800
<v Speaker 1>trying to come up with a way to improve it.

0:16:01.960 --> 0:16:04.680
<v Speaker 1>One day, near the end of the summer, he looked

0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:08.440
<v Speaker 1>up at Ridgeway's mug shot and asked himself again, what

0:16:08.480 --> 0:16:13.160
<v Speaker 1>do a serial killers victims look like? Statistically? As he

0:16:13.200 --> 0:16:16.720
<v Speaker 1>talked through the project one last time with his research assistant,

0:16:16.800 --> 0:16:20.920
<v Speaker 1>Liz Lucas, an idea struck him. As I was taking

0:16:21.040 --> 0:16:23.360
<v Speaker 1>Liz to the airport because she had to go home

0:16:23.400 --> 0:16:26.360
<v Speaker 1>to defend her master's thesis. I told her that what

0:16:26.560 --> 0:16:29.520
<v Speaker 1>might work, and we're gonna try this next is a

0:16:29.600 --> 0:16:34.600
<v Speaker 1>kind of cluster analysis. Instead of querying all of the data,

0:16:35.280 --> 0:16:40.240
<v Speaker 1>we tried to assemble the data into smaller clusters according

0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:43.720
<v Speaker 1>to the county where the murderer occurred, the gender of

0:16:43.760 --> 0:16:46.560
<v Speaker 1>the victim, the method of killing, and at that time

0:16:46.600 --> 0:16:51.120
<v Speaker 1>age group. Then we calculated what the clearance rate was

0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:55.640
<v Speaker 1>for each cluster, how many of those murders were solved.

0:16:56.520 --> 0:16:59.200
<v Speaker 1>Up until this point, he tried looking at the data

0:16:59.360 --> 0:17:02.840
<v Speaker 1>for all the orders in Seattle. His new idea was

0:17:02.920 --> 0:17:06.679
<v Speaker 1>to further break down the data. Have the algorithm split

0:17:06.800 --> 0:17:10.760
<v Speaker 1>up the homicides for each county into buckets of victims,

0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:13.720
<v Speaker 1>and then rank these different buckets by the percentage of

0:17:13.760 --> 0:17:18.120
<v Speaker 1>cases that were solved. And Hargrove wasn't just doing this

0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:21.000
<v Speaker 1>for Seattle. He was doing this for data all across

0:17:21.040 --> 0:17:23.520
<v Speaker 1>the US, and he was hoping that out of the

0:17:23.560 --> 0:17:27.920
<v Speaker 1>thousands of clusters, Ridgeways Seattle killings would show up somewhere

0:17:27.960 --> 0:17:31.800
<v Speaker 1>near the top of the list. Hargrove ran his new

0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:37.520
<v Speaker 1>algorithm and waited anxiously for the result. When we did that,

0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:42.280
<v Speaker 1>the Green River killings jumped out plane as Day came

0:17:42.320 --> 0:17:46.600
<v Speaker 1>in third place most of the time seventies seven percent

0:17:46.680 --> 0:17:48.920
<v Speaker 1>of the time, and arrest is made when a woman

0:17:49.040 --> 0:17:52.920
<v Speaker 1>is killed in the cluster where the Green River killings

0:17:52.960 --> 0:17:58.359
<v Speaker 1>were grouped. The solution rate was less than and that

0:17:58.640 --> 0:18:03.119
<v Speaker 1>was our key. We're looking for groups of similar murders

0:18:03.160 --> 0:18:08.199
<v Speaker 1>that have very low clearance rates. We had hundreds of

0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:12.760
<v Speaker 1>results all over the country, highly suspicious clusters, and we

0:18:12.800 --> 0:18:35.280
<v Speaker 1>started investigating them. Heart Grove was a static. It seemed

0:18:35.320 --> 0:18:39.200
<v Speaker 1>like his algorithm might be working. It detected Gary Ridgeway,

0:18:39.359 --> 0:18:43.119
<v Speaker 1>the Green River killer, but at the same time, he

0:18:43.280 --> 0:18:46.800
<v Speaker 1>designed the algorithm to detect Ridgeway, and he kept tweaking

0:18:46.840 --> 0:18:49.879
<v Speaker 1>it until he did. So maybe the algorithm had just

0:18:49.920 --> 0:18:54.160
<v Speaker 1>detected Ridgeway by luck and it wouldn't generalize to other killers.

0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:58.720
<v Speaker 1>In statistics, this is a problem called overfitting, and it's

0:18:58.760 --> 0:19:01.800
<v Speaker 1>a common problem when scientists try to make algorithms that

0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:05.680
<v Speaker 1>predict things. So to get around this problem of overfitting,

0:19:06.000 --> 0:19:08.840
<v Speaker 1>people often train their algorithms with one set of data

0:19:09.240 --> 0:19:13.560
<v Speaker 1>and then validate the algorithm by testing it with new data. So,

0:19:13.680 --> 0:19:16.840
<v Speaker 1>since Hargrove had been using homicides in Seattle. To train

0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:19.919
<v Speaker 1>his algorithm, he needed to look at other cities to

0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:23.800
<v Speaker 1>see if it was really working. There were two larger

0:19:24.160 --> 0:19:29.920
<v Speaker 1>suspicious clusters, and in first place was Los Angeles. They

0:19:29.960 --> 0:19:35.119
<v Speaker 1>were a large group of almost entirely African American women

0:19:35.359 --> 0:19:39.040
<v Speaker 1>who were killed by handguns, and those murders had a

0:19:39.200 --> 0:19:43.399
<v Speaker 1>very low solution rate. So I assembled a spreadsheet of

0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:46.920
<v Speaker 1>those murders and emailed them to the public relations department

0:19:46.920 --> 0:19:49.399
<v Speaker 1>of the l a p D. Got one of the

0:19:49.600 --> 0:19:53.040
<v Speaker 1>representatives on the phone, is there a chance that any

0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:56.560
<v Speaker 1>of these could be serial murders? And he spent a

0:19:56.760 --> 0:19:59.800
<v Speaker 1>minute or so looking through the files, and then he

0:19:59.800 --> 0:20:02.520
<v Speaker 1>can back and said, what are you kidding? They're all

0:20:02.560 --> 0:20:07.440
<v Speaker 1>serial killings? I said, what. In fact, in the es

0:20:08.040 --> 0:20:10.800
<v Speaker 1>l ap D established what they hoped would be a

0:20:10.840 --> 0:20:15.040
<v Speaker 1>secret task force. They didn't want to alarm the public,

0:20:15.760 --> 0:20:18.560
<v Speaker 1>but they were exploring the possibility that there could be

0:20:18.600 --> 0:20:22.679
<v Speaker 1>a serial killer active. They called it the South Side

0:20:22.680 --> 0:20:26.879
<v Speaker 1>Slayer Task Force. Well, it turned out that the task

0:20:26.920 --> 0:20:29.520
<v Speaker 1>force was misnamed. It should have been called the South

0:20:29.680 --> 0:20:34.080
<v Speaker 1>Side Slayers Task Force. Because they had five they were

0:20:34.080 --> 0:20:36.880
<v Speaker 1>all quite independent of each other. They didn't know each

0:20:36.880 --> 0:20:39.920
<v Speaker 1>other but they were all killing women over a period

0:20:39.960 --> 0:20:44.560
<v Speaker 1>of twenty years. You heard that right. During the eighties

0:20:44.600 --> 0:20:48.159
<v Speaker 1>and nineties, Los Angeles had at least five different serial

0:20:48.280 --> 0:20:52.439
<v Speaker 1>killers who were shooting, strangling, and sexually assaulting women in

0:20:52.440 --> 0:20:55.560
<v Speaker 1>the area. This was happening at the height of the

0:20:55.640 --> 0:20:58.879
<v Speaker 1>crack epidemic and at a time when homicides across the

0:20:58.960 --> 0:21:03.719
<v Speaker 1>US where peaking. The large number of overall homicides probably

0:21:03.760 --> 0:21:06.080
<v Speaker 1>helped cover up the fact that there were these serial

0:21:06.160 --> 0:21:09.879
<v Speaker 1>killers operating in l A. But it's also likely that

0:21:09.920 --> 0:21:13.119
<v Speaker 1>the police didn't give these murders enough attention due to

0:21:13.200 --> 0:21:16.760
<v Speaker 1>a phenomena that's sometimes called victim discounting, and this is

0:21:16.800 --> 0:21:21.760
<v Speaker 1>the tendency to ignore crimes targeting marginalized groups. But when

0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:25.199
<v Speaker 1>Hargrove found out about these l A serial killers, he

0:21:25.240 --> 0:21:28.080
<v Speaker 1>took this as another sign that the algorithms seemed to

0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:31.959
<v Speaker 1>be working. It had detected a group of confirmed serial

0:21:32.080 --> 0:21:36.520
<v Speaker 1>killers that he hadn't even been aware of. Hargrove continued

0:21:36.560 --> 0:21:40.320
<v Speaker 1>down his list of top clusters that the algorithm had identified.

0:21:41.080 --> 0:21:44.639
<v Speaker 1>He called up the police department in Youngstown, Ohio, and

0:21:44.720 --> 0:21:47.520
<v Speaker 1>left a long message where he tried to explain the

0:21:47.560 --> 0:21:50.919
<v Speaker 1>algorithm and how it had detected a cluster of murders

0:21:50.920 --> 0:21:54.520
<v Speaker 1>in Youngstown. Thirty minutes later, the phone rings the chief

0:21:54.560 --> 0:21:57.720
<v Speaker 1>of detectives and you gotta give him credit, answering a

0:21:57.800 --> 0:22:00.359
<v Speaker 1>voicemail like that, he's a young guy. He called back

0:22:00.440 --> 0:22:03.320
<v Speaker 1>and said, that was the damnedest message I ever had

0:22:03.359 --> 0:22:05.560
<v Speaker 1>on my phone. And so I went back and I

0:22:05.640 --> 0:22:10.080
<v Speaker 1>interviewed my senior detectives and they told me something I

0:22:10.160 --> 0:22:13.240
<v Speaker 1>did not know. We thought we had a serial killer

0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:15.840
<v Speaker 1>in the nineties. We definitely thought we had one, and

0:22:15.880 --> 0:22:19.359
<v Speaker 1>we never got him, and so we started a new investigation.

0:22:19.920 --> 0:22:24.119
<v Speaker 1>He was attempting to locate the rape kids from those cases,

0:22:24.760 --> 0:22:27.760
<v Speaker 1>to try to DNA type all of the rape kits

0:22:27.800 --> 0:22:32.040
<v Speaker 1>they could find. Unfortunately, and this was very embarrassing, the

0:22:32.119 --> 0:22:35.719
<v Speaker 1>rape kits had all been destroyed, the property rooms had

0:22:35.760 --> 0:22:39.400
<v Speaker 1>been cleaned out, and he was not able to get

0:22:39.440 --> 0:22:44.679
<v Speaker 1>any of the kids from his cases or from surrounding jurisdictions.

0:22:45.320 --> 0:22:49.520
<v Speaker 1>There were other similar murders in neighboring jurisdictions, but they

0:22:49.560 --> 0:22:52.600
<v Speaker 1>too did not retain the rape kids. So it was

0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:54.600
<v Speaker 1>it was very sad, but they gave it the old

0:22:54.640 --> 0:22:59.159
<v Speaker 1>college try again. The algorithm had identified a cluster of

0:22:59.240 --> 0:23:01.399
<v Speaker 1>murders that seemed like it was the work of a

0:23:01.520 --> 0:23:05.560
<v Speaker 1>serial killer. Police couldn't prove that the killings were connected,

0:23:06.119 --> 0:23:09.720
<v Speaker 1>but the algorithms findings lined up with what police suspected,

0:23:10.440 --> 0:23:14.400
<v Speaker 1>and the algorithm had inspired a reinvestigation of those cold cases.

0:23:15.480 --> 0:23:18.159
<v Speaker 1>Hargrove felt like he was on the right track and

0:23:18.240 --> 0:23:21.119
<v Speaker 1>that maybe the algorithm could be a useful tool for

0:23:21.240 --> 0:23:25.600
<v Speaker 1>law enforcement. We selected ten major cities that appeared to

0:23:25.640 --> 0:23:30.960
<v Speaker 1>have a suspicious number of algorithm identified murders. Gary was

0:23:31.000 --> 0:23:35.480
<v Speaker 1>one of those ten. Gary, Indiana, the city right next

0:23:35.480 --> 0:23:39.120
<v Speaker 1>door to where Africa Hardy would be strangled. Four years later,

0:23:39.920 --> 0:23:44.639
<v Speaker 1>the algorithm flagged fifteen all unsolved murders in the Gary,

0:23:44.680 --> 0:23:48.600
<v Speaker 1>Indiana area. They were all women who were strangled. Not

0:23:48.680 --> 0:23:53.240
<v Speaker 1>one of the cases were solved, which is unusual. Seventy

0:23:53.280 --> 0:23:57.400
<v Speaker 1>seven percent of female murders get cleared, but not one

0:23:57.520 --> 0:24:02.480
<v Speaker 1>of these fifteen strangulation murder and Gary were cleared. I

0:24:02.600 --> 0:24:06.560
<v Speaker 1>called the public relations officer for the Gary Police Department,

0:24:06.800 --> 0:24:09.560
<v Speaker 1>gave him my name and said what we had found,

0:24:10.640 --> 0:24:13.160
<v Speaker 1>and said, is there a chance that you're dealing with

0:24:13.240 --> 0:24:17.280
<v Speaker 1>a serial killer? The next day the phone rings, it's

0:24:17.400 --> 0:24:21.200
<v Speaker 1>uh as I recall His name was Captain Roberts, who said, UM,

0:24:21.240 --> 0:24:24.760
<v Speaker 1>I've checked with our detectives and I can tell you

0:24:24.920 --> 0:24:30.200
<v Speaker 1>definitively that there are no unsolved serial murders in Gary, Indiana,

0:24:30.960 --> 0:24:35.679
<v Speaker 1>which is by definition an impossible statement to make. Unless

0:24:35.720 --> 0:24:39.239
<v Speaker 1>you have no unsolved murders, you cannot claim you'd be

0:24:39.280 --> 0:24:44.240
<v Speaker 1>definitively certain that there are no unsolved serial murders. Hargrove

0:24:44.320 --> 0:24:47.000
<v Speaker 1>felt like the police were just blowing him off, so

0:24:47.040 --> 0:24:51.679
<v Speaker 1>he started investigating the fifteen murders himself. Hargrove wanted to

0:24:51.720 --> 0:24:55.040
<v Speaker 1>know whether the algorithm was working, and he thought that

0:24:55.119 --> 0:24:58.879
<v Speaker 1>if he found evidence suggesting the murders were connected, maybe

0:24:59.000 --> 0:25:02.919
<v Speaker 1>the police would start take came seriously. But looking up

0:25:02.920 --> 0:25:07.280
<v Speaker 1>the information about the cases wasn't easy. The FBI supplemental

0:25:07.320 --> 0:25:10.720
<v Speaker 1>homicide report didn't include the victim's names or even the

0:25:10.760 --> 0:25:13.960
<v Speaker 1>exact date of their death. It just listed a month

0:25:14.000 --> 0:25:17.560
<v Speaker 1>in a year. So define more details about the cases,

0:25:18.040 --> 0:25:21.919
<v Speaker 1>Hargrove had to meticulously dig through old issues of local papers,

0:25:22.400 --> 0:25:24.679
<v Speaker 1>and as he started to piece things together, he was

0:25:24.760 --> 0:25:28.280
<v Speaker 1>unsettled by what he found. He was disturbed not just

0:25:28.320 --> 0:25:31.840
<v Speaker 1>by how grotesque these murders were, but by the patterns

0:25:31.880 --> 0:25:35.000
<v Speaker 1>that seemed to link them, and he became convinced that

0:25:35.080 --> 0:25:38.600
<v Speaker 1>Northwest Indiana had a serial killer on the loose, a

0:25:38.720 --> 0:25:43.280
<v Speaker 1>strangler who was targeting young women, women just like Africa Hardy.

0:25:44.440 --> 0:25:46.960
<v Speaker 1>He tried to talk to Gary's chief of police, but

0:25:47.040 --> 0:25:50.280
<v Speaker 1>he couldn't get through. I continued to suggest, have you

0:25:50.359 --> 0:25:54.720
<v Speaker 1>really looked at these cases? Soon the police stopped returning

0:25:54.720 --> 0:25:59.040
<v Speaker 1>his calls altogether, and Hargrove needed a response. He wasn't

0:25:59.080 --> 0:26:02.400
<v Speaker 1>just playing arm chair detective. We were about to publish

0:26:02.400 --> 0:26:05.680
<v Speaker 1>a story saying that Gary, Indiana has a serial killer

0:26:06.320 --> 0:26:10.600
<v Speaker 1>and the police would not talk about it. We were

0:26:10.640 --> 0:26:13.439
<v Speaker 1>afraid that the reason they weren't talking to us was

0:26:13.480 --> 0:26:15.719
<v Speaker 1>because they were hot on the heels of solving it.

0:26:16.080 --> 0:26:17.920
<v Speaker 1>That they had a suspect that we're trying to reel

0:26:18.000 --> 0:26:19.879
<v Speaker 1>them in, and we were going to screw that up.

0:26:21.000 --> 0:26:25.200
<v Speaker 1>We needn't have worried, but um, that was our fear.

0:26:25.920 --> 0:26:29.080
<v Speaker 1>I even sent registered letters to the chief of police

0:26:29.119 --> 0:26:31.440
<v Speaker 1>and to the mayor saying what we were about to do,

0:26:32.040 --> 0:26:35.600
<v Speaker 1>and if there's any issue they have, or any conversation

0:26:35.640 --> 0:26:39.520
<v Speaker 1>they want to have, for heaven's sakes, call me. This

0:26:39.600 --> 0:26:42.480
<v Speaker 1>is the letter that I wrote to the chief of

0:26:42.520 --> 0:26:48.760
<v Speaker 1>Police and Mayor in Gary, Indiana, and it goes dear Chief.

0:26:48.840 --> 0:26:52.560
<v Speaker 1>Carter Scripts Hour news service based in Washington, d C

0:26:52.840 --> 0:26:58.720
<v Speaker 1>is conducting a national reporting project looking into the thousand

0:26:58.800 --> 0:27:03.120
<v Speaker 1>unsolved thomicides committed in the United States since night. As

0:27:03.160 --> 0:27:06.600
<v Speaker 1>part of this project, we are investigating whether it's possible

0:27:06.640 --> 0:27:11.600
<v Speaker 1>to spot victims of serial murder among these unsolved killings.

0:27:11.760 --> 0:27:17.720
<v Speaker 1>Using the FBI's Supplementary Homicide Report. Using multivariate analysis, we've

0:27:17.760 --> 0:27:21.920
<v Speaker 1>determined that Gary, Indiana has an elevated number of unsolved

0:27:22.000 --> 0:27:25.600
<v Speaker 1>murders of women who were strangled in recent years. The

0:27:25.720 --> 0:27:29.080
<v Speaker 1>data that your department reported to the FBI are consistent

0:27:29.600 --> 0:27:33.720
<v Speaker 1>with the possibility that multiple victim killers have operated in

0:27:33.800 --> 0:27:39.439
<v Speaker 1>northwestern Indiana. Broadly, we see two possible patterns. In recent years,

0:27:40.000 --> 0:27:43.760
<v Speaker 1>several women have been strangled in their homes. In at

0:27:43.840 --> 0:27:47.040
<v Speaker 1>least two cases, of fire was set after the women

0:27:47.080 --> 0:27:51.640
<v Speaker 1>were killed. Also, starting in the nineteen nineties, we've seen

0:27:51.720 --> 0:27:55.800
<v Speaker 1>several women who were found strangled in or near abandoned buildings.

0:27:56.600 --> 0:28:00.399
<v Speaker 1>We doubt these killings are the result of convicted serial

0:28:00.480 --> 0:28:04.399
<v Speaker 1>killer Eugene V. Brit who admitted to killing eight people.

0:28:06.760 --> 0:28:11.040
<v Speaker 1>Please note the attached list of homicide victims. We'd be

0:28:11.080 --> 0:28:15.160
<v Speaker 1>grateful if your detectives would review these cases to determine

0:28:15.160 --> 0:28:19.240
<v Speaker 1>if any might have a common perpetrator. The US Justice

0:28:19.280 --> 0:28:22.840
<v Speaker 1>Department defines a serial killer simply as anyone who kills

0:28:22.920 --> 0:28:28.280
<v Speaker 1>two or more people in separate incidents. Experience thomicide investigators

0:28:28.320 --> 0:28:32.440
<v Speaker 1>tell us it's extremely difficult to spot a serial murderer.

0:28:33.200 --> 0:28:36.639
<v Speaker 1>There have been enough unsolved killings of women in Gary,

0:28:36.680 --> 0:28:40.680
<v Speaker 1>Indiana that your metropolitan area made our top ten list.

0:28:41.360 --> 0:28:44.920
<v Speaker 1>We are contacting authorities in all ten areas. Police and

0:28:45.000 --> 0:28:48.560
<v Speaker 1>five cities have already confirmed that cases we've cited contained

0:28:48.600 --> 0:28:52.360
<v Speaker 1>proven or suspected victims of serial murder. We are also

0:28:52.400 --> 0:28:55.720
<v Speaker 1>making a similar request to the Lake County Coroner's office.

0:28:56.320 --> 0:28:59.320
<v Speaker 1>Thank you for your time and consideration. Please help us

0:28:59.360 --> 0:29:05.440
<v Speaker 1>explore whether national crime data can assist local law enforcement. Sincerely,

0:29:05.480 --> 0:29:11.040
<v Speaker 1>Thomas Hargrove, Scripts Hour News service, and we had total

0:29:11.120 --> 0:29:16.280
<v Speaker 1>radio silence from those people. The Gary police chief and

0:29:16.400 --> 0:29:19.400
<v Speaker 1>mayor didn't respond to Hargrove's letter or to his follow

0:29:19.440 --> 0:29:22.440
<v Speaker 1>up phone calls, but Hargrove had also sent the letter

0:29:22.560 --> 0:29:26.400
<v Speaker 1>to the county corners corners or the public officials who

0:29:26.480 --> 0:29:30.880
<v Speaker 1>oversee autopsies and determined causes of death. They work with

0:29:30.920 --> 0:29:34.080
<v Speaker 1>the police, but they're an entirely separate entity. When I

0:29:34.120 --> 0:29:37.920
<v Speaker 1>called the Lake County Coroner's Office, identified myself, I'm Tom

0:29:37.960 --> 0:29:40.920
<v Speaker 1>Hargrove calling from Washington, d C. Oh just a minute,

0:29:41.000 --> 0:29:44.360
<v Speaker 1>Mr Hargrove, the senior deputy corner, wants to talk to you.

0:29:44.880 --> 0:29:47.520
<v Speaker 1>He came on and said, Mr Hargrove, we got your

0:29:47.560 --> 0:29:50.160
<v Speaker 1>packet of information. Thank you very much for sending it.

0:29:50.320 --> 0:29:53.480
<v Speaker 1>I'm assigning it to one of our assistant corners, a

0:29:53.560 --> 0:29:57.960
<v Speaker 1>lady named Jackie. We're going to have her look into it.

0:29:58.480 --> 0:30:01.720
<v Speaker 1>An entirely different reception them when I didn't get it Gary,

0:30:01.880 --> 0:30:05.040
<v Speaker 1>they agreed with us that there were too many unsolved murders.

0:30:05.080 --> 0:30:08.240
<v Speaker 1>She added three more cases that she thought belonged on

0:30:08.320 --> 0:30:12.240
<v Speaker 1>that pile we had identified fifteen. She added three, making

0:30:12.280 --> 0:30:15.960
<v Speaker 1>eighteen that she thought were connected and was trying to

0:30:16.000 --> 0:30:19.480
<v Speaker 1>have a conversation with the Carry Police department. She's never

0:30:19.560 --> 0:30:23.400
<v Speaker 1>gone on Mike to talk about this case. For the

0:30:23.440 --> 0:30:27.440
<v Speaker 1>Coroner's office, it is very, very difficult to speak ill

0:30:27.600 --> 0:30:31.080
<v Speaker 1>of a police department. It's considered bad form, and so

0:30:31.280 --> 0:30:34.760
<v Speaker 1>she probably still feels a reluctance to do that. Although

0:30:34.800 --> 0:30:38.680
<v Speaker 1>she has passion about this case, you shouldn't use this

0:30:38.800 --> 0:30:41.800
<v Speaker 1>recording where I named her unless she agrees. I was

0:30:41.840 --> 0:30:44.360
<v Speaker 1>looking up other names of people in that department, you know.

0:30:44.400 --> 0:30:47.960
<v Speaker 1>I think one went down for some kind of corruption charge,

0:30:48.160 --> 0:30:50.680
<v Speaker 1>and then it's kind of hard to find someone who

0:30:50.720 --> 0:30:55.080
<v Speaker 1>is there that can talk about this stuff. Yeah, now

0:30:55.160 --> 0:30:57.760
<v Speaker 1>your your only hope is to get Jackie to talk.

0:30:58.360 --> 0:31:01.560
<v Speaker 1>This is really one of the most frustrating experiences of

0:31:01.600 --> 0:31:04.560
<v Speaker 1>my life. I think the Gary Police Department should be

0:31:04.560 --> 0:31:08.480
<v Speaker 1>looking at some of those old cases. They still may

0:31:08.480 --> 0:31:11.760
<v Speaker 1>have a killer out there. When I finished speaking with

0:31:11.800 --> 0:31:15.280
<v Speaker 1>hard Grove, I tried calling Jackie, but I couldn't get through.

0:31:16.880 --> 0:31:19.360
<v Speaker 1>After a couple of failed attempts, I left her a

0:31:19.400 --> 0:31:22.920
<v Speaker 1>voicemail explaining the podcast how I was trying to look

0:31:22.960 --> 0:31:26.400
<v Speaker 1>into the murders Hargrove had identified to see if they

0:31:26.400 --> 0:31:30.920
<v Speaker 1>were indeed connected to Africa's death. Weeks passed, and I've

0:31:30.960 --> 0:31:34.720
<v Speaker 1>worked on other stories and chased down other leads, and

0:31:34.800 --> 0:31:37.680
<v Speaker 1>after what Hargrove had told me about her reluctance to

0:31:37.720 --> 0:31:40.280
<v Speaker 1>talk about the case, I didn't think she would want

0:31:40.280 --> 0:31:44.240
<v Speaker 1>to speak to me. Then one morning I woke up

0:31:44.240 --> 0:31:48.640
<v Speaker 1>to a missed call from a number I didn't recognize. Hey, Don,

0:31:48.720 --> 0:31:52.239
<v Speaker 1>this is Jackie. You would try to contact me a

0:31:52.240 --> 0:31:57.400
<v Speaker 1>while back in regard to heart Grow story you're doing. Yes,

0:31:57.960 --> 0:32:01.360
<v Speaker 1>you want to give me a call later next week? Um,

0:32:01.480 --> 0:32:04.440
<v Speaker 1>that would be fine. Sorry, had gotten back to you sooner.

0:32:04.560 --> 0:32:09.200
<v Speaker 1>It's just everything is fine, a little different. All right, guys,

0:32:09.200 --> 0:32:14.560
<v Speaker 1>I'll talk to you soon. Maybe that's coming next episode.

0:32:15.560 --> 0:32:18.240
<v Speaker 1>They don't want to talk about it either, I assume

0:32:18.360 --> 0:32:22.360
<v Speaker 1>because they don't want to embarrass their neighboring police agency.

0:32:23.120 --> 0:32:25.840
<v Speaker 1>All right, and said here and they had nothing to do.

0:32:26.280 --> 0:32:29.240
<v Speaker 1>They led to the death your friend. You should try

0:32:29.280 --> 0:32:31.280
<v Speaker 1>to find out. You'd be the first to do that.

0:32:33.480 --> 0:32:37.320
<v Speaker 1>Algorithm is released weekly on Tuesday's Subscribe Now so you

0:32:37.360 --> 0:32:40.120
<v Speaker 1>don't miss the next episode on the I Heart Radio app,

0:32:40.280 --> 0:32:47.280
<v Speaker 1>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows. This

0:32:47.360 --> 0:32:50.280
<v Speaker 1>episode was written and produced by me ben Key. Brick.

0:32:50.760 --> 0:32:54.400
<v Speaker 1>Algorithm is executive produced by Alex Williams, Donald Albright, and

0:32:54.440 --> 0:32:59.320
<v Speaker 1>Matt Frederick. Production assistance in mixing by Eric Quintana. The

0:32:59.400 --> 0:33:02.640
<v Speaker 1>music is by Makeup and Vanity Set and Blue Dot Sessions.

0:33:03.200 --> 0:33:08.280
<v Speaker 1>Thanks to Christina Dana Miranda Hawkins. Jamie Albright, rema El Kaili,

0:33:08.600 --> 0:33:15.200
<v Speaker 1>Trevor Young, and Josh Thane for their help and notes. Again,

0:33:15.280 --> 0:33:18.320
<v Speaker 1>thanks for listening as it heads up. I'm still working

0:33:18.320 --> 0:33:21.360
<v Speaker 1>on this podcast as we release it, so any feedback

0:33:21.480 --> 0:33:24.720
<v Speaker 1>is appreciated. I think Algorithm is going to address some

0:33:24.800 --> 0:33:28.800
<v Speaker 1>really important issues about policing and how crimes are investigated

0:33:29.000 --> 0:33:32.360
<v Speaker 1>that don't receive enough attention. So if you can, please

0:33:32.440 --> 0:33:35.120
<v Speaker 1>leave a review on Apple Podcasts or tell a friend

0:33:35.160 --> 0:33:38.320
<v Speaker 1>about Algorithm, where brand new show and could really use

0:33:38.320 --> 0:33:38.680
<v Speaker 1>your help.