Speaker 1: In part two of our episode on the nineteen eighty
Speaker 1: two Chicago Thailand All Murders, we look at the suspects
Speaker 1: in the case and really zero in on one of them,
Speaker 1: but to this day it's not clear if they were
Speaker 1: behind it, and although there was a lot of weird
Speaker 1: evidence around him, it's all circumstantial. I hope you enjoy
Speaker 1: finishing up on the Thailand All Murders.
Speaker 2: Welcome to Steff. You should know, a production of Iheartradios
Speaker 2: How Stuff Works.
Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. There's
Speaker 1: Charles w Chuck Bryant, There's guest producer Josh over there.
Speaker 1: Guess enough with the pleasantries. Let's get back to.
Speaker 3: It Chuck Thailand All Murders, Part two, Park, if you
Speaker 3: did not listen to the first part. In nineteen eighty two,
Speaker 3: seven people were murdered by ingesting Thailand, all tainted with cyanide,
Speaker 3: all on the same day, all on the same day.
Speaker 3: America and much of the world is super freaked out.
Speaker 3: Johnson and Johnson is the manufacturer, and part one of
Speaker 3: part two has a deal with Johnson and Johnson and
Speaker 3: how they handled this in a public relations sort of way.
Speaker 3: Because there were and are a huge company. Like you
Speaker 3: said in the episode one, they held thirty seven percent
Speaker 3: of the market share, which was many hundreds of millions
Speaker 3: of dollars of tile and all that they're selling every year.
Speaker 1: And that's in nineteen eighty two dollars.
Speaker 3: Right, which is like gazillions now. So it was a
Speaker 3: very big deal for that company. And the way they
Speaker 3: handled it is taught in colleges and PR classes all
Speaker 3: over the world as exactly how to handle a big
Speaker 3: public relations crisis.
Speaker 1: Like this, Like it's literally called a textbook example of
Speaker 1: how it's done.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they did a good job because as you remember
Speaker 3: from the last episode, they found out pretty sure early
Speaker 3: on that this had nothing to do with Johnson and Johnson, right, Like,
Speaker 3: it wasn't in their factory, it wasn't in their supply chain.
Speaker 3: That it happened almost certainly, and that it probably happened
Speaker 3: by some crazed person taking them out of the store
Speaker 3: or tainting them maybe in the store in the parking lot,
Speaker 3: then putting them back on the shelf. But Johnson Johnson
Speaker 3: can't come out on the news and say hey what
Speaker 3: and us.
Speaker 1: Right well at first though, and this gets overlooked and
Speaker 1: left out of the college business courses and the PR courses.
Speaker 1: At first, Johnson and Johnson was not in favor of
Speaker 1: a massive recall.
Speaker 3: Sure, because that looks well, it looks good in one
Speaker 3: way but bad in another.
Speaker 1: And they actually didn't recall anything until Mayor Jane Byrne
Speaker 1: held her press conference on Friday calling for a recall
Speaker 1: of the Thailand all in Chicago, and Johnson and Johnson
Speaker 1: did a little face palm. Yes, we're recalling all of
Speaker 1: the Thailand all in Chicago.
Speaker 3: Yes, what she said.
Speaker 1: Right. So by Friday, the thirty first of September, is
Speaker 1: there thirty one in September? Was this October first?
Speaker 3: I have no idea.
Speaker 1: I think it was October first, anyway. By the Friday,
Speaker 1: two days after the death yeah, the deaths, Johnson and
Speaker 1: Johnson recalled all of the tail in all in Chicago.
Speaker 1: And that should have been enough to them, that was enough.
Speaker 1: But this PR crisis was so massive and spread so fast,
Speaker 1: and like we said earlier in Part one, became global
Speaker 1: almost overnight. It was not enough. Yeah, And so Johnson
Speaker 1: and Johnson, within a week of the deaths recalled every
Speaker 1: bottle of extra strength TIL and all in the United States,
Speaker 1: which is worth about one hundred million dollars at the time,
Speaker 1: took it back to their factories and destroyed it.
Speaker 3: So they say, right, yeah, both Johnson and Johnson, right.
Speaker 3: I wonder if one of them was like, know about this.
Speaker 1: One of them said, Okay, I'll take all the states
Speaker 1: west of the Mississippi, North Dakota, South Dakota, and Somewayoming
Speaker 1: and then you can take all the other states. That's
Speaker 1: a part one, Joe.
Speaker 3: They even got an award the Public Relations Society of America,
Speaker 3: which is a real thing, I believe it or not.
Speaker 3: They awarded them their Silver Anvil Award for how they
Speaker 3: handle the.
Speaker 1: Crisis the tailan All poisoning, that's right.
Speaker 3: And high grade foods. Remember we talked about the bad
Speaker 3: Wieners in the first episode. The ballpark Frank Zip supposedly
Speaker 3: had razor blades but did not. That still created a
Speaker 3: public relations crisis for them, even though they were just
Speaker 3: these little jerks in Detroit, And they won the Golden Anvil,
Speaker 3: which is one higher than.
Speaker 1: Silver, because of how they handled the pr crisis brought
Speaker 1: about by the copycats of the actual tailan All.
Speaker 3: Crisis, which was in fact really brought about by two
Speaker 3: jerk kids in Detroit, right, really, not even.
Speaker 1: Copycats, not the tile in all crisis. I wonder where
Speaker 1: those kids are today, probably in the Senate.
Speaker 3: I bet one of them was the guy who did
Speaker 3: our our lighting at our Detroit show.
Speaker 1: It was a smoke I'll go some more smoke.
Speaker 3: Yeah, guys, we did a show in Detroit a few
Speaker 3: years ago and very famously we still use that as
Speaker 3: the standard bearer for a bad crew bad. We had
Speaker 3: a guy that looked like a former roadie for Uriah
Speaker 3: Heap that was running like a light show basically during
Speaker 3: the middle of our podcast, and like smoke came out.
Speaker 3: We were like, we had to stop the show, almost
Speaker 3: like dude, what are you doing?
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, the lighting was so bad that your highlighter
Speaker 1: had turned like brown and you could no longer see
Speaker 1: the words. And you asked him, we had to stop
Speaker 1: the show, and you had to ask him to use
Speaker 1: a different colored light.
Speaker 3: Uh huh.
Speaker 1: And his response, because you and me he was hanging
Speaker 1: out and our friend Chris Bowman was hanging out in
Speaker 1: the sound with the guy. His response, according to them,
Speaker 1: they want smoke, I'll give them some more smoke and
Speaker 1: we got some more smoke.
Speaker 3: Like a smoke machine.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Man, And people ask us why we haven't been back
Speaker 3: to Detroit.
Speaker 1: That's a big reason. It's a big reason, not the
Speaker 1: only reason.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 3: Okay. So they won the Golden Anvil for the Wiener
Speaker 3: pr moves McNeil Consumer Products, which is a subsidiary of
Speaker 3: Johnson and Johnson.
Speaker 1: They actually make Til it All.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they make the pills again. The way this all
Speaker 3: this supply chain works is really convoluted, and like you said,
Speaker 3: they didn't want to recall Johnson Johnson everything at first.
Speaker 3: They want to kind of take it a little slower.
Speaker 3: I guess, well, sure, because they'd found out the drugs
Speaker 3: are actually fine, right thanks to Pinky McFarland.
Speaker 1: This is one hundred million dollars worth of stock that
Speaker 1: they were kind of feeling the pressure to recall. That's right.
Speaker 1: So they were kind of reluctant at first, especially if
Speaker 1: they were convinced that there was nothing wrong with the
Speaker 1: rest of them.
Speaker 3: They had no choice, no, that was the only way
Speaker 3: to do it was to lose a lot of money
Speaker 3: in favor of future gains.
Speaker 1: Yeah. But even at the time, a lot of people
Speaker 1: were like, this is it for tail and All. Sure,
Speaker 1: the public has lost faith in Thailand All. So when
Speaker 1: Thailandol recalled thirty one million, fifty count bottles of Extra
Speaker 1: Strength tilent All and destroyed it all, there was a
Speaker 1: chance that not only were they losing one hundred million dollars,
Speaker 1: but that they were losing one hundred million dollars of
Speaker 1: a brand that had already lost the public trust and
Speaker 1: would never regain it. So which wasn't true. But yeah, no,
Speaker 1: they didn't necessarily know that at the time. It was
Speaker 1: still up in the air. So they it was basically
Speaker 1: thirty one million sacrificial lambs that were killed to show
Speaker 1: the public this taint of talent All has gone forever.
Speaker 3: That's right.
Speaker 1: Your chances of dying from taking Extra Strength tilent All
Speaker 1: are now gone. You can go back to taking Thailand All. Now.
Speaker 1: That was one thing that was a big gesture, which
Speaker 1: is what it amounted to. It was a gesture half
Speaker 1: of Johnson and Johnson. But they did other stuff too.
Speaker 1: They started to do things right out of their reluctance.
Speaker 1: Once they finally said there, we have to just go
Speaker 1: with this to save face and to win back public trust,
Speaker 1: they started to do things right, like including like setting
Speaker 1: up a hotline sure putting out one hundred thousand dollars
Speaker 1: reward for information.
Speaker 3: Jump change, considering how much they had lost already.
Speaker 1: It's nineteen eighty two dollars.
Speaker 3: Well still jump change it is, yeah, and that remains unclaimed.
Speaker 1: It does they But because of all of this, Johnson
Speaker 1: and Johnson managed to regain the public trust and actually
Speaker 1: managed to position itself as a victim in all of this, Like, yes,
Speaker 1: there were these which they were, I mean seven murder victims. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and Johnson and Johnson. I don't think I ever tried to
Speaker 1: push them out of the spotlight. But they also managed
Speaker 1: to portray themselves as the victim of a mad poisoner
Speaker 1: who may or may not had something out for them.
Speaker 1: But either way, their brand was taking a huge hit
Speaker 1: because of this, and they were a victim and were
Speaker 1: able to generate public sympathy. Is part of the road
Speaker 1: to regaining the public trust.
Speaker 3: Right, which is why it's taught in PR classes. So
Speaker 3: we'll take you back to nineteen eighty two if you're
Speaker 3: if you weren't around then or old enough to be
Speaker 3: taking OTC pills and pain relievers.
Speaker 1: OTC is over the counter by the way. That's right, Okay,
Speaker 1: you down with OTC. Yeah, you know me so dumb.
Speaker 3: I love that you played along, though, I appreciate that
Speaker 3: you could have made me feel stupid.
Speaker 1: We've been partners for eleven years almost now.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that'd be when next month or this month? Yeah right, yeah, unbelievable.
Speaker 1: So uh I'm believable, Not not in that way. Okay.
Speaker 3: So here's how it used to happen. If you wanted
Speaker 3: to take a pill, like a tile and all, you
Speaker 3: would get your bottle, you would pop it open with
Speaker 3: your thumb.
Speaker 1: Well first, first it came in a little box.
Speaker 3: Sure, but the box wasn't even glued shut. No, you
Speaker 3: would pop it open with your finger. You would take
Speaker 3: out the cotton in there, and you would take your pill.
Speaker 3: It was that easy. There was no tamper proofing. No,
Speaker 3: there was no The cotton was completely superfluous at this time.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Cotton originally was introduced to keep bare aspirin like
Speaker 1: the hard tablets, yeah, from getting crushed in transport.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And since they started using capsules and other stuff and
Speaker 1: figured out how to strengthen tablets, there was no reason
Speaker 1: for the cotton any longer. But because consumers expected it.
Speaker 3: I know.
Speaker 1: Still today you'll find cotton in your in your pills.
Speaker 1: There's no reason for it to be there except because
Speaker 1: the companies know that you want it to be there.
Speaker 1: You would be weirded out if there wasn't cotton in
Speaker 1: your pills.
Speaker 3: Imagine the cotton lobby had something to do with that too.
Speaker 1: Well, I'll bet they're not. They're not complaining, you know,
Speaker 1: so big cotton.
Speaker 4: They.
Speaker 3: New, fancy otc pill should have Micromo doll in there, right.
Speaker 1: It just comes with a pair of Meuni stuffed into
Speaker 1: your pill bottle like these have been warm.
Speaker 3: And so this was a time. It was a very
Speaker 3: innocent time previous to this, where you could like and
Speaker 3: you pointed this out. I remember seeing this in grocery stores,
Speaker 3: like I remember seeing mothers and grocery stores opening food
Speaker 3: products and smelling them.
Speaker 1: Yes, that's what you could do, and then.
Speaker 3: Closing it back and putting it back on the shelf.
Speaker 4: Mate.
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh there's a little mold in this one. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I'll just leave it for the next person.
Speaker 3: Forget poisoning like these they could be spitting in this stuff.
Speaker 3: It was allowed.
Speaker 1: That's just the way it was. Like, there was America
Speaker 1: was innocent enough that that was fine. That's how we lived.
Speaker 1: And that sets up this Tile in All Poisoning. It
Speaker 1: really shows how much of a jarring experience it was
Speaker 1: from America, because all of a sudden, like it's finally
Speaker 1: sunk in in a couple of days, there's something wrong
Speaker 1: with the tile in all. Somebody has gone out of
Speaker 1: their way to poison the tail and all in order
Speaker 1: to randomly kill people. And the reason they were able
Speaker 1: to do this is because it's easy to get into
Speaker 1: the tile in all, tamper with it, put it back,
Speaker 1: and no one will be any any more. The wiser
Speaker 1: and wait, it's not just tile and all. Milk doesn't
Speaker 1: have anything that keeps it tamper resistant. Nei, there's orange juice, NEI,
Speaker 1: there's cereal. Neither does cottage cheese. Nothing does. And America
Speaker 1: forreaked out. And this is the reason why this Tile
Speaker 1: in All Poisoning is considered widely the first incident of
Speaker 1: domestic terrorism in the United States, because it was terrorism,
Speaker 1: pure and simple. America was terrified. They were petrified not
Speaker 1: only to take tail in all or any over the
Speaker 1: counter medicine. Now they were petrified to drink milk or
Speaker 1: give milk to their kids. Paula Prince, the flight attendant
Speaker 1: who was the last one to die in Chicago, she
Speaker 1: had a coworker who said, like, everything looked tainted. Now,
Speaker 1: I was afraid to give my kid's milk. I was
Speaker 1: afraid to give my kids cereal. If they could get
Speaker 1: to the tail and all, they can poison anything. And
Speaker 1: that was really emblematic of the attitude, the shock that
Speaker 1: everybody went through. And as a result, within six weeks,
Speaker 1: Tyland all said we got this covered.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I have a feeling they did this so
Speaker 3: fast there had to have been this idea in place already.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was. I saw a reference that it was.
Speaker 3: And I imagine it was not done because they're like, well,
Speaker 3: it's a lot of money, and why would we bother.
Speaker 3: It's like, it's not like someone's going to poison the medicine, right,
Speaker 3: And then that happened. So within six weeks they had
Speaker 3: a box that was actually glued shut, so if your
Speaker 3: little box had been opened, you would be able to tell.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was That was part one of three of
Speaker 1: this tamper resistant packaging.
Speaker 3: That little plastic seal over the top of the bottle
Speaker 3: after you open it or no, no, no, the plastic is
Speaker 3: over the cap on the outside of the bottle.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like the plastic foil.
Speaker 3: And then the actual foil was over the mouth of
Speaker 3: the bottle that you we all have to poke through
Speaker 3: now to pull out the cotton and whatever still uses cotton.
Speaker 1: None of that existed until the beginning of nineteen eighty three.
Speaker 3: So all three of these are put in place within
Speaker 3: six weeks. Not only that, they said, you know what,
Speaker 3: we're going to introduce the caplet, which everyone knows now
Speaker 3: it was we didn't have them back then. Everything was
Speaker 3: a little capsule that you could literally pull apart, and
Speaker 3: you could snort the tile in all if you wanted to.
Speaker 1: Sure, I'm quite sure some people did.
Speaker 3: I'm sure someone did. But the caplet is, you know,
Speaker 3: a tablet coated with an easy to swallow a gelatine.
Speaker 3: It's solid, it's I imagine you could tamper with it.
Speaker 3: And even I even saw with all these things in place,
Speaker 3: they said, nothing is tamper proof. But these measures really
Speaker 3: went a long way to restore the public, you know, well,
Speaker 3: like the good feelings about what was going on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, within about a year, Thailand all or Johnson and
Speaker 1: Johnson managed to win the public's trust back in Thailand.
Speaker 3: All that's hard to believe. Yeah, that was really fast, but.
Speaker 1: It also goes to show like just how perfectly they
Speaker 1: did everything from that from the time they ca admitted
Speaker 1: to it on.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I feel like I remember like commercials with
Speaker 3: CEOs and stuff addressing the public. He became sake.
Speaker 1: I can't remember his name. I want to say, Jeoffrey Beam.
Speaker 1: That's like a shoe brand.
Speaker 3: Gabby Johnson, No, um, Bill Johnson, No, Jimmy Howard Johnson.
Speaker 1: Yes, this, I can't remember his name, but he Jimmy
Speaker 1: Johnson is way far away from that. But he became
Speaker 1: a public face. He would, you know, go on to
Speaker 1: sixty minutes and he talked to Dan Reather and take
Speaker 1: Copple and all those cats like he he was out
Speaker 1: there like showing how much the company cared. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: it had had a huge effect.
Speaker 3: And then in nineteen eighty three, Congress got involved. They
Speaker 3: passed what they dubbed the Tail and All Bill, which
Speaker 3: basically says, if you do something like this is now
Speaker 3: a federal offense. A few years later, in nineteen eighty nine,
Speaker 3: the FDA actually established guidelines for all manufacturers of any
Speaker 3: product really to make it Tampa proof.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because it wasn't just the OTC manufacturers that started
Speaker 1: doing this. They followed suit very quickly once Tail and
Speaker 1: all came out with it, because they kind of had
Speaker 1: to if they wanted to keep up with TIL and all.
Speaker 1: But also the uh, the manufacturers of everything, like every product,
Speaker 1: every consumer product, started putting their products in like tamper
Speaker 1: proof packaging. Dial soap started coming wrapped in cellophane inside
Speaker 1: the box.
Speaker 3: To trap the chemicals in.
Speaker 1: I guess, but also to show like nobody's injected this
Speaker 1: with lie or something like that, although lie is used
Speaker 1: in the making the soap, isn't it. I remember my
Speaker 1: fight Club.
Speaker 3: It's pretty funny someone injected soap into the soap. All right,
Speaker 3: let's take another break and we'll come back and talk
Speaker 3: a little bit more about the profile of the supposed
Speaker 3: mad poisoner. Right after this.
Speaker 4: Stop you know, stop stop, should know no stop?
Speaker 3: All right. So this was a very big case at
Speaker 3: the time. Obviously, like we've been saying, it was a
Speaker 3: landmark case. So of course you're going to get psychological profiles,
Speaker 3: which you know we should do one in profiling. Actually,
Speaker 3: have we done that.
Speaker 1: I don't think so, it'd be a good one.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because it always like seems like the trope in
Speaker 3: movies and TV. But it is kind of like that.
Speaker 1: No, it is a thing for sure.
Speaker 3: It's not like they just make this stuff up. But
Speaker 3: in the end they said, you know, this is probably
Speaker 3: a man in his twenties or thirties who was sort
Speaker 3: of a Jekyll and Hide type During the day, he's
Speaker 3: very ordinary. He could be in the desk cubicle next
Speaker 3: to you and you wouldn't even know it.
Speaker 1: Every once in a while uses here him go more.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. But deep in his in the recesses of
Speaker 3: his brain, everyone, he's plagued with self doubt and has
Speaker 3: an illusion that a random killing can boost a sense
Speaker 3: of self worth, which is just sounds like a straight
Speaker 3: out of a movie.
Speaker 1: It sounds like a psychiatrist saying I want to be
Speaker 1: on TV. Yeah, listen to me.
Speaker 3: They also speculated, and this is just completely like conjecture
Speaker 3: was that he had probably already taken his own life
Speaker 3: after the killings.
Speaker 1: That was one specific person who was it that. Yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was I think like the medical examiner for Cook County.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he probably already jumped off the bridge, so don't
Speaker 3: worry about it.
Speaker 1: Don't worry everybody. Yeah, yeah, he just threw that out there.
Speaker 1: I don't know if it was to calm people or not,
Speaker 1: but or maybe he's just throwing his two cents in.
Speaker 1: But I think you kind of said it earlier. I
Speaker 1: don't remember if it was part one or part two.
Speaker 1: The whole things is blurred and become a haze by now.
Speaker 1: But no one has ever been charged with the Thailand
Speaker 1: All murders.
Speaker 3: Yeah that's the ending.
Speaker 1: But there has been There were a lot of suspects
Speaker 1: that remember Thailand All set up a hotline and this
Speaker 1: Thailand All Task Force, one hundred and forty person strong
Speaker 1: task force investigating this, chasing down leads, taking calls on
Speaker 1: the hotline. Thousands and thousands of calls that were coming in. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they were trying to whittle those down into actual tips
Speaker 1: that were worth pursuing, and out of all of them,
Speaker 1: they deemed twelve hundred tips or twelve hundred leads worth
Speaker 1: checking out. There's a lot of leads for a case,
Speaker 1: even considering yet one hundred and forty people working them.
Speaker 1: And I read somewhere that they started out with like
Speaker 1: twenty thousand suspects or something like that and whittled it
Speaker 1: down to four hundred.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And sort of the sad part is as quickly
Speaker 3: as they sort of figured a lot of this out
Speaker 3: and had that one hundred and forty person task force,
Speaker 3: they almost just as quickly within a few months, realized that, like,
Speaker 3: we don't have a very good chance at finding this person.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it became clear very quickly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they whittled that down. By the last week of October,
Speaker 3: the task force was down to forty people. By the
Speaker 3: end of the year, it was down to twenty. And
Speaker 3: it was a situation again in nineteen eighty two where
Speaker 3: you didn't have security cameras everywhere, you didn't have credit
Speaker 3: cards and debit cards creating paper trails. It was a
Speaker 3: lot easier back then to get away with something like this,
Speaker 3: to be completely unknown, to walk into a store, maybe
Speaker 3: slip some tilin all into your pocket, go out to
Speaker 3: the parking lot and come back in and slip them
Speaker 3: back on the shelf. Yeah, if you're really easy.
Speaker 1: You won't even go to the trouble of buying it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess that's a good point, steal it and
Speaker 3: then put it. But you know people were using cash.
Speaker 3: If there were cameras in a place, they were probably
Speaker 3: trained on employees. I worked at a golden pantry in College.
Speaker 3: Only camera we had was directly above us, pointing down
Speaker 3: at the catch register.
Speaker 1: It was the one at Alps in Atlanta Highway.
Speaker 3: Alps. No, ok, the one on the east side College
Speaker 3: Station Road. I think, okay, yeah, very interesting job. That's
Speaker 3: the one where I got a job. I needed a job.
Speaker 3: I got a job at McDonald's and I showed up.
Speaker 3: I took the one hour training video and they got
Speaker 3: my uniform number. I went home and I was supposed
Speaker 3: to show up the next day and I was just like,
Speaker 3: I can't do it. I can't go work at McDonald's.
Speaker 3: And I got the Golden pantry job later that day.
Speaker 3: Here you go, which, hey man, sure, it's like sign
Speaker 3: me up.
Speaker 1: From Golden arches to golden pantry. That's like a rags
Speaker 1: of riches story.
Speaker 3: I was selling beer and cigarettes.
Speaker 1: Nice.
Speaker 3: It was pretty great.
Speaker 1: You're like one for you, one for me.
Speaker 3: Oh, I would never do that, all right? Where was I?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was at Golden pantry. So the cameras trained
Speaker 3: on the register. They're not. You know, you could come
Speaker 3: and go in a store and no one even knows.
Speaker 3: In nineteen eighty two, right, it ops of nothing to
Speaker 3: go on. Most importantly, no motive.
Speaker 1: That was a big one, because remember, this is just
Speaker 1: a Jekylin Hyde type who you'd never suspect.
Speaker 3: Who's probably at the bottom of the Chicago.
Speaker 1: River, right, who also is engaged in some senseless random
Speaker 1: killings of people, anonymous poisoning killing, not even shooting. It
Speaker 1: just made zero sense whatsoever. So, like we said earlier,
Speaker 1: the cops figured out within about a month, within the
Speaker 1: first month of the investigation, that this was they were
Speaker 1: not going to have a break in this case. But
Speaker 1: it's not to say that they didn't have some suspects.
Speaker 1: Some people definitely did kind of come to come to
Speaker 1: the fore, but not many of them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but these two are really interesting sub stories in
Speaker 3: and of themselves.
Speaker 1: For sure.
Speaker 3: The first guy's name was last name Arnold.
Speaker 1: First name Roger. That's right, I call him Richard, That's
Speaker 1: all right, but for good reason.
Speaker 3: Oh sure, because you said he was like the Richard
Speaker 3: Jewel of his day. Yeah, the Olympic bomber who was
Speaker 3: not the bomber.
Speaker 1: Right, but whose life was ruined because he basically was
Speaker 1: implicated as the Olympic bomber.
Speaker 3: Right, the same thing happened to this guy. Yeah, he
Speaker 3: was one of the first named suspects. Forty nine year
Speaker 3: old guy.
Speaker 1: So put yourself in the position. Okay, the media is
Speaker 1: going berserk on the story. Everybody hears about it. It's
Speaker 1: a mad anonymous poisoner. And now all of a sudden
Speaker 1: there's a name and a face associated with it. Who's
Speaker 1: a suspect, But he's the first person named. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like people going crazy, like trying to get to
Speaker 1: this guy to interview him.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I have my doubts about this guy, not that he
Speaker 3: did that, but there are a lot of hinky things
Speaker 3: that they found out about him. Sure, and then how
Speaker 3: it all ended up. Yeah, as you're about to see.
Speaker 3: So he was a diy chemist.
Speaker 1: It's a big one.
Speaker 3: There's a big thing right there, because into chemistry.
Speaker 1: He said, he's a jekylin Hyde type who's probably into chemistry.
Speaker 3: That's right. He was a dockhand at Jewel food just
Speaker 3: at a warehouse west of Chicago.
Speaker 1: And Dual Foods. There are a couple of different jewel
Speaker 1: foods are where the tyran was bought. It's like a
Speaker 1: grocery store of food market.
Speaker 3: It's all checking out so far. So the cops look
Speaker 3: into him and go to his house. He has a book,
Speaker 3: a handbook rather on methods of killing people.
Speaker 1: How to kill people A to Z. I don't know
Speaker 1: if that's a title, but okay, that's a good one.
Speaker 3: He had five unregistered guns.
Speaker 1: That's a big one.
Speaker 3: He admitted to having cyanide once. Yeah, but he said
Speaker 3: I threw it out like at least six months before
Speaker 3: these murders.
Speaker 1: He's like, when were the murders again? Oh, yeah, six
Speaker 1: months before that. That's fine, it was.
Speaker 3: And then his wife said, uh, you know they're investigating
Speaker 3: her and interviewing her. She was like, you know what,
Speaker 3: Actually I did take some tyl and all and felt
Speaker 3: really sick and threw up one time. But again I
Speaker 3: was it was probably due to overeating and it was
Speaker 3: just that once.
Speaker 1: As the fact of the podcast, So like, you.
Speaker 3: Can't blame cops for saying this guy's a pretty good lead.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because you can kind of start to see, like
Speaker 1: if you add all the other stuff together. And then
Speaker 1: hear about the wife throwing up from tailand all we like,
Speaker 1: could you see this guy like toying with his wife,
Speaker 1: like testing it out on her, just enough to make
Speaker 1: her sick, but not to kill her, to see what happened,
Speaker 1: you know, see if she would notice? Who knows. But
Speaker 1: the cops thoroughly investigated this guy and cleared him. There's
Speaker 1: a there's not a person associated with the story that
Speaker 1: I came across who thought, he said, I actually think
Speaker 1: this guy did it. I didn't find one person who
Speaker 1: thought Roger Arnold actually did it. But in very short
Speaker 1: order he proved that he was more than capable of murder,
Speaker 1: because six months after he was cleared as a suspect,
Speaker 1: he was brought in for the murder of somebody else,
Speaker 1: a guy named John Stenishaw Stanisha. I would say, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm going with that too, some Slovak or something.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he was forty six. He was a Chicago computer consultant.
Speaker 1: And that's saying something in nineteen eighty two.
Speaker 3: Yeah, probably. So, So here's what happened Arnold. There was
Speaker 3: his bartender name or bar owner named Marty Sinclair, who
Speaker 3: Arnold had thought had initially turned him into the cops
Speaker 3: and ruined his life essentially, so he goes to kill
Speaker 3: who he thinks is Marty Sinclair and it's actually this
Speaker 3: just completely innocent, random guy who gets shot point blank.
Speaker 3: And so he in fact did kill somebody. He did
Speaker 3: because of what had happened to his life.
Speaker 1: It was premeditated murder, even though it was the wrong person.
Speaker 1: He was definitely he created an intentional homicide. He killed
Speaker 1: somebody on.
Speaker 3: Purpose mistaken identity killing though.
Speaker 1: Right, and because of this, because it was directly related
Speaker 1: to the Titlan All poisonings, John Stanisha is frequently considered
Speaker 1: an eighth victim of the Titlan All killings. Yeah, kind
Speaker 1: of like an honorary victim, right in this case. But
Speaker 1: it is kind of appropriate that he just happened to
Speaker 1: be in the wrong place at the wrong time, a
Speaker 1: victim of mistaken identity. You know, it would have like
Speaker 1: a slightly different ring to it if it had been
Speaker 1: the right guy. The fact that it was the wrong
Speaker 1: guy and that poor dude just happened to be in
Speaker 1: the wrong bar and it happened to look like the owner,
Speaker 1: that's just it just is perfect for this saga.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I wonder what Marty Sinclair thought about all that.
Speaker 1: I'll bet he was not very happy.
Speaker 3: Probably not, but probably also very relieved and probably also guilt.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would guess there's a touch of that.
Speaker 3: A range of emotions, I would imagine, yeah, all over
Speaker 3: the place. So Arnold ended up serving fifteen years of
Speaker 3: a thirty year sentence, was released in ninety nine, and
Speaker 3: died nine years later.
Speaker 1: Yep, So, chuck, Before we go on to the main attraction,
Speaker 1: as far as the suspects go, yeah, I propose that
Speaker 1: we take a break. Agreed. Okay, We'll be right back.
Speaker 4: Stop you know, stop stop stop, should know no, stop?
Speaker 1: All right, Chuck. So this dude, there was basically two
Speaker 1: suspects in this whole case. Over all these years, there
Speaker 1: are basically two people. And again no one was ever
Speaker 1: actually charged with the murders. But this guy came awfully close.
Speaker 1: And his name was James Lewis. It was it, it
Speaker 1: turns out it was. But James Lewis came under the
Speaker 1: attention of the Chicago p D and the Thailand All
Speaker 1: Task Force when a letter showed up at Johnson and
Speaker 1: Johnson headquarters and it was from allegedly the Thailand All Poisoner,
Speaker 1: the mad Poisoner, and in the letter. It said basically like,
Speaker 1: I've spent fifty so far, and the whole thing has
Speaker 1: taken me about ten minutes per bottle, and I've already
Speaker 1: killed seven people. I basically see no reason to stop.
Speaker 1: Pay me one million dollars and then I will stop
Speaker 1: the killings. And it hired.
Speaker 3: He gave a bank account number, right, he said, wire
Speaker 3: me this money.
Speaker 1: Very very presiently. No, that's not the right word. Stupidly maybe,
Speaker 1: but is it. No, it's not. So this letter has
Speaker 1: a New York postmark, but the bank account is associated
Speaker 1: with a travel agency in Chicago. And so the cops go, Okay,
Speaker 1: this seems like it was dropped in our lap, but
Speaker 1: let's go check it out. And they find the owner
Speaker 1: of this travel agency that had closed up, had gone under,
Speaker 1: and this guy is like, oh my god, you're kidding me.
Speaker 1: He's like, no, I didn't write this letter, but I
Speaker 1: can guarantee I can tell you who did is a
Speaker 1: guy named Robert Richardson. Robert Richardson, it turned out, was
Speaker 1: the husband of a woman named Nancy Richardson, who had
Speaker 1: worked at the travel agency, and when the travel agency
Speaker 1: went belly up, Nancy lost her job and never got
Speaker 1: her last paycheck. Well, Robert Richardson was the type of
Speaker 1: guy who would fixate on this, right, and was even
Speaker 1: more so the type of guy who would write a
Speaker 1: letter to frame the owner of the travel agency for
Speaker 1: the tailan all murderers in retaliation for that last paycheck.
Speaker 1: He was that kind of dude, right, And so the
Speaker 1: cops started sniffing into this Robert Richardson cat and they
Speaker 1: figured out pretty quickly that Robert Richardson didn't actually exist,
Speaker 1: that he was actually somebody else, a man named James Lewis.
Speaker 3: Right. So when we joked earlier about is that his
Speaker 3: real name, and you said it was, it was?
Speaker 1: It was.
Speaker 3: His name was not Robert Richardson though, that was an alias.
Speaker 3: So what they found out was that Robert Richardson was
Speaker 3: a tax consultant. He and this is just a strange,
Speaker 3: ironic twist, when he was twenty years old, he tried
Speaker 3: to take his own life by swallowing aspirin.
Speaker 1: Thirty six of them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so that's just neither here nor there. But an
Speaker 3: interesting little side note.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the fact that, like most people don't have that
Speaker 1: as part of their past. Yeah, it is interesting that
Speaker 1: it came.
Speaker 3: Up, so he had a pretty long rap sheet. He
Speaker 3: was wanted by postal inspectors for a credit card fraud
Speaker 3: in Kansas City. He was indicted in nineteen seventy eight.
Speaker 3: And this one is just mind blowing. Yeah, he's indicted
Speaker 3: for murder after police found remains of one of his
Speaker 3: former clients in bags in his attic, and he got
Speaker 3: let loose because it was an illegal search.
Speaker 1: But he was caught with the body of one of
Speaker 1: his clients. He was dismembered in his attic with no
Speaker 1: good explanation as far as I've ever heard.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, what explanation would be good?
Speaker 1: Well, we were playing poker and one thing I.
Speaker 3: Do another juggling swords and yeah. So his wife's real
Speaker 3: name was lee Anne, the one who worked at the
Speaker 3: travel agency and went unpaid. They fled Kansas City in
Speaker 3: December of eighty one, and this was as US Postal
Speaker 3: inspectors were converging on them about this credit card scheme.
Speaker 3: So they're like, just bad people.
Speaker 1: Not the postal inspectors, No, no, no, the Lewises.
Speaker 3: Sure great. Yeah, so they moved to Chicago. They changed
Speaker 3: their names to Robert Nancy Richardson. He got that job
Speaker 3: as a tax preparer. But then he was fired after
Speaker 3: a violent outburst in his office against his co workers,
Speaker 3: and then she lost her job, went unpaid. They left Chicago,
Speaker 3: and this turns out this is what got them exonerated
Speaker 3: from the title. All thing is, they left Chicago and
Speaker 3: moved to New York before this.
Speaker 1: Happened, right before those same month, right.
Speaker 3: But if the theory held up that this person went around,
Speaker 3: most likely in one day and did all this stuff,
Speaker 3: then it couldn't have been them.
Speaker 1: No, And here's why, because the cops had decided that
Speaker 1: it was done locally. And one of the other things
Speaker 1: that supported that local mad poisoner theory was because the
Speaker 1: cyanide ate through the gelatin capsules eventually, so I had
Speaker 1: a very very short shelf life before the whole bottle
Speaker 1: just turned into a mush of cyanid powder and melted gelatin. So,
Speaker 1: like you said, it had to have been done basically
Speaker 1: the day before the twenty ninth. On the twenty eighth,
Speaker 1: they could not, no matter how hard they tried, they
Speaker 1: could not put James Lewis or his wife in Chicago
Speaker 1: that day. They just couldn't. And for his part, James
Speaker 1: Lewis said, yeah, I wrote this letter. I wrote the
Speaker 1: letter of Johnson and Johnson framing that travel agency guy.
Speaker 1: But I did not I did not poison the title.
Speaker 1: In all. He's always been adamant about that. He's never
Speaker 1: toyed around with it. He's never messed around, he's never
Speaker 1: been coy he's always been adamant that he did not
Speaker 1: poison that tile in all. Although the Talent All Task
Speaker 1: Force tried to trip him up once, I guess to
Speaker 1: just get this on the record that he done this,
Speaker 1: but they asked him, like, in an interview, Okay, let's
Speaker 1: say you had done it, how would you have done it?
Speaker 1: And he actually pulled an OJ. He showed them how
Speaker 1: he would have done it.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: Yeah. He just didn't write a book about it. He
Speaker 1: just showed him in an interview.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And he defends this later on by saying it was
Speaker 3: just a speculative scenario. I could tell you how Julius
Speaker 3: Caesar was killed, but that doesn't mean I was the killer, right.
Speaker 3: I think the answer for me would have been I
Speaker 3: don't know, man, Yeah, I'm innocent. I can't figure this out.
Speaker 3: But he's like, here's how I do it.
Speaker 1: I've been waiting for you to ask me.
Speaker 3: Though he's eventually found in New York City. He's at
Speaker 3: the public library with a reference book, copying names and
Speaker 3: addresses of newspapers. I would imagine to send them letters
Speaker 3: like zodiac style.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because so we got to say this. So the
Speaker 1: cops figured out who James Lewis was before they found
Speaker 1: James Lewis, and it became part of the national media circus.
Speaker 1: While they were looking for James Lewis, this guy was
Speaker 1: writing letters to newspapers. He called in a radio talk show. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he was really relishing the fact that there was a
Speaker 1: national manhunt out for him. Who Like, that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: On the one hand, you got to kind of feel
Speaker 1: a little bit bad that this guy was kind of
Speaker 1: being railroaded into, you know, the rap for these murders.
Speaker 3: After his extortion attempt, that's where the.
Speaker 1: Feeling bad forms is. You're like, oh, yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: He totally brought this on himself.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So they hauled him out of the New York
Speaker 3: Public Library. He was sentenced to ten years for extortion
Speaker 3: attempt in ten years for credit that original credit card fraud,
Speaker 3: and served thirteen years and lives in the Greater Boston
Speaker 3: area today.
Speaker 1: So still today there, I think there are a few
Speaker 1: people who are like, I could see this guy, maybe
Speaker 1: maybe he could, he could be at Some detectives maintain
Speaker 1: that the Tailanhall murder could have flown into O'Hare, rented
Speaker 1: a car, done that circuit, flown or driven back to
Speaker 1: here and flown out all in the same day the
Speaker 1: day before, but they could never put James Lewis in
Speaker 1: Chicago at all that day. So he was cleared finally,
Speaker 1: although he did serve two consecutive ten year sentences. He
Speaker 1: served thirteen of the twenty years for that credit card
Speaker 1: fraud that the Postal Inspectors wanted him for and for
Speaker 1: the extortion letter. And like you said, he lives in Cambridge,
Speaker 1: mass now. But then in two thousand and nine, the case,
Speaker 1: after basically having gone dormant in the early eighties, was
Speaker 1: reignited by the FBI because they worked up they thought
Speaker 1: a DNA profile from the capsules, and they raided James
Speaker 1: Lewis's house demanded a fingerprint and DNA sample. James and
Speaker 1: Leanne Lewis fought it in court. The judges like, no,
Speaker 1: you have to do this before leaving the courthouse. They
Speaker 1: gave him the samples and nothing has come of it.
Speaker 1: So I guess that means tacitly that the Lewises were
Speaker 1: cleared once and four all of the tailent all murders.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know, the DNA thing is an interesting
Speaker 3: piece because they still have some samples of the cyanide.
Speaker 3: I guess that the capsules have worn away by now
Speaker 3: if it had the cyanide in there. But there was
Speaker 3: and still his hope that DNA could could crack this case,
Speaker 3: just like eight or nine years ago. The unibomber ted Kazinski.
Speaker 3: Is that a two parter? No, No, just one part
Speaker 3: good podcast, So I.
Speaker 1: Don't think so. That was a good episode.
Speaker 3: He grew up in Chicago and his parents were living
Speaker 3: in the Greater Chicago area in eighty two, and he
Speaker 3: is the unibomber. So they said we might as well
Speaker 3: get a DNA sample and talk to him, right, and
Speaker 3: he was cleared. I don't think he was ever a
Speaker 3: super strong suspect, no, and he probably would have admitted it.
Speaker 3: So he was like, no, this is not me.
Speaker 1: Right, So the unibomber has been cleared. That's right from
Speaker 1: the talent on. But that remains. The case remains unsolved
Speaker 1: to this day. I think they also have a fingerprint
Speaker 1: work up that they found on one of the bottles
Speaker 1: and that and some DNA it is they're just sitting
Speaker 1: around with that. There's there are no suspects there. Every
Speaker 1: suspect has been cleared and there's nobody on the horizon.
Speaker 1: It's just an unsolved random series of killings that happened.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're still working on it though. There's a police
Speaker 3: sergeant named Scott Winkelmann who has been on this task
Speaker 3: force for a long time and he says he thinks
Speaker 3: is solvable and his department did just save a forty
Speaker 3: five year old murder case cold case.
Speaker 1: Man, if they solved this one, that would be, I know,
Speaker 1: the biggest cold case ever solved.
Speaker 3: I think. I mean, who knows, But I could see
Speaker 3: maybe finding like a deathbed letter or something one day,
Speaker 3: maybe like I don't know if they're going to catch someone.
Speaker 1: At the bottom of the Chicago River and hull them.
Speaker 3: Off to jail. But I could see the truth coming
Speaker 3: out when day. I hope so for the families because
Speaker 3: Monica Janis she's the niece of Adam Stanley and Teresa.
Speaker 3: She said her family to this day, this is from
Speaker 3: an article like last year, I think, said that they
Speaker 3: have still not gotten over it. She said her grandparents
Speaker 3: have passed now, but she said, literally every day for
Speaker 3: the rest of their lives, they just cried about me,
Speaker 3: the fact that they didn't know who did it. She
Speaker 3: grew up and has been a therapy therapy her whole
Speaker 3: life because there were all victims. You know that this
Speaker 3: post traumatic stress disorder kicks in sure where she grew
Speaker 3: up fearing that any of her family members could die
Speaker 3: at any time. Joseph Manus, her dad, says that he
Speaker 3: still has dreams like you know on the rag about
Speaker 3: these murders. He said he had one recently where everyone
Speaker 3: involved was in a room in the case and then
Speaker 3: two black men in suits and glasses were laughing about
Speaker 3: how they got away with murder. Michelle Rosen, she's the
Speaker 3: daughter of Mary Reiner. She has dedicated her life to
Speaker 3: investigating this on her own and she doesn't agree with
Speaker 3: the Loane the mad poisoner theory at all.
Speaker 1: No, this is interesting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, she thinks it had something to do with the
Speaker 3: supply chain.
Speaker 1: And that Johnson and Johnson knew this and covered it.
Speaker 3: Up.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: One of the things, one of the things that people
Speaker 1: who believe this point to is that Johnson and Johnson
Speaker 1: recalled all of that tail and all thirty one million
Speaker 1: bottles and then destroyed them allegedly without testing any of it.
Speaker 1: So we will never know whether it was Pinky had
Speaker 1: the day off right, whether whether it was beyond Chicago
Speaker 1: or just locals in Chicago. Seems like it took long
Speaker 1: enough that other people would have died in that week
Speaker 1: before the national recall was undertaken. But there was something very,
Speaker 1: very interesting that was a PostScript to all this that
Speaker 1: does undermine that mad poisoner theory.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was just a few years later, in nineteen
Speaker 3: eighty five, a woman in New York named Diane Ellsroth
Speaker 3: took two extra strength Tilon all capsules and died from
Speaker 3: cyanide poisoning. But they found I mean, it's just completely unrelated.
Speaker 3: Was it another copycat case well, or the original poisoner maybe?
Speaker 3: So this is a different cyanide.
Speaker 1: Right, The cyanide was definitely not the same side from
Speaker 1: the same batch. It was chemically different. But there was
Speaker 1: another bottle found around the block from where Mary Elswroth
Speaker 1: bought hers and Yonkers that did match that cyanide. So
Speaker 1: there were two bottles of extra strength til and All
Speaker 1: two years later in another state that had been tampered with.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: The problem is this was after the three prong tamper
Speaker 1: resistant packaging had been introduced.
Speaker 3: Which means it was an inside job, right.
Speaker 1: I guess because the tamper the thing had not been
Speaker 1: obviously tampered with. Then Thailand all was never able to
Speaker 1: play what happened?
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then within five days of her death, eight
Speaker 3: states outright banned the capsules, Thailand all capsules.
Speaker 1: Right, and Thailand All, for its part, was like, we've
Speaker 1: been trying to get everybody to take capl it's anyway,
Speaker 1: but they keep taking capsules, so we're making it.
Speaker 3: And then a guy wrote a book, right, Scott Bart's Yeah,
Speaker 3: a former Johnson and Johnson employee wrote in twenty eleven
Speaker 3: a self published book on the timel in All poisonings.
Speaker 3: And he said, you know what we were talking about earlier.
Speaker 3: He's like, this supply chain is so convoluted, right, basically,
Speaker 3: like it could definitely could have happened at any point
Speaker 3: right along the way.
Speaker 1: And his idea is that that Johnson and Johnson knew
Speaker 1: that it was in their distribution network and they covered it.
Speaker 3: Up self published book.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you gotta note that for sure.
Speaker 3: I'm not knocking it, no, but it's noteworthy.
Speaker 1: It does if there's like any hint of journalistic integrity
Speaker 1: in US, that feels like we have to note that.
Speaker 4: Sure.
Speaker 1: So that's the tailanol poisonings of nineteen eighty two in
Speaker 1: Chicago changed America, changed the world, but definitely changed America.
Speaker 1: Was the end of some form of innocence that we
Speaker 1: still had.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, if you.
Speaker 1: Want to know more about the tail and Al poisonings,
Speaker 1: go online. There's stuff all over the place and you
Speaker 1: can go down that rabbit hole and it's deep and wide.
Speaker 1: Since I said that, it's time for listener, ma'am.
Speaker 3: This is from Jin from Brunswick, Maine. Hey, guys, been
Speaker 3: listening for several years and never thought I'd have a
Speaker 3: never thought a perfect time would to write. End would
Speaker 3: be related to synthetic farts. Remember the discussed episode we
Speaker 3: talked about synthetic parts. It's a real thing. When I
Speaker 3: was in high school, my dad came across the stuff
Speaker 3: online called liquid ass.
Speaker 1: That's horrible.
Speaker 3: Not a lot occurs, right, No, that occursion.
Speaker 1: We can spell it out, though, sure, or I guess
Speaker 1: maybe you should have said, like ask asterisk.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there you go. A good name for a product, though.
Speaker 3: She said. He found it on a joke web website
Speaker 3: and ordered some. And I have to tell you it
Speaker 3: is the worst thing you've ever smelled. I can't even
Speaker 3: describe it, and it makes you want to not breathe anymore.
Speaker 3: The tiniest little drop is deadly. So of course I
Speaker 3: took it to college with me to play pranks, and
Speaker 3: boy did it backfire. I thought I was pretty funny
Speaker 3: putting a couple of drops in the radiator by across
Speaker 3: the friend across the hall friends room, not eating, thinking
Speaker 3: and not even thinking about what would happen when the
Speaker 3: heat turned on. Well, the heat turned on and the
Speaker 3: whole floor of the dorm was amazingly disgusting and made
Speaker 3: us just about gag. Smell took almost a week to
Speaker 3: finally go away, and I have not used it again
Speaker 3: in the ten years since.
Speaker 1: That's probably it's called learning your lesson.
Speaker 3: But she still has the bottle.
Speaker 1: She's like, but I kept it right just in case.
Speaker 3: Thank you for your interesting and entertaining podcast. This is
Speaker 3: the first podcast ever listened to, and it's still always
Speaker 3: on the top of my download list. Thanks thanks for
Speaker 3: giving this twenty eight year old woman a platform on
Speaker 3: which to tell a story of synthetic farts that is
Speaker 3: not completely out of place.
Speaker 1: Signed anonymous that is Jengreen. Thanks Jengreen, very brave for
Speaker 1: you'd put your name on that one. Especially. I wonder
Speaker 1: if you stepped up and said that horrible smell that
Speaker 1: was my bad.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 1: If you have a great story about college pranks, we
Speaker 1: want to hear about it. You can get in touch
Speaker 1: with this via our social links by going to stuff
Speaker 1: youshould Know dot com, or you can send us an
Speaker 1: email to Stuff Podcast at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2: Stuff you Should Know is a production of Iheartradios How
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