1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: It's time to get inside the Giants Huddle on Giants 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:09,479 Speaker 1: dot Com, the Giants Mobile, Go Go, Giants Podcast Network. 3 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:12,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Giants Huddle. I'm Paul Detino and we 4 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: are joined by a very special guest, Rich Podolski, who 5 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:19,720 Speaker 1: is the author of You're Looking Live, a book which 6 00:00:20,040 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 1: really kind of breaks the barriers from the old CBS 7 00:00:23,880 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: NFL Today program that really was the precursor to every 8 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,560 Speaker 1: kind of live pregame show that you see today in 9 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:35,879 Speaker 1: sports television. You can always see the Giants Huddle on 10 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:38,440 Speaker 1: our YouTube channel, as well as getting all the audio 11 00:00:38,720 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 1: on our Giants Mobile app and our website at Giants 12 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:44,560 Speaker 1: dot Com. And Rich, uh, the people out there, I 13 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:49,160 Speaker 1: don't think they truly understand how this particular program changed 14 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:53,560 Speaker 1: the entire landscape of what we are seeing today. We 15 00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 1: have to go back to the nineteen seventies. The NFL 16 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:04,320 Speaker 1: Today as we it started in nine. Before that, there 17 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 1: were only three channels. There was no cable ESPM was 18 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:14,200 Speaker 1: still six years away. There was no CNN News Cycle, 19 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 1: there was no Internet. There was no way to get 20 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:21,480 Speaker 1: even scores unless you had an ap kicker in your house. 21 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 1: The networks didn't give scores. Up score updates in a 22 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:31,080 Speaker 1: timely fashion. You couldn't even get highlights at halftime of 23 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: CBS games. The only highlights you would see is of 24 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:39,199 Speaker 1: the game you were watching. You know, videotape was only 25 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 1: a little more than a decade old. Uh So these 26 00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: these really were the old old days of sports television. 27 00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: And then a guy named Bob Bussler came along. Bob 28 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 1: Whussler had run the CBS News Special Unit with Waller Cronkite. 29 00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: He did uh so many gray events for them, and 30 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 1: he was a terrific executive and a producer, and he 31 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:12,920 Speaker 1: knew what he thought the public would want, and he 32 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 1: uh the first thing he did is he converted the 33 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:19,080 Speaker 1: show to live. He made it a live previously to 34 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:22,400 Speaker 1: seventy five, uh the only thing that was live were 35 00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:26,360 Speaker 1: the games themselves. All the pregame shows were take days before. 36 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 1: In fact, on Thursday night they would take them. Jack 37 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 1: Whittaker and Lee Leonard were the hosts in seventy four, 38 00:02:35,320 --> 00:02:40,960 Speaker 1: And when the producer and seventy four Bill Fitz, tried 39 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 1: to do highlights Jack Whittaker, it just it was too 40 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:48,079 Speaker 1: fast for him. They couldn't get it done until one 41 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:51,799 Speaker 1: weekend Whittaker was away on assignment. They brought a guy 42 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 1: named Brent, somebody in from Chicago, Brent Musburger, and he 43 00:02:57,639 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 1: thought he was a kid in the candy store. Was 44 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 1: easy heck for him, and they knew Brent was going 45 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: to be the future of UH doing highlights and hosting 46 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: the show. When Weissler came in a seventy as the 47 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:13,679 Speaker 1: new president of CBS Sports, he brought a guy named 48 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:17,520 Speaker 1: Michael Pearl to be his live producer from Miami, a 49 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 1: great producer. He brought in Brent to run the show 50 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:29,919 Speaker 1: from UH the situation of being the cog on the 51 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:34,640 Speaker 1: table there and he decided that we needed a woman 52 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 1: on the show. Wessler said that it was TV sports 53 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 1: was becoming a male ghetto, and he thought there was 54 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 1: room for a woman to bring the women into into 55 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 1: the audience. And he also wanted to have an African 56 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 1: American co host, and that became our cross. You know, 57 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:01,640 Speaker 1: I think, Rich when when I look back at it, 58 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:04,560 Speaker 1: and I think the title of your book is really 59 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: so appropriate because you had the live whip around which 60 00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 1: Brent was so good at introducing using your catchphrase. You 61 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 1: had the live personalities that were now interacting on the desk. 62 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:22,799 Speaker 1: I mean the these plus of course, the mixture of 63 00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:25,200 Speaker 1: of the the characters that you're talking about. We didn't 64 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:28,360 Speaker 1: even get to Jimmy the Greek yet, so we're talking 65 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:34,159 Speaker 1: about significant changes that today. I mean, holy moly, we've 66 00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:38,119 Speaker 1: got whip around coverage everywhere you can see, including red zone. 67 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 1: We've got mixtures of personalities on every desk you can 68 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: find in every form of television, entertainment and sports. And 69 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:50,520 Speaker 1: you know, we've also got you know, the the the 70 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:54,960 Speaker 1: I don't want to say the versification isn't necessarily the 71 00:04:55,080 --> 00:04:58,120 Speaker 1: right word, but the way that they covered so that 72 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 1: it's more entertaining as well as just giving you the 73 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:04,320 Speaker 1: XS and o's of sports, I guess, broadening the scope 74 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:06,760 Speaker 1: of what they were trying to do. I mean, heck, 75 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:09,120 Speaker 1: we might even have a pregame show for the NFL 76 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:12,719 Speaker 1: release of the schedule coming up sometime soon. That's how 77 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:15,840 Speaker 1: crazy this is all exploded. Which do you believe is 78 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:19,400 Speaker 1: the most important innovation of all the different things that 79 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:24,279 Speaker 1: the NFL today did. Wow, that's a tough one, Paul Um. 80 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 1: I would say that, let me think about that for 81 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 1: a little bit and I'll come back to you with it, 82 00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: I'll tell you what. I'll tell you what I'll do 83 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:37,479 Speaker 1: instead of making me get one from you. Do you 84 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:40,760 Speaker 1: think that there are three that would be all tied 85 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:43,200 Speaker 1: together and say these three would be the three that 86 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:46,040 Speaker 1: we could not we could not ignore the NFL today. 87 00:05:46,040 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 1: For well, I think going alive was tremendously significant. I 88 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:55,920 Speaker 1: think adding a person of color and a woman was 89 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:59,679 Speaker 1: light years ahead of the rest of the television world. 90 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: I mean, Whistler grew up in a community in uh 91 00:06:04,520 --> 00:06:07,400 Speaker 1: New Jersey, and he it was it was kind of 92 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 1: a mafia run community, and he saw a lot of 93 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:15,920 Speaker 1: the ills of society, and he wanted to do this 94 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 1: to make things available for the rest rest of the world. 95 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:26,120 Speaker 1: You know, before nineteen seventy five, Um, besides of not 96 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:29,680 Speaker 1: being alive, the only hosts were middle aged white men 97 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 1: of these pregame shows, you know, and having Phillis Georgia 98 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 1: and Phillis George for for those of you who are 99 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:40,719 Speaker 1: under the age of fifty, was a Miss America in 100 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:47,040 Speaker 1: seventy one. She was vivacious, She she was next door beautiful, 101 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 1: but she was approachable, you know. She she didn't wear 102 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:54,800 Speaker 1: a lot of makeup. She was somebody you would want 103 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: to sit down and have a drink with She was 104 00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:03,040 Speaker 1: fun um, and America just took to her right away. 105 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 1: She had previous TV experience on a show called Candy 106 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:11,400 Speaker 1: Camera in New York with a guy named Alan Fund, 107 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: but she didn't like playing second banana to Allen Fund, 108 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 1: and she got her chance with Bob Whistler, and Whistler 109 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:24,520 Speaker 1: really had tremendous confidence in her and earth Cross. Earth 110 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:31,040 Speaker 1: Cross was already the first African American doing analysis on 111 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 1: games for the CBS network, but he wasn't doing games 112 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: back to New York, so the New York audience wasn't 113 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:41,120 Speaker 1: really that familiar with him, except as an ex player 114 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:48,040 Speaker 1: with the Eagles. Uh earth Cross met Bob Whistler at 115 00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:52,560 Speaker 1: the Super Bowl eight. CBS was doing the game at 116 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 1: the pregame luncheon and Whistler asked earth crossed what he 117 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 1: thought was going to happen in the game. Well, earth 118 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:05,600 Speaker 1: had spoken to both quarterbacks the day before privately, and 119 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:07,600 Speaker 1: he knew what was going to happen in the game, 120 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,760 Speaker 1: and he told Whistler what the game plan was and 121 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:13,840 Speaker 1: when it turned out that way with the Dolphins winning 122 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:18,160 Speaker 1: so convincingly, after the game Whistler grabbed her across and said, look, 123 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 1: we're going to do this show next year and I 124 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 1: want you to be a part of it. And uh 125 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 1: that that's how that came to be. Uh. As far 126 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:31,240 Speaker 1: as the phrase, you are looking alive. And one of 127 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 1: the very first production meetings, Bob Fishman, who was the director, said, 128 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:42,320 Speaker 1: in the meeting, which included Michael Pearl the producer, and 129 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 1: Phyllis and Brent and Earth, they were talking about how 130 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: to open the show and uh, and Fishman said, well, 131 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:54,400 Speaker 1: I've got somebuddy, so I like to bet on the games, 132 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 1: and they always want to know what the weather is 133 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:01,560 Speaker 1: and uh. CBS was already dealing kind of a whip 134 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 1: around showing the different stadiums, and Brent said, in this 135 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 1: meeting that was real. Early in nine, Brent said, well, 136 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: when we do that whip around, I could say you 137 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 1: are looking live at Soldier Field in Chicago where today 138 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:22,319 Speaker 1: Walter Payton and the Chicago Bears, etcetera. And you are 139 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:26,199 Speaker 1: looking live at Vet Stadium. And and as soon as 140 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:29,920 Speaker 1: he said You're looking alive, it was as if everyone 141 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:32,440 Speaker 1: had just seen the Mona Lisa for the first time. 142 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:36,800 Speaker 1: They knew it was perfect. It gives you goose bumps 143 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:39,920 Speaker 1: just thinking about it. Rich to be honest, and you know, 144 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:43,720 Speaker 1: I think Brent, we we know of his journalistic background, 145 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 1: and you go into it very deeply in the book. 146 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 1: He just was the right guy. I'm not sure if 147 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:54,400 Speaker 1: the show had gone in another direction and taken somebody else. 148 00:09:54,520 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 1: And let's make it clear, there have been some great 149 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:01,080 Speaker 1: studio hosts. Bob Costas and Jim mc k come to 150 00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:05,680 Speaker 1: mind pretty quickly, and you know, but Brent, Brent was 151 00:10:05,760 --> 00:10:11,319 Speaker 1: the right guy for that job exactly. He was. He 152 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 1: was so much the right guy. Uh. The strange thing 153 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:20,040 Speaker 1: about Brent was nobody really knew him. He was a 154 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 1: guy from Chicago and he had done a few games 155 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:28,439 Speaker 1: for CBS the year before as a play by play guy. Uh, 156 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: and I think he had hosted a sports spectacular too, 157 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:35,080 Speaker 1: But he was he was pretty much unknown. And he 158 00:10:35,120 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 1: says this himself, and he comes in and he runs 159 00:10:38,640 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 1: the show as if he was, uh, the man in 160 00:10:43,480 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: charge for a decade already. And as far as saying 161 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:49,080 Speaker 1: you are looking live, he said that at the beginning 162 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:52,400 Speaker 1: of every show for the next fifteen years, and then 163 00:10:52,440 --> 00:10:55,920 Speaker 1: the following year, as you brought up they brought in 164 00:10:56,040 --> 00:11:00,280 Speaker 1: Jimmy the Greek to make the gamblers happy and add 165 00:11:00,320 --> 00:11:04,080 Speaker 1: a little spice to the show. And uh, Bob Wessler 166 00:11:04,120 --> 00:11:08,960 Speaker 1: had tremendous, tremendous hutzpah to do this. I mean, the 167 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:14,679 Speaker 1: NFL and Pete Roselle, at least outwardly, were dead set 168 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 1: against gambling and didn't want any mention of point spreads 169 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:23,080 Speaker 1: on the show. I remember Rich when when the Greek 170 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:26,680 Speaker 1: came on, they used to have this big board and 171 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:29,080 Speaker 1: Brent would be on one side and Jimmy the Greek 172 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 1: would be on the other side, and you would see 173 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:35,679 Speaker 1: these different categories that that Jimmy had picked out right 174 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:37,640 Speaker 1: for the game, and then he would have a check 175 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 1: mark and let's say they'd be a check mark on 176 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:42,840 Speaker 1: the San Francisco side or a check mark on the 177 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 1: Dallas side, to compending upon you know, what he thought 178 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:48,880 Speaker 1: of each of the categories. And then he would say, well, 179 00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 1: I think they'll win, you know, rather handedly, and he 180 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 1: had to be very careful about, you know, not specifically 181 00:11:55,280 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 1: getting too detailed in his comments. He uh, yeah, he 182 00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 1: had eighteen categories. And I knew Jimmy very well since 183 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:09,040 Speaker 1: I was writer on the show back in nineteen seventy seven. 184 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:16,560 Speaker 1: I'm much older than I look, so, but uh, he 185 00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:19,440 Speaker 1: had of the eighteen categories, he thought team speed was 186 00:12:19,760 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: probably the most important one. Uh and UH when Jimmy 187 00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 1: came to his conclusion, he would say, I think they'll 188 00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:31,640 Speaker 1: win by a touchdown, or I think they'll win by 189 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 1: a field goal, or sometimes he would say, what does 190 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 1: the golfer say when he hits it out of bounds? 191 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:44,000 Speaker 1: He yells four. And they had fun with it, you know, 192 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:47,520 Speaker 1: and in the beginning, you know, Brent and Jimmy had 193 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:51,040 Speaker 1: a great time doing this segment and they really got 194 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:56,720 Speaker 1: along well. And Brent uh was interested in the gambling 195 00:12:56,800 --> 00:12:59,080 Speaker 1: part of it, and he knew as well as Bob 196 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:04,400 Speaker 1: Wessler and Peter Roselle knew that bringing more gamblers to 197 00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:08,400 Speaker 1: the to the show and to the NFL would only 198 00:13:08,480 --> 00:13:12,880 Speaker 1: increase the audience. And it did increase the audience tremendously. 199 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 1: I mean, the NFL today was an incredible hit its 200 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:22,199 Speaker 1: first year in one uh, an unfathomable thirteen Emmy Awards 201 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 1: in nineteen and it really helped increase the audience for 202 00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:33,160 Speaker 1: NFL games and helped the NFL overtake baseball as America's 203 00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:36,760 Speaker 1: favorite sport. I think when Jimmy came to the show, 204 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 1: I mean, we all knew that he had a legendary 205 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 1: niche following with with the gambling community, But when he 206 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 1: came to the show, he was very gregarious. You know this, 207 00:13:47,520 --> 00:13:51,440 Speaker 1: He was quite the personality and and I think he 208 00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 1: added a whole another level of of I don't know, 209 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 1: I don't necessarily want to say humor, but it was 210 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:01,240 Speaker 1: just fun to watch him. Even if look, I was 211 00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 1: a kid in those days. I didn't know anything about 212 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 1: point spreads are gambling. But I enjoyed watching Jimmy because 213 00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:09,839 Speaker 1: you knew he was going to be very colorful in 214 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:16,440 Speaker 1: his presentation. Well, yeah, you know he Uh, he was 215 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: extremely colorful. He was probably the best known of the 216 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: four of them, including fellows George, who had won Miss 217 00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 1: America and had co hosted uh many Miss America shows 218 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 1: after that with Bert Parks. Uh, but Jimmy was really 219 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:37,640 Speaker 1: well known. He was syndicated in three hundred newspapers across 220 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 1: the country, and uh these papers, that was the only 221 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:46,680 Speaker 1: way they could get point spreads, so uh it became 222 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 1: very popular. The Greek Road a column with the point spreads. 223 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:54,880 Speaker 1: A guy named Hank Goldberg, who was t v j 224 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 1: UH sports director and down in Miami. He goes to 225 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:03,840 Speaker 1: the column for many years for the Greek, and the 226 00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: Greek was well, not funny thing about how that came about. 227 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:12,040 Speaker 1: The Greek was very, very successful. Going back to the forties, 228 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: he had won over a million dollars in n betting 229 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,760 Speaker 1: on Harry Truman, who was a twenty two one underdog 230 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:22,960 Speaker 1: to be Governor Dewey of New York for the presidency. 231 00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:28,000 Speaker 1: Uh the Greek Uh was growing a mustache and his 232 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 1: sister said, shaved that off. It reminds me of Hitler. 233 00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:33,960 Speaker 1: And the next thing he did is he looked at 234 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,480 Speaker 1: the front page of the paper and he saw a 235 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 1: picture of doing with his mustache, and he thought, man, 236 00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 1: this guy can lose. He did a little research. He 237 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 1: thought it was an even money bet, and he went 238 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 1: to New York at Lindy's where they served cheesecake where 239 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 1: all the book He's had hung out with Damon Runyon, 240 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 1: and he bet fifty thousand dollars, getting twenty to one 241 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:59,640 Speaker 1: odds and he was a millionaire when a million dollars 242 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:02,680 Speaker 1: was a lot of money. He went to Vegas, he 243 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:07,760 Speaker 1: opened up some of his own bookmaking shops and UH 244 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 1: when RFK, when the Kennedys came in, Bobby Kennedy tried 245 00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 1: to go after uh Sam g and Connor and the mafia. 246 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 1: He had no success. He decided to make a name 247 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:21,520 Speaker 1: for himself by going after Jimmy the Greek, and he 248 00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:28,200 Speaker 1: UH got Jimmy for talking about the over the interstate lines. 249 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 1: He did a phone call with a friend in Utah 250 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,720 Speaker 1: who wanted to know the line on the Utah Utah 251 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:39,080 Speaker 1: state game. And that's how he lost his gambling license. 252 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:41,480 Speaker 1: He had to start all over. He walked into the 253 00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:45,680 Speaker 1: Las Vegas Son and he said, I'll write this column 254 00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:49,240 Speaker 1: for for free. If you don't like it, get rid 255 00:16:49,280 --> 00:16:52,080 Speaker 1: of me. If you like it, pay me and will 256 00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 1: syndicate it. And Uh he became He renewed his vigor, 257 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:01,520 Speaker 1: and he became famous all over again. And in fact, 258 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:05,679 Speaker 1: he started a public relations firm where Howard Hughes was 259 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:09,560 Speaker 1: this big client because Hugh's owned all the big hotels 260 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 1: in Vegas. You alluded to earlier about how you had 261 00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:18,120 Speaker 1: written for CBS Sports mentioned in your book in the biography, 262 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,199 Speaker 1: A handful of years you wrote for CBS for the 263 00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 1: network also prior to that, a very lengthy career, very 264 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:28,119 Speaker 1: well established a respected career as a sports route covered 265 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:31,439 Speaker 1: the Dolphins for a while I saw so, you know, 266 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 1: I can't even imagine how you must have even felt 267 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:39,400 Speaker 1: as someone who was part of that NFL culture and establishment. 268 00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 1: You know, Greek was becoming this huge superstar for something 269 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 1: that was so you know, in the dark in terms 270 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:48,800 Speaker 1: of the way the NFL would recognize it. And now 271 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:52,359 Speaker 1: here it is today where it's not only out there, 272 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 1: but it's also sponsoring the National Football League. I mean, 273 00:17:56,760 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 1: you must be shaking your head. And I think Jimmy 274 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:02,800 Speaker 1: the Greek Snyder would be absolutely going blunkers today. It's 275 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:06,919 Speaker 1: it's unbelievable, you know. And and and you know, I 276 00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:10,880 Speaker 1: gotta wonder turning turning the tables on baseball. I mean, 277 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: every inning there's an ad from DraftKings or Fandel and 278 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:18,280 Speaker 1: you gotta you gotta wonder, how is Pete Pete Rose 279 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 1: not eligible for the Hall of Fame? You know. But 280 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:26,640 Speaker 1: but going back to Jimmy the Greek, I mean, man, 281 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:30,959 Speaker 1: when he came in, it was really it shook up 282 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:34,439 Speaker 1: a lot of people. They were shocked. They you know, 283 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:37,960 Speaker 1: Whussler went out on a limb, and he knew he 284 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:42,040 Speaker 1: had the equity from all successes at CBS. Before he 285 00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:46,600 Speaker 1: came to CBS Sports, he had turned w BBM around 286 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 1: in Chicago from the number four station and news to 287 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:53,320 Speaker 1: the number one. They loved him at CBS, so they 288 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:56,879 Speaker 1: let him do whatever he wanted to do, and bringing 289 00:18:56,880 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 1: the Greek in and and famely, faintly talking about point spreads. 290 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 1: I mean, Roselle had gone on the record in front 291 00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 1: of Congress saying that he thought only two of the 292 00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:13,080 Speaker 1: audience actually bet on the games. That's how much Congress 293 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:16,760 Speaker 1: was worried about it. And when Being no Cook heard 294 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 1: about this, Being Cook was then a publicist for CBS Sports. 295 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,120 Speaker 1: When Being a Cook heard about this, he said, if 296 00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 1: that's true, they all live on my block. All right, 297 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:31,920 Speaker 1: let's let's take it back for a second to the time. 298 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:34,879 Speaker 1: We're talking about the mid seventies, early to mid seventies, 299 00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:38,199 Speaker 1: and you and I both know rich At that point, 300 00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:43,359 Speaker 1: baseball was king here in the States. That was America's pastime. 301 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:47,440 Speaker 1: Baseball was by far the number one professional sports draw. 302 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 1: And I truly believe that the NFL today and the 303 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:55,159 Speaker 1: popularity of that program and getting people pumped up for 304 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:58,320 Speaker 1: the games and making it a Sunday tradition was one 305 00:19:58,359 --> 00:20:02,040 Speaker 1: of the reasons why the NFL started to quickly gain ground. 306 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:04,520 Speaker 1: And now, as we've seen now for a better part 307 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:06,760 Speaker 1: of the last decade or so, it is the most 308 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:12,879 Speaker 1: popular sport in America. Yeah, exactly right, Uh, Paul. You know, 309 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:19,120 Speaker 1: like I said, the NFL today's popularity was off the charts. Uh. 310 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 1: People in the Midwest, in the Heartland were rearranging their 311 00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:27,399 Speaker 1: church going to schedules so they didn't miss Jimmy the 312 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:31,720 Speaker 1: Greek or Phyllis George interviewing the athletes. I mean when 313 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:36,520 Speaker 1: Phillis George asked Roger Starback how he thought he compared 314 00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: to Joe name it. Star Back through that amazing line 315 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:44,359 Speaker 1: at her and said, you know, Joe likes to have 316 00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:47,679 Speaker 1: sex with a lot of girls. I just have sex 317 00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:51,000 Speaker 1: with one and I'm just as happy with it, you know, 318 00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:53,880 Speaker 1: And nobody could believe that, you know. And Phillis got 319 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,760 Speaker 1: these guys to say things that they would never say 320 00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: to a sportswriter, you know, or if they had sent 321 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:02,720 Speaker 1: Arf Cross, you know, they sent off Cross to talk 322 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:06,520 Speaker 1: to the coaches about the game plans and NF NFL 323 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:11,679 Speaker 1: Films helped produce UH. The segments. They were terrific segments, 324 00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:17,480 Speaker 1: but the show was enormously popular. It forced NBC to 325 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:21,960 Speaker 1: start its own pregame show, which it had Jack Buck doing, 326 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:25,119 Speaker 1: which Jack was a great play by play guy, but 327 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,840 Speaker 1: he wasn't really the studio host. And before the end 328 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:31,480 Speaker 1: of the year they brought in Briant gumbel As as 329 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:35,480 Speaker 1: the host, who was a tremendous asset for them, and 330 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 1: then eventually Bob costas UH and then you know, they 331 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:42,760 Speaker 1: had their own version of the Greek with Pete Axelm 332 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:50,120 Speaker 1: at NBC. It just expanded the universe of fans watching 333 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 1: UH the NFL and it was you know, the NFL 334 00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 1: people just loved it in those days. It was so 335 00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 1: exciting and it was kind of so new. Still, Why 336 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:07,400 Speaker 1: do you think that NBC, which had the old AFL 337 00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:11,880 Speaker 1: and then the a f C package, did not come 338 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 1: up with the thought to do what CBS did. I 339 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:23,920 Speaker 1: don't know, to be exactly, I I'm really not sure 340 00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:27,679 Speaker 1: about that. But they didn't have to. You know that 341 00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: they probably felt they didn't have to. UM. I can't 342 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,360 Speaker 1: think of any other excuse at the time. Maybe they 343 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:40,120 Speaker 1: didn't feel they had the personnel to do it. Um. 344 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:43,280 Speaker 1: But you know, CBS started a pregame show back in 345 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 1: the sixties with Johnny Luchack, and then three X giants 346 00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:53,200 Speaker 1: were running the pregame show, Frank Gifford and Kyle Road 347 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:56,720 Speaker 1: and Pass comber All. I mean they took turns from 348 00:22:57,240 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 1: the mid sixties all the way up to seventy three. Uh, 349 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,400 Speaker 1: summer All was doing it with Whittaker, and those were 350 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:11,960 Speaker 1: the shows that were pre taped. Now, back in seventy 351 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:14,800 Speaker 1: of the show was called the NFL Today, and then 352 00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:18,520 Speaker 1: it wasn't called that again until nineteen seventy. It was 353 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 1: called the NFL Report, the NFL on CBS, they had 354 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:28,439 Speaker 1: different names for it. But uh, it was really hard 355 00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:33,760 Speaker 1: for them to go live. Uh back in those years. Now, Richard, 356 00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 1: I want you to clarify if you can for me, 357 00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:38,320 Speaker 1: because as you mentioned Gifford summer All, there were some 358 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 1: of the hosts with Jack Whittaker prior. Um. If if 359 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 1: Brent Musburger had not been such a hit when they 360 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 1: brought him in to do the show, is it possible 361 00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:52,199 Speaker 1: that summer All would have stayed in studio and not 362 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,600 Speaker 1: become the legendary play by play man and voice of 363 00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 1: the NFL that he became because I was kind of 364 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:01,879 Speaker 1: under the impression, if I understood the timeline in your 365 00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:05,240 Speaker 1: book correctly, that you know, when Mussburger was able to 366 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 1: come in, uh and and Whittaker had had kind of 367 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,119 Speaker 1: been phased out, some are all wound up going to 368 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:15,359 Speaker 1: the play by playbooth. Yeah, that that's correct. I don't 369 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:17,920 Speaker 1: think that they would have made some are all the 370 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:23,520 Speaker 1: host of the NFL today because Bob Wessler had come 371 00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:27,360 Speaker 1: in in the mid nine as the president of CBS 372 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:32,760 Speaker 1: Sports and Musburger was his sports director in Chicago, and 373 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:38,320 Speaker 1: he knew how talented Musburger was. I mean, Jim Nance, 374 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:42,560 Speaker 1: who wrote a beautiful forward for this book, said that 375 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:47,119 Speaker 1: Mussburger is the greatest studio host of all time. And 376 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 1: who's going to challenge that. Mussburger was unbelievable, you know, 377 00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:56,680 Speaker 1: And to me when when Brent left CBS and went 378 00:24:56,720 --> 00:25:00,359 Speaker 1: to ABC, and he for the most part, only did 379 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:05,679 Speaker 1: play by play duties, the shame of it was he 380 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:09,520 Speaker 1: never got to host another studio show, which he was 381 00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:15,280 Speaker 1: unbelievably great at. Tim Brando, who was the first host 382 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:19,679 Speaker 1: of Game Day on the ESPN said that the term 383 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:24,280 Speaker 1: studio chemistry was created by Brent and Earth. They were 384 00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 1: so great doing highlights and analysis together. Brent was just unbelievable, 385 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:33,760 Speaker 1: And you know, for fifteen years he did that like 386 00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:38,639 Speaker 1: he was reading uh, the Star Spangled Banner off a 387 00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,240 Speaker 1: sheet of paper. It was the easiest thing in the world. 388 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 1: He was such a natural at it. In fact, the 389 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:50,080 Speaker 1: natural was what Van Gordon saw, his former boss called him. 390 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,679 Speaker 1: If I understand correctly, Rich, one of the things I 391 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:55,280 Speaker 1: noticed in your book was that there was influence from 392 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:59,080 Speaker 1: Howard Cosell doing the live halftime highlights on Monday Night Football, 393 00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:00,920 Speaker 1: and that was kind of of the reasons that they 394 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:05,280 Speaker 1: incorporated that into into the studio show with the NFL today. 395 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:10,399 Speaker 1: Is that right, that's correct. I think CBS was embarrassed 396 00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:17,600 Speaker 1: that here it was, uh en seventy seventy one Monday 397 00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 1: Night Football start in nineteen seventy off from seventy through 398 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:25,679 Speaker 1: seventy four. The only way you could see highlights. I 399 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,360 Speaker 1: mean imagine this, You're sitting at home and you you 400 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 1: see the scores of the other games, but you can't 401 00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 1: see a highlight of it. There's no YouTube to go 402 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:40,440 Speaker 1: to to find it. There's no midnight shows of sports recap, 403 00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:45,399 Speaker 1: there's no ESPN. You've got to wait until halftime of 404 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:50,399 Speaker 1: Monday Night Football, when Howard Costell came on with about 405 00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:54,720 Speaker 1: a five minute package of special plays from the games 406 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,600 Speaker 1: on the day before that NFL Films have put together 407 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:02,320 Speaker 1: for him, you know, and coas l was great hosting 408 00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:06,879 Speaker 1: the you know, voicing those those highlights. And in fact, 409 00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 1: some they would get letters from people from cities and 410 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:15,840 Speaker 1: teams that were piste off that their teams weren't included 411 00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:20,959 Speaker 1: in the Monday night halftime package. You know. So, CBS 412 00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:25,040 Speaker 1: Bob bill Fitz was a producer of the pregame show 413 00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:28,880 Speaker 1: for CBS, and in fact he was the executive producer 414 00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 1: in those days, and he was trying to find a 415 00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 1: way to get halftime highlights in and he tried, like 416 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:38,719 Speaker 1: heck in nineteen seventy four when he tried to go 417 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:44,520 Speaker 1: live with Whittaker, and he said, the pace of trying 418 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:47,199 Speaker 1: to get the highlights up to Jack, it was just 419 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 1: too fast for Jack. He said. Jack was a great announcer, 420 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:54,399 Speaker 1: a great play by play guy, a great writer, a 421 00:27:54,520 --> 00:28:00,399 Speaker 1: great essayist, but this was not his cup of tea. Yeah, true, 422 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,080 Speaker 1: and truth. I mean, I remember after when Brent took 423 00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:06,959 Speaker 1: the host's job, Jack used to do a commentary on 424 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:10,080 Speaker 1: the show for several years, and and you know, he 425 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:15,440 Speaker 1: was very studious, very button down. Almost. I don't want 426 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:18,200 Speaker 1: to necessarily say the voice of God because we all 427 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:21,440 Speaker 1: give that to John Facenda, but I believe for people 428 00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 1: who don't know, and they're too young to remember what 429 00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:28,040 Speaker 1: Jack Whittaker was, he was like the elder statesman who 430 00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:32,400 Speaker 1: would just give you the perspective that you needed, uh 431 00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:35,040 Speaker 1: you know, to kind of put everything in its proper context. 432 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:40,640 Speaker 1: He was the class, really the class of of CBS Sports, 433 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:46,720 Speaker 1: and for so many years before nine he was the 434 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:51,920 Speaker 1: face of CBS Sports. Um, do you have time for 435 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:56,440 Speaker 1: a story about how that came to CVS. Back Whittaker 436 00:28:56,680 --> 00:29:02,200 Speaker 1: was doing uh uh h. He was doing radio when 437 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:06,720 Speaker 1: he got out of uh the army after World War 438 00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 1: Two for a small station in upstate Pennsylvania. And he 439 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:17,400 Speaker 1: walked into the newsroom one day in nineteen and there 440 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 1: was audio of Ben Hogan's um Us open at Murrion. 441 00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 1: And it wasn't radio, it was a new fangled invention 442 00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:33,560 Speaker 1: called television. And Whittakers saw that and he said to himself. Here, 443 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:36,320 Speaker 1: I've been interviewing the mayor in the pastor of this 444 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:41,400 Speaker 1: town once a week. You know, I gotta get get 445 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,600 Speaker 1: to Philadelphia and try to get on television. And he 446 00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:47,800 Speaker 1: went to w c i U in Philadelphia where he 447 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 1: had gone to St. Joseph's College, and the interviewed for 448 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,280 Speaker 1: the job, and the sports guy had just quit, and 449 00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,320 Speaker 1: they said, do you know anything about sports? And he said, 450 00:29:57,360 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: that's when I made my big mistake by saying yes. 451 00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:07,760 Speaker 1: And he became, along with Ed McMahon, the two really 452 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:13,200 Speaker 1: big stars of CBS in Philadelphia w CiU. McMahon had 453 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,120 Speaker 1: come there from the Army as well, I'm sorry, from 454 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:20,720 Speaker 1: the Marines, and McMahon was doing essays on the show 455 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:24,640 Speaker 1: for Senda would would do the news, Whittaker would do 456 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: the sports, and McMahon would do uh the editorials and 457 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 1: and interviews with local celebrities. And McMahon and Whittaker were 458 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: great pals. And then the CBS network by w c 459 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,440 Speaker 1: AU and decides to cut it from a thirty minute 460 00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 1: newscass back the fifteen minutes. They get rid of McMahon's editorials, 461 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: they get rid of Whittaker sports no sports, and they 462 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,840 Speaker 1: may have Whittaker doing the weather. Jack Whittaker was not 463 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 1: a man. It was not a weather man. McMahon and 464 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,920 Speaker 1: mcmahannum and Whittaker thought they were going to be out 465 00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 1: of a job any day now, and they started taking 466 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 1: the train in the mornings from Philadelphia to New York 467 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,560 Speaker 1: and went to the advertising agencies that really cast people 468 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:17,800 Speaker 1: on the shows, and they tried to get jobs at 469 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 1: the network. Well, McMahon got a job as the co 470 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 1: host of a game show called Who Do You Trust? 471 00:31:27,880 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: Whittaker got a job as uh an analyst for the 472 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:36,719 Speaker 1: CBS network for NFL games. Who Do You Trust was 473 00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:41,480 Speaker 1: hosted by some guy named Johnny Carson. When Johnny Carson 474 00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 1: got the Tonight Show, he took McMahon along with him. 475 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:49,600 Speaker 1: Mc whittaker was so good doing the games for CBS, 476 00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:52,600 Speaker 1: they asked him to do CBS Sports spectacularly. They asked 477 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:55,160 Speaker 1: him to do horse racing, and all of a sudden 478 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 1: he was on the staff and he didn't need w 479 00:31:58,160 --> 00:32:02,440 Speaker 1: c a U anymore. But that's how Whittaker got to CBS, 480 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,680 Speaker 1: and he was the most important guy at CBS Sports. 481 00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:10,120 Speaker 1: And then some are all came along and Frank Gifford 482 00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 1: came along and they had an incredible lineup. It's incredible 483 00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:18,800 Speaker 1: how the Spiderweb intertwines so many of these jobs in 484 00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:22,280 Speaker 1: these names and these personalities. You know, it's funny too. 485 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 1: We mentioned earlier about some are all how his fate 486 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,760 Speaker 1: wound up turning and becoming a play by play guy 487 00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:31,280 Speaker 1: and the voice of the NFL Frank Gifford. Many people 488 00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:34,760 Speaker 1: nowadays don't remember that he was with CBS. They used 489 00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:37,880 Speaker 1: to call him the men from Maritech because guys like 490 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:40,800 Speaker 1: wrote and some are all and Gifford and Dearra Gottess, 491 00:32:41,240 --> 00:32:43,920 Speaker 1: we're all stepping off of the football field with the 492 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 1: Giants and becoming sportscasters on television and radio, and of 493 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:52,120 Speaker 1: course Gifford. I mean, I don't know was there ever 494 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:54,400 Speaker 1: a chance that he could have been a staple at 495 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 1: CBS instead of winding up over at ABC where he 496 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:01,720 Speaker 1: became part of their Olympics and Monday night FOOTBA coverage. Well, 497 00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:05,800 Speaker 1: he was a staple at CBS early on, but early on, 498 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:10,520 Speaker 1: and Bill McPhail, who was then the president of CBS Sports, 499 00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:14,320 Speaker 1: he loved Gifford and he gave him his blessing. When 500 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 1: bruinoilage wanted to hire him away to do Monday night football. 501 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:22,160 Speaker 1: He couldn't. McPhail could not offer Gifford anything close to 502 00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:28,560 Speaker 1: that in the way of um a big game assignment. Uh. 503 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:32,400 Speaker 1: They were already set with their big game announcers, so 504 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 1: Gifford was their studio guy and it was it was 505 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:40,360 Speaker 1: a great chance for Gifford, and I think it worked 506 00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 1: out well for him to go to ABC. Now, a 507 00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:48,080 Speaker 1: quick story about Bill McPhail. Bill McPhail was the president's 508 00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:53,800 Speaker 1: CBS Sports for seventeen years before h he retired and 509 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:59,080 Speaker 1: they brought Bob Wessler in. But in the nineteen seventy UH, 510 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:01,880 Speaker 1: when he was a president and Bill Fitz was producing 511 00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:04,560 Speaker 1: the NFL Today, Bill Fitz had a woman by the 512 00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:09,960 Speaker 1: name of Marjorie Mark Goldie's uh producing features for the 513 00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:14,759 Speaker 1: pregame show. And she was even uh the face and 514 00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:17,520 Speaker 1: the voice of some of these features on the show. 515 00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:21,400 Speaker 1: She was really the first woman on the NFL Today. 516 00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:24,600 Speaker 1: She had come from w c IU as well, and 517 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: she had done the first two or three weeks UH 518 00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,799 Speaker 1: feature stories, and she knew her stuff. She was pretty good. 519 00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:36,200 Speaker 1: And one morning, UH McPhail calls Bill Fitz in his 520 00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:40,880 Speaker 1: office and says this Margolis woman, she can continue producing, 521 00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:43,319 Speaker 1: but we've got somebody else who's going to do the 522 00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:48,319 Speaker 1: announcing or of these features. And he said, who's that, 523 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:51,839 Speaker 1: and he said the Winston cigarette girl. And he said 524 00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:56,760 Speaker 1: who the Winston Cigarette girl. As a friend of Frank Giffort's. 525 00:34:56,760 --> 00:35:00,040 Speaker 1: She's out of a job because that you can't and 526 00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:05,920 Speaker 1: advertise cigarettes on TV anymore. Now, this this woman, uh, 527 00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 1: her name skips my mind at this moment, but she 528 00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,880 Speaker 1: had done a spot. She was very sexy brunette. She 529 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:16,600 Speaker 1: had done a spot called Me and My Winston's. It 530 00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:21,160 Speaker 1: was a song and dance number, and she she was 531 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,839 Speaker 1: very popular and Gifford knew her husband, who was also 532 00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:28,680 Speaker 1: an executive at CBS, and that's how she got the job. 533 00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 1: Margolis uh and she were became so popular with the 534 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 1: press that the New York Times did a feature on them, 535 00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:43,279 Speaker 1: and so did TV Guy, and Margolis was quoted as saying, well, 536 00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:46,879 Speaker 1: we're doing these so the women don't just sit there 537 00:35:46,880 --> 00:35:49,359 Speaker 1: and nick while their husband's watching the game, or open 538 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 1: beer cants for their husbands. Rich Prodolski, You're looking live 539 00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:57,439 Speaker 1: is the name of the book. This has been such 540 00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 1: a thrill before we go. I'd like to ask that 541 00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:02,840 Speaker 1: you could hold up to the people could see it. 542 00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:05,160 Speaker 1: There you go, there you go, We could say it 543 00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,879 Speaker 1: there in the camera. Thank you. Could you kindly give 544 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:13,200 Speaker 1: us if there's just one favorite memory you have? And 545 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:15,040 Speaker 1: there are so many in the book. You put so 546 00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:17,080 Speaker 1: much time and effort into it. And I can't tell 547 00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:19,839 Speaker 1: you how much I thank you because I grew up 548 00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:22,520 Speaker 1: with that program and so it just took me back. 549 00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:26,000 Speaker 1: The smiles on my faces as my faces I continued 550 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:29,360 Speaker 1: to read page by page was rather wide. So you 551 00:36:29,440 --> 00:36:33,480 Speaker 1: really did me a tremendous amount of of good to 552 00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:36,120 Speaker 1: to put this book together. But is there a favorite 553 00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:40,719 Speaker 1: memory of all one one scene, one show, one instance 554 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 1: that that you would like people to know us from 555 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:51,000 Speaker 1: now that they could just like hold onto in Um 556 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:54,320 Speaker 1: the Greek had been on CBS Sports for five years now, 557 00:36:54,800 --> 00:37:00,840 Speaker 1: and Brent and the producers, we're getting a little tired 558 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:04,640 Speaker 1: of his quote unquote inside information. It all seemed to 559 00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:08,319 Speaker 1: be coming from his pal, Al Davis, and on on 560 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:12,319 Speaker 1: the set that's only talked about was Al Davis, and 561 00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:16,200 Speaker 1: they were they were a little tired of it. Um. 562 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 1: But on this one particular day in October night the 563 00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:25,080 Speaker 1: Greek had a news flash that nobody else had, and 564 00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:29,520 Speaker 1: it was really a big deal. Notre Dame was going 565 00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:34,960 Speaker 1: to fire Dan Divine and hire Jerry Faust high school 566 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:39,160 Speaker 1: coach from Akron, Ohio when the season was over. Nobody 567 00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:41,759 Speaker 1: else had it. The Greek was gonna come on his 568 00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:45,440 Speaker 1: segment called the Greek's Grape Fine and tell this little 569 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:48,600 Speaker 1: piece of news, and he was going to get some 570 00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:52,799 Speaker 1: pretty good publicity out of it, he thought. When it 571 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:57,480 Speaker 1: led into it, the lead in Brant was usually said, 572 00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,480 Speaker 1: I would say something like what he got for us 573 00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:04,319 Speaker 1: today week? Well, instead, on this day, Brent blurted out 574 00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:08,120 Speaker 1: the Greek's news and left the Greek kind of flat footed. 575 00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:12,640 Speaker 1: Hank Goldberg said, it left the Greek as if he 576 00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:17,840 Speaker 1: was Ralph Crampton from the old Honeymooner day saying hammon ahmahmah. 577 00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 1: He didn't know what to say, and he was kind 578 00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:26,400 Speaker 1: of embarrassed. And the Greek was already upset with Brent 579 00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:30,560 Speaker 1: and the producers for not getting enough airtime on the show, 580 00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:35,960 Speaker 1: and now his one big moment gets taken away. That night, 581 00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:40,280 Speaker 1: everybody used to go to a place called Pear Trees, 582 00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:43,640 Speaker 1: a restaurant and Barrow on the Upper East Side in 583 00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:48,200 Speaker 1: New York actually was a fiftie and first Avenue in 584 00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:52,880 Speaker 1: New York. And that night, for some reason, Brent showed 585 00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:56,000 Speaker 1: up there with his brother and the Greek showed up 586 00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,840 Speaker 1: there as well. They wound up at the same time table. 587 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:05,160 Speaker 1: The Greek kept complaining. Ted Shaker, the producer, was there, 588 00:39:05,239 --> 00:39:11,160 Speaker 1: and Shaker said that one bright when the Greek kept 589 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:15,200 Speaker 1: bitching about airtime and what he did to him that day, Brent, 590 00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:20,840 Speaker 1: who had they had all had too many cocktails. Brent said, 591 00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:26,200 Speaker 1: I can make you disappear anytime I want, Greek, and 592 00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:28,840 Speaker 1: Greek with that gave him a slap or a punch, 593 00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:33,600 Speaker 1: depending on who you listened to. I was not there 594 00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:36,640 Speaker 1: at that moment. I didn't hear that, but that's what 595 00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:40,480 Speaker 1: Ted Shaker told me. He thought he said, and Uh, 596 00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:45,560 Speaker 1: the valley who was on everybody grabbed everybody. Uh there 597 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:49,680 Speaker 1: was only one punch thrown. Kevin O'Malley, the executive, said 598 00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:52,680 Speaker 1: it was a one punch nothing burger. But it wound 599 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,200 Speaker 1: up on the front pages. It wound up in the 600 00:39:55,239 --> 00:40:01,040 Speaker 1: Washington Post, and uh, Ben Gordon Sauter, who was the 601 00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:04,000 Speaker 1: president of CBS sports a lot of people thought he 602 00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:06,440 Speaker 1: was the one who linked it because he was looking 603 00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:10,080 Speaker 1: for the ratings the following week, and uh I wrote 604 00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:14,920 Speaker 1: that show the following Sunday, and we started out ringing 605 00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:18,080 Speaker 1: a bell as if it was a fight fight, and 606 00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:23,120 Speaker 1: everybody had boxing gloves. That was my favorite moment in 607 00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:31,640 Speaker 1: the book. Oh I was going out one. Folks. If 608 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,960 Speaker 1: you want to read about the rest of the fourteen rounds, 609 00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:39,240 Speaker 1: hold it up again, Rich Podolski, you are looking live. 610 00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:45,200 Speaker 1: It is a fantastic read. Through the entire creation of 611 00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:49,319 Speaker 1: CBS Sports is NFL today. It has had so much 612 00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:52,680 Speaker 1: influence on everything we do when we watched the National 613 00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:57,520 Speaker 1: Football League and quite frankly, even other facets of television. Rich, 614 00:40:57,560 --> 00:40:59,560 Speaker 1: it has been a joy to speak with you. We 615 00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:01,960 Speaker 1: hope to see you out at MetLife Stadium. Make sure 616 00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:03,759 Speaker 1: you say hello and we wish you the best of 617 00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:06,560 Speaker 1: luck with the publication. Just let me know what what 618 00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:11,680 Speaker 1: what window you're leaving the ticket side. You gotta be well, 619 00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:15,240 Speaker 1: Rich Produlski. Here are the Giants Huddle. You can catch 620 00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 1: this show at our entyrondo. Archive of New York Giants 621 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:23,200 Speaker 1: podcasts on Giants dot Com and the Giants Mobile app 622 00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:26,959 Speaker 1: and podcast platforms everywhere until next time, I'll pull the Tino. 623 00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:28,040 Speaker 1: We'll see you then