1 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature Feature production of iHeartRadio. I'm your host 2 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:16,800 Speaker 1: of Many Parasites, Katie Golden. I study psychology and evolutionary biology, 3 00:00:16,800 --> 00:00:19,760 Speaker 1: and today on the show, it's a listener's Questions episode. 4 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:23,880 Speaker 1: I love to answer your questions. It always sends me 5 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: on a really interesting research trip. I go to the library, 6 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:32,159 Speaker 1: and by library, I mean I send my Piamazon, go 7 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:37,360 Speaker 1: on to Google scholar and el Sevier, etc. Make sure 8 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 1: I am answering your questions with as much accuracy as possible. 9 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 1: So if you have a question and you're like, hey, 10 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 1: wait a minute, I want that answered by Katie, you 11 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: can send it to me at Creature Featurepod at gmail 12 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 1: dot com. Any questions about evolutionary biology, your pets, ammals, 13 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:01,279 Speaker 1: I will do my best to answer them as an 14 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:07,039 Speaker 1: armchair zoologist. All right, so let's get right into it, Hi, Katie. 15 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 1: Let me start by saying that Death Bloat Corpse Parade 16 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:12,679 Speaker 1: is actually a really good pretend metal band name. I 17 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:15,520 Speaker 1: have a question about bird sounds. Some birds can mimic 18 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:19,039 Speaker 1: or have calls that sound almost mechanical or robotic rather 19 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:21,399 Speaker 1: than melodic. Does that have something to do with the 20 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:24,520 Speaker 1: mechanics of how birds produce sound. I've wondered this for 21 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 1: a while, but the recent mystery sound White Bell Bird 22 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 1: reminded me. Thanks as always for the great show, Carolyn. So, Carolyn, 23 00:01:31,920 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 1: this is a great question and one I've wondered about 24 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:37,440 Speaker 1: many times myself. I think what have come to the 25 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:42,760 Speaker 1: conclusion is that the reason they sound more mechanical is 26 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:47,720 Speaker 1: how they can produce crisp sounds with rapid trills and 27 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 1: fluctuations that are loud, clear, and distinct, as well as 28 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: producing more than one note at a time. So when 29 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:01,720 Speaker 1: human singers produce trills, there's a sliding between notes. Now 30 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 1: I'm not a singer, please don't laugh. This is what 31 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 1: it kind of sounds like for you. And you're like, oh, 32 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 1: you know, you have this sort of like in between 33 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 1: the notes. It's not like, oh, although really skilled operatic 34 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:17,520 Speaker 1: singers can do that quite fast, not as fast as 35 00:02:17,560 --> 00:02:20,920 Speaker 1: a bird can, which makes it sound mechanical right, like 36 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:24,120 Speaker 1: it sounds like a keyboard or an instrument. It doesn't 37 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: sound like something biological because it's so fast, it's so precise, 38 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:31,760 Speaker 1: and there's no sliding around. So yeah, a bird can 39 00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 1: go from one note to another extremely quickly without having 40 00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:38,000 Speaker 1: to make that slide in between the notes. So the 41 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:44,639 Speaker 1: question is this a mechanical or learned difference in bird's 42 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 1: song versus human sounds or other mammal sounds. So surprisingly, 43 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:52,400 Speaker 1: it's actually kind of a combination of the two. It's 44 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:56,880 Speaker 1: not purely mechanical, but the mechanics are really important. It's 45 00:02:56,960 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 1: also how birds learn. Song Birds have a syrinx instead 46 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:05,840 Speaker 1: of a larynx. The syrinx is the sound producing organ 47 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 1: in birds, whereas the larynx is the sound producing organ 48 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:13,400 Speaker 1: in humans and other mammals. There are some physical and 49 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 1: mechanical differences between the syrinx of a bird and a 50 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:21,520 Speaker 1: larynx that allows birds some special techniques. So the syrinx 51 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 1: of songbirds actually splits into two bronchial tubes, each of 52 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:31,000 Speaker 1: which can operate independently of one another. That means they 53 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: can produce two notes simultaneously, something that is very difficult 54 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: for a human to do. There are actually a few 55 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:40,840 Speaker 1: exceptions to this in terms of humans being able to 56 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: produce two notes at once. Tuven throat singers and other 57 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 1: overtone singers can produce two notes at once. This is 58 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:54,760 Speaker 1: accomplished by an extremely skillful manipulation of the tongue and 59 00:03:54,840 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 1: throat while singing to create a base, humming and overtone simultaneously. 60 00:04:00,920 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 1: It's really really cool. It takes a lot of skill 61 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:07,880 Speaker 1: to master. Birds, of course, can do this more naturally. 62 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 1: They also have a lot of other mechanical differences, right, 63 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 1: They don't have lips or the shape of their mouth 64 00:04:15,240 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 1: openings that well. They do in a certain ways, so 65 00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:20,839 Speaker 1: like a large mouth that they can open really wide 66 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:24,400 Speaker 1: can produce a louder volume. That's the case for the 67 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 1: white bell bird. But the precise control of shaping the 68 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 1: sound with like our mouths that we do with human language, 69 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 1: a bird can't do. They don't have the lips for it. 70 00:04:35,160 --> 00:04:39,279 Speaker 1: They also don't use their tongues as much as humans 71 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:43,600 Speaker 1: to manipulate sounds, or as much as other mammals. They 72 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:46,880 Speaker 1: do use their tongue sometimes to shape sounds, especially parrots 73 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 1: when they're mimicking human speech, they can use that tongue 74 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 1: in a much rougher less We're much more skilled. We 75 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 1: have more muscles and fine motor control over our tongues 76 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 1: such that we can produce much mo more complex sounds 77 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 1: with our tongues, whereas birds can't do that. On the 78 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:08,120 Speaker 1: other hand, they can produce very complex sounds through the 79 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:13,160 Speaker 1: contraction of muscles inside the syrinx, which changes how the 80 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:17,039 Speaker 1: sound vibrates. We also do this. You can experience it 81 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:20,360 Speaker 1: yourself by humming with your mouth tightly closed. Clamp it shut. 82 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 1: You start to hum. All of that is coming from 83 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:28,520 Speaker 1: your vocal cords, right, the vibration of your vocal cords, 84 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: and you can hum pretty complex, right mmmm. It's all 85 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:36,520 Speaker 1: coming from those vocal cords. None of that is really 86 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 1: coming from your lips or your tongue to produce that sound. 87 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 1: So birds are the masters at this muscle manipulation. Their 88 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:51,279 Speaker 1: syrinxes are also longer and thinner than mammalian larynxes, which 89 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:55,920 Speaker 1: makes the production of sound more efficient, so they can 90 00:05:56,080 --> 00:06:01,440 Speaker 1: produce really complex, precise sounds that doesn't have as much 91 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:05,200 Speaker 1: of the fluidity perhaps as human speech. Right, Like, we 92 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: have this sound that we kind of shape with our 93 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:12,800 Speaker 1: mouths and our tongues and it comes out. And for birds, 94 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:15,799 Speaker 1: they can just kind of hit that note with shifting 95 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:19,840 Speaker 1: of those muscles from one vibration to another, which is 96 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:23,320 Speaker 1: quite uncommon for humans to be able to do. We 97 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:25,839 Speaker 1: can't a bit though, with and there are certainly people 98 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 1: who can mimic the sounds of birds through impressive larynx control. 99 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:34,320 Speaker 1: One of my favorite recent news stories is about a 100 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,840 Speaker 1: little boy who learned to mimic birds in a way 101 00:06:36,880 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 1: that I've personally never heard before. I'll try to play 102 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:41,359 Speaker 1: a clip for you right now. 103 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:46,120 Speaker 2: That is not a blue jay you're hearing, not a robin, 104 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:52,040 Speaker 2: nor a tufted titmouse. Those sounds are all coming from 105 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 2: a Samuel an eleven year old Samuel Henderson. 106 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 1: I actually quite enjoy this. I actually think it's not 107 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: super surprising that a child is capable of doing this. 108 00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:07,599 Speaker 1: I mean, I think this child in particular is really 109 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: really talented, But children are really really good at language 110 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 1: acquisition and learning how to manipulate sounds. And for a 111 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:17,760 Speaker 1: kid to learn how to do this, right, I think 112 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 1: it's actually more likely a child could learn how to 113 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 1: do this, given the interest in it, than say, if 114 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:27,880 Speaker 1: an adult wanted to suddenly learn how to do bird calls. 115 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:30,000 Speaker 1: It would be more difficult for us to learn that, 116 00:07:30,360 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 1: because as we get older, that kind of language ability, 117 00:07:34,440 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 1: the ability to manipulate sounds and learn how to manipulate sounds, 118 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 1: it just gets harder. It's not impossible if you want 119 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:43,640 Speaker 1: to learn how to do bird calls. Don't be discouraged 120 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 1: if you're older. But yeah, it is easier as children, 121 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 1: which is interesting because birds are the same way. Young 122 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:55,720 Speaker 1: birds can learn how to make really complex song, but 123 00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 1: there's this crystallization period and after which birds really can't 124 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 1: learn that. They're not that good at learning new songs 125 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 1: or new noises. Parrots are something of an exception. There 126 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: are some birds that can learn into adulthood new sounds, 127 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 1: but younger birds are really really the best at it, 128 00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:18,480 Speaker 1: and for some songbirds that's really the only period of 129 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 1: time where they can learn new sounds. Unlike humans, where 130 00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: we can be learners our entire lives. It just does 131 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 1: get a little bit harder. Maybe when we're adults we 132 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:30,800 Speaker 1: have to as it's not necessarily harder to learn, because 133 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:33,800 Speaker 1: we do learn how to learn better as we get older, 134 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 1: but it is less. We don't absorb things as instinctively 135 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,360 Speaker 1: as adults. We're not like a sponge, especially in terms 136 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 1: of acquiring languages, which I'm learning as someone trying to 137 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,559 Speaker 1: become good at Italian. It's so much harder now as 138 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 1: an adult trying to learn Italian, even though I've learned 139 00:08:50,440 --> 00:08:53,839 Speaker 1: how to learn. I'm probably more disciplined than I used 140 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:55,839 Speaker 1: to be in high school. But when I was in 141 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 1: high school, with that younger brain, language acquisition was just 142 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 1: a lot pastor came a lot more naturally to learn 143 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:05,240 Speaker 1: these things and just have them sink in. So, if 144 00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 1: there are any kids listening, if you want to learn 145 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:10,840 Speaker 1: an instrument or learn a language and you're still a kid, 146 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 1: you know now is the best time to do it. 147 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:18,679 Speaker 1: But it's never too late. That's the cool thing about 148 00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 1: being human is we do have a lot of neuroplasticity 149 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,680 Speaker 1: all throughout our lives. So it's actually it's actually fine. 150 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:26,560 Speaker 1: If you miss your chance to learn how to play 151 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:28,720 Speaker 1: the violin, you can learn as an adult. It's just 152 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:36,480 Speaker 1: a little more challenge. Onto the next listener question. Hello, 153 00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:39,360 Speaker 1: I always enjoy learning about animals, which is why I'm 154 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 1: a big fan of Creature Feature. Thank you, thanks for 155 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:44,439 Speaker 1: doing the show. Well, thank you for listening. I've also 156 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 1: been watching some VET shows and a recent episode that 157 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 1: I watched had a baby two headed snake. I was 158 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 1: wondering how common are situations like that? What would cause 159 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,160 Speaker 1: a snake to be born with two heads? Are other 160 00:09:55,200 --> 00:09:58,000 Speaker 1: animals ever born with two heads. Any information would be great. 161 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:02,040 Speaker 1: And here are a couple photos of my sne headed kitties, Erica, Erica, 162 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:06,200 Speaker 1: I have to admit I misread your email. At first, 163 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 1: I thought you were saying here's a couple photo of 164 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:12,440 Speaker 1: my two headed kitties. And I was aghast and I 165 00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 1: was like, oh my god, how do you have multiple 166 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 1: cats with two heads? Because it is very very rare 167 00:10:18,880 --> 00:10:23,720 Speaker 1: for animals to be born with two heads, particularly mammals, 168 00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 1: but it does happen. Any animal can be born with 169 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: two heads. It can happen in any species, although it 170 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:36,680 Speaker 1: is extremely rare and even rarer for the individual to 171 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:41,520 Speaker 1: survive past gestation. So the key thing is it's not 172 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 1: really one organism that has somehow decided to grow an 173 00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 1: extra head. Right, we don't really have like a headbud, 174 00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:52,440 Speaker 1: you know, Like it's sort of like with there are 175 00:10:52,440 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 1: certain types of having an extra something that can happen, 176 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,520 Speaker 1: like if you have an extra finger, you know, that 177 00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:04,400 Speaker 1: can happen in humans, where like with polydactylism, or you 178 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:07,720 Speaker 1: kind of have like an extra site where you have 179 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:11,400 Speaker 1: like stem cells creating another finger. Right, that's not really 180 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:15,640 Speaker 1: the case for heads, for having an entire extra head. 181 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:19,079 Speaker 1: For both humans and any other animal, you really need 182 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:24,760 Speaker 1: to have a specific situation that would result in what's 183 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:29,079 Speaker 1: called polycephaly having more than one head. So during embryonic growth, 184 00:11:29,120 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 1: a few things can happen to create an extra head. 185 00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:35,959 Speaker 1: And it's the same types of situations that can also 186 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:42,480 Speaker 1: create conjoined twins. So an embryo while undergoing division and 187 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 1: development can sometimes make an error and partially split. So 188 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 1: a full splitting of the embryo might result in identical twins, 189 00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 1: but a partial splitting can result in conjoined twins or 190 00:11:56,200 --> 00:12:00,040 Speaker 1: an individual that seems to have two heads. Right. In 191 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:04,280 Speaker 1: that case, it's actually conjoined twins, but they're really limited 192 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 1: in terms of having like one body and two heads, 193 00:12:06,760 --> 00:12:11,319 Speaker 1: but they're still conjoined twins. Another situation is two embryos 194 00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 1: that form at the same time that merge together. So 195 00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 1: normally embryos developing together that didn't result from one embryo 196 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:23,319 Speaker 1: or one blast is splitting in two are fraternal twins, 197 00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 1: so they're non identical twins. It could be a boy 198 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:28,640 Speaker 1: and a girl, they could look a little bit differently, 199 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:32,760 Speaker 1: but they are developing at the same time in utero, 200 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:36,200 Speaker 1: and so this happens with you know, it's pretty rare 201 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:38,920 Speaker 1: that that happens. But it's even more rare that these 202 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 1: twins will actually kind of push it into each other 203 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:46,520 Speaker 1: and sort of merge during development. Actually, there are some 204 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:50,160 Speaker 1: cases in which one of the twins it's kind of 205 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 1: a miss. Like sometimes I hear like, oh, a twin 206 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 1: eats another twin in utero. It's not eating. What happens 207 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 1: is one twin absorbs the cells of the other twin 208 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:03,000 Speaker 1: almost entirely. It's called a vanishing twin. And then you 209 00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 1: really only discover it if you find maybe part of 210 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: like the twins cells or organs inside the living twin 211 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:17,840 Speaker 1: later on. So it's not really eating another twin in utero. 212 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:20,679 Speaker 1: There's nothing intentional about it. It's just at that point 213 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: cells absorbing other cells. So for an animal with two heads, 214 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:28,960 Speaker 1: what could happen is these two embryos mostly merge, except 215 00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 1: for partially, you know, the part of it where they 216 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:36,480 Speaker 1: have two heads. And so again it is a case 217 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 1: of conjoined twins, but in an extreme case where you know, 218 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:47,560 Speaker 1: there's basically one body and two heads. So these types 219 00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:52,560 Speaker 1: of genetics shenanigans are really rare. It's rarer still that 220 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 1: one would survive two fetal maturity, and even rarer that 221 00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 1: the newborn individual would survive past that to the complications 222 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:05,199 Speaker 1: that arrived with conjoined blood vessels and a single heart 223 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:08,920 Speaker 1: pumping for more organs or body parts than it bargained for. 224 00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:15,640 Speaker 1: So having two heads is a problem, mostly in terms 225 00:14:15,679 --> 00:14:20,160 Speaker 1: of those structural issues that would usually result in a miscarriage. 226 00:14:20,680 --> 00:14:22,560 Speaker 1: But even with a newborn it's going to make it 227 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:27,720 Speaker 1: really hard for it to thrive. But interestingly so snakes, turtles, 228 00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:33,560 Speaker 1: and other reptiles seem to have this sort of two headed, 229 00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:38,480 Speaker 1: conjoined twin situation more than we see in other animals, 230 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: at least like more in terms of what we observe. 231 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:47,120 Speaker 1: Why this is, I'm not one hundred percent certain. It 232 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:50,000 Speaker 1: could be that there's an increase in probability of there 233 00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 1: being an incident. Given that reptiles lay eggs. They lay 234 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,840 Speaker 1: a lot of eggs, and so there's two things that 235 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 1: go on with that, or actually three things. One is 236 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 1: that eggs are exposed to an environment more than say 237 00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 1: an embryo that's developing in utero. The embryo developing in 238 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 1: utero is exposed to whatever the mother is exposed to. 239 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: Through eating, but an egg can be more directly affected 240 00:15:15,520 --> 00:15:22,240 Speaker 1: by environmental conditions like temperature, by pollution, et cetera. The 241 00:15:22,320 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 1: other thing is that in utero, right, one of the 242 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 1: interesting benefits of having a live birth is that the 243 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:37,160 Speaker 1: animal can, the organism can kind of determine whether this 244 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 1: embryo is viable or not and whether it wants to 245 00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: spend the resources on it. So in some cases, the 246 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:52,520 Speaker 1: maternal body will not consciously just decide that the embryo 247 00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 1: is not viable and will do a spontaneous abortion. And 248 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 1: it's a natural process that happens in all mammals. All 249 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 1: animals that are live give live birth, And this might 250 00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 1: in a lot of cases, say, happen in the case 251 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 1: where you have like some sort of abnormality with an embryo, 252 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:17,480 Speaker 1: like an embryo splitting partially or merging or something, it 253 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: may result in a miscarriage in a library animal, whereas 254 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: maybe that happens less often that like in an animal 255 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 1: that lays eggs. Obviously it's not going to necessarily miscarry 256 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:32,280 Speaker 1: during the during the development of the egg, just whether 257 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:37,320 Speaker 1: the egg continues to develop or not. Write the maternal 258 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 1: the mother's body doesn't really have any say in it 259 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 1: at that point. So also they lay you know, large 260 00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:49,720 Speaker 1: clutches of eggs, so you just have more chances for 261 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 1: something interesting to happen. Now, we probably only see a 262 00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 1: great number of two headed reptiles due to the frequent 263 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:01,640 Speaker 1: breeding and key being of reptiles. I think otherwise we 264 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 1: probably wouldn't see that. There may be also an element 265 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 1: of safe we're breeding them selectively, right, there might be 266 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 1: some inbreeding. I'm not really sure. There's not like great 267 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:14,879 Speaker 1: research on this that I could find, and I was 268 00:17:14,960 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 1: curious in say, other examples of egg laying livestock or 269 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:23,120 Speaker 1: domesticated eggling animals. It is true that like chickens will 270 00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:29,199 Speaker 1: have high rates of sort of conjoined twin cases, but 271 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:33,119 Speaker 1: usually they're not viable. Usually it's something where they either 272 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:36,199 Speaker 1: don't hatch or they die pretty shortly after hatching. So 273 00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 1: it is really interesting to me that with reptiles there 274 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:45,159 Speaker 1: does seem to be more, say snakes and turtles especially 275 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,920 Speaker 1: that actually survive at least a few months, if not longer, 276 00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:53,760 Speaker 1: with having two heads. I don't know exactly why that is. 277 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:58,160 Speaker 1: I couldn't find good research on that. My guess would 278 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 1: be it has something to do with the circulatory system 279 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:10,320 Speaker 1: being more amenable to having that extra pressure of having 280 00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:15,200 Speaker 1: two heads, right, and somehow it being easier to bifurcate 281 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:20,400 Speaker 1: those blood vessels. That does not arise in greater fatality rates. 282 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:23,119 Speaker 1: But I really don't know. It's a really interesting question. So, 283 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:28,200 Speaker 1: but to answer your question, it can't happen in any animal. 284 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 1: It's just very very rare. And the situation itself when 285 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:39,960 Speaker 1: that could happen is very rare of embryos conjoining or 286 00:18:40,720 --> 00:18:45,919 Speaker 1: partially splitting, but it's even more rare that that pregnancy 287 00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 1: would come to full term, or that the egg would 288 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: even hatch, and even even more rare that this animal 289 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:59,399 Speaker 1: could live, you know, and be able to say, eat 290 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:03,760 Speaker 1: or breathe normally. So yeah, very very rare, but it 291 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 1: does happen, which is pretty wild. And I mean, there 292 00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:13,520 Speaker 1: are cases of conjoined human twins where it's they essentially 293 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:17,439 Speaker 1: have one body and two heads and you know they're conjoined. 294 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:23,760 Speaker 1: Twins are two individual people who do have complex situation 295 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 1: in terms of internal organs, but it's not like it's 296 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 1: not I want it to be clear that it's not 297 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 1: like a two headed person. These are two people and 298 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:39,240 Speaker 1: they just are conjoined, but in a very complete way 299 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:42,120 Speaker 1: where really they cannot be separated at all, right, because 300 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:45,359 Speaker 1: they're sharing a lot of organs and so it seems 301 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 1: like it's a two headed person, but it's really two 302 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:55,480 Speaker 1: people conjoined twins. So onto the next listener question. Hi, 303 00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:58,760 Speaker 1: while listening to the most recent episode, I immediately recognize 304 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,800 Speaker 1: the American woodcock. Please be sure to mention their flexible 305 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:04,639 Speaker 1: beak when talking about them. I adore them. My question 306 00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:06,520 Speaker 1: may be strange, but as someone who's around all kinds 307 00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:08,840 Speaker 1: of animals during my life, I desperately need to know 308 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:11,440 Speaker 1: if they recognize when we repeat or mimic their sounds 309 00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:14,240 Speaker 1: back at them. I'm mainly curious about cats for this question. 310 00:20:14,359 --> 00:20:16,359 Speaker 1: I have a few in the home and a feral 311 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:19,199 Speaker 1: population nearby, and I'm always curious to know if they 312 00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:22,800 Speaker 1: judge me or enjoy when I repeat their sounds back. 313 00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:24,520 Speaker 1: But I'd love to know if different animals have different 314 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 1: understandings or reactions. This is from Max. My max great 315 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:33,320 Speaker 1: point about the woodcocks, So this is true. The tips 316 00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:35,919 Speaker 1: of their beak have a bit of give to it, 317 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 1: which allows them to open up just the tip of beaks, 318 00:20:38,560 --> 00:20:42,719 Speaker 1: so like you press your fingers together kind of tightly, 319 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 1: like your two index fingers together. You can kind of 320 00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 1: just open the very tip of your index fingers together, 321 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:54,320 Speaker 1: and so remember that sort of feeling of like opening 322 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:57,639 Speaker 1: your index fingers together fully and just the just kind 323 00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: of the tippy tip of it. So this this is 324 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:06,520 Speaker 1: called disto. This is called distal rinko kinesis, and it's 325 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:09,920 Speaker 1: also common among sandpipers. And the reason they have this 326 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 1: features that they can then dig their beaks into the 327 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:15,919 Speaker 1: sand and open just the tips of their beak to 328 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:21,360 Speaker 1: grab earthworms or other kinds of insects. And it makes 329 00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: it a lot easier, right, like if you're looking at 330 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,639 Speaker 1: your fingers right, it takes a lot less effort and 331 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:28,919 Speaker 1: force to just open the very tips of your fingers 332 00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 1: versus the whole like opening up. And if you combine 333 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:34,639 Speaker 1: that with, say you have a bunch of pressure of 334 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:38,000 Speaker 1: packed sand, bird's not necessarily going to be able to 335 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:41,919 Speaker 1: open their beak fully under the ground or in sand, 336 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:44,920 Speaker 1: especially a long, thin beak, but they could just open 337 00:21:44,960 --> 00:21:47,440 Speaker 1: that very tippy tip of the beak and then that's 338 00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: exactly what they do to snatch up their prey from 339 00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:56,520 Speaker 1: inside sand or inside dirt. So onto your question. There 340 00:21:56,560 --> 00:22:02,359 Speaker 1: are definitely ways to kind of mimic animal sounds or 341 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:08,119 Speaker 1: gestures that they can understand as being in their sort 342 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:13,919 Speaker 1: of way of communication, right, including cats and dogs. So 343 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:16,399 Speaker 1: if you've ever slowly blinked at a cat and you 344 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 1: see it blink back, that's a form of communication it understands. 345 00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 1: It's kind of a way of saying like, I'm chill, 346 00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 1: I'm relaxed, how about you, And if it blinks back, 347 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:28,560 Speaker 1: it's kind of saying, yeah, I'm chill, I'm relaxed. It's 348 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 1: a show of trust of you know that things are cool, 349 00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:36,480 Speaker 1: like you're not anxious. Everything's cool. If you've ever fake 350 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:38,919 Speaker 1: sneezed at your dog, I mean I highly recommend it. 351 00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:43,920 Speaker 1: You kind of just do it and they might sneeze 352 00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:47,000 Speaker 1: back and it's kind of a playful gesture. Or if 353 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,600 Speaker 1: your dog sneezes at you and you sneeze back, they 354 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: might actually sort of then drop down into a play 355 00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 1: bow because they're saying, oh, you want to play I 356 00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:58,680 Speaker 1: sort of as like making this fake sneeze sound, which is, hey, 357 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 1: I'm feeling kind of playful. You sneeze back, and now 358 00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 1: I'm in a play bow with their little paws on 359 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,960 Speaker 1: the ground and their butts in the air because they're thinking, 360 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:10,320 Speaker 1: you just responded to my place sneeze, so you want 361 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:13,600 Speaker 1: to play. So if you're a dog or cat owner, 362 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,760 Speaker 1: you probably have these like interesting little interactions all the time. 363 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,880 Speaker 1: You may not even maybe just natural at this point, right, 364 00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:23,200 Speaker 1: but you are communicating with them using their language when 365 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:27,040 Speaker 1: you kind of learn these cues from them. Now, specifically 366 00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:29,960 Speaker 1: with cats, right, Like, I mean, anyone who's had a 367 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: cat or interacting with a cat, I'm sure we've all 368 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 1: faked a mew at a cat, tried to fake a 369 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:40,440 Speaker 1: perretta cat, right and watched their reaction. Now, it's really 370 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:47,720 Speaker 1: interesting because cats don't really mew at each other that much. 371 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:53,119 Speaker 1: They do, but like say feral cats or cats just 372 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 1: sort of left in the company of other cats. They uh, 373 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:01,040 Speaker 1: they do me ow at each other occasionally, but the 374 00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:04,959 Speaker 1: main purpose of meowing in say the ancestors of cats, 375 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,680 Speaker 1: the African wild cat, is to communicate between the mother 376 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:11,439 Speaker 1: and the kittens. And then there's a lot of other 377 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:15,240 Speaker 1: vocalizations that cats might communicate with each other, either for 378 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:19,959 Speaker 1: mating or for territoriality, which is going to be more 379 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:24,840 Speaker 1: of a growling and hissing. Right, So cats do communicate, 380 00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:28,119 Speaker 1: but the kind of mews that we so associate with 381 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,959 Speaker 1: cats and are so frequent and adult cats seem to 382 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:35,880 Speaker 1: be unique to domesticated cats in their communications with humans 383 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 1: because meowing at humans gets them attention and love and stuff, 384 00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 1: and it's an instinct from when their kitchen, from when 385 00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:47,720 Speaker 1: they're kittens where meowing gets them attention from their mothers, 386 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,360 Speaker 1: and then when they're in the care of humans, it's like, hey, 387 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 1: I'm meowing. I'm an adult, but I'm still basically being 388 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 1: taken care of by my human mommies. So I'm gonna 389 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:02,479 Speaker 1: keep mewing and getting attention, eating food, getting cuddles. So 390 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 1: because of this, it's really interesting. There there is some 391 00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:11,120 Speaker 1: research in terms of like how cats respond to human communication, 392 00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,879 Speaker 1: and there's some evidence that cats can tell when a 393 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 1: human is addressing them versus just talking to another person. 394 00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:22,399 Speaker 1: Our tones, i think change like when we look at 395 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:25,320 Speaker 1: a cat, we're like I missed the wish girls like 396 00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:27,479 Speaker 1: our tones kind of change into this kind of like 397 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:32,440 Speaker 1: baby talk cat talking. Cats, it seems, based on this research, 398 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:35,400 Speaker 1: actually respond to that they can tell that it's being 399 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:37,440 Speaker 1: addressed to them, or at least they pay more attention 400 00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:43,359 Speaker 1: to those vocalizations, seem to heed them more then say 401 00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 1: the way I'm talking to you right now, it's cats 402 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:48,359 Speaker 1: may think nothing of this kind of conversation, but if 403 00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,480 Speaker 1: I suddenly go, oh, heng you on, miss you wish girls, 404 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:54,120 Speaker 1: your cat might sort of perk up, pay a little 405 00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:58,119 Speaker 1: more attention because that sounds like something that is like, Okay, 406 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:00,320 Speaker 1: I know this, this is something that's meant for me. 407 00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 1: It's probably a learned response, right, They probably learned that 408 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,040 Speaker 1: these kinds of things are aimed towards them. And it's 409 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:12,119 Speaker 1: also the exaggerated change and tones. The high pitch probably 410 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:16,680 Speaker 1: also helps them be able to into it better, sort 411 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:19,199 Speaker 1: of your tone in the same way that like a 412 00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 1: high pitched meal is different from a low pitch like 413 00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:27,720 Speaker 1: growling meal that's like stay back right. So, uh, when 414 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 1: you meow at a cat, you're probably not really talking cat. 415 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:36,040 Speaker 1: I would imagine I think you're It's it's almost the opposite, 416 00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:38,680 Speaker 1: like when a cat meow's at you. They've learned how 417 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:43,200 Speaker 1: to modulate their vocalizations to be more supplicating to you. 418 00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:46,440 Speaker 1: So those kind of like you know that an adult 419 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:50,560 Speaker 1: cat makes is something where it's like I've learned that 420 00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,200 Speaker 1: they respond really well to this, and sometimes they even 421 00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,120 Speaker 1: make these little purring sounds that are a little more 422 00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,680 Speaker 1: whiney towards people because they found that that's more effective 423 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:02,439 Speaker 1: to get the person to pay attention to them. So 424 00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:05,159 Speaker 1: when we meow back at a cat, we're kind of 425 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:09,760 Speaker 1: like mimicking the cats who are not quite mimicking us, 426 00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:13,120 Speaker 1: but the cats who have modified their language for us, 427 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:16,520 Speaker 1: So we're not doing a natural cat sound, but we're 428 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:20,200 Speaker 1: kind of playing back for them this like this sound 429 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 1: that the adult cat has learned to make for our 430 00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:28,920 Speaker 1: for attention from us. And uh, I think probably if 431 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:33,280 Speaker 1: we're basically copying what they sound like, right Like if 432 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 1: you're if it's a high pitched now that your cat 433 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,040 Speaker 1: is making when they have relaxed body language, and you 434 00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:42,640 Speaker 1: kind of mimic that, or like a purring sound while 435 00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:46,000 Speaker 1: they're also relaxed, because purring can be done when they're anxious. 436 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,119 Speaker 1: It's all a lot of this is a combination of 437 00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,240 Speaker 1: the vocalization and their body language. You can tell when 438 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:55,760 Speaker 1: a cat is relaxed or agitated. Uh So if you're 439 00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 1: mimicking the sounds they make when they're relaxed, they probably 440 00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:01,840 Speaker 1: just see it as a way of you saying like, 441 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:05,440 Speaker 1: I'm also relaxed and I'm paying attention to you. You're 442 00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:10,159 Speaker 1: not really speaking cat necessarily, but you are finding a 443 00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:13,480 Speaker 1: commonality with the cat, like a common kind of way 444 00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 1: to communicate with them that you are paying attention to them, 445 00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:22,040 Speaker 1: and also that you're also chill. You're fine. Obviously. I 446 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,600 Speaker 1: think if you try to antagonize a cat, which I 447 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 1: would never recommend, and you like hissed or growled at them, 448 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,760 Speaker 1: you could make them upset. The actual application of this 449 00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:33,879 Speaker 1: is like if you have a especially with a dog 450 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 1: who's barking. If you yell at a dog who's barking, 451 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 1: you're just basically encouraging them to bark more because it's like, oh, 452 00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:48,400 Speaker 1: you're barking, so then or the dog is barking and 453 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:52,480 Speaker 1: then it hears you yelling, so you're matching that emotional 454 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,120 Speaker 1: heightened like anxiety like, oh, you know, I think something's wrong. 455 00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:58,560 Speaker 1: They also think something's wrong, so I'm gonna bark even louder. 456 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:00,840 Speaker 1: That's the same thing with cat. It's like if a 457 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:07,080 Speaker 1: cat is growling and hissing and you get really kind 458 00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:11,880 Speaker 1: of severe with your voice and really intimidating sounding, they're 459 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 1: probably going to be even more scared or be even 460 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,680 Speaker 1: more upset. So when you match your pet at sort 461 00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:21,240 Speaker 1: of where they are in terms of if they're upset 462 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 1: or agitated, they're going to get more upset or agitated, 463 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:27,920 Speaker 1: even if you're using human words right. In some cases, 464 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:31,160 Speaker 1: I don't know if there's been research on this. I've 465 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:35,040 Speaker 1: just noticed it with the pets that I've had. When 466 00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:38,400 Speaker 1: you have, say, if you have a pet who's scared 467 00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 1: of thunder, sometimes I mean certainly for me with my dog, 468 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,400 Speaker 1: I've developed a voice where it's like, oh poor baby, 469 00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:49,360 Speaker 1: and you know, coddling her, and I think sometimes using 470 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:53,200 Speaker 1: that tone of voice actually makes her more anxious because 471 00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:56,640 Speaker 1: she associates it with the bad thing, Like oh, right, 472 00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:00,440 Speaker 1: this is what Katie sounds like when there's thunder and 473 00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:02,200 Speaker 1: I'm kind of scared right now, So she hears the 474 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:04,960 Speaker 1: oh you poor baby, and she'd get she like maybe 475 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 1: either gets more anxious or leans into the anxiety response 476 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:13,560 Speaker 1: because she's getting attention for it. Whereas if during a thunderstorm, 477 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:17,560 Speaker 1: I kind of choose a very cheerful tone like oh hi, Cookie, 478 00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:20,200 Speaker 1: how'd you go on? Cookie? And then play with her 479 00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:23,400 Speaker 1: maybe try to play with a squeaky toy or act 480 00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:27,240 Speaker 1: like things are fine. It tends to help her anxiety. 481 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,800 Speaker 1: It doesn't make it go away, will never go away 482 00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:33,560 Speaker 1: with thunderstorms, but with bad and other things like you know, 483 00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:37,960 Speaker 1: stroking her back or putting on a thundershirt, those things 484 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:40,200 Speaker 1: do seem to help. In addition to a tone of 485 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 1: voice that's like light and care free and it's like, oh, 486 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:44,840 Speaker 1: you know it's thunder it's okay. And then you know, 487 00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:48,040 Speaker 1: playing with her and trying to make things seem like 488 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:50,240 Speaker 1: fun and like a game that can actually help them. 489 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:54,720 Speaker 1: So animals are really responsive to tone of voice. Doesn't 490 00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:57,200 Speaker 1: really matter if you meow at them or you use 491 00:30:57,280 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 1: human words, it's really the tone of it. I think 492 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 1: they respond to the most purring, if you like fake 493 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 1: a purr at cats. I couldn't find research about this. 494 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,440 Speaker 1: I don't know why someone should do it, but I 495 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:14,600 Speaker 1: imagine that might actually be something that makes them feel relaxed, right, like, 496 00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:19,800 Speaker 1: because you're sort of mimicking that relaxing sound. And cats 497 00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:24,640 Speaker 1: do per around like kittens will pur around their mothers 498 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 1: when they're feeding, So I don't know that adult cats 499 00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:33,280 Speaker 1: typically pur around each other. Like say, in like feral 500 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:37,560 Speaker 1: cat populations, but I think domesticated cats also, like say 501 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 1: you have more than one cat, you might notice like, hey, 502 00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,480 Speaker 1: these cats actually do seem to meow at each other 503 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:44,960 Speaker 1: or pur around each other. I think that's kind of 504 00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:50,520 Speaker 1: a learned response in this unusual situation of domestication. So anyways, 505 00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 1: I would say, keep meowing at your cats. I'm sure 506 00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:54,840 Speaker 1: they love it as long as you're meowing in a 507 00:31:54,920 --> 00:32:01,040 Speaker 1: nice way. All right, guys, So I I think the 508 00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:05,400 Speaker 1: last few weeks we had a few reruns. But the 509 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:09,040 Speaker 1: mystery animal sound hint before I went on a brief 510 00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:12,479 Speaker 1: break was this. This fierce little carnivore is like a 511 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,520 Speaker 1: wolf that you can fit in your pocket. And here 512 00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 1: is that sound now, all right, congratulations to rees I, 513 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:26,600 Speaker 1: Rob and Ali D for guessing correctly. This is a 514 00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:31,400 Speaker 1: grasshopper mouse, so they howl and this very hard to hear, 515 00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:34,280 Speaker 1: high pitched frequencies. I actually got a lot of emails 516 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 1: from people who could not hear this sound. I tried 517 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:38,760 Speaker 1: to turn the volume up a little bit. But part 518 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 1: of it is just as are like for some people, 519 00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:44,880 Speaker 1: we just can't hear these higher frequencies. For me, it's 520 00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:48,800 Speaker 1: barely audible for my dog. She could certainly hear it 521 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,480 Speaker 1: and did not like it. So I apologize if your 522 00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:54,920 Speaker 1: dogs out there are unhappy. But yeah, they howl and 523 00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:57,880 Speaker 1: these really high pitches to defend their territory. They're also 524 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:01,920 Speaker 1: fierce predators, eating in vertebrates and even smaller mice, and 525 00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:05,080 Speaker 1: they stalk their prey like a wolf and pounce on them. 526 00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:09,240 Speaker 1: So very terrifying but very tiny. All right, guys. So 527 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 1: a quick programming note is I might do a few 528 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:16,360 Speaker 1: more of these listener questions episodes in a row, so 529 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:21,000 Speaker 1: please do send me your questions and I will do 530 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:24,600 Speaker 1: my very best to answer them and thank you guys 531 00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:27,840 Speaker 1: so much for listening. If you're enjoying the show and 532 00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:31,040 Speaker 1: you leave rating or review, it's always appreciated thanks to 533 00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,880 Speaker 1: the space cause it's for their super awesome song ex Alumina. 534 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:37,920 Speaker 1: I'll just repeat the email if this might be useful. 535 00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 1: If you do want to send in a question, you 536 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 1: can reach me at Creature Featurepod at gmail dot com. 537 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:48,720 Speaker 1: Creature Future is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts 538 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:50,880 Speaker 1: like the one you just heard, visit Dieheartradio app Apple 539 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:52,680 Speaker 1: podcast or Hey guess what where of you listen to 540 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 1: your favorite shows. I'm not your mother. I can't tell 541 00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:58,719 Speaker 1: you what to do. I can tell you, though, if 542 00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:01,800 Speaker 1: you hear a tiny, high pitched owl could be a 543 00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:04,920 Speaker 1: grasshopper mouse that could be trying to have you for dinner. 544 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:08,200 Speaker 1: I mean, if you're the size of a grass. See 545 00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:09,160 Speaker 1: you next Wednesday.