1 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:21,239 Speaker 1: If it doesn't work, you're just not using enough. You're 2 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 1: listening to Software Radio Special Operations, military news and straight 3 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:42,200 Speaker 1: talk with the guys and the community. Hello again, everyone, 4 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: welcome back to Software Up Radio. You're on the air 5 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:48,240 Speaker 1: to this afternoon with Steve Balastraari. We have a great 6 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: guest with this, Paul Bruno, Award winning author. He's written 7 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 1: a couple of books. He's written a couple of books 8 00:00:55,560 --> 00:01:02,280 Speaker 1: about the probably the most iconic he's of American military 9 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:07,039 Speaker 1: equipment ever, which is the Army's jeep while the Military's cheap, 10 00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: not just the Army um. His first book was The 11 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:14,720 Speaker 1: First Jeep in two thousand fourteen, and he's come up 12 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:17,760 Speaker 1: with a new one, The Original Jeeps, The Race to 13 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 1: Build America's First Jeeps. It's now available on Amazon dot com. 14 00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:25,200 Speaker 1: So we're gonna talk to Paul about his books. We're 15 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 1: gonna talk to him about the Jeeps, which if you're 16 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:32,679 Speaker 1: a fan of military history, you're gonna enjoy this um 17 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:35,840 Speaker 1: and you should check out the book as well. So, 18 00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: without any further ado, Paul, welcome to Software Radio and 19 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:43,319 Speaker 1: thanks for taking the time this afternoon with this. Oh 20 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 1: glad to be here and thanks for having me. Yeah, 21 00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 1: and uh, you know when when I got the email 22 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:53,200 Speaker 1: about this, I was like, oh, man, because I had 23 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 1: just read something not too long ago, um in relationship 24 00:01:58,920 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 1: to the jeep, and somebody had written an article in 25 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: one of those military magazines and it just caught my 26 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: eyes out of reading and they were saying, if it 27 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:10,400 Speaker 1: wasn't for World War Two, it might have have never 28 00:02:10,480 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: been built. And uh it ended up. I mean it's 29 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:21,240 Speaker 1: lasted but eighty years now and it's now a part 30 00:02:21,280 --> 00:02:25,799 Speaker 1: of American consumers. I mean everybody has the jeeps now 31 00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 1: that we have one in our front yard as a 32 00:02:27,600 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: matter of fact, So you know, the jeepest, it's a 33 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:38,000 Speaker 1: true iconic vehicle has passed the test of time. Oh, 34 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,560 Speaker 1: that is absolutely correct, and that's one of the reasons 35 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: we came out with the updated book was to celebrate 36 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 1: the Eightihan anniversary or the creation of the first three jeeps, 37 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:50,639 Speaker 1: which are on the cover of the book. Uh, they 38 00:02:50,639 --> 00:02:53,840 Speaker 1: were all built and delivered to the army in nineteen 39 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 1: forty and you maybe learn a little bit about the 40 00:02:56,680 --> 00:03:00,760 Speaker 1: DNA of that jeep sitting in your driveway because every 41 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 1: jeep from these first three. Yeah, it's amazing because um, 42 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:10,240 Speaker 1: you know, and then when you're reading about it, it's 43 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,600 Speaker 1: it's because, like you said, it's out in the driveway, 44 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 1: you you consider it a mordn modern vehicle. But when 45 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 1: you go back to the original, the Army was trying 46 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:24,959 Speaker 1: to replace the mule as a as a you know, uh, 47 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 1: former transport, and uh that tells you how far back 48 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:33,400 Speaker 1: we we've come. It's so quickly. I mean, we were 49 00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: replacing mules with the jeep. And I remember reading something 50 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: a long time ago. General Dwight Eisenhower said after World 51 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 1: War Two, the Dakota, which was the transport aircraft, the 52 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:50,320 Speaker 1: landing craft that you you know, you see the guys 53 00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: going ashore like in D Day, and the Marine Corps 54 00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 1: and they're amphibious landing in the jeep were the three 55 00:03:57,760 --> 00:04:02,240 Speaker 1: biggest things that won World War Two for us. He 56 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 1: definitely said that, and General Marshall, the Chief of Staff, 57 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 1: also credit the jeeps like America's greatest contribution to modern warfare. 58 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 1: So it's an amazing vehicle and testament to those who 59 00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:18,720 Speaker 1: built the first three that eighty years later it's still 60 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 1: there and it's still here and still performing exceptionally well 61 00:04:23,279 --> 00:04:27,040 Speaker 1: for what it does. It's great stuff. So what possessed you, 62 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 1: um to originally start researching this because I read somewhere 63 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 1: that you spent over twenty years researching the jeeps in 64 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:42,600 Speaker 1: their history. That is true my journey with early jeep history, 65 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 1: and that's my niche. I'm early geep history once in 66 00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:50,200 Speaker 1: the first couple of years nine one and uh many 67 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 1: many people, excellent people have documented the jeep after after 68 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: the war started. But what drew me into the story 69 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:03,800 Speaker 1: originally was back in nine believe or not. Um, I 70 00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:06,480 Speaker 1: was leading the exciting life that I do, watching the 71 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:10,839 Speaker 1: History Channel and they had on the big rigs of 72 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 1: combat jeeps and they did this teaser before commercial break 73 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 1: that said, um, the first jeep was created by a 74 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 1: bankrupt car company in Butler, Pennsylvania and the incredibly short 75 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:26,440 Speaker 1: time of forty nine days. And I was beginning to 76 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:29,279 Speaker 1: write screenplays at the time, and I said, that just 77 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 1: sounds like a screenplay. And as I began the research 78 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:37,799 Speaker 1: Bandam's journey, I came to find out just how amazing 79 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:42,200 Speaker 1: their story was. They were bankrupt, they had no resources. Um, 80 00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:45,239 Speaker 1: they were given this incredibly short time frame of forty 81 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 1: nine days, and they delivered the vehicle and exactly half 82 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 1: an hour to spare on the forty ninth day, and 83 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:54,960 Speaker 1: I'm like, you can't make this stuff up. So it 84 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: really fit the screenplay form, and I worked for many 85 00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 1: years to have that happened. It didn't happen. But then 86 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: that just as I kept researching the story and researching 87 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:08,880 Speaker 1: the story and then decided to write the books and 88 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:13,800 Speaker 1: came into even more um information came even more amazing 89 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,480 Speaker 1: of how the original jeeps, the first three came about. 90 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,599 Speaker 1: So that's there was The genesis for me was just 91 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:24,120 Speaker 1: this is you can't make this stuff up. And we'll 92 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 1: probably get into more of that as the interview goes on, 93 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:29,920 Speaker 1: but that's just the beginning of it, you know. It's 94 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:34,640 Speaker 1: just that's amazing about Yeah. I mean, when you think 95 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:38,720 Speaker 1: about it, this went from a concept to them putting 96 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,039 Speaker 1: something put together for the military to look at in 97 00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 1: forty nine days. I don't think you could do that today. Well, 98 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:49,000 Speaker 1: they didn't think they could do it back then because 99 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:51,840 Speaker 1: the betting odds against Banham actually achieving that were five 100 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,239 Speaker 1: to one in Detroit. Because it was a small world. 101 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 1: It's still a small world in some sense, but the 102 00:06:56,520 --> 00:06:58,919 Speaker 1: automotive world was pretty small back in those days, so 103 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 1: people knew what was going on, and so they were 104 00:07:00,960 --> 00:07:06,040 Speaker 1: taking five doing odds even before Vegas was Vegas. Yeah, 105 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 1: Vegas was just uh flipping in desert back then. In 106 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:16,960 Speaker 1: that's absolutely true. So, um, what what's your background? I mean, 107 00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:20,120 Speaker 1: I know you grew up in the Northeast and you 108 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,560 Speaker 1: grew up in the Northeast. And my background is I 109 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 1: have a bachelor's degree in management and a master's degree 110 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:32,240 Speaker 1: in marketing and and then another bachelor's degree in computer 111 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:34,240 Speaker 1: software and then I went and got an m a. 112 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:37,080 Speaker 1: In history, So I kind of have a background both 113 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 1: in business management and history. Always been a big history 114 00:07:41,360 --> 00:07:44,680 Speaker 1: buff since I was, you know, young person. And so 115 00:07:44,760 --> 00:07:46,960 Speaker 1: what I did is I combined mine and I worked 116 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 1: at Information Technology for about twenty five years, still kind 117 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 1: of do. And I was a project manager for a 118 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 1: good portion of that journey. And so the first book 119 00:07:57,520 --> 00:08:00,640 Speaker 1: I wrote from a project management perspective, and the project 120 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:04,280 Speaker 1: management in history the first Jeeps. And then what happened 121 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 1: is when I came up with the idea, you know, 122 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:11,640 Speaker 1: we gott to try to honor the eightieth anniversary, and 123 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 1: what we decided to do is go to my history 124 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: side and really create a history book, and then extended 125 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:21,760 Speaker 1: to include the uh the other two pilot models as 126 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 1: I mentioned, the Willis Quad and the Fort Pigmy in 127 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:28,480 Speaker 1: the book, and extend the book out from when we 128 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:32,480 Speaker 1: ended the first book in October of nineteen forty through 129 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 1: early nineteen one February March, and even up until May 130 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:39,840 Speaker 1: of forty one. With some information we put in how 131 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 1: Willis uh evolved the Quad into the Willis m a 132 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 1: so to kind of honor again. So it's much more 133 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:53,320 Speaker 1: uh history, It's a history book. Um has a wider audience, 134 00:08:53,360 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 1: probably because we included Willis and Ford in it along 135 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,560 Speaker 1: with the Bandon BRC. And that's kind of, uh the 136 00:08:59,600 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: short version of my background and how the two books 137 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:08,439 Speaker 1: came about. Awesome, now you know, uh, you obviously get 138 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:12,520 Speaker 1: interested in this. You started, you know, putting some stuff together. 139 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:16,640 Speaker 1: Talk to our listeners a little bit about how this 140 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:20,520 Speaker 1: all came about in like the background of you know, 141 00:09:20,679 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 1: the beginning of World War two. Why the military was 142 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 1: looking to do this, that's a great question. And uh 143 00:09:28,080 --> 00:09:32,439 Speaker 1: so what happened us the military through the nineteen thirties 144 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:36,640 Speaker 1: As the decade went on, they knew they needed to modernize, 145 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:40,200 Speaker 1: but there was this slight thing going on called the 146 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:45,560 Speaker 1: Great Depression, and there was no money. Then as the 147 00:09:45,640 --> 00:09:48,280 Speaker 1: decade came to an end in Germany was rising up, 148 00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:51,760 Speaker 1: the military realized they needed a vehicle and they did 149 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:54,839 Speaker 1: a lot of testing, especially in the infantry UH in 150 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:58,360 Speaker 1: thirty nine, which is documented in the book, and they 151 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,400 Speaker 1: really could didn't come up with anything. They had some ideas. 152 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:06,360 Speaker 1: So what happened is UH in nineteen forty Bannam was bankrupt. 153 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:08,719 Speaker 1: They hired a guy named Charles Pain to try to 154 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:12,000 Speaker 1: drum up some government business because the military end was 155 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:15,679 Speaker 1: starting to free up at the same time. In May 156 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:18,480 Speaker 1: of nineteen forty and that's kind of when the jeep 157 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:24,280 Speaker 1: procurement project began. They had this meeting up at Camp 158 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: holar Bird, Maryland, which was the primary vehicle procurement depot 159 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 1: at the time of I think it was the Motor 160 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:34,800 Speaker 1: Transport Subcommittee. And and May about a couple of weeks 161 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:38,320 Speaker 1: after Hitler invaded the Low Countries and they had nothing 162 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:42,240 Speaker 1: on the drawing board, nothing, and they were trying they 163 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:44,440 Speaker 1: had to replace the mule, and they knew that the 164 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:49,360 Speaker 1: motorcycle with sidecar really didn't have the cross country country 165 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 1: capabilities the towing capabilities and the ability to amount you know, 166 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:58,200 Speaker 1: a machine gun and other weapons, and they and they 167 00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:00,719 Speaker 1: and it did had and then knew the half ton 168 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:04,040 Speaker 1: truck wasn't capable of what they're doing. So they had 169 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:07,840 Speaker 1: this meeting and they basically have nothing. They have no idea, 170 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:09,839 Speaker 1: and this goes, you know, may here this a few 171 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:14,079 Speaker 1: more times. Steve can't make this up. A gentleman in 172 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,840 Speaker 1: the infantry by name of Colonel oss At from the 173 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:20,840 Speaker 1: infantry at that meeting, goes back to his office. Charles 174 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 1: Paine is literally sitting in the window behind his desk 175 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 1: from Bantam, and he says what he you know, walks 176 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:29,320 Speaker 1: into says who were you when he Charles pain and 177 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 1: introduced themselves to Bannom rep and tells him he's looking 178 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 1: for Major Howie, who was famous for the Howie machine 179 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:39,080 Speaker 1: Gun character, and he's trying to interest the army in 180 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 1: a vehicle that Bannam. He says, Bannam can build it, 181 00:11:41,480 --> 00:11:44,600 Speaker 1: and O seth Long shorten up the story says, how 182 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:47,040 Speaker 1: he's not your guy. I'm the guy that knows everything 183 00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 1: the infantry could possibly want about vehicles because he had 184 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 1: been Fort Benning. At Fort Benning when they did all 185 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:54,840 Speaker 1: the testing in the late thirties that I mentioned, and 186 00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 1: that was the genesis of the project. This guy walks 187 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,560 Speaker 1: back from this meeting where they have nothing and pain 188 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 1: is sending as his window and here they meet and 189 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 1: like this moment like you just again really, and they 190 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 1: began the process to develop a general characteristics which which 191 00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 1: would kick off the Jeep project, which again, the memo 192 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 1: they came up with about the eight or nine characteristics 193 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:24,959 Speaker 1: was literally officially came out on June six, n exactly 194 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:28,040 Speaker 1: four years before D Day. So that's kind of how 195 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: the whole jeep procurement began. That's amazing. It's yeah, it's 196 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 1: like again screenplay, It's like, how did this happen? So 197 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: that that was the beginning of the jeeprement. And when 198 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,240 Speaker 1: I went out to the archives to try to find stuff, 199 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,880 Speaker 1: I could never find anything about the truck for by 200 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:51,400 Speaker 1: four light quarter Ton before June six, nineteen forty and 201 00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:53,520 Speaker 1: I couldn't figure out why. But then as I researched 202 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:56,040 Speaker 1: the story and was able to find out more about it, 203 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,080 Speaker 1: I came to realize that was the first document that 204 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:02,439 Speaker 1: kicked off the jeep a curement, and it was just 205 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: on a chance meeting between this colonel and obviously a 206 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:11,000 Speaker 1: marketing guy that they just met. Yes, and that's a 207 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 1: great term. Charles Paine was the ultimate marketing guy. And yes, 208 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 1: exactly he was. Charles Paine had spent a few a 209 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:21,080 Speaker 1: number of months before that trying to, you know, go 210 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:23,760 Speaker 1: through the labyrinth of the military in Washington and he 211 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:26,920 Speaker 1: just ends up an OSS office in infantry on that 212 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:29,560 Speaker 1: day when he comes back from the meeting at Camp 213 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: Hola berber like, we don't have anything, and here we go. 214 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 1: So yeah, just credible set of circumstances. Now I'm under 215 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: the I don't know if I read this correctly. One 216 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:46,360 Speaker 1: of the articles I wrote I read and I didn't 217 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:51,319 Speaker 1: write it. I read about the jeep with the designer 218 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 1: put this on paper in like eighteen hours. That is 219 00:13:56,920 --> 00:14:01,280 Speaker 1: another one of those stories. Yes, So after they came 220 00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: out with the June six memo, whole bunch of really 221 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:08,959 Speaker 1: good stories between what the quartermaster did to develop a 222 00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:12,240 Speaker 1: spec which was e S four seventy five and a 223 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 1: concept drawing and I actually got to hold that concept 224 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:20,160 Speaker 1: drawing from uh in my hands zero eight three seven 225 00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:23,240 Speaker 1: zero dash z if my memory is correct and that's 226 00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:25,480 Speaker 1: in the book and e S four s in the book. 227 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 1: So what the army decided to do was Bannam was 228 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:31,280 Speaker 1: helping them develop the spects, and Bannam thought they were 229 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 1: going to just get a negotiated contract and off we go. 230 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:37,360 Speaker 1: Then then we get another one of those twists in 231 00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: the story. The army decides and the quartermaster, you know, 232 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:43,360 Speaker 1: we're gonna put this out to bid, So they sent 233 00:14:43,440 --> 00:14:47,360 Speaker 1: it out to hundred thirty five companies and eventually forward bid. 234 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 1: Bannam was completely off guard that they were gonna have 235 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:55,160 Speaker 1: to do this bid. So they were bankrupt, they had nothing, 236 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 1: so they had to call this guy up, Karl Probes again. 237 00:14:57,880 --> 00:15:00,600 Speaker 1: And this whole whole stories detailed in the book. He 238 00:15:00,720 --> 00:15:04,680 Speaker 1: was an automotive designer from in Detroit. He literally, yes, 239 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 1: exactly that he drives the butler gets there on a Friday, uh, 240 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 1: and yeah, he draws the concept drawing based upon what 241 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:17,080 Speaker 1: the military wanted in literally eighteen hours, and they put 242 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 1: their whole bid together on you over that weekend and 243 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 1: then drove down to Baltimore on the on thee. So 244 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 1: that's actually true story and Propes is doing that is 245 00:15:27,880 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: is documented in the book it's another one of those 246 00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 1: how does that happen? It doesn't happen anymore like that, 247 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:40,400 Speaker 1: that's for sure. Yeah. Absolutely, it was just again it's 248 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:43,560 Speaker 1: just like it was just like this kar moment to 249 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 1: be thing going on. So yeah, that's actually true. Amazing. Now, 250 00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 1: when the when the Army put out you know, they 251 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:54,200 Speaker 1: were going out to bid, they usually put some kind 252 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 1: of proposal out there. This is what we're looking for 253 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 1: the specs. Do you have the original in the book? 254 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:04,440 Speaker 1: Do you you talk about that what they were looking for, 255 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 1: what the vehicle was supposed to do. Yeah? Absolutely, um, 256 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:11,840 Speaker 1: and the appendix is uh specification E S four seventy 257 00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:16,360 Speaker 1: five and all. It's a wonderful detail. And we also 258 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 1: have ban UM's and Willis's response. I actually held ban 259 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: M's and Willis's response to that spec in my hands, 260 00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 1: Bannom's bid proposal and um, so yes, that detail is 261 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 1: in the book and the appendix of someone wants to 262 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,800 Speaker 1: read it, and it's really quite amazing what the army 263 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 1: was looking for. If I can tell you one other 264 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:40,440 Speaker 1: story though, uh, another bugaboo was the Army came up 265 00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 1: with this requirement for the weight and as a project manager, 266 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:45,920 Speaker 1: this is the kind of requirement you don't want to get. 267 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:49,400 Speaker 1: So they said, without asking anyone who would build them, 268 00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:52,240 Speaker 1: anyone with any expertise on how much this thing would 269 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: weigh based upon what they're looking for, they said, how 270 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,720 Speaker 1: much shoot away? Oh wow, we're looking for something between 271 00:16:57,760 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 1: the motorcycle and the sidecar lotually about five hundred pounds, 272 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:04,120 Speaker 1: and we're looking for uh and then the halfton truck 273 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:06,760 Speaker 1: at two thousand pounds, So this thing magically needs to 274 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 1: weigounds and yeah, exactly. Shockingly, no one at that time 275 00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:19,240 Speaker 1: could manufacture vehicle for what they wanted anywhere near that, 276 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:23,399 Speaker 1: so ban them basically decided we're just going to ignore 277 00:17:23,440 --> 00:17:26,280 Speaker 1: the man behind the curtain. We're just gonna ignore that requirement. 278 00:17:26,800 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 1: But no one told Carl Probe. So they filled out 279 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:33,400 Speaker 1: their bid document. They go to Baltimore the night before 280 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:37,880 Speaker 1: because Camp Holbird was located in Baltimore, and the July 281 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:41,479 Speaker 1: and they're gonna open up the bids the next morning 282 00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:45,160 Speaker 1: at July or present their bids and be opened and 283 00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:48,760 Speaker 1: Charles Paine looks at the form and says, you can't 284 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:51,600 Speaker 1: put in a weight of eight hundred pounds. They will 285 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:53,840 Speaker 1: reject you right out. Because you didn't check off the 286 00:17:53,960 --> 00:17:57,440 Speaker 1: right checkbox. So they literally had to call this tomographer, 287 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:01,359 Speaker 1: retype all the forms of and put in a new way. 288 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 1: And Carl Prokes twenty years later is remembering, you know, 289 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: we didn't want to look too close to pounds, so 290 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 1: we just decided to say this thing's gonna seventy three pounds, 291 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:15,560 Speaker 1: thank you very much, without any idea. Yeah. And then 292 00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:17,679 Speaker 1: then then the kicker to the story is I'm in 293 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:21,399 Speaker 1: the archives and I find Banams bid proposal. I'm holding 294 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:25,920 Speaker 1: this incredibly historic doc into my hands, which is exceptionally humbling, 295 00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: and I look at the box for weight and it 296 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:33,320 Speaker 1: says and seventy three pounds, and I know exactly where 297 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 1: that number came from. I just blew my mind. So yeah, 298 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:39,119 Speaker 1: that was that was Bannams. You know, way to do 299 00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 1: the weight, you know, let's just yeah, twelve hund seventy 300 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:43,680 Speaker 1: three sounds like a good number. We'll throw that in there. 301 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:51,200 Speaker 1: That's awesome. Yeah, yeah, it's not right on the limit here, 302 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: but it's close enough to where the Army is going 303 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:59,000 Speaker 1: to be real happy with that. Exactly, Steve, exactly, because 304 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:01,800 Speaker 1: you know, if it was the Army would have found 305 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 1: fault with it, you know pricings that you know. Nine, 306 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 1: if they put it at twelve ninety nine, they would 307 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:14,680 Speaker 1: have said, there there's gotta be something going on here. So, um, yeah, 308 00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 1: talk us through them now they um they approached you said, 309 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:24,440 Speaker 1: a bunch of different car manufacturers. How many actually put 310 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:29,680 Speaker 1: it bids in? Oh, excellent, another excellent question. Only four 311 00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:32,600 Speaker 1: showed up to the Only four fou r showed up 312 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:36,560 Speaker 1: to the bid opening. Four didn't propose because they said 313 00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:41,640 Speaker 1: the seventy five forty nine day time frame was impossible. 314 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:46,359 Speaker 1: A firm called Crosley also refused a bid for the 315 00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:49,919 Speaker 1: same reason. Willis was there and it put together a 316 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:52,480 Speaker 1: time of materials bid. And how they put their bid 317 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:56,200 Speaker 1: together as documented in the book great story there and 318 00:19:56,400 --> 00:20:00,399 Speaker 1: but they said they couldn't deliver and for seventy five days. 319 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:05,119 Speaker 1: So again one of these moments the major laws. The 320 00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:08,400 Speaker 1: head of the carament for the Army at Camp Holabird 321 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:11,560 Speaker 1: walks out to the group and says, well, Willis has 322 00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 1: the low bit, had banned them like representatives just turned white, 323 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:19,040 Speaker 1: like how can they have the whole bit? Then he says, 324 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:21,000 Speaker 1: after that, you know that that they have a heart 325 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,600 Speaker 1: attack However, Willis says that they can't build in seventy 326 00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:27,359 Speaker 1: five days, and Banam says they can build, and excuse me, 327 00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:30,199 Speaker 1: in forty nine days, and Banam says they can. So 328 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 1: with the penalty, Bannam has the low bid, and Bandam 329 00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:35,480 Speaker 1: is going to get the contract to build the first 330 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:38,439 Speaker 1: pilot in the first seventy. Of course Bannam had no 331 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:40,280 Speaker 1: idea if they could really do it at forty nine days, 332 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,360 Speaker 1: but they were bankrupts. So it's tall hundred seventy three 333 00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:44,640 Speaker 1: pounds and absolutely we can do it in forty nine days. 334 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 1: So that's how that happened. That's amazing. Now, yeah, during 335 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 1: this time, you know, um, you know, going back to 336 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:59,679 Speaker 1: the history and we're talking the summer, this is the 337 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:04,159 Speaker 1: error of Blitzkreek where the Germans are going across you know, 338 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:08,400 Speaker 1: they did the low countries, they went across France all 339 00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:11,440 Speaker 1: this and and amazing as it sounds, when we talked 340 00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:14,919 Speaker 1: about Blitzkrieg or lightning War, they were still a horse 341 00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:19,280 Speaker 1: drawn army for the most part, weren't they. Actually that's true. 342 00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:21,480 Speaker 1: And even when they went into the Sobering Union in 343 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:24,440 Speaker 1: June of forty one and in the epilogue of the book. 344 00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:27,800 Speaker 1: We have a great kind of that. A friend of 345 00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:29,679 Speaker 1: mine actually pointed out to me in a book he 346 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:34,560 Speaker 1: had read D Day from the German perspective. So again 347 00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:36,960 Speaker 1: going back to that June nine memo, here we have 348 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:40,720 Speaker 1: D Day in the book and the German soldiers saying, 349 00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:44,879 Speaker 1: we saw the Allies come on on shore with all 350 00:21:44,960 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 1: mechanized and that included all the jeeps, and we're still 351 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:53,120 Speaker 1: using horses and have veterinarians. We knew we were facing 352 00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:56,399 Speaker 1: an incredibly powerful opponent. And that really stands at a 353 00:21:56,680 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 1: U as a testimony to the incredible verse utility and 354 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:06,040 Speaker 1: and uh greatness of the jeep that even the Germans 355 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:08,360 Speaker 1: took one look at that and said, you know, we're 356 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:12,280 Speaker 1: we're in big trouble. So that's exactly correct that the 357 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:15,800 Speaker 1: jeep really put the Allies into another another level in 358 00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:18,560 Speaker 1: terms of mechanization that I don't even think the Germans 359 00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:22,720 Speaker 1: were able to get to. And you know, so when 360 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:26,679 Speaker 1: they when they got this Bantam, like you said, they 361 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:30,919 Speaker 1: were already bankrupt, they get this contract, how difficult was 362 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:34,040 Speaker 1: it for them to actually produce what they said they 363 00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:38,600 Speaker 1: were going to They still had some production capacity, so 364 00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 1: they hand built the first one called I think it's 365 00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:45,399 Speaker 1: a bandomed number one, and then that was accepted by 366 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,680 Speaker 1: the army. They were able to build their build their 367 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:51,880 Speaker 1: the next sixty nine for that contract, and then through 368 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: a whole bunch of other um stuff that went on 369 00:22:57,920 --> 00:23:00,600 Speaker 1: in the fall of which is document in the book, 370 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:06,360 Speaker 1: each manufacturer Bannam, Willis and Ford were able to were 371 00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 1: given contracts for fifteen hundred of their models, and Bannon 372 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,280 Speaker 1: was actually able to build their fifteen hundred. Uh, they 373 00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:17,400 Speaker 1: only ended up building twenty seventy three two thousand, six 374 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:21,560 Speaker 1: hundred seventy three because the contract in nineteen forty one, 375 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,920 Speaker 1: which was gonna be a winner take all for sixteen thousand, 376 00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 1: was awarded to Willis. And after that awarding there was 377 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:33,680 Speaker 1: a whole bunch of changes to the the vehicle as 378 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:39,200 Speaker 1: it continued to evolve between August of nineteen and November 379 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:43,000 Speaker 1: nineteen one, and so the Willis m A, which was 380 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,600 Speaker 1: their second model, was so changed by and throughout ninety one. 381 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:51,000 Speaker 1: That's why they named it the Willis MB and that's 382 00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:52,960 Speaker 1: the one that ended up being for the war. So 383 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 1: um Bannon was able to build the ones that they 384 00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 1: they were contracted to do, but they were not um 385 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,879 Speaker 1: eston to be the ones to build the vehicles for 386 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:08,359 Speaker 1: the war. Now, now the uh was there any differences 387 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: between what Bantam, Ford and will was producing or were 388 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:19,680 Speaker 1: they all exactly the same that going off the same blueprint? Uh? 389 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:24,360 Speaker 1: In essence they were because they were using the army specifications, 390 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:29,520 Speaker 1: but each kind of put their own um uh what's 391 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:33,320 Speaker 1: the word stamp on their their vehicle. For example, Ford 392 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,439 Speaker 1: was the one the first to come out with the 393 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 1: flat front end the BRC and you can see that 394 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 1: on the cover of the book. And the Willis Quad 395 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,440 Speaker 1: they had rounded hoods to start. But the big difference, 396 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,879 Speaker 1: and this is document in the book, is Willis decided 397 00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:52,400 Speaker 1: to use for cost reasons and engine they already had 398 00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:55,200 Speaker 1: in production called the God Devil engine. And I was 399 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 1: able to geek out they had the where I was 400 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:00,960 Speaker 1: able to find in the research a lot of detail 401 00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: on how they got that engine to where it needed 402 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:06,280 Speaker 1: to be. And that engine was in the Quad, the 403 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,080 Speaker 1: m A and the MB so that God Devil engine 404 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,880 Speaker 1: was in all the hic jeep vehicles. And the key 405 00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 1: there was it was ban them and Ford went with 406 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:21,439 Speaker 1: forty horsepower and engines because of trying to meet the weight, 407 00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:23,960 Speaker 1: and Willis said, we're gonna have to go with this 408 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,399 Speaker 1: heavier engine because we can't, you know, either buy another 409 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 1: engine or develop another engine that would help us meet 410 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,840 Speaker 1: the weight. But the Go Devil when they're able to 411 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:36,320 Speaker 1: meet weight, that that was sixty horsepower, So that gave 412 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,240 Speaker 1: them a nice advantage over the other two. And the 413 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,399 Speaker 1: testing in forty one and del mar Rouz, who was 414 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 1: the head of the H building the jeep for Willis, 415 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:49,320 Speaker 1: he said, we made that decision because I learned from 416 00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:52,200 Speaker 1: building vehicles that you can never never have enough too 417 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:55,720 Speaker 1: much power, and so that that was a huge difference 418 00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:58,440 Speaker 1: between the two. Was the more powerful engine that Willis 419 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 1: was able to put in h than Bannam or Ford did. 420 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:03,919 Speaker 1: They may have put in a more powerful engine if 421 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:07,160 Speaker 1: they hadn't been so constrained by the weight, but Willis 422 00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,000 Speaker 1: got it done with the Go Devil, and that that's 423 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:12,480 Speaker 1: a great story that we document in the book. Yeah, 424 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:16,800 Speaker 1: and uh, you know you said they had an original 425 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:21,960 Speaker 1: production run of sixteen thousand. That was that was the 426 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:27,359 Speaker 1: contract in July of forty one. What how it went 427 00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 1: evolved is in this kind of even in nineteen I 428 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:34,920 Speaker 1: read the documents. You can feel it in the documents. 429 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:38,359 Speaker 1: They really didn't have an understanding of the magnitude of 430 00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:40,480 Speaker 1: the war they're about to get into in a year 431 00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:43,439 Speaker 1: and a half. And so in in July ninety like, 432 00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: you know what, look at seventy of these seventy Okay, 433 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:49,720 Speaker 1: that's not even a drop in the bucket. That's an 434 00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:53,280 Speaker 1: insult to the drop, okay. And so then in the 435 00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:57,639 Speaker 1: fall after they Bannam came in the BRC and it 436 00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: was so universally loved there, they didn't really have a 437 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 1: plan of where they're gonna go next. So they're kind 438 00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:06,399 Speaker 1: of like, well, maybe we'll get five hundred more, and 439 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:10,800 Speaker 1: they go out with that and basically they're gonna get 440 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:13,200 Speaker 1: them for Bannam. And then Willis and Ford both said, 441 00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:15,880 Speaker 1: you know, hey, we wanted on this. And so through 442 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:17,600 Speaker 1: a whole bunch of things that happened in the fall 443 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:21,440 Speaker 1: of nineteen forty, they went from uhive, they said, you 444 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:26,040 Speaker 1: know what, let's everybody get you know, we'll get these now. 445 00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:30,000 Speaker 1: And so that's what that's how that happened. And then 446 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:33,040 Speaker 1: as you know, forty one moved on and and and 447 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,080 Speaker 1: the magnitude of the conflict. Think about this in July 448 00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:41,959 Speaker 1: ninety there thinking seventy. In July nine, they're thinking we 449 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,680 Speaker 1: need at least sixteen thousand. And then they eventually ended 450 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:49,159 Speaker 1: up building over between Willis and for six hundred thousand 451 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,720 Speaker 1: for the war. But going from seventy in a year two, 452 00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:54,840 Speaker 1: you're gonna need at least sixteen thousand of these. That 453 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:57,639 Speaker 1: was a huge expansion of their thinking in terms of 454 00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,959 Speaker 1: the magnitude of the cost and the numbers of what 455 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:03,960 Speaker 1: they were going to need. Uh, not only jeeps obviously, 456 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:08,800 Speaker 1: but pretty much everything. Yeah, it's it's amazing how how 457 00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:12,480 Speaker 1: many they produced. I mean, you're talking six hundred thousand 458 00:28:12,520 --> 00:28:16,040 Speaker 1: by the end of World War Two, because obviously all 459 00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:18,920 Speaker 1: the Allies were using them, not only the American Army, 460 00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:23,639 Speaker 1: but there are British Allies, and uh, we gave a 461 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:28,120 Speaker 1: ton of those to the Soviets. Who I remember reading 462 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:33,639 Speaker 1: something from the Soviet oh Marshall Zukov, who was the 463 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 1: you know, the top Russian general. He said that without 464 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:42,880 Speaker 1: American trucks in the jeeps, they wouldn't have been able to, 465 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,680 Speaker 1: you know, go through Germany as quickly as they did 466 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:51,880 Speaker 1: in the end of the war. Yeah, it definitely helped 467 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 1: them on their mobility. And I mean again, it's a 468 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:58,960 Speaker 1: testimony to the genius in the DNA. It's in the 469 00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 1: three of these vehicles that they created a vehicle that 470 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: could work in every theater of a world war from 471 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:11,800 Speaker 1: subzero temperatures temperatures excuse me, to the tropics, and that's 472 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:16,080 Speaker 1: what it did. And it's still that ver versatile today. Yeah, 473 00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 1: it goes anywhere. And that's that's the beauty of the jeep. Yeah, 474 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 1: and it lasted a long time. I mean, I know 475 00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:27,520 Speaker 1: I'm dating myself, but when I went into the military, 476 00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 1: we still had jeeps. And it wasn't until later, I 477 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 1: want to say, late nineteen eighties when you know, the 478 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,680 Speaker 1: humvees finally started to replace them. But you're talking about 479 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:41,920 Speaker 1: a lifespan of forty five years. And that's that's amazing 480 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:46,480 Speaker 1: because the jeeps will go just about anywhere. And the 481 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,320 Speaker 1: one thing about him is because they were light. You know, 482 00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:54,160 Speaker 1: as you mentioned the weight and seventy three problems. You know, 483 00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:56,880 Speaker 1: if they got stuck, I mean, a couple of g 484 00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 1: I s could lift it up, you know, get it 485 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,000 Speaker 1: out of where if if it did get But those 486 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,880 Speaker 1: things weren't just about anywhere. They had four wheel drive. 487 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 1: I mean everything about them was simple and it worked, 488 00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 1: and it's amazing, and they had so many different, uh 489 00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:16,520 Speaker 1: ways of using it. It wasn't just a troop carrier. 490 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:18,920 Speaker 1: I mean you could man a machine gun on him. 491 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:21,920 Speaker 1: We had gun jeeps back when I was in. We 492 00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 1: mounted a pencil in the back and you could put 493 00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:27,800 Speaker 1: an M sixty machine gun on there. Which it wasn't 494 00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:29,840 Speaker 1: fun being a machine gunner, I can tell you that, 495 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:34,240 Speaker 1: because you get tossed all over the place. But it 496 00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:38,719 Speaker 1: was it was a tremendous piece of equipment. And this is, uh, 497 00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:44,720 Speaker 1: it's amazing, isn't it. What what happened in eighteen hours? Yeah? Well, 498 00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:47,560 Speaker 1: and then building the first one in forty nine days 499 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:49,360 Speaker 1: and delivering it with a half an hour of spare. 500 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:51,600 Speaker 1: But go to your wait story about how a couple 501 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:54,640 Speaker 1: of people could pick it up. You say, well, Paul, 502 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:57,240 Speaker 1: how did they decide after the banum came in and 503 00:30:57,240 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 1: they were testing in and it looked a little overweight 504 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:01,520 Speaker 1: that you know, we'll accept that at the weight that 505 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:04,240 Speaker 1: it is. So here's how that happens, Steve. So they're 506 00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:06,800 Speaker 1: out testing it one day and these generals show up 507 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:11,000 Speaker 1: and the General's decide, as generals can do, we want 508 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,360 Speaker 1: to go out in this thing. So they hop in. 509 00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 1: It's a Calvary general and an infantry general I think, 510 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 1: and a driver and they get stuck. And and then 511 00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,680 Speaker 1: then then they started asking the bandom reps um, you 512 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,120 Speaker 1: know how much is this way? And and Carl Probes, 513 00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:29,600 Speaker 1: who we've mentioned earlier, kind of starts haming and han 514 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:33,240 Speaker 1: and this and that, and Charles Pain was gonna try 515 00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,880 Speaker 1: to say, you know, this is really close to thirt pounds, 516 00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:38,960 Speaker 1: so that the Calvary general says, you know what if 517 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 1: I can raise this up with the infantry general and 518 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:43,600 Speaker 1: we can pick the backside up, it's good to go. 519 00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:45,880 Speaker 1: So they get out of the jeep, go to the back, 520 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:48,320 Speaker 1: lift up the back to two of them, and they go, yeah, 521 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:56,360 Speaker 1: we'll accept this set this week. Sounds good. It's amazing that. No, 522 00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:58,560 Speaker 1: they're one of those things to put the story. It's 523 00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,920 Speaker 1: like the whole thing's ride. Now. These two generals deciding 524 00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 1: that this thing can make weight in anyway, and I can. 525 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:07,640 Speaker 1: It's so going right to your point of right there 526 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 1: at the beginning, it was like two people can lift 527 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:13,040 Speaker 1: this thing up, get this up from being unstuck. We're 528 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,920 Speaker 1: good to go, And there was many years later, Uh, 529 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:21,680 Speaker 1: the same dynamic was playing out. Yeah, it's it's it's incredible. 530 00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:24,880 Speaker 1: I mean the jeep and it still lives today. Like 531 00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:27,360 Speaker 1: I said, I mean, of course, the one that I 532 00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:30,640 Speaker 1: have in my my driveway. It's my wife's vehicle. But 533 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 1: it's probably not very close to the original design, but 534 00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 1: it's still a jeep. It still looks like a jeep, 535 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:41,480 Speaker 1: doesn't it, right? What I always say, and I see 536 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:44,000 Speaker 1: all the jeeps on the road, and having you know, 537 00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:46,600 Speaker 1: lived this story for twenty years and done the research 538 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:49,840 Speaker 1: and seeing what went into the first three that the 539 00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 1: grit determination, the genius of the design, the teams have 540 00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:57,400 Speaker 1: built these first three jeeps. It still lives on. Their 541 00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,560 Speaker 1: spirit is still in this eighty years later. You Banham, 542 00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:04,520 Speaker 1: Willis and Ford of what they did to you know, 543 00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,960 Speaker 1: create this iconic vehicle in the time frames they did 544 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:11,160 Speaker 1: and you know, coming from nothing so well, they may 545 00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:13,840 Speaker 1: not look the same, and you know exactly the same. 546 00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,480 Speaker 1: The spirit is still there and then and then and 547 00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:19,520 Speaker 1: some of what they built into it that this is 548 00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:23,560 Speaker 1: gonna go anywhere never And during the research to this, 549 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:25,760 Speaker 1: I know you you said you went through the archives. 550 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:28,720 Speaker 1: Did you reach out to Jeep at all for any 551 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:35,720 Speaker 1: of their historical stuff? Um, not really. Um, they're hard 552 00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: to reach and UM it's it's also I don't think 553 00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:43,000 Speaker 1: they would want to be saying there promoting one book 554 00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:47,760 Speaker 1: or the other. And most of the information that I 555 00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:53,240 Speaker 1: needed was in this And during the war there Willis 556 00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:55,720 Speaker 1: Overland started to say that they created the first jeep, 557 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,160 Speaker 1: and the Federal Trade Commission took exception to that. So 558 00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:03,000 Speaker 1: they started actually a trial to find out, you know, 559 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 1: how the jeep actually came about nineteen and so they 560 00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:14,920 Speaker 1: deposed all the principal players from Bannon, Willis and Ford 561 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:18,359 Speaker 1: for this trial. And I found the trial in the 562 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:22,359 Speaker 1: archives and I've copied about four thousand pages of testimony. 563 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:24,680 Speaker 1: And so, as an a historian, you know from my 564 00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:29,960 Speaker 1: m A and history degree, oral history can be problematic 565 00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,760 Speaker 1: for two things. One, especially if the people are remembering 566 00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:37,560 Speaker 1: it long time afterwards, and two, people may slightly embellish 567 00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:42,799 Speaker 1: their role. But this was an extremely unique thing in 568 00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:46,680 Speaker 1: history where they were deposing all these people only a 569 00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,640 Speaker 1: few years after all the events that happened, so it 570 00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:52,640 Speaker 1: was still relatively fresh in their minds, and they were 571 00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:55,160 Speaker 1: doing it in a court case where they were being 572 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:58,080 Speaker 1: sworn in, So you pretty much want to tell the 573 00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,080 Speaker 1: truth as you know it because you're on the the 574 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:04,239 Speaker 1: penalty of perjury. So that's where as I was I 575 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:06,839 Speaker 1: realized as I was reading this that we can write 576 00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:10,520 Speaker 1: both these books allowing the people who were there to 577 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 1: tell their story because they're told their story. What I 578 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:17,919 Speaker 1: added was, you know, hopefully some narrative and and and uh, 579 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:21,520 Speaker 1: you know, connection between the stories they told. And also 580 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:24,719 Speaker 1: the trial when they testified, it wasn't organized, so I 581 00:35:24,760 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 1: was able to organize in an order of you know, 582 00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:30,880 Speaker 1: how things happened. Um, just give you another example. Uh, 583 00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:34,000 Speaker 1: there's this famous drawing that was out on the web. 584 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:37,120 Speaker 1: It's been out there for years about this is the 585 00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:41,440 Speaker 1: first drawing that was ever done of a Jeek type vehicle. 586 00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 1: And they'd say, no one's ever gonna really know where 587 00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:48,560 Speaker 1: this happened or where this came about. And I'm reading 588 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:51,080 Speaker 1: in the archives and I'm reading with Frank Fenn and 589 00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:55,520 Speaker 1: he says, well, they came to the uh came to 590 00:35:55,600 --> 00:36:03,440 Speaker 1: the Butler June nineteen. And he describes in great detail 591 00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 1: what happened on both days. And he says, at the 592 00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 1: end of the day on June nineteen, Mr Brown, Uh, 593 00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:14,120 Speaker 1: Mr Beasley and Mr Brown made a sketch which incorporated 594 00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:16,719 Speaker 1: their ideas of what this car should likely be like 595 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:19,759 Speaker 1: and look like. And it's that sketch, so I call 596 00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,440 Speaker 1: it the Beasley Brown drawing. But for the first time 597 00:36:22,440 --> 00:36:26,320 Speaker 1: in our books and to fourteen where that sketch came about, 598 00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:30,080 Speaker 1: when it was drawn, who drew it and why? Uh 599 00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:32,480 Speaker 1: was found out and that was sitting in the archives 600 00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:36,000 Speaker 1: in Frank Fence testimony, buried for decades and I guess 601 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,480 Speaker 1: no one had found it, So that was really really something. 602 00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:42,239 Speaker 1: And they had actually a copy of that drawing right 603 00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:44,880 Speaker 1: in the court case. I'm holding an actual copy of 604 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:48,719 Speaker 1: the original drawing and actually finding out exactly when that 605 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:53,000 Speaker 1: famous document, the first document that was a drawing of 606 00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:55,680 Speaker 1: a jeep type vehicle, how it came about, when it 607 00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:58,000 Speaker 1: came about, and who did it. That's great. That was 608 00:36:58,040 --> 00:37:01,440 Speaker 1: just again very humbling, and I'm I'm grateful I have 609 00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:05,600 Speaker 1: a chance to explain that to people that like jeep history. Well, yeah, 610 00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:09,080 Speaker 1: you're listening to the software radio. We we have Paul Bruno, 611 00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:14,120 Speaker 1: the author of a really details and must read book 612 00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:17,520 Speaker 1: if you're a military historian, you're gonna really want to 613 00:37:17,560 --> 00:37:19,719 Speaker 1: see this. In the name of the book is the 614 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:23,400 Speaker 1: Original Jeeps, The Race to Build America's First Jeeps, And 615 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 1: you can find it on Amazon and wherever you buy 616 00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:29,120 Speaker 1: your books. But Paul, now, the next question I have, 617 00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,800 Speaker 1: because I've heard so many different stories on this, where 618 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:38,760 Speaker 1: did the the name jeep actually come from? Well, that's 619 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:41,560 Speaker 1: yet another one of those good questions, and we try 620 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:43,560 Speaker 1: to answer it in the book as best we can 621 00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:50,080 Speaker 1: in the epilogue after reading through the trial transcript and 622 00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:54,520 Speaker 1: also their summary of the case that they did, and 623 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:57,360 Speaker 1: we included this verbiage right from the court case and 624 00:37:57,400 --> 00:38:04,560 Speaker 1: the epilogue that basically even then Int. Five they couldn't 625 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:07,520 Speaker 1: really there was conflict of how the jeep name got 626 00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:09,960 Speaker 1: put onto the vehicles because they were really officially known 627 00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:13,600 Speaker 1: as uh quarter ton four by four lights and when 628 00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:17,160 Speaker 1: they first came in that hall of bird the the 629 00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:19,640 Speaker 1: the personnel there would call them like the Bannum or 630 00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:23,759 Speaker 1: the Willis or the Ford, and so there's they really 631 00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:27,200 Speaker 1: couldn't figure out exactly when the jeep name got onto 632 00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:32,279 Speaker 1: the the quarter tons. Exclusively, it happened somewhere between the 633 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,319 Speaker 1: fall of nineteen forty after the Bannom was delivered in 634 00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,879 Speaker 1: early nineteen But we did find out and we put 635 00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:42,560 Speaker 1: it in the book that the name jeep after Worlar 636 00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:48,160 Speaker 1: one could was applied many times by military personnel, you know, 637 00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:51,759 Speaker 1: two new vehicles that would come in. And so what 638 00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,080 Speaker 1: I think happened, and it's just my supposition is they 639 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:58,279 Speaker 1: just started calling the quarter tons jeeps, because that's kind 640 00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:01,200 Speaker 1: of what they did. And then over that period of 641 00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:04,080 Speaker 1: time I mentioned it just all of a sudden became 642 00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 1: singularly attached to the quarter ton vehicles and they were 643 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:12,600 Speaker 1: just known as jeep and after that and nothing else 644 00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:15,719 Speaker 1: was known as jeeps, just the quarter tons. So that's 645 00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:18,320 Speaker 1: my best guess. I figure if the court case couldn't 646 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:22,320 Speaker 1: quite figure out it really isn't from GP general purpose, 647 00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:25,520 Speaker 1: because Ford did not come out with the general purpose 648 00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:28,120 Speaker 1: to the spring of forty one, and they were all 649 00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:31,880 Speaker 1: already calling these things jeeps even as of um, you know, 650 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:37,520 Speaker 1: December of nineteen forty and the Eugene Eugeep theory, which 651 00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:43,040 Speaker 1: isn't a bad theory. Um again, um, the fact it's 652 00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:45,920 Speaker 1: really hard to prove that a one guy testified that 653 00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:48,680 Speaker 1: that's exactly how he named it. But there was conflicts 654 00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:52,000 Speaker 1: from what he testified to what other people testified. So 655 00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:55,800 Speaker 1: that's my best guests. It evolved from they called things jeeps. 656 00:39:56,040 --> 00:40:00,000 Speaker 1: They brought these vehicles in. They were revolutionary, knew nothing, 657 00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:03,279 Speaker 1: no one had ever seen anything like them, and the 658 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:06,919 Speaker 1: jeep name just stuck to it, and you know, using 659 00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:10,600 Speaker 1: overused cliche, the rest, as they say, is history. Yeah, 660 00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:13,399 Speaker 1: well then you know, during the war years, you've got 661 00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:18,160 Speaker 1: six million guys coming in unit to serving World War 662 00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:20,759 Speaker 1: Two and probably maybe even more than that. I mean 663 00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:24,719 Speaker 1: you have millions of you know, g I's Marine sailors 664 00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:28,920 Speaker 1: whatever you want to call them, and uh, you know, 665 00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:31,879 Speaker 1: once they hear that term, of course, now it's it's 666 00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:36,000 Speaker 1: being repeated millions of times, so that that name was 667 00:40:36,040 --> 00:40:39,920 Speaker 1: gonna stick. I was always wondering about that because I 668 00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:43,040 Speaker 1: had heard the g P story as well, you know, 669 00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:45,680 Speaker 1: a long time ago, and I even asked my dad, 670 00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:48,480 Speaker 1: who served in World War Two, about that, and he 671 00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:50,279 Speaker 1: was like, I don't know when I came in. He 672 00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:54,239 Speaker 1: entered the army in nine and he was like, by 673 00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:57,759 Speaker 1: the time I saw the first jeep uh in forty one, 674 00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:00,680 Speaker 1: which he was talking about, because they they took them 675 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,680 Speaker 1: from Camp Edwards Mass all the way down to Fort 676 00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:08,880 Speaker 1: Benning and uh in a in a battalion convoy and 677 00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:11,600 Speaker 1: he's like, we already were calling them jeeps. I don't 678 00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:15,360 Speaker 1: know how it got the name, so it's it's really interesting, 679 00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:20,480 Speaker 1: but I heard that the like the civilian term that 680 00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:23,080 Speaker 1: we use, like c J five, c J seven for 681 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:30,719 Speaker 1: the civilians vehicles. Dad came from Willis, right, yes, Uh. 682 00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:33,320 Speaker 1: After the war, Willis was the one that decided to 683 00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,040 Speaker 1: keep using the jeeps and try to make them into 684 00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:38,200 Speaker 1: a civilian vehicle. But I want to go back to 685 00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:42,560 Speaker 1: your dad for a second, if it's okay, sure. On 686 00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:46,560 Speaker 1: our Facebook page the original Jeeps, one of the things 687 00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:52,919 Speaker 1: we're doing is we're sharing people's family stories of there 688 00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:55,959 Speaker 1: anyone in their family that served in World War Two. 689 00:41:56,520 --> 00:41:59,320 Speaker 1: Um number my uncle served in World War two and 690 00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:02,480 Speaker 1: one of my aunt served and so the uncle that 691 00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,600 Speaker 1: served in the Air Force over in Italy on b 692 00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,160 Speaker 1: twenty four is we're sharing some of his stories and 693 00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:11,919 Speaker 1: also of his wife, who was my aunt Marge. Um. 694 00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:16,879 Speaker 1: She was in the Woman's Army Auxiliary Corps. And so 695 00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:20,040 Speaker 1: anyone that wants to share a story of their family service, 696 00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:22,040 Speaker 1: if you have any from your dad, Steve, if you 697 00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:24,480 Speaker 1: go out out to our Facebook page, the original Geez 698 00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,319 Speaker 1: Jeep and want to post it with a photograph, we 699 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:29,759 Speaker 1: already have some posts from my aunt and uncle kind 700 00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:32,080 Speaker 1: of as examples of what we're what we're doing, and 701 00:42:32,239 --> 00:42:35,480 Speaker 1: we're just trying to honor the greatest generation there again 702 00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:38,040 Speaker 1: in a different way with our book by you know, 703 00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:40,840 Speaker 1: hopefully people will share their family stories. So it was 704 00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:42,839 Speaker 1: kind of a good chance, good time to mention that 705 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:46,440 Speaker 1: and honor your dad also at the same time that 706 00:42:46,440 --> 00:42:49,279 Speaker 1: that would be awesome. In fact, yeah, my my, my 707 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:52,640 Speaker 1: dad always talked about that a long convoy, you know, 708 00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:57,440 Speaker 1: because he said, there wasn't you know back then, uh 709 00:42:57,560 --> 00:42:59,920 Speaker 1: you know, it was going through small towns all the 710 00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:02,719 Speaker 1: way and then you have a big long convoy with 711 00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:06,160 Speaker 1: Deuce and a half jeeps and motorcycles. And he said, 712 00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:09,440 Speaker 1: and I made the mistake because they were short motorcycle riders, 713 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:14,560 Speaker 1: you know, for you know, for the convoy. I told him, 714 00:43:14,600 --> 00:43:17,800 Speaker 1: all I owned a Harley in the civilian world, and 715 00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:20,640 Speaker 1: he was like, halfway down, I became a Harley writer 716 00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,760 Speaker 1: until we all got down to you know, to Georgia, 717 00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:27,239 Speaker 1: and he said, and that wasn't fun. You know, and 718 00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:30,520 Speaker 1: I can't imagine trying to be an out writer in 719 00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:33,359 Speaker 1: the old days. Today it would be easy going down 720 00:43:33,440 --> 00:43:38,640 Speaker 1: ninety five, but not back then. No, And um, that 721 00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:41,719 Speaker 1: is exactly the type of story we're looking for. And 722 00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:43,880 Speaker 1: that's even better. It doesn't have to be about jeeps. 723 00:43:43,880 --> 00:43:46,160 Speaker 1: Would that be about jeeps? So you know, I'm willing 724 00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:49,000 Speaker 1: to beg if you would go out and actually, Philip considers, 725 00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:51,440 Speaker 1: you know, sharing that storry Steve of your dad and 726 00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:53,640 Speaker 1: the convoy with the jeeps could get ugly if I 727 00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:56,239 Speaker 1: beg too hard, So I'll just I'll just you know, 728 00:43:56,440 --> 00:43:58,719 Speaker 1: ask politely. And if you give that some thought and 729 00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:01,160 Speaker 1: you check out our Facebook page age the original jeeps, 730 00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:05,480 Speaker 1: that's exactly the kind of stories we're looking for. Great stuff. Yeah, 731 00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:08,960 Speaker 1: because my dad ended up in armor and uh, I 732 00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:12,160 Speaker 1: have some pictures of him around jeeps because they and 733 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:16,120 Speaker 1: the armory units they used them for reconnaissance and uh, 734 00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:21,040 Speaker 1: you know, for the headquarters elements always had jeeps and 735 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:24,480 Speaker 1: they used to tow ammunition trailers with them and the 736 00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:28,640 Speaker 1: halftimes and I could do anything with a jeep when 737 00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:33,879 Speaker 1: they really wanted to. Yeah, yeah, so hey, uh, Paul, 738 00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:36,400 Speaker 1: I want to thank you man, this was This was 739 00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:39,880 Speaker 1: a lot of fun. I mean, the history involved with 740 00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:42,480 Speaker 1: this is uh. Are there any more stories about the 741 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:45,000 Speaker 1: book that you want to share with our listeners because 742 00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:47,719 Speaker 1: we still have a couple of minutes if you want to, Yeah, 743 00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:49,319 Speaker 1: I'm gonna share one more, but let me get a 744 00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:52,759 Speaker 1: couple of shameless, blatant plugs in while I'm here. I 745 00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:57,040 Speaker 1: do but for podcast listeners such as your listeners. One 746 00:44:57,040 --> 00:44:58,759 Speaker 1: of the things we're doing, and this is just for 747 00:44:58,840 --> 00:45:02,680 Speaker 1: people that listen to podcast asked for that type of media. 748 00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:04,759 Speaker 1: At the same price. You can get the book at 749 00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:09,720 Speaker 1: Amazon twenty dollars. If you go to the website www. 750 00:45:10,239 --> 00:45:17,000 Speaker 1: Dispatcher magazine dot com Dispatcher Magazine dot com slash books, 751 00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:20,640 Speaker 1: you can order an autograph copy for twenty dollars there. 752 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:22,919 Speaker 1: So I just want to make sure your listeners here 753 00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:27,680 Speaker 1: that Dispatcher Magazine dot com slash books autograph copy by 754 00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:30,960 Speaker 1: Paul Bruno, which makes a great Christmas president. What more 755 00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:33,440 Speaker 1: could someone ask for than an autograph copy book by 756 00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:35,920 Speaker 1: Paul Bruno? Actually a lot, but that's the best I 757 00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:42,239 Speaker 1: can offer there. You go, I know it's gonna be 758 00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:44,640 Speaker 1: under my tree this year. Well, hey, if I see 759 00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:47,080 Speaker 1: you out there and you go to Dispatcher Magazine dot 760 00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:49,640 Speaker 1: com slash books and be glad to give you an 761 00:45:49,640 --> 00:45:52,040 Speaker 1: auto sign an autograph copy and ship it to you. 762 00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:54,160 Speaker 1: The other is I just want to mention our website. 763 00:45:54,200 --> 00:45:58,040 Speaker 1: It's called original Jeeps dot com Original Jeeps dot com 764 00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:01,000 Speaker 1: and on there we have a contact form so you 765 00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,160 Speaker 1: can contact us if you'd like. And there's a lot 766 00:46:03,239 --> 00:46:06,160 Speaker 1: of more really cool information about all three of the 767 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:09,040 Speaker 1: original Jeeps out on that website, so feel free to 768 00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:11,520 Speaker 1: check that out. The last story I'll talk about, and 769 00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:14,799 Speaker 1: there's just plenty more is um we're talking about how 770 00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:19,400 Speaker 1: the army came up with the expects. So they really 771 00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:21,920 Speaker 1: great detail this that I found in the trial case, 772 00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:24,520 Speaker 1: how they did a chalk mark on the floor or 773 00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:28,440 Speaker 1: wooden mock up and uh so then they did they 774 00:46:28,440 --> 00:46:31,239 Speaker 1: put together a little bit of a vehicle. I don't 775 00:46:31,280 --> 00:46:33,000 Speaker 1: know if it was wood or however, they did it. 776 00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:36,640 Speaker 1: And they put a bandom twenty horsepower engine in it, right, 777 00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:39,200 Speaker 1: and so this is I can't holl over. So they 778 00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:41,919 Speaker 1: tried to drive it up the hill and it makes 779 00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:45,000 Speaker 1: it halfway up the hill, and Colonel O. Seth was there. 780 00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:49,200 Speaker 1: Actually I believe in the vehicle, the infantry gentleman we've 781 00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:52,239 Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, and he basically says, we're done. This isn't 782 00:46:52,280 --> 00:46:55,400 Speaker 1: gonna work. It's not enough. And Charles Pain is standing 783 00:46:55,520 --> 00:46:57,520 Speaker 1: right there and he comes running up, or he was 784 00:46:57,560 --> 00:46:59,359 Speaker 1: there and he comes running up. It goes, oh, don't 785 00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:02,000 Speaker 1: worry about that, that it doesn't have enough horsepower. We're 786 00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:03,880 Speaker 1: not gonna use the band imagine, we already got a 787 00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:08,400 Speaker 1: different engine in mind. And Olss said, well, Charles Pain 788 00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:11,359 Speaker 1: kept the project for being shipwrecked on that one. Right there, 789 00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:14,479 Speaker 1: it's like, right on the edge, we're not gonna even 790 00:47:14,520 --> 00:47:16,960 Speaker 1: do this. At Charles Pain show, Oh don't worry. We 791 00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:18,960 Speaker 1: got you know, it's gonna bake twelve one or something 792 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:21,400 Speaker 1: three pounds. We got a more powerful engine. We're great. 793 00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:25,440 Speaker 1: Thumbs up. So just another one of those shook my 794 00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,560 Speaker 1: head moments saying, wow, this is how close it came, 795 00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:30,680 Speaker 1: in that one moment to maybe never even having a 796 00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:33,359 Speaker 1: jeep as it was. And and they actually did get 797 00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:36,239 Speaker 1: the continental engine and uh, you know, forty horsepower and 798 00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:39,440 Speaker 1: away they went. So that's just another nice story on 799 00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:42,440 Speaker 1: you know, how they would develop on the specs and um, 800 00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:44,920 Speaker 1: that's great. I love that detail geeking out on that 801 00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:48,560 Speaker 1: where you see come alive, you know, from just this 802 00:47:48,680 --> 00:47:53,520 Speaker 1: concept into something that uh they could build a vehicle from. 803 00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:56,960 Speaker 1: Oh that's great, and you know it's some great history 804 00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:00,160 Speaker 1: and the jeep has served our military's It served dar 805 00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:03,680 Speaker 1: military for like I said, about forty five years, maybe 806 00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:06,680 Speaker 1: even more. I know we started replace them in the 807 00:48:06,719 --> 00:48:09,719 Speaker 1: mid mental late eighties, but I mean it had a 808 00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:13,640 Speaker 1: great shelf life for the military and everyone who served 809 00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:16,359 Speaker 1: in that era from World War Two right up until 810 00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:21,600 Speaker 1: like the first Desert Storm. I mean everyone had stories 811 00:48:21,640 --> 00:48:25,480 Speaker 1: about jeeps and stuff that happened. It was a great tool, 812 00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:29,520 Speaker 1: It was a great piece of equipment. It always kind 813 00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:32,080 Speaker 1: of served well and you could beat the heck out 814 00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:34,120 Speaker 1: of them, and they just keep coming back for more. 815 00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:39,120 Speaker 1: So we we appreciate your time today, Paul, and we 816 00:48:39,200 --> 00:48:41,439 Speaker 1: want to thank you once again for joining us and 817 00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:44,759 Speaker 1: it was a lot of fun. We want to thank 818 00:48:44,760 --> 00:48:46,960 Speaker 1: our listeners for hanging in there. And if you want 819 00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:50,160 Speaker 1: to get soft rep on your phone, download our free 820 00:48:50,160 --> 00:48:54,560 Speaker 1: mobile app and get some easy access to articles, podcasts, 821 00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:58,520 Speaker 1: gear reviews, all perfectly format it to your own individual device. 822 00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:02,480 Speaker 1: Please subscribe the software dot com to get access to 823 00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:06,839 Speaker 1: all our library of e books and uh our exclusive 824 00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:11,040 Speaker 1: team room forms and content available on all Apple and 825 00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:14,719 Speaker 1: Android devices. Paul, what can I say? Thanks again? Man? 826 00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:16,840 Speaker 1: This has been a lot of fun for us. We 827 00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:20,720 Speaker 1: really appreciate your time and this is an awesome book 828 00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:24,680 Speaker 1: for those military historian types. Yeah, I really thank you 829 00:49:24,719 --> 00:49:27,839 Speaker 1: for having me in. But even military stories, we've tried 830 00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:30,560 Speaker 1: to make the story of the original jeeps accessible to 831 00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:33,360 Speaker 1: just about anybody because it's just a it's just a 832 00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:36,680 Speaker 1: great story of something people see every day. So um, 833 00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:39,719 Speaker 1: I'm really grateful that you had me and um, yeah, 834 00:49:39,760 --> 00:49:41,600 Speaker 1: it's it's a lot of fun to talk about. I 835 00:49:41,640 --> 00:49:44,120 Speaker 1: can tell you that now you get anything else in 836 00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:48,360 Speaker 1: the fire you're researching anything new? Uh not at the moment. 837 00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:52,400 Speaker 1: I have some I'm laughing because I have some concepts. 838 00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,440 Speaker 1: It sounds like the military if I've made n right, 839 00:49:55,920 --> 00:50:00,560 Speaker 1: um of where I might go next, but nothing concrete. Okay, Well, 840 00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:05,480 Speaker 1: thanks once again, and folks, thanks for listening to SOFTWAREP Radio. 841 00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:10,279 Speaker 1: We appreciate all your you know, loyalty and listening and 842 00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:13,880 Speaker 1: as well as you're reading all of our great articles. 843 00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,040 Speaker 1: So for myself, Steve al Story, Paul Bruno, all of 844 00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:20,040 Speaker 1: us here at software dot com. Thanks for listening. We'll 845 00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:38,439 Speaker 1: be back real soon. You've been listening to self Rep 846 00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:38,920 Speaker 1: Radio