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Speaker 1: Hey be warned.

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Speaker 2: The following behind the scenes interview contains major plot spoilers

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Speaker 2: of hooker Gate Season one. Yo, It's me your girl,

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Speaker 2: Lindsey Byron, and I am your host of hooker Gate.

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Speaker 1: Today.

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Speaker 2: I am here with the second member of this two

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Speaker 2: man band, that is Guy Kelly. All of the music,

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Speaker 2: the soundscapes, the sound effects, this whole audio world that

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Speaker 2: has been created has been created by him. So today

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Speaker 2: I want you, dear listener, to get to know Guy

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Speaker 2: a little better. Very rare does anybody willing to be

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Speaker 2: roped into my artistic projects. But if there's ever any

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Speaker 2: who is willing to be riped into my artistic projects,

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Speaker 2: it's you, man.

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Speaker 1: I fucking love you. You're a great friend, and I just

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Speaker 1: respect the hell out of you. I mean that, dude, Well.

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Speaker 3: That means a lot to me. I've worked with a

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Speaker 3: lot of people creatively, and you are the easiest person

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Speaker 3: I've ever collaborated with. We're on the same creative wavelength.

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Speaker 3: And if this has been the most fun I've ever

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Speaker 3: had on any project, it's also been the most difficult

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Speaker 3: creative project of my life, of my career. But I

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Speaker 3: couldn't think of anybody better to do it with than.

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Speaker 2: You dude, Thank you man, beast of a project Saga.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to get into some questions about your art

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Speaker 2: and your craft. Who are the top three influential musicians

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Speaker 2: on your own art?

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Speaker 3: That's a really tough question because I like a lot

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Speaker 3: of different types of music and a lot of musicians.

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Speaker 3: But I can definitely pin down three top ones. One

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Speaker 3: is a band called Fugazi. I think you're probably familiar

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Speaker 3: with them. A lot of people aren't familiar with them,

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Speaker 3: but they were kind of the biggest punk rock band

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Speaker 3: in the nineties. In the time we all think of

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Speaker 3: his grunge and alternative, those were punk bands that were

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Speaker 3: getting signed up by the major labels, and the biggest

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Speaker 3: of those bands was Fugazi. But they refused to ever

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Speaker 3: sign a major label deal. They had their own record label.

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Speaker 3: They booked their all of their own tours. They were

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Speaker 3: pushing new ground. When you think of punk rock, you

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Speaker 3: often think of really fast, kind of, for lack of

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Speaker 3: a better term, dumb, you know, three chords. This is

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Speaker 3: not what they did. They had really complex music was

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Speaker 3: still that punk rock attitude. Second, I would definitely have

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Speaker 3: to say would be James Brown. His ability to just

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Speaker 3: you know, to make you dance was just incredible. And

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Speaker 3: my third top influence is a man named Dave Paho.

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Speaker 3: The band that he's most well known for is called

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Speaker 3: But what really influenced me was he started putting out

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Speaker 3: albums in the late nineties where he recorded all the

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Speaker 3: instruments by himself. He did drums, guitar, bass, vocals, everything

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Speaker 3: all by himself. And when I heard those one I

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Speaker 3: love the music, but it also inspired me to think, hey,

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Speaker 3: I can play different instruments, and it sort of led

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Speaker 3: me on the journey where I am now, where I

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Speaker 3: have this self contained solo music studio where I do

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Speaker 3: everything myself without him, and hearing what he could do

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Speaker 3: all by himself, I'm not sure if I ever would

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Speaker 3: have thought to do that.

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, that's a great segue to what I

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Speaker 2: was going to ask next, because you know, I'm not

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Speaker 2: sure if people realize, but this whole podcast is a

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Speaker 2: two man band. You know, I'm the writer and the narrator,

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Speaker 2: but all of the music and sound, all of it,

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Speaker 2: all the instrumentation and the composition is being done.

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Speaker 1: By you, dude.

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Speaker 2: So my question is, how are you creating the music technically?

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Speaker 2: How much of the music is instrumental, and by that

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Speaker 2: I mean you know you're playing it on a guitar

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Speaker 2: or keyboards, and how much of it is digital, meaning

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Speaker 2: you're creating it on software on a computer.

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Speaker 3: Generally, if you're hearing a guitar on the podcast, I

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Speaker 3: have played that on a guitar. There's a few exceptions.

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Speaker 3: When I got into like the second and third episode,

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Speaker 3: and I realized I wasn't just going to be able

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Speaker 3: to reuse the same music for every episode. I was like,

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Speaker 3: this story is too complex. I wrote a ton of

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Speaker 3: music for the first episode, and then the second one comes,

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Speaker 3: I'm like, damn it, I need to write a bunch

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Speaker 3: more music like this is hard, And a couple episodes

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Speaker 3: in there was a part that I knew needed some guitar,

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Speaker 3: but I needed to get it done quick, and so

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Speaker 3: I did get a guitar like sample software because it

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Speaker 3: would be easier to plug it in and I didn't

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Speaker 3: have to set up microphones. I could do it late

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Speaker 3: at night or whatever. But generally, if you you're a

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Speaker 3: guitar on the podcast, I actually played that. Basically everything

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Speaker 3: else is a digital version of some sort. So I

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Speaker 3: have my studio at home, I have a computer, I

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Speaker 3: have a few microphones, I have like eight guitars, and

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Speaker 3: I have a digital drum set. But I have a

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Speaker 3: couple keyboards that are just MIDI controllers, And what that

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Speaker 3: means is they don't actually make sounds on their own.

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Speaker 3: They control the software that I use, and the software

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Speaker 3: that I have can basically I can pull up any

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Speaker 3: instrument that you could possibly think of. So when there's

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Speaker 3: a piano on there, I didn't record a physical piano,

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Speaker 3: but I played those parts. But the beauty of MIDI

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Speaker 3: is that I can record in the parts and then

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Speaker 3: I can change the notes around. Either if I make

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Speaker 3: a mistake or I need to do another part, I

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Speaker 3: can actually use a mouse and click in MIDI notes.

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Speaker 3: That makes it sound like I'm playing piano. A lot

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Speaker 3: of the textural sort of drony kind of stuff that

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Speaker 3: you might hear that was played with a keyboard, usually

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Speaker 3: while I'm listening to the words, so that I can

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Speaker 3: build when things are a little more tense or things

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Speaker 3: you need to get quieter, I can play off of

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Speaker 3: your words as I change the notes to help move

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Speaker 3: things a lot.

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Speaker 1: So it's not just a simple cut and paste job.

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Speaker 3: It is not a cut and paste job. I wish

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Speaker 3: it was, because that would be a lot faster. I

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Speaker 3: think some there are ways that I could have done that.

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Speaker 3: We have, you know, access to stock music libraries that

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Speaker 3: are vast and high quality, and some people do really

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Speaker 3: amazing work taking pre recorded music and fitting it to

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Speaker 3: podcast or videos or whatever. But that's not what we

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Speaker 3: wanted to do, and so to some extent I was

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Speaker 3: doing it the hard way, but it was very rewarding.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm glad that you've done it the hard way.

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Speaker 2: I remember listeners may or may not be aware that

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Speaker 2: I have a previous podcast call strip Cast True Stories

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Speaker 2: from a Stripper with a PhD. And you listen to that,

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Speaker 2: and I remember you saying to me in the past,

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Speaker 2: these people are doing you a disservice because they're just

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Speaker 2: plunking down, yeah, backing tracks without any real engagement of

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Speaker 2: the narration or movement of the scenes or the story.

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Speaker 3: Yet, how I always thought of my job was how

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Speaker 3: how are we telling the story? It's not just the mood,

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Speaker 3: it's not just background music. It's is what is the

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Speaker 3: music and the sounds doing to help you understand the story.

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Speaker 3: The music plays such an important part in tension and drama. Yes,

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Speaker 3: And if you don't line it up with what's going on,

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Speaker 3: it's meaningless. It's just background noise.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes even the music or sound reveals the plot.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, like action.

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Speaker 2: The more I have become accustomed to working with you,

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Speaker 2: the more I have started to step back and leave

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Speaker 2: sections where I do allow the sound to tell the story.

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Speaker 2: In the last episode, we end with our hero Rodney

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Speaker 2: is shot at and bullets fly over his head and

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Speaker 2: they explode the window, the big pane window that I

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Speaker 2: talk about a lot in his office. I wrote this

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Speaker 2: so many times and I just could not get that

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Speaker 2: pow like I wanted to end this episode on just bam.

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Speaker 2: But any way that I wrote and then the window

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Speaker 2: exploded just didn't give that crisp like slow app in

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Speaker 2: the face. And so what I've done with my script

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Speaker 2: for that is I'm going to allow the sound of

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Speaker 2: a gun, of a car speeding off of shattering glass,

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Speaker 2: and the listener is going to know what that is.

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Speaker 2: M Now, if I wrote that episode six months ago,

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't have even known that such a thing were

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Speaker 2: an option. To allow the sound to tell the story

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Speaker 2: in that way. You know, I've often wondered if I

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Speaker 2: could be a fly on the wall in this studio

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Speaker 2: of yours, what am I going to see?

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Speaker 3: It would actually be really boring. It can be a

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Speaker 3: really long, tedious, frustrating process. And what I find when

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Speaker 3: I'm working on music, it sounds terrible until the very

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Speaker 3: end when it doesn't sound terrible. I can't imagine anyone

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Speaker 3: enjoying watching me do what I do. Sometimes I'm a

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Speaker 3: little bit in the zone, you know, and I'm listening,

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Speaker 3: and I've got the keyboard in front of me, and

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Speaker 3: I'm playing the notes to try to move things along.

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Speaker 3: But you know, I might re record a guitar line

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Speaker 3: fifteen times to get it right, or play a bunch

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Speaker 3: of wrong notes and got to move them around. I

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Speaker 3: always say, whenever I'm making music, it sounds awful up

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Speaker 3: until the point where it doesn't can relate.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, one hundred percent. Same with my writing. And when

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Speaker 2: I am writing these episodes, my process is to first

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Speaker 2: I just get the content down. By that, I mean

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Speaker 2: what needs to happen, Like I put bullet points. This

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Speaker 2: scene needs to convey that there's trouble in paradise in

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Speaker 2: this relationship, that there is domestic violence, et cetera, any

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Speaker 2: sort of plot points, and I just write that content

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Speaker 2: with no concern to style or poetry. And frankly, I

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Speaker 2: think that's where the majority of writers stop.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, It's an important part of the creative process

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Speaker 3: of not caring about what it's like. Yet you know, like,

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Speaker 3: that's so true. A carving of a statue has to

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Speaker 3: look like a bunch of chunky rock before it can

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Speaker 3: look like David.

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Speaker 2: It absolutely does all of the hours of unglamorous, ugly writing,

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Speaker 2: ugly music, chunky rock that you have to be willing

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Speaker 2: to do in order to ever get to the beautiful

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Speaker 2: thing at the end. And I think you will probably

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Speaker 2: agree with me in that even when you get that

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Speaker 2: beautiful thing that you're done, a couple months later, you

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Speaker 2: look at it and you're like, damn, I should have

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Speaker 2: left that out, I should have fixed this. It's still

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Speaker 2: not what I want it to be.

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Speaker 3: It's the artist curse of never being satisfied with what

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Speaker 3: you've done.

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Speaker 2: By the way, particularly considering the fact that you are

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Speaker 2: sitting there listening to my words and composing according to

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Speaker 2: my words. If I want to make major revisions, I'm

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Speaker 2: kind of fucking you, you know, And I'm sorry, okay,

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Speaker 2: And I try not to do much of that because

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Speaker 2: of that knowledge. And what that means is I have

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Speaker 2: to be willing to put out into the world some

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Speaker 2: things that aren't exactly as perfect as I would want

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Speaker 2: them to be. However, I do believe also that the

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Speaker 2: quest for absolute perfection is another barrier of entry, and

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Speaker 2: that trying to make something absolutely the way you want

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Speaker 2: will prevent you from making something at all absolutely true.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a constant battle. Where's the line between perfection

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Speaker 3: and getting it done? Yes? I could work on thirty

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Speaker 3: seconds of music for years and never get it right

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Speaker 3: or where I want it to be. And I can't

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Speaker 3: spend that kind of time if I actually want to

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Speaker 3: put something out in the world. But also, at the

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Speaker 3: same time, if it's not good, why would anyone listen

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Speaker 3: to it? Yes, we have to make it amazing, but

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Speaker 3: also have to let go sometimes of where we wanted

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Speaker 3: to be.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, by the way, put the pin down.

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Speaker 3: By the way, you can send me re revisions anytime

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Speaker 3: I'll put in the work, I'll redo it.

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Speaker 1: Yes, thank you. I'm trying to go too hard with that.

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Speaker 2: But there's a few things I'd like to change on

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Speaker 2: some earlier episodes.

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Speaker 3: To that point, I have learned so much about this

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Speaker 3: that I think, should I just redo the first episode

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Speaker 3: because I didn't know what it was going to become

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Speaker 3: until we did it.

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Speaker 1: I want to read it, and you know, in a.

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Speaker 3: Few maybe you're finding out here that we actually did

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Speaker 3: a second version of the first episode. That might be happening.

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Speaker 3: It sounds like, but you know, as as I create

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Speaker 3: figure things out how to build this world and how

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Speaker 3: to put things together, I'm like, you know, I should

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Speaker 3: have done this earlier, but I didn't know to do

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Speaker 3: it until we actually started creating it.

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Speaker 1: And thus is the nature of the Beast.

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Speaker 2: And that's the thing that'll kind of pish you off

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Speaker 2: because the first episode is so important. You know, you

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Speaker 2: got to get the people in, but the first episode

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Speaker 2: is when you are just learning to swim.

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Speaker 3: Yeah you know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Okay, another question, can you recount for our listeners

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Speaker 2: the first time you ever heard about this project?

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Speaker 1: Do you remember that?

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Speaker 2: So?

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Speaker 3: I do know that I got a text from you

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Speaker 3: and you're like, I want to do this with you,

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Speaker 3: and it was a link to the iHeart competition that

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Speaker 3: we entered and won. You just said that you had

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Speaker 3: a really amazing story and that you're going to call

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Speaker 3: me later and tell me about it. So I do

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Speaker 3: remember you calling me and we had a conversation, and

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Speaker 3: I immediately was just like, this is a pretty cool story,

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Speaker 3: and I could immediately hear the potential for it. And

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Speaker 3: I do remember very clearly you had a vision immediately

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Speaker 3: from the very first conversation. What you wanted it to

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Speaker 3: be is basically what we have done. You know, you said,

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Speaker 3: this isn't just a podcast. It's going to be like

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Speaker 3: a TV show or like a movie. There's going to

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Speaker 3: be sounds, you know. I want sound effects and original music,

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Speaker 3: a whole soundscape, a whole world built around this. And

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Speaker 3: I was so excited because it was exactly the kind

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Speaker 3: of project I have always wanted to do and that

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Speaker 3: I was looking for. And I was thrilled that you

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Speaker 3: were asking me to help you with it.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't do it without you, man, And it's just

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Speaker 2: been a huge blessing to have you in my life,

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Speaker 2: to be to be available for these things. Listeners may

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Speaker 2: or may not know. You also designed my memoir. I

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Speaker 2: did cover and the inside. So we just keep finding

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Speaker 2: new ways to work together. And folks, do you want

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Speaker 2: us to release an album. L you know, I sing

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Speaker 2: a little bit. You know, we'll see.

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Speaker 3: We have a couple unreleased tracks.

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Speaker 1: We do some rap song angry man. We write them

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Speaker 1: shits at some dark times in our lives.

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Speaker 2: Boy. Okay, So guy, I recorded all of my vocals

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Speaker 2: for this podcast at home and then would send the raw,

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Speaker 2: unedited vocal recordings along with the script to you. What

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Speaker 2: was your process for taking these recordings and this script

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Speaker 2: and turning it into a full episode.

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Speaker 3: It was a really complex process, and like I kind

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Speaker 3: of mentioned before, I had to kind of figure it

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Speaker 3: all out on the fly. So I've never done a

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Speaker 3: full podcast before your most recent podcast, When We Could Touch.

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Speaker 3: I did the theme music for that, which was really fun,

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Speaker 3: but I didn't do any of the other episodes or

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Speaker 3: any of the editing. So this was my first time

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Speaker 3: doing a full on podcast episode, and for sure my

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Speaker 3: first time doing a full on scoring soundscape sort of

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Speaker 3: project like this. So what I would have to do.

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Speaker 3: There were basically three main jobs that I had. One

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Speaker 3: was as a composer, that's the one that I kind

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Speaker 3: of talk about the most. But there's also sound designer,

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Speaker 3: which is creating the soundscape. So the worlds and the

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Speaker 3: sound effects. And then there's the audio engineer aspect, which

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Speaker 3: is just assembling all of the pieces into a final

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Speaker 3: file that sounds good, which involves chopping up your vocals

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Speaker 3: that you sent because you would have directions to me

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Speaker 3: or you might mess up a little bit. Also, there's

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Speaker 3: just breaths and mouth clicks that I have to get

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Speaker 3: rid of. I have to process the audio because when

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Speaker 3: you record audio into a microphone, it actually doesn't sound

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Speaker 3: very good, so it needs a lot of processing so

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Speaker 3: that it sounds good when you listen to it on

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Speaker 3: your headphones. And those are all very distinct stages. And

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Speaker 3: what I realized is that I had to compartmentalize to

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Speaker 3: some extent, because when I would sit down and think

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Speaker 3: about everything that I had to do, it was so overwhelming.

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Speaker 3: I couldn't do anything. Yeah, So I would always start

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Speaker 3: with pulling up the track, just editing it down into

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Speaker 3: just the vocals that are going into it. What that

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Speaker 3: did also do is allow me to at least start

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Speaker 3: getting a sense of what's the story and what's going on.

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Speaker 3: From there, I would then start with the music next.

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Speaker 3: And that was a dance between chopping up your vocals

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Speaker 3: for pacing versus creating pacing with the music. So sometimes

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Speaker 3: I might move words here or there to speed things

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Speaker 3: up or slow them down to give room for the music.

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Speaker 3: Other times I would be fitting the music to the

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Speaker 3: words as they were, and it was just kind of

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Speaker 3: an interplay, you know, there was no real It wasn't

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Speaker 3: a science. That was just kind of had like, oh,

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Speaker 3: this part needs to speed up or slow down, or

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Speaker 3: I need to move this word or whatever. And you know,

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Speaker 3: so that was a long process that doesn't even include

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Speaker 3: the part of actually writing the music, which is kind

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Speaker 3: of a separate process of its own. And then the

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Speaker 3: last thing I would do is start doing the sound effects,

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Speaker 3: because that was kind of like the candy the courtroom

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Speaker 3: Ambiyonce all of that and that was always the last part.

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Speaker 3: And then after all of that's done, I have to

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Speaker 3: then adjust all of the levels. The music would be

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Speaker 3: too loud in one section to quite in another section.

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Speaker 3: That stomp right there was way too loud, you know,

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Speaker 3: got to turn that down. So then got to smooth

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Speaker 3: all of that out. That's more of the audio engineer

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Speaker 3: aspect of it, making it actually sound like a high

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Speaker 3: quality audio file in single piece.

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Speaker 1: Well, you knocked it out of the park.

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Speaker 3: Well, thank you.

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Speaker 2: And the candy that you refer to is really just

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Speaker 2: delightful and some of my favorite parts those sound effects

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Speaker 2: that you add in there, just sounds of, say, a

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Speaker 2: woman crying for the church was one of my favorite scenes.

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Speaker 1: That you created. Okay got most of.

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Speaker 2: Your experience as a musician has been in writing songs

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Speaker 2: in a band or as a solo artist. How different

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Speaker 2: is the process of writing the score to a podcast

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Speaker 2: compared to writing a traditional song.

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Speaker 3: It almost feels like a completely different discipline. I'm obviously

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Speaker 3: able to use my knowledge of music and a music production.

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Speaker 3: That skill that I've developed over time transfers the same.

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Speaker 3: But the biggest thing that was different and the hardest

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Speaker 3: thing to deal with, was that sometimes the music does

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Speaker 3: need to fall into the background. It can't get in

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Speaker 3: the way of the story. And when you're writing a song,

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Speaker 3: you want the listener to be engaged, you want the hooks,

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Speaker 3: you want it to be awesome all the time. I'm

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Speaker 3: looking for that energy. This was one thing I learned

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Speaker 3: when we did the pilot where there were certain times

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Speaker 3: where I had some people I think you might have

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Speaker 3: even said this too. It's like well, you know, the

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Speaker 3: music's a little too good. It's kind of distracting me.

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Speaker 3: I'm listening to the melody you've got in the background,

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Speaker 3: and I'm not listening to the words, and that's a problem,

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Speaker 3: you know. So with the way we built things, we

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Speaker 3: would introduce a new theme that needed to sound good

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Speaker 3: and needed to have a hook, but it also had

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Speaker 3: to be able to go into the background when it

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Speaker 3: was necessary. So all of the themes had to have

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Speaker 3: sort of repetitive, drony, kind of simpler parts so that

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Speaker 3: it could still give that feeling but not distract from

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Speaker 3: the words. That's the hardest part, is not distracting from

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Speaker 3: the story.

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Speaker 2: So on that note, I you know, when we first

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Speaker 2: started talking about this project, I told you write out

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Speaker 2: the gate that I had certain groupings of characters.

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Speaker 1: Let's say, for example, the Pimps.

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Speaker 2: I told you, hey, I would like for each of

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Speaker 2: these character categories to have a musical theme to help

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Speaker 2: the listener know when they hear this song, draw they know, okay,

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Speaker 2: here we are we're dealing with, say the pimps.

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Speaker 1: How did you develop these themes?

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Speaker 3: So it would always start with what's the mood and

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Speaker 3: the feeling of the different characters, you know. So the

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Speaker 3: Pim's theme, you know, I was like imagining that it

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Speaker 3: starts out with those that stomps. It's actually like fifteen

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Speaker 3: kick drums, but I kind of wanted it to sound

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Speaker 3: like footstomps, and then there's the claps it does, and

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Speaker 3: I was imagining some down home boys throwing back a

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Speaker 3: few beers and singing some songs together and stomping and

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Speaker 3: clapping together. We're having fun, you know, We're getting down

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Speaker 3: and dirty kind of guys. You know, that was sort

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Speaker 3: of what was in my mind what Originally I wrote

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Speaker 3: it as the Prostitute's theme, but I kind of more

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Speaker 3: think of it as Buckeye's theme, just very arpeggiated guitar.

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Speaker 3: It felt like that was something that needed something a

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Speaker 3: little more introspective, not necessarily innocent, but innocent adjacent if

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Speaker 3: that makes sense.

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Speaker 2: Well, we have to mention Rodney's theme. Yeah, yeah, So

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Speaker 2: can you tell us a little bit about that and

404
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Speaker 2: why you designed it the way you did the typewriter?

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, that was such a brilliant move, dude.

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Speaker 3: That was actually the first idea I had for anything.

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Speaker 3: I remember, right after we found out we won and

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Speaker 3: we were going to do a whole season. You called

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Speaker 3: me and we were talking and you were like, really,

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Speaker 3: driving home, we need themes for everything, for all the

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Speaker 3: different characters, or I'm going to jump around a lot

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Speaker 3: and everything, and you're telling me about Rodney. At this point,

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Speaker 3: you hadn't interviewed him yet, and so you were just

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Speaker 3: telling me about him, and you were like, this is

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Speaker 3: what he's going to be like, this is his character,

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Speaker 3: this is going to be like and he's so focused

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Speaker 3: on his journalism career. And I was like, ah, I

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Speaker 3: think I even told you on the phone that day.

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Speaker 3: I was like, you know what, I could make a

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Speaker 3: beat to start it off that's made out of typewriter samples.

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Speaker 3: A funny story, I actually found a mechanical typewriter on

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Speaker 3: Facebook marketplace and bought it for twenty five dollars so

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Speaker 3: that I could sample that and make a beat. But

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Speaker 3: then when it actually came down to it, I just

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Speaker 3: downloaded typewriter samples into the bub Well.

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Speaker 1: It's effort, though a for effort, it sounds great.

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Speaker 2: And as a side note, Rodney is just the most

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Speaker 2: likable son of a bitch too.

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Speaker 1: I shouldn't even call him an sab I love that dude.

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Speaker 2: Interviewing him in real life loved him even more and

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Speaker 2: it was really a joy to center him. Yeah, so, guy,

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Speaker 2: which is your favorite of the themes?

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Speaker 1: Which one is the biggest banger?

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Speaker 3: I actually like Buckeye's theme is probably my favorite. As

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Speaker 3: far as a musical piece. The best banger, I think

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Speaker 3: is the Pimps theme.

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Speaker 1: It's such a banger, dude.

438
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 3: My favorite one, though, is actually Whitehead's Joe Whitehead's theme.

439
00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 3: It's really simple, just those kind of dark slide guitar

440
00:24:57,359 --> 00:24:59,240
Speaker 3: lines and then the parts where I bring in the

441
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,520
Speaker 3: piano at the And that was like a game time decision.

442
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 3: When I was doing the first episode, I had written

443
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:07,679
Speaker 3: everything other than that, and at the very end, I

444
00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:09,639
Speaker 3: was like, you know what, what if I added some

445
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:12,199
Speaker 3: dark piano here at the end. And when I was

446
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:13,920
Speaker 3: done with it, it was one of those moments where

447
00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:16,040
Speaker 3: it's like it's terrible until it's not terrible. But I

448
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 3: was just like waving my hands in the air like, yes,

449
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 3: I did it. Yes, sounds awesome.

450
00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 1: Okay, so listeners wouldn't know this, but I do.

451
00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:29,040
Speaker 2: You have a fine arts degree and most of your

452
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:32,359
Speaker 2: career has been spent as a graphic designer. In fact,

453
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:37,640
Speaker 2: that's why I enlisted you to design my book Too

454
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,640
Speaker 2: Pretty to Be Good by Lucy Byron, available where all

455
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:48,359
Speaker 2: books are sold. Dude, how has your experience as a

456
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:54,440
Speaker 2: visual artist help prepare you for this project?

457
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:57,879
Speaker 3: One thing I learned pretty early on as I started

458
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:03,280
Speaker 3: my career, I really learned the process of being creative professionally,

459
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:07,320
Speaker 3: which is very different than just being an artist and

460
00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:09,199
Speaker 3: doing it for the love of it. This was the

461
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,119
Speaker 3: biggest struggle I had when I first got out of

462
00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 3: college is learning how to be creative on demand. It's

463
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,280
Speaker 3: so difficult. In college, I would have like one project

464
00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:19,959
Speaker 3: and we'd have like three weeks to work on it,

465
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 3: and then you get into the workforce and they're like,

466
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,920
Speaker 3: we need this today, or we need this two hundred

467
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:28,879
Speaker 3: page book in two weeks or whatever the time is.

468
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 3: I eventually moved on to magazines, where I would literally

469
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,760
Speaker 3: lay out one hundred page magazine in a week, so

470
00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:39,399
Speaker 3: there's no time to wait for inspiration. Like I have

471
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:43,600
Speaker 3: to manufacture creativity and that's a really hard thing to do,

472
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:45,439
Speaker 3: and it took me a really long time to do it.

473
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 3: But now I'm really good at that. And that was

474
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 3: the biggest benefit of all of those years working as

475
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:54,520
Speaker 3: a professional creative, even those in graphic design. I know

476
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,560
Speaker 3: how to make myself be creative. It may not be

477
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,120
Speaker 3: great at first, as we've mentioned, but I can sit

478
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:04,879
Speaker 3: down and get work done when I need to get

479
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:08,679
Speaker 3: it done, whether it's design or music or whatever creative

480
00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:10,520
Speaker 3: enture it is, I know how to do that.

481
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:12,639
Speaker 1: Absolutely can relate.

482
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,880
Speaker 2: And I think that's another barrier of entry for many

483
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 2: would be artists is so many people believe that they

484
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 2: have to wait for inspiration to strike.

485
00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:28,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, and inspiration striking is, you know, fairly rare.

486
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,240
Speaker 2: What you really need is discipline and you got to

487
00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:37,440
Speaker 2: sit down at that fucking desk and whether whatever mood

488
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 2: you're in, you got to make it happen.

489
00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:45,040
Speaker 3: Yeah. If you're just making art or music just for

490
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 3: yourself and there's no stakes, you know, you don't care

491
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:51,240
Speaker 3: if anyone ever hears it. You can wait for inspiration

492
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,560
Speaker 3: and that makes you happy. That's great, But you know,

493
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 3: when you're doing something as a professional, can't You can't wait.

494
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 3: You have to manufacture that inspiration.

495
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 2: So you know, in this podcast, bro, I'm presenting you

496
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 2: with any number of scenes, and I have my favorites

497
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 2: you know, for example, I really enjoy the diner mm hm,

498
00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:12,639
Speaker 2: the Edgewood Diner.

499
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:13,959
Speaker 1: What a vibe?

500
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:17,400
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Well, of course the court we see over

501
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 2: and over and by the way, season two that's about

502
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,040
Speaker 2: to be very court room heavy because we're going into

503
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:27,479
Speaker 2: the trial. With season two, we have a number of

504
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:31,879
Speaker 2: scenes that the brothels, the truck stop brothels, which also

505
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 2: what a vibe. How are you envisioning these soundscapes?

506
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 3: What is your process? What it always has to go

507
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 3: back to is a personal experience. Yes, sometime where I

508
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 3: have been in a situation that I can I feel

509
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 3: is similar to that. So courtroom, you know, my only

510
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 3: real experience, So the courtroom is about ten years ago.

511
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:04,560
Speaker 3: I had to do jury duty once and I was

512
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:08,240
Speaker 3: in a jury pool, didn't actually get selected for the

513
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 3: final jury. This was in Cincinnati, and you know, courtrooms

514
00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,520
Speaker 3: are going to look different everywhere, but this one that

515
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,360
Speaker 3: I have a very vivid memory of. It was all wood.

516
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:19,959
Speaker 3: There was no plush anywhere. The floors were wood, the

517
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 3: benches were wood, lots of creaking going on, very echoey,

518
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 3: and so that's kind of reflected in the courtroom scenes

519
00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:31,520
Speaker 3: that we have here. There's lots of reverb on the vocals.

520
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:34,040
Speaker 3: It's really one of the few places where I made

521
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 3: all of the vocals have reverb on them because I

522
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:38,600
Speaker 3: really wanted you to get a sense that you were

523
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 3: in that room. And then I just start thinking, how

524
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:45,400
Speaker 3: do I communicate that you're in a room when the

525
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 3: talking is going on without being overwhelming, but get that across.

526
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 3: So you know, there's the obvious stuff like the gavel,

527
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:55,400
Speaker 3: and then I started imagining, what else might you hear

528
00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 3: while you're in a courtroom like that? So somebody leans

529
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 3: back in their seat, there's a little chain creek. I

530
00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:02,720
Speaker 3: don't know if you notice that, but there's chair creaking.

531
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 3: A lawyer's got to look through his notes, and so

532
00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 3: there's some paper shuffling. Somebody off in the distance coughs yes,

533
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 3: or you know, those kinds of things to set the stage.

534
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:16,320
Speaker 3: They usually start at the very first court scene would

535
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,800
Speaker 3: usually start with some chatter, you know before like people

536
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:22,560
Speaker 3: are talking, then there's the gavel, or like everybody's be

537
00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 3: quiet because we're getting started on the trial again, those

538
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 3: kinds of things to build you into that world for

539
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 3: the For the diner, A lot of my memories go

540
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,880
Speaker 3: back to my time growing up in Springfield, Kentucky, which

541
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:39,880
Speaker 3: I often think is very similar to Danville. I've never

542
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 3: been to Danville, but the way you describe it, it

543
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:43,480
Speaker 3: reminds me a lot of the town that I grew

544
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:46,000
Speaker 3: up in. So there was a little diner that my

545
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:48,840
Speaker 3: parents would take me to sometimes, and so I just

546
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,440
Speaker 3: kind of imagine being there and just the general noise

547
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 3: that's going on of chatter and clinking dishes, spoons being

548
00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 3: stirred in coffee, that kind of stuff. The church was

549
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 3: another fun one. I also I grew up going to

550
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:04,360
Speaker 3: church a lot, and so that one also kind of

551
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 3: felt easy to do. And the truck stops I would

552
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 3: think about. There was a gas station right by the

553
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:15,160
Speaker 3: Bluegrass Highway, which was just outside of Springfield, this really dusty,

554
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:17,720
Speaker 3: gross gas station truck stop kind of place, and I

555
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:20,320
Speaker 3: would think about that and like imagining, you know, the

556
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 3: light bulbs humming when they're walking outside of the truck stop.

557
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:29,360
Speaker 3: It's gravel, because I imagined in the seventies in rural Virginia,

558
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 3: they're not going to have a paved parking lot in

559
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:34,320
Speaker 3: their gas stations or truck stops. You know, those kinds

560
00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:38,480
Speaker 3: of personal memories that sort of led to the decisions

561
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:41,080
Speaker 3: for how to develop the sounds.

562
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:45,720
Speaker 1: On that note. You've never been to Danville. By the way, folks,

563
00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 1: if you rearrange the letters in Danville, it spells evil Land.

564
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,880
Speaker 1: It's just one of the best little kernels of trivia

565
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 1: of my life.

566
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 2: I discovered that when I was a teenager and I've

567
00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 2: carried it with.

568
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 1: Me ever since. Really, bro, what does Danville sound like

569
00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 1: to you?

570
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 3: The first word that comes to mind is twangy. The

571
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:13,680
Speaker 3: main theme for the intro that we always do this

572
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:19,640
Speaker 3: the cold open, but then there's the intro part. That

573
00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 3: was the very first thing I ever wrote for Anything Like,

574
00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:26,400
Speaker 3: because the first thing we did was the trailer for

575
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 3: the competition. In order to even get selected to do

576
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:31,040
Speaker 3: a pilot, we had to do a one minute trailer.

577
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 3: And the way you described everything, you use the phrase

578
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 3: dark bluegrass, and I know a lot about bluegrass, but

579
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 3: I've never played bluegrass before, but I know that there's

580
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 3: a lot of what's called hammer on and pull off.

581
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 3: That's sort of one of the techniques that sliding the fingers.

582
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:51,080
Speaker 3: So that little first line I plucked the string once

583
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:52,800
Speaker 3: and then some of the notes are just played by

584
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 3: my fingers pressing down and pulling off of the strings

585
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 3: by themselves, and that when you do that really fast,

586
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 3: gives that sort of twangy sound. And so that was

587
00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:04,880
Speaker 3: kind of the basis for everything after that, building off

588
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:05,640
Speaker 3: of that vibe.

589
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 2: Once you dropped that first song, you know, when we

590
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 2: were the very early stages of this, straight away, I

591
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 2: was like, nailed it. I think that is such a

592
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 2: compelling and I dare say, catchy cold open.

593
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 3: I'm glad you say that because that was the point.

594
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is, it is, you know.

595
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,840
Speaker 3: Lindsay just I don't know what the right word to say,

596
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:33,560
Speaker 3: mouthed out that guitar line, right, she's saying that guitar

597
00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:37,200
Speaker 3: line there. One of my favorite things when I would

598
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 3: get Lindsay's vocals for each episode is that's whenever she

599
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:45,360
Speaker 3: would finish with the cold open, she would do exactly that.

600
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:50,400
Speaker 3: She'd go baron you and I it won. It was hilarious,

601
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 3: but it also made me feel really awesome. I was like, hey,

602
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:55,360
Speaker 3: I actually wrote something that's kind of catchy there that

603
00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 3: she likes and can remember and sing song it like that.

604
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 3: You know, so oh it's an earworm.

605
00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:06,280
Speaker 2: I mean I could hear it him asleep. You know,

606
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:09,840
Speaker 2: all of the vocals of mine that you had to process.

607
00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 2: I mean, my apologies and my gratitude. There's so many asides.

608
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 2: It is so much of me being like this fucking dog,

609
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:25,040
Speaker 2: like I can't believe the lawnman is here. Yes, also

610
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:28,279
Speaker 2: a lot of just direct instructions where I'm like, okay, guy,

611
00:34:28,320 --> 00:34:30,840
Speaker 2: I'm about to do this, and a lot of me going.

612
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 1: Start over.

613
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:36,560
Speaker 2: When I first started this project, I didn't I don't

614
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,359
Speaker 2: know why. I didn't realize how much of my role

615
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:40,680
Speaker 2: would involve acting.

616
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 3: Yeah.

617
00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:46,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I've been a storyteller my whole life, but

618
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:47,840
Speaker 2: I had to full on act.

619
00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:51,080
Speaker 3: I didn't even really think about that until an episode

620
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 3: or two in. I was just like, man, she's not

621
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 3: just the writer, she's not just the host. She's a

622
00:34:56,960 --> 00:35:00,799
Speaker 3: voice actor. And it caught me by prize too. But

623
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:04,400
Speaker 3: that's absolutely such an important part of the process and

624
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:05,879
Speaker 3: of what you do. Well.

625
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:08,000
Speaker 2: It was a trial by fire, my friend, because I

626
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,160
Speaker 2: have no experience voice acting.

627
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 1: But it's been fun.

628
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:18,040
Speaker 2: Okay, Now, this is a question I really want to know, dude,

629
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:21,799
Speaker 2: who is your favorite character from Hooker Gate.

630
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 3: H That's a really tough question, but I I think

631
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:30,399
Speaker 3: it's got to be Joe Whitehead. I've always been kind

632
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:32,279
Speaker 3: of a you know, when I was a kid, I

633
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 3: liked Darth Vader. Yes, you know, I liked the Cobras

634
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:38,879
Speaker 3: in the g I Joe's you know, like the bad

635
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,479
Speaker 3: guys were kind of like, that's who I like more.

636
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:44,880
Speaker 3: And I'm not like a bad dude, like I'm so

637
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:49,600
Speaker 3: like rule following and straight laced, but I always kind

638
00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:53,680
Speaker 3: of gravitated towards the bad guys and their stories. I

639
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 3: think that's why I loved shows like you know, Breaking Bad,

640
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,480
Speaker 3: where the main character was the villain, you know, which

641
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:02,800
Speaker 3: has been so popular in the last couple of decades.

642
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:08,759
Speaker 2: You know, I wonder sometimes you're the only person right

643
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 2: now and I by the time you guys are listening

644
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,319
Speaker 2: to this, you guys know this story, but at the

645
00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:18,359
Speaker 2: time of recording, Guy is the only other person who

646
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 2: knows this story, has any investment in these episodes, has

647
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 2: listened to any of it front to back. I mean,

648
00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 2: not even my husband, not even I would say my

649
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 2: best friends, but Guy is one of my best friends.

650
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,520
Speaker 2: Only you're the only one who knows these characters, who

651
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:40,720
Speaker 2: knows the story. I have wondered, how do these people

652
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:44,759
Speaker 2: come across to you, so, like, let me just ask you.

653
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:48,480
Speaker 2: For example, if you were to describe Joe Whitehead to

654
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,680
Speaker 2: a stranger, how would you describe this dude?

655
00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 3: I would say privileged to a fault would be one

656
00:36:55,640 --> 00:37:00,799
Speaker 3: of the biggest things. Someone who has never really had

657
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 3: to struggle in life and therefore has been able to

658
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:10,319
Speaker 3: become kind of a shitty person because they come from

659
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 3: good stock and don't have to grow up. You know.

660
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:15,640
Speaker 3: I think about certain people that I see who come

661
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:17,960
Speaker 3: from a well to do family, and they might be

662
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 3: in their forties, fifties, sixties and are terrible people. And

663
00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:24,120
Speaker 3: I think that's somebody who when they were eleven or twelve,

664
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 3: never had anyone that was just like, no, you can't

665
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 3: do that. I'm not going to let you do that.

666
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:32,359
Speaker 3: You don't get what you want. And when you don't

667
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 3: get that at that age, you never mature in to

668
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,680
Speaker 3: an adult and you can become a maniac.

669
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:44,120
Speaker 2: Absolutely, did any of the female characters stick out to you?

670
00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:49,759
Speaker 3: Janet? Janet and Thomas's relationship was the one that resonated

671
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 3: with me the most. I wrote specific music for theirs

672
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:59,280
Speaker 3: because it felt a little more intense and dreamy at times.

673
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:03,040
Speaker 3: You know, if you can remember the acoustic guitar lines

674
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:05,440
Speaker 3: and that are very ethereal, you know, so there is

675
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:07,920
Speaker 3: guitar and that that's the that's the part that it's

676
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 3: actually a sampled digital guitar because it needed to be

677
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 3: very loose and that was going to it's going to

678
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 3: take me forever to record that physically. But that one,

679
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:19,880
Speaker 3: that was kind of one of the moments where I

680
00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:23,040
Speaker 3: was like, I can't just reuse the buckeye theme as

681
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,040
Speaker 3: I'm calling it now. I can't just use that over

682
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:28,040
Speaker 3: top of this storyline. It's not going to fit. It

683
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:33,040
Speaker 3: needs something slower and also that can build into something

684
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,239
Speaker 3: more dramatic, which it often did, would start in one

685
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:39,080
Speaker 3: way and then build into suspenseful parts.

686
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 2: You know. I would mostly build those characters based on

687
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:47,640
Speaker 2: the way they acted in court.

688
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 3: Mm hmm.

689
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:55,400
Speaker 2: And both of those women, Robin and Janet, just especially

690
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 2: Robin by the way, just had this.

691
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 1: Kind of fuck you attitude that I liked.

692
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 2: And I have news clippings featuring photographs of Robin and

693
00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 2: she's in court looking beautiful, by the way, with just

694
00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:19,279
Speaker 2: this fuck you grin. You know, it's like, I dare you,

695
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:27,279
Speaker 2: and that woman shows up in my dreams, and I

696
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:31,440
Speaker 2: wonder is she alive. I couldn't find her, and Robin's

697
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:37,000
Speaker 2: not her real name. I couldn't find Janet either. But

698
00:39:37,120 --> 00:39:40,719
Speaker 2: if y'all are listening, I hope I did my best

699
00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:45,120
Speaker 2: to depict you in ways that depicted you as complex

700
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:50,480
Speaker 2: human beings. If I miss the mark, I'm my deepest apologies.

701
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:52,520
Speaker 1: Reach out.

702
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 2: I would love to hear from you, guys. So, final

703
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:03,520
Speaker 2: couple questions. Guy, if scoring this podcast could lead to

704
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 2: anywhere professionally or artistically, where would you want it to lead?

705
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:12,200
Speaker 2: In a dream world the right person? Here's hooker Gate.

706
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:13,520
Speaker 2: What happens for you?

707
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:18,640
Speaker 3: Well, plan A is scoring the TV adaptation of hooker

708
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:21,320
Speaker 3: Gate while you produce that. I think that's both of

709
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:25,040
Speaker 3: our plan a. Yeah, but I have to say I

710
00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:28,879
Speaker 3: really enjoy the process of scoring. It's, like I said,

711
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:31,640
Speaker 3: very different than writing songs, and I think I might

712
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:33,880
Speaker 3: actually like it more. And so I would love to

713
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:37,680
Speaker 3: do more of this, whether it's a podcast or film

714
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:43,759
Speaker 3: or TV. I'm really planning to springboard this into further projects.

715
00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:48,399
Speaker 3: Anytime you've got one, I'm on board. I'm ready to go.

716
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:50,480
Speaker 3: That's kind of what I think I'm going to focus

717
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:54,080
Speaker 3: on is scoring and composition moving forward.

718
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:58,479
Speaker 2: Hell yeah, I agree entirely with your plan A, and

719
00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:02,480
Speaker 2: I maybe buy. But I think that this story, and

720
00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:05,160
Speaker 2: indeed this podcast, the way that we have created it

721
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:12,479
Speaker 2: from the jump, is just ripe for television adaptation for sure.

722
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:17,160
Speaker 2: I mean, this whole time I've been writing it has

723
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:23,799
Speaker 2: been visualizing scenes. Sometimes I think this story is like

724
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 2: if Breaking Bad took place in a truck stop brothels

725
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:34,399
Speaker 2: in the Deep South, you know, like I just think

726
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:37,600
Speaker 2: it is. I think the world is ready for this

727
00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:38,520
Speaker 2: kind of story.

728
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:42,719
Speaker 3: When I was doing my research prepping waiting for the

729
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 3: vocals to get started, you sent me some podcast references

730
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 3: and I listened to a bunch of those. But I

731
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:52,920
Speaker 3: actually found that I started watching and analyzing the scores

732
00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:56,240
Speaker 3: of TV shows, and I started picking up that because

733
00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:58,160
Speaker 3: that really was more of the vibe we were going

734
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:01,280
Speaker 3: for a TV show without the big you. I actually

735
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:05,320
Speaker 3: picked up a lot of little tricks one thing I noticed,

736
00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:08,000
Speaker 3: and a lot of TV shows where they would at

737
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 3: the very end of a scene, you didn't realize it

738
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:12,400
Speaker 3: was the end of the scene, but some different music

739
00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:14,960
Speaker 3: or some different sounds would start playing, And what that

740
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:17,880
Speaker 3: actually was was the intro into the next scene, and

741
00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 3: it's a way of leading you into it. And so

742
00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:22,000
Speaker 3: I actually did that in a few times where like

743
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 3: at the very end of a scene, the music starts

744
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:26,319
Speaker 3: to drop out, there's a little bit of talking, and

745
00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:28,080
Speaker 3: then a little bit of music or a beat starts

746
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:31,200
Speaker 3: coming in, and that's actually the beginning of the music

747
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:32,799
Speaker 3: for the next scene as you're moving in.

748
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 2: And that's the kind of practically subliminal clues that most

749
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:45,480
Speaker 2: listeners are not going to consciously pick up on, but

750
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:48,800
Speaker 2: subconsciously it's getting them prepped for what's next.

751
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:51,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I actually I find that what I was

752
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,719
Speaker 3: most interested in were the things you weren't going to notice,

753
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 3: the little swell of a frequency that comes up. I

754
00:42:57,640 --> 00:42:59,680
Speaker 3: did that in a few times where there's a frequency

755
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:01,880
Speaker 3: that just goes up as there's a climax, and you

756
00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 3: may not even hear it or notice it, but if

757
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:06,360
Speaker 3: it wasn't there, it wouldn't have the same impact.

758
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:08,799
Speaker 1: But like this, really you're gonna feel it.

759
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, yes, Okay, final question, who is Guy Kelly.

760
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,440
Speaker 3: I'm a lover, not a fighter. I'm a dad, I'm

761
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 3: a husband. I'm a person who cares about the world

762
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:31,160
Speaker 3: passionately and wants to try to do the right thing

763
00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:35,560
Speaker 3: most of the time, whatever that means. I think being

764
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 3: kind to people and helping them is the greatest thing

765
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 3: we can do, and I think that pretty much sums

766
00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:42,560
Speaker 3: me up.

767
00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:48,319
Speaker 2: Guy. It has been a pleasure talking with you as always.

768
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:52,520
Speaker 2: But what I want to know is where can we

769
00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:54,920
Speaker 2: find more of your work?

770
00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:58,120
Speaker 3: Well, if you want to go to my website, Guy

771
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:02,239
Speaker 3: Kelly dot com, that's g U y k E l

772
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:05,200
Speaker 3: l y dot com, you can find links to a

773
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:07,480
Speaker 3: lot of my music. I've produced a lot of music

774
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:10,000
Speaker 3: over the years under different artist names that you can

775
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:13,160
Speaker 3: find on streaming services. I've done a lot of design

776
00:44:13,200 --> 00:44:15,840
Speaker 3: work that you can see and can find links to

777
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,759
Speaker 3: all my socials and everything there. That's a great place

778
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:21,200
Speaker 3: to go. Be on the lookout. If you like the

779
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 3: music that you've heard in this podcast, you can find

780
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 3: a lot of that music on streaming services. We are

781
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:31,240
Speaker 3: collaborating for a soundtrack album. If it's not there already,

782
00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:33,359
Speaker 3: it will be very soon, but you can definitely find

783
00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:36,160
Speaker 3: the links for that at Guy Kelly dot com and

784
00:44:36,200 --> 00:44:39,240
Speaker 3: you'll be able to listen anywhere where you stream music.

785
00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:50,359
Speaker 2: So friends, thanks so much for listening for real. We

786
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:53,400
Speaker 2: really appreciate your attention both to this episode and of

787
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:59,279
Speaker 2: this whole podcast. Tune in next time when the homie

788
00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:04,319
Speaker 2: guy Kelly interviews yours truly and I try not to

789
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:07,359
Speaker 2: incriminate the hell out of myself, which is one of

790
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 2: my bad habits.

791
00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:11,280
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.

792
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:12,360
Speaker 3: Thank you,