1 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wik f Daily with 2 00:00:14,800 --> 00:00:18,479 Speaker 1: me your girl, Danielle Moody, recording from the home bunker. 3 00:00:19,160 --> 00:00:23,320 Speaker 1: I have a question to start out today's show. What 4 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: was the last time that any of you received a 5 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 1: tenth try at anything? You know, you get a first try, 6 00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: you get a second try, maybe sometimes you even get 7 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:41,000 Speaker 1: a third try. What was the last time? Somebody said 8 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:45,280 Speaker 1: the last nine, but here you go, here's number ten. 9 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that the answer is going to be. 10 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 2: Never. 11 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:56,040 Speaker 1: But if your name is Donald Trump, then you get 12 00:00:56,080 --> 00:01:00,640 Speaker 1: as many tries as there are humanly available, and even 13 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:05,679 Speaker 1: after that, we'll just keep manufacturing them. But Judge Merchant, 14 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:14,040 Speaker 1: the judge in the hush money bribery case, has now 15 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:18,479 Speaker 1: held Donald Trump in contempt of court for the tenth time. 16 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:23,119 Speaker 1: For the tenth time, Donald Trump has violated the gag order. 17 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 1: For the tenth time Donald Trump has violated a court order. 18 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 1: And Judge Marshan, you know, directly addressing Donald Trump, says, 19 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:39,760 Speaker 1: you know, I'm not basically above threatening jail time. And 20 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 1: here's my thing. Can we just stop with the fucking 21 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 1: threats and just get to the doing. And if you're 22 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 1: gonna say that, holding Donald Trump in prison would be 23 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 1: a logistical nightmare because of the Secret Service, because of this. 24 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:57,880 Speaker 1: Because of that, then I have another idea. Maybe you 25 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 1: start finding Donald Trump in a way that is actually 26 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 1: fucking painful and on par with however much money he 27 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:08,760 Speaker 1: lies about having in the bank. So we know that 28 00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:13,960 Speaker 1: the appeals judge in his you know, other fraud trial 29 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 1: with in terms of how he ballooned the costs of 30 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:21,799 Speaker 1: his real estate properties, he was supposed to pay out 31 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 1: half a billion dollars and there wasn't going to be 32 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 1: a bank that was going to give him that money. 33 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 1: And then, of course an appeals court comes back and 34 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:32,920 Speaker 1: they lower it and then he's able to pay it off. 35 00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 1: My thing is start making it actually fucking hurt, and 36 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 1: then maybe Donald Trump will shut the fuck up. So 37 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:44,320 Speaker 1: if for every time that he violates the court's gag order, 38 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:47,560 Speaker 1: it is going to cost him one hundred thousand dollars, 39 00:02:47,840 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 1: and we know that that is going to happen on 40 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:53,440 Speaker 1: a weekly basis, then you're talking about by the end 41 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 1: of the month him racking up somewhere between four hundred 42 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 1: and five hundred thousand dollars. That to me makes fucking sense. 43 00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:04,440 Speaker 1: But if you're just gonna roll out and say, oh, well, 44 00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:07,160 Speaker 1: I'm gonna find you one thousand dollars. What the fuck 45 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:12,040 Speaker 1: Donald Trump spends that at McDonald's for lunch. So I'm 46 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 1: just like, I'm tired of the consistent finger wagging at 47 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:22,639 Speaker 1: Donald Trump and the empty threats that are never going to, 48 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 1: you know, measure up to anything, or like the moments 49 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 1: that we think that the justice system has finally caught 50 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:30,640 Speaker 1: up to him, only to make an entire u turn 51 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:34,080 Speaker 1: and start the erase over again. I'm just fucking over 52 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 1: it because you all know that if it were any 53 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:39,960 Speaker 1: of us that were on trial, we would have been 54 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 1: in jail. Oh I don't know. Nine times ago people 55 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:46,360 Speaker 1: are thrown in contempt of court folks for showing up 56 00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: late to their trial by a few minutes. Do you 57 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:52,400 Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, in order to teach them a lesson. 58 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 1: So if you want to teach Donald Trump a lesson 59 00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 1: and it's too much of an obstacle to throw him 60 00:03:58,800 --> 00:04:01,400 Speaker 1: in jail, then I I say that you start making 61 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:05,560 Speaker 1: it financially painful for him to shut the fuck up. 62 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:11,680 Speaker 1: Like I you know it, just like in so many ways, 63 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 1: everything is just beyond exhaustion. I don't know what we 64 00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:19,479 Speaker 1: go beyond exhaustion. Is it burnout, is it a coma? 65 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:21,919 Speaker 1: I have no fucking idea, But I do know that 66 00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:25,720 Speaker 1: I'm completely and totally over every single one of these 67 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:28,799 Speaker 1: lawsuits that are never going to see any outcome before 68 00:04:28,880 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 1: twenty twenty four, the election. And the fact is that 69 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 1: I continue to say that the only thing that is 70 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: going to hold Donald Trump accountable are the American people 71 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:43,039 Speaker 1: voting to end his political career, to end the political party. Finally, 72 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 1: that's it. You know, After that, then the justice system 73 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 1: will be clear to actually treat Donald Trump the way 74 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 1: that he should be treated, because you won't be running 75 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:56,599 Speaker 1: for a political office and won't be able to say 76 00:04:56,800 --> 00:04:59,599 Speaker 1: that this is some type of political witch hunt. It'll 77 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:03,240 Speaker 1: just be another fucking old, privileged white dude on trial 78 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 1: for shit that shit caught up to him four decades ago. 79 00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 1: I digress, folks. Coming up next, I'm gonna be in 80 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:20,159 Speaker 1: conversation once again with friend of the show, and you 81 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 1: know someone who I think provides a great deal of 82 00:05:25,520 --> 00:05:30,040 Speaker 1: clarity to us, which is Sky Perriman, who is the 83 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:33,359 Speaker 1: CEO of Democracy Forward, is going to join me to 84 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: discuss you know, where we are right now, in this moment, 85 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:41,000 Speaker 1: as we make the slow march to the election, and 86 00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:44,479 Speaker 1: what they think is necessary to make the American people 87 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 1: aware that this election is not the most consequential, it 88 00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:51,640 Speaker 1: is going to be the last election of the United States, 89 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: if in fact people decide to either sit out or 90 00:05:54,640 --> 00:06:01,840 Speaker 1: vote for Donald Trump. That conversation is coming up next, folks. 91 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:05,200 Speaker 1: I am so excited to welcome back to ook f Daily, 92 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:11,039 Speaker 1: the president and CEO of Democracy Forward, Sky Perryman, to 93 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: give us kind of you know, Sky, Democracy Forward. What 94 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:18,159 Speaker 1: is it's kind of like Democracy Forward? Question mark. I 95 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:21,080 Speaker 1: feel like you need you need to add to the 96 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 1: to the organization website and branding. But I don't know 97 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:30,040 Speaker 1: what's happening. I don't you know, you tell me because 98 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 1: between right now, following the Supreme Court, following h Donald 99 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:40,200 Speaker 1: Trump's cases before the Supreme Court in Manhattan, you know, 100 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:44,160 Speaker 1: and and following what is happening with the Biden campaign, 101 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:47,640 Speaker 1: It's just it's a lot. So I want to start 102 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:51,560 Speaker 1: off with asking you what are you all keeping track of? 103 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:55,599 Speaker 1: What do we need to be you know, honestly paying 104 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:59,039 Speaker 1: attention to because as of the time of this recording, 105 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 1: we are are less than two hundred days away from 106 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:06,479 Speaker 1: election day, which every day I'm not going to provide 107 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:08,400 Speaker 1: my audience with a countdown because I don't want them 108 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 1: to lose their mind. But it's wild where we are, 109 00:07:12,120 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 1: So talk to me. Where is democracy forward and where 110 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: are you? Well? 111 00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 2: We are both fighting for democracy and fighting to move 112 00:07:20,200 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 2: the country forward, not backward, and that is a real 113 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:26,960 Speaker 2: fight right now. So thanks for having me on. I 114 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 2: think you know, in terms of what to pay attention to, 115 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 2: I always like to ground ourselves in what we know, 116 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:36,880 Speaker 2: which is that the vast majority of the American people 117 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 2: are pretty fair minded people, that they believe in the 118 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 2: promise of democracy. They may not agree on everything, that 119 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 2: there are some basic things that we believe in the 120 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 2: promis of democracy. That our country has changed a lot 121 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 2: since it was founded, and that there are a lot 122 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 2: more people that look like you, there are a lot 123 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:55,280 Speaker 2: more people that look like me, There are a lot 124 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 2: more people that look like all of our friends and neighbors. 125 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 2: And that we are a real multi race, multi generational, 126 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 2: diverse society. And that there is a movement to seek 127 00:08:06,080 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 2: to push us back to a time where that was 128 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 2: not the case, or where power structures sought to undermine 129 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:15,520 Speaker 2: the ability of so many people to be able to 130 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:19,120 Speaker 2: determine who governs them, to be able to determine their 131 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 2: lives and their futures. And so that's what we're fighting for. 132 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 2: So just yesterday I was at the Supreme Court where 133 00:08:25,560 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 2: the Court heard a case concerning access to abortion in 134 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 2: emergency situations, with people who literally go into an emergency 135 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 2: room with life and health threatening conditions. This extremism has 136 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:44,960 Speaker 2: gone so far extreme that we are having to basically 137 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:48,440 Speaker 2: beg at the Supreme Court as women to be treated 138 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:51,839 Speaker 2: as fully human to be able to approach an emergency 139 00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:55,000 Speaker 2: room like everyone else in this country and be given 140 00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:58,560 Speaker 2: the care that we need in emergent situations. And that 141 00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 2: we saw that on display yesterday at the Supreme Court. 142 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 2: There was literally a debate about how many organs a 143 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:08,439 Speaker 2: woman has that needs to be threatened before she can 144 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,839 Speaker 2: obtain an IDAHO, for instance, the care that she needs. 145 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:14,880 Speaker 2: We have women in this country being life flighted out 146 00:09:14,880 --> 00:09:17,199 Speaker 2: of hospitals because they cannot get the care to save 147 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:20,000 Speaker 2: their health and their life or even their fertility. And 148 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 2: that was yesterday at the Court, and then today at 149 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:26,800 Speaker 2: the Court we have seen questioning that suggests that there 150 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:30,280 Speaker 2: is a movement in this country that believes that a 151 00:09:30,360 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 2: person who has held political office can engage in all 152 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 2: sorts of unlawful activity and it's just their prerogative. And 153 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:41,240 Speaker 2: that is really not what a democracy is. So we 154 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 2: are watching a lot. We're watching what's in the courts, 155 00:09:44,679 --> 00:09:48,320 Speaker 2: we're watching what is in communities across the country. But 156 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 2: we're also watching, you know, the hope that we can 157 00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 2: have in this moment, if we all use our lives 158 00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:56,600 Speaker 2: and if we all do what we can in this 159 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:01,760 Speaker 2: moment to say that this narrow, rigid, back words vision 160 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 2: for the country does not represent you, it doesn't represent me, 161 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 2: and it doesn't represent the vast majority of people in 162 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:09,240 Speaker 2: this country. And we need to use all the tools 163 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 2: we have to fight back. So I'll start maybe I'll 164 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 2: just start with that, that's a lot. 165 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:16,880 Speaker 1: It is. It is a lot, you know, and it's 166 00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: and it's hard. I think it's hard even for us 167 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 1: whose job it is right to pay attention to all 168 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:25,600 Speaker 1: of the things that are happening and to try and 169 00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:29,439 Speaker 1: make them digestible, to try and encourage people to engage 170 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:33,680 Speaker 1: that for lay people to understand and keep track, right, 171 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:38,040 Speaker 1: it's nearly impossible I want to go to the Idaho 172 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:40,840 Speaker 1: case and lift that up that you were just discussing, 173 00:10:40,880 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 1: because I have to tell you that listening to the 174 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 1: five men on the Supreme Court, particularly Justice Alito, just 175 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: glossing over the health, the safety and well being of 176 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 1: women and pregnant people is wild to me. And I 177 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: honestly think you know, and I you know this is 178 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:03,480 Speaker 1: me saying this and not you, that cruelty really is 179 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:09,280 Speaker 1: the point, right, Because if a group of doctors recently 180 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 1: sent an open letter to the Supreme Court saying, how 181 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:16,680 Speaker 1: many seces of blood does a woman have to lose 182 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:21,959 Speaker 1: before we can proceed with an abortion? How much oxygen 183 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 1: right to your point, how many organs need to be 184 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 1: in failure? Right? How far along does the sepsist need 185 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:32,240 Speaker 1: to be? These are people that went to law school, 186 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:34,960 Speaker 1: they didn't go to medical school. They didn't swear an 187 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:37,640 Speaker 1: oath to do no harm, because all they're doing is harm. 188 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:42,000 Speaker 1: So I wonder when we're thinking about how we move 189 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:46,679 Speaker 1: democracy forward sky and democracy not only does it it's 190 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 1: not stuck, it's being rolled backwards. What does it look 191 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:54,680 Speaker 1: like in the next you know, less than two hundred 192 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 1: days to galvanize people to the severity of the situation 193 00:11:59,840 --> 00:12:00,600 Speaker 1: that we're in. 194 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 2: Well, I'm glad you asked that question. I'll just say, 195 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:06,160 Speaker 2: you know, in the in the Iaho case, I'm a 196 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 2: counsel for the nation's medical associations doctors from her doctors 197 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 2: to obg I N's to internal medicine physicians that are 198 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 2: coming to the court to say this is really contrary 199 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 2: to our medical ethics and it's not why we got 200 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 2: into this business, and it's not the way you treat patients, 201 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:26,839 Speaker 2: and there's real harm. But to your question about galvanization 202 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:29,320 Speaker 2: of people, I think we need to be able to 203 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 2: look at this reality in the face and to not blink. 204 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:36,760 Speaker 2: And so it's telling stories about what we saw yesterday 205 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:40,080 Speaker 2: and not trying to make people feel better about it. 206 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:43,320 Speaker 2: I was in the courts in the courtroom watching this 207 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:48,080 Speaker 2: exchange about how severe something needs to be. Are people 208 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:51,920 Speaker 2: looking down at their papers on the dais when when 209 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:56,120 Speaker 2: Justice Sodomayor was reading the accounts that have been filed 210 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:58,360 Speaker 2: with the court. And we need to be able to 211 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:01,360 Speaker 2: sit in this reality and not really. In twenty twenty one, 212 00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:05,080 Speaker 2: the United States was added to a list of backsliding 213 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:08,440 Speaker 2: democracies in the world, and we're the only country that's 214 00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 2: not part of the Global South, and that was not 215 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 2: a former USSR affiliate country that is on that list. 216 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,320 Speaker 2: We are a complete outlier for that list. And that 217 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:22,480 Speaker 2: was the state of democracy in twenty twenty one before 218 00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:26,520 Speaker 2: we started looking at the threats and seeing the threats 219 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:28,599 Speaker 2: we have today. One of the things we need to 220 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:32,000 Speaker 2: galvanize around that. If your listeners are tuning in, please 221 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:35,440 Speaker 2: go google it, learn about it, talk about it is 222 00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:38,760 Speaker 2: something called Project twenty twenty five YEP, which is a 223 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 2: project that has been put out. It is nine hundred pages. 224 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 2: I have read it, so I'm happy to come on 225 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:45,600 Speaker 2: and talk about that at some point in more detail. 226 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:50,080 Speaker 2: But it is a man asserted effort, a manifesto, a 227 00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:53,080 Speaker 2: concerted effort of a society that they want a society 228 00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 2: where we are not prioritizing our climate, we're not prioritizing 229 00:13:56,640 --> 00:14:00,960 Speaker 2: our workers in our workforce. We're criminalizing women's health on 230 00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:04,520 Speaker 2: a national basis, as opposed to now where we have 231 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:07,040 Speaker 2: a lot of states that are seeking to criminalize women's health. 232 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:10,400 Speaker 2: And all I could think about yesterday in the courtroom, 233 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:13,280 Speaker 2: that's how powerful it was that the United States was 234 00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 2: who was there, represented by our Solicitor General was there, 235 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 2: and they were there on the side of the federal government, 236 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 2: and they were there on the side of women who 237 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 2: need emergency care. And that doesn't happen right if we're 238 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 2: looking at Project twenty twenty five. We don't have that 239 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:36,000 Speaker 2: Solicitor General, and we don't have the United States government, 240 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,400 Speaker 2: at least the federal government putting its full full force 241 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:43,040 Speaker 2: behind some of these issues. And so I think the 242 00:14:43,080 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 2: stakes are really high. But for galvanizing, we've got to 243 00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:47,640 Speaker 2: be able to sit in this reality. We've got to 244 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:49,920 Speaker 2: be able to have these conversations and talk to people 245 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 2: about it. And if it makes you uncomfortable, it should, 246 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:56,040 Speaker 2: and that discomfort should get you motivated to do anything 247 00:14:56,120 --> 00:14:59,720 Speaker 2: you can do at this moment in our country. 248 00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 1: Let's switch gears to the presidential immunity case, which is 249 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 1: extraordinarily dangerous. I think that sky it goes beyond just 250 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:20,240 Speaker 1: dangerous for democracy. What the Trump lawyers are arguing is 251 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 1: that presidents are absolutely one hundred percent above the law. 252 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:28,119 Speaker 1: And I thought about something before we even started recording, 253 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 1: and I said, my god, how bleak of the times 254 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:34,800 Speaker 1: that we are living in. With the argument that the 255 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:38,160 Speaker 1: Trump lawyers are putting forward basically, the president of the 256 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:40,560 Speaker 1: United States could kill the first lady in the White 257 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:46,160 Speaker 1: House and nothing would happen to them, could order the 258 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 1: Secret Service protection to kill the first lady in the 259 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 1: White House and in less according to the Trump attorneys, 260 00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 1: they were convicted under impeachment, and then it went to 261 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 1: a lower court and a court isci you know, it 262 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:05,280 Speaker 1: would basically be okay, your thoughts. 263 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:08,400 Speaker 2: Well, I think this is one of the most critical 264 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 2: representations of how this moment that we're in the country 265 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 2: where you have you know, one day, we're debating about 266 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 2: how many organs women have to lose at the Supreme Court. 267 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:20,640 Speaker 2: At the other day, we're hearing arguments about how a 268 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:24,800 Speaker 2: country that was founded on the idea that there are 269 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 2: no kings and queens, on the idea that no one 270 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:32,160 Speaker 2: is above the law, we're now in a situation where 271 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:35,040 Speaker 2: we're having and seeing this being given, you know, and 272 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:39,600 Speaker 2: seeing this extremism. So, you know, I think this is 273 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:41,960 Speaker 2: definitely something to pay attention to. But I want to 274 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:44,600 Speaker 2: make sure your listeners because we've been talking with a 275 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 2: lot of media and you know, everybody's very they're following this, 276 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:52,400 Speaker 2: They're following the trial in Manhattan. That's very important and 277 00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 2: it symbolizes where we are in the country. But you know, 278 00:16:56,640 --> 00:17:00,800 Speaker 2: last year we had over four thousand fans and communities 279 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:04,560 Speaker 2: throughout the country. We have access to healthcare issues. There 280 00:17:04,600 --> 00:17:07,399 Speaker 2: are still people that are making such low wages that 281 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 2: they can't put food on their table, and the price 282 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:13,359 Speaker 2: of food is where it is. And so I just 283 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:18,080 Speaker 2: want to also ground us in not falling for thinking 284 00:17:18,119 --> 00:17:22,280 Speaker 2: about the very tip of the headline and not really 285 00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:25,160 Speaker 2: looking at how we can be part of a change 286 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 2: and holding people accountable to the American people, not just 287 00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 2: on one or two issues, but on all the issues 288 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:35,760 Speaker 2: that are so critical and so intertwined and under attack 289 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 2: at this moment. So that's one thing I'll say. But 290 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 2: I do think you know, the other thing we know 291 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 2: from history is that when democracies fall, you can go 292 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 2: look at it. They often fall because people take for 293 00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 2: granted they think, well, that could never happen here. And 294 00:17:55,400 --> 00:17:57,840 Speaker 2: so I really want your listeners to just and I 295 00:17:57,880 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 2: think you do a good job of it on your show. 296 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 2: Oh but we've got to come to the reality. This 297 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:06,520 Speaker 2: is what was happening in the Supreme Court today, this 298 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:09,640 Speaker 2: is what people are suggesting, and we had questioning from 299 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 2: the justices suggesting that you know, if you hold the 300 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 2: president accountable to the laws, well then the president may 301 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:18,640 Speaker 2: not we may not want to like move on from 302 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:21,920 Speaker 2: a peaceful transition of power. That is, you know that 303 00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 2: this is the kind of situation that we're seeing, which 304 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 2: is just an extremism from from some of the justices 305 00:18:28,760 --> 00:18:31,119 Speaker 2: as well as from Council in that case. And so 306 00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 2: we have power in this country. We don't have to 307 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 2: stick with courts that are rigged. We don't have to 308 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:40,560 Speaker 2: stick with a rig gain. We don't have to coordinate 309 00:18:40,720 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 2: our leaders as kings and queens, and we need to 310 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:47,480 Speaker 2: be thinking about in using all the tools our democracy provides. 311 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:52,199 Speaker 2: It's voting, but it's being informed, it's advocating. We're going 312 00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 2: to be in court, you know, arguing for the right things, 313 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 2: but it's we need to be using all of those 314 00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:57,960 Speaker 2: tools at this time. 315 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:02,160 Speaker 1: Do you think Sky right now that the average American 316 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:06,560 Speaker 1: is paying attention to the things outside, Like you said 317 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: of the tip of the headline, I don't even know 318 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:12,400 Speaker 1: if they're paying attention to the headline. So I'm wondering 319 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:17,119 Speaker 1: because like to me, everything is about civic engagement and 320 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: also education. But the Republicans have made it clear exactly 321 00:19:22,880 --> 00:19:25,359 Speaker 1: what it is that they want to do. I've talked 322 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:28,360 Speaker 1: about Project twenty twenty five for the last year on 323 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:31,359 Speaker 1: this show. Yep, you know, to raise the alarm and 324 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 1: say it's not something that they're doing behind closed doors, 325 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 1: like it's on their website. You can download it, it's free, 326 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:41,600 Speaker 1: and so I just wonder do you think Americans are 327 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:44,879 Speaker 1: paying attention. Do you think that they recognize that this 328 00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 1: election really is the most consequential election or have we 329 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:55,000 Speaker 1: been saying that for too long that it doesn't resonate anymore. 330 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 2: Well, I think what we know is that people are 331 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:04,560 Speaker 2: concerned and concerned about issues. So they're concerned about how 332 00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:08,919 Speaker 2: they're going to afford their life, what the economy is 333 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:11,600 Speaker 2: going to be, like, they're concerned about healthcare, they're concerned 334 00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 2: about their kids' education. We know that on those issues, 335 00:20:16,080 --> 00:20:18,240 Speaker 2: and what we've got to do is to make sure 336 00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:21,480 Speaker 2: that we're educating people about this movement that is afoot 337 00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:25,560 Speaker 2: in the country. The Project twenty twenty five early represents 338 00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 2: this highly coordinated far right movement that is finding common 339 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:35,520 Speaker 2: cause with other interests and that seeking to normalize this 340 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:37,639 Speaker 2: five alarm fire. I mean, I'm going to say, you know, 341 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 2: the democracy has been under threat for many years for 342 00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 2: their entire existence for many people who aren't included in 343 00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:53,680 Speaker 2: our nation's founding, and it has been an urgent matter 344 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 2: that needs to be addressed, and it remains urgent. But 345 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:01,560 Speaker 2: what we're seeing now is just on on a wider scale. 346 00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:06,920 Speaker 2: Were even even rights of people who have enjoyed more 347 00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:10,720 Speaker 2: privileged throughout the country, even rights of people those are 348 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,880 Speaker 2: now being threatened, and we're now seeing even you know, 349 00:21:14,440 --> 00:21:16,760 Speaker 2: this is just a much It's a much more extreme 350 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:19,159 Speaker 2: version of a lot of a lot of the fights. 351 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:22,000 Speaker 2: And so I think that paying attention really matters. But 352 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:25,719 Speaker 2: educating and making sure that we all understand how this 353 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 2: affects our lives. Dobbs has been devastating. One of the 354 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:33,840 Speaker 2: things that it did, though, was it has forced people 355 00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:36,080 Speaker 2: to come to grips in many ways with what this 356 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 2: really means, as the harrowing accounts that Justice Sotomayor and 357 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:42,159 Speaker 2: others were referring to yesterday at the argument. And so 358 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:44,120 Speaker 2: I think we really need to be able to connect 359 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:48,159 Speaker 2: for people where the threats to our democracy are coming from. 360 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:51,440 Speaker 2: And then what tools we have to push back. 361 00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 1: I think that it is incredibly important to remind people 362 00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 1: of the two that we do have tools, right, Like, 363 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:03,720 Speaker 1: That's the point of my show and my work is 364 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 1: to remind people that they still have power, even though 365 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:10,199 Speaker 1: they may find themselves in a really dark moment and 366 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:13,639 Speaker 1: place right now in our democracy. You know, just a 367 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:19,320 Speaker 1: last question for you for those people who feel extraordinarily 368 00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:24,840 Speaker 1: bleak right, who are thinking and I they're all over 369 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:29,040 Speaker 1: my social media page about not voting or not voting 370 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 1: for democracy, and they're serious about it. They say they 371 00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:37,119 Speaker 1: can't stomach it. What do you say, Well, look. 372 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:41,159 Speaker 2: Our country is only as strong and our democracy is 373 00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 2: only as real as the people who are going to 374 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:47,879 Speaker 2: keep it that way. And so whether that is volunteering 375 00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,639 Speaker 2: in your local community, signing up to vote, you know, 376 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 2: getting involved civically listening to the show and then talking 377 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 2: to three friends about these issues. Being willing to sit 378 00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,240 Speaker 2: with the discomfort and the injustice at this moment and 379 00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:01,879 Speaker 2: to voice and to do something about it. It is 380 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:05,960 Speaker 2: going to take all of us. And we have seen 381 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 2: in prior times where people thought, well, it couldn't get that, 382 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 2: you know, it couldn't get worse. I mean, we saw 383 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:14,960 Speaker 2: you know before it was always well everyone was saying 384 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:17,960 Speaker 2: Roby Wade is under threat, and it was like, well, 385 00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:20,320 Speaker 2: that's really not going to happen. Well, you know it has, 386 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:22,680 Speaker 2: and we're now having debates at the US Supreme Court 387 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:25,040 Speaker 2: about how many women have to die and how many 388 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:28,040 Speaker 2: organs women have to lose in order to get healthcare. 389 00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 2: And so I think that we know that these are 390 00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 2: matters that concern the well being of people in communities, 391 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,680 Speaker 2: and there should you know, we can't be apathetic and 392 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:42,880 Speaker 2: maybe that there's something that motivates you. There's a lot 393 00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:45,399 Speaker 2: of ways that people can get involved, and not everybody 394 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 2: needs to be Not everybody's an activist. Not everybody's going 395 00:23:48,119 --> 00:23:50,160 Speaker 2: to show up to a rally or hold a sign. 396 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:52,880 Speaker 2: Not everybody wants to run for office. Not everybody wants 397 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,120 Speaker 2: to be a lawyer, not everybody wants to be a journalist. 398 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 2: But there are things that we can do in our 399 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 2: individual lives. Libraries are under attack, schools are under attack, 400 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,119 Speaker 2: public servants are under attack. You know, find a way 401 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:09,280 Speaker 2: in your community, in your localized setting to get involved 402 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,480 Speaker 2: and get involved civically and to see the people in 403 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:15,000 Speaker 2: communities that are at stake, and then we have to 404 00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:17,960 Speaker 2: use our power to try to make things better. And 405 00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:20,840 Speaker 2: one of those powers is obviously getting involved in making 406 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 2: sure that we're voting and that we're showing up for democracy. 407 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,159 Speaker 2: But there's a lot of other things as well. So 408 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:28,040 Speaker 2: I would just say, you know, I couldn't do my 409 00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:32,040 Speaker 2: job if I didn't have hope. And what gives me 410 00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,600 Speaker 2: hope is seeing the people yesterday. I mean, we had 411 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,640 Speaker 2: doctors from across the country, patients from across the country 412 00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:41,439 Speaker 2: at the Supreme Court demanding more. We see this in 413 00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:44,600 Speaker 2: schools across the country. Is people that are saying, you know, 414 00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 2: democracy is not going to fall on my watch, and 415 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 2: I'm going to do what I can in this moment. 416 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,040 Speaker 2: I had a cab driver the other day that said 417 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:56,280 Speaker 2: to me he was a former civil servant. He's retired, 418 00:24:56,560 --> 00:25:01,119 Speaker 2: he drives in retirement, and he wanted to talk. We 419 00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:03,600 Speaker 2: drove past the Washington Monument. He wanted to talk about 420 00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:05,600 Speaker 2: our country, and he said, you know, now is the 421 00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:08,200 Speaker 2: time that good people need to come to the aid 422 00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:11,840 Speaker 2: of their country. And that was a when he was 423 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:14,679 Speaker 2: when he was in civil service in the civil rights movement. 424 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:18,520 Speaker 2: This was something and in the Vietnam War that people said, 425 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:21,439 Speaker 2: and he said that it was a good saying for today, 426 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:23,919 Speaker 2: and I think it is now is the time that 427 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:26,360 Speaker 2: good people need to come to the aid of their country. 428 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:29,360 Speaker 2: And so thanks for having me on, and we all 429 00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:30,720 Speaker 2: got our hat to hold on to that home. 430 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:35,159 Speaker 1: Yes we are. Thank you, Skuy. Always appreciate you, Thank you. 431 00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:43,160 Speaker 1: That is it for me today. Dear friends on woke 432 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 1: ay app as always, Power to the people and to 433 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 1: all the people. Power, get woke and stay woke as fuck.