Speaker 1: The following is a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. Are you ready for
Speaker 1: a break? Yes? Are you ready for a break? Absolutely
Speaker 1: ready for a break? Yeah, and so much for that.
Speaker 1: It's time for The Break on Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: with Nick Eatman, David Hellman, and bar Garcia and Derek Eagleton.
Speaker 1: It is Wednesday, April twenty fourth, twenty nineteen, Season fifteen,
Speaker 1: episode number six. Welcome to another edition of The Break.
Speaker 1: We're live from the s WBC Mortgage Studios at the
Speaker 1: Star and this Draft Week, Cowboys twenty nineteen NFL Draft
Speaker 1: is upon us. It starts tomorrow night. We'll have wall
Speaker 1: to wall coverage for you guys across all of our channels,
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys dot Com, Cowboys Mobile, Cowboys Connected TV App,
Speaker 1: basically everywhere you can go to get content. We'll be
Speaker 1: there and we'll be giving you guys wall to wall coverage.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the show, Nick, Dave in Spanish and in
Speaker 1: Spanish were doing wall to wall in Spanish. I don't
Speaker 1: know about wall to wall as far as I can reach,
Speaker 1: you know, I can't reach both sides of the wall.
Speaker 1: Giving us some content we'll have some stuff some most
Speaker 1: Cowboys for those of you that don't know, go check
Speaker 1: out some most Cowboys dot com. You can also get
Speaker 1: access to that Spanish content on our mobile app, Cowboys Mobile.
Speaker 1: How's everybody this morning? Great? From this mid day? Good?
Speaker 1: We ready for draft? Yes? Yeah, you've been working on
Speaker 1: this for a while, Dave. It's like Christmas. I love.
Speaker 1: This is one of the best weeks of the year.
Speaker 1: I think this is my three favorite days that don't
Speaker 1: actually involve football being played. Okay, yeah, yeah, not the games, No,
Speaker 1: I mean football season in general. Labor Day to Christmas
Speaker 1: is better than the rest of the year always. But
Speaker 1: this is nice, good. So let's talk a little bit
Speaker 1: about draft. And I wanted to take it a little
Speaker 1: different direction, seeing is this is not the Draft show,
Speaker 1: so I don't expect that you're going to get a
Speaker 1: whole ton of you know, here's who the Cowboys should
Speaker 1: be looking at in the sixth round. But what I
Speaker 1: wanted to do I actually saw this article this week,
Speaker 1: and actually I was listening to our sister station in
Speaker 1: W one five three of the fan here in Dallas,
Speaker 1: and they were doing a similar thing, but there was
Speaker 1: it was all based on this article that I that
Speaker 1: that I read that Bucky Brooks produced on NFL dot com.
Speaker 1: And the contention, the whole contention of the article was
Speaker 1: that based on his experience and the other guy who
Speaker 1: works with Daniel Jeremiah, who's also a former scout, both
Speaker 1: of them being former scouts, Um, they kind of came
Speaker 1: up with this formula of what they said a super
Speaker 1: Bowl contending team should be. Here the ingredients that a
Speaker 1: super Bowl contending team should be in today's NFL. UM.
Speaker 1: And so I wanted to talk about number one, that
Speaker 1: formula that they put together. But then also as a
Speaker 1: part of the article, they named five teams in the
Speaker 1: NFL that they felt like our super Bowl contender ready
Speaker 1: based upon this formula, one of which being the twenty
Speaker 1: nineteen Dallas Cowboys. And they gave some names as to
Speaker 1: some of the ingredients that they thought kind of made
Speaker 1: up this whole, uh, this whole you know, concoction of
Speaker 1: what a team would look like. Um, so we'll talk
Speaker 1: about that as well. So let's start first with kind
Speaker 1: of his overall idea of what should be in a
Speaker 1: Super Bowl contending team. And I want to get your
Speaker 1: opinions on whether you think, what do you think of
Speaker 1: the actual setup? Right? So he says Super Bowl contending
Speaker 1: teams should one have a franchise quarterback. Number two should
Speaker 1: have three offensive linemen. And when I mean by offensive line,
Speaker 1: three really good offensive linemen. He calls them blue players.
Speaker 1: These are players that you would consider top ten to
Speaker 1: fifteen to twenty depending on the position in the NFL.
Speaker 1: But three offensive linemen, three offensive playmakers. And by the way,
Speaker 1: you can't have multiple guys in You can't have a
Speaker 1: guy in two different positions. So if your quarterback is
Speaker 1: your quarterback, you can't consider him one of the playmakers. Right,
Speaker 1: Does that makes sense? Then you have two pass rushers,
Speaker 1: and then you finalize finally, have three defensive playmakers. Do
Speaker 1: you guys think of that? I think that seems like
Speaker 1: a bit much. Do you think that. Do you argue
Speaker 1: the point of whether you need some of those some
Speaker 1: of those people, I mean on three playmakers on the
Speaker 1: offense outside the quarterback and the three offensive linemen. Yes,
Speaker 1: so three skill positions that are playmakers, and then on
Speaker 1: defense three playmakers that are not your two pass rushers. Okay,
Speaker 1: I don't like to be that guy that always just
Speaker 1: disagrees with stuff. But I just think that it's a
Speaker 1: very black and white way to look at it. I
Speaker 1: guarantee you there are people listening to this show right
Speaker 1: now that are like, what about the coach? Where does
Speaker 1: that factor in on all this thing? But I, you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: those things sound pretty good. The difference for me, it'll
Speaker 1: start with number one, the franchise quarterback, because how many
Speaker 1: franchise quarterbacks are there? You know, like, is my franchise
Speaker 1: quarterback better than your friend? I mean, you're calling Kirk
Speaker 1: Cousins a franchise quarterback in Minnesota because you're paying for it,
Speaker 1: but he's not helping you win like Tom Brady is
Speaker 1: as a franchise quarterback. So I yeah, you knows that
Speaker 1: a franchise quarterback. Let me give you let me give
Speaker 1: you some perspective on that. Of the five teams he mentioned,
Speaker 1: he mentioned the Patriots and this is where you get interesting,
Speaker 1: the Cleveland Browns, the Los Angeles Rams, the Dallas Cowboys,
Speaker 1: and the Chicago Bears. Four of those five are not
Speaker 1: considered top three to top five quarterbacks in the NFL. However,
Speaker 1: he identifies them as franchise quarterbacks, which makes me think
Speaker 1: his definition of a franchise quarterback is not necessarily that
Speaker 1: as much as it is who you have a guy
Speaker 1: that you know is your guy at quarterback, whether that's
Speaker 1: whether he has flaws, we know that he has flaws,
Speaker 1: but he is your guy. Like this is a guy
Speaker 1: you're committed to and you feel like buying large he
Speaker 1: can get you to the promised Land, Right, He's gotta
Speaker 1: have pieces, Maybe that's the truth, but he's just a
Speaker 1: quarterback that you feel like you're committed to and you
Speaker 1: think he can get you there with the right things
Speaker 1: around him. Yeah, and that I mean that conversation has
Speaker 1: become so skewed and like it's it's a meme at
Speaker 1: this point, like the old, you know, decade old joke
Speaker 1: about is Joe Flacco elite? Like you know, is a
Speaker 1: franchise quarterback a guy that can make every play on
Speaker 1: his own and win your games that you're not supposed
Speaker 1: to win and he will keep your rell that no
Speaker 1: matter what. Or is a franchise quarterback a guy that
Speaker 1: you trust to steer your organization in the right direction.
Speaker 1: I think it's a wide definition and not everybody has
Speaker 1: the same one, which is why it's perfectly logical for
Speaker 1: me to think that Daniel Jeremiah considers Dak a franchise quarterback,
Speaker 1: and a bunch of people listening to this don't. Um.
Speaker 1: But the recipe, I mean, that's that's not that's not
Speaker 1: groundbreaking stuff. You need a quarterback, You need to protect
Speaker 1: your quarterback. Your quarterback needs weapons to get the ball
Speaker 1: to You have to rush the passer. You have to
Speaker 1: have guys that can make plays on the ball when
Speaker 1: the ball comes out, especially in the stands. It sounds
Speaker 1: like a good football team, and a good football team
Speaker 1: is usually a Super Bowl contenter. So yeah, he's breaking
Speaker 1: it down and it's it's April, and he's doing his
Speaker 1: homework and I get it, like that's that's a that's
Speaker 1: a well written thing. And he's now identifying teams that
Speaker 1: are on there that that's awesome. Um. Yeah, I agree
Speaker 1: with Dave. It's not really groundbreaking. But I do think
Speaker 1: coaching is a part of it. Um. And then there's
Speaker 1: some intangibles thing too, you know, kicker and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: You got to have a guy that's not gonna you know,
Speaker 1: I don't know if kicker has to make you elite,
Speaker 1: but you can lose games if you you know, the
Speaker 1: Rams certainly got into the Super Bowl because they had
Speaker 1: a kicker, you know, so there's some other factors there,
Speaker 1: But that's interesting. I think it just starts with a quarterback.
Speaker 1: I mean, like you said, is this quarterback elite? Is
Speaker 1: he good enough to get there? But if you've got
Speaker 1: those three offensive linemen and three playmakers on offense, and
Speaker 1: then and then your defense is doing its job. You know,
Speaker 1: I don't even know how if you even need a
Speaker 1: franchise quarterback. You just need a quarterback that's not going
Speaker 1: to mess it up. I actually I haven't read this article,
Speaker 1: so I don't know for sure, but I can lump
Speaker 1: it into two different categories. Is there's the teams. There's
Speaker 1: and there's the New England's of the world and the
Speaker 1: New Orleans. And New Orleans has a hell of a roster.
Speaker 1: Don't get me wrong. At Green Bay. I know the
Speaker 1: Packers won six games last year. I don't care. There's
Speaker 1: that category of quarterback where you're in the conversation no
Speaker 1: matter what Seattle now. And then there's a group of
Speaker 1: teams and the ones you listed come to mind of
Speaker 1: you've got all the pieces, and enough of it is
Speaker 1: cheap that you've got the cap space that it makes sense,
Speaker 1: and I don't like to think of it in terms
Speaker 1: of like a one off. I mean, you know, the
Speaker 1: Saints probably should have been in the super Bowl, and
Speaker 1: fluke circumstances kept them out, and that happens every year.
Speaker 1: This is such a parody driven league. I mean, you
Speaker 1: know Dez caught it right or even you know the
Speaker 1: Packers won that game and then they're up twenty points
Speaker 1: in the fourth quarter and they don't go to the
Speaker 1: super Bowl. Like I prefer to think of it in
Speaker 1: a two three year window, and I think the teams
Speaker 1: you listed are all set up to be very successful
Speaker 1: in this two three year window, and I definitely think
Speaker 1: the Cowboys are one of them. And I think the
Speaker 1: quarterback in the head coach you mentioned the head coach,
Speaker 1: I think those are the two parts to me that
Speaker 1: can affect the rest of the list. Depending on how
Speaker 1: good they are, you may have to have less of
Speaker 1: these other parts. If you have a Tom Brady and
Speaker 1: a Belichick together, then to me, although he makes the
Speaker 1: arguments that they have all those other pieces, I think
Speaker 1: all those other pieces would be moderate pieces on other teams.
Speaker 1: But because you've got such a great head coach, in
Speaker 1: my opinion, first, and then you have a great quarterback.
Speaker 1: It allows you to get away with using lesser players
Speaker 1: in some those other roles and you're still able to
Speaker 1: win super Bowls. And I think what Dave was saying
Speaker 1: is there's a few of those teams with those quarterbacks
Speaker 1: like that that can do that. Right The Saints, though,
Speaker 1: to me, seem are they on that list? Actually they're
Speaker 1: on the list of teams that are close but not
Speaker 1: quite there. And his whole argument with them was they
Speaker 1: don't have the offensive line. They don't have three of
Speaker 1: those guys, which when we get into ours a little bit,
Speaker 1: I think you can start making some arguments whether the
Speaker 1: Cowboys have right now as we stand, do they have
Speaker 1: three great offensive linemen? Do they have three guys that
Speaker 1: at their positions are considered across the league some of
Speaker 1: the best. And I don't know if you can make
Speaker 1: that argument right now, but we'll get into that a
Speaker 1: little bit, can I will? Okay, so good, let's let's
Speaker 1: have that conversation and let's talk right about these different
Speaker 1: positions on the Cowboys franchise. Quarterback obviously, he says, daku
Speaker 1: three offensive linemen. Tyrn Smith Zach Martin, Travis fred Fred,
Speaker 1: Travis Frederick. Obviously the question mark there is Travis Frederick.
Speaker 1: Offensive playmakers, he says Zeke Amari Cooper and Jason Witten,
Speaker 1: which I thought was a bit curious, but we'll talk
Speaker 1: about that. Two pass rushers obviously DeMarcus Lawrence and Robert Quinn.
Speaker 1: They have other guys that could potentially step up, so
Speaker 1: I think this is an area that probably makes some sense. Um.
Speaker 1: And then three defensive playmakers Jalen Smith, Layton Vander esh
Speaker 1: and he throws in Byron Jones. Barron Jones a good player.
Speaker 1: I don't know if he's a playmaker. He's not a playmaker.
Speaker 1: He prevents plays, which is really important at that position,
Speaker 1: but he's not making plays right now. And I think
Speaker 1: that's what the hole, not the hold up, but I
Speaker 1: think that's what the hesitation is to pay him a
Speaker 1: lot of money. But really good player though, And he
Speaker 1: got into the the Pro Bowl without an interception, which
Speaker 1: is which is unique, you know, for this team. But
Speaker 1: I don't know if he's a playmaker, but I you know,
Speaker 1: that's that's still I mean, a good he's a really
Speaker 1: good player. This is an example I think in his
Speaker 1: article where he describes the blue players as he calls them,
Speaker 1: the players that are top ten at their position around
Speaker 1: the league. I think this is a situation where you
Speaker 1: could have a Byron Jones who could be considered a
Speaker 1: blue player let me, but may not necessarily be a
Speaker 1: play Let me change that. You know what, if you're
Speaker 1: throwing a deep ball in third and nine and he's
Speaker 1: knocking the ball down or he's contested and you're getting
Speaker 1: off the field, you made a play, you know, So
Speaker 1: I'm not going to call him not a playmaker. He's
Speaker 1: not getting an interception or a turnover, and he knows that.
Speaker 1: He says that's the number one thing he's got to
Speaker 1: change this year. But he's making plays by getting off
Speaker 1: the field. So let me enough that you call them
Speaker 1: playmaker though, see, I think you're right the first time,
Speaker 1: and all due respect to Byron, I'll be the one
Speaker 1: to bring up Earl Thomas this time since you usually
Speaker 1: do it. But who oh, it was coming. It was coming.
Speaker 1: Go back to Week three in Seattle, Like, when was
Speaker 1: the last time the Cowboys had a dB that just
Speaker 1: completely took over a game like that? And that hasn't
Speaker 1: finding as a playmate and that's not on this roster.
Speaker 1: But it's not right. Not in the secondary. Nope, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean Jalen and Layton one hundred percent. I'm very
Speaker 1: comfortable listing them as playmakers. They forced fumbles, they intercept
Speaker 1: the ball. I think they make key stops. Layton had
Speaker 1: more interceptions than any dB on this team, team or tied. Like,
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, go for it, y'all. Y'all deserve that title.
Speaker 1: I don't feel comfortable listening a dB on this team
Speaker 1: as a play maker. I think Byron Jones is a
Speaker 1: hell of a player. I hesitate to put that label
Speaker 1: on him. Okay, so that's one position that we have
Speaker 1: a question. More like to me, that's like the cherry
Speaker 1: on top type of stuff, like I feel good enough
Speaker 1: with him. Yes, you want interceptions, you want them to
Speaker 1: get the ball back. But I think he deserved to
Speaker 1: go to the Pro Bowl. I kudos to the league
Speaker 1: for having the wherewithal to give him that without the turnovers,
Speaker 1: because there's more to life than turnovers. Coverage is important,
Speaker 1: but in a league where in a league where like
Speaker 1: seventy five to eighty percent of the games or a
Speaker 1: coin flip, that is kind of important. You need a
Speaker 1: guy who can give you a short field once every
Speaker 1: other game or do something like that. You know, I think, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, go ahead, you were saying something. No, I
Speaker 1: was just gonna mention, like as far as corner, he
Speaker 1: would be the one that I feel the best like
Speaker 1: in recent time like that, I feel good about having
Speaker 1: him on the field, Like the copy was having really
Speaker 1: had a good corner like that to where you feel
Speaker 1: come to well enough and he was able to make
Speaker 1: that happen last year. Yeah, And I think the stretch
Speaker 1: there is that having a team with five dynamic players
Speaker 1: is that's a lot on defense, and that's kind of
Speaker 1: what he's asking two pass rushers and then three playmakers,
Speaker 1: where if those guys were doing their job where we
Speaker 1: call them pass rushers, then they are playmakers as well. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's kind of I mean, not consider DeMarcus Lawrence a playmakers.
Speaker 1: DeMarcus Lawrence is the best playmaker on the team because
Speaker 1: when you factor what he does in the one game,
Speaker 1: he's the best playmaker on the team. So they're they're
Speaker 1: good there. You know, he's asking for five difference making
Speaker 1: players and whether or not he's getting an interception or not,
Speaker 1: he's making a difference for sure. He made it all
Speaker 1: pro Byron Jones. So yeah, I think we're there. He's
Speaker 1: not a catalytic playmaker, but he's definitely doing his job. Okay,
Speaker 1: let's go back up to the offensive line, and they
Speaker 1: had He says, you need three dynamic offensive lineman. I
Speaker 1: think as of two years ago, there wouldn't even be
Speaker 1: a question. We would just go right over this and
Speaker 1: move on to the next thing. But I do think
Speaker 1: with Travis Frederick having missed the season, with him coming
Speaker 1: back from an injury that is not your typical Hey,
Speaker 1: I've broke this bone and it takes this long for
Speaker 1: the bone to heal because there's a lot of unpredictability,
Speaker 1: if that's a word around this kind of ailment. Do
Speaker 1: you guys feel like right now the Cowboys can feel
Speaker 1: confident in the fact that they've got three difference making
Speaker 1: offensive linemen on this team. You're right, I want to
Speaker 1: I'm like, if anybody deserves the benefit of the doubt,
Speaker 1: it's Travis Frederick. He's definitely in that category of player.
Speaker 1: But you're right, this isn't a broken bone or a ligament,
Speaker 1: and it's it's something that bears watching. I have every
Speaker 1: confidence he can work himself back into being that caliber
Speaker 1: of player, But I hesitate to just assume it'll happen,
Speaker 1: you know. But but you know, here's where I will
Speaker 1: argue with that notion. There is that if I'm sitting
Speaker 1: here with a you know, a right guard, a right tackle,
Speaker 1: and a center that are all pro let's somewhere some
Speaker 1: AFC team, But my left tackle, my left guard or issues,
Speaker 1: you know, and I have an Eric Flower's type of
Speaker 1: guy on the left side where you know, I've got
Speaker 1: to give help to all the time, then yeah, I
Speaker 1: got three studs over here. I mean, Joe Thomas was
Speaker 1: great for years for with Cleveland, but I don't know
Speaker 1: who else was good with him. I would rather I
Speaker 1: would rather not have three all pro guys. I'd rather
Speaker 1: have five guys that are pretty good that we're all
Speaker 1: rated first round picks. You know, Lyell Collins is very
Speaker 1: very serviceable, if not good on the right side. Connor
Speaker 1: Williams as a rookie, if this is the floor for
Speaker 1: Connor william He's gonna be fine. So I would rather
Speaker 1: have five guys like that than just say, do I
Speaker 1: have three all pros? Maybe? Maybe not, But I know
Speaker 1: my five, it is probably as good as anyone else,
Speaker 1: you know, so it is a unit more than any
Speaker 1: other football kind of question. That little bit I get.
Speaker 1: You need some elite guys that you don't have to
Speaker 1: worry about Zachbard, you don't have to worry about that.
Speaker 1: But and knowing that when a player gets hurt, you're
Speaker 1: gonna be mine with the backup, like we saw Sat
Speaker 1: Martin go out. Obviously, Travis Frederick was out the whole season,
Speaker 1: so Filo when he went out. So it was good
Speaker 1: this year when you saw all these different types of
Speaker 1: injuries that you had a backup that was able to
Speaker 1: come in and do the job. Yeah. Frankly at the
Speaker 1: center position, you got one that you feel pretty good about.
Speaker 1: He played all last year and played pretty well. Loonie,
Speaker 1: Suahilo and Fleming on top of the five that are starters.
Speaker 1: I don't think there's a team in the league from
Speaker 1: one to eight that's better than that. Yeah, but they
Speaker 1: were still second in the league in sacks allowed, which
Speaker 1: that is something that will have to be better if
Speaker 1: this is a team that's gonna true take the all
Speaker 1: important and they couldn't move those Rams guys out of
Speaker 1: the way. They really couldn't. I mean, Travis Frederick playing
Speaker 1: at his normal level could be so big for this team.
Speaker 1: And I hope for the Cowboys and for him that
Speaker 1: that you know, this will be a natural progression. You know,
Speaker 1: there's debate, you know, people that have had GIAMA are
Speaker 1: a syndrome or like, this is a thing that takes
Speaker 1: a year or more to really get back from speed.
Speaker 1: But then you're also like, well, Travis Fredericks an NFL athlete,
Speaker 1: He's got access to rehab, and he's got the genetics
Speaker 1: that might make this an easier transition for him. But
Speaker 1: I've heard an NFL athlete who's gone through the same
Speaker 1: exact same thing it takes a year to come back.
Speaker 1: We will have to see, Like I said, like I
Speaker 1: want to just assume that he will plug right back
Speaker 1: in and be an all pro I hope that happens,
Speaker 1: but I think it would be a mistake to just
Speaker 1: assume that that's the case in late April. Do you
Speaker 1: think because of his stature on this team as one
Speaker 1: of the leaders, that the Cowboys, even if he isn't
Speaker 1: really back to being himself and he's maybe not even
Speaker 1: the best center that they got, you think they would
Speaker 1: actually make him a backup this year and let him
Speaker 1: keep working his way back, or do you think that
Speaker 1: because of his stature they're putting him out there if
Speaker 1: he can go. I think Travis is the type of
Speaker 1: player and person that won't allow that if he can't
Speaker 1: do what he needs to do physically. And he's even
Speaker 1: said that in his in his UM interviews here. Recently,
Speaker 1: he had a story that Robert Phillips wrote on our
Speaker 1: site about right now, it's great, I'm and making progress,
Speaker 1: but we don't know until we really get the pads on,
Speaker 1: and I have to go block Antoine Woods and keep
Speaker 1: him from getting back there. By the way, that's when
Speaker 1: we first started realizing something. We didn't know what was wrong,
Speaker 1: but we knew it wasn't Travis Frederick, right, And so
Speaker 1: you know, he's he's like, let's see, we'll see what happens.
Speaker 1: And so I don't think if it's if he's not
Speaker 1: better than Joe Looney, I don't. I mean, what's Jason
Speaker 1: Garrett holding on for. I mean, he's got to make
Speaker 1: sure that that his job's on on the I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, there's no playing favorites anymore. The flip side
Speaker 1: got bigger problem right now, let's go. Yeah. The flip
Speaker 1: side of that too, is you know, maybe Travis Frederick,
Speaker 1: who's at seventy five percent, is still better than a
Speaker 1: lot of centers. I don't know. We'll have to see
Speaker 1: that maybe. And that's the question, like what percentage does
Speaker 1: he have to be back to where he's better than
Speaker 1: what you got from Looney? That's the question. Great, and
Speaker 1: and that's not But the thing is, that's not a
Speaker 1: that's not a black and white no. That is a
Speaker 1: lot of that is based upon kind of just your
Speaker 1: feel what you see, and you're kind of making some
Speaker 1: you know, you're kind of extrapolating what you make it
Speaker 1: will be in the regular So also his awareness and stuff.
Speaker 1: He's sitting there in the middle of the of the line.
Speaker 1: How much is he gonna help Dak? How much is
Speaker 1: he gonna help Connor Williams over here just having him around? Is?
Speaker 1: I mean? I'm not, no, I get that. Here's my
Speaker 1: other part to that, though, is I think Luney's a
Speaker 1: fairly smart guy. He is after doing a whole season,
Speaker 1: how much better is he at that now than he
Speaker 1: would have been a year ago? I always, I always
Speaker 1: struggle with I love that guy's good. No, just you know,
Speaker 1: people love to look at it like a game of
Speaker 1: Madden or like inc double a football is like, all right,
Speaker 1: you go to the rating, you go to the off season,
Speaker 1: and it's the off season, so like you're gonna get better,
Speaker 1: Like he's gonna get seven points better and he's back
Speaker 1: from injury. Like that's how it works in video games
Speaker 1: and that's not how it works in real life. And
Speaker 1: that's always something you have to keep in mind. All
Speaker 1: we're gonna take our first break. We'll come back and
Speaker 1: I have a question for you guys around the three
Speaker 1: offensive playmakers. Jason Witten was on that list. I don't
Speaker 1: want to know. Do you guys think he should be?
Speaker 1: Should the Cowboys consider him to be on that list?
Speaker 1: We'll talk about that when we come back. This is
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Speaker 1: Dealer dot com slash football. Back to the Break Welcome back.
Speaker 1: We're the second segment of the Break Life and he
Speaker 1: has w ABC Mark Mortgage Studios at the Star. We're
Speaker 1: talking about the draft in a roundabout way. We're gonna
Speaker 1: get to the draft. I promise we'll have some questions
Speaker 1: here about the draft and how this is good this
Speaker 1: but for nothing. We're starting by talking about this from
Speaker 1: the standpoint of how you might want to say that
Speaker 1: around right. Um. We we're talking about this from the
Speaker 1: standpoint though, of how a team is constructed, how a
Speaker 1: super Bowl caliber team is constructed, from the eyes of
Speaker 1: the former scout Bucky Brooks who writes for NFL dot
Speaker 1: com and article he put out. So we've talked about
Speaker 1: kind of what we think about the franchise quarterback idea.
Speaker 1: We talked about the offensive line, we talked about the
Speaker 1: defensive playmakers. The other thing that was curious to me
Speaker 1: is that he said the Cowboys have three offensive playmakers. Uh.
Speaker 1: He named Zeke which we agree on, Amari Cooper obviously,
Speaker 1: and then he mentioned Jason Witten. My question for you
Speaker 1: guys is should the Cowboys go into this season expecting
Speaker 1: that Jason Witten will be a playmaker of that caliber
Speaker 1: for this team after being off for an entire year. No,
Speaker 1: I don't really think you can expect that, And I
Speaker 1: don't know if he was really a playmaker. He was
Speaker 1: not that caliber before he retired, So no, I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't. I wouldn't put him in there, really, I
Speaker 1: kind of I will make the argument that that's I
Speaker 1: do think maybe maybe not toward the end of right
Speaker 1: before you tire, but his career I think is marked
Speaker 1: by being That was what was so remarkable to me
Speaker 1: about him is he was a playmaker. There were moments
Speaker 1: in games where teams wanted to take him away and
Speaker 1: they couldn't take him away. He wasn't fast, he wasn't quick,
Speaker 1: but it just worked like he had a way of
Speaker 1: finding a way to get open and Vall gets to
Speaker 1: him and he makes the catch. Now, he's not gonna
Speaker 1: run for most times, not gonna run for some long
Speaker 1: run after the catch, but he'll get you that needed
Speaker 1: first down at critical moments in games. Right, So from
Speaker 1: that standpoint, I do think he was a playmaker. I
Speaker 1: just don't know that. I think he is still a
Speaker 1: playmaker that that remains to be seen. For me, was one.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't put him in there right now. I think
Speaker 1: you're being liberal with the definition of playmaker. And Jason
Speaker 1: Witten has a useful purpose and everything you just said
Speaker 1: is true. He can help this offense. He can know
Speaker 1: like he's a genius. He's got a master's degree in
Speaker 1: route running and finding the open space. Those they do,
Speaker 1: they do. Actually that's hanging over locker. Um, yeah, it's tennis.
Speaker 1: It's the nine Pro Bowl Stars. That's here you go
Speaker 1: or whatever. Ten eleven. I'm like, I don't count him. Um,
Speaker 1: he can do all that stuff. He'll be there on
Speaker 1: third down and he'll probably catch somewhere between two and
Speaker 1: five touchdowns, which he touchdowns have never been the big
Speaker 1: thing for him. I don't know which. And again, what's
Speaker 1: what are we calling a playmaker? Like? I think a
Speaker 1: playmaker can be a guy that in critical moments moves
Speaker 1: a chain for you regularly, that's a playmaker. Playmaker, in
Speaker 1: my opinion, is a guy who, like you, hold your
Speaker 1: breath because when the ball's going his way, you don't
Speaker 1: know what's going to happen. Like, playmaker to me is like, oh,
Speaker 1: Dad threw this eighteen yard passed to Amari Cooper and
Speaker 1: now he's running eighty yards for a touchdown. Like that's
Speaker 1: a playmaker. That's the case. I don't know how in
Speaker 1: the world Bucky Brooks Brooks because that's never been Jason
Speaker 1: Witten's game. So how in the world could he put
Speaker 1: Jason Witten. You have to tie in Dak Prescott and
Speaker 1: what Jason means to Dak Prescott safety blankets. You're yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: so I thought that's where you were going. But go ahead,
Speaker 1: as your point, well, just having him there, if whether
Speaker 1: that's catching or blocking, just having went in there, and
Speaker 1: what he means, how he helps death and especially like
Speaker 1: for example, what he can do in the red zone,
Speaker 1: in the end zone, you know where the Cowboys had
Speaker 1: so many troubles last year. Plugging him back in, whether
Speaker 1: or not he's the one catching that ball, is still
Speaker 1: going to be a difference maker. I do agree with that.
Speaker 1: I agree that. I agree with that, But what I'm
Speaker 1: saying is is that he's putting all this while your
Speaker 1: franchise quarterback. Is this the reason why he would be
Speaker 1: in the conversation as of being a franchise quarterback is
Speaker 1: because he is an offensive playmaker. He is one of
Speaker 1: your guys. He and he's one of the guys that
Speaker 1: when you get down in the red zone he needs
Speaker 1: to have. You know, his ability to roll out there
Speaker 1: and make plays is what you know. The past to
Speaker 1: Beasley one of his greatest plays ever against the Giants.
Speaker 1: I mean it was his mobility to get out there,
Speaker 1: the arm strength to throw it, rolland left like that.
Speaker 1: He probably could have run it as well. That's a playmaker.
Speaker 1: And um, you can't tell me that when Carolina was
Speaker 1: doing its thing a couple of years ago that Cam
Speaker 1: Newton wasn't a franchise quarterback and an offensive playmaker for
Speaker 1: them and other defense when they're you know, trying to
Speaker 1: plan what they're gonna do on the field, they're gonna
Speaker 1: pay more attention to it. With Jason Witten, then Blake
Speaker 1: Jarwin or Dalton Schultz or whoever else is in there.
Speaker 1: Difference maker for sure. Yeah, playmaker. Like you know, back
Speaker 1: in the day, ESPN used to have a three minute
Speaker 1: highlight package where they covered every single meaningful play in
Speaker 1: the game, and now it's more like twenty seconds. If
Speaker 1: you're a playmaker, then your highlights are in that twenty seconds.
Speaker 1: You know what I mean, Like you tell the story
Speaker 1: of the Eagles game in Amari Cooper play not showing
Speaker 1: I mean borderline guys. I mean if if Jason Witten
Speaker 1: was a playmaker at some point, Rainal Cobbs certainly was
Speaker 1: that well at that I was going next, That's what
Speaker 1: I was going to My question was gonna be from
Speaker 1: what we've seen so far, and I'll make the argument
Speaker 1: for two. Do you think Gallop or Cobb ends up
Speaker 1: being really your third playmaker on this team on this
Speaker 1: on Williams, Hey, well, I hope not. Then you drafted
Speaker 1: I did, but I hope. I mean, if he is
Speaker 1: a playmaker for this team, that means Zeke's not on
Speaker 1: the field necessarily. And I was gonna go there next.
Speaker 1: But let's take one thing at a time. Do you
Speaker 1: think Cobb or Gallop jump around? No, you think Cobber
Speaker 1: Gallup have the potential, based on what you've seen in
Speaker 1: their career so far, Yeah, have the potential to be
Speaker 1: that third playmaker for theself. I do. I think Cobb
Speaker 1: has has the ability to be that guy and I mean,
Speaker 1: I think Beasley was a playmaker at times. And when
Speaker 1: you get Whitten on there, you're gonna get tomorrow, you
Speaker 1: getting Zeke. You know you can't cover everyone. And I
Speaker 1: still think Cobb has the ability to do some things
Speaker 1: like that, So I would put Randall Cobb in that ability.
Speaker 1: And who'd you say? Cobb and Gallop? Gallop? And I
Speaker 1: actually think Gallup has, in my opinion, has more of
Speaker 1: an opportunity. You go to what dave definition of the playmaker,
Speaker 1: the guy that you see in those highlights. I know
Speaker 1: there were enough times last year when Cowboys took shots
Speaker 1: and there was an opportunity and it was just a
Speaker 1: little off. I expect that this year those seeing those
Speaker 1: times when it was a little off, they should be
Speaker 1: able to connect on those And if they do that
Speaker 1: at that rate of the amount of times we saw
Speaker 1: it last year, Gallup will be a guy that is
Speaker 1: regularly being seen. He will be, for lack of a
Speaker 1: better way to put it, your Alvin Harper, he will
Speaker 1: be a guy that can go down feel and make
Speaker 1: some plays and you're seeing it regular and defensive are
Speaker 1: now having to think about Michael Gallops down the sideline.
Speaker 1: Somebody better be back there to make sure if he
Speaker 1: catches the ball, he didn't end up in the end zone. True,
Speaker 1: I agree with that, and I mean I hope, I
Speaker 1: hope the Cobbs signing pans out as well as I
Speaker 1: can't as well as it could, because that you're talking
Speaker 1: about a guy that averages sixty yards per season for
Speaker 1: his career, and that's with a couple of injury hobbled seasons,
Speaker 1: forty touchdowns, twelve yards per per catch for his career. Again,
Speaker 1: all improvements over Jason Witten. No disrespect to him, but
Speaker 1: that's I mean, he can do all the things Cole
Speaker 1: Beasley can and adds more of a big play and
Speaker 1: downfield element, and I think that could be huge. There's
Speaker 1: a lot to like about this cob There is what
Speaker 1: about missing inside joke? Okay, Nick likes to throw two
Speaker 1: or three of those in there inside. You know what,
Speaker 1: I think it's very exciting when you look at this roster,
Speaker 1: especially in the offense. On the offense that it doesn't
Speaker 1: matter who's being blocked. Let's say Amari Cooper can't make
Speaker 1: a player or whatever you feel good enough with whoever
Speaker 1: else is open that it would be able to catch
Speaker 1: that ball and do something with it, as opposed to
Speaker 1: let's say last year, where it was kind of like
Speaker 1: up in the air and you don't really trust many
Speaker 1: of those receivers at times. So now it's the point
Speaker 1: that you just feel good, you don't care. Just as
Speaker 1: long as one person is open and can do something,
Speaker 1: you feel confident. That's the pick your poison type of strategy.
Speaker 1: The weird thing about this whole offseason is is when
Speaker 1: you talk about offense, you got a lot of things
Speaker 1: to be excited about, but the last time they were
Speaker 1: on the field, they were pretty much shut down at
Speaker 1: least from the running game, and everything we saw last
Speaker 1: year is different because there's a new coordinator. It's hard
Speaker 1: to build on that because you don't really know what
Speaker 1: Kellen Moore is, how different he's going to be than
Speaker 1: Scott Lanahan. You hope there are some some big differences,
Speaker 1: especially with red zone play calling, so it's it's kind
Speaker 1: of hard. That's what's what's weird about this is that
Speaker 1: you really can't build off of, you know, last year,
Speaker 1: because you've got a new play caller. Here's the thing,
Speaker 1: as we went through this list, there seems to be
Speaker 1: two areas that probably we had the biggest questions about. Again,
Speaker 1: I think we kind of feel like they're answers for
Speaker 1: all of them. But if you had to identify, it
Speaker 1: would be the offensive playmakers the defensive playmakers. So basically
Speaker 1: playmakers guys that are making big plays for you offensively
Speaker 1: or defensively. My own opinion of this is that when
Speaker 1: you're talking about the draft, particularly when you're you don't
Speaker 1: have a first round pick, there are two positions I
Speaker 1: think that typically you can find good quality can probably
Speaker 1: throw offensive guard in there as well, but there are
Speaker 1: two positions where you can usually find good value second, third,
Speaker 1: fourth round, that being safety and running back. So let's
Speaker 1: talk about those two positions from the standpoint of the
Speaker 1: second round. Would you, guys, be willing to use a
Speaker 1: second round pick on a running back? I know what
Speaker 1: Stephen Jones says. He says, you kind I really want
Speaker 1: your second round pick to be playing. But in a
Speaker 1: situation like this where if you got a versatile running
Speaker 1: back who has the ability to do more than just
Speaker 1: line up in the backfield, maybe he lines up in
Speaker 1: the slot, sum maybe he does some other stuff. He
Speaker 1: can spell zeke at times, would you be willing to
Speaker 1: use a second round pick on that kind of running back.
Speaker 1: What did you say the positions were? I'm sorry, The
Speaker 1: positions running back and safety seem to be positions you
Speaker 1: can get value later in the draft, right, exactly right? Well, well, well,
Speaker 1: I would either be later second rounds. I disagree about
Speaker 1: safety completely, but you disagree that there is value later
Speaker 1: in the draft. I think if you're trying to find
Speaker 1: a difference maker in terms of upgrading your roster at safety,
Speaker 1: it had better be a top sixty pick or even
Speaker 1: top forty. And so let me let me define that again.
Speaker 1: I may have missed said that. What I'm saying is
Speaker 1: in the second round. By the time the Cowboys pick,
Speaker 1: you could still find value at those two positions, good value,
Speaker 1: really good value, just as opposed to pass rushers. He'll
Speaker 1: get him on the the top ten. You're probably not get him, right,
Speaker 1: But the safety you got to hope that your defense
Speaker 1: can cover up his flaw whatever he's got something, or
Speaker 1: he wouldn't last the fifty eight, right? Did he not
Speaker 1: time fast enough? Did he did he not have a
Speaker 1: lot of interceptions? Is he kind of light? You know?
Speaker 1: Does he not tackle? I mean just things like that
Speaker 1: that that drop him which I guess you could make
Speaker 1: the argument with every position. I'm getting dropped. I'm getting
Speaker 1: ready to speak out of both sides of my mouth
Speaker 1: because I did mock Trayvion Williams to the Cowboys at
Speaker 1: pick number ninety. But there's so much value to be
Speaker 1: found at that position that you should not have to
Speaker 1: do it at fifty eight, especially when you already have
Speaker 1: an all pro on the team. And yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: you might get a guy that can do all that stuff.
Speaker 1: You can find that guy in the fifth round too.
Speaker 1: Here's here's why the caveat to that is, this is
Speaker 1: a decision that needs to be made right now, and
Speaker 1: I'm sure it has been. This is Stephen Jones, Jerry Jones,
Speaker 1: Will McClay, Garrett. I guess it's a philosophical decision. So
Speaker 1: this is a what are we doing with Ezekiel Elliott, which,
Speaker 1: by the way, he did. They did give him his
Speaker 1: fifth year option today, which isn't you know that wasn't
Speaker 1: earth shattering. We knew that was going to happen. But
Speaker 1: are they planning on signing him? If they're like, you
Speaker 1: know what, we might just say let's go for two
Speaker 1: years and then we'll just see. If that's the case,
Speaker 1: then fifty eight makes it is a different But can
Speaker 1: you do you have enough information to make that kind
Speaker 1: of decision right now? The argument I would make is
Speaker 1: for a running back like it, the drop is precipitous
Speaker 1: and it happens quickly, and they're always every time they
Speaker 1: touched the ball, there's a chance for injury, and that
Speaker 1: injury could change the complexion of who they are as
Speaker 1: a player. If you've got two years left on a
Speaker 1: deal with a running back, I would suspect that right
Speaker 1: now you cannot make a well informed decision about what
Speaker 1: you're gonna do in two years from now on a
Speaker 1: running back. Well, that's fair because DeMarco Murray was basically
Speaker 1: like out of league two years after he was NFL
Speaker 1: Offensive Player of the Year, and he was he was
Speaker 1: older than Zeke at that point, much older. I feel
Speaker 1: like at least two or time. Girls is a good example. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what happened this year, Like by the end of the year,
Speaker 1: and I don't know this, I just I've said it before,
Speaker 1: like I feel like running back was making so much
Speaker 1: progress in terms of regaining some of its lost value,
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, like people are worried about
Speaker 1: Todd Gurley's knee, and you're seeing it trend right back
Speaker 1: the other way, and Pittsburgh will just let leveyon Bill walk.
Speaker 1: I mean like those kinds of things. In early February
Speaker 1: stirred no. In early March, Stephen Jones said, like, you know,
Speaker 1: Gurley's the jumping off point for Zeke, and we'll get
Speaker 1: that done when we can. And they still might. I
Speaker 1: haven't heard anything to suggest that they won't, but they
Speaker 1: can change their mind. They got him under contract for
Speaker 1: two examples. Aren't aren't really fair to Zeke? Because number one, yeah,
Speaker 1: they let leveyon Bill go and they missed the playoffs.
Speaker 1: I mean, Leon, that was a difference maker. This guys
Speaker 1: led the league in rushing two of the three years
Speaker 1: he had the incident, which we all. I don't know,
Speaker 1: but I'm not putting words anyone else's mouth, but I
Speaker 1: think it was a bogus situation for him to be
Speaker 1: suspending for six games like that. This team did not
Speaker 1: make the playoffs and he still almost had a thousand yards.
Speaker 1: He is an absolute difference maker with no injury history,
Speaker 1: like Todd Gurley, and just like Levion Bell when he
Speaker 1: wasn't in there. The team dropped off. So he's done
Speaker 1: everything he's supposed to do. And if you're gonna make
Speaker 1: this deal, I would do it right now. I've said it, yeah,
Speaker 1: and I agree with you. I'm saying, though, that's if
Speaker 1: you're gonna go ahead and resign him now, so that
Speaker 1: you get the benefit of having a deal that doesn't
Speaker 1: start in two years. It starts now, right so that
Speaker 1: I agree with you. I'm saying, if they're not ready
Speaker 1: to do that now, then I think you wait, because
Speaker 1: I don't think you can. Going back to your the
Speaker 1: example you were given about the draft, I don't think
Speaker 1: right now they can say what's gonna be the health
Speaker 1: of this running back in two years? Because the amount
Speaker 1: of times they gave him the ball last year, they
Speaker 1: keep up that pace, I don't trust it in two
Speaker 1: years he's two years, he's gonna be injury free, because
Speaker 1: that's a ton. I mean, that's a word. And Jerry
Speaker 1: and talked about it in a couple press conferences ago
Speaker 1: where he said, hey, a lot of times we gave
Speaker 1: him the ball, like we gotta do something different. We
Speaker 1: can't expect to give him that workload. But if they don't.
Speaker 1: They don't get a viable secondary option, and they keep
Speaker 1: giving him that kind of workload. I don't trust it.
Speaker 1: In two years he's gonna be help. You don't have,
Speaker 1: Like Dave said, you don't have to go to the
Speaker 1: fifty eighth pick in the draft to get a solid
Speaker 1: backup running back that can spell zeke and run behind
Speaker 1: this line. You can get a guy in the fifth
Speaker 1: round that you would be impressed with and be like, huh,
Speaker 1: you're not asking him to do a lot. We're asking
Speaker 1: him to get ten carries, catch the ball a little bit,
Speaker 1: and he gets the run behind this line. He's pretty
Speaker 1: good to take that to the safety position. Would you
Speaker 1: guys be willing to look at fifty eight for safety?
Speaker 1: I think fifty eight is I think safety is what
Speaker 1: they want to spend pick fifty eight on the need
Speaker 1: to get it. Can you get a playmaking safety at
Speaker 1: fifty eight? Probably not if you get really lucky. That's
Speaker 1: I mean, how do you have to go and get
Speaker 1: us playmaking safety? That I mean? Welcome to and I'm
Speaker 1: not trying to be facetious, like, welcome to the debate
Speaker 1: we've been having on the Draft show for three months.
Speaker 1: Because this is a deep safety lass. But there is
Speaker 1: a drop off at a certain point, and it's right
Speaker 1: around where the Cowboys are picking the caveat there is
Speaker 1: this is this is gonna be one of the most
Speaker 1: unpredictable drafts in recent memory. I think, I mean, the
Speaker 1: number one overall pick is probably gonna be Kyler Murray,
Speaker 1: but that's still a question. Well, I don't think I
Speaker 1: think they're full of crap. I think the Cardinals are
Speaker 1: full of crap. I think they're gonna pick him. Point
Speaker 1: being the guy that's probably gonna go number one is
Speaker 1: like consensussly considered like the fifteenth best prospect in this draft.
Speaker 1: So that throws everything off. And then the number one
Speaker 1: prospect is Nick Bosa. He'll will go right after that,
Speaker 1: and then it's literally beauty in the eye of the
Speaker 1: beholder for the rest of the way down. Like you're
Speaker 1: seeing Variances on grades between you know, Brian Burns is
Speaker 1: a pass rusher that Dane Brugler thinks is the tenth
Speaker 1: best prospect in this draft. Brian brought us thinks he's
Speaker 1: fifty and you see you see Variances like that. It's
Speaker 1: huge spirit you're talking. I mean, let's go through the
Speaker 1: list of safeties. Taylor rap is considered like the most
Speaker 1: well rounded safety in this class, but his projected mid
Speaker 1: first round though he's no his grade is everywhere from
Speaker 1: late first round to maybe the Cowboys could draft him
Speaker 1: because he ran a four seven forty. People are out
Speaker 1: on his athletic ability. Jonathan Abram a guy the Cowboys
Speaker 1: are absolutely smitten with. Again, more of a box safety, thumper,
Speaker 1: doesn't have the range that makes him elite. So does
Speaker 1: he go in the first round? Probably not. He's probably
Speaker 1: pegged somewhere between thirty two and forty five. Juan Thornhill
Speaker 1: his versatility. I've seen him everywhere from thirty five to
Speaker 1: sixty five. Chauncey Gardner, Johnson the kid out of Florida,
Speaker 1: samething like it's all about who's rating these guys. You'd
Speaker 1: be willing to jump up to forty five to get
Speaker 1: one of those guys who really love It's the conversation
Speaker 1: we had last night. We did a seven round mock
Speaker 1: for the Cowboys. In this mock, which again we're gonna
Speaker 1: be wrong, Like there we're gonna see guys going in
Speaker 1: the first round that we didn't expect. We're gonna see
Speaker 1: guys falling. I'm very confident of that. But you actually
Speaker 1: might get a really great player at another position that
Speaker 1: you didn't expect to be there, like defensive tackle where
Speaker 1: it's pretty deep. Right, completely explains why the Cowboys have
Speaker 1: done so much diligence with so many different positions. That's
Speaker 1: why running backs with high grades were brought in, and
Speaker 1: wide receivers. I really think safety and d tackle or
Speaker 1: the spots they're focusing in on though. But so last night,
Speaker 1: in this exercise, Taylor Rapp, who is most people's best
Speaker 1: all around safety prospect, he fell to I think forty nine,
Speaker 1: And so you're faced with the prospect of, well, we'd
Speaker 1: love to trade a fourth round pick to go up
Speaker 1: and get this guy. But is that enough of a price.
Speaker 1: Probably not, because it's all up to the team that's
Speaker 1: trading back. So are you willing to trade pick ninety
Speaker 1: to go get a guy you really love at forty nine?
Speaker 1: And that's maybe a decision they'll have to make. All right,
Speaker 1: let's go and take our final break. We'll come back.
Speaker 1: Let's get some questions. Eight eight eight eight five five
Speaker 1: two two nine seven is our number again? Eight eight
Speaker 1: eight eight five five, two, two nine seven. We'll also
Speaker 1: ask these guys to give us a few names of
Speaker 1: guys that they will be watching this weekend second and
Speaker 1: third rounds, and maybe even some sleep. We'll do that
Speaker 1: when they come right back. This is Dallas Cowboys dot
Speaker 1: Com Radio. While the player can look good on paper,
Speaker 1: it's when he's out on the field that you really
Speaker 1: find out what he's made of. That's why the Cowboys
Speaker 1: rely on more than just stats and scouting reports when
Speaker 1: building their team. When picking a tractor, it's why you
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Speaker 1: Welcome back. It's the final segment of Break Live from
Speaker 1: the SWBC Mortgage studios at the Star and we got
Speaker 1: we're talking about draft a little bit. We're talking about
Speaker 1: which deed what the Cowboys need in order to make
Speaker 1: a kit Super Bowl contender. According to Bucky Brooks and
Speaker 1: his article on NFL dot com, We're gonna take some
Speaker 1: questions and numbers eight eight eight eight five five two
Speaker 1: two ninety seven. I guess let's go and jump into that,
Speaker 1: and then we'll save for a little bit later for
Speaker 1: you guys to give us some names of some players
Speaker 1: in this draft that fans should be looking forward to
Speaker 1: in the second, third round and maybe even some sleepers.
Speaker 1: Let's take a call right now from David and North Carolina. David,
Speaker 1: what up? Hey guys? How are you doing everything you do?
Speaker 1: You gotta do a great job. Thank you. I've actually
Speaker 1: got a couple questions. The first question is everybody seems
Speaker 1: to be talking about Joe Looney as a backup center
Speaker 1: and nobody seems to be talking about him as a
Speaker 1: backup left guard. Why are they just giving that job
Speaker 1: to Connor? Seems like Joe would be in better I mean,
Speaker 1: he'd be in tune with Travis Frederick because I mean,
Speaker 1: he spent so much time in the film room and
Speaker 1: playing center. Seemed like he might be a better choice
Speaker 1: if you're gonna put your best five linemen on the
Speaker 1: on the field. And then my second question is it
Speaker 1: seems like the safety thing. I'm not totally sold on
Speaker 1: that because I haven't seen the team lose a Super
Speaker 1: Bowl because of a safety, but I've seen the team
Speaker 1: lose a Super Bowl because of defensive blind play. So
Speaker 1: I just want to get your thoughts on that, and
Speaker 1: I'll hang up and listen to what you guys have
Speaker 1: to say. All right, thanks for a call. I saw
Speaker 1: a team win a Super Bowl because of a S
Speaker 1: fifty two months ago. Mccordy play was unbelievable, yep, I
Speaker 1: mean incredible, and I have no faith that anybody on
Speaker 1: the Cowboys roster right now could have made it. Well
Speaker 1: I do, I agree. I mean line play. Line play
Speaker 1: is much more important in the grand scheme, but they
Speaker 1: defensive even three technique is probably one of the more
Speaker 1: important positions. This is a good football team right now
Speaker 1: and it needs you know, you're just finding a spot.
Speaker 1: That's what our safety is. It's like, all right, where
Speaker 1: can they be better at? I mean, no one's talking,
Speaker 1: No one ever is talking about anybody going to the
Speaker 1: Pro Bowl. It's safety, linebacker. They had one and almost two.
Speaker 1: They had a defensive line, they've got a receiver, they
Speaker 1: have a running back that you know, the tied end
Speaker 1: they're bringing one back. Quarterback is going. No one's ever
Speaker 1: had a Pro Bowl safety here for a long time.
Speaker 1: So I mean that's when you're when good football teams
Speaker 1: are like, how can we make this even better? That's
Speaker 1: why safety is even an issue. And this is one
Speaker 1: of those positions that we've been talking about for a
Speaker 1: few years now to where it's like, Okay, how can
Speaker 1: you upgrade it? Or when are you going to upgrade it?
Speaker 1: And it's kind of getting to that port. I mean, yes,
Speaker 1: last year they were able to manage through the year,
Speaker 1: and before that season started we were all talking about safety. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they didn't happen, and they went through it. They made
Speaker 1: it work. But when you're watching games and there's a
Speaker 1: bad playing like, oh my god, yes, they do need
Speaker 1: a safety that can do certain things and they don't
Speaker 1: have that, it's when you know this time of the
Speaker 1: year comes around again and you start talking about it
Speaker 1: and you do want to address it because how many
Speaker 1: more years are you gonna keep waiting on. We's to
Speaker 1: the first part of his question about the offensive line,
Speaker 1: particularly Joe Looney. He says he thinks Joe Looney should
Speaker 1: be arguably your backup, a backup guard. He said backup.
Speaker 1: I really think he meant starter. He does he yeah,
Speaker 1: because he said, why are are you just giving the
Speaker 1: job to Connor Williams. I don't think you'd be arguing
Speaker 1: about being a backup. I really believe that what he meant.
Speaker 1: I thought he made a mistake in thinking that Connor
Speaker 1: Williams was going to continue to be the backup as
Speaker 1: he was towards the you know, about the middle last
Speaker 1: year when he got hurt and then came back. I
Speaker 1: think I've heard this argument before is why is Joe
Speaker 1: Looney not being considered to start at left guard? And
Speaker 1: I really think that's what he was saying to do
Speaker 1: you think it from that stamp? Yeah, you think he should? Um?
Speaker 1: I no, I don't. I don't because I think what
Speaker 1: you're doing is is and that's not fair to him.
Speaker 1: But you know, I believe that you're getting more out
Speaker 1: of your players about having a game day backup as
Speaker 1: a three position backup center, two guard spots. I think
Speaker 1: that's very valuable. You don't have that with Connor, you
Speaker 1: don't have that with Xavier Sulaphilo. So if Frederick comes back,
Speaker 1: then Looney is a is a very valuable backup player.
Speaker 1: And this team wants to be right, they want to
Speaker 1: show success in the draft, and they want to have
Speaker 1: Connor Williams be their starting left guard. That's what they want. Well,
Speaker 1: all teams do, I mean, you want to give your
Speaker 1: draft picks a chance. When we just spent the first
Speaker 1: segment saying, you know, we got to wait and see
Speaker 1: on Travis, we're not ready to pencil him in as
Speaker 1: ready to be Travis Frederick. So I don't want Joe
Speaker 1: Looney to have to learn a new position. If he's
Speaker 1: going to wind up being my starting center. I like
Speaker 1: having him there. You're right, you can play all three
Speaker 1: positions in a pinch. You also have Xavier Suaphilo, who
Speaker 1: kind of becomes redundant if Joe Looney's starting at another position,
Speaker 1: and then Connor would naturally be his backup. So what
Speaker 1: do you do with Xavier? I mean, I don't want
Speaker 1: to cut him, So I think I think that's a
Speaker 1: good problem to have. I'm I'm banking on Connor continuing
Speaker 1: to improve. I like, I don't think that was a
Speaker 1: bad pick at all. I'm completely not ready to Yeah,
Speaker 1: like he's gonna be fine in my opinion. So they've
Speaker 1: got good depth and that's a good thing coming into
Speaker 1: this season. Do you expect that Connor or Suaphilo will
Speaker 1: be your starting left guard? I think Connor. I mean
Speaker 1: part of it is I hate to say politics because
Speaker 1: I don't think it's like Connor's not undeserving. Like what
Speaker 1: I thought, what you said in the first segment was great,
Speaker 1: Like if that's his floor, he should be pretty good. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so he's going to continue to get better. You want
Speaker 1: to be right, You want your draft picks to play
Speaker 1: the meaningful roles for you. That's how you win is
Speaker 1: cheap service for multiple years. I mean, Xavier's in a
Speaker 1: contract year now, Joe is too. Connor's got three more
Speaker 1: seasons to play. It just makes sense. And so it
Speaker 1: was Lyle Collins or Collins will be Lyles in a
Speaker 1: contractor contract here. So that's an interesting part of this
Speaker 1: thing as well. I don't want to give up on
Speaker 1: Suafilo either. I thought that was a was a very
Speaker 1: good find, and I think you know he sometimes these players,
Speaker 1: I just I just think a lot about Colombo, with
Speaker 1: him drafted pretty high, didn't really work out where you
Speaker 1: wanted to be. Now you're kind of humbled a little bit,
Speaker 1: get another start, surround yourself with better players, and you
Speaker 1: know you have a different outlook on thing, which if
Speaker 1: Suefilo just completely outplays Connor and training camp, and I
Speaker 1: think he would be the starter. But I am willing
Speaker 1: to give Connor Williams the benefit of the doubt that
Speaker 1: he will be better. There is no reason why to
Speaker 1: think otherwise. I mean, when you watched Connor all of
Speaker 1: last year, you saw improvement game after game, even after
Speaker 1: he got hurt and went out. When he went in
Speaker 1: for Zack, he did a good job. And then when
Speaker 1: he got back into position went to A Filo went
Speaker 1: out with an injury, he was able to perform a
Speaker 1: lot better. So's he's one of those players rookie last year,
Speaker 1: okay young, and that you're seeing development in progress. So
Speaker 1: there is nothing that he just kind of right went backwards.
Speaker 1: But sue Filo was drafted even higher in his round
Speaker 1: a few years before that, and he's considered to have
Speaker 1: just as much, if not more, talents, So you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: he could play right next to Frederick and Tyrann Smith
Speaker 1: and play well too. So it's a good problem. And
Speaker 1: something really special about Sua Filo is how much he cares,
Speaker 1: how passionate he is about the game. It may not
Speaker 1: seem like it, but when you look at him around
Speaker 1: the locker room, and talk to him or whatever. Just
Speaker 1: the fact that he would walk in and I would
Speaker 1: see him. I talk to him a lot. He would
Speaker 1: walk in and be kind of upset, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: what's wrong with you? And He's like, yeah, I just
Speaker 1: I wasn't good enough out of practice and like those
Speaker 1: little things that even at practice. I'm like, well, it's
Speaker 1: just practice. This is the time to make mistakes. It's
Speaker 1: like no, no, no, that's not how you have to
Speaker 1: look at it. This is like you have to take
Speaker 1: it as a game day and just perform how you
Speaker 1: need to perform. There's no room for mistake. Because that
Speaker 1: whole thing was happening with Connor and there's that debate.
Speaker 1: So also his job was kind of on the line
Speaker 1: or like the starting position. So when you see his
Speaker 1: players care that much, it shows it starts to translate
Speaker 1: on the field. And I think those kind of attitude
Speaker 1: it's very important if you a lot of a lot
Speaker 1: of guys there on the offensive line, and I mean,
Speaker 1: don't want to take this show to another level, but
Speaker 1: if there is a player that you wanted to pick
Speaker 1: and you needed to trade somebody, I mean, if you'all
Speaker 1: even had that, if y'all even had that discussion of
Speaker 1: which player on this team. Let's say you really wanted
Speaker 1: a third round pick. We did it with Tank, but
Speaker 1: that was before he signed his deal. Not really. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think the only position you could probably look at
Speaker 1: what you just have kind of this. I think this
Speaker 1: dearth of riches is probably offensive line. You can make
Speaker 1: the argument at a pass rusher. Maybe if you wanted,
Speaker 1: if you could get some bad about you could Lyle.
Speaker 1: That's where I was going. Lyle would be the guy
Speaker 1: I don't really love plugging it right tackle Well, I
Speaker 1: mean you gotta again you do that, and then Travis
Speaker 1: Frederick is not healthy, and then you got now everything
Speaker 1: is off and you're like, what we thought we were great? Yeah,
Speaker 1: you got just talking here. I think that would be
Speaker 1: a spot. But but I wouldn't do it because I'd
Speaker 1: also be curious to see what you could get for
Speaker 1: a guy with one year on his deal. It's true.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, maybe you could get a
Speaker 1: third maybe, I kind of I kind of doubt it.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think it's throwing a time. I
Speaker 1: don't know anybody that you would actually want to trade.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you could get that big a
Speaker 1: compensation pick for maybe if you if you thought, hey,
Speaker 1: we are we know from our money standpoint, we're not
Speaker 1: going to be able to resign Byron Jones. Byron Jones
Speaker 1: would be a guy and maybe you consider, but you
Speaker 1: better be drafting somebody because all right now, now you
Speaker 1: got a problem. Now you got a problem. No, you
Speaker 1: don't mess with a second alone. Byron Jones is moving
Speaker 1: around the facility on crutches right now, like what are
Speaker 1: you going to get for him? And that's that's true.
Speaker 1: That was the whole problem with Tank too, right. People
Speaker 1: had that that argument about what happened with with a
Speaker 1: guy from Seattle? The guy traded and could you get
Speaker 1: the same compensation for Tank? Well, the problem was Tank
Speaker 1: out a bump shoulder, and that always affects what you're
Speaker 1: going to get in compensation. I'm losing track of time
Speaker 1: right now. So Taco third year was entering his third year,
Speaker 1: entering third Why fast forward two years or one year?
Speaker 1: Fast forward one year? Do you think that the Cowboys
Speaker 1: will be giving hiving up his option? If I had
Speaker 1: to guess, no, what you know what, we didn't think
Speaker 1: they would pick up Byron Jones exactly, And I think
Speaker 1: in those situations that's where you wait to see, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: is this the year when it starts to pop for him?
Speaker 1: Is this the year when everybody's like, man, that was
Speaker 1: a bump year. It was Parcels that said by the
Speaker 1: third year, right, I mean that's the big Oh, before
Speaker 1: you get somebody crazy on Twitter because he got that
Speaker 1: from Tom Landry. So sorry, sorry, Tom Landry. I'm just
Speaker 1: saying you will get that if you say that that
Speaker 1: was Parcels this thing. But yeah, a lot of great
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame coaches have have made that an agree
Speaker 1: with it. By the third year, it's gonna click, or
Speaker 1: it does. But I will say this, I think the
Speaker 1: caveat to that is by the third year you will
Speaker 1: probably find if you canna have a great player or not.
Speaker 1: I don't know if it necessarily mean, because you can
Speaker 1: put it to a lot of a lot of situations
Speaker 1: where by the third year you don't get a great player,
Speaker 1: but by the fourth year you got a guy that's like, oh,
Speaker 1: he's pretty good. It's not he may not be, yeah,
Speaker 1: he may not be all pro, but he's a guy
Speaker 1: that's pretty good. So I don't know that that always
Speaker 1: works right from the standpoint of just saying if you're
Speaker 1: gonna get a really good player versus what happens when
Speaker 1: you're nearing the end of your contract. Stuff. It kind
Speaker 1: of delight Sometimes I can't get over the fact of healthy, scratch,
Speaker 1: healthy scratch, you work healthy, you were ready to go.
Speaker 1: By the way, at a position that rotates, right, it's
Speaker 1: a rotational position. And they said, we don't need you today,
Speaker 1: we don't need what happened, I still don't know. I mean,
Speaker 1: Marion Elly doesn't really care who was drafted, what or
Speaker 1: where and all that. He just says, this squad here
Speaker 1: and play. And he wasn't really helping him so and
Speaker 1: that's the part that I think. You know, he was
Speaker 1: banged up a little, but the trainers will tell you like, no,
Speaker 1: he was. He was ready to go, and you know,
Speaker 1: so he that's the start I mean for it being great,
Speaker 1: being good, how about just playing but being on the field,
Speaker 1: and then we'll work from there. He's he's got a
Speaker 1: long ways to go before he is a productive player.
Speaker 1: I think, yep, real quick, before we end the show,
Speaker 1: I do want to give you, give you guys an
Speaker 1: opportunity to throw out some names of guys here in
Speaker 1: the second and third round. Cowboys won't be picking until
Speaker 1: Friday unless they move up into the first round, which
Speaker 1: would take a ton of resources, which I don't think
Speaker 1: probably is gonna happen. But second and third year, maybe
Speaker 1: second and third years, second and third round picks that
Speaker 1: will happen on Friday. Give me some names of some
Speaker 1: guys that fans should be paying attention. Well, we have
Speaker 1: a video that we will produce, I believe today. If
Speaker 1: not today, it'll be tomorrow. Uh. And it was a
Speaker 1: four riders doing a second and third round today. Okay, awesome,
Speaker 1: And I don't mind previewing that a little bit of
Speaker 1: some of the names. I from my standpoint, I went
Speaker 1: with one Thornhill to safety from Virginia. Um, what does
Speaker 1: he do well? He is versatility is great. Uh, he's
Speaker 1: played corner, he's had been had interceptions at corner, He's
Speaker 1: had interceptions at safety. He can he's really good at
Speaker 1: tackling behind the line of scrimmage. I think he's anticipates
Speaker 1: really well. It's got that decent size, a little lanky
Speaker 1: for a safety, but boy, Christmas Chard would snatch him
Speaker 1: up to be a corner. So does he not do well? Um,
Speaker 1: you know, he whis in the second round. I guess
Speaker 1: probably when you're a jack of all trades, you're a
Speaker 1: master of none. So I think that's probably. He's not
Speaker 1: a shut down corner and he's not a ball hawking
Speaker 1: safe you know, but he does get to the ball.
Speaker 1: He had six interceptions last year. I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: so you can make play again that playmate. I'll say this,
Speaker 1: I don't think and I know the guys that study this,
Speaker 1: they really don't think he's a he's a he's a
Speaker 1: fifty eight. They think it's it's hard you get to
Speaker 1: this than you get to this time than that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's probably not gonna be you get to this time
Speaker 1: of year. And the team that's picking tenth overall is like,
Speaker 1: nobody's getting to us. We're gonna have to settle on
Speaker 1: a guy we don't love, which right like, looking at
Speaker 1: it right now, I don't feel great about what might
Speaker 1: be there for him. But who knows, you know, That's
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. Like the very there's so much variation,
Speaker 1: the grades are all over the board. I think it's
Speaker 1: gonna be wild. I think it's gonna be fun. I
Speaker 1: think if they had their way, they would draft a safety.
Speaker 1: Want thorn Hills a guy to watch. I mocked them.
Speaker 1: Chauncey Gardner Johnson out of Florida. Don't think that'll happen either.
Speaker 1: Um Darnell Savage is a guy to watch. Taylor Rapp
Speaker 1: and Jonathan Abram and for some reason they were to fall.
Speaker 1: I think they were like one A and one bum.
Speaker 1: And if they can't get a safety, then I think
Speaker 1: they'll be looking at defensive lineman Jalen Ferguson at a
Speaker 1: Louisiana Tech as a guy, Tristan Hill out of UCF
Speaker 1: as a guy. I think those are two big names
Speaker 1: worth circling. And everyone knows this team needs a safety.
Speaker 1: They've talked about it so many times. So if you're
Speaker 1: sitting at fifty eight and here's a guy you like
Speaker 1: at fifty two fifty three, when what's they gonna take
Speaker 1: to get up there? A fourth rounder? Conceivably yeah, because
Speaker 1: you know someone's gonna gonna try to maybe jump you
Speaker 1: and go we want a safety. Two. But you gotta
Speaker 1: get in front of Dallas. So even though they try
Speaker 1: to say, wow, we don't need a safety, we don't
Speaker 1: need to safety. We got George A Loco. I mean,
Speaker 1: we were good there, but I don't know. And then
Speaker 1: without a first round picks. This is what happens a
Speaker 1: lot of times. This team will go backwards. We think
Speaker 1: they're gonna go up. They might even Gowards to try
Speaker 1: to stop because they're like, if we need a safety,
Speaker 1: we just gotta get above Dallas. As long as we
Speaker 1: stay ahead of Dallas, we can get the guy maybe
Speaker 1: we want, because ten years ago, I mean, you just
Speaker 1: kept going back. You just kept getting twelve picks. And
Speaker 1: surely if you pick twelve guys, somebody's going to be
Speaker 1: a stud. Honestly, if they were to do that, it
Speaker 1: wouldn't bother me because the options that I think are
Speaker 1: going to be there for him at fifty eight are
Speaker 1: not great. But if you could trade back to sixty
Speaker 1: five and add another pick or two in there, then
Speaker 1: I feel better about it. You know, Tristan Hill is
Speaker 1: a guy like fifty eight sounds rich for me, but
Speaker 1: I'm listening in the sixties. Maybe it just like I said, like,
Speaker 1: we did a mock draft on the show last night,
Speaker 1: and like halfway through it, I was like, I don't
Speaker 1: love what we're coming away with here. We got. We
Speaker 1: got Tristan Hill, tray ViOn Williams. We took a safety
Speaker 1: and of a pass rusher in the fourth, um added
Speaker 1: a special teams linebacker in the seventh. Our fifth round pick.
Speaker 1: Oh man, I'm drawn a blank. I think we got
Speaker 1: a wide receiver drinking at this place. It was yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean the big ones. The big ones were Tristan Hill.
Speaker 1: I see the video yesterday. The big ones were Tristan
Speaker 1: Hill and Treyvion Williams. Which you know, again you're talking
Speaker 1: about value. You're picking at the end of the round.
Speaker 1: So pick pick nineties, basically a fourth roun pick. It's
Speaker 1: higher than I would want to pick a running back.
Speaker 1: But Trevion Williams led the SEC and rushing. He's an
Speaker 1: all around guy. I think he could step right in
Speaker 1: and play if for some reason Zeke was unavailable. It's
Speaker 1: not what I would prefer to do. But again, you're
Speaker 1: at the mercy of what so many other teams do that.
Speaker 1: First of all, it's incredibly hard to forecast, and beggars
Speaker 1: can't be choosers. So it's gonna be interesting. I think
Speaker 1: it's gonna be fun because there's gonna be so many surprises.
Speaker 1: So many unpredictable things happen, and I think it'll be
Speaker 1: even more so this year. So hell, maybe they'll come
Speaker 1: away with the safety. I just say this. The beauty
Speaker 1: of what they did in free agency is that they've
Speaker 1: they've basically cleared up all their holes. So to me,
Speaker 1: don't be afraid to take even if it's in the
Speaker 1: second round. If you're if the running back that's on
Speaker 1: the board is so much better than any other position,
Speaker 1: don't be afraid to take the pick because I think
Speaker 1: right now they can only get better by getting more
Speaker 1: talent of playmakers. Right so, and you can find a
Speaker 1: way to figure out how to get them into the
Speaker 1: into the game and use an the only position, and
Speaker 1: you can't do that as quarterback. Every other position you
Speaker 1: can rotate. So try get the best available player, and
Speaker 1: if you do that, I think they'll come out of
Speaker 1: this jag. I agree with. I would feel so much
Speaker 1: better if they did that with a wide receiver. That's
Speaker 1: what I've been saying all along. Deebo Samuel from South Carolina.
Speaker 1: He's there and he's the best guy, Go go for it.
Speaker 1: I don't think they will. Maybe they won't. I think
Speaker 1: they are hell bent on coming away with a defender
Speaker 1: at pick fifty. I think that's where I think you
Speaker 1: get into problems. A sneaky need here is cornerback. I
Speaker 1: really do. I think that it's something to considers. It
Speaker 1: just you don't know what what's gonna happen with Byron
Speaker 1: you don't know, you know, with with Jordan Lewis, and
Speaker 1: you know Anthony Brown will be a free agent. I
Speaker 1: think you need to look at corner and that's why
Speaker 1: those two we just talked about, Thornhill and Gardner Johnson
Speaker 1: are safety slash corners, and it's like you're getting a
Speaker 1: poor man's Byron Jones kind of. Richard's been scouting corners
Speaker 1: for the last two months. So don't forget a little bit.
Speaker 1: Nothing should surprise you. I like a little bit and do.
Speaker 1: The only thing that should surprise you is if they
Speaker 1: draft a quarterback. That's the only thing. Yeah, exactly. That's
Speaker 1: why I don't even think that would be that surprise
Speaker 1: unless you kicker. I mean, they could, I don't think
Speaker 1: they will. But all right, we appreciate you guys joining us.
Speaker 1: We'll be back next week. Make sure you take to
Speaker 1: stay tuned for all of our draft coverage coming up tomorrow,
Speaker 1: Friday and Saturday. We appreciate you guys joining us. Still
Speaker 1: in for Nick Eatn, Dave helm At, Amber Garcia. I'm
Speaker 1: Derek Eagleton. This has been the Break live on Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys dot Com Radio Hole. This has been a production
Speaker 1: of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.