1 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: On this episode of News World. I'm particularly excited because 2 00:00:08,880 --> 00:00:14,000 Speaker 1: my guest is one of the most admired athletes, champion golfer, philanthropists, 3 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,079 Speaker 1: and by the way, somebody who's helped a lot of Republicans. 4 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: The Golden Bear Jack Nicholas the winner of one hundred 5 00:00:21,360 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: and twenty professional tournaments worldwide, including seventy three PGA Tour 6 00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:30,920 Speaker 1: events in a record eighteen major championships over a twenty 7 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 1: five year span. Those majors include six Masters, five PGA Championships, 8 00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:41,559 Speaker 1: four US Open Championships, three British Opens, and amazingly, he 9 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:46,279 Speaker 1: won at least two PGA Tour events in seventeen consecutive 10 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:50,199 Speaker 1: seasons from nineteen sixty two to nineteen seventy eight. In 11 00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:53,559 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty two, his first Tour win, was also his 12 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: first US Open title, and he put on his last 13 00:00:56,800 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 1: green jacket in nineteen eighty six. As a historian, I'm 14 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:04,320 Speaker 1: always interested in how people be in their journey to greatness, 15 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:06,640 Speaker 1: and I've listened to Jack Truck. At one of those 16 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:11,160 Speaker 1: fascinating evenings, we had two Republican golfers of some renown 17 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:16,039 Speaker 1: in speaker John Bayner from the Senator from South Carolina, 18 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 1: Lindsey Graham, who is always golfing with Trump, and Jack Nicholas, 19 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:22,800 Speaker 1: and the three of them talked and it was amazing 20 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:27,039 Speaker 1: to listen to the conversation. So I promptly begged Jack 21 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:30,119 Speaker 1: to join us and talk with us about what's going on. 22 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,040 Speaker 1: It's a great privilege for any of us who've ever 23 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 1: tried to golf to have a chance. So Jack, thank 24 00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:53,560 Speaker 1: you for joining me. And I really want to just 25 00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:56,080 Speaker 1: start with talking about your life, but I want to 26 00:01:56,600 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 1: start with a quote from you. You said quote, golf 27 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 1: was my vehicle to competition, and competition is what I like. 28 00:02:05,040 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: And I'm just curiosed. What tell you to love competition? 29 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,360 Speaker 1: I don't know. I think from an early age my 30 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 1: dad was a good athlete. He played four sports a 31 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:17,639 Speaker 1: high school, started the golf team at South High in Columbus, 32 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:20,960 Speaker 1: and he played football, basketball baseball, played football, basketball baseball 33 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:23,600 Speaker 1: at high State. On the weekends, he went down to 34 00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: Portsmouth and played under an assumed name with the Portsmouth Spartans, 35 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: which are now the Detroit Lions. So he was competitive, 36 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 1: and I think that tertiary went over to me and 37 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: everything that we did, we competed. He'd say Oh, come on, 38 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:41,560 Speaker 1: I'll ratiated the movie theater. Or I bet I can 39 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:43,960 Speaker 1: kick the ball further than you can, or I can 40 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:46,400 Speaker 1: throw that ball further than you can. You know, he 41 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 1: constantly ate me on for competition, and you know, as 42 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,840 Speaker 1: a result, I enjoyed that. I loved it. My dad 43 00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:54,680 Speaker 1: was I don't want my father, but he was my 44 00:02:54,720 --> 00:02:57,440 Speaker 1: best friend and we spent a lot of time together. 45 00:02:57,919 --> 00:03:01,079 Speaker 1: He introduced me to all sports, the everything actually more 46 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 1: than sports, and I guess that competitive nature just came 47 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:08,919 Speaker 1: from there and continued. You said one time, my real 48 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:12,600 Speaker 1: competition was me. What did you mean by that? Well, 49 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 1: in the game of golf, you really can't control whatever 50 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:17,799 Speaker 1: your opponent is doing. I mean, I don't care where 51 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: it was, Arnold Palmer or Gary Player or Tom Watson, 52 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:23,359 Speaker 1: whoever it was. I couldn't control their game. The only 53 00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 1: game I could control was myself. So I had to 54 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:29,679 Speaker 1: play it. I compete against myself to make sure that 55 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 1: I played my best. If I screwed up, then I 56 00:03:32,360 --> 00:03:34,440 Speaker 1: wasn't going to be in contention. So I had to 57 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 1: compete against myself to make sure I was giving it 58 00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 1: my best shot. Do you think in that sense golf 59 00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 1: is particularly focused on sort of self control and self awareness. 60 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:48,000 Speaker 1: It has to be you've got to be aware of 61 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 1: what you're doing all the time, and you have to 62 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:52,800 Speaker 1: have good self control. You don't have it, you know, 63 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 1: it's bye bye down the road. You're not any good, 64 00:03:56,840 --> 00:03:58,920 Speaker 1: you know. As a Georgian, I was intrigued with the 65 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: fact that you reference Bobby Jones as an influence on 66 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:07,080 Speaker 1: both you and your father. How did Bobby Jones influence you? Well, 67 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: he was my dad's eye and my dad had watched 68 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: him win the US Open at Ssiota and Columbus when 69 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: he was a kid, and he'd always been in my 70 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:19,479 Speaker 1: dad's vision. And well, I qualified for the National Amateur 71 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:22,039 Speaker 1: for the first time. I was fifteen years old. I 72 00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:26,039 Speaker 1: was played in Richmond, Virginia, and Bob Jones came out 73 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,040 Speaker 1: to that match. It was a speaker that night, and 74 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 1: he introduced himself on the eighteen screen. I hit a 75 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: ball into the eighteen green and he's called me over 76 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:35,720 Speaker 1: and I didn't met And what Bob Jones looked like 77 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:38,040 Speaker 1: anything else? He says, young man. I'd been here for 78 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 1: you know, three hours, and he says, I'm only see 79 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:43,160 Speaker 1: three people reached the screen and two and you're one 80 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:46,279 Speaker 1: of them, and so he says, I'm Bob Jones says, oh, 81 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,839 Speaker 1: mister Jones. So anyway, he spoke that night at the banquet. 82 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:52,160 Speaker 1: After the banquet was over, he was walking with two 83 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:54,599 Speaker 1: canes at the time, and he came up to me 84 00:04:54,600 --> 00:04:55,800 Speaker 1: and he says, he said, you're not gonna come out 85 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:58,719 Speaker 1: and watch you play a little bit tomorrow. Bob Jones 86 00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:00,719 Speaker 1: is gonna come out and watch me. Fifteen year old 87 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:04,200 Speaker 1: kid and my first nash lamitor. Well, I kept looking 88 00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: for him all day and on the tenth hole, all 89 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:10,160 Speaker 1: of a sudden, down the fairway comes Bob Jones. At 90 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:11,719 Speaker 1: the end of ten holes, I was one up on 91 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:15,240 Speaker 1: a fell named Bob Gardner, who was later a Walker 92 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:19,360 Speaker 1: cup in eisenhowerd Trophy. Good player, And anyway, Bob Jones 93 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:22,360 Speaker 1: came and immediately went bogie bogie double Bogeie. He turned 94 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:24,120 Speaker 1: to my dad and he says, Charlie, and I don't 95 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:26,280 Speaker 1: think I'm doing Jack any good. So he got out 96 00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 1: of there. I got back to even but ended up 97 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 1: losing the match. But anyway, that's sort of developed a 98 00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 1: startup our relationship. And then Jones came a couple other 99 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:35,280 Speaker 1: times to events I was at, and then when I 100 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 1: first qualified for the Masters, when I was nineteen, there 101 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:41,239 Speaker 1: was a little note in my locker inviting my father 102 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 1: and made down to his cottage to talk. And that 103 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 1: little note was there every year, and we went down 104 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 1: every year. I got a lot of wisdom from them. 105 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:53,600 Speaker 1: Taught me a lot of things about life and what 106 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: I needed to do and how I needed to prepare 107 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,920 Speaker 1: myself and how to be responsible for my own game 108 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 1: and not keep running back to my teacher and all 109 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:04,719 Speaker 1: those kinds of things. And so you know, he was 110 00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 1: a great influence on my life and my father's. When 111 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:09,799 Speaker 1: you look back on his record, I realized he played 112 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 1: before you would have watched him. But what's your sense 113 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:16,280 Speaker 1: of how relatively good he was, because at least from 114 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 1: a Georgia perspective, of course, he's a legend. Do you 115 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 1: think that his peaky would have been competitive in the 116 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:24,880 Speaker 1: modern PGA? Oh? Absolutely, it's had a gorgeous golf swing. 117 00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:29,799 Speaker 1: He obviously had a great attitude and a competitive attitude. 118 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: He had a set of golf clubs that they were 119 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:35,479 Speaker 1: all played them all very well except for one club 120 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 1: is four iron, And after he got done playing, they 121 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 1: started measuring swing weights and things with clubs. He had 122 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:44,320 Speaker 1: one club in his bag that was out of kilter. 123 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 1: All the others were a perfect symmetry except first four iron. 124 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:51,479 Speaker 1: That's what he found that out. So you know, he 125 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:53,320 Speaker 1: had a great feel for what to do and how 126 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: to do it. And he would have been a champion 127 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 1: today the same as he was in the twenties and 128 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 1: thirties when he won. He's pre spect well, he said, 129 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:04,040 Speaker 1: of course, a huge impact in Georgia. And I think 130 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 1: and that Augusta there's a certain kind of spirit of 131 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:13,240 Speaker 1: Bobby Jones which permeates Augusta National. Now, when did you 132 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 1: actually take up golf? I was ten years old and 133 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:21,200 Speaker 1: my father broke his ankle. I thought he sprained it 134 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:24,360 Speaker 1: when I was about seven. He ended up having three 135 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: operations on it and refused his ankle doctor told me, says, 136 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 1: Charlie says, you better take up something that you could walk, 137 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 1: otherwise you're going to be in a wheelchair. And he said, 138 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: he said, why I played golf as a kid. He said, 139 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 1: maybe you ought to take up golf. So he couldn't 140 00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 1: make a game with anybody because he couldn't walk very far. 141 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:43,160 Speaker 1: So it took me along. I carried the bag. He 142 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 1: would go play a hole, he'd sitting down and rest, 143 00:07:45,160 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: but played out a hole, he'd sitting down and rest. 144 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:49,080 Speaker 1: While he was rested, I would go chip the button 145 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:52,280 Speaker 1: flew around and so forth. That was the same year, 146 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 1: in nineteen fifty that Jack Grout came to Siota, and 147 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 1: Jack Grout was my lifelong teacher. Well, anyway, he says, 148 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:00,200 Speaker 1: would you like to learn how to play? It said, 149 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:03,280 Speaker 1: of course, And so he turned me over to Jack Grount, 150 00:08:03,320 --> 00:08:05,840 Speaker 1: and Jack Graut got me started, and it was my 151 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: dad breaking his ankles how I started playing golf. Do 152 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 1: you think having the right teacher who got you from 153 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:16,600 Speaker 1: the very beginning into the right habits was a key 154 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 1: to your ability to be such a dominant player. Well, 155 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 1: I don't think that it's so important that a teacher 156 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 1: be a great player or be a great teacher. I 157 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: think what he has to have is a great feeling 158 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:34,760 Speaker 1: of having to care about his pupil. And Jack Grount 159 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 1: cared about me as I started hitting shots as golf claying, 160 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 1: He'd say, Jackie Boys has come out here and show 161 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:41,920 Speaker 1: these kids how to hit a hook, show him how 162 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:43,839 Speaker 1: to hit a slice, Show him to hit the ball 163 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:45,840 Speaker 1: up in the air. He used me as an example, 164 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 1: and I don't even play an a couple of weeks, 165 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:51,080 Speaker 1: and so it made me feel good, and he kept 166 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:54,040 Speaker 1: doing that. I remember my dad was concerned about how 167 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:56,439 Speaker 1: many balls I was hitting because the bill from Sciota 168 00:08:56,520 --> 00:08:59,520 Speaker 1: came home was pretty pretty high for golf balls. Well 169 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:03,240 Speaker 1: that's the lessons charge jack group beyond the time I 170 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 1: was ten years old, never charged me a penny for anything. 171 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 1: He knew that I had a talent and he wanted 172 00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:11,320 Speaker 1: to be part of helping me develop it. And he 173 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:12,840 Speaker 1: was a great guy. But he taught me how to 174 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:16,719 Speaker 1: be responsible for my own game. He taught me how 175 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:20,319 Speaker 1: to control myself and the kind of attitude I should have. 176 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 1: And he grew up as an assistant pro in Fort 177 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 1: Worth of Glen Garden were Ben Hogan and Byron Nelson 178 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:30,560 Speaker 1: were both juniors, and so he knew what was going on. 179 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:32,920 Speaker 1: He'd been around it before, he played the tour for 180 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:35,959 Speaker 1: a while, and he was just a nice man. I 181 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 1: remember when he got into his late seventies, before he 182 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 1: passed away, he called me and he'd said, Jackie boy, 183 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,000 Speaker 1: he says, you're coming out here today. I said, well, 184 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:46,640 Speaker 1: if you want me to je grab you want me 185 00:09:46,679 --> 00:09:48,320 Speaker 1: to come out? And he says, yeah, why don't you 186 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:50,200 Speaker 1: come out and we'll have lunch. We'll got some balls. 187 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 1: And I said, okay, we could do that, so we'd 188 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:55,240 Speaker 1: go out and have lunch. We grew out hit balls. 189 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 1: He may never say a word to me about my 190 00:09:56,920 --> 00:10:01,040 Speaker 1: golf game. We talked about everything. He just I wanted 191 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 1: to be part of what I was doing, and I 192 00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:05,480 Speaker 1: wanted to be part what he did. He was like 193 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:08,040 Speaker 1: a second father to me, and he was just great. 194 00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: I don't care how good you are. There are periods 195 00:10:11,760 --> 00:10:16,240 Speaker 1: in golf when you get frustrated when something either isn't 196 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:19,319 Speaker 1: working or whatever. When you were younger, I mean, you're 197 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:21,839 Speaker 1: starting out at a very early age. How did you 198 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:27,200 Speaker 1: deal with the frustration when it just wasn't quite working? Well? 199 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:30,280 Speaker 1: My father helped me with that too. Remember when I 200 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:32,640 Speaker 1: was eleven years old, we were playing at side of 201 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,760 Speaker 1: the fifteenth old and I had a really good drive 202 00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:37,720 Speaker 1: and I had an eight iron into the green and 203 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 1: I hit the eight iron in the bunker and I 204 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:42,200 Speaker 1: threw the club and the club almost reached the bunker too, 205 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 1: And he looked at me and he says, we'll go 206 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:47,319 Speaker 1: pick the club up, we'll go pick the golf ball up, 207 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 1: and we'll go back to the clubhouse because you're done 208 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: playing today. As a matter of fact, you're done period, 209 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:56,679 Speaker 1: unless you could learn not to do that again. Oh okay, 210 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:00,560 Speaker 1: that's a pretty good lesson. First of all, control your tepper, 211 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 1: control your own actions. And I did the same thing 212 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:08,920 Speaker 1: with my oldest boy, Jackie was eleven when I won 213 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:11,840 Speaker 1: the US Open. It Kevin Bishop. We went to Spyglass 214 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:14,600 Speaker 1: and he hit it down the first hole. It hit 215 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 1: a few bad shots through a club mad so forth. 216 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 1: I said, okay, go pick him up, let's walk back 217 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 1: to the clubhouse. We left done played. It worked magically. 218 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 1: My dad was not stupid. You knew exactly what to 219 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:29,719 Speaker 1: do to get me to do the right thing, So 220 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 1: that was part of it. Then I learned as I 221 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 1: went along that I saw how these other guys did 222 00:11:34,679 --> 00:11:37,720 Speaker 1: stupid things, and I just tried to, you know, model 223 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:42,839 Speaker 1: myself after not being stupid. It's a great hind trying 224 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: not to be stupid while you're doing this. So I'm curious. 225 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:50,439 Speaker 1: There must have been moments when something that had been 226 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: working started to not work, and you had to sort 227 00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 1: of think your way through it and adjust. I mean, 228 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:58,800 Speaker 1: did you have those kind of occasions during your career? 229 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:01,560 Speaker 1: Everybody has it, and you just go back to fundamentals. 230 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:05,440 Speaker 1: I would quite offer in a tournament, if I start 231 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 1: hitting the ball poorly, I'd say, okay, let's check my stance, 232 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:13,000 Speaker 1: let's check my head position, let's check my ball position. 233 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:16,040 Speaker 1: I could check that fairly easily without anying a golf ball. 234 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:18,520 Speaker 1: I'd get to a hole that didn't have a lot 235 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 1: of trouble on it, say okay, now let's check a 236 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:23,439 Speaker 1: couple of other things in the swing, and I'd play 237 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: a couple of shots on that hole, even though it 238 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:28,360 Speaker 1: was in the tournament, to make sure that I knew 239 00:12:28,360 --> 00:12:31,200 Speaker 1: what I was doing. Ah, I got it, and I think, 240 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:34,200 Speaker 1: go and finish my round. But if you can't do 241 00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 1: that on the golf course, you know pretty soon a 242 00:12:36,559 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 1: lot of guys will start making mistakes, and then pretty 243 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:42,920 Speaker 1: soon you've seen it in Congress, they make a mistake, 244 00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 1: and then they multiply their mistakes. You don't need to 245 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:48,760 Speaker 1: do that. So I learned to control myself, learned how 246 00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:51,560 Speaker 1: to manage myself, learn how to teach myself on the 247 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 1: golf course, And you know, as Bob Jones said to me, said, 248 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,160 Speaker 1: I used to run back to Stuart Maiden, who was 249 00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:02,000 Speaker 1: his teacher, and he said, I had my seven lean years, 250 00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:05,960 Speaker 1: he said, until I learned to control myself, manage myself, 251 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:08,839 Speaker 1: and be responsible for my own game. And this is 252 00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:11,200 Speaker 1: when I did that, then I became a golfer. And 253 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 1: I think Jack Grout and obviously heard that somewhere, and 254 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:17,000 Speaker 1: I'd heard from Bob Joe, so we would I hadn't. 255 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:19,079 Speaker 1: We followed that model, and I thought it was a 256 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:22,239 Speaker 1: good model. That's interesting, you know, when I think about 257 00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: the pressure you must have been under in some of 258 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 1: these major events, it would be very easy to suddenly 259 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 1: have something start to go wrong and not be able 260 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:34,560 Speaker 1: to recover. And you've got to be able to recover 261 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 1: literally between two strokes. Well you tried to. You might 262 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 1: take you two or three to get it back. But 263 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 1: I was always able to figure it out get it 264 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:44,920 Speaker 1: back because I was responsible. And some of these guys, 265 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:47,440 Speaker 1: and it's a day, they have teachers that are out 266 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 1: of the practice tea with them before they play, and 267 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,360 Speaker 1: they watched it every shot. They talk about us. I 268 00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: would drive be crazy, and so I didn't want that. 269 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:59,520 Speaker 1: I figured out myself. Jake Grout, he was there a 270 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:01,760 Speaker 1: lot of turn that he never wants stad a foot 271 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:05,560 Speaker 1: all the practice team, and I appreciate that because he 272 00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:06,960 Speaker 1: knew that I had to figure it out. If I 273 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 1: had a question or something and I want to say, 274 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:11,560 Speaker 1: I'd walk back to check check and say, Jae Crowd, 275 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:14,640 Speaker 1: I said, I can't figure this out. He said, check 276 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 1: your head position. He wouldn't tell me what to do, 277 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: say check that or check your left foot. He'd say 278 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 1: something and I'd go back to check. It usually was 279 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 1: the right thing, and then I would be able to 280 00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 1: move on. And that didn't happen very often, but every 281 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:29,680 Speaker 1: once in a a while I did. And of course then 282 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:32,040 Speaker 1: the next time something like that happened, I remembered what 283 00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:52,920 Speaker 1: he'd said, I didn't have to go back. I was 284 00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:56,040 Speaker 1: a little surprised in getting ready to talk with you 285 00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: and looking at your life's experiences. You know, some people 286 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 1: like a Tiger Woods from a very early age or 287 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 1: totally focused on golf, and that's really I think the 288 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 1: only track that they're on. You really had a period though, 289 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:12,720 Speaker 1: when you were young where you were a very successful 290 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 1: insurance agent, and you've actually been named Junior Agent of 291 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 1: the month for the agency. You were making a bunch 292 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,720 Speaker 1: of money, so you had a real break point where 293 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:25,040 Speaker 1: you had to sort of give up what could have 294 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 1: been a pretty darn good financial career in order to 295 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 1: pursue golf. Was that a difficult decision? Well, not really, 296 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 1: I guess the nineteen sixty one and I was making 297 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:39,880 Speaker 1: a little over thirty thousand a year selling insurance. That's 298 00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 1: a lot of money that that translates into a pouty 299 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:45,960 Speaker 1: tost of three hundred thousand dollars today, and as a 300 00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:48,320 Speaker 1: twenty one year old, I think that's pretty good. But 301 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 1: I really wanted to be the best I could be 302 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: at playing golf, and the only way I could be 303 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:57,960 Speaker 1: the best I could be was to play against the best. 304 00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 1: And so I talked to my wife and in the 305 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 1: first job in nineteen sixty one, she says, go for 306 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 1: what you want to do in your life, and I said, okay. 307 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:08,760 Speaker 1: So I turned pro because I wanted to compete against 308 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 1: the best, because that's the only way I could get there, 309 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 1: and it was obviously the right choice for me. Now 310 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,080 Speaker 1: I was out. I remember after about three tournaments there 311 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 1: was an article written in San Francisco, about this young 312 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:23,600 Speaker 1: kid that's coming out on the tour. And they asked 313 00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:25,040 Speaker 1: me how much I thought I could make. I said, oh, 314 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,360 Speaker 1: if I did thirty thousand dollars, I thought I probably 315 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 1: do pretty well. And they said the older guys, look 316 00:16:31,160 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 1: at this cocky young kid coming out thanks he can 317 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:36,200 Speaker 1: come out here and just make thirty thousand dollars like 318 00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:39,320 Speaker 1: it was falling off a log. Well, I did a 319 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:41,280 Speaker 1: little better that. I ended up making about one hundred 320 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 1: and seventeen my first year, So you know, I surpassed 321 00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 1: what I wanted. But I can't always try to climb 322 00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: a mountain. I did that all my life. I always 323 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 1: felt like, if I got this far, I ought to 324 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:54,120 Speaker 1: be able to get this far. I get this far, 325 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 1: I ought to be able to go get this far, 326 00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:58,520 Speaker 1: and you keep working up that mountain. I kept climbing 327 00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:01,000 Speaker 1: that mountain until I was probably, oh, I don't know, 328 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:03,280 Speaker 1: my mid forties. I suppose that all of a sudden, 329 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:05,879 Speaker 1: you know, I sort of fell off the other side. 330 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:09,159 Speaker 1: But that's all right. You know, it's interesting that you 331 00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 1: have this constant self awareness of improving, that you apparently 332 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:19,520 Speaker 1: spent a large part of your life consciously thinking about 333 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: how can I do better, how can I get this 334 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:25,560 Speaker 1: thing to work? And yet I remember you mentioned that 335 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:28,760 Speaker 1: the dinner event I was at that you'd won a 336 00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:32,160 Speaker 1: major as an amateur, which they don't count among your majors, 337 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:35,439 Speaker 1: or you'd have had nineteen. Can you briefly share that 338 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 1: I want two national amas, which were giving me twenty, 339 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 1: and so they took those away maybe after I'd met 340 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:44,639 Speaker 1: a pro for maybe ten fifteen years, all of a sudden, 341 00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 1: the side the National Amber was the major championship anymore. Well, 342 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:49,840 Speaker 1: it was all right with because Tiger one three of them, 343 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 1: so I didn't bother me that much. Yeah, we lost those, 344 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: but then it went a big deal. It was all 345 00:17:57,280 --> 00:17:59,119 Speaker 1: part of growing up and me and part of it. 346 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 1: And I guess the professional majors today is what people count. Well, 347 00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:06,600 Speaker 1: you know it's interesting and I did not know this 348 00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:11,720 Speaker 1: story that you actually competed with Bob Jones's son in 349 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 1: an amateur And the story is that he called his 350 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,120 Speaker 1: dad and said, why don't you come watch? And when 351 00:18:17,119 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: his dad learned who he was going to play against, 352 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:22,879 Speaker 1: he said, in effect, well that'd be a really short match. 353 00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 1: Now I'm told you have a better way of telling 354 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:29,399 Speaker 1: that story Bob Jones. He called his dad and say, hey, Dad, 355 00:18:29,480 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 1: I qualified for the financial Ever can you come out 356 00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:34,199 Speaker 1: and watched me? And he says, well, who are you 357 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 1: playing in the first round? He says, I'm playing something 358 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 1: young kid named Nicholas. He said, well, he says, I've 359 00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:41,440 Speaker 1: seen mister Nickolas play. He says, I'm not going to 360 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:45,480 Speaker 1: come out and watch you play thirteen holes. That's what 361 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:47,959 Speaker 1: we're playing. I beat him six and five. That's wild, 362 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:50,680 Speaker 1: but that's what I enjoyed being Sunday's a nice band. 363 00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 1: When you were first introduced to coach Roud, as I 364 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:58,480 Speaker 1: understand it, he has six fundamentals that he coached you 365 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: on and I think that proudly led to one of 366 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: your first books on how you play golf. Jack was 367 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: very much on fundamentals, being able to understand your stay 368 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:13,320 Speaker 1: as your posture, your head position, your balance, your rhythm 369 00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: a plane from the ground up. I mean, those are 370 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 1: problem with basic things that he had taught. I had 371 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:21,439 Speaker 1: the opportunity to the night when we were with you 372 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:24,679 Speaker 1: to also meet Barbara for the first time, and I'm curious. 373 00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:27,879 Speaker 1: I mean, she obviously is hugely important part of your life, 374 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,119 Speaker 1: and she was just a great hostess. The other evening. 375 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:34,399 Speaker 1: When did you first meet her? Well, I better her 376 00:19:34,480 --> 00:19:38,239 Speaker 1: first week at college. The girl I was dating introduced us. 377 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:42,400 Speaker 1: I walked Barbara off to a class and we don't 378 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:44,600 Speaker 1: decide we're going to date a round and I walked 379 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: Barbara after class ask her for a date. She worked 380 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:49,960 Speaker 1: me in it a couple of weeks and we were 381 00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:53,440 Speaker 1: auto dated. We got penned after a sophomore year, got 382 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 1: engaged Christmas of our junior year, and got married after 383 00:19:57,560 --> 00:20:01,040 Speaker 1: our junior year that summer, and she picked the week 384 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:03,880 Speaker 1: of the PGA Championship to get married because she knew 385 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 1: that I couldn't play in the PGA Championship as an amateur, 386 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 1: and so we did that. But Barbara's been unbelievable. Barbara 387 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:13,560 Speaker 1: is a very smart gal. She was very athletic. She 388 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:17,840 Speaker 1: knew that I needed to support and she really good 389 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 1: about making sure that happened, and so she did that 390 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:26,919 Speaker 1: for about forty years. About seventeen years ago, the Honda 391 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:30,400 Speaker 1: Tournament moved to the Palm Beach area, and they came 392 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:33,160 Speaker 1: to me and asked for ed children's charities in Paul 393 00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:35,800 Speaker 1: Beachhaking's support and I looked at Barbara and I said, 394 00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 1: do you want to go for it? And she says absolutely. 395 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 1: So that's when we formed our foundation. So we formed 396 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:43,760 Speaker 1: our foundation. We've been the main recipient of benefits from 397 00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 1: the Honda and then we have a lot of events 398 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:47,840 Speaker 1: that we use. We've raised a lot of money for 399 00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:51,879 Speaker 1: kids that We've made a relationship with Miami Children's Hospital, 400 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:55,760 Speaker 1: which is now Nicholas Children's Hospital in Miami and Nicholas 401 00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:59,840 Speaker 1: Children's Healthcare System, and we have one main hospital in Miami. 402 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 1: We have twenty outpatient clinics up and down the east 403 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:05,919 Speaker 1: west coast of Florida, and last year, I believe we 404 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:08,600 Speaker 1: saw kids from every state in the Union, in one 405 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 1: hundred nineteen countries. We're pretty global. And I want to 406 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,320 Speaker 1: tell you it changed my life totally. After I got 407 00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:19,640 Speaker 1: done basically playing golf, I was looking for things to do, 408 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:23,879 Speaker 1: and Barbara started doing this and I got interested in it, and, 409 00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 1: as I says, my turn to support her. And so 410 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:30,320 Speaker 1: for the last seventeen years, I've had an absolute blast. 411 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:32,480 Speaker 1: I don't want to run a hospital, but I don't 412 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:35,480 Speaker 1: mind going out and walking into somebody's office and ask 413 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:37,720 Speaker 1: him for a lot of money because I know what 414 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:41,400 Speaker 1: it does. It really helps a lot of kids. That's 415 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:45,240 Speaker 1: really tremendous. And Barbara have been married sixty one years, 416 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 1: and for a fair amount of that time you were 417 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:50,840 Speaker 1: out competing in golf. What's your advice on maintaining a 418 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:54,240 Speaker 1: long successful marriage. First of all, we always looked at 419 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:58,160 Speaker 1: the marriage as being about ninety five kid and five 420 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:01,880 Speaker 1: percent take on both side. Barbara and I've always taken 421 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:05,960 Speaker 1: that philosophy. And you know, I've always looked at my 422 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 1: career as being secondary to by family, and I always 423 00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:14,520 Speaker 1: spent family first, golf, second, business related things. Third, we 424 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 1: have five kids, twenty two grandkids. We now have two 425 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 1: great grandchildren and a third one on the way, and 426 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 1: so we got a big family and we love it. 427 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 1: I made a vow to Barbara when I turned pro 428 00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:28,359 Speaker 1: that I'd never be away from more than two weeks, 429 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 1: and I never was. I never broke that. But if 430 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:33,600 Speaker 1: I was away for two weeks, I would tell you 431 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:36,160 Speaker 1: over the weekend in the first tournament, she'd usually show 432 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:39,200 Speaker 1: up with maybe two in diapers, travel on a commercial airplane, 433 00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:41,840 Speaker 1: fly across the country to spend the weekend with me. 434 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 1: She made a huge effort to make sure that her 435 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:50,320 Speaker 1: kids knew their father, and I know my kids. My 436 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,600 Speaker 1: kids all know me. Four of the five live here 437 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:55,919 Speaker 1: in the Palm Beach area. One lives in Atlanta, but 438 00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:59,439 Speaker 1: his businesses here in Palm Beach, so I see all 439 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:03,359 Speaker 1: our grandkids a lot. Over Christmas holidays, we had five 440 00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:07,000 Speaker 1: different Christmases, one for each family and a different day 441 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 1: or night. We have a great time as a family. 442 00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:11,760 Speaker 1: That's always been by far the most important thing to me. 443 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: Golf is a game. It's a game that's given me everything, 444 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:20,240 Speaker 1: and you know, the foundation and things I do would 445 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,400 Speaker 1: never have hadn't if I hadn't made a few four 446 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 1: foot puts. I understand that we got in a position 447 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:28,040 Speaker 1: to be able to help others, and you know, it's 448 00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:29,800 Speaker 1: really fun to be able to do so. When you 449 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,360 Speaker 1: talk about getting a position to help others, it strikes 450 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,640 Speaker 1: me that to have been as consistent as you were, 451 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:41,879 Speaker 1: I mustn't required a level of perseverance that's really remarkable. Well, 452 00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:43,399 Speaker 1: I think you have to have it, you have to 453 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:45,720 Speaker 1: know what you have to do. But I never did 454 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:49,120 Speaker 1: it at an expense of my family, and I think 455 00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,240 Speaker 1: that was important. Maybe I was one of the lucky ones. 456 00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:54,040 Speaker 1: I mean You've got some guys who will hit balls 457 00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:56,440 Speaker 1: twenty four to seven and that's all they do is 458 00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:59,680 Speaker 1: play golf, and I feel sorry for them. Frankly, they're 459 00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:02,199 Speaker 1: miss seen out so much in life. Could I have 460 00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:03,919 Speaker 1: one more tournaments? I think I could have won a 461 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,159 Speaker 1: lot more tournaments, but I think it would have been 462 00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:08,840 Speaker 1: the expense of my family and the expense of living 463 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 1: a balance life. And I really enjoyed living to balance life. 464 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,879 Speaker 1: It's been something that I don't consider myself and I 465 00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:17,200 Speaker 1: don't think my friends considered me to be anything other 466 00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 1: than Jack Nicholas was five kids and joining two grandkids. 467 00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:23,359 Speaker 1: And we'll go out and we play tennis on the weekend, 468 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:26,160 Speaker 1: or we go boating or go fishing or whatever we do, 469 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:29,320 Speaker 1: and I'm just another guy, and I like it that way. 470 00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 1: I don't want to ever be a special cat. Well 471 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:34,920 Speaker 1: you sort of buy your achievements or special, but you're 472 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:38,520 Speaker 1: pretty normal. Special I tried to be. You said to 473 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,919 Speaker 1: me many years ago that you could learn things in 474 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 1: one round of golf with somebody about sort of how 475 00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:49,199 Speaker 1: to measure who they really were. Oh, golf is unbelievable. 476 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:51,440 Speaker 1: You can go spend a lot of time a guy 477 00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 1: every place. You take them out on the golf course, 478 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,200 Speaker 1: You're going to find out their temperament, You're going to 479 00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:00,160 Speaker 1: find out how you could approach them. You find there's 480 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 1: so many think about from their mannerisms on the golf 481 00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:05,520 Speaker 1: course that you know, when you get back to the 482 00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:08,479 Speaker 1: office and sit down and talk about business, it then 483 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,159 Speaker 1: becomes a piece of cake. Well, and you've emphasized a 484 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:15,720 Speaker 1: lot the importance of integrity. Oh boy, you don't have 485 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 1: any integrity. You got nothing. That's sort of the way 486 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,400 Speaker 1: I feel. I'm sure you've always felt the same way. 487 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:23,680 Speaker 1: I think that's exactly right. It's one of the things 488 00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:26,879 Speaker 1: we tragically don't have enough of in the current culture. 489 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 1: They have very little of it. Kind of think it's 490 00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: a huge problem. It's a huge problem we have today. 491 00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:00,240 Speaker 1: At your peak, when you were really out there, it 492 00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:02,399 Speaker 1: was sort of a band of brothers with you and 493 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: Arnold Palmer and Gary Player. You must have gotten to 494 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,200 Speaker 1: know each other very well because you were consistently competing 495 00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:11,040 Speaker 1: with each other. Somehow, there must have been an interesting 496 00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:14,879 Speaker 1: interplay of the three of you as personalities. It really 497 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 1: was interesting because you know, Arnold would rather be at 498 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 1: a party with three hundred people he didn't know than 499 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:25,119 Speaker 1: with four friends to dinner. I would rather be with 500 00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:27,679 Speaker 1: four friends at dinner than a party with three hundred. 501 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:32,520 Speaker 1: Gary Player. He'd like both. Gary's the most energetic guy 502 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 1: I've ever met. They're both great guys. Are both there's 503 00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: two close to friends as I've ever had. Arnold was 504 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,879 Speaker 1: very kind and very generous. But did he liked to 505 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,760 Speaker 1: compete who he loved compete him. I always called him 506 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:48,240 Speaker 1: on his birthday, and I called him two weeks before 507 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 1: he passed, which was his birthday of September tenth. Called 508 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,360 Speaker 1: him every year and I knew are it wasn't doing 509 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:58,280 Speaker 1: very well? He says, how you doing their ap? He says, 510 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,880 Speaker 1: I'm doing fantastic. He said, you can't believe how good 511 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:03,680 Speaker 1: I feel. I said, I'm figured I'm gonna out and 512 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 1: start playing support golf. And I said, I can get 513 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,199 Speaker 1: back to golf again. Now he was lying to mean 514 00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:11,600 Speaker 1: something awful, but he wasn't going to give in to me. 515 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 1: You know, That's the way he was. It was competitive, 516 00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:17,560 Speaker 1: and I love that Gary Player plays golf six days 517 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:21,359 Speaker 1: a week. Now if they did handicapped, Gary Player averages 518 00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:24,800 Speaker 1: about seventies. Gary playing plus two or three hendicap. I mean, 519 00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:29,439 Speaker 1: he's unbelievable, eighty six years old. I played golf twice 520 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:33,760 Speaker 1: last year. I have no interest whatsoever playing golf. I'm terrible, 521 00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 1: but that's okay. I played my golf. But you know, 522 00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:40,400 Speaker 1: we've all had different personalities. But our wives became very 523 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:45,119 Speaker 1: close friends. Winnie Palmer and Vivian Player and Barbara became 524 00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:47,439 Speaker 1: like three amigo. So they just spent a lot of 525 00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,840 Speaker 1: time together. They got to know each other. They traded 526 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,879 Speaker 1: off thoughts, and Barbara would ask Winnie. She said, Monny, 527 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,080 Speaker 1: how did you handle Arnold when you got mad at him? 528 00:27:57,520 --> 00:27:59,359 Speaker 1: She said, oh, boy, says he was tough when I 529 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 1: got it. Sometimes come up from a tournament and I 530 00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:03,399 Speaker 1: want to just beat him over the head to something. 531 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:05,960 Speaker 1: But I wouldn't say anything because maybe he was like 532 00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:08,199 Speaker 1: Tuesday or Wednesday, and I didn't want to bother his 533 00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:11,600 Speaker 1: game for the weekend. And she said, but then when 534 00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:13,399 Speaker 1: the weekend came along and the tournament was over, I 535 00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:17,080 Speaker 1: forgot what I was mad about. So she had all 536 00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:18,800 Speaker 1: that way, so Barbara had, it'll be a little bit 537 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:22,320 Speaker 1: that way. Vivian was very soft spoken. I remember one 538 00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 1: time Gary had kids around a lot and He found 539 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:27,640 Speaker 1: a driver that he really liked, and he said, boy, 540 00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:29,919 Speaker 1: I'll tell you one thing. He says, if I had 541 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,119 Speaker 1: to choose between this and my wife, I said, you know, 542 00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,919 Speaker 1: I sure miss Vivian. Well, anyway, Gary got home in 543 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 1: South Africa. He got there first night, he got went 544 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:40,600 Speaker 1: to bed and there was a golf club wrapped up 545 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:45,240 Speaker 1: in a neglijay. Vivian nowhere to be found. We all 546 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:47,560 Speaker 1: passed those stories around. We all had to fund if 547 00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 1: one of us shot a bad round, we couldn't wait 548 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,080 Speaker 1: to get to the locker room to sit next to 549 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:56,160 Speaker 1: the other guy's locker. It would say seventy five the 550 00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 1: day are and huh where did you get all your birdies? 551 00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 1: You know, start kidding him, and we started laughing because 552 00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,080 Speaker 1: garyt I probably at sixty eight or nine. But then 553 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 1: what we do would shake hands. He finished the round, says, 554 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 1: let's go have dinner. Where are we going to night? 555 00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:11,000 Speaker 1: We spent a lot of time together and enjoyed it. 556 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: We traveled together, we did all kinds of things together, 557 00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,240 Speaker 1: and we all became great friends. And you know, unfortunately 558 00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,480 Speaker 1: Arnold's past, but Gary and I good gracious we see 559 00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:23,600 Speaker 1: each other. You know, he's in South Africa right now. 560 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:25,800 Speaker 1: But well, you see each other three or four times 561 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:29,680 Speaker 1: a week, that's great. Well I'm curious. You know, Palmer 562 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 1: preceded you a little bit, and fame was already emerging. 563 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:37,320 Speaker 1: And Palmer had this knack of surging at the very 564 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 1: end and sort of charge, and that was his moat. 565 00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 1: I've always been curaged by because I also see it 566 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:44,880 Speaker 1: with some football teams that you know, they go along, 567 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:46,360 Speaker 1: they go along, and they go along, and then all 568 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 1: of a sudden there will be this burst. And Palmer 569 00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:51,600 Speaker 1: sort of had this knack of coming along at the 570 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:53,640 Speaker 1: very end when it looked like he was almost out 571 00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:56,800 Speaker 1: of it, and then suddenly he just began eating up 572 00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:59,440 Speaker 1: the rest of the field. My sense was that you 573 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:03,400 Speaker 1: had a much steadier style. Arnold played to the crowd 574 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:06,960 Speaker 1: of it, and he loved being around the crowd. And 575 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,440 Speaker 1: when he'd hit it off in the trees and then 576 00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:11,040 Speaker 1: he hit a shot out of the trees, hit a 577 00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:13,680 Speaker 1: little low slicing running up on the green and the 578 00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,920 Speaker 1: people would go wild. That just charged him up. So 579 00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 1: when he got near the end of the tournament, if 580 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,200 Speaker 1: he made it Bertie, all of a sudden, the people 581 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:22,680 Speaker 1: got very excited, and he just went with the crowd. 582 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,240 Speaker 1: I couldn't do that. If I did that, I'd lose 583 00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:28,120 Speaker 1: my focus and couldn't get back to it. So I 584 00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: had to keep a little bit more of an even keel. 585 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 1: I think Gary player would be acted like he was 586 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 1: getting charged. But I think Gary needed to pull himself 587 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,480 Speaker 1: back a little bit because Gary sometimes got too excited 588 00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:41,240 Speaker 1: and couldn't play. We were all different, and that's what's 589 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 1: life's all about, but we all loved being able to compete. 590 00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:48,040 Speaker 1: Arnold was ten years older than I am. Gary's four 591 00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:50,280 Speaker 1: and a half years older than I am. Arnold came 592 00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:53,080 Speaker 1: from Heart first, and Gary and Arnold competed together, and 593 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:55,000 Speaker 1: then I joined them, and when I was the third 594 00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 1: one of the crowd. It's interesting because each of you 595 00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:00,800 Speaker 1: are successful, but each of you is very different, very different. 596 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:03,880 Speaker 1: I'm curious where did the golden bear come from as 597 00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,680 Speaker 1: a nickname? Well, just before I turned pro, Mark McCormick, 598 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:11,480 Speaker 1: who represented me to start with from IMG, went to 599 00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,920 Speaker 1: Australia and I felt, I'm Don Lawrence with a Melbourne 600 00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:17,960 Speaker 1: age wrote an article about me. He called me a 601 00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:22,680 Speaker 1: cuddly golden bear in the article. Now I was big 602 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,360 Speaker 1: and blonde at the time, and I was a pretty 603 00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:29,480 Speaker 1: big guy without by today's standards, obviously, but I was there. 604 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:33,040 Speaker 1: But anyway, so the first contract I had was a 605 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:37,440 Speaker 1: shirt contract, and we're looking for an emblem, and we 606 00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 1: looked through all kinds of things. In college nicknames is that. 607 00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:43,640 Speaker 1: And high school I went to was the Upper Arlington 608 00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 1: Golden Bears, and the article called the Golden Grass. You know, 609 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,280 Speaker 1: I've been a Golden bearl in my life. Why not 610 00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 1: just stay one? And so I just picked up the 611 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:56,320 Speaker 1: Golden Bear and that's what I used, and it serviced 612 00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:59,720 Speaker 1: me very well. Well dinner, it's a great definer. I'm 613 00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:03,080 Speaker 1: all's not curious. You're not only a great athlete, obviously, 614 00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 1: but you also studied it. I mean my impression was, 615 00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,200 Speaker 1: as often as you played Augusta, you would still go 616 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:13,040 Speaker 1: back a week early and just sort of renew your 617 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:16,440 Speaker 1: acquaintance with the course. There's no excuse for not being 618 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:21,720 Speaker 1: properly prepared. I always felt that, even though I played Augusta, 619 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 1: the course it's different every year. The fairway grass a 620 00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 1: little bit different, greens a little bit different. The buggers 621 00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:28,400 Speaker 1: say it's a little bit different. They make a few 622 00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:31,280 Speaker 1: odd changes here and there, and I always wanted to 623 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:35,040 Speaker 1: make sure that when the tournament started, I had all 624 00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,280 Speaker 1: those changes, all those little quirks out of the way, 625 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 1: and say it was a US sofa. Every how deep 626 00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 1: is a rough? How hard are the greeds, how fast 627 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: the greeds, how narrow are the fairways? Went ahead of 628 00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: time and made sure I got all that all the 629 00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:52,160 Speaker 1: way down. Most of the guys would come in on Monday, 630 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,720 Speaker 1: a Tuesday the tournament, and when Thursday rolled around they 631 00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:57,320 Speaker 1: were still trying to figure out how to play the 632 00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,360 Speaker 1: golf course. Well, I did all that the week ahead time, 633 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:02,120 Speaker 1: and once I got it out of the way a 634 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: week ahead of time, when I got to deserve it, 635 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:05,880 Speaker 1: all I had to do was play golf because the 636 00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:08,600 Speaker 1: other part was solid in my head and I wasn't 637 00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:11,640 Speaker 1: going to forget it. And so I think that helped 638 00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:15,480 Speaker 1: me tremendously in the major championships. Obviously it was amazing. 639 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 1: Now in some ways, I think your most remarkable win 640 00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:23,200 Speaker 1: was the eighty six Masters. You were forty six years old. 641 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:25,040 Speaker 1: I think a lot of people thought it was nice 642 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:27,320 Speaker 1: you were playing, but you really weren't going to compete, 643 00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:30,720 Speaker 1: and you were actually like one over par and six 644 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:32,640 Speaker 1: shots out of the lead. This is a little bit 645 00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:36,160 Speaker 1: like Arnold Palmer. I mean you suddenly went from a 646 00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,880 Speaker 1: time for a ninth place in boom, you shot a 647 00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 1: thirty on the back nine. What came together? How did 648 00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:45,520 Speaker 1: that happen? Well? I sort of started earlier in the 649 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:49,160 Speaker 1: year and McGregor, which I owned at the time, made 650 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:51,640 Speaker 1: this big putter. It was about, oh, I don't know. 651 00:33:51,880 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 1: It was six or seven inches long, maybe eight inches 652 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:57,320 Speaker 1: and ugly. It's looking thing you've ever seen. And I 653 00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:59,240 Speaker 1: struggled with a start with but they kept telling me 654 00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:01,840 Speaker 1: how well the ball would But finally, by the time 655 00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:03,960 Speaker 1: I got to the mastress, I started putting the ball 656 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,920 Speaker 1: pretty well. I wasn't hitting the ball that great, but 657 00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:08,640 Speaker 1: by the week ahead of time I started out, I 658 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:11,200 Speaker 1: shot seventy four much wasn't much, and then I shot 659 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:14,160 Speaker 1: seventy one, and then I shot sixty nine and I 660 00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:16,080 Speaker 1: started hitting the ball pretty well, but I wasn't funny. 661 00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:18,600 Speaker 1: Then I sat sixty nine, started putting. Then I got 662 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:21,200 Speaker 1: to the last round that I had eight guys in 663 00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:23,440 Speaker 1: front of me. I was in ninth place and I 664 00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:26,040 Speaker 1: was only four shots behind. And I didn't think that 665 00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,799 Speaker 1: was a big deal. I've overcome that before. And my 666 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:34,120 Speaker 1: son Steve called me. He was working the Hattiesburg tournament 667 00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 1: for a company, and he says, what do you think, Pops, 668 00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:39,879 Speaker 1: And I says seaver. I says, I think sixty six. 669 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:42,919 Speaker 1: Oh time, sixty five will win. He says exact number 670 00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:47,000 Speaker 1: I got in mind, go shoot it, said okay, And 671 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,279 Speaker 1: my son was on the bank. Jackie, my mother and 672 00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,799 Speaker 1: my sisters came to the mastress, first time they come 673 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,879 Speaker 1: to the mastress since nineteen fifty nine, twenty seven years 674 00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:01,040 Speaker 1: in between, and a lot of thing eggs happened, and 675 00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:04,640 Speaker 1: I saw I got excited about being in contention. I 676 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:07,360 Speaker 1: got up on Sunday morning. I started running through my 677 00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:12,200 Speaker 1: wardrobe and I ran across the yellow shirt and I 678 00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:14,839 Speaker 1: looked at the yellow shirt and I said, Barbara, I said, 679 00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:18,040 Speaker 1: what do you think Craig would think of this? She says, 680 00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:20,680 Speaker 1: I Craig would like it. Rag Smith was a young 681 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:24,680 Speaker 1: boy who I developed a relationship with. He was a 682 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,000 Speaker 1: son of our minister at home, and he developed eue 683 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:31,919 Speaker 1: sarcoman passed away in nineteen seventy one at the age 684 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 1: of thirteen. I called him one day and he says, 685 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:36,960 Speaker 1: you know, why you won today, don't you? Said, well, 686 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:39,319 Speaker 1: how's that, Craig, And he says, I wore my lucky 687 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,160 Speaker 1: yellow shirt so he could wear a yellow shirt for me. 688 00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 1: I could wear a yellow shirt for him. So I 689 00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:46,960 Speaker 1: never said much about that story, but I wore a 690 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:50,960 Speaker 1: yellow shirt quite often on Sunday for him. And so 691 00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:55,040 Speaker 1: fifteen years had passed and I pulled the yellow shirt out. 692 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:57,640 Speaker 1: So that was another thing that I got there, and 693 00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 1: Barbe said, go for it, so I wore the shirt. 694 00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:02,960 Speaker 1: I had a lot of things happening that day, and 695 00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:06,040 Speaker 1: I started out. I really played the front nine sort 696 00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:08,480 Speaker 1: of not very good. I was even part going to 697 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:10,680 Speaker 1: the ninth hole, and I had about a twelve footer 698 00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:13,840 Speaker 1: at the ninth hole, and I got up over the 699 00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:15,719 Speaker 1: ball and a big roar went up at the eighth 700 00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,840 Speaker 1: hole and Bias stairs and hold a win shot for 701 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:22,120 Speaker 1: eagle and he was leading the tournament. And then before 702 00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:24,080 Speaker 1: I could get back over again, Tom Kite had a 703 00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:26,520 Speaker 1: shot and he hold a winch too. It also big 704 00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:29,920 Speaker 1: Roar another eagle, and so it sort of relaxed me 705 00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:32,920 Speaker 1: and I turned to the gallery around man says, well, 706 00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:34,759 Speaker 1: if they could make that kind and nobody's up there. 707 00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:36,840 Speaker 1: Let's see if we can make some noise here. I 708 00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:40,200 Speaker 1: knocked up put in. The crowd erupted, and then I 709 00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:42,879 Speaker 1: just started. I hold a twenty five twenty five footer 710 00:36:43,080 --> 00:36:45,440 Speaker 1: and I just kept making Burris shot that thirty on 711 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:48,960 Speaker 1: the back nine and so. And the funny thing was, 712 00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:52,600 Speaker 1: it wasn't that I was ready to do that. I 713 00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:55,840 Speaker 1: wasn't that far out of being competitive that I didn't 714 00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 1: remember how to play. I remembered how to play the 715 00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:01,319 Speaker 1: back nine. I remember how to compete. I remembered how 716 00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:04,799 Speaker 1: to finish. And so that's what I did, and it 717 00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:07,719 Speaker 1: was exciting. It was probably obviously the most fun nine 718 00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:10,759 Speaker 1: holes I've ever played. That's wild. I'm curious you mentioned 719 00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:13,359 Speaker 1: I'm sinking a series of twenty five fos. Did you 720 00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:17,240 Speaker 1: find that there were periods when it all just clicked 721 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:20,719 Speaker 1: and you could sink apart from amazing distances, and then 722 00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:23,160 Speaker 1: there were periods when you were going to come up 723 00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:26,880 Speaker 1: slightly short? We always that way. I mean, you know, 724 00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:29,880 Speaker 1: I wouldn't make it many puts earlier the tournament. Then 725 00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:31,680 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, the last nine holes I made everything. 726 00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:34,920 Speaker 1: I looked at the last round of tournament golf. I 727 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:38,200 Speaker 1: played was a Saint Andrews in two thousand and five 728 00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:41,759 Speaker 1: and I wanted to make the cut very bad. I 729 00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,279 Speaker 1: didn't want to finish my career on a Friday, and 730 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:48,799 Speaker 1: I shot seventy tiered the first round and it looked 731 00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:51,160 Speaker 1: like one forty four was going to make a cut. 732 00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:53,920 Speaker 1: I was all around the whole all day, couldn't make it. 733 00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:59,360 Speaker 1: Put saved my life, and finally I bogeed seventeen that 734 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,120 Speaker 1: put me through over the plot for the tournament. I 735 00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:05,279 Speaker 1: knew I wasn't going to make the cut, and the 736 00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:08,440 Speaker 1: eighteenth old I had twelve feet by the whole thirteenth feet, 737 00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 1: and I knew that since the turmy was over, I 738 00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:14,080 Speaker 1: was going to make that put. I say, didn't make 739 00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:15,799 Speaker 1: any much. Where I hit the put, the whole would 740 00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:18,200 Speaker 1: move and get in my way, and it did. I 741 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:19,960 Speaker 1: made the putt, but I mean, you know, it's funny 742 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:22,560 Speaker 1: how you can't make things happen, and all of a 743 00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:26,040 Speaker 1: sudden they just happened. And I ended my career with 744 00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:30,160 Speaker 1: a birdie. And I started my major championship career with 745 00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:34,040 Speaker 1: a birdie at Invertus in Salado in nineteen fifty seven, 746 00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:36,440 Speaker 1: when I was seventeen years old the US Open, So 747 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:40,000 Speaker 1: I started an inn with a birdie. Pretty good symmetry 748 00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:43,479 Speaker 1: and a pretty good framing to your career. Well, all, listen, 749 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:46,840 Speaker 1: I want to thank you for joining to You're not 750 00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:49,839 Speaker 1: just one of those extraordinary golfers, but you're a remarkably 751 00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:52,640 Speaker 1: good person. And you and Barbara are doing great things 752 00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:56,439 Speaker 1: with the Nicholas Children's Healthcare Foundation. And so we're gonna 753 00:38:56,480 --> 00:39:01,240 Speaker 1: link both to Nicolas Design and to the Children's Healthcare 754 00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:03,840 Speaker 1: Foundation on our show page. And I want to really 755 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:07,680 Speaker 1: thank you for taking time to share these insights from 756 00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:11,160 Speaker 1: a lifetime of extraordinary achievement. Well, thanks to I appreciate 757 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:14,239 Speaker 1: that I've always enjoyed being with you and talking with 758 00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 1: you through the years. You don't think I've ever walked 759 00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:20,359 Speaker 1: away from you not learning something I don't know about that? 760 00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:22,720 Speaker 1: Well I do. We've had great wisp and you've handled 761 00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:25,480 Speaker 1: your life well, and every time you come on television, 762 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:28,640 Speaker 1: we never changed the channel. Well listen, tell Barbara we 763 00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:31,280 Speaker 1: said hi, and Chlison and I wish you a wonderful 764 00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:33,840 Speaker 1: year and look forward to seeing you again. Thank you 765 00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:39,760 Speaker 1: so much. I appreciate it. Thank you to my guests. 766 00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:43,600 Speaker 1: Jack Nicholas, you can learn more about Nicholas Design and 767 00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:48,480 Speaker 1: Nicholas Children's Healthcare Foundation on our show page at newsworld 768 00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:51,920 Speaker 1: dot com. News World is produced by Gingwich three sixty 769 00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 1: and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer is Garnsey Slow, our producer 770 00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:01,480 Speaker 1: is Rebecca Howe, and our researcher is Michel Peterson. The 771 00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,600 Speaker 1: artwork for the show was created by Steve Penley. Special 772 00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:09,000 Speaker 1: thanks to the team at Gingwidge three sixty. If you've 773 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:12,279 Speaker 1: been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll go to Apple Podcast 774 00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:15,719 Speaker 1: and both rate us with five stars and give us 775 00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:18,560 Speaker 1: a review so others can learn what it's all about. 776 00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:22,560 Speaker 1: Right now, listeners of Newtsworld can sign up for my 777 00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:27,000 Speaker 1: three free weekly columns at Gingwidge three sixty dot com 778 00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:31,080 Speaker 1: slash newsletter. I'm Newt Gingridge. This is Newtsworld.