Speaker 1: I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset.
Speaker 2: When I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset.
Speaker 1: And when I find my.
Speaker 3: Ball in a bride egg Frida egg, the dreaded Frida
Speaker 3: egg Frida egg, Frida egg egg Frida egg, bride egg.
Speaker 2: Lie, I'm about ready to run off the golf course.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Friday Egg Golf Podcast. I'm Garrett Morrison,
Speaker 1: and today we're talking about where Live Golf stands at
Speaker 1: the end of its twenty twenty three season. The Saudi
Speaker 1: Funded Golf League's Team Championship in Miami is coming up
Speaker 1: this week, so I figured it would be a good
Speaker 1: time to take stock and see what's going on in
Speaker 1: Live Golf. My guest is Adam Woodard. He's a reporter
Speaker 1: for Golf Week who covers Live on a regular basis.
Speaker 1: He and I will talk about a variety of storylines
Speaker 1: that defined this year for Live including its recent rejection
Speaker 1: by the Official World Golf Ranking, which is currently playing
Speaker 1: out as a controversy. We're also going to talk about
Speaker 1: liv's supposed agreement with the PGA Tour where that stands,
Speaker 1: as well as the league's declining status in the news cycle.
Speaker 1: I think it's fair to say that we haven't heard
Speaker 1: as much from Livegolf this year. Before we get to Adam, though,
Speaker 1: I wanted to put in a quick word for fridayg
Speaker 1: Golf's membership. It's called Club TFE and you get a
Speaker 1: number of things with it, including in depth golf course
Speaker 1: write ups and videos and other content. You can find
Speaker 1: out about everything that comes with the membership at the
Speaker 1: Frida Egg dot com slash membership. But one specific thing
Speaker 1: we did for members recently was give them a sneak
Speaker 1: peek at our twenty twenty four Friday Golf Events calendar.
Speaker 1: We've got a bunch of cool golf courses lined up
Speaker 1: for our twenty twenty four events. Some of these events
Speaker 1: are exclusive to Club TFE members and for others, members
Speaker 1: will have early access for registration. That is a major
Speaker 1: perk of being part of CLUBTFE. So again, sign up
Speaker 1: at the Friday dot com slash membership and we hope
Speaker 1: to see you in the club. All right, here is
Speaker 1: Adam Woodard on Livegolf's twenty twenty three season. All right,
Speaker 1: Adam Woodard, why don't we start with the latest news
Speaker 1: out of livegolf World, and that is that the tour's
Speaker 1: application for official World Golf Ranking points has been denied.
Speaker 1: Maybe not a big surprise, but can you take me
Speaker 1: through this story and why it's important for Live and
Speaker 1: its players.
Speaker 2: I'm kind of actually surprised that it wasn't accepted, given
Speaker 2: how long it took. I mean, it's the whole discussion
Speaker 2: was what usually takes a year. It could be up
Speaker 2: upwards of a year long process for a lot of people.
Speaker 2: I think when that one Asian tour got Funder got points,
Speaker 2: it was almost eighteen months, and that was right in
Speaker 2: the middle of Live's application last year in July. So
Speaker 2: I thought the longer that it went on, it was
Speaker 2: kind of going to be like, oh, they might actually
Speaker 2: they're working out a way to give them points, whether
Speaker 2: it's based on only a select few, it's based on
Speaker 2: the tournament. You know, it's obviously going to be tiered.
Speaker 2: You know that they won't get the same amount of
Speaker 2: points that a PGA Tour, a DP World Tour event
Speaker 2: would get. But I thought they might actually get them.
Speaker 2: But at the same time, I'm not surprised that they didn't.
Speaker 2: The one thing I am kind of shocked about was
Speaker 2: was Liv's response to not getting points. I thought the
Speaker 2: one thing that really stood out from that very lengthy
Speaker 2: statement that they put out was they didn't once address
Speaker 2: the main issue that the OWGR brought up, which is
Speaker 2: the fact that they couldn't get around the fact that
Speaker 2: it's a closed door circuit, which is ninety five percent
Speaker 2: true and the five percent that it's not true is
Speaker 2: Live does plan to have that promotion relegation for next season,
Speaker 2: but it's only three players that can get in, and
Speaker 2: players who are relegated can still play their way in,
Speaker 2: so like it's not like in you know, in English football.
Speaker 2: We know a lot about English soccer. Excuse me that
Speaker 2: we know a lot of you know, promotion relegation. Once
Speaker 2: you're relegated, like you're in the bottom tier, like you're
Speaker 2: done for the next year, you can.
Speaker 1: Work your way back up. Yeah, yeah, you've got to,
Speaker 1: like a spend a year in the lower league exactly.
Speaker 1: You're not going to spend a year on the Asian Tour.
Speaker 1: You can spend stenson or whatever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you spend two months without a job for next year,
Speaker 2: but then you can still play your way into through
Speaker 2: one of those spots that they do give for the
Speaker 2: Asian Tour, the Order of Mayor the International Series, that
Speaker 2: Order of Merit. You know, that's how Andy oagle Tree
Speaker 2: is going to get a spot for next year. He's
Speaker 2: basically already locked in for that. So they have three
Speaker 2: spots up for grabs. So it's not a fully closed circuit,
Speaker 2: but for the most part it is. But I just
Speaker 2: thought it was crazy that they released that huge, long,
Speaker 2: lengthy statement, like Tiger Woods esque level of saying a
Speaker 2: whole lot with will saying nothing at all, and the
Speaker 2: fact that they didn't address the one concern that the
Speaker 2: OWGR brought up I thought was kind of of kind
Speaker 2: of interesting and telling in a way.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is a little bit odd. Why don't we
Speaker 1: do basics for a second here? What were the stakes
Speaker 1: of this decision by the ow GR for live What
Speaker 1: would it have meant for them to get World Ranking points?
Speaker 1: And what doesn't mean that they are apparently not going
Speaker 1: to get them?
Speaker 2: Well what it What it would have meant had they
Speaker 2: gotten points was easier access into majors. As we all know,
Speaker 2: you know, the o wgr's main position is yes, ranked players,
Speaker 2: but it also goes through to get players into majors.
Speaker 2: Now the stakes now, now that they're not going to
Speaker 2: be getting points is well, are the majors going to
Speaker 2: have to think up some sort of you know, exemption
Speaker 2: criteria for live players. Do you take the top five,
Speaker 2: the top ten, the top whatever from their points list
Speaker 2: and give them exemptions into majors?
Speaker 1: Maybe?
Speaker 2: Who knows. I think that's going to be the easiest
Speaker 2: way to do what each major can have already has
Speaker 2: their own credit is already has their own criteria for
Speaker 2: giving exemptions in spots. So I think every major is
Speaker 2: probably going to have a different take on Live going forward,
Speaker 2: if they have any at all, or if the status
Speaker 2: quo remains the same. If you've seen Phil Michelson on
Speaker 2: Twitter this morning, he's going off and doing his thing,
Speaker 2: replying to people and giving his opinions. But I think
Speaker 2: the biggest issue now is going to be, well, you know,
Speaker 2: Live is saying that the OWGR isn't a credible world
Speaker 2: ranking system anymore, And in some ways you could there
Speaker 2: is some merit to that if they're not going to
Speaker 2: be ranking those live players. But at the same time,
Speaker 2: Live has been open to changing its format. They don't
Speaker 2: Live officials will say this all the time if you
Speaker 2: ask how it's going and you know, what's the talking
Speaker 2: point for him? They say, well, you know, we're building
Speaker 2: the plane while it's already in the air. So and
Speaker 2: that's what they've been doing for the last eighteen months
Speaker 2: when they started, when film made those scary mphors quote.
Speaker 2: You know, they've been adapting, they've been changing quickly. And
Speaker 2: that's been something they've been able to do, is they
Speaker 2: can make changes if they see fit and if they
Speaker 2: need to. Is Live going to be able to put
Speaker 2: their pride aside and change up some things to open
Speaker 2: up the doors a little bit? I don't think that's
Speaker 2: going to happen in the short term. A lot of
Speaker 2: their players still have a year or two left on contracts,
Speaker 2: so that'd be kind of difficult to do to open
Speaker 2: up more positions for players. But it's it's that at
Speaker 2: this point, it's looking like if Live doesn't change their format,
Speaker 2: they're not getting points. It seems to be as simple
Speaker 2: cut and dry as that. But we'll see what happens
Speaker 2: over the next you know, three or four months or so.
Speaker 2: With the framework agreement. Maybe that changes something if this
Speaker 2: deal does get pushed through, But it's it's all up
Speaker 2: in the air right now. With even more so. But
Speaker 2: the ramifications for them not getting points is going to
Speaker 2: be pretty big going forward.
Speaker 1: I should clarify that we are recording this on Thursday,
Speaker 1: October twelfth. It's going to come out next week. I
Speaker 1: should always make that note when we're discussing Live because
Speaker 1: these are dynamic situations. But yes, as you mentioned this morning,
Speaker 1: Phil Mickelson took to Twitter as he does, and he
Speaker 1: loves it. He can't he can't get enough. He and
Speaker 1: stop himself.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, so he's he's going at Trevor Immlman, Kyle
Speaker 2: Porter like everybody can get it, Like step up if
Speaker 2: you Phil is. Phil is ready to go this morning,
Speaker 2: and he's ready to go this week.
Speaker 1: He's taken on the world. So his basic argument, as
Speaker 1: as far as I can tell, is that the majors
Speaker 1: are protecting themselves. And this would seem to be an
Speaker 1: odd argument because the main entity that gets protected by
Speaker 1: Live not receiving World ranking points would surely be the
Speaker 1: PGA Tour because if Live doesn't have world ranking points,
Speaker 1: a lot of currently informed great players are not going
Speaker 1: to go there because they don't want to risk missing
Speaker 1: the majors. But Phil is taking this a step further
Speaker 1: and saying that the majors are protecting themselves because after all,
Speaker 1: it was the governing bodies and the majors that made
Speaker 1: this decision essentially, and so his basic argument is a
Speaker 1: little bit convoluted to my ear. But what he's saying
Speaker 1: is that if there were a world in which Live
Speaker 1: had world ranking points and all of the best players
Speaker 1: in the world decide to play for Live, then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, Live would have more bargaining power with
Speaker 1: the majors, and that would ultimately hurt the majors because
Speaker 1: they would have to end up, I guess, giving up
Speaker 1: more money to the players because Live is more player
Speaker 1: focused as far as Phil is concerned, and so the
Speaker 1: majors don't want that. According to Phil, that's his argument.
Speaker 1: Is this what people in Live world are starting to
Speaker 1: think about the owgr issue, that it's not just j
Speaker 1: Monahan and the PGA too are pulling the strings with it,
Speaker 1: that all of the majors are sort of ganging up
Speaker 1: against Live and trying to make sure that it's not successful.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they've been Lived, folks, and people tied in with
Speaker 2: Live have been playing the victim cards since they tried
Speaker 2: to team up with the menotaur in the middle of
Speaker 2: the night, thinking that would automatically get them points.
Speaker 1: And that's such a strange little story, and it's always
Speaker 1: one gambit that Live used to try to get World
Speaker 1: Ranking points, one of the manyiate itself with essentially a
Speaker 1: dead tour that did happen to have OWGR status.
Speaker 2: Just thinking that just because if you say, oh, we're
Speaker 2: aligned with them now, that's going to get us in
Speaker 2: like that that I still can't believe, like reporting on
Speaker 2: that story and calling people figuring that out. It's one
Speaker 2: of the most it's one of the what more wild
Speaker 2: moves that LIVE has made over the last few last
Speaker 2: few years. But it also shows they're willing to try
Speaker 2: anything to get points. So going back to what we
Speaker 2: said earlier, that means they might be willing to open
Speaker 2: up their criteria and change things up because they are
Speaker 2: willing to do whatever it takes to be successful and
Speaker 2: to get that seat at the table. They've shown that
Speaker 2: now they want to do everything other than comply with
Speaker 2: the OWGR, which they have also shown. But I just
Speaker 2: think it's crazy how you know, they're just willing to say, hey,
Speaker 2: you know what, we're gonna try this and it's just
Speaker 2: trying to speak it into existence. And then the massive
Speaker 2: issue that the OWGR has with them, they just don't
Speaker 2: even address it, don't even talk about it. It's just
Speaker 2: if it blows my mind that they're not even willing
Speaker 2: to entertain that publicly, but no live officials that they
Speaker 2: wanted play the victim card. They were saying this. In Mexico,
Speaker 2: we had one of those like behind closed doors meetings
Speaker 2: with the select group of the media to talk about
Speaker 2: their their pathways to live in their promotion relegation system,
Speaker 2: and even then stuff was talked about how they were
Speaker 2: they were weren't getting the kind of response from the
Speaker 2: OWGR that they thought that they deserved, and at that
Speaker 2: point they had already put their application in and didn't
Speaker 2: make any changes to their system. So I don't really
Speaker 2: know what they were looking for other than they knew
Speaker 2: what was what was expected of them and what the
Speaker 2: OWGR wanted, and they just expected them to bend over
Speaker 2: and do what they do what they say, and that's
Speaker 2: just not going to happen. It's's there's too many different
Speaker 2: entities at play, and I think it's really important to
Speaker 2: point out what you said a lot of what Live
Speaker 2: officials were upset with early on throughout this process was
Speaker 2: the fact that you know, Jay Monahan Keith Pelly got
Speaker 2: from the PGA Tour and the dp World Tour were
Speaker 2: on the board and they thought that that was a
Speaker 2: massive conflict of interest, which in a way, yeah, kind
Speaker 2: of was, so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they recused themselves.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and then it was the majors that did it.
Speaker 2: So now they're directing fire at the majors and it's
Speaker 2: it's it's the same thing all over again, but instead
Speaker 2: of you know, Monahan and Pelly in the Crossairers, that's
Speaker 2: going to be the Green Jackets at Augusta National, the
Speaker 2: folks at the RNA, and the PJ of America.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and this Live versus the Major's stance that now
Speaker 1: seems to be getting adopted by the likes of Phil
Speaker 1: Mickelson is a little bit odd to me because one
Speaker 1: thing that the majors can do to render all of
Speaker 1: this irrelevant is just to provide an acceptable number of
Speaker 1: spots in their tournament to the top whatever number of
Speaker 1: players on the Live points list, and that would essentially
Speaker 1: circumvent the owgr's power to determine which players get to
Speaker 1: play in the majors. Now, I should be more specific
Speaker 1: about this because I believe that the PGA Championship does
Speaker 1: not currently use OWGR. Crisis here, right, Yeah, the Masters does,
Speaker 1: and the US Open does. I often get this wrong,
Speaker 1: so to the listeners, I apologize. I'm a golf architecture reporter. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but in any case, I think that's the case. And
Speaker 1: so there are complexities with each major that need to
Speaker 1: be considered. But if the PGA Championship, the US Open,
Speaker 1: and the Masters and the Open Championship all decided, we're gonna,
Speaker 1: you know, say that the top ten or twelve on
Speaker 1: the Live points list, you all can be in the major.
Speaker 1: Suddenly the OWGR stuff is kind of irrelevant, right, because
Speaker 1: that's all this really boils down to, is access to
Speaker 1: the majors.
Speaker 2: I agree, yeah, And I think the one thing that
Speaker 2: I also find interesting is the fact that they want
Speaker 2: to play the victim card, but also two of those
Speaker 2: majors you can go play your way into, like their opens.
Speaker 2: Like if you want to play the Open, you want
Speaker 2: to play the US Open, go qualify, Like you knew
Speaker 2: that this was going to be a potential, you know,
Speaker 2: risk when you went to Live that was well, known,
Speaker 2: and anybody who says it wasn't well known as lying
Speaker 2: or naive or an unpleasant mix of the two. But
Speaker 2: like Taylor Goochs last year getting all upset about not
Speaker 2: getting in, like then go qualify, and then he played
Speaker 2: the victim woe is me card they don't want me there.
Speaker 2: If they don't want me there, I'm not going to go. Well,
Speaker 2: then then stop complaining and and pipe down and go
Speaker 2: play on Live and go go make your tens of
Speaker 2: millions of dollars like he's made this year, and he's
Speaker 2: played well this year on Live. I'll give it to
Speaker 2: him not to pop Taylor too much, even though he's
Speaker 2: a very easy target for some of the stuff that
Speaker 2: he says sometimes. But it's just that just that look
Speaker 2: at us woe is us thing that it just it
Speaker 2: drives me nuts when there are there are ways around
Speaker 2: this and this can be avoided. But to your point, though,
Speaker 2: I think, like I said earlier, and like you just said,
Speaker 2: it's going to come down to the majors giving exemptions.
Speaker 2: But I have no idea like what what number would
Speaker 2: be would work? And what number is the proper ways
Speaker 2: at five? Is it ten? Like I have no idea
Speaker 2: what that it would even look like or what would
Speaker 2: even need to go into creating that kind of exemption criteria, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I don't know if anyone would even be
Speaker 1: happy with the number, yeah, that they'll always would come
Speaker 1: up with, you know, number of thirteen on the list.
Speaker 1: If it's twelve, would be like, well what about me?
Speaker 1: You know, So so it would all kind of be messy.
Speaker 1: But I suppose major exemptions kind of always are.
Speaker 2: There's always somebody on the outside looking in. Yeah, right.
Speaker 1: That is the source of the owgr's power right now.
Speaker 1: That's why everybody is arguing about it. That's really what
Speaker 1: it comes down to, because otherwise it's just a ranking
Speaker 1: that I don't know, some players kind of care about
Speaker 1: getting world number one and invest in that, but I
Speaker 1: feel like that feeling maybe has gone away over the
Speaker 1: past couple of years. And that really what it comes
Speaker 1: down to is access to the majors, and that is
Speaker 1: why the OWGR is currently powerful. But you know, the
Speaker 1: OWGR has criteria.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and which which they said can be flexible to
Speaker 2: be fair, they said they can be flexible with some
Speaker 2: of the areas which they said in the you know,
Speaker 2: Dawson said to the said to Doug Ferguson with the
Speaker 2: AP and his and his initial story that broke that news,
Speaker 2: like they're willing to be silence.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah they are. You know, criterias maybe a misleading.
Speaker 1: They're not requirements, they're not rules. They're guidelines that the
Speaker 1: OWGR board uses to determine whether a certain tour qualifies.
Speaker 1: And a lot of tours have have qualified that haven't
Speaker 1: necessarily had the had that you know, most consistently competitive
Speaker 1: or traditional types of events, and so to an extent,
Speaker 1: you can understand why some Live folks are are unhappy
Speaker 1: with this decision. But now that we all are aware
Speaker 1: of what the owgr's key criteria are in a way
Speaker 1: that we definitely weren't a few years ago. I mean,
Speaker 1: I know so much more about what the OWGR asks
Speaker 1: of a golf league now than than than I was,
Speaker 1: you know, a couple of years ago. But Live can
Speaker 1: make some changes, presumably to reverse this decision next year.
Speaker 1: I don't know if they're inclined to do that, whether
Speaker 1: there's any chance that they're going to do that, But
Speaker 1: what changes would need to make? What are the key
Speaker 1: things here? Would it be this kind of promotion and relegation,
Speaker 1: you know, open access to the league and a possibility
Speaker 1: of being demoted from the league. Is that the main
Speaker 1: issue or are there other things that Live would need
Speaker 1: to alter in order to become acceptable to the AUWGR.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm looking into this more now because now this
Speaker 2: has really peaked my interest over the last few days
Speaker 2: with all of this happening and really digging into what,
Speaker 2: you know, what the OWGR wants from a Live But
Speaker 2: if you just look at the AP story, the main
Speaker 2: reason was the fact that it was a closed system
Speaker 2: and that they don't have an open door policy for
Speaker 2: other players to play their way in. If you can
Speaker 2: only allow three new players at most or four new
Speaker 2: players at most in and it's it just doesn't It
Speaker 2: doesn't seem like that's going to be the way to go,
Speaker 2: and they're going to need to open that up to
Speaker 2: even more people. And the fact that like if you're
Speaker 2: a captain and you are in the relegation zone, you're
Speaker 2: automatically in Like the way that Live sees contracts, they
Speaker 2: see them as exemptions basically, so if however many years
Speaker 2: Phil has left on his deal, he could come DFL
Speaker 2: in every event for an entire year, and as long
Speaker 2: as he still has a contract for that next year
Speaker 2: as a captain, he's in. Like, there are two guys
Speaker 2: currently I think it's Martin Kimer and Lee westwood. Lee
Speaker 2: west would one of three captains for the Majestics, I
Speaker 2: might add, So they have three guys that are locked
Speaker 2: in no matter how bad they play.
Speaker 1: It's like a yeah, it's if you have.
Speaker 2: If you have three captains, do you even have one?
Speaker 1: I don't know, definitely not. It's got to be a
Speaker 1: financial thing of some sure.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The question and the fact that it's it's it's
Speaker 2: Lee west Wooden and Martin Kimer. Who to Martin Kimer's
Speaker 2: you know, defense, He's been hurt for most of the year,
Speaker 2: so he's obviously going to be towards the bottom. But
Speaker 2: they're in that drop zone area, those last four spots.
Speaker 2: But because they have contracts for next year and their
Speaker 2: captains they're in, they don't get to there. They're not
Speaker 2: getting dropped. So I think that's another thing that you
Speaker 2: can't have. You can't call it promotion relegation if you
Speaker 2: have built in you know, I don't know, I don't
Speaker 2: know what the word is, but built in production. Thank you, yeah,
Speaker 2: to to keep players. And the one thing I also
Speaker 2: think is just is just so funny is the fact
Speaker 2: that for that promotion relegation event, I think it's like
Speaker 2: the top two hundred or two fifty maybe from the
Speaker 2: OWGR are allowed to go to that promotion relegation in
Speaker 2: that promotion tournament that they're going to have next year.
Speaker 2: So it's like on one side live saying, oh, these guys,
Speaker 2: you know that the OWGR, like, let's condemn it. It's
Speaker 2: not credible anymore. And then at the same time they're
Speaker 2: using it to fill their promotion fields. Like it's just
Speaker 2: I just find that so funny. The fact that it's
Speaker 2: just like talking.
Speaker 1: To they're not going to use the SI World Golf rankings.
Speaker 2: That come come, use the Golf League, Sacharine rankings ahead
Speaker 2: the head, you know, to go to Data Golf. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's something in it. Yeah, there are there are other
Speaker 2: options out there, you know.
Speaker 1: It's so funny actually, because there are a number of
Speaker 1: alternate rating rankings that have popped up in the past
Speaker 1: couple of years now. I don't even want to name them,
Speaker 1: but they're on Twitter and they're trying to get attention
Speaker 1: for themselves. And Sports Illustrated of course, came up with
Speaker 1: its own ranking that was, you know, endorsed by lab
Speaker 1: Golf Cutters, which connected with Bryson to Shambau, et cetera.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, look into that story yourself. But there
Speaker 1: are these other rankings, but every time I see one
Speaker 1: of them mentioned, I see a somebody from Golf Week,
Speaker 1: you know, will pop in and be like, what about
Speaker 1: the Sagarine rankings. We've been around for a while. Why
Speaker 1: is nobody paying any attention to the Sagarine rankings? And
Speaker 1: it's true that Golf Week has been doing this for
Speaker 1: a while. Golf has a pretty good broad ranking, so
Speaker 1: there are resources available, but the OWGR is really still
Speaker 1: the authoritative one, even even for people on Live. So
Speaker 1: that is anyway, Okay, I think we've talked enough about
Speaker 1: the rankings issue, but that is gonna that's the that's
Speaker 1: the main news right now, and it's going to continue
Speaker 1: to be discussed for sure, and it will affect potentially
Speaker 1: the way that Live shapes itself over the next few
Speaker 1: years because this is obviously very important for the recruiting
Speaker 1: of players to have some kind of pathway to the
Speaker 1: major all right, So.
Speaker 2: Like, yeah, you're the only incentive new players would have
Speaker 2: to go is the money. At this point, there's nothing
Speaker 2: else that's there.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, right, yeah, and and and players who are
Speaker 1: in their prime, yeah, are going to want to play
Speaker 1: in the majors. And that's that's kind of one of
Speaker 1: the amazing things that we've learned through this whole Live
Speaker 1: ordeal that the majors still have real power that goes
Speaker 1: beyond money. The players who are in their prime want
Speaker 1: to play those events because they know that's where their
Speaker 1: legacy is formed. And that's something although the majors offer
Speaker 1: incredible amounts of money, it's it's really not about that.
Speaker 1: So that's that's at least one thing that we have
Speaker 1: learned that that isn't totally sole killing over the past
Speaker 1: couple Yeah. Yeah, all right. So the other huge Live
Speaker 1: related story this year is that Live in the PGA
Speaker 1: Tour have established a framework agreement.
Speaker 2: The Public Investment Fund in the PGA Tour. And it's
Speaker 2: not a merger. It's not a merger. My bad, My bad,
Speaker 2: My bad, just because there we're going to come for
Speaker 2: you on that one. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I know, I know, looking on Public Investment
Speaker 1: Fund of Saudi Arabia. It's Live has nothing to do
Speaker 1: with it, right, nothing to do with as if Live
Speaker 1: isn't a subset of the public.
Speaker 2: As if as if the chairman of Live isn't gonna
Speaker 2: be Yeah, isn't going to be the new chairman of
Speaker 2: the board for this new entity. Yeah, but they're not
Speaker 2: connected at all.
Speaker 1: It's all it's all yasirs all the way down. So
Speaker 1: uh yes, I'll remind it who we're referring to. Hear,
Speaker 1: all right, So, the Public Investment Fund of Saudi Arabia
Speaker 1: and the PGA Tour have established a framework agreement. They
Speaker 1: dropped the litigation against each other that was ongoing, and
Speaker 1: have essentially agreed to work together in the future. Can
Speaker 1: you give me and our listeners an idiot's guide to
Speaker 1: what this agreement basically contained.
Speaker 2: The one big thing that you mentioned was the dropping
Speaker 2: of the lawsuits. I think that was honestly the biggest
Speaker 2: thing to move for them. If they were ever going
Speaker 2: to move forward, they had to stop the lawsuits first,
Speaker 2: and if they were ever going to have any.
Speaker 1: The only it's the only thing that's rest Maybe.
Speaker 2: We'll see what happens. Yeah, well, we'll see where it
Speaker 2: comes from. There but no, it's the dropping of the
Speaker 2: lawsuits was definitely the biggest thing to come from it.
Speaker 2: It's well, it's frankly the only thing that's come from
Speaker 2: it at this point outside from some very funny Senate hearings. Uh,
Speaker 2: it's it's it's confusing to wrap your head around because
Speaker 2: I know you and I were talking offline yesterday. It's like,
Speaker 2: one day I think it's going to go through the
Speaker 2: next day I don't. But basically, the short answer version
Speaker 2: is they drop the lawsuits, and that the the PIFF
Speaker 2: and the PGA Tour and the dp World Tour, we're
Speaker 2: going to combine their assets to make a for profit
Speaker 2: golf entity called a new cod I think the new
Speaker 2: code there was, PGA Tour, whatever they were thinking about
Speaker 2: calling it. There's going to create a for profit entity
Speaker 2: that they're going to be able to make money off
Speaker 2: of and to bring their their products together. It's gonna
Speaker 2: inject a whole bunch of life and money into the
Speaker 2: PGA Tour while also giving PIFF the ability to to
Speaker 2: break their way officially into golf and to have even
Speaker 2: a bigger seat at the table than they already do.
Speaker 2: They have until the end of the year to push
Speaker 2: this through. From people that I'm talking to it, some
Speaker 2: are very adamant that it's going to happen, and some
Speaker 2: are starting to, well, maybe not, And I think the
Speaker 2: truth is somewhere in the middle. I think, like everything
Speaker 2: that's happened over the last eighteen months, it's going to
Speaker 2: go to the eleventh hour. It's gonna come end of
Speaker 2: December before we get any sort of movement on this.
Speaker 2: I think there's just so much at stake for the
Speaker 2: future of professional golf as we know it, for the
Speaker 2: future of the PGA Tour, potentially the future of the LPGA,
Speaker 2: if there is any sort of movement on that front,
Speaker 2: which there have been rumors and talks at twenty twenty
Speaker 2: five or twenty twenty six that PIFF and Live might
Speaker 2: want to start getting involved with the women's game. At
Speaker 2: some point, that's all conjectured. That's all just rumors and
Speaker 2: hearsay of people talking about what may happen. That's not
Speaker 2: me reporting anything, Let's get that clear. But there's just
Speaker 2: so much money at stake here, and there is so
Speaker 2: much on the line that I'd be shocked if it
Speaker 2: doesn't go through because both sides have way too much
Speaker 2: to lose if it doesn't go through, I think, and
Speaker 2: what I don't even know what twenty twenty four would
Speaker 2: look like if this doesn't go through.
Speaker 1: At this point, you think there's a kind of deadline here,
Speaker 1: right for sure, that this has to be something has
Speaker 1: to be done before the seasons start up again. Okay,
Speaker 1: very interesting. I mean, we're getting reports right now. Bob
Speaker 1: Harrig of SI I believe recently reported that there could
Speaker 1: be a delay in making this agreement official, which is
Speaker 1: not surprising, but it does, you know, I mean that
Speaker 1: there if there's no action by the time the seasons
Speaker 1: start up again, then then what good is the framework
Speaker 1: agreement at all? I suppose. So, so there is a
Speaker 1: little bit of time pressure here on these two sides.
Speaker 1: So all right, so it's a looking at this deal
Speaker 1: from the piffs perspective or from Liv's perspective. Why do
Speaker 1: you think they thought it was a good idea?
Speaker 2: I think, well won the lawsuits for on on both
Speaker 2: sides to the aisle there like some some bad stuff
Speaker 2: was going to come out on both sides. You have
Speaker 2: a feeling where, you know, with the things that Live
Speaker 2: was doing with you know, some of their some of
Speaker 2: their actions at getting players to go and some of
Speaker 2: the some of the things they've done, and then obviously
Speaker 2: with the PGA Tour and trying to keep players, I'm
Speaker 2: as I'm I'm only assuming that there was some some
Speaker 2: less than stellar things happening behind the scenes when it
Speaker 2: comes to to vendors and wanting to keep players and
Speaker 2: all that. It's just it didn't seem like it was
Speaker 2: all above board, and it's I think it's gonna save
Speaker 2: face for a lot of both of the operations, except
Speaker 2: for you know, the PJ Tour now goes back on
Speaker 2: their word of saying, you know, we're not going to
Speaker 2: have to do this. You know you've never when Jay
Speaker 2: said you never had to apologize for playing on the
Speaker 2: PGA Tour, all that goes all that good will goes
Speaker 2: out the window with that. But with Live and I
Speaker 2: think with with Yaser in particular, it just adds even
Speaker 2: more legitimacy. If you're if you're with A, if you're
Speaker 2: connected to the PG Tour and the DP World Tour,
Speaker 2: there's still seen as outsiders. They're still seen as this upstart,
Speaker 2: renegade circuit that's out there where. If you finally have
Speaker 2: this coming together and you can invest in, and you
Speaker 2: can invest with the PGA Tour and work alongside the
Speaker 2: PGA Tour, like we talked about earlier, that probably opens
Speaker 2: up the door to getting more access to majors. That
Speaker 2: it's all interconnected. All of these golf organizations are all
Speaker 2: intertwined and interconnected, and they all feed off of each other.
Speaker 2: So for for Live to get an even bigger seat
Speaker 2: at the table for that, it just made too much
Speaker 2: sense for them to try and make this move and
Speaker 2: come together. And frankly, just speaking on a completely like
Speaker 2: thirty thousand feet view, like a divided game isn't good
Speaker 2: for anybody. Sure, it drives up competition and stuff, but
Speaker 2: for the fans, for the people that really matter, you know,
Speaker 2: a divided divided tours, divided circuits don't do anything. So
Speaker 2: if this can open up the door to get these
Speaker 2: players back, to get some of the best players back
Speaker 2: in majors, to get to reduce some of the divisiveness,
Speaker 2: I get it. I completely understand it. I didn't think
Speaker 2: it would happen as quickly as it did, with only
Speaker 2: a year and a half in to live with they
Speaker 2: make that decision was at June sixth I think was
Speaker 2: the was the day that the MSNBC interview and all
Speaker 2: that happened. But there's just right to me, there's too
Speaker 2: much on the line. There's too much to lose for
Speaker 2: this not to go through, I think, and it's especially
Speaker 2: on the PGA Tour side, now that you know they're
Speaker 2: they were hurting for money with the with some of
Speaker 2: the decisions that they made, and the court cost fees
Speaker 2: were we're going to be a problem coming up here
Speaker 2: in the future. But it's there's just so much that
Speaker 2: both sides can gain from this.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it seemed like you know, one thing, one
Speaker 1: advantage that the PIFF had was money.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no doubt the.
Speaker 1: PGA Tour was getting hurt by the costs of litigation.
Speaker 1: The PIFF really wasn't. But it seems like there are
Speaker 1: a couple of things that were hurting or could hurt
Speaker 1: both sides, one of which you mentioned discovery, but also
Speaker 1: you know, Lives Golf League hasn't skyrocketed. No, it hasn't.
Speaker 1: It hasn't really taken off. I mean, it just seems
Speaker 1: like a if it had taken off more, then there
Speaker 1: would have been no need to partner or to intend
Speaker 1: to partner with the PGA Tour.
Speaker 2: And I think a lot of that stem from the
Speaker 2: players that they brought in for a year or two.
Speaker 2: None of them really moved the needle. They didn't get
Speaker 2: a sort of Dustin Johnson. They didn't get a Bryson.
Speaker 2: They didn't get a Patrick Red, you know, they didn't
Speaker 2: get a Cam Smith. They got a Charles Howell the third.
Speaker 2: You know, they got a few other people like that.
Speaker 2: They didn't get the big name talent that I think
Speaker 2: they thought they were going to get in the second
Speaker 2: go around. And I think that's affected there. They're product though,
Speaker 2: it's they still have a product that works and that
Speaker 2: stands on it's that stands separate on its own. Whether
Speaker 2: you like it or not. There's a market for it.
Speaker 2: That's that's been true since you and I met each
Speaker 2: other at the first event in Portland last year. It's
Speaker 2: been there's a market for it. Just depends on what
Speaker 2: you want out of professional golf. And like you said,
Speaker 2: the interest just isn't hasn't been there around the golf
Speaker 2: this year like they thought it would come. Sunday at events. Sure,
Speaker 2: when the team event gets close and it gets tight
Speaker 2: at the end, it's like any sporting competition, you know,
Speaker 2: you can you can sleep through the first you know,
Speaker 2: through the first couple of quarters for a lot of things.
Speaker 2: But then once it gets tight at the end, that's
Speaker 2: when it gets interesting. And you can see the fans
Speaker 2: do feed off of the team energy and these guys
Speaker 2: really do care about the team aspect. At first, I
Speaker 2: thought that was all just kind of bs with the
Speaker 2: whole goal. We feel like we're back in college golf.
Speaker 2: Like I genuinely believe that's real. Like these guys are
Speaker 2: having fun together now and now that they've got the
Speaker 2: team stuff worked out, like you can genuinely tell they
Speaker 2: love playing for each other. They love this this new aspect,
Speaker 2: this different take on golf. I thought it was going
Speaker 2: to be complete nonsense and that there was all just
Speaker 2: you know, a company line to to explain the move
Speaker 2: and taking the money. But the team aspect is real,
Speaker 2: I'll say that. But it just still, like you said,
Speaker 2: just hasn't quite caught on the way that they thought
Speaker 2: it would. But like I said, it's it's still two
Speaker 2: years in. They gets still very very early and lives
Speaker 2: in lives defense, they are still very early on in
Speaker 2: this and granted they had unlimited money to get this
Speaker 2: thing off the ground. But the fact that they were
Speaker 2: able to host an event as successfully as they did,
Speaker 2: host eight events in a half a year as successfully
Speaker 2: as they did it was impressive.
Speaker 1: And TV is a big part of this. I want
Speaker 1: to talk about that a little bit later. First, just
Speaker 1: a if you clean up things on the framework agreement issue.
Speaker 1: I've been having a hard time personally envisioning what a
Speaker 1: post official agreement Live PGA Tour landscape would look like.
Speaker 1: What would be different about the PGA Tour? What would
Speaker 1: be different about Live? If these two entities were to
Speaker 1: unite through this nonprofit organization, would Live end? Would it
Speaker 1: have a reason to continue to exist? Would the PGA
Speaker 1: Tour be significantly different? I mean, have you thought this through,
Speaker 1: like what this world would be like?
Speaker 2: I have. I can't quite game plan what it looked
Speaker 2: like for the PGA Tour outside of them having more
Speaker 2: money to throw around and being able to increase per
Speaker 2: sizes a little bit and be able to maybe up
Speaker 2: there up the production for some of what they're doing
Speaker 2: for Live. I don't see anything changing in twenty twenty
Speaker 2: four if this deal does go through. They've got a
Speaker 2: schedule pretty much locked in at this point, aside from
Speaker 2: a few tweaks and changes. Can't quite get that confirm,
Speaker 2: but I've got it on pretty good authority that they're
Speaker 2: there for twenty twenty four and basically set to go
Speaker 2: for twenty twenty five. They're already looking ahead from talking
Speaker 2: to Live officials, they're already planning out courses for the
Speaker 2: future for I know some of their contracts were up
Speaker 2: with a few of the courses that they've posted events
Speaker 2: at the last two years, but they're already looking at
Speaker 2: properties for twenty twenty five. They've got places that are interested.
Speaker 2: I think Live would expand and be the worldwide tour
Speaker 2: that it wants to be. I think we'll see more
Speaker 2: worldwide events and less US events going forward. I think
Speaker 2: those will be the majority. It'll probably be a good
Speaker 2: four or five still here in the States, but I
Speaker 2: think you'd see eight or nine potentially across the world,
Speaker 2: and they want to branch out. This is what Greg
Speaker 2: Norman's wanted since he tried to do the World Tour
Speaker 2: in ninety four, and this is what Yaser loves too.
Speaker 2: Like he loves Team Golf, he loves this Live concept.
Speaker 2: And if he's gonna be the new chairman and the
Speaker 2: head of the board for this new co. Live's not
Speaker 2: going anywhere. It's his baby. He will fight tooth and
Speaker 2: nail to keep it and to and to keep it going.
Speaker 2: And I think now that we're starting to see Live teams,
Speaker 2: you know, bring in sponsors and get apparel deals and stuff,
Speaker 2: they're showing that they can be like, they can be profitable.
Speaker 2: And that's another profitable wing for the public investment Fund.
Speaker 2: So sure, they're still way far in the red given
Speaker 2: how much they've paid to get this thing off the ground,
Speaker 2: the billions of dollars that they've thrown at this, but
Speaker 2: they Live is showing that in ways it can be profitable.
Speaker 2: And with they got the seed, they got the cw
Speaker 2: TV deal that's not going to be a long term thing.
Speaker 2: That was a hey, we're going to do this to
Speaker 2: show other you know, broadcast partners that we can do this.
Speaker 2: So I think this means more for Live going forward
Speaker 2: than it does for the tour. I haven't quite gotten
Speaker 2: to figure out what it would look like, but I
Speaker 2: would be shocked if Live goes away, and maybe in
Speaker 2: the long term, if it doesn't stem out and if
Speaker 2: the team concept doesn't quite catch on like they think,
Speaker 2: But in the short term, I think it's going to
Speaker 2: be a lot of trial and error. Let's see what
Speaker 2: happens and we'll learn from it and move on, kind
Speaker 2: of like how Live has been the last two years.
Speaker 1: I think the thing that puzzles me about this potential
Speaker 1: for these two tours to work together. And I don't
Speaker 1: expect you to know these details or for anybody to
Speaker 1: know how this would work, but would Live players then
Speaker 1: get to play in PGA Tour events fairly freely? What
Speaker 1: would it mean for a PGA Tour player like Xanderschoffle
Speaker 1: or Patrick Cantley to say I'm going to Live. Yeah,
Speaker 1: obviously the PGA Tour wouldn't want that. But if the
Speaker 1: PIFF and the PGA Tour are working together, then are
Speaker 1: they rival leagues anymore? And will the PGA Tour have
Speaker 1: anything to say to a player who is departing for Live,
Speaker 1: because right now it makes sense that these are rival leagues.
Speaker 1: You don't want a player to leave the PGA Tour
Speaker 1: and go to Live, and once a player makes that decision,
Speaker 1: it is kind of definite. But what does that all
Speaker 1: look like if there's this nonprofit entity that the PGA
Speaker 1: two who were in the pit for collaborating on.
Speaker 2: I think, going to what you said earlier, I think
Speaker 2: one of the biggest misconceptions about players who went to
Speaker 2: Live is that they all want to come back to
Speaker 2: the PGA Tour. Most of them don't. Talking to a
Speaker 2: lot of the people that I've spoken with and talked to,
Speaker 2: they are very happy with their format. I know cam
Speaker 2: Smith said it yesterday in the JEDA press conference. He
Speaker 2: likes the fact that they're at fourteen events. He plays
Speaker 2: the four majors, that gets him to eighteen. He goes
Speaker 2: and plays some in Australia, he plays his twenty like
Speaker 2: he would have on the PGA Tour. He likes the schedule.
Speaker 2: They like the break. They like how it's not as
Speaker 2: grueling of a week in and week out schedule with
Speaker 2: when it comes to media availability, when it comes to
Speaker 2: you know, the multiple practice rounds in the pro am
Speaker 2: that you have to, you know, put the big smile
Speaker 2: and face on for everybody. They only have to play
Speaker 2: three rounds. It's just completely different. A lot of the
Speaker 2: guys like that. Talking to Fill and some guys in Bedminster,
Speaker 2: they were Sergio, all those guys very happy with their life.
Speaker 2: Now those are a lot of the older guys, So
Speaker 2: maybe some of the younger guy might want to go back.
Speaker 2: And you know, sure guys did say there are events
Speaker 2: on the PGA Tour that you know, we're we're close
Speaker 2: to our heart, whether we won there, or we liked
Speaker 2: the course, or we had some sort of sponsor connection there.
Speaker 2: They still have those relationships and those good relationships with
Speaker 2: a lot of those people. But I don't think as
Speaker 2: many guys would want to go back and play in
Speaker 2: PGA Tour events, And they wouldn't play in as many
Speaker 2: as as some outsiders and some of us might think.
Speaker 2: I genuinely think that they like the life that they
Speaker 2: have on live and honestly, for them, what's not to
Speaker 2: what's not to like? Everything is catered towards them. They're
Speaker 2: making so much money no matter how poorly you might play.
Speaker 2: It's it's it's a it's a really good life for
Speaker 2: these guys. It really is. If they can, if they
Speaker 2: can deal with the with the criticism that comes from
Speaker 2: from joining up with it's, it's it's paid off for
Speaker 2: a lot of the guys. So I think you it
Speaker 2: would open the door certainly for for players to come
Speaker 2: in until lives credit from the start, they have always
Speaker 2: said that we don't want to be we want to
Speaker 2: be additive to the professional golf calendar, right, we don't
Speaker 2: want then they's when they hosted events, they're not going
Speaker 2: up against the heritage designated events, whatever you want to
Speaker 2: call them. They've avoided a lot of those, They've avoided
Speaker 2: the majors. They've built their schedule around a lot of that.
Speaker 2: And I think that was a show of good faith
Speaker 2: to the folks at the PGA Tour and dp World
Speaker 2: Tour and the fact that they weren't trying to put
Speaker 2: events opposite Bayhill or opposite of the players or you know,
Speaker 2: Tiger's genesis. I think that's a feather in their cap.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 2: Flip side of that is, well, of course, no one's
Speaker 2: going to watch the live events when those events are
Speaker 2: going on, you know' that's you got to meet in
Speaker 2: the middle there some way. But I think that that
Speaker 2: is a sign of good faith from Live and the
Speaker 2: fact that they did say that they want to be
Speaker 2: additive and they weren't going to overly challenge a lot
Speaker 2: of the PGA Tour's biggest events.
Speaker 1: I'm still puzzled about this issue of players on the
Speaker 1: PGA Tour leaving for Live in a post agreement world. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you know, I get that once players are on
Speaker 1: Live that they might not have any desire to play
Speaker 1: PGA Tour events. I think that's really true. Now. Yes,
Speaker 1: Live has avoided key dates on the PGA Tour calendar.
Speaker 1: But if Patrick can't Lay after an agreement is established,
Speaker 1: says I want to play on the Live tour, He's
Speaker 1: not going to have time to play many PGA Tour
Speaker 1: events even if the Live schedule is arranged around it.
Speaker 1: And so do you think there's going to be any
Speaker 1: do you think there would be any collaboration there between
Speaker 1: the tours to make it so a Patrick can't Lay
Speaker 1: can play a significant number of events on Live, but
Speaker 1: also devote some time to the PGA Tour. Would that
Speaker 1: be the direction that you think they would go in?
Speaker 2: They would That would have to be it, because then
Speaker 2: Live would also have to change up their format to
Speaker 2: be able to have substitutes play in if you weren't
Speaker 2: going to have the same guys play in every week,
Speaker 2: So that would make Live would have to change their format.
Speaker 2: I think, if anything, it would be a dry run
Speaker 2: for a lot of the guys to go. And to
Speaker 2: be fair, you saying can't lay and shawfle At those
Speaker 2: are two guys that have long been rumored. You're not
Speaker 2: just you're not just spouting off because of what happened.
Speaker 1: No, No, that's not going to do it. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well if you if you've seen the quotes from
Speaker 2: ship nuxt book about you know, and all the stuff
Speaker 2: about they wouldn't want Rory you know, to be over there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we don't. You're not interested in me. I'm
Speaker 1: not interested in exactly.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. So it's it's it's also open the air,
Speaker 2: like it's a lot of this is speculation. I wish
Speaker 2: I had more answers. I wish I could there was
Speaker 2: a way to game plan this out and show it.
Speaker 2: But I it was funny. I did a I did
Speaker 2: another another show with some people a couple of weeks ago,
Speaker 2: and Harold Barnert the third was on with us and
Speaker 2: you know, the host asked him, hey, so what can
Speaker 2: you tell us? He goes, I know as much as
Speaker 2: you guys do, if not less, because I'm not actually
Speaker 2: reading up and into it. They'll you'll, they'll tell me
Speaker 2: what they tell me and we'll go from there. A
Speaker 2: lot of the guys are just kind of flying, you know,
Speaker 2: flying along with it and just saying, hey, we'll react
Speaker 2: to whatever happens. We like our life now, we'll go
Speaker 2: for it. But I mean, it would it would take
Speaker 2: a massive change in in PGA Tour and the DP
Speaker 2: World Tour and Live for them to be able to
Speaker 2: have players play at the same time on both circuits.
Speaker 2: I think it would be I mean, if they can't
Speaker 2: even figure out how to get this framework agreement together,
Speaker 2: I don't know how they're all three gonna be able
Speaker 2: to get in a room and figure out a way
Speaker 2: to do that. Like, that's gonna take time, and it's
Speaker 2: gonna take a lot of time and a lot there's
Speaker 2: a lot of egos at play. There's gonna be a
Speaker 2: lot of you know, alphas in that room talking about it.
Speaker 2: The PGA Tour seems like throughout this whole process that
Speaker 2: they seem to think that they're gonna be the big
Speaker 2: dog when all of this is happening, even though y'all
Speaker 2: you're sure they're going to control the board for this
Speaker 2: new co, but the man controlling the money, Yaser aka
Speaker 2: mister Andrew Waterman. You know, they're at the he's at
Speaker 2: the top, he's the money man. Like I think the
Speaker 2: money's gonna make the decisions and you got to follow
Speaker 2: the money and see where it goes. And it's yeah,
Speaker 2: I wish I had more information for you, but it's
Speaker 2: just it's all speculative at this point and trying to
Speaker 2: game plan it out. But if if the framework agreement
Speaker 2: does go through, I don't think we'll see as many
Speaker 2: chain in twenty twenty four. I think twenty twenty five
Speaker 2: they'll they'll they'll give it a year to figure it out,
Speaker 2: and then that'll be the that'll be the real test
Speaker 2: year to see what happens, because it's just it would
Speaker 2: be way too fast of a turnaround to be able
Speaker 2: to get anything done in twenty twenty four, and like,
Speaker 2: these organizations just can't move at that pace. At least
Speaker 2: the PGA Tour and dp Rule Tour can't. They're too big.
Speaker 2: Like Lives, to their credit, they're small enough that they
Speaker 2: were able to pivot and move and be able to change,
Speaker 2: you know, at the at the drop of a hat.
Speaker 2: But I think Andy said this once, like they're you know,
Speaker 2: the PGA to ur the dp ROLE Tour. They're like
Speaker 2: tanker ships, you know, they can't just it takes a
Speaker 2: while for them to turn. They can't maneuver the way
Speaker 2: that Live can because they're just they're too big at
Speaker 2: this point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we've seen this with the designated events thing
Speaker 1: where the PGA Tour basically like, I can try to
Speaker 1: make a quick change, but they're really not going to
Speaker 1: and maybe ultimately they're just going to revert to their
Speaker 1: former way of doing things because that's just easier. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, suffice it. I don't expect you or anybody
Speaker 1: to have answers about what exactly a cooperative relationship between
Speaker 1: Live or the PITH and the PGA Tour would look like.
Speaker 1: I think what I'm maybe pointing out here is stuff
Speaker 1: that's going to come up when the sides discuss the agreement.
Speaker 1: And you know, I'm not a genius, but even I
Speaker 1: can see that this would be a difficult relationship to
Speaker 1: make work if Live continues to exist in its current form,
Speaker 1: because if these two sides are working together, then that
Speaker 1: gives top players on the PGA Tour an awful lot
Speaker 1: of incentive to leave the PGA Tour and play full
Speaker 1: time on Live because one of the main things that's
Speaker 1: preventing them from doing that is the rivalry right now,
Speaker 1: it's the permanence of leaving for Live and being cut
Speaker 1: off from the rest of the ecosystem. Well, if that
Speaker 1: threat isn't there anymore, I can't see a reason why
Speaker 1: a lot of players wouldn't remove themselves from the PGA
Speaker 1: Tour circuit. And so I think that that's got to
Speaker 1: be something that the PGA Tour is thinking about right now.
Speaker 1: How do we prevent this if we are working with
Speaker 1: the PIFF.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and think and it all goes back to what
Speaker 2: we were talking about earlier. Not to bring up to
Speaker 2: odopgr again and all that, but if I can't layer
Speaker 2: a shof like go Sure they might have some long
Speaker 2: term exemptions into a few of the majors, but those
Speaker 2: are going to end at some point. So how long
Speaker 2: would they stay with Live? Would they be able to
Speaker 2: play enough PGA Tour events or World Ranking Point events
Speaker 2: to be able to keep their status and still get
Speaker 2: into those would if this does go through, does that
Speaker 2: mean this do we'll live get points? Then all of
Speaker 2: a sudden, if they're aligned with the PGA tour this time.
Speaker 2: There's so much stuff that's up in the air and
Speaker 2: so much that's going to have to change. But like
Speaker 2: you said, with these organizations working together, it opens up
Speaker 2: the door for so many new new wrinkles and new
Speaker 2: things to happen. It's the future of professional golf and
Speaker 2: professional golf as we know. It could look completely different
Speaker 2: in a year or two times. And it's I don't
Speaker 2: know if that's good for the fans are bad for them, Honestly,
Speaker 2: I really don't.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's been mostly bad so far. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: but hopefully at some point somebody will We'll think about us.
Speaker 1: You know, we don't have a lot to offer. But
Speaker 1: but you know, well that's not true.
Speaker 2: We have so much to offer. We have so much offer.
Speaker 2: Don't sell us short like that, Gar, You have our
Speaker 2: interest to offer. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Now for a quick word from ag one. If you're
Speaker 3: a longtime listener, you might know. I've been drinking ag
Speaker 3: one for about a year. I started right around this
Speaker 3: time last year. When I started drinking ag one daily,
Speaker 3: I really noticed a difference in how I felt on
Speaker 3: a daily basis. I just felt more energy, I felt
Speaker 3: like I had better focus, and I generally felt healthier.
Speaker 3: That's because ag one is a foundational nutrition supplement that
Speaker 3: supports your body's universal needs like gut optimization, stress management,
Speaker 3: and immune support. Since twenty ten, ag one has led
Speaker 3: the future foundational nutrition, continuously refining their formula to create
Speaker 3: a smarter, better way to elevate your baseline health. Even
Speaker 3: some of my friends have started to drink AG one
Speaker 3: and they always tell me how much better they feel,
Speaker 3: how much more energy they have on a daily basis,
Speaker 3: and just how much better they feel their body works.
Speaker 3: I share that sentiment. It's been really a great year.
Speaker 3: So ag one is a sponsor of the show. They've
Speaker 3: really supported us over the last year, and ag one
Speaker 3: is the supplement I trust to provide the support my
Speaker 3: body needs daily, and that's why they've been a partner
Speaker 3: for so long. If you want to take ownership of
Speaker 3: your health, it starts with ag one. Try ag one
Speaker 3: and get a free one year supply of Vitamin D three,
Speaker 3: K two, and five free AG one travel packs with
Speaker 3: your first purchase. Those are really handy when you're on
Speaker 3: the road. Go to drinkag one dot com slash the
Speaker 3: fried egg that's drinkag one dot com. Slash the fried Egg.
Speaker 3: Check it out. Now back to the show.
Speaker 1: Shifting topics. You know you've been on site at a
Speaker 1: few live events this year, You've been tracking the league.
Speaker 1: I don't cover professional golf even full time. I kind
Speaker 1: of split my time between thinking about professional golf occasionally
Speaker 1: and mostly writing about golf architecture and golf industry stuff.
Speaker 1: And so from my perspective, Live has certainly dealt with
Speaker 1: some waning interest this year. And when live events are
Speaker 1: on there are certainly people who are very interested in them,
Speaker 1: but my sense is that they're not penetrating the mainstream
Speaker 1: discourse in the way that they did last year. So
Speaker 1: I wonder, from your point of view, which is very
Speaker 1: different from mine as somebody who writes about live and
Speaker 1: has been to a vents and all that kind of stuff,
Speaker 1: is that just my perception that the interest in live
Speaker 1: has been waning or is that something that people on
Speaker 1: the inside or people covering the league have noticed as well.
Speaker 2: No, it's definitely something we've noticed, and I think one
Speaker 2: of the I know you and I have talked about
Speaker 2: this before, but the biggest thing with Live wasn't what
Speaker 2: was happening on the course, It was what was happening
Speaker 2: off the course. It was the player movement. Who's going where?
Speaker 2: What's jaysaying about Greg? What's Greg saying about Jay? It
Speaker 2: was that back and forth, you know, mud slinging that
Speaker 2: kept everybody interested in Live for all that time, and
Speaker 2: then they would tune into the events on Sundays to
Speaker 2: see who won. It's interest levels at events have have
Speaker 2: probably maybe maybe been a bit better with some turnout. Obviously.
Speaker 2: I was at you know, the the opener in Mexico
Speaker 2: at Mayacoba, but no, no, there wasn't a really great
Speaker 2: atmosphere there, but not many resort you know events get
Speaker 2: great atmosphere, So that's nothing against Live.
Speaker 1: There wasn't a great atmosphere at the PGA Tour event
Speaker 1: that was at my act.
Speaker 2: Exactly, but I would say like the amount of the
Speaker 2: amount of bachelor parties that went for that event was crazy.
Speaker 2: It was. It was there were at least four or
Speaker 2: five that were out walking the grounds that day or
Speaker 2: that weekend, which is crazy. But yeah, it's the interest
Speaker 2: level on the course has maybe gotten a bit better,
Speaker 2: not from the outside looking in, but at events. I
Speaker 2: think they're they're getting a better turnout at places their
Speaker 2: their party whole atmosphere at Adelaide was absolutely wild. They're
Speaker 2: going to keep doing events like that. They're going to
Speaker 2: keep doing things like that because they've seen the success
Speaker 2: and what it can bring in and the social media engagement.
Speaker 2: It drives the fan interest from people wanting to go
Speaker 2: to the events. It'll drive that interest. Like I said,
Speaker 2: is there a little bit better off the course, though
Speaker 2: not as much anyways, because like we said, there isn't
Speaker 2: that same player movement because they have to have their
Speaker 2: rosters locked in now that they have this league concept.
Speaker 2: It's I think it'll all I think I'm curious to
Speaker 2: see what the free agency kind of transfer period looks
Speaker 2: like coming up after next week. They're going to be
Speaker 2: able to, you know, trade players and move players. They
Speaker 2: were allegedly supposed to do that last year, and the
Speaker 2: only really thing we saw was the two moves with
Speaker 2: Dustin Johnson getting rid of Taylor Gooch and picking up
Speaker 2: Peter u Line and a few other switches that came
Speaker 2: Matt Wolf move teams. It's I think we're gonna see
Speaker 2: a lot more movement with that, given the fact that
Speaker 2: they've got that twenty five to forty four is like
Speaker 2: so long story short, the way the Live is gonna
Speaker 2: break down their points. One through twenty four is their
Speaker 2: the lock zone they call it, and those are the
Speaker 2: players that are locked in for twenty twenty four no
Speaker 2: matter what. Twenty five to forty four are in the
Speaker 2: open zone, which means that they can those players can
Speaker 2: be traded, they can be dropped from their teams, picked
Speaker 2: up by other teams, complete and total free agency with them.
Speaker 2: They can either stay with their team or they can move.
Speaker 2: And then forty five to forty eight are that drop
Speaker 2: zone area, like we talked about earlier, that would be
Speaker 2: somewhat relegated but have a chance to play their way through.
Speaker 2: I'm curious to see what the transfer period looks like
Speaker 2: and how many teams are moving people around. I think
Speaker 2: that could be interesting to pick up some of their
Speaker 2: interests off the course. But yeah, waning interest has been
Speaker 2: across the board. I don't think they've reported their TV
Speaker 2: viewership numbers since like the second or third event of
Speaker 2: the year. I know SBJA still goes through and you know,
Speaker 2: kind of takes them to task on a few of
Speaker 2: those for the different ways that they look at their
Speaker 2: ratings and what they do. But I will say, the
Speaker 2: broadcast has gotten a bit better, still not saying much
Speaker 2: given from how poor it was last year, but they
Speaker 2: show a lot of shots, which is a feather in
Speaker 2: the cap for them compared to what the PGA Tour
Speaker 2: and what we've gotten from NDC and Golf Channel for
Speaker 2: the last year. But they still struggle with providing the
Speaker 2: context for those shots, Like it's cool to be able
Speaker 2: to sit back and see golf shot, golf shot, golf shot.
Speaker 2: You can see so much, what was the context of it?
Speaker 2: What does it mean other than the fact that, well,
Speaker 2: if they keep playing really well, they're going to make
Speaker 2: a ton of money at the end of the.
Speaker 1: Week, all right. So you know, something that is really
Speaker 1: significant about what LIV is doing and has been done
Speaker 1: well is the live event aspect. Right, That's not something
Speaker 1: that necessarily comes through on the telecast, which, as you mentioned,
Speaker 1: has had its issues, and to be fair, the PGA
Speaker 1: Tour telecasts have had significant issues this year as well.
Speaker 1: But the on site event, to my mind, has has
Speaker 1: always been pretty impressive at LIV. What they stand up
Speaker 1: and the experience that they provide at a golf course
Speaker 1: for a you know, I mean, yes, they have all
Speaker 1: the money in the world to do what they want.
Speaker 1: But it's it's working as far as I can see now.
Speaker 1: I've I've just been to one, you know, I went
Speaker 1: to Live Portland and that was one of my main takeaways.
Speaker 1: I was like, this is a real thing here, this
Speaker 1: is a real event. It doesn't have that eerie potentkin
Speaker 1: village vibe to it where they're just putting it on
Speaker 1: for TV. There's something happening on site. So is that
Speaker 1: something that you've picked up on or continued to pick
Speaker 1: up on this year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. I Mean the one thing that kind
Speaker 2: of really tripped me up when we were in Portland
Speaker 2: together was the did you ever see the guy that
Speaker 2: was on the unicycle that was riding around and juggling
Speaker 2: during competition?
Speaker 1: Saw him, but I certainly heard about him. Their tongues
Speaker 1: were wagging the.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. I haven't seen anything like to that level since.
Speaker 2: But as far as you know, the music and the
Speaker 2: festival atmosphere and all of that, that the fan village
Speaker 2: is is actually pretty cool. I'm not gonna lie. They
Speaker 2: get some really good, you know, really good food options
Speaker 2: in there, some beverage options for the adults and for
Speaker 2: the kids. They've got it like the little kids village
Speaker 2: that they do where they're actually teaching you know, courses
Speaker 2: where they've got stem and stuff like that. It's it's
Speaker 2: really interesting they what they do there, and they give
Speaker 2: fans so much like you almost forget there's a golf
Speaker 2: tournament going on when you go to some of these events,
Speaker 2: but that's to their kind of catering towards They like
Speaker 2: this festival, fun atmosphere. They don't want it to be
Speaker 2: as as you know, rigid as a PGA tour they would.
Speaker 2: They want you to know that you can go out,
Speaker 2: you can come here for four to five hours, you
Speaker 2: can have fun, and you can watch a little golf
Speaker 2: from some of the best players in the world, not
Speaker 2: all of the best players in the world, but some
Speaker 2: of them, and then go about your day and it's
Speaker 2: it's completely there. And I think that's the one thing
Speaker 2: that they've really, really, really done well is the fact
Speaker 2: that they make it engaging for fans. Right, It's not
Speaker 2: like you're just going there to watch golf. You can
Speaker 2: actually they've got you know, chipping contests and putting contests
Speaker 2: everywhere where you can you know, win money or prizes
Speaker 2: or whatever. They've got so much going on that it's
Speaker 2: a very interactive day for fans, and that's not something
Speaker 2: you see at a whole lot of PGA Tour events
Speaker 2: or any PGA Tour events. For the most part, they
Speaker 2: might have some small stuff here and there near a
Speaker 2: merchandise ten or something, but I will it's it's impressive
Speaker 2: when you go out and see how much live gear
Speaker 2: is being worn by people. They'll go out, they'll buy
Speaker 2: the hat, they'll do this high flyer stuff just flies
Speaker 2: off the shelves. I don't know if that's the fill.
Speaker 2: Probably if that's just the fill you know, issue there
Speaker 2: or whatever, but fireball stuff letting people love that. I
Speaker 2: saw four live golf hats at the Salheim Cup, which
Speaker 2: I did not expect to see, but that was that
Speaker 2: was interesting enough, to say the least, probably from people
Speaker 2: that went to the Valdorama event also over there, I
Speaker 2: would assume, But yeah, it's there's there's definitely interest in
Speaker 2: the fans that they do show out for it, and
Speaker 2: they seem like they all have a great time, and
Speaker 2: you know that's obviously there. But like you said earlier,
Speaker 2: it's it's impressive what they've done, but kind of takes
Speaker 2: away from it. Given how much money they have at
Speaker 2: their disposal to'll be able to hire all the production
Speaker 2: companies to put on these events. But this year they
Speaker 2: have really you know, tightened up their their budget as
Speaker 2: far as the production stuff goes, and they're still able
Speaker 2: to put on put on a pretty decent product. So
Speaker 2: it's impressive for what they're able to do. They're hiring
Speaker 2: some really impressive musical talent to come and play concerts.
Speaker 2: After the fact, they're absolutely nailing that aspect of it.
Speaker 2: And I think if anything that could be you know,
Speaker 2: something that helps the helps the league grow going forward
Speaker 2: in the future is the fact that they can say,
Speaker 2: look at all these musical acts, like these people who
Speaker 2: are aligning with us, look at the people they're getting
Speaker 2: to play in their pro am, and they're creating you know,
Speaker 2: social content off of that. You know, they had the
Speaker 2: barstool guys out there. They've done stuff with a bunch
Speaker 2: of professional football players, basketball players, drivers, athletes, actors. They're
Speaker 2: getting big names to align themselves with live and I
Speaker 2: think that's only going to help them going forward.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's going to be a gradual creep, right
Speaker 1: you know, as this league gets normalized and people start
Speaker 1: to realize that it's not a pr problem for them
Speaker 1: to be associated with it anymore. You're going to see
Speaker 1: more and more of these big names showing up at
Speaker 1: events and linking themselves with this brand. Right for a
Speaker 1: little while there, that would have been a major us. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but it's not. It doesn't seem like it is anymore.
Speaker 1: That that kind of hard news juice that Live had,
Speaker 1: where New York Times reporters and Washington Post reporters were
Speaker 1: showing up and asking the questions that those kinds of
Speaker 1: journalists ask, that they're not there anymore, and and so
Speaker 1: that has taken some of the pressure.
Speaker 2: Off they they showed up at Bedminster again. That's always
Speaker 2: got some of the guys from from the New York
Speaker 2: media and all that. And I'm sure we're going to
Speaker 2: get plenty down down at Derrelm next week as well.
Speaker 2: But like going back to Port, do you remember how
Speaker 2: contentious some of those some of those interviews and press
Speaker 2: conferences were.
Speaker 1: It was it was he was Brooks's first event, right,
Speaker 1: and he was in a foul mood.
Speaker 2: Right. He he hit me. He hit me with the
Speaker 2: Thanks chief after I asked him about uh, I asked
Speaker 2: him of what kind of after I got him, what
Speaker 2: kind of a what kind of media training they got,
Speaker 2: because they all gave the same answer, and uh Ari
Speaker 2: Ari Fleischer was standing three feet off the podium. I
Speaker 2: haven't seen him since. I've seen him since, but I've
Speaker 2: seen him since, but I haven't seen him like standing
Speaker 2: right next to taking notes like he was then.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you know that, and they're sitting right
Speaker 1: in front of me. It was. It was a New
Speaker 1: York Times reporter, and there were people who were there
Speaker 1: to report hard news, right, not sports news. And and
Speaker 1: I'm not insulting sports news or anything, that's obviously what
Speaker 1: I do, but you know that it's a it's a
Speaker 1: different kind of atmosphere when you have those kinds of
Speaker 1: reporters there. And yes, it absolutely was contentious. You can see.
Speaker 1: You could see that the players who were giving those
Speaker 1: press conferences were not at all used to being asked
Speaker 1: to engage with these issues, and so their their attitudes
Speaker 1: came through clearly about it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And the point I want to make there with
Speaker 2: with that is the fact that there has been nothing
Speaker 2: even close to that this year, aside from before the
Speaker 2: majors when they're asking about what it's going to be
Speaker 2: like to come back with the guys, and and you
Speaker 2: know what, you know, when you're seeing the players you
Speaker 2: haven't seen a long time, you know, what's it going
Speaker 2: to be like? Or when Brooks played played on the
Speaker 2: Ryder Cup team. That's the only even bit of contention
Speaker 2: that we've seen with these press conferences. And I know
Speaker 2: that the issue of sportswa washing has been brought up
Speaker 2: a lot Golf weeks and am and Lynch has written
Speaker 2: a lot about it. I've written about it. We've talked
Speaker 2: about it a lot. And if people are saying, you know, well,
Speaker 2: you know sports watching is working because those questions aren't
Speaker 2: being asked anymore. It's like it's it's such a tough
Speaker 2: line for us to walk because we probably should still
Speaker 2: keep asking these questions, but we know the answer we're
Speaker 2: going to get, and we only get a few guys
Speaker 2: for a little bit of time. That's the one thing
Speaker 2: that a lot of people don't understand is we don't
Speaker 2: have the access to the players at live events that
Speaker 2: you would at a PGA Tour event. Right you can
Speaker 2: request to bring people in. It's up to the player
Speaker 2: more than more likely than not if they're going to
Speaker 2: say no. Like Dustin Johnson was leading after the first
Speaker 2: day in Portland last year and he didn't talk to
Speaker 2: the media. I don't know if you remember that part of.
Speaker 1: It so hard to get players that you wanted, Like
Speaker 1: it was just like we're going to give you who
Speaker 1: we're going to give you.
Speaker 2: And then even now it's even more difficult because what
Speaker 2: they used to do is they would bring everybody. Everybody
Speaker 2: would go to scoring at once, right, So it was
Speaker 2: we were basically had a feeding frenzy picking off as
Speaker 2: many people as we could that weren't going to be
Speaker 2: you know, standing on the standing for the normal press
Speaker 2: conference after the round. Now they're doing scoring at whatever
Speaker 2: hole they end on. They're not going back to the tent,
Speaker 2: so we don't have that ability to pick off guys
Speaker 2: as they come through. So if you want to try
Speaker 2: and get somebody, you got to run out onto the course,
Speaker 2: try and find them wherever the heck they might be
Speaker 2: out there, and then sprint back in to try and
Speaker 2: get stuff at the press conference near there.
Speaker 1: That's got to be intentional.
Speaker 2: That's well the reason given when they when they put
Speaker 2: out the press release for doing all that was the
Speaker 2: fact that oh, it's going to save like, you know,
Speaker 2: so much time for the players and they can go
Speaker 2: back to doing you know, they're they can go to
Speaker 2: the range. None of these guys go to their range
Speaker 2: after Bryson. Might be there's only one that goes to
Speaker 2: the range after the ground. Yeah. So but that's just
Speaker 2: another wrinkle of that that I think that to defend us,
Speaker 2: you know, us big jay journalists who are out there,
Speaker 2: us entertainment reporters who are out there on the front
Speaker 2: lines doing all this cover and live like we don't
Speaker 2: We just don't get that access anymore like we would
Speaker 2: normally get. So it's just should we still be asking
Speaker 2: these questions? Probably? But yeah, I can understand a lot
Speaker 2: of us who have kind of pivoted, who are trying
Speaker 2: to actually talk about the things that are happening right now,
Speaker 2: when not the stuff that we've already covered and people
Speaker 2: have already given answers on or not answered the.
Speaker 1: Yeah or shown what they're going to do in response
Speaker 1: to and they've been trained on all those questions at
Speaker 1: this point, So you're not going to get the interesting
Speaker 1: stuff that everybody got at Live London, where nobody was
Speaker 1: prepared and so a lot of things were let slip,
Speaker 1: and that's just they've tightened up. And I'm with you
Speaker 1: on this, you know, and we're all we're all trying
Speaker 1: to serve our audiences, and to be frank, our audiences
Speaker 1: don't want us writing every single week about sportswashing in
Speaker 1: the same way over and over again. I think that
Speaker 1: this is still a relevant consideration and something that everybody
Speaker 1: should absolutely keep in mind when they're thinking about live
Speaker 1: or watching live. I think we've been pretty clear and
Speaker 1: urging people to do that, and as you say, Aim
Speaker 1: and Lynch at your own publication has been very consistent
Speaker 1: on the issue himself. But you know, at a certain
Speaker 1: point you've had your say and you've got to keep
Speaker 1: covering what's happening because that's the job and that is
Speaker 1: what is serving the audience. So we're all the media
Speaker 1: is put in a difficult position here, you know, and
Speaker 1: everybody I'm sure is trying their best with it. Now
Speaker 1: a media related question here not to not not to
Speaker 1: you know, uh, look inward too much or naval gaze
Speaker 1: too much. Here we're toward the end of the podcast.
Speaker 1: You know, this is what we can do here. You
Speaker 1: mentioned I remember you mentioning the last time we talked
Speaker 1: about Live in February or so that articles that you
Speaker 1: were writing about Live were doing major like numbers on
Speaker 1: sort of off months for the golf season. You know,
Speaker 1: you write about Live in January or February, and all
Speaker 1: of a sudden it's just, you know, giving you the
Speaker 1: kinds of page views that you might get if you
Speaker 1: were writing a preview for the Open Championship and so.
Speaker 1: Has that remained the case. Are you still noticing that
Speaker 1: readers are avidly seeking out the latest Live stuff?
Speaker 2: Depends on what the what the area of conversation is,
Speaker 2: game stories and all that. Still, you know, on Sunday,
Speaker 2: sure there'll be some some interesting views there and be
Speaker 2: some some interesting you know, spikes and numbers when we
Speaker 2: see a guy like DJ Win or Cam Smith or
Speaker 2: one of the big names. When when Charles Howell and
Speaker 2: do you remember Danny Lee won the second Live End
Speaker 2: of the year? How about that? Yeah, those story those
Speaker 2: two guys didn't. Yeah, those those two guys. Yeah, he
Speaker 2: hasn't really done much since those two guys really haven't.
Speaker 2: Yeah right, I'll leave that one alone. I'll leave that
Speaker 2: one alone. Yeah, it's their interest is still there in
Speaker 2: some cases, but it depends on what it is. When
Speaker 2: it comes to the OWGR stuff, obviously we're getting huge
Speaker 2: playoff of that. When it came to the framework agreement,
Speaker 2: obviously we had massive, massive playoff of that massive interest there.
Speaker 2: But like we said, the game stories and the in
Speaker 2: what the league is doing on a week to week
Speaker 2: basis not as much. But it's those overarching you know,
Speaker 2: stories and storylines that have the bigger ramifications. That's the
Speaker 2: stuff that we're still seeing a whole lot of interest in.
Speaker 2: And that goes back to what you and I talked
Speaker 2: about twenty or thirty minutes or so ago, talking about
Speaker 2: the interest level has dropped across the board, off the course,
Speaker 2: just because there it's not as device as it used
Speaker 2: to be, Like they've already disrupted the market now they're here,
Speaker 2: Like there's it there that's there's still divisive and it's
Speaker 2: still there's still the one side versus the other in
Speaker 2: some aspects, but it's not nearly as as bad as
Speaker 2: it used to be. And you know, I think one
Speaker 2: of the one of the massive you know, headline things
Speaker 2: for newspapers and stuff was if it bleeds, it leads,
Speaker 2: so like you need the you need that kind of
Speaker 2: you know, gory, bad stories that are going to do
Speaker 2: a whole lot of numbers because people like to read
Speaker 2: about that stuff. It's just it's how it is across
Speaker 2: the board. So we're still seeing some but it's not
Speaker 2: certainly like it was when you know, DJ left or
Speaker 2: all these players, the rumors for players leaving, what's happening
Speaker 2: and all that. It's it's it's certainly not to that level. No,
Speaker 2: but still interest though. That's why I'm going to spend
Speaker 2: the full week in Miami. That's why I went to
Speaker 2: went to Mexico to start off the year. It's there.
Speaker 2: There is still very much interest in this, but I
Speaker 2: think that's because people want to know what's happening, and
Speaker 2: Live doesn't release a whole lot of info. So that's
Speaker 2: what's up to what's up to people like myself and
Speaker 2: you know, we mentioned Bob Harrig on this. Evan Priest
Speaker 2: from from Digestics Good has been to a lot of
Speaker 2: events and covered a lot of this pretty well too.
Speaker 2: Like it's it's basically on us to try and go
Speaker 2: out there and shed some light on what's what's actually
Speaker 2: happening through there. And I think, you know, a lot
Speaker 2: of people in the media have sort of picked up
Speaker 2: on that. I think not to not to pat ourselves
Speaker 2: on the back too much, but I think Golf Week
Speaker 2: its kind of early on that one.
Speaker 1: But it's a beat.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's been. It's been interesting, to say the least.
Speaker 2: It's it's a I never thought when I joined Golf
Speaker 2: Week in twenty nineteen that this is the kind of
Speaker 2: stuff I'd be writing about her doing when I signed
Speaker 2: up to be our college and an amateur beat reporter
Speaker 2: four years ago. You know, it's the game has definitely
Speaker 2: changed changed quite a bit since then, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: All Right, Adam, keep doing your thing. Thank you so
Speaker 1: much for coming on the podcast, and we'll talk against.
Speaker 2: So always a pleasure join Club TFE. It's awesome.
Speaker 1: This episode of the Friday Golf Podcast was produced by
Speaker 1: Matt Rusius. Thank you, Matt. If you have a moment,
Speaker 1: please rate and review the Friday Golf Podcast wherever you
Speaker 1: might be listening to us. I think the Apple Podcasts
Speaker 1: ratings and reviews are especially meaningful, so if you're there,
Speaker 1: that would be a big help to us. Thank you
Speaker 1: for listening, and we'll be back again.
Speaker 3: Soon