WEBVTT - Gottlieb - All Ball -guest Michael Roll 0:00:07.040 --> 0:00:09.800 Hey, welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlie. This is the All 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:13.840 Ball podcast, All Basketball, all the time. Look, I could 0:00:13.960 --> 0:00:17.840 I could get lost in some needless conversation about the 0:00:17.920 --> 0:00:21.079 Lakers or about college basketball. We got plenty of time 0:00:21.120 --> 0:00:23.840 to get to that. I told you that one of 0:00:23.840 --> 0:00:25.520 the things I wanted to do with this podcast. And 0:00:25.560 --> 0:00:27.200 by the way, if it's your first time listening, thanks 0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:30.280 so much for making as part of your podcast rotation. 0:00:30.320 --> 0:00:34.040 Don't forget to download, subscribe, and rate this podcast. By 0:00:34.040 --> 0:00:35.440 the way, I guess if you're listening to it, you've 0:00:35.440 --> 0:00:39.040 already downloaded it, so subscribe and rate. During the season, 0:00:39.080 --> 0:00:40.760 we'll have all the people that you want. I got 0:00:40.760 --> 0:00:43.920 great commitments to having some other interesting people throughout this 0:00:43.960 --> 0:00:47.120 off season, which is very short, very condensed, because there 0:00:47.120 --> 0:00:49.919 seems to be no real off season outside of August 0:00:50.240 --> 0:00:54.440 in basketball. But I'm committed to bringing people stories in basketball. 0:00:54.480 --> 0:00:56.800 If you're listen to this, you probably love hoop, right, 0:00:57.000 --> 0:00:59.360 you just love it. I would hope you have a 0:00:59.400 --> 0:01:01.800 ball in the back of your car and some shoes, 0:01:02.160 --> 0:01:05.400 actually two pairs of shoes. If you're a baller, you 0:01:05.480 --> 0:01:08.720 got a basketball in your car. Actually check that, two basketballs. 0:01:08.760 --> 0:01:11.320 In your car, need indoorball in your outdoorball and you 0:01:11.360 --> 0:01:15.240 need indoor shoes, need outdoor shoes. You probably need some socks, 0:01:15.280 --> 0:01:18.160 although let's be honest, a baller can play with no socks, 0:01:18.200 --> 0:01:19.840 or a baller can play with some dress socks. It 0:01:19.880 --> 0:01:23.000 doesn't really matter. The shoes are far more important than 0:01:23.040 --> 0:01:25.479 the actual socks, regardless of which. You're a ball guy. 0:01:25.520 --> 0:01:28.199 That's why you're listening to this. So with that in mind, 0:01:28.280 --> 0:01:29.920 I brought you Chris Beard a couple of weeks ago. 0:01:30.000 --> 0:01:33.560 Got some great commitments upcoming, and I really wanted to 0:01:33.600 --> 0:01:38.040 share with you Mike roll story because look, it's real basketball. 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:40.200 He is a professional basketball player. I'm not gonna ask 0:01:40.240 --> 0:01:41.960 him how much money he makes, but it's well into 0:01:42.000 --> 0:01:45.200 six figures. Heck, might even be close into seven at 0:01:45.520 --> 0:01:48.400 some point. The point is he makes a healthy living 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:51.440 as a tremendous basketball player, having played at U C. 0:01:51.600 --> 0:01:53.960 L A for five years, a part of three Final 0:01:54.000 --> 0:01:57.400 four teams playing for Ben hallen Uh suffered an injury, 0:01:57.440 --> 0:01:59.760 missed the season, got a medical red shirt, came back, 0:01:59.840 --> 0:02:01.680 and his last year was a year in which the 0:02:01.720 --> 0:02:03.920 bottom fell out, but he had a tremendous season. Has 0:02:03.960 --> 0:02:07.520 part laid that into a spectacular foreign career. Does he 0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:09.120 want to come back to the States. We'll get We'll 0:02:09.160 --> 0:02:11.880 get with that. Uh. Does he think he should have 0:02:12.520 --> 0:02:14.720 been drafted in the NBA. We'll have him take us 0:02:14.720 --> 0:02:17.079 through the pre draft process of the workouts he had, 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:19.280 the things he does to work out now, the things 0:02:19.320 --> 0:02:21.520 he does to his body in terms of eating and 0:02:21.560 --> 0:02:23.200 working out, and what he would have done if he 0:02:23.240 --> 0:02:26.200 went back to high school. But I do I do 0:02:26.280 --> 0:02:28.919 want to start with this one story out of the NBA, 0:02:29.520 --> 0:02:31.040 and then I'll get to one thing at a college 0:02:31.040 --> 0:02:34.440 basketball then we'll get to mic role. Channing Fry, of course, 0:02:34.520 --> 0:02:36.480 was on a different podcast and he said, hey, look, 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:39.880 it's hard to play with Lebron because Lebron likes vets 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:41.360 to where he can walk in and go, you're a shooter, 0:02:41.400 --> 0:02:44.280 you're a pastor, you're a driver, you're a rebounder. These 0:02:44.320 --> 0:02:46.600 are your rules. So it's gonna be interesting to see 0:02:46.639 --> 0:02:49.720 what the Lakers because that's how Lebron's always played. On 0:02:49.760 --> 0:02:51.600 the other hand, I do think that the Lakers, if 0:02:51.600 --> 0:02:54.639 they're smart, gonna challenge Lebron for Hey, Lebron two point 0:02:54.639 --> 0:02:56.400 o or three point o or four point oh. It's 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:59.720 probably more four point oh than anything. Should be a 0:02:59.720 --> 0:03:02.919 guy who can who can take a breath at times 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:05.120 during the game and let other people play, can be 0:03:05.240 --> 0:03:07.880 more of a facilitator, which is a skill that doesn't 0:03:07.919 --> 0:03:10.640 go away. Like the skill of going by everybody and 0:03:10.680 --> 0:03:13.600 taking on a team like that, you lose that that 0:03:13.600 --> 0:03:17.160 that first step ability. Now. I do think they'll playim 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:18.840 at some small ball five. He has the size to 0:03:18.880 --> 0:03:20.840 do it. He's a sneaky shot blocker, he's a good 0:03:20.919 --> 0:03:24.200 enough rebounder, and it'll find him the mismatch. But more 0:03:24.240 --> 0:03:27.520 than anything, I don't think anything Shanning Fry said wasn't accurate. 0:03:27.520 --> 0:03:29.840 It's not always easy to play with a superstar. It's 0:03:29.840 --> 0:03:32.760 not always easy to work with a superstar. And the 0:03:32.800 --> 0:03:34.680 idea this is not a bad thing when he's paying 0:03:34.720 --> 0:03:37.520 the picture of Hey, he likes guys and roles. I 0:03:37.880 --> 0:03:40.240 work with Colin Cowherd Colin Coward as a way in 0:03:40.280 --> 0:03:42.960 which he preps every day, and if you fill in 0:03:42.960 --> 0:03:44.600 for him as I do on his show on Fox 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:46.400 Sports Trade or do my own chow from twelve to 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:49.120 three Pacific time three to six Eastern time, there's a 0:03:49.160 --> 0:03:51.040 way in which I do things that somebody who fills 0:03:51.080 --> 0:03:55.120 in for me has to do. Lebron James wanting to 0:03:55.160 --> 0:03:58.000 know shooters, passers, drivers and let them know all their roles. 0:03:58.040 --> 0:04:01.600 That's no different than a rock group. And you know 0:04:01.880 --> 0:04:06.240 one guy likes all green eminem's in his dressing room, right. 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:09.880 He wants his his his ear is volume level in 0:04:09.880 --> 0:04:11.960 his ears to be just so. He wants to play 0:04:12.000 --> 0:04:15.280 golf every morning. Like that's that's what musicians do. That 0:04:15.320 --> 0:04:18.320 what actors do. That's part of their process in preparing them. 0:04:18.440 --> 0:04:20.479 And even though I am not a Lebron is the 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:23.040 greatest player ever guy. I'm absolutely willing to put him 0:04:23.080 --> 0:04:25.120 in the top five greatest players I've ever seen play 0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:29.800 basketball conversation. But I don't view it as a negative. 0:04:29.839 --> 0:04:32.000 I view it as really interesting. The other point that 0:04:32.080 --> 0:04:35.080 Channing Fry made, which was something I've said on radio, 0:04:35.760 --> 0:04:37.920 it's completely different when you're playing with Lebron in terms 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:43.120 of how much people prepped for you. Right, Look, Lebron 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:45.200 come into town. Go and look at all of these 0:04:45.240 --> 0:04:48.640 different teams and their websites or their Twitter Twitter handles. 0:04:49.040 --> 0:04:53.160 When the schedule came out, the Dallas Mavericks, check out 0:04:53.200 --> 0:04:55.680 the Dallas Mavericks schedules and the two games we play 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:59.440 at home against Lebron and the Lakers, you're everybody's biggest game. 0:04:59.520 --> 0:05:01.480 There are lots games in the NBA where guys are 0:05:01.520 --> 0:05:02.920 second night of a back to back and they went 0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:05.120 out when they landed in town and they're not taking 0:05:05.120 --> 0:05:08.120 it as seriously. That's not the case when the Lakers 0:05:08.160 --> 0:05:10.839 come to town. So the challenge to these Lakers will 0:05:10.839 --> 0:05:14.680 be can they play the same system they've played against 0:05:14.680 --> 0:05:17.039 a higher level of competition with a heightened amount of 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:20.080 detail and do it while working in Lebron James, who's 0:05:20.080 --> 0:05:22.919 played in his own system for the entirety of his career. 0:05:23.600 --> 0:05:28.960 I think it's fascinating. In college basketball, what I'm fascinated 0:05:28.960 --> 0:05:31.920 by is the Duke Blue Devils. I know Kentucky played 0:05:31.920 --> 0:05:34.240 in the Bahamas, and I've watched those tapes as well, 0:05:34.760 --> 0:05:37.320 but everyone is I don't know everyone. A lot of 0:05:37.320 --> 0:05:40.640 people are freaking out over Zion Williamson making some jump 0:05:40.680 --> 0:05:44.880 shots and frankly looking great and there foreign tour against Canada. 0:05:45.040 --> 0:05:48.560 First thing is um R J. Barrett obviously is the 0:05:48.600 --> 0:05:51.599 better talent, and as good as Zion was, he was 0:05:51.640 --> 0:05:54.200 even better. The second thing is let's also catch our 0:05:54.200 --> 0:06:00.640 breath and realize that they're playing against massively inferior competition. 0:06:01.480 --> 0:06:05.080 They just weren't. They weren't The Canadian teams they're playing 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:08.840 against weren't. They weren't really even Division one teams. So 0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:12.040 it's great for Duke and for Kentucky to promote their 0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:14.880 players to get some run, to get some cohesion so 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:17.440 that when they hit the ground running early in November 0:06:17.440 --> 0:06:20.760 and playing He's made for TV games, They've already played together. 0:06:20.760 --> 0:06:23.200 They don't have to, and they're they're the verbiage that 0:06:23.200 --> 0:06:25.040 they have to learn and some of the defensive slides 0:06:25.040 --> 0:06:28.160 and adjustments they have to make. The questions for Zion 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:33.400 Williamson being at six ft five pounds, I just I 0:06:33.880 --> 0:06:36.120 don't see playing at that weight is a good idea. 0:06:37.160 --> 0:06:40.279 Like if I'm advising Zion, I'm telling him, a dude, look, 0:06:40.720 --> 0:06:42.880 you look great there, and you have an incredible burst. 0:06:42.880 --> 0:06:45.800 You can chase dudes down and block shots. But we 0:06:45.800 --> 0:06:48.279 gotta try and get you in the two sixties. I 0:06:48.279 --> 0:06:49.640 gotta try and get you in the two six. You've 0:06:49.640 --> 0:06:51.280 got a couple of months to do. So it's gonna 0:06:51.279 --> 0:06:53.599 be about diet. It's gonna be how we change your body, 0:06:53.640 --> 0:06:57.039 how we train you. Because Zion Williamson's ability to make 0:06:57.080 --> 0:06:59.800 it in the NBA and stick in the NBA. Yes, 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:02.520 has to make jump shots, but it's can he play 0:07:02.560 --> 0:07:08.360 eighty two games? And can he guard laterally five five positions? 0:07:08.880 --> 0:07:12.200 You know physically with long arms and a thick body, 0:07:12.560 --> 0:07:14.840 there's not a ton of posts. He won't be big 0:07:14.840 --> 0:07:17.040 boy that much. But can he guard these guys out 0:07:17.040 --> 0:07:21.200 in the perimeter? One he hasn't always played hard defensively, 0:07:21.960 --> 0:07:25.400 and two he's gonna have to change his body as 0:07:25.480 --> 0:07:27.760 much as he's an absolute tank and a physical FREAQ. 0:07:27.760 --> 0:07:31.320 When he plants his his his jump foot and he 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:34.240 flies all around, I think he's got lightened up. And 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:37.480 when you're sometimes we we we gotta watch the game backwards. 0:07:37.920 --> 0:07:40.560 Can he defend point guards on switches? Can he guard 0:07:40.600 --> 0:07:43.440 on the perimeter? Is he tough enough underneath the basket 0:07:43.640 --> 0:07:46.480 playing against bigger players to box out to rebound? Because 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:49.559 the reason Traymond Green is not a great athlete. Remember, 0:07:49.640 --> 0:07:53.920 Drink can't jump up and do anything that the Zion 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:56.160 can do. And frankly, Zion right now is going to 0:07:56.240 --> 0:08:00.840 progress towards being a better shooter um in. Draymond Green 0:08:01.400 --> 0:08:04.400 granted very early, and he's gotta put in massive represence 0:08:04.400 --> 0:08:07.040 against inferior competition. But Draymond played without a jump shot 0:08:07.120 --> 0:08:10.200 last year. Draymond Green is Raymond Green because his ability 0:08:10.240 --> 0:08:13.240 to pass, He's ability to play five positions on offense, 0:08:13.240 --> 0:08:16.560 but more than anything, because he can guard defensively. That's 0:08:16.600 --> 0:08:20.480 the challenge design Williams. All right, let's get to the 0:08:20.960 --> 0:08:23.120 to our special guest in the All Ball Podcast names 0:08:23.160 --> 0:08:27.080 Mike Role played at U C l A. Well, I 0:08:27.120 --> 0:08:30.560 was great catching up with Mike. Uh. I'll tell you 0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:37.920 quickly my story of landing in Russia. So I was sometime. 0:08:37.960 --> 0:08:40.160 I'll go through the whole process and tell this story again, 0:08:40.160 --> 0:08:42.360 but here's what I remember. I was in Salina, Kansas, 0:08:42.360 --> 0:08:44.480 playing with the Salanta Rattlers, and it was a short 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:45.880 term deal because I knew I was going to get 0:08:45.880 --> 0:08:48.320 a call to play overseas. And an agent at the 0:08:48.360 --> 0:08:50.920 time called me and said, hey, do you want to 0:08:50.960 --> 0:08:54.040 go to Russia? And I was like sure. So we 0:08:54.120 --> 0:08:56.679 packed up our stuff from Salina. I dropped my wife 0:08:56.720 --> 0:09:01.040 off in Oklahoma City at our apartment in Ocala. Uh. Well, 0:09:01.200 --> 0:09:04.280 I think at our parents house and she was going 0:09:04.360 --> 0:09:07.200 to join me in a couple of weeks. And you know, 0:09:07.240 --> 0:09:09.559 we had apartment in Oklahoma City, and so we dropped 0:09:09.600 --> 0:09:11.679 off in an apartment in Oklahoma City, like a four 0:09:11.720 --> 0:09:14.800 hour drive or so. I fly from Oklahoma City to 0:09:14.840 --> 0:09:16.360 New York City. New York City, have to go to 0:09:16.360 --> 0:09:21.040 the Russian consulate and then overnight I fly on air 0:09:21.200 --> 0:09:26.600 float too Russia. I land in Moscow and when you 0:09:26.679 --> 0:09:28.960 land in Moscow, you don't speak in English. And at 0:09:28.960 --> 0:09:32.160 the time, this is two thousand and one January two 0:09:32.160 --> 0:09:36.679 thousand one, snowing outside, everybody's smoking. Everywhere you land, you 0:09:36.720 --> 0:09:38.240 go through, you get your bags, you got all your 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:41.640 lifely possessions, and all there was was a sign in 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:45.040 Russian with a basketball. This guy could have been at 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:47.640 axe murder. Right. You've ever been on that road from 0:09:47.760 --> 0:09:50.800 from the Cancun airport to Plia del Carmen and it's 0:09:50.840 --> 0:09:53.120 like a two lane road each way, and there's nothing 0:09:53.160 --> 0:09:55.160 along the road, and you're like, if somebody murdered me 0:09:55.280 --> 0:09:58.040 right here, no one would ever know for months. That's 0:09:58.080 --> 0:09:59.840 the feeling. When I got into the car in Russia, 0:10:00.360 --> 0:10:02.360 I was super groggy because I traveled again to New 0:10:02.400 --> 0:10:04.880 York City and then overnight and I yet to master 0:10:05.040 --> 0:10:07.600 flying on red eyes and whatever, and smoke really bothered me. 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:11.360 We stopped to eat at a Russian restaurant. I didn't 0:10:11.400 --> 0:10:13.640 speak English. The guy ordered for me to smoke everywhere. 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:16.320 We drank tea afterwards, and I passed out in the car. 0:10:16.360 --> 0:10:18.599 And here's my my most distinct memory, in addition to 0:10:18.600 --> 0:10:19.959 the fact that the guy just had a sign and 0:10:20.000 --> 0:10:22.720 didn't speak in English, who was driving me from one 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:25.360 Moscow airport to another? If you've been to Russia and 0:10:25.400 --> 0:10:27.280 you didn't fly just in the Moscow to stay, you 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:30.800 knew you had to go to a different airport. I 0:10:30.880 --> 0:10:32.920 was so tired. It was like a spy movie where 0:10:33.000 --> 0:10:34.959 somebody I was like b a baracus in the A 0:10:35.120 --> 0:10:36.440 team right where they gave me a shot, and I 0:10:36.480 --> 0:10:39.320 was like in and out of consciousness. I remember waking 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:42.240 up and seeing like we're pulling in, We're pulling by 0:10:42.320 --> 0:10:45.280 Red Square, We're like a mile out. And then I 0:10:45.320 --> 0:10:47.640 woke up again and we're right next to Red Square. 0:10:47.840 --> 0:10:49.640 And then I woke up again and Red Square was gone. 0:10:49.679 --> 0:10:52.720 But I remember seeing Red Square in the towers and 0:10:52.760 --> 0:10:54.840 all the look and I'm like I could not believe 0:10:55.640 --> 0:11:00.320 growing up in the eighties watching Red Dawn, Wolverades or 0:11:00.480 --> 0:11:05.680 Rocky four. Boys can change, and youth can change. We 0:11:05.800 --> 0:11:09.680 all can change that. I was in made Russia, but 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:13.199 I was, and then I passed out and I woke 0:11:13.280 --> 0:11:16.160 up and I'm at another airport. And there weren't sheep 0:11:16.600 --> 0:11:19.720 and goats and chickens and pigs that got on my 0:11:19.760 --> 0:11:23.400 flight to parm Russia, but it sure felt that way. 0:11:23.640 --> 0:11:26.400 And I remember the seats on that air flow plane. 0:11:27.040 --> 0:11:28.640 If you nobody was sitting in there, you could push 0:11:28.679 --> 0:11:30.760 it forward. They would almost fold down, like it was 0:11:30.800 --> 0:11:33.319 like being on a on a weird bus. Only we 0:11:33.360 --> 0:11:36.480 were flying and people are smoking and drinking vodka and koonak. 0:11:36.600 --> 0:11:39.640 You drink koonak to uh to take a shot to 0:11:40.960 --> 0:11:44.880 for a famous war for stalling goodad they got done 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:49.120 and gooead and they drink excessively. We land in perm Russia, 0:11:50.240 --> 0:11:51.800 and I remember getting off and it was one of 0:11:51.840 --> 0:11:54.960 those they they bring the stairs right to the plane 0:11:55.760 --> 0:11:59.040 and he walked down the stairs and you realize that 0:11:59.080 --> 0:12:02.360 you landed on like a foot thick piece of ice 0:12:02.400 --> 0:12:04.760 because it's that cold. What's the point of what's the 0:12:04.760 --> 0:12:06.400 point of going back and getting the ice when it's 0:12:06.480 --> 0:12:08.679 that cold every day at a park on and some 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:10.760 gloves on and a beanie on and a scarf on, 0:12:11.200 --> 0:12:13.000 and all you can see is my face and my breath. 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:17.440 And I had like an Oklahoma State park on the bags. 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:22.800 Come in outside and again this time I walk outside 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:24.960 and there's a lady who does speak some broken English. 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:27.400 They put me in a van that has the basketball 0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:30.280 logo on the van, and they take me to my apartment, 0:12:30.280 --> 0:12:34.080 which is on the ninth floor. And I remember like 0:12:34.240 --> 0:12:36.839 walking up the stairs or going up the elevator, getting 0:12:36.840 --> 0:12:42.440 to the ninth floor, opening opening the door and looking 0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:45.840 around and thinking to myself, this is either the start 0:12:45.960 --> 0:12:50.439 or the end of my basketball career that's playing overseas. 0:12:51.760 --> 0:12:55.360 That's what's really like. No food in the apartment. Had 0:12:55.400 --> 0:12:57.240 to go and pick out stuff. Learned that the word 0:12:57.800 --> 0:13:00.160 this is at the so i'd walk around the we're 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:02.839 go at the at the at the at the which 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:05.960 is pleased by jallatt by jasta. And I didn't know 0:13:06.000 --> 0:13:09.000 that Russians don't really say please and thank you that much, 0:13:09.480 --> 0:13:11.439 so they could pick me out that, in addition to 0:13:11.440 --> 0:13:13.800 the fact that I couldn't speak Russian. I was saying please, 0:13:13.800 --> 0:13:17.440 then thank you a lot. Anyway, there's my Russian story 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:20.080 for the day. Guy picking me up, doesn't speak English, 0:13:20.120 --> 0:13:23.920 holding a sign driving me across Moscow, stopping for dinner, 0:13:24.120 --> 0:13:26.120 to which he made the mind do you want to eat? 0:13:26.440 --> 0:13:28.280 And I said yes. I still don't know what I ate. 0:13:28.320 --> 0:13:30.640 It was quite gross. I drank tea. I fell asleep. 0:13:30.679 --> 0:13:34.640 I woke up. I was another airport. More smoke, more drinking, land, 0:13:34.880 --> 0:13:38.880 sheet of ice, baggage van, close the door to van, 0:13:39.160 --> 0:13:42.520 ninth floor. I'm in my apartment. I passed out, woke 0:13:42.600 --> 0:13:47.640 up the next day and play ball. All right, let's 0:13:47.640 --> 0:13:50.320 welcome in my girl, who, of course start at U 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:52.360 C l A and now is a star with one 0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:55.920 of the elite teams in all of professional basketball. He 0:13:55.960 --> 0:13:57.880 plays from Akabi Tel Aviv. Kind of have to spend 0:13:57.920 --> 0:14:00.160 some time with this year. In the All Ball podcast, Mike, 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:04.440 how are you? How are you? I'm good? Um, so 0:14:04.640 --> 0:14:06.840 look at the time of this recording, I believe you 0:14:06.960 --> 0:14:12.640 leave for Israel tomorrow, right, yeah, alright, the thirty hours 0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:16.560 uh between now and the NonStop flight to Tel Aviv. 0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:19.640 I wanted if if you don't mind, I wanted to 0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:22.560 go down kind of memory road, and because I think 0:14:22.600 --> 0:14:26.640 your path is amazing. It really is. From high school 0:14:26.840 --> 0:14:28.800 when you're supposed to go to ucs B, to go 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:31.240 into u c l A, play on some final four teams, 0:14:31.840 --> 0:14:34.560 and then you know, kind of fighting your way up 0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:37.680 the ladder in professional basketball to play for you know, 0:14:37.720 --> 0:14:40.360 Beshi toash Now Maccabi Tel Aviv, you know, being a 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:43.080 Turkish League All Star before you come over to Israel. 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:45.680 Like that. That's the climb that I don't think a 0:14:45.720 --> 0:14:47.640 lot of people in the state's get a chance to 0:14:47.720 --> 0:14:51.160 hear from um. Let's let's start. Let's start with with 0:14:51.320 --> 0:14:55.680 high school and recruiting. You're highly touted out of mission 0:14:55.760 --> 0:14:59.360 via HO and you're supposed to go to UCSB. Why 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:03.080 the chain in going to u c l A. Yeah, 0:15:03.120 --> 0:15:06.920 So the recruitment from uh L A was a late thing. 0:15:07.440 --> 0:15:09.600 I went through the whole recruiting process, you know, I 0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:12.160 fell in love with a couple of schools, ultimately chose 0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:15.160 Santa Barbara. I wanted to stay a little bit close 0:15:15.200 --> 0:15:18.280 to home, and then I had verbally committed and I 0:15:18.320 --> 0:15:22.240 was really excited about that. And then shortly into the 0:15:22.280 --> 0:15:25.160 beginning of my senior year. I believe it was UM 0:15:25.240 --> 0:15:28.240 coach Allen called me. Uh he offered me a scholarship 0:15:28.360 --> 0:15:31.080 right there on the phone, and I was just something 0:15:31.120 --> 0:15:33.440 too good for me to pass it up, and luckily 0:15:33.480 --> 0:15:36.600 I took it. Yeah, I remember. It's it's interesting because 0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:39.520 um I obviously also grew up in Orange County. I 0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:41.480 remember I was at tested in high school. My my 0:15:41.520 --> 0:15:43.160 sister was a cheerier U C. L A. My brother 0:15:43.160 --> 0:15:46.160 went to school there, and they didn't offer me. It 0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:48.160 wasn't late. They didn't have me till summer before my 0:15:48.200 --> 0:15:51.240 senior year, and I kind of held it against them, right. 0:15:51.320 --> 0:15:53.400 I was like, dude, like you've known me since I 0:15:53.480 --> 0:15:55.680 was knee high. I used to be a ball boy 0:15:55.760 --> 0:15:59.880 when when Walt Hazzard was there, and uh, like it was. 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:02.960 It felt like a perfect match. Although maybe I had 0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:04.760 to kind of blow up at abc D camp before 0:16:04.800 --> 0:16:07.040 I could get there. So how did you process the 0:16:07.080 --> 0:16:08.640 idea of like, hey, I could go to u C. 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:11.360 S B and maybe start for four years plus if 0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:13.360 you haven't been, if somebody hasn't been, I would. I 0:16:13.360 --> 0:16:15.440 would put down u C. SPS campus is the best 0:16:15.480 --> 0:16:19.160 in California, even better than Pepperdine because Pepperdine overlooks the water, 0:16:19.440 --> 0:16:22.400 whereas U c s B is literally on the water. Um, 0:16:22.480 --> 0:16:24.480 and it's like a better it's a party town. It's 0:16:24.320 --> 0:16:26.640 like it's a cool place to go to school. How 0:16:26.640 --> 0:16:29.320 did you process the idea of going to ucs B 0:16:29.440 --> 0:16:31.240 and being a star as opposed to being part of 0:16:31.280 --> 0:16:34.600 an ensemble cast at u c l A. Yeah, So 0:16:34.680 --> 0:16:38.920 my dad originally was so against the idea of me 0:16:39.040 --> 0:16:42.040 going to u c l A for exactly what you said. Uh. 0:16:42.040 --> 0:16:44.160 He thought I would be the bigger fish in the 0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:47.920 small pond at Santa Barbara, and the small fish and 0:16:48.000 --> 0:16:50.880 the big pond at U c l A. Um. Benny 0:16:50.880 --> 0:16:55.200 Hellen had just got there. He had really recruited some stars. Um. 0:16:55.280 --> 0:16:57.840 The class before me was in my position with Aaron 0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:00.480 and Falo, and the other guard was Jordan Farmer Are 0:17:00.520 --> 0:17:04.679 and Josh shipped the talented crew. Um. So at first, 0:17:04.720 --> 0:17:07.520 you know, I was a little bit hesitant because of 0:17:07.560 --> 0:17:10.560 what my dad said. Um. But after that, you know, 0:17:10.600 --> 0:17:13.560 I thought about it. I believed in myself and you 0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:16.879 shall add basketball and all the law and everything about it. 0:17:16.920 --> 0:17:18.320 You know, I just wanted to be a part of 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:22.399 that brotherhood, that community and I just ultimately took the jump. 0:17:23.119 --> 0:17:27.440 But like you said, Santa Barbara, that campus, while unbelievable, 0:17:27.920 --> 0:17:29.719 I already knew a bunch of friends that we're going 0:17:29.760 --> 0:17:31.679 to go to school there. You know, I'm familiar with 0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:34.720 Santa Barbara and not being that far. So that that 0:17:34.800 --> 0:17:37.720 part it was tough because I was like traffic in 0:17:37.840 --> 0:17:41.159 Los Angeles, you know, the whole school, Like I'm in 0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:43.879 love with the whole Santa Barbara. You skateboard, you biked, 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:47.720 the class, can serve on the weekends. So that part 0:17:47.840 --> 0:17:51.320 it was a change of mentality and ultimately for me, 0:17:51.640 --> 0:17:54.679 I love groups and that's where I wanted out. All right, 0:17:54.720 --> 0:17:55.920 So you go to u c l A. You show 0:17:56.000 --> 0:17:58.960 up and your your first team at U c l A. 0:17:59.240 --> 0:18:04.400 Who was on it, uh was Cedric Bosman, Ryan hollwand 0:18:05.080 --> 0:18:11.080 Aarona Flanlo, Jordan Farmer, Josh Ship My my class was 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:13.720 there and call us In Luke and Ball Mute and 0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:18.240 two other talented freshmen. We were a very star studded teams, 0:18:18.480 --> 0:18:21.639 very good teams ended up making the final four. We 0:18:21.680 --> 0:18:25.800 won the pack ten. Wow, it was great. What was 0:18:25.800 --> 0:18:29.000 it about Howland that allowed you? I mean, look, you 0:18:29.040 --> 0:18:31.560 guys had you just named off seven NBA players right 0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:34.800 outside of yourself, um, and and Josh Ship, who I 0:18:34.800 --> 0:18:36.399 don't think played in the league, but I know he 0:18:36.440 --> 0:18:39.840 played overseas. So he got seven NBA players and you 0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:42.879 being a uh, like a European League All Star Like 0:18:42.920 --> 0:18:45.639 those are some that's elite level of talent outside of 0:18:45.640 --> 0:18:48.600 the talent, which which was important. And as soon as 0:18:48.600 --> 0:18:50.840 Howland got the job, he hit the ground running in 0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:53.840 recruited l a hard. Uh. What what was it allowed 0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:58.040 that allowed him to be successful coaching wise? From your perspective, Yeah, 0:18:58.040 --> 0:19:03.159 he's he's uh. He demands physicality and toughness and be 0:19:03.320 --> 0:19:05.600 prior to him coming at usual. I think that's what 0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:09.600 everybody was lacking there. Um, he he got the most 0:19:09.600 --> 0:19:11.760 out of our talent with that toughness. You know, he's 0:19:11.760 --> 0:19:15.280 playing hard makes up for a lot of mistakes. And 0:19:15.640 --> 0:19:17.760 we were all just able to believe in what he 0:19:17.800 --> 0:19:20.359 said in that sense, and we just played, you know, 0:19:21.280 --> 0:19:23.399 every night and gave everything and we made up for 0:19:23.440 --> 0:19:26.159 a lot of his small details that the mistakes that 0:19:26.160 --> 0:19:28.720 you make in basketball by just overcoming with your your 0:19:28.720 --> 0:19:30.760 power and your will. Yeah, And I brought some of 0:19:30.800 --> 0:19:33.200 that mentality from his time is interesting kind of the 0:19:33.440 --> 0:19:35.200 ties that bind, right, like he was he started his 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:37.960 career at UCSB, worked his way around to the East 0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:39.720 Coast and brought some of that kind of East Coast 0:19:39.720 --> 0:19:42.840 back to u c l A. Um, your second year, 0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:44.840 you go back, you go back to the final four, 0:19:45.280 --> 0:19:47.919 and you didn't you face Florida again? Right? Wasn't that 0:19:48.000 --> 0:19:50.520 the You played him again and kind of the same 0:19:50.520 --> 0:19:53.240 thing happened, right, he used You guys used to hedgehard, 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:56.440 almost a double team ball screens and you would always 0:19:56.520 --> 0:19:58.879 post double and it was like the one team in 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:01.480 college basketball that you could not play that way against. 0:20:01.800 --> 0:20:03.560 It felt like the same game play in the second 0:20:03.560 --> 0:20:08.280